Wrestling With The Angels: Recent Episodes
ZacShawhan
Have you experienced a stigma surrounding mental health in your community? Listen in as we share our experience. God loves you. If you struggle with suicidal thoughts please call 988.
Boundaries help communicate our own personal limitations and counterintuitively help us better serve our neighbor.
On this week’s episode we discuss the disposition of struggle (discontent) vs. surrender (acceptance).
We each discuss our struggles with identity and leave the conversation more grounded in who God made us to be.
This is a tough conversation, but one I’m glad we spent time wrestling through. We do our best to interact with opinions different than ours and communicating our own beliefs with the same love in which God has loved us (Clint and Zac) sinners with as best we can.
Persistence in good things is persistence in small things, and that persistence will change us. Hope is not lost.
Do you struggle with asking for help? We do! We are learning it’s a necessary aspect to human connection.
The serenity prayer suggests that we need God to grant us serenity so that we can discern things we can change and things we can’t. We can change ourselves. We can’t change others. God grant us serenity today.
Today we discuss caregiving with Mrs. Debbie. She’s been a caregiver to her mother for the last 15 years. She has such a sweet soul and she emanates humility and contentedness. Hopefully that experience comes through this discussion
Why is the journey often better than the destination? Why does the grass seem greener on the other side? This experience of things never quite measuring up to expectations is what we are discussing today.
This has been a subtle theme throughout our podcast, but today we wanted to discuss it specifically. Something I’ve learned is that I need to spend more time doing the things I joy. These simple things are reminders that God has given us desires to make the world a better place.
We have our good friend Laura Taylor discuss her experience as a professional artist. One of the things I’ve learned from this discussion is how technique and inspiration come together to make beauty, and how that beauty can bring us back to God.
Ted Kluck joined us today to talk about story and imagination. In this discussion I learned that this is something in our day we have to work at getting back to. It’s worth it because it can teach me how to be alone in my thoughts and meet God there.
This week we discuss some false ideas we’ve had about motivation in the past. In our experience we have found that it is better to take the act of love in service to our neighbor even when we don’t feel like it and find the motivation somewhere along the way.
We start off differentiating vacationing from a previous episode on rest. We talk about our experience with this topic, our struggles with it, and how we want to do better. I’m uploading this from Orange Beach. Im not sure if that means I’m vacationing right or not, but here’s to progress not perfection.
When I first thought about this topic it seemed like loyalty was clearly a virtue. The more I thought about it and discussed with Clint the more complex this topic became. We try and define it and speak from our own experience with it. Hope you enjoy!
Today we talk about an ancient Christian concept that essentially says good things come from mistakes. This saying actually goes farther and says it’s good that a mistake was made because now redemption and reconciliation is possible whereas before it wasn’t. We wanted to have a conversation and see if this perspective would help in our day to day.
Have you ever had to leave a job? Angie is moving to a new state and is leaving her current job. Today we discuss how she has wrestled with wanting to do that well. I am thankful for the conversation because I gleaned principles that I’ll practice that go beyond the scope of simply leaving a job.
Last week we talked about mourning with others being the easier of the two. The more we discussed the more we came to the conclusion that it’s just as difficult to mourn with others well. Why bother? We find that it nourishes the soul to practice this behavior.
Has it ever been difficult for you to be happy for someone else? Why is that? We talk about it today because we recognize that has been something we’ve wrestled with before (and likely will again!). Can we change our stripes? We think so.
Todays episode taught me a new word: equanimity. This is something we ask for in every episode, “Lord make us a channel of your peace.” Another phrase that comes to mind with todays topic is, “This too shall pass.” Ultimately, Clint and I want emotional balance in our lives. Thanks for listening!
Today we discuss what it means to take up space in relationships. Clint and I come at this topic from two different perspectives. This isn’t a topic we’ve wrestled with a lot. You can hear us working out our thoughts real time. We hope it is a help to you!
What does it mean to be judgmental? We define it as being hyper critical. While there are various connotations with this word we are focusing on the negative aspect. We speak from our personal experience with being judgmental and what has helped us escape that mindset.
Today we attempted to define insecurity, discuss what it looks like for each of us, and how we deal with it. I’ve found it helpful to talk about my insecurities because it helps me come terms with having them and practicing acceptance.
Today we ask ourselves the question, “Should religion be public?” We all affirmed that ours should be, but practically what that looks like may not be how you’ve experienced it. The way I have practiced my faith publicly has changed over time. I hope it’s been for the better. Time will tell.
Angie and Clint were tied up so I invited Sarah and Pastor Dave onto the podcast. We asked ourselves the question, “What is one thing in our past that has made us who we are?” A question I couldn’t help but ask is, “Does the thing that changed me have an impact on others?” That is something I’ll have to wrestle with. What I have experienced is hearing other’s stories and sharing mine has caused spiritual growth.
Today is probably our longest episode. It has been a while since we’ve all been on. We each had a different approach to the question, “What expectations do you place on others.” And we came to the conclusion that we often are looking for ourselves in others which can be good, but it can also hinder relationships at times.
It may be a bit of an eye roll to listen to a 31yo and 36yo discuss getting older, but we wanted to discuss how getting older has changed us, why that is, and our outlook of the future. Spoiler alert we are optimistic about it.
We struggled to come up with a topic this week. This is an age old question we aren’t hoping to resolve, but rather offer our opinion and why (counter intuitively) our answer gives us great comfort. We hope to bring comfort to you as well.
While Clint and I have not actively made resolutions, the rhythm of a new year has had an impact on us. Why is that, and can we use it to our advantage?
Is faith certainty, or is it something else? Is doubt unbelief, or is it something in between belief and unbelief? Today we wrestle with these questions and share our experience with them.
Angie and I discuss one of Jesus’ statements in the book of Revelation. What does it mean? How have we seen that play out day to day? Where have we failed to participate in the making all things new?
Where is the closest you experience God outside of the weekly gathering of believers? We have different places, but the experience is ultimately the same. We end every episode with asking God to make us a channel of His peace. These weekday places of worship help us to be channels of God.
Most of my life I’ve smuggled in justifying myself when I apologize. Why is it so hard to simply say, “I’m sorry for ___.” Better yet, “I was wrong for ___.” This is what we wrestle with today.
Are there risks associated with extending kindness? If there are, is it worth it? We think so. Listen in as we wrestle with being kind with no strings attached.
When was the last time you changed your mind about something? Have you ever been defensive about your opinions? Why is that? Listen in as we wrestle with the idea of changing our minds.
Some of the most impactful moments I’ve experienced have been centered around conversations. How do we learn to listen instead of waiting for our turn to talk? We discuss this and more on today’s cast. Hope you enjoy!
This week is in tandem with last week’s conversation. Why is it awkward when we receive compliments? Do you feel like you never receive any? Can receiving compliments actually humble us? We discuss all this and more.
Listen in as Clint and Angie talk about how they handle criticism. What about those we disagree with? What about if the criticism is overly harsh? Can good things come from those types of criticisms?
What is disappointment? Why do we experience it? What is at the heart of this experience? Clint and I openly discuss these questions from our own perspective. Hope it’s helpful.
Angie and I discuss what bearing burdens looks like from our experience. What exactly is that? When / why do I struggle with doing it? Who does it best?
I’m sure we’ve all heard the expression, “It’s ok not to be ok.” Today we are riffing on that topic. What’s it mean to not be ok? How have we dealt with others and ourselves who haven’t been “ok”?
This is a topic that sadly everyone is forced to deal with. It seems in the last year or so we have all been inundated with the reality of death. That is especially true more recently for Clint and I. How do we deal with such a heavy topic? Wrestling through it with a friend is always a good place to start.
Doubt is something everyone struggles with to varying degrees. We talk about our own personal experiences with it, and what has helped us in seasons of doubt. Is there hope for those who doubt? We think so.
Clint and I are finally back in studio together! This week we have another guest on to talk about our personal experiences with Christ. It’s interesting the different ways we talk about Him yet it’s the same fundamental experience.
This week Clint talks with Pastor Dave about what it looks like to reach the modern family. They talk about the necessity to include people that come from different perspectives and the importance of listening and meeting needs. I am thankful to have someone with Dave’s heart and mind as my pastor.
We talk about friendship on the podcast today. We ask the question, “Is friendship important, and what makes a good friend?” I loud cap a really sweet statement from Clint. Where we end up is talking about how a diverse friend group causes us to grow.
Today I have a conversation with my friend Sam. We attended the same church in 2018, lost touch with one another, and recently reconnected over chess. He is a recent convert to Roman Catholicism and I found his shift in theology fascinating. What causes some to be open to new ideas and changed by them? Do we maintain that openness? I’m not sure we answer those questions, but they are at the heart of this episode.
Purity culture and our experience with it. Tune in to hear about my “non-sexy earth tone” passion for purity shirt. Where we end up is that any time behavioral aspects of our faith are emphasized the point is missed. We have some laughs along the way. Hope you enjoy.
We thought it might be a good idea to talk about the nature of our podcast and where our name came from...38 episodes in. It’s been enjoyable to let the podcast flesh itself out. Wrestling with these topics has benefitted me greatly spiritually. It hasn’t always been pleasant in the moment, but I’m always better for it in the end.
We recognize this is a very sensitive topic and most people have very strong opinions. This episode we are attempting to share how we have wrestled with the topic and encourage nuance and introspection. We understand many will disagree with us. We welcome those disagreements and hope to learn from them.
Anger is something we all experience. Recently I’ve learned that I am rarely angry at a person or the circumstance that triggered my anger. Usually my anger is a result from internal insecurities. When I can ask, “What is really going on here?” I have a better chance of discovering the root of the issue.
I love my pastor. Today I was able to ask him questions I’ve often thought about, but never asked for whatever reason. We also talk about a text that he’ll be preaching on this upcoming Sunday.
Each of us speaks on this topic from our own perspective that results in two different understandings. The first is a tiredness that results from exercising our spiritual muscles. The second is one that is difficult to continue in belief or practicing belief. The cure for each is a lessening view of self and to indulge in God.
I’ve recently heard wisdom described as the hard candy of spiritual truths. It’s not something you can immediately bite into, but the longer you dwell on it the sweeter it gets. Hopefully you feel the same about our podcast! Thanks for listening.
We discuss ego using the common understanding of the word, “to think highly of oneself”, not in the Freudian use of the term. My goal is to have a right sized view of myself. When my ego flares up it hinders my relationship with God and hurts my relationship with my neighbor.
Clint and I discuss what kind of legacy we want to leave and who has left a legacy for us. One thing I walked away with from this conversation is that the hard work of legacy will come from how we treat others. In particular, how we treat others in moments of conflict. Leave us a review if you enjoy the discussion!
Angie and Clint talk about lament today. What it is, how to do it, where it can go wrong, and where it can go right. Simply talking about it leads Angie to a revelation on why we might struggle with lamenting to God with the seemingly small things we experience. It was enlightening to me!
This week we don’t talk about our views so much as views we’ve encountered that have changed us along the way. It’s a tough topic to discuss. Our aim is to be able to have open minded discussions on the toughest of topics. Hopefully we did that today.
Today we talk about one aspect of where our hope comes from. There were things that were discussed this episode that I think will be a spiritual milestone for me. I want to have resurrection lenses when I encounter various circumstances and people.
In this episode you’ll find a few different views on this concept. However, the approach in dealing with our unfulfilled expectations are all the same. The hard part is getting to a place of acceptance and tolerance. We have found that practice to be a worthwhile endeavor. Listen in as we wrestle with this topic candidly.
In this episode Angie and I get to talk about our personal heroes. We share some of our better known heroes, and a few that might be surprised that we consider them to be heroes. A question I have after recording is, “Do the people I consider to be heroes shape me as a person, or am I drawn to certain people because of an innate desire from within?” No clue, but it’s fun to think about!
Weep with those who weep and mourn with those who mourn. A simple concept that can be hard to practice. It’s just Clint and I today, and we get to talk about our own wrestling’s with empathy. We touch on the spiritual benefits we’ve experienced when we are able to practice empathy. Enjoy!
What is prayer? We define it through our own experience and talk practically about our own prayer life (flaws and all). This can be an intimidating topic but we are hoping that by starting the conversation it makes it easier.
Today we are talking about confession from our own perspectives. What does it look like? Who do we do this with? What benefits are there? We aren’t great at it, but we want to get better. Hopefully the more we talk about it, the better we’ll get. That’s our hope anyway.
It may not be fair to call what we discuss today “deconstruction.” We weren’t sure what else to call it. Spiritual renovation? Maybe you resonate with what we share and have a better term for it. We would be happy to hear from you!
This is our first listener suggested episode! We discuss our jobs: what we do, what we like about our jobs, and when we’ve experiencing burn out. Are some jobs secular and some sacred? Is work a burden that we have to endure or is there another perspective? We hope you enjoy!
This week we are talking about intentionality. Is it simply focus or something more? What prevents us from being intentional? We discuss these things while hopefully leading with our weaknesses. Let us know what you think!
Community is something we need, but it’s also really tough at times. It’s tough because the people we need the most can often be the ones that hurt us the most. Give us a listen as we wrestle with these things today.
We talk about what we consider fear to be, some of our personal fears, and how it plays out in unhealthy ways for us. Sometimes our fears are irrational. Sometimes they aren’t. What if the worse case scenario actually comes true!? Listen in and see if you can relate to our story.
We’re back! Still missing Clint this week, but Angie and I get together to discuss discipline. I learned that discipline helps us to be authentic and our relationships be more fulfilling. We discuss some of the things we do personally and the areas we struggle in as well.
Today we had a special guest where we discussed why it’s difficult for us to find rest. We discovered we had a common problem through an honest conversation. I hope you can hear how fun this episode was for me.
This year has been tough for so many people. We want to mourn with those who are mourning. Is it possible to be grateful while we are sad? What would that look like? That’s what we wanted to discuss in this episode.
Humility is a kind of spiritual modesty. We discuss what it isn’t, what it is, our own failings, and what helps us to be humble. We missed Angela today, but hoping to get her back on next week.
We start with the question, “Am I my brother’s/sister’s keeper?” Where we end up is that we are our neighbor’s keeper. We are a work in progress hoping to demonstrate that we can find common ground even with people that are different from us. Come along for the journey. We will meet you there.
Grace is a word that’s thrown around a lot, but what is it really? We asked people in each of our circles, and we talk about it from our perspective. We recognize our need for others to be gracious to us. Hopefully we can return the favor. We need each other.
Today is Angela’s first time on the podcast! We are very excited for her to become a regular co-host. We discuss what tolerance is from each of our perspectives. If we want to experience connection with others we must first tolerate them so that we can move to acceptance. We discuss our shortcomings and our desire to be better.
Surrender is the spiritual discipline of being ok with the way things are not as we want them to be. We discuss acceptance and how the two are closely related, and the conversation dovetails to how we have embraced mystery.
This was a difficult topic to put into words. However, we have a better understanding of the feelings we have when we experience beauty because of the discussion. We do our best to define beauty and give specific examples of things we find to be beautiful. We hope you enjoy!
Today we discuss the benefits of friendship, how friendship elevates us to do things we never would otherwise, and how friendship helps us to get outside of ourselves. Friendship also helps us to see God better.
This weeks episode is about shame. We speak from our own experiences what it is, what happens when we feel it, and discussing our way out. We are really pleased with how the conversation went and feel it captures our journey. We pray it will bless you in yours.
Here’s an article we found helpful:
https://www.1517.org/articles/a-victims-shame
This week we take another line from the St. Francis Prayer. That God would grant us the ability to seek to love rather than to be loved. We can’t do this alone. We need each other and we need God to love in this way. Even then it’s still hard. We want to get better! _________________________https://www.1517.org/articles/enemies-with-benefits?token=7STuU-ghBeny4KBrj3dhVg4OFJen1K6e
This is a line from the St. Francis prayer, that we are notoriously bad at practicing. We are reaching out to one another and God for help because we need it. It’s painful to come to terms with these things but has been necessary for our growth.
This cast is about sharing where we wrestle with parenting and our own shortcomings. We have experienced the more we talk about these things and are honest with ourselves, this is where growth can happen. We hope our conversation benefits you as well.
This episode is all about contentment. We talk about our struggles to be content, but also the hope we have of finding that balance and experiencing peace._____________________Here is an article we reference a few times: https://greatergood.berkeley.edu/article/item/what_if_you_pursued_contentment_rather_than_happiness
Today we talk about what to expect from our podcast. We hope we can be honest and vulnerable enough to help ourselves so that maybe we can be of service to others. A big thank you to our good friend Charles Dew who helped us out with some artwork.