Disrupt the Dialogue: Recent Episodes
The American Public Human Services Association (APHSA)
Disrupt the Dialogue is a podcast designed to allow leaders of color to share their personal experience and insight regarding the effect that race has on their lives and careers. Through this open and honest sharing of individual experiences, we hope to connect our guests and our listeners to create a common understanding of the effects that race has on leaders of color, create a community of support, and share tools and resources to support BIPOC leaders.
Join co-hosts Tina Wright-Ervin, Organizational Effectiveness Consultant, and Alexander Figueroa, Assistant Director of Learning and Development, in this podcast from the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). Authentic and informative, these are the conversations that leaders of color are having about the office that don’t always feel safe in the office.
In this episode, Debra Johnson, the Deputy Assistant Secretary for External Affairs for the Administration for Children and Families (ACF), details the life experiences that have taught her why EDIB principles matter—in the workplace and in our personal interactions.
From her younger years in the South Side of Chicago to her pioneering work with notable figures like Carol Mosley Braun, Pete Buttigieg, and Bobby Rush, Debra offers candid reflections on the challenges and triumphs of navigating leadership roles while advocating for racial equity.
Along with hosts Tina Wright-Ervin and Alex Figueroa, Debra argues for the importance of having a sounding board, making your presence felt and, ultimately, the power of creating warm, welcoming spaces for leaders of color.
On this episode, we are joined by Dr. Raquel Hatter, Managing Director of the Human Services Program at the Kresge Foundation, to discuss her approach to leadership as well as how she implements equity, diversity, inclusion, and belonging (EDIB) in her work every day.
At Kresge, Dr. Hatter focuses on family-centered systems change, with a particular emphasis on communities of color. This interview delves into the necessity for system change and the many challenges that arise in effecting those positive transformations.
Dr. Hatter's work is deeply rooted in her lived experience of growing up in a two-generation household that relied on services, and in this interview, she offers lessons to other leaders as they pursue this necessary work within their communities.
Resources: “Battlefield of the Mind” by Joyce Meyer: https://amzn.to/4aN8Jh4 “Collective Courage” by Jessica Gordon Nembhard: https://amzn.to/44boGv8
We sit down with Michael Becketts, the Director of Fairfax County, Virginia Department of Family Services. Michael shares the details of his professional journey, from being a social worker to understanding his desire to create a more macro-level impact in the sector as a leader.
In his current role, Michael has learned the importance of seeing individuals as whole people, embracing their intersecting identities, and fostering authentic conversations that help them bring their best selves to the table.
This conversation provides an approach for human services workers to better understand and apply their strengths as they help communities thrive while also offering insight into how to navigate the intersections of race and identity.
Shaneen Moore, Deputy Assistant Commissioner of the Minnesota Department of Human Services Children and Family Services and Director of the Administration’s Child Support Division, tackles the effects of imposter syndrome that many BIPOC leaders face, as well as the deep importance of listening to people with lived experience.
Shaneen’s career in the human services sector began with an understanding of the value she brought as someone whose life was significantly enriched by the human services system. She stood in stark contrast to others who were on a more traditional career path, and so this episode talks about those differences along with the approach Shaneen takes to ensure she’s able to serve the communities of Minnesota while always being her authentic self.
Gain insight into what leaders can do to enhance their work with people from diverse backgrounds, and learn what it means to stand in your greatness. ____
“Whiteness in Plain View: A History of Racial Exclusion in Minnesota,” by Chad Montrie: https://amzn.to/48zpcnj
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
Emeka Madu, the Health and Government Solutions Manager with KPMG, joins us to share his unique perspective as a leader of color and second-generation Nigerian immigrant. Working within the private sector, Emeka is able to offer a different take on nationwide human services work than what we’re used to hearing.
For Emeka, it’s been about leaders being able to help others feel seen and applying that understanding to their approach to mentorship. He sees his personal history as a testament to that need and a reason to ensure that we include all identities in the conversations that drive us forward. This episode speaks to the necessity for BIPOC leaders to be bold in their efforts to build safe and inclusive communities while taking on underrepresentation in their respective industries.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
We speak to Jonathan Palmer, a nonprofit management consultant with director-level experience in local community centers throughout Minnesota. Jonathan details raw personal experiences that have not only shaped his professional journey but shed light on the profound impact of race on our nation. Throughout the interview, he delves into the historical injustices that have disproportionately affected certain communities while also outlining tactics that leaders can adopt to take on the modern-day implications of the past—within the human services sector and beyond.
Listeners are given a call to action to create positive change while understanding that change comes through connecting with others and building something better together within your community.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
In this exciting bonus episode of Disrupt the Dialogue, hosts Tina Wright Irvin and Alex Figueroa welcome their first live audience. Recording at the APHSA National Human Services Summit 2023 in Baltimore, MD, this episode gathers past guests from season one in a discussion focused on the importance of self-care for those of us in the human services sector.
The conversation moves from the personal—how individuals incorporate self-care practices such as journaling—to the more structural, as they talk about the challenges of helping others while working in spaces where they are sometimes asked to adjust who they are.
This panel of experts dives deep into the motivations behind their work, why they do it, and how they continue to do it while also offering advice and perspectives from years of experience. Listeners are provided with a road map for how they can sustain their efforts to better their communities and themselves.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
In this discussion, Edgard Martinez, the Equity, Diversity, and Inclusion Manager at Children and Families First, connects insights from his personal and professional journey to the many challenges that race and sexual orientation present to BIPOC leaders. He discusses his work to create programs and structures that empower LGBTQ+ youth while also challenging the legal restrictions that impede their growth and well-being.
Pairing his passion for positive change with a long-term vision that recognizes the realities ahead, Edgar shows us that this work will not always be easy, but it will be worth it. His thoughts on how leaders can create a more inclusive environment will help you to build stronger organizations as you support individuals from diverse backgrounds.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
In this, the final episode of season one, we’re in dialogue with Natalie Williams. Natalie has over 25 years of experience in human services—working at the national, local, and community level and currently serving as the Chief Equity, Diversity, Inclusion, and Belonging Officer (EDIB) at the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). In this episode, she touches on the need for self-care and data-driven strategies to tackle challenges in racial equity and racial justice. Data, Natalie comments, provides focus on what may sometimes be a hard conversation by removing some of the emotion and focusing on outcomes and successes. She talks about witnessing successes first-hand in her work at Jefferson County (Colorado) Human Services, where she had the opportunity to see systems come together to help move people and families out of poverty. Discussing how she sees the principles of EDIB incorporated in human services work, Natalie spotlights the necessity to understand the value of different perspectives and to think big in making advancements in racial justice.
This episode is with Dannette Smith, Chief Executive Officer of the Nebraska Department of Health and Human Services. Dannette has over 25 years of leadership experience in human services and is the Chair of the Executive Governing Board for the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). In our conversation, we delve into her decades-long career and what it means to be aware that, as a Black woman, not everyone will view you and your community the same way that you do. Dannette delves into her experiences in those spaces and the importance of being bold, courageous, and sure of yourself and where the work takes you. She also talks about the importance of carrying yourself with respect and graciousness in professional and personal spaces. Throughout, Dannette reflects on the ability to learn from failure as well as the need for a certain level of discomfort to initiate change beyond the status quo—both outside and within our individual communities.
“We have to allow people to sit in that. To feel a sense of uncomfortableness, but then be able to, when they’re ready, help them work through that. I think too often we want people to feel comfortable, but change doesn't happen with feeling comfortable, even for us.”
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag # DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
This episode features Vannessa Dorantes, Commissioner for the Department of Children and Families (DCF) in Connecticut and an Executive Governing Board Member of the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). Having worked for DCF since 1992, Vannessa shares her journey as a social worker rising through the ranks to be appointed Connecticut’s first Black DCF Commissioner—a journey that included battling imposter syndrome to finally understanding her self-worth. During this episode, Commissioner Dorantes talks about the need to clearly understand EDI principles, what it means to stay true to them, and the importance of relating those values to others in your workplace. From paving the way for other BIPOC leaders to representation, she relates the work of EDI to her lived experience in the field and as an administrator.
“Is racial justice work something that should be a thing set aside to focus all of our attention on, or should it be woven throughout all of our work? My response is that it’s both, until it doesn't have to be.”
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by APHSA. Editing and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
This episode features LaRae Cantley, Senior Manager of Centering Community & Well-Being at Full
Frame Initiative in Greenfield, MA. LaRae has spent years as a community organizer, supporting those
who confront issues of poverty, violence, trauma, and oppression. Her lived experience informs her
work, and in this episode, LaRae shares her personal stories as well as an approach to human services
that brings the voices of people who have been marginalized into the spaces where solutions are
discussed. She argues that this shift not only provides more effective services but empowers those who
need it most.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at
jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). Editing
and sound design for this episode was done by Bea Mitchell.
Links: Full Frame Initiative https://www.fullframeinitiative.org/
Episode 1 features Derrik Anderson, Executive Director at Race Matters for Juvenile Justice and a certified diversity professional. Derrik has over ten years of experience within the field of Equity, Diversity, and Inclusion (EDI), and in this episode, he talks about his journey into EDI, what it means to practice its principles, and the experiences that inform his approach to social justice. He also provides advice to others starting or currently on their leadership journey including the importance of unapologetically affirming your voice.
Be a part of Disrupt the Dialogue: use the hashtag #DisruptTheDialogue or write to us at jgaron@aphsa.org.
Disrupt the Dialogue is produced by the American Public Human Services Association (APHSA). Editing and sound design for this episode were done by Brandon Mitchell.
Links: Race Matters for Juvenile Justice - https://rmjj.org/
https://aphsa.org/