with Jeff Dorchen follows the interview.Check out Caroline's book here: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/815354/stand-your-ground-by-caroline-light/Help keep This Is Hell! completely listener supported and access bonus episodes by subscribing to our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/thisishellPlease rate and review This Is Hell! wherever you get your podcasts. It really helps the show ascend the algorithm to reach new listeners.