Trauma Healing: Recent Episodes
Win Your Day / Listen Notes
Podcast: The Mindvalley Podcast with Vishen (LS 63 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Rapid Transformational Therapy To Heal Your Body And Mind with Marisa Peer
Pub date: 2019-11-11
Your body and mind are healing machines. In this episode, you’re going to immediately experience and apply the change you desire for yourself through a guided meditation with Britain’s leading hypnotherapist, Marisa Peer.
Listen out for:
(02:54) How hypnotherapy helped a young girl heal herself after an accident and a man to end his alcoholism
(05:55) The power of self-healing through the mind by understanding neuroplasticity
(08:34) The importance of using the right words and being clear with your mind
(12:03) The PPP — If it’s not Permanent, Personal, or Pervasive, it’s not coming to get you and it can go away.
(14:18) Marisa’s Hypnotherapy session: The Healing Vortex begins
Bonus:
- Subscribe to Mindvalley Membership to discover 30+ Mindvalley Quests, watch our podcast sessions live, interact with the guests, connect with the world’s best teachers and find your community 👉 https://go.mindvalley.com/NOW
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Mindvalley, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: London Real (LS 65 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: DR JOE DISPENZA - BECOMING SUPERNATURAL
Pub date: 2018-05-08
Dr. Joe Dispenza is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, researcher, and educator.
Watch the Full Episode of Dr Joe Dispenza on London Real for FREE only at https://londonreal.tv/e/dr-joe-dispenza/
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Brian Rose, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: London Real (LS 65 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Dr Joe Dispenza - Break The Habit Of Being You
Pub date: 2019-05-08
Dr. Joe Dispenza is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, researcher, and educator.
Watch the FULL EPISODE here: https://londonreal.tv/e/dr-joe-dispenza-3/
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Brian Rose, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Inspire Nation Show with Michael Sandler (LS 60 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Why The Universe Has Your Back - Now More Than Ever (Especially During Coronavirus)! Matt Kahn
Pub date: 2020-04-22
If you ever wanted more peace and love during this incredibly challenging time, then do we have the Universe Always Has a Plan Show for you.
Today I’ll be talking with Matt Kahn, one of my all-time favorite spiritual teachers and authors, and the author of “Whatever Arises, Love That”, “Everything is Here to Help You”, and his latest, “The Universe Always Has a Plan”
And that’s just what I want to talk with him about today, about what in the world is going on today, and how it will all work out.
Key Points Discussed
- Evaluating our collective energies during this pandemic and taking this period as an opportunity for spiritual awakening (03:11)
- Returning into our own alignment state that's free from conditioning by taking the journey of finding your own self-truth (04:33)
- Unshackling from fear and realizing Covid-19 is just a cocoon helping us develop our wings for a re-birthing of humanity (05:33)
- Tapping into your hero element and doing the most when faced with so much less (07:17)
- Taking a vision quest and deciding on the version of yourself that you want to be (08:04)
- When the world is in a place of uncertainty and away from comfort this provides the perfect opportunity for meditation (09:48)
- How sticking with our desires and instincts creates an identity free from victimhood mentality (10:59)
- Everything that we need to function and thrive is always within ourselves (12:24)
- The fear we feel is a normal part of an evolution cycle: Fear is unearthing and awakening of our inner artist (14:01)
- Understanding negative energy as just repressed energy that has not been given room to express (16:03)
- Discovering new realities no matter where you are in the spiritual journey (17:24)
- Evaluating what we can do to circulate more energy, replenish and recharge by interrupting the normalcy (19:04)
- Activating the power of alchemy and melting the barriers within (21:42)
- One of the first steps in spiritual evolution happens by putting your ego in a state of fight and flight (23:35)
- Each one of us is on their own path of self-awareness and spiritual awakening (24:45)
- A day in the life of Armageddon meditation (28:05)
- The law of unity consciousness: what you do to others verbally comes back to you over time (30:46)
- An awake centered consciousness (35:10)
- Change is the doorway for renewal and transformation (36:37)
- Learning to live a life of intentionality and spiritual alignment (39:35)
- Taking a journey of guided meditation (46:17)
Additional Resources:
- The Universe Always Has a Plan By Matt Khan
- Whatever Arises, Love That By Matt Khan
- Everything is Here to Help You By Matt Khan
- www.InspireNationUniversity.com
- www.AutomaticWriting.com
…….
For free meditations, weekly tips, stories, and similar shows visit: www.InspireNationShow.com
To support the show and get even more great tools, tips, and behind-the-scenes access, visit: www.Patreon.com/InspireNation
And to follow Inspire Nation (and the lives of Michael and Jessica) on Instagram, go to www.Instagram.com/InspireNationLive
And to follow Inspire Nation on Tik Tok simply go to InspireNationShow on Tik Tok
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Michael Sandler, Jessica Lee, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Stuck Not Broken (LS 51 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Complex PTSD and the Polyvagal Theory
Pub date: 2020-04-07
My thoughts on the intersection of PTSD and the Polyvagal Theory. There's a lot of polyvagal implications with this one.
Polyvagal Patrons access for $5/mo - https://www.patreon.com/justinlmft
Peter Levine and Shame Interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2CN5nhmfxk
Intro/Outro music & Transition Sounds by Benjo Beats - https://soundcloud.com/benjobeats
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Justin Sunseri, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Being Well with Dr. Rick Hanson (LS 61 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Healing Trauma with Dr. Peter Levine
Pub date: 2020-03-09
Dr. Peter Levine, a legendary expert on the subject of healing trauma, joins Dr. Rick Hanson and Forrest to discuss the power trauma holds over the body, how we can truly connect with others, and simple practices for calming fear and unwinding from trauma.
Dr. Levine has worked in the field of stress and trauma for over 40 years and is the creator of Somatic Experiencing. He is also the author of the best-selling, classic book on trauma Waking the Tiger. He’s authored and co-authored several other fantastic books including Healing Trauma, In an Unspoken Voice, andTrauma and Memory.
Connect with the show:
- Follow us on Instagram
- Follow Rick on Facebook
- Follow Forrest on Facebook
- Subscribe on iTunes
From Dr. Hanson: The Foundations of Well-Being brings together the lessons of a lifetime of practice into one year-long online program. Podcast listeners can use the code BEINGWELL25 at checkout for an additional 25% off! Please don't hesitate to apply for a scholarship if you're in need.
We're now on Patreon! If you'd like to support the podcast, follow this link.
Timestamps:
03:06: The power of trauma on the body.
13:36: The role of the practitioner during therapy.
19:32: Learning empathetic attunement.
25:39: What can people who carry trauma, but aren’t seeing anyone for it, do on their own to release it?
34:45: "Big-T" vs. "little-t" trauma
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Rick Hanson, Ph.D., Forrest Hanson, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Going Beyond the Food: Mindset, Intuitive Eating, Body Image, Diet Culture and Anti-Diet Podcast (LS 48 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: 225-Post Traumatic Dieting Disorder with Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2020-01-30
In today's episode, we'll explore about post-traumatic dieting disorder, the intersection between trauma and dieting with Irene Lyon For 25 years, I was stuck in fear mode when it came to food. I was obsessed with controlling my eating has this was the only way that I could control my body weight. I was on high alert about food and the way my body appeared to others.
Over time, I unconsciously disconnected myself from my body. In an attempt to self-protect, I numbed myself from feeling my emotions of shame, guilt, fear, and anxiety consistently triggered by diet culture.
If you look up PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder), you’ll find many similarities between this diagnosis and my 25 years of chronic dieting career side effects. Some health experts are describing this similarity as PTDD (Post Traumatic Dieting Disorder).
Post Traumatic Dieting Disorder (PTDD) Dr. Yoni Freedhoff was the first to coin the term PTDD in a 2014 article published in the Globe and Mail:
“Dieting is predicated on suffering and humans aren't built to suffer in perpetuity. Why, despite knowing better, do we blame ourselves when the nonsense fails? Could it be a case of suffering from post-traumatic dieting disorder (PTDD)? Because, really, what are modern-day diets, if not traumas?”
Recurrent restrictive eating may, indeed, feel traumatic and recovering from dieting—not just from emotional or binge-eating—may have lingering traumatic effects. The shame carried on by poor body image or weight stigmas (internalize or externalize) is felt in the depth of the nervous system and perceived as trauma to our body. A violation of our innate sense of worth.
PTDD is not a formal diagnosis rather at this time a collection of symptoms.
The part responsible for this collective of symptoms not being yet considered a condition is the fact that the medical establishment still believes in the due value of diets although research is clear that all diets have a 95% failure rate long term (5 years).
In my opinion, we are 20 years away from fully understanding the ripple effect of chronic dieting in the human mind, body, and spirit.
In today’s episode Our guest for this expert interview is Irene Lyon, a trained nervous system expert. She teaches people around the world how to work with the nervous system to transform trauma, heal body and mind, and live full, creative lives.
What you'll learn listening to this episode: * What trauma is and what it’s not. * How we relate to food and body impacts our nervous system * The impact of generational dieting * The concept of Post Traumatic Dieting Disorder * Traumatology: How to heal trauma
Mentioned on the show: Healing Trauma free video series
Going Beyond the Food Academy Registration
Dr. Yoni Freedhoff's ARTICLE
Connect with our guest Podcast
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Stephanie Dodier Clinical Nutritionist CNP, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Your Own Magic (LS 62 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Magic with Gabby Bernstein, Byron Katie, Jim Kwik, Mastin Kipp, Lisa Nichols, Paul Selig, Lacy Phillips, + More on Creating Your Own...
Pub date: 2020-01-13
How would you advise the Your Own Magic listeners on how to create their own magic?... their answers. Many of YOM's past magical guests - dedicated to rewiring our mind to remember, trust, and feel more excited about our purpose and living it this new year, new decade. Guests include: Byron Katie, Gabby Bernstein, Mastin Kipp, Paul Selig, Teal Swan, Emory + Trevor Hall, Jim Kwik, Lisa Nichols, Vishuddha Das, Sahara Rose, Lacy Phillips, Jordan Younger TBB, Lauryn + Michael of the Skinny Confidential + more.
In Order on this Episode:
Allie Michelle @@alliemichellel
Mastin Kipp @mastinkipp
Lisa Nichols @lisa2motivate
Charlie "Rocket" Jabaley @charlie
Heather Hoffman @activationvibration
Trevor Hall @trevorhallmusic
Emory Hall @emoryhall
Jordan Younger @thebalancedblonde
don Miguel Ruiz Jr. @donmiguelruizjr
Teal Swan @tealswanofficial
Jim Kwik @jimkwik
Melissa Wood @melissawoodhealth
Ainslie MacLeod @ainslie_macleod
Lacy Phillips @tobemagnetic
Sahara Rose @iamsahararose
davidji @davidjimeditation
Ashley Woods @alnwithin
Lauryn Evarts @theskinnyconfidential
Michael Bosstick @michaelbosstick
Annie Tarasova @annietarasova / @dreamymoons
Vishuddha Das @vishuddhadas
Melissa Ambrosini @melissaambrosini
FullyRaw Kristina Carrillo-Bucaram @fullyrawkristina
Shaman Durek @shamandurek
Emma Mildon @emmamildon
Sarah Blondin @sarahfinds
Gabby Bernstein @gabbybernstein
Bree Melanson @bree_melanson
Rebecca Campbell @rebeccathoughts
Byron Katie @byron.katie
Paul Selig @paul.selig
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Podcast: Embodied with Elizabeth DiAlto (LS 50 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: EP 332: Trauma and the Nervous System with Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2020-01-13
In a recent podcast listener survey, a lot of you listed trauma and healing under topics you'd like to see explored more in 2020 on the show, so I hope you enjoy today's guest, Irene Lyon who is a nervous system expert and somatic practitioner!
Her big truth was that we're at a point in time where we have the science, research, practices and immediacy to heal deep stuff. We talked about what somatic work is, the difference between the parasympathetic and the sympathetic nervous systems and touched on Polyvagal Theory.
She helped me understand the difference between trauma trained and trauma informed - a very important distinction as we all consider practitioners, guides, teachers and coaches in various areas of our lives.
And we also got into neuroception, our sensitivity to safety or danger, common trauma responses that people might not realize is their trauma talking, and how we can value the health that IS present.
It's a great chat, you might want to listen more than once. Enjoy and share!
xo,
E
For more information and for full show notes, head to http://untameyourself.com/332
Truth Telling with Elizabeth DiAlto aims to cut through the noise and ignorance of our current culture by exploring the truths of a diverse range of incredible voices. From authors, artists, creatives and educators, to activists, speakers and those in various scientific and esoteric fields - our guests hail from cultures and countries all over the world. The main intention here is to contribute to creating a kinder, gentler, more curious, collaborative, reverent world where people respect each others’ background experiences and truths and they learn to trust in themselves and life and recognize that we really do need each other. We post a new interview every Monday and if you want to keep up with the show notes and quotes from our guests you can follow me on Instagram. If you love what you hear here and you find it useful and inspiring the best way to show your appreciation is to share the episode, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review wherever you listen from.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Elizabeth DiAlto, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Stuck Not Broken (LS 51 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Irene Lyon Interview p2
Pub date: 2019-11-12
Part 2 of my chat with Irene Lyon!
IRENE
Website - https://irenelyon.com/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/irenelyon/
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBkXgr0E9ZWUg4iSDEUKqVA
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/lyonirene
Twitter - https://twitter.com/Irene_Lyon
Intro/Outro music & Transition Sounds by Benjo Beats - https://soundcloud.com/benjobeats
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Justin Sunseri, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 166: Escape from Physical Pain: An Interview with Dr. David Hanscom
Pub date: 2019-11-11
In today's podcast, David and Rhonda interview Dr. David Hanscom, a renowned and controversial spine surgeon who gave up a large and lucrative surgical practice in favor of helping and educating people struggling with back pain, directing them on the path to recovery without surgery or drugs.
Dr. Hanscom describes his personal journey and recovery from panic, pain, and other disabling somatic symptoms when he read Dr. Burns' book, Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy, and began doing the written triple column technique to challenge his own negative thoughts and overcome his own feelings of depression, panic, hopelessness, and anger.
He also began to study alarming research reports indicating that many of the surgical procedures were no more effective than placebos; and even worse, he could see that back surgery often had damaging and even disabling and horrific effects on patients. And he also discovered that most of the patients seeking surgery for back pain could be helped simply through talk therapy and support, by focusing on the problems in their lives, rather than simply focusing on pain and pills.
Dr. Burns supports Dr. Hanscom's premise, that even physical pain can have powerful psychological causes and cures. Dr. Burns briefly summarizes his own research on hospitalized inpatients with significant emotional problems as well as chronic pain. He wanted to answer the question of why physical pain and negative feelings so often go hand-in-hand.
To find out, he studied changes in negative feelings, like depression, anxiety and anger, as well as the intensity of pain, in more than 100 patients attending a 90 minute cognitive therapy group. He saw that there were often massive shifts in negative feelings, like depression, anxiety, and anger, as well as the severity of physical pain, during the groups.
He analyzed the data with sophisticated statistical modeling techniques to evaluate two competing theories about why pain and negative feelings go hand-in-hand.
- Physical pain could cause negative feelings, like depression, anxiety and anger. This seems plausible, since physical pain is so debilitating, and just plain awful.
- Negative feelings could have a causal effect on physical pain.
The analyses indicated that there were causal effects in both directions, but the most powerful effect, by far, was the effect of negative emotions on physical pain. In fact, the analyses indicated that, on average, half of the physical pain these patients were experiencing, on average, was the direct result of their negative emotions.
This means that if you're in pain, and you're emotionally upset, which would be totally understandable, that a great deal of the pain you are feeling is the result of a magnification of the pain by your negative emotions.
There is a positive implication of this finding that supports what Dr. Hansom is saying--namely, that if you are in pain, including chronic pain, and you are willing to overcome your negative feelings and deal with the problems in your life, there is a good chance that your pain will improve substantially. Some people, as David saw in the groups, will experience a total elimination of pain--something he often observed within the group.
It is also possible that you will experience a reduction of your pain, but not a complete elimination. And it is possible that your pain will not improve when your negative feelings disappear--but at least you won't have to struggle with pain and depression!
So he has now devoted his life to making people, as well as his surgical colleagues, aware of the realities vs. the myths of back surgery. To learn more, visit his website, or pick up a copy of his terrific book, Back in Control. The book includes a section on your personal roadmap out of pain.
Rhonda and I are incredibly grateful to Dr. Hanscom for this illuminating, challenging, and profoundly personal interview. We hope you enjoy it! And if you've been struggling with any kind of chronic or debilitating pain, we hope you will find some hope, as well as a drug-free path to recovery!
David D. Burns, M.D. & Rhonda Barovsky, Psy.D.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from David Burns, MD, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Stuck Not Broken (LS 51 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Irene Lyon Interview p1
Pub date: 2019-11-05
Show notes are available at https://www.justinlmft.com/post/irenelyon
Links are to Amazon, where I get a portion of the sale at no extra cost to you.
Gabor Mate, When The Body Says No - https://amzn.to/2VNe0Q3
Peter Levine, Trauma Through a Child’s Eyes - https://amzn.to/2WHc7Fj
Bruce Perry, Born for Love - https://amzn.to/2PO3x6i
Bruce Perry, The Boy Who Was Raised as a Dog - https://amzn.to/2r6pJ0T
The Story of Ryan - https://youtu.be/3WI3aUfsNxM
The Story of Teddy - https://youtu.be/dNts7T8_Vig
IRENE
Website - https://irenelyon.com/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/irenelyon/
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBkXgr0E9ZWUg4iSDEUKqVA
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/lyonirene
Twitter - https://twitter.com/Irene_Lyon
JUSTIN
https://www.justinlmft.com
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Justin Sunseri, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Inspire Nation Show with Michael Sandler (LS 60 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: THE MOST POWERFUL PRACTICE TO FREE YOUR SOUL: FORGIVENESS!!! Self-Help Tips from Stephen Mitchell, Husband of Byron Katie
Pub date: 2019-11-04
If you’ve ever wanted to live a more beautiful, peaceful life, then do we have the Joseph and the Way of Forgiveness show for you.
Today I’ll be talking with Stephen Mitchell, a brilliant author and interpreter of books including Tao Te Ching, Gilgamesh, The Iliad, The Odyssey, Beowulf, the co-author of three beautiful books with his wife Byron Katie, and the author of one of the most beautiful reads I’ve ever had the privilege of coming across, “Joseph and the Way of Forgiveness”
And that’s just what I want to talk with him about today, about a profound tale to open your heart and ease your life.
Key Points Discussed:
- How to bring more forgiveness into our lives (03:08)
- Has forgiveness always come easy to you? (03:23)
- The inner wisdom that would pull Joseph to do things and that was there for his highest good (10:34)
- The central moment: When Joseph choose not to blame his brothers for throwing him into the pit (12:10)
- The freeing realization that can lift condemnation from ourselves and the rest of the world (17:29)
- What does “May your will be done” mean? (20:57)
- Using God’s name as a synonym for reality and getting out of the human image of God (24:31)
- Accepting what is and seeing every situation as the best that could possibly be happening (31:42)
- How everything that appeared to be the worst thing for Joseph actually served him (37:57)
- The many years of intensive Zen practice and practice of “The Work” that changed Stephen’s life? (47:36)
- The meaning of “The Great Hymn to the Sun” (58:53)
- How important is it to forgive everyone in our lives? (01:02:58)
Additional Resources:
- Joseph and the Way of Forgiveness
- www.TheWork.com
- www.StephenMitchellBooks.com
…….
For free meditations, weekly tips, stories, and similar shows visit: www.InspireNationShow.com
To support the show and get even more great tools, tips, and behind-the-scenes access, visit: www.Patreon.com/InspireNation
And to follow Inspire Nation (and the lives of Michael and Jessica) on Instagram, go to www.instagram.com/inspirenationlive
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Michael Sandler, Jessica Lee, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: HighVibeTribeRadio.com
Episode: How to Dissolve Chronic Pain & Break the Chronic Pain Loop
Pub date: 2019-10-29
Interview with Hal Greenham & Dr. Howard Schubiner.
Do you experience chronic pain that holds you back from living a life you love?
Chronic pain can be complex… involving much more than your physical body…
However, you can live pain-free by retraining your brain — whether the pain is from an injury, a chronic condition, inflammatory disease, or even depression…
Pain psychotherapist Hal Greenham and Howard Schubiner, MD, will share an evidence-based approach to lessen or completely stop your chronic pain, along with a guided practice to get you started on retraining your brain to unhook from pain patterns.
You can register here for their Upcoming Shift Network Event: 3 Keys to Free Yourself From Chronic Pain.About Hal Greenham and Dr. Howard Schubiner
Hal Greenham, BSc (Psych), BA, a somatic psychotherapist, is the Clinical Director and co-founder of Freedom From Chronic Pain. After recovering from his own chronic pain with a neuroplasticity and psychotherapy intervention, he retrained, studying psychology and a number of schools of psychotherapy. Hal specializes in treating chronic pain conditions using the Freedom From Chronic Pain approach, which combine the insights of his work as a therapist with the neuroplasticity techniques of Dr. Schubiner.
Howard Schubiner, MD, is the Clinical Director, medical advisor, and co-founder of Freedom From Chronic Pain. He held the title of Full Professor of Medicine at Wayne State University, where he worked for 18 years. He is the director of the Mind Body Medicine Program at Ascension Providence Hospital in Southfield, Michigan. He is also a Clinical Professor at Michigan State University College of Human Medicine.
Dr. Schubiner is a pioneering clinician and a leading researcher in the field of Mind-Body Medicine, and has been published more than 100 times in scientific books and journals. He is the author of Unlearn Your Pain and Unlearn Your Anxiety and Depression, and the co-author of Hidden From View, with Dr. Allan Abbass. He was included on the list of “Best Doctors in America” four years in a row.
You can visit their website at FreedomFromChroniPain.com
Support the show (https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=Z7GC46DF4BQ7G)
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Liz Gracia, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Commune with Jeff Krasno (LS 52 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Question Your Thoughts with Byron Katie
Pub date: 2019-09-25
Byron Katie became severely depressed while in her thirties. Over a ten-year period, her depression deepened, and for the last two years, Katie was seldom able to leave her bedroom. Then one morning, in the depths of despair, she experienced a life-changing realization. Katie saw that when she believed her thoughts, she suffered; when she didn’t believe her thoughts, she didn’t suffer. What had been causing her depression was not the world around her, but what she believed about the world around her. In a flash of insight, The Work was born.
In this episode, Jeff does The Work with Byron Katie, recalling and reliving a difficult moment in his childhood and turning what was a painful memory into an opportunity for growth.
To learn more about Commune’s course with Byron Katie, visit https://www.onecommune.com/the-work-of-byron-katie
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Commune, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Mind and Fitness Podcast (LS 45 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: 085 - Dr. Howard Schubiner
Pub date: 2019-08-28
The long-anticipated interview is finally here: Dr. Schubiner makes his debut on The Mind and Fitness Podcast. Dr. Schubiner is the director of the Mind Body Medicine Center at Providence Hospital in Southfield, Michigan and a Clinical Professor at Wayne State University and Michigan State University School of Medicine. He has authored over 60 scientific publications and lectures nationally and internationally. He has been included on the list of the Best Doctors in America since 2003.
Dr. Schubiner discusses his training, his practice, his methodology, the role of the brain in chronic pain and illness, and he takes YOUR questions.
This Podcast is sponsored by Yabla: Watch, Listen, Learn. Become Fluent. Yabla is a Language Learning Software Service - available by subscription and accessible via desktop as well as the mobile app. Learn Spanish, French, Italian, Chinese, German or English with easy-to-follow on-screen instructions that allow you to immerse yourself in not only the language, but the culture.
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Eddy Lindenstein, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Ten Percent Happier with Dan Harris (LS 76 · TOP 0.01% what is this?)
Episode: 201: Doing "The Work," Byron Katie
Pub date: 2019-08-21
At 43 years old, Byron Katie was unhappily married, suffered from depression and agoraphobia and was addicted to codeine and alcohol. In fact, she felt so much self-hatred, she slept on the floor believing she did not deserve a bed. Yet in the midst of her crisis, she awoke one morning in a halfway house, with a sense of pure joy. A switch had been flipped and all her suffering disappeared. It had become evident to her that her thoughts were causing all her emotional pain and she had finally broken free. Katie believes she has been given a gift and now spends her life trying to help end suffering for others. Plug Zone The Work of Byron Katie: https://thework.com/ Books: https://www.amazon.com/Byron-Katie/e/B001H6S8B4 Twitter: @ByronKatie Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/theworkofbyronkatie/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8dvufocK9zM6KnkronGbzA The Work App: https://thework.com/the-work-app/ VOICEMAILS Have a question for Dan? Leave us a voicemail: 646-883-8326
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Podcast: Relationship Alive! (LS 54 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 198: Healing Your Earliest Attachment Wounds - with Peter Levine
Pub date: 2019-07-10
How would you know if there were experiences from the earliest moments of your life affecting you here and now? And if you are indeed being impacted by the distant past - what can you do to heal those early traumas so that you’re more free and connected in your current life? Our guest today is Peter Levine, creator of Somatic Experiencing, and author of many bestselling books on healing trauma - “Waking the Tiger”, “In an Unspoken Voice”, and “Trauma and Memory” - just to name a few! Today you’ll learn how to recognize the signs of these deep emotions, and what to do to regulate them, as well as how to help our co-regulate with your partner, to build a stronger, more resilient foundation for your relationship (and within yourself).
As always, I’m looking forward to your thoughts on this episode and what revelations and questions it creates for you. Please join us in the Relationship Alive Community on Facebook to chat about it!
Check out my other episodes with Peter Levine:
Episode 127 of Relationship Alive on Building Resilience
Episode 29 on Healing Your Triggers and Trauma
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Resources:
Visit Peter Levine’s website to learn more about his work and Somatic Experiencing.
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Visit www.neilsattin.com/levine2 to download the transcript, or text “PASSION” to 33444 and follow the instructions to download the transcript to this episode with Peter Levine.
Amazing intro/outro music graciously provided courtesy of: The Railsplitters - Check them Out
Transcript:
Neil Sattin Hello and welcome to another episode of Relationship Alive. This is your host Neil Sattin. As always we are exploring both the relational skills and the inner healing that's required in order to show up fully in your life and in your relationships. Today, we are fortunate to have a return visit from none other than Peter Levine -- one of the world's experts on healing trauma and also the creator of somatic experiencing one of the world's foremost modalities on healing trauma of all kinds. This can be the big kinds of traumas that people think of, you know, with war, and assault, and things like that. Or, it can be the smaller traumas that that still have a huge impact on us, things that happen in our childhood things that happen in our day to day lives. So, today in our conversation with Peter Levine we're going to be talking about how our early attachment traumas affect us in our adult lives and what we can do about that to bring more presence to our relationships. As always we will have a detailed transcript of today's conversation which you can get if you visit Neil-Sattin-dot-com-slash-Levine-2. That's L-E-V-I-N-E, as in Peter Levine and then the number two. Peter has also been on the show a couple other times, so if you, if you check out Episode 127 you can listen to us talking about resilience. Or I used the kind of funny form of that word resiliency, and uh, way back in Episode 29 we were talking about the again the effects of trauma on our lives and how to heal it. So we're building a comprehensive library here for you to help you get present and free your cells as and your physiology as well as your mind and your emotions -- your mind body spirit from the pernicious effects of trauma on our lives.
Neil Sattin So as always Peter thank you so much for joining us here today. It's great to have you again.
Peter Levine Sure, sure.
So let's just without having to give the full picture because I definitely think that our listeners can, can go and check out those other episodes that the two of us have done together. Let's talk about what might constitute an early attachment trauma or an early attachment wounding. What kinds of things would be the kind of thing that might stick with someone into their adult lives?
Peter Levine Yeah. Well you know, I mean, so many things from our past from our deep deep long past do affect us. They don't affect, they don't affect us in ways that we're conscious of, I mean that's part of the problem. And. I think of attachment, probably a little bit different than than most people do. I look more along a developmental arc about what happens to us from womb to, to adolescence and and the memories we carry. Now I said the memories are not conscious. But what are they? Well, we have to just take a couple of minutes to understand, at least comprehend, the different types of memory. Basically that some memories are conscious, are explicit. Other memories are much more unconscious and those are called implicit memories. And our basic attachments have to do with implicit memories. It has very little to do with explicit memories. That's one of the reasons why I think probably therapists often struggle in working with the early attachment wounds because they're so deeply ingrained in the, in the body experience and and can only really be accessed through the vehicle of sensations and these sensations are very primitive sensations very old, very raw. So, if we look at an implicit memories there are basically two types. One type is emotional. And so for example if you're introduced to somebody for the first time and all of a sudden you feel anger or fear or revulsion or just wanting to avoid them. There's a good chance that this stems from earlier experience with somebody who had some of those same qualities, so they get triggered and then they explode in an emotional way. I mean we all experience something like that at different times. You know, as an example, uh, a couple that's riding in their car and the wife is driving and they make a wrong turn. And her husband starts yelling at her: "Don't you know where you're going?" And then of course he starts laughing and they both died laughing. But from that moment something in him something in not being to the party at time or being lost, triggered some kind of a.. an old engram, an old memory trace. I sometimes am a little hesitant to use the word memory because the memories are so different than the conscious explicit memories. Ok, then even deeper than the emotional memories, which again do have to do with our early experiences as well as our development over the lifespan, that the other type of memory is called procedural memory. And these are memories that happen in our bodies and they can be both positive and negative, depending a lot on what our early experiences were in the womb at birth and during the bonding process.
Peter Levine And procedural memories very often are long, longlasting, and I divide them into two categories. One are basic things that the body learns such as for example, teaching a child how to ride a bike. So the parent or an older sibling by the side of the child and has their hands on the bicycle and they walk together and then run together, run and then bikes goes a little bit faster and then just at that right moment the parent lets go of the bike because they sense that the child is being able to balance themselves and then the child rides off on the bicycle and wants to go on the bicycle every day for the next six months. Because they're thrilled at that accomplishment. They now have a new memory, a new procedural memory, a new body memory and that involves a lot of different things that the body does. So if the parent trying to explain to the child: "Well, if you, if you, if you bend over this way your center of gravity will go off that way. So you'll have to turn the bicycle in that direction." It's just impossible.
Neil Sattin Right.
Peter Levine The body learns that quick, quick, quick, and once it's there even with a memory like that a positive memory like that the child is - you never forget how to ride a bicycle. That adage is largely true. It really is. So let me give you an example -- and again those memories can be positive like learning to ride a bike or learning dance steps or they can be highly negative. But let me give you an example and it does affect - It does introduce the relationship between attachment and these memories.
Neil Sattin Ok.
Peter Levine God, I don't know. Twenty, twenty-five years ago or so I was visiting my parents in New York City, in the Bronx. And so I spent the day down in Manhattan going to museums and it was coming back in the train the D train and train was packed with men in similar suits with newspapers folded under their arms. And so. But there was one particular person I just I didn't even see his face. There was just something about his posture that had a strange effect on me and I felt a slight slight expansion of my chest and a little bit of a warmth in my belly as I paid attention to my body sensations. So unbeknownst to me in a way I was having a memory but certainly not a conscious memory because you know I hadn't been the type, who knows why I was having this attachment. So anyhow, he, we both got off at the last stop. The crowds thinned out. Two-hundred-and-fifth street and I walked up to him and the fact, the words came out of my mouth out of my lips. I wasn't even consciously aware of saying them. I touched his arm and I said, "Arnold." And he looked at me utterly perplexed and puzzled. And we just stayed there for a moment. And then I said, "Arnold, you were in my first grade class with Ms. Campini. And well I would say, I would say, he was astonished, we were both astonished. There is something that I knew him in this class many decades before several decades before. Yet there was some attraction to that person because I obviously I don't remember everybody who was in the class. He's probably the only person I do remember that was in my in my first grade class. I mean I do remember bullies and I was very bullied at the time because I came in I was younger I came in in the middle of the class time, middle of the semester, and I had my ears were the same size then as they are now. So kids tease me about and call me Dumbo. And so I was bullied a lot. And Arnold was the one child that seemed to support me that seemed to care about me and it wasn't even verbal support. It was some, I just felt him someway, somehow on my side. So that implicit procedural memory is something that I've carried forth, for the rest of my life. Hopefully our early attachment figures have something like that so that when we are meeting another person, for, in terms of cultivating or being in a relationship or navigating the vicissitudes relationship that we have these positive memories, which have to do with approach. OK. Keep that word in mind. Approach.
Neil Sattin Ok.
Peter Levine If on the other hand we have had neglect, abuse, confusion, in our early experiences, we have procedural memories that are primary avoidance. Hopefully, hopefully, hopefully, hopefully, the positive experiences, the approach experiences are much greater than the avoidance experiences because that's what we need for a healthy relationship. So. OK. So, anyhow let's look at some of the kinds of things that happened early in our experience of the world.
Peter Levine So. So as I was saying hopefully they approach procedural memories outweigh the they avoidance one. But again starting way way back our experiences in utero. You know, if the mother is in a relaxed state, which again is a good reason why hopefully, mothers are able to spend it. Certainly the later part of their pregnancy at home doing things they enjoy to do settling, resting, preparing, that, so, however if the mother is under a lot of stress, accumulated stress during that period particularly the later part of gestation, that stress through different channels is actually passed on to the fetus. It does this by certain chemicals that are released when the mother is under stress but also direct neural mechanisms that, that, that, that increase or decrease the blood flow to the placent-placenta itself. So the placenta increases level of carbon dioxide, less oxygen, which stresses the fetal nervous system and overstimulated it. And then, what often happens in these studies were done in animals of course, is that you have this tremendously increase in the activity of the whole brain. But then after a certain point it just shuts down. And so again here already, we're hopefully having positive implicit experiences, but we also might be having negative ones.
Peter Levine Then birth of course is the next stage here in development and my sense is that the, the utilization of midwives and doulas is a little bit starting to come back taking the birth process out of the realm of a, of a disease that needs to be dealt with medically.
Neil Sattin Right.
Peter Levine To part of a natural process. But anyhow. And so during that time again the fetus the newborn can be extremely stressed. But, here's the, here's the, the, the hopeful part because eh, that the parents, the caregivers can also soothe the distress of the infant after it's born, can really hold it, rock it, soothe it, patiently. So again it's getting a positive imprint a positive memory of being able to be helped out of the distressed state into a state of settling, of a relaxation because remember an infant can not regulate itself. If it's distressed, it has precious little in the way of being able to, to, to come down from that activation and that will -- and calm itself. It needs to be, the term used often is, co-regulated by the caregiver. So by holding, soothing, singing, gently rocking all of those kinds of things helps the newborn regulate.
Neil Sattin So.
Peter Levine And again. Yeah go ahead, anytime you want.
Neil Sattin So there are a couple things that are jumping out at me. One of them being that from the youngest moments of our existence, we're creating memories that are that are not the kind of memory that you would typically think about, you know, where you can picture a story in your head of something happening. These are actual body memories and emotional experiences that just live within us and can be evoked in the present. But they don't necessarily, they're not necessarily something that have a story attached to them that you would consciously remember.
Peter Levine Yes.
Neil Sattin And then the second piece that's popping into place for me is around how, so there are all these things that are just kind of happening to us when we're in the womb. And then when we come out and are born there's this additional component where we're associating these really intense visceral experiences in our neurobiology with our primary caregiver so with our primary attachment figures, and I can already see this kind of setting up what plays out in, in our future selves when we are actually entering partnership with others, so we create attachments as adults with the people who are, who we can be most vulnerable with, most cared for most caring to, et cetera. But it's like --.
Peter Levine Or the opposite.
Neil Sattin Exactly. Good point, good point. And memory being what it is, just the presence of these people will naturally evoke some of these early memories. And then if we're not aware that that's happening, it's clear that that could create all sorts of problems because you might think that it's something specifically about your partner that is evoking this particular sensation, you might not know you're having a memory you might think whatever they just did is absolutely disgusting, and revolting and whereas you're really actually having a memory and I'm wondering as an adult how do we begin to tease apart the two or is it not even really important to do that? Maybe it's more important to just think about how we process those experiences so that they're not impacting us quite so profoundly?
Peter Levine All right. Well actually let me go back to, to baby time.
Neil Sattin Yeah. Let's go back.
Peter Levine Before we go to adult. And this is and this is actually an example of work with a 14 month old and the session is all, is described and along with photographs in, in my most recent book, "Trauma And Memory: Brain And Body In A Search For The Living Past." So again it's how the past lives within us. Anyhow Baby Jack was born of an extremely traumatic birth. The cord was three ti-- it was around his neck three times, at the last minute he turned breech and he had the more mother tried to push, the more that Jack tried to propel against the uterine wall. He became more and more wedged at the apex of the uterus. In other words, oh! Maybe some people don't know that actually the birth process itself is not just about the mother pushing the baby out, but the baby actually pushing itself out. So the more Jack pushed the more he got wedged, the more he got stuck in, you know in the new apex of the uterus, and so they did an emergency caesarean his, his heart rate was starting to go down significantly. And even so they still couldn't pull him out. So they use suction to pull him out. And use it -- this is a very traumatic birth. And he was suffering from some physical symptoms which would have required that they do endoscopes and also looking into his lung, uh, a procedure which would have certainly really add a tremendous amount of traumatization to this fourteen, to this infant which has already been highly traumatized. So the baby has been highly traumatized. So I start to work with him. And again and you'll see that the pictures in the book. But I take some wrapped rattles that were made for me by a Hopi person and I wrap them a little bit to get his attention and he's he's an alert person but his mother says he never will, you know, uh, stay still. Never just stay her lap and mold into her. She never had that experience of him. So she say "He'll maybe come over. But then he is off to the next thing again." And she says, "Oh and he can be okay when he is alone." So again you see this thing in relationships, when we're alone where we do we perceive ourselves to be OK, but then when we're in a relations with somebody, we can lose all of that. So anyhow he reaches for the rattle as I hand it towards him. And then he retracts his hand his arm and just, it goes limp. And so he is now having a memory. He cannot talk about this memory because he doesn't really have words and even if he could they wouldn't be the words that could, would work. So then I give the rattle to him again and this time he pushes against the rattle. And I say "Yeah that's great, Jack." You know because he had all, he was taken away. All these tubes all these procedures that were done, and he felt, he was helpless. He was this little teeny baby and all of these, you know, giants were doing these things towards him. So anyhow we continue with this and at one point I put my hand on his middle back, because I see that's where he stiffens when his mother starts talking about needing to, the doctors wanting to do an endoscopy. So anyhow this time he pushes against her leg really pushes any propelled, as though it was propelling himself through the birth canal as though it really was. Anyhow after that he just starts crying and crying and crying. It's just birth cry sounds. And his mother is just astonished. She said, "I've almost never heard him cry and I've never seen tears coming down." His tears coming from his eyes. And you can see it's both a combination of amazement and relief and she doesn't even quite know what that relief is about.
Peter Levine Then at, at the end of this crying there is deep spontaneous breaths, deep spontaneous breaths and he just positions himself so he can mold into the mother's shoulder and then she knows exactly what to do now.
Peter Levine She put her arm around him and gently holds him and you see them attaching. So it wasn't that she was a bad mother that prevented the attachment. That wasn't the case. It was that they got disconnected at birth. She was definitely a, in Winnicott's terms, a good enough mother, very caring mother. But again you see in youth, and you can see it in the pictures, her complete delight at him doing this and then they come in the next week for a checkup. And his mother says, "Oh, when, when we got home Jack went to sleep, and then at one o'clock in the morning he called out, 'Mama! Mama!' And she she came in and picked him up and he molded again right into her arm, right into her shoulders."
Peter Levine So this here is a, is a definitely implicit memory. And it turned out to be positive. But what if nothing had been done at that, had been done at that time. Then you can certainly project ahead and probably have a pretty good guess that he is going to have difficulties in relationships, that he's going to have difficulty in getting really close and bonding and attachment. So I'd be able to change that memory from the timeframe of this birth that really made it much more possible for him to have secure attachments in other later relationships. There's one thing I like to say about that. Oh OK. So even in this case, in a case, like this where there has been trauma, er, around the birth and around early attachment, we are still able to work with those memories. They may not be as accessible as they were with Baby Jack. But, but at the same time we can use language and imagery to help the person connect with those procedural memories and to transform them, to transmute them, from negative ones which were dominating Jack to positive ones of approach. And again we want a relationship -- a relationship is not going to be able to really survive, unless there is much more approach memories than avoidance memories. But again these things can be shifted even in our adult life, but they will come up in close relationships. And if we have had those difficulties experienced negative experience if we were neglected... You know, when I was born, the medical wisdom at the time was, first of all, give the mother all kinds of drugs and then do not breastfeed because breast-feeding was unsanitary. I mean, can you imagine how archaic that was?
Neil Sattin Oh my god.
Peter Levine And to add insult to injury they also instructed parents not to pick, not to pick up their babies when the babies were crying because the babies would just use that to manipulate them.
Neil Sattin Right.
Peter Levine I mean think about that, that, that's abuse. Frankly, as we understand today. But that was the that, was the that was the understanding of the time the wisdom at the time.
Peter Levine So anyhow when people from my generation were crying and upset we weren't held. And so that's the memory that we carry, that when we're upset we will not be able to calm. So we're, if we're upset in adult relationship we do not expect to be calmed, and we won't even allow ourselves to be calmed. So we either avoid the relationship or become over dependent in the relationship to soothe us because we're unable to be soothed. And again one of the things that we teach in somatic experiencing, is to help people learn this is part of working with these procedural memories, to have people learn to be able to regulate themselves. And for couples to learn how to regulate each other, because there's a pretty good chance that if you you're dysregulated you find a dysregulated person to, to be in relationship with or, or opposite.
Neil Sattin Yeah. So, wow, there are so many things jumping out at me right now and I definitely obviously we're not going to go through the whole body of work of somatic experiencing right now. I do hope that we can offer our listeners a few things they can do when they notice these things coming out. All your books that I've read have been such a revelation to me and in particular when it comes to applying your work, there is a rather thin book called "Healing Trauma," that we've spoken about before, that I think is just so great because it offers like a whole sequence of exercises that people can work through that, that take you on this journey of of uncovering these implicit memories and and unearthing them and being able to resolve them in the moment like you were describing resolving or the resolution of your work with that with baby Jack. When you were describing the ways that your generation was or that your parents were taught to to care for your generation when you were born. It made me also think about the way that trauma is passed from generation to generation because what I think happened to a lot of people in my generation was that their parents were, you know, the product of this whole you know don't, don't breastfeed the baby, don't pick up the baby, and then when when they were presented with a baby that was crying or inconsolable, even if they had a different sense maybe of like, "Oh I'm supposed to be doing this differently or differently than my parents did." It's evoking all of these implicit memories for my parents. Um, and which makes it much more challenging for them to show up as a regulating force for their children.
Peter Levine Yeah yeah yeah. Or sometimes the parents will try to do the opposite of what they had experienced. And so there's another key feature here which is also important is, that absolutely you know for the first several some months after birth the child basically has to be held and rocked, eh, when it's upset. But then you know starting after several months like nine months or so, it's also important that, because once the child has had enough solid procedural m-memories, experience of being calm, being settled then it is important to at least allow for the child to be upset for some amount of time, so that they can also bring in their capacity, their gradually learned capacity to self regulate. And often parents who come, where they were not picked up, and where they were just left in this, this, this swamp of distress, they may have trouble to not immediately pick up their baby when it's crying and then immediately hold it.
Peter Levine So, sometimes those children don't develop a full enough capacity for self regulation, which can also can be problematic in later relationships, because of course we're going to be upset with things that our, that our spouses do, our partners do. And... But the question is do we have tools so that we don't just go into profound distress and despair every time something happens that upsets us. So we do need to have both, I think, I just mentioned this, the capacity to regulate and to co-regulate and to get some of these skills that the book that you mentioned, book-CD, actually by "sounds true" called "Healing Trauma," something like, "A pioneering program for healing trauma." I don't know but anyhow...
Neil Sattin "A Pioneering Program For Restoring The Wisdom of Your Body."
Peter Levine Ah. That's it. OK thank you. So again, some of the exercises where we learn to regulate states of arousal, of fear, of anger -- so that we don't have to constantly rely on the other person. But at the same time a healthy relationship also involves co-regulation. Particularly, hopefully, when we're able to say and this may this is, a kind of a higher state, "Dear. I'm really feeling so unsettled and anxious. Could you please just hold me for a little bit?" And, then if the other, if the other partner is in a relatively grounded, calm place themselves then they most likely will want to offer that.
Peter Levine So again it's a combination of co-regulation, transmuting into or developing into the capacity to self regulate. And then as adolescents and adults to be able to switch between self-regulation and co regulation. So again we are in a sense transforming these procedural memories where we did not have positive experience of being co regulated or we didn't develop the capacity to self regulate, to self regulate.
Neil Sattin So, how would I know if I'm having an experience where, where it would make sense for me to check in with my partner let's say and ask for some co regulation? What kinds of experiences would I be having within me that might be an indication of like, "Oh wait. That's..." So when when someone hears this, they'll be like, "Oh that's the thing that Peter Levine was talking about. And look I'm experiencing that right now. Maybe I should go ask my my partner if they'll hold me for a minute and see what happens."
Peter Levine Right. Well guess what. It's absolutely not... It's not going to happen at once, at once. It's a skill that one has to really, really build. But the basic idea is that when we become upset, become emotional, become angry, become fearful, become sad, that's out of proportion to what's happening here in the present, then that's a almost certain guarantee. It's a certain guarantee that we're dealing with some kind of imprinted procedural memory a negative, in a word, memory. And so while we're in the midst of it it's going to be harder to ask for help. But if we know how to co-reg, uh, how to self regulate ourselves, even a little bit then we can realize, "OK, I'm upset but I'm upset so much more than you know then my partner saying “you know I'm not going to be able to get together tomorrow because I have to work, for dinner. I have to work later at work." OK. So really upset. But if that child had been abandoned as an, as as a baby, then all of a sudden that abandonment comes in, and for an infant being abandoned would cause death. If if the baby is abandoned for enough time.
Neil Sattin Right.
Peter Levine And so we will experience this, this perceived rejection as a life threat. OK, so again if we know enough about our implicit memories we can then be able to kind of soothe ourselves, and I give exercises for that, to soothe ourselves and then to be able to enter back into the relationship. But it's a skill that really needs to be developed and good therapy, both couples and individual therapy, can really help to facilitate this kind of cooperation, between, between our relationships, our primary relationships as adults.
Neil Sattin Yeah, no, I've mentioned it on the on the show before and I think when when you were on... Maybe the first time you were on, we, we went over the "Voo" exercise and that's something that Chloe and I we do together all the time when we notice one or the other being in a dysregulated state to help us come back into balance with each other. It's super helpful.
Peter Levine Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean there are a number of exercises like the Voo exercise, like the self holding exercise, where it is bringing one's awareness to the parts of our body which are not feeling horrifically. And so that could be our, our hands or our feet even. So again there's a number of different exercises that we can learn from and learn how to self regulate enough. You know there's a Motown song that goes something like: "It takes one to stand in the dark alone. It takes two to let the light shine through." So I think again it's this combination of being responsible for our own implicit memories, our own emotional and procedural memories. But also to be, to be cognizant about them enough so that we can enter into co-regulation and that co-regulation really enhances the attachment, the adult attachment and secures that relationship, solidifies that relationship, build it into a positive experience. So you know, again a lot of times all these things that happened to us can have these different effects that really will disrupt the relationship. Let me give you one example. I was working with this woman, young woman, who was abused by a sports coach when she was 13 years old, and because she is a teenager, she thought that he was in love with her. She certainly was in love, whatever that means, with him. And then she was rejected by him. Anyhow, those were really, eh, procedural memories and so when her husband would try to touch her. She would go into anger or revulsion and just want to push him away. So. And of course he was deeply deeply upset cuz he had no idea what to do. So I had worked with her to do a few sessions and then suggested that they would come in together. And they were sitting as far away as possible from each other and they talked about their resentments. That he never gives me eye contact, she never gives me eye contact. So they were talking about wanting to make contact but they couldn't do it. So after this went on for 30 minutes where they were basically blaming each other I asked if they would be willing to try an experiment. And I said, "This is, there's a risk at this. I mean hopefully this will help but it might not. Are you willing to take that risk?" And they both said yes. So then, he, I had him where he was sitting and then I had her going to explain this both to them sit with her back towards him and kind of having his knee a little bit like touching her shoulder. So she could feel this contact but it didn't demand eye contact and it was touching in a relatively, in a relatively safe way. And so at first I could see they you know they felt very awkward and I encouraged them just to keep noticing their body sensations and maybe just report them out loud and they did that for a while and then for the first time she could say that she felt some safety with her husband. But otherwise it was all threat and confusion the confusion of this 13 year old adolescent. So, again all of these things will affect our attachments profoundly. But the good news is there are things that we can do about that. So, again I hope I'm not pitching too much, but I, I really do recommend that people, even if they're not therapists, read "Trauma and Memory," because it really helps to explain the nature of all of these memories that we have a better idea of the map of where we are, and also the understanding of when we're hyper activated or when we're shut down, which I cover deeply in, "An Unspoken Voice." So. And then of course the one that you mentioned. So all of these really talk about a map to know where we are. What is it, if we're, if we're angry with a person, there's energy in that we can more easily work with that. But what happens if when with the person our whole organism shuts down and goes into a protective shell, where we can't easily be reached then we have to help the person come out of that shutdown into a more activated state, and then learn to regulate... co-regulate that state and then to learn to self regulate that state. I know that's a mouthful. I'm putting in it at the end but...
Neil Sattin Yeah way to drop the bomb, Peter! You know I'm curious when maybe you could offer something then. So because I think it's so common for a partner when they feel their beloved shutting down in some sense to not really know what to do in that moment to not know how to how to speak to them or how to respond in a way. So, what would the invitation be there?
Peter Levine So sometimes you know instead of like being like confronting each other, uh, indoors, to, or at least I mean even indoors but hopefully outdoors if the weather is clement, is to just walk together, side by side and talk instead of trying to face each other, which is bringing up a lot of those difficult emotions. And when you're walking you're less likely to shut down. So, that's the first thing I would recommend. Don't, if you, if if things are stuck just walk together side by side because there's something just in that gesture side by side which is supportive which is caring. And caring that the person can actually experience.
Peter Levine Then I'll suggest doing some of the exercises like the "Voo exercise", you know the long easy sustain "voo" directing it from the belly. And that's one way of helping people both come out of shutdown or if they're in a hyper state, to calm the hyper state. So, I would suggest that they do the exercise and maybe especially do them together so that they feel more settled and in this more settled place they're able to engage each other, much more in the here and now, rather than in there and then. So, again that's why I use the term brain and body in the search for the living past, how the past lives within us and what we can do about it - how we can change the past so that we can be in the present.
Peter Levine And when two people are in the present with each other who care about each other that solidifies the bond and takes that out of the realm of things like adaptations, like codependency.
Neil Sattin Right and gets them into that space where, they can, they can re-experience those memories but metabolize them into something positive, where they're feeling like, "Oh I'm experiencing that, but my partner is here to support me like now I know what it's like to actually feel supported in this...
Peter Levine Exactly. Exactly. And again when we're able to cultivate in the relationship to the degree that we're able to do that, we're solidifying the relationship. Because difficult times will happen. I mean there is no -- I don't know of any relationships where, where crises have never occurred. Some kind -- it can be a small crisis but it can also be a really big crisis. So the question, is are we fortified enough have we built the foundation of our relationship somatically, so that when these things do occur we're able to weather them and co regulate each other. And I'm thinking sometimes of something that's really devastating. Like when a child dies or gets seriously ill, that's the time really that the parents need to co-regulate each other.
Neil Sattin Mm hmm.
Peter Levine But that's also the time where there's a tendency to distance. Or to blame. Rather than to connect.
Neil Sattin Right. Right. Those are the moments where you need each other more than ever really.
Peter Levine More than ever. But again if we've solidified that, up to that point then the chances of us getting through that are greatly enhanced.
Neil Sattin Yeah. It makes perfect sense. Makes perfect sense. And, and I could see you know, for instance even just with something as simple as taking a walk and doing the "Voo” together. That doing that in times that aren't dysregulated. That it's setting the stage for that just becoming something that you can rely on in a challenging moment.
Peter Levine Yeah yeah. You know many people, many couples, many individuals are reported when they did that with their partner, did the walking, the "Voo"ing that kind of thing -- they were really angry and fearful and blaming and they just walked for a while did the "VU" and then both of them started spontaneously laughing and laughing and laughing and crying and laughing. And then just kind of both seeing the ridiculousness of those, of that reaction but also their appreciation for the other.
Neil Sattin So yeah I can relate. And it's so important too, I think because when you're stuck in an old memory, that translates often into thoughts, the kinds of thoughts like that, "You're not safe with this person or that they're out to get you." And, and but the feelings actually precede the thoughts. So if you're able to tackle your somatic experience that feeling in your body, then the thought shifts.
Peter Levine Yeah. Right. The emotions precede the thoughts and the procedural memories come... uh, procedural memories are what's also evoking their emotional memories.
Neil Sattin Yeah.
Peter Levine So again and in somatic experiencing, we do a lot of work from the bottom up from sensations then to affects, then to new meanings. And so that couple had the new meaning like, "Oh my gosh. I don't have to feel so alone when I'm feeling angry or fearful I just need to ask for some kind of connection such as what we were just mentioning. Yeah. So again these are tools I hope that couples all know and practice a bit so that when they really, when it's really called upon that it'll be there. And again, my experience is that can really determine in a crisis time whether people, whether couples stay together, work together, stay together cooperate together, or where they split.
Neil Sattin Right. Yeah. Well, Peter thank you again for all your time and wisdom and you know, the years and years of dedication to unearthing ways to heal from traumas that happened to us before we even were aware of them. And your work is so important, I think to finding ourselves again and again in the present, especially when we're in partnership and you know evoking each other's deep emotional experience all over the place and hopefully, hopefully healing together as well.
Peter Levine Yes, yep, that's the idea.
Neil Sattin Before I go there's some work that's a little tangential to this conversation but I just wanted to give you an opportunity to mention it because it's so important that has to do with the ways that the effects of stored trauma, unprocessed trauma, in our bodies results in chronic illness and I know, I know you've been hard at work on ways to help people through that.
Peter Levine Yes.
Neil Sattin Would you mind taking a moment to just talk about what that is and...?
Peter Levine Oh yeah yeah yeah. No, gladly because that's something that really really excites me really turns me on. It over the years some 40 plus years. Um, I've probably worked with thousands of people who have had what would now be called conditions like fibromyalgia, irritable bowel, chronic fatigue, severe PMS, migraines, urinary problems and so forth. And working with them, with SE, has been quite effective. And these are conditions that don't have a medical diagnosis. There are now calls sometimes in medicine MUS, medically unexplained symptoms. MUS. And there's no help for many of them, some people do have something organically wrong of course and that has to be eliminated. But many of these people are just thrown from doctor to doctor, specialist to specialist, with you know, with no help. And you know even after the diagnosis of fibromyalgia, I think in 1980 to 94, 84... Still very very few physicians understood that but certainly almost nobody understood that it was not something that was just in a person's head. But these are functional disorders involving our stress responses basically. So you know thinking about that. There are probably at least 10 or 20 million people suffering in the US alone with those kind of symptoms and there's no amount of therapists. I mean that could really help all of these people and many people can't really afford therapists and so forth and they really need something that they can use even if they are doing therapy to be an adjunct of supportive therapy. So along with, uh, a project manager, an entrepreneur and an M.I.T. specialist in computer human interaction affective communication. And then three other programmers, we've been working in the last two and a half years on this program, be a program or an app, that people can use at home to help them heal those kinds of sick, uh, symptoms. And we'll be finally testing the first version of that in the next couple of months. So I'm both also I'm excited but I'm also a little bit, like, anxious... A little trepidation you know like putting in all this work. And I bet and I know it's going to help. I mean we did a proof of concept at the very beginning. And, it had very powerful effect but anyhow that's that's really where my a lot of my energy is right now. It's in, in, in continuing to develop that as we start getting feedback from the first... or, actually the second test group. So if you want to be glad to let you know when we're up and about.
Neil Sattin Definitely and we can we can send a blast out to everyone on our email list about that. And, and your assistant Melissa who is such a blessing, she also wanted me to mention that if if you send an email to Ergos-Levine-at-gmail-dot-com and that's spelled E R G O S L E V I N E at gmail-dot-com then then they can let you know and there's maybe even a chance that that those people can get involved in the testing of that app as well it sounds like.
Peter Levine Yeah.
Neil Sattin So. And of course you're always out teaching and people can participate in your public courses. There are some on the East Coast in the fall. There's a course in London in June. And if they visit is it, Somatic-Experiencing-dot-com? Then they can sort of see everything that you’r e doing.
Peter Levine I believe so. I believe so. Yeah some of the stuff I'm doing yeah.
Neil Sattin Well Peter. Peter it's always a pleasure to chat with you. And I've so enjoyed your generosity of time and wisdom over the years. And thanks so much again for dropping in with us here on Relationship Alive.
Peter Levine OK. Take good care.
Neil Sattin You too Peter. Take care.
Neil Sattin And as just a reminder if you want a transcript of this conversation and also the relevant links and things you can visit Neil-Sattin-dot-com slash-Levine-2. That's L E V I N E, and the number two or you can text the word passion to the number 3 3 4 4 4 and follow the instructions where you'll be able to download the complete transcript of our conversation. All right thanks again.
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Podcast: The Body Awake (LS 41 · TOP 1.5% what is this?)
Episode: Our Interconnected Bodies, Trauma & What Now with Peter Levine — ep 49
Pub date: 2019-06-15
Peter Levine founded Somatic Experiencing, a body-oriented approach to healing trauma. In this interview, we hear about the origins of that work, and a lot about what's now, and what's next, for this pioneer.
Find Somatic Experiencing, and more of Peter Levine's bio, at https://traumahealing.org/
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Liam Bowler + Dynamic Alignment Bodywork, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The School of Greatness (LS 79 · TOP 0.01% what is this?)
Episode: 800 Byron Katie: Enlightenment Is Within You
Pub date: 2019-05-22
QUESTION WHAT YOU’RE BELIEVING. We’re a slave to our thoughts. And most of the time, they’re not true. “This person doesn’t care about me. This person did this to me. I’m not worthy of love.” Our thoughts create suffering. So how can we stop believing them? On today’s episode of The School of Greatness, I talk about the ego and how to investigate our thoughts with the creator of The Work: Byron Katie. Byron Katie is a speaker and author who teaches a method of self-inquiry known as "The Work". She is the founder of Byron Katie International, an organization that includes The School for the Work and Turnaround House. TIME describes her as "a spiritual innovator for the 21st century.” Byron walks us through her four questions that help us investigate the stories we tell ourselves. After listening to this episode, you can download the worksheet for free and work on investigating your own stories. So get ready to learn how to live fearlessly on Episode 800. Some Questions I Ask: Why were you so depressed in the first place? (6:00) How do we eliminate anger? (26:00) How often do you feel suffering? (42:00) When you see something that is unjust, what do you do? (56:00) How do we tap into an abundant mindset? (1:00:00) In This Episode You Will Learn: How Byron Katie came out of her depression (5:00) Why our brain thinks harmful thoughts (13:00) The “four questions” to get rid of untrue thoughts (18:00) The four noble truths (38:00) Why it’s important to investigate our thoughts (50:00) How to not allow fears of the future to affect your present (1:05:00)
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Lewis Howes, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 140: Ask David--Hypochondria, Abuse Survivors, Healthy Euphoria, Mania, ADHD, LSD and more!
Pub date: 2019-05-13
Do I have ADHD? Is it a real disorder? Hi podcast fans,
Today we've got some terrific questions that you have submitted.
General Questions
- Jose and Bri both asked: How would you treat hypochondria?
- Christian: How would you treat an abuse survivor? I’ve heard that talk therapy is inadequate for healing trauma!
- Ted: Is there such a thing as healthy euphoria?
- Hillary: Would you do a podcast covering the treatment of mania?
- Jim: I think I have ADHD, but some doctors claim it’s not a true diagnosis. What do you think?
- Dan: What your thoughts are on LSD in the treatment of depression and anxiety?
I could not get to all of your excellent questions in the time provided. The next time we do Ask David with general questions, we will include these:
- Guy: What’s a nervous breakdown?
- Rob: How would you treat a field goal kicker who’s afraid of missing the winning field goal? Would you use positive visualizations?
- Michael: How would you treat someone with the fear of aging? I turn 60 in a few months!
- Hidem: How fast is fast? You seem to get super-fast recoveries from your patients most of the time. How about other therapists? How rapidly does the average patient recover>
- Rubens: What you can do when you're upset but can't identify any negtaive thoughts?
Next week, our Ask David will focus on questions about relationship conflicts and problems. Rhonda and I have lots of other cool programs planned in upcoming weeks.
Thanks for tuning in today, and over the past months. We will hit one million downloads in a week or two (this is April, 2019). Rhonda, Fabrice, and I deeply appreciate your support!
David and Rhonda
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Podcast: Inspire Nation Show with Michael Sandler (LS 60 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: HOW TO LOVE THE HATERS! Matt Kahn
Pub date: 2019-05-06
If you’ve ever wanted more peace and less conflict in your life, then do we have the How to Love the Haters, Everything is Here to Help You show for you.
Today I’ll be speaking again with Matt Kahn, one of my all-time favorite spiritual teachers and authors, and authors of Whatever Arises Love that, and Everything is Here to Help You!
And that’s just what I want to talk with him about today, about why everything is here to help you, even the haters, and challenging people in our lives.
Everything is Here to Serve You Self-Improvement and Self-Help Topics Include:
- Why do spiritually people get sick?
- What’s a spiritual vaccination?
- What does it mean to welcome in the newly expanded selves?
- Who are the haters?
- Why do they lash out at others?
- What’s a new level of understanding or reframing of our internal fires?
- What’s it mean that we’re spiraling upwards?
- What is the upward expression of our repressed energy?
- Why the lashing out is really an attack on one’s inner world?
- What does it mean to be stuck in one’s shadow?
- What is happening when we are attacked by a hater?
- What is going on inside of a hater when they are attacking?
- What it means to perceive someone as outside of their comfort zone?
- What’s the persecution of a threatened heart?
- Why we want to love up the haters?
- What we can learn about those who want to control and dominate others?
- Why getting our way is not the way to get ourselves happy?
- What is object consciousness and how can we move past this?
- How can we send others love?
- How can we turn the love inward toward ourselves?
- How can we handle the haters at work?
- How can we handle the haters in our family?
- What can we do for our kids when there are bullies???
- For More Info Visit: www.MattKahn.org
Matt Kahn on How to Shift Your Life & the World Through the Power of Love! Health | Inspiration | Motivation | Spiritual | Spirituality | Meditation | Inspirational | Motivational | Self-Improvement | Self-Help | Inspire
For more similar shows visit: www.InspireNationShow.com
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Podcast: CIIS Public Programs (LS 43 · TOP 1.5% what is this?)
Episode: Gabor Mate: On Mind Body Unity
Pub date: 2019-04-10
In this episode, addiction expert Gabor Mate is joined in conversation by CIIS Dean of Alumni Richard Buggs to discuss his groundbreaking work on trauma and the mind/body connection.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from CIIS Public Programs, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Higher Practice Podcast for Optimal Mental Health (LS 43 · TOP 1.5% what is this?)
Episode: The Inner Thoughts of a Trauma Guru - Dr. Peter Levine - HPP 51
Pub date: 2019-04-01
Years ago, trauma was defined more by external events rather than the responses human beings have to those events. Psychological trauma can happen to anyone when they perceive a situation as a threat and are unable to complete a satisfactory fight, flight or freeze response.
The nervous system is designed to keep us psychological intact when we perceive we cannot keep ourselves safe in a situation. However, if we do not address the way in which our nervous and memory system categorized the event, the aftermath can be quite devastating.
In this episode you’ll learn about:
- The origins of Somatic Experiencing from the founder
- Why Somatic Experiencing works so well with trauma
- The basics of how trauma gets trapped in the body
- The simple protocols that go a long way
- The spiritual implications of trauma
- The relationship between presence, dissociation and trauma
- Trans-generational trauma
- MDMA-assisted psychotherapy
- Where trauma work is headed
Visit www.higherpractice.com/podcast to get the show notes and to learn more about Keith Kurlander.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Keith Kurlander, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Going Beyond the Food: Mindset, Intuitive Eating, Body Image, Diet Culture and Anti-Diet Podcast (LS 48 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: 180-The Emotional Body: Part 4-Holistic Approach to Make Peace with Food and Body with Dr. Joan Rosenberg
Pub date: 2019-02-21
Why do I need to go beyond the food to make peace with food and my body
That’s the one question I get and yes...
that’s a very valid question, and to be honest, a very good starting point for us to have a very powerful conversation.
We’ve been trained for years via diet culture to seek a solution to our food, weight and body issues with food and exercise. If we whip in shape our physical body, we will get result. Get thinner... and then, we’ll be happy and healthy.
yet it doesn’t work. We know that and hence why you and I are here...
Why doesn’t it work... because our relationship with food and body doesn’t stem from our physical body, rather it shows up in our physical body. It originates from our mind, emotions, and spirit.
That’s what I’ve found through my own struggle and later on what my training and education has taught me. The 4 layers of the human being is what we address in the Going Beyond the Food Method. It stems from a very old body of work - Holistic health.
In today’s episode, will deep dive into the emotional body particularly with Dr. Joan Rosenberg.
In show 177, we spoke about the mental body with Christina Hyland.
In show 178, we spoke about the spiritual body with Dr. Louise Swartswalter.
In show 179, we spoke about the physical body with Dr. Michelle Sands.
Finally, show 181 we’ll talk about a unique aspect of human that has a tremendous impact on why we urge to eat or self-destruct via body shaming: our nervous system with our resident expert, Irene Lyon.
In this episode I discuss * The role of the Emotional Body in relation to the holistic health model * The real purpose of our emotions * How having emotional strength is part of confidence, too: Developing emotional strength
Last episode was an interview with Dr. Michelle Sands and she talked about the role of the physical body in relation to the holistic health model.
She also shared her view why we cannot separate each of the 4 bodies from each other and the impact of menopause and perimenopause to women’s body’s overall health.
Finally, she detailed why suffering is optional when dealing with perimenopause and menopause and how the Physical Body plays as a vehicle to making peace with food and body. Click here!
Leave me a review, if you enjoy the show and would love to encourage and support my work, leave me an honest review using this link, click here. For a podcaster like me, reviews are like a fuel... and I would appreciate hearing from you more than I could possibly say!
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Links mentioned in the episode Dr. Joan Rosenberg latest book: 90 Seconds to a Life You Love
Dr. Joan Rosenberg free gift
Take the Self-assessment to evaluate your relationship to food and weight
Free Audio Training
Episode 177: The Mental Body
Episode 178: The Spiritual Body
Episode 179: The Physical Body
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Podcast: Oprah's Super Soul (LS 84 · TOP 0.01% what is this?)
Episode: Byron Katie: Set Yourself Free
Pub date: 2019-02-20
Best-selling author, speaker and teacher Byron Katie shares how she believes we can end our own suffering forever. Katie, as she is known, guides us through her powerful process of inquiry she calls “The Work.” She says we can radically shift our stressful beliefs about our lives, other people and ourselves. Katie explains that all the problems in the world originate in our thinking and gives us the tools to open our minds and set ourselves free. Based on her own experience of how suffering is created and ended, Katie says her simple process is accessible to people of all ages and backgrounds and requires nothing more than a pen, paper and an open mind. Katie is the founder of “Byron Katie International,” an organization that includes The School for the Work and Turnaround House in Ojai, California. TIME magazine describes her as "a spiritual innovator for the 21st century."
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Oprah, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Thoughtful Counselor (LS 46 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: EP114: Reconsidering Chronic Pain - How Understanding the Neuroscience of Pain Can Transform Treatment with Howard Schubiner
Pub date: 2019-02-08
Support us at www.patreon.com/thethoughtfulcounselor
A conversation with Dr. Howard Schubiner on the latest neuroscience approaches to understanding and treating chronic pain. Dr. Schubiner's Mind Body Program emphasizes the way the unconscious brain and neural pathways (versus structural abnormalities) are the cause of most chronic pain and require a different approach to treatment than standard pharmacological and/or pain psychology frameworks.
For more about Dr. Schubiner, links from the conversation, and the APA citation for this episode visit
Make sure to check out:
Theory of Change Podcast
Leader's Project interview with Jared Rose
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Podcast: Being Human (LS 29 · TOP 10% what is this?)
Episode: #39 Waking the Tiger - with Peter Levine, PhD
Pub date: 2018-12-21
Sign Up For Our Newsletter: http://www.firsthuman.com/being-human-newsletter/
In this episode I speak with a major thinker and pioneer in the field of trauma and recovery and author of the seminal "Waking The Tiger", Dr. Peter Levine.
We talk: - The concept of re-enactment and why it's so important to understand for personal and business relationships - How memory formation works and what we mean by implicit and explicit memory - Why trauma is still so taboo - How Dr.Levine first discovered the natural mechanisms we can use to recover from trauma - What we can do within businesses to acknowledge and benefit from understanding trauma
Enjoy!
Links: www.traumahealing.com - home of The Somatic Experiencing Trauma Institute
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Richard Atherton, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Trauma Therapist (LS 54 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Episode 324: Moving Out of Survival Mode. Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2018-12-18
Irene Lyon, MSC., is a nervous system specialist who helps people release their deepest traumas from their nervous systems, allowing them to finally heal from chronic mental, physical, and emotional conditions they’ve tried everything to fix.
Irene has intensively studied and practices the work of Dr. Moshe Feldenkrais, Peter Levine (founder of Somatic Experiencing) and Kathy Kain (founder of Somatic Practice).
Irene has a master’s degree in research in the fields of biomedical and health science and regularly appears on podcasts and online summits teaching all things nervous system health, healing trauma and neuroplasticity.
Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-trauma-therapist-podcast-with-guy-macpherson-phd-inspiring-interviews-with-thought-leaders-in-the-field-of-trauma/exclusive-content
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Guy Macpherson, PhD, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Other Side of Weight Loss (LS 47 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: Healing the nervous system to overcome chronic illness with Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2018-12-11
In this episode, Karen Martel talks to Irene Lyon about how childhood trauma could be the source of chronic illness.
She explains what trauma really is, how it affects our health and our ability to heal.
Why it might be stopping you from attracting what you want in your life.
This could be the largest missing piece in today's medical world.
Irene Lyon, MSC., is a nervous system specialist and therapeutic coach who helps people transform their bodies, businesses, relationships, and lives through regulating their nervous systems.
Irene helps people release their deepest traumas from their nervous systems, allowing them to finally heal from chronic mental, physical, and emotional conditions they’ve tried everything to fix.
Women's Empowerment Project is a free online summit; interviews with empowering life coaches, health experts, and authors.
Hosted by Elle Russ and Karen Martel.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Karen Martel: expert in women's hormone health and weight loss., which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Awakening Your True Potential
Episode: Episode 5: Brent Baum with Resolving Your Trauma To Restore Wholeness
Pub date: 2018-11-15
In this episode of Awakening Your True Potential we welcome one of the most sought after trauma specialists in the world to learn how his technique can transform both your past and present. Holographic Memory Resolution™ is a body-centered and client-centered technique for resolving all traumas and memories ranging from severe abuse to the briefest moments of shame, fear, abandonment and other emotional traumas. In this episode you'll learn:
- Holographic Memory Resolution's evolution from past models of trauma therapy
- Traumas big and small significantly impact your life and health
- The limitations of traditional "talk therapy"
- The holographic nature of our memories
- Specific sites on the body that similar memories/traumas are stored
- Resolving the emotional charge of trauma with color
To learn more about Holographic Memory Resolution™ or find a practitioner in your area visit www.hmrtraining.com or www.healingdimensions.com
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Daniel Maresca, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Authentic Parenting (LS 47 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: How Trauma Gets “ Stuck” in Your Nervous System with Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2018-11-01
Irene Lyon is a nervous system specialist and in this episode she talks about what trauma is, types of trauma, stress, autonomic nervous system and how to tell whether you have experienced trauma. You may not have physical symptoms per se.
FULL SHOW NOTES; pictures, links, resources, about my guest and anything mentioned in the show, visit my website:
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ABOUT ME
I help overwhelmed, frustrated parents who want to parent differently than their parents, make sense of their early childhood experiences, connect to their authentic self and their children on a deeper level, reduce stress, bring more ease, calm and joy into their lives by yelling less, and practicing non-punitive discipline.
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Podcast: The Other Side of Weight Loss (LS 47 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: The mind body connection in healing chronic pain Steve Ozanich
Pub date: 2018-10-21
Steve Ozanich hit rock bottom with back pain and multiple symptoms that kept returning. Bedridden, he read a book that helped him banish his pain and profoundly changed the direction of his entire career. Steve Ozanich, a mind-body health consultant, life coach and author, penned his first two books—”The Great Pain Deception,” and “Dr. John Sarno’s Top 10 Healing Discoveries”. Over the past 16 years, Steve has helped teach thousands of people how to heal themselves through his lectures, books, articles and interviews.
On today’s show Steve is going to share some breakthrough methodologies and insights around pain:
-
How to stop pain.
-
Understand what the pain deception is.
-
Why there really is no such thing as chronic pain from an old injury.
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How pain can actually be a gift that’s here to serve or warn us.
Plus Steve shares his own powerful story and why he wrote The Great Pain Deception.
If you have been suffering from any chronic pain or illness this is a must watch!
https://steveozanich.com/
Visit https://karenmartel.com/
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Join the OnTrack Women's Weight Loss program
Karen Martel, Certified Transformational Nutrition Coach and weight loss expert. Karen's passion lies in helping women find their weight loss code through body positive nutrition, correcting digestive issues, optimizing hormones and managing chronic stress. She is a health leader and researcher determined to revolutionize nutrition for modern women.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Karen Martel: expert in women's hormone health and weight loss., which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Human Upgrade with Dave Asprey—formerly Bulletproof Radio (LS 75 · TOP 0.05% what is this?)
Episode: Byron Katie: Hacking the Voice in Your Head : 532
Pub date: 2018-10-04
You may know Byron Katie as the bestselling author of “Loving What Is.” She is an inspirational guide who offers people a different way to think their thoughts so they can change their mindsets and, ultimately, their lives.
In 1986, at the bottom of a 10-year spiral into depression, rage, and self-loathing, 43-year-old Byron Katie literally woke up one morning to a state of constant joy that has never left her.
She realized that when she believed her stressful thoughts, she suffered, but that when she questioned them, she didn't suffer, and that this is true for every human being. Her simple yet powerful process of inquiry is called “The Work.”
Katie has been bringing The Work to millions of people around the world for more than 30 years through public events, workshops, intensives, retreats and a Turnaround House.
In this episode, we talk about the powerful ways your spirit can move you to change your mindset and change your life.
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Dave Asprey, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Truth Talk for Conscious Entrepreneurs (LS 25 · TOP 10% what is this?)
Episode: Cleared for Profit: Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2018-09-27
In this episode of Cleared for Profit, Emma talks with Irene Lyon. Irene is a nervous system specialist and therapeutic coach who helps everyone transform their bodies, businesses, relationships and lives through regulating their nervous systems. Emma and Irene have a powerful conversation about why it’s important to address regulating your nervous system now before you get stuck and can’t grow your business. Irene shares an unexpected perspective on early childhood trauma and how it shows up later in life in our businesses and specifically discusses how the patterns of feeling abandoned or betrayed play out in life and business.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Emma Churchman, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: How's The Pressure? (LS 40 · TOP 2% what is this?)
Episode: "Procedural Memory" w/ Irene Lyon
Pub date: 2018-08-25
This week I am bringing in Irene Lyon to talk about working with trauma. A little bit about Irene, she is a nervous system specialist and therapeutic coach who helps everyone — from the mom next door to the next big thought leaders — transform their bodies, businesses, relationships and lives through regulating their nervous systems. Irene has intensively studied and practices the work of Dr. Moshe Feldenkrais, Peter Levine (founder of Somatic Experiencing) and Kathy Kain (founder of Somatic Practice). Irene has a master’s degree in research in the fields of biomedical and health science. She regularly appears on podcasts and online summits teaching all things nervous system health, healing trauma and neuroplasticity.
In this episode we cover what got her working in the field of trauma, and then dive into the subject of procedural memory. I was fascinated by the mechanics of procedural memory and ever since that conversation I have been paying attention to how it might play into my life and the lives of my clients. She also talks about the fight, flight, or freeze response. And we learn about the ACE study, which stands for Adverse Childhood Experiences, and the implications from that body of work.
Here are some resources she mentioned: 1) Dr. Mate's first book,When The Body Says No - Understanding The Stress-Disease Connection 2) Dr. Mate's website https://drgabormate.com/ 3) The Need For Authenticity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUGGNPAK6uw 4) https://soundcloud.com/irenelyon/origins-of-the-ace-study 5) https://www.ted.com/talks/nadine_burke_harris_how_childhood_trauma_affects_health_across_a_lifetime
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Haley Winter, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Your Own Magic (LS 62 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Byron Katie: Way Out Of Suffering, Doing ‘The Work’ to Fully Live in Your Infinite Being-ness, and Meeting the Ego with Unconditional Love
Pub date: 2018-08-06
The cause of suffering is what we are thinking and believing. But, what if I told you there is a way out? A way out of suffering. A way out of the pain of betrayal, addictions, depression, and whatever else pulls us down. When we sit alone with Byron Katie's four powerful questions, we remind ourselves what's really true within our own self. Not what the world says is true. But what's true within us. What's true within you. Raquelle has Byron Katie guide us to help heal our grievances and mend our hearts.
The Four Questions from "The Work":
- Is it true? (Yes or no. If no, move to 3.)
- Can you absolutely know that it's true? (Yes or no.)
- How do you react, what happens, when you believe that thought?
- Who would you be without the thought?
CONNECT WITH KATIE
thework.com
instagram @byron.katie
twitter @byronkatie
facebook The Work of Byron Katie
youtube Byron Katie
BOOKS
Loving What Is: Four Questions That Can Change Your Life
A Mind at Home with Itself
I Need Your Love - Is That True?
A Thousand Names for Joy
Who Would You Be Without Your Story?
Question Your Thinking, Change the World
Your Inner Awakening
CHILDREN'S BOOKS
Tiger-Tiger is the True?
The Four Questions: For Henny Penny and Anybody with Stressful Thoughts
A Friendly Universe
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CONNECT
ig @raquellemantra
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Raquelle Mantra, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 094: 50 Methods in 50 Minutes (Part 2)
Pub date: 2018-06-25
For a long time, Fabrice has wanted to do a show on my list of "Fifty Ways to Untwist Your Thinking" called "Fifty Ways in Fifty Minutes." So we finally did it, and it was fun!
If I'm helping you overcome depression or anxiety, I'll ask you to fill out a Daily Mood Log, so you can list your negative thoughts and feelings at some specific moment when you were upset. You may be thinking, "I'm a failure," or "I should not have made that mistake," or "I'm unlovable."
Your negative thoughts will nearly always be distorted, but you'll still believe them, and that's why you're feeling depressed and anxious. And the moment you discover that your negative thoughts aren't true, you'll immediately feel better. But that's not going to be easy, because you've probably been giving yourself the same negative messages for years, or even decades. And friends and family members, and even your therapist, may have been trying, unsuccessfully, to talk you out of them.
That's why I've developed more than fifty methods to help you crush the negative thoughts at the heart of your suffering. So today, you'll take a look at the landscape!
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from David Burns, MD, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 093: 50 Methods in 50 Minutes (Part 1)
Pub date: 2018-06-18
For a long time, Fabrice has wanted to do a show on my list of "Fifty Ways to Untwist Your Thinking" called "Fifty Ways in Fifty Minutes." So we finally did it, and it was fun!
If I'm helping you overcome depression or anxiety, I'll ask you to fill out a Daily Mood Log, so you can list your negative thoughts and feelings at some specific moment when you were upset. You may be thinking, "I'm a failure," or "I should not have made that mistake," or "I'm unlovable."
Your negative thoughts will nearly always be distorted, but you'll still believe them, and that's why you're feeling depressed and anxious. And the moment you discover that your negative thoughts aren't true, you'll immediately feel better. But that's not going to be easy, because you've probably been giving yourself the same negative messages for years, or even decades. And friends and family members, and even your therapist, may have been trying, unsuccessfully, to talk you out of them.
That's why I've developed more than fifty methods to help you crush the negative thoughts at the heart of your suffering. So today, you'll take a look at the landscape!
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from David Burns, MD, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Dr. Joe Tatta | The Healing Pain Podcast (LS 48 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: Episode 88 | Dr. Peter Levine, PhD: Connections Between Trauma, PTSD And Chronic Pain
Pub date: 2018-05-24
PTSD can happen to anyone. It's not a sign of weakness. In many ways, it's a normal part of the traumatic healing process. Post-traumatic stress disorder can occur after you've experienced any type of trauma. A trauma is defined by a shocking or a dangerous event that you see or experience. Depending on which study you read, approximately 15% to 35% of patients with PTSD also suffer from chronic pain. Is there a link between trauma, PTSD, and chronic pain? Dr. Peter Levine, author of “Waking the Tiger: Healing Trauma” think so, and offers ironclad research to support his claim. Dr. Levine received his PhD in medical biophysics from the University of California at Berkeley, and also holds a Doctorate in Psychology from International University. For over 40 years, Dr. Levine has worked in fields of stress and trauma, leading to his development of the Somatic Experiencing Method, giving a new lease in life for PSTD survivors.
Sign up for the latest episode at www.drjoetatta.com/podcasts.
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Joseph Tatta, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Align Podcast (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Byron Katie: The Work, Enlightenment, Power of Thought | Ep. 165
Pub date: 2018-04-22
KATIE’S STORY Byron Katie, founder of The Work, has one job: to teach people how to end their own suffering. As she guides people through the powerful process of inquiry she calls The Work, they find that their stressful beliefs—about life, other people, or themselves—radically shift and their lives are changed forever. Based on Byron Katie's direct experience of how suffering is created and ended, The Work is an astonishingly simple process, accessible to people of all ages and backgrounds, and requires nothing more than a pen, paper, and an open mind.
Through this process, anyone can learn to trace unhappiness to its source and deal with it there. Katie (as everyone calls her) not only shows us that all the problems in the world originate in our thinking: she gives us the tool to open our minds and set ourselves free.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Aaron Alexander, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Body Awake (LS 41 · TOP 1.5% what is this?)
Episode: Irene Lyon Returns for More on Perception, Intuition and Raising Our Kids Well — ep 34
Pub date: 2018-03-15
Welcome back to Irene Lyon for our second chat on TBA. We pick up largely where we left off from our first interview (ep 17), namely into this question I had — and have — around okay, so we're aware of this trauma thing ... what do we do about it?
Wondrous, deep territory. Plus the pitfalls and joys of teaching online (newly on my mind as well).
Also, here's that 15-min neuroception exercise.
Love, LB. Get this, as always, on iTunes et al, or download direct here.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Liam Bowler + Dynamic Alignment Bodywork, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Relationship Alive! (LS 54 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 133: Change Your Thoughts, Change Your Life - Cognitive Distortions with Dr. David Burns
Pub date: 2018-03-15
The way that you think creates the way you feel. If you have great thoughts then no problem, but if your thoughts are a little distorted, then...look out! Wouldn’t it be great if there were an easy way to look at your thoughts...and change them? As it turns out - there is! In today’s conversation we are going to show you how to identify the kinds of thoughts that lead to depression, anxiety, shame, anger, and self-doubt - and talk about the process that you can go through to eliminate those thoughts for good. Our guest is Dr. David Burns, author of the acclaimed bestseller Feeling Good and one of the leading popularizers of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT). He is also the creator of TEAM therapy, which takes CBT to the next level. Today, David Burns and I are tackling the topic of “cognitive distortions” - the messed-up thinking that can get you stuck in negative emotions. By the end of today’s episode you’ll not only be able to spot the times when your thinking gets distorted, but you’ll know what to do about it so that you can “feel good”.
If you want to listen to our first episode together, where David Burns and I spoke about how to apply his work in relationships (based on his book Feeling Good Together), here is a link to Episode 98: How to Stop Being a Victim - Feeling Good Together - with David Burns
And, as always, I’m looking forward to your thoughts on this episode and what revelations and questions it creates for you.
Join us in the Relationship Alive Community on Facebook to chat about it!
Resources:
Check out Dr. David Burns's website
Read David’s classic books, Feeling Good or When Panic Attacks
FREE Relationship Communication Secrets Guide
www.neilsattin.com/feelinggood2 Visit to download the transcript, or text “PASSION” to 33444 and follow the instructions to download the transcript to this episode with David Burns
Amazing intro/outro music graciously provided courtesy of: The Railsplitters - Check them Out
Transcript
Neil Sattin: Hello and welcome to another episode of Relationship Alive. This is your host Neil Sattin. On today's show, we're going to cover ways that your thinking can be distorted. And, by being distorted can impact the way you feel, the way you behave, the way you interact with other people, and basically get in the way of you being an effectively functioning human being.
Neil Sattin: I'm talking about cognitive distortions and they've been mentioned a little bit on the show before, but I wanted to take this opportunity to dive deeply into the ways that our thinking can just be messed up. From that messed upness - and no that is not a technical term - comes all sorts of problems.
Neil Sattin: From today's show, what my hope is for you is that you understand these things well enough so that you can spot them happening in your own thinking and perhaps in the thinking and reasoning of those around you. We're going to talk about effective strategies for changing the pattern.
Neil Sattin: In order to do that, we have with us today a fortunate return visit from Dr. David Burns who was on the show back in episode 98 where we talked about how to stop being a victim in your relationship. This was an episode that was all based on David's work in a book called Feeling Good Together.
Neil Sattin: If you're interested in hearing that, you can go to neilsattin.com/feelinggood. What I wanted to talk about today relates to some of the pioneering work that David did in popularizing cognitive behavioral therapy primarily through his book Feeling Good which has sold millions of copies all over the world and has been prescribed and shown to actually help people with depression simply by reading the book and going through the exercises.
Neil Sattin: I'm very excited to have David with us today, we're going to talk about cognitive distortions, we're probably going to touch on TEAM therapy which is his latest evolution that's attacking some of the problems with cognitive behavioral therapy. And hear about some of the amazing results that that's getting and get some insight into how that even works.
Neil Sattin: Without any further ado, let us dive right in. David Burns, thank you so much for joining us again here on Relationship Alive.
David Burns: Thanks Neil, I'm absolutely delighted to be on your podcast for two reasons. First, I think you're a tremendous host. You know your stuff both technically and you know my background, you do your homework, that's very flattering to me being interviewed, but also you seem to exude a lot of warmth and integrity, just a pleasure to hang out with you a little bit today and your many, many listeners.
Neil Sattin: Thank you. Thank you so much. I appreciate your saying that. This stuff is important to me. I'm hoping that this podcast makes a big difference in the world and the way that we do that is through being able to feature amazing work like what you do. I don't want to forget to mention that you also have your own podcast, the Feeling Good Podcast that has amazing insight into the work that you're doing.
Neil Sattin: In fact, you record sessions with people so people can actually hear you working with clients and then explaining how you did what you did and also getting direct feedback from the people that you're working with. That's a fascinating show and how many episodes have you put out at this point?
David Burns: I think Fabrice and I are up to roughly 60, in the range of 60. One really neat bit of feedback we're getting is that a lot of therapists now are requiring their patients to listen to the Feeling Good podcasts. There's been a lot of research on my book Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy and studies have shown that if you just hand the book to someone with moderate to severe depression, 60% of them ... 65% of them will improve dramatically within four weeks.
David Burns: That's really, really good news. It's called bibliotherapy or reading therapy, but now we're getting this ... I'm getting the same kind of feedback from people who are listening to the podcasts and saying that just listening to the Feeling Good Podcast had a dramatic effect on their depression or their obsessive compulsive disorder or whatever is bothering them. I'm hoping that that trend will continue.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, someone's going to have to study podcastio-therapy.
David Burns: Yeah, right. You may be having the same thing Neil on your relationship broadcast from people with troubled relationships following the information and the techniques you're providing and perhaps experiencing genuine improvement in their relationships, greater intimacy and love.
Neil Sattin: Absolutely. I'm getting that kind of feedback all the time from listeners and I also hear that therapists, particularly couples therapists are having their clients listen to the show and even sometimes prescribing specific episodes for them to listen to. It feels really good to be able to be an adjunct part of people's progress and therapy.
David Burns: Congrats. That's great. That's a real credit to the quality of what you're offering.
Neil Sattin: Thank you. Thank you. Well, let's dive in. Enough kudos although it does feel really good, though I guess that doesn't surprise me considering you're the author of Feeling Good. Quick point of clarification. Is it the just handing of the Feeling Good book that has a 60 to 65% improvement rate or did the people actually have to read some of it to get that?
David Burns: All they have to do is touch it. The improvement comes through osmosis and many of those who have read it have gotten worse. They don't have good data on that in the studies. It's people coming to a medical center for the treatment of depression and in the original studies, they said that they had to be on a waiting list for four weeks and during the four weeks, read this book.
David Burns: Then they continued to test them every week with various depression tests and half the patients went to some kind of control group who were on a waiting list control for four weeks or they gave them some other book to read like Viktor Frankl's book Man's Search for Meaning and in all of the studies, the patients who were given a copy of Feeling Good, two thirds of them had improved so much within four weeks that they didn't need to have treatment anymore at the medical center.
David Burns: They never got antidepressants or psychotherapy. Then they've done follow up, up to two year follow up studies on these patients as well. For the most part, they've continued to do well or even improve more and have not had significant relapses. The alternative groups who got Victor Frankl's book did not show significant improvement or people on waiting list control.
David Burns: They were pretty well done studies sponsored by research from ... sponsored by National Institute of Mental Health and other research groups. Forrest Scogin is a clinical psychologist at University of Alabama and he pioneered a lot of these studies, but there have been probably at least a dozen replications of that finding that have been published now with teenagers, with elderly people and with people in between.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, I want to just say, your book despite having been published a little while ago now is eminently readable and I did read it a while ago. In fact, I think it was one of the first "self-help books" that I stumbled across probably around when I was graduating from college. In sitting down and revisiting it in preparation for our conversation today, I was just struck by how personable, for a book that's about cognitive behavioral therapy which is something that I think just calling it that probably turns a lot of people off.
David Burns: You bet.
Neil Sattin: The truth is that reading it through, it just makes so much sense and I love how you bring humor into the subject and in many ways talk about yourself as an author in some of the quizzes around the kind of thoughts that undermine our self-esteem. Anyway, I definitely recommend it.
Neil Sattin: If you're not one of the millions of people who have already read it, you should pick it up and if you are, I would suggest picking it up again to just glean again what more is there. We're going to talk about one of the central topics in the book which is how our thinking affects the way we feel.
Neil Sattin: Maybe we just start there because that was one place where I even in upon revisiting, I got a little confused and in the past, that's made total sense to me. Yeah of course, I make something mean something and that gives me an emotional response to it which ironically makes me think of Victor Frankl's work.
Neil Sattin: At the same time, I know that we have feelings that just our bodies kick in with emotional responses in a split second when something happens. That seems to precede thought. How do you parse that apart in a way that makes sense?
David Burns: Well, the basis of cognitive therapy and we've moved on to something new called TEAM therapy or TEAM CBT, but I think the basis of cognitive therapy which as far as it goes it's still pure gold goes back to the Buddha 2,500 years ago and to the Greek philosophers like Epictetus 2,000 years ago that humans are disturbed not by things, but by the views we take of them that you have to interpret an event in a particular way before you can have an emotional reaction to it.
David Burns: This thought is so basic that our thoughts create all of our moods. We create our emotional reality at every moment of every day by the way, we interpret things, but that's such a basic idea that many people can't get it or they don't believe it. I had an example of this at my workshop in the east coast recently - I was in a hotel.
David Burns: I've had many afflictions myself in my life. I love to treat people with depression or anxiety because whatever they have I could say, "Oh, I've been there myself." I can show you the way out of the woods, but when I was little, I had the fear of heights and then I got over it completely as a teenager through a high school teacher who had me stand on the top of a tall ladder until my fear disappeared and took about 15 minutes and it was dramatically effective.
David Burns: Suddenly, my anxiety went from 100 to zero and I was free, but it crept back in because I stopped going up on heights not out avoidance, just I had no reason to and then suddenly I realized it had returned. I was on a hotel on one of these glass elevators and I was going up to the 14th floor and I was looking down into the elevator and I had no emotional reaction whatsoever and it was because I was telling myself and this was automatic I guess, but you're safe.
David Burns: However, if there hadn't been that glass there and it would have been the same elevator going up and looking out, I would have been paralyzed with fear and terror and it would have been a total body experience that I can feel in my whole body this extreme terror. That's the first idea that you can't have an emotional reaction without having some kind of thought or interpretation.
David Burns: You feel the way you think - your thoughts create all of your moods. After Feeling Good came out, I got a letter from a therapist in Philadelphia. He was a student therapist at the Philadelphia Marriage Counsel I believe and he said he had read my book Feeling Good: How Your Thoughts Create All of Your Moods.
David Burns: He said, "Well, that's a great idea, but how can it be true? If you're on a railroad track with a train coming and you're about to get killed, you're going to feel terrified. You don't have to put a thought in your mind, it's just an automatic reaction." He said, "I don't believe your claim that only your thoughts can create your moods."
David Burns: I got that letter and I started thinking, I said, "Gosh, what he's saying is so obvious, how could I have missed that when I wrote that book?" I felt embarrassed and ashamed. A couple days after I got that letter, I was in a taxi coming home from the airport and at a certain place on River Road, you go over this railroad track.
David Burns: I looked down the railroad track, I saw there was a car driving on the railroad track at about two miles an hour. Bumpety-bumpety-bump. I looked then in the other direction and this is ... Freight trains come through here, they never stop, they come at 65 miles an hour. I saw one about a mile and a half in the other direction.
David Burns: I said, "Man, that guy is going to get smashed by the train." I told the taxi driver, "Stop, I got to try to get that guy off the railroad tracks." I ran up and knocked on the window and he rolled down the window and there's this older man there and he said, "Can you please direct me to City Line Avenue?"
David Burns: I said, "City Line Avenue is 10 miles in the other direction, but you're on the railroad tracks and there's a train coming. You've got to back up. Back up to get to the road." Because he was beyond the road, where you know how they have a pile of rocks at the railroad tracks, that's where he was and I said, "Back up, I'm going to get you off the railroad tracks."
David Burns: He backed up and he kept ... When he got to the road, I said, "Now turn, turn your car." Finally I had them positioned to where just the nose of the car, the front part of the car was over the tracks and I was standing in front of it. Now the train was about maybe 20 seconds from impact and they had their whistle on.
David Burns: I was waving my hands like, "Back up, back up. Just back up five feet and it will save you." Instead, the guy started creeping forward very slowly.
Neil Sattin: Oh no.
David Burns: The train smashed into him at the side of his car at about 60 miles an hour.
Neil Sattin: Oh my goodness.
David Burns: Actually ripped the car in half. The front compartment was thrown about 30 feet from the tracks. They had their brakes on, the train was skidding to a stop and I ran over again to the driver's compartment and looked in, it was all smashed windows and I thought I'd see a decapitated corpse, but it hit probably an inch behind his head and it hit so fast it had just cut the car in half and he didn't seem to be that injured or anything.
David Burns: He looked at me and smiled and said, "Which way exactly did you say now to City Line Avenue?" I said, "You got to be kidding me." I said, "You were just hit by a train." He said, "I was not." He says, "That's ridiculous." I said, "Oh yeah, what happened to the windows of your car?"
David Burns: Then he looked and he noticed all the windows were smashed and there was glass all over. Then he says, "Gosh, it looks like somebody broke my windows." I said, "Look, where's the back seat? Where's the back half of your car?" He turned around and he saw the back half of his car was missing.
David Burns: He looked at me and he says, "I think you're right. Half of my car seems to have disappeared." He says, "Where is this train?" I said, "Look, it's right there, it's 20 feet from here." Now the conductors were rushing up and the engineers and he looked at me and he says, "This is great."
David Burns: I said, "Why is that? Why is this great?" He says, "Well, maybe I can sue." I said, "You'll be lucky if they don't sue you. You were driving down the railroad tracks." I couldn't understand it and at this point, the police cars came, the ambulance, they put him in an ambulance, I gave my story to the police, he looked just fine and they took him to the Bryn Mawr Hospital.
David Burns: I was just scratching my head and I got in the taxi, it was just a mile from home, the taxi driver took me the rest of the way home. I was saying, "What in the heck happened?" The next day I was jogging around that same corner, of course, there was all this litter from the car or broken pieces of metal and glass all over the place and there was a younger guy maybe 50 years old or something like that going through the rubble.
David Burns: I stopped there and asked him who he was and he says, "My father was almost killed by a train here yesterday and somebody saved his life and I was just checking out the scene." I said, "Well, that was me actually." I said, "I didn't understand it - he was driving down the railroad track and if I hadn't gotten there, I think he would have been killed."
David Burns: I said, "Why was he driving down the railroad track?" He says, "Well, my father has had Alzheimer's disease and he lost his driver's license 10 years ago, but he forgot and after dinner, he snuck out. He grabbed the keys and snuck out, decided to take the car for a drive." Here is the same situation, a train about to kill somebody on a railroad track about to smash into you and I had the thought this guy is in danger he could be killed.
David Burns: I was experiencing 100% terror and anxiety and fear, but his thought was different. His thought was, "This is great. I might be able to sue and get a great deal of money." Therefore he was feeling joy and euphoria. Same situation, different thoughts and radically different emotions.
David Burns: That's what I mean and that's what the Buddha meant 2,500 years ago when we say that only your thoughts can create your emotions. It's not what happens to you, but the way you think about it that creates every positive and negative emotion.
Neil Sattin: Did you ever write back to that person who wrote you? About that train - to tell him what had happened?
David Burns: I don't remember it because this was way back in 1980 shortly after the book came out. I probably did because in those days, I was so excited to get a fan letter. I never had any idea that the book would become popular, it didn't hit the best-seller list until eight years after it was published because the publishers wouldn't support it with any marketing or advertising because they thought no one would ever want to read a book on depression.
David Burns: When I got a letter in the days before email, I would get so excited and I would try to contact the person and sometimes talk to them for an hour or two on the telephone thinking this might be the only fan I'll ever have. I'm sure I did write back.
Neil Sattin: Speaking of that, this might be a good chance to start talking about the cognitive distortions and like the idea that this might be the only fan that you ever have, what are we talking about in terms of now we've established pretty well. The way I think about things is going to determine how I feel.
Neil Sattin: Yet, there are these distorted ways of thinking about the world that really have an enormously negative impact on our ability to function and interact.
David Burns: This is one of the amazing ideas of cognitive therapy that at first I didn't quite grasp, but the early cognitive therapists like Albert Ellis from New York and then Aaron Beck at University of Pennsylvania who I learned it from were claiming not only do your thoughts create all of your moods, but when you're upset, when you're depressed, when you're anxious, when you feel ashamed or excessively angry or hopeless, not only are those feelings created by your thoughts and not by the circumstances of your life, but those negative thoughts will generally be distorted and illogical so that when you're depressed, you're fooling yourself, you're telling yourself things that simply aren't true and that depression and anxiety are really the world's oldest cons.
David Burns: Beck - when I first began learning about cognitive therapy from him when I was a psychiatric resident and postdoctoral fellow, he had about four distortions as I recall and he had big names for them and then I added some to those and I used to talk to my patients about all-or-nothing thinking and overgeneralization and self-blame and the different ones.
David Burns: Once, I was having a session with a patient and he said, "Why don't you list your 10 distortions and hand it out to patients?" He said, "It would make it so much easier for us." I thought, "Wow, that is a cool idea." I ran home that night after work and I made the list of the 10 cognitive distortions and that's what led to my book Feeling Good.
David Burns: My list of 10 cognitive distortions, it's probably been reproduced in magazines and by therapists all over the world, I would imagine easily millions of times and probably tens of millions of times, but there are 10 distortions. Number one is all-or-nothing thinking, black or white thinking.
David Burns: It's where you think about yourself in black or white term, shades of gray don't exist. If you're not a total success, you think that you're a complete failure or you tell yourself you're defective. I gave a workshop with Dr. Beck at one of the professional conferences like the Association for Behavioral and Cognitive Therapies, cognitive therapy had just come out and Beck is not a very good public speaker.
David Burns: I was a novice also at the time and we had a half day workshop and there were a few hundred therapists there and it was okay, but it wasn't great and they started challenging us because nobody liked the idea of cognitive therapy initially, it was scorned and looked down on. We got defensive and then afterwards Dr. Beck looked at me and said, "David, you look like you're feeling down. What's the problem?"
David Burns: I said, "Well, to tell you the truth Dr. Beck, I thought we were below average in this presentation and I'm feeling upset about that." He said, "Oh, well you should, if we were below average, you should thank your lucky stars." I said, "Why should I thank my lucky stars if we were below average?"
David Burns: He said, "Because average is the halfway point. By definition, we have to be below average half the time. We can thank our lucky stars we got the below average one out of the way and we look forward to an above average one the next time we present." Suddenly, my discouragement disappeared.
David Burns: He was just modeling thinking in shades of gray whereas I had been thinking in black and white terms. All-or-nothing thinking is very common in depression and it's also the cause of all perfectionism - thinking if you're not the greatest, second best or average just is not good enough, it's either the world or nothing, perfection or failure and it creates tremendous problems.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, I could see that also coming up in terms of comparisons like if so and so is already doing this thing, I can't possibly do that because it's so and so's domain. As if one person could own the domain for the entire world in any particular area.
David Burns: Well yeah, that's another mental trick that we play in ourselves with the distortions I call mental filtering and discounting the positive. You see this all the time when you're feeling inferior and comparing yourself to other people. Mental filter is where you focus on all of your flaws thinking about all of your errors.
David Burns: You don't think about what's good about you or what's beautiful about you. I did a TV show finally when the book gained popularity in Cincinnati and it was a morning show and they had a live audience and a band and he was interviewing me. It was exciting for me because it was still the first time I had any media exposure.
David Burns: Then after the show, the host said, "Dr. Burns, could I talk to you for a minute?" This often happens to me when I'm on a radio or TV show because the people in the media have tremendous pressures on them and they often also feel that they're not good enough. I said, "Sure. I'd love to. What's the issue?"
David Burns: He says, "Well, after every morning show, I get about 350 fan mails, fan letters or calls or whatever." He said, "They are 99.9% positive, but everyday I'll get one critical letter. One critical feedback and I dwell on that one constantly and make myself miserable and ignore all the other positive feedback." That's called mental filter because you filter out the good stuff and you've just focused on your flaws.
David Burns: A lot of the people listening to the show right now do that. Then an even bigger mental error is called discounting the positive - when you say that the good things about you don't even count. You may have done this to yourself when someone gives you a compliment, you might tell yourself, "Oh, they're just saying that to be nice to me. They don't really mean it." You discount that positive experience.
David Burns: I had a colleague who got upset when he recently won the Nobel prize, one of my college roommates, and the reason he got upset is he said they haven't recognized my best work yet. So those are three of the 10 distortions.
Neil Sattin: Yes. One of my favorites I think comes next on your list, at least the list I'm looking at after discounting the positive which is the ways that we jump to conclusions.
David Burns: Right. There's two common patterns here, jumping to conclusions that aren't warranted by the facts and mind-reading and fortune-telling are two of the commonest ones. Now, fortune-telling is when you make a prediction about the future, an arbitrary prediction about the future and all anxiety results from fortune-telling, telling yourself that something terrible is about to happen - like when I get on that plane, I just know it will run into turbulence and crash. You feel panic and anxiety.
David Burns: Depressed people do fortune-telling as well. Hopelessness results from predicting that things will never change, my problems will never get solved, I'm going to be miserable forever. Almost every depressed patient thinks that way and that's actually why many people with depression commit suicide because they have the illogical belief that their mood will never improve, that they're the one untreatable person.
David Burns: Mind-reading is the other common form of jumping to conclusions and this is real common in social anxiety, but Neil, I'm sure you see it in a lot of people with relationship problems.
Neil Sattin: Absolutely.
David Burns: But mind-reading is where you assume you know how other people are thinking and feeling without any evidence, without any data. I used to struggle with intense social anxiety among my many other fears and phobias that I've had and overcome over the years, but the anxious person - say you're at a social gathering and you think, "Oh, these people won't be interested in what I have to say and they never feel anxious. I'm the only one who feels insecure."
David Burns: Then you also may have the thought, "Oh, they can see how anxious I am and they're going to be real turned off by me." Then what happens is that when you start talking to someone, you get really busy worrying about how they're not going to be interested in you. You try to think of something clever or interesting to say while they're talking.
David Burns: Then when they're done, instead of repeating what they said and expressing an interest in what they said, you make the little speech you had prepared. That turns the other person off because I think, "Wow, David doesn't seem interested in me. I was just telling him about my son, he was just accepted to Harvard and now he's talking about something else."
David Burns: That person pretty quickly loses interest in you and says, "Oh, I have to talk to so and so on the other side of the room." Then you, the shy person get rejected again which is what you thought was going to happen. Although these are distortions, you're thinking in an unrealistic way, they sometimes feel like self-fulfilling prophecies so you don't realize that you're fooling yourself.
Neil Sattin: Right, because when you're in it, then you seem to be getting plenty of evidence that it's true.
David Burns: Yes, and another form of evidence comes to another distortion. One name I made up called emotional reasoning where you reason from your feelings. You see this in angry interactions, you see that in anxiety and in depression. The depressed patient is giving themselves all these messages like I'm a loser, I'm no good and beating up on yourself and then you feel ashamed and guilty and worthless and inferior and inadequate.
David Burns: Then you say, "Well, I feel like a loser, I must really be one." Reasoning from your emotions, thinking your emotions somehow reflect reality. That thought by the way is one we skipped over - overgeneralization. That's number two on the list actually, right after all-or-nothing thinking.
David Burns: Overgeneralization, this is a Buddhist thing, really overgeneralization. It's where you generalize to yourself from some specific event. For example, I have a free training for Bay Area psychotherapists every Tuesday evening at Stanford and you don't have to be a Stanford student to come, I give unlimited free psychotherapy training to therapists who can come to my Tuesday group and any of the listeners or therapists near in the Bay Area on a Tuesday email me and you're welcome to attend my Tuesday training group.
David Burns: Then I also have free hikes every Sunday morning and we go out hiking for maybe three and a half hours on the trails around my home and I treat people for free on the hikes. We do training and one of the women on the Sunday hike, I'll keep it vague to protect her identity, but she just had a problem with her boyfriend and they broke up and then she was telling herself, "I'm inadequate ... I'm unlovable" kind of thing.
David Burns: "This was my fault and I must have been doing something wrong." You see, when you think like that and most of us do when we're upset, she's generalizing from this event, that it didn't work out with her boyfriend to then this global idea that "I'm inadequate. There's something wrong with me" - as if you had a self that wasn't good enough.
David Burns: Then people also say, "I'll be alone forever. I'm unlovable. This is always happening to me." That's all over generalization where you generalize from a negative event and you see it as a never-ending pattern of defeat. You also see it as evidence that you're somehow defective or not good enough than when you're thinking these things, they seem so true - just as believable as the fact that there's skin on your hand.
David Burns: You don't realize that you're fooling yourself, the pain that you feel is just incredible. I know that of the many people listening to this show right now, I'm sure you can identify this with this that you've had thoughts like that and you know how real and painful these feelings are.
David Burns: It's one of the worst forms of human suffering, but the good news is and we haven't gone around to that, but not only are there fantastic techniques, cognitive therapy techniques that we've been talking about from my book feeling good described in there or my feeling good handbook so that you can overcome these distorted thoughts and get back to joy and self-esteem quickly, but also my group at Stanford over the 10 years, the past 10 years, we've created even more powerful techniques and to help bring about really high speed recovery for people struggling with depression and anxiety.
David Burns: The new techniques are way more powerful than the original cognitive therapy although those methods are still fabulous, but maybe we'll have time to talk about some of these.
David Burns: But there's more distortions to cover.
Neil Sattin: Yeah. Maybe what we could do because I'd love to balance this out and I want to ensure that we cover the other distortions. We have maybe four more. At the same time, maybe let's break from the distortions just to change things up a bit and start entertaining that question of, "Alright, yeah. I relate to some or all that we've even listed so far."
Neil Sattin: What are some of the initial steps that someone could talk because where I tend to go with this is like, "Well, these belief patterns like you talked about, "I'm unlovable" as one, those seem to emerge from a place that's immutable. It's something that's really deep in someone's psyche and yet, you're suggesting that there's ways to transform that that are really quick and direct and give someone a felt experience of the truth that's not that thing.
David Burns: Yeah, that's right. You can group the techniques into cognitive techniques to crush these distorted thoughts and motivational techniques to get rid of your ... To bring your resistance to change to conscious awareness and melt away the resistance. The patients become incredibly motivated to crush their thoughts.
David Burns: An example of the way the cognitive techniques work, what is crucial and this is one of the first things when we first created cognitive therapy in the mid 1970s was to write the negative thoughts on a piece of paper. It's a very humble thing to do, but it can be dramatically effective because then you can look at the list of 10 distortions and immediately, pinpoint the distortions and that makes it much easier to talk back to these disruptive thoughts and poke holes in them.
David Burns: I'll give you an example of my own personal life because I've used these techniques myself and if they hadn't worked for me, I never would have become a cognitive therapist and now a TEAM CBT therapist, but when I was a postdoctoral fellow, I used to go to Dr. Beck's weekly seminars and I would present all my most difficult cases and get tips from him on how to treat these people with what was then the rapidly emerging brand new cognitive therapy and it was an exciting time, but one day, I talked to him about a patient that wasn't paying the bill, that I've had a bad session with this patient and asked him for some guidance.
David Burns: He actually was pretty critical of the way I had dealt with this patient. I became awfully upset, I got depressed and anxious and I was riding home on the train and my head was filled with negative thoughts and negative feelings. Then when I got home, I told myself, "Well David, you probably better run, go on a long six mile run and get your brain endorphins up so get over your depression" because those were the days when everyone was believing the phony baloney that somehow exercise boosts brain endorphins and will reduce depression.
David Burns: I went out on this long run and the longer I ran, the more believable my negative thoughts became. I said, "David, what are you telling yourself?" I said, "Oh, I'm a worthless human being. I have no therapeutic skills, I'm going to be banned from the state of Pennsylvania and they'll take away my medical license, I have no future in psychiatry. I'm a worthless human being, I'm a bad person." Stuff like that.
David Burns: It seemed overwhelmingly true. I said, "Are there some distortions in your thoughts David? Look for the distortions like what you tell your patients." I said, "No, there are no distortions in my thoughts. This is just real." I was telling myself it's so weird to hear, you're something like 30 years old or however old I was, 31, it took you all of this time in your life to realize what a horrible loser you are.
David Burns: It's as if I had seen the truth for the first time and it was devastating. Then when I got home, I said, "David, why don't you write your thoughts on a piece of paper? That's what you make all of your patients do." I said, "Oh no, no, my thoughts are real, that won't do any good." Then I told myself, "But isn't that the same way you're whining just like your patients whine and resist? And you force them to write their thoughts down on a piece of paper. You tell them they have to do that. Why don't you try that David?"
David Burns: I said, "No, no, it wouldn't do any good. I really am a worthless human being. This is true." Then I said, "No David, you're still resisting. Take out a piece of paper and do what you tell your patients to do." I said, "Oh okay, I'll do it just to prove that it won't work." I wrote my thoughts down. Number one, I'm a worthless human being, number two, I have no therapy skill.
David Burns: Number three, I screwed up with this patient. Number four, they'll take away my medical license, stuff like that. I wrote down four or five thoughts. Then I said, "Now, are there any distortions?" I looked at my own list of 10 distortions. I said, "Wow, those thoughts are pretty distorted. It's all-or-nothing thinking, black and white thinking like I'm not allowed to make a mistake with a patient. It's overgeneralization, I'm generalizing from the fact that I screwed up with this patient in a session to, "I am a worthless human being," it's fortune-telling, "I have no future in psychiatry."
David Burns: Jumping to conclusions, self-blame, hidden "should" statements, that's another distortion. I shouldn't have screwed up, I should always be perfect. It was emotional reasoning, I feel worthless, I must be worthless. I suddenly saw those distortions and then I said, "Now, can I write a positive thought to challenge these negative thoughts?" That's the other part of the exercise. First you write the negative thought, then you identify the distortions, then you write a positive thought.
David Burns: The positive thought has to be 100% true. Rationalizations and half truth will never help a human being. I came up with this positive thought. I said, "David, you're just a beginner. You have the right to make mistakes. In fact, even when you're 75 years old years from now, you might be a great therapist, but you'll still make mistakes and learn from them. That's part of the territory."
David Burns: "You're absolutely permitted to do that. Instead of beating up on yourself, why don't you talk it over with your patient tomorrow and tell him that you made a mistake and see if you can repair that rupture in your relationship with the patient." All of a sudden, I said, "Is that true?" "Yeah, that thought is 100% true." How much do I believe this rubbish that I'm a worthless human being and all of that and my belief in those negative thoughts went to zero and my negative feelings just disappeared in a flash entirely. I said, "Wow, this shit is pretty good. This really works." Hope you don't have to edit out that word.
Neil Sattin: No, that's fine. That's fine.
David Burns: Then the next day I saw the patient, I said, "You know Mark, I've been feeling terrible since last session and ashamed because I don't think I treated you right." I was putting pressure on you because of the unpaid balance and I didn't put any emphasis on your suffering and what's going on with you as a human being I just imagine you felt so hurt and angry with me and discouraged and I'm just overjoyed that you came back today rather than dropping out of therapy so we can talk it over and see if we can deepen our relationship.
David Burns: He just loved that and we had the best session ever, he gave me perfect empathy scores at the end of the session, but that's just an example from my personal life and I'm sure the people here can relate to that, but I've developed probably 50 or 100 techniques for crushing negative thoughts and I've made it sound easy, but it isn't always easy because you might be very, very trapped in your negative thoughts.
David Burns: You might have to try several of the different techniques before you find the one that works for you. I want to be encouraging to the listeners and to therapists who may be listening, but I also don't want to make it sound like something overly simple or overly simplistic because it's really a pretty high-powered, sophisticated type of therapy.
David Burns: Fortunately, many people can make it work on their own, but anyway, that's the half of the treatment breakthroughs and that was called the cognitive revolution and my book Feeling Good really helped usher that in when feeling good came out in 1980, cognitive therapy was virtually unknown and they were just a handful of cognitive therapists in the world.
David Burns: Now, it's become the most popular form of psychotherapy in the world and the most researched form of psychotherapy in all of the history of psychology and psychiatry.
Neil Sattin: I wonder if we could emphasize because I'm thinking about how we talked about the technique for identifying a negative thought, identifying the cognitive distortion or distortions that are happening and just to talk about the importance of actually going through that exercise and writing it down.
Neil Sattin: Maybe you could just talk for one more minute about why that part is so important. Why is it important to actually write that stuff down versus to do it in your head?
David Burns: I think that the negative, the power of the human mind to be negative is very profound. The negative thoughts are like a snake eating its tail, they go round and round and one leads to the next.
David Burns: In the early days, I used to try to do cognitive therapy without the written exercise and to this day, new therapists still try to do that. They think they're too fancy that writing things down is too simplistic or something like that and they're going to be deep and just do verbal, deep stuff with people, but the problem is, the human mind is so clever.
David Burns: Each distortion reinforces another one and each negative thought reinforces another one and you go round and round and round. That's why doing it verbally or in your head when you're alone is rarely going to be effective, but when you write the negative thoughts down one at a time and number them with short sentences, that makes it much easier to identify the distortions in them and turn them around.
David Burns: There are three rules of thumb. There's an art form to writing them down. Everything is more sophisticated than I make it sound in a brief interview. There's a lot of rules of the game. For example, when you're writing down negative thoughts, you should never put an emotion or an event.
David Burns: People have a negative thought like Trisha rejected me and I feel terrible. Well, that's not a negative thought. That's an event. Trisha rejected me and I use a form called the Daily Mood Log and at the top you put the event and then you circle all of your emotions and put how strong they are between zero and a hundred.
David Burns: These emotions might be feel guilty, ashamed, lonely, depressed, worthless and then the negative thought would be the interpretation of that event like I must be unlovable, I'll be alone forever. Then those are things that have distortions. A second rule is don't ever put rhetorical questions in the negative thought column.
David Burns: If you say something like, "Oh, why am I like this? Why am I so anxious in social situations?" Or "What's wrong with me?" You can't disprove questions so instead you can substitute the hidden claim behind the question which is generally a hidden should statement like I shouldn't be like this or I must be defective because I'm so anxious in social situations or some such thing.
David Burns: There are probably one or two other rules of the game and my book When Panic Attacks which is one of my newer books on all the anxiety disorders, Feeling Good is on depression. When Panic Attacks is on all of the different kinds of anxiety. I think the third chapter shows how to fill out the Daily Mood Log and what the rules are to follow to enhance the effectiveness of it so you'll be more likely to have a successful experience.
Neil Sattin: Great. The idea is that it's simply by doing this process that the things shift. It's not like there's ... You go through the process and then maybe you would track your mood afterwards and see, "Wow, I'm actually feeling better than I was before" just by simply doing that?
David Burns: Well, a lot of people can feel better just by doing it, but the research has shown that two thirds of people just by reading Feeling Good, they can improve a lot in depression, but some people need the help of a therapist and it isn't true that everyone has to do it on your own, sometimes you need another person to get that leverage to pop out of it.
David Burns: Another thing that's helpful when you're writing down your negative thoughts is Beck's theory of cognitive specificity. You see, Buddha said our thoughts create our emotions, but Beck took it to the next level and said different patterns of thoughts create different types of emotions.
David Burns: If you're feeling guilty, you're probably telling yourself that you're a bad person or that you violated your value system. If you're feeling hopeless, you're definitely telling yourself that things will never change, something like that. I'll be miserable forever. If you're feeling anxious, you're definitely telling yourself something awful is about to happen.
David Burns: "When I get on that show with Neil, I'll screw up, my brain will go blank." That type of thing. When you're feeling sad, you're telling yourself... or depressed, that you've lost something central to your self-esteem. When you're feeling angry, you're telling yourself that someone else is a loser that they're treating you unfairly, that they shouldn't be that way.
David Burns: These rules can also help individuals pinpoint your negative thoughts. Once you see what the emotions are, then you know the kind of thoughts to look for. One last thing is sometimes people say, "Oh, I don't know what my negative thoughts are." I just say, "We'll just make some up and write them down and number them."
David Burns: Then I say, "Are your thoughts like this?" They say, "Oh, that's exactly what I'm thinking." Those are a few tips on refining the part with the negative thoughts. But now we have even more powerful techniques that have evolved in my work with my training and development group at Stanford.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, before we talk about those, which I hope we will have time to do - there are a couple of things that jumped out at me. One was as you were describing the distortions that we've already talked about, it popped into my head that this is often at the source of most conflict that happens in couples - that either one person is having distorted thinking or one person is protecting themselves from their own distorted thinking.
Neil Sattin: For example, your partner says something and you have this feeling like, "Well, that's not true. I got to defend myself from that accusation."
David Burns: That's right yeah.
Neil Sattin: You jump into this place of conflict that's all about proving that this negative concept you suddenly are perceiving about yourself isn't true. When that negative concept in and of itself might be an example of you just having a distortion - like for instance, "my partner is mad at me, that must mean they think I'm a horrible human being."
David Burns: Yeah, what's huge what you just said, when we're in conflict with people, there's a lot of inner chatter going on in addition to the verbal altercations, the arguing, the escalation, the defensiveness - and some of the distortions will be focused on the other person and some of the distortions will be focused on yourself.
David Burns: You see all of the 10 cognitive distortions in relationship conflict, but they have a little bit of a different function I would say. Now, let's say you're angry, Mary is angry at her husband Sam, she's ticked off and then if you look at her thoughts, they have all 10 distortions.
David Burns: She'll tell herself things like, she might be thinking, "Oh, he's a loser. All he cares about is himself. The relationship problems are all his fault, he'll never change." That type of thing. You sell all-or-nothing thinking, mind-reading, imagining how he's thinking, you see blame, you see hidden should statements, he shouldn't be like that, he shouldn't feel like that.
David Burns: You see discounting the positive, mental filtering, overgeneralization, magnification, minimization. You see all the same 10 distortions. The only difference is that when you're depressed and I can show you that your thoughts about yourself are distorted and that's not true that you're a loser, you're going to love me, the therapist, you're going to appreciate that and you're going to feel better and you're going to feel better and recover from your depression.
David Burns: When people are in conflict and we're having distorted thoughts about the other person, we're generally not motivated to challenge those distortions because they make us feel good. We feel morally superior to the other person. I don't generally work with people too much on changing their distortions about others because they don't want to hear it.
David Burns: If the therapist finds out that this woman, that her thoughts about her husband are causing her to be upset, not her husband's behavior, and in addition that her thoughts about her husband are all wrong, wrong, wrong, they are all distorted, she'll just fire the therapist and drop out of therapy and she'll have two enemies, her loser of a husband and her loser of a therapist.
David Burns: That's why I developed some of the techniques we talked about in the last podcast we did on relationships. I used slightly different strategies, but you're right, those distortions are incredibly positive and the other kind of distortion you have when you're in conflict if someone's criticizing you, again you may start thinking, "This shows that I'm a loser, I'm no good. I should be better than I am. If you're criticizing me, that's a very dangerous and terrible situation."
David Burns: By attending to those kind of thoughts that make you feel anxious and ashamed and inferior and guilty and inadequate, then you can modify those and then do much better in the way you communicate with the other person because your ego isn't on the line. An example with me is in my teaching, I always get feedback from every class I do, every student I mentor or supervise from every workshop and I get it right away, I don't get it six months from now, I get it the very day that I'm teaching.
David Burns: I get all kinds of criticisms on the feedback forms I've developed even if I have a tremendous teaching seminar, I'll get a lot of criticisms especially if they feel safe to criticize the teacher. I find that if I don't beat myself up with inner dialogue, then I can find the truth in what the student is saying and treat that person with warmth and with respect and with enthusiasm even.
David Burns: Then they suddenly really love the way that I've handled their criticism and it leads to a better relationship and that's true between partners or in families as well. That inner dialogue that's where we're targeting ourselves and making ourselves needlessly anxious and defensive and hurt and angry and worthless when we're in conflict with someone - that can be adjusted and modified to really enhance relationships.
Neil Sattin: The two distortions that we hadn't really covered yet, you just mentioned them and I thought ... We've mentioned them all at this point, but some of them like blaming, whether it's blaming yourself for a situation or blaming others for a situation, that seems a little self-evident.
Neil Sattin: I'm curious if you could talk for a moment about labeling and then also magnification and minimization just because I think those are the two that we listed, but didn't really cover.
David Burns: Did we mention shoulds?
Neil Sattin: Let's mention them and I think again, that might be something that's a little more understandable for people, but yeah, let's do this.
David Burns: Oh yeah, okay. Yup. Well, labeling is just an extreme form of overgeneralization where you say I am a loser or with someone else, "He is a jerk." Where you see yourself or another person as this bad glob so to speak. Instead of focusing on specific behaviors, you're focusing on the self. When you think of yourself as a loser or a hopeless case, it creates tremendous pain.
David Burns: When you label someone else as a jerk or a loser, it creates rage and then you'll often treat them in a hostile way and then they treat you in a hostile way and you say, "Oh, I know he was a loser." You don't realize you're involved in a self-fulfilling prophecy and you're creating the other person's, you're contributing to or creating the other person's hostile behavior.
David Burns: Magnification or minimization is pretty self-evident - where you're blowing things out of proportion - like procrastinators do that. You think about, "All you have to do, all the filing that you're behind on." It feels like you have to climb Mount Everest and you got overwhelmed and then minimization, you're telling yoruself, "Oh, just working on that for five or 10 minutes would be a drop in the bucket. It wouldn't make a difference." You don't get started on the project.
David Burns: We've done those two. The should statement say I think is very subtle and not obvious to people at all that we beat up on ourselves the shoulds and shouldn'ts and oughts and musts and we're saying, "I shouldn't have screwed up, I shouldn't have made that mistake. I should be better than I am."
David Burns: That creates a tremendous amount of suffering and shoulds go back - if you look at the origin in the English dictionary, maybe we did this in our last podcast, I don't recall that if you have one of these thick dictionaries, you'll find the origin of the word should is the Anglo's accent word scolde, S-C-O-L-D-E where you're scolding yourself or another person, where you're saying to your partner, "You shouldn't feel that way." Or, "You shouldn't believe that."
David Burns: We see that politically, two people are always blaming someone they're not in agreement with and throwing should statements at them. Albert Ellis has called that the "shouldy" approach to life which is a cheap joke I guess, but it contains a lot of truth. The feminist psychiatrist Karen Horney who actually I think was born in 1890s did beautiful work on shoulds - when my mother, when we moved to Phoenix from Denver, I think my mother got depressed and she read a book by Karen Horney on the Tyranny of the Shoulds, how we give ourselves all these should statements and make us feel like we're not good enough and we're not measuring up to our own expectations and create so much suffering.
David Burns: I think that book was very helpful to her and then Albert Ellis in New York saw that, he argued and I think rightly so that most human suffering is the result of the shoulds that we impose on ourselves or the should statements that we impose on others.
Neil Sattin: Well, if that's true, then maybe that should be what we take a moment to attack and I'm wondering if you have a powerful crushing technique that works with shoulds whether it's and maybe it would be a little bit different, the ones that we wield against ourselves versus so and so should know or should have done this differently.
David Burns: Right. Well, a lot of the overcoming has to do with the mystical, spiritual concept of acceptance, accepting yourself as a flawed human being is really the source of enlightenment, but we fight against acceptance because we think it's like giving in and settling for second best. We continue to beat up on ourselves thinking if we hit ourselves with enough should statements, we'll somehow achieve perfection or greatness or some such thing.
David Burns: One thing that I learned from Ellis that has been really helpful to my patients is that there's only three correct uses of the word should in the English language. There's the moral shoulds like the 10 commandments, thou shalt not commit adultery, though shalt not steal or thou shalt not kill.
David Burns: There's the laws of the universe should where if I drop a pen right now, it should fall to the earth because of the force of gravity and then there's the legal should. You should not drive down the highway at 90 miles an hour because that's against the law and you'll get a ticket. Now, I had a colleague who came on one of the hikes who has a developmentally challenged child, say a son just to disguise things a little bit and she's from a very high achieving family, Silicon Valley family just to say the least.
David Burns: She and her husband are giants, geniuses and then she went to the grammar school for the parent's day and they had all the kids and they have their daughter in some very expensive private school. The kid's pictures were up on the wall and then she saw her son's picture and it was just very primitive compared with the other children who are real high-powered children from high powered families.
David Burns: Her son struggles severely and then she saw that and she felt the feeling of shame. Then she told herself, "I should not feel ashamed of my son." That's hitting herself with a should statement which it's like she doesn't have permission to have this emotion and that's what we do to ourselves.
David Burns: That's not a legal should, it's not illegal to feel ashamed of yourself or your son. She then was also of course feeling ashamed of herself. It's not immoral and it doesn't violate the laws of the universe. A simple technique that Ellis suggested and it's so simple it goes in one ear and out the other instead of saying, "I shouldn't, you can just say it would be preferabe if or I would prefer it if or it would be better if."
David Burns: You could say it it would be better, it would be preferable if I didn't feel ashamed of my son, but that's the human feeling and probably other parents feel upset with their children, they feel ashamed sometimes of their kids or angry with their kids. It's giving yourself permission to be human and that's called the acceptance paradox.
David Burns: The paradox is sometimes when you accept your broken nature, accept your flaws and shortcomings, you transcend them. I've often written that acceptance is the greatest change a human being can make, but it's elusive and Buddha tried to teach this 2,500 years ago when I saw on TV and I don't know if was just a goofy program, but it was on PBS that he had over 100,000 followers in his lifetime and only three achieved enlightenment.
David Burns: I think it was frustrating to him and disappointing, but I can see it clearly because what he was teaching was so simple and basic and yet it's hard for us to grasp it and that's why I love doing therapy because we've got powerful new techniques now where I can bring my patients to enlightenment often in a single therapy session if I have more than an hour.
David Burns: If I have a two hour session, I can usually complete treatment in about a session and see the patient going from all the self-criticism and self-hatred and misery to actually joy and euphoria. It's one of the greatest experiences a human being can have because when my patient has a transforming experience, then it transforms me at the same time.
Neil Sattin: Can you give us a taste of what some of the more powerful new techniques are and how they might work in these circumstances?
David Burns: Yeah, they're pretty anti-intuitive and it took me many years of clinical practice before I figured it out and before it dawned on me. I would say very few therapists know how to do this and it's absolutely against the grain of the way therapists have been trained and the general public have been trained to think about depression and anxiety as brain disorders.
David Burns: The DSM calls them mental disorders. We've gone in the opposite direction and I'll just make it real quick because we're getting long on people's time here I'm afraid, but when I am working with a person, like last night at my Tuesday group, we were working with a therapist and someone who's in training to become a therapist and she was being very self-critical and telling herself she wasn't smart enough and just beating up on herself and saying that she was defective and she should be better at this and she should this, she shouldn't that.
David Burns: She was feeling like 90% depressed and 80% ashamed and intensely anxious. One thing I do before I ... She had all these negative thoughts, "I'm defective" and I don't have the list in my hand, but she had about 17 very self-critical thoughts. After I empathized and my co-therapist was Jill Levitt, a clinical psychologist who I teach with at Stanford and Jill is just a gem, she's fantastically brilliant and kind and compassionate and humble.
David Burns: After we empathized with this individual and I'll just keep it vague because most therapists feel exactly the same way so I won't give any identifying details, but we asked this young woman, "Would you like some help today?" With her depression and anxiety. If we had a magic button on the table and she pressed it, all our negative thoughts and feelings would instantly disappear.
David Burns: Would she press the magic button? She said, "Oh yeah, that would be wonderful." I guess she's felt this way on and off throughout her life since she was a little girl that she is somehow not good enough. Then we said, "Well, we have no magic button, but we have amazing techniques." But before we use these techniques, maybe we should ask, "What are your negative thoughts and feelings show about you that's beautiful and awesome?"
David Burns: Also, "what are some benefits to you in having all of these negative thoughts and feelings?" She was very puzzled by that at first as most therapists are like, "How could there be benefits from having depression? We learn that's some kind of mental disorder or major depressive disorder, dysthymic disorder, all these fancy names pretending that these are mental illnesses of some kind.
David Burns: But then she got in the flow, we primed the pump a little bit and she was able to come up with a list of 20 overwhelming benefits to her and beautiful things about her that were revealed by her negative thoughts and feelings. For example, when she says, "I'm defective." She will say, "Well, it shows that I'm honest and accountable. Because I do have many flaws."
David Burns: Then a second benefit was "it shows that I have high standards." I was able to say, "Do you have high standards?" She said, "Absolutely." I said, "Have your high standards motivated you to work hard and accomplish a lot?" She says, "Oh yeah, absolutely." That was the third benefit. Then the fourth benefit is her self-criticism showed that she's a humble person. That was the fourth benefit, the fourth beautiful thing it showed about her.
David Burns: Then we pointed out that humility is the same as spirituality. Her self-criticism shows that she's a humble and spiritual person and then her sadness showed her passion for what she hopes to achieve which is a role as a therapist and a good therapist and her self-doubt keeps her on her toes and motivates her to work really hard.
David Burns: Her suffering shows enhances her compassion for others and her shame shows that she has a good value system, a good moral compass and on and on and on, then we came up with a list of when we got to 20 benefits of her negative thoughts and feelings, then we simply said to her, "Well, maybe we don't want to press that magic button because when your negative thoughts and feelings disappears, then these other good things will disappear as well. Why in the world would you want to do that?"
David Burns: We have become the role of her subconscious mind and the therapist is paradoxically arguing for the status quo and not arguing for change. The therapist's attempt to help or change the patient is actually the cause of nearly all therapeutic failure both in the treatment of depression and anxiety as well as in your specialty area which is relationship conflicts.
David Burns: Then we did a little thing to help her resolve this conflict called the magic dial which is instead of pressing a magic button and making them all disappear, maybe it's appropriate to have some negative feelings fro time to time. How depressed would you want to feel when you walk out of the room tonight at the end of the evening?
David Burns: Maybe you don't need 90% to have the benefits of the sadness and the depression. What would be a good level? What would you like it to be? She said, "Well, maybe 20% would be enough." Then, "Yeah, okay." We make that her goal, we'll reduce it to 20. Then if she want to reduce her anxiety to 15 and reduce the shame to five and reduce the anger to 15 and these different goals we set for her.
David Burns: Then I said, "Okay, we'll reduce them to just that level, but no higher. Now, you have to be careful because the techniques are so powerful that we're going to use now that your depression may go below 20. It may get all the way to zero or five, but don't worry, if we overshoot before the end of the evening, I help you work your depression back up to 20."
David Burns: Then she started laughing, but at this point, we've made a deal with her subconscious mind and then she's in control. We're not imposing our values on her. She's saying, "I'm willing to go to this level." Then at that point, we're generally five or 10 minutes away from total enlightenment which is what happened last night.
David Burns: She started just crushing her negative thoughts and finding the distortions in them because her subconscious mind is now giving her permission to fight these distorted thoughts. By the end of the evening, we worked with her for about two hours including teaching about 30 therapists who are launching, teaching along the way and pretty much everything went to zero.
David Burns: At the moment of that, she suddenly received her enlightenment, she started sobbing because she was so euphoric and ecstatic. At the end of the evening, it was not just feeling less depressed and anxious because all the feelings pretty much went to zero, but she went into a transcendent state of what I would call spiritual enlightenment.
David Burns: It's just mind-blowing and most therapists in the general public, they don't even know that these new techniques exist and that these fantastic rapid changes are possible, but that's what I see. Almost every time I treat somebody now and it's mind-boggling and that's why I'm so grateful to have had the chance to be on your show today to try to get the word out more.
David Burns: I'm writing a new book about it as well. The tentative title will be Feeling Great. It will have all of these new positive reframing and resistance busting techniques along with the powerful cognitive techniques.
Neil Sattin: Just to step up a little bit, it sounds like the technique that you described is all about laying the ground work so that when you go back to doing the cognitive work, you have way less inner resistance to that change actually happening.
David Burns: Yeah. Usually there's none and all patients have within them and everyone listening to the show right now, this powerful healing voice, but we keep it suppressed because of the resistance thinking we don't want to give up our perfectionism for example. We think that if we keep beating up on ourselves, that's somehow honorable or good or motivating and that's why in all of the psychotherapy outcome studies for depression, at least 50% of the patients don't improve much at all and it's because all these schools of psychotherapy are busy throwing help at patients without stopping to think, "What are some reasons this person might want to resist change?"
David Burns: The kinds of reasons we have come up with for resistance are all flattering to the patients. We make the patients proud of their symptoms, proud of their resistance and paradoxically when we do that, suddenly they want to change and then recovery is generally just a matter of minutes away like eight minutes or 12 minutes or something in that range.
Neil Sattin: Wow. While we wait for your new book to come out, what are the best ways for people to get more information about these techniques if they're not in the Bay Area?
David Burns: On my website, www.feelinggood.com, feeling good is one word with two G's in the middle. There's tons of free resources for therapists and general public alike. There's a Feeling Good blog, the Feeling Good podcasts, there's all kinds of stuff. I probably have at least 500 or maybe a thousand or more pages of free resources there for folks and I would say that's a good step in the right direction or to pick up the feeling good handbook or the feeling good book because those tools are still incredibly powerful and helpful to millions of people in the United States and around the world as well.
David Burns: Feeling Good is now in over, well over 30 languages. It sold more than five million in the US and I have no idea how many more worldwide. Those techniques are still as good as gold and really helpful for individuals.
Neil Sattin: Wow. Well, we will have links to your site and your books available on the show notes for this episode which you can pick up by visiting neilsattin.com/feelinggood2 or you can always text the word passion to the number 33444 and follow the instructions to get the transcript and action guide for this episode. David, I'm wondering if we have time for one more quick question.
David Burns: Absolutely.
Neil Sattin: This is of course a relationship show. A lot of what we've talked about is ways of turning the work inward, noticing the cognitive distortions that are coming up within you and how you can attack them powerfully in order to neutralize their effect and actually be more present, more in the moment and more able to have feelings that are actually based on reality and not just on something that you're making up.
Neil Sattin: However, when I think about hanging out with Chloe tonight, my wife, who's amazing, I wonder about what should I do, not that this would ever happen, but what if I notice her saying something or let's just flip this around. What if Chloe listens to this podcast and then she notices that I am using some cognitive distortion, some distorted thinking is coming out of me.
Neil Sattin: What's the best way for Chloe as my partner to avoid the pitfalls of maybe calling me out on it, but still to turn it into a generative conversation when she recognizes exactly what's going on? "Oh Neil, he's just trapped in blame again." Or not that I would ever do that, but a should statement, whatever it is.
David Burns: Well, I may not have the answer you're looking for here, but I do have a definite answer to that. I write books for people to help themselves, not to try to help other people or to impose these ideas on someone else because if you go around saying to someone, "Oh, you're having this distorted thought or that distorted thought."
David Burns: It would just irritate the heck out of them. If you have a family member or friend who's depressed, you could give him a copy of Feeling Good or suggest they pick up a copy of Feeling Good and it will probably be very helpful to them, but when you see another person involved in distorted thinking, I think that the thing that you can do in this too is hard to learn and probably would need another podcast would be to empathize and to listen and to provide emotional support without trying to help or fix them or change the distortions and their thoughts because I can tell you that it's not going to be effective to throw help or advice at someone who's angry at you or who's depressed and angry with themselves.
David Burns: Empathy can have a certain healing power and I think is about as far as we need to go as general citizens, as partners, as family members. I think empathy itself requires a lot of training and learning to do it skillfully and it's a gift that the world needs where we're not seeing a lot of empathy and support for one another in the world.
David Burns: We're seeing a lot of attack and criticism and trying to change other people, trying to punish other people and those strategies in my opinion are usually doomed to failure or as empathy and warmth and compassion has always been a gift through the ages.
Neil Sattin: I would love to have you back on the show to chat about empathy. In the meantime, I will make sure that if I hear any cognitive distortions, I don't go offering a magic button too.
David Burns: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Thank you so much Neil and maybe another six months down the road or something we'll do Feeling Good part three, but it's always an honor for me to work with you and I have a tremendous respect for you because of the quality of what you bring to the interview and to the dialogue which I just think is tremendous.
Neil Sattin: Thank you so much David and the feeling is mutual.
Resources:
Check out Dr. David Burns's website
Read David’s classic books, Feeling Good or When Panic Attacks
FREE Relationship Communication Secrets Guide
www.neilsattin.com/feelinggood2 Visit to download the transcript, or text “PASSION” to 33444 and follow the instructions to download the transcript to this episode with David Burns
Amazing intro/outro music graciously provided courtesy of: The Railsplitters - Check them Out
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Neil Sattin, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Science of Success (LS 60 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: Four Questions That Will Change Your World - An Exploration of “The Work” with Byron Katie
Pub date: 2018-03-08
In this episode, we take a journey into the inquiry know as “The Work’ and uncover the 4 question framework that you can use to break down negative thoughts and limiting beliefs. We examine what happens when we argue with reality, look at the difference between being right and being free, explore the causes of suffering, and much more with our guest Byron Katie. Byron Katie is an American speaker, author, and founder of the method of self-inquiry known as “The Work”. She has worked with millions of individuals at both private and public events in prisons, hospitals, treatment centers, universities, and schools. She is the author of three bestselling books and her work has been featured in TIME, The Huffington Post, Oprah, and much more!
What happens when you don’t accept reality? Do you like it when you scrape your knee? How should you deal with negative experience? Missing the miracle of life by arguing with it What happens when we get caught up in having to be right? Why it’s painful to “believe your own thoughts” and why you should question your own thinking The Four Questions of “The Work” that can allow you to challenge your negative thoughts and limiting beliefs Using the “Four Questions” to meditate on and reflect on challenges in your life How to become a better listener, listening is powerful When you argue with someone else, you miss valuable information and become disconnected with that person We are often looking outside for the answers to our questions - we should instead look inside The only way to change the world is to question what you believe about the world? How to be open and fearless What you think that causes your suffering - it's only what you’re thinking and believing that causes your suffering What we think and believe create our identities People don’t need to change - what you think and believe about them could use some work Be aware of your life right here, right now - the value and the gift of life and how to take care of it. The Four Questions of the Work and how you can apply each of themIs it true? Can I absolutely know that it’s true? Who am I when I believe this to be true? Who would I be without this thought? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Matt Bodnar, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Relationship Alive! (LS 54 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 127: Peter Levine - Building Resiliency in Yourself, Your Relationship, and Your Children
Pub date: 2018-01-31
One of the most important things that you can develop in your life, and in your relationship, is your resilience - the way that you bounce back from the challenges that life throws your way. How do you recover in a way that leaves you even stronger, more connected, more inspired than before? In today’s episode, we’re talking with Dr. Peter Levine, creator of Somatic Experiencing, author of the bestseller Waking the Tiger: Healing Trauma, and co-author, with Maggie Kline, of Trauma-Proofing Your Kids. Peter and I explore exactly how to build your own resiliency - and how to also help your partner, and your kids become more resilient.
Please enjoy this week’s episode, with Dr. Peter Levine, on Relationship Alive! We’ll show you how to tap into the language of sensation, which gives you a window into the deepest parts of your brain and body. We’ll explain how to show up for others in your life, to support them in the most effective way possible. And you’ll discover how to help children access their innate ability to heal as well.
Resources:
Here is a link to Relationship Alive episode 29, my first conversation with Peter Levine: How to Heal Your Triggers and Trauma
Peter’s author page on Amazon
FREE Relationship Communication Secrets Guide
Peter Levine’s website
Somatic Experiencing Trauma Institute (to locate certified SE practitioners)
Relationship Alive Community on Facebook
Amazing intro/outro music graciously provided courtesy of:
The Railsplitters - Check them Out
Transcript:
Neil Sattin: Hello and welcome to another episode of Relationship Alive. This is your host, Neil Sattin. How do you foster resiliency in yourself and in your partner and if you have kids, in your kids? When it comes to relationship and how we are in the world, there's perhaps nothing as important as how resilient we are because let's face it. Life sometimes sends problems our way or things that are challenging. And if you're expecting everything to be a cakewalk, then life is going to be really hard for you.
Neil Sattin: On the flip side, if when things go wrong, you think, "Oh, my goodness, it's over now," then things are also going to be hard for you. In order to get through anything that happens to you and come out the other side stronger and more vibrant and to bring that same quality into your relationship and to bring that same quality to, if you have kids in your life, the way that they respond to the world. That is what we are going to talk about today.
Neil Sattin: In order to do so, we have brought back one of our most esteemed guests to the Relationship Alive podcast. His name is Dr. Peter Levine, and he is one of the world's experts on how to heal from trauma. He was first on the show back in Episode 29 and if you're interested in checking that out, you can go to http://www.neilsattin.com/trauma and you can hear all about how to heal your triggers and trauma in relationship.
Neil Sattin: We're not going to cover much of that material. We're going to try to cover new ground here. I invite you to listen to Episode 29. In the meantime, it's not a prerequisite for today's conversation and we are going to dive deep on the topic of resiliency. If you want a transcript and guide for this episode, you can visit http://www.neilsattin.com/levine as in Peter Levine and that's spelled L-E-V-I-N-E or you can text the word "passion" to the number 33444 and follow the instructions and I will send you a link where you can download that show guide and transcript.
Neil Sattin: In the meantime, Peter Levine, thank you so much for joining us today. It's great to have you back here on Relationship Alive.
Peter Levine: Thank you. It's good to be back. I enjoyed the last time.
Neil Sattin: Well, it's always exciting to be able to chat with you and you are someone who has been on the forefront of figuring out how we heal the things that keep us stuck. And there's nothing that I think defines resilience more than the ability to get unstuck when you're going through something.
Peter Levine: Indeed, I like that. I think that's right on it. It's about when we get stuck, somehow knowing we can handle it because of an inner sense in our bodies, in our organism and that we can also receive and give support at times that are really challenging.
Neil Sattin: Yeah. I'm inspired by in your book, Trauma and Memory: Brain and Body in a Search for the Living Past, which I happen to have here right in front me. You talked about this location in the brain where resides our capacity for wanting to persevere through adversity.
Peter Levine: Wow, you obviously have actually read it. Yeah, that is central to healing from trauma, and also for being able to stay in a supported intimate relationship. There amazingly are areas in the brain, specific areas that appear literally to be involved with the will to persevere in the face of significant obstacles.
Peter Levine: If you think about it, it makes sense because we wouldn't be able to survive as a species if we didn't have that capacity. I don't say it's the same as resilience but it's a big important component of resilience. In working with people who have been traumatized for 45 years, and I think back on it, I think really my job is to help them enlist that capacity, connect to that capacity and by doing that being able to move forward in difficult times. But I think they're very closely related, this will to persevere and resilience.
Peter Levine: I also see resilience as an autonomic exercise and what I mean by that is when we're in states of fear, our autonomic nervous system gets activated in particular ways and that really affects our whole perception of the world and our cognition really because it's strong ... But it's a foundation for many perceptions. And if we're able to experience ourselves, for example, our heart rate increasing and then experiencing it decreasing, we're doing an autonomic exercise.
Peter Levine: This is something that couples can do with each other by just being present when one of the members is feeling frightened. “It's okay, and so what happens now and what happens next? And is there anything about that? Is there anything else about that?” To be there with the person, to help them move through the stuck places is a great gift and I really believe that in one way or another, most, maybe even all successful couples have some degree of this capacity.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, and in the interest of increasing that and maybe even getting a little bit more detail about what you were just mentioning, I'm thinking now because as I mentioned before we jumped on the interview, I just read your amazing book, Trauma-Proofing Your Kids: A Parents' Guide for Instilling Confidence, Joy and Resilience. One of the things that I loved about the book was not only feeling way more resourced in terms of how I show up for my own children but also you stressed the importance for parents of being able to understand the language of the body so that you can have those communications with your children and help them understand the language of the body.
Neil Sattin: But one thing I'd love for you to talk about is how there's this way of communicating about sensation that is how these deeper parts of our brain actually perceive the world that's not about ... Because I think the temptation, if I were sitting with my partner would be, if I were saying “what's next” and “what happens next” we would be caught in these zoo of thoughts and feelings. I love bringing it down to the deeper level of sensations. Can you talk a little bit about that and why it's so important to develop a vocabulary around sensation in your body?
Peter Levine: Yeah, for sure. All of our emotions have sensation-based components. Indeed many emotions, particularly difficult emotions, are a combination of physical sensations and cognitive thoughts or beliefs. And together, they drive an emotional state such as fear or rage and if we are able to become aware of the sensations that actually underlie those emotions, then we are able to allow the sensations to change, to transform and also noticing the thoughts that are involved, and doing that has the sometimes miraculous way to actually change our emotions.
Peter Levine: Because one of the things about difficult emotions - called negative emotions - is they just have a tendency to keep going and keep going as much as we can understand them or understand our thoughts about them. Really, it's difficult to change them and I really believe my experience is that again, the way that we can change the ... One of the ways that we can change these difficult emotions is by the alchemy of working with these sensations, the underlying sensations and also sensations of goodness.
Peter Levine: In my major book, In An Unspoken Voice: How the Body Releases Trauma and Restores Goodness, the key is in both. And restoring goodness also is a sensation, a feeling of felt sensation of resilience. When I say goodness, I don't mean like a good child, a good spouse, a good so forth and so on. I mean, more of the Buddhistic understanding of goodness - that it's a feeling of wholeness and a feeling like this, like wholeness, are some of the most important antidotes again for these difficult emotions and sensations, that allow us to move through them because we have this innate capacity to heal.
Peter Levine: Originally, I studied this in animals and how they rebound in the aftermath of prey animals and predation but it's led me to a more general understanding that there is this profound instinct similar to the instinct to persevere - they're related, I'm sure, to heal - that we yearn healing. And in a way, in relationships, I'm sure as you and many of your speakers have noted that we tend to pick people with similar traumas or complementary traumas. At first, we're very much in love, which is often the first phase of a relationship, but then what happens when the stuff hits the fan, how do we deal with that in a collaborative way, in a corrective way?
Peter Levine: Again, this is so important in restoring resilience because co-regulation is tremendously important. I'm looking forward to it and later this month, there's a big Evolution of Psychology conference in Anaheim and I'm on a panel with Sue Johnson. I think you've interviewed Sue and if any of your readers don't know, Sue is the leading person in understanding the emotions that go on in couples' dynamics and really has a strong emphasis on co-regulation.
Peter Levine: What I'm saying is that we need both co-regulation, of course, but we also need the tools for our own regulation, for our own building of resilience. I see the two blending together very nicely.
Neil Sattin: Taking a step back, I guess just to-
Peter Levine: Let me go back, one other thing.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, go ahead.
Peter Levine: We're talking about with our children. By learning to read their bodies and helping them connect with their sensations, we are building a tremendous reservoir of resilience that they will add skills that they will carry for their whole lives. Again, one of the things that as parents that we need to be able to do is when there's ... In the inevitable fall or God knows the ride to the emergency room, we need first to take care of our own sensations and emotions because children are incredible mimickers. They will pick up the emotion of the parent.
Peter Levine: You know, anybody who's flown in an airplane in the last 25 years, what do they call them? The cabin personnel, they make the announcement that in the unlikely event of depressurization, the oxygen mask will come down. If you have a child or somebody infirm next to you, put the mask on your face first and then put the mask on the child. In other words, calm yourself first so that the children are not picking up the fear. Or very often, the parents override the fear with anger and they're very angry at the child. Again, children will pick this up.
Peter Levine: If we learn to take care of ourselves, self-regulation, we then can impart that capacity or support that developing capacity in our kids. When I work with kids when there's been a relatively acute trauma, sometimes, it just takes a few minutes of play and they go right to the place where they are stuck in their bodies. I just help them move through that and then, they're off back to play again.
Peter Levine: These tools are tremendously important and probably a quarter of the book or the eighth of the book, I guess, probably is about exercises to help the parents maintain this resilience in the face of the catastrophes that will befall the children and the parents. It's a given. Kids, especially when they get into the more active phase around 18 months, 2 years where they're just scooting everywhere and climbing and falling and pulling flower pots down on their sweet little heads. They get terrified but again, if we hold our own center and then help the child contain those difficult emotions and sensations, they will calm often surprisingly quickly, sometimes in a matter of minutes.
Peter Levine: The way you support children, it's age-dependent. The way you support a baby who's tremendously upset is way different than the way you support a four-year-old. With a young child, you're going to be holding the child and rocking the child. With the four-year-old, you're going to sitting by child's side and maybe placing your hand as we suggest in the book, on the child's back until the breathing reestablished itself, the spontaneous breathing reestablished itself.
Peter Levine: The amazing thing, I think, the side effect of this is that kids start doing it for themselves and many of the children that I've worked tell me how they've done it in their school when something happens to one of the students. They sit there and they're with the student in that way. Actually, when I was designing the cover of the book with North Atlantic, I wanted it to be red. It has a picture of children in the middle. This is not red, but the rest of the cover is red and the idea, please forgive me, is Mao Zedong and the way he wanted the red book, well, he insisted that the red book be in the hands of everybody in China that had his sayings.
Peter Levine: The idea here is that every parent could have this book and could share it with other parents. One of the things that I think geopolitically is that when we're in a fearful state, any leader, and we've had ample evidence of this, who says there's an enemy out there. They want to attack us. They want to humiliate us. They want to take our jobs away and I am the only person that can protect you. No names mentioned.
Peter Levine: That's going to grab a lot of people. But if you're not in a fearful state, then you don't buy into that. You really think about it. I'm hoping also that this book in the next generation will give us more citizens, more democratic citizens allowed to or what's the word I'm looking for? Empowered, really, to make effective action.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, as I was reading the book for one thing, and actually this brings me to a question because I was reading it and I was, of course, thinking, "Wow, I wish I had read this before my kids were born." I want to fill in a gap or two but perhaps before we do that, I'm just going to ask you this question which is, let's say, my son. He's going to turn 11 in a couple of months, but there are things that I remember having happened with him. When he was two and tumbled down the stairs or three or four years ago, he jumped off a swing set and ended up breaking his arm. These are some traumatic events in his life. I'm wondering, and this is obviously going to have some bearing for adults as well. How do I know if those things are lodged within him as trauma? And if so, what's a way to invite him into releasing that?
Peter Levine: Well often, you'll see it, 11 is an age where you can really also talk to the child-
Neil Sattin: Definitely.
Peter Levine: And sometimes, we're sitting around. We'll say something like ... Maybe even if we're at the top of stairs or something like that and I would just maybe sit down with the child and saying, "Gosh, I remember when you fell down these stairs when you were two years old. Do you remember anything about that?" If the child very quickly says no, then you have a good indication there's something there. Or, if they say yes, if they reflect and then say yes, then it's an opportunity, really a wonderful opportunity to explore that.
Peter Levine: What I sometimes will do is, for example, if the child was falling, I'll hold the child or put my hand on the back of the child and hold the child and let them fall into my hand gradually and then to see what happens as they have this controlled fall. Because again, you have your hands, they're not going to fall. But they have the feeling, the sensations of falling. That may bring up images or sensations that were associated with the earlier event when they tumble down a flight. I guess, it was a flight of stairs. I think that was just an assumption I made.
Peter Levine: In games, in play, in just talking, 11-year-old, you were able to say again, "Remember, a couple of year ..." When was it that happened, a couple of years ago?
Neil Sattin: Well, that and the stairs, that was a long time ago, but I know he remembers it because it's come up before in conversation.
Peter Levine: Well, I would again make a game at it with a falling game. Sometimes, I'll do it just holding them with my hands, letting them slowly fall backwards, for example, or forward. You can do either one, and then I'll put a really big, super big pillow or combination of pillows and then they can begin to ... I'll let them down part way and see if they want to play the game where you release them and they fall into the pillows.
Peter Levine: At first, there may be some fear. You might see it in their eyes or their heartbeat might increase. They might tense a little bit, but you see when you continue with this controlled falling and they're falling into the soft cushions, the kids love it. And very often, it's something simple like that which is all that's needed. Something simple like that.
Neil Sattin: Where would it come in, for instance, just using my son as an example. Let's play a game. Let's do this thing, and let's say I notice something in him, where would it come into ask him or to invite him to name the qualities of sensation that he's feeling within him?
Peter Levine: Well, again, if you talk to him, "I wonder if you remember the tumble you took down the stairs when you were really little, when you were about two years old." If the child says yes, then the sensations are going to be right there. If they're not remembering it, you can say, "Well, when you just even think about that, think about how it might have been for you. Is there any place in your body that you can actually feel that?" Again, most children will point to some part of their body.
Peter Levine: Then, you take it to the next step. "Okay, and you feel that sensation. Does it have a shape? Does it have a size? Does it have a color? What does it feel like?" And so forth. You start asking these what I call open-ended questions.
Neil Sattin: What is it about naming those sensations that's so important?
Peter Levine: Well, of course, the most important thing, of course, is feeling the sensations, being in contact with the sensations. But naming them is also important, because that's a way that the child can reference them in the future. It's kind of like a flag attached to the sensation. "Okay, this sensation has a name. The next time I have this sensation, I have a name and when I have the name, I can also notice the sensation." You're shifting back and forth.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, and that reminds me of how important it is for all of us really to have the experience of moving through - which is part of what contributes to resiliency - is knowing that the pendulum swings the other way.
Peter Levine: That's right. Yeah, I call that pendulation, because no matter what we're feeling ... What we tend to do when there's been a difficult sensation is we recoil from it. We try to push it away and by pushing it away, it actually makes it seem stronger. That which we resist persists. If you have a sensation that's coming up, imagine your hand moving upwards and your hand is in a fist, your arm moving upwards and you take the other hand and you put it over that hand that wants to move up. Well, then it's going to push harder against your upper hand and then your upper hand is going to push harder against it. It then seems like this is going to be overwhelming and we lose resilience.
Peter Levine: However, when we're able to experience the sensation and that it moves through, that it increases and it decreases, that it contracts and it expands. It contracts and expands and expands and expands. This is the expansion, which I talked about when I say goodness or wholeness. Again, I think it's very deeply related to resilience. I think we're talking about many, many, many of these different states and processes that increase a resilience.
Neil Sattin: When a child is able to get related to that inner sensation, and I think this is true for adults as well that when we're sitting with our partner and able to say, "Okay, like right now, I'm feeling this constriction in my chest and this heat in the palms of my hands. There's tension behind my eyes like I almost want to cry." When you can get really related to that sensation, then you can-
Peter Levine: I'm sorry, to which sensation? The sensation of?
Neil Sattin: To all of those, I guess, like those things that are happening in your body. Like one, just like you were saying earlier, when you feel those states again, it can remind you like, "Oh, I've been here before," and “I know what's going on” so there's that. But then, there's also ... And you talk about this in terms of pendulation, if you can get acquainted with the sensations of goodness and what that feels like in your body as well.
Peter Levine: That's right.
Neil Sattin: Then that really connects you with that full range of experience and how you move from one to the other.
Peter Levine: When you experience goodness, it stays with you and it really helps you get that whatever you're feeling, whatever the sensations are, they will change. But the bigger reservoir of goodness we have, the more resilient. A study was done, oh, gosh, I don't remember by whom or when. I think Bessel told me about it, Bessel van der Kolk, that if a person, a child has had tremendous trauma in their lives, neglect and abuse, that child will actually fare okay - in other words, you'll be able to work with that person - if one adult in their lives has cared about them and loved them unconditionally.
Peter Levine: In a way, that's amazing. Again, I think that's something that contributes to that reservoir of goodness and resilience that somebody really reflected our feelings and our states and imparted upon us that gift of being seen, of being known, of being cared for, of being loved. It's very important.
Peter Levine: Again, most people that you see have had, I believe, one encounter with that reservoir of goodness and so, sometimes actually with adults but possibly also with children, to remember together that person. When you remember that person, how does it sense in your body? How does it feel in your body when you see the picture of grandma and how she would, when you were sick, she would come and put her hand on your forehead and reassure you. These are valuable. These are lodestars that help us return to our own capacity for resilience and wholeness.
Neil Sattin: One thing that strikes me too is that that is why relationship can be so profoundly healing and allow people to reach new levels of their own thriving in life is if you're able to find that in partnership or your partner is willing to see you unconditionally and hold space for you and accept you in your vulnerable moments, then that allows your system to do what it needs to do to evolve past the things that-
Peter Levine: Right, right. Yeah. Well, unconditional love is not necessarily a given.
Neil Sattin: That's true.
Peter Levine: Hopefully, it's a given between a parent and a child. But I think that just being sufficiently centered and caring can catalyze healing. I don't think there's any question about that. I think it's really important that couples sort of work out a ritual of sorts where if one person needs something, that they can communicate that. And then the other person, their job is to try to be there for that person. And it should be relatively equal. Each person should have a relative number of things.
Peter Levine: Although, particularly, I'm thinking about couples where one of the spouses is coming back from Afghanistan or Iraq. They're very, very traumatized and it's very likely, and hopefully that their spouse, their partner is going to be able to be there for them in those difficult times. I can't tell you how healing that is. It's not easy because a lot of times, because of the fear, the spouse becomes like the enemy. It's almost like you're expecting them to throw a hand grenade at you. So, it's tricky.
Peter Levine: If people want, they can go to ... It's on YouTube, and it's called Ray's Story, Peter Levine's Somatic Experiencing, where I work with a young marine who was blown up by two of these IEDs and then lost ... I think his best friend died in his arms just before that, and how we worked with the shock of that. And then, how we worked together with he and his wife and their new child. And at that time, it was really helping her develop the skills to be with him and to not pursue him when he really needed to withdraw.
Peter Levine: I think it's a short documentary. It's about 20 minutes. I recommend looking at it because it really talks a lot about this. Because when you're highly traumatized, your resilience is very, very low and vice versa when your resilience is higher, the trauma has less of a corrosive effect. But then again, I think it's also important that there'd be some kind of equality that ... I guess I'm saying that one person doesn't become the therapist for the other person, that there's reciprocity - which you have to have in a relationship, of course.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, I have some faith in the pendulation in relationship as well where that reciprocity may not have to all be at the same time, that most likely if one partner is having their moment where they really need to be attended to, the other partner will have their moment at some point down the road.
Peter Levine: Yes. You can pretty well be assured of that.
Neil Sattin: Yeah. And even when people aren't coming back from war zones, and I think the fact that your work is so helpful for people who are suffering such severe trauma, that's like a testament to just how powerful your work is. And at the same time, when you're hijacked and kind of triggered by your emotions and whatever is happening with your partner, you're going to feel like your partner is out to get you. I think that one of the biggest things for partners to realize is to establish like, "Oh, I'm actually safe with you," like, "You're not out to get me or get something from me." Sometimes, there are some reckoning that has to happen for that to actually be true-
Peter Levine: Indeed.
Neil Sattin: For people to renegotiate how they even come together in partnership.
Peter Levine: Absolutely. Again, the idea of making a ritual out of it and because of pendulation, no matter what we're feeling, it may transiently ... It may temporarily feel worse but if you're able to stay with it and maintain an observing presence, it will shift. And often, this observing presence is fostered by the support that we get from our partners.
Neil Sattin: Yeah. Can we talk for a moment about what that looks like? Because I think there's a danger in being the witness whether it's with your partner or with your kids of maybe intervening too soon. What does that process actually look like where something stuck gets resolved?
Peter Levine: Well, let's just say it's a heterosexual couple. The husband comes in and he's had a difficult day at work. It's not a trauma per se, but he failed to get a promotion. The person got the promotion who he felt didn't deserve it, and he's really angry. And he comes home, and there were toys gathered all over the floor, no different than any other day when he would be returning home. He's angry, and he yells at the kids, "Dammit, pick these toys up! You always leave toys in the middle of the room," something like that.
Peter Levine: Let's say the spouse is able to maintain her center and then she can approach her husband and say, "Yeah, it seems like something is upsetting you. And I'd like to just offer myself of just being here so that you can feel what you're feeling." But again, this has to be a pre-agreed upon ritual that you give the permission. You empower the other person to do this for you. Again, because when you're angry, sometimes the tendency is to snap at the partner, not just the kids but the partner.
Peter Levine: Again, we have to find a way that we have some rules and regulations built into it.
Neil Sattin: Yeah. I like a code word sometimes in a time like that.
Peter Levine: Sure. "Okay” or “leave me alone right now."
Neil Sattin: Right. I was thinking more like something even kind of like one partner comes in and says, "This is a ..." I'm just going to make something up here. "This is a Oriole moment," or "This is a Blue Jay moment," or, "We're in code Cardinal for Red"
Peter Levine: Oh, I see. I didn't know what an Oriole moment is back then.
Neil Sattin: Right, just a way like some pre-arranged designation so that the partner doesn't have to say, "Wow, you seemed really triggered right now."
Peter Levine: Oh, got it. Got it. Okay, good idea.
Neil Sattin: If I can say, "Code Cardinal," then the other partner, "I would love to hold space for you right now. I would love to just hear what's going on with you." Then - takes a little bit of the edge of.
Peter Levine: Right. "Can I just be there with you?"
Neil Sattin: Yeah.
Peter Levine: No, code word is a good idea because each person probably knows what word is most likely to work for them and not be reactive to it.
Neil Sattin: Good point.
Peter Levine: Yeah. I think that's an idea. I think that's a great idea. I know some couples, when the other couple is really like anxious and getting ready to, in their perception to snap at them, I had couples that just say, "Eggshells." That's it, and often, they laugh together but not always. You're concerned. You're noticing that you are walking on eggshells. Maybe that's useful.
Peter Levine: But anyhow, let the person pick their own. That's the one that's more likely to work and nothing is going to work all the time. That's another given. There are times when it won't work and you don't want to be discouraged by that. That's just the nature of-
Neil Sattin: Resilience.
Peter Levine: Resilience, of building resilience. It doesn't happen all at once. It doesn't always seem to happen “increase, increase, increase” because sometimes, you're feeling more resilient and then, something happens and it feels like you're less resilient. But the overall movement is towards greater resilience. Again, I think that's just part of how we are built. That's part of our evolutionary advantage, is to have this kind of resilience.
Neil Sattin: Right. And yet so often, it doesn't happen. People do get stuck in trauma or couples get stuck in a pattern of how they interact with each other. I'm curious getting back to our example of the husband who comes home, the partner says, "Could I hold some space for you?" What's likely to happen next?
Peter Levine: Well, let's say a favorable outcome what I've seen many times. Again, let's just say it's heterosexual couple. The husband is coming home and he's obviously activated. Just by being there and being present and saying, "I'm here," saying it verbally and non-verbally, "I am here. I am here for you." Often, the tears will just start flowing from the spouse's eyes, from the husband's eyes, tears of relief and tears of gratitude. And that's another part that's really important in resilience, is not the belief in gratitude but the inner experience of gratefulness, of gratitude.
Peter Levine: Again, that's something that we can cultivate together because it's really what we want. We don't want to be angry and withdraw and isolate ourselves and become more angry. We want to be able to move through it. If people are in a relationship, they're committed to a passionate relationship. If you are committed to that, then you have to be able to work with these difficult emotions. Otherwise, there won't be the passion. The passion will die as these emotions get more and more suppressed.
Peter Levine: I think if people are committed to a passionate relationship, then they also are committed to being there for each other with these difficult emotions.
Neil Sattin: Tears are normal to experience?
Peter Levine: Tears, even sometimes, you'll see shaking and trembling and spontaneous breaths. Sometimes, there'll be even, of course, sobbing. When they're sobbing or even when there's just the tears, very often if the spouse or the partner says, "Can I hold you?" Or, "I'd like to hold you." And they give some kind of a non-verbal cue that it's okay, just holding the person when they're in that emotional pain. God, how liberating that can be to be literally held?
Neil Sattin: Right. And this really challenging because sometimes when your partner is in pain, it's hard to know, like to know what am I supposed to do in this moment. Being willing to make an offer like that. How would I know if I'm holding space for my partner and they're crying and shaking, like how do I know if everything is okay versus like things are not okay?
Peter Levine: Again, no matter what the emotion is, if you're helping to hold the space including holding the person, and I'll put in the question like, or statement like this, "I'd like to hold you. Just nod if that's okay." So, they don't have to think because they will, "Is it okay if I could hold you now?" Well, then the person has to start thinking about it, which takes them out of the feeling. But if you're able to do something like that I just described, "I really would like to hold you. If that's okay, just nod or just look at me for a moment."
Peter Levine: Then, to be held ... Because almost all of us who have been traumatized have not been held in those critical times when we should have been held - but it's never too late to have a resilient childhood. It's never too late to have a happy child because the child not only lives within us but that child's ability to rebound, to be resilient also lives within us.
Neil Sattin: Yeah, and I'm wondering, what does it look like? Like how do these things ... How would it typically resolve? Because I think one thing that a lot of us can feel a lot of fear going into tears and I want to offer this because if you're listening to the show, and maybe you're thinking like, "Oh, God, I got some tears to shed," or like I want you to have a sense of, that there is another side like what does it look through when you get through the tears? What does it look through like if you feel yourself starting to shake? What's on the other side of the that and how do you know when you're getting there?
Peter Levine: Yeah. Again, almost any sensation where the person … It's in a safe enough situation and the person is able to stand back enough to observe them. I can barely ever think of a sensation that didn't become more good, more glad, more whole. It's just our nature, and it's a skill. You have to practice. It doesn't happen all at once, so a couple shouldn't feel frustrated if it doesn't work at once. And if the spouse that's in the distress barks at you, just to feel your own body, of course, and remind yourself that you're not the target, that they're angry at somebody else.
Peter Levine: And then again, sometimes, the partner will say something like, "Maybe it seems like you just want to be alone right now, and if you need me, I'm here. And so, let's just talk a little bit later," because again, a lot of times and again, I know this is like stereotypic but it's also true. A lot of times, the men don't want to deal with it then. We need some more time just to be with ourselves and then we can reach out for support and help. It would be great if it didn't happen that way, that we're always open to support but we're not. We're not. We need also to acknowledge and respect that.
Neil Sattin: Right.
Peter Levine: Again, to know because if you have ... As your relationship grows and as trust continues, those skills really build. And I've seen clients, where they're just really angry at each other at one moment and then boom. They're in love with each other again, and again, and again. It does take practice. It does take appreciating that nothing is going to happen perfectly. Nothing is going to happen all at once. That it's a gradual process of deepening as relationships are about deepening the connection and deepening our skill to be with ourselves and to be with the other.
Neil Sattin: In the How to Trauma-Proof Your Kids book, Trauma-Proofing Your Kids, you talk about offering children the opportunity to tell the story of what happened.
Peter Levine: Well, that's usually after you've gone through first the bodily reactions.
Neil Sattin: Yes.
Peter Levine: The crying, the shaking, the trembling, the spontaneous breaths, and leaving time for that to settle. And then, I know a number of parent who told me and say that happens like just before dinner. Well, then they'll have the family dinner together and then afterwards to sit by the child and say, "Wow, you know, when you fell off your bicycle, that really scared me. God, I bet it really scared you. Do you remember? Do you remember what it was like to fall off?" And then the child, if they want, can then start talking about the content of how scary it was, about how they couldn't get their breath, but then they could get their breath when they were crying just then.
Peter Levine: Yeah, it's fine to talk about it but again to at least separate it in time with moving through the shock part of it and moving towards a more beneficial sensations, more supportive sensations.
Neil Sattin: Right. You've moved from shock. Maybe even numbness into really tuning into the bodily sensation and the things that are uncomfortable in a moment-
Peter Levine: That's right.
Neil Sattin: And by being there, it initiates the process. I think this is what you're talking about that by attending to that sensation, there's a natural mechanism at work that invites it to evolve to a place of release, which is going to feel good in the end.
Peter Levine: Yeah. We will always, always open, almost always open to release given an adequate amount of support.
Neil Sattin: Right. What I loved too is you talked about the importance of time in between questions, so when you're asking like what are you sensing or what comes next to just leave space there.
Peter Levine: Yes, that's right. Adults tend to be linear time, this, then that, then that, then this, then that, then this, then that, like a long straight trajectory. Kids don't do that. They're much more with what the so-called aboriginal people called circular time. And children are like that. They get up in the morning. They have their breakfast. They go to school. They come back. They have milk and cookies, milk and Oreos. They go out and play. The parents call them for dinner. They come and they eat. They play. They go to sleep. They wake up. They get dressed. They have breakfast. They go off to school. It's a very different relationship of time. It's a much more right brain way of relating to time.
Peter Levine: Yes, adults will often tend to rush things when you need pauses, and the children will give you clues about that. One of the case examples I give or the examples I give in Trauma-Proofing your Kids is a play where with Sammy who had a fall, cracked his ... had to go to the emergency room for stitches and so forth. And then, we were playing the game of rescuing Pooh bear. Pooh bear was in the hospital. Each time, he would give us very clear signals of what he needed then, and our children give us these cues if we're paying attention. And in order to pay attention, we have to be able to be relatively comfortable within ourselves. Again, this is something that the parents can practice with each other, and it just spreads to the child, and it spreads to the child's playmates, and it spreads to the whole village as it were.
Neil Sattin: Peter, you've been so generous with your time and your wisdom as before. I have one more question for you, if you don't mind that, that just sprang in with what you just said, which is ... For one thing, I'm impressed by your faith in our ability to heal, to get to a place of goodness and wholeness. And what you said about the children, that they can communicate to us exactly what they need if we're willing to pay attention and offer space. And I'm thinking as an adult, how do we recognize the signs within ourselves of what we need in a given moment?
Peter Levine: Well, that takes practice because again, when we're in a scary or a vulnerable moment, our early pattern may be to withdraw. But again, we can unlearn that and learn new ones. When you talk about faith, well, I guess I could kind of relate to that. I could relate to that, but it's also 45 years of experience in seeing this happen thousands of times.
Neil Sattin: Yes.
Peter Levine: I guess I know it because of experience. I guess if you want to call that faith, okay, we have to call it faith, but it's just ... The human being never ceases to amaze me. I think we're all like this meadow of different colored flowers, and there were all moving from our roots to our stems, to the flower, to the bud, to the flower and opening and opening and opening. And I think opening is basic human need, a basic human drive.
Peter Levine: I think Anais Nin said something like this, "When the pain of tightening into a bud becomes more than the pain of opening as a flower, then we will open." And there's some truth to that, of course, but I don't think it's just pain that brings us towards opening. I think it's just this innate capacity, the desire to open, to be fully alive, to be able to say, "I'm alive, I'm here, I'm real. I'm here, I'm alive and I'm real. I'm alive and I'm here." That's what everyone wants.
Peter Levine: Again, faith, it's observation. I was trained as a scientist and a lot of that is about observation. Yogi Berra said it this way, "You can observe a lot just by watching." And I would say that. Again, in the book, we give a number of different exercises for the parents to help them get more in contact with their inner sensations and their own resilience.
Neil Sattin: And I would like also, following on your metaphor, I would love for this conversation to plant the seed, that pain isn't required to get you to this place of blossoming. That knowing that it's possible to blossom will hopefully help you invite your partner, invite your children, invite yourself into that experience.
Peter Levine: Exactamente as they say in Brazil. Exactly.
Neil Sattin: Well, Peter, thank you so much for being with us today. Your books, Trauma-Proofing Your Kids, Trauma and Memory, Healing Trauma, Waking the Tiger, so many classics that are just completely inspiring, both in the level of recognizing what's possible but also understanding what is happening within us and in the world around us. It's such an honor to be able to talk to you and to share your work with the world.
Neil Sattin: As a reminder, if you want the show guide and transcript for today's episode, you can visit neilsattin.com/levine, as in Peter Levine. You can also text the word passion to the number 33444 and follow the instructions. And we will have links as well to Peter's work, to his books. Peter, what do you think is the best way for people to find out more about what you're doing in the world? Is there a particular website you'd like them to visit?
Peter Levine: Yeah. There's the website of my training institute. It's www.traumahealing.org. And there are lists of therapists and you can find that, for example, therapists that specialize with children or with relationships. And then I have a website with different information of where I might be giving a public lecture or something like that or some videos that are available. That's www.somaticexperiencing.com, or dot org, I think.
Peter Levine: Yeah, you can get material there. And apparently, although, I've never seen them, people tell me there are a number of interviews or lectures that are available on YouTube. So, I guess if you just YouTube my Peter A. Levine, it will come up with a bunch of stuff.
Neil Sattin: Great. I think-
Peter Levine: And it's delightful to talk with you again, Neil, really. I so much appreciate what you're doing because really we are designed to be in relationship, and to keep our relationships alive. That's the real task. It sure is for me. Okay.
Neil Sattin: Thank you, and your work has been so helpful in my life. And I know the thousands upon thousands of listeners who listened to our first conversation together. So, really exciting to talk to you. Thanks, Peter.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Neil Sattin, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy (LS 57 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 064: Ask David — Quick Cure for Excessive Worrying!
Pub date: 2017-11-27
How would you treat excessive worrying? a listener asks.
David describes a new patient who had struggled with 53 years of failed therapy for excessive, relentless worrying, and describes how she was "totally and irreversibly cured" in just two therapy sessions, which was the "good news." The Hidden Emotion Technique was the key to her remarkably rapid recovery. David explains that the "even better news" was that her relentless worrying would come back over and over in the future, and that this was actually a really good thing!
David also emphasizes the importance of using all the four models, along with a Daily Mood Log, when treating any form of anxiety: the Motivational Model, the Cognitive Model, the Exposure Model, and the Hidden Emotion Model. To learn more about how these four powerful treatment models work, you can listen to Podcasts 022 through #028.
The DSM5 is the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, published by the American Psychiatric Association. It is used to assign diagnoses to patients. David critiques the DSM5 diagnostic criteria for "Generalized Anxiety Disorder" (GAD) and emphasizes that while worrying exists, and can easily be treated in most cases, the "mental disorder" called Generalized Anxiety Disorder does not exist, and is simply a fantasy made up by the psychiatrists who have created the DSM.
Soon, David and Fabrice will launch a series of five podcasts on the Five Secrets of Effective Communication, focusing on one technique each week. Say tuned, because these podcasts could change your life and show you the road to more loving and satisfying relationships with friends, patients, colleagues, and family members--and "enemies" as well!
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from David Burns, MD, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: The Mind Your Business Podcast (LS 64 · TOP 0.1% what is this?)
Episode: Episode 125: Mysteries of the Mind-Body Connection with Steven Ozanich
Pub date: 2017-11-06
I’m very excited today to be bringing you a conversation I had with the author of one of my all-time favorite books, Steve Ozanich. The reason this episode is so personal for me is that not long ago I had debilitating back pain, and by reading Steve’s book, The Great Pain Deception, it was miraculously cured. In this episode you’re going to hear how our thoughts, emotions and physical pain are all linked together. So if you are feeling any sort of pain, you’re going to learn why it’s so important to look inside yourself and see what is really going on!
In this episode you’ll learn:
- Steve’s own powerful story and how and why he wrote The Great Pain Deception
- Why there really is no such thing as chronic pain from an old injury…
- What happens to our health when we retire (and why)?
- The big difference between getting rid of pain and truly healing
-
How pain can actually be a gift that’s here to serve or warn us
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The one word that Steve uses to sum up his book!
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from James Wedmore, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Going Beyond the Food: Mindset, Intuitive Eating, Body Image, Diet Culture and Anti-Diet Podcast (LS 48 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: 033-Healing Trauma with Irene Lyon: The Secret is in the Nervous System
Pub date: 2017-02-26
The post TBTFS 033- Healing Trauma with Irene Lyon: The Secret is in the nervous system appeared first on Stephanie Dodier.
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Stephanie Dodier Clinical Nutritionist CNP, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Inspire Nation Show with Michael Sandler (LS 60 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: HOW TO HEAL YOUR BACK!!! Steve Ozanich | Dr. Sarno | Health & TMS | Fitness | Inspiration | Motivation | Self-Help | Inspire
Pub date: 2017-01-14
If you’ve ever struggled with chronic back pain or other mysterious pain, that just won’t leave you alone, then do we have the Back Pain Permanent Healing show for you.
Today I’ll be talking with Steve Ozanich, author of The Great Pain Deception: Faulty Medical Advice is Making us Worse, and Back Pain Permanent Healing.
And that’s just what I want to talk with him about today, about understanding the myths and confusion surrounding back pain, and what in the world we can do about it, beginning today.
That plus we’ll talk about Jim Carrey and 23, tails wagging dogs, what we can all learn from tiger woods, the 2 percent solution, pounding defenseless scarecrows, what in the world’s vertebroplasty, 6 blind men and an elephant, and whether ostriches really do stick their heads in the ground.
Back Pain Self-Improvement and Self-Help Topics Include:
- What happened with Howard Stern’s back and how did he heal?
- What can we learn from Tiger Woods’ back problems?
- Who is Dr. Sarno?
- What is TMS – Tension Myoneural Syndrome
- How does TMS Occur?
- Where does back pain really come from?
- What do back abnormalities have to do with back pain?
- What does the power of belief have to do with back pain?
- What are the common traits Dr. Sarno found in people with back pain?
- What does an intense need to be good have to do with anything?
- What does anger and rage have to do with back pain?
- Why does back pain always come from an emotional process
- How is back pain almost always a diversion?
- Why is back pain never in the head
- What does a lack of bloodflow have to do with back pain?
- What can we learn from a 1994 study on Understanding Acute Low Back Pain Problems?
- What’s the 2 percent solution?
- What do we need to know about herniated discs?
- How can one heal from TMS?
- What’s the most important first step people can take to heal their back pain
Steve Ozanich on How to Heal Back Pain and Chronic Pain for Life!!! Health | Fitness | Medicine | Dr. Sarno & TMS | Inspiration | Motivation | Spiritual | Spirituality | Meditation | Inspirational | Motivational | Self-Improvement | Self-Help | Inspire
For More Info Visit: www.InspireNationShow.com
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Michael Sandler, Jessica Lee, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Active Pause
Episode: Peter Levine: Understanding memory
Pub date: 2016-12-05
This conversation with Peter Levine is about different types of memory. We talk about trauma, but also about the fluid notion of self that goes together with this understanding of memory. This conversation is available as a video, as well as audio only, and as a printable PDF transcript.
Peter A Levine, PhD – is a forerunner in body-oriented approaches to trauma. He is the developer of Somatic Experiencing® a naturalistic, approach to healing trauma which he has developed during the past 45 years. He has received the Lifetime Achievement award from the US Association for Body Psychotherapy, and an honorary award as the Reiss-Davis Chair for his lifetime contribution to infant and child psychiatry. Dr. Levine served as a Stress consultant for NASA in the early space shuttle development and has served on the APA task force for responding to large scale disasters and ethno-political warfare. He is currently a Senior Fellow and consultant at The Meadows Addiction and Trauma Treatment Center in Wickenburg, Arizona. He is the author of several best-selling books on trauma, including Waking the Tiger, Healing Trauma, published in 26 languages, and Trauma and Memory; Brain and Body in a Search for the Living Past.
See also: Conversation with Peter Levine about Somatic Experiencing therapy.
Published December 2016
The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Active Pause, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Dr. Joe Tatta | The Healing Pain Podcast (LS 48 · TOP 1% what is this?)
Episode: Episode 10 | Dr. Howard Schubiner: Emerging Neuropsychology of Chronic Pain and Other Symptoms
Pub date: 2016-07-10
Today we are joined by Dr. Howard Schubiner, MD.
In This Healing Pain Podcast You Will Learn:
- Why the brain is the generator of your pain.
- How even if an injury completely heals, pain can still persist.
- How emotions can cause pain.
- Why X-Rays, MRI’s and other tests are not telling the entire pain story.
- How to heal from past trauma.
Sign up for the latest episode at www.drjoetatta.com
Love the show? Subscribe, rate, review, and share!
- Here’s How »
Join the Healing Pain Podcast Community today:
- integrativepainscienceinstitute.com
- Healing Pain Podcast Facebook
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- Healing Pain Podcast LinkedIn
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Joseph Tatta, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
Podcast: Relationship Alive! (LS 54 · TOP 0.5% what is this?)
Episode: 29: How to Heal Your Triggers and Trauma with Peter Levine
Pub date: 2016-03-08
On our show, we’ve talked a lot about getting “triggered” - but what does it even mean to get triggered? Why do we hold trauma in our bodies? And how do we move through it so that we can live more freely, be more fully alive - and present for what life is bringing us in the moment? And if you’re in a relationship, how can you and your partner help each other heal - either the traumas of the past, or the inevitable traumas that we cause each other?
Today’s guest is Dr. Peter Levine, one of the world’s foremost experts on Trauma, and author of many books on the topic, including “Waking the Tiger”, “Trauma & Memory”, and “Healing Trauma” - a book that guides you through a process for Healing Trauma and your triggers. He is also the creator of Somatic Experiencing, one of the most effective ways of dealing with the effects of trauma, and releasing trauma from the body with thousands of trained practitioners all over the world. In today’s episode, you’re going to not only learn how your body holds trauma and triggers, but also get some guidance into how you can, in the moment, come back into balance and actually allow yourself to fully move through whatever is stored in your body. We talk about how we can help each other in relationship - and we also chat a bit about how to apply Peter’s work with children.
In this conversation Dr. Peter Levine and I discuss the following:
The past lives in us. Our past lives in us in ways that we are often unaware of. Times when we may have been left alone, yelled at, hurt, neglected, abused, misunderstood, exposed to difficulty, or otherwise traumatized, all leave imprints on our bodies that can last through many years and decades. The question is not whether these memories exist in us, but how they live in us.
Implicit and Explicit Memory:
Explicit memories- These are the ones that we normally think about as things to remember. These are the thoughts and memories we are fully conscious of. Lists at the grocery store, directions, etc. Rarely has emotional content.
Episodic memories- these are also explicit memories, however they have a deeper quality. This is when, for example, you are sitting at the ocean and all of a sudden you have images from your childhood. Representative of parts of our lives
Implicit memories- These are even deeper. Emotional memory is when all of a sudden you find yourself angry, or frightened, and wonder what just happened. You may be feeling threatened and defensive. A fight might occur from this.
Procedural or Body memories- Even deeper than emotional memories are procedural or body memories. When we felt terrified our bodies experienced terror physically (shoulders go to our ears, we get a knot in our belly. heart going fast..) These are all autonomic and automatic response we have. Even if we understand why we are being triggered and the emotions that occur as a result, our procedural memories prime the pump and cause us to react in often inappropriate ways.
Triggers are echoes of memories stored in our bodies: If in a couple, both people have been traumatized in their life, it can happen that their fear and their anger will escalate, ricocheting off of each other. What is happening here is that our brains are wired to perceive threat and all the intense emotions ensuing as caused by something real. Our partner may do something, or not do something, or give a look, or say something, and all of a sudden our body reacts by developing a knot in the stomach, a tightening in the shoulders, faster heart beat… Our brains look to find causation for this symptomatic response, and often will attach blame to anyone near by! In this way we enter into situations where we begin believing “this must all be about you”, when in reality it is most often the result of an echoing of earlier memories stored in our own body. A relationship and interaction will go nowhere when both people are stuck in this velocity trap of blaming and shaming.
Somatic Experiencing helps people learn to experience their emotions and sensations in their body and notice all that goes on without having to react. It helps people go from being closed and defensive to open and curious- which is the key to trauma recovery!
Our relationships are constant sources for healing. Living, loving and being in constant interaction with our significant others provides endless opportunities for our triggers to be revealed! While this can be seen as very painful, burdensome, and unsexy, it is important to realize that every trigger offers an opportunity to heal! Our intimate relationships are ideal places to have our traumas arise, because we can face our memories and reactions with a trusted other who can share it with us, hold us, and be with us as we come into greater aliveness and joy! We cannot live our life with vitality and clarity when we are stuck in our habitual trauma responses.
Bringing your relationship into the here and now: The most important lesson for growth in relationships is learning how to individuate, together. To see the other as other, and not as a perception of our own fears and flaws. To do so it is critical to get to know ourselves- spiritually, sexually, psychologically, somatically...This is especially true when there is a history of trauma present in a relationship. Just as trauma causes the body to remain stuck in the past, trauma can keep a relationship from being in the present. To bring your relationship into a more current state, you need to learn to be in touch with your reactions and learn ways to move not around, but through them. Be direct- ask your partner “Can you just be here with me and give me a little support and time to figure out what I am feeling and sensing, and how it is connected to a memory?” Each time we can do this we can further and further uncouple from those trauma laden memories so that we can bring ourselves AND our relationships back into the here and now.
How to move through triggering moments:
Trauma is never graceful, and often it leaves parts of us, physically, emotionally, and psychologically, stuck. With support and guidance we can move through the stuckness. Consider animals in the wild. Although their lives are threatened on a routine basis, they are rarely traumatized (if so they would lose their resilience and go extinct). What is it in animals that gives them resilience? All mammals, including us, have identical instinctual fight and flight autonomic nervous systems to us, but other animals have the added benefit of remembering how to use the body to work through the traumatic experience. Animals shake. Literally. They shake their bodies which allows the body to process all of the hormones and neurochemicals involved in the fight/flight response. You have likely experienced this too- shaking and trembling in your body, cold hands, spontaneous deep breaths immediately after a scary event. It is important that we help support each other in allowing our bodies to work through our experiences similar to how other animals do. Somatic Experiencing developed as a methodology that imparts basic life skills to move through events that are potentially traumatized in order to gain a greater resilience and joy in life. These are skills everyone in the world could use! It would make for a better, safer, and more compassionate world.
Fight or Flight, then Freeze. Our autonomic nervous systems are wired for a fight or flight response to threat (real or perceived). If we are unable to follow through on either of these instincts, if these actions do not suffice, or if our system becomes too overwhelmed, the body will go into a state of apathy and collapse. It freezes. This shutdown stage is meant to be temporary, but sometimes we get stuck there due to fears that reinforce the paralysis. When someone we can trust is near us, it is possible to have less fear to truly sense the immobility, make contact with it, and move through it. Being in presence with the sensations will lead to deactivation and we can learn to see what memories are keeping us stuck, and from there learn to renegotiate our reactions, and our reactions to our reactions!
A good experiment to try: When we have been traumatized, especially in the case of sexual trauma, we try to isolate from our body (also known as dissociation, or soul fragmenting). It is as if the body has betrayed us and we begin to perceive it as the enemy. You can start by befriending and reconnecting with your own body. Pay gentle and nonjudgmental attention to your own reactions. With time it becomes softer and easier for you to reflect on your feelings, and your physical responses. You can do this with your partner. Agree not to have intercourse, but just to explore together. As soon as a trigger comes up, take the time together to integrate and be with the sensations in a patient and compassionate way. Know that our minds are clever but our bodies are wise! Our bodies know what to do, they are instinctive. Imagine what your body might have wanted to do at the time when it was violated-- push away, fight, run? Find safe ways to allow the body to express the desires and needs that it had but could not follow through with in the past. This brings power and energy back to the body, and helps hold compassion for the child, or younger version of yourself that could not defend or protect itself at the time. As we sort through the links between memories and reactions, we begin to mend again and return to a deep and full sexual, spiritual, psychological, and physical connection with partner.
Learning to recognize when you are triggered and work with the procedural body memories will help you find more freedom and more wholeness!
Tip to try with your child, and/or your partner: When your child is very angry, help give them a way to safely and effectively direct their anger. Most children find it difficult to deal with their own intense emotions because their parents have difficulty with them. As a parent, and as a partner to your significant other, you can help another feel their strength by directing their feelings into healthy aggression. Try this: put out your hand, make eye contact while you are doing this, and invite them to push your hand hard. Putting a lid on our anger puts a lid on all other feelings simultaneously. Allowing the body to safely express its sensations will help to release stuckness and lets us feel more alive!
VOOO: A wonderful thing to practice. This is a simple practice that helps you get present and out of a trauma response state. Take a full and easy inhale, and as you exhale make the sound “voooooooo”. Let the sound come from your belly and go until breath comes to an end. The next inhale happens automatically and naturally. Do several rounds to help calm your autonomic nervous system.
Resources
Learn more about Somatic Experiencing and find a practitioner in your area here.
Read some of Peter Levine’s books:
Trauma and Memory: Brain and Body in a Search for the Living Past: A Practical Guide for Understanding and Working with Traumatic Memory
Healing Trauma on Amazon
Waking the Tiger: Healing Trauma
Trauma-Proofing Your Kids: A Parents' Guide for Instilling Confidence, Joy and Resilience
www.neilsattin.com/trauma Visit to download the show guide, or text “PASSION” to 33444 and follow the instructions to download the show guide to this episode with Peter Levine - and to qualify to win a free copy of one of his books!
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Amazing intro/outro music graciously provided courtesy of:
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The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Neil Sattin, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
