(00:00)
Crystal Lubrikunt: Y’alright? My name is Crystal Lubrikunt, I’m a camp drag performer and international potato from London, and welcome to my podcast; What Are You Like?! Each episode I’ll be inviting a fabulous special guest on and we’ll be finding out what they are REALLY like… it could go one way or another but prepare for good vibrations, good conversations, and most of all… campery. So start strolling, or grab your cuppa’ tea, wherever you are in the world, whatever you may be doing out there, just make sure you’re comfortable, relaxed and ready for some fabulous discussion, let’s go.
(00:36)
Crystal: International, award-winning, industry favourite, and cabaret mother of me, Crystal Lubrikunt; I am thrilled to have the incomparable Coco DeVille on as my guest on today’s episode. For over a decade Coco has ruled the cabaret scene, the festival circuit and the globe with their joyous energy, unique burlesque concepts and overall iconic performances, but what ruffles Ms DeVille’s feathers? What is the key to Coco’s heart? Let us see as we discover what they are really like…
(01:17)
Crystal: Hello Coco how are you my darling, darling Coco?
Coco DeVille: I am very well thank you, very, very well indeed.
Crystal: Where are you coming from today?
Coco: So I’m coming live (er) from my studio in Manchester.
Crystal: In Manchester!
Coco: Up’north!
Coco: (That’s how-) That’s how I live now.
Crystal: What listeners do not know - well some of them might know - is that Coco DeVille is my cabaret mother-
Crystal: - I would have not known how to do many-many things, and how to navigate the show business life if it wasn’t for the award-winning Coco DeVille-
Coco: Awwww
(01:53)
Crystal: -And Coco DeVille is partly responsible for the absolute monster that you listen & see today-
Crystal -so Coco how do you feel being responsible for this absolute MESS?
Coco: Well I take a lot of pride and it’s an honour really, it’s just that joy (like) when I (you know) first see you perform I was just like: * gasp * “So much talent! Ah my goodness I must-I must (you know) share my energy” And it was such a joy that you wanted to (you know,) listen, that’s the thing and then it’s all been beautiful from there.
(02:29)
Crystal: It is, it was and it will always be my absolute pleasure to be connected with you spiritually, (um) and in show business, it is just a joy to know you, to be around you-
Coco: Awww
Crystal: -whenever we would meet at Wetherspoons in Brighton we would just have the loveliest time, I’ve balled my eyes out in front of you-
Crystal: - I have laughed and cackled in front of you and it’s just such a joy, but life takes us in different directions you’re all the way up in Manchester how are you doing in Manchester is everything okay?
(03:01)
Coco: Yeah! It’s absolutely fantastic, (like) the performance community in Manchester (is just-) has been so warm and welcoming and it’s just an honour to be part of it, a new scene that is up here it’s just everything is really thriving and it’s just wonderful to inject my energy and it’s been welcomed, and yeah it’s just been an absolute joy.
Crystal: So over the 14 years in the industry, over the years of your life as a human being, I have one question for you just to simply answer in any way shape or form that you wish to, and that is; what are you like Coco DeVille? What are you like?
(03:38)
Coco: What am I like? What am I like?!
Crystal: What are you like?
Coco: I just- I just like… I like making people smile really, I like (er)… yeah! It’s-it’s such an amazing feeling as a performer (like) I think it’s like our responsibility to (kind of) bring our little bubbles of entertainment of fun, and fabulous, quirky and share stories and stuff with the audience and I think (like) it’s just, it’s just a joy that this is my job-
Coco: - to (kind of) bring a lovely, happy energy into people’s lives and I just can’t imagine doing anything else really!
(04:18)
Crystal: That is joyous, well we’re gonna go straight into our first section Coco and it is called; ‘7 Things’.
Crystal: Now ‘7 Things’ is about- basically- a time to decipher all the things that other people think about you and one of those people that I have summoned to help me out with this is the - also award-winning - Dave The Bear-
Crystal: - from down in Brighton, Dave The Bear has come up with seven words that they like to describe Coco DeVille and we’re gonna go one-by-one and try and decipher why Dave The Bear has used these words.
(05:02)
Coco: Okay!
Crystal: But are you ready for ‘7 Things’ Coco?
Coco: Okay I’m ready bring it on okay.
Crystal: The first word that Dave The Bear has described Coco DeVille as is; ‘Joy.’
Coco: Awwww!
Crystal: Why do you think Dave The Bear has used the word ‘Joy’ ?
Coco: I think it’s because I-I’m the kind of person that (er-), I just don’t take myself too seriously, (um) and I don’t take my life too seriousl- well I’ve- there’s points you know, of my life that you have to take seriously but I think (you know) I’ve just always been brought up with the mentality that you only get one life, (you know) you might as well just make the most of it and just find happiness in the most random moments, and when you (kind of) have that as your constant (um) you’re just kinda- that’s how you are and that energy (kind of) rubs off on anyone that’s around you and I think that’s (you know- kind of-) a thing (like), I like to try and make myself happy and so it kind of bounces around anyone that’s around me I guess.
(06:05)
Crystal: I’ll never forget (when-) seeing you put together and also debut your ‘Geek Chic’ burlesque routine-
Crystal: -and I remember way back when I used to try- I had a bit of a knack for photography and I used to photograph some performers and every performer had their own little unique (er) fashion sense, and then I get Coco DeVille to come round to my house, and out comes this g-string unitard-
Coco: The mankini!
Crystal: The man-Oh!
Coco: The lime green mankini!
Crystal: The mankini! And is it still with us? It’s now stoned right? It’s now elevated.
(06:41)
Coco: Yeah that’s the thing; it was like… I literally created that act as a birthday present to one of my friends, a woman called Rebecca Drury whose still based in Brighton (um-), and she was one of my first friends (like) in the performance realm when I moved there which was absolutely great and she used to always have these parties that were (like) mixed with us performers and (you know) I think it was her birthday and (it was just like-) she’d ask certain people; “Instead of giving me a present, just do a little show” and it’s just like “Ok cool” Ummm and the theme was ‘Sexy And You Know It’
(07:18)
Coco: -and I think one of the big things that everyone always said to me was “Oh Coco your figure is always amazing you could wear aaaanything and still look hot!” And (it was just like you know) whats the most ridiculous thing that I could wear and-and just see what people’s responses would be? And then - yeah - then the mankini came to my mind and then everything just (kind of) spiralled from there and I just remember performing it and that party and everyone was in hysterics and I was like “Oh this is just really fun” and (er) yeah then I brought it into the burlesque realm and it brought up so much silly fun energy and it just (kind of) broke down the boundaries that (you know) “burlesque has to be very serious” and no it can be whatever you want it to be.
(08:07)
Crystal: The second word that Dave The Bear has used to describe Coco DeVille is; ‘Eclectic’.
Coco: That’s pretty-pretty cool (like) my (er) tagline is; Coco Deville: The Cabaret Chameleon, ha ha haa (Um) I think it’s because (like) as a performer, as an artist I get inspiration from everywhere, (you know), and I think (like you know) when you’re an artist and your brain’s just going all the time it’s amazing how different genres of music or different clothing, or different themes & cultures can just inspire (er) this wonderful world within you and I like to translate that into- into my work and onto the stage, and I think as well (like) I like creating work (um) and bringing it to audiences where they might not necessarily have seen it themselves, or they might not be aware of certain (um) levels, like when I (you know-er) remember creating my Hip Hop Bunny act and I just really loved the idea of bringing hip hop on to- into a cabaret environment and it all works you know? (Um-) And it’s just-it’s great to (kind of) keep mixing around with genres and stuff because it’s exciting for the audience, it’s exciting for a performer as well (like,) to keep it, to just keep it fresh!
(09:29)
Crystal: It’s so amazing to look at your repotoire and look at your numbers and each number is so extremely different to the other; from your Golden Brown to Voodoo Queen, to The Hip Hip Bunny to Geek Chic and the many more you have under your shoulders you are a very eclectic person and I also think you’re extremely innovative as well with your work-
Coco: Thank you.
Crystal: -you’re very hands-on aren’t you, you like to create a lot of parts of your shows.
(09:57)
Coco: Yeah definitely- (like) I know (like), I create a lot of my costumes and concepts and things like that, originally it’s because of money you know? But as time has gotten on (you know-like) I’ve enjoyed collaborating with costume designers like (um) there’s a designer called Chrissy Wild who I collaborated with my Gogo Uhura act because I was like “I really want a Star Trek uniform!”
Crystal: Yessss!
(10:31)
Coco: But I know I had to do it justice, I needed to get another mind into this, (um and yeah) I really enjoy having that avenue and (like) now I’m based in Manchester and there’s people like Miss Blair who’s an amazing performer herself but she also does (like) wigs and things like that so (It’s just like-) I love the fact that I’ve got to this point now that whenever I have an idea, I have got (like) the avenue of other performers and other creatives that I can turn to-to help make these ideas a reality, now its just like “ok what am I gonna be today?!”
(11:11)
Crystal: Yesss!
Coco: “How we gonna make this happen? How am I gonna bring it out there?” It’s just a joy to (kind of like-) literally have no obstacles on my imagination now it’s a great position to be in.
Crystal: Do you find that the best ideas come from a lot of planning or the best ideas come from impulsive sparks?
Coco: (um) It’s impulse, I think (like) for me it’s always been an impulse thing for me, (like) my strongest acts have just been an idea, (um) because when you have something that (you know) you hear a piece of music or you come across a fabric or a bit of costume that just sparks (you know like)- sparks joy! Within you! (it just) It brings up this lovely happy level within you and that happiness translates on stage and then when the audience watches you their seeing that joy & happiness and they’re sharing that with you and I think thats-thats something that is really-really precious that you can only really get in cabaret.
(12:19)
Crystal: Now the third word Dave The Bear has used to describe Coco DeVille is; ‘Unavoidable’.
Coco: Ha! Okay!
Crystal: What makes you so unavoidable?
Coco: I think (er) 1. I’ve been around for a long time thats the thing, I’ve been there, I’ve been there, I’ve been there, I’ve been around- I think because my work is quite eclectic I like to just get involved with different scenes, and different circuits (you know) like when I originally told people “Oh I’m a burlesque performer” Already you think of (you know) jazzy smooth, cabaret venues which is great, which is cool but I also really love performing with festivals, I love performing in any type of big club nights and stuff, like anytime that there are people wanting to have a good time that is (like) my perfect environment to perform so I just wanna get my fingers in all of the pies so within that I think my face is around all over the place so! I’m around!
(13:23)
Crystal: What would you say was the most unique place you’ve performed? What was the most interesting addition to the performance resume?
Coco: It’s actually really hard to (like) pinpoint? Cos over the years there’s just been so many bits and pieces but I think one of the most- Okay! I remember performing for someones 50th birthday party, and it was essentially in their living room and I was just like; this is really surreal because there’s no fancy lighting, there’s no- they’re just pressing play on a Hi-Fi system, I felt (like) proper like Strippergram vibes you know but (it just was like) everyones having a lovely time, I felt so awkward because everyone was just standing around-
Coco: - just like watching me!
Crystal: It sounds so weird!
Coco: I was just having a jolly time just going whip woo! I could see their faces, there was nowhere to hide, but I’m gonna take my glove off and it’s gonna end up on the corner of that bit of sofa but you know what? I left it, I left that whole situation like- I was treated really-really well, everyone was really-really respectful, it was just so daunting and the lady whose birthday it was she just had a lovely time so it just meant (like) any kind of feeling I had like “what the hell am I doing?” It (kind of) all just went out the window cos at the end of it she was all “Ooh I just loved it! It was great I’m just so happy thank you for coming aw!” And I was just like; “Right you know what? It doesn’t really matter where I perform as long as people are digging it. Then everything’s a winner.”
(15:20)
Crystal: The fourth word that Dave The Bear has described Coco with is; ‘Vivacious’.
Coco: Hmmm, I’ve always been known as being really extra, (like) ever since I was a kid, “ooh you know she’s so extra oh my god” It’s just that thing (you know) when you find something you like and it makes you happy, why is it (like) more acceptable to (kind of like) play it down? (Like) “Yeah this is kinda cool but meh” It’s like “No I’m the opposite” I’m like; if I’m getting enjoyment out of this? I’m gonna show it through (like) every part of my body (um yeah), I know that I do (like) squeal and I clap my hands a lot and all that kind of stuff but I think it’s good to (kind of) just share that enjoyment of things-
Coco: (Um) yeah!
(16:15)
Crystal: I am totally with you when you- we have emotions and we have an emotional language between humans for a reason and we need to be encouraging it more-so than ever to be emotional, to be vibrant-
Coco: Yeah
Crystal: -be unapologetically ourselves and you’re such a pure example of that and it’s just- it’s so joyous and it’s (um) infectious as well we love-
Crystal: - what we love and I wanna hark back to when you were at university, i remember when you would tell me about your times at university, you were at (like) Falmouth was it?
(16:45)
Coco: Dartington, (er)
Crystal: Dartington!
Coco: Yeah, so basically (er)- to put into context - Dartington was an internationally-renowned (er sort of) university that specialised in contemporary performance art so like-from theatre, dance, writing (um), choreography, film and everything like that and it was just like a little bubble-
Coco: -there was about 600 of us, (um) and we’re on a hill in the middle of nowhere so it’s like in Totnes so it’s like in-between Exeter and Plymouth, and stuff like that- and that whole experience (like), I was a proper city girl you know Brummie born & bred and I got accepted at this crazy arts university and it just blew my mind on (like) how to create basically, (like) how to get an idea from your brain and (like) learning the tools and the mechanics to get it out there on stage, so whether it’s (like) workshopping or finding text and everything like that and I think that experience and (er um) that joy was translated into my cabaret work and I remember when I went to university and I got really fascinated with gender politics within- on the- on the stage, I got into (like) burlesque, and drag, (like) from a very academic level and this is way before it became trendy (um) and I remember getting a lot of stick at university actually (um like): “How can you be a feminist performer and you’re wanting to (you know) be naked or use nudity & stuff on stage?” But (like) I saw nudity and female sexuality but it was always done in a very (er) repressive way, or rejecting (er) female sexuality (sort of) level and that just really (kind of) set of an internal conflict within me and I was just like; “No (like) surely (you know) it’s good to create work thats quite personal to you and embracing something that you are- (um you know) using your body as a canvas rather than rejecting certain elements of your identity and all of that jazz.
(19:12)
Crystal: It’s amazing when we refer back to our university experience- we share something quite similar there because at my university drag wasn’t - on my course of performance & visual art - drag wasn’t considered quite a well-esteemed art from-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -and I was challenged by professors who told me that it wasn’t basically, it felt like they were repressing it but I just got that repression and turned it into (you know) art & creativity-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -and thank god I did, and thank god that YOU did because I think that birthed what- well I think when you become a cabaret (er) performer whether it be in drag or in burlesque we both have our fingers in a lot of pies in different circuits-
Coco: Mmhm.
(19:52)
Crystal: - you can’t plan, you don’t know where you’re gonna end up and you don’t know what you’re gonna be doing in (like) two-three years creatively because you could be doing one style and then you’d be jumping to the next whatever tickles our fancy, it’s like we’re magpies; we just see something sparkly in our head and go “you know what i’m gonna do that now” or (you know) combine that with our feelings and our motivations and I find that when anyone challenges me I wanna prove them wrong and I think thats what came from-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -our university experiences, especially as performers and I think a lot of performers have similar experiences, especially in the scene, especially within the time that we were studying. Back to your eclectic repertoire; (it’s- you’ve just-) anything that you’ve felt has been something that maybe you can’t do or shouldn’t do, or maybe something that hasn’t been done and you’re thinking “I can’t really- no one can make that into burlesque” and you’re like “Watch me do Star Trek on this stage right this second!”
(20:50)
Crystal: It’s amazing that performers like yourself and when I think of other performers that are similar I think of Lilly Snatchdragon challenges those (you know-) those themes and those codes & conventions- Lolo Brow does that as well and it’s just so awesome to have these incredibly amazing but also strong mother-fucking women that dominate the burlesque & cabaret scene it’s so awesome, which brings me to-
Crystal: -this next word!
Coco: Oh my goodness the fact that it’s making you laugh!
Crystal: -and I’m sure it is within really good intention, but for some reason when I look at this word I re- I go back how many years - this is gonna be scary - (um) 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19,20- eight years!
Coco: Oh my goodness!
Crystal: When we were at Playgroup Festival in the middle of a field and you were on some (like) child-stilts pretending to be a dinosaur.
Crystal: (um-) But the word that Dave- the 1, 2, - I’m losing my count - 1, 2, 3- the fifth word that Dave The Bear has described Coco DeVille is; ‘Chaos’.
(21:51)
Coco: Oooh okay, (um) yeah! (er-I-I-) I can feel the vibe of that- I think it’s just cos I can be quite spontaneous sometimes (it’s like-) if something (kind of) sparks my interest or I’m seeing something I’m like “Ooh I wanna go and do that!” and then “You’re lovely people you’re coming with me! This is the thing we’re doing now.” (Um) And (you know like) at the end of a show for example and everything got that post-show glow and (it’s like) no ones got any plans afterwards so it’s like “Right! Lets all go out somewhere and lets see what the evening has for us and lets just do it! Lets just go lets just do it lets just ride that wave.” And yes! On that level it’s like sometimes (like) it’s just good to (kind of) roll with the moment and just go with it because the moment you kinda start thinking about things and I’m the kinda person that I - also - over think (um) and I overpack and I over-prepare and I over-plan but then on the flip side I’m just like; “Right lets just see what happens!” Thats how (like) adventures are created and I like adventures, everyone does.
(23:18)
Crystal: (Um) This next word makes me think - which I-I personally don’t have any memories of you being so but maybe because of your time at Proud with Dave The Bear this word may come into play because your adventures may happen after the show but they may happen before the show with this word, which is the second-last word of Dave The Bear’s 7 Things About Coco DeVille which is; ‘Late’.
(23:40)
Coco: Okay right, (um) I’ve forgotten what the word is- there’s a word which (er) I might look at Google in a minute (um) but for me I try and cram so much into a day (like you know) And I just feel like I have more time than I have (like) if that makes any sense, so for me I’ll wake up in the morning and I’ll try to have a little workout and I will ring people, make sure that they’re okay, everything like that, I might do some sewing and then I might have an idea and I might have to sketch it out or do some writing and everything like that, and then I’m like “OOH okay! Ooh I’ve gotta do do this!” (Um) And yeah, I think (like) for me it’s just (like) because (like) with my day I put so much in (um) it’s just one of those things but the thing is (like you know) in my - in what I like to call - my past life, (you know) I had a very corporate job and I had to wake up and commute and everything like that and I was always on time, (like) that was the thing, (like) i always had everything all perfect and nice and neat, and I gave myself time to do everything, and then when I became self-employed I just really relished the amount of freedom that it gave myself as a person and towards my work and it’s (just, you know) always an eternal roller coaster to find balance between making sure i get enough time for myself and making sure I give a dedicated amount of time towards my work, and sometimes (it-) there are weird (like) crossovers where it’s just like; “Okay oh my goodness I’ve got this amount of time to get to this venue blah blah blah” but the thing is granted; i might be a bit late to actually getting to the venue but I’m always on time for (like) actually stage-call, everything like that so (like) when it comes to the actual finished product? I’m always there glossy, pumped with energy, ready & rearing to go so thats just my thing.
(25:52)
Crystal: I think Dave’s just being a bit of a shady bitch there to be honest, I think he’s trying to dob you in it a little bit.
Coco: Oh no it’s all good, it’s all good!
Crystal: But it goes back to you talking about how you- life is short and you just take each day as an opportunity for you to do anything thats (you know) thats fabulous and anything thats gonna make you, or make others happy, and I think that is just an example of- someone just trying to poke fun at the fact that you have (you know) your love and your energy in so many different things in a day and I think thats awesome!
(26:22)
Coco: I’m just gonna say I’ve actually just found the word, there is an actual word, and I think it’s pronounced ‘tidsoptimist’ which is ‘a person that (um) thinks they have more time than they actually do, and thus are habitually late’ so there’s actually a term!
Crystal: The more you know, we are- we are teaching the world so many things today.
- Coco chuckles -
Crystal: And the last thing we’re gonna teach the world- which if you have never seen Coco DeVille on stage, if you’ve never been in her presence or lets say you’ve never seen an image of Coco DeVille this is a podcast you know it’s in audio, (which um) then I’ll let Dave describe- say the rest because this last word is two words together which is; ‘Nice Arse.’
Coco: Ah my boo-tay!
(27:12)
Coco: Ahh love it! I think thats the thing it’s like- you know when I was growing up I got bullied a lot which I think seems to be a common thing for quite a few performers (it’s like), we’ve managed to use all this negativity and use that to find ourselves and (kind of like) figure out who we are and what we are about and I find it really interesting that I used to get bullied just for being ridiculously curvy when I was younger, I was short & curvy when- back in the day when it was all about being really slim & super skinny, and low jeans and Britney Spears and all that jazz, so (um) but you know having a big booty being embraced now it’s (er) it’s wonderful and I think (like) thats one of the reasons that I enjoy burlesque is about just shaking what your mamma gave you you know? It’s about enjoying that physical freedom and enjoying sharing that on stage, and yeah! So if people like my boo-tay then thats a good thing.
(28:26)
Crystal: Oh I think the world loves Ms Coco DeVille’s booty, but if there is someone that’s listening that is thinking about burlesque or thinking about performing but is- doesn’t have the confidence with their body is there any advice you’d like to give to them?
Coco: Yeah I think (you know) the joy of self-care and self-awareness is a very important thing so if you are feeling really down about your body- I always (kinda) put that down to the fact that we’re looking (er) for reassurance and approval from other people so (you know we-) we put stuff on our Instagram, and on various social media platforms and we’re always comparing ourselves to other people and that’s where (you know) I believe insecurity lies, but when you (kind of) spend time with yourself, what makes you happy? (what) What makes you excited? What inspires you? And just spending time getting to know your own mind, then you realise that all of these other influences they don’t mean anything and some of them, if they’re going to be positive attributes to your life then of course include that, but I think (like yeah-) I think when it comes to body positivity that has got to come from yourself and take time to learn about yourself and then you’ll realise that everything else just (kind of) falls to the wayside.
(29:51)
Crystal: Absolutely I couldn’t agree more, well thats the ‘7 Things’ done by Dave The Bear you have survived Coco DeVille!
Coco: Yay!
Crystal: No surprise you dominated it- we’re gonna go to our next section which i called; ‘True Love.’
- a slow guitar jingle plays as notable American television personality Thorgy Thor saying “Ok i.. am OBSESSED with mustard, I can’t believe I said that out loud’ is played over it -
Crystal: Now Coco ‘True Love’ is basically a time for you to tell us something that for as long as you can remember you’ve been passionately in love with and you are still in love with today, is there something that you can think of whether it is a- an activity, a movie, a piece of music, an artist, a book or a person, or just something- it could be something as small as breathing or something as small as a packet of Wotsits, just let me know let us know!
(30:37)
Coco: I think my true is (er) it’s actually - this is gonna be a bit weird - it’s actually an arts movement (um) The Harlem Renaissance, (um) because- so basically The Harlem Renaissance happened if I remember correctly in sort-of 1920s to the 1930s, 1940s over in America, so what happened is (like) the newly-“freed” slaves basically were embracing the freedom (um) that (you know) that their new identities were being allowed to be embraced so during that (you know) people were buying properties, people were (you know) opening up their buildings and (um) opening up shops and properties and everything like that, but what also was happening is (um) a lot of music was coming out at that time, a lot of fashion, a lot of dance trends and everything like that was starting to-to explode because everyone was (just) full of joy and-and emotion of that particular period of time, and what I always found particularly wonderful about the whole renaissance is (like) it’s the birth of (like) jazz & blues which are the instigators of (like) popular culture that we have now we still are inspired by a lot of the musicians that (kind-of) instigating certain movements back in the day and I think (like) more- the more I learn about that particular period of history the more I’m (just) in so much respect that (like) throughout all this oppression they still found (you know) ways to celebrate life and connect with each other and I think as well when (er you know) I’d learn about these parties & speak-easys and things it was like you’d have these occasions where people would hold a party and it’d be like these speakeasy things where there would be a secret password you’d have to know, all that kinda jazz but it would be one of the first times that you’d have people of different races partying together (um), people- different social classes partying together, (um) sexual orientations partying together and, it was just this lovely little bubble in Harlem where people were allowed to be free and be who they wanna be for that (sort of) moment in time and there is just so much beauty in knowing that existed and… yeah, thats always my (sort of) go-to whenever I am feeling a little down because there’s been (like) so many movies and things like that, so much fashion and things that came from that time period and I feel really grateful to see- to see all of that (um… yeah), so thats always been my constant love.
(33:45)
Crystal: Well thank you, thank you for telling me all about that as (you know um) we’re in a current climate where people need to be learning and people need to be listening a lot more to the past so that we can pay it forward in the way that is progressive to the future and to present day and thank you for your energy and thank you for your time with that-that means a lot. But now Coco we’re gonna take a little break.
Crystal: Tired of using crap, overpriced make up? Done with using products that aren’t cruelty free and vegan? Wanna go out and look bloody gorgeous?! Then get yourself some GIVE FACE COSMETICS; direct from the UK Give Face Cosmetics are an independent queer brand that have an array of gorgeousness from eyeshadow palettes to foundation, neon pigments to liquid lipsticks, flash palettes and all the glitter you could ask for! And at extremely affordable prices. My personal favourite is the blinding highlighter powder phwoar! Better yet!Their entire range are vegan and cruelty free! To get 10% off your purchase at check out use code ‘CRYSTAL’ for money off! So go for it, what are you waiting for? Check them out at GiveFaceCosmetics.co.uk
(34:51)
Crystal: Right we are back with Coco DeVille!
Crystal: And we are gonna go into our section which is; ‘Topic Of Choice.’
Crystal: Coco ’Topic Of Choice’ is a time for you to have the floor and talk about something that you just wanna talk about today, with these interviews I don’t allow much planning for my guests because I want them to talk about something that’s impulsive, something that at this current time they really just wanna talk about whether it’s something really silly or a movie that you’ve watched, or an album that you’re listening to or something that’s been playing on your mind for a couple of days or months, we can talk about it and have a conversation about it, is there anything that comes across your mind today that you’d like to talk about with lil ole’ me?
(35:42)
Coco: (Um er) Okay, ummm I think the first thing that has just come in to mind is family (um), I think now is the time to start reconnecting with our families and the thing is that can be either your blood family or your chosen family because I think at this point in time with the world essentially being on fire and crazy chaos I think now is the time to start reaching out to the people that (you know kinda) made you-you, I know that over these past couple of months I’ve been in strong contact with my Mum for example, my Mum’s an NHS nurse so I’ve had these (kind of-sort of) moments to myself cos all of these venues have closed down, some of my work has (just- kind of) disappeared and I’m feeling all low and everything like that, but it just made me appreciate the fact that I’m actually in this profession in the first place and I’ll be okay and I’ll be fine, but then it was a case of just checking in with my Mum, taking myself out of my little bubble and just going like; “Right i’m going to ring my Mum and see how she is” and obviously the NHS is in chaos right now!
(37:01)
Coco: And so it’s just been really nice to actually be (er) to (kind of) rebuild the strength in that relationship because when I have been constantly working non-stop I haven’t connected with my family as much as I now believe I should’ve done so I am now really enjoying that notion that this lockdown has (kind of) given me a bit more time to (er-) to just connect (er) with the people that are important to me as I’ve also got my friends that are back down in Brighton as well so the fact that I moved up to Manchester and that was a total personal choice for myself and I absolutely love it but then (its just-you know) I love touching base with (like-) my close friends in Brighton and stuff and seeing how they are because (like it’s-) it’s been a tough one for everybody but it’s always really nice when you (just kind of-) randomly reach out to someone that (you know) that you were once upon a time (like) inseparable and then life happens and you (kind of) step out and pull away, but its really nice to just reconnect and (just kind of) give that little moment to someone going “Hey i’m still here, i’m still here for you, the love is still always there, you are my family, you are important to me, I’m just checking in on you as & when” And I think (like) if we all start (kind of) thinking like that so (you know) obviously spend time with yourself, spend time making sure that your head space is cool but (like) also try and find within your moment in a day just touching base with people that you care about and you love, and just saying “hey” just listen to them for a bit, just sharing that I think that would just make things a little bit more bearable because I know that it’s definitely worked for me and it’s definitely worked with the people that I’ve got around me and I feel very fortunate that I’ve got them there so it’s nice to remind them that I appreciate them.
(39:12)
Crystal: People are probably wondering why I am talking less than usual- it’s because once again Coco is very much my cabaret mother, I listen to her a lot and this is no disrespect to previous guests but the words that come out of Coco DeVille’s mouth I always (just) sit and really-really take it all in and I don’t have much to say to that because you’ve pretty much said everything that I would’ve said but more but… so much more, and I just appreciate your energy, I appreciate your words as a human, as a performer so-so much and that I think is so important right now and to add - if I was - to reconnect with family but to- I think to remind yourself of a spark you had with some people because-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: - I think people need to really (sort of) realise when they’ve connected & vibes with someone and- again we are in a current state of the world that is troublesome and it is wild and it is crazy and it has put some people in mindsets that question “How long do we have?” and that is a very morbid way of thinking-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -but I think it is a way of thinking that everyone should have in general, and what I mean by that is- what I mean by saying all of this is way back when, a few years ago when I first ever went out and performed in New York I had five days, I had five days with my mother and in the evenings was when I would go out and do drag until phwoar 4 in the morning and when I then returned and I was on my own and I was travelling solo, at each show or when I was at a show if I connected with someone I immediately said - and it stayed since then and I really-really advise anyone lived like this - anyone that I had a laugh with or I connected with I asked them immediately “what are you doing tomorrow?” “what are you doing in the afternoon? What are you doing in the evening?” “Lets go to dinner”
(41:03)
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal” “Lets see a show” “Lets go for a walk” Because the laws of attraction are very-very real-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -you are meant to connect with somebody and that connection I do believe will always be there no matter what happens and that goes to what your saying-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -that connection never dies, it never-never dies, there are people in our lives that there’ll be hurdles that you fall in front of and there’ll be time when you aren’t as connected as you once were or maybe will be, and one thing that we universally share as humans is that we are just that, we are human-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: - and we have hearts, we have love, we have experiences and now is the time to reconnect and to cherish and to treasure and (you know) I think it’s beautiful what you just said I think it’s so important to because in lockdown I’v every much reconnected and also capitalised on new connections I thought “you know what I’ve always had a great time with you” and I’ve ended up every other day sometimes every day talking to a person that prior to lockdown I’d talk to every so often in the comments d’ya know what I mean? It’s just joyous and I think life’s short!
Coco: Yeah.
(42:20)
Crystal: Just as you said.
Coco: Yeah thats the thing (its like you know-) as well (like) yeah enjoy it, hands down! Agree, I love that we’re on the same wave it’s beautiful (um yeah) I taught you well!
Crystal: There we go!
Coco: But I think that’s the thing (it’s like- you know) I feel like sometimes we (like) a lot of times especially in lockdown a lot of people feel alone because they’re alone with certain feelings and emotions and it’s like; no we’re actually, we’re not, we just need to (kind of) not feel the fear of expression of how we actually feel (um) and the thing is as well with (like) certain connections (you know) you can message someone everyday and that can be your thing but then (yeah-like) sometimes you can go years without connecting with someone and just touch base with them and sometimes when you’ve got the spark - like you were saying - you can (like) reconnect with someone and it’s like time has just disappeared, it’s like you’re just back to how you were and how you are and I really just enjoy those types of friendships that just show as humans that you just connect and I think thats something that (you know) we gotta remind ourselves (like) it’s never too late to say hello, it’s never too late to (just) check in on someone, I just feel like we’ve gotta allow ourselves that freedom to (just) to just do it (you know,) there’s so much more to gain from those experiences.
(43:52)
Crystal: Absolutely, couldn’t agree more and it’s just so important but we’re gonna go straight to our next topic which is quite the opposite of the sort-of tone we’ve been talking about, the next topic is called; ‘Pet Peeves.’
(44:12)
Crystal: In this section Coco I want you to bring up something that’s grinding your gears, something that’s just- you know what this is a time for you to just vent, to get something out your system, whether it’s small, whether it’s major, whether it’s something that’s just come off the top of your head now or maybe it’s something I’ve done in this interview and you just wanna clip me round the ear, just let loose, tell me a couple of pet peeves maybe two, maybe just one, maybe two or three, anything that is grinding Coco DeVille’s gears at the moment lets have it.
(44:42)
Coco: Okay (um) quite a few things…
Crystal: Bring it on.
Coco: Okay so what I’m really not digging, what really annoys me is the amount of people that are just really ignorant, (like we’re-) we’re at a very (sort of like) socially, politically very tender time where a lot of people are having to reevaluate the world that they’re surrounded by, (er) teachings, and social structures and everything like that, (er it’s just like) how some people - even when they’ve got evidence, when they’ve got all these people speaking out on certain issues that are just peopl- there’s a certain demographic of person that goes “no I don’t care, no thats not what I hear nope, nope, nope, no” (um) It’s just really frustrating.
Coco: You know? (Like) I’ve been the kinda person that- I’ve been brought up- (you know- that- like-yeah) when you’re at school and you had to write an essay, you know you’d have to (like) do loads of research, read different books, listen to interviews, watch programmes and then you’d come up to your own conclusion, so the thing is you-you are forced to listen to all these voices and get (you know)- form your own views based on facts and logic and statistics and everything like that, then you’d come up to your own conclusion, and thats how I’ve (kind of) always lived my life I am very fortunate that (you know) I live in- well I’m just around a lot of people that are (you know) also that way (er) they have that sort of thought process as well, (Um) but (it’s just like-) I just get really frustrated that (like) a lot of people (just) are so easy to (just) dismiss a lot, I think (like) for me and what’s been really important is obviously the Black Lives Matter movement and I am just getting so annoyed at the amount of propaganda and stuff that you see online, and so many people are like “Ooh it’s actually a terrorist thing” and all this kind of stuff and its like HOW do you (like)- there is so much (like)- information out there, there’s so many people actually telling and sharing their actual experiences, why is your ignorance just not allowing yourself to (like) change your perception? And that’s what really gets to me because (like) you know we have to start listening to each other, we have to (like- you know) start embracing different voices and different perspectives because thats the only way we’re gonna progress and it’s (just like it’s-) really frustrating you’re seeing one demographic of society that are (like) “Woah didn’t know these issues were happening, this is crazy, I’m gonna go out my way and learn, and re-educate and help break down the system so everything’s all fair” and then you’ve got this one- another demographic of society that are dragging their heels that are just living in their own tiny little bubbles and it is just preventing progression for all and it’s just- that, that’s what really annoys me.
(47:57)
Crystal: No it’s exhausting and (it’s-) it’s you know it shouldn’t have to come from anyone of Colour or Black or Brown people to give their energy to inform or educate, people need to going out- people need to go out their and educate their mother-fucking selves-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -because it’s been years upon years upon years of horror, of absolute chaotic disgusting events that have unfolded throughout the world and enough is enough and it’s time for us White people to fucking take accountability-
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -and do the work, and it’s ridiculous that ‘Simon & Karen’ are out there saying that someone has dedicated their life - whether it is at a protest, whether it is in the library, whether it is in government or in politics, someone that is of Colour, that is Black or Brown, that is someone sharing their experience or sharing their life-long knowledge, and then just going: “Nah” Yet they’ll go and watch Blue Planet or Planet Earth and be like: “No but Attenborough knows his stuff” (like) There’s no difference when someone has dedicated their life to (um) create positive change-
Coco: Yeah.
(49:07)
Crystal: -we should be listening.
Coco: Totally (like), hit the nail on the head (it’s just like-), for so long (like) so many people in various minority groups have had to adapt their way of life and kinda shrug certain things off and accept certain things as being normal but it’s like; actually no, (like) everyone should be allowed to live life where they feel safe, everyone should want to live a life where their families are safe and secure and full of love, (you know) thats what someone thing we should be striving for everybody and the fact that there’s certain people that don’t want that? It’s just- it just blows my mind and it’s a level of ignorance now because we know- we’ve got the internet!
(49:54)
Coco: You know we’ve got the joys of the internet, so even if you see something or you’re hearing something that you’re like “Hmm i’m not sure about that” you can go and do your own research and then figure it out from there, but the fact that there’s so many people that are still reluctant to educate themselves it’s just really frustrating and it’s really draining but hopefully (you know) we’ll look back at this point in the future (um you know,) and hopefully we’ll be on the right side of history so fingers crossed.
(50:26)
Crystal: Turning the page to a much nicer section which is gonna change the tone completely from arsehole ignorance to the next section which is called; ‘Somebody To Love’.
Crystal: Now this is our last section Coco, but ‘Somebody To Love’ is a part of this interview that I love and I’m so happy that I get to do this because it just allows a moment for my guest to reflect on the people that or the art that makes them happy and makes the love go through their body and into their veins and ‘Somebody To Love’ is a section of the interview where I ask my guest to talk about someone or something that they have- maybe recently discovered or recently (um) inhabited in their life that keeps them going, or keeps them sane, (um) whether it’d be a singer or an artist or a lover, a loved one, a family member, a friend, and it just gives you the time to just sit and talk about what is just- someone or something that you love, do you have anything that comes to mind?
(51:35)
Coco: Yeah, (this is like-hmmmm)
Coco: (Um) I think for me - oh goodness that-thats a hard one-
Coco: (Um well) Something (you know like) for me (like) where I get my, my, my sources of love (um like), when it comes to (like) creatively? I’ve gotta thank my cabaret mamma - whose your cabaret grandmother - Dolly Rocket!
Crystal: Dolly Rocket!
(52:05)
Coco: Dolly Rocket, (like) I’m gonna give her a shout out because (um) when I first started performing (um) at Proud (um you know) it was just wonderful to- she’s just wonderful to watch full stop, the way she holds herself and the way she commands the crowd it’s just inspiring, absolutely inspiring so it’s (like you know-) I remember the first (sort of) instances where I was properly fan-girling and everything like that and I’d just been aware of (like) her work with people like Booglaloo Stu and things like that and she just seemed to be (like) this absolutely awesome force of just epicness, (um) as the (you know-) as the years went by and we became (like) really good friends because we were working together a lot and everything like that, she also (like) gave me (like) so much (like) grounding and inspiration and you know just helping me (just) fine tune myself as an artist and owning myself and everything like that, (um) but as well as that (like), when I was going through a lot of personal issues (like you know-), I was going through some quite heavy stuff like on relationship levels or (like) financially and things like that and it was a total-total struggle, (Um) she was there for me to embark that mound because she’s the kind of person that has been performing all her life and when you come (you know-) from- as a fresh from university art student you always get warned like “Ooh there’s no money in the arts” or “Ooh it’s only gonna be a temporary thing” or like “After a certain age” all this, that and the other, you know, and when I’m around someone like her you know it’s just that case of (like) you just make it work; if this is where you’re meant to be in life you will make it work, you will find a way and (you know) its just such a joy to have that (sort of), someone that I can go to whether it’s- whatever is going on in my life I can (like) go to someone like that her and thats just fantastic and (you know) I have (like) on a personal level I have my friend (er) my friend Lyndsey who I went to university with (um) and she’s also been there for me on a friendship level since (like) freshers week and still to now and sometimes I think we forget (like) certain friendships (like) might happen at a party or at uni or whatever (you know) but sometimes those friendships can have the total longevity (you know) and thats (kind of) the joy and I just love the fact that I’m- (you know) I have certain people in my life that I can touch base with and that they can help boost me up and I can help boost them up and it’s just this wonderful little network but I do believe (you know) that if you (kind of) put the good energy out then you will get it back, it might not be straight away but it is that kind-of that kind of energy & flow and thats what I love and yeah! Yet again gone on a tangent!
(55:35)
Crystal: It is so-so wild how the world works and when I say that I think about- very recently I went out for the first time in drag FOR FUN-
Coco: Yay!
(55:45)
Crystal: In about- I wanna say 5 or 6 years and I went out with my good friend Herr The Queen and we went out with these group of queens who were so young and me & Herr kept on making jokes about how (like-) and old Lady Gaga song came on and we would go “Oh remember this in our day?” because we figured out that when it was out, when it was released these queens were (like) 11 & 12?
Crystal: And paying it forward is so important- not only in our industry but in life - that when you- the practice of paying it forward; once you introduce into your life it becomes automatic, you become a human that just wants to make (you know-) make everyone feel nice and make everyone feel good, and if it wasn’t for people like Dolly Rocket in your life and for me (like) yourself in your life, I couldn’t have those moments with these 18 year old queens! Because I used to be 18 year old baby queen you know! And share my knowledge and share my experience and give them advice when they asked for it, (um) and it’s just joyous how paying it forward really makes the world turn in terms of love, in terms of friendship and connection, and Dolly Rocket is just a legend-
(57:04)
Coco: Yeah.
Crystal: -and I have been very lucky to have worked with her I think once or twice and to share moments and I dared called her grandma…
- Coco & Crystal laugh -
Crystal: -but she openly accepted (um,) but it’s just awesome and this whole interview there’s been this theme of love, family and (um) taking life by the balls and realising how short & precious it is and you are such a testament to living life to the full and being a true heart, and a true soul and you’re such a- (it-it-) To meet people that are in the game and are incredible at what they do and are esteemed and I meet them and I say “Oh hello oh I’m Crystal doo-do-doo-“ Because there are many people that I’ve yet to work with and get to work with that I work in the room and I know who they are, I know where they’ve been and I love their work but do you know what always is an amazing ice breaker Coco? Is that tell them that my cabaret mother is Coco DeVille.
(58:08)
Crystal: And they immediately- (it’s like-) they’re like “Ok this one is-you’re good, you’re fine, lets talk, lets hang out” you know what I mean?
Coco: Ooh thats amazing.
Crystal: It’s amazing and the world is full of amazingness and we just need to keep on making it turn through love and through positivity & change, lord knows I have learnt my lessons and I have had hurdles that I’ve had to jump and I have missed, but ultimately when we fall down and when we pick ourselves back up as performers and as people, we take every single lesson and we put it towards the future and we pay what we have learnt forward and what we have in our skills and our love and our care for each other forward as well and you are just one of the most caring, authentic, incredible people- I’ve spoken to you about things, I’ve spoken to you about incidents or people that have upset me and you’ve either gone; “there there you’ll be okay, everything will be okay, don’t worry about, lets focus on you & your health” and somedays you’ve been like “No get your bag we’re gonna go to her apartment-
Crystal: -and we’re just gonna talk about it, we’re not gonna do anything we’re just gonna talk about it”
Coco: “We’re just gonna talk, we’re just gonna talk, it’s alright!”
(59:18)
Crystal: “We’re just gonna talk!” (Um) And you just- you are such a caring person and I’m JEALOUS of Manchester-
Crystal: I’m so-so jealous of Manchester and these communities that have you in their realm at the moment cos lord knows where you’ll go next because you love to travel and you love to have new experiences, but wherever Coco DeVille goes that place is fucking spoilt my love!
Coco: Awww! I’m getting so emotional right now.
Crystal: So before we go Coco is anything that you wish to plug, is there anything you wish to advertise?
(59:56)
Coco: I am involved in a collective (er) it’s part of Duckie and it’s called The Posh Club, (um) and there’s various Posh Club’s all around London and Brighton, everything like that- basically it’s an event (um) for the elderly so it’s basically- the concept of it is a project to combat loneliness amongst the elderly people, but what- the way that we’re gonna combat this is creating communities and events under the guise of a fabulous, amazing cabaret show (um) and we’ve got stuff online so we’ve been producing bits & pieces online and things like that, but I just feel like this is a project that I think more people need to be aware of and try and support so whether you’re a performer (um) and you want to perform for these kinda crowds or whether you just wanna help and volunteer and just be in this environment, I think (you know) we’re in a point now - more than ever - as artists, any kinda point we can get, our work out in to the communities, out into groups of (er) people that might not necessarily come across performance and Duckie fun stuff, (like) now is the time to start breaking down those boundaries, (um) now’s the time to start being, (you know) sharing our work and our joy with all these different communities because now more than ever it’s more- it’s so needed.
(1:01:27)
Crystal: I’ve seen clips and I’ve seen little bits & bobs from The Posh Club and what they do through an amazing performer - who I’m sure you know of - is Rhys Pieces whose incredible and they do a lot of work with The Posh Club and it looks phenomenal (um) and I’m sure many people who are listening are gonna get on that instagram and hit them up and have a look and help support because one thing that lockdown has taught us is that community is everything and support is everything so Coco DeVille lastly I wanna that you’re incredible, you are amazing-
Coco: Awww!
(1:01:59)
Crystal: -I love you, I am so proud of you-
Coco: Love you too! Aw!
Crystal: -and I’m so excited for people that are listening that may not know of Coco DeVille- first of all; how dare you -
Crystal: -but secondly; how lucky they are to go and have a binge on your socials, on YouTube and I look forward to a day when we can get back on stage and I look forward to the day when we can do a bloody double act! Thats gotta happen!
Coco: Yeaaah! One day!
Crystal: We’ve had little moments but you know the world is our oyster and I truly have a vibe that we’ll kick arse and do a massive double act one day.
Coco: Yeah.
(1:02:33)
Crystal: But for now Coco thank you so much for being on my podcast, and thank you so much for being in my life-
Coco: Ooh my goodness.
Crystal: -you’ve saved me from really dark moments, you’ve saved me from really-really tumultuous times and you’ve saved me from my own demons and made me realise when I need to step up a little bit or maybe when I need to sort my own things out before I even try and sort someone else and you are such a kind, patient person and I thank you so-so much for being here today.
(1:03:02)
Coco: Oh no thats the thing all of that energy is just within yourself, all I did was just (kinda) change your perception on certain situations and all the rest was you so yeah!
Crystal: But Coco DeVille you are a beautiful human being, you’re an incredible performer, you’re an AWARD-WINNING DIVA!
Coco: OoOoOh!
Crystal: And I will see you in the next one my love.
Coco: Yes indeed, mwah! All the love!
Crystal: Mwah mwah! Take care my darling!
Coco: Mwah right bye!!
(1:03:27)
Crystal: Thank you so-so much to the absolutely incredible Coco DeVille for being my guest on today’s episode of What Are You Like?! If you wish to follow Coco thats @MsCoco DeVille on Instagram M-S-C-O-C-O-D-E-V-I-L-L-E on Instagram, give them a google, find them, love them, book them, the cabaret chameleon and drag mother of mine, they are just everything to me… If you wanna hit me up thats @CrystaLubrikunt on Instagram thats C-R-Y-S-T-A-L-U-B-R-I-K-U-N-T but for now stay camp, stay fabulous and just you know, treat yourself! Stay hydrated, have a bloody wank.
Crystal: I’ll see you in the next one, ta-rah… “Ta-rah?” What am I on about?
Episode Ends