Jason Park Interview

John: All right. So today I am speaking with Jason Park of Margo Park Financial in San Diego. Welcome, Jason.

Jason: Hi. Thank you.

John: So super glad to have you here. And you know, the topic of today's discussion, obviously, is how to serve clients remotely or virtually. And before we get into that, I would love to talk to you a little bit about what you got. You started in the business. What drives you? And why do you serve clients?

Jason: Sure. OK. So I started, I guess you'd say started by helping my dad, who was an advisor at Wells Fargo, and I was in high school. And then from there I went to college and then I interned at Goldman Sachs and their asset management division. And I just kind of saw that whole world, the broker world and how it worked, especially working at Goldman Sachs. I saw how the wholesale side worked where you got these guys just trying to sell their funds through brokers. And so I learned all this and I did college, did a job, and then I got into insurance sales and became a top producer. But that was all commission. And it was just a huge hustle every day. And even the top guys were just nonstop selling. And then there was an opportunity to add my securities license because an insurance company I worked for had an independent broker dealer they were affiliated with. So I got my series seven sixty six. And then I was the financial advisor for the whole branch. So I was the only one. So if other agents needed help with clients or prospects who had investments, they had to bring me along and then I could help advise. But like I was still stuck in this broker world. And even just I mean, I was selling funds making five point seven, five percent front load commissions like my dad did and like Goldman Sachs was trying to sell through people like my dad and I happened to come across this one page study and it was from dimensional funds who I'd never heard of. And it had this amazing, terrifying statistic of, you know, over 20 years. If you look at all the mutual funds that exist, a fraction of them are still around. And then a very, very small fraction of that fraction were still around and beat their benchmarks. And that was just an eye-opening pivotal day for me because I thought. So you're saying all this time, all these funds that I'm selling to my clients, I only have the slim, slim percentage chance that they're going to do better. And so I just delved into the whole dimensional, like, you know, all their papers and talked to them. And I discovered like, OK, there is a better way and evidence based way, you know, scientific way that I can give my clients the best chance. And that meant also going independent and becoming an RIAA and no commissions. So that's just kind of been my evolution, I think. I think a lot of insurance agents kind of go through the same thing or will eventually come to the same crossroads that I did. Is they're going to realize there's a better way than just selling for commission and they're gonna have to choose whether to go in the arm, a fee based or fee only model or stay where they're at. And I think it becomes then an ethical issue of I know what's best for the client is no conflicts and commissions are inherently conflict driven. I mean, I mean, they're just baked into the design. So, yeah, that's my evolution. And then since then, I just have been just doing that. You know, fees only and helping clients. I do insurance once in a while when necessary, just as part of the planning process, because insurance is almost always part of the deal. But I'll donate all of the commissions generated from commission sales so I can stay conflict free. And the clients know that. And so, you know, I don't have to choose between a more expensive product that might pay me more versus a cheaper one that pays me less because I'm not going to keep it anyway.

Justin You would say you donate the commissions from products. Do you donate them to the client? Or do you donate to a charity?

Jason Yeah. Yeah. An actual donation. Because I can't donate it to the client or its rebating, which is a no no. Like I want to. I looked into that and while I think like the place that I go through for my insurance sales, they told me that maybe technically in California it's rebating is OK. The insurance carriers themselves are very you know, no on it. It just I think the idea is that it gets an unfair advantage that if one agent touts hey oh, you'll I'll share my commission with you and therefore I'll make the sale. It's not fair to the other agents who're not going to share commissions. So I'll do it to charity. If the client wants a particular one. Great. Let's just do it there. Just because if I'm going to get ten ninety nine the commission, then at least I can help get the donation to help offset that income that I'm not keeping.

John That is fantastic. That's pretty dedicated to making that model that you've built pure. Well, fantastic. So. And that's what's interesting and powerful. But something is equally powerful about the way you service clients is that you are primarily virtual or remote when you serve as clients. Is that right?

Jason Yeah. And it wasn't by design. Definitely not in the beginning, because the way that I was taught how to service clients in the insurance business was just go drive to your client's kitchen and sit down at their kitchen table, meet with them one on one. We focused on retirees and it was a lot of driving and it was great. Like, I love the little one on one face to face, comfortable setting. They don't come to my office. We don't have to go to a restaurant or a Starbucks. So I've done that. It's just that really personal touch. I love that. But if the driving wasn't sustainable, it's exhausting. And so as I grew, I just didn't have time to just go drive to my clients. And so and then simultaneously, like these are all primarily retirees. They were getting comfortable with texting and emojis. And it was amazing. I'll never forget, like the first text I ever got from my retiree clients in their 80s sending me an emoji or a bitmoji, you know, like them themselves. That's actually the first time I ever saw a big mojie was up my 80 year old client and I thought it was fantastic. So they're getting more comfortable with it. I am not wanting to drive anymore. And it was just a natural progression of, well, the texting. And I'll text back an email and they'll email, you know. You know, oh, I should say Blueleaf has been mine rocksteady like foundation from the beginning of all this. Like when I was transitioning from being an independent broker dealer, you know, the insurance company I was working at, I knew that I needed something that would make the client feel like there's not much changing, even though there was a lot changing. So I had all of their current accounts sync up and I could see it all. And so when I transitioned over and I had said, you know, go to a custodian and move their accounts over. It didn't feel different to them. The experience was the same. And so, you know, the Sunday morning e-mails that they get every week, like it's like that also helped me become more and more virtual. Because they are used to all this virtual stuff anyway So, yeah. So now at this point, it's mostly just phone calls. I'll do a screen share and I'll have them like, you know, just join it and I can show them stuff and I'll talk to them on the phone and texting. A lot of texting.

John So a lot of texting. So. And I'll come back to texting. I think a lot of advisors are going to be interested to hear how you handle compliance on that end. But before we get there. So it sounds like the foundation of your communication with clients is this idea of having a digitally based reporting system. Can you talk a little bit about how you thought about that and how your usage of that evolved? It sounds like you also do virtual meetings now, so. So talk a little bit about.

Jason Yeah. So. OK. We'll see. So. OK. Clients are used to getting statements virtually like their bank statements. You know, like every time you log on, it's like it forces you basically to like opt in, opt in, opt in. So there are they're accustomed to things being virtual related to finance. And so having Blueleaf be this thing which is similar to like what they're already getting and experiencing was very helpful. So every Sunday they get their weekly emails like they might even reply to it. And it comes to me, which is fantastic how you set that up. And then I can see the reply and I can reply back. And if they call me up and I'm talking to them through it and they're referring to their weekly statement, I'll just pull up my email because I bcse myself on the settings that you can put for compliance. And I'll just pull up their most recent weekly statement from Blueleaf and then we'll just go down and then usually hit. It's just like, oh yeah. Look, if you just keep scrolling down, you'll see account by account the change and then that's usually all they want to see. Yeah, so Blueleaf being my foundation, it's like my client system. I mean, I think the value is OK, so the clients experience, they just see the weekly emails. I don't even know if they really know how to log in to see their Blueleaf stuff. I know that they already have a log on for one custodian and we use a different custodian for different accounts like they already have different accounts. Log on and they have different statements. I doubt that they're really, really using this for log. Another log on, but they get the weekly emails and that's key. The other thing is that I can look in Blueleaf and analyze their accounts in one place and I can tell them like, OK, look, your performance for the past seven days, 30 days, you're inception across all your accounts, across all the various custodians. It's just right there live. And so I don't have to manually go into each custodian and analyze things. It's all there in one place. And I have run those reports where, you know, it's like my little picture and all that stuff for them. It's not that frequent just because they're content with the Sunday emails and it's like the right amount of information that they need. And it's really simple.

John Got it. So it sounds like reporting for you is kind of evolved into something that instead of a static PDAF has become something that's much more interactive and even driven by push messaging. In the case of the weekly email.

Jason Yeah, precisely right.

John And that it sounds like how you handle some of the ad hoc requests and sort of the regular day to day. Can you talk about a process that you might have for regular meetings or regular reviews with clients? How do you do that remotely?

Jason I think that maybe I should do more regularly scheduled meetings than I am. Just because the interactions that I don't know if this is just different in how I talk to her serves my clients, but it's so informal and again, not official, and so like, you know, they might have a question that they text me and then that might necessitate me to go into Blueleaf and look analyze something, look at past performance or or the allocation or something. So then I'll call him back and then either I'll share my screen and show them when I'm looking at on Blueleaf or I'll just talk it through and then just getting the information. And it's like. There isn't really like an official quarterly meeting of look at this report that I create and look at me. And I'm gonna like it like a teacher or a lecturer. It's like really informal. And it's just what they want to talk about and what they're interested in. And I think that's part of why I'm their advisor, is they they just trust me to do right by them and take care of the stuff that they either don't want to do or they don't understand. And true, I don't know just that Sunday email is like, it's something so profoundly helpful and simple for me and the client. It's like a weekly meeting, they get virtually that I don't have to create a report for. It's already done for me. So I don't know if that's like maybe a poor answer, but.

John Well, if I could summarize, I mean, what I but I think I heard you say is by going digital and having on demand information and push information, the need for what was a much more traditional process. Just went away.

Jason Yeah basically. And that's I don't know if I'm out of compliance by that happening, but my clients are happy. They're still getting updated. I mean, yeah.

Justin Jason, I had a question. Imagine being virtual. We're moving whatever in virtual and then on demand sending out reports. You just being virtual in general can be kind of scary to some advisors because they grossly underestimate their clients. Have you gotten pushback from prospects or clients given your process?

Jason I mean, if anything, like my out-of-state clients who I wouldn't regularly go see anyway. Right. And I only saw them once ever. And, you know, they're like, I want you to come out again. They're in Oklahoma. And I say, okay, I really should make another trip out there. But no. Like all my local clients who I could easily go see and drive to. Nobody's begging me to come back to their, you know, their kitchen table. That said, I think because I don't know if it's like a front load. So much of the relationship in the beginning that it it it's already like a really warm, informal, friendly relationship that it has allowed me maybe to be virtual from here on out now, you know, like they already know me. They have a good sense of me. They get a good flavor of you. Okay. I know who this is. And I can be informed with this guy. And he knows my favorite flowers, tulips, and he knows about my cat and that no, no pushback at all, which I have been a little surprised about. But again, it's also Ben, like, you know, the texting that they originate to me and the emojis and bit more Jesus like they're doing it. So I'm just doing it back. And I and I just have realized that it's okay. And they like it. So.

John What is the mix for you of communicating with your clients via phone vs. video conferencing? How much do you use video? You know what? How do you use that tool?

Jason OK. So I think I read this somewhere about some other advisor that when he does virtual meetings, he doesn't actually use his webcam like this. It's just he'll do the screen share. And I thought, that's very smart because I can just be in my pajamas and then talk to my client and show them all the stuff on the screen then ever seen. And I'll just have him on the phone. Which is better quality, I think, for audio. I've kind of stuck with it. I mean, if you look here like this is my home office and it's like this messy non white whiteboard and like this old door, I don't know that this is the best place to do a video conference like I kind of I'd like to do or at least experiment with that. But have a national background, maybe set up a camera with like a gray backdrop with the light on it, the right lighting. And I'd like to see what that does. But nobody's really asked me to see my face like they're happy on the phone and seeing my screen or just phone.

John And it sounds like your client satisfaction is still remaining high.

Jason Yeah, I think so. I mean, this is just me as a person, I think. Yeah, I think in life, not just with clients or relationships or friendships, but I try to make things as informal as possible as quickly as possible. That's just me as a person because I think it's just more fun, natural. You know, since I approach my clients that way too, even if it's a first time meeting with a prospect. I will purposely try to interject comments or things to get it really informal and then just have everybody feel comfortable. Obviously, in addition to all the necessary things like helpful things and analysis and all that stuff, but it's kind of like a value of mine. So yeah, I even forgot what your question was. Sorry.

Justin And so you're using the screen cast instead of a lot of video. What tools are you using for that? Do you have multiple you have based on the client or is it really just you your staple go-to.

Jason OK. Good. So in addition to my foundational value of making things informal, another thing of mine is keeping things super simple for the end person. So I was just going to say client. But even like my mom. Right. Or like a friend. I want to make it as easy and enjoyable as possible for that end person. So any kind of software that would require a download on their side. I don't want to. So like I'd looked at zoom and go to meeting, I'm used to some other stuff. There's a free video screen and the screen share software called whereby. So where? Buy.com you can sign up for free and then have your own name. So whereby dot com slash your name re-affirming or whatever and it doesn't require any download that's free. I've actually purchased a few video screen software things. I just haven't really tested them out. I'm part of the subscriber list for app Sumo's app Sumo's like this great software tool thing and they like to promote software that's usually cheaper and a lot of times are lifetime deals. So you just purchase it once and then no subscription. So I think I've purchased two or three different screen share or video conferencing things and I just haven't really tested them out.

John And I'm curious about how you've extended this kind of virtual approach to prospecting in your earn your sales process. You know, I'm sure you've got digital marketing. But once someone becomes an actual prospect, they believe they are qualified. I'm curious, you know, how you apply some of this virtual approach during that process.

Jason OK. So if it's a prospect, if it's local, I will still meet face to face. You know, again, like I try to front load. I know if I try, but I just naturally frontload the relationship right in the beginning, just a lot of like good feelings and they're happy. So I will meet them. And then after that, the rest of it, like everything can be done over the computer now, so, you know, we can dock you signed documents, we can open accounts just online. Will you even need a wet signature anymore for anything? Maybe some old school insurance places might require that. But I came in, just sent them the document, they signed it and then like to take a picture of it and send it back or something. So anyway, if it's local, I will try to meet them in person like I do like that. If they're too far away. I mean the phone. I don't know if people just underestimate the phone because also if you think of the retiree clients that I have. Like they grew up with that first. Right. The phone was first and then whatever computer and other things. So they're very comfortable chatting. And I don't know if it's a skill. Maybe you can, like, get better at phone call communication and just also get really friendly and like to have things informal pretty quickly just over the phone. Texting is also I think texting is a skill, too, though, of like sending things that are professional or helpful and also like adding in a little bit of fun. Right. Like these emojis and stuff. So we think I had a younger client who first contacted me, I think via text he was younger. So he's used to texting and we didn't so much back and forth, just the attacks. And then later we met for the first time. And, you know, again, like I want to make sure the end person has a comfortable, easy and formal fun experience. So if they want to communicate that way, I will communicate via the same way.

John So it really sounds like I mean, there is a real theme here for me, listening to the way you think about how you communicate with clients and it's empathy. It feels like you start with what would be good for this person as well as me, but what would be good for them? And then you add a little bit of personality in there.

Jason Yeah, that's great. That's a great summary. And I didn't realize that myself.

John Yeah.

Jason Well, you're totally right.

John I'm curious, you know, for advisers who are listening, who are thinking about going virtual with their client service. Do you have any things that you recommend they may think about or things that they should be doing first?

Jason I'm sorry. The question was with people who were starting.

John Yeah. Yeah. How should an advisor who's interested in serving clients digitally get started?

Jason Oh, I see. OK. Well if they are using Blueleaf then they're ahead of the game because again, that was my foundation. If they're not, then use Blueleaf like it is a no brainer, especially if you use multiple custodians and if you like communications sent on your behalf that come from you. And if they were, if the client replies to that, it comes directly to you, then Blueleaf. What other things? Like I use another tool, but this is just part of. I don't know if this is more specific to my planning process. I don't know. OK. So if they feel if a client's sorry, if a new advisor wants to do more virtual meetings and use virtual tools. Practice talking on the phone a lot because you'll be doing that. Try a screen, a free screen, share a video conferencing software like whereby there's so many others. Just try one of them. Maybe practice with your friends or family first and make sure like, you know, the quality is good. And then also you come across well, like the way that you want to come across. Really in not much health, I don't think. And maybe just experiment like try it with your best client and make it not official, like, hey. I want to try this virtually just naturally start using these things and then notice the ways in which they're virtually communicating with you and just respond in the same medium.

John We encourage experimentation. That seems to be a very successful strategy to be flexible and I think a little less formal in experimenting. Seems to work well in your experience doing this now for several years. Are there any mistakes that you, you've seen others make or made yourself that you think that other advisors should try to avoid?

Jason Huh? Let me think. I mean, I can imagine that if you're not ready for a video conference and then your video screens up and then, you know, that could be awkward weather. Weather, like I'm just saying, like you're in your pajamas and they didn't know. But like, maybe I don't know if you have a kid running around in the back or the background looks like my background, you know. And then you don't want to come across like this guy is my advisor or is he working out of like above his garage? Maybe prep that. Like, I can imagine that being a mistake. Let me think. Oh, I mean, OK. So there have been times when I've tried to use the screen share software and it just didn't work for the end person. We just had to roll over that and just do it over the phone. Right. So just like be ready that the attack may not work at that time. But that was like something that I know, for me, I wanted him to have a good experience. I really didn't like it when I wanted it to work because I had stuff to show him and I told him he was going to see things. So I don't know, maybe just ahead of time pre debug the technology you're using. And that's why I like to try with your friends or family first. And you. Sure. Like it's super smooth. The link works. There's no question about it. Oh, yeah. I have an adviser under me who's younger and so he's even more savvy with this technology. Is Hild text the link to the client? And he'll text it with spaces so that it doesn't show up as a link on the phone to tap. But it's very clearly broken out. That's a tip, I think. So that there's no question on what the you are ELAs if you're sending them to a site.

John Fantastic. Well, Jason, thank you. It's been really educational speaking with you and learning about your business. You know, look forward to chatting with you again in the future.

Jason Thank you so much. Yeah, my pleasure.

John And everyone, that's Jason Park of Margo Park Financial in San Diego. And we're out. Wow, thanks a ton, Jason.

Jason Yeah. You're very welcome.