What Next? The Adoptee Rights Podcast: Recent Episodes
Adoptees United Inc.
Discussion of adoptee rights along with some humor. Featuring legislative updates, interviews, legal developments, and the ongoing absurdities of being an adopted person.
Greg talks with Jennifer Kwon Dobbs and Ryan Gustafsson---two Korean-born transnational adoptees, scholars, and advocates---about their cases (and other cases) before the South Korean Truth and Reconciliation Commission.
Jennifer and Ryan discuss their own personal experiences as well as what is meant by truth and reconciliation, not only in a global context but more specifically in the context of problematic and illicit intercountry adoptions from Korea.
About Greg's Guests
Ryan Gustafsson is a researcher in the Faculty of Arts at the University of Melbourne. Trained in continental philosophy (phenomenology) and social theory, they conduct research on Korean overseas adoption, transracial adoptee lived experiences, migration, and diaspora. Ryan is the co-founder of the Philosophies of Difference (PoD) group and the Korean Adoptee Adoption Research Network (KAARN), which organize open-to-public seminars and symposia. Their nonfiction writing has appeared in literary outlets including Sydney Review of Books, Liminal Magazine, Peril Magazine, Island Magazine, and others.
Born in Wonju, Republic of Korea, Jennifer Kwon Dobbs is the author of Interrogation Room (White Pine Press, 2018); Paper Pavilion (White Pine, 2007), winner of the White Pine Press Poetry Prize; and the chapbooks Notes from a Missing Person (Essay Press, 2015) and Necro Citizens (German/English edition, hochroth Verlag, 2019). Interrogation Room received mention in The New York Times, was praised by World Literature Today for “a vigorous restlessness,” and won the Association of Asian American Studies Award in Creative Writing: Poetry. She also co-translates Sámi poetry with poet-scholar Johanna Domokos, and their translation of Niillas Holmberg’s Juolgevuođđu, published as Underfoot (White Pine Press, 2022), received the American-Scandinavian Foundation’s Lief and Inger Sjöberg Prize. She is professor of English and Race, Ethnic, Gender, and Sexuality Studies at St. Olaf College and lives in Minnesota.
Additional Links/Resources
- The Korean Truth and Reconciliation Commission
- Recent AP Report and Frontline Documentary: South Korea's Adoption Reckoning
- Danish Korean Rights Group (DKRG)
- Reports from the Netherlands, France, and Switzerland on Intercountry Adoption
Greg talks with Chelsey, a US-born adult adopted person who for years has been seeking to end her own adoption, and for good reason. They discuss her story and reasons, the various legal issues surrounding the rescission of an adoption, and the ongoing Adoptees United project that has led to a definition of terms and to a draft model bill that would establish a right as an adult to end your own adoption.
More information about the Rescission Project and its collective efforts are on Adoptees United. Greg's prior overview of the issue is on his law firm website, though efforts have progressed since he published the initial post a few years ago.
Support our work and conversations on the podcast by contributing to Adoptees United, a national nonprofit organization working to educate and empower adopted people and to challenge and change the dominant narrative of adoption.
Greg and CS talk with Korean-born and US transnational adoptee Kara Bos about her efforts to reclaim her Korean citizenship, lost to her when she was four years of age and adopted to the United States. Her efforts included the first successful paternity action in Korea to establish paternity with her Korean biological father.
The conversation is part of an Adoptees United event, Dual Citizenship for Transnational Adoptees, recorded on April 10, 2024, and available now on YouTube.
Follow and subscribe to What Next? The Adoptee Rights Podcast, and keep us going with a tax-deductible donation at adopteesunited.org/donate.
Greg speaks with Annette O'Connell and Shawna Hodgson about lobbying in state legislatures, plus other (kinda nutty) issues that pop up. As board members of Adoptees United and as advocates in New York and Texas, Annette and Shawna have years of experience in lobbying legislators on birth record bills. They talk about their approach, how hard it is to do this work, and what it may look like in the future.
This is the third installment of Legislative Boot Camp, a series of podcast episodes exploring and explaining how legislatures work as well as how to get a bill enacted (or killed), told within the context of adoptee rights.
Support the work of Donate to Adoptees United, which goes toward the making of our podcasts plus supports ongoing programming and projects.
A conversation with scholar, advocate, researcher and writer Gretchen Sisson, author of the recently published Relinquished: The Politics of Adoption and the Privilege of American Motherhood. This is the podcast version of our conversation we had before an online audience in March 2024. It has been slightly edited from that event.
What Next: The Adoptee Rights Podcast is a production of Adoptees United Inc., a national nonprofit organization dedicated to the equality of all adopted people. Gregory Luce is the host.
One of two episodes (the first with Ayana Smith-Kooiman) where Greg talks with legislative staffers. This time he sits down with Max Aulbach, the legislative director for Michigan Represetative Kristian Grant , whose district is in Grand Rapids. Max talks about his work, what works best (or not) in contacting legislative offices, and how he and his office works to support his boss. While we mention two pending bills there, the discussion is mostly about the ins and outs of working with legislative staff and trying to get a legislator's attention and support.
Part of the Legislative Bootcamp series, a set of intermittent episodes where we talk about the work of getting a bill enacted (or killing a bill when it goes bad).
Read more about the legislative work in Michigan currently, including the work of the Michigan Adoptee Rights Coalition.
We sit down with Ayana Smith-Kooiman, the legislative assistant to Sen. Erin Maye Quade in Minnesota. Ayana was the behind-the-scenes and front-desk staffer directly supporting Sen. Maye Quade's adoptee rights bill in 2023, ultimately getting it enacted. She's a Wisconsin-born adopted person, a Macalester College graduate, and a former advocacy fellow with Gender Justice in Minnesota. She talks about her work in the legislature as well as what does and doesn't work in advocacy.
More information about the enacted Minnesota legislation is here. The Minnesota Coalition for Adoption Reform was one of the organizations that had worked on the bill tirelessly for decades. Greg and Penelope Needham of MCAR also appeared on a podcast discussing the efforts to pass the new law: How to Succeed, Part 1.
Part 2 of a two-part interview with Astrid Castro, and we turn to the history of her work with Adoption Mosaic and the complications and joys of providing solid programming and events for adopted people---and allies, partners, and anyone impacted by adoption. We recommend listening to Part 1 before listening. Ciao!
Show Notes
Adoption Mosaic is a BIPOC woman owned, adoptee-led mission-driven business. With 30+ years of experience, its founders and leaders have created a robust, diverse community who want to see a future of more adoptee-centered and ethical adoption practices and critical thinking around adoption.
Upcoming Adoption Mosaic events and programming, including the We the Experts Series.
Greg talks with Astrid Castro, someone he's long wanted to have on the show. Astrid is a transracial transnational adoptee who was born in Colombia. She is also the longtime leader and current CEO of Oregon-based Adoption Mosaic, and has since 1990 provided programming, guidance, wisdom, and space to all people impacted by adoption, but with a particular focus and dedication to adopted people. Part 1 of a two part interview, with Part 2 released simultaneously and covering Astrid's experience in running Adoption Mosaic.
Show Notes:
Adoption Mosaic is a BIPOC woman owned, adoptee-led mission-driven business. Its founders and leaders have created a robust, diverse community who want to see a future of more adoptee-centered and ethical adoption practices and critical thinking around adoption.
Upcoming Adoption Mosaic events and programming, including the We the Experts Series.
More widely known among adopted people as @stoweyvik on Twitter, Vicki is a transracial UK adoptee, army veteran, and host of the weekly Sunday Zoom chats with adoptees and Vicki's special guests.
Greg talks to her about her and her sibling's life in rural England and about her recent participation in the government's recent inquiry into forced adoptions that occurred in the UK between 1949 and 1976.
You can connect with Vicki on Twitter at @stoweyvik, where she sends out links to her Sunday chats each week (when the sessions are being scheduled).
More information about the Joint Human Rights Committee inquiry on the right to family life: adoption of children of unmarried women 1949-1976. The latest proceeding of the committee can be viewed here:
May 25, 2022. Witnesses: Nadhim Zahawi MP, Secretary of State, Department of Education; Sarah Jennings, Deputy Director of Adoption, Family Justice and Care Leavers, Department of Education
Support this podcast and the work of Adoptees United Inc. by making a tax-deductible donation at https://adopteesunited.org/donate/
Erica Babino talks with Greg about Roe v. Wade, diversity, inclusion, and belonging in adoptee rights, plus what an adoptee rights retreat could bring and do for the community.
Erica Babino is New York born and Texas-adopted. She has a long history in the adoptee rights movement, including as former legislative director of the American Adoption Congress and as a current board member with Adoptees United Inc. She currently oversees equity and inclusion work at a private educational institution in Portland.
Erica is a consultant to numerous organizations on organizational issues of Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging. She is also the author of Rolling Into Peace, a children's book that explores mediation and conflict resolution using a stimulating and visionary approach that is logical and relatable to children. Another book in the series is forthcoming.
A conversation with biologist and climate scientist Sandra Steingraber, about adoption, cancer, and queerness.
Dr. Sandra Steingraber is a rockstar in her field, related to her research, writing, lecturing, and activism on issues related to chemical pollutants and environmental dangers in our communities, including fracking.
But she's also an adopted person, and Greg talks with her about her lived experience as an adoptee within the context of all of her communities, including academia, science, cancer survivor, and, more recently, the world of adoptee rights, particularly her identity as a queer adoptee.
Sandra Steingraber is also the subject of the documentary Unfractured as well as the acclaimed author of numerous books, articles, and essays, including:
- Living Downstream: An Ecologist's Personal Investigation of Cancer and the Environment;
- Having Faith: An Ecologist's Journey to Motherhood;
- Raising Elijah: Protecting Our Children in an Age of Environmental Crisis
She also has a large following on Twitter, where she posts on issues of adoption and environmental science and climate justice.
Like what you hear? Support Adoptees United Inc. and its programming, including this podcast, by making a tax-deductible donation at https://adopteesunited.org/donate/.
Vermont is on the precipice of history as an unrestricted equal rights bill is poised to become law. And Louisiana is on the same track.
Greg talks with many of the advocates who are making history in Vermont and the Northeast, including Ellie Lane, Rebecca Dragon, Bek Henson, Annette O'Connell and Claudia Corrigan D'Arcy (plus a shout out to Mary King, who couldn't be with us as we talked about Vermont, equal rights, and when we will have our next round of beer together).
Greg also talks with Elise Lewis about her and others' advocacy efforts in Louisiana, plus we have a rundown on other bills, including a quick update on the Adoptee Citizenship Act in Congress.
Follow legislative actions on the Adoptees United legislative page, where we track both federal and state legislation that impacts adoptees across the country.
Please consider making a tax-deductible donation to Adoptees United, a national nonprofit organization dedicated to equality for all adopted people. And be sure to sign up for our What Next newsletter so we can keep you informed.
Most adoptees know who you are talking about when you say the name Lynelle. As in Lynelle Long, who has been a quiet and consistent powerhouse in working to secure adoptee rights globally, for all adoptees.
I talk with Lynelle about her long experience, her work with adoptees across the globe, and about her own experiences as an advocate and adoptee.
You can find more information about her and her organization, Intercountry Adoptee Voices, at the ICAV website. And if you are an an intercountry adoptee you can join the ICAV group on Facebook. More information about Lynelle is also available here.
If you like our podcast, consider supporting us with a tax-deductible financial contribution at https://adopteesunited.org/donate. And sign up for the What Next newsletter at https://adopteesunited.org/whatnext.
What if you are switched at birth---and then adopted? How do you unravel all the legal threads of adoption to get to the truth, if not reconstruct relationships that may have been created from the wrong information and records?
Greg talks with Minnesota-born adoptee Diane Bazella about discovering a truth about the records of her birth and adoption that has left her reeling--- and has compelled her to seek legal help. Sign up for the What Next Newsletter at https://adopteesunited.org/whatnext. And help Adoptees United continue to produce these podcasts by contributing a tax-deductible donation at https://adopteesunited.org/donate.
Do bad bills ever go good? Rarely, if ever. But that may change with Vermont this session, as House Bill 629 is being redrafted and is expected to be cleaned up, all through the efforts of local and national advocates, including the Vermont Adoptee Rights Working Group.
Greg talks to Rebekah Henson, Ellie Lane, Rebecca Dragon, and Mary Anna King about their efforts and work in Vermont, about the New England Adoptee Rights Coalition, and about working to educate legislators about adoptee rights and original birth records.
Get more information about the New England Adoptee Rights Coalition here, as well as the Vermont Adoptee Rights Working Group here. And you can watch the latest testimony in the Vermont House Judiciary Committee on its YouTube channel here, including live testimony on March 9 for House Bill 629.
Greg talks with Claire McGettrick and Mari Steed about Ireland's history of adoption and original birth records---which have always been public records---and the decades-long fight for Irish-born adopted people to secure the right to obtain all records related to their own identities and history.
You can read more about this issue and Claire and Mari's work at Adoption Rights Alliance, which is also a partner in the rights-based research work of the CLANN Project.
And check out Claire and Mari's (and others') recent book, Ireland and the Magdalene Laundries: A Campaign for Justice, which provides "an overview of the social, cultural and political contexts of institutional survivor activism, the Irish State's response culminating in the McAleese Report, and the formation of the Justice for Magdalenes campaign, a volunteer-run survivor advocacy group."
Greg travels to Wisconsin for a legislative hearing and meets Diana Higgenbottom Anagnostopoulos and other advocates, legislative staffers, and legislators.
Diana's remarkable story is highlighted in this week's episode, and we talk about the documentary film being produced about her life, the hard work of showing up for adoptee rights advocacy, and what it takes to keep moving forward in the face of adversity. Plus, what she means by the three-egg omelette of adoption.
Keep our show going! Please consider making a contribution, which is tax-deductible, at https://adopteesunited.org/donate/. Plus, get show notes and the What Next newsletter at https://adopteesunited.org/whatnext/.
Extended interview session with Shelise Gieseke in which we talk mental health resources, advocacy, Adoption Mosaic programming, and Greg's mom. Enjoy.
What could the adoptee rights movement do if it had infinite money? We work to answer this question with Shelise Gieseke of Adoption Mosaic, and we predictably end up discussing all sorts of other issues within the adoptee rights community. You can find more information about Shelise and her work with Adoption Mosaic at https://adoptionmosaic.com. And listen to another recent interview with Shelise on the Janchi Show, a podcast "about, by and for Korean adoptees."
Can a person really be born in two different places? Yep, if you were adopted in Georgia. Greg talks with Jamie Weiss about her backstory and about a new story moving forward: changing the law in Georgia through her work with the Georgia Alliance for Adoptee Rights (GARR).
Support our work and this podcast by donating to Adoptees United Inc., a national nonprofit organization with an unwavering committment to equality for all adopted people. Make a tax-deductible contribution today: https://adopteesunited.org/donate/
Sign up for the weekly What Next newsletter with updates on legisative and legal issues in the past and coming week: https://adopteesunited.org/whatnext For more information about GAAR and its work, go to https://gaallianceforadopteerights.org.
Adoptee United's Gregory Luce launches the new podcast and talks with Marley Greiner about the origins of Bastard Nation, the history of adoptee rights, and the growing threat of Safe Haven Baby Boxes
Welcome to What Next:The Adoptee Rights Podcast. Each week we'll talk about the state of adoptee rights and all that it is---or isn’t. We’ll feature state and federal legislative updates, interviews, and legal developments, plus we'll discuss the frequent absurdities and complications of being an adopted person.
Join AU's Gregory Luce and his guests each week as they discuss the state of adoptee rights. Fun and informative, with a constant bottom line of equality for all adopted people.
Latest Episode: Infinite Money What if we had infinite money? That is, what if adoptee rights work was suddenly fully funded? What would that world look like? Greg talks with Shelise Gieseke of Adoption Mosaic about her work and what we could do if we actually had the resources to do it.
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Join Adoptees United, Gregory Luce, and many others each week to bemoan and bemuse the state of adoptee rights. We’ll make it fun, though the bottom line is always about equality for all adopted people around the globe.