Luther and Fariba welcome the incomparable Molly Ruffing to the podcast. We discuss paper production, pestilence, and pedantry.

Music: "Sweet Girl" by Caro Granner, Clover Austin-Muehleck, Yidi Zhang, Xiaoya Gao, and Moreau Halliburton

Hosts: Fariba Lale, Luther Abel

Sound Engineer: Nora Murphy

Thumbnail: Nora Murphy

Producer: Luther Abel