Conversational Counseling: Recent Episodes
Known Ministries
Conversational Counseling is where discipleship and counseling meet. Each season we help you apply biblical truths to your everyday life and to the lives of those around you.
After decades of having these conversations in the counseling room and side by side over coffee with friends, we really believe that every single thing we’ve learned is useful within family, with your friends, at your work, with your neighbors and at your church.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org. Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Do you want to build a habit of prayer but don’t know where to start?
One of our favorite prayer tools is the Examen Prayer! This simple structure can help you establish a rhythm of prayer and help you daily refocus your attention on the Father.
This prayer has five steps: replay, rejoice, review, repent, and reboot. As you become familiar with the structure, you can mold this tool to fit your preferences and the flow of your day as you reflect on the day that has passed and the day ahead.
While you reflect on the joys, fears and sorrows of your daily life, this prayer encourages you to live in close communion with God in the real moments of your day.
Resources:
The Examen Prayer Instructions
Season 11 of Conversational Counseling on “Sacred Access.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
This season, we’re diving into prayer and introducing simple tools to help all of us move into a deeper understanding of God’s presence!
If we’re being honest, prayer can be a place of a lot of guilt.
We struggle to find time to pray. Often our prayers feel like an overly-structured task to be checked off our to-do list instead of a relationship. Sometimes we even wonder if prayer is worth it because our situation is just growing worse.
But prayer is so much more than this. God created prayer because He wants to have a relationship with us. Through prayer, we all can find a sense of awe in the access Jesus has given us to the throne of God.
Wherever you are in your prayer life, we hope this season will expand your view of prayer and that the Holy Spirit will move in your life to increase your desire for prayer.
Season 11 of Conversational Counseling on “Sacred Access.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email!
What is your posture when you join someone on their journey to comfort and change?
If our first priority is to influence or teach, we risk pushing our framework of beliefs on others rather than prioritizing love.
In 1 Corinthians 13, Paul opens the chapter by reminding the church about the importance of sharing truth with love. As Christians and counselors, we should never compromise on the essentials of the gospel when we’re pursuing love. But at the same time, we must recognize that our framework about the nonessentials is colored by our own experiences, training and mentors.
Scholars and biblical leaders have studied the Bible for centuries and still disagree on many nonessentials. When we push our framework of these nonessentials on others, they can feel unheard and pressured to conform to a belief that isn’t foundational to their Christian walk.
As Paul exhorts in 1 Corinthians, we must emphasize love. Jesus, our better Counselor, welcomes people to Himself, not a certain denomination or school of thought. Just as He’s sanctified us, He can sanctify others and deepen their understanding of Him and His Word.
Resources:
Connect with other Christians and counselors: Gospel-Centered Biblical Counseling and Equipping Facebook Group with Bob Kellemen
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
We live in a very disembodied culture.
Many biblical counselors have a tendency to underemphasize the body as they counsel, while medical professions can focus on the body and ignore the mind and the soul.
But the Bible has a lot to say about the body! In fact, the first thing God gave Adam to steward in the garden was his body.
As biblical counselors, we need to consider the body as we counsel. Physical ailments or factors do not excuse sin, but we often need to deal with physical issues first before moving on to mental and spiritual healing.
Jesus healed the body and forgave sins. He fed the 5,000, and He preached the way to salvation. By caring for the whole person, we can better walk alongside them towards comfort and change like our good and better Counselor did on earth.
Resources:
560 Biblical Passages on Embodied-Souls by Bob Kellemen
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
In this episode, we’re diving into a hard — and very nuanced — topic. We encourage you to listen to the end and then share your thoughts, questions or concerns with your trusted community so we all can better understand a biblical view of caring and advocating for the oppressed in our church bodies.
We love the Church, we love when God calls godly leaders into positions of authority to shepherd the Church, and we strive for the spiritual unity of the body. But at the same time, we recognize that some Christians and churches choose their churches’ reputations at the cost of victims and of God’s character.
When faced with hard situations in our churches, how should we respond?
We recognize our churches are filled with finite leaders serving an infinite God and continually working to understand how to biblically address abuse and trauma in the body of Christ. As counselors, we can be an integral part of that process.
God has given so many of us the ability to perceive a wrong, and He equips us with the strength to address this injustice, advocate for the oppressed and abused, and bear one another’s burdens. In these difficult situations, the Holy Spirit helps us discern when to submit, to speak, and to step away.
When we speak up, we might make mistakes. Our reputation might crumble. But God calls us to live with integrity. As we prayerfully discern next steps when advocating for victims, He will remain faithful to guide and to comfort.
Resources:
“Becoming a Church that Cares Well for the Abused” Training Curriculum
Counselors Specializing in Preventing and Confronting Abuse in the Church:
Diane Langberg
Chris Moles
Darby Strickland
Leslie Vernick
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Sometimes we think we can clearly see the right choice another person needs to make. And maybe our instinct is right!
But it’s not our job to fix someone else’s problem or fix them.
We’re prone to impatience when another person struggles to grow and change at the rate we want. Too often we’re quick to give our opinion or solve one problem without realizing we’ve taken a person’s agency or ignored a root problem that’s actually causing the harmful behavior.
When we minister to others, our job is to encourage growth in biblical knowledge, self-awareness, and confidence so they can effectively navigate their own challenges through consulting with God, with others, and, when appropriate, with us.
Counseling isn’t about fixing people. It’s about encouraging people to grow in their relationship with Christ and to learn how to hear His voice.
Resources:
S9 Ep. 7 / Trauma: Helping Someone Tell Their Trauma Story
S7 Ep. 5 / You Have a Story
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Are we called to be perfect before we counsel? Of course not!
If all of us waited to reach perfection on this side of heaven, none of us would be able to counsel others. But God’s Word still calls us to serve one another and bear one another’s burdens.
In our imperfection, we will fail as we counsel or lead or serve. We may need to step away from a role or part of ministry for a season as we grow and learn. But we shouldn’t be a people who stop growing or following God’s call to comfort and change. Our own stories of failure and growth can instead be an encouragement to others of God’s faithfulness.
The perfect life has already been lived, and we should seek to model Christ’s life every day, recognizing that even in our failure, God’s plans and purposes will ultimately prevail.
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Do you feel burdened to always say “yes” even when you’re exhausted?
In our care for others and desire to see them made whole, we can neglect ourselves. We strive to be available and to offer comfort and counsel at all hours, even if other responsibilities suffer.
As finite creatures, God created us with a “tank” that can run out. If we try to serve others without slowing down to re-fill our tank, our ability to comfort well can suffer. When we recognize our limits, we can surrender ourselves to God and recognize He is the great comforter who never sleeps. He is the ultimate counselor and faithful Savior always interceding for us.
He also gives us the body of Christ filled with members with diverse gifts. All we can do is remain faithful to our gifting as one part of that body and allow God and others to work in the lives of sufferers and sinners. When we create healthy boundaries and recognize our limits, we can maximize our ministry to the sufferers God brings into our lives.
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Have you discovered yet that you aren’t perfect as you minister to others?
Over our years of ministry, we’ve definitely recognized our imperfections as we’ve made mistakes — big and small. When we look back and remember some of the things we’ve told people or we’ve done over the years, we cringe!
This season, we’re walking through common mistakes so many of us make while ministering or counseling others. We hope as we address these mistakes you won’t feel discouraged but inspired! We all will fall short in ministry, but each misstep reminds us of our dependence to God.
In this episode, we’re reminded that at one point or another, all of us need to hear, “It’s not all up to you!”
Often, our desire to take charge of another person’s life comes from a place of love and concern for their future, but this desire can be twisted into a belief that change is up to us.
Though God created us to exist in community with one another, we’re not all-powerful. We are not created to carry the weight of someone else’s choices or future, we can’t rescue someone from their sin or suffering, and we can’t fix their problems. What we can do is walk alongside them and encourage them to take small steps towards change through God’s help.
Our own lives are proof that change isn’t up to us. If we want to help other people trust God, we have to trust that God will work through us and through others in His way and His timing.
Resources:
Sean of the South by Sean Dietrich
Beginnings: Seeking God's Kingdom in the Midst of Trials and Temptations: A Self-Counsel Journal for Women by Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne
Season 10 of Conversational Counseling on “Do as I Say Not as I Do.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
As we comfort other sufferers, their pain and trauma can take a physical and emotional toll on us. In this season, we’ve shared tools you can use to support others, but in this episode, we want to focus on the comforters!
When someone is sharing their trauma story with us, we are encountering a great evil in their life. The tension of sitting in the midst of unresolved suffering and questions about God’s goodness and sovereignty can be difficult and exhausting. Not only do sufferers need care and comfort on their journey to healing, but we also must steward our minds and bodies well to avoid feeling physically and emotionally depleted.
Sufferers and comforters may find it easy to shrink our worlds to the size of suffering rather than recognizing the truths of God’s Word and His character. In this episode, we offer tools to remind ourselves of His goodness and of the beauty around us when evil tempts us to despair.
We hope this season is only the beginning of your trauma awareness and further training, and we’ve included resources below to continue your education. We can all become effective comforters through commitment to learning, grace for ourselves when we fail, and the Holy Spirit’s continued guidance.
Resources:
Try Softer: A Fresh Approach to Move Us out of Anxiety, Stress, and Survival Mode--and into a Life of Connection and Joy by Aundi Kolber
Strong Like Water: Finding the Freedom, Safety, and Compassion to Move through Hard Things--and Experience True Flourishing by Aundi Kolber
The Healer Within: The New Medicine of Mind and Body by Steven Locke, Douglas Colligan
Being Known Podcast with Dr. Curt Thompson
50 Biblical Counseling Resources on Trauma and Trauma Care by Bob Kelleman
In Our Lives First: Meditations for Counselors by Diane Langberg
Season 1 Ep. 2 / Superpowers
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Jesus saw us in our pain and suffering, and He sees us as we share our trauma stories. He’s moved with compassion, and He responds in action to comfort us. In spite of the painful words spoken over us or actions done to us, Jesus names us as His children. To Him, we are not outcasts.
As we process our stories, we’re able to find God in the midst of them and spiritually, emotionally, and physically begin a return to peace and safety in the present. The healing we find can help us as we minister to other sufferers.
Ministering to another sufferer is no small task. It requires growth, recognition of our own limits, and sensitivity to the Holy Spirit for strength and discernment. The injustice of someone else’s trauma can be overwhelming, and we may feel we don’t have the words to say or the advice to give. Another sufferer’s trauma can also trigger memories of our own pain and suffering.
We must approach these conversations slowly and carefully, and we don’t approach them alone! God is working in these moments, and the Holy Spirit is guiding and prompting us. Together we can encourage one another on the path to comfort and change.
Resources:
Love Walked among Us: Learning to Love Like by Paul E. Miller
S3 Bonus Episode / A Conversation with Dr. Curt Thompson
Dr. Curt Thompson’s Books
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
How do you speak to yourself and about yourself? Do you believe you’re too much or not enough? Do you continually analyze how others view you to establish your worth and identity?
Our heart is like a tree rooted in soil. If our soil is filled with lies about our worth, we can establish deeply rooted insecurities and feel shame because of words spoken over us and actions done to us. Trauma makes us feel despised, disliked, and disgraced. Yet God calls us to move away from contempt to kindness. He encourages us to view ourselves through His lens, a lens of kindness. God wants to uproot us from harmful soil and replace our belief system with the truths that we are chosen, desired, and loved.
As a community of believers, we can be His hands and feet to uplift other sufferers. At the same time, we are people who have also suffered deeply and experienced hurt at the hands of others. We bring our own misconceptions and opinions to every conversation. When we seek to comfort, we may fail and hurt other people. But we serve a God who uses the broken to serve the broken. As we carefully and intentionally love others, we can support them on their path to comfort and change with kindness, curiosity, boundaries, safety and repair.
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling is on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
In our suffering stories, we often struggle to understand God and His sovereignty. If He is everywhere, why didn’t He protect? If He is loving, why did He allow something so painful and devastating?
We wrestle with the questions trauma brings to mind in this episode, but we also turn our attention to the character and promises of God. While we may never learn the answers to these questions in the now and not yet, we can explore His character and His truth.
We serve a God who not only sent His only Son to take on our sin and sympathize with our temptations but One who also meets us in our pain. As Isaiah proclaims, He is a God who does not forsake His children and draws near to the broken-hearted. Many psalms of lament show that pain and suffering may last for a time, but these psalms also remind us that the Lord is still present and walking with us in this suffering.
In this episode, we offer tools to help all of us process our pain and share the messiest parts of our thoughts and our wrestling with God. He is not afraid of our questions or our doubts, but He meets us in this place with grace and kindness. Even in the darkest parts of our stories, He will not forsake us.
Resources:
“How God Begins to Describe Himself in the Bible” by BibleProject
Real Life Discipleship Counseling Class: Lament
S5 Ep. 3 / Carol Collier on Lament: How to Cry Out to God in Suffering
S5 Ep. 4 / How to Write a Lament
Joyful Journey: Listening to Immanuel by E. James Wilder, Anna Kang, and John Loppnow
S4 Ep. 2 / Anxiety Part 1
S4 Ep. 2 / Anxiety Part 2
Dr. Lisa Miller / Spirituality Mind Body Institute
“Where is God When There’s Abuse?” with Diane Langberg
“What We Find ‘Beneath Old Grey Olive Trees’” by Eric G. Evans
Immanuel Prayer Experience
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
We’re excited to welcome our dear friend, Tiffany Higginbotham, to this episode! Tiffany is a physical therapist who specializes in pelvic floor therapy and is the co-founder of BrainPump. She is passionate about helping her patients find healing not just for their bodies but also their minds and souls.
In the counseling and medical communities, we’ve witnessed a disconnect. Sometimes in counseling, the mind, soul and heart are emphasized and the physical body can be overlooked, while in medical fields, the physical body is emphasized but the other three can all too often be ignored. As we explore a biblical framework for trauma, we must recognize the first thing God gives humans to steward is their bodies, and the effects of suffering can influence the body as well as the mind, soul, and heart. Trauma can fragment our identity and cause us to wrestle with complex emotions and with God. It also influences the brain and body’s reactions to future experiences, ability to process, communicate, and self-regulate.
As we recognize how trauma affects our whole person, we can learn compassion for ourselves in our own wrestling and healing and for others as we walk alongside them. In this episode, we discuss the physical means God has created to help us return to our window of tolerance and offer exercises and practices we can use to regulate our body and focus on the Father’s promises. As we understand the physiological responses God designed in our bodies, we can better serve sufferers and encourage physical, mental, and spiritual healing.
Resources:
“560 Biblical Passages on Embodied-Souls” by Bob Kelleman
Breath as Prayer: Calm Your Anxiety, Focus Your Mind, and Renew Your Soul by Jennifer Tucker
Dr. Mike Emlet
Dr. Todd Stryd
Progressive Muscle Relaxation Script
Mid-Day Stress Relief | Guided Breathwork(Note: We do not endorse the beliefs of the company who produced this video, but the video itself does encourage useful breathwork practices)
“50 Biblical Counseling Resources on Trauma and Trauma Care” by Bob Kelleman
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
You don’t need a degree to provide vital comfort and support for someone processing their suffering story. Yet many of us struggle to know how to help or we’ve misstepped in the past and fear another failure. In this episode, we offer advice on using the comfort God has given us in our own stories to comfort others.
As we explore a biblical framework for trauma, we need to recognize the mistakes we’ve made and the Church has made when supporting others who have been traumatized. Too often we have re-wounded someone who has disclosed a traumatic experience or experiences to us. In order to effectively support others that come to us for comfort, we must be willing to see how we’ve failed in the past and where we need to grow.
When we walk alongside others, we can shift the narrative that’s too often applied to trauma discussions. “What’s wrong with you?” can become “What happened to you?” As we recognize how trauma has distorted our creation desires, we can purposefully reinforce God’s original design for our desires by supporting agency and reminding the sufferer of their identity in the Father.
Resources:
S3 Ep. 7 / Miserable Counselors: Key Elements of Everyday Ministry
S1 Ep. 6 / Show Up, Shut Up, Speak Up
“When Your Counselor Makes Your Life Worse” by Bob Kelleman
“Suffering and the Heart of God” by Diane Langberg
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions forConversational Counselingsent straight to your email! <<
We invite you into our wrestling in this episode as we work towards a biblical framework of trauma.
Shame, suffering, and sin cause us to wrestle with ourselves, our experiences, and even with the Father’s promises. Many of us are struggling with the aftermath of trauma, whether of one experience or a pattern. These experiences cause real emotional and physical responses in our bodies if we feel powerlessness and abandonment, and can lead to long term physical effects or spiritual struggles.
As we learn more about our Father and His character, we have the opportunity to recognize the connection between our physical body, soul, and spirit and embrace comfort and change. When faced with a traumatic experience, our bodies might become stuck in our natural mechanisms of protection - such as fight, flight, or freeze - even after the danger itself has passed. We may be unable to logically process emotions or to sort through complex and contradictory feelings. Trauma brings shame and fragmentation that can cripple our ability to function normally.
In this place, we might question God. We might lose sight of our identity in Christ and embrace inadequacy or self-hatred instead. We encourage you to not fear this wrestling or this tension. Trauma is a reality of the period before the final restoration. With care, time, and the Holy Spirit’s comfort, we can begin to find healing and restoration in the now and not yet.
Perhaps you’re experiencing shame or fragmentation from a wounding in your life. Maybe you believe our culture’s emphasis on trauma is overused or dramatic or you think the church hasn’t focused enough on trauma. We hope this episode encourages you that our Father will meet you wherever you are in your story and that you will be inspired to seek comfort and change in your own life and walk with others as they do the same.
Resources:
"The Beautiful" by David Wilcox
The Wounded Heartby Dan Allender
Building a Resilient Life: How Adversity Awakens Strength, Hope, and Meaningby Rebekah Lyons
Season 9 ofConversational Counselingon “Trauma.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Disclaimer: This season is about trauma, and it might be difficult at times for some listeners. It’s not graphic, but each episode does cover sensitive topics.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
How can we as imperfect and often wounded Christians deal with trauma in our churches, our communities, and our families?
This season we’re diving into the topic of trauma and the resources God has given us to encourage healing. We’re defining trauma as our experience of a painful event that causes us to feel both powerlessness and abandonment that results in shame and fragmentation.
God did not intend this sin or pain or trauma in our world. He created us for beauty, rest, peace, and purpose. Because of sin, shame and trauma can alienate us from our identity as children of God and distort our purpose to beautify and multiply. Although our Savior has defeated sin once and for all, we are waiting for the final restoration in the now and the not yet. The wounding of trauma is still real for so many of us, presenting itself in a multitude of different ways.
Just as He called the children of Israel to remember their captivity in Egypt, God calls us to remember the painful parts of our story. Yet He doesn’t call us to remain in that pain. As He reminded the children of Israel of His deliverance, He draws our attention to the healing and freedom we can find through Him. We can support others and share the truths we’ve taken to heart as they process their own trauma.
God has equipped us as a community of believers to encourage comfort and healing as we wait for the final restoration. Sin, suffering, and trauma will not have the last word.
Resources:
Creation to Restoration Story Visual
Diane Langberg
“Suffering and the Heart of God” by Diane Langberg
The Place We Find Ourselves Episode 150: Trauma Heals By Connecting with Others
Conversational Counseling Season 7: Counseling is Story Work
Season 9 of Conversational Counseling on “Trauma”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Throughout this season, we’ve examined how God views sin and the sinner. While God is not soft on sin, He is exceedingly gentle and compassionate to the sinner and knows our humanity and our frailty. We finish our discussion of the Gospel Waltz and the Sacred Struggle with the third step of the waltz: Love. We may also refer to this step as “obedience” or “action.”
When we seek to fight sin, we need to seek a change in our hearts – the root. We do this by targeting the three main actions of the heart. First, we target our cognition (beliefs) by weighing our beliefs with God’s Word. When we meditate on our beliefs, we can recognize where our beliefs about ourselves and our world do not align with our Father’s. For some of us, our relationships or our situations are influencing us to believe we aren’t loved or worthy, leading to destructive and sinful behavior to cope. Yet God understands this weakness, and He encourages the body of Christ to comfort and help the weak. As we understand more of His Word, we can reshape our thoughts and our feelings to align with the promises of God.
Next, when we recognize our affections (desires) are pointed away from God, we can position ourselves to allow the Holy Spirit to change our hearts. We do this by beholding God and recognizing how He offers our hearts a more true, right, and beautiful version of our desires. Though we cannot produce God-honoring desires on our own, we can meditate on our Father and set aside time to know Him better. The more we understand His heart, the more willing we are to come to Him with our sins and our weakness.
Finally, we change our actions by making choices in our hearts that reflect God’s will. Even when our hearts don’t yearn to follow God, we can choose to act in a way that honors Him and honors others. To fight sin, we need to actively plan against it and set up safe guards and accountability within our community. Even when change is slow or we regress, our community reminds us to not grow weary in doing good.
Resources:
S8 Ep. 3 / The Capture of the Heart
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
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Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
In the Gospel Waltz, believing is an important step we may overlook when moving from confession to action. When we confess, we must pause to believe and behold as God transforms our minds.
The devil intends that our sin will destroy us and those around us, but when we can view our failures as a way God draws us back to His heart, we begin to see more of His grace and love and to realize again and again that we can’t save ourselves by our own power. After we confess, we may choose to move to action, but we miss a beautiful step of repentance. Our confessed sin can become a catalyst for worship and for the continued transformation of our minds as we turn our eyes back to our loving and forgiving Father.
Through our confession and belief, we have the opportunity to fall even more in love with our Savior. He is a God who doesn’t require spiritual rituals for us to earn our salvation nor does He force us to hide in shame from our sin. Though there are often consequences for our sin, God welcomes us back after discipline. As we believe in Him, we can recognize who He is, what He’s done through the person and work of Jesus, and what He will do in our future and in the coming restoration.
Resources:
Character of God Series (Episode 1) - BibleProject
Still Sinning after All These Years - A Biblical Theology of Sinful Failure with Barbara Duguid
Extravagant Grace: God’s Glory Displayed in Our Weakness by Barbara Duguid
Battling Unbelief: Defeating Sin with Superior Pleasure by John Piper
Trusting God by Jerry Bridges
S1 Ep. 5 / Character of God: Sovereignty, Wisdom, Love
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
What does repentance mean to you?
When we think of repentance, we may fear the revealing of sin in our hearts. Maybe we’ve tried to conceal a sin from others because of the shame we’d feel if that sin were revealed. Perhaps we fear repentance because we fear discipline from God. But God intended repentance as good news for those who sin! The gospel reveals to us that we are flawed, and if we are honest with ourselves, we can recognize how the corrupted desires of our heart are leading us astray. Yet the hope of the gospel reminds us that we are loved more than we can imagine.
God has defeated sin once and for all, but the sin in our daily lives can affect our fellowship with Him. God desires a relationship with us, and when we repent, we can turn our hearts back to Him and back to a safe and loving relationship with Him.
In this episode, we break down repentance as a waltz - a three-step dance with the Holy Spirit. As the Holy Spirit convicts our hearts, we confess, we believe in God’s character and His promises, and we love as we walk in faith with God and others. God continually offers freedom from the burden of sin and invites us back into a right relationship with Him.
Resources:
S1 Ep. 3 / The “Tions”: Justification, Sanctification, Glorification
S1 Ep.4 / Gospel Waltz: Confess, Believe Love
Gospel Waltz Worksheet: Shall We Dance?
I Repent (Where I Belong) by As Isaac
The Gospel Waltz: Experiencing the Transformational Power of Grace by Bob Flayhart and Holly Mackle
Handout: 7 Traits of True Repentance by Jim Newheiser
Harriet (2019)
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Who or what do you worship? God has given us His Word and creation to lead us to worship Him, but often as we behold the creation, we’re tempted to worship the created things more than the Creator. Sometimes we believe we need to kill our desires to avoid misplacing our worship, but these desires come from God. He created us to desire good and to enjoy life. What, then, do we do when our desires are corrupted?
In this episode, we discuss four desires that God gave us for our good: He made us for rest and beauty, He gave us a purpose to glorify and enjoy Him, He gave us agency to make choices, and He made us to belong in community. These beautiful things can richly bless our lives or they can be twisted into idolatry. Some of us use the comforts and enjoyment of life as an escape from the tough reality of our circumstances. Others may idolize achievement or the approval of others. With the ability to choose, we may devolve into control, often leading to fear or anxiety when our perfectly laid plans don’t come to fruition. The things we idolize are a product of one of these desires, a sin under a sin.
Even though these desires can be corrupted, they do not have to be completely eradicated. God has blessed us with these desires for purpose and community, and He wants us to experience and deeply enjoy the richness of His creation. As we think the thoughts of God and do the things of God, our affection for Him grows and our hearts begin to reflect His heart. When our hearts are focused on God, we are protected from the corruption of our desires.
Resources:
The Dynamic Heart in Daily Life: Connecting Christ to Human Experience by Jeremy Pierre
“Behold (Be Held)” by As Isaac
“What is Worship?” with John Piper
“How to Talk About Sin in a Postmodern Age” by Tim Keller
Conversational Counseling Season 7 on Story Work
S4 Ep. 8 / Fear of Man
“I Want, I Want, I Want” by Paul David Tripp
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Just as our physical hearts are vital for our lives, our biblical heart is the center for our spiritual life. Our heart is our inner self, the root of our tree. It affects our thinking, our feelings and desires, and our actions. Our heart, just like our world, is infected by sin, and sin often corrupts the good desires God gave us for pleasure and enjoyment.
If the heart is the root, the influences in our lives are the soil. Our broken earth, body, and relationships put pressure on our hearts. These influences don’t make us sin, but the pressure of these painful influences can wear us down. When we encounter sin in our life or in another’s life, we’re often quick to judge the sin and attempt to eradicate this sin from the heart. But focusing on the sin alone doesn’t lead to healing. The influences in our lives shape us and our responses. A painful or manipulative relationship in the past can affect how we respond to situations in the present, and the continuous physical pain from illness or injury can steal our sleep and our joy. As we inhabit the now and the not yet, the sin of others, the sin in our hearts, and the sin in our earth tempts us to continue a cycle of sin.
As we’re assailed on many sides and tempted to sin, how can we resist? God gives us the opportunity to behold Him as He transforms our hearts. When we behold Him, we are moving beyond head knowledge. We know God is good, kind, and faithful, but as we behold Him and as we see our Father display His character in our lives, our head knowledge becomes heart knowledge. And yet, beholding God isn’t a simple task. Busyness, burdens of sin and suffering, stressful relationships, legalism, and so much more can draw our hearts away from beholding God. When we strive to behold Him, we are daily choosing to turn our hearts to God, even as the brokenness of our story tempts us to look away.
Resources:
The Dynamic Heart in Daily Life: Connecting Christ to Human Experience by Jeremy Pierre
“Beholding the Love of God” by Timothy Keller
“Don’t Get Too Familiar with the Bible” by Peter Krol
“Behold (Be Held)” by As Isaac
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
How do you view the sin in your life?
Sin is the catalyst for all the problems we face in our lives. In some circumstances, sin is our responsibility, but we also feel the pain of sin when another person sins against us. Sin can manifest itself through the decay of our fallen earth, not only in our lives but in our weather or the death of plants or animals. Whether we see an atrocity on the news, struggle through a season of suffering, or feel the weight of another’s sin against us, sin continually impacts our lives. From a young age, many of us have learned to focus on the consequences of sin and rely on our confession to free us from our sin. Though good things, overemphasizing sin can lead to fear and shame instead of recognizing God’s free gift of salvation and hope of transformation.
In this season, we will discuss sin, our responsibility, and the journey to transformation. God did not leave us to fight the battle against sin alone. Though our fear or shame may drive others from us, God does not fear our sin and brokenness. Sin separates us from God, but it does not have the power to separate God from us. The Bible shows us in a multitude of ways how God is moving in the lives of those who sin to draw them into a closer relationship with Him. Where sin abounds, God’s grace abounds all the more.
Resources:
Holier than Thou: How God’s Holiness Helps Us Trust Him by Jackie Hill Perry
Holy Holy Holy God - Jackie Hill Perry (Passion 2022)
The Return of the Prodigal Son: A Story of Homecoming by Henri Nouwen
S1 Ep. 4: Gospel Waltz: Confess, Believe, Love
Season 8 of Conversational Counseling on “The Sacred Struggle: Sin, Responsibility and The Journey to Transformation.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
The suffering and brokenness we experience in the now and the not yet can overwhelm us and shape our view of ourselves. In our final episode of Season 7, we welcome our dear friend and talented artist Lauren Duncan to the podcast to share her story of infertility. As we look back on her journey through brokenness and suffering, we see elements of the Grand Narrative that point us to the Father.
In her infertility journey, Lauren faced shame and inadequacy from many fronts while she and her husband went from doctor to doctor searching for answers. With each closed door, she felt overwhelmed, unable to make sense of her circumstances. Unable to conceive her own children, Lauren experienced an identity crisis since she could not do what she was “supposed” to as a woman. In this season, she took hold of the idea of “beautify and multiply.” Instead of multiplying her family, Lauren multiplied her paintings, illustrations of her suffering, her prayers, and the Lord’s promises in her life. Painting and writing became her outlet to seek the Lord and express her emotions, and she began to share her work and the truths she had learned with others. Through her own journey, she has been equipped to listen well and empathize with others as they navigate similar seasons of suffering.
Now as Lauren looks back on her story, she can see how God brought her through this painful season and reminded her of her identity. He has now blessed her with three children through adoption. Yet even in her blessing, she still feels the lingering pain and shame of infertility. As we live with the reality of the Fall, we are not promised that God will take away all of our pain or suffering, though He promises to remain by our side through every season. We must wake every morning and reorient to God’s Story, reminding ourselves of our identity in Him and looking forward to His final restoration.
Resources:
Lauren Duncan Art
Made to Create
Painted Prayers
J&M Bookstore
S1 Ep.1/The Lens: Saint, Sufferer, Sinner
Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “Telling One Woman’s Story with Lauren Duncan.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
In Part 1, we share the importance of orienting ourselves to God first before we look horizontally to listen and support others. But how do we orient ourselves toward God? In this episode, Brenda and Alex share parts of their testimonies to practice plotting out our stories on the Grand Narrative. Through these stories, they highlight the cultural and personal experiences that shaped their views of the world and influenced sin struggles and painful moments, but they also remind us how God has held them since the very beginning.
God’s Grand Narrative reminds us that He is the hero of the story of the whole world. He sent His Son to redeem us and to give us worth, despite the false beliefs about ourselves we have internalized. As we look backwards, we can recognize God’s hand, even though we did not consciously feel it in the moment. This exercise teaches us more about God’s character and about His love for us and can open the door for the Holy Spirit to minister to our hearts. As He has been faithful in the past, He will be faithful to restore us and give us rest in the future. Knowing our stories not only allows us to build our faith but also equips us to listen and support others.
Resources:
S4 Ep 9: Perfectionism
Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “You Have a Story.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Every morning, we wake up and remember we live in “the now and the not yet.” The aches in our bodies and in our hearts remind us we inhabit a post-Fall world that causes pain, suffering, and brokenness. The pages of the Bible depict characters who experience loss and heartache, who willfully sin and harm those closest to them, and who walk through the literal and metaphorical deserts of this life. These stories remind us that we are not the only ones to travel through dark or lonely moments, even though the Enemy tempts us towards shame and isolation.
We often wonder, “If I tell her about this struggle, will she judge me? If he learns about this season, will he reject me?” When we choose to be vulnerable, to expose ourselves to the risk of rejection, we may feel shame or lose relationships. We can feel trapped in a cycle of rejection that dissuades us from seeking out others. Yet in a God-filled community, each one of us can wrap our arms around each other and offer support through seasons of suffering and healing.
As we orient ourselves vertically to God, we can then look horizontally and better listen and support others. Each of us has a story to tell, and many of us share similar suffering and sin struggles. In order to listen well and support others, we need to strive for healing in our own stories. This starts with remembering who we are as God’s children and where we fit in His Grand Narrative. If we acknowledge that the God of the universe loves us despite our shame or guilt, then we can begin to accept our worth in Him. He does not promise complete healing in this life, but He does promise comfort as we daily strive for final restoration. We cannot do the work of healing on our own, but we can demonstrate His love by listening well and standing shoulder to shoulder with those around us as we all lean in towards final restoration.
Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “You Have a Story.”
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
We’ve all asked these loaded questions, “Who am I? What is my purpose?” Since the Fall in the Garden of Eden, the Enemy has fought to undermine God’s story with counterfeits that promise answers to these questions. The competing stories begin early as our personal influences form our opinion of ourselves and the world. Our family of origin, place of birth, and socioeconomic background expose us to specific subcultures, opinions, and prejudices. The people closest to us form our opinions of self, of family, and of relationships, and these people may be the ones who injure us the most. As we age, our cultural context continues to shape our worldview, some good and other bad. Through social media and entertainment, we see different bodies and relationships and lifestyles and wonder what we can do to achieve their happiness. The 24/7 news cycle breeds fatalism and fear if we don’t take their prescribed path to presumed peace. We’re bombarded with these influences and more as the Enemy tempts us to place our trust outside of God.
But our 21st century American pursuit of happiness is failing us. We work for more money, power, and accolades because we’re promised we’ll find happiness, worth, and fulfillment in them. When faced with inevitable suffering, our culture advocates for a multitude of avenues to avoid it. Some choose busyness, others addiction to drugs, alcohol, or sex. We attempt to distract ourselves from painful relationships and experiences and continue pursuing happiness in what we can accomplish. We hope one of these avenues will restore us and provide peace and wholeness and happiness, but we’re let down time and again.
God does not leave us in this place of despair. He has given us the answers to our questions, and His Grand Narrative trumps all competing stories. Where broken relationships and hurtful experiences have clouded our view of ourselves and our story, God reminds us of our place within His great story of redemption. When we learn more about the truth of God’s story, we can find lasting peace as we hope for His final restoration.
Resources:
Ancient Cosmology / BibleProject Podcast
Walking with God through Pain and Suffering by Tim Keller
BEMA Podcast
The Journey with Alex Kocher
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “Competing Stories."
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
What moments of your life stick out to you when you think of your past? Many of us may feel trapped or discouraged because of the brokenness in our past. We wonder if our brokenness and suffering will ever end. At the same time, we feel a longing in our hearts for something better. We know God’s story promises restoration, an even greater ending than our beginning in the Garden of Eden, but we feel tension as the sin in our world reminds us we have not fully realized the restoration. In this tension, we experience ambivalence, meaning we’re holding two or more emotions that feel contradictory.
As we wrestle with this tension in the now and the not yet, we may feel shame and helplessness. We realize we can’t resolve the weight of our present suffering or the longing for something greater than this life. We taste some of the redemption and hope of Jesus’ sacrifice, and we also feel sin decaying our world. Jesus’ life on earth shows us our greatest joys and triumphs can and will be threaded with sorrow. The very Son of God felt this same tension as He grieved over the death of loved ones and for lost souls. Despite the grief, He also modeled a life of hope for restoration to demonstrate how to live well in ambivalence. As Paul says in 2 Corinthians 6:10, we are sorrowful yet rejoicing.
Remembering the Grand Narrative can bring hope and joy when we feel stuck in a season of our story. When we focus on the brokenness, we can lose sight of God’s faithfulness. His promise of restoration can become blurred, and shame and despair can grab a foothold. And yet, God’s promise to never leave us or forsake us rings true no matter our season. By looking backwards, we can recognize that He has walked alongside us and carried us through every part of our story. As He has been faithful in the past, He will be faithful to bring us to final restoration.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on "Counseling is Story Work."
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
Every day, we’re faced with the painful effects of sin: abuse, trauma, suffering, betrayal, broken relationships. We feel a prodding for something we cannot grasp, a resolution to our pain that’s just out of reach, as if we’ve been straining forward but the light at the end of the tunnel is no closer.
As we dive into God’s Grand Narrative again, we’re joined by our dear friend and gifted pastor, Adam Coppock. Adam is more than a guest – he’s family. In this episode, we explore the tension we feel in the present. We long for true peace and resolution, yet we wait. We’re tempted to only see the present, to view ourselves as the hero of our stories and to see our stories as isolated from others’. But God’s story began before He spoke creation into existence, and He is weaving the stories of our lives together into the tapestry of His Grand Narrative, giving us a design and purpose.
As we face the weight of sin in our own stories, we may be tempted to lose faith in God’s foreshadowed restoration. We can look at the pitfalls and pain of ours and others’ lives and wonder if this life is the best we’ll have. The Grand Narrative reminds us to look beyond our present struggles to God’s greater plans. We can have hope, remembering the work God has already done and recognizing that God, our good and faithful Shepherd, is walking alongside us right now through our hills and valleys.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “Counseling is Story Work”.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
What makes a good story? If we think of our favorite stories, we’ll start to notice a pattern. Many of these books or movies present the journey of a hero with a redemptive arc because God has hardwired a love for this kind of tale into our hearts.
And yet, many of us also know all too well the ache of a longing unfulfilled, the story that doesn’t have a bow on the end. The struggles we face in our lives are pieces of our story. When we recognize God’s greater story, the Grand Narrative, we can place ours and others’ seasons of suffering within that larger narrative. As we learn to honestly share our own stories, we’re able to recognize the lies we’ve been told and learn to hope in His plan for our story.
One day, our longing for resolution will be resolved in eternity, but for now, we can trust in Him as the hero of our story, no matter how messy it gets. In this season, Brenda, Alex, and their guests will share real counseling situations where they used story work to find healing in the midst of brokenness.
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Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Season 7 of Conversational Counseling on “Counseling is Story Work”
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
Our guest and dear friend on this episode, Ginger Jacks, lost her 17-year-old daughter in a car wreck back in 2010 when we all shared daily life together with our teenage kids. Our desire is that as she shares her story, that you would find hope and help if you have lost or child or know someone who has... or even are in your own season of grief for other reasons.
Grief is so different for everybody and there's no formula. You have to go through the process and the stages and no one can tell you when those will be. The process really is the healing.
God can handle your doubts. He can carry you through the day, one day at a time.
Heaven by Randy Alcorn
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Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known MinistriesisAlex Kocherand Brenda Payne. Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Listener discretion advised: This episode is not graphic but it does cover a sensitive topic.
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Drug use and abuse is a growing epidemic. And every struggler has a loved one. The grief of watching someone self-destruct can be agonizing. What are some of the things that can lead someone down a path of addiction? And what are some of the things that can truly help them?
Our guest this time, Peggy Bruning, was a good girl raised in a religious home who lost her mom as a teenager and turned to drugs for relief. This pain she had no way to deal with, led her down her own destructive journey of drug addiction. She tells the story of how she met Jesus and how for the first time she received true comfort for the death of her mother and forgiveness for all the ways she had sought to find relief outside of Christ.
How can we love an addict without enabling them? When someone is in chaos, how can you not enter it? How can we move towards real solutions of change? How can we respond without reacting?
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known MinistriesisAlex Kocherand Brenda Payne. Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
The information presented here is for the enjoyment of all. It is not intended as either medical advice or counseling, nor is it specific to any particular individual. It is not intended to replace counseling, medical care or professional advice. Please contact 911 if you are having an emergency.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Listener discretion advised: This episode is not graphic but it does cover a sensitive topic.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
Our guest Andrew Dealy has a family history of five generations back of completed suicides, including losing his own father. When dark thoughts come, Andrew doesn’t take them lightly. With compassion and clarity, he helps us learn the difference between suicidal thoughts and intent, risk factors, and what to do if someone discloses they are thinking of ending their own life.
Scripture defines every individual human being as indispensable in the body of Christ, uniquely made and handcrafted by God for this particular moment, this particular time. By God's grace, every individual we bump into has inherently more dignity and meaning than they could possibly comprehend. YOU have more dignity and meaning than you could possibly comprehend.
Instead of settling for entertainment and distraction, Andrew encourages us to lean into real relationships and Scripture, to share with someone about our struggles, and to find hope here and now, and to know that our problems are all time-stamped, and you don’t have to walk alone.
Andrew Dealy’s counseling at Austin Stone Counseling
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known MinistriesisAlex Kocherand Brenda Payne. Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
The information presented here is for the enjoyment of all. It is not intended as either medical advice or counseling, nor is it specific to any particular individual. It is not intended to replace counseling, medical care or professional advice. Please contact 911 if you are having an emergency.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Note: This episode is not graphic but it does cover sensitive topics you might not be ready for little ears to hear.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
A lot of Christian parents haven’t spent a lot of time thinking about gender and sexuality issues. Many young people are looking for somewhere to belong, to be accepted, to be loved.
Often parents are shocked by unexpected news from a child coming out to them and overcome with grief and don’t know how to move forward in love for their child and faithfulness to the Lord.
Our special guest this episode, Chris Torchia, reminds us that we do have the freedom to lean into the nuance and the messiness of real life relationships. And that as we reframe our experiences, relationships and our own brokenness and need for Christ, we’re able to see that we’re all more alike than we might have first thought. Then we’re able to affirm the good desires of a child to belong and be accepted, to be curious about what they really mean and where they are in their journey, and to be faithful to a deeper relationship of trusting God and His good leading for the process He is leading us each through and the value of His Word.
Chris break dancing... if you find more videos, send them in! :)
Shattered Dreams, New Hopea free curriculum you can download that has companion videos
Get help, including virtual groups, from Harvest USA
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocherand Brenda Payne. Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Note: This episode is not graphic but it does cover a sensitive topic you might not be ready for little ears that may be around to hear.
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
In this episode Marnie Ferree shares about the betrayal of a spouse, having herself been the betrayer and then decades into her marriage finding out that she had been betrayed. Marnie shares her story from her childhood up until just a couple of years ago with honesty and great hope, and in a way that is applicable to each of us since in some ways we’ve all experienced betrayal, feeling stuck or unsure about our worth.
Marnie shares as a woman who is marvelously redeemed from unbelievable amounts of pain, who is grateful for the journey because of all that God has done and continues to do. And although not always pleasant, she encourages us that our journey with God can always be healing.
Bethesda Workshops
Marnie’s Books
Forgiveness Season of Conversational Counseling
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Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocherand Brenda Payne. Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
We are SO thrilled to share this bonus episode with you!! Our colleague and quickly becoming dear friend, Shauna Van Dyke, is the Executive Director at the Association of Biblical Counselors (ABC).
Shauna has an amazing heart to equip believers for the work of ministry as she sincerely believes we are all called to care. That every single one of us can live out the "one anothers" in our daily lives. And she is an amazing champion and cheerleader of what the Lord is doing in and through others!
She offers a sincere and tender encouragement for any of us who feels isolated and alone in our calling... and if we're honest, that's each of us at some point! So we can not be discouraged if we are the only one who is leaning in... to consider it a great gift.
If you're looking to be reminded that you are not entirely alone, to learn, be enriched, challenged and encouraged in your own walk with the Lord but also as you walk with others, there's still time to register for the ABC conference coming up April 25-27, 2024. They have in-person and virtual options available! We're going to be there and would love to meet up with any of you who will be as well!
Called to Counsel, ABC's conference April 25-27, 2024 in Fort Worth ,TX
Shauna's Truth Renewed Ministry website
ABC's website: christiancounseling.com
Equipped to Counsel by John Henderson
Instruments in the Redeemer's Handsby Paul David Tripp
"Superpowers" (S1 E2) of Conversational Counseling
Our Real Life Discipleship Counseling Class (which Shauna so graciously recommends)
"Tim Challies: A Story of Immeasurable Suffering and Incomparable Hope" (S5 E8) of Conversational Counseling
ABC's Resources (even more available in their member area!)
CCEF's conference Oct 4-6, 2024 in Chattanooga, TN
Follow on social media:
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ABC on Facebook - Truth Renewed Ministries Facebook
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ABC on Instagram - Truth Renewed on Instagram
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministriesis Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Note: This episode is particularly one mother sharing her story, but this episode will not merely benefit moms. We think the principles we talk about apply to anyone whose world has been turned upside down and is facing depression. We hope you enjoy…
>> Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
Season six of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with specific knowledge and skills from special guests who have unique experience and expertise to help with harder issues you might encounter.
Sharing about depression is vulnerable, especially when it involves being put in a mental institution not once, but twice… Christine Chappell so compassionately and bravely shares her story of facing depression hoping to remove the stigma. Hoping to help us all walk with compassion with others as long as it takes for us to know that darkness doesn’t have the last say… No matter how long it takes.
Christine also shares some really helpful insight to help us understand what is a common struggle verses what is a serious struggle that is dangerous.
We hope you feel relief as you realize that you do not have to bear the burden of trying to suffer in this broken world perfectly. And we hope that we all are encouraged to be a manifestation of Jesus in the flesh to those around us.
Christine’s website
Midnight Mercies: Walking with God through Depression in Motherhood by Christine Chappell
Motherhood: Hope for Discouraged Momsby Brenda Payne
Spurgeon’s Sorrows: Realistic Hope for those who Suffer from Depressionby Zack Eswine
Our class on Lament, that is a free gift to you.
Christine Chappell’s, Hope + Help Podcast
Follow Christine on social media: Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, YouTube
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministriesis Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This sixth season of Conversational Counseling is a series designed to give you help with harder issues you might encounter.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
We’re honored to share time here together with Tim Challies. Tim’s firstborn and only son, Nick, died at college in 2020 after suddenly collapsing while playing a game and there is no diagnosis still to this day.
When we look on at the suffering of others, it’s so easy to feel the weight and think we could never make it through something similar ourselves. But one thing Tim so graciously reminds us is that none of us have the grace to walk through things until we’re in the moment. We tend to imagine the grief but not the grace.
Tim takes our hand and leads us through a “Manifesto” he wrote as a means to cry out to the Lord and call himself back to what was most important in the depths of his grief. Step by step, he walks us through. And maybe, just maybe, it might give you words or a template to fill in your own words, for your own seasons of grief.
Here is Tim’s website where he has been blogging since 2003.
Seasons of Sorrow By: Tim Challies
Connect with Tim via social on Facebook, X (Twitter), Instagram, and Threads.
Some additional resources mentioned in this episode were the John Piper biographies and Joni Eareckson Tada’s work.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
There are times when we just can’t see a way out. When all hope really does seem lost. Even very committed Christians can face very, very dark times. Oftentimes we’re afraid to talk about emotions, especially big emotions, that come with suffering seasons.
In our process of lament, there are times when all we can do is protest. But it’s so helpful to remember that when we protest, we’re still oriented towards God. We’re talking to Him. We can be encouraged that God knows how we speak when we’re desperate and He’s not surprised by our emotions or our desperation. We may have strong passions, but we can still have strong faith. In our protest to God we find so often that it leads us to a point of surrender because we learn that we are fully known and fully loved in the midst of our messiness and desperation. God is not afraid of your big emotions. You’re not too much… even if you’re afraid you are.
Doing a protest journal is a practical tool we’ll walk you through that can help you reach down into the raw emotions of those trials and lay it all out before Him… And it can involve fire, so you don’t want to miss it!
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)Suffering well might sound like a contradiction, but it is the process of going to God over and over again and allowing Him to change us through the process of suffering. As believers we can be confident in who God says He is and that He will do what He says - but in seasons of suffering those truths can be harder to hold on to. We want to be careful to not minimize suffering, or imply that suffering well means we walk through hard things perfectly. It does not have to be big and glorious. Suffering well can just be putting one foot in front of the other in daily life.
Although accepting comfort can be difficult, comfort has the ability to change us in a way conviction and encouragement sometimes cannot. As we accept comfort walking through our suffering we will also learn to comfort others in their seasons of suffering. We learn how to weep with those who weep, and how to be sensitive as we comfort those who are still in tender places. We can be encouraged that we don't need to be at the end of our story in order to be useful! We can be honest that we are still wrestling and haven’t reached the “happily ever after” while also reminding ourselves and others of who God is and what He has promised.
To listen to the Show Up, Shut Up, Speak Up episode click here.
For the Real Life Discipleship Class click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
God, what good can come of all of this suffering? What are you doing in it? How long until it’s over?
These are questions we have probably all asked ourselves at one point or another in seasons of suffering. In this conversation we are reminded about some important truths about God in our hardest seasons. Although we want to see His plan and purposes in the now, we don’t always know the overarching ways He is working. We might be able to see a few ways He is working in this season, but He is also working in a thousand ways we can’t. Those thousand ways might not be clear today or on this side of eternity, but He is still weaving them into His big picture.
In this conversation we are also reminded that when we have known and received His comfort in times of suffering we are able to pass it on to others. There is a sweetness in your suffering that you will not gain any other way, and to be able to share the comfort of Christ we have been given can be a precious gift to someone in their own season of suffering.
We all know people who have suffered profoundly and now they walk with Jesus deeply. We can hold on to hope that one day we will be able to tell our story without pain and shame, solely to put the glory of Christ on display. Until that day, we can continue to run to God in our suffering and trust that He sees us, hears us, and is near to us in it all.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)In our conversation this episode we walk through the importance of practicing lament and how to write our own laments to the Lord. Through the practice of personalizing a lament we can lay all of our pain and messiness before the Lord who will never stop loving us or get tired of us bringing all of our struggles and deep hurts to Him. This expression of trust in God allows us to struggle through our emotions with Him, not apart from Him, and begin to move towards hope in Him despite our emotions and circumstances.
This episode was originally recorded as part of our Real Life Discipleship Counseling class in 2021. You might notice slight differences in the audio quality, but it fits in perfectly with this season’s theme of suffering. It has been a fruitful teaching for so many and we wanted to share it will you here. We hope it bring you and hope and help wherever you are today.
For the personal lament handout click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
In our conversation this episode, we get to hear from Carol Collier who walked the horrific journey of watching her husband die of ALS. And not too long after, she suddenly lost her seemingly perfectly healthy adult daughter to covid. At the end of all interventions in both lives she dearly loved, she stood at the edge of the bed with the person she loved dying and struggling to breathe.
In these hardships, she grew to know in the depths of her being that it wasn’t about her grip on the Lord but it was all about His grip on her. From this place of security, she has embraced lament.
Carol considers herself a student of lament. She calls lament one of her life’s companions.
So often, we don’t connect lament with an act of faith. But really it’s moving towards God, because we’re talking to Him. The reality of lament, is that we’re saying what is true… that we were not made for death and decay and pain. So we are ultimately agreeing with God.
Resource: Lectio 365 App
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. Thank you for listening to our fifth season of Conversational Counseling about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! << (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release.)
The general question of why there is suffering in the world is hard enough to wrestle with. But so often, our theoretical questions really spring from a place in our own lives, or the lives of those we love, that has been touched by suffering. There is no doubt that pain tests our faith.
But we want to encourage you that wrestling with God as a believer is not necessarily a sign of unbelief but it’s really a sign of desperate faith. Because you're turning to Him, to engage! To seek Him.
And slowly we can find that our questions of "Where were You, God?" turn to "Who are You, God?" And we get to know Him more richly and deeply.
Resources:
Season 1, Episode 5 / "Character of God: Sovereignty, Wisdom and Love"
Triangle Handout: Love, Wisdom, Control
"Trust His Heart" by Babbie Mason
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here. (If you've already signed up for our email list, you'll receive them at each release already.)
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne.This fifth season of Conversational Counseling is about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Click HERE to get free visuals, handouts and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling sent straight to your email! <<
We suffer because we live in a fallen world. None of us escapes the impact of pain and sorrow and even outright evil. And honestly, this is probably one of the hardest things to reconcile for anyone who believes that there is meaning in this life. Sometimes we just desperately just want to know why...
But just because we don't understand all the ways of God, doesn't mean that we cannot wrestle with evil well, that we can't struggle well, and that we can't learn to move through suffering that draws us closer to Jesus and helps us walk with other people more richly.
Season 4 of Conversational Counseling on "Wisdom for Life's Common Struggles"
"Suffering: If God is good, why is there so much evil in the world?" by the late Dr. Timothy Keller
Our class on Lament, that is a free gift to you.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fifth season of Conversational Counseling is about suffering.
--- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/known-ministries/message
Have you ever felt like you are constantly striving for something that is never quite good enough? Or maybe you just feel like you're always falling a little short? If so, then this episode might be especially for you. This week’s common struggle is perfectionism. Whether we can see it in small areas or all throughout our lives, perfectionism can quickly become exhausting, exacting and exasperating!
The “do it all” mentality of many perfectionists often leads to positive feedback from others, but all the praise can easily hide our underlying motives to the point that we can become unaware of the shame beneath our striving. Throughout this episode Alex walks us through her own journey with perfectionism and how the gospel provides freedom from the many things that can drive the perfectionism in all of us.
For Ed Welch's Shame Interrupted click here.
For Robert Thune & Will Walker's The Gospel Centered Life click here.
For Milton Vincent's The Gospel Primer click here.
You can click to listen to S1 E2 / Superpowers and S1 E3 / The "Tions": Justification, Sanctification, Glorification.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
On this bonus episode of Conversational Counseling we are so excited to talk with Elyse Fitzpatrick!
Elyse has spent the last 40 years in the biblical counseling sphere asking two very important questions - what do women need to hear and how can I get it to them? She has paved the way for women in the biblical counseling movement and continues to help teach people how to walk alongside others.
We talk about how we can know all the right things and be doing them well, but miss the gospel. For the listeners that feel full of questions, this podcast is for you. If you are the person who has worked really hard to do all the right things and find the right answers, then this episode is most definitely for you. Listen now and hear Elyse talk about her journey and how the trajectory of life changed when the profound beauty of the gospel truly reached her heart.
To find out more about Elyse visit her webiste at elysefitzpatrick.com
Find Elyse's book, Because He Loves Me, here.
Find Elyse's book, Give Them Grace, here.
To listen to the Worthy Podcast, click here.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
Click HERE to get the FREE Anti-Psalm handout (it'll be sent to your email)
Fear of Man, also known as people pleasing, is the common struggle Brenda and Alex take us through this week. We are reminded that we were created to be known and know others deeply - but people pleasing distorts that into an inordinate desire for approval or inordinate fear of disapproval. These desires and fears can lead people into patterns of overcommitment, excessive worrying, over sensitivity, and over achievement. All of these traps can happen when we take good things and turn them into things we worship. We can begin to worship what others think of us, or what we can achieve, more than we trust in God and His plans for us.
Alex and Brenda explain that the way out of people pleasing behaviors isn’t to love ourselves more; it is to reorient ourselves to love biblically. When we walk in the truth that God loves us, and we love Him, we don’t need to fear man’s opinions or judgements. The process of letting go of those fears and desires may cause disruption in our minds and our lives; but it will allow us to go back to gospel truth of how we are called to love God and love others. Our ability to love well is based on our ability to understand that we are loved well. Once we understand we are loved well, we can begin to live from God’s approval even if others do not approve. Only by overcoming fear with love can we continue to grow in spiritual maturity.
Lou Priolo's People Pleasing Inventory and his booklet Fear: Breaking Its Grip.
Ed Welch's book When People are Big and God is Small.
Listen to Paul Tripp's Eternity Amnesia here.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
Click here for the Lament Resource mentioned in Episode 7.
Bitterness is the complicated, yet common, struggle that Brenda and Alex take us through this week. Bitterness can cause us to feel powerless and will begin to shape how we view the world around us, how we see the past, and how we anticipate the future. If it continues we can begin to lose hope and forget that God is writing the story and we can trust Him in it.
Through walking out a very personal experience that Brenda shares we learn that the path from bitterness to forgiveness goes through grief. Using Brad Hamrick’s model Alex and Brenda go through the similarities and differences of grief and bitterness. Through every example we can see how bitterness is the opposite of forgiveness, which will keep us stuck in a cycle of pain and hopelessness. In bitterness we tend to turn away from God in order to hold on to anger and our own idea of vengeance, but grief allows us to run towards Him in lament. Lament is an intentional form of grieving and it is essential to overcoming bitterness. Moving towards grief allows us to acknowledge the pain of our circumstance and begin the process of forgiveness. Grief can be exhausting, but as we work through it we can gain strength and hope. Hope in the future that ultimately rests in our hope that God is in control and we can trust in Him.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
For the Personal Lament Handout Click Here
Depression is a common but complex struggle that all of us will encounter in our own lives or in the lives of people we love.
In this episode Brenda and Alex begin by addressing what depression is and walk through possible causes for it in our lives. Looking at it holistically they address our physical and spiritual lives, the influence of other people, and the influence of the enemy. This is the lens used by Dr. Bob Smith who was both a medical doctor and a biblical counselor. By looking at all these areas we can begin to see that even at the root depression is complex, and it is okay if we feel that complexity deeply.
Depression tempts us to see the world in black and white categories. Its antidote, Biblical hope, acknowledges that there are other colors in the midst. There are dark colors in the midst of the bright and beautiful. We can become depressed when we think people have let us down, but when we think God has let us down we can feel that depression more deeply. Biblical hope leads us to trust God even when we can’t feel Him or see Him in our circumstances. We can trust in His character, His presence, and His promises.
This is not meant to be a spiritual bandaid or a quick fix. Through exploring Paul Miller’s J-Curve in this episode we see that when we walk through the heaviness of our grief and sorrow instead of trying to get out from under it we can come to a place of hope. The Biblical hope that even when we have to dig into deep hard things there is a time coming when we will have ultimate hope realized.
The soul tool in this episode walks us through writing a lament. This tool allows us to express our deep messy emotions while engaging our faith. Although it can feel disrespectful or irreverent to be raw and messy before the Lord; a lament is a pure form of faith that simply takes God at his word. He wants to meet us exactly where we are. It is also important to listen to our bodies and create new rhythms and patterns that will help us feel anchored and have structure in our routine. Small goals and small victories in these areas can make a big difference in the battle of depression.
Alex and Brenda encourage us to engage in the beauty we can find around us because it reminds us that God has not given up on the world. In the end, there will be nothing to depress us, all the sadness will one day be wiped away. No matter the season, we can depend on the promise of a final and future resolution through Jesus.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
For the Seven A’s of Confession Handout click here.
In this episode Alex and Brenda explore guilt. By walking through the difference between subjectively feeling guilty and objectively being guilty we can begin to work through where and how guilt is affecting our walk with the Lord.
It’s important not only to recognize the difference between guilt and shame that Brenda and Alex discuss, but also to remind ourselves that there is a difference between conviction and condemnation.
The Holy Spirit’s job is to convict us, but that conviction is an open invitation to repent and lean back into our relationship with God. Condemnation drives us away from Him and leads us into despair, but conviction is a gift that leads us into a better understanding of God’s Law and our relationship with Him.
Alex and Brenda bring us back to the courtroom analogy to remind us that when we are in the courtroom of God we don’t have to worry. We can claim Christ’s righteousness for our own. We are responsible for how we respond to conviction, and whether we run towards or away from repentance, but ultimately through Christ we are declared not guilty. So often we’re programmed to think that the voice of God is harsh and demanding, but really He is wooing us back into a relationship with Him.
The soul tool in this episode walks us through the process of confession. In our own lives we can silence guilt in many ways, but unrepentant sin can bring destruction in our faith and our lives. When we confess our sin we are simply agreeing with God about our sin. We bring the darkness of our sin into the light of God’s mercy. We will receive forgiveness and cleansing when we lay our confessions before Him.
Listen to Paul Tripp’s Confession is Grace here.
Find the Gospel Waltz episode of Conversational Counseling here.
If you would like to listen to our season on Forgiveness you can find the first episode here.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
Click Here to have the Anger Journal Handout sent to your email
In this episode Brenda and Alex begin to unpack Anger. Anger is an all encompassing response - we feel it in our bodily responses, our mental value judgements, and our emotional reactions.
Through exploring the differences between righteous and unrighteous anger in the journaling exercise provided in this episode we can begin to work through our own struggles with this layered emotional response. It is possible to be right in our assessment of what is making us angry, and wrong with how we handle it. By working through the questions discussed throughout the episode we can begin to walk through the process of anger in a way that allows us to grieve unrighteousness that is personally affecting us. As we allow grief into our anger we are more able to respond with meekness and wisdom.
As we acknowledge how anger affects our spirit, we also acknowledge how it heavily affects our body. Brenda and Alex also talk about the importance of using the energy surrounding our anger to propel to motion, which will help us to have a clear mind and process the roots of our anger.
It’s important to remember that this is not a perfect formula to remove anger from life. We are not always going to get this right - we are going to have to continually confess, repent, and ask for forgiveness because we are imperfect. We can take the time and be intentional and work through anger instead of trying to remove it altogether. Sometimes we want change to come instantaneously but we have to remember that sanctification is a process where we are cooperating with God to become Holy in thought and process. The more we can practice intentionally processing anger the more routine it will become, which allows us to also teach this process to others.
“The Madness of Anger” by Ed Welch - click here for PDF.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
Get FREE Anxiety Journal and Biblical Thought Filter handouts <<
In our second episode on anxiety we bring it to a personal and practical level as Brenda walks through one of her own anxiety journals with Alex.
As they walk step by step through the Anxiety Journal exercise (that is available for free on our website) Brenda and Alex show us how to take a very real moment of anxiety and work through it using Philippians 4:4-9. This Biblical self counsel tool takes us through what it looks like to pray, think, and act biblically in our anxiety or current struggle.
Through Biblical prayer we are reminded that if we have His presence we have everything we need. Our anxieties can draw us into a deeper and more trusting relationship with Him because we can shift our eyes from our circumstances onto His promises and assurances. Using the thought filter tool we can acknowledge our internal monologue and bring Him our current thoughts and turn that into a conversation with God where we consider how God would speak into those very thoughts that reflect His character.
It’s important for us to acknowledge that a lot of the time anxiety is inviting us into grief - but it can be easier for us to feel anxiety than engage in the grief underneath. Maybe we need to begin to ask ourselves what grief is the Lord asking me to enter into and lament before Him.
Once we walk through those prayers and thoughts, we can move into productively channeling them into actions. We can look at the simple and practical ways to acknowledge our anxiety in the moment, and adjust our focus to the rest of our day. As we end the exercise we can begin to rest in the peace that is cultivated as we practice the presence of God through biblical self- counsel.
Scripture memory and meditation, within the anxiety journal and in everyday life, help our minds to create new neural pathways. We have the power to slowly change those pathways as we meditate on biblical truths and God’s promises. It is mentally impossible to focus both on my worry and God’s word - and we can practice continually redirecting our attention from worries to truth to help us walk through hard moments.
This is something we can invite others into! We can share our journals with someone who can encourage, comfort, and challenge us as we walk through our anxieties and in turn become more equipped to walk with the same struggles with others.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
Get a free handout on visual theology that goes with this episode! <<
Anxiety is one of the most common struggles that we all face today. And it can be no small thing. We experience anxiety as a whole person so it impacts our thinking, feelings, body and behaviors. In this episode Alex and Brenda discuss how anxiety affects us holistically and how to address these different factors so we can truly move towards turning our worry into worship. This doesn't mean that we won't face anxiety! But we can have more tools and frameworks to be able to navigate it as it comes, both in our own lives and as we walk with others we love.
In this season of Conversational Counseling we're offering a tool for your soul and a tool for your body in each episode. The soul tool we walk through in this episode is walking through visual theology which allows us to meditate on specific biblical truths and attach them to a mental picture before anxiety hits. So then when it does hit, our distressed nervous system (which can often more easily recall an image) will then be reminded of the truths of Scripture. You'll have to listen to learn more about it! And learn about specific breathing techniques that are helpful tools to relax your body when experiencing anxiety.
It is precious to see God's personal nature for us through these processes, the ways He connects what's especially meaningful to us to bring the hope and help we so desperately need when facing anxiety.
To sign up for free visuals and discussion questions for this season click here.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
This season of Conversational Counseling is all about offering wisdom for life's common struggles. In this episode Brenda and Alex begin with introducing the six topics that will be discussed throughout the season that are common to us all.
What we'd like to do over this season is to bring clarity to these common struggles by pairing biblical knowledge with our individual experiences, provide body and soul solutions, and equip our listeners to become more confident and competent to walk through these struggles within their own lives and when walking alongside others.
Whether it's a season of guilt and shame, or wrestling with people-pleasing and anxiety, or a battle with bitterness and anger - there are categories of sin and suffering that we all walk through. Throughout this season Brenda and Alex both share their experiences with the struggles that are common to each of us. We want you to know that in whatever season you find yourself in you are not alone and there is hope and help available.
Get free discussion questions and visuals for this season
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This fourth season of Conversational Counseling is called "Wisdom for life's common struggles.”
On this episode of Conversational Counseling we are thrilled to have Marty Solomon, creator and executive producer of The BEMA Podcast join us!
We talk about the how Jewish scholarship teaches us about the ministry of Jesus and therefore our ministry to others, the theme in the story of the Bible of God's desire to restore relationship after disruption, the value of a deeper understanding of the Text to help us understand who God is more fully, the value of radical community amongst our diversity, a rabbinical model of discipleship, the value of wrestling with questions and nuance, and so much more!
Marty Solomon is an author, content creator, and resource creator on a mission to examine bad readings of the Bible and reconstruct better readings of the Bible that are informed by historical/Jewish context. His recently released book is called Asking Better Questions of the Bible: A Guide for the Wounded, Wary and Longing for More. He is the president and director of discipleship for Impact Campus Ministries. He and his wife, Rebekah, live in Cincinnati with their two children. Find out more about Marty at martysolomon.com.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
Let’s be honest, sometimes as we walk with one another, we just miss it. None of us are perfect and sometimes we get on people’s nerves and even outright hurt them.
In this episode, we highlight some of the ways we can really just be miserable counselors in everyday ministry. Even though we address some serious misses, hopefully you’ll find yourself laughing through this episode and taking yourself a little less seriously.
And remember, what strengthens relationships is not that we never miss people; it’s that we’re willing to own where we’ve missed them and take responsibility for where we’ve missed them. So let’s keep learning together!
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
So often when we think about feeling inadequate in ministering to others, it’s because we don’t think we’ll know what to say. We hope by now in this season, that we’ve shown you (ironically, with our words… ha!) how even though we tend to think words should be used first in ministry, so often they really need to be used last.
Before we speak, we really have to remain humble enough to recognize that we don’t have all the answers.
But when the time does come to speak up, how do we know what to say? What to not say? It’s so nuanced and unique in each situation. Our hope in this episode is to give you some tools and frameworks to help you craft hopeful words offering true comfort and a path to change in others’ lives. Not to have all the answers, but to faithfully point people to the One who does. And to use your words to enter in and come alongside others.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
On this episode of Conversational Counseling we are thrilled to have Dr. Curt Thompson share about interpersonal neurobiology and embodying the gospel to one another.
We talk about the incredible science of the brain, the Scriptures, how important physical presence is, cultivating community, telling our stories more truly, paying attention to our bodies, suffering, transformation, and more!
Dr. Thompson is known for bringing together a dialect of interpersonal neurobiology (IPNB) and a Christian anthropology to educate and encourage others as they seek to fulfill their intrinsic desire to feel known, valued and connected. Curt understands that deep, authentic relationships are essential to experiencing a healthier, more purposeful life — but the only way to realize this is to begin telling our stories more truly.
Dr. Curt Thompson's work may be found through curtthompsonmd.com; his Being Known Podcast; his books The Soul of Desire, The Soul of Shame, The Anatomy of the Soul, and The Center for Being Known.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
Many of us can think of someone who is just really good at asking questions. It can seem like an unobtainable skill, yet it’s really something we can all grow in!
Rather than assigning motives and misunderstanding people, we can truly just ask the next question to get to know them. Not simply fact finding to satisfy our curiosity, but really learning who they are.
Learning to ask better questions will help us grow into being a holy, healing community.
In this episode we offer examples and paradigms for asking better questions that can help right away but also open up ways of approaching asking questions that can help for a lifetime.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
So often, when trouble comes to those we love, we are tempted to be quick to give advice. But the Gospel calls us to listen before we speak. And in our listening, to really seek to know and understand the other person rather than to just try to get information and facts out of them.
This episode has a total of 20 tips you can practically use to pause, see and really experience someone’s story with them.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
If we’re going to care for someone, we have to be present with them. But it’s not just being a body in the room, it’s being truly present. Really being an embodied presence so they feel like they’re in the presence of Christ.
Being present with others in this way can be risky and vulnerable. And it definitely requires a lot from us. But when we know that we are beloved by Jesus, we really are empowered to comfort and enter in with others. When we are with Jesus and know that He is with us, we’re able to be with others.
A couple of resources we mention in this episode are:
- Love Walked Among Us by Paul Miller
- One Thousand Gifts by Ann Voskamp
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
Ministry is to us, before it’s through us. Until we know how to receive it from the Lord, we’re not going to be able to let it flow through us to other people. As we pause and slow down to think about how Jesus moves towards people, what He asks, what He says, we start to learn how to share the same type of ministry care with others.
This season of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with frameworks to be able to minister more fully to those around you in your everyday life. In this episode, we delve into God’s plan to bring peace to the chaos of the world one life at a time and how He invites us to partner with Him.
In all the intricacy and complexity, we want to pause and slow down to move towards people.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
This season of Conversational Counseling is all about equipping you with frameworks to be able to minister more fully to those around you in your everyday life, the ones right in front of you.
Much of the preparation for the best things in life really do not take a linear path. And so much preparation of our hearts comes through seasons of being in a desert place. A place of pain. A place of failure even.
But as we learn to work our story out in the context of God's story, we're able to see our places of failure or pain turn to places of growth. Growth that helps us grow into community that's healthy, where we can know and be known. Growth that lets us lean into heartache and nuance more fully. Growth that leads us to being able to be available, moving through simply being disciplined into being faithful.
For free visuals and discussion questions for Conversational Counseling, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Shane Selby, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This third season of Conversational Counseling is called "Key elements of personal ministry.”
Season 2 was all about forgiveness, and we have a special treat for you in this bonus episode... Our dear friend and colleague Sherri Tate shares part of her own story and how the Lord brought her to a place of genuine healing and forgiveness after experiencing compound trauma and abuse.
Sherri bravely shares her story of suffering and even her own sin, graciously dispels myths perpetuated by those within the church that harmed her, and offers a long view of forgiveness full of freedom and redemption that has come and holds hope for the future still.
The stories shared in this episode are not explicit or graphic but they do involve murder, domestic violence and sexual, verbal, emotional, psychological and spiritual abuse so take caution if these are a part of your own story or if you have children who might be within listening distance.
You can follow along with Sherri's ministry, Daughter By Design, on her website.
In this episode, Sherri mentions the 5 aspects of true repentance as described by Steve and Celestia Tracy.
For a free visual and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineers and producers Zachary Tate Smith and Daniel Nelson, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness.”
This season has been all about forgiveness, both what it is, but also what it isn’t. This episode is about restoration.
We have to orient vertically to the safety we have in Christ. He's the only one who ultimately is not going to let us down. It's only from that place of safety, that we're going to be able to venture out into the risk of any relationship.
“How to Discern True Repentance When Serious Sin Has Occurred” by Darby Strickland
For a free visual and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness.”
This season, we’re talking about forgiveness, both what it is, but also what it isn’t. This episode is about reconciliation.
Reconciliation is where we’re clearing away the rubble and beginning to repair the ruins of the relationship and the hearts that are involved.
But reconciliation isn’t always possible, no matter how much we desire it. So when is it possible? And how can it look? Even in the midst of leaning in towards reconciliation with other people, we find ourselves confronted often. So we have to stay in a posture of humility and teachability.
For a free visual and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness.”
This whole season, we’re looking at forgiveness… both what it is, but also what it isn’t. Our conversation on this episode is about discerning when to overlook and when to confront.
What’s so hard about knowing whether to overlook or to confront, is that we could do either one from a place of fear and sin or from a place of love and obedience. All of us have a bent one way or the other, but being willing to lean in and listen to the Lord’s leading is essential to knowing the next steps forward for our health as people.
It takes a lot of wisdom to know if we should overlook something or confront it. We’re going to share some practical help in this episode, but our goal in all is to increase a greater love for God and greater true love for another. Let’s love others enough, that we are willing to do what’s hard.
For a free visual and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness.”
In this season, we’re looking at forgiveness, both what it is but also what it isn’t. This episode, we talk through what it looks like to release someone from personal vengeance and bitterness.
The reality is, that we can’t rush this process. And if we try to do so, we’ll likely just experience more shame because we still feel the weight of the pain and a measure of bitterness. But if we choose to hold onto bitterness, even if we try to pretty it up, it surely will harm us and other relationships around us. We really do need to fully feel and recognize the impact of sin, but choose not to get even.
Release isn’t letting go into an empty nothingness, but release is letting go into the most capable God who will defend us and work on our behalf. And there may still be consequences, but when we release we can choose not to retaliate.
For a free visual and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness.”
This season we're looking at forgiveness... what it is, but also what it isn't. In this episode we explore the reality that what we remember, what we rehearse and hold onto, impacts our lives and relationships.
So much of forgiveness is not just an event, it's a process. And just because you have to walk in forgiveness again in something you already forgave before, doesn't mean you're doing something wrong.
Our tendency so often is to seek vengeance. And the good news is, vengeance is not an ungodly thing to feel the need for! But we have to remember, it is God's job. When there has been injustice, God does want us to advocate for justice. Yet in that, Jesus is challenging us to be more committed to reconciliation and forgiveness than we are to revenge.
And when grace and mercy need to be extended, God is so kind to offer it and empower us to do the same. This episode is a challenge to us to remember something different than what so often is our nature to remember.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness."
This season is all about the topic of forgiveness. So often forgiveness is equated with complete repair and restoration of relationships. What we'd like to do, is look at what it means to walk in forgiveness and how it can really impact our relationships.
There are a lot of myths around forgiveness. Forgiveness is not forgetting. Forgiveness is not the same as reconciling and trusting. So we're going to take this season to look at what it is...
When we're walking in forgiveness, we’re not in bondage anymore. We’re not in prison. And we find we're not alone because we’re able to move into relationships and have a beauty and a flourishing in relationships that we can’t have apart from forgiveness.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This second season of Conversational Counseling is called "It's bigger than forgiveness."
Welcome to Conversational Counseling, where counseling and discipleship meet!
In this episode, Brenda and Alex introduce themselves and their heart for you and this podcast... They're not trying to make professionals out of everyone, but just help meet you in your everyday life and everyday situations so you can enjoy and invite others into the comfort and change Jesus offers.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast season, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This first season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
The episode in which Brenda and Alex say a "bad" word… listen to find out which one…
One of the things that is the biggest danger to good listening and good speaking up is assuming things. We have to be willing to wade in and ask questions and open up every part of what someone is telling us.
Our methodology (how we go about ministering to people) is as important as our theology (what we’re saying to people).
We want to walk alongside one another in a way that represents and embodies who Christ is as much as it represents and embodies what Christ would say.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Our theme music is by As Isaac. The featured song of this episode is "A Lot Like Me" by the lovely Jill Phillips.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This first season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
In this episode, "These Three Things" we talk about are three aspects of God's character; His sovereignty, wisdom and love.
There's something particular about suffering that makes us ask the question why? And why me? If we can't orient to the truest truth, we really begin to be tossed about.
So often, we think our highest good is our happiness. But God says our highest good is that we would be conformed more to the image of Christ for the glory of God.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
A helpful resource on this topic is Trusting God by Jerry Bridges.
Our theme music is by As Isaac. The featured song of this episode is "Trust" by Jojo Shoemate.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
Join us as we explore the themes of confession, belief and love as a beautiful ongoing dance that brings the gospel to life every single day.
It is a normal part of the Christian life for the Holy Spirit to show us the beauty of the character of God and that we don't measure up and to bring us to a place where we want to turn away from that.
God's love is inexhaustible. He's like, "I'm going to stand with you. And I'm going to give you the grace and the power and let you know that I love you."
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Helpful resources on this topic are The Gospel-Centered Life by Robert H. Thune, Because He Loves Me: How Christ Transforms Our Daily Life by Elyse M. Fitzpatrick, and the Battling Unbelief sermon series by John Piper.
Our theme music as well as the featured song of this episode, "I Repent", are by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
Justification is nothing to prove, nothing to lose. Because God says I'm not guilty, I don't have to prove anything. I don't have anything to lose. I'm free.
We begin to see the glory and grace of God grow so much as we really understand who God is, what He's done for us, how much He loves us.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Helpful resources on this topic are We Must Clarify The Three Phases of Salvation by Paul Tautges, Who am IN Christ by Bob Kellemen, and Who I am TO Christby Bob Kellemen.
Our theme music is by As Isaac. The featured song of this episode is "That's Why" by Addie Green.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
If you're asking yourself how you're going to do this, Brenda and Alex offer you some hope to know that you are not alone!
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
Helpful resources on this topic are Anatomy of the Soul by Curt Thompson and his podcast called "Being Known".
Our theme music is by As Isaac. The featured song of this episode is "Praise To The Lord The Almighty" by As Isaac.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."
If you’re suffering, it’s about suffering. If you’re sinning, it’s about suffering. And if we’re driving ourselves to clean up our act and get it right, we’re missing it.
For free visuals and discussion questions for this podcast, sign up at knownministries.org.
A helpful resource on this topic isSaint, Sufferers, and Sinners: Loving Others as God Loves Us by Mike Emlet.
Our theme music is by As Isaac. The featured song of this episode is “I Will” by Andy Gullahorn.
This podcast is made possible by engineer and producer Zachary Tate Smith, executive producer Meleah Smith, and generous donors.
Known Ministries is Alex Kocher and Brenda Payne. This season of Conversational Counseling is called "These Three Things."