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Does running have the power to transform the prison system? According to the data, it might, and it definitely has the power to ignite personal transformation, as you will see in the remarkable new documentary, 26.2 TO LIFE.

Our guest today is Christine Yoo, the director and producer of 26.2 TO LIFE, which tells the story of incarcerated men at San Quentin State Prison who are members of the 1000 Mile Club, the prison’s long distance running club. They train all year for the San Quentin Marathon — a 105 lap, 26.2 mile race that takes place in the San Quentin yard.

The film was shot over the course of three years with unprecedented access to the prison, and for the reasons we discuss in this conversation, I urge everyone to see this film.

TOPICS & TIMES:

Background: Russian Spies & Korean Rom Coms (2:38)

The Cinematic Nature of Running (11:30)

Filming at San Quentin Prison (14:02)

Prison Life (23:38)

Prisons as Businesses (29:06)

Running & Prison Reform (32:34)

Other Prison Running Clubs (45:40)

Where To Watch (53:10)

Music of The Film (55:39)

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The Rocky Mountain Grand Slam: it involves summiting 122 peaks and 318,000 feet of elevation gain (the equivalent of summiting Everest 11 times from sea level). And Vuori & Athletic Brewing athlete, Jason Hardrath, recently set a new FKT by completing it in under 40 days. So I caught up with Jason to break down his most recent accomplishment, and to discuss the blurring of the lines between running, scrambling, and soloing.

TOPICS & TIMES:

Rocky Mountain Grand Slam (2:02)

Planning (7:03)

Calculating Risks (10:57)

Blending Disciplines (23:19)

Crux's of The RMGS (27:58)

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Off The Couch #110: What Makes Jason Hardrath Tick

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Recently at the Tahoe 200, Michele Graglia found himself in first place with an hour lead. Then he decided to stop running. So why did the former winner of the Moab 240 and Badwater 135 stop? And why, shortly thereafter, did he announce that he would be walking away from racing? Blister founder, Jonathan Ellsworth, explores these questions and more with Michele.

TOPICS & TIMES:

What happened at Tahoe? (6:04)

Pushing vs Pulling (13:24)

Authenticity & Joy (29:16)

Mindset Going Into Tahoe 200 (35:17)

Reaction from Sponsors (41:56)

What’s Next? (55:45)

Other Updates & Upheavals (59:59)

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Become a BLISTER+ Member

Off the Couch #102: Michele on Success & Struggle

Off The Couch #87: Michele on Going ‘Ultra’ (Pt 1)

Off The Couch #88: Michele on Going ‘Ultra’ (Pt 2)

Michele Graglia’s book, Ultra

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The 50th running of the Western States 100 took place over the weekend and delivered on all of the excitement and drama we’ve come to expect from US ultrarunning’s biggest stage. Snowy conditions in the high country weren’t enough to stymy blistering times, including a new women’s course record that’s already being hailed as the greatest single run in our sport’s history. To recap the race, Matt Mitchell is joined by Matt Seidel, who also spent the day bouncing around the course from sunup to sundown. They talk about Matt Mitchell’s experience crewing and pacing Leah Yingling to a 9th-place finish; what it was like to be in the middle of the elite women’s field; trying to wrap their minds around Courtney Dauwalter’s performance; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The Matts Do Western States (2:09)
• Pacing Leah Yingling to F9 (3:14)
• Why This Race Rules (6:33)
• Course Conditions (9:27)
• Forest Hill, the Place to Be (13:05)
• Tom Evans’ Race Tactics (20:36)
• Anthony Costales, Hell Yea! (23:46)
• Courtney Dauwalter’s Course Record (25:41)
• How Coverage of the Race Has Evolved (30:53)
• Matt’s Golden Ticket Ambitions (40:44)
• How He Wound Up in a Banana Costume (46:48)
• Highlights & Shoutouts (49:13)

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• Western States 2023 Live Stream
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First run in 1905, the Dipsea is the oldest trail race in the US. Its course takes runners from Mill Valley, CA to Stinson Beach, 7.4 miles separated by 700 stairs, shortcuts, thickets of poison oak, technical singletrack, and stretches of trail with nicknames like “Suicide,” “Cardiac,” and “Insult.” The race’s unique handicap format gives certain runners head starts based on age, gender, and prior performances, meaning that logging the fastest time on the course doesn’t always ensure a victory.

Unless you’re Paddy O’Leary this year. The North Face athlete took home both trophies at the 112th Dipsea a little over a week ago, so Matt Mitchell sat down with him to talk about the race’s storied history; some of the eccentricities that make it so singular; and the various films that have been inspired by it. We also breakdown the Broken Arrow Skryace, which wrapped up its weekend of races on Sunday, and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Broken Arrow Recap (2:07)
• Fun Storylines Coming Out of the Weekend (8:53)
• Eleanor Scholz’s Lupine Shadow Lamp Trophies (11:53)
• The Dipsea (14:14)
• Shortcuts, Handicaps, & Film Recs (20:52)
• Western States Pacing Duties (31:19)

RELATED LINKS:

• Eleanor’s art
• Mt. Marathon
• From The Shadow Of A Mountain
• Survival Run
• Dipsea, The Greatest Race
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The North Face athlete Olivia Amber is just about to roll into her second summer of 2023. Earlier this year, she set out on a 3-month road trip through South America, running and climbing (and occasionally fly fishing) from Santiago, Chile all the way down to Tierra del Fuego, an archipelago off the southernmost tip of the continent. Now that she’s been back home for a bit, we sat down to talk about her southern hemisphere summer, including the FKT she set on the 40-mile Huemul Circuit outside of El Chalten, Argentina, her overall win at the Ultra Fiord 30k, and a whole lot more. Then, we launch into a back-and-forth discussion about fastpacking best practices and gear tips just in time for summer in the States.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Road Tripping Through Chile (1:48)
• Trail Running in South America (4:50)
• Chilean Fjords (8:24)
• Olivia’s Huemul Circuit FKT (12:35)
• Fastpacking 101 (21:24)
• Why & When to Use Poles (27:11)
• Fastpacking Pack Recommendations (32:45)
• Calorie Corner (37:10)
• Navigation Tips & Tricks (46:53)
• Choosing Adventure Partners (51:29)

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• Olivia’s Huemul Circuit FKT trip report
• Palante
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Leah Yingling returns to the show to discuss her partnership with Lululemon and their FURTHER initiative, a first-of-its-kind ultramarathon specifically for women; the brand’s efforts to close the sex and gender data gap in sports medicine that historically underrepresents female athletes; Lululemon’s new women-specific road-to-trail shoe, the Blissfeel Trail; how she’s preparing for this year’s snowy Western States 100; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Leah’s Lululemon Partnership & the Blissfeel Trail (1:41)
• Attending the Launch Event in Vancouver (6:51)
• Her Biomedical Engineer Background (9:12)
• What is the FURTHER Initiative? (12:00)
• 6-Day Ultramarathon & World Record Attempts (16:41)
• Western States 100 Prep (18:28)
• Bring On the Snow! (21:52)
• Summer Racing Storylines (24:55)

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• Lululemon’s Trail Team
• Lululemon’s FURTHER Initiative
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Even in a 250-mile race, falling 10 hours behind the leaders is an almost insurmountable gap. Almost. After some electrolyte issues threatened to derail Salomon athlete Mike McKnight’s third attempt at the Cocodona 250 this year, he found himself confronted with a choice: pull the plug and take a DNF just 70 miles in, or put his head down and try and work his way back up the field. What ensued is already being hailed as one of the greatest comebacks in ultrarunning history. So, Matt Mitchell asked Mike to take him through how he rescued his race, took the win, and set a new Cocodona 250 course record in the process.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Cocodona 250, Round 3 (2:00)
• Intrinsic vs. Extrinsic Motivation (6:05)
• Electrolyte Mishaps (7:34)
• Blueprint for 200 Mile Races (11:30)
• Mike’s Mental Preparation (25:13)
• Race Recovery & Nutrition (28:43)
• Raw Milk (35:49)
• The Rise of 200+ Mile Events (40:07)
• Gear Corner (44:20)
• Western States & What's Next? (45:15)

RELATED LINKS:

• Testing Limits: Mike McKnight on Running 100 Miles, 0 Calories (Ep.51)
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It’s probably fitting that Andrea Sansone and Andrew Hamilton met at the summit of a Colorado 14er, one of the 58 such peaks in the state that have gone on to help forge their relationship. Though neither considers themselves trail runners, the duo routinely puts up times on popular alpine routes that outpace those of the pros. Andrew has held the supported FKT for climbing all of Colorado’s 14ers since 2015, and last year, Andrea set the supported FKT on Nolan’s 14, becoming the first woman to complete the roughly 100-mile route in less than 2 days.

As the high country continues to thaw, Matt Mitchell sat down with Andrea and Andrew to talk about their summer goals; the partnership they’ve formed by doing hard stuff in the mountains together; lapping the Manitou Incline for 24 hours straight; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Forming an Endurance Power Couple (2:17)
• Andrew’s Adventure Racing Background (5:41)
• Their FKT Progression (7:37)
• Why They Don’t Consider Themselves Runners (11:09)
• Dissecting Andrea’s Nolan’s 14 FKT (14:18)
• Winter Training for Mountain Season (44:52)
• Tips for Faster Hiking (54:20)

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• Nolan’s 14 - Andrea Sansone FKT 2022
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Sarah Ostaszewski has run the Cocodona 250 all three years of its existence, each go-around shrinking the amount of time it’s taken for her to get from where the race starts just outside of Phoenix, Arizona, to where it ends 250 miles north in the town of Flagstaff. Sarah’s latest attempt on the grueling point-to-point course was her fastest yet; she finished in just over three days, good for 1st place and 4th overall.

The daunting prospect of returning to something the scale of Cocodona 250, a race that includes 40,000 ft. of cumulative elevation change, vast temperature swings, and a 125-hour cutoff that leaves little room for sleep, all but guarantees that the number of repeat finishers stays quite small. So, Matt Mitchell talked to Sarah about why she keeps coming back for more; why multi-day events are so alluring; what makes the changing landscapes of the Mountain West so intoxicating; her ice cream intake; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Recovery After Running 250 Miles (2:21)
• Moving to US Trail Towns (5:42)
• Sarah’s Ultra Entry Point (7:54)
• Favorite Trails in the PNW (9:52)
• Discovering the Cocodona 250 (11:34)
• Time On Feet (14:32)
• Arizona’s Changing Landscapes (17:17)
• Crew Tough Love (22:55)
• Cocodona 250’s Rapid Growth (23:44)
• Why She Keeps Coming Back (28:25)
• Sarah’s Sleep Strategy (34:58)
• Thoughts on Nutrition (41:24)
• The Allure of Multi-Day Races (45:38)
• Preparing for the Ouray 100 (52:21)

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For the most part, competitive trail running in the US is perceived to bias heavily toward the West Coast, with many of its marquee races and popular training hubs lying left of the Mississippi. This imbalance has stoked a gentle sense of rivalry in trail runners who call the East Coast home, an underdog mentality that many — including this week’s guest, New York native and athlete for The North Face, Sarah Keyes — have turned into fuel.

Sarah recently punched her ticket to Innsbruck, Austria to represent the US as part of their Long Distance team at this year’s World Mountain Championships, a spot she earned with a podium finish at the Lake Sonoma 50 in Northern California. We talk about what it’s like living and training in the Adirondacks year-round; East Coast vs. West Coast trail running scenes; the upcoming World Mountain Running Championships in Innsbruck, Austria; the latest hits (and misses) in her kitchen; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Sarah’s Background & the Adirondacks (1:53)
• East Coast vs. West Coast Trail Scenes (14:14)
• Race Directing and Weed Whacking (19:48)
• ITRA (27:05)
• Making the US Long Distance Team (35:07)
• Joining The North Face (38:25)
• Pastry Making (41:50)
• International Racing (44:11)

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Last time Jason Hardrath was on Off The Couch he teased a future project that involved a trip down to Mexico, a volcano, and a whole lot of running and climbing, but aside from those hints, gave no major clues as to what exactly he had cooked up. Well, during his spring break from teaching earlier this year, Jason, together with his buddy Nathan Longhurst and a lean film crew, set out to complete what is affectionately known as an “infinity loop” on Mexico’s Pico de Orizaba (18,491′), the tallest volcano in North America. Without spoiling anything, Jason’s project predictably turned into quite the sufferfest, so Matt Mitchell sat down with him to hear all about it in anticipation of the upcoming film that documents the attempt.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Pico de Orizaba & HAPE (2:41)
• History of the “Infinity Loop” Format (40:18)
• Previous Attempts (19:42)
• How Health Issues Almost Derailed the Project (24:06)
• Traveling in Mexico (35:05)
• The Legend of Nathan Longhurst (40:18)

RELATED LINKS:

• Jason Hardrath on FKTs & What Makes Him Tick (Ep.110)
• Jason Hardrath on Deer Collisions, Convoluted Bliss, & Keeping the Dream Alive (Ep.149)
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Speedland recently released their much anticipated third commission, a hyper-performance trail shoe intended for ultra-length distances, which they call the GS:TAM. So, Matt Mitchell sat down with co-founders Dave Dombrow and Kevin Fallon to catch up on all that’s transpired since their first appearance on the show back in February of 2022; how they came to adopt a commission-based model for their company; the ins-and-outs of building an athlete team; what informed the design of the GS:TAM; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What’s New? (2:31)
• SL:PDX Reception (3:50)
• Speedland’s “Commission” Model (6:16)
• Building an Athlete Team (9:50)
• Collaborating with FreeTrail (14:44)
• Corporate Team (16:03)
• GS:TAM Deep-Dive (16:58)
• Availability (25:11)
• Small Brand Surprises (29:12)
• The Future of Speedland (31:15)
• Cameron Hanes Commission & Criticism (34:50)
• Cocodona 250 & Race Sponsorship (37:19)

RELATED LINKS:

• On the Creation of a “Hyper-Performance” Trail Shoe Company: Speedland (Ep.107)
• Speedland
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When Preston Cates popped up on most peoples’ radars with his unexpected 6th place finish at the 2021 Canyons 100k as a 23 year-old, he had a pretty simple motivation driving his young trail running career: to never have to pay for shoes again. Since then, the Boulder, CO native has racked up podium finishes left and right, landed a pro contract to run for Nike (shoes included), and recently punched his ticket to represent the US at the World Mountain Running Championships in Austria later this year. Matt Mitchell sat down with Preston a week after his 3rd place finish at the 2023 Lake Sonoma 50 to chat about his development as an athlete; walking on to a D1 program at the University of Arkansas; training vs. spending time outside; what he grabs at a gas station during a mid-run bonk; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Flagstaff by way of Boulder, Gunnison, Arkansas, and Austria (2:17)
• Preston’s wrestling career (4:43)
• How he fell into running (6:56)
• Being an extravert (12:08)
• Moving to Austria in the middle of COVID (15:22)
• Canyons 2021, dance parties, & Camelbaks (20:05)
• How doing different sports can keep you healthy (31:06)
• Nike contract & transitioning to running full-time (36:16)
• Social media (42:23)
• His Nike teammate, Drew Holmen (45:35)
• Making the U.S Team at Lake Sonoma 50 (46:54)
• What else he has lined up this year (55:47)
• Gas station snacks (57:33)

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“So, how did you get into trail running?” is an evergreen question, one that’s likely to field a variety of interesting and original responses regardless of who you ask. Underlying its premise, though, rests one of the sport’s major shortcomings, at least on the elite level. Up until recently, there existed few (if any) direct paths for new runners or athletes crossing over from different disciplines to pursue trail running professionally.

Recognizing the critical role that development programs play in helping a formerly recreational sport mature, Salomon Athlete Andy Wacker launched The Trail Team earlier this year for expressly that purpose — to provide mentorship, skill development, and media exposure to 6 aspiring pro trail runners in the US. Matt Mitchell spoke to Andy and two Trail Team members, Lauren Gregory and Sam Hendry, about the organization’s backstory, before expanding into a roundtable discussion centered on what Lauren and Sam hope to get out of their time on the team, their professional goals, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• What is The Trail Team? (2:59)
• Challenges of transitioning from track / XC to the trails (7:00)
• Mountain running (10:12)
• Lauren’s experience on the US Junior Mountain Running Team (12:46)
• Sam's Nordic ski background (15:44)
• How The Trail Team is structured (17:20)
• Navigating social media as a pro athlete (24:50)
• The importance of keeping the team independent (26:45)
• Specializing in sub ultra distances (32:10)
• How Lauren & Sam ended up on the team (34:06)
• Balancing D1 athletics with trail running (37:27)
• How Andy sees the team growing over the next few years (43:56)
• Long-term goals (51:15)

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• The Trail Team
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As far as superlatives go, there’s little hand wringing about Salomon Athlete Courtney Dauwalter’s standing as one of the best ultrarunners in the world, period. In a sport known for its fickleness, she’s been outright untouchable on the trails for the past two years, riding a 15-race win streak that dates back all the way to 2021 and includes dominant victories on stages such as UTMB (where she set a new female course record in 2021) and Hardrock 100.

Matt Mitchell recently sat down with Courtney to try and get a sense for how she conceives of running as something that can be taken lightly but practiced seriously. Along the way, they also map the interior of her pain cave, the mental space she occupies when things get dark deep in a race; discuss what does and does not belong on top of nachos; talk bowhunting; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Courtney’s background (3:14)
• How Nordic skiing translates to trail running (8:04)
• What guides her training philosophy (12:13)
• Skiing at the University of Denver (13:17)
• 14er first date (16:04)
• Moving to Leadville, CO (22:17)
• Training for Transgrancanaria this winter (23:10)
• Transitioning to running full-time (24:51)
• The pain cave (28:26)
• Running by feel instead of numbers (31:40)
• Nachos & balloon hunting (38:29)
• Doubling up at Western States & Hardrock 100 (42:50)

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Corrine Malcolm is a true trail multi-hyphenate. In addition to running professionally for adidas TERREX and recently launching her own coaching business, Corrine also covers the sport as a writer, editor, race broadcaster, and podcast host. Matt Mitchell recently sat down with her for a grab bag conversation on topics like the relationship between writing and editing; what makes for a good interview; the pros and cons of the way mainstream media outlets cover trail running; the Barkley Marathons; fitness trends; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Playing catch-up (3:27)
• New role & science writing (4:37)
• “Tough Enough” (7:26)
• Writing vs. editing (13:17)
• What makes for a good interview? (17:43)
• The PTRA & the future of trail running (25:53)
• Barkley Marathons: any press is good press? (38:08)
• The Norwegian Method (44:56)
• Trail running’s next hotspot (46:13)

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• Foothills Endurance
• Pro Trail Runners Association
• “Tough Enough”
• Lazarus Lake NYT Profile
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Recycling old running shoes is hard, really hard. The concoction of glues, plastics, fabrics, and foams that go into making each pair can each require their own form of disposal, a drawn out sorting process that’s often as inefficient as it is unrealistic. As a result, every year millions of pairs of retired shoes end up in the dump, where many eventually spill out into the sea only to wash ashore on coastlines thousands of miles away.

As a proud Alaskan, artist, filmmaker, and trail runner, Max Romey knows the repercussions of this problem first hand. Currents make the state’s wild beaches a popular landing spot for ocean debris, leading to pollution Max cleverly captures through watercolor in his new film for Nnormal, “No Lost Shoes.” Matt Mitchell recently sat down with him to talk through some of the major sustainability issues facing the footwear industry; how Nnormal is attempting to upend that process; musings on imperfection in art; parenthood; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Watercolor (2:25)
• Leaning into imperfection in art & life (7:27)
• Run-sketch-run (9:22)
• Landscape painting in Alaska (16:58)
• How Max got into adventure filmmaking (20:52)
• The cinematics of filming an ultra (27:04)
• Nnormal and “No Lost Shoes” (30:31)
• Channeling anger into action (40:24)
• Nnormal’s sustainability goals (43:41)
• Thoughts on parenthood & the future (48:45)
• Upcoming projects (52:00)

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• “No Lost Shoes”
• Nnormal Tomir
• Nnormal Kjerag
• Nnormal’s No Trace Program
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Ryan Scura and Dylan Ladds have been making movies together since they were both teenagers. What began as a childhood friendship quickly evolved into a creative partnership, culminating in Dooster, the award winning production company they started several years ago. Much of the duo’s work focuses on storytelling in the outdoor community, offering an often candid lens that frames one of their latest projects, a short entitled, “Urban Oasis: A Love Letter to San Francisco.” Ryan has called the film his passion project, one that “...was always put in the back of the line,” so we sat down with him to learn more about how it all finally came together; the role city parks play in making trail running more accessible; the challenges and benefits of creative collaboration; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Teaching adventure filmmaking (4:14)
• “What is ‘Dooster’?” (11:16)
• How Ryan balances relationships that are both personal & professional (14:28)
• Trail running in San Francisco (18:15)
• Paddy O’Leary, “Coming Home,” and the creative process (23:08)
• “Urban Oasis” (33:33)
• Thoughts on the importance of publics parks & open spaces (46:25)
• Upcoming projects (50:18)

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• "Urban Oasis: A Love Letter to San Francisco"
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The Black Canyon 100k in Arizona is one of the most competitive ultras in the US. As the penultimate Hoka Golden Ticket Race promising automatic entry into this year’s Western States 100 to the top two female and male finishers, its elite field runs deep, meaning finishing times are often blisteringly fast. The men’s course record, set all the way back in 2016, was considered among the stoutest in the sport, that is until Anthony Costales, clad in his college singlet and sun hat, dropped it by a dizzying 19 minutes just a few weeks ago. So, we caught up with Anthony to recap his race; learn how he changed his preparation after finishing 5th at the BC100k last year; chat about how he’s approaching Western States; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• The ultra learning curve (3:35)
• ‘Which is harder to recover from, a road marathon or a trail race?’ (4:29)
• Taper tantrums! (7:08)
• Thoughts on having a coach vs. being self-coached (7:51)
• Chico State, a pipeline to the trails? (9:35)
• Balancing running with his job as a PE teacher (16:05)
• Transitioning to the trails after college (17:56)
• The ups and downs of increasing distance (22:01)
• Black Canyon 100k race recap (24:17)
• Aid station lemon pound cake (27:30)
• Racing for the love of competition (29:59)
• Preparing for Western States ’23 (36:22)
• What he learned from his debut 100-miler (39:44)
• Race livestreams & drone footage galore (41:27)

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Trail running’s evolution from recreational to professional sport has not been without its own share of setbacks, and as often is the case, athletes are the ones most immediately affected by them. Facing the lack of a collective voice to confront these challenges, Nike Athlete Francesco Puppi co-founded the Pro Trail Runners Association (PTRA) in 2022 to enable an international body of elite trail runners to share concerns about the sport’s present and future. So, Matt Mitchell sat down with Francesco to learn more about the association’s specific areas of focus, including anti-doping, athlete rights, and environmental protection; why forming a union was necessary at this point in trail running’s level of professionalization; what the US can learn from Europe when it comes to further developing the sport; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• How Euros develop as runners (4:50)
• Where Francesco gets his passion for running (7:19)
• Top training resources (11:52)
• His background in physics (13:14)
• 2022 recap (14:18)
• Trail running in the US vs. the EU (18:38)
• Breaking down the current pro trail running landscape (28:36)
• Co-founding the Pro Trail Runners Association (30:24)
• Where do we go from here? (43:16)
• Matt Carpenter & the “Legend of Pikes Peak” (47:13)
• How to support the PTRA (48:49)

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Newly christened The North Face Athlete, Rod Farvard, returns to the show to talk about the brand’s unique Athlete Development Program, an initiative launched earlier this month to provide 17 young athletes from a multitude of outdoor sports with resources to accelerate their careers and serve as activists in the outdoor space. Rod and I talk about the critical role such programs play in continuing to professionalize the sport of trail running; how he intends to use his platform to help decrease our environmental impact while enjoying trails and wilderness spaces; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Doi Inthanon: a series of unfortunate events (3:41)
• Getting Rhabdo (7:49)
• “What’s your longest ride on Zwift?” (14:43)
• TNF’s Athlete Development Program (16:12)
• Mentorship with The North Face (20:41)
• Meeting the ADP team (25:04)
• Is running inherently selfish? (29:20)
• 6-month program goals (33:29)
• 3rd time’s a charm at Western States ’23 (35:13)
• UTMB & TDS (38:12)

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Ultra-distance trail running is a sport ripe for storytelling, something that filmmaker Jeff Pelletier recognized when he first began chronicling his adventures back in 2018. Since then, his background in video production, married with his passion for exploring the world by trail, has produced dozens of compulsively watchable POV-style films of his experiences at events like UTMB, the 205-mile Tor des Géants, and most recently, a 7-day stage race in the country of Georgia. We talked to Jeff about the added challenges of filming himself during grueling ultramarathons; how YouTube is helping to grow the sport of trail running; bucket-list fastpacking trips; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Trail running in Vancouver, BC (4:59)
• Jeff’s background in video production (9:05)
• How YouTube helps grow trail running (10:27)
• Storytelling through races & Tor des Géants (17:45)
• ‘Racing Georgia’ (26:46)
• Travel tips (35:28)
• Fastpacking in the US & Europe (36:36)
• Choosing to film himself vs. someone else (44:26)
• Jeff’s relationship with Salomon (47:24)
• Thoughts on the S/LAB Genesis (50:50)
• Goals for 2023 (54:35)

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Running injuries are often talked about in hushed tones, as if mere mention could speak one into existence. While undoubtedly the suckiest part of the sport, they’re also perhaps the most inevitable, so learning how to approach them mentally can make time away from running an opportunity for growth. Saucony Athlete Katie Asmuth spent much of 2022 nursing a broken foot, yet despite being sidelined, she discovered new ways to connect with the greater trail running community. Now healthy and in the process of building back up for a big 2023, we caught up with Katie to talk about how she dealt with her injury; the strength of being a mother to 2 boys gives her deep into ultras; the major family vibes of the Western States 100; race coverage; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Katie’s background (2:42)
• Living & training in Mammoth Lakes, CA (10:45)
• Her career as a nurse practitioner (13:45)
• Nabbing a Golden Ticket in 2021 (15:40)
• Why trail running is NOT therapy (19:35)
• SWAP & the one and only David Roche (22:17)
• Saucony’s small but mighty trail team (25:21)
• Running with a tampon in her nose (28:13)
• Western States 2021 & 2022 (30:46)
• Injury & life advice (42:43)
• Diving into trail running media (48:44)
• Things Katie’s excited about in 2023 (49:54)

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La Sportiva Athlete John Kelly has speculated that one of his weaknesses is that perhaps he’s uncomfortable being comfortable, and one look at his resume sure suggests as much. After trying his hand at triathlon for a few years, a stint that included a few trips to Kona, John found his way into ultrarunning and quickly began to prod at the limits of an already extreme sport. Since then, he’s become only the 15th person to finish the infamous Barkley Marathons (as well as the last to do so) and he holds several FKTs over 200 miles in length. So we sat down with John to learn more about the mindset required to run for several days straight; living and running in the UK; how he recently rebuilt his speed to run a sub-2:30 marathon; who’s winning the Super Bowl; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• From triathlon to trail running (3:00)
• The story behind his nickname, “Random Forest Runner” (6:19)
• The 2017 Barkley Marathons (8:50)
• Does John still have the legendary orange hat from the race? (13:07)
• UK trail running culture (19:13)
• Training for “shorter, faster stuff” (40:53)
• Plans for 2023 & a potential long trail FKT (45:00)

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We recently talked to Salomon Athlete, Jeff Stern, about racing as an elite while simultaneously covering the trail running landscape in his role as the assistant editor of Ultra Running Magazine, a still independently owned publication that has served as “the voice of the sport” since 1981. Jeff hopped on the show shortly after they announced their UltraRunners of the Year for 2022, so we spent some time talking about the history of the award, this year’s winners, and a whole lot else — including, how he came to trail running after years of racing bikes competitively; his profile writing process; the 111th running of the famed Dipsea Race; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• How the SF Giants helped Jeff get into running (2:47)
• A Dipsea deep dive (6:11)
• His background as a cyclist (10:33)
• Making the jump to ultrarunning (15:00)
• 2022 goals (18:42)
• The JFK 50 / Quad Dipsea double (22:16)
• Ultra Running Magazine and profiling athletes (30:57)
• Adam Peterman & Courtney Dauwalter (40:32)
• History of the UltraRunners of The Year Award (46:31)
• Jeff's 2023 goals (53:37)

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The high desert of Northern Arizona has been a hotbed for trail running for decades. The combination of altitude, changing topography, and year-round trail access the region affords helps to harden the legs and fortify the lungs. It’s perhaps no coincidence then that since moving to Flagstaff in early 2021, adidas TERREX pro, Abby Hall, has been tearing up the international racing scene. So, we sat down with her to talk about some of the changes she’s made to fuel this success in a winding conversation that also includes a recount of a potential UFO encounter, musings on writing and creativity, an ode to the Eastern Sierra, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Moving to Flagstaff, AZ (2:50)
• “The Big Ditch” (7:48)
• Running full-time (8:25)
• How to set priorities (10:25)
• What actual goes down at athlete training camps (20:27)
• Musings on writing (22:33)
• Adventures from last year (27:41)
• JMT UFO encounter? (34:46)
• Her Transvulcania victory and Lowest to Highest (45:42)

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As a newly minted thirty-year-old, Dani Moreno has already been racing trails professionally for the better part of a decade. Over the last couple of years, she’s solidified her status as one of the world’s best sub-ultra distance trail runners, a position she’s reached through patience, consistency, and an intuitive knowledge of exactly the right time to give it some gas. This approach continued to pay dividends in 2022; Dani finished in podium position at both the Mont Blanc Marathon and OCC, two marquee international races historically swept by euros. As the calendar ticked over into 2023, we sat down with her to recap a few memorable performances from the previous year; discuss how she mended her broken relationship with running after graduating from college; offer some beta on spearfishing, of all things; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Dani’s background (2:07)
• Advice she’d give to aspiring college athletes (8:56)
• Motorcycles & spearfishing (15:01)
• How she mended her relationship with running (18:23)
• Why trail runners shouldn’t fear the track (24:52)
• Dani’s 2022 racing season & stepping up in distance (30:36)
• “What are your long-term goals?” (41:17)

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Barney “Scout” Mann has been called “the dean of America’s long-distance trails” and is one of the rare individuals to have conquered the Triple Crown of thru-hiking, successfully completing the 8,000 combined miles of the Appalachian, Pacific Crest, and Continental Divide Trails. Each spring for the past fifteen years he and his wife Sandy have hosted hikers starting out on the PCT (more than 7,000 to date) at their San Diego home, providing them with a final hot meal and a bit of encouragement before they begin their trek from Mexico to Canada. So, we sat down with Barney to chat about his deep connections to the PCT and the community it creates; "Journeys North," the memoir he wrote about his own 2007 thru-hike; the future of thru-hiking in America; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Trail names (2:02)
• Scout 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0 (12:10)
• Career as a “kind” lawyer (16:05)
• Mastering the art of storytelling (19:28)
• "Journeys North" (20:30)
• His 2007 PCT thru-hike (24:13)
• Vulnerability on the trail (32:43)
• The endurance mindset (42:02)
• The future of the PCT & being a trail advocate (47:10)

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For On athlete, Jeff Colt, the chase for a coveted spot into Western States had been a multi-year saga fraught with close calls and near misses, that is until a near-perfectly executed run at the Black Canyon 100k in February earned him a Golden Ticket and automatic entry onto one of ultrarunning’s biggest stages. We pick up Jeff’s story there and hear all about his journey leading up to Western States, a play-by-play of his 11th-place finish, and the complexities of looking back at that experience now. Along the way, we also get into topics like the Wilderness Act, the Beat Generation, books currently on our nightstands, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Gary Snyder and the Beat Generation (1:46)
• Working & running in the White Mountains hut system (5:49)
• Hardrock 100 & the Wilderness Act (12:47)
• Jeff’s journey to Western States (17:23)
• Pandemic silver linings (27:04)
• Reflections on his performance at Western States (33:54)
• His interests outside of running (42:30)
• “What books are currently on your nightstand?” (44:57)
• Representing the US at the Trail World Champs in Thailand (49:09)

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Running injuries seem inevitable; almost everyone has a story about being sidelined at some point in their career, either from an acute issue or from general overuse. While no one is completely immune to the stress the sport places on our bodies, there’s plenty we can do to make ourselves more resilient to it. It’s common knowledge that adopting a strength training routine is one of them, but knowing exactly where to begin can be difficult if you don’t have a ton of experience in the gym. So, we spoke to Dr. Anh Bui, a physical therapist, certified strength coach, and USATF certified running coach, about some guiding principles for those looking to get started; how strength training can reinforce proper running form; why everyone should have a basic foam roller; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Anh’s running background (2:58)
• Catching the injury bug early in her career (8:38)
• Her journey to becoming a physical therapist (11:47)
• What is “proper running form”? (16:22)
• The importance of arm swing (19:08)
• Mythbusting running cadence (24:56)
• It’s all in the hips (and core)! (26:36)
• Supination, pronation, & functional feet (28:19)
• The case for having multiple pairs of running shoes (33:53)
• How strength training will help your running (34:40)
• Home gym setups (41:11)
• Breaking the chronic injury cycle (44:13)
• Recovery techniques and tools (45:50)

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• Run Resiliently

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Ultrarunning is often admired for the strength of its community, a quality that unites runners with a sense of belonging. However, we can always do more to ensure that this feeling of acceptance extends to everyone, regardless of how they identify. As one of our sport’s most vocal advocates for queer inclusivity and representation, Altra Athlete Ryan Montgomery is working to do just that. So, we sat down with him to talk about Out Trails, an initiative he started to help build safe spaces for LGBTQ+ runners. Along the way, we also discuss what trail runners, brands, and organizations, can do to support the queer community on every level; why adding a non-binary category to races is so important; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• How Ryan got into ultrarunning (2:31)
• Expedition Bolivia (6:10)
• Turning pro (8:15)
• How running has helped inform his identity (11:42)
• Ways to organically add diversity to the ultra running community (15:23)
• How can races become more inclusive? (20:08)
• Out Trails (25:26)
• The value of LGBTQ+ group runs & retreats (30:22)
• Running: a year-in-review (34:31)

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We first had Jason Hardrath on the show back in March, before the release of his film, “Journey to 100.” Since then, Jason’s spent much of the summer on tour, hosting screenings in cities across the country. But that hasn’t stopped him from continuing to set some pretty mind-blowing FKTs while he’s at it. So, we caught up with the King of FKTs to hear about the reception to his film, his series of vision quests in the Sierra, getting hit by a deer at 40 mph, what adventure he’s dreaming up next, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Recapping “Journey to 100” (4:04)
• Highlights from the film tour (8:55)
• Why memories made in the mountains are stronger (10:19)
• COVID & a mid-ride deer collision (14:15)
• Convoluted Bliss, Norman’s 13, & CA 14ers FKTs (21:23)
• Tips for navigating in the backcountry (48:01)
• Gear talk (53:27)
• Infinity loops & volcanoes (56:01)

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• Convoluted Bliss Video
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• Jason Hardrath on FKTs & What Makes Him Tick (OTC Ep.110)

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After placing 4th at the 60th annual JFK 50 Mile, the oldest ultramarathon in the US, Matt Seidel is taking a break. The 26-year-old former D1 runner has finished in the top 6 at every trail race he’s entered this year, a successful rookie campaign that’s included multiple wins and put the rest of the sport on notice. As the 2022 season comes to a close, we caught up with Matt to talk about what he’s learned from his first year racing as an elite; why more and more road and track athletes are transitioning to the trails; who he wants to model his career after; World Cup predictions; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Matt’s post-ultra turkey trot (2:06)
• How he got into trail running (3:50)
• Inside a D1 college track & field program (9:42)
• Who he looks up to in the trail world (12:28)
• Taking bits and pieces from different training styles (16:17)
• What’s on tap for 2023? (17:30)
• Range: keeping things fresh by mixing it up (22:42)
• The JFK 50 Mile (27:13)
• Hardening the mind during a race (42:00)
• “Are you a runner or a real person?” (47:27)
• Mental vs. physical training (51:56)
• Taking up residence in the pain cave (54:52)
• Golden tickets & World Cup predictions (56:49)

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Joe DeMoor is about as Colorado as they come; he’s from Buena Vista, ran collegiately for the Buffalos at CU Boulder, lives in Carbondale, and works on Aspen Snowmass’s trail crew in the summer and grooms ski runs there in the winter. As a professional mountain runner for La Sportiva, he’s had a breakout year of racing thus far, with several wins under his belt. Redlining up mountains is in Joe’s blood, so we sat down with him to talk about growing up on Colorado trails; the ins and outs of sub-ultra-distance racing; graveyard shifts; pain caves; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Growing up in CO (3:02)
• Running with the Buffaloes (5:49)
• Transitioning to the trails (11:21)
• Tourism management, what’s that? (14:45)
• Trail crews & graveyard shifts (15:46)
• How Joe prepares for a race (18:46)
• Does having a super physical job help or hurt his training? (21:40)
• Recovery hacks (24:12)
• Following in his brother’s footsteps (27:20)
• Year-in-review (29:22)
• Racing Vertical Kilometers (35:31)
• Skyrunning World Champs (41:09)
• Making his international racing debut in Italy (43:33)
• Thailand travelog (45:00)
• FKTs (48:00)
• Skimo season (53:00)

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After a few months in the field, Off The Couch’s reporter-at-large, Leah Yingling, returns to the show to catch us up on how she rounded out her summer season after a top-10 finish at the Western States 100 back in June. We talk about her experience taking in the scene at UTMB this year, and why it’s an event worth going to regardless of whether or not you’re racing, before recapping her run for Team USA at the inaugural World Mountain and Trail Running Championships in Thailand a couple of weeks ago. Along the way, we also chat about racing on short notice; travel stories from Chiang Mai; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Taking a break after Western States (1:58)
• Life bases! (6:09)
• Notes on Jim Walmsley’s run at UTMB (16:18)
• Kilian Jornet’s legendary year on the trails (18:38)
• World Mountain and Trail Running Championships (20:39)
• Thailand travelog (31:10)
• What’s next? (48:32)

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Backpacker’s Pantry has been family-owned and operated for over 70 years, a legacy that’s as important to the brand’s identity as the gourmet adventure meals they make. While that’s not set to change anytime soon, they recently welcomed a new leader to take the company into its exciting next chapter. As CEO, Duane Primozich will prioritize Backpacker’s Pantry’s role as environmental stewards, a commitment to sustainability that goes above and beyond. We recently sat down with Duane and Backpacker’s Pantry owner and Head Chef, Soraya Smith, to hear all about the company’s history; where it’s headed; climate change’s adverse effects on the food industry; what Backpacker’s Pantry is doing to reverse them; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Soraya’s background (3:03)
• How Backpacker’s Pantry got its start (4:53)
• Their line of products (7:26)
• Recipe creation (10:24)
• The CEO next door (12:53)
• The “next chapter” (19:12)
• Environmental stewardship (23:47)
• Duane’s background in climate activism (26:06)
• Chef Soraya’s culinary influences (28:35)
• The freeze-drying process (33:05)
• Gourmet meals on trail, on the river, in the ski lodge (33:54)
• Climate change’s effects on the food industry (36:05)
• Looking ahead (42:11)

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Since her first appearance on Off The Couch back in 2021, Olivia Amber has switched things up. In addition to joining The North Face’s athlete team as a mountain-ultra runner, Olivia also recently decided to step away from the corporate grind for a bit to double down on investing in herself. So, we caught up with her to recap her summer spent epic-ing in the Sierra and, more generally, to find out how she’s adjusting to training full time. Along the way, we go back and forth about the importance of managing ego in the mountains; all-time Halloween costumes, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Investing in her “human capital” (2:12)
• Taming your ego & mental training (12:20)
• Epic-ing in the Sierra (17:50)
• Risk management in the mountains (21:50)
• Blurring the lines between running and climbing (27:06)
• How personal joy can affect race performance (33:07)
• Irish bogs & beer (37:22)
• Mt. Marathon (40:23)
• Wizard sticks! (45:31)
• The Euro trail scene (50:44)
• All-time Halloween costumes (52:49)

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Canyon Woodward has found success on a few different types of trails over the last few years. In addition to an impressive top-50 finish at the Ultra-Trail Du Mont-Blanc in August, he served as the campaign manager for Maine State Senator Chloe Maxmin’s victorious House & Senate runs in 2018 and 2020, which put him on a demanding campaign trail through rural America rivaling that of any ultra. So we sat down with this seasoned political strategist, passionate climate activist, trail runner, and published author to hear about how his new film, Rural Runners, captures where all of these different interests intersect; why the key to both trail running and politics is mostly about just showing up; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Canyon’s background (2:01)
• Convincing Harvard to divest from fossil fuels (5:14)
• Life on the campaign trail with Senator Maxmin (7:09)
• Practical steps for political involvement (11:16)
• Dirt Road Revival (14:44)
• His multi talented brother, Forest (19:21)
• Rural Runners (20:23)
• Finding success at the 100-mile distance (23:18)
• UTMB (26:55)
• His writing process (33:03)
• Canyon’s list of must-read authors (34:37)
• Upcoming races (35:23)
• “Would you ever consider running for office?” (37:01)

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As an adventure photographer and videographer, Ted Hesser spends most of his professional life behind the lens, shooting some of the world’s top mountain athletes for major outdoor brands and publications. His eye for capturing dramatic scenes in the high alpine and willingness to immerse himself in extreme conditions to do so has garnered him success in an otherwise precarious industry. But success isn’t always synonymous with happiness.

Ted’s latest project, a short film called Chains of Habit (released by Mountain Hardwear last month), focuses on his lifelong battle with depression in an effort to destigmatize conversations around mental health. So, we spoke to Ted about the story behind his film; the role trail running plays in keeping him aloft; steps to take if you’re struggling; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Ted’s background (3:34)
• When he first picked up a camera (9:02)
• The realities of #vanlife (13:01)
• Photography tips for beginners (15:22)
• Chains of Habit(21:19)
• Training for the WURL (25:56)
• How depression hits him (29:19)
• The double meaning behind Chains of Habit (40:00)
• Running, psychedelics, & depression (41:56)
• “Taking mental anguish and putting it into a form of your own choosing” (47:14)

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David Kilgore is living the dream. In addition to his role as On Running’s Sports Innovation Manager, David also runs professionally for On himself. As an athlete privy to several sides of the trail running industry, his perspective offers unique insights into the future of the sport as it continues to rapidly professionalize. So, we sat down with David a few days after he made his race directing debut — yet another hat he now proudly wears — to hear how he climbed the ranks at On; how he helped build their trail running team; the business of athlete sponsorships; the simplicity of hard work; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• David’s race directing debut (4:18)
• Representing East Coast trail running (6:47)
• NYC’s ultrarunning scene (8:30)
• David’s background as a D1 runner (10:22)
• Falling out of love with the sport after college (16:48)
• Filmmaking & photography (19:44)
• On Running (20:47)
• Climbing the ranks at On (29:16)
• The ins and outs of building a pro trail team (32:19)
• On’s latest shoes (40:05)
• Recapping UTMB (42:17)

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Running is often praised for its simplicity, but what it requires from the body can be quite complex. As October rolls around, many of us will feel the stress from all those hard summer miles take the form of unexpected aches and pains, which sometimes demand more involved treatment than just some extra time spent on the foam roller. So, we sat down with Claire Bernard Miller, PT, to learn about how her style of physical therapy thinks of the body holistically; why every runner should work on strengthening their feet; pelvic floors, and why having a healthy one can help prevent common overuse injuries; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Claire’s background in PT (6:10)
• What’s PT school actually like? (9:06)
• Starting her own business during the pandemic (10:31)
• Working with high-level athletes (13:11)
• Who to see first: doctor or PT? (13:42)
• How her own injury history directs her practice (17:20)
• What is your pelvic floor & why is it important? (21:48)
• How to strengthen your pelvic floor (25:02)
• Running & pregnancy (31:54)
• Building strong feet (35:31)
• Gait Happens (37:52)
• Busting myths about supination & pronation (40:49)
• MoBo Board & ToePro (43:08)
• Shoes with wide toe boxes: friend or foe? (44:37)
• When to stay away from zero-drop shoes (47:06)
• How to find Claire (48:33)

RELATED LINKS

• Claire's practice
• Claire's Youtube channel

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• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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Specialty-running stores are seldom just places to buy shoes; as community hubs, they serve as places where runners of all skill levels can gather to learn, connect, and train. In this way, they’re essential to the sport, key landmarks in its growing future. However, the demographics these small businesses cater to often fail people of color. So, we spoke to Victor Diaz, owner of Renegade Running, a run-specialty store rooted in Oakland, CA, to learn about how he’s creating a space that’s engaged with the diverse culture it’s a part of; the ways we can go about improving BIPOC representation in running; allyship; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• The importance of specialty-running stores (1:45)
• Oakland, CA’s running culture (3:00)
• Victor’s background in public education (10:42)
• How Renegade approaches merchandising (17:07)
• Representation in running (25:13)
• Practical ways to make the sport more inclusive (36:18)
• The future of Renegade Running (40:01)
• What does “Renegade” mean? (45:50)
• How to support the store & its mission (48:32)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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Specialty-running stores are seldom just places to buy shoes; as community hubs, they serve as places where runners of all skill levels can gather to learn, connect, and train. In this way, they’re essential to the sport, key landmarks in its growing future. However, the demographics these small businesses cater to often fail people of color. So, we spoke to Victor Diaz, owner of Renegade Running, a run-specialty store rooted in Oakland, CA, to learn about how he’s creating a space that’s engaged with the diverse culture it’s a part of; the ways we can go about improving BIPOC representation in running; allyship; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• The importance of specialty-running stores (1:45)
• Oakland, CA’s running culture (3:00)
• Victor’s background in public education (10:42)
• How Renegade approaches merchandising (17:07)
• Representation in running (25:13)
• Practical ways to make the sport more inclusive (36:18)
• The future of Renegade Running (40:01)
• What does “Renegade” mean? (45:50)
• How to support the store & its mission (48:32)

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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As an accomplished endurance athlete who has let ultrarunning, mountaineering, marathon swimming, and more take her around the world, Jennifer Strong McConachie has cultivated a life philosophy informed by principles that have brought her success in competition. Lucky for us, she’s also pretty savvy with paper and pen, so we sat down to talk about her new book, Go Far: How Endurance Sports Help You Win At Life, a collection of stories that encapsulate what she’s learned from running long, climbing high, and swimming deep. In the process, we also explore the connection between writing and running, reading Dostoevsky, the rise of swimrun events, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Jennifer’s background (1:29)
• Drawing on her father for inspiration (11:56)
• The value of being a multiport athlete (14:11)
• Huck Finn & rafting the Mississippi (22:08)
• The rise of swimrun events (24:08)
• Specialization vs. generalization (32:51)
• What’s at the core of endurance sports? (36:03)
• A writer’s life (38:13)
• The connection between writing and endurance (43:25)
• Reading Dostoevsky (44:51)
• Jennifer’s next project & where to find her book (47:55)

RELATED LINKS:

• Go Far: How Endurance Sports Help You Win At Life

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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As an accomplished endurance athlete who has let ultrarunning, mountaineering, marathon swimming, and more take her around the world, Jennifer Strong McConachie has cultivated a life philosophy informed by principles that have brought her success in competition. Lucky for us, she’s also pretty savvy with paper and pen, so we sat down to talk about her new book, Go Far: How Endurance Sports Help You Win At Life, a collection of stories that encapsulate what she’s learned from running long, climbing high, and swimming deep. In the process, we also explore the connection between writing and running, reading Dostoevsky, the rise of swimrun events, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Jennifer’s background (1:29)
• Drawing on her father for inspiration (11:56)
• The value of being a multiport athlete (14:11)
• Huck Finn & rafting the Mississippi (22:08)
• The rise of swimrun events (24:08)
• Specialization vs. generalization (32:51)
• What’s at the core of endurance sports? (36:03)
• A writer’s life (38:13)
• The connection between writing and endurance (43:25)
• Reading Dostoevsky (44:51)
• Jennifer’s next project & where to find her book (47:55)

RELATED LINKS:

• Go Far: How Endurance Sports Help You Win At Life

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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Despite its fast rise from a quirky pastime to budding professional sport, ultrarunning is anything but new; people have been running (or walking) long distances competitively for centuries. Fueled by beer, and usually motivated by a wager or two, these early pioneers helped establish a long tradition of human-powered endurance that persists today. So, we sat down with ultrarunning historian, Davy Crockett, to trace the development of the 100-mile foot race through time, from its roots in the UK to its modern incarnation in the US. Along the way, we also bust some myths about the Western States 100, chat about race nutrition in the 1800s, and debate the greatest ultrarunner of all time.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Davy’s background (1:36)
• Falling in love with the 100-mile distance (6:58)
• Recovery strategies (10:53)
• How the sport has changed in the last 20 years (12:37)
• Ultrarunning History Podcast (15:29)
• “Where did ultrarunning actually start?” (20:28)
• Tracing the sport through the 19th century (28:16)
• 1800s gear talk (34:39)
• Whiskey, drugs, and gambling (36:28)
• The first 100-mile mountain race (39:05)
• The Grand Slam of Ultrarunning (41:20)
• How to get into the American Ultrarunning Hall of Fame (44:52)
• G.O.A.T. debate (46:51)
• “Stranger Things” (53:15)

RELATED LINKS

• Davy's website

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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Despite its fast rise from a quirky pastime to budding professional sport, ultrarunning is anything but new; people have been running (or walking) long distances competitively for centuries. Fueled by beer, and usually motivated by a wager or two, these early pioneers helped establish a long tradition of human-powered endurance that persists today. So, we sat down with ultrarunning historian, Davy Crockett, to trace the development of the 100-mile foot race through time, from its roots in the UK to its modern incarnation in the US. Along the way, we also bust some myths about the Western States 100, chat about race nutrition in the 1800s, and debate the greatest ultrarunner of all time.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Davy’s background (1:36)
• Falling in love with the 100-mile distance (6:58)
• Recovery strategies (10:53)
• How the sport has changed in the last 20 years (12:37)
• Ultrarunning History Podcast (15:29)
• “Where did ultrarunning actually start?” (20:28)
• Tracing the sport through the 19th century (28:16)
• 1800s gear talk (34:39)
• Whiskey, drugs, and gambling (36:28)
• The first 100-mile mountain race (39:05)
• The Grand Slam of Ultrarunning (41:20)
• How to get into the American Ultrarunning Hall of Fame (44:52)
• G.O.A.T. debate (46:51)
• “Stranger Things” (53:15)

RELATED LINKS

• Davy's website

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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If Rod Farvard had grown to be a few inches taller, we might be watching him contend for a rebound on the basketball court instead of toeing the line at some of ultrarunning’s biggest races. After his hoop dreams fell short, Rod found trail running by way of triathlon, two sports that rewarded his ability to flatly outwork his competition in spades. So, we sat down with Rod exactly a week removed from finishing 5th American at this year’s Ultra-Trail du Mont-Blanc to talk about how he handles such a high training volume; his first time racing on an international stage; how having a full-time job helps fuel his running; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Rod’s recovering from UTMB (1:30)
• Hoop dreams (5:22)
• How cycling translates to ultrarunning (15:55)
• The Ultra-Trail du Mont-Blanc (17:49)
• Training in Santa Barbara & Mammoth Lakes (21:39)
• What’s on Rod’s UTMB playlist (30:43)
• European vs. American trail running culture (34:30)
• UTMB travel tales (37:50)
• Nailing race day nutrition (39:44)
• Running: both a “hobby” and a passion (42:44)
• John Muir Trail FKT (47:13)

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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If Rod Farvard had grown to be a few inches taller, we might be watching him contend for a rebound on the basketball court instead of toeing the line at some of ultrarunning’s biggest races. After his hoop dreams fell short, Rod found trail running by way of triathlon, two sports that rewarded his ability to flatly outwork his competition in spades. So, we sat down with Rod exactly a week removed from finishing 5th American at this year’s Ultra-Trail du Mont-Blanc to talk about how he handles such a high training volume; his first time racing on an international stage; how having a full-time job helps fuel his running; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Rod’s recovering from UTMB (1:30)
• Hoop dreams (5:22)
• How cycling translates to ultrarunning (15:55)
• The Ultra-Trail du Mont-Blanc (17:49)
• Training in Santa Barbara & Mammoth Lakes (21:39)
• What’s on Rod’s UTMB playlist (30:43)
• European vs. American trail running culture (34:30)
• UTMB travel tales (37:50)
• Nailing race day nutrition (39:44)
• Running: both a “hobby” and a passion (42:44)
• John Muir Trail FKT (47:13)

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• CRAFTED
• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas

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Ask ultrarunner and race director Todd Aydelotte for a bit of New York City history and he’ll probably tell you to lace up your running shoes. After injury derailed his marathon training a few years back, Todd traded a competitive approach to the sport for a uniquely historical one. Through months of research, he began piecing together ultra-length routes that visited important locations in the lives of historical figures, including Edgar Allen Poe, Teddy Roosevelt, and Walt Whitman. So, we sat down with Todd to hear all about what running has taught him about our past; how he picks his subjects; NYC after dark; and a whole lot more — including, the semi-legal 28-mile road race he created to reenact the 70’s cult film, “The Warriors.”

TOPICS & TIMES

• What is “historical ultrarunning”? (1:38)
• Chasing after Edgar Allen Poe (6:53)
• How Todd chooses his topics (14:32)
• The NYC Black History 50 (17:52)
• How to use history to hack your running (24:39)
• The Warriors UltraRun (25:24)
• Using crime heat maps to stay safe in cities (31:51)
• NYC after dark (34:18)
• Getting picked up by the New York Times (42:25)
• The story of a truly demonic run (48:35)

RELATED LINKS

• The Warriors UltraRun New York Times article

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
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Established in 1955, the Sierra Peaks Section List includes 247 of the most prominent peaks scattered throughout California’s Sierra Nevada Range. Reaching every summit is a lifetime’s work for most, and up until recently, no one had completed the list within a calendar year. Far more complex than a thru-hike, the SPS List is an undertaking that requires a mix of skills and probably a fair amount of chance. So, we sat down with Travis Soares, who finished tagging all 247 peaks in a record 117 days earlier this month, to find out how much luck had to do with it. In the process, we talk about how the idea for the project came together; how things went, including close calls with the Mineral King Marmot and coming across wreckage from a plane crash; his relationship with his climbing partner for most of the project (and previous SPS List FKT-holder), Nathan Longhurst; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is the Sierra Peaks Section List? (2:22)
• Travis’ background (7:04)
• Logistics & planning (9:00)
• His relationship with Nathan Longhurst (14:10)
• Settling into the project (17:29)
• Raising money for the Bishop Paiute Food Sovereignty Program (20:03)
• The Palisade Traverse & the Mineral King Marmot (22:39)
• ‘Crux’ of the trip (24:40)
• Backcountry traffic (29:55)
• His gear setup (33:55)
• Dodging fire season (35:02)
• “What have you learned about yourself from this project?” (36:06)
• What’s next? (42:17)

RELATED LINKS:

• Travis and Nathan’s SPS 2022 Website
• Donate to the Bishop Paiute Food Sovereignty Program

OUR OTHER BLISTER PODCASTS:

• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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With summer in full stride, Matt Mitchell and Drew Kelly sat down to take stock of how their mountain running seasons have played out thus far, including the ways Drew sees his skiing translate to the trails; our tendency to bite off more than we can chew; and gear picks for a big day out in the alpine. We also discuss some of the early stumbling blocks we ran into when we started trail running; extol the virtues of vert; and Matt makes the case for why you should be eating “Ramen Bombs” in the backcountry (and only the backcountry).

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Drew's background (1:30)
• Skiing vs. running (5:01)
• Thoughts on skimo (7:44)
• Vert is real (11:51)
• Is trail running actually a minimalist sport? (13:42)
• Running seasonally vs. year round (26:05)
• Gear picks for a big day out in the mountains (28:05)
• How trail running hooked us (31:00)
• Filmmaking & music (34:26)
• 100 milers & eating contests (39:29)
• Some good (and some bad) nutrition tips (42:02)
• Frozen burritos and “Ramen Bombs” (47:08)
• Upcoming projects (51:20)

OUR OTHER BLISTER PODCASTS:

• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Relying on a bunch of college kids to crew you through the Western States 100 might sound misguided, but for trail and ultra runner, Alex Nichols, it’s an important part of team building. After being named the head coach of Colorado College’s cross country program last year, Alex has made a habit of inviting some of his athletes out to support his own racing endeavors. So, we talked to Alex about the intersection between coaching full-time at his alma mater and running trails professionally. Along the way, we detour into his ongoing four-year streak of summiting Pikes Peak every month; John Steinbeck; the joys of beekeeping; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Running 100 miles on a 1.1 mile loop (1:41)
• Western States 100 (6:04)
• Alex’s Background (11:22)
• Colorado College’s block schedule (15:27)
• Two English majors talking (17:03)
• Alex’s collegiate running career (19:30)
• “Indulgence: 1000 Miles Under the Colorado Sky” (21:11)
• The professionalization of trail running (27:02)
• Self-coaching (30:46)
• Alex’s Pikes Peak streak (35:27)
• Coaching cross country at Colorado College (39:43)
• Beekeeping (47:40)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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You’ve probably encountered the adage that running is 90 percent mental, yet despite this feeling (and how true it may be), most runners dedicate the majority of their training to making sure they’re physically fit. But the brain fatigues too, so we talked with running coach and licensed clinical social worker, Danielle Snyder, about the importance of mindset training and the connection between mental well-being and physical performance.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Women Who FKT update (1:38)
• Hardrock 100 pacing (6:13)
• Danielle’s background (8:30)
• Combining social work with athletics (10:27)
• Why athletes are an underserved population (11:40)
• Founding Inner Drive Wellness (12:42)
• Mindset training (14:55)
• Ultrarunning & mental health (16:25)
• Mental toughness vs. psychological flexibility (18:47)
• What a healthy relationship with running looks like (20:40)
• Why we shouldn’t run to destress (22:36)
• Processing injury (25:13)
• Thoughts on social media (27:06)
• Has Covid changed how we talk about mental health? (30:16)
• Rewarding failure (33:31)
• Taper tantrums & post-race blues (39:42)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Tailwind Nutrition’s story starts with Co-founder Jeff Vierling’s head in a trash can, losing his breakfast after the Leadville Trail 100 MTB. Following years of dealing with gut issues during endurance events, and having exhausted just about every sports nutrition product on the market, Jeff and his wife, Jenny, did what every frustrated endurance athlete would do — they designed their own. Tailwind products are now some of the most popular fueling options for trail runners and mountain bikers alike, so we had Jeff on the show to hear all about how he went from mixing powders in his kitchen to outgrowing one production facility after the next.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Tailwind Nutrition was born (1:44)
• Jeff’s background & “kitchen chemistry” (9:53)
• Why nailing flavor is so important (14:10)
• How Jeff turned his idea into a business (18:27)
• Tailwind’s tie to Durango, Colorado (22:23)
• Tailwind’s Hospital Support Program (25:26)
• How many pounds of product do they ship a year? (31:06)
• Why runners deal with “gut bombs” (31:50)
• Tailwind’s current line of products (37:05)
• Advantages of powder-based products (42:52)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
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After finishing 6th at this year’s Western States 100, Salomon athlete (and sometimes co-host) Leah Yingling returns to the show to give us a play-by-play of how her day panned out. Along the way, we talk about the race’s rich history; helpful strategies for assembling a crew; the best hour in all of sports; what it was like for Leah to sprint the final 100 meters with her dad; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• A brief history of Western States (1:21)
• How Leah organized her crew (10:12)
• Finding “all day pace” (21:25)
• What to look for in a pacer (28:30)
• Running 30+ miles on a torn calf (32:34)
• Using family as motivation (34:57)
• “Hunting” in the dark (38:38)
• Leah’s last 6 miles (44:25)
• Stories from the drug testing tent (51:39)
• Golden hour (53:33)
• Will she be back next year? (56:15)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Paddy O’Leary’s path from the farm he grew up on in Wexford, Ireland to becoming an elite runner for The North Face is by no means a linear one.Long before he started running, Paddy spent much of his early 20s growing the sport of lacrosse in Ireland. It was only after an opportunity to pursue cancer research led him to San Francisco that he found his knack for racing on trails. So, we sat down with Paddy (and his charming Irish brogue) to talk about all of that and more — including, how he ended up racing on the trails (with and without a horse); the Wicklow Round; community building; and toeing the line at the oldest trail race in North America.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is “ride & tie” racing? (1:33)
• Growing up on a dairy farm (6:31)
• Lacrosse abroad (9:36)
• Fell running & jailbreaks (13:37)
• A brief history of Irish mountain running (22:48)
• How Paddy ended up in San Francisco (33:15)
• Building community (35:54)
• Western States 100 & the Dipsea Race (40:45)
• What’s next? (50:36)

RELATED LINKS:

• Ride & Tie Association
• Coming Home film

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Endurance training has come a long way from handwritten logs and fax machines, and we owe a lot of that progress to web-based platforms like TrainingPeaks. Founded in the late 90s by endurance coaches Dirk Friel and his father, Joe, TrainingPeaks has helped modernize the way athletes can track, analyze, and plan their training. So we sat down with Dirk to hear more about how better data leads to better performance; artificial intelligence; growing up with a world-renowned endurance coach as father; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is TrainingPeaks? (4:38)
• Thoughts on coaching (6:55)
• Expanding TrainingPeaks to cover multiple sports (9:59)
• Coaching as a family business (11:42)
• TrainingPeaks users: athletes vs. coaches (16:53)
• Data & endurance (20:42)
• Artificial intelligence (23:13)
• What Dirk learned from his dad (29:08)
• Power meters & performance (34:20)
• Podcasting (37:10)
• Dirk’s skimo success (39:43)
• Tech trends in the endurance world (42:45)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Naked Sports Innovations’ line of products has evolved a lot from the popular Running Band that started it all, and this month they announced plans for their first trail running shoe, the Naked T/r. So we sat down with Naked’s President and Co-founder, Lindsay Dakota, to break down their debut model, from (laceless!) upper to outsole; the challenges of growing a small brand sustainably; the future of footwear; how the notion of “simplexity” drives Naked’s design process; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Starting with the Naked Running Band (5:40)
• “Was the Naked Band’s popularity a surprise?” (6:50)
• Exopower mesh & “simplexity” (8:52)
• Naked products on non-affiliated elites (12:49)
• How Lindsay thinks about fit (15:04)
• The importance of supporting athletes (16:11)
• Striving for sustainability (17:20)
• Expanding Naked’s line of products (21:18)
• What is a “cooling face fabric?” (22:43)
• Working with Vibram (25:26)
• The Naked T/r Trail Racing Shoe (26:57)
• Small brands & the state of trail running (46:20)

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Ultramarathons are sometimes called eating competitions with a bit of running thrown in, and with so many different nutrition products and approaches at our disposal these days, it can be hard to know how to fuel properly. So, we talked to GU Energy Labs’ Nutrition and Performance Research Manager, Roxanne Vogel, about the ins & outs of eating on the run; how GU’s line of products fit into that equation; the importance of “flavor scientists;” and a whole lot more — including Roxanne’s lightning ascent of Mt. Everest and living in a hypoxia chamber.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Roxanne’s background (1:37)
• Her lightning ascent of Mt. Everest (5:02)
• What to eat above 20,000 ft. (9:18)
• Using herself as a human guinea pig (10:37)
• Nutrition tips from the top of Everest (12:09)
• Roxanne’s next challenge (14:28)
• The history of GU Energy Labs (15:35)
• Going high octane with GU Roctane (18:33)
• Can you consume too much caffeine? (20:47)
• GU’s R&D process & flavor science (22:52)
• Sports nutrition vs. general nutrition (27:19)
• What’s the deal with “gut training”? (29:56)
• Why not to sweat sugar consumption (32:31)
• Eating for different distances (34:13)
• The future of sports nutrition (37:16)
• Running in extreme heat (39:41)
• A primer on fueling for endurance events (43:13)
• Training for the Leadville 100 (46:40)

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If you grow up in Portland, OR, running is practically a birthright, and for David Laney, it quickly became a way of life: he was already running 5 to 6 days a week by the time he turned 10. After a successful collegiate career followed by a brief stint racing on the roads, David burst onto the trail scene in the early 2010s and has gone on to build an impressive resume of race results on the strength of an unmatched dedication to training in the mountains.

This past year, David left his longtime sponsor and joined a relatively new player to the trail space in Craft Sportswear. Soon after signing to run for Craft, he doubled down and took a full-time job helping them launch footwear in running shops across the US. Not too many athletes have that kind of relationship with their sponsors, so we talked to David about how it came about and what to expect out of Craft Footwear in the years to come. Along the way, we also get into his signature ice bath routine; running a self-supported 100-miler to raise money for Charity: Water; his breakout performance at UTMB in 2015; shoe surgery; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up in Portland, OR (1:52)
• David’s running career (5:25)
• Why run specialty shops matter (7:13)
• Ways to grow the sport of trail running (7:42)
• Turning “pro” (9:21)
• How to get sponsored: then vs. now? (10:30)
• Adventuring in the North Cascades (11:48)
• Truck living & mice attacks (13:29)
• What David does when he’s not running (14:38)
• Thoughts on coaching (16:57)
• 2015 UTMB: highs & lows (17:57)
• COVID & a year without races (23:04)
• Running 100 miles for charity (23:58)
• Craft Sportswear (26:35)
• Creativity & shoe design (31:04)
• A meditation on ice baths (33:00)
• What’s next (35:09)

RELATED LINKS:

• Support Charity: Water
• Billy Yang’s film capturing David’s 2015 UTMB

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On this “Running Through the News” edition of Off The Couch, Salomon athlete Leah Yingling stops by to catch us up on current events in the running world, including — a debate around Tom Cruise’s running form; the rise of 200-mile races; what mountain runner Joe Gray is doing to make trails a more equitable space for people of color; course records at the Zegama-Aizkorri Marathon; and Kilian Jornet’s new shoe brand, NNormal.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Leah’s Golden Ticket at Canyons 100k (1:46)
• Jazmine Lowther’s breakout performance (5:13)
• Western States nears! (6:36)
• Fitness comes in many forms (9:29)
• Leah’s Western States Training Camp (11:06)
• Heat training & trash bags (15:05)
• Zegama is Zegama (17:13)
• Kilian Jornet & NNormal (22:34)
• Rise of 200+ mile races (27:22)
• Why women have the upper hand (36:32)
• Climbing all 247 Sierra peaks (38:22)
• Redemption on the Arizona Trail (41:05)
• Joe Gray on diversity & inclusion (43:47)
• Track star Tom Cruise? (47:08)

RELATED LINKS:

• SPS FKT Live Tracking
• NYT Article on Joe Gray
• Tom Cruise runs. But is he any good at it?
• Sara Alonso Downhill Running

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Over half of all runners will deal with an injury each year, but run enough miles and you’ll know that number is a lot closer to 100%. The irony is most running injuries are easily preventable, so as folks ramp up their summer training, we had Dr. Hal Rosenberg on to talk us through some simple tips for staying healthy out on the trails (and off the couch). Along the way, we get into Hal’s own experience racing ultras; how 100-milers make him better at treating athletes; and a whole lot more — including, a very hot take on standing desks.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Hal’s background in sports medicine (2:17)
• His current practice (4:44)
• What exactly is a sports chiropractor? (5:16)
• Getting into ultras (9:35)
• The Javelina 100 (11:40)
• Desert magic (13:29)
• Running & treating athletes (14:42)
• Favorite part of his job (17:23)
• Thoughts on injury rates (20:31)
• Pain & stoplights (24:27)
• Common running injuries: trail vs. road (25:47)
• How to beat the odds (31:51)
• Graston, KT taping, & ART (37:15)
• “What shoe should I run in?”(45:57)

RELATED LINKS:

• Hal’s practice: Mt Tam Sport & Spine

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After discovering running in his 30’s, ultra-endurance athlete Robbie Balenger became obsessed with the power of human endurance and quickly found that he needed challenges far exceeding standard ultramarathons to test his limits. So, he started creating his own. Since then, Robbie has run across America, completed the “Colorado Crush,” and recently outran a Tesla. We had him on to unpack each of these efforts before asking him about the mental side of endurance, recovery techniques, his next challenge, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Robbie’s background (5:19)
• Travel & settling in Austin, TX (6:05)
• Burning out in the restaurant industry (6:49)
• Robbie’s Trans-Con Challenge (10:05)
• How he trained to run >3,000 miles in 75 days (13:15)
• Using social media with intention (21:00)
• Robbie’s Central Park Loop Challenge (22:57)
• The Colorado Crush (27:02)
• Outrunning a Tesla (31:19)
• NuCalm & mental performance (35:31)
• What Robbie’s days look like now (37:15)
• Plant-based diets: the key to recovery? (40:57)

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Rabbit Elite, Elan Lieber, called his recent second-place finish at the 2022 Miwok 100K, “the run of his life,” but not for reasons you might expect. Before setting a massive PR and running the course’s 3rd fastest time ever, Elan said goodbye to his grandfather for the final time. With a heavy heart, he showed up at Miwok with one goal in mind: to not race in fear. 9 hours later, cresting from an incredible performance, Elan crossed the finish line to the news that his grandfather had passed during his race. So we talked to Elan about the role running plays in overcoming loss, how he let go of fear (and how you can too), and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up in Ohio (3:43)
• How trail running found Elan (8:15)
• His start in the coffee industry (11:03)
• Equator Coffee (13:38)
• Running with the SoCal Coyotes (15:52)
• The glamor of 100-milers (18:22)
• Thru-hiking the JMT w/ Billy Yang (22:44)
• Running as a practice vs. a competition (30:48)
• His recent running “glow up” (33:28)
• The Miwok 100k & overcoming loss (39:43)

RELATED LINKS:

• The John Muir Trail w/ Elan and Billy Yang

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Brian Metzler has been writing about running, in one form or another, for the better part of the last 25 years. His latest book, Trail Running Illustrated: The Art of Running Free (which he co-authored with Doug Mayer), captures the playful side of trail running through illustration while also offering helpful advice for runners of all levels. It’s a genre-bending book with an interesting backstory, so we talked to Brian about how it all came together; his writing (and running) career, and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Brian’s background (1:05)
• Connecting writing & running (4:31)
• Avoiding burnout in Boulder (9:51)
• Trail shoe trends (15:50)
• Lessons from >2,000 shoe reviews (18:36)
• Kicksology: The Hype, Science, Culture, & Cool of Running Shoes (26:57)
• Trail Running Illustrated: The Art of Running Free (32:25)
• “A graphic novel for trail runners” (34:53)
• Brian’s book recommendations (39:07)

RELATED LINKS:

• Trail Running Illustrated: The Art of Running Free
• Kicksology: The Hype, Science, Culture, & Cool of Running Shoes

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
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If you’ve followed coverage of ultrarunning at all over the last few years, Corrine Malcolm is a name you’ve probably heard a lot. But between her many roles as a member of the media, it could be easy to overlook her as an elite runner in her own right. So we talk to Corrine about how she went from an Olympic-level biathlete to running professionally for adidas Terrex; setting the supported FKT on the Tahoe Rim Trail; her return to racing; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How ultrarunning found Corrine (1:15)
• Why Nordic skiers make great trail runners (4:38)
• Learning how to suffer (10:34)
• Overtraining vs. under recovering (13:07)
• Corrine’s experience with overtraining (16:32)
• Her favorite race distance and why (19:41)
• Corrine’s Tahoe Rim Trail FKT (22:09)
• How injury led her to a career in race broadcasting (33:03)
• Talking for 20 hours straight (37:35)
• Her return to racing at MIUT (39:37)
• Plans for 2022 (41:17)

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Pablo Vigil has been called the greatest mountain runner in the world. In the 1980s he was nearly unbeatable, winning the famous Sierre-Zinal four consecutive times. We talk to Pablo about the early days of mountain running; what has changed since then; why he thinks simplicity is still the key to training (and life); how he ended up on a show with Kilian Jornet; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Pablo’s background (1:21)
• Trail shoes in the 1970’s (4:48)
• Sierre-Zinal (8:10)
• US vs. European mountain running (14:16)
• Running 3 Olympic Marathon Trials (20:16)
• Why his wins at Sierre-Zinal are still so impressive (23:13)
• How Pablo thinks he would have compared to current pros (28:08)
• Linking up with Kilian Jornet (36:36)
• A little life advice (41:31)

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In this ‘Race Edition’ of Running Through the News, Salomon athlete, Leah Yingling (who’s already been on major podiums twice this year), joins us to discuss race results from the past few weeks and to preview the stacked fields at Madeira Island Ultra Trail and Canyons 100k.  

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Why moving to Utah will make you faster (1:17)
• Racing across the Canary Islands (7:29)
• Descending like a Euro (12:02)
• Chasing waterfalls at Gorge 100k (17:38)
• Death by 1000 cuts at Lake Sonoma 50 (30:00)
• Western States Golden Ticket predictions (37:18)
• Will records fall at the 100k road championship? (47:37)

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Devon Yanko’s resume speaks for itself. She’s had success at numerous signature races over her career, including victories at the Leadville 100, Javelina 100, and a 3rd place finish at Western States, to name a few. But after years of pursuing races for their prestige, she found her motivation drifting towards other goals. Thus was born Devon’s 2022 DY DIY Slam, an ambitious plan to run 5 100-mile races within the span of just a few months.

Blister running editor, Matt Mitchell, caught up with Devon after her overall win and course record run at the Umstead 100, the first race of her project. The two talk about Devon’s time running in the Bay Area and her recent move to Colorado before diving into her experience at Umstead 100; the performance-enhancing effects of techno music; the history of the Grand Slam of Ultrarunning; what led Devon to invent her own “DY DIY Slam”; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Devon’s running background (3:02)
• What keeps her racing ultra (11:09)
• Origins of the Bay Area’s “Ninja Loop” (14:19)
• Moving to Salida, CO (22:13)
• Winning the Umstead 100 & techno music (34:55)
• Devon’s “DY DIY Slam” project (49:37)
• How to run 5 100-milers in a single summer (1:00:25)

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We talk to Brendan Madigan, race director of the Broken Arrow Skyrace, about the current state of races; prize purses; the economics of putting on a race; and why Brendan sees independent races as such a critical part of the race landscape.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Alpenglow Sports & starting Broken Arrow Skyrace (1:54)
• Economics & logistics of putting on a race (6:28)
• Independent races (12:13)
• Prize purses (19:17)
• Crystal Ball: state of racing 5 years from now? (23:56)
• Dates, details, & race distances at Broken Arrow Skyrace (29:12)

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We talk to Marta Fisher about how her experience at Hardrock 100 led her to the creation of Women Who FKT; what the near-term goals of the group are; how to get involved; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up, starting to run, & grad school (1:26)
• 2021 Hardrock 100 (4:47)
• Women who FKT (15:08)
• Near-Term Goal of Women who FKT (28:02)
• Underrepresented groups in the ultra community (31:43)
• Growing Women Who FKT (33:36)

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Blister running editor, Matt Mitchell, is joined by Blister reviewer, Gordon Gianniny, to discuss current events in the running world. The two dish on race results from the month of March, including the Way Too Cool 50k, Chuckanut 50k, and the Barkley Marathons; talk through the significance of Broken Arrow Skyrace’s prize purse announcement; look forward to the North American Golden Trail Series; and speculate about what Kilian Jornet is up to after leaving his longtime sponsor.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Way Too Cool 50k, Chuckanut 50k, and Barkley results (9:50)
• Broken Arrow Skyrace’s prize purse announcement (31:23)
• North American Golden Trail Series is back (40:28)
• Lake Sonoma 50’s stacked field (42:05)
• Killian Jornet’s next move (43:59)

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We talk to Adam Hill about how dealing with anxiety disorder led him into Ironman competitions; his new book, Shifting Gears; and the process and mechanisms of personal transformation.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Anxiety & Alcohol (2:23)
• Anxiety & Sobriety (18:03)
• Getting into Ironmans (26:22)
• Overcoming hopelessness - (46:44)
• Shifting Gears (51:37)
• The support of Adam’s wife (56:05)
• YoYo Ma vs. Mstislav Rostropovich (1:07:25)

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Jason Hardrath holds more “Fastest Known Times” than anyone in the world. We talk to Jason about his upbringing; how a nearly fatal car accident introduced him to the world of FKTs; and his upcoming film, “Journey to 100,” which chronicles Jason’s attempt to climb the 100 tallest peaks in the state of Washington over 50 days; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Have you always pushed yourself? (1:33)
• Risk, exertion, & becoming fully present (17:13)
• The car accident (25:23)
• Recovery, physical & mental (31:53)
• Identity & Purpose (42:17)
• When did you first learn about FKTs? (49:45)
• Where to watch Journey to 100? (1:00:00)

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CTS coach Jason Koop makes his return to Off The Couch following the release of the 2nd edition of his book, Training Essentials for Ultrarunning. We talk to Koop about why he updated his book; the increase in ultramarathon-specific research; myths around running economy; the art of pairing coaches with athletes; how to sift through all the bad science on social media; and his time with Timothy Olson on the PCT.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Thoughts on his KoopCast (2:56)
• Koop’s book: why a 2nd edition? (6:02)
• Increase in ultramarathon research (19:40)
• Carbon Plates & Running Economy (23:17)
• Being a well-rounded coach (29:41)
• Which resources to trust? (40:30)
• How does racing affect your coaching? (46:24)
• Supporting Timothy Olson on the PCT (57:21)
• Where to find Koop’s book (1:06:28)

RELATED LINKS

• Our Weekly Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup
• Koop’s book, Training Essentials for Ultrarunning
• Koop’s Twitter List
• Running Economy Study

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• Blister Podcast
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Our running editor, Matt Mitchell, sat down with Salomon athlete Logan Williams to discuss his recent top 10 finish at the Black Canyon 100K. This top-10 finish happened after Logan ruptured his achilles last yearat Black Canyon, so Logan talks about what returning to the scene of the crime meant for him; his relationship with injury; how he’s recovering from racing 62 miles through the desert; his thoughts on running as an artform, and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Black Canyon: golden tickets, stacked fields (1:07)
• Processing injuries (5:14)
• Running as an art form (12:29)
• Training for Black Canyon (16:58)
• Fueling: physical & mental (20:27)
• Broken Arrow Triple Crown (29:12)
• Logan’s origin story (33:24)
• 2022 plans (40:32)
• Recovery (48:18)

RELATED LINKS

• Our Weekly Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Why would two friends who’d been working at the highest levels of product design at Nike, Under Armour, and Puma — and in some of the biggest product categories (soccer, basketball, and running) — set out to create a hyper-specific, hyper-performance trail running shoe company? We talk to the co-founders of Speedland, Dave Dombrow and Kevin Fallon to get the answers; to learn about their paths to becoming directors of design and innovation at some of the biggest brands in the world; and to discuss the design elements of what a “hyper-performance” trail shoe looks like to them.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is Speedland? (2:10)
• Meeting at Nike Basketball (4:14)
• Kevin Fallon’s background (6:51)
• Dave Dombrow’s background (10:33)
• How did you get jobs at Nike, Under Armor? (13:46)
• Why is it so hard for brands to move into other product categories? (26:07)
• Starting Speedland (31:39)
• Trail shoe design (36:40)
• Incorporating dual BOA dials (46:27)
• Pricing (51:41)
• Removable carbon plate (55:45)
• 1st shoe: SL:PDX (57:38)
• Speedland’s ‘Give Back’ program (1:03:49)
• Optimizing for specific environments (1:05:20)
• Price & Hyper Performance (1:07:11)
• runspeedland.com (1:11:08)

RELATED LINKS

• Our Weekly Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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As a follow-up to our Winter Running and the Meaning of Life conversation (episode #103), today we’re talking about some very practical tips, tricks, and gear recommendations to help you get out and run in colder temps and snowier environments.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Layering (2:48)
• Thicker socks? (9:26)
• Some favorite cold weather gear (13:28)
• Gore-Tex running shoes? (15:43)
• Some favorite winter running shoes (22:44)
• How to fuel / hydrate in cold temps (26:27)

RELATED LINKS:

• Our Weekly Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup
• Mens Nordic Hats – Skida | Headwear & Accessories
• Pyrenees T19 Hooded Long Sleeve Shirt | PATH projects
• Outdoor Research Shuck Mitts

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• GEAR:30 podcast
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We talk to Salomon’s Mike Ambrose about running shoe design; taking a shoe from concept to production; his life in running and the running industry; European vs. North American markets; & what’s next in running shoes.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What does a Product Line Manager do? (2:00)
• How’d you get there? (6:25)
• Getting into running (19:41)
• Shoe design (24:29)
• Emerging research findings & shoe design (30:21)
• The Salomon Ultra Glide (34:54)
• European vs. North American trail market & culture (41:15)
• What’s next in shoe design? (45:27)
• A little life advice (49:26)

RELATED LINKS:

• Our Weekly Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

OUR OTHER BLISTER PODCASTS

• Blister Podcast
• GEAR:30 podcast
• Bikes & Big Ideas podcast

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Sabrina Little is an ultra runner, a writer, & philosophy professor, and has held the American record in the 200K and the 24-Hour American Record (she ran 152.03 miles in 24 hours.) So we talk about all of the above, and also toothpaste and Harry Potter.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Bookshelves & toothpaste (1:04)
• Sabrina’s 1st 100K (12:15)
• 24-hour record (17:30)
• Philosophy background (19:51)
• Running & school (27:08)
• Writing “The Examined Run” column (30:01)
• Running & Flourishing (33:14)
• Humanities today (41:22)
• Teaching (46:49)
• 2022 races and goals (55:07)
• Harry Potter (57:29)
• What’s next? (1:00:15)

RELATED LINKS:

• Blister Summit
• Getting Here: Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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Yesterday, Jonathan Ellsworth sat down with Blister reviewer, Gordon Gianniny, and our new Running Editor, Matt Mitchell, to talk about winter running. But our conversation took a much bigger and broader turn.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Introductions & winter running (2:42)
• Your worst winter-running stories? (5:42)
• Running year round (11:11)
• Running & mental health (26:18)
• Everything is an opportunity (32:27)
• Topics for another time (43:11)

RELATED LINKS:

• Blister Summit
• Getting Here: Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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Michele Graglia has racked up a number of major victories in his career, including wins at the Badwater 135, Yukon Arctic Ultra, the Moab 240, and more. But in this conversation, we focus on some of Michele’s recent struggles, disappointments, and difficulties, and Michele talks about what he’s learned along the way — and what he’s still learning.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The reception of Ultra (3:36)
• Badwater 135 (13:05)
• Tahoe Rim Trail 100 (26:41)
• Tor de Géants (31:10)
• The mind / spirit vs the physical (40:39)
• Personal toll of athletic pursuits (45:50)
• Pursuing excellence while being in a relationship (52:05)
• Detachment from "things" (59:26)

RELATED LINKS:

• Ep. 87 with Michele
• Ep. 88 with Michele
• Michele’s book, Ultra
• Blister Summit
• Getting Here: Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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Before Kikkan Randall was winning Olympic and World Cup gold medals in XC skiing, she was a runner, and she has never stopped being a runner. In this conversation, we discuss how she got into XC skiing; some of the keys to her longevity; becoming a mother while also being a professional athlete (and how much attitudes still need to change for women in a similar position); and going from winning an Olympic gold medal to being diagnosed with cancer, and how she is doing today.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up in Alaska (3:33)
• Running vs Skiing (5:46)
• A fork in the road (9:09)
• Resisting overspecialization at a young age (15:01)
• Gravel Racing (17:05)
• Boston Marathon (18:15)
• Running while being a XC skier (27:15)
• Being a mother and a sponsored athlete (35:29)
• From winning Gold to being diagnosed with cancer (45:54)
• Advocate for yourself (50:44)

RELATED LINKS:

• Kikkan’s website
• Avocado Green Mattress
• Jonathan’s Sleep Experiment
• Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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For our 100th episode of Off The Couch, Tessa Chesser (who just podium’d at the Javalina 100 miler, earning a gold ticket to Western States) came on droppin’ mics, spittin’ inspiration, telling her story and mincing no words, and talking about how she has dealt with negativity and adversity.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Babes & parkour dogs (2:54)
• Javelina 100, NYC, & Tommy Rivs (9:08)
• “Diesel Mode” (16:45)
• Golden ticket, Western States (27:54)
• Growing up & Bruce Lee (30:42)
• “Soccer Strength” (33:54)
• Oklahoma, Hershey’s, & a wild side (37:23)
• Fun & Suffering (41:36)
• Handling negative comments (43:39)
• Western States (50:08)

RELATED LINKS:

• How to Get Here: Gunnison & Crested Butte

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Grayson Murphy is back on Off The Couch to talk about her 2021 race season; trail racing in Europe vs. the US; the Olympic trials; avoiding injuries; the biggest changes to her own training; the most ‘off the couch’ thing she’s ever done; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• “2nd breakfast” (2:24)
• Grayson’s sleep schedule (3:43)
• Cinnamon Roll loop (4:48)
• Recap of Grayson’s racing in 2021 (7:06)
• Trail racing in Europe vs. the USA (11:37)
• Recovery time (17:05)
• Biggest change to her training in the last 2 years? (18:12)
• Olympic trials & World Cup races (22:44)
• Avoiding injuries (27:40)
• Current favorite distances & future favorites? (34:51)
• Most ‘off the couch’ thing you’ve ever done? (38:06)
• Cross country skiing (40:50)
• Engineering update (42:06)
• Grayson’s Training Log & Planner (45:06)

RELATED LINKS:

• How to Get Here: Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Grayson’s 2022 Training Log & Planner
• OTC ep. #24: our 1st conversation with Grayson

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Sanjay Rawal joins Jonathan Ellsworth to discuss the Boston Marathon being held on Indigenous People’s Day; why the sport of long-distance running is particularly well-positioned to create a far more equitable situation for indigenous people; what it means to have had so many high-profile marathons held so close to one another; and the mission of Shalane Flanagan.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Update: Self Transcendence 3100 Run (1:04)
• Major races are back (5:05)
• Boston Marathon on Indigenous Peoples’ Day (8:15)
• Running traditions of Indigenous communities (11:30)
• Shalane Flanagan’s multi-marathon mission (30:38)

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Olivia Amber grew up in rural Wisconsin; headed off to Maine (where she became an all-American XC skier); found her way into the tech world of San Francisco; then started getting into ultra running. Now, Olivia is a Salomon athlete who is also juggling a career in tech. We talk about all of the above, plus coffee; sleeping / not sleeping; her current & future interests in running; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Last Weekend: the Broken Arrow 52k (0:00)
• Skiing, Running, & Roller Skis (2:16)
• Why Colby College? (16:58)
• Geology (19:28)
• Longest run before college? (21:19)
• Running during college (25:32)
• Internships & Whiteboards (28:03)
• “Strategic Research Leader” (36:22)
• Work / Life balance (38:00)
• A hot take on not sleeping (40:27)
• Coffee (42:13)
• Current & future interests in running (49:18)

RELATED LINKS:

• This Week’s Gear Giveaway
• Gear Giveaway / Newsletter Signup

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We recently talked to Anton about a number of things, including his recent return to racing; his ongoing exploration of different ways to move through the mountains; we get his completely unfiltered take on Murakami’s What I Talk about When I Talk about Running — and that turned out to be suchan interesting part of the conversation that we agreed we ought to re-read that book and then later this fall, come back to record another conversation about it. So we invite you to join us in reading / re-reading Murakami’s book and then you’ll be all set for our upcoming conversation about it.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Leadville (1:31)
• “Psychotic Runner” (5:14)
• What were you into as a kid? (14:58)
• Injuries (17:56)
• Climbing, bike touring, & skiing (18:57)
• Influences (23:53)
• Murakami (31:17)
• More Leadville & a life-changing bike trip (36:34)
• Studying philosophy (50:32)

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We talk to Tasha Wodak about her performance in last month’s Olympic games; the twists and turns of her running career; mental preparation and the mantras that inspire her; a critical insight to remember during life’s hardest moments; running playlists; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Jonathan is bad at pronouncing things (1:34)
• Tasha’s on-the-ground report on last month’s Olympics (3:16)
• Expectations going into the games (9:52)
• The mental game of running & Tasha’s mantras (13:59)
• Sports psychology - underlying principles (19:11)
• Super shoes (25:58)
• What caused Tasha to quit running (35:41)
• What caused Tasha to resume running (42:13)
• Running with gratitude, joy, & love (51:37)
• Tasha’s Running Playlist (55:35)

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Our guest today is an ultra running legend. But beyond his impressive endurance exploits, Dean is an incredibly thoughtful and generous person who just so happens to love running. It was a real honor and a true pleasure to talk to Dean about running, his life-long interest in reading, his approach to writing, and what he is currently passionate about outside of the world of running.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Depressing jet lag facts (1:53)
• Your trip to Australia (5:17)
• “A different sort of torture” (12:02)
• Longevity & Ultras (14:34)
• Reading (23:00)
• Writing (26:52)
• Ultramarathon Man vs. A Runner’s High (31:42)
• Classics (50:32)

RELATED LINKS:

• Buy Dean's book, Ultramarathon Man
• Buy Dean's book, A Runner's High
• Connect with Dean

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Today we’re kicking off a new series on Off The Couch, and Sanjay Rawal joins us to talk primarily about track and field at the Olympics, but we also discuss the Leadville 100, as well as the longest foot race in the world, the 3,100-mile Self Transcendence race in New York.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Sanjay’s big night (2:37)
• Sifan Hassan’s 1500m, 5000m, & 10,000m (4:57)
• Athing Mu’s 800m American record (12:21)
• 400m hurdles — men’s & women’s (16:30)
• Are decathletes underappreciated? (25:18)
• Overall state of track & field? (31:42)
• 2021 Leadville 100 (37:51)
• Self Transcendence 3100 Run (44:31)

RELATED LINKS:

• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Mountain Town Economics, Pt 3
• Mountain Town Economics, Pt 2
• Mountain Town Economics, Pt 1

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Annie Hughes is 23 years old and is quickly becoming quite a force in the world of ultra running. So we talked with Annie about her preparation for the Leadville 100 and the race itself; waiting tables; potentially running for president (which is related to waiting tables); her plans to run the Moab 240 this October, and what she’s most excited about beyond this October.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Congratulations! (4:25)
• Preparation for the race (9:33)
• Race recap & thoughts on ‘home court advantage’ (9:10)
• Other ultra experiences (12:09)
• Annie’s running background (14:59)
• Approach to training (19:21)
• Thoughts on the upcoming Moab 240 (22:34)
• Annie’s off-days (25:48)
• More on Moab (33:56)
• What else are you excited about in the ultra world? (37:01)

RELATED LINKS:

• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte
• Mountain Town Economics, Pt 1
• Mountain Town Economics, Pt 2

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We talk to Dakota Jones about how motivation evolves, different chapters of life, and what led to the launch of the Footprints Running Camp.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Breaking bones (3:27)
• Footprints Running Camp (6:53)
• ‘What you should do’ vs ‘What you want to do’ (21:00)
• Dakota’s different chapters of life (26:19)
• What ignited your environmental passion (34:11)
• What are you currently studying? (36:10)
• What does the next year look like? (40:09)
• Fundraiser for the next Footprints (46:01)

RELATED LINKS:

• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte

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Ian Sharman is back on the podcast (check out ep. 12 for more with Ian) and we sat down with him in Blister HQ, along with our good friend and Ian’s favorite pacer of all-time, Dana Kracaw.

We talk about how Ian and Dana met; what makes a good pacer; when & when not to DNF; Tanya Harding; deer costumes; trolling; all-mountain roller skates; and yes, murder. This one is a lot of fun, so if you dislike fun, please skip it. Otherwise, enjoy!

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Introductions & Instagram trolling (2:18)
• Preparing for another Leadville 100 (11:21)
• Difference between a “hike” and a “run” (16:00)
• Heart rate monitoring (26:02)
• The art of pacing (30:01)
• Ian & Dana’s proudest running accomplishments (36:12)
• Hacking Wikipedia pages (44:45)
• Tanya Harding & deer costumes (50:48)
• To DNF or Not to DNF (55:14)
• Coaching & race selection (1:09:26)
• Ian’s strategy for this year’s Leadville 100 (1:17:56)
• More trolling, Boston, Leadville, & costumes (1:24:00)

RELATED LINKS:

• Off The Couch ep. 12: Ian Sharman
• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte

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Sanjay Rawal is back on the podcast to discuss his latest film project about the American runner, Patti Catalano Dillon; how being coached by Patti has caused him to completely overhaul how he trains; and why we all might benefit by remembering to “run easy.”

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The Reception of the film, Gather (1:44)
• Sanjays' own running & latest project (8:37)
• Training & the signs of a "happy" runner (16:39)
• Running easy (36:27)

RELATED LINKS:

• Filmmaker, Sanjay Rawal, on the World’s Longest Race (Ep.2)
• Sanjay Rawal on Running Dumb, Training Slow, & Finding Joy through Exertion (Ep.33)
• Food Sovereignty, Indigenous Rights, & the Film, Gather (Blister Podcast Ep.131)
• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte

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In part 2 of our conversation with one of the top ultrarunners in the world, we discuss Michele’s book, Ultra, that comes out today; his motivation heading into the Moab 240 last year (which he won); the “art of the pull”; death; purpose; and Michele makes an announcement about a big upcoming project.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Today’s release of his book, “Ultra" (2:50)
• Running the Atacama & Gobi deserts (5:14)
• Motivation going into the Moab 240 (10:50)
• Pulling vs Pushing (17:26)
• DNFs (26:16)
• Death (29:41)
• Purpose (37:33)
• How Dean Karnazes’ book saved his life (45:36)
• The backstory of his book, Ultra (57:43)
• Michele announces an upcoming project (1:09:12)

RELATED LINKS:

• Part 1 of our conversation
• Order Michele’s book
• Camping in Gunnison & Crested Butte

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How does a kid from a little town in Italy go from working in his family’s floral business to being a top fashion model in Miami to being one of the top ultrarunners in the world? Michele Graglia has done all of that, but he isn’t just about winning long-distance races and setting world records (though he’s won the Moab 240, Yukon Arctic Ultra, Badwater 135, & more). He is most passionate about human potential, helping us redefine what is possible, and motivating each and every one of us to do the same.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Why Michele’s book Ultra is a big book but a fast read (2:55)
• Growing up in Italy, education, & the family business (11:00)
• How a rainstorm started Michele's modeling career (18:35)
• Weight, Form, & Nutrition: modeling vs ultrarunning (26:41)
• Being disciplined vs remaining open (34:48)
• Diet & experimentation (41:48)
• Coaching running, practicing yoga (54:23)
• Ultrarunning, Yoga, Vedic philosophy, & “getting to the fabric of your soul” (56:08)

RELATED LINKS

• Part 2 of our conversation
• Order Michele’s book, Ultra

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If you want to understand one of the most important developments currently taking place in the outdoor industry, then this conversation is for you. Jenny Bruso is the founder of Unlikely Hikers, and what she has started is a movement that is growing fast, and for good reason. See why.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Life, presently (1:32)
• Navigating social media & the digital world (3:54)
• The mission of Unlikely Hikers (15:32)
• Main takeaways so far from Unlikely Hikers? (27:41)
• Plus-size apparel & gear (31:35)
• Getting real about “average” size (39:25)
• Proving to gear makers that there's a market (43:36)
• Jenny’s Unlikely Hikers podcast (52:06)

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We’re talking again with one of the most influential product designers in the outdoor industry, Jean-Luc Diard. He was formerly the CEO of Salomon and played a major role in the development of Salomon’s running shoes (and the first shaped skis), he co-founded HOKA One One, and he is now the VP of innovation for the Deckers Group and the head of Deckers X Lab. Yesterday, we spoke with Jean-Luc about the design philosophy of Deckers X Lab, and why they are rethinking everything from the standard flip flop to the casual sneaker to the suspension systems of very high-end, performance shoes.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The Deckers X Lab philosophy & lineup (2:26)
• Minimalist vs Maximalist shoes (8:53)
• KO-Z Slipper series (31:06)
• Suspension & Arch Support (36:53)
• K-ST series 35 (44:55)
• X-SCAPE series (49:24)
• Running-Shoe Quivers (53:29)

RELATED LINKS:

• Ep.73: Jean-Luc Diard on the Process of Innovation

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Neli Vasquez Rowland is the co-founder and president of A Safe Haven, which is a Chicago-based nonprofit whose goal is to end homelessness. So we talk to Neli about A Safe Haven’s comprehensive approach; how and why their model could be adopted by other cities around the world; their Run to End Homelessness; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Running in Chicago (0:53)
• What is A Safe Haven (5:14)
• What led you to start A Safe Haven? (6:30)
• A Safe Haven’s approach (15:00)
• Neli’s book, HEALING (18:04)
• Who qualifies for the program? (19:58)
• A Safe Haven’s housing options (28:48)
• How does this compare to other programs? (29:40)
• Providing jobs to break the cycle (33:38)
• What could other cities be doing better? (38:25)
• Expanding A Safe Haven to other locations (52:50)
• What policies or laws most need to be changed? (1:01:05)
• A Run to End Homelessness (1:08:58)

RELATED LINKS:

• A Safe Haven
• Run to End Homelessness
• Neli’s book: Healing: Real Stories Told By People Who Have Overcome The Homeless And Opioid Epidemics

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Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Daryl Murphy about his Miles For Justice project; why he’s been running 5k or more every single day for over 300 days; his running background; his ideas about the future of Miles For Justice; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is Miles For Justice? (1:41)
• What started your 5k-a-day streak? (4:13)
• Daryl’s background, getting into running (5:36)
• Did you have running heroes? (25:21)
• The process of fundraising (28:06)
• Books (35:48)
• Acapella poem / rap (43:02)
• Interest in writing? (44:29)
• The 5k Streak: what’s easiest & what’s hardest about it? (46:20)
• The future of Miles For Justice (52:08)
• Running goals this year? (56:37)
• Expanding on the "idea" of Miles For Justice (1:01:42)

RELATED LINKS:

• Watch Daryl’s Video
• Donate to Miles For Justice

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Brendan Leonard and I talk to TheGingerRunner, Ethan Newberry, about life before GingerRunner; what led Ethan to start GR and how it has evolved; anxiety and mental health; his partnership with Kim Teshima Newberry; and of course, shoe reviews.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• On being interviewed (2:29)
• Life before GingerRunner (4:55)
• Acting Auditions (16:57)
• Ethan’s process of content creation (24:47)
• The Barkley Banana (31:58)
• Ethan’s partnership with Kim (37:23)
• Branding / the origins of the GingerRunner name (45:09)
• “Making It” (57:00)
• Anxiety & Mental Health (1:06:10)
• “What shoe should I run in?” (1:15:20)

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Today we’ve got some race recaps for you; our initial impressions of Saucony’s Switchback2 (which features the BOA system); and we discuss the arrival of the first carbon-plated trail shoe, The North Face's Flight Vectiv.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Race Recap: Moab Red Hot (2:05)
• Race Recap: Black Canyon Ultras (8:52)
• Review: Saucony Switchback2 (15:03)
• Carbon-plated trail shoes have arrived (24:26)

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My Off The Couch co-host Brendan Leonard has a new book coming out, so I talked to Brendan about zen koans, piñatas, other running books, kids, alternate titles for the book, and why Jonathan thinks that you should read this book whether you hate running, or love it.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Best Table of Contents Ever? (2:00)
• Who is the book for? (4:23)
• Alternate titles  (11:09)
• Running books & Born to Run (17:18)
• From Zero to Try (29:38)
• How do books work? (36:52)
• The importance of piñatas (41:43)
• Running & Love & Your Kids (44:45)
• When / Where to get the book (48:03)

RELATED LINKS:

• SEMI-RAD.COM
• BOOKSHOP.ORG

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Brendan Leonard & Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Mike Foote, who on 12.31.20, headed out with fellow The North Face athlete, Rob Krar, to attempt an FKT of the Rim to Rim to Rim “alt” route of the Grand Canyon. So Brendan and I caught up with Mike to get his version of events, and we discuss a number of interesting and important topics that show just how terrific and thoughtful of a person Mike is (in case you didn’t know that already).

TOPICS & TIMES

• Mike’s attempt to photograph Rob Krar’s butt (2:30)
• Racing, training, & race directing in 2020 (12:19)
• Races planned for 2021 (17:27)
• Getting in to race directing + Mike’s previous jobs (25:45)
• Books & reading habits (39:29)
• Ted Lasso! (52:16)
• Mental Health, exercise, & sports psychology (53:57)

RELATED LINKS

• THE VIDEO: R2R2R ALT ROUTE

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Brendan Leonard & Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Ed Roberson, the creator of The Procrastinator’s Punishment 50k; the host of the excellentMountain & Prairie podcast; and the author of a fantastic Books Recommendation series. So we talked to Ed about all of the above, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Ed’s podcast, Mountain & Prairie (1:52)
• The Procrastinator’s Punishment 50k (9:09)
• Ed’s Scary DNF (30:22)
• ED’s Gross DNF (36:41)
• Triathalon community vs the Ultra community (39:31)
• Ed’s bi-monthly book recommendations (44:40)

RELATED LINKS:

• Ed’s Mountain & Prairie Podcast
• Signup for Ed’s Book Recommendation Emails

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Zoë Rom is a runner / scrambler / climber; reader; writer; and host of the DNF Podcast. And we talk about all of this plus her interest in continuing to deepen and enrich running culture; the very specific way to win her heart; getting cut from the cross country team in high school; winning her first ultra with the help of Oreos & Fireball; her FKT on Capitol Peak; what she’s reading, watching, and listening to; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Fruit, books, & growing up in Arkansas (2:29)
• Getting cut from the XC team (6:40)
• Oreos, Fireball, & Winning her 1st Ultra (12:55)
• Moving to Boulder, CO (22:38)
• Climbers or Runners: who are more cerebral? (26:55)
• Writing about Running (30:13)
• Mountain Running (34:11)
• How to win Zoe’s heart (35:51)
• Zoe’s FKT on Capitol Peak (37:47)
• DNF Podcast (44:32)
• What Zoe’s reading, watching, & listening to (49:47)

RELATED LINKS

• Survivor Endurance phone case
• Our experience with the Survivor Endurance

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Brendan Leonard and I talk with Peter Bromka, a runner that grew up in Portland, ran at Tufts University in Boston, started trail running around San Francisco, and now, is back in Portland where he runs for the Bowerman Track Club Elite Program. But in addition to training hard and running fast, Peter is focused on writing about running itself. And in this conversation, you’ll hear more about how he is currently pursuing both.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Confession of being an OTC impostor (4:26)
• How Brendan and Peter met (10:05)
• Running / Not Running / Running (13:32)
• Falling short (25:35)
• Peter’s “The Bubble of a Dream” (32:34)
• Getting better at running without getting faster? (38:45)
• Thoughts on the book, Win At All Costs (42:31)
• Compensation & professional running (49:18)
• Going forward: writing & running (55:24)
• See Peter’s work: peterbromka.com (1:00:30)

RELATED LINKS

• Survivor Endurance phone case
• Our experience with the Survivor Endurance

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Most of you are familiar with the BOA fit system, but do you know what BOA is up to today? Or maybe you’ve thought, What’s wrong with regular shoe laces? We went to the BOA Performance Fit Lab to learn more; hear why they see a big opportunity in trail running shoes; and see how they are working with companies to optimize products.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• BOA’s background & the Performance Fit Lab (2:29)
• Dan Feeney & Kate Harrison’s backgrounds (6:20)
• BOA vs traditional shoe laces (8:20)
• 3rd-Party Testing (14:28)
• BOA’s biggest categories & emerging categories (16:15)
• Trail running benefits of BOA (21:50)
• Lateral Stability & BOA (23:50)
• Working with companies for optimization (25:55)
• Different foot shapes & BOA (28:37)
• Data collecting with athletes (30:10)
• Current BOA products to try on (32:55)

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Our guest today is Matt Hart, author of the book, Win at All Costs: Inside Nike Running and its Culture of Deception, which is an important book that everyone interested in competitive athletics should read.

We talk to Matt about how he got interested in and involved with this story; whether we should just make all performance-enhancing drugs legal in all sports; who is most to blame for PED use in sports; what Nike’s response to the book has been; Alberto Salazar’s upcoming trial; and more. This is a great conversation that raises a lot of important topics, and after you listen to this conversation, you should read Win at All Costs.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Matt’s background (3:45)
• The Nike Oregon Project (18:42)
• Legal vs. illegal drugs (23:16)
• Drugs in sports: who is most to blame? (31:54)
• Fact-checking the book (1:06)
• Nike’s response to the book? (1:15:45)
• Alberto Salazar’s upcoming trial (1:18:51)

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If you are interested in product design and the process of innovation, then you need to listen to this conversation. Jean-Luc Diard started as an intern at Salomon, developed the first shaped ski, became the CEO at Salomon, played a major role in the development of Salomon’s running shoes, moved on to found Hoka One One, and is currently the VP of Innovation for the Deckers Group, where he currently heads up the Deckers X Lab.

This conversation explores the process of bringing about real innovation, how to make it happen, what to do, and what to avoid. It is not to be missed.

TOPICS & TIMES

• What is the Deckers X Lab? (3:18)
• What is the Deckers Group? (4:25)
• Jean-Luc’s background (5:50)
• Why outdoor brands used to be narrowly focused (10:08)
• From intern to CEO of Salomon (14:40)
• Designing Salomon’s first ski (17:45)
• Getting Salomon into running shoes (24:23)
• Tangent: what happened to inline skating? (31:56)
• Starting Something New: Hoka One One (34:58)
• Adoption - and Resistance - to Innovation (48:39)
• From Hoka to the Deckers X Lab (52:29)
• ‘Not-My-Invention Syndrome’ & the Process of Innovation (58:45)
• Putting huge balloon heels on shoes (1:14:28)
• What is Deckers X Lab up to today? (1:23:05)

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Billy Yang is (among other things) a runner, filmmaker (Billy Yang Films), podcast host (Billy Yang Podcast), and someone who has been chronicling the sport of running in a fashion that is often beautiful, and always inspiring.

In this conversation, Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Billy about everything from cigarette brands to the need for more compassionate critical thinking in our world.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Smoking / not smoking (1:52)
• Filmmaking & influences (8:23)
• Different mediums (16:54)
• Immigration (22:08)
• Finishing projects (34:10)
• LA & moving? (43:25)
• NFL and the NBA (51:02)
• Podcasting & media (57:07)
• Hopes for the coming year (59:09)

RELATED LINKS:

• YouTube: Billy Yang Films
• Billy Yang Podcast

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Today we’re putting our Off The Couch co-host, Brendan Leonard (semi-rad.com) in the interviewee seat to hear about his recent FKT; his review of his FKT route and whether you should do it; movies; his current running program; gas station donuts; how well he deals with deadlines; some of his current and upcoming projects, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Brendan’s new FKT (7:27)
• Interlude: movie talk (9:42)
• Brendan’s review of his FKT (12:16)
• Gas station donuts (17:18)
• Are you a heart rate monitor? (19:12)
• Running as a couple (29:02)
• The deadline dungeon (33:31)

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Six months ago, professional skier, Cody Townsend, hated running. Now he loves it. So what happened?? And will his current training program really get him ready to ski tour up and down some of the gnarliest peaks in North America for his ongoing Fifty Project? If you have ever found yourself in the “I hate running” camp, you should listen to this episode.

• WATCH THE CONVERSATION ON OUR YOUTUBE CHANNEL

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Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Kaytlyn Gerbin about her work as a bioengineer, the Rainier Infinity Loop; running ultras vs mountaineering; why scientists make good ultra runners; cheating on snowboarding; and a whole lot more. 

TOPICS & TIMES

• Kaytlyn tries to remember the name of her dissertation (2:21)
• Describe the Rainier Infinity Loop? (6:35)
• Choosing projects / running ultra vs mountaineering (10:30)
• How much do you tailor training for specific events? (14:03)
• Is your brain on or off while exercising (15:57)
• Why scientists make great ultra runners (19:59)
• Rock climbing vs. ultra running (21:23)
• What was your introduction to running? (26:11)
• Growing up in Wisconsin (32:30)
• Imposter syndrome & start line at Western States (35:09)
• Snowboarding / cheating on snowboarding (37:50)
• Ultra runner couples & pacing your partner (51:42)
• The rest of 2020? (57:41)

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Last Saturday, Blister reviewer & accomplished ultrarunner, Maddie Hart, ran the Emma Coburn Elk Run 5k with Blister founder & very unaccomplished runner, Jonathan Ellsworth, and they recorded the experience. Hilarity (and embarrassment) ensued, but it was all for a great cause: Living Journeys. Check it out.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Running attire (5:50)
• Maddie’s FKT attempt(10:33)
• 5k Update: how’s Jonathan feeling? (13:21)
• Converting miles to kilometers (17:52)
• Listening to music while running (21:15)
• Maddie’s FKT training (23:32)
• Finishing! (26:39)
• Closing thoughts (30:06)

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Coree Woltering is definitely one of the most interesting ultrarunners out there, so Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talked to Coree about the one time when a catcall actually worked; why the running world needs to stop overlooking midwestern athletes; Quick Trip burgers and how to remove ticks and deal with bird-sized mosquitoes; and the injury and the miracle that happened while he was setting a new FKT on the Ice Age Trail.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Quick Trip Burgers & FKTs (5:32)
• Catcalls, skydiving & a white minivan (12:31)
• Start of Trail Running and Biology (29:17)
• Ice Age FKT, Ticks, Mosquitos (40:30)
• The injury & the miracle (51:27)

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Ryan Hall is a two-time Olympian, holds the U.S. record in the half marathon, and is the only American to run a sub-2:05:00 marathon. But these days, Ryan has cut back quite a bit on his running, and is currently far more focused on lifting— and his transformation from a ~130 lb. worldclass runner to ~180 lb. bodybuilder is wild.

But that’s not the only wild thing Ryan’s got going on — he just completed his first ultramarathon, The North Face Grand Traverse here in Crested Butte — and he did it in the most ‘Off The Couch’ way possible.

So I sat down with Ryan in Blister HQ to talk about his first ultra; some of the incredible highs and some painful lows in his running career; weight and performance and his own struggles as a professional runner to find the right balance; the importance of finding proper perspective; and his current work as a running coach where others can benefit from what he’s learned over the years.

Check out runfreetraining.com to learn more about working with Ryan.

TOPICS & TIMES:

1. Welcome to Crested Butte! (3:31)
2. Running after retirement? (10:10)
3. Performing ‘off the couch’ (17:13)
4. Developing a proper perspective (23:54)
5. Coaching (26:47)
6. Weight & disordered eating (29:33)
7. Ryan’s podcast, book, & documentary (1:01:47)
8. On aging / getting older (1:16:08)
9. On setting goals & excellence (1:16:11)

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Ever feel like you aren’t — or couldn’t ever possibly be — a “real” runner? Most of us have, which is why most of us need to meet Kelly Roberts. Kelly is good at making us feel fine about the fact that we sometimes hate running. And she’s equally good at helping us continue to run — or walk, or bike, or just keep moving. So we talk to Kelly about her moving (and hilarious) entrance into running; her Badass Lady Gang; angel ghosts; and more.

TOPICS

• Life currently in Brooklyn (8:05)
• Best motivating tips / tricks (18:24)
• Kelly’s origin story & getting into running (21:44)
• Kelly’s first half marathon (30:08)
• From first half to first full marathon (39:23)
• Badass Lady Gang (46:27)
• Coaching (52:08)
• Current personal goals? (101:50)

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We talk to 3-time Olympian, Simi Hamilton, about XC skiing and running; competition & competitive drive; his recent win of the Audi Power of 4; and Jonathan Ellsworth tries to instigate a battle between Simi and a previous Off The Couch guest.

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This week we take a look at the trends in running shoes for 2020. Jonathan Ellsworth is joined by Maddie Hart and Gordon Gianniny to talk about knit uppers on trail shoes (??), massive heels, marketing copy, and we even design our own ‘Blister Pro’ shoe. Then we wrap up by talking about a few current events and get Maddie and Gordon’s upcoming plans.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Current Running Shoe Trends (2:40)
• Brand Marketing (8:36)
• Carbon? (17:00)
• The Blister Maddie Pro (18:03))
• Minimalist Shoes (25:05)
• Heavier Shoes? (29:00)
• Massive Heels (31:50)
• Some Current Events & Trends (36:44)

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What do Taco Bell, the Harlem Globetrotters, a twisted femur, & Rocky Balboa have in common? They’ve all played a role in the journey of Camille Herron to become a world champion runner and a multiple world record holder — and Camille still has some very big plans. So Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk with Camille about all of the above, including her unusual path to trail running, and what her sites are set on next.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Taco Bell update (3:16)
• Early basketball aspirations (5:16)
• Track & cross country background (12:21)
• Marathons & the Olympic Trials (15:27)
• Getting into Ultras, breaking world records (17:43)
• Next Up: Trail Running (22:25)
• Telling Nike to Just Do It (23:53)
• Winning the 2017 Comrades Marathon (28:19)
• The advantage of a twisted femur (36:01)
• How Camille trains (41:15)
• Sponsorships & Gender Equality (49:04)
• Rocky Balboa & the IAU 24-Hr World Championship (55:59)
• Camille’s upcoming plans & goals (1:02:56)

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Noah Brautigam just won the Speedgoat 50K — a very tough race that includes nearly 12,000 feet of total climbing and takes place mostly above 9,200 feet on a rocky, rooty, steep course.

A few days after winning, Noah sat down with us in Blister HQ to provide a very fresh and very fun recap of the race, and describe what tweaks were made to allow the event to happen in these times of COVID. We also discuss his background and a surprising discovery that has him feeling great, performing at a high level, and recovering really well.

This is a fun conversation with a thoughtful and self-deprecating guy, and we’re sure you’ll enjoy it.

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Martinus Evans is the founder of 300poundsandrunning.com, the founder of the Slow AF Run Club, a marathon runner, a DJ, the host of the 300 Pounds And Running podcast, and more. And this week, Brendan Leonard and I talk to Martinus about modern media, being a Black runner in 2020, DJ-ing, motivation, Detroit pizza vs. Chicago pizza, the Slow AF Run Club Martinus started, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Getting into Running (5:52)
• 1st marathon (11:50)
• Music (19:14)
• Masters Thesis & Media Today (24:37)
• Police & being a Black runner (34:33)
• Slow AF Run Club (49:18)
• Pizza & Carrot Cake (56:57)
• What’s Next? (1:03:00)

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Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Amelia Boone about being a world champion obstacle racer; transitioning into trail running & racing; mental health & eating disorders; ElliptiGos, mtn lions, & more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Mtn Lions, Bears, Snakes, & Sharks (2:24)
• Amelia’s background (7:24)
• Intro to Tough Mudder (10:35)
• Competing & Practicing Law (18:03)
• Getting into Ultras (24:16)
• The pressure of competition (29:58)
• Results vs. Process (35:31)
• Biggest sacrifices you’ve made? (39:21)
• Mental Health & Eating Disorders (41:56)
• ElliptiGos & FKTs (53:20)

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Addie Bracy is an accomplished runner who thinks hard about the psychology of sports performance. So we talk to Addie about her background and how it led her to the study of sports performance psychology; the book she is now writing on the topic; and OUTrun, the organization she founded with her partner, Corey Conner, to empower and connect LGBTQ+ individuals within the running community and to create an environment that is encouraging, supportive, and inclusive to all.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Addie’s intro to running (3:43)
• Highlights from college racing (9:41)
• Life after U of North Carolina (10:50)
• Coaching & Getting into Ultras (14:25)
• Addie’s book on sports psychology (22:12)
• Competition & Culture: trail running vs road running (29:02)
• What is the mission of OUTrun? (39:14)
• The importance of doing what you love (51:00)

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The Skid Row Running Club is “an unusual running club that uses the power of running to improve the lives of those who are at risk of homelessness and addiction” in the Skid Row area of Los Angeles, California. And this week we talk to the club founder, Judge Craig Mitchell, about why he started the club; his background as a runner, highschool teacher; the duty of police officers to protect and serve; the need for minimum sentencing reform; and much more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• The judge’s running background (2:40)
• The Midnight Mission & the running club (5:37)
• What / where is Skid Row? (7:54)
• Who are the club members? (11:29)
• The club’s international marathons (12:58)
• Stories of specific members (18:10)
• Police & the duty to Protect & to Serve (27:30)
• Mandatory minimum sentencing reform (33:03)
• The importance of jury duty service (37:24)
• Best ways to support the running club? (39:26)
• Do you have a dream race for the club (42:04)

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Abby and Cordis Hall are both very good runners who both run for Adidas TERREX and who both recently set FKTs for the Cottonwood Marble Loop in Death Valley. And Abby and Cordis are soon going to both be going after another FKT, this time, on the rather gnarly Pfiffner Traverse.

So we discuss all of that, plus the benefits and challenges that arise when your partner is alsoa competitive runner. And we also talk about a current rule that is in place specifically for women’s FKTs that deserves to be re-considered.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Something about observability? (3:10)
• Setting dual FKTs for the Cottonwood Marble Loop (7:33)
• FKT rule that ought to be reconsidered? (12:17)
• Their running backgrounds & approaches (14:18)
• Relationship Dynamics & Couple Goals (35:47)
• Upcoming FKT attempt of the Pfiffner Traverse (47:43)
• Running plans after that? (1:00:21)
• Cooking recipes & advice for lazy people (1:04:21)

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Our guest this week is Shaun Martin, who we’ve talked about before on this podcast in our conversations with Sanjay Rawal, since Shaun appeared in Sanjay’s film, 3100: Run and Become. But this time we’re talking to the man himself, and Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Shaun about his background, heritage, coaching philosophy, and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Shaun’s background (2:23)
• Shaun’s father’s upbringing as a Navajo native (4:09)
• How relatable is your father’s experience to your own? (10:55)
• Getting into competitive running (16:47)
• Running in college (21:13)
• Pursuing a career in education & coaching (22:48)
• Shaun’s coaching techniques & philosophies (33:31)
• Getting into ultras / starting the Canyon De Chelly Ultra (38:44)
• Sharing running with your kids (54:01)
• Your ultra running career (57:12)

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Faith E. Briggs is a filmmaker and a runner, and this week, Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Faith about her latest film, This Land; growing up and running track & cross country and transitioning into long distance running & trail running; and our current / not-merely-current circumstances here in America.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Faith’s film, This Land (2:52)
• Boarding school & the ‘nonchalance of wealth’ (10:22)
• College & running track (15:02)
• Getting into documentary filmmaking? (23:36)
• When did you consider yourself a distance runner? (26:42)
• Getting into trail running (32:26)
• Inspiration & Influence for your writing and films (38:24)
• Our current situation (46:31)

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A few weeks ago Brendan Leonard and I talked to the legend himself, Buzz Burrell. In the first part of our conversation, we talk about Buzz’s background, including his first ever long-distance run; starting the first organic farm in Colorado; the time he delivered a baby; inventing the hydration pack; and more. And then we discuss Buzz’s role in establishing the concept of the Fastest Known Time; creativityand FKTs, the process of approving FKT submissions, and some of the trends he’s seeing in the world of FKTs.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Buzz’s first long distance run (1:45)
• Starting the 1st organic farm in Colorado (11:20)
• Delivering a baby? (13:06)
• Going to Asia, biking in Tibet (16:56)
• Mountain Running (26:31)
• Running the John Muir Trail (36:36)
• Inventing the hydration pack (47:06)
• Giving yourself a promotion (48:36)
• Establishing ‘Fastest Known Time’ (52:36)
• Creativity & FKTs (58:25)
• The process of approving a FKT submission (1:02:24)
• Trends in FKT submissions (1:07:06)

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On Saturday, August 25th, 2019, Zach set a new world record for the fastest time that a human being has run 100 miles. He did it on a track in Wisconsin in 11:19:13. And once he hit the 100-mile mark, Zach preceded to just keep on running, and he then set another world record: longest distance run in 12 hours (he went 104.8 miles). These are two mind-blowing feats, and you can listen to our conversation with Zach about this on episode 15 of Off The Couch.

Fast forward to May 16, 2020, and Zach just set another 100-mile world record: fastest 100 miles ever run on a treadmill. So we spoke to the 34 year old runner just a couple days after his most recent feat to discuss when he first got the idea to attempt this; the biggest differences between running 100 miles on a treadmill vs a track; and his preparation, strategy, and goals for this event.

We also have a great discussion about Mike McKnight’s Zero-Calorie 100.

And if you’d like to hear more of Zach talking about issues related to peak performance, you should check out his own podcast, Human Performance Outliers.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• When did you first get this idea? (4:03)
• 100 miles on a treadmill vs. track? (6:50)
• What was your strategy for pace? (12:42)
• What were your goals? (15:09)
• Putting on a media event during the run (17:14)
• Lowest moment during the effort? (19:36)
• What was the hardest mental aspect? (24:00)
• Food & fluids consumed (27:10)
• Advising Mike McKnight on his ‘Zero-Calorie 100’ (34:50)
• Current Interest: Exogenous Ketones (51:13)
• Other plans for 2020? (56:28)

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Is it humanly possible to run 100 miles without consuming a single calorie? Would it be possible to run 100 miles in under 24 hours without consuming a single calorie? On May 8th, Mike McKnight set out to find out, and Mike, who is the record holder of the Triple Crown of 200’s, not only accomplished this extraordinary feat, he did it in 18 hours and 37 minutes.

So we talked to Mike about why and when he first thought this was possible; how he prepared and trained for the feat; intermittent fasting and his ketogenic diet; some of the criticism he’s received for even attempting this; and what else he thinks might be possible.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is the history of ‘Zero Calorie’ runs? (1:55)
• When & why did you decide to do this? (4:08)
• Mike’s ketogenic diet (6:00)
• Pros & Cons ofIntermittent Fasting & Carnivore Diet (12:05)
• Science behind the preparation (14:14)
• What criticism about ketogenic diets do you hear? (16:58)
• What was your biggest concern before starting? (28:52)
• The route itself (32:13)
• What did you consume during the run? (34:50)
• Hardest moment of the day? (36:44)
• What other human “limits” do you want to test? (44:24)
• What did you do when you finished? (45:24)

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We talk to Georgia Porter, co-owner and personal trainer at The Physio Shop in Flagstaff, Arizona, about her dislike of running as a kid; her grandma who was running ultras back before running ultras was a thing; how to incorporate apple fritters and beer into your training regimen; competing at the 2020 US Olympic Marathon Trials; her belief in combining strength training and endurance training; and why all runners would benefit from learning to love strength training.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Workouts & trivia? (1:54)
• Georgia’s family of runners (3:45)
• Georgia’s ultrarunning grandma (8:35)
• Running at Western Colorado University (10:15)
• Turning point: going off course during a race (12:45)
• Rediscovering joy (17:35)
• Georgia’s approach to training for longer distances (24:13)
• From paramedic to personal trainer (29:10)
• How do you blend endurance & strength training? (34:40)
• What are your running goals? (44:45)
• How to sprint the last 5k of a marathon (52:00)

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Hillary Gerardi won the 2018 Skyrunner Extra World Series Circuit, and yet, she still doesn’t necessarily think of herself as a runner. So Brendan Leonard and I discuss this with Hillary, and, turns out, her hesitation makes a lot of sense once you understand her background and what it is that she enjoys most about being in the mountains.

Hillary was born in Vermont, but has lived in France since 2010, and currently lives in Chamonix, where she works at the Research Center for Alpine Ecosystems, so of course, we discuss all of that, too.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The hesitation to call yourself a “runner” (2:10)
• Hiking & backpacking in New England (5:03)
• The Hut Traverse in the White Mountains (9:45)
• Getting into trail running & moving to France (14:14)
• Skiing & backcountry accidents (19:40)
• Winning prosciutto (25:42)
• Hilary’s work with CREA Mont Blanc (29:16)
• What did you study in college? (33:47)
• Balancing work & running (37:30)
• Getting into “Skyrunning” (41:55)
• Trail Running vs. Mountain Scrambling (51:40)
• Having fun vs. wanting to win (1:07:19)

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Rickey Gates is a professional runner, a writer, a photographer — and someone who has a whole lotgoing on. His new book, Cross Country, a 3700-Mile Run to Explore Unseen America, just came out, and it documents Rickey’s 2017 odyssey of running from South Carolina to San Francisco and the people and places he interacted with along the way. We also discuss his Every Single Street project, Hut Run Hut and Bus Run Bus group trips he organizes every year, the current project he’s working on called 50 Classic Trails, and that still doesn’t cover everything that Rickey is up to. Rickey is a very good runner, but an even more interesting person. (Watch the trailer "Cross Country")

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Rickey’s new book, Cross Country (2:35)
• How & how not to travel (6:00)
• Bridging political divisions (10:00)
• The kindness of strangers (14:52)
• From XC racing to long-distance running (20:15)
• The Every Single Street Project (31:05)
• Media Bias, Partisanship, & Becoming MoreDivided (35:05)
• Rickey’s group trips:Hut Run Hut & Bus Run Bus (47:09)
• Rickey’s upcoming film: Transamericana (52:16)
• Rickey’s current project: 50 Classic Trails (53:55)
• Favorite Books, Music, & Movies? (57:33)

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Late last week, Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talked with @Jenny and Scott Jurek. This probably wasn’t the conversation that you oughtto have when you get to talk with a running icon like Scott Jurek and someone who is as accomplished and interesting as Jenny, but, whatever. We had fun, and you will, too. Among other things, we talk about Scott’s very first race; Jenny’s transition from climbing to running; Scott’s love of cooking; Jenny’s ambition to set the Slowest Known Time on the Pacific Crest Trail; and the process of co-writing their wonderful book, North.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Scott’s very first race (2:00)
• Jenny’s transition from climbing to running (7:52)
• Sharing a cubicle with Krissy Moehl (9:22)
• How Scott & Jenny met (10:15)
• Scott’s love of cooking (15:50)
• Best veggie burgers? (28:25)
• Thoughts on processed vegetarian food? (35:00)
• What’s your current relationship to running? (43:50)
• Goal: Slowest Known Time on the PCT (52:14)
• Co-writing their book, North (54:42)

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Dom Di Tommaso (@domtomato) is a freerunner, a certified mind blower, and the guy behind one of our favorite Instagram pages and YouTube channels in the world. He is also a fascinating person, and a perfect reminder that “running” is not a sport that we should narrowly define. So on our latest Off The Couch podcast, we talked to Dom about his uncommon upbringing; his training, his focus, his injury history, and how he avoids dying doing the stuff he does; similarities between the freerunning community and the long-distance running community; and more. Check it out..

TOPICS & TIMES

• What sports were you into growing up? (5:59)
• Freerunning vs. Parkour? (23:14)
• What’s your craziest idea? (33:49)
• Progression & training (36:48)
• Injury history (42:44)
• How to handle massive drops & landings (51:32)
• Track & Field: what would be your best events? (59:13)
• Your strengths & areas where you want to improve? (1:03:25)
• The freerunning community (1:08:45)
• Acting, Movies, & Freerunning (1:14:43)

Instagram: @domtomato

YouTube: DomTomato - DIVING FRONTS 2019

YouTube: ’FreeDom’ - 2019

YouTube: DomTomato - DIVING FRONTS 2018

YouTube: Dom Tomato Channel

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We talk to Topo Athletic founder, Tony Post, about serving as the CEO of Vibram USA; founding Topo Athletic; minimalist and maximalist shoes; Topo’s design philosophy and process; and more. 

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Moving to Boston, working for Rockport (1:15)
• Were you always into running gear? (5:20)
• “Craftsmanship” in the running shoe industry (7:47)
• The decision to start your own shoe company (10:21)
• Vibram and the “Born to Run” affect? (14:19)
• The minimalist movement (21:10)
• Where is there consensus on shoe design? (31:20)
• What is Topo’s approach to fit? (35:55)
• What differentiates Topo Athletic? (40:49)
• Topo’s trajectory (44:20)
• Which Topo shoes are you running in the most? (46:51)
• New Topo products? (52:16)
• What’s the best question I haven’t asked you? (58:47)

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Eric Schranz has been a staple of the trail running and ultrarunning world for over a decade — both as a passionate runner, and as the host of Ultrarunnerpodcast.com. And since Eric spends so much of his time writing about and interviewing other runners, Brendan Leonard (semi-rad.com) and I thought it would be fun to put Eric in the guest seat. So Brendan and I talked with Eric about how he got into running; his work in the music industry and politics; getting started at ultrarunnerpodcast.com; the art of conversation; how running media differs from other sports media coverage; and a whole lot more — including, a rather spirited discussion about the best bank robbery and heist movies of all time.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• When & How Eric got into trail running (1:45)
• Working in the music industry & politics (7:20)
• Joining Ultrarunnerpodcast.com (13:52)
• Making it full time (17:30)
• The art of conversation (20:28)
• Finding stories and guests (24:30)
• Running media vs. other sports media (33:07)
• What are your running goals? (40:05)
• Cutting out caffeine and alcohol (50:46)
• Ranking the best heist movies (52:39)

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Ryan Van Duzer has a YouTube series called, Running with Ryan. And last fall, as our Off The Couch co-host, Brendan Leonard, was nearing his goal of running 52 marathons in 52 weeks, Ryan had Brendan as a guest on Running with Ryan. So we thought we’d give Brendan the chance to turn the tables and have him interview Ryan, and that proved to be a good idea. They talk about snakes; biking across the country; starting his YouTube channel; the Burning Man Ultra; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Running the Caballo Blanco Ultra (1:55)
• Bringing his mom along for adventures (7:32)
• Running BOLDERBoulder 10K at age six (9:06)
• Snakes (12:55)
• Suffering at his first marathon (18:06)
• Launching a career in travel journalism (21:54)
• Moving from television to YouTube (27:25)
• “Running with Ryan” Series (30:25)
• Preparing (or not?) for his fourth Javelina 100 (35:07)
• Maintaining “relentless” positivity (46:10)
• Burning Man Ultra Marathon (50:11)

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Joe Grant is an endurance athlete, a mountain runner, a reader, a writer, a thinker, a filmmaker, and, as you are about to find out, an exceptional storyteller.

And in this conversation, Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Joe about how he got into running; racing (and winning) the 2008 Caballo Blanco Copper Canyon Ultra and how that affected his life; his Tour de Fourteeners, a self-powered and self-supported link up of all Colorado’s 14,000-foot peaks by bike and on foot; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Joe & Brendan met (1:55)
• Joe’s background (6:45)
• Film: The Middle Way (10:30)
• From Rollerblading to Running (16:40)
• Greyhound Bus Road trip (20:05)
• Developing a Minimalist Aesthetic (23:25)
• Learning to run in Kenya (26:45)
• Running the Waldo 100K (32:50)
• Running (and winning) the 2008 Caballo Blanco (35:53)
• How the Caballo Blanco race affected Joe’s future (41:17)
• 2008: Kilian Jornet & a changing of the guard (47:00)
• Turning running into a career (51:43)
• Other creative interests & pursuits? (53:53)
• Joe’s mom’s amazing relationship with running (56:50)
• Running on your own terms (1:01:44)
• The “Runner’s High” & continuity with life (1:06:40)
• The Marathon Monks of Japan (1:19:25)

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When a 15-year-old Hayden Hawks first learned about the Western States 100, he knew that he would someday get into running ultras, and it became his dream to race Western States. Fast forward 14 years later, and the now-29-year-old Hayden Hawks is a world-class runner, he’s just won the Black Canyon 100k, and he’s qualified to race Western States this June.

So we talked to Hayden about his Black Canyon 100 win and the specific lessons he learned there. And we discuss his trajectory from running track in high school to where he is today. But the biggest takeaway from our conversation with Hayden is just how driven he is to test himself and see what is possible for him. It is a very infectious energy, and a great reminder to approach life with passion, drive, and joy.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Post-Race Vacations (1:57)
• Training vs. Racing (5:19)
• Getting a ticket to Western States (7:12)
• Black Canyon: what went right & wrong? (12:27)
• How & why did you get into ultras? (22:20)
• Avoiding burnout (25:20)
• When did you start running trails? (31:56)
• Do you feel more like a veteran or a newbie? (36:49)
• Preparing for Western States (40:50)
• Life outside of running (43:53)
• Environmental advocacy (46:07)

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While most of us know the explorers, Lewis & Clarke, the exploits of John Colter (who was a member of Lewis & Clarke’s famous expedition) might be a bit less familiar, but they are arguably even wilder. And in their short film, Colter: A Legacy of Adventure, Sawyer Thomas and Riis Wilbrecht set out to venture through the territory John Colter had explored two centuries ago, across some of the most remote terrain in the lower 48 states.

So we talked to Sawyer and Riis about John Colter and why they chose this particular adventure; the (serious) difficulty of running, skiing, and trekking through this terrain; the logistics of shooting this film; and more.

• Watch the Trailer
• Watch the Full Film

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Sawyer and Riis’ Background (6:58)
• Who is John Colter? (9:02)
• The Logistics of the Route (17:00)
• The Skiing Element of the Adventure (23:37)
• The Best Moment of the Expedition(29:39)
• The Running Portion of the Project (39:20)
• Biggest takeaways from the adventure? (46:14)

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By some measures, Eric Walker is a pretty normal guy. He lives in Minnesota, he’s not a professional runner, he’s 38 years old, and he’s a husband and a dad.

But at some point in 2018, Eric found himself committed to the goal of running 5 kilometers every day for 365 days, and a year later … he’d done it.

So Brendan Leonard and Jonathan Ellsworth talked to Eric to find out what motivated him to do this? How did the idea come about? How did he actually pull it off? What did he learn in the process? And is this something he thinks the rest of us should try? And as you’ll see, there’s a lot that each of us could learn from this pretty normal (but pretty charming) guy.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Balancing life and running (10:00)
• Did you tell others about your goal? (22:39)
• The significance of the challenge (27:44)
• Biggest takeaways from running 5k for 365 (30:50)
• Day 366 & Beyond (38:37)
• Varying intensity? (49:04)
• Would you recommend this challenge to others? (52:02)

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Nell Rojas is fascinating. And fast. So fast that on February 29th, she’s got a shot at making the USA Marathon team, despite the fact that she didn't compete in her first marathon until 2018. But she then won her second marathon (the very competitive Grandma’s Marathon), and now, the Olympic Trials are just around the corner. So we talked to Nell about her unique background; the dynamics of being coached by her dad (Rick Rojas, a very accomplished runner himself); her uncommon emphasis on strength training, low-mileage, and speed work; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up & playing basketball (3:18)
• Coaching young runners (8:30)
• Being coached by her dad (14:40)
• Speed work & avoiding overtraining (21:11)
• Nell’s interval training: the details (30:10)
• Race strategy & splits (32:05)
• Strength training for marathons (37:00)
• Feb. 29th: US Marathon Trials (51:10)
• Life outside of running (59:38)

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Liza Howard is smart, funny, accomplished, humble, and by her own account … is extremely susceptible to peer pressure. She’s run marathons to impress a guy, still runs marathons for donut money, has won the Leadville 100 (and other big races) multiple times, is a coach, a parent, a NOLS Wilderness instructor, and the director of the terrific non-profit, Band of Runners. Her energy and enthusiasm are infectious, and you are in for a treat.

This conversation between me, Brendan Leonard, and Liza ranges from the absurd to the profound; upsets a lot of preconceived notions and conventional wisdom; and will make you laugh and think in equal measure.

In short, Liza is a joy, and this conversation is a gift.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Donuts & Donut money (2:10)
• Winning the USA FIT Marathon (4:28)
• Getting into running to impress a boyfriend (9:54)
• Winning Leadville (13:00)
• Ultrarunning vs. Parenting (17:04)
• Trail running in San Antonio (24:22)
• Training in a flat region (30:00)
• Band of Runners (bandofrunners.org) (31:30)
• Training in heat for elevation? (43:12)
• Wilderness courses & trail running (45:50)
• Aging & Expectations (49:25)
• Liza’s goals for 2020 & 2021 (56:58)

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Duncan Callahan is one of our favorite people, so we’re excited to have him back on the show to catch up. We had Duncan on last July (Episode 9 of Off the Couch) and it was a very compelling and very honest conversation about some huge successes of his, but also about some of Duncan’s struggles and doubts and questions.

In this conversation, Duncan and I talked about the increasing amount of coaching he’s doing with Carmichael Training Systems (including coaching our own Maddie Hart); thoughts on winter training; his working through the logistics of being a coach versus being an athlete, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Duncan’s work with CTS (3:57)
• Best practices for winter training (5:25)
• Coaching Maddie Hart (7:47)
• Are there more injuries in the winter? (12:43)
• Staying motivated (13:51)
• Balancing coaching & training (18:18)
• What big race interests you the most? (29:00)

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Trail Sisters is a trail running community for women and an online journal that offer lots of great resources — including articles and stories, grants, retreats, directories for female coaches, trail locations, and races that meet the trail sisters standards for gender equity. 

So Brendan Leonard and Maddie Hart spoke with Gina Lucrezi, the founder of Trail Sisters, about the unusual way in which Gina got into running; her impressive accomplishments as a runner; the remarkable things happening at Trail Sisters; the ways you can get involved with and support Trail Sisters; and Gina shares an exciting development for a brand new Trail Sisters project.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Started running b/c of a bet with her mom (1:45)
• Competing in running (6:10)
• The story behind Trail Sisters (24:35)
• Thoughts on 50/50 male-female lottery (33:00)
• Joining the Hardrock 100 Board of Directors (35:35)
• Standards for “Trail Sister Approved” races (39:01)
• Trail Sisters local groups (47:00)
• How to get involved (50:25)
• Trail Sisters’ very first race (55:10)
• Upcoming women’s retreat (59:20)

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In 2019, Grayson Murphy won the US Mountain Running Championship; the World Mountain Running Championship; and the Xterra Trail Run World Championship. But there were many twists and turns along the way in getting there, and first and foremost, Grayson’s story is really about her constant push to evolve. Grayson is 24 years old and has already racked up some seriously impressive results. But perhaps even more impressive and instructive is her willingness to experiment, adjust, and explore new ideas and practices, and we discuss all of this and more in this conversation.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• From soccer to xc & steeplechase (1:34)
• Signing with NAZ Elite (18:09)
• Getting into trail running (25:36)
• Trail running vs. road running culture (29:52)
• Navigating generalized anxiety (38:19)
• Working with coach Kameron Ulmer (42:29)
• Winning the World Mountain Running Championship (47:15)
• Grayson’s Planners (52:41)
• Interests outside of running (54:53)
• Experiments with diet & food (55:57)
• Goals for 2020 (1:03:46)

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Sanjay Rawal was our first guest on Off The Couch, and we are pleased to have him back on for our first episode of 2020. We invited him back to ask about his rather spectacular performance — and even more spectacular meltdown — near the end of the California International Marathon this past year. But in addition to getting a fantastic first hand account of that race, we touch on a number of important topics that go way beyond some race report.

Sanjay talks about the concepts of running dumb; training slow; finding joy through exertion; and whether it is possible to run a great time by not caring about running a great time. We also talk about the urban roots of ultrarunning, Sanjay’s latest film project, the future of podcasts, and more. I assure you, there is an abundance of food for thought packed into this episode.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The future of podcasts? (2:00)
• Lessons from 3100: Run & Become (9:20)
• The urban roots of ultrarunning (14:06)
• Beyond Bonking: Sanjay’s experience at CIM (17:05)
• Running Dumb (32:29)
• Boston Marathon this April? (37:32)
• Training Slow (38:45)
• Sanjay’s take on personal resolutions (50:55)
• Inspiration vs. Aspiration (54:45)
• Finding Joy through Exertion (57:10)
• Sanjay’s next film: Patti Dillon (59:40)

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What’s the best way to eat to feel good and perform well? The fields of nutrition and diet are massive topics, as are all of the related issues surrounding them. So on our latest Off The Couch podcast, we talk with Registered Dietitian Nutritionist, Kylee Van Horn, about the various diets out there; whether certain diets are prone to help or hurt training recovery; athletes & eating disorders, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Kylee’s running background (2:35)
• Her background in nutrition (19:40)
• Low-carb, High-fat diets (24:27)
• How does sleep affect appetite? (33:30)
• Fatigue & food (35:46)
• Supplements (39:37)
• Athletes & eating disorders (48:27)
• Adapting to seasonal changes (57:25)

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New races and running events seem to be popping up all the time, which raises the question: Are there some specific characteristics, policies, and practices that should be built into pretty much every running event?

To start thinking about this question, we talked to Caleb Efta, the race director of the High Lonesome 100. Caleb started the High Lonesome 100 in 2017, and the race is already a Hard Rock 100 qualifier.

Caleb has thought hard about how best to structure races, so I talked with him about how and why he started High Lonesome, and we get into some of the specific policies and requirements of the event that are designed to mitigate its environmental impacts and increase gender equality. It’s good stuff for all of us to be thinking about how and in what areas we can improve.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Caleb’s background (2:18)
• Why the name “High Lonesome”? (26:32)
• Overview of the race (32:15)
• Conservation efforts (37:00)
• Progressive gender policies (43:44)
• Becoming a Hard Rock 100 qualifier (1:00:55)
• Future goals for the race (1:03:40)

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For 2019, Brendan Leonard (@semirad) set a goal for himself: run 52 ‘marathons’ in 52 weeks. He told very few people about this goal, and we are proud to report that Brendan accomplished his goal with several weeks to spare. 

So in this conversation, Jonathan Ellsworth talks to Brendan about what prompted him to create this plan; why he decided to tell very few people about it; exactly what the parameters were for these ‘marathons’; how he handled the logistics; what he learned along the way; and more.

This is a fun one, and it might just inspire you to think creatively about some goals for 2020. 

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What did you just do, and why? (1:50)
• Defining the rules for these ‘marathons’? (8:10)
• Eating donuts & running (20:51)
• Why did you tell so few people about your goal? (23:01)
• Injuries? (29:25)
• What was the hardest part of the project? (32:08)
• What was the best part? (34:35)
• Funniest moment? (40:00)
• Goals for 2020? (45:10)

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We talk with Blister reviewers, Maddie Hart and Gordon Gianniny, about how they handle running and training in the cold and on snowy, icy roads and trails. Maddie and Gordon offer their tips and tricks and perspectives on this age-old conundrum of when and whether to run when the days are short and summer is a distant memory.

So check it out, see if you agree or disagree with some of their practices and suggestions, and in the show notes to this episode on the site, we’d love to have you share your own best tips, tricks, and practices.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Winter running & training changes (10:25)
• Dealing with icy / snow roads & trails (22:46)
• Winter gear — layering (24:30)
• What gear is useful & what isn’t? (32:24)
• Work on Weaknesses (36:52)
• Work on non-running stuff (39:06)

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By the time she was 5 years old, Kelly Newlon had already identified two of her biggest passions: running and cooking. Those passions led her to running longer and longer races and becoming a classically trained chef.

And these days, Kelly and her husband Morgan operate RAD (“Real Athlete Diets”) out of Boulder, Colorado, where they are — quite literally — feeding and fueling the ultrarunning community, including a high number of its elite performers.

So in this episode, Maddie Hart and I talk to Kelly about eating well and performing well; the entrepreneurial story of how she went from training at the Culinary Institute of America, to working on a food truck, to starting Real Athletes Diets; dealing with the huge range of the dietary restrictions of runners; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The story behind Real Athlete Diets (RAD) (2:00)
• The pressure of fueling performance (6:10)
• Growing the company (10:32)
• Runners’ relationships to food (18:55)
• Kelly’s background in running & cooking (20:41)
• Training with Jason Koop (40:25)
• Gourmet vs. utilitarian cooking? (44:33)
• Thoughts on nutrition & dieting (48:04)
• Favorite event to work with? (57:43)
• Reducing catering’s environmental impact (1:01:18)

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Stevie Kremer is back on the show, and she came to BLISTER HQ in Mt. Crested Butte to talk about her experience at this year’s New York City Marathon — including all the gory details and the lessons she learned; the things about running she truly loves and truly hates the most; how many children is too many children, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Running in freezing temps (5:15)
• NYC Marathon: gory details & lessons learned (8:23)
• Cuba?? (23:40)
• Books & TV shows (26:00)
• The switch from teaching to counseling (27:20)
• Winter plans + how many kids is too many?? (31:06)
• Thoughts on Big’s Backyard Ultra (33:35)
• What Stevie loves (and hates) about running (42:21)

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Mr. Cappuccino of the @cappuccinocowboys is back on the show to issue an apology for his performance last week. And then Jared Hazen and Eric Senseman join us, so we got to ask them why they continue to associate with Mr. Cappuccino, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Apologies for last week (1:45)
• If “The Guys” were Sex & the City characters (2:50)
• Mr. Cappuccino on Jared & Eric (6:25)
• Jared & Eric join the call?? (9:38)
• TNF 50 Recap (14:25)
• Which @cappuccinocowboys post made you genuinely angry? (16:45)

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What is Cappuccino Cowboys, and who is the person behind it? Is he an evil genius hell-bent on ruining ultrarunning? A provocateur shaking up the stodgy state of running media? Or is he just a giant pain in the ass of Jim Walmsley, Eric Senseman, Jared Hazen, Cody Reed, Tommy Rivs and a few other unfortunate souls? We spoke to Mr. Cappuccino himself to find out.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• What is @cappuccinocowboys? (1:55)
• Who are the Cappuccino Cowboys? (11:10)
• Do you think you deserve to be on this show? (24:01)
• Why do people let you hang around? (30:55)
• Why cappuccino? (36:30)
• Exclusive memes for Off The Couch (40:20)
• Are your parents proud of you? (43:31)
• Lifeboat Q: Jim, Jared, Eric, Tommy, & Cody… (44:45)
• Helping Walmsley get lost at Western States (47:50)

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Maggie Guterl just became the first woman ever to win Big Dog’s Backyard Ultra, a multi-day race that does not have a fixed-distance finish line. So we talked to Maggie about how this extraordinary race works, and Maggie does a brilliant job of detailing what it was like to overcome the unique physical and mental challenges of Big’s; the significance of being the race’s first female champion; the next insane race she has her sights set on, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Salad and M&M’s (1:40)
• What is Big Dog’s Backyard Ultra? (5:50)
• Approaching a race that has no fixed end (10:02)
• Big’s vs. other ultras (19:14)
• Your physical / mental limits? (28:52)
• Being the first woman to win Big’s (40:00)
• Mike McKnight & Zack Bitter’s records (34:50)
• Barkley Marathons vs. Big’s Backyard? (39:29)
• On NOT running (46:28)
• Why do you run? (50:39)

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Simply put, Mike McKnight’s story is amazing. This year, he won the Triple Crown of 200’s, which includes the Bigfoot 200 in August, the Tahoe 200 in September, and he just won the Moab 240. And in covering those ~640 miles of racing, he smashed his own cumulative-time record for the three races by … 43 hours.

That’s probably not what you’d expect from a chubby kid who grew up on a dairy farm and didn’t participate in sports till he tried one season of highschool football, nor what you’d expect from a person who broke his back in a ski accident 8 years ago and had 2 rods and 9 screws placed in his spine, along with part of his hip bone.

So we talk to Mike about all of this and more — including getting a total of ~30 minutes of sleep over the course of ~640 mile races.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Mike recaps his Moab 240 win
• Mid-race conversations with David Goggins (4:52)
• Getting lost for over 2 hours (9:32)
• Farm life & football (20:37)
• How a broken back led Mike to ultrarunning (26:39)
• Jumping from 100 milers to 240’s (40:31)
• Longer races? 300 milers? 500 milers? (49:41)
• Reflections on his Triple Crown win (54:27)
• Mike’s diet — and current week-long fast (59:46)
• Mike’s work at Altra (1:06:50)

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What’s it like to run two hundred and one miles … and know that you still have another 40 miles to go? And why would you sign up and subject yourself to such a thing?

To find out, we went to Moab, Utah, to the Moab 240 Endurance Run — a two hundred and forty mile race — to capture the very raw and unfiltered reactions from runners, pacers, friends, medics, and concerned mothers from the Geyser Aid Station located at mile 201 of the Moab 240. And we also learned what this race — and this community — is really about.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Wes Plate & Bryan Fillman (5:05)
• Gordon Gianniny (aid station director) (8:39)
• Chris Plunkett (16:02)
• Catra Corbett (18:29)
• Scott Bailey (22:23)
• Wilk (pacer extraordinaire) (23:36)
• Byron Roca (28:22)
• Masato (32:44)
• Hans Siemelink (36:55)
• Toby Ballard (race medic) (40:27)
• Daneri Gay (concerned ultra mom) (52:40)

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When Cam Smith graduated high school in 2014, he had little or no mountain experience. But fast forward a few years, and Cam is now an accomplished trail runner, mountain biker, a member of the U.S. ski mountaineering team, a repeat winner of the Grand Traverse Mountain Run from Crested Butte to Aspen, and a repeat winner of the Grand Traverse Triple Crown.

All of that is extremely impressive, perhaps especially since Cam grew up in Rockford, Illinois, which isn’t exactly an incubator of high alpine achievement.

So I sat down with Cam in BLISTER HQ to talk about his journey, his goals, his relation to running and skiing and mountain biking, his work as a coach and as a guide at the Adaptive Center here in Crested Butte, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Racing the Grand Traverse (2:45)
• Growing up in Rockford, Illinois (7:38)
• Getting into ski mountaineering & racing (10:57)
• Overcoming an overly competitive mindset (21:35)
• Who do you look up to? (25:55)
• Short & long term race goals (28:30)
• Cam’s “intuitive” training process (31:23)
• How Cam avoids burnout (34:12)
• Being on the US Skimo team (39:34)
• Working with the CB Adaptive Center (41:42)
• The coolest thing Cam’s ever done (48:36)

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Jason Koop is a passionate runner, the author of Training Essentials for Ultrarunning, the head coach of CTS Ultrarunning, and someone who is not afraid to speak his mind. So Maddie Hart & Jonathan Ellsworth talk to Jason about his endurance coaching; “nonsensical” training aids & techniques; his recent running of the 330 km Tor de Geants; the current state of the minimalist / maximalist shoe debate; what he thinks the running scene will look like 10 years from now; and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Jason got into running & coaching (1:40)
• The early days of remote coaching (4:01)
• Jason’s book Training Essentials for Ultrarunning (9:11)
• What’s the current state of endurance science? (12:31)
• Coaching “physiological anomalies" (15:20)
• “Nonsensical” training aids & techniques (22:44)
• Minimalist vs maximalist running shoes? (30:42)
• Running the 330 km Tor des Geants (38:14)
• Sharing your pain on social media (44:45)
• What will the racing scene look like in 10 years? (47:39)
• Jason’s coaching work today (1:04:50)

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Kyle Robidoux is a passionate runner and skier and beer enthusiast. He has run 25 marathons and ultra marathons, including three 100-mile races, and the Boston Marathon six times. He also happens to be legally blind.

Like the vast majority of us, Kyle Robidoux grew up loving sports and the outdoors. But at the age of 11, Kyle was diagnosed with a degenerative eye disease, and he was declared legally blind at the age of 19.

So Kyle and I talk about his background, his anger about his receding vision and what he did about it; how he got into running and trail running, his efforts to create more inclusive trail races; his advice to all of us about how to deal with loss of any kind; and what specific things we all can do to be better to and more supportive of everyone dealing with disabilities. (And we talk about beer.)

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Kyle’s work with the Massachusetts Association for the Blind & Visually Impaired (2:30)
• Growing up & playing sports (3:37)
• Being diagnosed with Retinitis Pigmentosa (5:20)
• The changing condition of Kyle’s vision (6:18)
• On losing sight immediately vs. progressively (8:54)
• Facing feelings of frustration & shame (14:40)
• How Kyle got into running (28:24)
• Proudest accomplishments? (32:04)
• From road running to trail running (38:51)
• Kyle’s first 100-mile trail run (34:41)
• Running Western States with Scott Jurek (44:47)
• What makes for a great sighted guide? (48:11)
• Future plans and aspirations? (49:48)
• How can ski areas improve adaptive skiing? (52:53)
• Kyle’s takeaway message for each of us (1:03:34)

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Luke Nelson is a professional runner, physician assistant, race director (of the Scout Mountain Ultras in his town of Pocatello, Idaho), climate activist, husband, father of three, and … someone who doesn’t get a lot of sleep.

And in this conversation, my co-host Brendan Leonard and I talk to Luke about how he and Brendan first met; his background as a serious snowboarder, climber, and kayaker; how and why he got into running — and did his first marathon; his obsession with testing his limits; how he attempts to balance that obsession with family life; why (given everything else he’s got going on) he makes the time to also be a race director, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• How Luke & Brendan met (1:30)
• Running his 1st marathon b/c of a bet (5:40)
• Learning from Jared Campbell (13:13)
• FKT of WURL / managing risk & fear (15:04)
• Balancing athletic & professional ambitions w/ family life (21:34)
• Sleeping little, training lots (23:47)
• Snowboarding & kayaking (& origami?) (26:38)
• Why Luke is racing less, pursuing FKT’s more (30:16)
• Finding comfort in pain (31:48)
• Medical concerns about “pushing your limits”? (45:55)
• ANWR expedition with Clare Gallagher & Tommy Caldwell (48:46)
• Why are you a race director? (54:49)
• Environmental activism (1:01:34)

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Finding the right running shoe can be far more complicated and confusing than it should be. So this week, reviewers Luke Koppa, Jonathan Ellsworth, Maddie Hart, and Gordon Gianniny discuss our new BLISTER Brand Guide to Running Shoes; why we saw a need for it; what we hope it accomplishes for runners everywhere; and the trends and takeaways we’ve seen in the process of building it.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Gordon Gianniny’s whereabouts & recovery (2:00)
• Maddie & the Eleven Experience Trail Running Camp (3:45)
• Is Stevie Kremer dodging Jonathan?? (5:00)
• The major problem with buying new running shoes (6:35)
• Our biggest takeaways from developing the guide (9:25)
• Brand lineups with redundant shoe designs (11:30)
• What are the overall market trends? (13:22)
• Should companies provide a stated last? (17:05)

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Salomon athlete, Jackson Brill, is a 21-year old senior in college at CU Boulder, but given his approach to running, the way he talks about the sport, and his race results, you’d be forgiven for assuming that he was twice as old as he is. So we talked to Jackson about his studies and his work in CU’s Locomotion Lab; being teammates with Kilian Jornet; his experience with the Golden Trail Series; and his strong interest in coaching.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Golden Trail Series (3:10)
• Lessons learned from studying physiology (14:02)
• Ascents or Descents? (19:30)
• Do you strategize races based on your competitors? (21:58)
• Being teammates with Killian Jornet (25:53)
• Growing up & downhill ski racing (31:00)
• The “distance” question (34:41)
• If you could only run 1 race in the next 2 years? (39:38)
• What was your best day running? (41:41)
• Jackson’s upcoming races (45:47)

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On Saturday, August 25th, 2019, Zach Bitter set an incredible world record for the fastest time that a human being has run 100 miles — 11 hours, 19 minutes, 13 seconds.

And for an encore, Zach kept onrunning, then set anotherworld record — the 12-hour distance world record. (In 12 hours, Zach ran 104.8 miles.)

To call these achievements remarkable is an understatement. So we talked to Zach a few days after his big day about the logistics of the event; training for it; why he considers it his masterpiece; his perspective on other world records, and a whole lot more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Recovering from the race (2:50)
• Race day report (6:17)
• Running on a track vs. trail (15:47)
• Zach’s headspace while running (20:56)
• When did you start training for this event? (33:23)
• Thoughts on Ian Sharman & David Roche’s training philosophies (45:07)
• How to get to a 6:40 split (57:47)
• Thoughts on other world records (1:01:53)
• Why we need to celebrate more runners & events (1:07:27)
• What’s Next: Preparing for the Spartathalon (1:15:27)

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David Roche is one of the most successful running coaches out there, but he is certainly not the most conventional running coach out there.

And while data-driven training play an important role in the “SWAP” coaching program run by David and his wife Megan, there are some foundational and existential principles that underlie their approach to running, coaching, and life.

So we explore with David the philosophy and principles that undergird his coaching; how he arrived at them; how he went from being a 200 lb. football & baseball player to two-time national champion in the 10k; how he has evolved and improved as a running coach; what new training ideas seem most promising to him; whether he would consider coaching non-runners; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Races as celebrations of training (3:50)
• David’s days as a 210 lb football player (5:45)
• David’s philosophy (16:05)
• Running and Death (26:00)
• How have you most improved as a coach? (32:40)
• Insecurity (36:34)
• Training for fast twitch vs. slow twitch (47:08)
• Is success for yourself or your clients more fulfilling? (51:22)
• David’s book, Happy Runner (53:17)
• “SWAP” running (57:17)
• Would you coach non-runners? (58:22)

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This week’s episode is a bit of a prodigal son story, because our guest today, Justin Ricks, was an accomplished young runner who walked away entirely from the sport early into his college running career — he just dropped running completely. But some years later he found himself drawn back to running, and he gave up a secure corporate job, moved his family into a camper, and started to put on race events.

Then, Justin and his family kept putting on more and more race events each year under the Mad Moose Events moniker, and as you’ll hear, Mad Moose is very much a ‘whole family’ affair.

But Justin and his family don’t merely make a living in running, they also live to run, and they literally run together - the whole family - every single morning.

And despite putting on over 20 races a year in Colorado and Utah, Justin himself somehow manages to score some very impressive race results when he himself decides to race, including his 1st place finish two weeks ago at the Silverton Ultra 55k; his 5th place finish last month at the Leadville Silver Rush 50 miler, and you’ll find a whole lot of other wins, podiums, and top 10 finishes of his over on ultrasignup.com.

So I talked to Justin about this rather unconventional and very interesting life that he and his family are constructing; we talk about walking away from and returning to running; the origins of Mad Moose events; whether he intends to put on even more events in the coming years, which event he himself is most interested in racing in someday, and yes, I ask him about those really improbable-sounding daily morning runs with the whole family.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Justin’s background in running (4:38)
• From the corporate world to living in a camper (11:15)
• The origin of Mad Moose Events (17:47)
• How scared were you to leave your secure job? (20:24)
• What goes into putting on a good race? (26:12)
• How has race directing affected your own running? (31:16)
• What does directing a race actually involve? (32:37)
• What’s your favorite race to put on? (34:45)
• What’s your coaching style? (39:26)

• familygoals — their daily family morning runs (42:18)

• What race do you want to do the most? (48:10)

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Ian Sharman likes to keep running fun, and is extremely good at running races in Spiderman, Santa Claus, and Elvis costumes.

But Ian is also a fierce and amazingly consistent competitor, and has completed over 200 ultras and marathons. He is the only person to finish in the top 10 at Western States 100 9 times in 9 starts; he is a 4-time Leadville 100 champion (and the only person to break 17 hrs four times at Leadville), and … we could go on about Ian’s records and results.

And Ian is equally passionate about keeping ultrarunning fair, and keeping doping out of the sport. So we talk to Ian about setting Guinness World Records for racing in costumes; some of his impressive wins and records; the most common mistakes he sees people making in training and in racing; his strategy for keeping doping out of ultrarunning; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Trial-and-erroring his way into endurance sports (2:16)
• Becoming the World’s Fastest Elvis (13:11)
• Racing in costumes: Pro Tips (18:36)
• Coping with injuries & life lessons (21:02)
• Record Holder: The Grand Slam of Ultra Running (29:56)
• Ian’s Western States 100 streak (31:19)
• Doping & Ultrarunning (34:46)
• Trail running culture vs. road running culture (48:46)
• Thoughts on the sub-2-hour marathon (50:23)
• Running in the US vs. Running in the UK (52:28)
• Biggest mistakes people make in training & racing? (56:23)
• How to avoid long-term burnout (1:06:48)

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Brendan Leonard and I recently talked to Meghan Hicks, who is one hell of a trail runner in her own right, in addition to being the managing editor of iRunFar, a website that, among other things, produces some of the best race coverage out there — or as Meghan so eloquently puts it, they cover and capture “everything from the puke fests to the transcendental moments” that make up this sport of trail running.

Meghan is also just a real joy to talk to, even if, she made Brendan and me work really hard to get her to talk about her accomplishments. But try we did, and along the way, Meghan painted for us a very interesting picture of her life and background; how iRunFar.com came to be; what motivates her to run; her unusual but wonderful combination of self-deprecation and overflowing optimism; her lowest lows lows and highest highs as a runner; what she thinks is the most misunderstood thing about ultra races; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Growing up in Minnesota, discovering trail running (3:57)
• Bonking during her first 100 mile race (15:15)
• A “transcendental” moment during the Marathon des Sables (18:20)
• Identifying as a journalist vs. identifying as a runner (21:16)
• Running 100 ultras? (26:55)
• How to get better at running without getting faster (28:07)
• What do most people misunderstand about ultrarunning? (30:09)
• Meghan’s early aspirations in writing (33:13)
• Growing iRunFar from a blog to a business (41:12)
• Meghan’s lowest low in a race (52:08)
• Pizza (57:00)

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BLISTER reviewer & contributing editor, Maddie Hart, just wonthe Tahoe Rim Trail 100 Mile Run, making her the youngest person — male or female — to ever win the event.

So we talked to Maddie about the race; her strategy; how she felt throughout it; what gear she used and how it performed; whether running the demanding 60k Infinite Trails race in Europe was good or bad prep for the Tahoe Rim Trail 100 Miler; her pacers; and her achievement.

TOPICS & TIMES

• Recovering Post-Race (2:02)
• Why did you decide to run this race? (4:45)
• Race Day Recap: obstacles, emotions, and the finish (6:23)
• The eating trick that helped Maddie during the race (11:23)
• People’s reaction to her age (13:52)
• Was her 60k Infinite Trails race good or bad preparation? (16:43)
• Gear: what worked, and what didn’t (19:18)
• Biggest lesson learned from the race (23:24)
• What her pacers did right (25:47)

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There’s a common narrative in the running world about people who are struggling in life, then they are saved by running. But what happens when you’ve been an endurance athlete for over twenty years, and you then find yourself in search of some answers? We talk to Duncan Callahan — 2-time winner of the Leadville 100 and a number of other ultras — about his story, things he’d do different, and what he’s still hoping to learn.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Duncan’s background in endurance sports (3:23)
• Ultrarunning at an early age (6:55)
• Duncan's first Leadville 100 (13:45)
• Winning the 2008 Leadville 100 — i.e., the ‘Gunnison’ 100 (18:15)
• Burning out (21:49)
• What would he have done differently? (25:20)
• On identifying as a “runner” (30:34)

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Clare Gallagher just won the Western States 100-Mile Endurance Race, and she did so in spectacular fashion. And normally, that is all the introduction we’d need here, since winning Western States is a very big deal. But there happens to be a whole lot more to this particular story.

Because rightbefore this race, Clare accepted an invitation from Tommy Caldwell to go on an expedition to the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge to raise awareness of and opposition to plans to give oil and gas companies the right to drill in the coastal plain of the Arctic Refuge.

But backpacking and mountaineering around the wild landscape of Alaska is not how professional runners typically spend time right before their biggest race of the year.

So in addition to diving into the details of her epic Western States win, we discuss with Clare why she was willing to go to Alaska; why she runs; and how wins at Western States — or her 2016 win of the Leadville 100, or her FKT of the Zion Traverse last year — all work to create a larger platform to talk about the things that matter most to her.

TAKE ACTION

Text 40649 now or CLICK HERE to submit a comment to your representative asking them to protect the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge by voting to pass The Arctic Cultural and Coastal Plain Protection Act.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Recovering from a huge effort at Western States (3:00)
• Race Recap: day of the race & the first 80 miles (8:06)
• On the intense last 6 miles of the race (10:05)
• Mile 93 — 2017 vs. 2019 (13:16)
• Clare’s expedition to Alaska prior to the race (18:48)
• Winning, Losing, & Competitiveness (29:14)
• Clare’s background (34:40)
• Her future (49:46)

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Scott Jurek, one of the greatest trail runners of all time, called his attempt to break Jennifer Pharr Davis’ FKT (Fastest Known Time) for hiking the Appalachian Trail the hardest thing he’d ever done. And yet, hiking and thru-hiking often isn’t given the credit it deserves either as a monumental test of endurance, or as a more accessible / less intimidating activity to get more people outdoors.

So we talk to former National Geographic Adventurer of the Year, Jennifer Pharr Davis, about the differences and divides between hiking culture & trail running culture; why — and how — she works to break down barriers and get more people outside; the increasing importance of connecting with nature; lessons from her book, The Pursuit of Endurance, and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Jennifer’s unconventional book tour (5:05)
• “Hiking” vs “Trail Running” culture (7:50)
• Inclusivity & diversity in the outdoors / outdoor industry (16:09)
• How hiking can help individuals & communities (22:50)
• Jen’s favorite story from The Pursuit of Endurance (27:30)
• Harnessing the power of failure (33:53)
• What does it mean to “befriend adversity”? (37:35)
• Inner drive vs contentment (39:44)
• The increasing importance of connecting with nature (44:14)

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While participation in trail running and ultra trail races is increasing, it has tended to draw an older crowd. But things are changing. Younger runners are getting into the sport, and they aren’t following all the old conventions.

So we discuss the current and future state of trail running and ultra trail running with two young and rising trail runners — Maddie Hart and Gordon Gianniny. We also talk about how they got into trail running and longer-distance racing as teenagers; their take on the idea that a lot of people get into ultras later in life as a way to cope with inner demons or certain life crises; how they see trail running changing; and more.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Getting into running & ultras as teenagers (2:55)
• How do you see trail running changing? (19:47)
• Inner demons & ultras (24:00)
• How do you see the future of competitive trail running? (30:50)
• On Maddie & Gordon’s upcoming relay-style trail ultramarathon (36:03)
• Ultras as Eating Contests (41:55)
• Which races are on your bucket list? (49:32)
• Thoughts on ‘ultra’ ultras? (52:47)

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This past weekend, our Off The Couch co-host, Brendan Leonard, ran the Bighorn Trail 100 Mile Endurance Run. So Jonathan Ellsworth talks with him about why he decided to run it; how he prepared; the highs and lows of the experience; dealing with the race’s signature mud; his advice for anyone thinking of running a 100; and then, the big question: whether or not he plans on running another 100 miler.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Recovering from the race (2:23)
• The story behind the Bighorn Trail Run (5:15)
• When & Why did you decide to do it? (10:41)
• Preparing for the Bighorn 100 (11:25)
• How mud changed the race (12:27)
• Resisting comfort at aid stations (16:00)
• Pushing through the 2nd half of the race (18:22)
• The patience of race pacers (23:12)
• The Finish (30:13)
• Wildlife encounters? (32:29)
• Hellbender 100 vs. Bighorn 100 (35:36)
• The Question: Will you do another 100? (36:57)

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Stevie Kremer is a world-class runner, but her life sure doesn’t include many of the stereotypes that description might conjure up. So we discuss her unusual training routine; sitcoms & life lessons; how she got into trail running and ski mountaineering; and juggling being a runner, mother, and educator.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Sitcoms and life lessons (2:12)
• Stevie’s background & early races (4:00)
• Hangovers & long-distance mountain races (8:00)
• Running at over 21,000 ft. elevation (18:30)
• Stevie’s (remarkably) precise daily routine (24:59)
• Ski mountaineering & running (34:23)
• Racing goals in exotic locations (38:50)
• The Salomon Eleven Running Experience (42:50)
• Running & real life (47:22)
• What do you listen to when trail running? (52:27)

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Brendan Leonard and I talk to Sarah Lavender Smith, who ran her first marathon back in 1995, and has gone on to complete eighty marathons and ultramarathons since.

Sarah is the author of the excellent book, The Trail Runner's Companion: A Step-by-Step Guide to Trail Running and Racing, from 5Ks to Ultras; she is a columnist for the magazines UltraRunning and Trail Runner, she also keeps an active blog at TheRunnersTrip.com; and she is the co-host of the UltraRunnerPodcast.

We talk to Sarah about what inspired her to start running; the problem of “mommy guilt”; the importance of being process oriented; running marathons with horses; her relationship with competitiveness; and how she gradually went from smoking and partying to running ultras.

Sarah has strung together a very interesting life and career, and she has a ton of insight to offer both newbies and seasoned veterans. So we hope you enjoy this conversation as much as we did.

Connect with Sarah:

Twitter

Instagram

Facebook personal page

Facebook blog page

Blog: TheRunnersTrip.com

Coaching Website: sarahlavendersmith.com

TOPICS & TIMES:

• Sarah’s background & getting into running (3:13)
• How the ultramarathon scene has changed (23:47)
• On “mommy guilt” (27:35)
• Injuries and recovering from them (34:53)
• The primary reasons why people reach out for coaching (37:17)
• Staying motivated (39:22)
• What’s the most common advice she gives to runners? (46:22)
• Biggest mistakes made by newbie and by experienced runners (48:30)
• Hardrock = Burning Man? (54:00)
• Sarah’s most joyful moment running (56:52)

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In this episode, Brendan Leonard and I had a remarkable conversation with a remarkable person, and we urge every runner — and non-runner — to listen to it.

Filmmaker and runner, Sanjay Rawal (3100: Run and Become; Food Chains; Challenging Impossibility), joined us to talk about how running can be far more than just a fitness routine or a competitive outlet, it can be transformative, and make us better people.

An accomplished runner himself, Sanjay shares how burning out on competitive running, a fraught political climate, and a desire for self-discovery led him to veer off the 'straight-A's / med school' path that he was on at Berkeley, and instead go explore running as a form of meditation under the guidance of the spiritual leader Sri Chinmoy.

We then talk about Sanjay’s most recent film called, 3100: Run and Become, which centers on the longest certified race in the world, the Self-Transcendence 3100 — that’s right, this is a three thousand and one hundred mile long race that takes place in, of all places, Queens, New York, on a sidewalk. That surrounds a high school. So this three thousand 100 mile race takes place on a closed-loop course that’s about ½ a mile long.

Sanjay’s film goes into why in the world someone would create an event like this, and then why in the world anyone would actually run in an event like this? Who are these people, and what are they doing? The film then covers the Self-Transcendence 3100 race as an inroads to examine the connection between running and spiritualism in a number of diverse traditions and communities around the world, including the Navajo Nation of Arizona, the San Bushmen of Botswana, Africa, and a Buddhist monastic community in Japan where the practitioners aren’t exactly runners per se, but their long-distance rituals almost defy comprehension.

TOPICS & TIMES:

• The Pizza Marathon (3:29)
• Sanjay’s background and early relationship with running (8:14)
• What led Sanjay to go study with Sri Chinmoy (19:23)
• Sanjay’s evolution from “better” runner to “happier” runner (25:55)
• Sanjay’s film, '3100: Run and Become' (35:47)
• Can running really make someone a better person? (48:54)
• How do you get motivated to run when you don’t want to? (52:22)
• What’s the best question we haven’t asked you? (57:22)
• Sanjay’s next film project (1:00:49)

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In our inaugural episode of Off the Couch, Jonathan Ellsworth (founder of BLISTER), and co-host, Brendan Leonard (creator of Semi-Rad.com and producer of How to Run 100 Miles), talk about their running backgrounds; their love / hate relationships with running; and consider Strava as a modern-day spiritual exercise??

TOPICS & TIMES:

• When do you actually get to call yourself a “runner”? (1:30)
• Our running backgrounds — the early years (3:15)
• Brendan’s return to running (7:25)
• Jonathan’s return to running (after breaking his neck) (13:06)
• Exploration, drugs, and stories (21:25)
• Strava as a spiritual exercise?? (34:30)

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Off The Couch is a new podcast from BLISTER that will be taking a closer look at the wide, weird, and wonderful world of running.

This is a show for people who love to run, but it is also a show for those who maybe only kinda like running — and for those who sometimes really hate running. As for us, we find ourselves falling into all 3 of these categories depending on the day, and we have a hunch that quite a few of you might be able to relate to that, too.

So whether you are just starting to think about getting into running; or you only run once or twice a week or month; or whether you are out there crushing ultras every single weekend, our goal here is to encourage you to get off the couch and get moving by talking each week to some of the biggest characters, most accomplished runners, some extremely “average” runners, and to fill you in on some of the notable events, new gear, and interesting research that all contribute to making running an activity that can make our lives better.

Off The Couch will be hosted by BLISTER founder, Jonathan Ellsworth, and Brendan Leonard, the creator of Semi-Rad.com, and the award-winning director and producer of several films, including How to Run 100 Miles. Brendan has a very refreshing, funny, informative and inspiring approach to running, and our goal is to infuse Off the Couch with a similar mix of information, inspiration, and fun.

Our first episode of Off The Couch is set to come out the first week of March, so subscribe to the podcast now so that you’ll get that inaugural episode fresh from our little podcast oven. This is going to be fun — probably a lot more fun than it sometimes is to actually go running — so we’re excited to get started on this new adventure with you. So go hit that subscribe button, and we will talk to you very soon.

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