The Neurodiverse Lawyer: Recent Episodes
Amelia
A podcast for all those in law and professional services who don’t quite fit in. Each week we talk to a different diverse thinker about their experience. Tune in to get tips, insights, and ideas as we explore difficult topics such as neurodiversity and mental health in work, university, and employment processes. Made by a Depressed Dyspraxic, join our community.
In this week’s episode Naomi (PR Director at NDLP) is Joined by Gemma, who was diagnosed as autistic aged 17 and now works as a Legal Engineer at Simmons & Simmons Wavelength, consulting clients on legal operations. She is a part of the Neurodiversity Network at Simmons & Simmons and advocates for the proactive inclusion of neurodivergent and disabled people. Gemma is interested in how legal operations functions can help to remove barriers to neurodivergent people by improving processes and using technology.
Naomi and Gemma discuss all from mental health to what a legal engineer does to the importance of neurodiversity networks.
In this week's episode, we are joined by Stephanie Camilleri, who was diagnosed with ADHD following the diagnosis of her children. Stephanie has worked in magic circle law and in-house, predominately in banking law. She founded The ADHD Advocate in 2018, uniquely combining "Coaching, Education, and the Law".
Stephanie explains that The ADHD Advocate "helps people understand their ADHD - their entitlements to support under the law and how they can manage the challenges and harness the strengths that come with ADHD...clients include children with ADHD and their parents, adults with ADHD, teachers, schools and leaders in the corporate world."
Find out more here
To find Stephanie on Linkedin, press here
Transcribed version here
Welcome back to the ND Lawyer Podcast! In this shorter episode, we introduce Series 2 and some changes to the podcast. Amelia explains some candid personal updates (including starting as a Trainee) alongside an overview of the project's growth within the last 8 months.
In this week's episode, Saffia and Adam from the full-service national firm Geldards LLP join us for a discussion. While Saffia describes the firm's approach to neurodiversity in recruitment and employment, Adam talks about his experiences as a dyslexic Associate Partner and Head of Education Law.
In this episode we are joined by Annie Crowe. Annie is a proud autistic ADHD advocate and lawyer and the founding Director of Neurodivergent Millennial, a consulting business, a consulting business that is leading the way for Neurodiversity inclusion in the 21st Century. She is also the founder and Chair of Eating Disorders Neurodiversity Australia (EDNA), a neurodivergent-led not-for-profit aimed at primarily supporting autistic Australians with eating disorders through the promotion of neurodiversity-affirming healthcare and disability support. She is an internationally recognised speaker on neurodiversity and disability inclusion. Annie has a background in human rights law and policy development, she uses this combined with her lived experience to advocate for social justice and inclusion of neurodivergent people in the Australian Health System and workforce. She works tirelessly to ensure neurodivergent voices are heard and that their lived experience is valued for the expertise that it is.
Dr. Felicity Gerry QC joins us on this week's episode. We begin by talking about Felicity's path, her career, her pursuits, and her personal insights. We then talk about her work on autism and criminal justice, as well as the broader issues of complicity, intent, and defences, "trauma-informed courts," and what the criminal justice system can do to be more inclusive to all.
Transcript: https://otter.ai/u/HHNq_S3Xd7RWzkxk8jONt0xU68U
https://felicitygerry.com/ - "Professor Felicity Gerry QC is an international QC at Libertas Chambers, London and Crockett Chambers, Melbourne, largely defending in serious and complex criminal trials and appeals, often with an international element. She was Solicitor’s Journal Legal Personality of the Year 2016 and Australian Barrister of the Year 2020...Admitted to the list of counsel for the International Criminal Court and the Kosovo Specialist Chambers in The Hague and in England & Wales and in Australia (Victoria and the High Court Roll) and has had ad hoc admission in Hong Kong and Gibraltar. She led the appeal in R v Jogee in the UK Supreme Court which was described by the BBC as a ‘moment of genuine legal history’ and she led the intervention for JUSTICE in the Shamima Begum Appeals. Felicity is one of the few women silks to defend in a terrorism trial and led a team of academics and practitioners who were given leave to file an Amicus Curiae brief in the ICTY on JCEIII liability. She has also advised in relation to death penalty matters in Indonesia and the Philippines, on citizens held in Syrian camps and on complicity in international criminal cases. Felicity is Honorary Professor at Salford University in the School of Health and Society where her research focus is on Autism and criminal law, FGM law and Child Rights. She is also Professor of Legal Practice at Deakin University where she is unit chair for MLL419/MLJ728 Contemporary International Legal Challenges – topics have included Modern Slavery, Terrorism, War Crimes and Climate Change law – and is involved in the clinical programs."
"Autism Spectrum Disorder and the criminal Law" (Gerry QC, FR, Allely, CS and Rowland, AG) - https://usir.salford.ac.uk/id/eprint/61021/1/autism-spectrum-disorder-and-the-criminal-law-felicity-gerry-june-2021.pdf
Website - https://felicitygerry.com/
Libertas Chambers - https://www.libertaschambers.com/our-people/felicity-gerry-qc/
We are the city - https://wearethecity.com/inspirational-woman-professor-felicity-gerry-qc-international-queens-counsel-professor-of-legal-practice/
University of Salford - https://www.salford.ac.uk/our-staff/felicity-gerry
We meet Sana Malik, a prospective Bird & Bird Trainee Solicitor and LPC student with ADHD and Dyspraxia, in this episode. We start by discussing Sana's experience getting diagnosed and navigating her Paralegal and Banking roles and Legal Internships with undiagnosed neurodivergence, then we talk about rejection during four unsuccessful application rounds and how she got a TC. Finally, we hear Sana's insights into what more the legal sector can do for neurodiversity, building inner confidence, and what drew her to her current firm, Bird & Bird, an international law firm with a focus on technology (35 minutes onwards).
Transcript alongside audio recording - https://otter.ai/u/RenolRw7OYe14j5cVgFNcZcG8po
Sana's Linkedin - https://www.linkedin.com/in/sana-malik-27632a110/
EmployAbility - https://www.employ-ability.org.uk/
Bird & Bird "NeuroNetwork" via Early Careers Officer Rachel Boyle - https://www.linkedin.com/posts/rachel-boyle-a3974098_diversity-inclusionmatters-neurodiversity-activity-6889255176855797760-ZZtF?utm_source=linkedin_share&utm_medium=member_desktop_web
We speak with Sarah, Staff Disability Advisor and Trans Lead at the University of Oxford, in this week's episode. Sarah is trans, blind, and neurodivergent, and was named Stonewall's LGBT+ role model of the year (East Midlands 2018). She also presents her own podcast, the Simply Equality Podcast. Sarah talks about her personal experiences, the similarities and contrasts between the LGBT+ and disability experience, what businesses, universities, and individuals can do to be more inclusive, and why she decided to advocate, campaign, and train others.
Transcript; https://otter.ai/u/3siaTzugGChzexE7tuOSXuiW9bk
Simply Equality Podcast; https://www.simplyequality.com/about-me
Linkedin; https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarah-stephenson-hunter-she-her-02225a96/?original_referer=https%3A%2F%2Fuk%2Esearch%2Eyahoo%2Ecom%2F&originalSubdomain=uk
In this episode, we talk with Richard, a Clinical Negligence Partner at Irwin Mitchell, about his experience as a dyspraxic and dyslexic lawyer. Richard discusses why he decided to share his story, how his neurodivergence has helped him in his career, dealing with impostor syndrome, and how senior staff can be more inclusive.
Transcript: https://otter.ai/u/oIEQhbxIfYeSvncJV59gBT51me0
In this episode, we speak with Natasha Hirst, a co-researcher on The University of Cardiff and Law Society's 'Legally disabled?' research, which was one of the first explorations into the " experiences of disabled people and people with health conditions (including mental health) working in the legal profession". Natasha is a Neurodiversity advocate, Vice President of the National Journalist Society, Writer, Trade Union Representative, and Photographer who is deaf and has ADHD and Dyspraxia. Natasha's personal experience, the research and why it came about, its legacy, and what more needs to be done are all discussed in this episode.
Links and resources mentioned in today's episode;
Transcript: https://natashahirstblog.co.uk/post/682252269115392001/the-neurodiverse-lawyer-podcast
Legally Disabled website; http://legallydisabled.com
University of Cardiff and Law Society research; http://legallydisabled.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Legally-Disabled-full-report-FINAL.pdf
Law society interview; https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/topics/lawyers-with-disabilities/legally-disabled-two-years-on
Some of Natasha's work; https://www.disabilitywales.org/author/natasha-hirstgmail-com/
Natasha's blog; https://natashahirstblog.co.uk
Kirsten, Autistic Solicitor Consultant, and Neurodiversity Advocate, joins us in this episode. Kirsten discusses her experience training in the magic circle and working in-house in the financial sector while undiagnosed. She also discusses her late diagnosis, the challenges of being a senior neurodivergent lawyer, what the sector needs to change and how they can do so, as well as some useful advice on navigating neurodiversity in the legal profession.
Transcript: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1w44_iGlSEH2sEnym2H_aTNAsz7bSG9P8TFg7VE5AWps/edit?usp=sharing
In this episode, we are joined by Emma Bartlett, Partner at CM Murray, an Employment Law, and Partnerships Law firm. Emma has been advocating and raising awareness through her work, appearing on podcasts, and writing several articles on neurodiversity in the workplace including in People Management. Emma discusses the legal obligations of employers, the rights of neurodivergent individuals, why they are a good fit for the sector, and general ideas around good practice in the legal profession.
People Management: https://www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/experts/legal/managing-neurodiversity-in-the-workplace#gref
Global Legal Post: https://www.globallegalpost.com/news/the-benefits-of-being-different-why-law-firms-should-embrace-neurodiversity-1732397067
CM Murray: https://www.cm-murray.com/knowledge/navigating-neurodiversity-within-law-firms-embracing-the-benefits-and-understanding-the-challenges/
In this episode, we talk to Phoebe, a future In-house trainee solicitor at the BBC. Phoebe, who runs @trainwithtiss on Instagram, discusses her journey, why she chose in-house, mental health, 'lawfluencing', alongside lots of helpful tips and tricks! For the last 20 minutes of the episode, we flip the script and Phoebe interviews us about the project, neurodiversity, and law.
We speak with Alice, a dyspraxic future trainee at a top 25 firm and University of Oxford student, in this episode. We go over everything from discussing your neurodivergence on applications to disclosure, asking for reasonable adjustments, how to ace commercial awareness and competency interviews, and delivering feedback. This is one of the first thorough podcasts for neurodivergent applicants to aid in getting a training contract; we recommend supplementing it with additional resources and keeping in mind that this is based on both of our personal experiences.
All opinions are our own and not representative of our future employers.
In this episode, we are joined by Leanne Maskell. Leanne is the author of ADHD: an A to Z, and The Model Manifesto, who has appeared on Sky News, and the BBC to talk about her experiences. She is also an ADHD Coach and Legal Consultant who has advised/trained the likes of Microsoft and Lewis Silkin on neurodiversity. Leanne discusses her personal journey, alongside key insights from her coaching/consultancy, and provides an overview of the issues in the sector and what can be done to overcome them.
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leannemaskell
ADHD Works: https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/adhd-works-6891301963426803712
ADHD: an A to Z: https://www.amazon.co.uk/ADHD-Z-Leanne-Maskell/dp/B08SGXMNM9/ref=asc_df_B08SGXMNM9_nodl/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=500798696358&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14485589709550129539&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1007161&hvtargid=pla-1234984872217&psc=1&th=1&psc=1
In this episode, we are joined by the University of Sheffield's Edward Bramley Law Society to talk about their approach to neurodiversity and welfare. Alice, the Vice-President who has anxiety and BPD, and Sharon, the Inclusion Officer, also discuss a wider university approach and what more they can do to better accommodate neurodivergent students.
This week we chat with Elaine, a Commercial Property Solicitor at a Top 200 firm, about her experience with Dyspraxia, whilst managing legal education and work. Elaine provides her insights and tips for attaining work as a Paralegal, Trainee, and Qualified Solicitor. We also discuss mental health and issues with the diagnostic process.
This week, we're joined by Laura Yeates, Head of Graduate Talent, and Zoe Jenkins, Graduate Recruitment Specialist from Clifford Chance, a Magic Circle International Law firm. In this episode, we talk about 'stigma-busting' initiatives and approaches to neurodivergent diversity and inclusion in the firm's recruitment process, as well as some helpful recommendations and guidance for applicants.
This week we are joined by Marco, a Legal Advisor and legal tech entrepreneur, with Dyslexia, Dyspraxia, and Dyscaculia. In this episode, we discuss getting a late diagnosis, coming to terms with your neurodivergency, and adapting to the legal workplace.
This week we speak with Amy, Magic Circle Paralegal and LLM LPC student who is autistic. We discuss late diagnosis, coping with postgraduate study, and applying to and working at a magic circle firm.
This week we speak with Hannah, a 2nd-year law student with ADHD, and Hope, a 3rd-year law student with Dyspraxia, Dyslexia, and ADHD about their experience with misconceptions, gender bias in diagnosis, and entering the legal sector.
This week we speak to Konstantina and James, Chair and Vice-Chair of the upcoming organisation 'Bringing Dis(Ability) to the Bar'.
"Bringing [Dis]Ability to the Bar aims to open up the legal profession and dismantle the barriers that currently stop people with disabilities from reaching the Bar. This includes raising awareness that current practices and standards are inadequate in making the Bar a profession that is accessible and inclusive; whilst trying to destigmatise how disabilities are perceived within the profession. In order to do so, we will research, educate, and enable a two-way mentoring scheme. We will use our research findings and practical experiences to improve accessibility at the Bar - in the hope that the barriers to the Bar can be broken down, and a more equal and fair Bar can be create"
- Facebook: BDABar
- Instagram: BDAbar_org
- Twitter: https://twitter.com/BDABarOrg?s=20
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/bdabar
Georgia, a Marketing Executive with ADHD/ADD who is starting the PGDL to become a Solicitor, features this week. Join us as we investigate the difficulties and benefits of having ADHD/ADD in everyday life, employment, and university.
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This week we chat with Anisabela about her experience working in non-commercial law with Autism.
This week, I spoke with Jasbir, a Bar Practice Course student and CPS Paralegal Officer with Dyslexia, about her experience with late diagnosis, navigating undergraduate and postgraduate studies with and without support, and more.
This week, I talk to Gabrielle, a first-year Autistic law student, on her experience applying to and starting at university. We talk about the issues experienced, the help we received, and the help we wish we had. We'll also talk about the mental health ramifications, as well as the pressures of having good grades and lots of legal/volunteer experience at such an early stage!
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Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.