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In this episode of Dreams With Deadlines, host Jenny Herald interviews strategy execution expert Brett Knowles to explore the intersection of technology, strategy, and execution. Throughout the conversation, Brett shares insights and practical advice on leveraging AI and large language models like ChatGPT to enhance strategy execution.

Key Things Discussed:

• The limitations of traditional approaches and the need for agility in strategy execution.
• The role of AI in creating an execution ripple and assessing departmental capabilities.
• Building a lightweight nexus and keeping OKR systems simple for effectiveness.
• The evolving role of senior leadership and the importance of asking the right questions.

Show Notes

• [00:00:18] Understanding the Distinction: AI and GPT Explained. Jenny and Brett explore the difference between AI and GPT, highlighting GPT's capacity to learn and respond to conditions.
• [00:02:21] Harnessing GPT's Potential in Strategy Development and Execution: Jenny and Brett discuss the benefits of incorporating GPT into strategy development, testing its recommendations, and achieving a balance between familiar and innovative ideas.
• [00:06:37] Unlocking the Versatility of GPT in Business Applications: Jenny and Brett explore the various business applications of GPT, including automation, decision-making, recommendation generation, option generation, and strategy evaluation.
• [00:11:54] Accelerating Strategy Development and Execution with AI: Jenny and Brett highlight how GPT can simplify and enhance the strategy development process, providing examples of idea generation, insights gathering, and automated slide deck creation.
• [00:17:11] Navigating Limitations and Challenges of GPT in Strategy Development: Jenny and Brett discuss the misconceptions, data input importance, and recognizing GPT's potential to surpass human decision-making quality.
• [00:23:35] Calibrating Parameters for Enhanced Strategy Execution with GPT: Jenny and Brett explore the significance of parameter calibration in optimizing GPT's performance and overcoming status quo bias.
• [00:30:40] The Execution Ripple and Building the Nexus for Strategy Execution: Brett delves deeper into the concept of the execution ripple, mapping connections, and enhancing GPT's insights and recommendations.
• [00:35:12] The Execution Donut and Building a Consistent Model: Jenny and Brett explore the interconnectedness of elements in the execution donut and the importance of a reliable and repeatable decision-making model.
• [00:38:38] The Evolving Role of Senior Leadership in Strategy Execution: Jenny and Brett discuss the agility needed in strategy execution, asking better questions, and embracing AI-powered strategies for a competitive edge.
• [00:44:43] Quick-Fire Questions for Brett:
  • What’s your Dream With a Deadline: Brett's dream is to share his knowledge with as many people as possible on an ongoing basis. He is passionate about making information available to the community, but there is no specific deadline for this dream.
  • Using Large Language Models (ChatGPT) for OKRs: Brett emphasizes the importance of ownership when considering the use of these technologies for OKRs. If using the tools adds complexity or creates barriers to acceptance, it may not be recommended. However, he believes that organizations will eventually need to move in this direction to succeed with OKRs.
  • Advice for Starting with OKRs: The key advice is to keep it simple. Many OKR systems fail because they become too complex, with too many objectives and key results. It is important to ensure that every individual benefits from using OKRs and that it is not just a reporting system for the leadership team.
  • Excitement about Advancements in Technology for Strategy Execution: Brett is excited about how these advancements allow us to challenge outdated paradigms in strategy development and execution. He believes that traditional approaches, rooted in decades-old knowledge, need to be replaced or reimagined. The new possibilities open up avenues for innovative solutions.
  • Book(s) that Shaped Thinking: Brett recommends anything written by Edward de Bono, who focused on helping the brain become more creative. De Bono's frameworks provide ways to enhance creativity without relying on external substances. Brett also highlights that while there are many business books available nowadays, they often present methodologies as isolated silos. Recognizing the interconnectedness of concepts and joining existing ideas is crucial for creating value.

Relevant links:

• “Can Machines Think?” Alan Turing's decades-old question
• The Turing Test
• Kasparov vs. Deep Blue
• The Rumsfeld Papers: Known and Unknown
• The Rumsfeld Matrix
• Peter Drucker, the Father of Management Thinking
• Dr. Edward de Bono, the originator of the term Lateral Thinking

About the Guest:Brett Knowles is the Founder at Performance Measurement & Management. He is a renowned thought leader with a track record of spearheading strategic execution and driving remarkable performance improvement through rapid OKR implementation. Featured in Harvard Business Review, Forbes, and Fortune for his expertise in the Balanced Scorecard.

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Join host Jenny Herald and special guest Andrea Belk Olson in this newest episode of Dreams With Deadlines as they dive into the world of OKRs and the challenges organizations face in driving change and building buy-in.

From understanding varied nomenclature to crafting achievable aspirations, they explore the importance of aligning organizational goals with the current state and involving people in the change process.

Key Things Discussed:

• The concept of customer-centricity
• The Three Ws ideation process for empathetic thinking
• Integrating change in traditional manufacturing
• The six key components of building change buy-in, and finding the balance between committed and aspirational goals with OKRs.

Show Notes

• [00:00:26] Introduction to OKRs and Varied Nomenclature: Andrea Belk Olson discusses her experience with OKRs and the diverse terminology used to describe them.
• [00:01:17] Starting with a Current State Assessment for Differentiation: Jenny and Andrea discuss the importance of conducting a current state assessment to help companies identify their core strengths, revenue streams, talent, and assets.
• [00:02:27] Crafting Achievable Aspirations and the Role of People in Change: Jenny and Andrea explore the importance of setting realistic and achievable aspirational goals for organizations, using the example of a client wanting to become the "Tesla of the industry."
  • They discuss the need to align aspirations with the organization's current state, identifying unique differentiators, and finding a target market that values those differentiators.
  • Additionally, they emphasize the critical role of people in driving change, highlighting the importance of buy-in, individual growth opportunities, and addressing employees' concerns about skill sets, timeline, and personal advantages.
• [00:13:38] Achieving Customer Centricity and Shifting Organizational Mindset: Andrea shares a client example where they successfully addressed the challenges of aligning aspirations with their current state, focusing on customer-centricity and mindset shifts for growth
• [00:17:32] Three Ws Ideation Process for Customer-Centric Thinking: Andrea introduces the Three Ws Ideation Process from her book "What to Ask" as a framework for organizations to think more empathetically and better understand customer needs. The process involves examining the "why" by considering the customer's context, determining the "what" based on that context, and formulating a hypothesis for the "wow" solution.
• [00:19:40] Applying the Three Ws and Piloting for Customer-Centric Solutions: Jenny and Andrea discuss how to apply the Three Ws process to improve community events and increase participation.
• [00:22:21] Integrating Change and Efficiency in Traditional Manufacturing: Overcoming resistance to change in manufacturing organizations through Kaizen and manageable changes.
• [00:27:53] The Six Key Components of Building Change Buy-In: Legitimacy, ownership, attainability, authenticity, impartiality, and relevance as essential components for buy-in.
• [00:34:12] Balancing Committed and Aspirational Goals with OKRs: Jenny and Andrea discuss the balance between committed goals and aspirational goals when using OKRs.
  • They emphasize the importance of relevance, acknowledging the day-to-day operational needs alongside the aspirational goals.
  • They highlight the need to tie objectives to known challenges and issues, involve employees in shaping the objectives, and ensure that everyone can influence the outcomes.
  • They also discuss the significance of breaking down the goals into manageable steps and painting a picture of the results to generate buy-in and momentum.
  • The approach of microdosing the OKRs is recommended to create quick wins and maintain momentum throughout the journey.
  • The focus is on measuring progress, identifying priorities, and fostering meaningful forward momentum towards the larger aspirational goal.
• [00:41:03] Recognizing and Rewarding Successes in Organizational Culture: Jenny and Andrea discuss the importance of examining organizational culture and reinforcing behaviors that celebrate successes.
• [00:45:54] Quick-Fire Questions for Andrea:
  • What’s your Dream With a Deadline: Andrea's dream with a deadline is to write her fourth book within her lifetime.
  • What is Andrea’s prevailing insight of the moment? Organizations can be hypersensitive to change, perceiving it as a personal attack on their capabilities.
  • What is emerging from this discussion is the idea of what? What is emerging is the idea of a confident organization that acknowledges flaws but believes in their ability to improve.
• Where do you think the future is headed in terms of the OKR space? The future of OKRs lies in overcoming terminology hurdles and creating environments where employees can achieve success and meet customer needs.

Relevant links:

• “What To Ask: How to Learn What Customers Need But Don't Tell You,” by Andrea Belk Olson
• “Getting Employee Buy-In for Organizational Change,” by Andrea Belk Olson

About Our Guest:Andrea Belk Olson is a behavioral scientist and customer-centricity expert. She is the Founder & CEO of Pragmadik, helping companies differentiate and build customer-centric cultures. Andrea is a renowned speaker, published author and a TEDx presenter. She is also a contributing writer for HBR, Entrepreneur, Rotman, Chief Executive, and more.

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Host Jenny Herald dives deep into the journey of Ben Lamorte, the renowned OKRs expert and founder of okrs.com, in this captivating episode of Dreams With Deadlines.

Discover Ben's transformation from a network engineer to an OKR visionary as he shares his profound insights on deploying successful OKRs, overcoming challenges, and his bold coaching framework.

Key Things Discussed:

• Unveiling the 10 universal deployment parameters for successful OKRs implementation.
• Exploring the distinction between milestone and metric key results and when to use each.
• Understanding the roles of OKRs project leads and the importance of executive sponsorship.
• Unpacking the real-world examples where OKRs drive outcomes over outputs.
• Gaining valuable perspectives on the application of OKRs in cross-functional and rapid growth areas.

Show Notes

• [00:00:19] Introduction and Ben Lamorte's Enthusiasm for OKRs
• [00:00:48] OKRs as a Critical Thinking Framework: Ben describes OKRs as a critical thinking framework, emphasizing the importance of ongoing discipline and asking three key questions:
  • Where do we want to focus for near-term progress?
  • How do we know we've achieved the objective?
  • What is the intended outcome of the task? These questions help define objectives and key results, align efforts, and prioritize measurable impact.
• [00:04:38] The Importance of Embedding Alignment in OKRs: Ben discusses the trend of embedding alignment throughout the entire OKRs program, emphasizing its importance as a critical success factor. He highlights the shift away from cascading OKRs directly and notes that more organizations are now implementing OKRs correctly from the start, leading to positive developments in the OKRs landscape.
• [00:08:37] Mantras for Successful OKRs Implementation: Ben shares five key mantras for successful OKRs implementation:
  • "less is more" to focus on a small set of OKRs,
  • "crawl, walk, run" to scale gradually after achieving success,
  • "OKRs are not everything" as they represent the most important areas for progress,
  • "the only way to learn OKRs is to do OKRs" by practical implementation,
  • and "outcomes, not output" to measure intended results.
  • The discussion also hints at the emerging trend of embedding alignment into every aspect of the OKRs program.
• [00:13:05] Embedding Alignment in OKRs for Organizational Cohesion: Ben highlights the importance of alignment in OKRs, emphasizing the need for clear answers to key questions and achieving both top-down and horizontal alignment. He explains that alignment should be established at each stage of the OKRs program to ensure organizational cohesion and addresses the ongoing nature of aligning throughout the OKRs journey.
• [00:17:00] The Importance of Universal Deployment Parameters in OKRs: Ben highlights the importance of universal deployment parameters as foundational prerequisites for successful OKRs implementation. These parameters, including setting the OKR level and defining the OKR cycle duration, play a crucial role in ensuring effective OKRs training and implementation.
• [00:22:55] 10 Universal Deployment Parameters for Effective OKRs Implementation: Ben identifies 10 essential parameters to define before implementing OKRs. These parameters are crucial for successful OKR implementation and training workshops.
  • These parameters include levels, number of OKRs, scoring methods, cycle duration, milestone vs metric key results, OKR publishing and storage, performance review integration, KPI vs key result differentiation, alignment, and bottom-up involvement.
• [00:28:53] Roles in Defining Deployment Parameters: Defining the 10 universal deployment parameters for OKRs involves OKRs project leads from various functional teams and the executive sponsor, allowing for training based on these parameters and the flexibility to make adjustments in subsequent cycles.
• [00:31:32] The Distinction and Appropriate Use of Milestone Key Results: Milestone key results represent significant achievements or outcomes that indicate progress towards a future metric key result, such as obtaining permits to begin construction or listing an app on the Apple Store, and can be valuable in certain situations to track progress and set the stage for future success.
• [00:36:56] Distinguishing Between Output and Outcome Key Results: Jenny and Ben discuss the distinction between output and outcome key results, emphasizing the importance of outcome-oriented milestones that represent true outcomes and setting higher requirements for target and stretch key results. The challenge of committing to government approval is also highlighted.
• [00:39:45] Quick-Fire Questions for Ben:
  • Where does Ben want to see OKRs.com by the end of the year? Ben wants to have a clearer definition of the impact of OKRs through an OKRs maturity model and quantifiable data on the success of OKRs.
  • Where are OKRs most important within organizations? OKRs are particularly valuable in cross-functional initiatives and rapid growth areas like the environmental movement.
  • Where does Ben think OKRs are headed? Ben believes that OKRs will continue to grow, and their application will expand beyond formalized goal-setting, becoming more of a mindset and a way of asking outcome-focused questions across the organization.

Relevant links:

• Measure What Matters," by John Doerr.
• "The OKRs Field Book: A Step-by-Step Guide for Objectives and Key Results Coaches," by Ben Lamorte.

About Our Guest:

Ben Lamorte, founder of OKRs.com, is an internationally recognized OKRs coach. He has consulted with organizations around the world, including eBay, Zalando, and Booking.com. He's authored two books — Objectives and Key Results: Driving Focus, Alignment, and Engagement with OKRs (co-authored with Paul Niven) and The OKRs Field Book.

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In this special episode of "Dreams with Deadlines," host Jenny Herald engages in a thought-provoking conversation with AI expert Gary Bhattacharjee. They explore the rise of generative AI and the evolving relationship between humans and machines.

Key Things Discussed:

• The potential applications of generative AI.
• The challenges of machine ambiguity and ethics.
• The significance of educators in the wisdom economy.
• The importance of trust in building strong alliances between humans and machines.

Show Notes

• [00:00:51] The Significance of Touchless Business in Today's World. Embrace the significance of touchless business in today's world, where Gary explores the accelerated need for digitization and virtual interactions, highlighting the challenges faced by organizations that haven't embraced these changes.
• [00:02:24] The Tremendous Growth Potential of the Data and AI Market. Dive into the tremendous growth potential of the data and AI market, as Gary shares staggering growth projections and emphasizes the interconnectedness between data, AI, and the cloud market.
• [00:03:33] From Automation to Alliance: The Evolution of AI in Decision-Making. Discover the fascinating evolution of AI in decision-making, as Gary delves into the concept of autonomy, the potential for human-machine alliances, and the psychological dynamics involved in trusting machines.
• [00:19:29] The Power of Generative AI and Amplifying Innovation. Generative AI and Amplifying Innovation with Gary Bhattacharjee: Unleash the power of generative AI as Gary explores ChatGPT, the democratization of AI, and the transformative potential of amplifying innovation through collaboration between the creative and technical realms.
• [00:29:12] Tricky Aspects and Pitfalls of Generative AI. In this part of the podcast episode, the conversation shifts towards discussing thNavigate the challenges and pitfalls of generative AI, as Gary discusses machine ambiguity, customization, ethical considerations, and the importance of responsible AI deployment.
• [00:37:09] The Wisdom Economy and the Importance of Educators. Embrace the rise of the wisdom economy and recognize the pivotal role of educators in shaping a responsible AI-driven future, where Gary emphasizes the need to teach machines foundational knowledge and align them with human values.
• [00:41:31] Quick-Fire Questions for Gary:
  • Dream with a Deadline: Gary's dream with a deadline is to have machines and technology that can perform his job tasks. He envisions a world where machine partner with humans in equal footing and not be just an order-taker. He believes that machines should amplify human potential, accelerate the speed of thought and challenge the civilization to be better
  • enabling a Jetsons-like lifestyle where machines take care of daily activities, such as cooking and transportation.
  • Excitement about Bleeding-Edge Technology: Gary is most excited about the scale and acceleration of innovation that generative AI and machine-to-machine conversations bring. He also mentions the hardware advancements in GPUs and quantum computing, which have the potential to revolutionize neural networks and solve complex problems in real-time.
  • Most Exciting AI Application: Gary mentions that he comes across exciting AI applications daily. He highlights the potential of AI twins, where every job could be replaced by an AI counterpart. This thought experiment challenges professionals to envision how their own roles could be performed by AI.
  • Recommended Reads: Gary suggests exploring science fiction novels for imaginative narratives that can inspire real-world applications. Additionally, he recommends books on organizational psychology and ambidexterity to understand the dynamics of human-machine interaction. He mentions "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy," "Innovator's Dilemma," and "Catch-22" as some of his current readings.
  • Shaping Thought: Gary mentions that there is no single book that has shaped his thinking. Instead, he believes that different books have influenced him at different stages of life. He emphasizes the profoundness of philosophical ideas found in various works and their applicability to different contexts.

Relevant links:

• Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
• Innovator's Dilemma by Clayton Christensen
• Catch-22 by Joseph Heller
• Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics + the Zeroth Law by Isaac Asimov

About the Guest:Gary Bhattacharjee is the head of AI at Infosys, with extensive experience in product development, corporate banking, financial consulting, and wealth management. He co-founded a fintech startup and holds a patent on Management of Data via Cooperative Method and System, a wiki-based data management system.

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In this episode of Dreams With Deadlines, host Jenny Herald sits down with Natalija Hellesoe, an Organizational development Coach and OKR expert. Natalija shares her insights and experiences in implementing OKRs, emphasizing the importance of leadership engagement, setting realistic commitments, and making time a priority.

Key Things Discussed:

• The concept of "eat the frog" days and how they can help teams overcome time constraints.
• The need for education, continuous improvement, and conscious implementations when adopting OKRs.
• She offers guidance on developing a well-designed OKR system that aligns with the organization's goals and addresses the complexity of the business ecosystem.
• The importance of avoiding mainstream implementations and fostering a community that promotes diversity of thought and continuous learning.

Show Notes

• [00:00:37] Motivations and Challenges in Implementing OKRs for Business Success: Jenny Herald and Natalija Hellesoe discuss the common motivations and challenges faced by businesses when implementing OKRs.
• [00:01:37] Exploring the Pros and Cons of Implementing OKRs for Organizational Success: Jenny and Natalija discuss both the advantages and disadvantages of using OKRs as a methodology for goal-setting and organizational alignment.
• [00:04:13] Navigating Realism in Company Goal Setting for Effective OKRs: Natalija emphasizes the importance of strategic focus and considering other requirements and stakeholders when setting realistic OKRs.
• [00:06:51] Navigating Difficult Conversations for Successful OKR Implementation: Natalija discusses the need for difficult conversations in setting priorities and making commitments for successful OKR implementation.
• [00:07:47] The Importance of Realistic Assessments for Successful OKR Implementation: Natalija highlights the significance of conducting realistic assessments before implementing OKRs.
• [00:09:44] Balancing Customer Expectations and Delivering Effective Methodologies: Natalija emphasizes understanding customers' actual needs and meeting expectations while providing what they truly need.
• [00:10:41] Navigating the Role of Senior Leadership in Successful OKR Implementation: Natalija discusses the challenges and importance of senior leadership involvement in OKR implementation.
• [00:13:30] The Crucial Role of Senior Leaders in OKR Implementation and Success: Natalija emphasizes the importance of senior leadership's commitment and understanding of OKRs for successful adoption.
• [00:16:14] Making Time Commitment the First OKR: Natalija explores the concept of making time commitment the first OKR and provides examples of addressing time-related issues.
• [00:21:20] Fostering Engagement: Natalija discusses the benefits of "eat the frog" days and the challenge of engagement when introducing new initiatives.
• [00:23:25] Bridging the Gap: Strategies for Engaging Skeptics and Fostering OKR Adoption. Natalija discusses strategies for bridging the gap between OKR believers and skeptics.
• [00:27:29] Striking the Right Balance: Implementation for Successful OKR Adoption. Natalija emphasizes the importance of finding the right balance in OKR adoption and avoiding micromanagement.
• [00:29:46] Guidelines for Developing a Well-Designed OKR System. Natalija highlights the importance of understanding the problem, prioritizing focus, and educating oneself about different variations.
• [00:33:52] The Future of OKRs: Moving Towards Conscious Implementations. Jenny and Natalija discuss the future of OKRs. Natalija urges conscious implementations of OKRs and avoiding the mainstream trap.
• [00:35:25] Enhancing the OKR Method: Embracing Complexity and Engaging in Conversation. Natalija emphasizes embracing complexity and engaging in conversations to improve the OKR method.
• [00:37:47] Quick-Fire Questions for Natalija:
  • What’s your Dream With a Deadline: Natalija's dream is to go on an expedition through Greenland before turning 40.
  • What drew Natalija to the OKR method: Natalija's interest in connections and seeing the bigger picture naturally drew her to frameworks and methods that help people understand how things belong together, and OKRs fulfill these aspects for her.
  • Advice for those starting out with OKRs: Natalija advises not to believe everything written about OKRs, but instead to keep digging and talking to people to enrich their understanding and benefit from diverse opinions and perspectives.
  • Where Natalija hopes to be this time next year: Natalija hopes to be in a remote location, reflecting on the past 12 months of working with great customers and finding more organizations that have embraced change in how they work together, driven by enthusiasm to make a difference.
  • Book that shaped Natalija's thinking: The book "Speaking and Being" by Kübra Gümüşay, which explores how language shapes our thinking and determines our politics, shaped Natalija's thinking and emphasized the importance of language, also relevant in the context of OKRs.

Relevant links:

• “Speaking and Being” by Kübra Gümüsay
• “Measure What Matters: How Google, Bono, and the Gates Foundation Rock the World with OKRs” by John Doerr
• “OKRs AT THE CENTER,” by Natalija Hellesoe and Sonja Mewes

About Our Guest:Natalija Hellesoe is a trainer, coach, and chance taker, supporting companies in increasing focus, autonomy, and value creation. She works with organizations at various stages of their OKR journey. Her diverse experiences and global perspective drive her to redefine possibilities.

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If you want to know what kind of team culture really exists at a company, look very carefully at how product roadmaps are developed and executed. That, says Jenny Herald’s guest on this episode of Dreams With Deadlines, is where you can see the “messy, bloody war” that may or may not be going on behind the scenes.

Agile consultant Maarten Dalmijn, author of a forthcoming book about using sprint goals to deliver better products more efficiently, shares fascinating insights on project management and how to optimize it.

Key things discussed

• Why agile software development isn’t about delivering more stuff more quickly.
• How three common gaps in understanding, effort and results hobble projects.
• What the Cynefin Framework is and how to leverage its domains in managing complexity – along with chaos.
• Why less up-front planning and more adjustment along the way enables nimble project management and a quicker path to desired outcomes.
• Ways to identify and mediate opposing goals that can mire projects in constraint and micromanagement.
• The interplay between product goals, Scrums and OKRs.

Show Notes

• [00:03:27] Diving into the “why” behind Maarten’s decision to write his soon-to-be-published book – or any book – at this point in time.
• [00:04:30] What Scrum can look like (flexible and supportive of change) versus what people think it should be.
• [00:06:48] Why being agile is about more than just shipping more stuff faster. About Maarten’s effort to define what makes a successful Scrum, the outputs that drive desired business and customer outcomes and obstacles commonly encountered.
• [00:08:57] "Succeeding with Sprint Goals: Empowering Teams with Better Ways of Delivering Value," which is forthcoming in May, is comprised of four parts.
• [00:09:32] Maarten shares in the book a personal story about a childhood exercise on a Dutch island that parallels the journey of discovery that is software development.
• [00:13:26] A closer look at the three gaps, a model originated by leadership strategist Stephen Bungay, including:
  • The Knowledge Gap: What we know is less than we’d like to know.
  • The Alignment Gap: What we’re likely to do versus what we actually do.
  • The Effects Gap: The difference between desired results and actual outcomes.
• [00:15:51] How to avoid getting lost in “the fog of beforehand,” which can result in overcompensation and analysis paralysis that constrains or slow decision-making.
• [00:18:28] Humble Planning: It’s not about planning less. It’s about reducing upfront planning in order to leave room for critical adjustments later in the project life cycle.
• [00:20:17] About Dave Snowden’s Cynefin Framework, designed to help manage complexity (and chaos) in times of crisis – a sort of field guide for decision-makers.
• [00:21:19] Delineating the domains encompassed by the Cynefin model and how they apply in a software development context:
  • Confusion
  • Clear
  • Complicated
  • Complex
  • Chaotic
• [00:23:40] Understanding self-imposed friction and how rigid plans can lead to massive breakdowns in desired business outcomes.
• [00:27:16] How opposing goals fracture teams and slow – if not defeat – mutually desirable results while team alignment (internally and with partners) supports success.
• [00:30:21] Navigating “Roadmap Hell” and how a traditional project management mindset yield binary, inflexible processes that create conflict and self-defeat.
• [00:32:45] Want to see how agile a company culture really is? Look at their mindset around road mapping – that’s where business and IT really come together and reveal the turf wars and rigidity!
• [00:34:06] Teasing out Part II – the “beating heart” – of Maarten’s book: Sprint Goals:
  • They depend on a clear understanding of intent, what the team is trying to achieve and why it matters.
  • It’s key to integrate foundational sprint goals into every Scrum.
  • OKRs have a role to play in helping to prevent or break the feature factory loop.
• [00:36:32] Understanding the interplay between product goals, Scrums and OKRs; how they fit together in multi-faceted ways with multiple protocols.
• [00:38:42] About applying North Star Metrics – when and how they work and the constellation of factors that can influence measures and strategic adjustments.
• [00:41:42] What happens when companies don’t use sprint goals?
  • It disempowers teams.
  • It restricts information, understanding and decision-making ability.
  • It reduces flexibility.
  • It leads to technical debt and prioritizing speed over quality.
• [00:44:42] Quick-Fire Questions for Maarten:
  • What is Your Dream with a Deadline? Finishing up his book secure in the knowledge that he has delivered what he intended – and then some!
  • How do you define a good sprint goal? It includes everything in the acronym FOCUS: Fun, Outcome-oriented, Collaborative, Ultimate and Singular.
  • What’s the takeaway he most wants for those who read his book? More joy, a sense of empowerment, flexibility, freedom, less effort that yields more results!

Relevant links:

• "Succeeding with Sprint Goals: Empowering Teams with Better Ways of Delivering Value," by Maarten Dalmijn and Friso Dalmijn.
• More about leadership Strategist Stephen Bungay’s The Three Gaps.
• More about Dave Snowden and the Cynefin Framework.

About Our Guest:

Maarten Dalmijn worked with award-winning start-ups, scale-ups and corporations in various roles before taking the leap as an independent Product Management, Agile and Scrum consultant. By blending the world of Product Management and Agile, Maarten helps teams beat the Feature Factory and uncover better ways of delivering value together.

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Key Things Discussed:

• Where ESG and CSR overlap in their mandates to develop better corporate citizens.
• The UN’s 17 Goals for Sustainable Development and how that’s going.
• The challenges associated with creating reliable, long-term metrics by which to track individual company efforts to reach carbon neutrality.
• The difference between – and examples of – carbon offsetting and insetting.
• Innovative technologies Guenter is involved with and what’s on his horizon.
• The episode wraps with some lively Quick Fire Questions that will leave you inspired to join Guenter in driving hard towards creating the environmental solutions we need!

Show Notes

• [02:20] Guenter brings us up to speed on his career trajectory, from academia (where he acquired advanced mathematical and analytical skills) to the Boston Consulting Group, where he was introduced to a steep learning curve across industry sectors.
• [03:25] Defining the E, S and G of ESG, a framework for supporting Environmental, Social and Governance measures for corporate responsibility:
  • Provides a common language to discuss non-financial indicators and parameters.
  • Connects corporate impacts in a global context.
• [06:50] While there is overlap, ESG and CSR (Corporate Social Responsibility) are not completely interchangeable.
  • CSR has traditionally been a somewhat vague, even random, corporate commitment to philanthropy, community engagement, stockholder expectations and compliance/risk mitigation.
  • ESG is the framework or vehicle through which to measure and quantify social impacts beyond financial metrics, the boardroom or day-to-day business.
• [10:28] Guenter places ESG within the context of 17 Sustainable Development Goals defined by the UN, including challenges such as hunger, poverty, health, economic development.
• [13:00] Does ESG impact the bottom line? Guenter argues yes and that evidence suggests that environmental and social elements in particular pay off in terms of both overall corporate and global health.
• [16:26] Challenges and Concerns:
  • What metrics can be put in place based on hard indicators such as CO2 emissions developed based on sector-relevant resources and practices.
  • Large accounting firms and regulatory control will also have a role to play.
• [18:42] Affordability, especially for small- and medium-sized businesses, will be determined in large part by scaling of technology and automation in the coming years.
• [19:44] Impact measures and the fuzziness around defining them because of a lack of longitudinal tracking measures and the murkiness of long-term timelines.
• [22:17] Guenter’s thoughts about developing corporate solutions and plans for capturing impact measures in terms of political and scientific indicators:
  • Using a flexible framework for collecting data.
  • Implementing pro bono efforts to help environmental nonprofits.
• [26:25] Guenter explains the difference between carbon offset and inset: Buy your way out versus build your way out? It’s nuanced!
• [30:07] Guenter gets granular with specific examples of offsetting methods, relative levels of impact available through programs in place today as well as innovative new technologies under development to scale efforts to stabilize and sequester carbon.
• [33:04] Guenter shares projects he’s excited about with Sinkco Labs, which is developing a carbon-neutral alternative protein source, as well as a new app in beta testing that will offer consumers a simple way to get an ongoing read of their carbon footprint based on travel, dining out and other lifestyle patterns.
• [38:54] Quick Fire Questions for Guenter:
  • What Is Your Dream With A Deadline? Helping all sectors – but most especially the corporate world – realize their pledges to be profitable as well as socially and environmentally responsible.
  • What do you appreciate about the teams you work with? The passion for common goals, excellence and pursuing a mission to make a difference.
  • What challenge have you overcome and how did you do it? By pivoting in the right way at the right point in time. It’s about stepping back to reassess, even if it means shifting your direction or strategy.
  • Advice for effective team-wide and company-wide goalsetting? Focus on creating a shared vision that excites and enfranchises all stakeholders, which will lead to high levels of buy-in, satisfaction and success across the enterprise.
  • What’s top of mind for you these days? Moving forward with projects in progress in order to grow, grow, grow, scale, scale, scale and meet our global challenge

Relevant links:

• The UN’s 17 Sustainable Development Goals.
• Sinkco Labs

About Our Guest:

Guenter Rottenfusser is a strategist, global social impact and sustainability expert currently working with Sinkco Labs. He has been named an EWOR fellow and previously consulted for the Boston Consulting Group.

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Key Things Discussed

• Factors that contribute to the 70% failure rate among companies attempting to execute transformation, which can be attributed to:
  • Lack of audacious, bold goal-setting on the part of leaders.
  • Lack of clear-cut KPIs.
  • Lack of alignment among key stakeholders and leadership messaging.
  • Lack of transparency and buy-in across teams and missions.
• OKRs and communications that ensure smooth adoption of initiatives.
• Common challenges associated with M&A scenarios – and critical tactics to ensure a smooth and human-centered integration.
• Why it’s okay to fail – and preferably to fail fast. Then learn from it!
• An insider’s look at the composition of boards, their roles and responsibilities as well as the need for more diversity.

Show Notes

• [00:01:20] About Karen’s migration from focusing on business psychology to a strategic, inter-disciplinary global consulting role with KPMG and IBM.
• [00:03:08] How 12 years ago Karen made the decision to go out on her own, providing three things:
  • Consulting with companies navigating transformation, M&As and other strategic initiatives.
  • Serving on boards.
  • Angel investing.
• [00:05:08] Karen reflects on the whys behind a 70% failure rate among companies attempting to execute transformation:
  • A reluctance on the part of company cultures to act audaciously and boldly.
  • A lack of clear-cut KPIs.
  • Non-alignment among key stakeholders and in leadership messaging.
  • Not having “the recipe” for securing buy-in across the enterprise.
• [00:09:28] About digital transformation and what does it actually entails:
  • The first priority is creating a mindset shift within the business and organization.
  • Clearly define customer needs and the consumer landscape. “It always starts with where you think the market will go.”
  • Deploy the same technology – platforms and apps – both internally and externally.
• [00:14:06] Karen shares factors that set the stage for successful adoption of change:
  • Research and metrics to understand customer behavior.
  • Consider necessarily cultural changes.
  • Roll out pilot programs – but don’t stay in pilot mode too long. Prepare to scale.
  • Align customer-facing technologies with those used inside the enterprise.
  • Be prepared to fail. Do it fast – and learn!
  • Ensure that leadership is coming along on the journey.
• [00:20:44] About all things M&A and special challenges and tactics for managing them.

  • 1: Make sure the value case is clearly understood from the outset.

  • 2: Understand the multiple cultures at play on both sides of the acquisition.

  • 3: Create an integration management function to ensure the initiative has structure, stewardship and clear communications.

  • 4: Don’t neglect ripples within the customer base. Address concerns and offer transparency around changes.

  • 5: Maintain clear objectives and key results to measure financial outcomes, growth and cost synergies.

• [00:25:12] Karen shares her key top-line metrics on the scorecard for M&A success:
  • Growth in shareholder value.
  • The rate of talent retention and attraction.
  • Employee insight surveys. Positive or negative? Inspired or disaffected?
  • Customer retention and satisfaction data.
  • Track the valuation of cost savings synergies as well as growth synergies.
  • Implement Day 1 operational performance and resource management.
• [00:28:45] When, whether and how to deploy OKRs:
  • Be bold with intention from the outset to win hearts and minds.
  • Prioritize team engagement with the mission.
  • Establish key metrics to analyze customer, employee, financial, processes, technology.
  • Think first about what you should measure – then consider whether that objective is achievable.
• [00:33:12] Strategies for managing M&A leadership integration and reorganization:
  • Anxiety is par for the course and expected. Ditto ego!
  • Make fairness and transparency a central feature of any go-forward plan.
  • Make decisions swiftly to maintain stability.
  • Build relationships and understand people’s motivations upfront to smooth transition.
  • Prepare to be a coach and mentor through the emotional upheaval and insecurities.
• [00:37:22] Why measuring for success in transitioning merged workplaces has to do with retention, which is quantitative, but also must be assessed in qualitative experiences. Did people feel respected and supported whatever the outcome?
• [00:40:06] Karen shares perspective on serving with nine private equity-backed boards, both as chair and a non-exec.:
  • The role has evolved in recent years.
  • You are responsible for serving multiple constituencies, including shareholders, employees, governance, compliance and public perception/reputation.
  • Composition of boards depends on multiple factors, such as skills sets required.
  • OKRs have an important role to play in guiding the oversight provided by boards.
• [00:47:22] Quick Fire Questions for Karen:
  • What’s your Dream with a Deadline? Twofold: Her family’s health and happiness and, personally, to get her book written and “out there.”
  • Can you describe a strategy execution challenge you’ve faced and how you responded? Moving an energy company through transformation inside multiple cultures and with limited digital capability or capacity among employees.
  • What advice would you give to boards that aren't looking at OKRs right now? Why should they use them? “It's an old saying, but I always go to what gets measured gets done or what gets measured gets managed.” It’s critically important to establish a goal (doesn’t have to be comprehensive) and put some OKRs under it.
  • What’s top of mind for you these days? Tough times economically on the horizon and what that will mean for priorities such as diversity and green initiatives.

About Our Guest:

Karen is an Interim Executive Committee member, Consultant and NED with 25 years’ experience leading complex enterprise-wide transformations and M&A integrations to $105bn turnover. Her interim and consulting clients over the last eleven years have included Accenture, Microsoft, EY, Invesco, National Grid, RELX Group and PE funds where she has successfully led major programs of change. She has been on private equity backed boards to drive value creation and achieve a major fundraise or exit, working alongside major investors. Karen has proven expertise in strategy and transformation of complex global businesses involving the creation of new and disruptive operating models to reduce cost, grow the top line, extract greater value from data and technology, create new dynamic cultures and deliver customer centric and digitally delivered customer experiences.

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Key Things Discussed

• A variety of initiatives that Mike and his team have introduced and the how they’ve brought stakeholders along for the ride.
• The difference between Outcomes and Outputs, as well as creative strategic visioning versus analytical, project-based planning.
• Key ingredients to highlight in the pursuit of cross-functional buy-in.
• Two major indicators for successful OKR adoption.
• The power of an aspirational mindset shift from “committed” to “stretch” goals.
• Why discovery, time, transparency and collaboration will advance your OKR framework every time – no matter how complex or tradition-bound the enterprise.

Show Notes

• [02:34] Mike walks us through his career trajectory, from digital publishing to e-commerce, mobile computing to a longer-term shift into IT consulting and coaching.
• [03:54] A look at KeyBank’s decision to acquire Hello Wallet, an app to support customer loyalty, financial health and smarter decision-making.
  • The young team brought fresh energy.
  • The integration has served as a model for other fintech acquisitions.
• [05:41] About 200-year-old KeyBank – the 20th largest in the U.S. with assets of about $180 billion – and the role that Mike’s team plays in moving the institution from analog to digital, from on-prem to cloud and all the mindsets that go along with change.
• [06:52] Mike highlights initiatives and strategy development at KeyBank:
  • Infrastructure improvements to create the runway for innovation.
  • Fintech acquisitions.
  • Hack-a-thons to test resiliency.
• [08:29] Outcome versus Outputs:
  • Outcomes are strategy-focused, enabling a different future and new capabilities.
  • Outputs are more analytical and project-based.
• [09:32] About OKRs and cross-functional development, reaching across silos to enable restructuring and transformational initiatives through outcome-oriented teams.
• [13:39] Mike explains why initiatives like his at KeyBank succeed by offering recurring value, embracing system shifts and integrating clearly defined OKRs from the outset – then staying grounded and aligned with the original vision.
• [17:23] How an Agile Transformation initiative launched discussions within KeyBank – including its coaching team and a global consultant, resulting in an OKR framework.
• [18:06] Challenges that arose out of KeyBank’s transition to a new OKR orientation:
  • Not simply substituting OKR measures for a previous KPI approach. They are different animals.
  • Shifting away old systems and the Project Management Orientation that is especially common among legacy companies.
• [19:42] “Stretch” versus “Committed” Goals: Part of Mike’s mandate is to help KeyBank stretch beyond setting easily achievable goals – a comfort zone for established organizations – to become more nimble, swing for the stands and accept that failure is part of the process.
• [21:38] How Mike evangelizes for sufficient time for implementation and a leadership orientation towards aspirational goals. Cross-functional, structural change takes patience and persistence.
• [24:03] Two Major Factors for OKR Adoption Success:
  • Creative, strategy-led focus (rather than an analytical, planning approach).
  • A substantial discovery process built on teams digging deep and creating a collective vision for how to work cross-functionally over the long haul.
• [24:58] What “discovery” looks like at KeyBank, which includes working collaboratively with both the business and technology sides of the house and using an outcomes- and value-based framework.
• [26:41] Velocity and efficiency are great, but effectiveness is the goal. Using continuous discovery – with small, nimble assays – accelerates desired measurable outcomes.
• [28:54] What happens to all those measures? Do teams throw them out? Story points and velocity can be helpful, but outcomes-based, empowered collaboration and creativity are king.
• [31:29] Are OKRs just a burden? Not when teams work together to strengthen and evolve existing processes that aren’t stymied by planning and task-based systems. Solid leadership, transparency, communication and coaching enable success!
• [35:27] Quick Fire Questions for Mike:
  • What’s your Dream With a Deadline?
    • Step by step, over the coming year or two, Mike would like to see KeyBank leadership and teams working collaboratively across the enterprise. Each chapter of that journey may be a chapter for a book!
  • What do you appreciate about your team?
    • They are caring, thoughtful and extremely committed to agile coaching with a range and depth of skills to offer.
  • What execution challenge has KeyBank faced?
    • As a legacy organization, it has been a process for the CEO and leadership team to execute over time on digital transformation and migrate to a more nimble mode of operations.
  • What nuggets of advice do you have for a business just starting out with OKRs?
    • Linking client-centricity with creative strategy is critical – and then hiring good people and putting in place a program that's effective in setting goals and effectively delivering against them.
  • What’s top of mind for you these days at KeyBank?
    • Continuing to do the hard work to make transformational breakthroughs and move together as a team to best serve our customers every day.

Relevant links

• Hello Wallet, the financial fitness app.
• Christina Wodtke’s book about OKRs: "Radical Focus: Achieving Your Most Important Goals with Objectives and Key Results."
• Mike’s recent article about "Why You'll Miss Your OKRs Again This Cycle."
• Teresa Torres and her opportunity solution tree’s role in Continuous Discovery.
• Reflections by Roger Martin on Strategy versus Planning.

About Our Guest

Michael Goitein, enterprise agile and OKRs coach at KeyBank, is a global technology leader, innovator, author and certified Agile transformer who strategically directs and delivers multi-million-dollar, enterprise-level digital, mobile, big data, and high-tech solutions for Fortune 200 clients. He leads local and globally-distributed teams coaching, innovating, executing, and delivering end-to-end mobile and digital projects.

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Key Things Discussed

• The core mission at STRTGY, an Italian company that works internationally to mobilize teams around nimble, adaptable management structures and systems suited to today’s fluid marketplace.
• What’s required to effectively implement OKRs – including leadership buy-in and carefully defined and clearly communicated objectives.
• The things that founders have and their employees want – authority, agency and autonomy.
• The power of real numbers and ongoing iterations to measure and optimize OKR roll outs.
• And finally… We get the scoop on Antonio’s unique 12-week program for successful OKR adoption – from developing strategy to energizing teams to establishing a culture that embraces robust feedback to optimize procedures over time.

Show Notes

• [00:02:32] Antonio explains STRTGY’s core mission, which includes mobilizing teams and making older management structures more nimble and adaptable.
• [00:03:37] STRGY’s ultimate goals revolve around three pillars – People, Processes, Products and Profits – designed to give companies a radically different model that is continuous, effective, structured, collaborative – and fun!
• [00:04:00] About how Antonio became the OKR expert he is today, including his boutique Italian innovation work untangling corporate structures whose systems were demotivating, ineffective, rigid with strategy profoundly disconnected from execution.
• [00:05:59] Antonio developed his unique approach to OKR adoption by combining his expertise as a workshop moderator with constantly evolving tools to improve the process.
• [00:06:36] Defining OKRs: Critical decisions about how to optimize resources (including teams) to win strategic challenges by iterating on an ongoing basis.
• [00:08:10] Why it’s about more than just the numbers: Far more than end goals, which are fleeting, it’s progress that keeps teams energized, bonded and committed.
• [00:10:12] About managing by numbers rather than expectations: Antonio too often sees managers issue ill-defined expectations, which leads to micromanagement and other counterproductive leadership behaviors. The alternative? Managing well-defined, transparent goals with real-time numbers and autonomous, proactive teams.
• [00:12:08] Antonio focuses his clients on outcomes, not the path to getting there.
• [00:12:48] About “Make Progress with OKRs,” Antonio’s new book influenced by recent research and analysis around productivity across industry sectors as well as problem-solving, autonomy and communication styles.
• [00:14:30] The basic principles that support productivity, team work and non-judgmental, self-reinforcing reporting systems throughout a product’s life cycle.
• [00:16:03] About what it is that founders have that everyone wants: Decision-making authority, autonomy and discernable rewards along the way. Do models that incorporate these elements remove roadblocks and inspire self-determination and accountability?
• [00:18:41] Antonio highlights processes and systems that support effective OKRs and shares his take on continuously updated SOPs, flexible structures, emotional alignment around goals and mechanisms for measuring for quality.
• [00:22:02] Jenny and Antonio reflect on misconceptions about autonomy versus procedure. Mindshare and structures = freedom up and down the enterprise.
• [00:24:02] About Antonio’s new book and its program for launching a successful OKR cycle in 90 days:
  • Part I provides an overview of what OKRs are and why they’re important.
  • Part II is a 12-week program broken into three phases:
    • 1. Working step-by-step to identify and align management around key objectives, culminating in a big, all-in meeting to share the methodology.
    • 1. After securing buy-in, deploy bottom-up and sideways support from teams around key objectives and measures.
    • 1. Deployment! The goals require discipline, good habits and prioritization of three important dynamics:
      2. A sense of progress, forward movement.
      3. Regular check-ins to slow activity, help identify roadblocks and avert constant hyper-reactivity.
      4. A culture in which feedback is ongoing and non-threatening to keep everyone positive and learning together.
• [00:30:23] Antonio recalls two of the transformational projects of which he is most proud, including the tools he and his team were able to deploy across cultures and sectors.
• [00:32:02] The Big Idea: What one thing would Antonio most like to advise as a thought leader in the OKR space? Invest the time and resources to ensure your strategy is crystal clear. Poorly written objectives disenfranchise contributors and generally result in poor execution.
• [00:36:50] Quick Fire Questions for Antonio:
  • What is Antonio’s Dream with a Deadline? To develop and evangelize the most pragmatic OKR program of any company in Europe.
  • What does he most appreciate about his team? Their velocity with constant product development and the continuous improvement process they embrace.
  • What’s an example of a STRTGY execution that proved challenging? Starting from scratch with SEO optimization to differentiate from competitors; building a growth loop, community and human face in the midst of pandemic.
  • Any advice for those who have tried (and perhaps fallen short on) OKRs? Keep going! Nobody gets it right the first time. Ensure that there’s commitment at the top levels and clarity among those executing at the lower levels. Communicate!
  • When will Antonio’s book be available? He’s in the midst of a crowdfunding campaign and his first edition (in Italian) will be available on Amazon and elsewhere this fall.

Relevant links:

• "Measure What Matters," by John Doerr.
• "The Progress Principle: Using Small Wins to Ignite Joy, Engagement, and Creativity at Work," by Teresa Amabile and Steven Kramer.
• Andy Grove’s book introducing the idea of growth at the periphery: "Only the Paranoid Survive: Lessons from the CEO of Intel Corporation."
• “Make Progress con gli OKR” (Make Progress with OKRs) is now available.

About Our Guest:

Antonio support big clients, PMIs and start-ups as a Design Leader driving innovation through “Design Thinking” and “Human Centered Design” processes to solve complex problems with a data-driven and creative problem-solving approach. He works in many fields including branding, service design, UX, digital products, portals and e-commerce platforms.

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Key things discussed:

• The need for deeper, more authentic connection within distributed workplaces.
• Workvivo’s highly interactive approach to intranet communications based in collaboration, posting and sharing – not top-down C-Suite communiques.
• The strategy behind story-driven marketing – a transparent, human-centered approach that inspires customer loyalty and engagement.
• Case studies and some of the specific tools Gidi and his team use to generate compelling content that in turn drives revenue – a correlation too often overlooked by bottom line-driven leadership teams.
• The blended approach Workvivo takes to incorporating OKRs that are both transactional and inspirational – a nimble combo when it comes to maintaining employee commitment and achieving objectives in the midst of rapid growth.
• And finally … Speaking of scaling, Gidi explain how knitting our company cultures together through shared stories not only supports the Holy Grail of employee retention and motivation. It also sends a resonant message out into the marketplace – one that pays real dividends in sales and brand loyalty.

Show Notes

• [00:03:53] Before and After: A look at the transformative effects of pandemic on the workplace and the way in which employees value their time.
• [00:04:35] Gidi views “The Great Resignation” as a binary way of looking at a much bigger issue: Working from home has unleashed a new sensibility. Workers at all levels of the enterprise are no longer willing to place hours on the job above quality of life.
• [00:06:44] Employers have had to look for ways to connect teams and build community internally to keep staff engaged even in heavily distributed environments.
• [00:09:11] There is opportunity to be found in adapting to remote work — especially for smaller, agile organizations that can offer workers (particularly younger workers) a sense of meaningful human connection and belonging.
• [00:10:18] Absent a traditional water cooler environment, the chief task for leadership teams today is to build bridges among remote workers.
• [00:10:41] Because 70 percent of employees are frontlines workers not connected via internet or social media channels, Gidi believes there’s an historic opportunity to fill that gap, digitally enfranchising and motivating them.
• [00:11:28] If Gtmhub is the nervous system, Workvivo is the heart and arteries that bind company cultures in hybrid conditions that require new ways of collaboration.
• [00:12:18] Gidi explains how Workvivo acts as an internal communications platform – but without the cumbersome, clunky interface associated with traditional intranets.
• [00:13:18] Workvivo is a community-led platform that transcends one-way corporate communications to empower employee interaction similar to that on social media. Likes, comments, analytics, peer-to-peer posting of content, podcasts, livestreams. It’s an entirely different user experience.
• [00:14:18] Corporate values, positive reinforcement and community building are central to Workvivo’s rich ecosystem.
• [00:18:28] All about Gideon – and the passion for storytelling that has been a driver throughout a purpose-driven marketing career that has emphasized connection.
• [00:20:03] Gideon shares some of the tools and rules he has developed around story-led marketing, including:
  • Evoking feeling is critical to winning over consumers.
  • B2B also revolves around story – not just the features a product offers but how it will improve the company’s culture or earnings potential.
  • It’s critical to invest the time to talk to/understand the customers you’re targeting now – and in the future.
  • PR, advertising and marketing are fueled by different business requirements.
• [00:22:28] An example of a story-led Workvivo initiative that garnered 200+ media mentions globally. It was an investment in research that paid off in a big way.
• [00:24:32] Gidi shares thoughts on the evolving mandate for executives: Retention. The key management strategy for keeping employees engaged and productive post-pandemic emphasizes mentorship and emotional connection – not keeping tabs.
• [00:26:00] Younger generations are demanding more nurturing, more independence and the help of enlightened management in building/navigating meaningful careers.
• [00:29:34] Gidi reflects on the place of OKRs and measurable results. Do they align with the emotion-based mandates of story-led marketing and employee experience? Initially Workvivo’s singular focus on core values didn’t require OKRs, but scaling demands clear objective measures to keep the growing enterprise on track.
• [00:31:27] The aspects of OKRs that Gidi particularly appreciates:
  • It’s not a binary system that forces over-planning or paralysis.
  • The guardrails foster experimentation without fear of catastrophic failure.
  • There’s room to balance “fluffy” initiatives with quantifiable measures.
  • OKRs act as beacon – enabling teams to map to an objective vision.
• [00:33:34] About the adjustments Workvivo has made to their OKRs to accommodate fast growth and evolving objectives:
  • Designating an owner to provide operational support to leadership teams in the execution of OKRs, thus preventing bottlenecks.
  • Creating an interplay between OKRs that allows for both Transactional and Inspirational measures; a deliberate balance of realism and vision.
  • Mapping short-term goals (i.e. quarterly) to big-picture, longer-term objectives based on interim key results.
• [00:37:28] Jenny shares thoughts and an example of how rigid, fixed OKR measures (in some cases not fully relevant) can produce unintended patterns and misleading data.
• [00:38:57] Gidi spells out four levels of alignment necessary to achieve objectives:
  • Process and safety.
  • Functional systems.
  • Relational values and approaches.
  • Inspirational vision and clearly articulated mission.
• [00:40:23] Why objectives are so important – and so hard to nail. In the vast majority of cases, clearly defined desired outcomes drive successful OKR execution.
• [00:40:59] Jenny shares info from a Stanford Project study that diagrams four elements of means and control coordination that set organizations up for success:
  • Direct Monitoring (such as call centers, customer experience follow-up).
  • Peer and Cultural Control: Building an environment in which teams feel committed to showing up for and problem-solving with each other.
  • Clearly established professional standards and protocols.
  • Formal processes and procedures.
• [00:42:12] The startups that tended to fare best, according to Stanford, placed a heavy emphasis on Peer and Cultural Control – cultivating environments in which performance metrics reflect employee engagement and commitment.
• [00:42:55] Quick-Fire Questions for Gidi:
  • What’s your dream with a deadline? To travel around the world for a year with his wife and two kids sometime within the next six years.
  • What do you appreciate about Workvivo and the team you lead? They are the best in the business – fierce, focused and mighty. There is a culture of “extreme ownership” that looks like a startup within a start-up.
  • What’s the biggest strategic challenge for CMOs, especially in a B2B environment? Securing respect and buy-in from executive teams who tend not to understand the sales that smart, story-driven marketing can drive.
• [00:46:28] Gidi highly recommends that marketing professionals seek out companies (like Workvivo) that “get,” acknowledge and are willing to let marketing inform internal strategy beyond the transactional.

Relevant links:

• About Daniel Kahneman, a Nobel Prize-winning economist who has extensively researched human judgment and decision-making.
• The Stanford Project’s "Organizational Blueprints for Success in High Tech Start-Ups."

About Our Guest:

Gideon Pridor drives marketing strategy and execution for technology startups with a demonstrated record of achievement in international business development and demand generation for both B2B and B2C segments. He’s a forward-thinking business development executive for developing and leading go-to-market strategy and measurable marketing acquisition and retention strategies. With proven success leading high tech marketing operations from inception to large-scale execution by combining conventional marketing strategies with innovative, Gideon cultivates measurable online marketing techniques.

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Key Things Discussed

• The growing demands among consumers for corporate accountability and sustainable practices – particularly among top offenders in the travel and supply chain transportation industries.
• Why old-school, top-down industry averages provide a far less precise measure of climate impacts than the accurate, granular, bottom-up data collection and tracking technologies available today.
• How meaningful carbon reduction will require a portfolio approach based on a mix of methodologies developed for large companies that can ultimately be rolled out as scalable, affordable solutions for smaller ones.
• Advice for companies interested in establishing proactive programs to reduce their footprint through data collection, offsetting and insetting strategies.
• What’s behind corporate “greenwashing,” which is often the unintended consequence of sustainability programs that lack accreditation, expertise and committed resources.
• How the team at Pledge is partnering with enterprises to move their commitment to carbon neutrality from the “nice to have” column towards “mission accomplished” – ASAP!

Show Notes

• [00:03:12] David highlights the service Pledge provides by helping businesses integrate a climate dimension into their customer offerings – including support for supply chain logistics to reduce carbon footprint.
• [00:04:13] Defining Terms: The international mandate to reduce carbon dioxide emissions 45% by 2030 and achieve net zero levels by 2050 requires reliable measures and strategies going forward.
• [00:05:03] About two ways of looking at carbon emissions:
  • Top Down: Industry average spend and per unit impacts versus financial value of a good or service consumed.
  • Bottom Up: Activity-based data that break down indirect emissions at a more granular level.
• [00:06:59] Why pursuing a sustainability strategy makes good business sense: Both because consumers are demanding responsible commerce and regulatory bodies in Europe and beyond are demanding accountability and compliance.
• [00:09:03] David explains the reasons that sustainability is often pushed down the corporate agenda (cost, resources) and how outsourced software solutions will likely advance adoption in the coming months and years.
• [00:11:14] Transport is among the largest carbon offenders. The more emissions are measurable the more transparent choices become for consumers. Alternative energies offering significant reductions are also coming on strong.
• [00:13:38] Advice for companies interested in establishing proactive programs to reduce their footprint:
  • Prioritize data collection, tracking and quantification.
  • Identify and address with an offset strategy those functions that are essential.
• [00:15:32] There are ongoing challenges associated with closing data gaps, especially with Scope 3 emissions, but large enterprises (especially in the transportation space) are leaning on suppliers to reduce their footprints and overall environmental impacts.
• [00:17:12] Explaining the finer points of carbon offsetting versus insetting.
• [00:18:49] Meaningful carbon reduction will require a portfolio of solutions to holistically neutralize impacts. It’s not a zero sum game but a mix of technologies that, through the support of larger enterprises, can be scaled to help subsidize smaller ones.
• [00:21:21] How so-called “greenwashing” happens in both intentional and unintentional ways due to lack of knowledge, resources and vetting practices.
• [00:22:37] How business leaders can establish a trust-worthy climate strategy through:
  • Education and onboarding of the necessary sustainability resources.
  • Strong and transparent data-based systems to hold vendors accountable.
  • Partnerships with accredited bodies whose calculation methodologies qualify them to manage carbon accounting and offsetting programs.
• [00:24:32] Quick Fire Questions for David:
  • What’s your Dream with a Deadline? Helping to remove gigatons of carbon from the atmosphere – ASAP!
  • What is an example of a strategy execution challenge that you faced and how did you overcome it? There’s no pre-existing playbook, which means creating a data-driven niche in the climate space while learning on the job.
  • Best advice for business leaders who want to incorporate sustainability in a meaningful way? Whatever the size of your company, choose a concrete milestone in terms of net carbon emissions and then reverse-engineer a program to make it happen!
  • What is top of mind for you these days? Moving sustainability as a business priority out of the “nice to have” and into the “must have NOW” column.

About Our Guest:

An early employee of Revolut, David co-founded Pledge in 2021, to help businesses of every size to understand and manage the climate impact of their products and services. Pledge has built an integrated suite of climate tools for businesses to incorporate trusted carbon measurement, reduction and carbon removal capabilities into their customer offering quickly and easily. By giving customers the tools they need to understand and reduce their climate impact, businesses can meet demand for ESG initiatives, win new business and build a talented, purpose-driven workforce.

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Key Things Discussed

• Mayur’s personal evolution from engineer to marketing and growth strategist.
• What it looks like to marshal a major shift in alignment within a traditional news organization whose first priority is to remain a trusted source.
• How Mayur was tasked with expanding Gannett’s platform and reach through a customer-obsessed focus on experience, engagement and retention.
• The various teams – or “pods” – that worked cross-functionally to execute on a broad range of OKRs while never losing sight of the organization’s foundational “North Stars.”
• The critical role that marketing has to play in aligning teams that are laser-focused on building a brand that is not only beloved but positioned for increased market share and growth.

NOTE: This episode was recorded when Mayur was the Chief Marketing and Strategy Officer at Gannett. He has since moved on to Kraken Digital Asset Exchange as their Chief Marketing Officer.

Show Notes

• [00:03:57] Mayur starts the conversation with a little about his career evolution from engineering to marketing to working with one of the largest legacy media companies in the U.S.
• [00:07:44] Understanding marketing as a potential center of and agent for growth – a shift of paradigm from its relatively static function in the 20th century into what became a “rather soulless” pursuit tailored to digital platforms and adtech data.
• [00:09:39] Covid refocused businesses on the importance of honoring customer engagement and “the why” because, far beyond data, loyalty maps to shared narratives and authentic connection.
• [00:11:40] Mayur reflects on integrating technology into legacy companies and the most common underlying challenge across all verticals: The challenge to adapt to a rapidly evolving marketplace in which the nimble and responsive cultures will dominate.
• [00:14:32] Getting granular about Mayur’s experience at Gannett, a traditional media conglomerate trying to transition on two fronts:
  • Evolving from the legacy print orientation that has been central to newspapers for hundreds of years to a natively digital business.
  • Shifting from an advertising-led business model focused on eyeballs and impressions to a subscriber-led focus on customer experience and the core value of content (which can include gaming and other forms of engagement).
• [00:17:13] Piggybacking on Mayur’s observations, Jenny echoes the belief that creating an ethos of safety amidst chaos and calm amidst a frenetic, even manic, pace will be a huge differentiator for enterprises moving ahead.
• [00:17:43] Focusing in on the content subscription model and what it looks like for legacy media companies like Gannett that are making the transition.
• [00:20:08] Mayur unpacks the various facets of Gannett that underlie its core mission, which is to be a gatekeeper and trusted source of news and information.
• [00:20:25] Beyond journalism and news, Gannett’s mandate is evolving to invest in sports, educational products, contextual tools
• [00:22:24] How a subscription-based model fosters a “customer-obsessed” culture dedicated to creating incremental value that keeps readers/viewers coming back.
• [00:23:33] Personalization has a powerful role to play in helping to tailor data to specific audience members – to “become the Netflix of non-fiction,” as Mayur puts it.
• [00:26:13] Mayur weighs in on the metaverse and the role education has to play in this rapidly developing ecosystem.
• [00:28:13] About the concept of “pods" recently deployed at Gannett, creating cross-functional units that are self-sustaining and autonomous with very clearly defined OKRs and core leaders to keep teams on track.
• [00:28:47] Gannett “pods” are constantly mapping to five “North Star” priorities, including strategies for supporting operations agility and decision-making processes.
• [00:30:55] More about the strategy ops role that Mayur is implementing to orchestrate all the moving parts and shape the chaos. It’s a work in progress with evolving OKRs and assessments along the way.
• [00:33:24] Gannett’s Shift Out of a Legacy Mindset: Mayur explains the current transition from laying a foundation for change in 2021 to adopting a lean mentality in 2022 that emphasizes autonomy over bureaucracy, nimbleness and velocity.
• [00:33:55] The role of communications across the enterprise in accelerating and bringing the marketplace into the organization in a vivid, agile way.
• [00:34:51] Breaking down the CMO role, which Mayur believes should explicitly focus on advocating for customers and tracking market developments to grow business and user value. He regards the role as a flywheel with three key components:
  • Growing the brand.
  • Growing the user base.
  • Growing user value.
• [00:36:47] About user retention and the constant cultivation required to manage fickle audiences and maintain loyalty in a world where customers have infinite choice.
• [00:39:31] To secure enduring relationships, brands must find ways to communicate to customers the emotional, value and data moats that represent incremental investments that make it hard to jump ship. Think Netflix and LinkedIn.
• [00:42:30] Serendipity and irrationality impact a platform’s success, but growing a beloved brand identity is the most critical factor for scaling velocity and longevity. Project managers need to be working synergistically with marketing and vice versa to ensure that the company ethos is evident and connects with users.
• [00:46:03] Mayur takes a deeper dive into the concept of brand outcome and the elements that must be orchestrated in order to create a cross-functional network of commitment to the ultimate: Amazing customer experience.
• [00:48:38] Critical components on which Mayur relies to assess and ladder up KPIs:
  • A clear hierarchy for OKRs understood across the enterprise.
  • An operating scorecard to track and understand variables such as product, data and brand performance.
• [00:50:33] A Quick Fire Question for Mayur Gupta:
  • What’s your dream with a deadline? To remain continually challenged while also enjoying the ride and observing gratitude – a human revolution towards what in the Buddhist practice is known as a state of absolute happiness. When you’ve reached that place? Things like OKRs and KPIs fall into the right proportion.

About Our Guest:

Mayur Gupta is an engineer who evolved into a marketer with several pivots through his career. He spent the first half of his career in tech and product management, building adtech products before gradually shifting towards growth, performance, data science, brand, creative and storytelling - the core tenets of modern marketing. Currently the CMO at Kraken Digital Asset Exchange. Prior to that, he led the transformation of Gannett - USA Today Network from the largest news media company to a growing content subscription platform that is obsessed with user value and subscriber growth. Leads a team of growth strategists, brand and performance marketers, data scientists and product managers to drive growth both for it’s D2C content business and B2B SaaS platform for local businesses. Responsible for actualizing Gannett’s mission to build trusted local communities where people and businesses thrive.

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Key Things Discussed

• Product development strategy and implementation in a fluid, multi-national company with distributed teams and competing priorities.
• A framework for grouping outward- and inward-facing teams into “tribes” dealing with consumer experience, field operations and digital platform development.
• OKRs in the strategy-to-product pipeline context, including managing backlogs, the role of data and building out effective systems for discovery.
• How to prioritize stakeholder meetings to pinpoint progress, ensure transparency and make room for necessary adjustments to the product roadmap.
• The Top Four pitfalls companies fall prey to in the implementation of OKRs.

Show Notes

• [00:02:51] Markus shares an overview of his career, which encompasses entrepreneurial efforts, product management, coaching/consulting with startups in various stages of development.
• [00:03:52] About the juncture at which Markus entered the mobility space in 2018, joining a very small team at Circ, one of more than a dozen nascent kick scooter companies competing at that time for market share in Europe and beyond.
• [00:05:52] When people think of kick scooters, they’re imagining micro-mobility. But Markus’s focus was on creating the optimal customer experience based on a triad of mutually critical elements: hardware, software and operations.
• [00:08:01] Markus explains how Circ grew and scaled product, design and engineering teams over the course of 18 months, growing from zero to 80 team members while building out the well-oiled machine that ultimately was acquired.
• [00:09:17] The company was divided into “tribes,” which included:
  • Consumer Facing: Product marketing, customer experience, service and retention, partner and data integration.
  • Field operations and fleet management functions such as warehousing and repairs.
  • Technology and development of the horizontal platform itself.
• [00:13:17] The wild ride that was Circ’s product strategy – often lacking cohesion and rife with internal jockeying and contradictions.
• [00:14:36] Instituting OKRs early in the process enabled Markus to work closely with his CTO and oversee his tribes effectively, efficiently with clear communication and processes with measurable quarterly results and making staffing, operational and other adjustments accordingly.
• [00:16:51] Markus summarizes the Circ organizational strategy and how OKRs were deployed to quantify progress along the way.
• [00:18:01] From Strategy to Product Pipeline: Do OKRs define the roadmap or vice versa? In the case of Circ, Markus was all about establishing objectives first. Once outcomes are well-defined, the roadmap (and roadmaps within roadmaps) can be broken down, morphing organically and incrementally quarter over quarter.
• [00:20:56] Managing unwieldy backlogs is a high priority for Markus, who very intentionally separates the engineering from the consumer/product pipelines with new projects and implementations placed in a category of their own.
• [00:22:16] How Markus keeps his team’s focused and engaged with new ideas, problems and opportunities in a way that is productive and always advancing:
  • A quick weekly opportunity assessment.
  • PMs take ownership of discrete initiatives.
  • Regular discovery to understand the nature of requests.
• [00:24:05] Three key questions that PMs should ask when assessing opportunities:
  • What is (or do I believe will be) the impact on our objectives?
  • What will the expected effort deliver that impact?
  • What is the expected confidence?
• [00:26:45] Jenny summarizes the goals of Markus’s carefully delineated discovery process, including helping teams to prioritize, focus and gauge workload capacities.
• [00:27:31] Markus believes discovery is most effective when it’s explicit, time-boxed and data-based to drive up confidence levels and depth of understanding/problem-solving.
• [00:30:12] How hard metrics and other qualitative data inform discovery and map back to objectives – a process that is driven by regular, high-level meetings in which key stakeholders exchange perspectives and challenge ideas based on defined progress.
• [00:32:09] How Markus structures meetings and pushes PMs to determine whether objectives are being met:
  • 10 minutes is focused on where the team stands on OKRs.
  • 10 minutes to update any priority changes in the roadmap pipeline.
  • 10 minutes for a quick exchange of specifics around discovery.
  • 30 minutes during which stakeholders can challenge PMs to tease out whether their focus is on the right priorities for achieving big-picture goals.
  • The entire process includes documented comments to ensure transparency around project status, advancement and likelihood of success.
• [00:35:10] Getting Real About Data: The value of attaching specialists to each of the business units at Circ, where the collection of data confers huge benefits – when it’s effectively, cross-functionally integrated. The alternative is data analytics and engineering that lags behind and never reaches fruition.
• [00:38:27] How Markus’ “central-decentral” approach enabled a balance between data engineers and their more team-based data scientists and analysts – all of which facilitated more give-and-take with PMs.
• [00:40:06] Marcus reflects on lessons learned about OKRs from his experiences at Circ, N26 and elsewhere:
  • No. 1: The concept of outcome over output is very hard for teams to grasp/adopt.
  • Incorporate a mix of top-down and bottom-up management to get timing right.
  • Avoid over-engineering. Too often companies try to implement a variety of measures all at once. Pick just one or two to start.
  • Challenge Points if you can prioritize OKRs, which is very difficult to do.
• [00:46:46] Quick Fire Questions for Markus:
  • What’s your Dream with a Deadline? Implementing continuous OKRs for life, including nurturing business opportunities and long-term health.
  • What do you like about the work you do? It’s inspiring people and helping them to find a passion and happiness and spread positivity in the day to day.
  • What’s next for Markus? Starting up and running his own business, building something creative and fulfilling.

About Our Guest:

Markus Müller is a consultant and coach with a deep background in product management for successful startups such as the kick scooter company Circ and the mobile banking provider N26. He is an entrepreneur currently in stealth startup mode as well as a prolific author and thinker on such topics as OKRs, product discovery and leadership.

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Key Things Discussed

• Even though sustainability has been around as a concept since the United Nations defined it in 1987, progress
• has been slow and time is running out.
• ESG (Environmental, Social and Governance) requirements and the role they play in good citizenship and
• environmental stewardship.
• A Call to Arms: Climate change has accelerated steadily and experts now believe that, absent drastic adjustments to business practices and carbon emissions, the window to prevent irreversible impacts shuts in 2030.
• There are scientists out there, especially in the oil and gas sectors, with deep expertise and nature-based solutions to mitigate climate change.
• What it might look like if industry leaders were brave enough to pivot and become “energy companies” instead of “gas and oil companies.”
• The uniquely influential role that large financial institutions are positioned to play in pressuring corporations to hedge against climate change-related exposures that could negatively (even drastically) impact markets.
• About global regulatory standards on the horizon, optimally written in concert with corporations and accessible to consumers and investors.
• Practical steps that organizations can take to establish best practices in response to increasingly robust regulatory reporting and data validation standards.
• Corporate ESG and sustainability today are less of a marketing feel-good feature and more of an essential resilience and risk mitigation strategy.

Show Notes

• [00:02:44] A quick hello to this episode’s guest, OKR expert Felipe Castro.
• [00:03:59] Why OKR? Customers give lots of reasons – ranging from weak (the boss read a book or everyone’s doing it) to borderline vague (accountability or transparency).
• [00:04:36] The Tinkerbell Approach: The common misperception (or delusion!) that a little bit of fairy dust is all it takes to take a traditional enterprise to Google-level OKR success.
• [00:05:34] Adopting OKR is not a goal in and of itself. It’s a transformational tool to help organizations be more competitive, adaptive and normative in the 21st century.
• [00:06:19] Successful OKR implementations require that organizations do three key things:
  • Demonstrate commitment and consistency over time.
  • Learn how to execute the system in practice.
  • Accept that old models and experience will have to be unlearned.
• [00:07:36] Three components necessary to set teams up for success:
  • Access to the data (liberate it from the silos!).
  • Clarity about the core business metrics and strategy.
  • Knowledge of data analytics and statistics.
• [00:09:44] Felipe shares some of the common organizational problems that OKRs quickly uncover and highlight:
  • Lack of clarity about goals.
  • Lack of grounding in the strategy behind projects.
  • Managers who don’t provide clear context.
• [00:11:04] Elements to develop and instill for better (not more) management:
  • Leadership (based on new rather than old business models)
  • Problem-solving skills.
  • An ability to both offer and communicate trust.
  • Permission to get inspired and inspire others.
• [00:14:32] Felipe explains why part of the beauty in OKRs is that they don’t take a one-size-fits all approach. Rather, it’s a flexible philosophy that can be tailored and tweaked based on a huge range of factors across industries and organizational cultures.
• [00:18:44] OKRs may vary, but there remain common foundational building blocks.
• [00:19:44] Felipe shares his take on cascading management:
  • 100% top-down.
  • Lacks agility.
  • Creates silos.
  • Discourages inter-departmental collaboration.
  • Fails to provide clearly defined, measurable goals.
• [00:24:44] It’s a journey! Felipe explains the (necessarily imperfect) process of establishing OKRs and bringing everyone along.
• [00:27:52] Stumbling Blocks: Felipe shares one OKR scenario that commonly occurs at large companies (overattachment to a business case or spreadsheet) and another that often besets smaller companies (data availability bias).
• [00:31:02] Better tools create better outcomes. But not without a holistic approach that includes a commitment to educating and enabling teams.
• [00:33:44] Don’t leave talent on the table! Give teams the tools they need!
• [00:35:06] Elements that set the stage for successful OKR implementation:
  • Ensure that teams understand the metrics and data fundamentals.
  • Establish weekly one-to-ones for continuous feedback.
  • Ongoing coaching and development.
  • Adoption of advanced engineering technologies to improve processes.
  • Regular customer feedback interviews.
  • Established systems to test, experiment and collect data for nimble decision-making.
• [00:39:30] Felipe shares his evolving thoughts on what capabilities are critical to successful OKR implementation at traditional organizations, including the need for a bridge between old and new business models (in spite of inevitable hiccups and cultural challenges).
• [00:43:30] The Finer Points of Performance: Standards for evaluation are as variable as team and individual roles, responsibilities and contributions. Beware tying bonus structures and compensation to measures that are inefficient, inaccurate or illogical.
• [00:49:59] Why individual goals can be a huge liability and disincentive.
• [00:51:22] Defining calibration and how it level sets performance reviews.
• [00:52:44] Quick Fire Questions for Felipe:
  • What do you appreciate most about your team? Passion and commitment.
  • What is your greatest dream and its associated deadline? To facilitate a second edition (with new contributions/examples) of the classic John Doerr book, "Measure What Matters: The revolutionary movement behind the explosive growth of Intel, Google, Amazon and Uber." No deadline since it’s up to the author!
  • Can you describe an experience or situation that made you proud? It’s a feeling that arises whenever organizations adopt, evangelize for and continue to use OKR tools in the long term – which fortunately for Felipe has been a common occurrence!
  • What’s the most important word of advice you can give people who want to try OKRs but feel wary? They are not a “to do” list. It’s about the outcomes you want to achieve and creating data-driven, measurable benefits for your customers, your company and your employees.

Relevant links

• "Powerful: Building a Culture of Freedom and Responsibility," by Patty McCord, former head of people at Netflix.
• Simon Senek's Website
• Felipe's Interview with Itamar Gilad.
• Intuit Founder Scott Cook @Khan Academy.
• "High Output Management," by Andy Grove, former CEO at Intel.
• YouTube: Tom Chi on "Rapid Prototyping and Product Management."
• "Measure What Matters: The revolutionary movement behind the explosive growth of Intel, Google, Amazon and Uber," by John Doerr.

About Our Guest:

Felipe Castro is an OKR Trainer. He helps organizations transform how they use goals by adopting OKR, the Silicon Valley framework for goal setting. He created the OKR Cycle, a simple method to avoid OKR’s most common pitfalls.

Follow Our Guest: Website | LinkedIn
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Key Things Discussed

• Even though sustainability has been around as a concept since the United Nations defined it in 1987, progress
• has been slow and time is running out.
• ESG (Environmental, Social and Governance) requirements and the role they play in good citizenship and
• environmental stewardship.
• A Call to Arms: Climate change has accelerated steadily and experts now believe that, absent drastic adjustments to business practices and carbon emissions, the window to prevent irreversible impacts shuts in 2030.
• There are scientists out there, especially in the oil and gas sectors, with deep expertise and nature-based solutions to mitigate climate change.
• What it might look like if industry leaders were brave enough to pivot and become “energy companies” instead of “gas and oil companies.”
• The uniquely influential role that large financial institutions are positioned to play in pressuring corporations to hedge against climate change-related exposures that could negatively (even drastically) impact markets.
• About global regulatory standards on the horizon, optimally written in concert with corporations and accessible to consumers and investors.
• Practical steps that organizations can take to establish best practices in response to increasingly robust regulatory reporting and data validation standards.
• Corporate ESG and sustainability today are less of a marketing feel-good feature and more of an essential resilience and risk mitigation strategy.

Show Notes

• [00:04:59] A college Geology class blew Catherine’s mind, inspired reverence for the earth and set the stage for her journey towards becoming a geoscientist and ultimately a force for change within the world of environmental sustainability.
• [00:07:34] Why an advisory role within the financial services sector made sense for Catherine, who was in a position to navigate compliance and entrenched mindsets.
• [00:08:49] About the concept of Sustainability, which was first defined by the United Nations in 1987: “Development that meets the needs of a generation without compromising the ability of future generations to meet their own needs.”
• [00:09:39] What ESG (Environmental, Social and Governance) is about and how it encompasses sustainability and extends what it means to be a good corporate citizen.
• [00:12:34] There remains discord and a lack of common understanding internationally with regard to the foundational elements of ESG.
• [00:12:55] Corporations today are being held accountable to higher standards for:
  • Environmental stewardship.
  • Human and social equity.
• [00:14:04] The decade ahead promises concrete ESG action rather than aspiration because climate change is real and more pressing than ever.
• [00:16:07] Oil and Gas Industry Scoop: Looking for ROI and modifications in short-, medium- and long-term timeframes.
• [00:18:27] About untapped resources within the gas and oil industry – experts who could help counter environmental impacts such as CO2. But decision-makers must first pivot.
• [00:19:37] It takes bravery for large oil and gas companies to develop environmental solutions. For many smaller businesses in the sector, it’s financially unfeasible.
• [00:21:04] A look at what’s on the horizon in the realm of regulation and how financial institutions – managing global assets – have a fiduciary responsibility to hedge against climate change. In turn, companies must find ways to comply and reduce exposures.
• [00:22:54] The EU is leading the way with regulations that are designed to promote investment in green companies, create “green credits” and a commitment to oversight among financial institutions and investors.
• [00:26:24] Making sense of Alphabet Soup: Catherine explains efforts to optimize data to streamline corporate ESG terminology, acronyms, complex environmental initiatives and grading that are all but inaccessible.
• [00:30:34] Catherine shares advice for organizations looking to put in place best practices to meet quickly evolving international standards with regard to disclosures and data validation.
• [00:35:54] Quick Fire Questions for Catherine:
  • What’s your dream? For everyone to unite and get along. Many individuals pulling in the same direction can make significant impacts!
  • What do you like most about working with your team at Grant Thornton? The mind-expanding diversity of backgrounds, expertise and life experience.
  • What are the biggest challenges faced by corporate leaders responsible for company-wide sustainability initiatives? 1) Getting educated. 2) Securing stakeholder buy-in and long-term support. 3) Coping with the pace of regulatory change and acceleration. 4) Fully committing to making change. It can be done!

About Our Guest

Catherine is a senior energy/sustainability specialist with 15 years global experience, who joined Grant Thornton in 2021 to lead the sustainability offering in Financial Services. Prior to joining the firm, she worked for 13 years with FTSE listed Tullow Oil, holding both technical and non-technical roles with responsibility for portfolio management, business performance and risk, working extensively with multidisciplinary teams and increasingly focusing on ESG issues.

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Key Things Discussed

• “Rewirement” and Laurie’s career pivot into coaching.
• The specific roles and functions that chiefs of staff serve.
• The three C’s that form the basis of Laurie’s trusted advisory practice.
• Block-and-tackle tools and systems to optimize leadership goals and efficacy.
• The unique cross-industry opportunity that Laurie’s ChiefSpace group coaching program offers chiefs of staff – especially those who are operating in isolation.
• Valuable lessons learned, especially when it comes to speaking up early and often!

Show Notes

• 00:03:48] About the many hats that Laurie wore during a long career at AT&T and the venture she has more recently launched as a business coach for high-level leaders.
• [00:04:53] “Rewirement” and what it means to pivot – not into retirement but into an opportunity to leverage skills sets, experience and passions in new ways.
• [00:07:31] About the 3C’s that form the basis of Laurie’s trusted advisory practice:
  • Coaching
  • Consulting
  • Chief-ing
• [00:09:13] Breaking down the role of chief of staff into five parts:
  1. Air traffic controller for a leader and their team.
  2. Integrator among silos.
  3. Master communicator.
  4. Link between the executive team and broader organization.
  5. Honest broker and truth-teller, a confidante without an agenda.
• [00:10:08] Laurie’s take on the servant-leader role that chiefs of staff play, which is shaped by the requirements and needs of specific leaders at any given moment.
• [00:13:08] Why developing relationships and ensuring alignment among various team members is a critical aspect of performing the Chief of Staff function.
• [00:14:53] How it feels to work for a Fortune 10 company on the cutting edge of innovation, including the exhilaration (as well as occasional exhaustion and loneliness) associated with being integral to critical decision-making.
• [00:17:18] Laurie shares strategies she deployed with the leaders she served at AT&T, challenging narratives, providing perspective, highlighting risks and rewards and pushing back where necessary.
• [00:19:08] Ultimately a chief of staff’s highest purpose is to see what needs to be done and then ensure that, one way or another, it happens efficiently and effectively.
• [00:21:23] More about the chief of staff’s highly strategic niche:
  1. Identifying and delivering on goals.
  2. Ensuring alignment among companies, departments and divisions.
  3. Tracking progress against strategic plans.
• [00:22:00] About where the chief of staff function should sit organizationally and why.
• [00:25:35] Laurie touts the 4D Productivity System as a helpful filter for chiefs of staff:
  • Do it – Is this a task that I can accomplish quickly?
  • Delegate it – Is this something that could be better done by someone else?
  • Defer it – Could this be pushed out to a later time?
  • Dismiss it – Does this really need to be done at all?
• [00:27:28] About the power of time blocking, which places all planning in an intentional framework that modulates energy and maintains focused priorities.
• [00:27:48] More helpful tools for chiefs of staff, leaders and really anyone at any level:
  • Apps to support morning routines and drive efficiencies.
  • Intention-setting at the start of meetings.
• [00:31:16] Laurie’s ChiefSpace group coaching program targets chiefs of staff, who generally lack a support network, offering them a cross-industry opportunity to:
  • Navigate critical decisions with speed and confidence.
• Act as an accountability partner and reality check.
• Drive alignment and maximize efficiency across the enterprise.
• Act as a gatekeeper, protecting and advancing leadership’s key priorities.
• Learn how to work powerfully and deftly across silos.
• Be a strategic thought partner and proxy in executing strategy.
• [00:31:48] About the book Laurie is writing – which is the book she wished she had when she first started in her chief-of-staff role. It will demystify the job and offer advice.
• [00:34:56] How to turn challenges into foundational opportunities:
  • Cultivate crystal-clear clarity about where you’re going and why.
  • Implement clear communication that aligns efforts across teams.
  • Follow up consistently to ensure alignment and anticipate issues.
  • Put milestones in place as well as measures for tracking execution.
  • Take time out to reflect, debrief and learn from wins and losses.
• [00:42:24] About the primary leadership lesson that Laurie has learned: To speak her truth early and often. It isn’t about being liked. It’s about expressing yourself as a leader.
• [00:45:30] Laurie shares what’s top of mind for her in advancing her work as a transformational coach and advisor, cultivating health and wellness and keeping a calendar that reflects her philosophy that time is energy. “I want to give my clients and my family and myself the best energy I can,” says Laurie.

Relevant links:

More about Stephen Covey's books and business strategies..

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Key Things Discussed

• How OKRs can shift company cultures towards more outcomes-based approaches – especially relevant for Covid-inspired distributed workers.
• The difference between OKRs, KPIs, and their sometimes complementary goals.
• How to infuse company-wide meetings and employee evaluations with OKR-oriented measures and priorities.
• Deployment of CLEAR – Career Path, Learning Objectives, Expectations, Accountabilities & Rewards – in a sales context.
• How leaders who are vulnerable to personal challenges set a tone that trickles down and encourages OKR adoption throughout the ranks.
• Why creating an environment where it’s safe for employees to ask questions – and fail – is a key element to successful OKR implementation.
• Tips and tactics for anyone getting ready to adopt an OKR approach.

Show Notes

• [00:20] Growing up in a big, rambunctious family, Bradford realized early on that he was energized by two things: Making people happy and understanding how business works.
• [02:25] Bradford defines the HR function and its multi-dimensional role in showcasing and aligning departments across the enterprise.
• [03:30] About Bradford’s take on the freight industry and Loadsmart, a provider of digital solutions to manage industry logistics. As CPO, he was part of creating a powerful, scalable, synchronous clearinghouse for automating communications and industry flow.
• [07:10] What it will mean for Loadsmart to provide an AI-driven platform that coordinates and connect not only shippers, who are the primary customers, but also carriers, ports, customs, warehouses – the many dispersed elements that have never before had access to shared data.
• [10:00] Throughout his career and multiple engagements, Bradford has been building on OKRs that weren’t much more than KPIs when he started on the journey – a journey, he says, that never ends.
• [12:00] Defining the core difference between an OKR and a KPI, based on the lens used and varying indicators.
• [15:10] Bradford highlights the transformational impacts on company-wide meetings that focus cross-functionally and creatively to expand ideation and stretch goals.
• [16:58] KPIs do have a place within organizations, particularly in areas where baseline goals are important for level-setting.
• [17:42] About linking OKRs and evaluations, for Loadsmart a quarterly process based on four check-in questions focused on exceptionality.
• [19:50] “Loadee” evals include results-focused OKR questions that flip the paradigm to emphasize effort and output rather than a check-the-box mentality.
• [23:49] About CLEAR (Career Path, Learning Objectives, Expectations, Accountabilities & Rewards), an automated progression program that offers employees flexibility from quarter to quarter in how they pursue objective goals. Bradford shares examples from sales, where he recently rolled out a highly successful program.
• [29:27] Accelerated by Covid, workplace culture is rebranding performance management to shift from a performative (long hours, butts in seats) mentality to an impact- and measures-based orientation.
• [31:09] Ideation and expectations at the senior level in terms of how to bring OKR strategy to life, starting with the pyramid of progress:
  • At the individual level it’s about initiatives and tasks and making progress towards long-term team objectives. Then measuring for key results.
  • Expectations can be set top-down, but individuals are empowered bottom-up to try things, fail fast and drive initiatives autonomously.
  • Ideation comes into play as observation and opportunity-oriented rather than imposed problem-oriented solutions as a starting point.
• [34:45] Testing ideation is a critical next step in successful OKR deployment:
  • Build tools (they can be fairly basic) to create evidence-based data analytics rather than blindly pursuing initiatives based on hearsay or intuition.
  • Test adoption and outcomes via KPIs by tracking things like revenue.
• [37:25] Bradford explains how he once used the creation of a cricket league for employees in India as a strategic initiative (including data metrics) to drive corporate OKRs like employee engagement and productivity. It was a fun and popular way to get there!
• [40:48] Why employees have to be empowered to fail in order to be successful.
• [42:45] Bradford’s advice for how people managers should respond when employees fail? (Which they inevitably must …)
  • Whether an individual or a team: Do they have clarity as to what went wrong?
  • Be prepared to do a retrospective to uncover the reasons for derailments.
  • OKRs can be as critical for indicating what not to do as what to do.
  • Meet regularly to go over OKRs and identify what’s red, yellow, green – and why.
  • Is it psychologically safe for people to proactively raise a hand and get help?
  • Leadership should not shy away from being vulnerable. Humility and authenticity trickle down through the ranks in liberating ways.
• [46:10] When it comes to OKRs, sales is a somewhat different animal. There are, however, great opportunities to partner and leverage in a marketing context.
• (46:52] Quick-Fire Questions:
  • What’s your dream and, if you’ve got a deadline, what’s that? It’s changeable based on his evolving family life and the new dimensions it brings.
  • What do you appreciate most about your team? Their openness to trying new things, which is critical when rolling out unfamiliar, innovative initiatives.
  • What’s top of mind these days? Budget planning and performance.
  • No. 1 tip for launching new OKR initiatives?
    • Less is more! It’s much easier to measure for quality through patient sequencing. It’s all about progress.
    • Are you developing metrics and milestones rather than “to do” lists?
    • When success is clearly defined and measurable, OKRs are lots of fun!

Relevant Links:Follow Our Guest: Website | LinkedIn

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Key Things Discussed

• What led to the decision to implement an OKR system at ChargeBee
• Reducing the number of priorities teams were focusing on and mapping all these out
• Getting company buy-in on implementing OKRs by having the leadership team paint the vision of what it is and why it’s important
• Learnings, experimentation, and refinements made since the program has been implemented

[00:02:54] About Lavanya’s origin story and how she came to stewarding objectives and key results (OKRs) at the billing and revenue management platform Chargebee.

[00:04:49] How and why OKRs play a pivotal operational role at Chargebee.

[00:06:12] About prioritizing goals in a way that quickly aligns leadership and teams.

[00:06:59] The Chargebee journey has not been without stumbling blocks.

[00:08:24] Defining key results: What to communicate about and when.

[00:09:29] About the Why: Strategies for motivating teams to adopt OKR processes.

[00:12:19] How Chargebee articulated cultural values and objectives designed to resonate across the enterprise.

[00:13:39] About Chargebee’s key objectives: growth, value-add, an empathetic ethic, fast learning cycles.

[00:14:49] How outside OKR coaches helped define and respond to challenges.

[00:16:49] Learning Curve Lessons: The process takes time and people need prodding.

[00:18:00] About experimentation and failing fast, which are part of the OKR journey.

[00:20:43] How Chargebee layers OKR and operations into quarter-end close-outs.

[00:23:27] Rules of the Road: How to set your OKR process up for success.

[00:23:35] The role of internal OKR champions deployed across all business functions.

[00:25:54] How OKR champions are identified and recruited.

[00:27:57] About the cadence of Chargebee’s quarterly and annual OKR milestones.

[00:29:49] What occurs during monthly OKR reviews and how the tracking works.

[00:32:39] Rolling out recognition at the functional level.

[00:33:29] Special ways of honoring (and reinforcing) individual contributors.

[00:34:50] About blending OKR methodology with other performance metrics.

[00:37:14] How OKRs differ by function and in a cross-functional context.

[00:38:19] What’s comes next in Chargebee’s evolving OKR journey.

[00:40:26] Quick-fire questions.

[00:43:07] Operational issues that are top of mind for Lavanya.

Relevant links:

Webinar featuring Lavanya: How Chargebee Uses OKRs to Inspire Collaboration and Manage Hypergrowth.

Follow Our Guest: LinkedIn

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Alexis is a firm believer that change starts with the self. He is the author of two books: Changing Your Team From The Inside and I am a Software Engineer and I am in Charge.

We discuss how they’re making hybrid work work at Red Hat. He shares a wonderful technique called impact mapping which he uses to facilitate OKR setting sessions. And Alexis shares an example of how incentive structures can reinforce collaborative behaviour.

“I bumped into so many issues trying to help people work with each other where the root cause were their individual incentives.” – Alexis (30:17)

• (01:27) A day in the life of Alexis Monville
• (02:53) How Red Hat is supporting hybrid work
• (08:09) Culture on a plate
• (12:17) What is the most important thing right now?
• (16:00) Impact mapping OKRs
• (19:55) A not-so-great method to facilitate OKR creation
• (27:05) Customers get the answer to their question in their first call, 80% of the time
• (30:17) Individual incentives as the root cause of collaboration issues
• (31:18) An example of incentivising sales teams to collaborate
• (35:50) Quickfire questions

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“...if OKRs are focused on our growth as a company, there's a second area that's equally critical and that's our business strength.”- Christine (20:47)

What You Will Learn in this Episode:

• (01:09) Christine on getting Groupon back to agile.
• (06:13) Why she is an advocate for other women in technology.
• (12:17) How COVID was a forcing function for Groupon to innovate.
• (15:45) Pre-requisites for working with OKRs.
• (17:41) How Groupon's OKR process works.
• (21:28) The three things OKRs cannot solve—organizational indecision, a lack of discipline, and a lack of muscle around estimating.
• (33:05) OKRs and portfolio management.
• (36:51) OKRs and day-to-day delivery.
• (39:20) The three places we need to measure performance: business growth, business strength, and personal development.
• (41:33) Christine answers quick fire questions.

Relevant Links:

• Website
• LinkedIn
• Instagram
• Twitter
• Want Progress? Measure
• OKRs do not measure human performance
• Abandoning your work: The key to unconventional and effective strategic planning

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“If you don’t bring OKRs into the regular management agenda, you will set it and forget it.”- Dan (20:47)

What You Will Learn in this Episode:

• (02:20) Dan on his interest in people’s organization plus the different career paths he’s undertaken.
• (03:35) Why he wrote his book Start less, Finish More, which is about strategic agility.
• (04:56) How to do more strategic thinking – begin with the end in mind rather than focusing on a to-do list.
• (07:04) How to create a minimum viable strategy – creating holistic value for all your business’s stakeholders.
• (10:37) The difference between the traditional mechanical business planning and today’s trying and scaling strategy.
• (13:48) The 5-steps of building strategic agility as outlined in his book; access, focus, commit, act, and learn.
• (29:34) Overburdened matrix – not being agile and operating in silos plus how to use shared OKRs to cut across those silos.
• (33:09) Dan answers more quick-fire questions.

Relevant Links:

• Website: https://agile-strategies.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/montgomerydan/

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So, your organization has passed down a mandate that you’re going to do OKRs. Now what? In this episode, I’m joined by Allan Kelly. Allan is an agile coach, author of 7 books, and keynote speaker. His introduction to OKRs was exactly this—it came down as a mandate and he had to figure things out. He’s got some controversial ideas around maintaining a backlog (spoiler: he thinks it’s okay to nuke your backlog and start anew every quarter). He believes it’s okay to not achieve your Key Results. In his mind, there’s something far more important—delivering business benefit. We’ll discuss these things and more.

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“At that time, I never would have said that or thought that, but in hindsight, being in a band is like being in startups.” – Jeff [02:04]

What You Will Learn in this Episode:

• [01:31] Who Jeff is and what he’s all about
• [04:50] What Jeff means by “planning season”
• [08:19] A better way of planning
• [14:59] Adjusting the definition and borders of planning
• [16:00] The freedom of assumptions and hypotheses
• [18:42] How Jeff defines value
• [20:55] Introducing friction instead of fuel
• [24:18] Why organizations should be thinking agilely
• [28:45] Organizational roadmaps and how they work with OKRs
• [34:50] What organizations do after OKRs and what that looks like
• [38:17] Whether Jeff is considering putting out books
• [39:12] Quickfire questions

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Chris Butler is a Chaotic Good Product Manager, the Global Head of Product Operations at Cognizant, a writer, and a speaker. He worked previously as a product leader at Microsoft, Facebook, KAYAK, and Waze. Jenny and Chris discuss a broad range of topics including— the future of AI products, uncertainly, randomness, OKRs as networks and trojan horses, issues with hierarchies, and the adversarial mindset.

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Richard Russell is an independent OKR and Leadership coach who held leadership positions at Amazon, Google, and Deutsche Bank. While working at Amazon, he learned the “working backwards framework” and uses it now in helping companies achieve results using the OKR methodology. Jenny and Richard discuss the advantages of working within large organizations, measuring value, the importance of listening, and more.

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Maya Townsend is the Founder and Lead Consultant of Partnering Resources, a management consulting agency that tackles big-picture organizational challenges. An expert in organizational networks, Maya breaks down the three types of influencers and which type holds the most influence. She shares her most profound insights from her 25-year career and gives examples of times she successfully aligned companies’ networks and strategies.

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John Quayle is an Operations Professional for small businesses, startups, and brands that are economies of one. Three months ago, he became the Chief of Staff at Four Growers, a startup that’s revolutionizing farming with robots that can pick ripe fruit in greenhouses. Jenny and John discuss false limitations, OKRs, what exactly is the role of a Chief of Staff, and explore the art of planning goals.

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In this episode, Jenny Herald is joined by Gibson Biddle, former VP of Product at Netflix and CPO at Chegg. He’s now a speaker, teacher, and workshop host. They discuss many of his tools, models, and frameworks — like GLEE and SMT, how culture is not a touchy-feely soft thing but rather describes the skills and behaviors expected of everyone in an organization. Gib puts Jenny in the hot seat a few times as they examine some Netflix case studies together.

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What should you do at the end of an OKR cycle? What does it mean to be a Key Result champion? What do you do if you know you won't make any impact on your OKRs this quarter? How do you make a metric that matters? In Part 2 of an interview with Ben Lamorte—an OKRs coach, author, and founder of OKRs.com—we'll discuss these questions and more.

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Founder of OKRs.com, Ben Lamorte, has more OKR coaching experience than anyone on the planet. In part one of this interview, Jenny asks Ben about his background, latest book, current trends, OKR deployment parameters, and experience working with huge companies.

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In this episode, Jenny Herald is joined by Mike Pilawski, the Chief Product Officer at Smallpdf where he leads product, design, and data teams. Prior to joining Smallpdf, Mike has held leadership roles in product, engineering, marketing, and data at Typeform, Leanplum, Vungle, and NativeX. In this episode, we chat about the Dimensions of Organizational Blueprints, how one goes about marrying up agility and OKRs for product and engineering teams, and the two camps concerning OKRs and performance management, and more.

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After working years in corporate America, startups, and scaleups, Caroline Franczia founded Uppercut First, a consultancy for startup founders. She’s a columnist for Maddyness UK, the author of Popcorn for the New CEO, an OKR expert, and an advocate for women. Her recent article—“I’ve never felt this awake”: Caroline Franczia on Thelma, Louise and inclusion—is about her personal experience as a woman in tech. She believes diversity and inclusion needs to be baked into the business strategy. In order for employees to stick around, they need to feel a sense of purpose, ownership, and that they make an impact. In this episode, we chat about the ROI of closing the gender gap, using a Value Pyramid to set the foundation for company-level OKRs, and what makes OKR programs fail or succeed.

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In this episode, Jenny Herald interviews Flavia Neves, Director of Product Management at Spotify and former VP of Product at Free Now. Flavia shares Free Now’s OKR journey. Listening to their experience is like going through the hero’s journey. She's gathered some lessons learned and provides advice to organization's considering adopting OKRs. There is pre-work required to make them work. Tune in to find what you need to make your OKR program successful.

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In this episode, Jenny Herald and Vessy Tasheva answer questions that came from participants that joined a Diversity & Inclusion (D&I) Roundtable discussion. Unfortunately, we did not have an opportunity to cover all the questions during the event and decided to record an episode to cover them.

We were asked the following:

• I had a man opt-out of our Diversity Advisory Council because of the literature required to read, which included critical race theory and LGBTQ+, due to his religious beliefs. How should I respond to him?
• Are you seeing any discussion of universal design as part of D&I?
• What do you think about colleges and universities having anti-racism statements and some are creating anti-racism training?
• How do we make sure the nice things we discuss and the slogans we proudly recite don’t stay in the classroom and on the walls, but to really start live and breathe them?

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• (0:00) Intro
• (1:35) Vessy’s Background
• (2:58) What is D&I?
• (4:07) The state of D&I
• (6:56) How D&I is misunderstood
• (13:44) Chief Diversity Officers on the C-Suite
• (19:14) Connecting D&I to OKR
• (22:08) Everyone has value
• (27:10) Negative D&I trends
• (30:30) Measuring and tracking the success of D&I efforts
• (38:50) Rapid fire questions
• (42:48) Outro

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In this episode, Jenny is joined by Peter Kerr, Managing Director of Auxin OKR. He’s had the opportunity and privilege of working with senior executives from some of the largest, most well-known companies in the world. Peter shares some incredible stories from his experiences with these leaders on maintaining relevance in the market, working through political infighting, the need for human connection in a digital world, and how OKRs can help aid all of the above.

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In this episode, Jenny Herald interviews Adam Bonifant, VP of Customer Success at ORock Technologies, and Tim Meinhardt, CEO of Atruity. We'll discuss the ins-and-outs of fast-tracking an OKR program into existence. ORock Technologies was able to get OKRs up-and-running in a span of 3 weeks, with Adam co-championing the program and Tim serving as their guide. Find out what they learned at the onset of their OKR journey.

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In this episode, Jenny is joined by Dan Weikart, Director and Enterprise Agile Coach at Cprime. We discuss the immutable and foundational ingredients necessary for unlocking enterprise value. We’ll get practical and, at times, somewhat prescriptive.

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On this episode of Dreams with Deadlines, Jenny Herald interviews David Anderson, an OKR Systems Coach at Auxin OKR. David explains what a Blue Zone is and how it relates to OKRs, what it means to live the OKR life, and how motocross racing relates to business. He's passionate about the environment and plans to grow the world’s largest electric bike company. He says it is impossible to scale a belief without a system.

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On this episode of Dreams with Deadlines, Jenny Herald interviews Dan Montgomery, author of Start less, Finish More: Building Strategic Agility with Objectives and Key Results, founder and Managing Director of Agile Strategies, and OKR Thought Leader. He goes through the five steps outlined in his book— Assess, Focus, Commit, Act, and Learn. They also discuss OKRs in relation to a concept pilots use called OODA loop (observe–orient–decide–act).

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On this episode of Dreams with Deadlines, Jenny Herald interviews Godehard Gerling, Managing Partner at go3consulting in Germany. Godehard shares how he persuades traditional European companies to build products with intent, adopt OKRs, and release their leadership grip to allow teams on lower levels to make decisions. He says that in these uncertain times, being safe in business is risky.

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On this episode of Dreams with Deadlines, Jenny Herald interviews Ash Seddeek, Chief Excitement Officer at the Executive Greatness Institute. Ash coaches senior leaders at large companies on storytelling, executive presence, strategic communication, the importance of reflection and ‘meeting with self,’ leadership transitions, and OKR rollouts. He believes the right story can connect, inspire, and move an entire company in the right direction. He is a best-selling author and co-author of Road To Success with Jack Canfield and MEANING, a bestseller on leadership communications.

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Russell Cummings is an experienced Management Consultant and Business Coach with Shifft Consulting. Russ has spent the last 35 years working with dynamic family businesses that want to grow. He is Australian-based but currently services clients across Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and the United Kingdom. In this episode, we cover a lot of ground like the 2 ways OKRs can help small businesses, a walk-through of how to cascade OKRs, how to approach tracking metrics when you’re first starting out, and the dangers of being efficient in the wrong places at the wrong times.

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Kit Friend is an Agile Coach, proud geek, and Atlassian Partnership lead for EMEA at Accenture (despite his enthusiasm, these views are currently officially only his own). In this special episode of the Voices of OKRs series, we discuss where it might make sense to apply the Waterfall model (and yes, in some cases this would be a reasonable approach), the many ways to be agile—from the “Seen more rarely currently approaches” like Lean to those we should “Approach with caution” like the “Spotify model,” and how organizations should be thinking about mapping work to value, data to strategy.

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Pedro is the founder of Pragmatic Management Consulting. Previously, he was Head of Management at Nextel Brazil where he implemented OKRs for more than 1700 employees. In this episode, he shares his story and experience with us. We get to hear what Nextel Brazil’s OKR lifecycle looked like. We’ll spend some time talking about how their pilot failed and how they were able to turn things around. Pedro goes over the importance of executive sponsorship, how that sponsorship played out in practice, their OKR calendar and check-in process, and how they had tied compensation to OKRs at that time but why he wouldn’t recommend that in practice today.

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Tim Whitmire is the founder of CXN Advisory, where he coaches executives on strategy, goal setting, alignment and execution. He is the co-founder of F3 Nation and co-author, with David Redding, of Freed to Lead: F3 and the Unshackling of the Modern-day Warrior. F3 is a network of free, peer-led workouts for men in the United States and has grown to more than 30 states and 2,000+ scheduled workouts a week through volunteer efforts. F3 participants apply a distinctive lexicon of terms during their workouts. How do these F3 concepts relate to OKRs? Find out in today’s episode.

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Carsten Ley is the co-founder of Asia PMO – a leading digital transformation & agile consulting company, specializing in implementing OKRs and other revolutionary project management techniques in Southeast Asia. In this first episode of a 12-part series on “Voices of OKR,” Carsten and I discuss: * The difference between customer data and feedback * How to begin using OKRs via a task force * Command-and-control culture versus participative culture * OKRA - Objectives, Key Results, and Actions

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Mathias Meyer is an engineer turned founder, a former CEO at Travis CI and CTO at Reaction Commerce. In this episode, we discuss how a simple process, architectural decision records, created the space for his team to make and document decisions; what it means to debug an organization; how to approach OKRs via an evolutionary approach—from not tracking anything to tracking something; the engineering metrics he ended up tracking and more.

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Srikant Vemuri has held leadership roles in overseeing the design and launch of breakthrough products in the B2B, Adtech, and Big Data spaces for industry innovators such as Seerene, Womply, Aarki, and Adchemy. Currently, he's managing product and technology at Frontier Car Group as the CEO of Technology. In this episode, Srikant shares what he's learned during his journey—filled with bruises, scars, blood, tears, and his share of successes. He's got this exciting idea of balancing great product concepts and a CEO's strategy—he calls it the "cage fight." We discuss Product Management benching. He's taken the term from sports and applies it in business. Find out what he thinks PMs should be doing when benched. And we spend quite a bit of time talking about OKRs, and a personal KPI he monitors to gauge his teams' health. He believes this KPI is foundational for OKRs to be successful.

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Alan Klement is known for developing the theories of Jobs to be Done and Market Modernization and inventing new methodologies and methods for engineering growth. His latest venture is Revealed — a market research and growth guidance firm that helps organizations grow, align, and reveal market insights. He's the author of When Coffee and Kale Compete and is writing a sequel called Jobs to be Done: Understanding Needs. Predicting Adoption. This is part two of our conversation. In this episode, we discuss OKRs and Jobs to be Done, the two goals that product people should take into consideration, the importance of a feed forward communication culture, and we get a sneak peek into some concepts and models from Alan's new book. Let's jump in.

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Alan Klement is known for developing the theories of Jobs to be Done and Market Modernization and inventing new methodologies and methods for engineering growth. His latest venture is Revealed — a market research and growth guidance firm that helps organizations grow, align, and reveal market insights. He's the author of When Coffee and Kale Compete and is writing a sequel called Jobs to be Done: Understanding Needs. Predicting Adoption. It's due in Summer 2020. My conversation with Alan is broken down into two parts. In this episode, we discuss the Taylorism versus Humanism approach to explaining OKRs, and how understanding needs means understanding how they're created, how they grow and shrink, and get eliminated. We cover the "voice of the customer" and its flaws and how Lean startup solves problems that come with the "voice of the customer" approach.

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In this episode, we hear from Scott Shapiro, Principal Product Marketing Manager for B2B/Account Management Customer Experience at Qualtrics. We get an inside look at how it felt when Qualtrics was pre-IPO and everyone thought it was going to happen—but gotcha—it didn't happen. We hear a lot nowadays that things are slowing down due to this global pandemic. Scott shares his findings from research they’ve been doing. They’re seeing an acceleration of what was already happening. Hear what they’ve learned. Qualtrics has a set of principles called Tacos. Find out what that means and how Tacos shape how they operate. We talk about OKRs and how to go from activity to delivering value.

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Joining me today is Rohit Gupta. He is the Head of Product at Honeypot.io and leads the Product Management, Product Design and large parts of the Engineering teams. In this episode, we discuss ways his team is staying socially connected during the Coronavirus pandemic, Honeypot’s dream and how his organization is pursuing it, the power of the reverse recruitment model in hiring, and the key learnings Honeypot weaved into their OKRs process to make the methodology work for them.

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Dennis Gräf is a Business Strategy Manager at Kolibri Games. Ubisoft acquired his company in January 2020. Kolibri is one of the leaders of the “idle” games genre. One of their most popular games, Idle Miner Tycoon, has been downloaded by more than 104 million players. In this episode, Dennis shares Kolibri’s journey with OKRs. We discuss the transition of everyone working from an office to everyone working from home, how he pulse checked the leadership team and the organization before introducing an OKRs tool, how their OKRs process works and has evolved, and the hard lessons the organization had to learn along the way.

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Gene Hammett is a leading expert on high-growth company culture and leadership. He has interviewed more than 530 CEOs of high-growth companies to understand the core principles of fast growth. In this episode, we examine what leaders of fast-growth companies have in common and what leaders should anchor to during these challenging times. We discuss what's more important in business, the employees or the customers. In Gene's worldview, accountability is too low a bar. Listen in to hear what he believes we need to strive for instead.

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Joining me is Blake Thomas, the Director of Engineering at NoRedInk. He’s learned a lot while working with engineers for over two decades. On this episode, you’ll hear us chat about the 2 modes of failure, why we experience issues with people updating their OKRs (and what we can do about it), how to prevent “OKR Theatre,” the universal reality of today’s workforce and more.

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Joining me today is Rob Bayley. Rob is currently a Senior Product Manager at Auvik Networks Inc. Previously, he was a Director of Product at Roadmunk and a Senior Product Manager at NetSuite. He's got a decade of Product Management experience under his belt. On this episode, Rob shares his thoughts on Product Management from the lens of an individual contributor, manager and leader, the dangers of cascading goals, the key to making OKR work, and how to utilize evidence based decision making when you're at a pre-product stage.

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Prar Johnson’s a changemaker who has over 19 years of experience—spent some time shaping products at Nokia, T-Mobile, Skype Microsoft, Soundcloud, Shopify, and now Atlassian. On this episode, you’ll hear her explanation for why product strategy is hard, the time she made a tough call using a consensus-driven approach, what data the Atlassian design team uses to shape their OKRs, how she got involved with the birth of what is now known as Microsoft Teams and more.

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Our guest for Episode 2 is Andrew Wallace. He’s the Managing Director and CPO of SmileBack. Previously, he was the Director of Product Management at Chefs Plate. Chefs Plate was acquired by the German meal kit company, HelloFresh, in 2018. In this episode, you’ll hear Andrew’s thoughts on the importance of knowing and having a shared vision, how Chef’s Plate planned to exit with a certain buyer in mind who ended up not being the buyer in the end, how sometimes a business needs to build unique technology in-house, why simple dreams are good, what Andrew’s learned from his experience at Chefs Plate and transferred to SmileBack and more.

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Taking Important Leadership Notes

Did you know that many historical impactful figures had some form of notetaking habit actively reflecting on their experiences? Research shows you forget 60% of the information that comes into you daily. It also shows that notetakers retain 95% of that information.

In this episode of Dreams with Deadlines, Jenny speaks with Ryan McMinn, the head of product for Microsoft OneNote and Sticky Notes. Ryan who has been with Microsoft for 13 years insists on being a good leader for his team and offering customers product value. He shares how OneNote has developed and grown as a product putting into consideration the target customer over the years.

Listen in to learn why you need to become a notetaker as it helps with reflecting on experiences which is what creates knowledge and wisdom. You will also hear the importance of learning by going through things first hand and gaining experience while finding ways to get over them fast enough.

“It’s very hard to do large things and if you don’t know exactly know where you want to end up, you can end up chasing small things instead of going after big things.”- Ryan [24:05]

What You Will Learn in this Episode:

• (0:12) Intro
• (1:37) Learning to be a good leader that sets an example for your successor.
• (3:16) Ryan describes OneNote’s target customers as organized individuals and the set of organized people that exist.
• (9:42) The importance of taking accountability and serving others as a leader without imposing your will.
• (14:53) The principles of trust and product depth that contributes to OneNote’s value.
• (16:47) The strategy and paths to taking OneNote to the people as things continue to change.
• (21:45) Ryan explains how they measure Objectives and Key Results (OKRs) by building on small things to make big things that fulfill customers’ wants.
• (26:33) How and why they created the seven big things to look at as a team that helped them breakdown and actualize the OKRs.
• (32:00) Understanding people’s motivation and tapping into it through trial and error.
• (36:14) Learning to be what the team needs- becoming what is expected of the rule and not what you as a leader is comfortable with.
• (39:26) The best thing that ever happened to Microsoft- being humbled and finding a balance.
• (41:30) How Ryan has learned not to beat himself up when things don’t work out and not comparing himself and the products he creates.

Relevant Links:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanmcminn/