Soul + Practice: Raw Conversations & Real Practices with Kathy Escobar & Phyllis Mathis: Recent Episodes
Kathy Escobar and Phyllis Mathis
Soul + Practice: Raw Conversations, Real Practices, is hosted by Kathy Escobar and Phyllis Mathis. It’s centered on raw conversations about our crazy world, and real practices that keep us grounded deep in our souls. Kathy Escobar and Phyllis Mathis write, speak, pastor, and counsel, and are dedicated to creating spaces that foster healing and change. Keep listening to your soul. Keep practicing.
We feel so thankful for the amazing people who come hang out with us and we are also amazed by how much happens in such a short time. As we looked back on where we started in Februrary and what's happened in the world, our worlds, this semester, it's kind of wild. And points to why we need resourcing and support so badly! In this episode, we look back on all of the conversations we've had since February and considered what space we want to make for Summer. We'll be back this Fall. Until then, let's keep letting our soul lead and #keeppracticing
Connect with Will at wildsoulcollective.org
"The soul is like a wild animal — tough, resilient, savvy, self-sufficient, and yet exceedingly shy… When we catch sight of the soul, we can become healers in a wounded world” - Parker Palmer
Learn more about All Souls Boulder at allsoulsboulder.org
The Courage and Renewal Center - couragernewal.org
Book both Phyllis and Will referred to - Centering: In Pottery, Poetry, and the Person" by M. C. Richards.
More on Tent of Nations at tentofnations.com
More on The Refuge at therefugeonline.org
Replay of 79th Annual Easter Sunrise Service at Red Rocks: https://www.youtube.com/live/Zj49Uw2gIYw?si=Ol3n08EPqCYD39GU
We loved this conversation with Janel Apps Ramsey, Co-Director of Brew Theology, Doctoral student, climate justice advocate, and a vulnerable leader who is learning how to own her body and live into it--no small task in this world and the systems that want us to be small, disembodied, and compliant. We could feel this conversation in our bodies and hope that you find what you need out of it, too! More on Janel's work at brewtheology.org
Names of poems and links:
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Poetry of Presence: An Anthology of Mindfulness Poems, editors Phyllis Cole-Dai and Ruby R Wilson | "Trees" by Howard Nemerov
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Poetry of Presence II: An Anthology of Mindfulness Poems, editors Phyllis Cole-Dai and Ruby R Wilson
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Almond Blossoms & Beyond by Mahmoud Darwish | "This of Others"
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Rosemerry WahtolaTrommer | "Today's Headline" (wordwoman.com)
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"Try to Praise the Mutilated World " by Adam Zagajewski
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Poetry Unbound with Padraig O'Tuama
-All the Honey by Rosemerry Wahtola Trommer | "For When People Ask"
-"still life with flying bird" by Maya Stein
-Anoint This Threshhold by John Roedel | "Are you ready for things to get back to normal?"
-Book of Hours: Love Poems to God by Rainier Maria Rilke | "Go to the limits of your longing"
Our friend Melvin Bray's newest book is here, yeah! UnLEARN InEQUITY: An Invitation to Truth and Transformation is a gift to the world and we're so thankful to get to hang out and process what's happening in the world right now through this lens. Equity is a life-long practice that must be done in community. Learn more about Melvin's work at unlearninequity.melvinbray.com
Phyllis turned 70 this weekend, woo hoo! In this episode we process aging well, embracing reality, and leaning into hard-won wisdom. Plus a cameo with Kelli Skoog, here in Denver celebrating this weekend, yay.
It's been a tough weekend, friends, with US and Israel waging war on Iran. We dream for better leadership. We dream of circles of connection and wisdom not towers of unhealthy power and destructive practices. We dream for a more just society not just for ourselves but for our future. Strap in, this one's raw, but that's what Soul + Practice is all about--raw conversations and real practices. Let's keep practicing together.
After we finished recording our last episode Phyllis and Kathy talked to BJ Skoog or a bit and we realized we wanted to process more about how all of this has affected spirituality and relationships, too. That's where we went in this second episode, recorded a week later from Minnesota an Denver, navigating what happens when we have such divergent values with people we once deeply connected to and how to wrestle with the pain and dissonance of this reality.
Oh, we feel so grateful for this conversation with BJ Skoog, a long-time friend of Phyllis and a person of hope in these hard times. BJ founded the Richfield Leadership Network in Minneapolis, which is dedicated to strengthening community connectedness. The power of these relationships are being illuminated so strongly in the current situation with ICE occupation in their city and the reality of what's needed to care for their most vulnerable neighbors. We felt so inspired and also reminded of how important it is to stay healthy and resourced for the amount of trauma communities are experiencing together. More on RLN at https://www.richfieldleadershipnetwork.com.
Well, we needed the Super Bowl this year folks! In this episode we process why it helps us so much and how embodying our values despite the resistance is everything.
After a 6 week break, we're back for Season 9 with a check in, some small signs of hope, bald eagles, poetry, and hopefully a sense of being in this hard stuff together and staying as healthy and connected as we can.
Sorry for the technical difficulties if you listened to two wrong files before we finally got this right one up! But yes, this one starts our weird, too, ha! #practicing. We loved looking back on this past season September-December 2025 and all of the incredible kindreds who came and shared with us. We learned so much together, gathered some resourcing, and felt a little more grounded in the middle of so much uncertainty. We hope you did, too. We are so thankful to our guests who come and play with us and would love to hear what parts of this season resonated with you. We'll be back in 2026!
Phyllis' son Justin Mathis rocks and we're so thankful that we got to hang out with him for a truly lovely conversation about peer to peer support, mental health, and the beauty and power of being alongside other humans offering presence and connection and receiving it, too. Also, the most simple practices make a big difference in stability and healing. Enjoy!
In a world (and season) obsessed with material goods, we decided to focus on some of our favorite things that aren't stuff--simple practices, actions, spaces, places that help us regulate our nervous system and feel more solid and connected to our souls in a destabilizing world. They aren't complex--they're simple. And often so underrated. We had fun and hope you can lean into your favorite things, too, in freedom.
We love stories of the long road of freedom and how we find themes and gems of truth in others' journeys, too. In this episode we hang out with our friend Karen Poland, who is a therapist in TX with the Christian Closet, which offers therapy, coaching, and spiritual support services for the LGBTQ+ community around the country and beyond. This conversation about the intersection of faith and sexuality and honoring our truest true was so good for our souls! Learn more about the Christian Closet resources at thechristiancloset.com as well as Affirming Therapy, a non-profit that offers therapy scholarships to meet this crucial need.
We've been wanting to have this conversation for while, and we finally did it! Our friend Hannah Wong, a college professor and leader who is passionate about learning, human development, and things of the soul helped us engage with the realities of AI and how it's changing our minds and our culture in powerful and scary ways.
We feel so grateful to get to play with kindreds and gather some extra goodness in the middle of so much hard! We loved hanging out with John Pavlovitz, writer, activist, storyteller, and friend for a little bit this week. He helped us remember how important it is to stay human in a dehumanizing world. It's a gift to be alongside long-term advocates who keep saying stuff that needs to be said and dream for a better more equitable world despite so many obstacles. You can find all of John's work at johnpavlovitz.com.
Oh, grief! It's a part of life, yet most of us have a very complicated relationship with it. This conversation is about metabolizing grief, learning to integrate it into the human experience alongside others who are trying to be honest about it, too.
We love the Enneagram, and in this episode we thought it would be fun to process what different Enneagram types might be feeling and experiencing in these wild times and offer some possible practices for support and resourcing. We had fun, and the truth is, no matter our type, there's always something we can learn and draw from.
We loved our conversation with Hugh Hollowell, writer, advocate, seeker of beauty, and pastor of Open Door Mennonite Church in Jackson Mississippi. It's exactly the kind of reminders we need right now in what he calls "The Circumstances" the US finds itself in. Learn more about his work in the world at hughhollowell.org and gather some beauty and hope today.
This conversation with Rev. Rob Jerger, who is the Vicar at St. Clare's Episcopal Church in Tyler, Texas (the only LGBTQ+ affirming community out of the 392 churches in that town), made both of us cry. It embodies such a beautiful example of what church is supposed to be - a little pocket of love, safety, freedom, and hope in the middle of this hard and harsh world. No matter what you believe, there's so much to glean from this conversation, and it is what our souls needed today. More on St. Clare's at scectyler.org
Beyond all the basic talking about left brain being logical and the right brain being creative is an expansive body of work that can help us also better understand what's happening not only in our own stories and experience but also in the wider one that's imploding right now. In this episode we process some of the ideas in the neuroscience book (600 pages!) by Ian McGilchrist called The Master and His Emissary and how we might be able to integrate some of the simplest ideas into our real lives and practices.
It's been a rough week in the USA and even though we pretty much say that every week we record, this past week has been extra bad with assassinations, school shootings, and social media awful. This episode we share what we needed most this morning--getting back to basic skills and guiding principles that will help us survive these really rough times. We felt better when we finished and hope you do, too.
We’re back! We always take a break in the Summer and re-group, decide if we’re going to keep on keeping on or not, and in these wild times, the answer is YES! This space helps us and we hope it helps anyone listening in whatever ways are needed. This episode is just a look-back at the Summer and what’s sustaining us right now. Looking forward to the season ahead!
It’s a wrap, friends! We had a great run of guests and topics from February-May centered on resourcing during these extra tumultuous times, and now it’s time for a Summer break! We loved looking back at our conversations and amazing friends who offered their time and wisdom to be part of Soul + Practice. We love having out with you each week and will look forward to being back in the Fall. Meanwhile, take good care of yourselves this Summer and know we’re with you in the human-ing in these hard times.
Julie-Anne Malette-Mauno is a French Canadian settler living on Treaty 9 territory in Northeastern Ontario, Canada with her family. She has 7 children. She writes poetry and her love for the boreal forest is reflected in her writing. She is a Registered Social Worker and is working as a therapist and researcher. Her work centers on perinatal mental health and wellbeing, and grief and loss. She is committed to her evolving decolonial practice and her calling to embody midwifery paradigms in her work and life. Though she is not working as a clinical midwife, she carries that calling into her poetry, social work practice, life, and relationships.
The Subversive Soul: The Gentle Revolution Every Soul Needs—Phyllis’ new book-- is coming out July 22nd! In this episode we process some of the key ideas in the book and are reminded on why soul and practice go together so well. Published by Quoir Publishing, this book is going to help so many discover, honor, and live into what’s already in us. More at phyllismathis.com
It’s always fun to learn from new friends and realize how connected we all are in different ways. David Artman is a retired minister, author, podcaster, and a leading voice in Christian Universalism over the years. With the rise of this 2.0 administration, he’s sharing more about the dangerous reality we’re living in as we slide toward fascism, with evangelicals locked in on this kind of leadership. We left our conversation grateful for his courage and committed to building relationships with kindreds that remind us of our values. More on David’s work at davidartman.net.
Oh, we needed this! Spending time with Dr. Lisa Pettit--who has been a student of Thich Nhat Hanh for 20+ years and is a kindred and community leader in the Compassionate Dharma Cloud Monastery in Morrison, Colorado,—is always so good for our souls. There are countless beautiful gems in this episode to draw back on, along with tangible ways to keep practicing human-ing both personally and together. Soak it in! More on Compassionate Dharma Cloud Monastery at compassionatedharmacloudmonastery.org.
In this episode, Kathy’s awesome husband, Jose joins us to share a little bit about his life as a pilot, military lawyer, and pro-bono attorney at a legal aid clinic during these wild times—what helps, what’s hard, and the power of seeking joy (and McDonalds). We had fun in the middle of so much hard. More about the incredible work of the Justice and Mercy Legal Aid Center at jamlac.org.
We loved our conversation with our friend Melvin Bray—Atlanta-based author, educator, dad, husband, and creator of the 12 Steps Truth and Transformation Model that are modified 12 steps for equity work in community. Melvin’s work in untangling from supremacist logic and the life-long practice of equity has helped us in more ways than we can say, and his reminder of our need for simple and meaningful human connection right now is everything. Check out Melvin’s work at collabyrinthconsulting.com and look for his newest books/tools in June 2025 centered on unlearning inequity at knowledgefam.com.
Weaving webs of community, healing, mutual aid, earth wisdom, and other practices that help us make it in this harsh world are needed now more than ever. Angie Fadel joins us this week, sharing some of what she’s learning and practicing in this season of her story and how small contributions—what can feel like just a drop—matter. Angie’s based in Portland and is a spiritual director, meditative archer, and cultivator of healing spaces in nature. More at angiefadel.com
We love making new friends, and Amanda Udis-Kessler, author, former sociology professor, songwriter, and anti-oppression trainer, helped us gain some clarity and hope around living out ethics of flourishing despite the complete lack of ethics at the highest level of our land right now. With practical, honest, and clear ways to stay connected to our truest values and live them out despite the pull to go low, Amanda is a voice we need in the world right now! More at her website at amandaudiskessler.com.
There’s so much more going on in the sky than most of us are aware of! In this fun and eye-opening episode our friend Polly Baker, who’s a spiritual director who integrates astrology in an incredibly unique and grounding way, brings some incredible knowledge to the forces at work in the sky right now that we’re feeling collectively while also offering some clear and tangible practices to consider as we navigate this season of our nation’s and world’s history. Learn more about Polly’s cosmic direction work at polly-baker.com.
In this check-in episode, we process how we can stay grounded and clear when we’re constantly being gaslit with alternate facts and realities. While this is happening on a national level right now, many of us have experienced it in relationship with others, too; yeah, it’s exhausting.
When we were thinking about this season and what we needed, one of the first people that came to mind was our friend Nikki Kennedy. A trauma-therapist and community builder, she is a wise kindred and leader and we loved this conversation so much. So many gems for how we navigate these wild times, own the reality of this story, and grow in our capacity to care for ourselves and one another in simple accessible ways.
100 Episodes of Soul + Practice, what?!? What better way to honor it than with an amazing conversation with our friend Tara Taylor, who is a volunteer docent at Armstrong Woods in Northern California and incredible nature-based facilitator and guide. As we center this season on resourcing, there’s so much we can learn from the redwoods and we hope everyone listening grabs something we need right now. They are incredible teachers.
Whoa, can you say 2025 and what unhealthy unchecked destructive power looks like in action? What we are experiencing right now in the US is an age-old story but it is illuminated in new and horridly painful ways. In this episode, Kathy shares a little bit about her newest book “Turning Over Tables: A Lenten Call to Disrupting Power” that released a week before the Inauguration and we process some things about power together.
We need all the help we can get and some consistent, clear practices for our mental health really matter right now. In this episode, Phyllis fleshes out some of what she wrote in a recent substack, and it’s packed with all kinds of tangible and much-needed practices and reminders.
Well, we're back. A lot of horrid has happened since we were last together at the end of 2024 and we feel clear we need as much resourcing as we can. In this episode we process something Phyllis wrote on her Substack about the Existential Flu, a reality that can overtake us in these unprecedented, tumultuous, traumatic times. So many gems in there! Looking forward to being together more as we tend to our soul and practice our way forward, together.
Our last episode of 2024 is about 2024! Remembering, celebrating, grieving, laughing through 6 simple questions we both reflect on and hope that others maybe consider, too! It's good to pause and look back before moving forward.
The world sure feels weary right now and in this episode we process through some of the main themes in Kathy's book "A Weary World: Reflection for a Blue Christmas"--Honoring Reality, Practicing Honesty, Embracing Paradox, and Borrowing Hope--for 2024. We hope it's nourishing somehow--we realized how much we needed it when we were done recording it!
Well, folks, here are--a second Trump presidency is coming and so many of us are reeling. In this episode we try to honestly acknowledge what we're up against and how we need to be careful of not feeding the futile that will keep us spinning and weakened and instead consider tangible practices that will help us be as healthy and connected as we can in the weeks and months to come.
Well, it's been a terrible ride, and here we are--the day before one of the most crucial elections in our lifetimes so far. We are holding everyone close in our hearts and know that no matter the outcome, it's a bumpy ride today. In this episode we process some things to remember as we tend to our souls and embody our values in tangible ways.
The fallacy of false equivalencies and "whataboutisms" can really mess with us when it comes to not only the US election but so many other areas of our lives. In this episode we explore that a little more (or, um, ramble about it) along with the importance of "breaking up with knowing" and a false sense of control that comes with trying to predict outcomes and find a way to perceived safety. Oh, and occasionally we make screaming goat sounds.
In Traditional Chinese Medicine, there are 5 seasons, not 4. This fifth season is "Late Summer", which starts in mid-August and goes through Fall Equinox and is a place to pause, ground, celebrate, and honor the energy and fruits of Summer intentionally before just barreling into Fall. In the wild season we're living in right now with US politics and the wider world--combined with our own personal realities--it feels so wise to consider what we can learn and apply from this season and that's what we ramble about on this episode!
Well, we weren't sure what would happen for the Fall but we did think we might come back for some episodes as we navigate this wild political ride we are all on in the USA right now. The election is coming November 5th and so much is on the line. In this episode we basically just catch up on the last few months and the turn of events that have happened since Joe Biden stepped down as the Democratic candidate. Here we go. Strap in, it's going to be an even wilder ride for sure.
Well, we definitely had no plans to do any episodes this Summer, but in light of the reality of the mash-up of the presidential debate and terrifying Supreme Court decisions--all just a few days before July 4th--we decided to pop up an episode so we could process and hopefully put a few things out into the universe for ourselves and others as we travel this road as a country the next 4 months. Please, if you haven't looked it up yet, check out Project 2025 (we forgot to mention this by name). Wake up, sober up, regulate, listen. This is real and we've got to be as. healthy and educated as we can.
Wow, 88 episodes for Soul Practice and this season, which started in November, had so much goodness. We are so grateful for our friends who come play with us, everyone who listens, and a place for us to letting our soul lead us and our practices help change us and the world we live in. Happy Summer. No telling what Fall will bring for Soul + Practice but we always love hearing from you!
As we begin to wind down Season 5, in this episode we share some simple things to remember for our soul, simple practices to consider, especially as we go into Summer. Now, to use them :)
There is so much goodness in this episode! We loved our conversation with Holly Roach, who is a social justice educator, contemplative activist, and community organizer dedicated to creating healthier people, systems, movements. Individual, ancestral, and collective trauma work all is linked together and basic practices to heal matter! Based near Asheville, she is founder of Restorative Retreats (more at restorativeretreatsnc.com). Learn more about Thomas Hubl's work and books at https://thomashuebl.com.
For more information, Peggy recommends Healing Dementia, by Kyrie S. Carpenter:
https://www.amazon.com/Healing-Dementia-Kyri%C3%A9-S-Carpenter/dp/1986619923
As well as a couple of websites:
https://contenteddementiatrust.org/ and https://teepasnow.com/
Also if people want more information, feel free to contact Peggy at peggybudai31@gmail.com.
We love the Enneagram and our friend Terra Lenihan, Enneagram coach and catalyzer for healthier systems and teams, had so much fun processing some simple hacks that we can draw from as tools, reminders, skills, and reminders for our souls that can help us practice healthier ways of moving in the world. You can connect with Terra at terralenihan.wordpress.com. Learn more about the tri-types she mentioned at: katherinefauvre.com/enneagramtritypetest
All roads do lead to power and in this episode we process power and Kathy's newest book project called...."All Roads Lead to Power: A Redemptive Challenge for Lent" that is releasing January 2025 in an accessible weekly reflection with practices format. Oh, we need more honest reflection about power and practices that help develop a healthier kind.
In this episode, we process faith deconstruction in some different ways than before-- exploring how language limits, faith is not the same as "faith systems" and how to nurture what supersedes all of the containers to get to the simple truths and practices that help us become healthier humans.
Why is the world such a mess and what can we do about it? The answer--we need more healthy living systems and it starts with us. In this episode we learn from the wise and amazing Pam Wilhelms Johnston whose work as an organizational development consultant, executive coach, and healthier systems catalyzer is what we need more of in the world. Healthier people make healthier systems and healthier systems make a better world. Our future, literally, depends on it.
It was so fun to play with our friend Dr. Tiffany Yecke Brooks, author of multiple books including her newest, Holy Ghosted: Spiritual Anxiety, Religious Trauma, and the Language of Abuse. We laughed and swore and shared about finding peace, freedom, and healing after being in a culture that unfortunately doesn't promote any of those things very well. You can learn more about her work at tiffanyyeckebrooks.com
Hand in hand with last week on faith beyond beliefs, in this episode we process the power of healing in nature. It opens us in ways our souls need without a lot of effort. In the words of Jared Escobar, "everything is better outside."
In this episode we chat about faith being far beyond belief, and that's why it's so scary and foreign. Practicing this is no small thing but our soul can hold unknowns a heck of a lot better than our heads.
While all our efforts for self-improvement and healing can be helpful, we can also become stuck in endless loops of trying to do better, be better, figure things out. In this episode we process how sometimes the solution is the problem. What if nothing is "wrong" with us?
In this episode we chat with our friend Eric Jepsen, who is the founder of Beautifully MAID (beautifullyMAID.org) and a passionate advocate for end of life options for people with terminal illnesses. We need to integrate conversations about death into the regular rhythms of our lives and we're grateful for spaces like to learn, listen, and expand our awareness together. More on Medical Aid in Dying at compassionandchoices.org and Eric's organization at beautifullyMAID.org.
We love having interesting conversations with our friends, finding hope and healing and resonance in hard places. Mary Rader catalyzed our 12 Steps for Anti-Racism group at The Refuge and we just all got back from our 2nd Civil Rights Learning Trip to Alabama a few weeks ago. In this episode Mary shares more about what happens when we are confronted with truth about our history, white supremacy, and supremacist logic and how it's all a mix of soul work and practice. More on the Truth and Transformation 12 Steps by Melvin Bray at collabyrinthconsulting.com and Equal Justice Institute at eji.org.
For President's Day this year in the US we decided just to ramble a bit about what we're learning about the truth of our history and what that's doing inside of us as we grow and change. It's all a hot mess. Happy $*!^$&!()% Presidents Day!
We love playing with friends and in this episode Ryan Taylor joins us for a fun conversation about the power of simple, unplugged, wild, and free spirituality that looks nothing like what a lot of the shiny we have been sold. Ryan's a mystic, person of presence, spirituality director, author of Awkward Spirituality: The Divinity of Ordinary Life and someone who brings us hope. It's always in the underground.
Yeah, we decided to mix it up this week and just have a light and easy convo about the Oscars. Even though at the time of recording Phyllis had only watched 3 of the movies (ha!) we had a lot to talk about. If you're an avid movie fan, don't be too annoyed with us!
We always love talking about the 4 Gateways (we did 5 episodes on it several seasons ago)--Lover, Magician, Warrior, Sovereign or Feeling, Thinking, Doing, Being. As we enter into a new year, it's a great time to consider how we can nourish our Sovereign and this episode is focused on its 4 Food Groups--Validation, Support, Inspiration, Blessing. Eat as much of that as we can!
We've talked a lot about the lies of white supremacy, Christian supremacy, male supremacy, and a lot of other supremacies over the last few years, but this episode is about one of them that doesn't get much play--"a certain kind of family supremacy." What's baked into our cultures and systems about what's better than others that's seeped into how we feel about ourselves and others? As culture changes, we're trying to let go of old entanglements that get in the way of freedom (and love!).
We love playing with kindreds and in this episode we interview Amber Cantorna-Wylde, author of several books including her most recent--Out of Focus: my story of shame, sexuality, and toxic evangelicalism. An LGBTQ+ advocate and community cultivator, Amber brings so much wisdom, honesty, and challenge to the table and we feel so grateful to have her voice here. More on her work at ambercantornawylde.com.
Sometimes, thinking about the human condition and the reality of suffering in the world is just too overwhelming, especially when the stories we rely on to keep our balance no longer hold up. How do we create lives worth living in the face of suffering, horror, and the very real threats to humanity and our earth right now? And why should we bother? Welcome to this raw conversation about how to be a non-delusional human being in the midst of all the mess.
Oh, the holidays stir up so much for so many. In this last episode of 2023 we process some ways we can all find our way in as healthy of ways as possible as we keep practicing, together.
We loved hanging out and learning from our friend Joanna Douglas, who nurtures soul care and spiritual formation at The Refuge and facilitates workshops, groups, and teams using non-violent communication/mindful communication/compassionate communication tools (along with a lot of others, too!). This episode is filled with so many gems and we are grateful to have it in our archives to come back to as an extremely helpful resource.
It's always fun to play with Jamison Escobar, Kathy's son. This year he is now working as the Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion Coordinator for the LA Lakers and so this episode is about learning, listening, considering the challenges DEI is facing in our country at the moment and what we can keep doing personally and organizationally to cultivate greater equity and health despite so much resistance.
It's November 2023 and we're less than a year away from a big ugly election. We don't want to get ahead of ourselves but we also want to make sure we recognize what's ahead and what's at stake and what we're feeling and others are wrestling with, too. Really, it's just a raw conversation because that's what we do here.
Phyllis's book--The Subversive Soul: the gentle revolution everyone needs--is now available on her website for download and we're so grateful it's in the world. In this episode she shares more about it and some of the major moments. It's got so much goodness in it. Her website is phyllismathis.com if you want to download your free copy.
This episode is our real transition into the new season. Last week's conversation was so important to not wait on and so in this one we do what we normally do after a break--ramble about real life, what's alive for us, what we're learning, what we're practicing in this season as we regroup.
Content Warning: Gaza War through the lens of Palestinian refugees. It's been a while and a lot of horrifying things are happening in the world. We decided to skip over the intro episode and just start this new season off with what's heavy on so many souls right now--what's happening in Gaza and the reality of over 10,000 Palestinian civilians killed so far. This conversation with our longtime friend Suzann Mollner, Founder Executive Director of Beirut and Beyond, which is dedicated to relief, reconciliation, and relationship with Palestinian refugees, is an honest and raw one related to advocacy on behalf of Palestinians. We are grateful for her voice, long-haul love and advocacy, and bridge building and challenge to us all. Follow Suzann's work at beirutandbeyond.org.
Wow, this is our 60th Episode of Soul + Practice and our Season 4 Wrap, where we look back at the last 5 months of conversations and reflect on all the goodness before a 3 month summer break. Thanks for listening!
What an incredible conversation we had with our friend Melvin Bray, author of the 12 Steps Truth and Transformation Model, and co-catalyzer of a group of black men walking through the steps together and healing from patriarchy in community. We could have talked all day but this episode is packed with so many gems of wisdom and deep challenges for all of us. More on Melvin's work at collabyrinthconsulting.com. He also refers to the work of relationaluprising.org--check them out!
Years ago at an event centered on Toxic Masculinity at The Refuge, someone asked the speaker, Regan Byrd, a Denver-based organizational consultant and black community organizer, what work related to toxic masculinity looked like for females. Her response was we needed to untangle from "internalized misogyny." It runs deep and damages us all.
We loved this conversation with Rabbi Charna Rosenholtz, who facilitates trainings and workshops for The Right Use of Power Institute in addition to her extensive work as a teacher specializing in psycho-spiritual growth and applications of spiritual wisdom. All roads lead to power and we need to respect it, honor it, process it, engage with it together if we want to embody healthier power personally and systemically. She is the founder of the Shulchan community (shulchan.net, shulchan translates to "table"), an online community dedicated to learning and fellowship. More on the Right Use of Power institute rightuseofpower.org.
Yeah, we need more honest conversations about death. We've had a few since Soul Practice started and were honored to hang out with our friend Becky Davis with The Natural Funeral for a conversation about death planning and healthier ways to navigate something that's going to happen to all of us. More at thenaturalfuneral.com.
Our friend Lori Wilson embodies curiosity and questions that connect humans together in simple but profound ways! The art of presence and remaining in a posture of curiosity takes practice (and is really hard in this world that thrives on certainty, statements, and positions) and we loved learning from her in this episode. Learn more about her work and sign up to get awesome questions in your in-box each week at questionsthatconnect.com.
In this episode we process the angst of narcissists and how they are bald-face liars and what that does to our soul and our society. It sucks!
Trigger Warning: gun violence and traumatic mental illness story | In this episode we feel so grateful for the courage of our friend Heather Kopp to share her real and extremely vulnerable story as a mom of a son struggling with mental illness that contributed to a tragic shooting of 3 random people and his death by the police. The names of the victims are Andrew Alan Myers, 42, Jennifer Vasquez, 35, and Christina Galella-Baccus, 34. In the complexities of life and especially with the reality of the recent shooting at a Nashville school, we are aware of how tangled up all these issues are and how important it is to be able to hear real stories that help us become people who can hold the complicated together. Learn more about Heather at heatherkopp.com
Instead of trying to earn, find, or claw our way into a seat at the tables created by oppressive systems, what if we just built our own f'ing table?
Toxic skills--things we can do that are not life giving and we really shouldn't be doing. This idea of considering toxic skills was originally shared by our friend Deborah Loyd at a Refuge workshop a chunk of years ago and comes up a lot in our soul practice work. In this episode we explore how easy it is to default to toxic skills (and how we're often praised for them) instead of doing the hard work of staying in our lane of things we love (or even like!),
Living--not just surviving--this harsh world is no small thing and one of the most brave and beautiful things we can do is be open to joy in the midst of it. This conversation with our friend Krista O'Reilly Davi-Dagui, founder of A Life in Progress and a brave and beautiful community, is raw and real and exactly what Soul + Practice is all about. Joy is the most vulnerable emotion and oh, we are allowed to feel it but it sure can be scary. More on Krista's work at alifeinprogress.ca.
In this episode, we unpack some of our reflections after a Civil Rights Learning Trip and Community Pilgrimage to Montgomery, Birmingham, and Selma Alabama with a group of 16 of us who are part of the 12 Steps for Anti-Racism group using Melvin Bray's 12 Steps Truth and Transformation Model centered on untangling from supremacist logic that's embedded in us, confronting the truth of our histories and its impact on us, and tangibly working toward change. This just scratches the surface but that's what this podcast is about--raw conversations and real practices. More on Melvin's work at collabryinthconsulting.com. More on the work of Equal Justice Initiative at eji.org
We had such a rich and soulful conversation with our friend Dr. Lisa Pettit on engaged Buddhism and how the teachings of Thich Nat Hanh in community can change us and the way we move together in the world. We wanted to keep talking for hours! More on Compassionate Dharma Cloud Monastery in Morrison at cdcmonastery.org.
Oh, the patriarchy. We could do entire seasons on it but for today, we're just happy to get to hang out with our amazing friend Kay Neuhausel, a therapist and kindred. The patriarchy doesn't just affect women; it messes with all of us and the long, slow work of healing start with honest conversations and creating a space where we can name some of the things that look invisible to many but affect everything. More on Kay's practice--Brave Therapy--at kayneuhausel.com
In today's episode we dive into a conversation with Tim H, co-author of "Adult Children of Manifest Destiny: A 12 Step Program for People Recovering from Settler Colonialism" with Alietta R. Untangling from our history and how it's impacted us and our culture is slow and long healing work meant to do together. You can learn more about their work and order the ACMD workbook at acmdonline.com
We need more conversations about the realities of neurodiversity in relationship! We learned so much in an amazing conversation with our friend, Lisa Baba, who is the Director of Community Relations at the Temple Grandin School in Boulder. We could have talked for hours but this is a great start and hope that everyone who listens gets a little something that they needed.
After 3 extra weird years, could we have a little hope for 2023? As we start Season 4 and a new year, we're trying to be realistic and also more "clear" and "uncluttered." How are you feeling about this new year?
Fall 2022 was our Season 3 and we covered a lot of ground from the British monarchy to processing through the 4 Gateways as a pathway to greater health, guns and God, long COVID, story-telling, making it through the holidays, and election angst. Human-ing in this weird world is not the easiest thing and we hope Soul + Practice somehow helps. We'll be back in 2023!
Oh the holidays stir up so much trouble for so many of us in different ways. When Christmas is blue, what are some things that might help and how can we find our way through this season as best we can? All roads always lead to paradox.
We love playing with friends! Mark Yaconelli, storyteller, facilitator, and author of his newest book-Between the Listening and the Telling: How Stories Can Save Us, joins us this week talking about the power of our simple and sacred stories. So much goodness packed into this episode and you can learn more about Mark's work at howstoriescansaveus.com.
In just one week there have been two mass shootings that we are aware of--Club Q in Colorado Springs and a Walmart Break Room in Virginia. There's so much tangled up with guns and God and fear and ambivalence and the reality that we live in this kind of culture. It's hard on souls, and there's a lot to lament--and, lament isn't always super coherent.
Yeah, long COVID is real. Like so many things related to COVID, a lot of us are ready to not be talking about it, thinking about it, or moving our lives around for it. But in reality, this illness continues to impact millions of people. This conversation is with our friend Joy Shroeder, a yoga instructor and kindred spirit and least likely to end up with a debilitating illness. But here she is. Losing health--no matter what the way--is no small thing; we learned a lot in this conversation that we didn't know and it was so helpful.
Being, Sovereign, Bringing it all Together - This is the last of our 5 part series on the 4 Gateways as a framework for growth--Thinking, Feeling, Doing, Being with the archetypes of Magician, Lover, Warrior, Sovereign. This quadrant is one of the most underutilized for so many of us and in this episode we lean in to the part that can help bring the others all together.
Tuesday November 8th 2022 is Midterm Elections in the USA, ack! It's a hot mess with so much on the line. If you haven't voted yet, please get it done! If you want to support an organization helping voting access in the most significant of ways, support Black Voters Matter at blackvotersmatterfund.org.
"Doing" energy is different for everyone. Some of us have really strong Warrior energy that can be exhausting--doing, doing, doing--while others have a hard time moving things into fruition. This 3rd quadrant in the 4 Gateways conversation explores bringing some of the "doing" into greater balance.
In this episode we dive into the Feeling quadrant in this 5 part series processing the Four Gateways, a framework for greater emotional and relational health that we're riffing on as we start this season. Some of us over-feel, over-love, over-empathize, and some of us are shut down, taught to suppress certain kinds of feelings to protect ourselves. There's no perfect balance but considering where we can practice and grow helps.
So many of us are masters at overthinking everything. This is part of the 4 Gateways series--Thinking, Feeling, Doing, and Being--and this episode is centered on the "Magician" or thinking quadrant and ways it can over-function, under-function, or with some practice and intention, become healthier.
Thinking, Feeling, Doing, Being - there's no such thing as perfect balance but we can keep developing ways to live more soulfully and integrated. The 4 Gateways are a tool to help us consider these aspects of ourselves and this episode is just an overview and a launching place for future conversations.
Queen Elizabeth's death has stirred up a wide mix of conflicted feelings for many. This episode, recorded on the day of her funeral, isn't so much just about the Queen of England dying but about our addictions to kings and queens and propping up unhealthy power structures.
After a Summer 2022 break, we are back for Season 3 for Fall 2022! We've missed being together but glad for the rhythm of Summer and a chance to anchor in some practices and keep finding our way...
Episode 30: Season Two Wrap
Wow, we covered a lot of ground since January and in this episode we look back at some of the conversations we’ve had together, promise to fix the sound, and reflect on what we keep learning and practicing as best we can. We’ll be back in September 2022 with Season 3! Thanks for listening!
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 29: Soul Healing with Angie Fadel
Embodied practices are everything, and Angie Fadel, our kindred and spiritual director and meditative archer, shares more about the hard, beautiful, and life-time work of soul healing. More on Angie’s work at angiefadel.com.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 28: Recovering Racists with Idelette McVicker
Idelette McVicker joins us for a soulful conversation about her new book, Recovering Racists: Dismantling White Supremacy and Reclaiming our Humanity. So much goodness and challenge and hope! More on Idelette’s work at Idelette.com.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 27: Dreaming of a Better Way
Healthy systems are possible! Simple and small matters. Living systems are against the grain but are built on healing ourselves to help heal the world. Our dreams of a better way can come true. We refer to some of Dr. Shawn Ginwright’s work and interview on Brene Brown’s podcast. More at shawnginwright.com
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 26: “How Will I Be Today?” - A Conversation with Aram Haroutunian
We have the best friends! Aram Haroutunian is a chaplain, pastor, and person of presence who has decades of experience in end of life realities and what “presence is everything” means.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 25: Long Haul Love and Learning…A Conversation with Suzann Mollner
Suzann Mollner has worked alongside Palestian Refugees for many years, and there’s so much we can learn from her about relationship, relief, and long haul love in the hardest places. More on her work at beirutandbeyond.org.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 24: Self Care
Self Care is a word and practice that has gained a lot of much-needed traction over the past few years but what if we are approaching self-care in the same way the world works and it’s defeating some of the purpose. What if there’s a small, simpler, soulful way to take good care of ourselves?
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 23: Freedom To…A Conversation with David Hayward (Naked Pastor)
David Hayward, also known as Naked Pastor, is one of our kindred spirits and dear friend from afar for many years. In this episode we talk about all things freedom and could have talked for hours! More on David’s work at nakedpastor.com.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 22: Our First Guest! A Conversation With Jamison Escobar
We had such a fun conversation with our first guest, Jamison Escobar, Kathy’s son and catalyzer of goodness related to Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion work. He definitely gives us hope for a better future, and we need as much of that as we can find.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 21: Paradoxing
We bring it up all the time but in this episode we focus in on the practice of paradox-ing, holding all the things despite their contradictions. It’s definitely an art, not a science.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 20: All the Supremacies
The lies of white supremacy, male supremacy, straight supremacy, Christian supremacy, thin supremacy, and all kinds of other supremacies are embedded into our culture, our DNA. Untangling from it is no easy task but recognizing it is a good first step.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 19: Spiritual Bypassing
In our desire to “be okay” in the world, we often do all kinds of things to skip over pain, find an easier solution, and bypass some of the deeper work.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 18: Our Hope is in the Underground
The realities of war in Ukraine stir up a lot of feelings of powerlessness, fear, and hopelessness for the state of our world. What is our part to play in change? Our hope is in the underground.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 17: Eldering
Don’t worry, we’re not talking about church elders, we’re talking about the wisdom that comes with aging, how we need each other–young and old mixed up together–and how crucial it is for aging people to not dismiss our contributions but step into what we have to bring to others, the world.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 16: Presence is Everything
Living in the here and now instead of in the future of the past is no small task. In a fragile and fractured world, being present is our best shot at surviving it. But learning how to be present isn’t something that we can learn with our heads; it comes with practice.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 15: Death
Talking about death, preparing for death, honoring death, respecting our mortality and other people’s mortality as well is something that a lot of us aren’t that great at naturally. In this episode, we dive into an honest conversation about death and dying, just another light topic on Soul + Practice.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 14: All Roads Lead to ISuckVille and WhatIfTown
In this foundational episode for all things Soul+Practice, we look at the two places that all roads seem to lead for most of us humans–ISuckville (Shame) and WhatIfTown (Fear). Our brains get so used to going there that they’re on autopilot. The way out to new patterns requires changing the channel and over time learning to build new roads.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 13: Season 2 and We Don’t Know Sh*t
We’re back with Season 2 and the start of a new year in 2022 that is off to a tricky start. We think it would help us all if we could “break up with knowing.” In a world that makes no promises, this entitled feeling can lead us to all kinds of trouble. In this episode, we focus on the healing that can happen when we embrace “I don’t know.”
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 12 - Season One Wrap
Soul + Practice has been a gift to us! This space to talk about hard things, to consider ways to move differently in the world, to connect with our souls and catalyze change within ourselves and the circles we move in has been healing for both of us. This episode is a look back at where we’ve been this season as we pause and get ready for season 2!
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 11 - Abortion
Trigger Warning: Abortion can be a traumatic topic. Whoa, we keep diving into the deep end and with abortion rights now up for grabs in a new way before the Supreme Court we decided to spend a little time talking about it together.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 10 - Men!
The patriarchy isn’t just bad for women; it’s bad for men, too. While we obviously can’t speak for men, we wanted to process some of what we hope for change, healing, and healthier human-ing together.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 9 - Womxn!
Womxn rock! The world needs the force of females to forge a better future. There are a lot of obstacles to freedom for women, but we’ll do all we can do to keep strengthening, encouraging, fanning freedom into flame.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Episode 8 - White Girl Anti-Racism Work
As two middle-aged white women, we are wrestling with what it means to play our part in anti-racism work. We stumble and bumble, feel shame and confusion, but won’t give up practicing, trying, learning how much we have to learn.
Get to know the hosts at KathyEscobar.com and PhyllisMathis.com
Here we go! We’re not sure the world needs another podcast, but we know we love to dive into the deep end and talk about life, faith, culture, and how to be healthier human beings in this crazy world. This first episode gives a little taste of who we are and where we’ll be going this season.