Life on Side B: Recent Episodes
Josh Proctor
Exploring the joy, beauty, and challenges of living in the traditional sexual ethic as LGBT+/SSA Christians.
We are back! We missed you! Josh is back with Eve Tushnet who has some big news to share especially for Catholic listeners. Also Josh has good news about Season 6. We can't wait to be back with you soon for Season 6!
All six cohosts hop on a call together to discuss this past season, what they have learned about reclaiming and very important news about season six and the future of the podcast.
Dr. Nate Collins, President of Revoice, is on the podcast for the first time to talk with Henry and Elizabeth about what it looks like to reclaim joy in the midst of life's circumstances.
Elizabeth and Josh are joined by Ed Shaw from Living Out to talk about reclaiming identity. Check out the Living Out Podcast as well as Ed's book, "Same-Sex Attraction and the Church".
Eve is back with us as she unpacks with Josh and Ashley the reality behind sanctification, transformation and growing in holiness. God calls us to grow in our faith but what does this look like.
Check out Eve's newest book called Tenderness if you are interested in learning more.
We are continuing the reclaiming theme as Josh and Ashley talk with Janelle Look and Alex Shippee about prayer ministry.
You can contact Janelle or Alex by emailing janelle@revoice.org. Also the code for $10 off Revoice registration is: RevoicePod
Finally, support Linden Hope's Kickstarter before November 22 through the following link: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lindseyhope/songs-for-the-bees-a-gay-womans-journey-of-faith
Dr. Julia Sadusky is back on the podcast talking with Josh about both her last book that she wrote with Dr. Mark Yarhouse on Trans Identity and Faith as well as her new solo authored book called "Talking to Your Kids about Sex." This is a question we get a lot from our parents who listen so it was great to have her on.
Henry and Josh sit down to talk about the phrase "grace and truth." This is a phrase often used within Christian conversations around sexuality. Is there truth to this phrase? How has it been misused? Also why does it seem to only be used in this conversation? Henry and Josh talk through their experiences with this phrase and what it might look like to reclaim the truth of it.
Bekah and Henry get together to talk about reclaiming family, how to engage with your family of origin and what it looks like to create chosen family.
The recording from our live episode at Revoice 23 is finally here. Recording in the month of June, we thought it only appropriate to talk about reclaiming Pride. What is our place in pride as Side B Christians? There are a lot of gold moments in this episode and our intern, Jacob, joins us as the host!
To finish out our mini-series, Bekah and Grant get together to talk about glorification. What are we moving toward? Will we still be queer in the Kingdom? Also hear Josh's spontaneous drop in to give a thought. You know he can't stay away from a theological discussion.
This is the third episode in our four part mini-series on the Gospel arch and how it relates to the queer experience. Elizabeth and Henry take us to church on what it means to be saved by Jesus, bringing wisdom from their experience as black and latino queer people. The conversation was so good that Josh could not help but step into the episode for a bit.
We were a little delayed in getting this episode posted but it is finally here! Josh and Bekah are joined by our intern Jacob to talk about the theology around sin and the Fall and how it relates to our experiences as queer Christians.
We are starting a min-series for the next four episodes looking at the theology around the topics of creation, fall, redemption, and glorification and how they relate to the queer experience. In this episode, Ashley, Grant and Josh talk about the theology of creation, the Image of God and queerness.
Josh talks with Ashley and Elizabeth about their experiences of femininity and what is biblical femininity.
The resources mentioned in this episode include:
- Ruby Slippers: How the Soul of a Woman Brings Her Home by Jonalyn Grace Fincher
- The Biblical World of Gender: The Daily Lives of Ancient Women and Men
- Redeeming Sex by Debra Hirsch
- https://www.instagram.com/p/Cnk-QGNJWSv/?igshid=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ%3D%3D
Henry and Grant get together to kiki about experiences of masculinity. Gay men are often seen as lacking in masculinity. How do we reclaim it? Don't miss their conversation which includes crop tops, fitness and nipples.
You can see the video that Henry mentions at the beginning here.
Elizabeth and Grant go live from the Brian Eckstein Podcast Stage at QCF 2023! They talk about what it looks like to reclaim intimacy as queer Christians and more specifically Side B Christians. Is intimacy primarily about sex? What does intimacy look like outside sexual relationships? What can the broader LGBT+ Christian community glean from the experience of Side B Christians with intimacy? The cohosts share from their experience and engage with questions from the audience. Thanks to QCF for having us once again!
Season 5 is finally here! After a delay in recording, the cohosts are back to talk about our new season theme: reclaiming. What does it look like to take ahold of the truth of the things that have been weaponized against us?
The cohosts recorded a live episode at Revoice 22 to finish out the season. We ran into some technical difficulties so the cohosts recorded some extra content during a retreat. They talk about what they learned this season and answer questions from the audience. Listen till the end to hear some exciting announcements!
For our last patron chosen episode of the season, Kristyn Komarnicki joins Josh, Grant, and Henry to talk about relationships across belief spectrums. Kristyn works as the director of dialogue and convening at Christians for Social Action and she is the creator of Oriented to Love dialogues about sexual/gender diversity in the church. Kristyn gathers Christians of different sexual orientations, gender identities, and theological convictions together so they can begin to know, understand, and love each other, in search of a unity that is deeper than agreement. Josh, Grant and Henry have all participated (or "gone through" as we say in the episode) in Oriented to Love dialogues. We engage with her on what she has learned from these dialogues about building relationships with people that belief differently than us.
As we draw close to the end of our season, Henry and Grant talk with our friend Gabriel about resilience and living with HIV. They discuss "poster child" culture in churches, what it is like to live with HIV today and much more.
Dean is back with us! His episode in Season 1 (S1E4 | Dean on Mixed-Orientation Marriage) has stood as a fan favorite episode. Today, he is back on the podcast with Ashley and Henry to give us a life update which includes that fact that he and Lisa have now divorced. Dean gifts us with his vulnerability as he shares about the resilience in his own life through the past few years. We cannot talk about marriage without also talking about the reality of divorce. Thank you, Dean, for the gifts that you continue to give to our community.
If you are interested in checking out the playlist Dean put together you can find it here:
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0Sm704MLmZtgYRHLsYAq9w
Wes Hill is back and John Starke joins us as well! Bekah and Ashley talk with them about prayer and how it plays into resilience.
Elizabeth and Bekah sit down with the legendary straight ally, Misty Irons. Misty has been advocating for and standing in the line of fire for queer people in the church for multiple decades. Her work for our community means she has in many ways shared in the church hurt and marginalization that too often happens to queer people in faith settings. Elizabeth, Bekah, and Misty come together in this episode to discuss the difficult question, "Should I stay or should I leave my church?" They each share some of their experience related to this complex question. We hope it can help give you some insights if and when you process these questions around finding a church home, especially after experiencing church hurt.
Grant talks with artist Joel Briggs about creativity and storytelling in art and how they all help us live with resilience. Joel Briggs is a fine arts painter based in San Diego, California. He works predominantly in contemporary figurative representational oil painting. His work currently explores the intersection of traditional religious symbolism with the present-day embodied experiences of shame and sexuality. His work can be found on Instagram @joelbriggspaints
In this episode, Elizabeth sits down with our good friends Adelynn and Ben to talk about their experiences of faith and gender as trans Christians. They discuss transitioning, dysphoria, the trans feminine experience and what they would love to see change in the trans conversation occurring in Christian faith communities.
Important note for those new to the trans conversation: Side B is a theological view specifically on sexual ethics and marriage, not gender identity. Therefore Side B Christians have diverse views on gender identity and trans Christians in Side B spaces express their gender in diverse ways. Conversations like these are important opportunities for our cisgender listeners and community members to take a posture of humility and listen.
This week's episode topic was picked by our patrons. Josh and Ashley are talking with Keifer Lucchi, a missionary in Central Europe, and Jesse White, a university student preparing to go into missions in East Asia. From navigating missions organizations to cultural contexts, all four of them share about their experiences in missions from Latin America to Europe to Asia. Thank you to our patrons who chose this topic!
Art Pereira is back and talking with Elizabeth about the committed friendships in his life. Elizabeth also shares about important committed friendships in her life as well. What does commitment look like in friendship especially when it is with a friend who is or plans to marry? What does resilience look like in relationships?
Johana Marie Williams has returned to the podcast to talk with Bekah and Grant about processing doubt and deconstruction. Deconstruction especially has been a main topic of discussion recently. So how do we engage this discussion around faith and sexuality? What do we do when we find ourselves in the midst of a time of deconstruction? Listen now to hear our cohosts and Johana Marie share from their experiences.
Mary, our cohost from Season 2, is BACK! She has returned home to Life on Side B to talk with Ashley, Grant, and Josh about how we engage with queer media as Side B Christians. What media most impacted us? How do we engage it when our values are different? What counts as queer baiting? This episode gets a little unhinged but we hope you enjoy this special Pride month episode.
This episode has been a long time coming. Grant talks with Collin, Michelle, and Will about asexuality and grey sexuality. They cover various aspects of their experiences as ace Christians pursuing celibacy.
Paolo Errico joins Josh this week to talk about sexual integrity. How does it differ from sexual purity? How does the closet work against the process of integrity in queer lives? How do we restore integrity when our lives begin to compartmentalize? Paolo and Josh share vulnerably from each of their experiences pursuing sexual integrity and we hope it can be helpful for you all.
Here are the books that were mentioned in the episode:
- The Deeply Formed Life by Rich Villodas
- Tenderness by Eve Tushnet
This is a conversation we have been looking forward to for a long time. Many of you know of Jackie Hill Perry. Today, Elizabeth, Henry and Ashley are sitting down with her to talk about her newest book, Holier Than Thou, plus the intersection of faith and sexuality and how she navigates conversations on racial justice.
Lesli is back and talking with Henry and Bekah about grief - grief over the loss of their wife, the loss of sexual intimacy in a life of celibacy, and the pain of church hurt. There is so much wisdom packed in this episode. Lesli shares how embracing grief helps us embrace God.
Josh is talking this week with Sarah Claire Smith, a licensed mental health counselor and the soul care director at Providencia WPB, where Josh attends. Sarah Claire shares about what is means to listen to your own story in order to process trauma and pain so that we can better engage in healthy community.
The book Sarah Clair quotes is My Grandmother's Hands: Racialized Trauma and the Pathway to Mending Our Hearts and Bodies by Resmaa Menakem
Today, Ashley, Elizabeth and Josh are getting "back to basics," discussing the question: "What do we wish we would have known back when we came out and entered Side B spaces for the first time?"
This week, Greg Piken is joining us from SoCal and sharing insights as a counselor on how to build emotional resilience in our lives. Josh and Bekah talk with him about working through breakdowns, processing second adolescence, and how to support each other in a community such as the Side B LGBT+ Christian community which has high levels of trauma.
This week, Bridget Eileen Rivera is back and talking with Henry about her new book, Heavy Burdens. You can tell from his questions that Henry has read this book more than once! They have a great conversation. Pick up your copy of Heavy Burdens today!
This week, we are sharing the recording from the live episode we did at the Q Christian Fellowship conference last month (January 2022). Elizabeth and Grant talk together about confronting shame as queer Christians and especially as Side B Christians. Thank you to everyone who attended and sent in questions!
We are finally back for Season 4! The cohosts are together again and talking about our season theme: the road to resilience. This is probably the most bible references we have ever made on the podcast so get ready. We hope you enjoy it.
The poem Ashley mentions is called "The One Hoss Shay" by Oliver Wendell Holmes. Thank you to Matthew Kaal (@matthewkaal on Twitter) for directing us to the name of the poem!
As we get ready for Season 4, we wanted to take this chance to get to know Elizabeth a little more. Josh and Elizabeth sit down to chat about her journey, her newly formed ministry called Kaleidoscope, and what it looks like to share your faith with others as a Christian who is queer and Side B. Learn more about Elizabeth on our team page at lifeonsideb.com/ourteam
Por fin, publicamos nuestro segundo capitulo en español. En este capitulo, Ashley habla con Jan de Puerto Rico sobre su experiencia de ser un cristiano gay y célibe. Hablan de todo un poco, incluyendo como pertenecer a la comunidad en la distancia (cultural, fisica, de lenguaje, etc).
The cohost team got together in person while attending Revoice 2021 last week and talked about Season 3, what impacted us most, and what we learned. It was great to have multiple friends and listeners We have a lot of exciting news and can't wait for you to hear!
1:21 - Begin discussion on Season 3
25:00 - Announcing Sarah's departure
30:58 - Announcing Elizabeth as a new cohost
44:32 - Milk & Honey Podcast Announcement
As we promised earlier in the season, Scott Herr is joining Grant to talk about being gay and Catholic as we were unable to include a Catholic voice in the Faith Tradition Diversity episode. Scott shares about his experience converting to Catholicism and how his sexual identity and faith relate to each other within the framework of Catholicism.
We are getting close to the end of season 3. Sarah is talking with Johana-Marie and Shelby about their experience of faith, sexuality, and gender as queer black women. Each of these wisdom has amazing wisdom in what they share.
Johana-Marie mentions an article called "Black is My Gender" by Hari Ziyad. Here is the link to check it out: https://afropunk.com/2017/07/my-gender-is-black/
Gregg Webb is back with us, joined as well by his long time friend Michelle. As we talked about being Side B in ministry in our last episode, it seemed only fitting to talk about what it is like being Side B outside vocational ministry. Sarah talks with Gregg and Michelle about what it is like to navigate sexuality and faith in their work environments.
The Brilliant Bee Patrons chose another episode topic and the winner was: Being Queer in Ministry. So today, Bekah is talking with Anderson McGee about his experience as an out bisexual pastor. Does being in vocational ministry make it easier or harder to be Side B? Anderson has been Co-Pastor, with his wife Sarah, of Trinity Family Midtown since December 2016 and co-Executive Director of Love Wins.:LGBT - a ministry of Trinity Family Midtown Church of the Nazarene, making Christ-like disciples in the LGBTQ+ Community by engaging the culture and equipping the Church.
Lesli Hudson-Reynolds is back as a guest cohost and talking with Lo about trans* inclusion. For this episode, we wanted to have a discussion with only trans voices and without the necessity to "cis-splain". This means we gave Lesli and Lo the freedom to talk about whatever they would like to discuss without needing to explain or define anything for cisgender listeners. If you would like an episode to listen to as an introduction to the trans conversation, we recommend going back and listening to S1E6 | Lesli on Being Genderqueer.
This is the last episode for the season on Side B globally and Bekah is talking with Adrian who lives with Hungary. Christian Johnston is also back and sharing from his experience as an American who lived in Poland. They discuss Adrian's experience as a British gay man living in Hungary, how the sexuality discussion looks in different parts of Europe compared to North America, and much more.
Greg Coles is back on the podcast and he is talking with Henry, Grant, and Josh about his new book - No Longer Strangers. This episode was delightful!
Order your copy of No Longer Strangers here: Amazon - https://www.amazon.com/No-Longer-Strangers-Belonging-Alienation/dp/0830847901 Barnes and Noble - https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/no-longer-strangers-gregory-coles/1137334317 IVP Press - https://www.ivpress.com/no-longer-strangers
Hear more about what Greg is up to on his website: https://www.gregorycoles.com/
In this week's episode, Josh and Ashley are talking with Lucas about his experience of being Side B in Brazil. We talk about what the conversation around faith, sexuality and gender looks like in Brazil, how Exodus looks different and/or similar than Exodus looked in the States, and Lucas' experience of coming out in Brazil.
Here are resources in Portuguese which Lucas mentioned as well as others which he put together for anyone interested:
RECURSOS SELECIONADOS EM PORTUGUÊS
Informativo
Os Lados da Questão (The Sides Framework, in Portuguese)
https://bit.ly/4Lados
Gálatas 3:28 (Instagram)
https://instagram.com/galatas328/ Exodus no Brasil e na América Latina (matérias)
https://apublica.org/especial/nega-te-a-ti-mesmo/
Ortodoxo (Lado B) Vivendo em Comunhão
https://instagram.com/vivemcomunhao/
Conflictu (podcast)
https://twitter.com/conflictucast
Documento de LoveWins.:LGBT
https://trinityfamilyonline.org/s/Documento-de-Posico-das-Testemunhas-Fieis-portugues.pdf
Conservador (Lado Y)
Andréa Vargas
https://estantedaandrea.com
Íris Projeto
https://facebook.com/irisprojetoficial Courage Brasil
https://youtube.com/c/CourageBrasil/videos
Progressista (Lado A)
Giovanni Alecrim
https://medium.com/de-casa-em-casa/entender-e-acolher-75409c7e8174
Aceitos pelo Reino
https://youtube.com/channel/UC1XyP0xqirKqIX9b-YvfOwA/videos?sort=da
Evangélicxs pela Diversidade
https://novosdialogos.com/author/evangelicxs/
PUBLICAÇÕES SELECIONADAS EM PORTUGUÊS
Ed Shaw
https://www.amazon.com.br/Atracao-Pessoas-Mesmo-Sexo-Plausibilidade-ebook/dp/B07DPW73TF/
Pedro Dulci
https://tuxdoc.com/download/identidade-e-sexualidade-pedro-dulci_pdf
Álvaro Pestana
https://www.scribd.com/document/494642611/SEMPRE-ME-PERGUNTAM-Capitulo-14-Deus-aprova-a-homossexualidade
Sam Allberry
https://www.amazon.com.br/Deus-contra-homossexuais-homossexualidade-ebook/dp/B08BRF5RG3/
Marília de Camargo César
http://lelivros.love/book/baixar-livro-entre-a-cruz-e-o-arco-iris-marilia-de-camargo-cesar-em-pdf-epub-e-mobi-ou-ler-online/
Jackie Hill Perry
https://www.amazon.com.br/Garota-gay-bom-Deus-historia-ebook/dp/B08DTDDDWB/
Wunibald Müller
https://www.estantevirtual.com.br/livros/wunibald-muller/pessoas-homossexuais/2269424382
Aelredo de Rievaulx
https://www.cultordelivros.com.br/produto/amizade-espiritual-oracao-pastoral-78391
Frederico Lourenço
https://docero.com.br/doc/nxecn8x
You may be asking, "What is a Queer Orientation Marriage?" It is the best name we could come up with for this episode. Ashley and Sarah are talking with Aaron and Liz Munson about being in a mixed orientation marriage as two queer people. They discuss attraction within relationship, the place other friendships hold in their lives, and how they navigate talking about their sexual identities with their kids. Ashley already says this is one of her favorite episodes to date.
Mentioned Resources:
-
Book series: God’s Design for Sex https://www.christianbook.com/gods-design-books-revised-updated-edition/stan-jones/pd/53133X?kw=21904556532&mt=b&dv=m&event=PPCSRC&p=1186432&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjpCn75nM8QIVMm1vBB3LzQSJEAAYASAAEgKqyPD_BwE
-
Christian Sexuality (for ages 12 and up) - https://christian-sexuality.com
-
Straight to Heaven: A Gay Christian Parody Musical - https://youtu.be/25AJi2H18UY
Sporadically throughout the season we will be talking with Side B Christians around the globe outside North America looking at what it looks like to live out Side B in their context. This is the second part of a two part conversation where Henry and Grant are talking with Mwendia Steve who lives in Kenya. This is a powerful conversation especially highlighting what it looks like to have so much joy even while facing so much difficulty. You won't want to miss this so go ahead and tune in.
This is the first of a few episodes we are going to do sporadically throughout the season focusing on what it is like to hold to a Side B Christian view around the globe outside North America. This week we have a two part conversation where Henry and Grant are talking with Mwendia Steve who lives in Kenya. This is a powerful conversation especially highlighting what it looks like to have so much joy even while facing so much difficulty. You won't want to miss this so go ahead and tune in.
In this episode, Johanna Finegan is back and talking with Ashley and Sarah about female inclusion in Side B spaces. They discuss history of female inclusion in Side B spaces over the years, the difficulties and the things that make them hopeful for the future. This is only our second episode with all female voices with our first being S2E4, and that is a reality which needs to become more common in the future.
In this episode, the following resources are mentioned:
Gay and Catholic by Eve Tushnet
Hole in My Heart Podcast by Laurie Krieg
The Life on Side B cohost family is back together this week (minus Henry) and Sarah is back for the first time in a bit. In honor of Pride month, we are discussing what each of our relationships with the broader LGBTQ community looks like and what chosen family means to us. Each cohost has a different experience and perspective which lends to a great conversation about the diversity of Side B Christians' experiences on this topic. Join us and Happy Pride Month!
The book Sarah mentions is Black Girl Dangerous by Mia McKenzie. Here is the link to the book on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Black-Dangerous-Queerness-Class-Gender/dp/0988628635/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=black+girl+dangerous&qid=1623177916&sr=8-1
If you want to listen to our bonus episode on Pride Month from last year, join our patreon community at patreon.com/lifeonsideb
This week we are sharing the recording from our live episode event that we did on May 20th. Bekah, Grant, Josh, and Ashley (plus an unexpected appearance from Henry) all came together to talk about the question - Is the Sides terminology (Side A/Side B) the best way to frame this conversation? If not, then what is? Thank you to everyone who joined us for our live episode it was such a fun time.
In this week's episode, we are covering a topic chosen by our Brilliant Bee Patrons: sexual abuse and harassment. Bekah and Josh are joined by Christian Johnston, who is sharing his own experience of sexual abuse, as well as Branden Polk once again. Josh also shares his experience of sexual abuse. The four of them discuss the reality of sexual violation and harassment in the queer community and more specifically the Side B community and what are some steps we must take to deal with it.
If you would like to follow or contact Christian, you can follow him on Instagram @cjohnston30.
Announcement: Our live episode, "The Cohosts on the Sides Terminology," has been rescheduled for May 20th at 9:15pm EDT. Sign up today at https://forms.gle/wXPRX5nUxJZqzoRQ6
We are continuing the review of the top ten most listened to episodes of the podcast so far. With the live episode postponed and the podcast's two year birthday having just happened, we decided to go through the top ten most listened to episodes so far. Last week, we listened to and reviewed clips from #10 through #6. This week we are going over the top 5.
Here is a guide to hear the clips
5 starts at 3:20
4 starts at 12:41
3 starts at 28:13
2 starts at 41:05
1 starts at 55:10
IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT: The live episode: The Cohosts on the Sides Terminology has been rescheduled for Thursday, May 20th at 9:15pm EDT. If you registered for previously before it was rescheduled, no need to do so again. If you have not, you can do so here: https://forms.gle/T9xuoTEQi6jVeCPe8
Our live episode today (4/22/2021) has been postponed due to a family emergency that Josh had. Thank you to everyone who sent messages and has been praying. With the live episode postponed and the podcast's two year birthday around the corner, we decided to go through the top ten most listened to episodes so far. In this episode we will listen to clips from #10 through #6. Come back next week for the top 5.
Here is a guide to hear the clips
10 starts at 3:41
9 starts at 11:19
8 starts at 18:37
7 starts at 26:26
6 starts at 36:11
This week, Josh is talking with three guests: Branden Polk, Johanna Goth Finegan, and Gregg Webb, all who come from different traditions in Christianity. The group talks about how Side B Christians can support each other in an ecumenical way as well as how we live out Side B within our own faith traditions.
Register for our April 22nd live episode at https://forms.gle/5Kr7D8hERfUQWrqU8
It is on year since we released our episode S2E7 | Side B on Life During Corona. You can listen to that previous episode at https://lifeonsideb.com/podcast/s2e7-side-b-on-life-during-corona/
For today's episode, Josh, Ashley, and Bekah are joined again by Melinda Melone and David Gill who were in that episode last season. We are looking back over the year. What has our life been like through the pandemic since that episode and where do we go from here?
Register for the LIVE episode on April 22nd at 8pm EDT at https://forms.gle/5Kr7D8hERfUQWrqU8
For our first patreon chosen episode topic, our Brilliant Bee Patrons chose "the Potential Power and Harm of Our Stories". To make this episode even more special, Ashley is back after a short break. Her and Josh discuss the culture of testimonies in church and the ways stories can be weaponized against LGBT+ people as well as the ways they can be a blessing.
Here is a link to Semlar's song "Youth Group" which Josh read the lyrics to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9U_OEvORgY
Sarah and Grant are sitting down with Matthew Ventura, author of the Singled Out blog, to discuss an article on his blog on LGBT+ labels and terminology. The article gives such a great perspective that the team felt it needed to be discussed.
Here is a link to the article: https://singledout.blog/2020/03/29/gay-versus-same-sex-attracted/
In this episode, Bekah and Josh are talking with Bill Henson, founder and creator of Posture Shift and author of Guiding Families of LGBT+ Loved Ones. Along the lines of this season's theme, the three of them talk about the importance of having a missiological perspective in ministry and how this affects the way we approach church inclusion. The episode touches on language, historic trauma, and church policy. If you are a pastor or church leader, you will definitely want to listen to this. Learn more about Posture Shift at postureshift.com and Guiding Families at guidingfamilies.com
Josh and Henry are having a late morning discussion with Wesley Hill, Eve Tushnet, and David Bennett, three prominent authors on sexuality and faith from a "Side B" perspective. We are talking about everything from how and why they wrote their books, how the landscape has shifted, and what they seen coming next for themselves and the movement.
Here is the link to Eve's article on the Pope that was mentioned: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/10/24/what-does-pope-francis-believe-about-same-sex-love/
Here is the article by Steve Holmes that Wes mentioned: https://shoredfragments.wordpress.com/2011/09/20/queer-hippo-musings-on-human-sexuality/
In this week's episode, we are sharing the recording of our live episode from back in January at the QCF Conference. Grant and Josh are joined by Darren Calhoun, board member of QCF and previously on S2E16&17 | LIVE Panel on Race and Queerness, to discuss queer Christian solidarity. What does it look like for Side A and Side B Christians to support each other across the belief spectrum?
We're back for Season 3! Bekah, Grant, Henry, Josh, and Sarah introduce the season theme of Identity & Inclusion, sharing what these two terms mean to them, why they are important topics to discuss, and what episodes each is looking forward to record. The cohosts also spend some time at the beginning of the episode sharing how each is doing in the initial weeks of 2021.
Here is the photo of Josh's family which was mentioned:
Theme Song: Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
We have a few announcements to share but the most exciting is our new cohost: Sarah Abbey! Sarah is an amazing person and we cannot wait for you to get to know her more over this coming season.
Plus we give a sneak peak of our latest patreon episode "A Gay Christmas with Bekah, Henry, and Josh." Check it out at patreon.com/lifeonsideb
Important links in the episode:
Season 2 Feedback Form: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSffknOwSvctm_7wkqoO0uTWoeexqrCLd-wnSxArNTiAaXr8nw/viewform?usp=sf_link
Q Conf 2021: Use the code SIDEB2021 when registering for conference at qcfconf.org/ will get $10 off the Virtual All Access Pass (Student Pass Excluded).
We are wrapping up Season 2 on Thriving instead of Surviving though we still have our Spanish episode to come. At the first ever B Chats event two weeks ago on November 14th, the cohost team recorded our Season 2 review and had a blast looking over the past year, discussing what we learned on thriving, as well as sharing exciting news about things to come in Season 3.
Theme Song: Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
Josh mentions a photo of a bunkbed product Grant saw that looks like the podcast logo. The photo of the bunkbed is pictured here:
Today we are talking with Anthony Esser and Greg Coles about prayer. Where does prayer fit into thriving?
Donate to Henry's medical bills here.
Sites Mentioned:
https://www.anthonyesser.com/
https://www.gregorycoles.com/
Pre-order Greg Cole's upcoming book, No Longer Strangers, at https://www.ivpress.com/no-longer-strangers
Theme Song: Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
Today, Bekah and I are talking with Branden Polk, board member of Revoice and director of Arrowhead Consulting, about social media and how to navigate it.
Music:
Theme: Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
Interlude: Wonderous Love by Murphy, D.X.
It has been a bit since we released an episode and that is because Josh has been on a road trip and behind on the podcast. We are back today with a new episode though! Mary and Josh are talking with Kat LaPrairie about abiding in Christ and what that looks like for us as LGBT+ Christians.
At the end of the episode, Mary mentions an episode of Theology in the Raw which Kat did with Preston Sprinkle. You can hear that episode at https://www.prestonsprinkle.com/theology-in-the-raw/2019/9/9/756-a-transgender-christians-journey-with-jesus-kat-laprairie
Also, Josh mentioned a podcast episode that impacted him on "slowdown spirituality." It is "Unhurry and Culture with John Mark Comer" on the Food Trucks in Bablyon podcast. You can listen to it at https://podcast.westernseminary.edu/episodes/unhurry-and-culture
This is an exciting one for me (Josh) because we are having a fellow Side B podcaster here on with us today...Laurie Krieg. Grant and I are talking with Laurie about doubt and how to deal with it. Is there anything good God can do through our doubt? We also talk to Laurie about her new book coming out in October 2020 called Impossible Marriage and the experience of doubt she explains about in the book. You can pre-order Impossible Marriage now at www.impossiblemarriage.com and join their launch team to get extra bonus materials.
Today, Grant and Josh are talking with Pieter Valk from EQUIP about his talk at Revoice20 this year on theology during the Pastors and Leaders Seminar of the conference. We talk about different feedback he has gotten from his talk and how we can approach theology on sexuality that helps LGBT+ Christians to thrive in our churches. If you haven't listened to Pieter's talk at Revoice and you are listening on the day this publishes, go to revoice.us and sign up to listen today because starting September 1st it will no longer be available.
If you would like to communicate with Pieter, you can do so by emailing him at pieter@equipyourcommunity.org.
To register for the B Chats event on November 14th, go to www.lifeonsideb.com and follow the popup that appears on your screen.
On August 6th, we held the first LIVE episode of the podcast over zoom with some old friends and new ones. We were joined by Meredith and Bridget as well as Darren Calhoun and Sarah Abbey, who are on the podcast for their first time. They came on to answer questions from a live audience and it was a very rich discussion. It was so good that we had to separate the conversation into two episodes.
A Note From Bridget: "In talking about colorism, I was trying to communicate the ways in which race gets erased from the conversation in many Latin American countries and how colorism plays into that equation, favoring lighter skin tones to darker. My wording wasn't the best, however, and runs the risk of communicating that Black and Indigenous people don't exist in Latin America. To clarify, Black and Indigenous people exist up and down Latin America! Their existence and experiences often get erased, however, and colorism often plays into that reality."
Here is the link to the twitter thread mentioned by Sarah: https://twitter.com/thearmchaircom/status/1048060815780323330?s=12
On August 6th, we held the first LIVE episode of the podcast over zoom with some old friends and new ones. We were joined by Meredith and Bridget as well as Darren Calhoun and Sarah Abbey, who are on the podcast for their first time. They came on to answer questions from a live audience and it was a very rich discussion. It was so good that we had to separate the conversation into two episodes.
A Note From Bridget: "In talking about colorism, I was trying to communicate the ways in which race gets erased from the conversation in many Latin American countries and how colorism plays into that equation, favoring lighter skin tones to darker. My wording wasn't the best, however, and runs the risk of communicating that Black and Indigenous people don't exist in Latin America. To clarify, Black and Indigenous people exist up and down Latin America! Their existence and experiences often get erased, however, and colorism often plays into that reality."
Here is the link to the twitter thread mentioned by Sarah: https://twitter.com/thearmchaircom/status/1048060815780323330?s=12
This week, we are continuing the conversation on race and justice. We are joined by both familiar voices and new voices. Meg Baatz, Ray Low, and Ed Guzman are back again and we are also joined for the first time by Paul Anthony Turner. Each of them bring important perspectives.
The podcast is back early with new episodes. Over the past few months we have witnessed the murders of Ahmaud Arbery, Breonna Taylor, and George Floyd and the events that followed. These events have elevated a much needed conversation about race and justice in the United States. It is important that we enter this conversation and the issue of intersectionality as LGBT+ Christians in the church. We are going to spend the next three episodes discussing race, church, culture and especially the experience of Side B LGBT, same sex attracted Christians within this reality. These episodes are not about discussing whether racism is real. They are about the experience of our brothers and sisters of color within that reality and the part each of us play in it whether willingly or unwillingly. Today, Henry is beginning these conversations with a discussion with Art Pereira. These conversations will be raw and honest but they are necessary.
This is the last episode before our summer break. Ashley is talking with Art Pereira on mentorship. Art is a youth pastor at a church in the northeast of the US and has an amazing story of how mentorship has impacted his life. In this episode, Ashley and Art explore the importance of mentorship in our lives, what we have to offer as mentors, and how we can honor the wisdom of LGBT+ and same sex attracted Christians who have been on this journey longer than us. There are so many great points in this episode. We will be back with more episodes in August. If you feel you can't wait till then, we will still be posting one "Other Side of the Episode" episode on our patreon page. Join by going to parteon.com/lifeonsideb
Many of you have asked us to talk about it...and we have listened. Bekah is going to be talking with Joel Jones about sex and pornography. Joel is a same sex attracted man in a mixed orientation marriage and him and Bekah will be discussing how to deal with our sex drives when living according to our convictions as man and women, married and celibate. Nothing is off the table in this conversation and we are sure this is only the beginning of many conversations to come on the topic.
Music:
Theme Song: Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
In today's episode, Bekah is interviewing Henry on his experience of loneliness as a celibate gay man. Their discussion is amazing and very insightful on how not to simply avoid loneliness but lean into and learn from it. We hope you all enjoy it!
Michelle is back! She is joining Josh, Grant, and Mary as they discuss different things many LGBT+ Christians especially those with a Side B view hear a lot from straight people. We asked a bunch of Side B LGBT+ Christians in multiple platforms to give us their weirdest and most interesting questions and critiques they have received. So much of what we received was gold. We are discussing what we received along with our own thoughts. Plus, Michelle brought some of her own questions she wanted to ask as a straight person. This is both a funny and enlightening episode that you won't want to miss.
Here is the link to the Canadian study on gay male speech which Josh referenced in the episode: https://web.archive.org/web/20071101043238/http://www.newsandevents.utoronto.ca/bin2/020218c.asp
This week, Ashley, Grant, and Josh are talking about shame about being LGBT+ and sexual history. Shame is something we all deal with as humans going all the way back to the garden. So how do we confront it and deal with it? This is a very vulnerable episode for all of us and we are really excited to share it with you all.
Here are the links to the books and resources mentioned in the episode:
- The Velvet Rage by Alan Downs - https://www.amazon.com/Velvet-Rage-Overcoming-Growing-Straight/dp/0738215678/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1586754287&sr=8-1
- "Experiencing intimacy with God & others as the antidote for shame in your sexuality" - Presented by Ty Wyss at Revoice 2019 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGOA2P2Xtwc&t=2616s
We are going to go to a weekly release of episodes for a time while we are all in shelter in place. Today, Dr. Julia Sadusky is back with us and is talking with me about depression and anxiety. Many of us deal with depression and anxiety on a normal basis and now with a global pandemic, those issues can be magnified. We also talk about managing relationships with our family and roommates as emotions run high.
If you want to contact Dr. Julia Sadusky, you can email her at drsadusky@gmail.com.
In the last month, a lot has changed in our world. We are not facing a global pandemic and an economy falling into recession. We debated whether it would be something to discuss here on Life on Side B but it seems we have arrived to the point where no one can ignore COVID-19 and it's impact on our world. So in this week's episode, Josh is talking with the cohosts as well as a number of previous guests and what it means to be Side B during a pandemic?
Here are a link to some info on research showing the importance of touch in a human's life:
https://www.khca.org/files/2015/10/8-Reasons-Why-We-Need-Human-Touch-More-Than-Ever.pdf
This week Henry is interviewing Ray Low on forgiveness. What is biblical forgiveness? What does it look like to forgive others, institutions and even ourselves? Ray and Henry have a great conversation about forgiveness, its importance and difficulty. At the end, they also answer questions that were sent in through Instagram and Twitter. So if you sent a question in, listen through the episode to see if you question is discussed.
Here are the links to the two articles Henry mentions in the episode:
-
Here is the article on masculinity which was mentioned (correction: the article comes from Desiring God, not the Gospel Coalition): https://www.desiringgod.org/articles/play-the-man-you-are?fbclid=IwAR137raJR1XpYhY3dloon82Zsv-ltAlEjjZpL-EDylmFg4CTperfRVRYfdw
-
Here is the article from the Dallas Morning news which was mentioned: https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/commentary/2019/03/08/what-churches-get-wrong-about-the-lgbtq-conversation/
On today's episode, Grant is talking with Bridget Eileen about LGBT+ victimization in the church and the criticism we as Side B Christians face from both the conservative church and other LGBT+ individuals. She discusses the book she is writing on this topic along with the importance of keeping our focus on the Gospel that Jesus alone saves.
You can follow her on Twitter @TravelingNun and follow her blog at https://bridgeteileenrivera.com/
Learn more about her upcoming book at http://bridgeteileenrivera.com/heavy-burdens-unpacking-legacy-lgbtq-discrimination-church/
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
On this episode, Mary is interviewing Dr. Julia Sadusky on mental health and loneliness. Dr. Sadusky has worked with Mark Yarhouse on multiple books and projects related to sexual orientation and gender identity. She did her disseration on loneliness in the lives of celibate gay Christians. Dr. Sadusky is sharing with us some of the results of her work as well as advice for Side B Christians who want to improve their mental health.
If you want to contact Dr. Julia Sadusky, you can email her at drsadusky@gmail.com.
Publications mentioned in the episode:
- The summary of Dr. Sadusky's dissertation research on Spiritual Friendships can be found here.
- "Approaching Gender Dysphoria" (Grove Ethics) can be purchased on Amazon here.
- "Understanding Transgender Identities: Four Views" (Baker Academic) can be purchased on Amazon here.
- "A Christian View of Sex Reassignment Surgery and Hormone Therapy” (The Center for Faith, Sexuality and Gender) - https://centerforfaith.com/blog/how-should-christians-respond-to-sex-reassignment-surgery-and-hormone-therapy
- Her upcoming book, "Emerging Gender Identities", releases August 18th, 2020. You can purchase it at here.
As discussed in the episode, if you are having suicidal thoughts, make sure to contact your therapist or call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline (800-273-8255) or the Trevor Project (866-488-7386).
Here is a list of some LGBT+ Side B friendly counseling services that might be helpful for anyone single or married in need of counseling. As we said in the episode, make sure you find a counselor that is right for you and that you feel comfortable with.
- Global Counseling Network - www.globalcounselingnetwork.com
- New Hope Counseling Center - www.newhopecounseling.com
- Hopewell Counseling - www.hopewellmin.org
- Arrow Advising - www.arrowheadadvising.com
- Henegar Counseling Center - henegarcc.com
- E91 Counseling Center - https://www.east91st.org/ministries/counseling/
- Caring Well Counseling - https://caringwell.net/
In today's episode, Grant is interviewing Ashley about how she has come out. They talk about what it means to "come out," the complexities of coming out depending on a person's situation, and the reality of second adolescence. Ashley also shares about the uniqueness of coming out as bisexual. You won't want to miss a minute of their conversation.
Earlier in January, Life on Side B was invited to the podcast stage at the Q Christian Fellowship Conference. I was joined by Melinda, who you all heard in Season 1, and my brother, Ed, to continue this conversation on thriving. What does it look like for LGBT+ Christians? And especially for Side B Christians?
It is finally here! Season 2! Today we are starting the year off with a chance for you to meet the new cohost team as we discuss the season theme of thriving. What does it mean to thrive? What are the topics we will be discussing this season related to thriving? Also learn some new updates about how we will be running the season.
Music:
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
¡Este es el primer episodio del podcast en español y estamos emocionados de compartirlo con ustedes! Hoy estoy hablando con Teo, un cristiano LGBT+ y célibe, sobre su experiencia como un cristiano del Lado B. ¿Qué es el Lado B? ¿Como puede ser un cristiano LGBT+ y mantener una perspectiva tradicional sobre el matrimonio y la sexualidad. Vamos a explorar esto juntos.
It has been 6 months and we are finally finishing season 1 of the podcast. Today I am joined by Ashley and we are looking back over this season, talking about why community and belonging was chosen as the first theme, and sharing our favorite moments. Plus, we are spilling the tea on what's coming up in season 2 including the new theme, a new format for the podcast, and a special event coming in January.
This week we are circling back with five of our guests from this season to ask questions sent in by listeners. I got to talk to Meg about non-Christians within intentional community spaces, Melinda about her experience coming out at 34, Dean and Lisa about emotional attachment and martial infidelity, and Matt about the relationship between celibate partnerships and marriage.
Per the conversation with Dean and Lisa, here is a list of some LGBT+ Side B friendly counseling services that might be helpful for anyone single or married in need of counseling. As we said in the episode, make sure you find a counselor that is right for you and that you feel comfortable with.
- Global Counseling Network - www.globalcounselingnetwork.com
- New Hope Counseling Center - www.newhopecounseling.com
- Hopewell Counseling - www.hopewellmin.org
- Arrow Advising - www.arrowheadadvising.com
- Henegar Counseling Center - henegarcc.com
- E91 Counseling Center - https://www.east91st.org/ministries/counseling/
Music from this episode by Scott Holmes.
Max has been with his partner, Jonathan, for 8 years. In today's episode, he shared about his experience in a celibate partnership as well as what he has learned over the last 8 years. A celibate partnership is a committed relationship between two queer people committed to pursuing celibacy together, normally because of a share conviction of the traditional Christian sexual ethic. This is an episode you won't want to miss.
Music:
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
This week, I am talking with Matt about celibate partnerships and what that looks like in the lives of LGBT+ Christians. A celibate partnership is a committed relationship between two queer people committed to pursuing celibacy together, normally because of a share conviction of the traditional Christian sexual ethic. Matt shares about his own partnership, what he has learned through his partnership, and the blessings and difficulties he and his partner have faced along the way. Celibate partnerships have been one of the most criticized issues within the Side B movement and not even all Side B Christians themselves agree on the topic, yet regardless, it is a major way many Side B Christians have found a source of community. So it is important that we listen to the voices of those who are in partnerships and how those partnerships have supported their faith.
Music:
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
For many Side B Christians that remain single, a call to celibacy is a sacrifice of the possibility to have kids and a family as well as a spouse. But is that always the case? Bekah Mason joins me today to talk about her experience fostering and adopting as a single woman. She shares an amazing perspective on family in the Bible and how taking care of orphans is not simply a command for married people but all Christians. You won't want to miss this episode.
Bekah Mason, ThM, is a mom, educator, student, and writer in Chattanooga, TN. Her studies have included research in the areas of history, theology, education, and sexuality, and she speaks and writes in those disciplines as well. In addition, Bekah serves on the board of Give Her Wings and is a member of The Pelican Project. She has written about singleness and sexuality at Boundless, Christ and Pop Culture, and Christianity Today, and blogs at bekahmason.com.
Episode Outline:
2:03 - Episode Introduction
2:50 - Bekah gives an introduction of herself.
5:00 - Bekah shares about how she identifies related to her sexuality.
8:00 - Bekah shares a bit about her story and how she has come to reconcile her sexuality and faith.
20:53 - Bekah shares about how she became a foster mom and finally adopted her two kids.
29:13 - Bekah explains how the Bible has influenced her view of family and the importance of adoption
33:06 - Bekah explains how her community around her helps support her as a mom.
38:40 - Bekah explains her thoughts on what it might look like discussing sexuality, and especially one's sexuality with one's kids.
43:19 - Bekah shares some of the difficulties and blessings of being a single mom.
53:32 - Bekah and I discuss steps people can take if they are interested in fostering and/or adopting
Music:
- Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
- Interim Music - Wonderous Love by Murphy DX
I have been excited to get Laurence on the podcast because he brings an amazing perspective on a wide range of topics from community to identity. More than anything our conversation impacted me with what he shared on the importance to look for how we can serve those we are in community with rather than how they can serve us. So often we go into community looking for how others can help us but Jesus calls us to another way of living.
You can contact Laurence at laurencekoo@gmail.com
Born and raised in the Netherlands, Laurence studied dentistry at the Vrije Universiteit in Amsterdam. After his graduation he worked part time on staff with a college ministry and part time as a dentist. After 6 years he left dentistry to focus on helping students and young professionals grow in their faith and become disciples of Jesus.
Laurence has served in different leadership position in collegiate ministry in the Netherlands for 14 years. After that he moved to Colorado Spring in the US to work for the same mission organization. He is responsible for the training and development for next generation US missionaries before and on the field. He is also an international speaker and consultant on the topics of sexuality and LGBTQ.
Music:
-
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
-
18:21 - Stomps and Claps by Scott Holmes
-
43:15 - Teamwork by Scott Holmes
Today, David Gill and I are continuing our review of the book, Costly Obedience by Mark Yarhouse and Olya Zaporozhets. This conversation was divided into two parts. In part one, we went through chapters one and two. Today we are finishing the book.
David Gill is a graduate of Covenant Seminary (’15) and a life-long musician whose current hobbies include leading worship and scoring silent films from 1915-1929. He is the current music director for the Revoice conference, and he looks to build bridges in the arts and LGBT communities with the Church.
Books Mentioned:
Yarhouse, Mark, and Olya Zaporozhets. Costly Obedience: What We Can Learn from the Celibate Gay Christian Community. Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2019.
Music:
-
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
-
Interlude #1 (15:15) - Hotshot! by Scott Holmes
-
Interlude #2 (36:38) - Shine Bright by Scott Holmes
Today, David Gill and I are reviewing the book, Costly Obedience by Mark Yarhouse and Olya Zaporozhets. The conversation was so good that it was hard to edit it down to one episode so this conversation is being separated into two parts.
David Gill is a graduate of Covenant Seminary (’15) and a life-long musician whose current hobbies include leading worship and scoring silent films from 1915-1929. He is the current music director for the Revoice conference, and he looks to build bridges in the arts and LGBT communities with the Church.
Books Mentioned:
Yarhouse, Mark, and Olya Zaporozhets. Costly Obedience: What We Can Learn from the Celibate Gay Christian Community. Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2019.
Music:
- Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
This week, Luke Calvin is joining me for the episode to discuss church inclusion. Recently, conservative churches have struggled to process the inclusion of celibate gay Christians. As Luke beautifully says in the episode, the church is meant to be a place where "others" can find they belong. So what does and should that look like for Side B Christians.
Luke is a Licensed Professional Counselor in the state of Missouri and is the co-director of New Hope Counseling Services. He is also a worship director, and a ruling elder in the Presbyterian Church in America. He lives in Wentzville, MO with his wife, Jen, and 2 boys Grey and Reese.
Music:
-
Theme Song - Driven to Success by Scott Holmes
-
Interim Music - (17:10) Come Ye Sinners by Murphy, D.X. and (35:56) Sun-Kissed by Scott Holmes
Books Mentioned:
(50:24) Mike Mason, The Mystery of Marriage: Meditations on the Miracle. Colorado, CO: Multnomah Books, 2005.
Today, I am talking with Pieter Valk about the monastic community he is creating in Nashville called the Nashville Family of Brothers, which aims to offer family to celibate men. We talk about celibacy, its place in the church, and the importance of community as a celibate individual.
Pieter is the Director of EQUIP, a Nashville-based team of missionary consultants who help churches become places where LGBT+ people can belong and thrive according to a traditional sexual ethic. He is also a clinical mental health counselor that serves LGBT+ students at a local Christian university. Pieter is motivated by the pain and beauty of his story and the stories of fellow gay Christians submitting their sexualities to the Lordship of Christ. Learn more about his story at equipyourcommunity.org.
The interim music comes from the song "Wonderous Love" by Murphy, D.X. Listen to them on Spotify, Apple Music or wherever you listen to your music. And as always, the theme song is by Scott Holmes.
Today, we are returning to the topic of mixed orientation marriage for one last episode this season. I am talking with Meredith, a queer black woman married to a straight white man. She is a self-identified nerd who loves science, and she is here to share about her experience faith, sexuality, as well as race issues. You will want to listen to the whole episode cause we have a fun time at the end talking about celebrity crushes and giving some "Dear Straight People" letters. You can follow on twitter @QueerXtian and you can contact her through her email, queer.female.xtian@gmail.com
Today, I am joined by Seth Touchton as my cohost and we are talking with Lesli Hudson-Reynolds about their experience as a genderqueer person. We are discussing trans issues and what it looks like in Lesli's life to be Side B. Many people are nervous to approach trans issues and are unsure how to walk along side non-cisgender individuals in their life. We hope that you can approach this episode with listening ears and a humble posture.
Lesli is currently serving as Gender Identity Ministry Director for Lead Them Home. Lesli mentors youth & adults seeking God's will in their gender identity. They are also developing a resource designed to thoughtfully engage church leadership in the gender conversation. Prior to joining the LTH team, Lesli spent 15 years on the road and in regional theatre as Production Stage Manager for numerous Broadway musicals, ballets, and plays. They still escape to NY to see shows whenever possible. If you want to get in contact with Lesli, you can contact them at lesli@leadthemhome.org.
This week, I am talking with Lisa, the wife of Dean Samuels who I interviewed in the last episode. She is sharing about her experience in mixed orientation marriage to a queer man. I love her honesty and realness like nothing else. You will totally wanna listen in to this.
If you want to check out the book I mentioned, it is called Redeeming Sex by Debra Hirsch. Also if you want to learn more about Dean and Lisa, you can learn more on Dean's authorship page on the Your Other Brothers blog at https://www.yourotherbrothers.com/author/dean/
Theme Music credit: "Driven to Success" by Scott Holmes
So we are trying something new called Side B Detours, where I and whoever I decide to join me just talk for 15 to 25 minutes on whatever topic or issue we want to not related to the season theme. For this first Detour, I invited Michelle Newbold back to share about her experience at Revoice since she shared about her anticipation for it in Episode 3. I also share about some things I have been reflecting on since Revoice like the question, "What keeps me Side B?"
You can follow Michelle on instagram @themichellenewbold or follow her at themichellenewbold.com. Also check out her blog post on Revoice called "Straight Girl, Gay Conference".
Today, I am talking with Dean Samuels about his experience as a queer man married to a straight woman. In recent years, heterosexual marriages which involve one or more persons with non-straight sexual orientations have come to be referred to as "mixed-orientation marriages." Dean is here sharing his experience in heterosexual marriage as a man primarily attracted to men as well as sharing advice for others navigating mixed orientation marriages or interested in pursuing one.
Dean is a pastor at a church in the midwest, has been married for more than 5 years, is the father to a beautiful little girl, and is also a contributing author to the blog, Your Other Brothers. You can read his writings on the Your Other Brothers blog here.
Also, in case you are looking for a resource to help with mixed-orientation marriages, Dean did not mention it in the episode but he really recommends couples check out The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work by John Gottman. While the book does not discuss mixed orientation marriages specifically, it holds a lot of great advice and principles that have helped Dean navigate his own marriage. You can buy it on Amazon here.
Theme Music credit: "Driven to Success" by Scott Holmes
Today's episode is a little different. Josh is joined by one of his best friend, Michelle Newbold. This week, Josh is sharing a little bit about his story of navigating sexuality and faith, and Josh and Michelle are discussing what it looks like to find community and belonging among family, both biological and adopted, and friends.
You can follow Michelle on instagram @themichellenewbold or follow her at themichellenewbold.com.
Theme Music credit: "Driven to Success" by Scott Holmes
Today, we are talking with Melinda Melone about the intentional community she is a part of in San Francisco, CA. Melinda's community is an absolute challenge for our western understanding of community. Community is about more than simply worshiping and or living in the same building. As she explains, "We are not called to simply do church but be church." She also shares about her experience arriving to living as a Side B Christian and the way her community helps her find intimacy and belonging.
Melinda is a member of the Church of the Sojourners, an intentional Christian community in San Francisco. She has spoken at gay Christian conferences such a Q Christian Fellowship, Revoice and E3, and presented workshops at children's ministry conferences such as Faith Forward and Weaving Our Gifts on how to make churches more welcoming for LGBTQ youth and families. She also serves on the QCF Side B Advisory. She is the mom of a grown son, and works as a Montessori educator and administrator.
Theme Music credit: "Driven to Success" by Scott Holmes
For the pilot episode of Life on Side B, we are talking with Meg Baatz about her experience in communal living, which is the idea of many different Christians both single and married coming together to live under one house and share life together. Meg has great stuff to share and most of all wants to show that God never meant the Christian life to be lived alone. No matter if you are straight and cisgender or LGBT+, this message is one everyone needs to hear!
Meg is the Director of Communication and Creative Design at Lead Them Home, a ministry equipping the Church to enhance care for LGBT+ people. She lives in Denver, CO, with her spiritual family and co-leads a small group through her local church.
The book Meg mentioned is called "All but Invisible" by Nate Collins.
Theme Music credit: "Driven to Success" by Scott Holmes
