Imperfect Mens Club: Recent Episodes
Imperfect Mens Club
The Imperfect Mens Club Podcast is a space for men to have real, raw and sometimes difficult conversations to help guide middle aged men through making hard decisions in life. Mark + Jim are both mentors focused on leading consciously. Tune in to hear honest, and often humorous, discussions on well-being, personal growth and professional development.
imperfectmensclub.com IG: @imperfectmensclubpodcast
Mark introduces the episode and reflects on the “pregame” discussion with Jim. Jim is giving a speech in a few days to a group or around 60 to 80 college students at San Jose State in the dept of Design and construction and he wants to give them career advice and life advice to help them with the transition from school to life
Jim brings the wheel into play and shares some context for his upcoming talk. Who the audience is and the topics to be discussed
Jim expands upon the idea of the letter he recommends students write or could write to be read later in life
Jim starts to talk about the types of advice that might be helpful to this audience
His first tip is mentorship. One of Mark’s favorite topics
90% of life is jus showing up - Jim goes into great detail about what showing up means. On time, all the time and prepared with a great attitude. That is hard to do
Mark loves the simplicity of it. He asks Jim to clarify who is writing the letter to whom. Two audiences. The elder to the 21 year old and the 21 year old to himself
Jim likes the question. He thinks it’s both too
Jim says it’s both what you “should” do, but also what you “should not” do. He wants to be cautious with giving advice. Sending kids down the wrong path…so he chooses to give wisdom instead of advice
Mark chimes in in agreement. He says advice is more likely to be presumptuous and wisdom is timeless. He cites how effective experience and stories are more so than advice. He specifically speaks to people about crafting their own stories before engaging the market
Jim shares his opinion about preparing kids for socialism and then releasing them in to capitalism…and wonder why they fail
He then brings up being American first. He says anything is possible if you show up as a working American. America is a meritocracy, not a bunch of identity groups. Just be good at something
Mark wishes he could attend Jim’s an event as a fly on the wall
Mark reflects on a do-over. Find out how to work hard and then spend the rest of your life learning how to work smarter. More efficiently and delegation of things you don’t like and don ’t do well
Jim brings in some quotes
“Success is a combo of hard work, showing up and luck”
If you don’t show up…nothing will happen
People like to help people, but you need to be “referable”
Mark shares how he found his mentor…by being referable
What is referable - dependable, punctual, productive, trustworthy…
Jim says at 21 all you have is your potential. Mark’s mentor saw his potential and Mark was willing to follow his mentor’s advice’
Jim clarifies that Marks mentorship was a win for all parties. Mark learned and progressed and his mentor made a lot of money
Ark says, no one is entitled to anything
‘Im says, give yourself permission
Jim’s quote - “The harder I work, the luckier I get”
Mark loves the simplicity
Einstein - Life is an illusion. It’s all perspective
Mark says you can create your own luck…by responding well to what happens to you
Don’t blame. Get better
Mark loves the quotes. He brings in the notion of time and how we have no notion of time when he was young. Now time is a an extremely valuable asset. Hindsight is 20-20
Jim says we had time in our youth…and now we’re running out of time
Life is a marathon. Small incremental change over time
Jim speaks of self awareness. You don’t know everything…you don’t know much. “We are all actors in this movie called life…)
Mark jokes about Candid Camera. Jim thinks we all have a default movie genre. Romance, comedy, thriller, etc…
Mark says his is comedy, but comedy is not always appropriate.
Jm talks about being identified as from the Northeast because of what he looks like. Mark says he is also direct unlike most Californians
Jim talks about the influence that “Rocky” had on him as a kid
Jim says in life it’s often not what you do…it’s what you don’t do He talks about working things out as a kid with his fists and how that does n’t serve you as you age
“Never accept criticism from anyone from whom you would not seek advice”
Mark says not to allow strangers to get under your skin. “What the fuck do I care what you think of me?”
Jim wants his audience to Get at least one good takeaway
Be careful with the advice you give out to young people
Be the best version of yourself
All comparison leads to misery
Mark agrees and has fallen back on observations and reflections and telling stories instead of telling people what to do. Stories prompt reflection and critical thought
The power of a third party story
Mark starts off introducing the topic which revolves around the presidential election of 2024. What do we do now?
Jim and Mark are more interested in addresing what actually happened, why it may have happened and what we might expect to happen next
What do we do now?
We went back and forth about the blue team and red team. No judgement
It's not what happens to you, it's how you respond...
We talked about elitism and messaging. How the blue team continued the division and condescension
We discussed how diverse the turnout was from the red team (ironically)
We left on an optimistic note. The system worked and now we have much work to do
Due to a technical glitch (my fault most likely), I lost my show notes to the ether. The summary above should capture the essence of my notes
This is the best that my memeory will allow:)
Mark introduces the topic of communication and within that general topic, the subtopic of persuasion. He then emphasizes the value of having a framework. He puts our framework in perspective
Jim chimes in about the idea of having a framework and emphasizes the IMC framework
Jim shares his 5 W’s framework and how helpful it has been for him in a variety of projects. How it adds perspective for both parties
He shares the value of effective people being clear
Jim asks Mark about his framework
Mark shares his childhood influences around communication and then his framework
What do you say?
How do you say it?
To whom do you say it?
When do you say it?
Both guys agree they made their frameworks theirs…no matter where it came from
Mark brings up the image Jim shared and begins to share the examples of lazy responses versus helpful responses
The guys dig into examples of how powerful specific words are and how changing a word can change the tone of the whole conversation
Problem versus “opportunity” or “challenge”
All the specific examples from Jim’s image become the conversations
Each example uncovers how simple shifts, different words change the whole tone and emotion of the conversation
Both guys share their experience with each example and how they have both made the mistake of using the lazy language and relearned the helpful response
They both emphasize the importance of not apologizing. Never apologize unless you’ve done real wrong
Mark shares - don’t say, “to be honest with you”. “Frank” or Jim’s option “transparent”
They discuss transparency as a double edged sword
“I’m too busy” means I’m too busy for you
They both have a laugh about “too busy”
“That’s not my” job versus, “let me get you to the right person”
Mark shares his mentor’s story about personal accountability
“I’ll try” versus “I’ll take care of it”. Jim has a different angle on this one
Mark frames it as personal accountability. I won’t dismiss you, we’ll get it taken care of
Apologizing comes up again and both guys reiterate the problem with saying you’re sorry
Jim uses “I own that one”. “That one’s on me”. Take ownership
Mark - “sorry never works for me unless you really fucked something up”
Mark shares some media examples of how apologies become bigger problems
Jim says behaviors are more important than words - Mark agrees
The next example is disagreement - “You’re wrong” versus “I have a different perspective on this than you and I’d like to share it with you”
Jim cites people who actually enjoy conflict to garner attention
“This might sound stupid but…” versus “Let’s try this.” Naysayers are everywhere
Jim agrees as an inventor he always shares new ideas…the value of reframing ideas until consensus is established
Mark brings up Jordan Peterson talking about Elon Musk and comparison (Elon’s roommate story)
Jim - All comparison leads to misery
Jim shares “I have an hypothesis” versus a theory. An hypothesis is designed to be challenged…designed to be criticized
He shares the difference between an hypothesis and a theory
A theory has been proven. An hypothesis has not yet been proven
“No worries”… “I’m happy to help”
Both guys discuss the nuance of this one
Mark feels like “no worries” is kind of a throw away
They conclude that this whole exercise is an exercise in self awareness
The final example is recommending something to someone
‘I think maybe we should” versus “I recommend we do this…”
Jim says “I think” makes him feel like “Why should I listen to you”
Mark finishes with his 4 pronged framework
He confirms that listening and asking questions before speaking is almost always the best strategy
Jim finishes with the value of clarifying assumptions, discussing desired outcomes, “who, not how” and what are the necessary resources?
Mark shares his support of this as authentic…for both parties
A we suggested in the episode, we want to encourage anyone who is interested and able to contribute to my daughter Caroline’s Go Fund Me campaign in support of documenting the devastation that hit Asheville, NC (where she lives) recently with her creative partners in the form of a documentary. Details can be found here - https://gofund.me/8fcfe6fa
Thanks for your support!!
————————
Mark introduces the topic of self interest and suggests that it might be valuable to flush out each party’s self interest before engaging another, regardless of the nature of the engagement. Then he tosses it back to Jim before engaging people in conversation.
Jim talks about introducing the idea of our podcast to others and describes how he explains it to people
He then reflects on how everything we do starts with self. He identifies our target market (middle aged men). He shares his thoughts on self interest in particular and how he tries to establish self interest
He feels this helps with transparency and honesty
Mark reflects on his sales journey and how he was coached to hide his self interest. He has evolved into a more transparent approach
Jim chimes in about his sales career and the evolution of how he handles self interest
Both guys reflect on their evolution from selling in the 80’s versus where they on now. They were taught to hold their cards close to the fence
Mark shares his reflection on the movie Glengarry GlenRoss. And Alec Baldwins “ABC” approach
Jim says he doesn’t miss that approach at all
Mark says you can make money with the hard sell, but not long term with the same clients. It’s a churn and burn
Mark reframes how he approaches sales and coaching today. Goodwill and referrals
It used to be “I win if you lose”. Now it’s win win
Jim suggests that our young folks (30’s) today have better bullshit detectors and they won’t tolerate a lack of transparency
Jim’s approach now is understanding how every party can win
Mark tells a story about his dad’s hand shake deal over a loan - there’s always been room for transparency
Jim tells his patent attorney story and how the final bill was much higher than expected - how he resolved the issue with both parties happy and the relationship in tact
Jim shares that both parties taking ownership for the solution was critical to the success of the engagement
Jim says he is much better at establishing assumptions, self interest and expectations before moving deeper into a negotiation or discussion
Marks says we often assume that others see the world the same way we do. He relates a story about his son and “getting things in writing”. Things change post agreement. Nothing is static. Things should be readdressed continuously over time
Jim distinguishes between knowledge and wisdom. Experience breeds wisdom. The world needs wisdom, not knowledge
Mark says most of his wisdom comes from mistakes and failure. He says execution is what he needs most
Jim wants to leave discussions with understanding, not power. He doesn’t know everything. No one does
Mark brings up the topic of what words mean. His example is abortion. He shares the different nuances with this particular topic
Jim jumps in and suggests that “I don’t want to talk about abortion”. Are you having the wrong conversation with the wrong person at the wrong time. “I don’t want to talk about that”. Back to self interest
One has to be self aware about what who wants to talk about
Mark jokes about the pregame conversation with Jim about the topic of health. Jim tells stories about different friends who ramble o. About their own ailments
Mark bring his daughter and he being able to help everyone…but not if they’re not ready. You can’t people who don’t want to be helped
———————
Jim asks Mark to share his daughter’s campaign to help Asheville, NC recover from the devastation from the hurricane by producing a documentary
The guys try to frame the situation and make a link available to help fund the project
Here is the link again - https://gofund.me/8fcfe6fa
Mark introduces two topics. Community and legacy
He shares that they skipped last week because of the two hurricanes and tells the listeners that everyone was safe in his family and how the communities came together
Why we can get along and be supportive in times of hardship, yet we are divided in times of peace
Mark says we’re not as divided as the media portray us. Mark says if we all got together, we wouldn’t need the government…and that scares the hell out of the government
Jim says he’s grateful everyone is OK. He compliments Mark on his ability to not show anxiety
Jim speaks about anxiety in general. Common anxiety. Anxiety brings people together
It’s human nature. He asks Mark to read the definition of anxiety
Mark shares a story about his son during the storm and how, without power, he came outside to help
Jim says it’s a perfect example of how anxiety can bring us together
Jim relates to the flywheel - health- mental health. He says the best way to handle anxiety is to have a conversation. Anxiety means you’re not present
Mark relates the community effort and how healing it was
Mark gives his opinion about why he handles anxiety the way he does
Jim says it’s not what happens to us it’s how we respond and then he transitions into legacy
Mark brings up the movie Poseidon Adventure and Gene Hackman - Great legacy story
Jim says it’ not just hurricanes..the political landscape approaching a presidential election
They acknowledge Asheville NC where Mark’s daughters and girlfriend daughter lives (everyone is ok)
Mark says the reason the current “regime” is nervous is because what they disasters are showing is that when we all get together…we don’t need the government…and that scares the shit out of the people in power
Jim agrees and brings up taxes - it’s an insurance policy. We pay you and you protect us…and they have not
Jim brings up his hometown near Oakland CA where the government has taken the money and not delivered the services
And we’re supposed to trust the government again?
Mark asks, why is this, why now? We have SO MUCH media. Regardless of political stance. So much noise. Anxiety comes from the noise
Jim shares a high school football story from this past weekend. Pregame pictures:)
Mark says there is only 1 MVP
He shares his frame of reference 1928 to 2024. 7 or 8 presidents. Their opinions have context
Jim says the kids were as interested in their pictures as they were in winning the game
Mark says. What’s important? It’s ass backwards
Jim says the parents don’t know what to do either and CA is passing laws about cell phones in class
Jim says the government can play a role, but another law that schools can’t suspend students anymore. Now way more kids are misbehaving. Also the $900 theft law is still in place
Mark asks how long will this most recent tragedy be remembered in the context of community
Mark transitions into legacy and asks when one should start thinking about legacy
Jim asks that we define legacy and both guys clarify their individual positions on legacy
Jim shares some thoughts about his own current anxiety about an upcoming speech he’s to give tomorrow and his most recent provisional patent recently submitted in the context of legacy and anxiety
Mark thinks having a legacy is a form of personal accountability
Mark shares his Little League All Star anxiety and his dad’s reply
Jim shares a Sylvester Stallone story
Jim says there is such a thing as healthy anxiety
Jim asks Mark what he would say to his 30 year old self
Mark says it’s difficult at 30 to think about being 60. Legacy is what the people say about you when you’re gone. Mark wishes Jim good luck with his speech
Mark introduces the topic based on Jim’s experience and the guys decide to expand on the flywheel and the 5 areas of life as “screens” that we look through
He starts with money
Jim shares a story about meeting some strangers and getting into a discussion about our podcast and specifically money. Jim has been getting more and more comfortable explaining our podcast
He shares how one of the people was triggered by the topic of money
These people were US citizens who grew up in Iran. He asked about wearing her veil and she told Jim she is not a fan of the covering but still wears it
This led to a discussion of worldview
Jim shares his recollection of the podcast that he listened to about money and his “screen” theory
Mark transitions to profession and how different life is for entrepreneurs and those that work for others
He talks about risk and the notion of playing with other people’s money
Jim refers back to his discussion with the strangers from Iran. A women’s perspective
Mark talks about serving men that are not encouraged to talk about emotion. He frames the podcast and the 5 areas in terms of self awareness
Jim expands on the self concepts
Jim tells about changing actual screens on his home and the analogy of looking at life through screens
He suggests that many people go through life unaware of their screens
Mark brings up masks and how different their screens are from his
Mark talks about his mom and his resultant health screen as far as eating and exercising were concerned. He shares his screen about the medical and pharmaceutical industries
Jim talks about his mom and dad and when they were born and their “cheap gene”
Mark shares his version of the cheap gene
Mark moves the discussion to relationships and brings his mom and dad back into the discussion
He suggests that boys and girls tend to look for mates like their mothers and fathers
The guys bring up how many people are jaded and the bitter or better phrase. How bitter people start as victims and how difficult this is to overcome
Mark talks about entrepreneurship and how it shapes your version of risk. He asks Jim what his life might be like if he never played football
Mark brings up grandparents and great grand parents
Jim tells a story about a company that he is close to was radio and everyone was let go. He shares how an event like that shapes peoples lens about trusting companies
Mark shares his experience with people who have been displaced and treated good bad and indifferent. He has arrived at a place where he is helping people be “prepared” for anything
Life isn’t fair. This realization is part of becoming an adult
Mark thinks that our podcast is helpful because it pushes self awareness which makes people more aware of what is true versus fair
He thinks being aware of your perspectives makes you a more effective communicator
Jim connects the discussion to our previous podcast episode of Amore Fatte
Mark brings up the topic - Love of fate, love of one’s fate - "Amore Fati"
Stoicism
Things happen for you, not to you
Personal accountability and self awareness
Mark asks Jim to share the back story Three conversations with three good friends
Jim did a deep dive into Amore Fate. The Japanese version “wabi sabi”
The connection to imperfection
People with victim mentalities are not pleasant to be around
Mark talks about personal accountability and self awareness…learning through failure
Jim shares a couple of pet phrases. Bitter or better and don’t wish it was easier, wish you were better
Everything is a choice
Mark talks about “the pause”. Don’t react. Wait. Regain objectivity
Jim came up with 10 words
-
Gratitude - Jim asks Mark about his daily practice
-
Presence - be in the moment. Mark talks about paying attention and young people struggling with attention. Jim cites California law taking phones from kids at school
-
Embrace
-
Response
-
Peace. Mark cites peace of mind
-
Meaning and the connection to suffering. Mark brings up Victor Frankel’s man’s Search For Meaning. Mark suggests that suffering m makes you stronger…it’s a choice
-
Forgiveness. Mark sheds light on forgiving yourself
-
Self Compassion. Jim says it takes work to forgive
Mark talks about forgiving his ex wife
- Mundane Beauty - Mark brings up his dad and how he sees new things with a childlike wonder
Life isn’t a highlight film - Jim
Mark calls the mundane practice. Weight rooms and running stairs
- Authenticity and inauthenticity (Our Vice President)
Mark talks about applying these concepts to life
Acceptance
Explore your reactions to things and maybe change your reactions
Look for the grace in things. Mark reframes his forgiveness of his ex wife and how he contextualizes her difficult childhood. Put yourself in the other persons shoes…gets you to grace
Jim goes back to embracing. Embracing adversity
Mark talks about consistency. The need to practice. It’s never done
Jim frames the discussion as being a persons worldview
Mark says emotional decisions are often bad decisions. Use the pause
Jim says these concepts are timeless and cross cultural constructs
Mark shares his daily practice and how all religions have very much the same concepts
Jim revisits “don’t be nice, be kind”.
Mark says nice is inauthentic
Mark says we’re all going through the same shit
Jim asks us to be men. There are too many boys out there
DEI gets some laughs
Jim shares “the search for meaning in the imperfection”
He closes with meaning in the incomplete
Mark frames incomplete in terms of shipping your work at 80 or 90 % complete
Jim agrees completely
Mark introduces the topic of civil discourse and reads the definition
He classifies it as a worldview topic and asks Jim to chime in
Jim tells the story about how he and Mark met and that the original topic of the podcast was going to be civil discourse
Jim takes us around the wheel and explains where our worldview comes from. Our childhood and our political views
Jim cites the current problem that we have in our country with being decided
He also suggests that some of the conspiracy theories out there might likely be true
Jim says we all are formed by what’s happening in our own back yard. Mark agrees
Jim references our wheel again and then asks Mark to share the story that originated the topic
Mark says in order to have civil discourse you need to be intentionally civil and kind
Both guys agree they are slightly misaligned with regard to optimism and pessimism
Jim doesn’t think “the other side” is willing to do this. They simply want to be critical
Mark asks a lot of questions and stays away from accusations
Mark tells his “yard sign” story
He responds to 3 Harris/Walz signs his neighbors dropped with his own sign response
Mark explains his positions and his take on the political argument landscape
Jim jumps back in with his take on our national elections. He likes using the phrases “red team and blue team”
He talks about the pandemic and the BLM riots influencing the 2020 election
Mark says the division is in pursuit of control. It was purposeful and it worked. He says the blue team is better at the game
Mark talks about the political terms that no longer mean anything
He cites the difference between knowing, feeling and thinking
Jim thinks we no longer vote “for” people, we vote “against” the other guy
Mark tries to take the person out of the discussion
Jim agrees, but doesn’t think people can.
Jim uses the word polarization and suggests that younger people don’t concern themselves with politics. They’re focused on getting their lives in order. He then distinguishes different generations
Marks shares a bit about speaking with his daughters
He calls civil discourse “mental gymnastics”
Jim sees people changing the topic when they get frustrated
Mark agrees and suggests people should just admit when they don’t know
People who are not able to support their positions are’t willing to admit they don’t know
Mark talks about the importance of speaking up
Jim talks about the media. Mark says there is no objective news anymore
Jim brings up Johnny Carson and his objectivity because that’s what his dad watched before bed time
Carson laughed and made fun of both sides
Mark says Carson had a singularity of purpose…to make people laugh
The guys then bring up the current late night hosts and how biased they are
Mark mentions that one group that is bringing us back is the stand up comedians
They discuss Bill Maher, Seinfeld and Joe Rogan
Mark brings up Jordan Peterson as a great civil discourse practitioner
Mark bring in RFKJr and Tulsi Gabard
Jim brings up the women of The View and Mark talks about how people love to stir shit. Bad news sells
Mark makes a suggestion to the audience about being more intentional regarding being civil
He says we spend too much energy on winning and convincing
Jim recommends not using people’s names. He likes the blue red team approach. He also recommends not watching the news and just repeating talking points
Mark recommends to not react to new things immediately. Wait, pause. Allow for context to be discovered
Don’t make assumptions and get context
Jim says you often have to simply stop talking about it
Change takes place over time, not in one conversation
Mark introduces the topic of people being coachable and referable
Jim tells the story of a young man he knows and attending his wedding
He goes back a few years when this young man was just starting out and shares how he introduced him to his future boss because he was coachable, referable and persistent. Jim says he still, to this day, tries to be coachable
Mark says team sports is great fodder for stories
Mark shares his story about his daughter asking to speak with him about recruiting
She was coachable and referable. His interview was 2 hours and fantastic and at the end she decided she didn’t want to be a recruiter. He goes on to talk about his perspective on people being coachable or not
Mark talks about his friend who can’t have lunch without looking at his phone and how he unconsciously decided to not refer him to others because of the risk that might not bring his full attention to the introduction
Jim is reminded of somebody at the wedding saying “it’s all about who you know” and how that is helpful, but not enough…you have to be coachable, referable and persistent
Mark talks about nepotism and and the absence of coachability and referability.
Jim says he won’t refer people just because they ask or are family or friends
Jim shares a story about another kid who he had to stop helping because he wasn’t coachable
Jim asks Mark for examples from his recruiting profession
Mark talks about coaching people in the interview process and the topics of compensation and setting expectations at the end of the interview
Jim laughs at how many people disregard his advice
Mark says polite persistence is a positive attribute
Jim talks about the power of questions and listening way more than you talk 80/20
Mark completely agrees and says opened ended are the way to go
Mark also says questions are the best way to disagree with someone too
Jim takes us back to the kid at the wedding and says he manifested his beautiful life by being coachable, referable and persistent
Mark says these skills are lifelong and we should constantly work on getting better
Jim shares his story about working with patent attorneys
He emphasizes the importance of working with great clients
Removing the friction
Mark shares his story about changing auto mechanics and why we pay experts that know stuff we don’t know
Jim shares his perspective about his gardener and how is so referable and never lets Jim down. He is ultimately referable
Mark shares the feeling of satisfaction of having referred someone and having that person come through
Be more coachable, be referable and be persistent
Mark introduces the topic of self identity in the context of how people feel their story about who they are and what they do
Jim chimes in with a story about the event he attended that generated our topic for today
At the event they did a “speed dating” like exercise where one of the questions was “what do you do?”
Cool story. Jim found that changed his answer as he learned by practicing with 40 or 50 people
He identified as a podcaster and found that people were very interested in his podcasting story
His other favorite question was “what is the best advice you’ve ever received?”
“Water your own grass”. Grass always looks greener…
Mark liked it because it makes you think
Jim also found that when asked, most people were happy doing what they were doing
Mark has found otherwise in his recruiting and staffing career
Both guys suspect it might be circumstantial
Mark talks about his perspective based on his staffing experience
Mark reflects on asking yourself that question…what do you do and then says most people struggle with answering and provide little to no context
Jim shares the wrinkle that everyone was on the clock. They had 5 minutes to answer…speed dating…
Jim proposes that he and Mark try the exercise on themselves. Both guys struggle and have fun with the exercise. What do you do for money…or just what do you do
Mark talks about being asked for a bio and the fear and confusion that request drums up
Jim shares that he has begun to identify as a “podcaster”. “It’s part of who I am”
Both guys agree that podcasting has made them better at everything else they do
Jim talks about what he does as projects. I do projects
Mark describes himself as a teacher, coach, agent
Jim asks Mark what he does and Mark answers and the guys go back and forth
Jim likes the word “agent” and feels that everyone needs an agent
Mark says objectivity is critical in being an effective agent
Jim says it also depends on who is asking the question
Mark likes the speed dating concept. Time is ticking
Mark begins all of his consulting with “what do you do”. He likes “what does that mean”. He tells his story about helping his girlfriends daughter
Mark thinks people don’t practice their story because we think it’s our story and we can obviously tell their own story. Jim brings up the value of having an agent again
Mark thinks anybody you can trust can be helpful, but Jim thinks we should stay away from friends and family
Mark says it’s critical to be paying someone for advice because skin in the game makes a difference
Both guys also think context is critical
Mark shares his technique for crafting a good story in three parts. The long story (interview), the elevator pitch and the tag line
Jim shares that he gravitated to the word “inventor”. I’m an inventor…
Jim critiques Mark’s response and Mark shares the evolution of his story identity
Professional development is where he arrived
Jim shares his story/identity evolution
Mark also likes the idea of putting people on the clock when crafting their story
Jim shares the judgement he felt at the start and gained confidence as he practiced
Jim makes a great point about the importance of how people introduce you to strangers. How would describe me to others?
Mark loves the speed dating idea to kick off a networking event
Mark recommends crafting and polishing your story for everyone
He recommends shooting for clarity
Jim talks about his father and his professional story. Mark does the same and talks about their generation how they were discouraged to brag about themselves
Jim says we live in a different time now where everyone seems to be building a brand
Mark talks about the self doubt monster pops up
Mark ends with a suggestion about focusing on clarity and recording yourself
Jim says get comfortable with your words and certainty. It’s not a one man job
Mark introduces the topic of friendships between men and shares how it came from our friend Jeff’s annual golf outing
He connects it to the wheel and the Harvard study of men which concludes that men thrive based on the number and depth of their friendships
Jim appreciates the fact that we’re coming up on 60 episodes
He shares his opinion of male relationships. How they change over time and how guys used to do things with only other men
Jim talks about how some friendships ships die out and others go away and come back
Mark brings up how his mentor and he lost touch for 2t years and recently reconnected. He says time is a challenge
Mark brings up his recent meeting with one of his best friends…who hates Donald Trump
Jim has a friend who feels the same way
They talk about disagreement versus personal insult
Mark reinforces the mission of the podcast - a place for men to talk about anything
Jim says technology has isolated and divided us and we’re all starving for human interaction
Jim says boys play and girls pretend and the guys talk about competition and dopamine. What happens when things come to an end
Mark talks about how we all have hardships in common over time and how helpful it is to have others to talk to about the hard stuff
Jim brings up alignment. Mind body and spirit calibrated…How important it is for him to start his day doing thing to calibrate and align himself
Mark talks about his morning routine and reflects back on his meet up with his buddy
Jim brings up the law of attraction and the “coincidence” of his mentor reentering his life
Mark brings up his relationship with God
Both guys reflect on their friends gold outing and how much realignment took place then
Jim tells a story about a recent consulting gig client and an aligned text message exchange
Mark says when you put in the work, coincidences occur
We move people with energy and it can be positive or negative
Mark tells a story about walking away from a friendship
Jim chimes in about walking away and self awareness
Mark talks more about the friendship he walked away from
Jim reminds us how important it is to be around positive people
Mark brings up happiness and fulfillment in the context of needing to reconnect with a couple of friends. . There is risk of disappointment. Mark shares a friend story of redemption
Mark talks about how he was lacking during his divorce. Jim gives Mark credit for the self reflection
Both guys agree to reconnect with 2 old friends as a challenge to everyone
Mark Introduces the topic for this episode - Traditions. He contextualizes it as connected to worldview as traditions are often cultural. The guys arrived at the topic talking about Jim’s annual high school football team barbecue he holds at his house and has for 17 years in a row
Jim also connects it to our childhood where our worldview begins to form
Jim shares his appreciation for what the football program did for him. He thinks that without football it
Very easily could have been bad - prison like his two cousins
He goes on to tell the story of how it all started - an incredible story
And a book called “The Season Of Life” which spoke to the issue of building men for others
Tradition, continuity , belonging and creating an environment to thrive
Jim talks more about how successful the program has been now that many former players have come back to coach and participate
And how beneficial the whole program has been in the wider circle of people who are touched by the program
Mark supports the notion of tradition and real masculinity…not toxicity. Way more than just football
Jim talks about the timing and the spirit and the excitement. It brings everyone together for a common cause
Mark talks about how men are shaped at an early age. Good choices or bad choices. The importance of a mentor and how difficult life is without one
Jim shares his perspective of living in a 1% area and driving to the 99% area and the difference in access to resources and support. He shares his appreciation for learning how to compete
Then he talks about how this competitiveness is helpful in life in general. Unity and camaraderie
50% divorce rate and how many boys grow up without a father…how important the football coach becomes in that situation
Jim thinks we’ve forgotten young men and even emasculated them
Mark agrees that Jim’s life could have really gone south
Jim talks about how many different roles there are in making this tradition stick and then flourish
He then talks about the importance of belonging to something
Mark talks about pushing back on human nature and how important it is to NOT do that, particularly in regard to masculinity
Jim talks about the goal of the program and shares stats on graduation rates and the trouble that creates. Kids that participate in sports graduate at much higher rates
He’s preparing young men for the last whistle and the last bell. We’re not preparing them for life
Mark talks about his career and coaching his own kids after high school. Then he brings up Mike Rowe and the trades
Jim reflects on his high school graduation and the massive shift and void
Mark shares his high school experience in contrast to Jim’s. Winning and losing is infectious/contagious
Jim tells his “Nobody runs on Hayward” story
Mark talks about his family tradition around military and fighter pilots
Mark puts Jim’s program in perspective of how impactful it is
Jim shares the two messages he delivers to the kids at the barbecue. Showing up and “no rules” no incident speech. The power of trusting and empowering back. The following morning his talk is about showing up and being prepared and “Don’t wish it was easier, wish you were better”. Boys blame others, men take responsibility. Be so good they can’t ignore you. It’s not what happens to you, it’s how you respond to what happens to you
Mark appreciates the work and Jim talks about how deep these relationships have grown
Jim feels that the best players aren’t always the most successful. It’s the second stringers
Mark thinks the more talented you are, the less likely you are to work hard
Belonging, routine, structure, hierarchy and honor. If you don’t get this in one place, you’ll find it somewhere else. He mentions gangs
Mark encourages listeners to seek out opportunities to help young men
Jim brings up Scott Galloway and his work with young men
Mark mentions example of places to go to help young men
Jim recommends the progress and trust are built up over time. What you can do immediately is help the coaches. Thank them. Bring a team meal. Little gestures go a long way
Mark shares his experience working with homeless kids for three years
You might even get more out of the experience than the kids
Jim ends with leaving the public side of this work and went off the radar
Mark says your efforts need to be authentic to be effective
Mark starts off with some context about what our podcast is all about. Sharing opinions and experiences with men to help them live a more fulfilled life
He introduces the topics of self-regret and self narrative and hopes for some humorous angles
Jim brings up the wheel and how we always start with self awareness
He talks about the power of reading the definitions. He says if you don’t have regrets you aren’t very self aware “the most important conversation you’ll ever have is the one you have with yourself”
Mark says regret and a bad narrative can eat you alive if you aren’t aware of it’s power. He says seeking blame is regressive
Jim talks about learning from regrets and mistakes. It’s not what happens to you, it’s how you respond to what happens to you. I’d rather die trying than live with the regret of not trying
Mark says it’s a balancing act between self awareness and misery. Your inner voice is powerful…one way or another
Jim shares how he is often angry at himself and tries to be careful not protecting that on others
Mark shares the work he’s doing on his own narrative around his future self and how at ease he feels. His friends have noticed
Mark shares his regret about not firing his divorce attorney sooner
Jim asks to break it down and offers his own story…helping someone else instead of himself
Mark gives his example about multiple choice quizzes in school
Mark shares how scared and angry he was during his divorce and how it clouded his judgement
Jim calls it trauma - flight, fight or freeze
Don’t wish it was easier, wish you were better
Jim cites opportunities exist in the learning from the regret or mistake
Mark shares some sports related regrets and how easy it would have been to hang on.
Jim shares his opinion about sports in his life
They both share the cultures they were around. Jim’s as winning and Mark’s was losing
Jim talks about asking for help, not asking, asking the wrong people…
Mark puts his divorce in perspective and see’s the wonderful side of it - his three kids
Mark shares his formula for a solid self narrative
If you want to be successful, notice your successes
The guys agree that we have a hard time noticing our success
Jim talks about gratitude
Meditation and living in the present
Mark share his morning meditation today and he was all over the place but able to come back to present
Mark shares a conversation with his younger brother about his divorce regarding how well he handled it
Jim quotes - All comparison leads to misery
Mark talks about how comparison is in your face now all day thru social m media. You have to be careful
Jim talks about being cautious about putting yourself out there on social media
Nobody really wants to know how good you’re doing
Mark talks about observations and assessment not what you’ve done
Jim says people remember how you make them feel and Reminds us that it’s better to be kind than nice
Jim tells a story about his friend regarding…has the world changed or is it the stage of life we are at. We’re running out of time and you don’t want to waste it on people with bad energy…or politics
Mark agrees it’s both. What he sees missing today is accountability
People are doing things wrong today and not getting in trouble
Mark ends with “I don’t know waaayyy more than I know”
Mark introduces the topic and explains that he and Jim will be guided in this episode by an article Jim read in Fast Company. Here’s a link to the article
Mark suggests personal branding begins with self reflection
Jim enters with reference to the self and self promotion in specific. He shares his opinion about self promotion and how society feels very different about personal branding. Then he takes us around the flywheel and the 5 areas of life
Then Jim focuses in on worldview and asks whether one’s worldview should be part of a personal brand
Mark shares his views about being entrepreneurs and personal brands. He says he’s always branded himself and presented to the world his personal strengths. He tells a story about his last employer who purchased his company told him not to sell himself, but to sell her brand. He expands on his view of this
Jim starts to share the main points of the article which are common myths about personal branding
#1 is that it’s selfish
Both guys share that they were raised not to brag and self promote
If we don’t brand ourselves then we get branded by others.
Mark tells his story about breaking out from imposter syndrome and his journey into branding himself
#2 It’s loud and obnoxious. Mark talks about his sales journey and helping people sell themselves
Jim cites the choices of being an influencer or a thought leader. Mark has chosen thought leader and shares his position on selling
Jim says he’s recently committed to his own personal brand
#3 It’s fake and disingenuous. Mark talks about how he was raised to be polite and respectful and being authentic
#4 It’s only for senior leaders and C suite executives. Both guys agree that this is no longer the case. Mark talks about a current client and the team he is working with
Jim reads a bit from the article
Mark goes back to worldview and shares his opinion on sharing his politics online as part of his brand
Jim shares his view of bringing politics into any conversation with someone outside his circle of friends…particularly here in Northern California
Mark goes into his politics and says either way is ok if you’re prepared for the consequences. He’s decided to go all in and be transparent about his views and how he responds with what he thinks is practical
The guys disagree on this issue
Jim thinks it’s not worth discussing politics with those on the fringe, right or left
Mark takes a different stance
Mark wishes everyone, including Trump would stop calling people names..it’s childish
Jim agrees and says it was funny and now it’s sad
Mark doesn’t care about the person, but only what they stand for
Mark talks about the power of questions and his experience speaking civily with people who are opposed to his views
Mark runs around the wheel again in the context of how he begins client sessions with deep personal questions
Jim identifies that Mark spent his entire career helping people grow their personal brand
Jim is curious about Mark’s experience with this
Mark frames it in the context of aligning the candidates worldview and the company culture
Mark share his story about the prospect with the BLM LinkedIn profile banner
The guys have a chuckle
Mark talks about how important a LinkedIn profile is in the personal branding journey
Jim asks Mark who should help you write your LinkedIn profile
Mark shares his answer
Mark introduces the topic of expectations. Setting and managing them with others
We succeed and we fail doing both
He says we do a poor job of being specific and clear and recalibrating as things evolve
Jim says ww are “wound up” in the existing political environment. We expect the politicians to be civil and honest…and they’re not. They throw rocks at each other
Mark identifies that he and Jim have taken different position. Jim chooses to remain quiet and Mark chooses to speak up. He cites the difference between thinking, knowing and emoting. We are treating them as the same
Jim takes us around the wheel and our 5 areas of life and how different women and men are regarding expectations
Mark talks about his relationships with his grandmothers and how different they were. Then he talks about his mom and sister
Then he talks about his kids
Jim shares that everyone struggles with expectations. We project things from our relationships on to others. He also thinks we have set expectations about women that they can “have it all”. It’s not possible
Mark says when you choose one thing you sacrifice another. No one can “have everything”. It’s an unreal expectation
Mark talks about his daughters and his mom again. His mom lived with regret and his girls struggle with confusion…what is a man? What is the expectation?
He brings up JD Vance and his cat lady comment. He asks what is wrong with being a stay at home mom? We need to change our expectations about being a mom
Jim brings up Esther Perel and her writings about relationships. She says our expectations about relationships are incorrect
Mark talks about having different expectations inside a marriage
Jim says where we are now in marriages has evolved away from the way it used to be. Married to one person and in a romantic relationship with another. Marriage was a contract
Mark says expectations change and we have to change behavior. He shares some info on his marriage/divorce. He talks about his ex wife’s father and her expectations of him based on her father’s behavior
Mark says things broke down when communication stopped
Jim asks Mark about his current relationship with his girlfriend
They talk about men and women and their differences. In a relationship what matters is what those two people think about. Most people don’t take the time to air out their differences before marriage and exchange/agree to the compromises
Episode 7 Immigration
Mark introduces the topic of immigration and draws a thick line between legal and illegal immigration. He’s very pro immigration and very much opposed to illegal immigration. He says there are many different lenses to look through at this issue
Jim jumps in and identifies that this topic falls into worldview on our flywheel. He mentions that Europe and in particular Italy are wrestling with open borders too. It’s impacting culture and religious beliefs. Jim has seen this while traveling
Mark agrees and brings up his brother who has been flying as for 35 years. He mentions Paris specifically
Jim agrees and doesn’t remember Paris being like this years ago. Crime, homelessness and garbage
Mark thinks we abuse the word compassion and distinguishes between those that are fleeing bad circumstances and those who are criminals
Jim takes it even further and suggests that illegals are stealing our resources while legal immigrants and citizens suffer. Jim shares that California just passed a law giving free healthcare to illegals. What about us?
Mark shares that Jim’s experience comes from international travel around his sports background. Mark helped many immigrants with visas and green cards during his staffing career
Mark gives more context to his experience. Legal immigrants are the most opposed to illegal immigration
Jim talks about his grandparents and how they strived to be American first, Mexican and Italian second. He also says that culture might come with them, but not necessarily religion. Some are escaping religious persecution
Mark mentions that we all came here escaping persecution from British rule. He says crime is now increasing in non border towns and if say anything about illegal immigrant crime you’re called a racist
Mark also mentions his two worst trends coming from this beyond crime. Sex trafficking and Fentanyl
Jim asks to take the conversation positive and asks Mark to share his immigration experience helping immigrants who wanted to stay get visas and eventually green cards
Mark goes into great detail about a program he ran helping graduates from other countries get jobs and financial assistance with their green cards after 3 years
Both guys agree that these immigrants have strong appreciation for America and are n to shy about showing it
Both guys agree “we don’t have a country without them”
Then the guys move into a discussion about what happens when you give free stuff to illegal immigrants…or anyone for that matter
Mark connects the entitlement issue with defunding police and liberal DAs..recipe for disaster
Jim pulls the conversation back to positive and Mark tells the story about a new home being built right next to him and his positive interaction with the crew. All immigrants
Jim brings up the Irish in the first part of the 20th century and Mark, being from Boston chimes in
He brings up the notion of people (legal an d illegal) who are “well intentioned”
Mark says we should figure out who is well intoned and whose not earlier in the process and then asks, if Trumps wins, how’s he gonna get the criminals out. Also how many legal immigrants can we absorb fro a resources standpoint. Then brings up the condition of the “sanctuary cities” and how over run they are now…oops
Mark bring back up his experience in Boston with the Italians and Irish communities
Jim suggest that kids born here of illegal parents.. What do we do with the kids. It’s a tough topic to figure out
Mark says both sides need to talk, even if only about the Fentanyl and the kids
Jim then tells his two immigration stories about a few people he helped and their circumstances
One was a girl from Venezuela and her friend who came here illegally as a kid so he has no papers and thus cannot travel outside the country
The other was about the captain of the USA Olympic rugby 7’s team who Jim helped get papers so he could leave the country
He then remembers a third story helping some Tongan kids with papers who as a result couldn’t get scholarships. Both ended up playing D1 and degrees
Mark says the bottom line, the system is broken and we’re not doing anything other than fighting over it
Ellis Island comes up as an example of a decent system
Jim notes that we’re not having enough babies and the system doesn’t work without enough people. Immigrants really help with this problem
Both guys agree that both sides of the aisle seem to want to keep this a their own blunt intstrument in the political races
Jim exposes the Democrat’s “immigration” bill that the Republicans didn’t sign it…it was full of Ukraine money
Mark says conflict sells ads and likes.
Mark ends with this is complex, but it needs to b e fixed
Mark introduces the two topics for today and how closely they are connected
Self accountability and life changing events
The Trump assassination attempt and the selection of his VP running mate
Mark reminds the audience of the fly wheel framework and the idea that both guys lean conservative. Mark more so than Jim
Jim jumps in ands goes into more detail about the wheel and the 5 areas of life
Jim identifies the Trump assassination as clearly a life changing event
Jim thinks self awareness is by far the most important human trait there is. He feels like if you are self aware, it’s highly likely you’ll be happier and more fulfilled
Mark describes Trump’s new attitude…calmer, less brazen. Jim agrees. Mark says the event triggered an analysis of self accountability. A complete absence of it
Mark says an event of this magnitude will remain under scrutiny for a while and hopefully time and context will bring truth. The investigation is ongoing. He cites the statement by the head of the Secret Service…”the buck stops with me”
Jim redirects toward the current administration and expresses his frustration with their complete lack of performance
Mark suggest that the Biden admin team is now having their hypocrisy thrown back in their faces
Mark cites his research of the statements of 4 or 5 special forces snipers that leads him to conclude this was one of two things…the government was in on it, or the Secret Service is broken
Jim says he wants accountability for the lie that is the mental condition of Joe Biden…the years and months leading up to the shooting
Mark says the depth and breadth of this deception is unique
Jim talks about the debate, subsequent interviews and the cover up
Even the media and others who have come out with the current truth have not acknowledged their previous lies
Mark says the rats are running at each other
Mark brings up JD Vance and shares some things he’s learned about him. Mark is looking forward to learning more
Jim says he’s not a “Trumper”…but he thinks JD represents the best of America and stands on his merits, not his collar or gender
Mark shares some more details with Jim about JD. He went to law school with Viviek R
Vance is also military and business savvy
Marks it seems that he’s the real deal
Mark shares Elon Musk’s recent claim to be giving millions to the RNC campaign
Mark shares that he’s not a Republican, he’s a pragmatist
Jim shares his family’s different positions on Trump. He feels like if you put the man aside and talk policy, it’s a no brainer
Jim’s looking forward to the fresh new talent and he gives Trump credit for not selecting based on skin color or gender. He also speaks about Trump’s fortitude
He brings up RFK Jr and his most recent new security detail
Jim ask’s Mark about his own life changing events and Marl shares a few of his…funny
Little league, getting in to Notre Dame and nodding a scholarship on his dad’s behalf
Then Jim shares a few of his “events”. The “I can’t” story, getting embarrassed reading in front of the class, high school football and his community college rejection
Mark responds to Jim’s responses to his events and how it built his fortitude and resilience. Showing up and being prepared
Marks says personal accountability leads to happiness and fulfillment..authenticity
We give people second chances all the time, but people still look for blame
Mark says life is a meritocracy. DEI comes up and Mark says it’s falling apart. The ex president needed to almost die for this to be exposed
Jim shares his distaste for victimhood. Why do these victims choose to give their power away? He blames Biden and his cronies for this, in pursuit of power and control
Mark praises Trumps response to being shot and how the choice for president is a no brainer
Mark says the ships starting to turn faster
Who is going to claim responsibility or get caught
Jim ends with Biden being the victim. Mark says there is nothing authentic about him
Think about something you can take responsibility for today…it’ll make you feel better about yourself
Mark starts off setting the stage for his most recent ex-wife encounter. Both guys see numerous lessons to be learned from Mark’s encounter the other day and decided to record their conversation as an episode
Mark sets the stage for the discussion by giving the event some historical context
He describes his emotional state and gives a few details of the actual event - sitting in front of a judge
Jim makes a great point - one of the reasons w decided to air this is that 50% of our audience will have to deal with divorce in some capacity - we thought it might be very helpful
Jim starts by going around the wheel and this event touches all 5 areas and the center (self)
Mark adds a timeline and additional historical context to the core event - his divorce
Jim brings up narcissism and they discuss that component of Mark’s ex
Mark says you can’t change people. He talks about her unwillingness to look inside
He also makes the point that you have to rid yourself of people who suck energy from you and how challenging that can be
Jim thinks we can’t change much except how we react to things
They both bring our current political situation into the discussion because it’s directly related
Mark reflects on good and bad energy and the physical manifestation of this stress
Jim takes Mark around the wheel
Money - how she used money as a weapon
Mark shares details of what she did to his career and a story about theft
Mark shares some details about his children and their struggle with anxiety. We work on it together
Worldview is next. Mark talks about his connection with God and his religious journey
Jim brings up Mark’s relationship with his mom, which he’s shared before
Jim says we are “conditioned” when we’re young. Mark shares his thoughts on his mom and the comparison to his ex.
Mark shares a story about his ex and her inability to accept responsibility for anything. If you agreed with me you immediately became her enemy
Jim asks how much was “attention”
Mark suggests the marriage fell apart because of her inability to accept responsibility or communicate
Mark brings up his ex’s childhood - very bad
Jim brings up a woman’s relationship with her own father
Mark compares his ex and his current love regarding their relationships with their fathers
Mark talks about self accountability and owning your life
Jim brings back politics and society as it relates to Mark’s ex
Jim brings our current president into the discussion.
Mark says he’s not in charge. He’s not sure if Biden knows what’s going on
Jim asks what audacity and is she just that
Mark shares his opinion on how good marriages get through hard times
They worked on themselves first
Jim shares how he’s worked on himself and how he shares our framework in his daily conversations
Mark shares how he never gave up and how his children helped him
Mark shares his Bill Burr’s “hitting women” joke
Mark starts to wrap up and shares some takeaways
Internal work and modifying his routines with age to keep up the work
You have to get negative people out
Life is good. Everything is a choice
You can’t change people
Jim says gratitude is the key and it takes work
Mark agrees and shares his gratitude exercise
Jim bring up growing bitter or better
Mark ends with his LinkedIn message story (she sent one after) and Jim notes that she was doing all the things she was accusing Mark of
Mark introduces the topic of mentorship
Jim reflects on the difference between being nice and kind. Real mentorship requires telling people things they need to hear but maybe don’t want to. He refers to some of the work Mark is doing, in part holding people accountable. Jim says showing up, prepared and consistently is huge
Mark agrees. He brings in communication and how social media and technology have revolutionized the way we communicate…and not for the better. Mark says people are confused about accountability and compassion.
Jim says it’s easier to be critical online than face to face. Mark agrees enthusiastically
Mark asks Jim to share the story that shared before the recording that prompted the topic of mentorship
Jim shares his recent encounter with a young man he’s known for 15 years and has mentored. How their interactions have evolved with some tough honesty. It started 15 years ago with a golf tournament and ended up raising #240,000,000 to rebuild three high school athletic facilities
He suggests that even the coaches need coaches. He reflects on mentoring kids for the last Beelzebub’s and the last whistle. How important sports are for teaching kids about life. He’s now able to see kids from 15 years ago become men. Mark marvels at Jim’s impact
Jim reflects on the political components of his mentorship and also that anyone can do anything they want in this country if they learn how to compete
Mark reflects on his feeling of obligation to be kind in the moment when you encounter anyone. That a small gesture or comment can change someone’s life
Jim agrees and reminds us this holds true for people closest to us as well. Jim says its the mans job to step up and be the bad guy. He asks Mark about this in the context of his divorce
Mark talks about disagreeing kindly with his daughters and how that increases their respect for him. He says “no” is one of the most important words a parent can use for 16 or so years:)
Jim brings up another quote, “I’d rather be feared than liked” and then he adds the context what is meant by the word “feared”
Mark shares the origin of “being feared” in his opinion…the Bible
Jim agrees and then contextualizes his spirituality
Mark attributes a saying to Jordan Peterson about living by the Ten Commandments even without believing in God
Mark reflects on his current client and how he works closely with people personally. In doing so he’s uncovered how many things that young people don’t know and how important sharing wisdom while mentoring them
Jim agrees and adds that this I also exaggerated by how much information is coming at us today versus years ago. So much info coming SO fast
Mark explains how he vets things in the current noisy environment
Jim brings up the recent presidential debate…can you blame them (the young) for being confused
Mark says he hopes it will wake people up who have been swallowing the nonsense from “whoever you are” and start to questions those in power
Jim piles on and Mark says “If you didn’t see that for what it was, shame on you”
He asks Jim again to tell his story about the young man he recently met with to reset their relationship with candor. He identifies with this young man’s full plate, but also how capable he is. They met for dinner to address their relationship. Jim used our wheel and brought up being your best self. He shares details about his students responsibilities and challenges. He was kind and not nice. Jim shares his recognition about getting older and “running out of time” and how his program is now beginning to bring in even younger kids and it’s really working…now with 15 years of evidence
Mark observes that this approach has ripple effects
Jim is appreciative of Mark’s perspective, in particular, the families of these young kids
He then brings up his annual cookouts at his house and how they haven’t missed one in 15 years and how the kids benefit from this shrining example of consistency and continuity
Jim then reflects on growing up where he did and with whom he did and how it shaped his work ethic and his own approach to showing up
Mark shares hi story about his son coming out of addiction, blossoming and the notion of him being a role model. The importance of modeling in mentorship
Jim gets clear on how important it is to have an agent. Everybody needs one to see things they can’t
Jim reflects on when he and Mark first met to map the IMC plan out. He mentions
The guys reflect o a program they both participated in over the weekend and the phrase “don’t die with your music inside you” and how we have an obligation to share what we know
The guys are building a program and it isn’t quite done yet, but it will definitely be some wisdom shared for a price
Our service will be essentially customizing our experience and wisdom to help men lead better lives
Mark introduces the topic - apologizing. He says too many people are apologizing too often
Mark reads the definition
Jim counters with thinking it’s a trigger for him. He brings up a conversation he just had with a 30 something and how he said he was sorry over and over…to the point that it was totally inauthentic
He was regretting things he said and did
Mark agrees about authenticity being critical. He says too many people apologize for offending groups
Jim says “This not an excuse, it’s an explanation”. I’d like to explain what happened
The difference between an apology and an explanation
Mark says context is missing from conversation
Jim says you should save apologies for when you really mean them. When you’ve reflected and given thought to what you may have said or done
Mark says if the apology doesn’t feel difficult, then don’t do it. It needs to feel difficult
Jim ponders when to accept or not accept an apology. He is anticipating a call later today with a friend who is in an overwhelming state. This guy says sorry too much and Jim wonders whether to confront his friend or not. He wonders if h should let his friend “get away with it
Mark says it’s important to start off conversation on a positive note and then get candid, but with kindness
It’s approach and timing
Mark rereads the definition of apology. Definition number 3…excuses
Jim thinks apology is different than an explanation and different than an excuse
Jim appreciates when people take responsibility and also consider how to keep this same thing from happening again. An opportunity to get better
People that say sorry all the time are dangerous. Our word is everything. Our integrity
Jim thinks social media and technology have made communication m ore difficult…ironically
Mark talks about how many words have lost their meaning. Racism and Nazi and sorry
Jim recounts a Father’s Day event about the racism comment. He says,” tell me what you think that means”. Both guys agree that we need to be more careful with words and make sure both parties agree on the meaning of words before discussing them
Mark brings up patriarchy as another word being abused
Jim adds the word “literally’. Mark agrees it’s a “filler” word, unnecessary and irrelevant
He adds the accountability that’s missing in communication. You have to call out these abusers of words
Mark brings up the phrase “toxic masculinity” and how people want apologies for this too. Mark says “fuck that”
Mark talks about people in the public domain who are forced to apologize
Jim asks Mark to look up “dignity” and the guys both agree that apologizing without authenticity forces someone to give up his dignity
Mark brings up the leadership training he’s doing now and how much of an issue this apology thing is in corporate America. Jim agrees
Mark suggests that the person on the receiving end of the apology needs to call out inauthentic apology
Jim says there are situations when you just have to remain quiet or you’ll get “kicked out of the club”
Mark says it’s important to pick your spots. What am I going to gain from calling someone out? You gotta read the room and you have to maintain your integrity
Give some thought to what you are trying to accomplish. Be authentic and work toward some type of benefit or progress
Jim says sometimes it’s tough to balance authenticity with empathy
Mark talks about people misinterpreting him and then brings up the exception of his two daughters. Jim calls him on it they have a laugh
Jim brings back up the importance of the meaning of words. Both guys agree that clarifying what a word or topic means before discussing it is critical for clarity
Mark goes back to his daughters and uses the word feminism as an example
Jim says the meaning of words can be generational. Mark agrees there is nuance to the meaning of certain words
Mark brings up Juneteenth and both guys have fun making fun
He says he sees a trend where we’re teaching people that being over sensitive makes you better person somehow
Both guys are put off by the victimhood connect to the apology issue
Mark says the media portrays a different world than the one he lives in
Jim talks about some of the things we can apologize to ourselves about
Mark thinks it’s more about forgiving yourself and then they put things in the context of career
The guys bring in the 5 areas of life from the wheel and Jim talks specifically about money
Jim also says that some people simply expect to be forgiven. They think they’ll get a “pass”
Both guys agree we should apologize less and pause to think before we apologize
Mark introduces the topic of self doubt
He places it in health/mental health category on the wheel
Mark talks about waking up “awash” in self doubt yesterday and he wrote about it to help pull him out of it
First he went through with his morning routine and was still bummed out..so he wrote about it
Jim says self doubt is normal and anyone who doesn’t get it every so often isn’t striving
Jim talks about how middle age produces doubts about what might have been
Jim shares his bout with depression and then brings in the wheel and how self doubt touches all areas of life
Mark says it can be event driven and he mentions his divorce and brings up other circumstances
Jim connects self worth to self doubt
The guys talk about moving on…moving past it
Mark brings up sports and aging
Jim mentions how players become coaches to keep getting that dopamine hit
Jim says leaving a company has the same impact
Mark brings up empty nest syndrome and then identifies his solution is internal. Looking inside and not focusing on external circumstances
Jim says that you can’t care too much about what other people say
Mark talks about learning how to be humble and the rebuilding that can take place if you choose it
Jim says in order to be human you to have humility…then you can serve others with empathy and compassion. These are better humans
Mark talks about judging people by the way they present outwardly. He mentions the PGA pro that recently killed himself
A lot of people who are miserable, present as happy
Mark says we see 2 things in the media…tragedy and overbite success. We never see the striving. The work
Jim’s quote “I wish my enemies all their success”. Because is you achieve major success, you have sacrificed a lot. Everything has a price
Success can be lonely
Mark tells his father’s Navy wings story. WTF do I do now
Same thing as retirement - want to stop using that term. It’s negative instead of…what’s the next awesome thing
Jim brings up “rebranding”. More possible than ever before. Technology and coaching
Rebranding is a total choice
Mark brings back up empty nest. Jim says he didn’t experience that. Everyone experiences this differently
Mark talks about his unique experience being both mom and dad…he didn’t see it coming
Mark says self doubt is the absence of self worth
Jim brings up ego. You have to put ego aside and that’s not easy. Being alone…no more feedback
Mark wonders why Jim didn’t feel the empty nest
Mark explains how he forgave himself and how freeing it was. If God forgives, why can’t we forgive ourselves
Jim talks about the self - words
Mark reads the definitions of self doubt and self compassionate
Mark talks about looking inward and not comparing to others…misery
Jim says happiness is overrated. Being fulfilled is better
Learning new things and striving to be better is the way to go
Mark suggests taking your new found humility…turning it into empathy and reaching out to help
Timing has to align in order to be well received with your offer of help
Jim summarizes his position on "recalibrating the soul"
Mark introduces the topic of thought leadership and connects it directly with critical thinking
He reads the Wikipedia definition and then connects it to the profession area in our flywheel
Mark says anyone who self identifies as such is not a thought leader. The market needs to determine that
Jim jumps in and brings up Jordan Peterson. He then connects back to our flywheel and the other 4 areas of life
Jim then brings up AI and the timeliness of our topic
He differentiates between “Big” and “Small” AI. He suggests people will be increasingly creating small customized AI’s for different use cases
Mark expresses some doubts about AI because on the back end is a human with bias
Mark brings Jordan Peterson back up
Jim brings up Joe Rogan and the View
Mark says he thinks to be a thought leader you have to also be a critical thinker. He wonders if people are being thoughtful and unbiased in their responses or are they simply emoting?
Mark brings up Bill Maher
Jim supports that Jordan Peterson is credentialed and experience in various sciences and topics. He separates the View as a business…entertainment
Mark gos a bit deeper into Peterson varied area of expertise
Jim recalls his live experience with Jordan and how diverse the audience was
Mark brings up JP’s son and daughter
He thinks JP was never intending to be rich or famous and he struggled with fame for a time
Jim brings up Joe Biden and Mark shares his opinion:). Neither has much respect for Joe
Mark suggests that perhaps all thought leaders are polarizing at some level. He goes on to add to what makes a real thought leader and Jim agrees
Mark mentions Martin Luther King and Ghandi
Jim asks Mark for examples oh thought leaders who grew fast and then bottomed out and disappeared. Mark shares a couple of examples but can’t remember names
Then Jim mentions Tony Robbins and Mark shares his opinion that he thinks TR is authentic but only for a certain audience (very troubled people)
The guys explore the cult like nature of TR’s tribe and then suggest there is perhaps cult like vibes to all thought leader followers. His rugby teams, for instance
The guys joke about “self proclaimed” thought leaders versus authentic thought leaders
Jim suggests that they all are narcissistic to some degree
Mark brings up Jim’s evolution from shy and reticent to engage to feeling lost obligated to share. Jim appreciates and expands. We have an obligation to share what we know that can help
They talk about the risk of sharing and exposing yourself to criticism
Jim reflects on his sales career and feels that everything is about persuasion
The evolution is largely based on the accumulation of expertise over time and confidence
Jim warns of the abuse of the power of persuasion
Mark chimes in with the abuses of power
He goes on to agree and then brings up celebrities and Robert Dinero…
Mark says real friends call bullshit on ego players like Dinero
Jim says it’s not what you say as much as what you do. Great leaders model. Like fathers
Jim tells his story about his Japanese assistant and Japanese leadership culture which promotes leadership by action and modeling
Mark brings JP back into the discussion and talks about how he walks his talk
Thought leaders do what they say
Jim tells a story about his friend who adds that people will see how people react to you…something you’ll never see. Mark recalls that good friends do that too…tell you how people react to you
Mark says if you have the ability to help others you are obligated to do so
Jim adds being careful about offering unsolicited advice and he says he’s pulled back
Mark talks about learning how to not conclude, but to observe…discernment
Jim shares his experience last night at a conference where he saw people who were so busy and overwhelmed that they can’t focus on the moment and/or are hypersensitive and teed up
Mark brings up his inner work with SOS and spirituality. Success comes from being bright and loving inside…the outside stuff comes when it’s supposed to. No need to scramble and grind
Mark introduces episode 52 to finish off season 2!
A milestone for the guys. Trying to get the message out to more people
Today’s topic is critical thinking. Mark says we’re lacking in critical thinking as a result of a lack of self awareness
Mark reads the definition from Wikipedia. He likes the one term “unbiased”
Jim jumps in with our flywheel and the 5 areas of life on it
Jim brings up Trump’s convictions
Jim says there aren’t many real critical thinkers and we don’t teach that skill. He suggests that being dyslexic makes him think critical
Mark gives his dad credit for telling him to question everything and Jim calls it a gift
The guys both believe you can respect processes and rules and laws and still question everything
Mark brings up science and climate change - nothing has been decided. Science is discovery
Jim says critical thinking makes us better as people - Our goal for IMC - help people get better
Jim shares his infographic about the factors that go into critical thinking
Research
Listening
Explanation
Flexibility
Fairness
Objectivity
Evaluation
Analysis
Mark identifies the major differences between critical and non critical thinking. He says listening is perhaps the most important of them all
Jim looks for win/win outcomes. What does success look like?
Marks cites the meaning of words and how we bastardize the language and words
Mark says biases are normal but we can put them aside and remain open to learning something new
Jim likes to approach new conversations with “what can I learn?”
Mark says it virtually impossible to know everything about any topic, so flexibility is important
Both guys are a bit mixed on the word “fairness”. What does it mean and who determines what’s fair. Mark says fairness is the journey but not the destination
Jim expresses his distaste for DEI. Mark agrees and thinks it’s going away
Both guys talk about sports in regard to DEI. Jim tells a story about a big conference he attended last week. He loved the conference but didn’t like all the groups people were divided into. Why do we have to separate people into groups? It’s the opposite of inclusive. The worst of elitism.
Mark brings up victimhood. You can’t think critically if you play victim
Mark brings up Pride month and how stupid it is
Jim brings up “the first” and how it should be the best…the first is unnecessary
Mark claims that critical thinking starts all the other dominoes falling. It fixes everything over time
Jim asks if Mark believes people are “Objective”? He says no, but can continuously move back to objectivity. It’s a journey
Jim quotes - To get what you want, give people what they want. You don’t need to get what you want by taking from someone
Mark tells and Dennis Prager tale about marriage and arguments. He says bringing generosity to conversations is effective
Sports come up again and both guys share reflections on winning and losing and how you look at things. How you respond to them. Jim talks rugby
Mark bundles analysis, research and evaluation together. Jim separates them out
Mark says it’s fine to have an opinion…as long as you claim it as such…not a fact…how I feel
Jim says “throw some math at it”
Jim brings up the data/math on black men being killed by white police officers. There is no math to support it. We often decide how we feel and see out numbers to support our opinions
Mark says we need more context and less speculation. He also brings up climate change and “river to the sea”. Do your homework
Jim. mentions the suicide rate of men and the isolation of young men. It’s our mission to help men talk about these difficult things
Mark challenges the audience to a debate
Jim cites the value of facts, data and math. He cites neurodiversity rates in incarcerated men
Mark says there are too many facts used that aren’t actually facts
Mark says the media values being first over being right. He talks about charts and duration and timelines. Timing
They wrap with how do you remain respectful and question everything
The topic remains open
Mark opens his intro with the guys topic of choice for today- Resistance
Jim’s traveling and is in Mexico City. He had some typical travel resistance issues and both guys ran with that and piled on
One caveat is Jim’s sound quality is diminished, but he can be heard just fine
Mark brings up the flywheel and the book Jim brought up, Steven Pressfield’s “The War Of Art”
Mark says he thinks resistance is mostly good with exception of dangerous things and that mitigating risk is a goo idea before just jumping up and pushing back on any and all resistance
Marks bring in his “pause” approach to regain objectivity and context before jumping in
Jim jumps in and refers back to the book and expands on it’s message - “The enemy of creativity is resistance”. Jim says that in his mind resistance is a sign of progress, but it’s hard to know when its progress or danger.
Jim then shares his travel story - Mexico City and the resistance from the line at the airpot to the hotel and then the Uber experience…3 different drivers and the wrong addresses. He asked himself if maybe these were signs that he should consider doing something else. He made the best of it
Mark then tells his Fringe Festival stand-up experience. It wasn’t his vibe but he wanted to support his girlfriend. He shares that relationships bump up against resistance. Compromise and the “20 minute rule”
Jim asks Mark to talk more about “risk” and Mark shares his experience starting his own company. He puts this in context. He brings up his “pause” technique and put’s in some additional context
Jim shares his opinion on pivoting in the face of resistance. Mark agrees and expands
Jim says timing is a big deal in life and how to tell if its the right time or not. Mark agrees
Jim speaks about decisions versus choices. What’s the difference?
Mark shares his interaction with his son about his meditation. About how he chose to react versus how he might have 10 years ago
Jim replays with his hotel noise experience and reaction. Don’t let it get into your head. And once again its about how you respond. Jim turned it into a nice lunch and a few beers
Mark goes back to his stand-up experience from the day before and how he was able to turn it around with the help of his girlfriend and a 7 minute conversation - a new perspective
Both guys agree that resistance is everywhere, all the time and they talk a bit about the different types
Mark brings up the 5 key areas of life and the flywheel. Resistance is in all 5 areas
Jim say traveling is an exercise in handling your response to resistance
The guys reflect on The US versus other countries. They differ a bit about this and that’s a bit interesting
Jim says it’s often challenging to find people to help with communication and how h appreciates people who can speak English as a second language
This leads to our current division and how that’s created different languages within our own language
Mark shares how appreciative people are of trying to the speak the native language of the country you’re in
Then he moves into his public speaking
They wrap it up. Jim’s going to Chicago before returning home
Mark introduces the topic of manifestation and the power of the subconscious mind. Then he brings up the wheel and attaches manifestation to health - mental health
Jim had introduced Dr James Doty having heard him on Lewis Howe’s podcast Mark reads from the show notes to give context to what the guys are about to discuss. Mark mentions the work he’s been doing and throws it to Jim
Jim mentions that he’s been reading and studying about manifestation for years. He talks about adversity and how it’s how you react to it that matters
Jim brings up the wheel and self awareness and lays out the 5 areas of life on our wheel
He references our past and then shares Dr Doty’s past traumas and how he overcame them. Doty mentions a billionaire he met who wasn’t happy in spite of his wealth. Your success doesn’t necessarily make you happy
Mark brings up what the podcast is all about. A forum for men to talk about things they don’t normally talk about
Mark says there’s an interesting balance between fortitude and sharing emotions
He discusses his current program and the picture of him as a 5 year old - see that kid. You are still that kid
Mark then goes into the past and Jim runs with it. We need to figure out how to process the trauma from our past in order to move on
Jim brings up our vibrational influence on the world and others
Mark tells his yoga/vibrational bowls - energy reading
Jim gives context to the vibrations we can put out. That can be good or bad
Jim says happiness should not be the goal. It should be fulfillment. The distinction between happiness, pleasure, joy, service, etc…
Mark says we misuse words like happy and crazy - what do they really mean
Jim shares another point Dr Doty spoke of. We can live in the past, present or future
The present is the goal
Jim shares his dyslexia story and how it shaped his aggressive behavior. He became self aware and has worked on it successfully
Mark shares his visualization practice and some successes that have come from it. Jim compliments Mark and gives him credit for his work and consistency
Jim goes deeper into how he uses manifestation as an inventor
He tells his patent story in the context of vibrations
Mark brings back up Jim’s past, present and future comment and gets into detail about how important processing trauma is - his anger at his ex-wife and his parents “scarcity” vibe as Depression kids
Mark mentions our sage and saboteur The sage would see the great things that came from his divorce. He the talks about worrying about what might happen in the future and how 90% of the things he worried about never happen
Jim brings up his bitter or better concept. He sees a lot of people in pain, projecting that pain in to the world The victim mentality and the negative vibrations that creates
Jim thinks we can help shift that pain to positivity. Marl appreciates his ability to shift people in a better direction
Both guys agree that sometimes you hold people accountable to their negativity and sometimes you don’t. You gotta pick your spots
Jim brings up politics and suggests that talking about it without using names. Not personalizing political discussion. Positive progress can be made. Self awareness comes into play again and questions are great tools to keep discussions civil
Questions are disarming and make people think. Add positive energy and it’s magical
Great leaders create hope for the future vibrationally
Jim asks Mark to remember what moments he was able to vibrate out positivity and change the outcome of a situation
Mark brings up some sports memories and Jim jumps in
Mark shares his Sept 11 work story - how he dismissed his staff for the day and shifted the emotion in the room
Jim shares a story about his friends loss and then his rugby national championship story. He played against doctors orders and raised the energy of his whole team leading to a victory
Mark remembers a Larry Bird and Willis Reed story. Coming back into the game injured and how energy shifted for both teams
Momentum shifts in sports and how quickly they occur…and then it’s game over
Mark shares his takeaways - The past vs the present vs the future and how much influence we have at our disposal if we do the work (meditation, visualization, exercise…)
Jim says it’s all a choice. Negative or positive and the energy in the room
Mark begins with self awareness and the flywheel of life - How we respond to things now versus when we were younger
Jim shares his thoughts on the wheel and self awareness. “We grow bitter or we grow better”
He say we work hard not to grow into the bitter old man
Jim shares his “only in San Francisco” story. Parking meters and silly parking laws. “Only in San Francisco”
Mark comments after laughing about how upside down San Francisco is right now
Jim laughs at how he responded to the crazy - over emotional
Mark gets into the laughter and jokes about San Fran being bizarro world
Mark shares his Honda driving story and how competitive he used to be
Both guys agree that conflict is more dangerous now
Mark - “I used to lose m y shit in my car”
Mark shares his car conflict - “Merry Christmas”
Mark talks about pausing and readdressing how he responds to other drivers now
Jim reflects again on his parking ticket story
They both laugh again at “only in San Francisco”
Mark says “all this shit’s a choice”. You either make your choices or you give your choices away…and that is also a choice
Self awareness makes you happier. You don’t have control over much
Jim says being self aware allows you to calm things down. It’s a sign of good leadership
Both guys think we are moving away from woke and back toward free speech
Mark quotes Scott Galloway’s Ted talk and “Do you love Your Kids”
Jim says our future leaders need to change the narrative - Stop scaring and misleading the kids
M ark says Biden is compromised across the board
Jim says more people are liking Trump because he speaks from his heart - not scripted
Mark says the election is going to be interesting
He says we are getting distracted from root causes and distracted with propaganda
Mark says the Dems are propping up abortion because it works. And there are maybe 10 topics more important than that. Safety, economy, border, etc…
Mark uses “the river to the sea” example. What river? What sea?
Jim had a young man change his perspective about the protests today. The young people today don’t know what they are protesting and many of the protesters are paid agitators
Our young people have been scared, misled and screwed by Covid. There anger and frustration is almost justified. They got a shit sandwich
Mark says it’s still just “other things” and they’re still just choices
Jim brings up the frat boys who raised the flag and then a go-fund me to the tune of half a mil
Mark brings up pausing in response to negative emotions
Jim shares his dinner story with some Disney related folks and how Disney is aggressively moving away from woke. The biggest box offices are pro America movies
Mark says we will continue to hear things that don’t make sense while Biden is still in office
Mark talks about the value of focus, objectivity and respect in having challenging conversations
You have to hold people accountable to what they say and do
Jim says capitalism fixes things. The market dictates what people will do eventually
Then he brings up Bud Light, Target and Planet Fitness as examples of wokeness backfiring
Mark says life is a meritocracy. Sports is life and it’s great for kids. Work ethic, consistency, respect…These messages work everywhere
Jim mentions the San Francisco government school entity that is going bankrupt. Enrollment dropped
Different testing for different races…it’s a comedy show
Florida and California are different planets. Jim says where he lives might as well be Texas or Florida
Mark says that why many laws belong down at the local level
Mark ends with self awareness, choices, how you respond to thing - you are regaining control over your happiness
Jim says if you ever go to San Fran…remember to turn your wheels
Mark introduces the topic in the context of self awareness, which then leads to self evaluation of, in this case, communication skills
He talks about generational differences, social media and a “laziness” that he sees creeping into our communication
Jim agrees and goes deeper into the generational distinction. He believes that younger people are too sensitive to words. Almost like they set booby traps for us. He feels that we are also confusing people by mixing up words and phrases. It’s ours to help them reframe positions
Jim brings up the Palestinian/Israeli conflict and the UNC “frat boys” who refuse to let the American Flag be lowered
Mark shares his feedback on “the river to the sea” and how misguided some of these young people are
Mark shares how similar he and his girlfriend are simply because they were born during the same year. He goes on to talk about the word “Oriental” and his experience with this “slur” in his yoga class
Words are getting bastardized. Jim calls hem the “thought police”
Mark brings up Jordan Peterson. How well he listens and how effective he is with his pause before responding. He also holds people accountable to his words, not their interpretation of his words
Jim brings up the difference between being nice and being kind
Jim says there are a lot of complainers out there now. Nobody likes a complainer…they tolerate them. No one will stick around complainers long term. They tolerate and move away. Complainers want to complain without consideration of a resolution
Mark brings up the strategy of using questions to disarm. I don’t know, I’m pretty sure, I feel, I think, I know…these are very different phrases… that mean very different things
Jim likes smart people, regardless of group affiliation. Mark adds the importance of kindness as well
Mark says try to not focus on winning or being right. Also too many people are too easily offended
Mark talks about the power and danger of groups
Jim shares a couple of stories. One about privilege. What is it and why is it important or not so much?
The second about protesting in the 60’s versus today. That today’s protesters don’t seem to know much about why they’re protesting or what they’re protesting. Jim says young people are mad because they got shit on (Covid, etc…)
Mark says we allow too much complaining. It’s about how you respond, to what happens to you
Jim brings the flywheel back in
Mark talks about leading conversations with questions and don’t try to change minds or be “right”
Jim’s quotes “To get what you want, give people what they want”
Begin with what success looks like
Fear drives much of our behavior…Try to find out what those fears are
Be respectful
Past present and future are all factors
Be transparent and work hard to create clarity
Mark introduces the idea of moving from where you are to where you want to be. How we are tempted to stay in our comfort zone and how our focus in men. We are attempting to help men get more comfortable with being vulnerable. He goes on to lay out the possible paths of staying “comfortable” versus striving for more
Jim jumps in and brings in our flywheel and the notion that most of this comes down to self awareness. Jim talks about listening to a recent podcast with Tim Ferris where he discusses his current place in life and how different it is from his younger days
Mark uses Jim as an example of someone who strives for more. You either choose to get better or you stay comfortable
Jim returns the compliment to Mark as being aspirational as well
Mark talks about never getting rid of fear, but continuing to try to overcome it. Once you move into fear, things start moving forward. He suggest’s that progress I not linear
The guys are using a graphic that shows stage of growth comfort - fear - learning -growth
They bring Tim Ferris back into the discussion and how he focuses now on quality and not quantity. People and not money
Mark brings up the Harvard Study of men and their happiness
Jim quotes Ferris “think of projects as experiments”. It’ll never be perfect…just put it out there
It’s about content, not polish. Mark shares his editing approach - simple and quick
Jim shares some more about the future of podcasting and Mark shares his point of view
Mark brings up Tim Ferris’ “Tools Of Titans” and Jim talks about how he loves to interview people
The guys disagree on the notion of defining what success looks like and then discover it’s not a disagreement, it’s a misunderstanding. After clarification - good point. Let’s agree on what success means or what words mean before we move forward
The guys go back and dig into the graphic. They are seeing it from two different vantage points and the discussion brings context. After contextualizing things the guys agree and the discussion progresses and gets interesting
Jim brings back up the previous episode and dopamine and adds that as context Dopamine hits come from fear and excitement among the things
Mark recalls their just put it outconversation they had about having nothing and having everything Jim expresses some “envy” about Mark uncertain future and Mark returns the favor. Both guys share their perspectives about having everything and nothing
They move in to a discussion of risk and the notion of moving from comfort to fear and purpose and the reality that life moves back and forth The value of hanging out with interesting people and developing the ability to solve problems.
Jim goes back to the graphic. Mark brings his faith and what he is supposed to give back. His purpose is being of service
The topic of goals comes up. Mark thinks of metrics and how he doesn’t like specific goals. Now he sets process and consistency goals. Jim likes the word ‘objectives”
Mark says goals are specific numbers and objectives are destinations. Interesting discussion
Mark says he thinks you have to have aspirations
Jim suggests that maybe it’s a mindset. He feels like he’s moved from what “he” wants and what “we” want. The guys talk about how sports and sales drove their goal driven somewhat selfish actions, which drove success, but maybe wasn’t the best way to be
Mark tells the story about his most recent coach/program and his evolution around this concept - we all have a judge of ourselves, others and circumstances. The other side is your sage. Fascinating stuff
Jim brings up a few of his experiences with some other “next level” guys - self awareness
Mark says he feels like he is reacting to both his stage in life and the circumstances around him He feels an obligation to help. Jim agrees. “You have an obligation to let that out”. He circles back to the graphic. It won’t be perfect,
Civil discourse, we need more. Jim says the podcast platform is still new and a big difference in how we communicate
Mark starts off with the topics of personal responsibility, self accountability and pride and how they stem from self awareness
He talks about his older brother’s background and a story he shared with him
Mark wrote an article about the story and then thought it would make a great episode
Jim liked the article and agrees that we all fuck up. Jim has his own story he’ll share too
Mark reminds the audience that The Imperfect Mens Club has a newsletter on LinkedIn
Mark shares his younger brother’s circumstances as the real root of this topic and explains why
Mark starts to tell the story
It’s about an F-15 pilot that his brother flew with and a situation he got himself into
It involves a mission and what happened when it was coming to an end and it was time to go home
He loses track of his fuel consumption and is faced with a few choices
The guys comment back and forth speculating about what he’s thinking and his options
Mark shares his opinion on the emotion of the moment and how the pilot’s mind was working in the decision making process
Jim offers his opinion on what might have been going on in the pilots head and the reflects on how we all have these moments and how we choose to respond
Jim begins to share his story of being the guy who picked up the phone for his buddy and his divorce
Mark shares his Will Rogers quote and how we should live our lives
Mark’s divorce story comes up and the guys go back and forth with compare and contrast
How we process big problems and the myriad of emotions. Shame, fear, pride, apology repercussions
Mark’s dad ’s life lesson “What do you do when an engine catches on fire?”
Mark talks about what happens when bad things confront you for the first time
The guys shift to how hard, but good it is to apologize when you really fucked up
Jim brings his friend back up - he had to apologize to his daughter
Mark says it’s hard for him to apologize
Mark relates this concept to projects in business and his experience with people not sharing mistakes until it’s “to late”
They go back to the pilot story and speculate on what happened to him after he landed and what could have been
Jim reminds us from the last episode about the three calls he took from three different guys struggling with the same issue
Jim then recounts a time he was struggling with depression and made a call. He gets a little emotional recalling the story
We all get punched in the nuts - when you take one of these calls you lead with empathy
Mark says we all make these calls and we all take these calls - the power of questions…”What’s going on”
Jim brings back up his call from his friend yesterday who’s in this bad divorce
Jim digs into marriage and how it’s the only license that doesn’t renew or expire - very interesting
Jim essentially helped his friend reframe the situation. Was it a failure or a success that came to an end?
Mark says when you admit to your mistake you gain respect
Apologizing, I fucked up, I don’t know what to do…
Jim says it’s also a cleansing. It flushes out and you become a better person
When you hold on to a fuck up it eats you alive
Jim says that’s what disease is
Mark connects stress to disease
Mark reminds listeners about the IMC newsletter on LinkedIn and encourage listeners to check it out
Jim repeats the connection to LinkedIN and how LinkedIn is melding with personal and professional development
Mark agrees - this melding breeds empathetic leadership among other things - Professional you is personal you
Mark goes back and summarizes the pilot story and asks, “what happens when he goes home?”
Mark introduces mindfulness as the topic and says he believes people who practice mindfulness are by nature self aware. He also suggests that most people are not self aware
Jim agrees and mentions the current mental health crisis
Jim reflects on his current state. He feels like he has a grey cloud over him
Loneliness is real
Mark talks about how divided we are. Mark says there are a lot of factors today, including Covid and the current wars going on
Mark shares how he responds to negative emotion
Jim brings up suicide - 55,000 per year - 80% are men
Mark brings up Jordan Petersons position on it being a mans world
Jim brings in dopamine - external and internal influences that impact our levels of dopamine. He cites a study that says men lose as much as 50% of their dopamine levels as they age
Jim brings up a few things that can help with dopamine
Mark mentions George Mumford and Andrew Huberman as experts in this stuff
Both guys share some ideas that they know about and or use to stay mindful and raise dopamine. Mark shares his morning routine and expands on his Wim Hof breathing routine and his meditation routine
Jim mentions that he’s reading George Mumford’s latest book about his work with high performance athletes. He uses the term “second wind”
Mark brings up Wim Hof’s position that we are all capable of far more than we think
Jim shares more about Mumford’s book
Mark reminds us of the “you either get bitter or you can get better”. He says he sustains his good habits because he chooses things that he likes, don’t take much time and are simple
Jim tells his story about his latest patent approval process that made him feel better for a few days
Mark shares some dopamine “hacks” from and article Jim found - good versus bad dopamine
Mark shares his yoga experience - why he started and how it helps him
Mark goes back to the topic of loneliness. You can be lonely in the company of other people. He was very lonely during the last few years of his marriage
Jim brings up how boredom can do the same thing
Mark shares how a major reason people leave jobs is no longer learning new things
Mark feels like boredom makes him think lazy - If you’re bored just do something positive - move, walk, get some sun…
It’s helpful to consistently celebrate small wins
Developing a growth mindset - turn your failures into learning opportunities
Mark shares how helpful his current morning routine has beed to his happiness
He shares how important exercise has been for him
Mark ends with some encouragement about how many simple, free, quick tools are available if you just look
Jim ends with the importance of hydration and breathing
Mark shares his hydration protocol and ends by saying that all of this stuff is free, simple and easy to do
Mark introduces the topic of confidence and mentions Jim’s pre-show comment about getting older and feeling less able to impact his future or the overall future of “things”
Mark mentions how anxious he felt at his 60th birthday party and how he feels like his cause of that same feeling is age but also because the world is crazier now too
Jim starts by sharing his thoughts about his struggles with confidence and his ability to make an impact
He cites AI, division and media as sources of his “dark cloud”
Mark brings up leadership and that we don’t have many leaders. Jim agrees and both guys express their disappointment in our current President.
Jim brings up the LSU/Iowa national anthem issue as an example of us not going in the right direction
Jim compares leadership to parenting…it’s modeling
Mark says good leaders are selfless and their words and actions are the same. He says our current leaders are saying and doing different things
Then they bring back up the LSU/Iowa issue. Jim mentions the LSU head coach and asks Mark for more details. Mark say the media is stoking the racism component
Mark suggests that our kids are not confident about our future and the anxiety it creates
Mark talks about his childhood and how he doesn’t remember being anxious as a kid
Jim cites the hypocrisy of one side being criticized and the other not
Mark brings up history and how this generation doesn’t know history
Jim says we’re rewriting history
Mark brings up the Francis Scott Key bridge collapse
The obsession with dividing us - affects our confidence in our future
Mark asks why this is happening - control. Covid was control. The election fraud was control
What about confidence in the US dollar
Mark shifts to “what do we do about this?” He goes inside and brings up his faith. A higher power
Jim brings up the Easter holiday and what it means. He asks Mark’s opinion from his Catholic background Mark talks about his faith
Mark feels compelled to help the people around him with their confidence
Mark talks about wisdom versus knowledge and the constitution
Jim tells two stories about calls he had last week with two younger people struggling with confidence and certainty. Completely unrelated with almost the exact same questions. “There’s something going on in the air right now”. What’s next?
A lack of confidence in our leaders and future
The guys bring up how they coach people up with their confidence with answers and advice
Success breeds confidence
Mark talks about how he regains his own confidence
Jim says we seek out “trusted” leaders. He bring the Wheel up on his screen and we talk about the 5 parts of life. Todays discussion falls into the Worldview category
Jim tells his story about his coaching call from last week and how he leveraged our wheel in his coaching
Mark says the wheel helps with any kind of coaching
We’re all in this together - everyone has issues. It’s about smoothing the ups and downs. Hopefully going up overall
Jim mentions “alignment” and talks about how isolated we’ve become. The world needs everybody
Mark mentions the Harvard study of men and what makes men happy. The number and depth of their friendships
The division today isolates and that makes us unhappy. The unknown is the worst. Uncertainty takes our confidence away
Jim thinks the devices (phones) have contributed to our isolation
Mark speak to how deep the division is based on your political choices
Mark shares his confidence ups and downs and how he gets it back
Jim brings up the word indifference and Mark’s word is apathy. The opposite of love is not hate, It’s apathy
Jim think young people are becoming indifferent and it’s concerning
Mark mentions having a loved one who is hopeless and he’s trying to help
Jim struggles to remember a quote about hope:)
Gift somebody hope for the future
Mark says find somebody you can help with their confidence today. You can change a life
Mark makes the introduction and connects today’s topic, immigration to the IMC flywheel from the self out to Worldview
He says it’s a polarizing topic and he also cite the importance of what words mean. Specifically “illegal immigration”
Jim says immigration pushes a lot of buttons. Jim agrees it’s connected to Worldview on our flywheel
Jim ha the perspective of having played rugby with guys from all over the world
When Jim meets first generation immigrants, he thanks them
Then Jim self reflects on his grandmother’s family who were Swiss Italian and talks about the connection that took place who he recently went back ti visit
Mark says most of us are only a generation or two away from immigrants. Then he talks habit about his Irish background and how the Irish and Italians were treated very poorly back in the 20’s and 30’s in Boston where his dad are up. The Irish and Italians bonded in defense and over common traits like Catholicism and story telling
Mark brings up his neighbors house building project. There were 2 white guys and 15 hispanics. He didn’t know who was illegal or legal. They all were polite, happy and working their asses off
Jim reflects on his dinner the night before, which prompted this discussion. A Bosnian couple who came here after flying the war, went to Spain and then came here. Very successful and patriotic. The wife is a teacher in So Cal and she has a very interesting take on the “immigrants of today” and how different they are
Jim asked her opinion - She said 30 kids recently showed up without English skills or any education at all. They are unable to handle the influx. She also said the whole issue has become political
Jim says this has clearly gotten worse under the Biden administration
Mark reflects on his experience working with immigration employment lawyers. The process and cost are absurd
The Mark gives the discussion the context of how w are making decisions as a country now without any concern for mid and long term impact. We do it with immigration, green energy, climate change…everything
Mark says how unfair these policies are to our education, healthcare, law enforcement. It’s going to break our systems
Mark brings up the hispanic young man who is on Tiki’s Tok recruiting, by telling immigrants, “come on over, you’ll get free shit standing in front of his new house and new car with his new phone…recruiting!
Jim brings back up his Bosnian couple. How grateful they are versus how entitled this new generation of immigrants
The guys agree that entitlement is a huge problem for everyone. “What happened to fortitude”
Mark says you can’t force behaviors. You can have laws and rules, but you have to enforce them
Jim speaks as a Californian - “these kids are revenue devices”
Jim talks about the school system - you can’t discipline these kids anymore so the behavior gets out of hand but the government wants the revenue so they can’t kick em out
The teachers are quitting. Everything’s OK and no-one gets punished
Jim brings up the Teacher union and how feckless they are
Both guys want the old way back - let the kids fight it out
The guys bring up the crime issue.
They both agree that a simple process should in place to screen and track. How is this going to impact the election?
Mark says the politicians are doing what they always do - obfuscation and bullshit
Mark addresses the executive order that Trump signed and Biden overwrote it day one. Then he talks about how bills work Stuffing other things in a bill and calling it an immigration bill
The guys have a good laugh about Don Lemon and the media - disingenuous
The media is a huge part of the problem and our “leaders” are doing nothing
The guys share positive immigrant stories
Mark shares his brothers Iranian friend who are in love with America and are both successful doctors and very grateful. They didn’t understand how we don’t understand the problems we are encouraging
Jim shares a couple of stories. One about a Scottish rugby teammate who is now the number 2 executive at the largest grocer in the country now - great story - “I’m the American dream”
He also shares the story of how he met the lady who cleans his house 20 years ago - another great story!
We don’t hear these stories anymore in the mainstream…interesting
Jim finishes with a third story about a family from the Vietnam war era - another great tale
Mark finishes with the point that this topic needs civil discourse. We need plans and accountability
These are not compassionate ways, they are dangerous
Mark brings up the topic - stoicism as a leadership guide . He reads the definition
Virtue - wisdom, courage, moderation and justice
Mark references the article and video series he’s created around stoicism and leadership
Jim shares his thoughts - He brings up his father’s death…and life. Notes to himself that were stoic
He shares how he reflects on some of his dad’s notes and shares some
Life is how you react to things. We have very little control over much
Mark identifies stoicism versus victimhood
Jim feels true stoics don’t talk about being stoic. He begins to address the similarity of religion
Mark mentions Seneca and Marcus Aurelius
Self reflection and leadership
Mark starts to deliver his 10 stoic leadership traits
Jim mentions Ryan Holiday and Mark mentions Tim Ferris
- Focus on what you can control…almost nothing. How I react - How I listen - What I do
How you respond to things - this also decreases worry and stress that comes from worry
- Learning as a lifelong journey. This makes you interesting, creates authority and credibility
Mark brings up Bill Clinton and Jim shares his Clinton story.
Jim brings up unlearning and how important it is to drop certain beliefs
-
Self accountability - How it fits in so closely with the foundation of the club. It’s not sustainable to be around victims. Mark shares his recruiter perspective about people’s stories - are they blaming or taking responsibility
-
How important failure is. Mark mentions the fear, risk, failure, experience, wisdom cycle. Jim mentions his Silicon Valley environment and failure and then talks about his fear during his rugby days. Both guys get deeper into risk and appreciate the difference between knowledge and wisdom
-
Integrity appears in your actions when no one is looking. Actions versus words
Jim cites the difference between integrity and morality Integrity os doing what you say you’re going to do…even if it’s bad
-
Mindfulness is paying attention with intention. Jim asks Mark for a definition of mindfulness. Being present and respectful. Mark reflects on their partnership with respect to respect and mindfulness. Both guys reflect on their individual mindfulness. Mark shares his Henry Ford dinner story. Both guys smile about making people smile
-
Forgiveness for others and yourself. Jim brings it back to the wheel. Mark shares his daily spiritual practice and how he beats himself up. Jim shares his self doubt story
-
Discipline comes incrementally with consistency. Mark talks about his inner conflict with self doubt around discipline. Show up every day. Jim mentions how close addiction is to self discipline - he shares his social media “addiction”. Like sugar to the brain. Moderation is a form of discipline. Media also can make you stupid - propaganda
-
Courage is not the absence of fear. It’s moving forward in spite of the fear. Most people are fearful. Some do things anyway. Motivation comes from doing the right thing and can be acting in service of others. Mark mentions the video he saw about an alligator attack
-
Empathy is treating people how THEY want to be treated. Empathy versus sympathy. How do you want to be led? Treated? Jim says you need to work on being empathetic. Hardship creates empathy
Mark brings up his dad’s Catholic belief and how he is also a stoic. Religion and stoicism are not mutually exclusive. They exist well together and apart
Jim’s shares his recent interaction with a recent football graduate. The last bell - The last whistle. “You’re not referable”. I need to get to know you. The kid didn’t follow-up. Didn’t show up
Mark reflects on Jim’s story and compliments him on his wisdom. 3 strikes and you’re out
Jim’s quote. “When you want to help people, you tell them the truth, When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear”. - Thomas Sowell
We’re not being truthful enough
Mark wraps up encouraging listeners to investigate stoicism
Mark introduces the concept of unconscious bias and frames it in the context of the IMC flywheel of life and the 5 areas of life
The topic came up as a result of conversations Jim had recently with a couple of friends over dinner and drinks, both attorneys
Jim suggests we all have a “team” whose membership creates some our unconscious biases
Mark immediately thought about what his unconscious biases are and proposes that our language is being bastardized. How important it is to define words before talking about them. Words mean different things to different people
Jim and his friends spoke of the need for 3 things
Free education
Free healthcare
Changes to corporate greed
Jim cites the CEO of PG&E getting a 40 million dollar bonus while utility rates in CA skyrocket. The politicians are in the pocket of the large institutions - collusion
Mark agrees theoretically but disagrees about how to get there. Jim presses Mark and challenges his logic
Mark reframes his position and moves into education…a space he knows well
Mark agrees that education is fucked up. Way to expensive and bad curriculum. He speaks about how big college endowments are.
Why is this happening and how did it happen
Mark suggests the problem is with the family and a move away from faith. Academia is a mess
Jim talks about the government’s responsibility to make America safe and they’re dropping the ball
Mark brings up the minimum wage movement
Jim talks about the lack of corporate support with regard to benefits and taxes
Mark talks about this concept with his companies
Jim brings up monopolies
Mark shares George Carlin’s routines and corporate greed. Mark asks “how did this happen and why did this happen?
Mark brings up Big Pharma and the hoax that is drugs for symptoms
Mark brings up victimhood
Jim brings up DEI and meritocracy
Mark jumps on DEI and then reads the definition of meritocracy
Mark references his daily prayer and the notion of holding people accountable with compassion
Ability and talent are the path to performance and achievement. But without performance, rewards can’t exist
Mark talks about group think and division
Jim asks if the division is what sells. Politicians looking for votes and advertisers for money
Mark says human beings like watching tragedy
Mark quotes Denzel Washington - they don’t throw 7 year olds in jail - if it gets to “the system” it’s too late”. It’s the family, the father
Mark asks if he has an unconscious bias against black people. Suggest no and why
He describes what a racists is to him
Mark talks about his two experiences where the police drew their guns on him
Jim laughs about his three times in handcuffs. “They had the right guy all three times”
Jim says unconscious bias is a necessary survival tool
He goes on about crime in CA and it’s because of zero accountability
Mark talks about the far left and right fringes
Jim says common courtesy cuts across all groups
Both guys suggest the cities with problems have brought the problems on themselves by who they keep voting for
Mark brings up the girl recently killed in GA by an illegal immigrant
Then he talks about Riley Gaines story
Jim says this behavior is hurting women…setting them back
Mark talks about the waste in the healthcare space and the administrative burden
Jim laughs about how healthcare and utility companies can afford to put their names on stadiums
Mark ends with a suggestion - We all should ask ourselves what our unconscious biases might be before we speak, write or present to the world
Mark starts out with the wheel and announces we will have a guest on today - Jeff Otis
He addresses the flywheel and suggests today’s “self-“ focus will be on self awareness and self confidence as it pertains to leadership
Mark tosses it to Jim and Jim talks about how we all met
Jim welcomes Jeff and Jeff says hello
Jim takes Jeff around the wheel and starts with worldview
Jeff tells us where he’s from - Beaverton OR…it’s also where he still lives
His community was tight and there were great communities and leaders
Jeff played baseball all the way thru college
As far as politics, Jeff is an independent and looks for what is practical and makes sense
Jeff started looking into what makes up a great leaders. He shares some insight about Oregon
He talks about the men in his life and sports and then he tells us about moving into work in staffing which was dominated by women. He has three daughters
Jeff talks about how important it is to pause and reflect on who you’re speaking to before speaking
Jim asks Jeff about his male role models and starts with his dad…and little league
Then Jeff names off the coaches who helped shape him. He was on 21 different championship teams!
His high school had 13 guys who went D1 or pro!
Jim shares his high school football success and speaks of the “winning culture”
Jeff reflects on being a pitcher and Jim folks about how pitchers are a bit off:)
Jim m loves on to health - Jeff shares how important mental toughness and resilient are so important
Jeff shares agin how important pausing and reflecting are
Next is money - Jeff reflects on money. “Monet kind of finds you when you need it”
Jim quotes “When I stopped chasing money and women, they started chasing me”
Jim brings Mark back into the discussion. Mark talks a bit about the work we are now doing together
Mark asks Jeff to speak further about his program that is now “our” program
Jeff discusses how we met and started to collaborate
Jim jumps in and asks Jeff about his professional journey. Jeff went in to staffing (just like Mark!)
He gets into detail about his 15 year career in staffing and his subsequent growth into the leadership space. He found that people went down 2 available forks Victim or transformation
He noticed that people needed help when they hit the wall. He went into digital marketing, his kids started to reach young adulthood, the internet became mainstream and smartphones came out
He felt compelled to help people craft their successful future selves
Jeff shares how the Project OTY evolved from this discovery and how he began to have success with young people
Jim asks Mark’s opinion - Marks talks about his kids and helping them find work and how he evolved into coaching. No one gave themselves permission to dream. Many had no purpose. Enter Jeff
What’s your unique strength, what’s your vision and how do you define success - most people seemed to struggle with all three
Jeff begins talking about how we all fit together. He describes his Project OTY “Build Your Roadmap” Program
He calls it developing that “North Star”
Jim offers up another quote - Momentum. “If you’re on a bike and you freeze, you fall down”. He shares a quick story about his daughter’s flight to Japan and how it will “off course” 99% of the time. Jeff - it’s like a guided missile
Jeff says most people want to help but many don’t know how - That’s what Jeff’s program helps with
His program takes the what and why and adds the how through his critical thinking journey
You can’t take anybody where they want to go until you help them define where they want to go, building structure and confidence
Mark pipes in with more insight about what the audience might get from the partnership and then moves into their current working plan. The program establishes a foundation, a working document for life.
Jeff - we live in a world of distractions and everyone needs a plan to get them back on track
Jim bring in the 5 W’s - Who, what, when, where and why. He quotes Thomas Sowell “When you want to help people, you tell them the truth, when you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear”
Jim cites the value of a coach…an objective third party
Jeff talks about accountability and how important it is
Mark end with how optimistic he is about the future
Mark starts with the IMC flywheel of life
Todays topic is self respect or self dignity and how it impacts relationships
Mark says it was at the core of his divorce
“If you don’t stand for something, you’ll fall for anything
He shares his thoughts about the mask mandates
Jim asks Mark to read the definitions of self-respect and self-dignity
Jim brings the wheel back in, shares the 5 categories and he lands on Relationships
Mark reflects back on his upbringing and his family’s evolution
He cites his sister’s disrespectful posture and then he shares his disagreement with his daughter about BLM
Jim applauds Mark’s ability to maintain his self-respect
Jim talks a bit about his dad’s ability to demand/maintain his self respect
Both guys suggested men are being challenged in this area all the time
Jim says when a leader caves, he can’t get that back
The guys bring childhood fighting and sports into the discussion
Then mark shares his experience with employees who give up their dignity at work
Mark tells his self respect story from 25 years ago
Jim reflects on Marks story with praise and cites his self-control too
Jim thinks the self respect issue is very different between men and woman
He shares his views on his dealings with women
Mark talks about relationships and how different they can be
Jim says “manage the crazy” and the guys have fun with it. He says we’re all “crazy”
Both guys think masculinity and femininity are being challenged and the roles are blurred
Man needs woman and woman needs man
Mark talks about his current relationship and how the roles have developed. He attributes their success to the level of dignity they both encourage each other to maintain
Jim brings crazy back up and how triggering it is - they get a few laughs
Jim talks about his wife’s reaction to “crazy”
Mark says people give up their dignity too easily. How you say things is important
Jim brings up cancel culture and how bad that is
Mark thinks the current people in power are asking us to give up our self respect
Jim brings up the shift in schools around bullying and how teachers can’t discipline anymore
Mark shares a junior high school fight story…Jim has one of his own too
Mark thinks young men are being weakened
Jim tells his story about misbehaving in class when he was young - one of the best lessons he ever received
Mark says even if you don’t feel it right away, giving up your self respect eats away at your soul
He also says that anyone who would intentionally try to take another’s self respect away is evil
Jim shares his experience with a manipulative leader who cut down students in a group he was in
Jim brings up the military and their psychological training
Mark brings up the difference - sacrificing their lives - requires a different set of rules
Mark begins with the wheel and the concept of authenticity. You begin in the center with self and it’s fascinating how you can then connect it to all 5 areas of life
Mark tells how the topic came up in a LinkedIn connection earlier in the day
Both guys agree that bragging online about material possessions doesn’t work anymore…maybe it never did
Mark talks about how authenticity is dominating his life lately
Jim shares his viewpoint and brings AI into the conversation and how AI could potentially bring a lot of inauthentic information into the world. He expands on how we don’t really trust institutions anymore. Advertisers, brands, etc
He says you can’t fake authenticity…you’ll eventually be found out
Mark reflects on his evolution from how he communicated as a young man and how he has discovered his authenticity and feels much braver in his content creation. Authenticity has become his goal
Jim is reminded of why we named our podcast the Imperfect Mens Club
Jim suggests that authenticity is more challenging when you are younger
He talks about shedding the people who don’t serve you
Mark suggests that being authentic is risky, but it’s OK to lose people who don’t serve you
The guys bring up worldview and Mark say our “leaders” are in authentic and it has invaded most institutions
Jim bring up his mom and how she feels that it’s noisier now then ever. People in positions of power and influence can no longer be trusted
Jim calls them paid actors
Mark talks about the left going back into people’s personal accounts to find dirt
He also acknowledges that people evolve and change
They bring up Joe Rogan and Bill Maher and Jim mentions Jon Stewart
Mark says he does not demonize people, but the left does
Jim brings up Biden and how sad he is. Also all the people that defend his sanity - inauthentic
Both guys suggest that the far left develops narratives based on rumors and lies
They have fun with how inauthentic Kamal Harris is
Gavin Newsome rounds out politics and inauthenticity
Mark shifts the conversation to the topic of health, both physically and mentally
Jim reenforces the notion of “your best self” and the importance of having an authentic story - your origin story. He’s more comfortable now sharing his flaws and challenges
Mark gives Jim credit for his evolution of authenticity
Mark talks about some of his challenges
Jim brings up his revelation about Mark’s divorce story
You can get bitter or you can get better
The guys discuss transparency and the idea of doing what you say you are going to do
Mark gives his example of looking for people who do and say the same things
Jim ends with the importance of surrounding yourself with authentic people
Mark cites his more recent success on LinkedIn and how more people following him who are also trying to be authentic.
Mark starts with a summary of the clubs philosophy and the flywheel and the 5 areas of life
He mentions his own recent battle with self doubt and can relate to middle aged men who get much of their self worth from their careers, and what happens when they are faced with a career change
Jim reiterates what we use as our foundational structure and goes into the topic of today - self doubt
Jim talks about the connection between self doubt and self worth
Mark reads a definition of self doubt from a Google search
Mark shares his most recent challenge with self doubt. He first mentions how he leaned on colleagues and friends for support
Mark shares the detail of his “big deal” and how self doubt crept in
He shares how grateful he was to have tools and resources to lean of to overcome his fears
Jim, as usual, wants to break it down
He proposes that Mark might have been in a protective mode and Mark agrees
He goes on to suggest that he probably had some subconscious drivers that he couldn’t even understand. He also shares how much of how we react is based on being in survival mode
Mark mentions his divorce and Jim says even though that was “a long time ago” it is likely still lingering and impacting his confidence
Jim share a quote - “A bad day for the ego is a good day for the soul”
Mark agrees and suggests that his self worth was at stake
Mark’s deal went through and he shares how cathartic the win was
He also shares his gratitude and Jim appreciates it and Mark says we don’t do anything good by ourselves
Jim observes how much work Mark did and how he took some chances. Mark relates his recruiting work to this deal and how little context he had with this project. While doing his work he got no feedback until it was go time
Jim brings up Mark’s other situation that he shut down, which opened this “other door”
Mark shares his experience with how difficult it was for him to get out of an emotionally draining situation and how it may have opened this new door because it freed up space, time and energy
You have to shed that which does not serve you
Jim shares the analogy of running with ankle weights and how it felt when you took the weights off
Mark appreciates Jim’s help and how valuable it is to have a coach and how men feel they should go it alone and how people actually are flattered when you ask for help
Self doubt leads to lower self worth and that can lead to depression and even suicide
The guys share some suicide stats
Mark says he feels like we are living in the most confusing uncertain times in his whole life
Jim brings up the notion of having a “second act” in life when your primary career comes to an end
Mark brings in the context of worldview and how much noise there is in the world. He shares his gratitude for having tools available to him to overcome self doubt and fear
Jim explains the reason for starting the club - a place to go for men to share and support each other
Mark explains the difference between safe spaces and this safe space
Jim talks about how we speak with ourselves so critically and how the media makes all this worse
Mark agrees about how much media and politicians mislead and scare to divide
Jim brings up the discovery around electric cars and the guys add in the solar, wind and climate change hoaxes
Mark talks about how he moves from “I don’t know” to either knowing or dismissing an issue
They wrap up with how important contribution is and Mark ends with how self awareness was triggered and then how he reacted to get better and not bitter
Mark starts reflecting on how we both had recent communications with 30 year olds and how different they operate and communicate than we do. Generational differences
Jim laughs about his encounter…”return your fucking phone calls…I don’t understand it Mark”
Mark frames the technology aspect of communication. We had none of the technology…no cell phones, social media, etc..
Jim shares his opinion about how younger people feel we speak too much and they prefer to text
He also believes everyone is trying to avoid conversation and we miss so much when we don’t talk
He predicts that intimate conversation. Will be in much higher demand as technology discourages it (AI)
Mark shares the importance of context and immediate feedback (physical, energy, body language)
He connects the increase in anxiety and depression in younger people to this disconnection
Mark believes he’ll be more self aware of these generational differences
Jim brings his mind map into the discussion and breakdown generational differences
Mark has a current client that consists of people in their late 20’s and 30’s
Jim gets specific about Generation Y characteristics and seminal events (housing crash and Sept 11th). Student debt for 43% of this age group
Mark suggests that every generation has had it’s challenges and that victimhood has become a norm
Jim goes into detail about Generational details
The guys talk about the stark differences between being kid in Florida versus California
They go into detail about the impact of COVID on young people
Wars, open borders and other conflicts
Mark asks Jim if he felt anxious as a kid - not really - we were outdoors
They joke about “playdates” and walking/not walking to school
Mark talks about speaking differently to different generations
Jim says he was more mad at himself for tolerating the behavior of the younger person than the bad behavior
How do you speak accurately without being a dick
Jim cites the difference between “nice” and “kind” - the value of candor
Mark cites evil people who are fake nice and fake compassionate
Can you be too candid?
It’s better to be feared than liked - Mark uses the word respected
They dig into the fear concept
Mark talks about guilt as an accountability tool
Jim talks about football coaches
Mark says he feared his dad - letting him down and/or being held accountable
The guys refer back to their previous guest who claimed to no longer seek his fathers approval
Jim talks about his dad passing
Mark talks about his dad’s generation - 95 years old - His daughter videoed him for 12 hours over 3 years
Jim reminds us how we are the product of our 4 grandparents
They talk about becoming different people over time
Jim talks about his Rugby days and how he struggled to not bring that intense personality home as a dad and husband
They both talked about being intimidating
Jim shares feedback from the high school football coaches he talks to that most young men don’t seem to want to lead
Mark talks about leadership and responsibility…and being the jury foreman
Mark’s take on being responsible for other people’s lives
Both guys talk about not needing to be the leader anymore and Mark says there are 3 types of people
Jim ends with what he likes about the younger generations
Mark shares his concern about the younger generations - anxiety and confusion
For the first time the guys have a guest !
Carl Lane is a childhood friend of Jim’s. They co-captained their high school football team, met at 14 years old and remain great friends today. Carl went on to play college football at Oregon State and has had great success as an entrepreneur and logistics expert
It’s a great interview and we all had fun
Mark begins with the flywheel foundation
Jim introduces Carl, who also is a listener and fan of the podcast
Carl talks about what he’s doing professionally
Carl trained top performing athletes for 6 years
Jim asks Carl about his views on health and Carl talks about his struggle with depression after retiring from sports. He shares his desire to lead a healthy life forever - hot yoga and running
Jim asks Carl to talk about his health scare - testicular issues and how he overcame it
Jim opens up a discussion about relationships. Carl shares his views on relationships and begins with his daughter. The he cites how important his mom and grandma were in his upbringing
He says he no longer seeks approval from his dad
Jim asks Mark about his daughters and being mom and dad and how important our daughters are
Next up is money - abundant or scarce and how money drives behavior
Carl talks about how we change as we grow - he’s no longer a slave to money
He talks a bit about having no excuses
Jim moves into worldview and the impact of childhood - who raised us and how they raised us
Carl shares stories about his grandparents and parents and brings in his professional athletic connections - uncle, cousin and son
Jim and Carl share how and when they met and how their friendship grew. How important football was in both their lives. Both guys cite how different coaches influenced their success
Jim and Carl continue to develop the story of their friendship and family growing
Mark cites how we all have the same challenges as middle aged men
Carl wants to be a cheerleader for the IMC
Jim - “what the world needs now more than anything is wisdom”
Jim tells his story about hitting Carl in practice and how the coach lost his shit - Jim had to run laps
Carl shares his story about the first time he went to Jim’s house and the other perspective having been friends with Huey Newton’s son
He states how focusing on what we have in common we can accomplish great things
Carl shares his experience first meeting Jim’s mom and dad
Jim brings the group into CEI and it gets interesting
Each of the guys have different opinions because they have different childhoods and upbringings
Carl talks a bit more about his football experience and how important performance and merit are
Jim brings up spirituality and Carl shares his journey and how different it is today from how he was raised
He felt nobody could answer him when he didn’t see any black people in the Last Supper—“I couldn’t ask about that”
Jim switches to politics and Carl shares how he was thinking in preparation for this interview. His sides are right and wrong. He doesn’t pick a side. He waits and listens. He’s interested in the community and shares some of his service to his various communities
Carl and Jim are in agreement that K-12 is socialism and then they get released into capitalism
Carl reflects on watching Jim develop his craft and his dyslexia and then Carl brings up his stuttering problem. Are these disadvantages or simple last whistle”ly obstacles to over come. It’s a choice
Jim brings up “The last bell and the last whistle”
Carl brings up his recent work with one of the largest high schools in Charlotte
Carl ends with how he really wants to be a part of this club
Mark shares about how important it is to disagree, get along and continue to explore
Mark frames the episode about DEI
Self - Worldview - Politics - Conservative - DEI
Mark reads the definition of DEI
Jim gives his take on Worldview and shares his addiction to YouTube videos
Mark reads the definition of equity and says that life is not fair
Jim says “who gets to decide what is fair…thought police
Jim says we’ve been compromised and it’s a plan to divide us into groups
The only way to ruin a country is from the inside
Jim talks about the 2020 election in the context of George Floyd and BLM and the propaganda around it
Jim shares thoughts from some cop friends about standing down from crimes
Mark talks about propaganda and how it works
Mark says sports and companies don’t function equitability
He shares some of his upbringing
Jim cites his referent to George Floyd and groupthink
Jim talks about how he grew up in a very diverse neighborhood and never saw color as an issue
Mark’s town was all white and his perspective is quite different
He talks about human nature and root cause - the home and the schools
Jim shares some frustration with DEI
Mark goes back to sports and how the liberal manipulates the numbers/ratio
Mark asks what he thinks the end game
The guys tease each other a bit about groupthink
Jim tells a story about his big sisters article about MLK and how disappointed he would be today
Mark states when you divide you can control
Mark reflects on diversity of thought
Jim tells a story about a sportscaster friend and how sports brings people together
Mark tells a Chicago basketball story
Then he tells his aviation story about DEI and how the damage DEI causes is incremental
How DEI will eventually collapse because it doesn’t work
Jim asks Mark if there is any benefit to DEI?
Everyone has been discriminated against and that the market will fix any imbalance
The guys ask if any progress has been made since civil rights
Jim tells his tory about presidential museums - LBJ’s in particular - LBJ’s discussions with MLK recordings and the Malcom X recording - “Don’t trust the foxy white liberals” - 1965
Mark ends with Frederick Douglas - “Leave us alone”
Mark starts with some info about the structure of the IMC “Club”
He transitions to speaking of “Self” and how it all starts there
Mark lists the 5 areas and talks about subtopics radiating out from the center, the self
He asks Jim about what happens when he brings up our flywheel
Im tells our origin story. “Don’t be frustrated, be fascinated”
Then he opens up about a trip to England to watch a rugby match - the club
Men only clubs allow very different private conversations
Different dynamic for men-only clubs
He talks about being dyslexic and how his way of viewing the world is so different from mine
People like to talk about themselves
Mark tells his story about the Orlando Country Club and the mens locker room
Getting a bunch of guys with similar outlooks together to talk about life - very cool
Jim mentions the importance of being with like-minded people
Jim uses his hand and fingers for the flywheel framework - it all starts with :self:
Mark starts with the self-hyphen phrases beginning with self awareness
Jim reads the definition
Mark talks about self awareness and how victimhood is the opposite
Next is self-evaluation the self accountability - executionMark talks about incremental change and how most people drop New Years resolutions because of impatience waiting for incremental progress
The guys are planning to have an assessment to qualify members
Jim respects self accountable guys
Mark talks about having drinks with Miles - one of his best friends
When you are your best self, you lift up everyone around you
Jim takes on self-identity
Both guys tout the value of authenticity and talk about how scary it can be
It’s reinforcement and reps
Jim brings up self control and talks about having to stop watching YouTube videos and Mark gave up bread and cheese
Mark talks about the value of an agent, a coach, a group in expediting performance improvement with objectivity and candor
The guys discuss control and discipline
Then they discuss self-talk and how important it is to be kind to ourselves and how bad we talk to ourselves
Self worth and self respect
Self gratification gets a few laughs
Mark cites the difference between pleasure and joy and then comments on guilt
Mark talks about his Catholic faith
Mark talks about cutting out the redundancies and creating the assessment for the “Club”
Mark talks about the formation of the resources and process of building the club
Mark starts with his definition of “Agency” and how he has worked as an agent as a recruiter
How personal things got when finding work for someone
Jim brings up real estate agents
Mark share his relationship approach
Jim talks about his agency in the cabinet business
Jim tells the story of his friend who managed the Seattle Mariners. How the young pitcher didn’t negotiate his 35 million dollar deal…his agent did
Mark goes back to positioning the framework flywheel and the 5 key areas of life and the self
Mark reads the definition of agency from the dictionary
Mark talks more about how he acted as an agent as a recruiter
Jim talks about artists and athletes who’ve been abused by agents
He shares some stories about his real estate buddies and how valuable they are
Mark explains where that value lies
Jim expresses his perceived value of agents
The guys talk about attorney agency
Mark lays out agency in the 5 key areas of life
Jim disagrees and talks about how coaches shouldn’t get personal
Mark speaks to the difference between Jim and Mark’s positions
Jim speaks to the difference between agency and mentorship
Mark speaks about the difference life experiences between Mark and Jim
Mark brings up how important qualifying clients is and Jim concurs
…there has to b e alignment between agent and client
Mark tells how Jim has acted as his agent and vice versa
Jim thinks friends and family are often too close to be objective
Jim reminds us how important objectivity is
Mark appreciates being helped with his tendency to give people the benefit of the doubt
Jim brings up business agents and how you don’t even need to like him, just respect and trust him
Jim brings up his Patent attorney story
Mark wants strong expertise and integrity
Jim brings the difference between integrity and morality…murderers murder….integrity, not morality
Mark talks about what separates the guys from the competition
Jim brings up self awareness again and how you have to do the work
Mark relates his leadership work with another client and the assessment piece of that process
Progress is made incrementally. Practice over time. Accountability
Jim speaks to the value of having someone else to hold you accountable
Mark says the best coaches have coaches
We can’t make people ready but we can help people who are ready
Jim brings up depression. With our help, optimism, a plan and advice we might help people avoid that darkness
To be your best self while the world changes
Mark relates his career coaching call from earlier and how much of his teaching comes from his failures
Jim engages with the time of year and reassessing life. He speaks to the importance of a system, a framework
Jim likes his quotes “The only thing worse than no hope is false hope”
The only thing worse than no advice is bad advice”
Mark says it’s what makes the guys unique - wisdom
The guys end in agreement on who to get advice from
They end with imperfect and club (authentic and community)
Mark begins with revisiting the framework of our program. The center of the flywheel and the radiant thinking that moves out from center to the 5 areas of life and todays podcast is about the 5th and final area…Others. People and relationships
Mark transitions to how events like Covid have made human contact and relationships even more important than ever
Jim tells a story about Christmas dinner with 10 family memebers at which they practice 2 traditions. First they go around the table and everyone makes his “Declaration” for the year 2024 and second “what are you hopeful for”. Jim committed himself to “putting it out there” even though not everyone is going to like it
He hopes we become America first again. Lead with being an American and not a group
He spoke of his Latino family never identifying as Latino first. They were Americans who were also Latino
Mark agrees and says it’s a joke that we even have to talk about this
Then Mark brings up the Harvard Study Of Men and Happiness Article Here
Relationships was the number one contribution to happiness. Purpose was number 2
Mark shares some context about the study and how rich and accurate the data is after 85 years!
Jim brings our flywheel of life into the discussion. He explains out “others” category
Mark talks ab out his dad’s family of eleven children and some of the conflict that existed there
Jim relates the Others category to the other 4 and shows again that each area affects the other 4…and it’s all about self awareness
Mark brings up his eldest brother being a pilot, in part, because his father was a pilot
Jim says we’re all the products of 4 people…both sets of grandparents…whether you know them of not
Mark talks about interested his eldest daughter is in learning about her ancestry
Jim claims he’s gotten more interested in his ancestry as he’s gotten older. Then he talks about his grandparents from Switzerland
Jim then talks about getting to know his father really well after his passing during the settlement of his estate (very interesting). He finishes with the importance of figuring out your own self through your understanding of your ancestry
Mark shares his opinion on self awareness and how it benefits relationship
Jim begins to talk about men and women and shares that everyone is not the same. Men and women are different
Mark asks Jim how many women friends he has that aren’t the wives of his or his wife’s friends:)
Jim admits that he has no female friends but that his kids do have friends of the opposite sex that they’ve not had sex with…and he feels this is progress. Mark agrees that his kids are the same and that this is mostly good. Progress. But things like polygamy are not sustainable
Jim revisits his female influencers…his mom was great
Mark shares the same about his mom
Jim shares his discovery at about 10 that he was dyslexic. He talks about being publicly humiliated and his mean ugly older female teacher. He became anti authority and distrusts older ugly women:)
Mark acknowledges that that kind of treatment will leave a scar and likely create an anger over time. Jim agrees and then brings up his young hot teacher who had the opposite effect
The guys laugh at movies from the 80’s and how thy could never be made today. Mark brings up Mel Brooks
Jim shifts the discussion to men and then speaks about the value of good friends…they anchor you and call you on your shit
Mark shares that because he moved when he was 26 that most of his friendships are from 26 on, but they are solid 20 plus year relationships nonetheless.
Jim asks Mark about his grandfathers and Mark shares his recollections, then Jim asks Mark about whether he has different relationships with his daughters and his son. Mark shares that his relationships are quite different
Both guys share insights about their daughters and how we go from teaching them to getting taught by them
Jim shares a story about losing his dad and talking to his friend about losing his. How losing your dad can be empowering as an adult…you get permission to no longer have to impress him
Jim reflects on a discussion with his daughter about how he has evolved as a man, a dad and that he was different when she was a child
Jim concludes with a story about his involvement in a high level 3 day coaching program “Landmark Forum?” Some cool exercises about communicating with your father or mother and discovering hidden agendas and misunderstandings
Episode 30 Money
Mark again leads with the foundational structure of our approach and the 5 key areas of life
Today we talk about money
Jim revisits his exercise of creating “self” phrases and talking with his good friend about self awareness
Then he starts talking about money and how it breaks up relationships
He says there are two types of people - they don’t have money, but act like they do…and those that have money and pretend they don’t
Mark talks about having money and then losing it all. Happiness was never connected to having or not having money
Why do we get so emotional about money if it doesn’t matter? Self awareness is the key
Jim revisits how our childhood shapes us and he talks about his upbringing and his parents attitude about money. Good stories about vacations
Jim talks about his neighborhood and how diverse it was. Poor and rich people
Mark talks about his hometown and the two different sides of the tracks and his parents attitude about money. Good people are good and bad people are bad…money isn’t a factor
Jim talks about how money is necessary and can bring you pleasure
Mark distinguishes between pleasure and joy. Joy comes from within
The guys talk about earned versus inherited money and the conflicts inherited money creates between siblings and family
Jim tells his story about looking for cheaper gas when he doesn’t need the money. Childhood habits that he’s stuck with
Mark shares his gas prices story and how our minds can fuck with us regarding money
Jim starts talking about money and relationships
Mark talks about his ex and money and how she clung to money
Mark talks about his hometown and his experience at Notre Dame
Again…inherited versus earned. Generational wealth
Mark distinguishes between employees with big budgets and entrepreneurs
Both guys talk about their parents views about money
Jim shares his dads various investment accounts left behind upon his passing
Mark talks about his childhood experiences with money and his attitude about eating out with friends
Jim says “I’m a cheap bastard”
Jim tells his “Jew” story
Mark talks about the difference between men and women and waiting on them as a waiter
Jim shares his opinions on money being used to manipulate and Mark brings up his ex again in the context of manipulation and the kids
Jim starts to connect the impact money has on the other 4 key area of life
Mark shares his story of recovering from losing everything…monetarily
Mark talks about Charles Barkley and Shaq. Less is more
Jim jumps in with - how much is too much
Mark talks about his kids success and how money complicates things
Jim shares his story of buying his first house and how it had a shed in the back where Jim could make cabinets too. How we both eat what we kill
How self aware are we about how we let money drive us
Mark opens with a summary of our framework from introduction, to the 5 areas to agency in the final episode of the 7 episode series within season 2
Jim brings up the concept of radiant thinking and the concept of self
Jim says men often find their identity in their careers
The world doesn’t need more knowledge…it needs wisdom and that’s we strive to provide
Mark comes from an angle of enhanced performance. He shares how his professional advisory work always goes deep personally
How much we make, our title and such can become too much of our identity
Jim suggests that we no longer separate our work from our personal and political lives
And now days you need to be careful about what you say and to whom
Mark appreciates being an entrepreneur because he can dod and say what he wants
He goes on about picking clients based on how reasonable they are - no assholes
Mark asks Jim about the day he decided to become his own boss. Jim tells a great story about being denied time off…”everything I do I have to run by someone else”
Jim references our flywheel and the 5 spokes of the wheel…our relationship with money
“Everyone is in sales”. Some people recognize that and some don’t
Jim talks about his dad being a government employee and how different that is from corporate
Mark thinks all men contemplate going on their own, but many can’t overcome the fear and how he coaches such men. He talks about men converting from permanent to consulting
Mark talks about working for stupid people
Jim pokes around with Mark’s career and how he operated as an agent for his candidates
Mark shares how he combines words - consultant, entrepreneur, freelancer…they are all eating what they kill
Jim talks about how our opportunities also depend on what our money situation looks like
Mark talks about deciding to go independent and what that discussion looks like. How agents act as facilitators of risk assessment
Jim brings up the importance of self awareness and that when things change, you need to recalibrate
Everything is connected and we seek alignment through self awareness
Mark shares his experience with people rolling from contract to perm. Job security is a myth
Jim brings up self identity regarding one’s career. How some men identify by what they do
How do you answer the question…”What do you do”. He asks Mark what he says in response
Jim distinguishes between “How do you make money” and “what do you do?”
Both guys share stories about their dads and not talking about their careers or how much they make
Jim asks first…”where are you from”. Isn’t that a better way to start a conversation
Mark shares his reflection about talking about money as a recruiter
Jim shares this in the context of “what are you worth?”
Jim tells a story about attending functions and how helpful it is to NOT lead with what you do
It’s a better conversation when you don’t lead with what you do
Jim asks Mark how he answers the “what do you do” question
Jim talks about introducing people and how he could introduce me to others better than I could
Jim shares how he answers the question “what do you do”. I’m an inventor and what the fuck does that mean?
Mark wraps it up with agency. Jim says it’s also about improved performance
Mark starts by summarizing the 7 episode series describing what the Imperfect Mens Club is all about. The inner circle of self and the surrounding 5 key areas of life
Today the guys discuss the topic of worldview
Worldview comes from childhood experience and your adult experiences
Mark identifies as conservative but more so a pragmatist
Jim agrees generally and adds that our focus is mainly men
Jim brings a real life example with physical and mental health
He also brings up culture, religion and other factors that form one’s worldview
Then he brings up politics and the anxiety and uncertainty it brings up
Politics and being either self accountable or not
Mark says we are not holding people accountable which affects our division
Mark shares how he processes information, particularly information about bad things
He pauses, observes and makes assessments before he concludes
Mark brings up January 6th and wars, crimes, riots and accidents
Jim brings up radiant thinking and the flywheel
Jim reflects on mar’s comment “Jim, it’s always about politics”
Let’s be respectful and try to not to divide even when we disagree
Mark says when he’s talking to someone he disagrees with, he does try and change minds
Discussions of politics need data and objectivity
Now the guys switch to childhood
Jim relates a story about a party he went to and how his first question for a new person is “where did you grow up” to find common ground
Mark tells how his girlfriend and he came from very different environments but the same year and how generational sameness breeds great common ground…movies, sports, songs, phrases and traditions
Jim brings up heritage and nationality as drivers of worldview
Mark brings up subconscious childhood experiences and trauma as drivers of worldview
Mark and Jim both speak about working on mindfulness and inner work
Mark talks about dad and how he practiced his Catholic faith
Mark talks about the bad side of Catholicism and both guys talk about how all large institutions have a small percentage of evil
Mark states the importance of context
Stay rooted in objectivity and facts and be mindful of your subconscious drivers
Jim brings up a conversation with his adult daughter and Mark his
Jim talks about his upbringing as violent and aggressive and how he’s mellowed
Mark gives Jim credit for changing
Mark tells the story of hitting his aunt with an overhead smash when he was 18
Mark brings up his kids and competition
What happens when we disagree - can we remain civil?
Jim says we learn from everyone, which makes us our best selves
Mark goes back at the different stages of life and raising his kids
If you’re paying attention and listening, that’s how you get better
They wrap up with authenticity and being able to be disliked
Without this we lose our dignity
Mark…”I never wanted anyone to kiss my ass”
Our “leaders” are not authentic
Jim talks about intentions and Mark agrees, but adds how important actions are as well
It all comes back to self awareness
Humility encourages self awareness
Mark sets future expectations
The Imperfection is the perfection
Today the guys continue the series on how their fly wheel framework works. The first spoke on the wheel connected to the SELF is the topic of health, both physical and mental
Mark asks wether people are interested in self care?
Mark brings up holistic health and his daughter the health coach
Jim suggests that if you’re going to help people with health you need to appear credible
Mark talks about the guys being athletes and how that affected their health conscious nature and the importance of mental health
Mark and Jim have friends who don’t seem to be interested in self care
Jim is currently into the carnivore diet and whole foods and values the benefit of good protein
He also says you have to listen to your body and managing injury as we get older
Being physically fit makes you more productive in all other areas of your life. “I don’t have time” is bullshit
Jim connects all five areas with health
Mark talks about his upbringing and the transition from traditional medicine the current holistic landscape
Neither of the guys are fans of traditional medicine and believe that you can heal yourself with food
Jim says the drug companies and medical industry are marketing companies
Mark speaks about the popularity of prescription drug advertising
Jim talks about rugby and fitness
Jim transitions in to mental health and experimenting with drugs before getting off them finally
Mark shares the way he thinks we should use drugs…but not long term - lifestyle choices
Jim recounts how we met when Jim was struggling with depression some years back
Mark reflects back on
Mark says we’re all fucked up
Self awareness is the start…am I taking car of myself?
Mark talks about how helpful having an agent is in the journey to perform at higher levels
Jim says environment is a big dal too and Mark concurs
We’re a product of the 5 people you spend the most time with
Mark brings up what we watch and listened - You Tube and anxiety
Mark shares how he gets rid of anxiety very easily
Mark wraps it up with some expectation setting on what’s coming next
Higher performance - Mark cites his mother and father
You have to be ready
If you liked this episode, please rate and review and share it with others you think might like it
Here’s How To Rate And Review Us It takes 2 minutes..Thanks!
Mark begins by summarizing the last episode about the IMC framework and philosophy
He then introduces the concept of “radiant thinking”
Jim shares that he discovered radiant thinking while seeking answers about his dyslexia
Mark reads the definition of radiant thinking
Mark brings up agency and how we function as agents at IMC
Mark speculates that most people don’t self reflect and those that do are triggered by events
He states that true self awareness is a life long journey
Jim talks about the evolution of the IMC
“The imperfection Is The Perfection”
What happens to us does not define us…how we react does
Mark says personal accountability (self-accountability) is the whole deal…the foundation…the juice
Jim brings up self-alignment. Radiant thinking is alignment
Life is not linear, it’s radiant
Jim shares how he thinks the brain works
Mark talks about communicating in a moment. Empathetic listening involves self awareness
When serving others, you begins with empathy and self awareness
Jim speaks of living in the present…leading to self control
Fear comes from the past and the future
Mark shares a recruiter training story about projection - the 90/10 rule of self awareness
Jim says people are seeking people with order and control
Mark asks Jim when he became self-aware and Jim identifies as an inventor
He struggled with communication until he discovered his dyslexia and now he leans on new technology to communicate
Mark asks Jim more about how his mind works
Mark talks about how to speak with different people in different circumstances
Women and men think different…and that’s a good thing…the world needs everybody
Mark reflects on a misunderstanding he had with Jim just before the show
Jim talks about using Chat GPT for foundational work
Mark brings up the time he questioned his faith and he recognized how self awareness is a gift
Jim brings up some conversations with his daughter about being a different person as he grew
Conversations don’t need to be right or wrong. No winner and no loser
The need to be right diminishes over time…or it should
Mark talks about his son’s addiction and recovery and the amazing self awareness that has come into his life
Mark puts the IMC program in the context of self awareness
Jim pulls agency back into the conversation
Most good things come from bad things - Mark Jr’s collapsed lung and recovery
Most people just need a little nudge - that what we do at IMC
Jim says he really appreciates people who can laugh at themselves
Mark jokes about how your kids start turning the tables on you as they become adults
Jim wanted to let his daughter know he’s a different person now - humanizing him
Jim asks Mark…what are your “selves”…he strives for authenticity
Jim ends with self worth and self love and gets a few laughs
Mark begins by setting up what the guys are up to next
The fly wheel of Self Awareness and the foundation of their work
Mark speaks about the Manifesto and upcoming programs in development
Jim goes into some detail about how our wheel works
He explains that we all begin with our self…self awareness, Self accountability…
The guys have both found that in talking with people about our podcast and our direction that many people are in agreement with our philosophy
The center of the wheel and the five areas of focus around the wheel:
Worldview
Relationships
Money
Profession
Health
The imperfection is the perfection
After Jim does a high level summary, the guys go into detail in each of the 5 areas and the center of self
Why are we doing a podcast and what is this wheel all about?
Self awareness is the key to making progress and being successful
Mark talks about experience and the value of mistakes and successes - wisdom
Jim agrees about the importance of self awareness
Mark shares who the program is for and who it’s not for
Why our culture is ripe for self awareness
After committing to being self aware, the next step is self evaluation
Jim brings up the fixing your car analogy
How hard we are on ourselves - self talk
Why having an agent is so helpful - to bring objectivity and help part the clouds
Jim brings up self worth and self accountability
All 5 categories are interconnected
None of this works without self accountability
“Don’t wish it were easier, wish you were better”
Finally the expectation of result is a complete self transformation
Mark shares the difference between band aids on symptoms versus addressing root causes
People who are ready to get to the root cause are who we want in the program
Jim asks Mark to talk about his background in recruiting and then shares his own background
Mark explains his experience and how it helps him as a coach
Jim shares how all 5 areas are always impacted by the other 4. They are all tied together
Mark shares how professional coaching bleeds into all the other areas
Both of us identify as entrepreneurs among other things
Mark talks about learning from the mistakes of others and the value of a good agent
Jim brings up worldview and Mark talks about how one arrives at a worldview
It starts with the adults in our childhood - parents, teachers, coaches, etc…and then reshapes based on our adult political views. Spirituality also factors in
Mark talks about how noisy the political landscape is and ho he’s tried to speak with people who disagree with him civil and with kindness and generosity…the program addresses this
Next up is money - scarcity versus abundance
Scarcity is driven by fear and pessimism. Money is hard to make, rich people are bad…
Mark says he’s ready to help in part because he’s done his own inner work
The next category is Health - Mental and physical
Jim says guys often keep their emotions inside
Mark says it’s all like exercise. Show up every day, consistently, in small doses daily
Breathing, meditating, praying and visualization
Results will come later - delayed gratification. Trust the process and don’t quit
Jim shares how he and Mark together years ago. Depression and seeking a solution
Mark shares his experience with Depression and Jim shares details
Mark say if you commit to the “Self” practices, you can fix almost anything with this holistic approach to root causes
Mark says the next step is an action plan. The “wheel” approach
Mark shares the weakest link in the chain
Being proactive is better than waiting for something bad to happen
The last key area is Relationships
Jim talks about all the different categories in the relationship category
Mark says communication is key. What you say, when you say it, how you say it and to whom you say it
Jim mentions the impact of birth order on your success
Mark begins to set expectations about what’s next. A manifesto and a program rolling out between now and the first of 2024
You can take the manifesto and go it on your own, but for people that want an agent, a guide…we can expedite your journey with our agency, our coaching
Jim brings up the assessment process and the idea that we will also continue to put out free resources to help as many people as possible
Mark “we’re collectively all in this together”
Mark opens with the definition of resentment
What it is and why it shows up in our lives
Jim brings our flywheel into the discussion and how many things are still present from our childhood
The guys both agree how important self awareness and personal accountability
Life is not fair
We all resent, but the difference is between those who wallow and those who look for personal accountability
Jim - I’d rather die trying than live in regret
Mark relates his divorce to the topic
Jim asks, how much are we still stuck in the past
Mark jokes about forgiveness in the context of his ex
Jim puts Mark on the spot
Mark admits he is mad at himself to some extent for thinking he could change her
Jim says most people blame and cannot look inside
Mark talks about managing her reengagement and abandonment and how he needs to let go
Mark brings up his mom’s suicide and how he resented that for a sec
Jim says we all resent
Jim resents our politicians for what they done to ruin the country - Worldview
Jim brings up professional resentment and Mark reminds Jim of his story
Jim says he’s more resentful of allowing his boss to get away with it
Resentment and dignity are intertwined
Mark brings back the concept of unfairness and why he speaks up, why he votes
Jim brings back the wheel
Money resent - Mark talks about not hiding money and being taken advantage of
Making decisions an emotional state
Mark resents not firing his attorney and the back story to that
Jim shares his attorney story…that fucking guy…
Mark talks about firing his attorney and then getting sole custody of his kids
Mark talks about his kids resentment of that whole process and everyone in it
Negative emotions processed quickly and moving on with learning is the way to go
Jim brings up listening to a podcast with the author of The Secret - it’s good to get your problems out or they’ll sneak up on you later…regret and resentment
Mark talks about how to process resentment and regret and how some of it stays around and needs further work
Mark talks about accepting your responsibility and how to move on, Self aware, nope to blame, and create space for some loving thought…move on
Jim speaks to learning what not to do if that bad thing happens again
Mark says you don’t make good decisions from a place of fear
Jim says yes and it’s unfair to blame others in that same spot
Blame gets you nowhere
I’m sorry and I forgive you…unconditionally
Mark talks about apologizing to his son and the time leading up to it
Jim references a Podcast about Putin and how he became who he is
How we become who we are. Pain and resentment can shape us
Mark says he’s a broken man. Not an excuse, but an understanding
Jim relates Putin’s judo background to his recent actions
Mark talks bullyinigand the psychology of it
Mark begins with what he believes “agency” is
We all need an agent off and on during our lives
Jim adds to the definition from his perspective
Jim tells a story about his good friend who was a professional baseball manger
The story of a young man signing a $40 million dollar contract and how he didn’t negotiate the contract, his agent did
The agent is not emotionally attached, strictly business
Mark talks about his career as an agent - recruiter
Agents need to be great listeners
Family and friends do not make good agents, they’re too close
Jim talks about another good friend who played in the NFL
Coaches have agents too
Pros and celebrities often need protection from their own families
Great agents can be life changing
Mark and Jim bring the flywheel framework into the discussion - agency touches every spot on the wheel
Jim asks Mark about his recruiting experience and how that works
Mark brings up a more recent client experience
Mark says how valuable questions are in helping someone with a big decision
Vulnerability and fear are driving forces and agents can really help with these
Change makes people uncomfortable
Much of what a good agent does has nothing to do with money
Both of Mark’s daughters, who are coaches, have coaches
Great agents get deep into the personal lives of their clients
Both guys are natural mentors and people come to them for advice all the time
Mark talks about his decision to start his own company and telling his dad
Jim - some of the worst advice came from the people closest to him
Jim distinguishes between experience, knowledge and wisdom
We don’t have the answers, but we can facilitate our clients answering their own questions
Wisdom comes from bad decisions, mistakes and failure
Telling someone that you know what they should do is irresponsible
Mark tells the story about helping his girlfriend’s daughter - changed her life
Agents help create clarity and confidence…and hope
Jim talks about the importance of good tools and people to teach you how to use them
Jim asks Mark what tools he uses as a recruiter
Resumes, LinkedIn profiles and his “Find Your True Purpose” workbook - self assessment
Jim brings up roadmaps and Mark mentions our new partner Jeff and his roadmapping tool
They discuss the areas they can help with - quite a few
Jim brings up AI and it’s uses moving forward
Mark mentions two AI. uses and how important prompts are
Both guys agree everyone needs to look into AI
Mark offers their services
Don’t take criticism from someone who you would not go to for advice
The guys are both dealing with anxiety and flinch at how widespread it is
Mark reads a definition
Then he puts anxiety in the context of our self awareness fly wheel
Mark’s kids all have issues with anxiety and they were all together last weekend
Mark speaks to the sources of anxiety
Jim restates the use of our wheel and The Middle East conflict as a source of anxiety
Jim starts sharing some stories that happened over the weekend at a college football game. He had two small “run ins” during and after the game
Jim brings up the media
Mark brings up our uncertain future including talk of another world war
Jim says war is what humans do
It’s not a partisan conversation, it’s a collective national position
Mark talks about the covid disaster, immigration, Ukraine, Israel and Hamas
Jim brings in China and Russia
Jim reflects on the good that came after World War 2
We’ve lost all trust in our government and large institutions
Mark says we’re also moving away from God - God fearing people are happier
No higher power increase loneliness and anxiety
Church is as much about community as it is about religion
Isolation is on the rise because of all these things…more anxiety
Jim comes back to his sports stories - college football
We have experience with the 18 to 35 year olds (we both have daughters)
Mark thinks men are being emasculated and this is confusing the kids in this age group
Both guys agree on progress and tradition. Some changes have been good and some have turned out to be harmful and unproductive
Back to the football game related stories
Nothing good happens when the word “dude” enters the conversation:)
Jim got the stink eye for his “ladies first” comment. How dare you call me a lady
Mark says it’s too bad we even have to think about this shit
Mark shares his coffee shop experiences with liberals and language
Jim gets hit with a peanut in the back of his head and threw it back and hit the wrong guy in the head (another dude)
Jim thinks young people are angry and anxious and have been brainwashed about our country and certain traditions
When your anxious it’s more likely you’ll get angry
Mark shares his wellness routine including breathing, praying and meditation. These are all anxiety killers
Jim has decided to be more reflective, empathetic and self aware
Mark inserts his personal accountability stance and Jim agrees
The world doesn’t need more anger, hate or anxiety
The guys are talking about triggers. We all have them
Knowing what your triggers are makes them easier to handle
This involves self awareness and that takes work
Mark mentions pausing when you get triggered
Triggers in this context are negative
Pausing allows you to regain objectivity
Jim talks about triggers from his childhood and younger years
When you allow yourself to be triggered all kinds of bad things can happen
Jim brings up our flywheel and the 5 areas
Profession - what kind of bosses have you had. Mark cites a LinkedIn post that he commented on where his story was similar but the end was different. Jim talks about the uncertainty and failure that is being and inventor
Money is loaded with triggers. Scarcity to abundance. Both our parents and grandparents come from scarcity families. Mark mentions his dad and Jim his mom
Worldview - Trigger land with politics. Jim brings up the Gaza conflict and his anger for the current administration. Both guys talk about limiting media intake to avoid getting so triggered
Mark says politicians and media are triggering us on purpose. Jim says what’s happening now is a religious war and that shapes our worldview. Mark shares a car accident story and how we are triggered by tragedy.
Health - Mental health is where the triggers are. Mental health needs constant attention. Mark shares his aging process and how it triggers emotions
Relationships - Men and woman..Mark says men are different. Men do confidence, competition and simple things. Jim says men are simpler and Jim says woman armor complicated and clever as well
Mark weaves in a story about his ex wife and her triggering strategy. Jim has a friend in a similar toxic ex-wife relationship and kids
Mark tells part of his ex-wife story…talk about triggers and her manipulation techniques
Jim’s perspective in support of Mark
Mark and Jim are both fascinated with human behavior
Both guys have a good laugh and give their understanding that her bad behavior is driven by anger and sadness
Mark gives some details and they both identify this behavior as projection
Jim tells a story about his Europe trip and his interaction with his wife regarding spending so much time together and how they got along
Mark identifies this as a transformative moment - empty nest
Mark’s ex comes back into the story - a lack of self-awareness
Jim says a lot of people are outwardly shiny but inwardly miserable
Mark says the external stuff is not how you get to happy. Happy is all internal
Fear based versus love based decisions
Mark brings up gratitude and how long his list is when he thinks about it
Jim ties in humility and how powerful that emotion can be. How adversity shapes us
Jim brings up AA members and how self accountable they are
Skilled sailors are built on rough seas
Mark’s ex comes back in again - Jim plays psychologist
Jim mentions the difference between knowledge and wisdom
Wisdom is born of experience
We took last week of because Jim was traveling around Europe for a few weeks
Mark suggests we use The Wheel and Jim explains the 5 components of the wheel
Relationships, Money, Health, Profession, and Worldview
Mark adds the center of the wheel - Self
Mark brings in Worldview
Mark asks Jim about his trip
We discuss how things have changed everywhere
Jim reminds us that Europe has always had wars going on
Jim says America is no longer the big stick and Europe has lost respect for us
Jim was treated quite well by the French - great food and people
He felt the Europeans were more in harmony…
Things and people were lighter, less threatening, easier
Mark says the media exaggerates how bad things are
Americans are competitive, individualistic and
Jim brings sports into the discussion
Jim talks about the difference in approaches to work and life
Europeans Start later, close earlier, linger over meals and take more vacations
Mark talks about work ethic being embedded in the DNA
Mark shares his daughters wanting to linger over meals and not eating fast
Europeans linger and eat for the experience
Europeans socialize and enjoy each others company
Mark misses eating dinner together as a family
Jim cites that corporations have taken over in the US and small business is thriving in Europe
Small businesses are becoming scarce here in the US
Covid accelerated everything
Mark talks about tradition breaking down over here
Jim explains why European roads have roundabouts and we don’t
Jim saw a great deal of young people out and about
In US people are growing old and lonely where in Europe 3 and 4 generations live together
Mark talks about growing up in Boston and the Italian and the Irish neighborhoods
Money doesn’t buy happiness. It creates isolation and complacency
Jim wants to know more about which countries have more than 2 political parties
Mark jokes about American ignorance
Jim wants a third party and thinks it would lessen the division over here
Europeans have their own countries but they’re also European and have figured out how to get along
Mark brings up the Ryder Cup
Jim talks about his visit to the World Rugby Championships which is one of the reasons for his trip
Game comes first and the player comes second - the ultimate honor is to represent your country
Mark brings tradition back up and the activity of taking down statues
Jim brings up the Irish “Troubles” and Mark shares his experience having married an Irish girl
Jim brings up the current situation in Israel
Mark goes off a bit about globalization the pro Palestinian riots here in the US
Mark gives his opinions on Israel and Jim had enough:)
Jim said things have changed but he has too
Jim says he was purposeful about respecting each different culture as he moved from country to country
Mark remember taking public transportation and get off at the last stop of the train and sample the small town off the map places. Genuine and hospitable
Both guys loved Amsterdam
Jim finishes with a story about visiting his cousin in the Swiss Alps by Lake Cuomo
Mark talks about his dad’s family ties in Newfoundland and his desire to visit there
Jim is traveling for the rugby World Cup He doesn’t have his good mic but it should be fine
Jim shares some details about the games and some of the places he plans on visiting
Mark makes the statement that most people don’t travel much
Jim shares some trips one and two years ago and how technology has made traveling much easier
Mark talks about his dad and brother’s worldly travel and his ability to travel as a kid
Mark reflects on how airline travel has changed
Mark tells his story sitting in the cockpit with his dad while taking off!
Jim sat next to the King of Tonga at the Tonga/Canada rugby match a few years ago and then has other rugby stories to tell
Jim gives insights into the difference between rugby and other sports
Jim reminds Mark that the world has become much smaller and you can get access to fine things everywhere and things are expensive everywhere
Mark tells his story about visiting Dublin in the 90’s versus today. Mixed races, food, cell phones and traffic. Then he goes on to his trip to Europe after college
Mark says you can tell in moments if the person you are speaking with has traveled
Jim says it’s not better or worse, it’s just different and you get adjusted and people get along
Jim shifts to his experience in Amsterdam and how cool it is. A lot of young people and all the restaurants were full
Jim talks about our laws versus the relative openness in Europe (drinking and cell phone usage)
Mark talks about his trip to the North of France and how they were celebrating their 2000th anniversary. Perspective
Mark talks about how vast the Roman Empire was and how fragile things are and how civilizations fall quickly
Jim brings up the war in Ukraine and Mark shares his own views
Americans don’t know European history
Marks talks about the documentary about cities in the world where more people live beyond 100 and why - the family culture, good food, faith and exercise
Jim brings up globalization and the impact on tradition and culture
Jim talks about his disappointment in the amount of graffiti in Milan and all over the world for that matter
Mark cites a lack of respect and accountability
Jim agrees that the younger generation has stopped caring and are scared
Mark also says, these criminals are not being arrested
Mark says the people in power are scaring the younger generation with climate change and war
Jim speaks to the lack of homeless people in Europe and Mark ends with some accountability
Mark starts talking about being a Baby Boomer and how we think generationally
There are a number of differences that impact our thinking
Geography, culture, religion, age, gender…
Jim says we need to understand and be aware of where people are coming from
Jim brings up Entitlement and says entitled people hold themselves in higher regard and then expands on what entitlement can mean
Mark talks about older generational wisdom and storytelling and his father’s monthly poker games
Jim says all those people are also flawed
Mark talks about his “perfect” dad and his uncle Kevin and the contrast and context.
Jim brings up Mark’s deal making and the idea that he’s dealing with 2 or 3 generations in one deal 20’s to 50’s
Mark talks about his kids friends when they were teenagers and Jim brings up the fact that that was 15 years ago!
15 years ago things were different
Just because it’s different doesn’t mean it’s bad
Jim brings up an event he went to in San Francisco over the bridge. He speaks about how liberal politicians have ruined SF, but…?
Jim talks about how big cities go through cycles and that maybe SF is on the mend??? Private citizens and business owners have hired their own police forces just in the last few weeks and have made hundreds of arrests and convictions
Mark talks about his experience with crime and homelessness in FL
Generational leadership - both our presidential choices are embarrassing and old. Old politicians are being reelected and we expect things to chance
America need to get the older generation out and a new younger generation
Mark brings up Rogan, Musk, Carrolla and Maher
Bill Maher has become interesting in light of his stance on free speech and free thought…a great sign
Mark talks about politics in a generational context
Stop bullshitting me and don’t tell me how to think. Our generation needs to take responsibility for fixing
Jim talks generational coaching evolution from Vince Lombardi to Bill Walsh. From WW2 gritty to West Coast offense and more encouraging
Not breaking down and rebuilding but coaching them up. Management styles have changed also…more empathy
Mark talks about racism and it’s roots and the difference between race and culture
Mark cites the different times and how we judge people during the time in which they live
Generational differences are real and need to be recognized
Mark brings up a poll “YouGov”
Jim asks some good questions about the poll
What people believe versus what is actually the case
Perception versus reality
What % of the country is black?
The guys talk about reality versus speculation
How many marriages are mixed race?
local versus national and how we’re being misled
How many families make more than $500,000
What % of Americans are vegetarian?
Mark brings up his brother - in law and the idea that we all need different diets/consumption
What % of Americans live in NYC?
What % of Americans are transgender?
We are expending energy on tiny slivers of the population and we are being distracted from our real problems
Mark brings up Disney and Jim feels optimistic about race, gender and ESG trends moving back to center
Both guys are optimistic about the ship turning back to practicality
Mark identifies these trends as social engineering and not human nature
The poll is now over and Mark shares some commentary
The media runs race, gender and wealth stories - you’re being brainwashed
The reality is that most people are practical and think just like you do
Mark cites events that are blown out of proportion
Jim says the media and advertising are one in the same and speaks about the history of the media
Jim tells his dynamite story - the media fuels and incites false narratives
Media got regulated and now it’s come full circle back to monetary incentive
The media is driven by money and advertisers and not the news
Jim brings up Big Pharma
Mark brings up the upcoming NFL season and political campaigns
Mark is a fan of investigation before acceptance
Mark tells his bank teller story - the human condition
What does the “mainstream media” even mean anymore
Joe Rogan comes up as one who is being authentic and practical - answering only to himself
Mark - “Dad, how do I know what to believe?”
Mark distinguishes between the left, the right, the middle and then the fringes on the right and left
Jim thinks that’s a 3rd party
Mark mentions Tip O’Neil. The Dems and Repubs used to get shit done over dinner and cocktails
Mark talks about Magic and Larry Bird
Jim bring up LeBron James and Colin Kaepernick
Jim is bothered by the race baiting the most
Mark ends with how to deal with emotion and not taking the bait
Mark brings up the topic of adjustments in middle age
He asks Jim about his recent trip alone for 11 days in his fully equipped Ford Transit van
Jim cites his solo journeys started a few years ago. “Things were getting tough”
He went to Europe alone and discovered some things about himself
Jim’s van is fully equipped - bathroom stove and bed
He went through 7 states in 11 days and realized America is a beautiful place
The quiet was wonderful and he appreciated the opportunity to think his own thoughts
Mark mentions retreats and sweat shops
Jim enjoyed the nights in his van as much as the one night at the Ritz
Mark asks Jim how his wife feels about this and his answer is cool
There’s a mutual benefit
Mark talks about his alone time beach afternoons every Wednesday for 6 months and how spiritual and relaxing the sun and ocean are
Jim talks about his food experience. He brought his own and didn’t drink that much
The guys talk about alcohol
Jim says changing your environment is healthy and how much he appreciates windshield time…sunsets, fields and mountains
Jim brings up people and the differences from more dense populations
Mark says the would be good for everyone, but particularly good for people you don’t like being alone
Jim appreciated not having a deadline or destination to restrict him and how he could come and go as he pleased because of the van
Jim liked the alone time for the self sufficiency. No lines, no waiting…
Gas prices in SF were $6/gal and in Utah it was $3.97
Jim cites California’s challenges
The disparity between Twin Falls Wyoming and Las Vegas!
He has two friends he visited that started over and now have built great new lives
The power of a change in environment
Mark talks about the notion of annual guy weekends
Jim talks about friendship in mid-life and rekindling with good friends
Jim switches to his Florida alligator story - his metaphor…when you move out of your “space” you grow
Both guys speak to the value at 17 or 18 of “leaving” to grow
Mark wanted to go as soon as he graduated
If you’re not living, you’re dying
Mark says college is no longer serving most young adults and leaving to another country might be the thing that’s best for our youth
Jim cite’s Israel’s youth program and that there are social acclimation benefits to college
Jim ends with the phenomenon that was weather on his trip. In charge, in control of your environment
Mark brings up Dopamine
Jim cites a book he just read relating to neuro diverse people and how their brains work differently. The dyslexic mind processes 4 or 5 times faster than a normal brain. This is good and bad
Drugs sex and gambling are some bad sources
The connection between dopamine and addiction
Our cell phones are dopamine crazy
Mark cites a 60 minutes experiment with Anderson Cooper about exactly this
Jim brings up workaholics and dopamine
Mark brings up his older brother as ADHD when it wasn’t yet diagnosed
Both guys have doubts about the need for all these drugs
Mark tells about his “runners high” experience in Chicago in his 20’s and marathoners
Jim shares his 20 year career of dopamine hits from rugby
Both guys are of the opinion that dopamine can be had through only natural sources
Mark talks about his meditation practice
Jim asks about the negative sources of dopamine
The guys talk about fighting when they were younger
Mark tells his fight story with his son present (8 years old)
Jim shares some of his experiences being in full control during sex, sports and fighting. Full control
Primal urges and survival
Jim brings up concussions and some studies he’s familiar with. Jim’s conclusions and how Mark and Jim met
Both guys talk about pro sports and retirement
Mark brings up his fighter pilot brother and retirement. Then they talk about veterans
Sports coaching and the differences between sports and business
Jim says that’s why sports are played in seasons…not sustainability
Mark brings up middle aged men and replacing old habits
Jim says he’s struggling with the middle aged transition
Mark brings up his dad and aging adjustments
Jim brings up alcohol and the first 1 or 2 drinks
Mark shares his alcohol stories
Jim uses the phrase “lubricant for the mind”
Good conversations can hit you up with dopamine. Meeting new people
Mark talks about presenting an offer to a candidate as a real high
The conversation starts with Jim’s 15th annual barbecue for the High School football team he played for 40 years ago…good stuff
Jim reflects back to how he became an active volunteer for the high school and specifically his football team 15 years ago
Mark makes the observation that good players rarely make good coaches. Many great players don’t want to be coaches
Jim started helping by being the weight coach for the freshmen and saw that the training facilities were in really bad shape. And that kids are kids. No color or size or hair style…just kids
Jim began a fund raising initiative for new facilities and all the details that went into that He rallied some successful alum and raised a ton of money…some of them professional athletes
It started with a golf tournament and then they all reflected on how life changing these investments of time and money could be and the went into high gear
Mark gives Jim kudos for the great work
Then Jim tells us what the program looks like now and how these efforts will give young men direction and belonging…changing lives
Jim fills in the gaps from his life journey from high school graduation to today…very cool
The importance of strong male role models
Jim shares some more football stories and life lessons including him overcoming some major transformative events including a car accident and discovering he had dyslexia
Jim ties it all back into his 15 year run asa mentor and this years backyard barbecue
High school kids are being “prepared in socialism and released into capitalism”
“The Season Of Life” book is an important set of lessons about men’s roles in this world
Jim shares the status of 9 alum that are all successful that also came back to the barbecue
One of the alum brought a “special guest”. An alum named Andre Ward - gold medal undefeated champion boxer who gave an awesome speech for about 15 minutes
Jim opens a window to all the politics and effort that went into what has become a movement to include all 3 high schools in the district $240 million dollars raised!
Mark and Jim share their perspectives on Andre’s speech,,,powerful. Jim shares Andre’s credentials as an athlete, but more importantly as a man
Jim breaks down Andre’s speech
Other topics…show up every day
Jim opens the barbecue with his “one rule”…there are no rules. You guys earned the right to be here…and they have not had one incident in 15 years
Mark mentions Bill Campbell and the book “Trillion Dollar Coach”
Jim shares some more alumni success stories and ties them into their common “wins”
The guys appreciate how sports eliminates the group speak. Skin color doesn’t matter in sports
Mark talk more about the importance of men being men and Jim agrees..why all the division
Mark thinks politics has bled into many areas that it doesn’t belong. Scare people and weaken them and you can control them
Mark and Jim agree on the political division but think it’s turning
Great stories!!
Mark leads with integrity
Jim is reminded about the difference between integrity and morality
Mark tells the story of his busboy coke dealer friend from his 20’s
Jim talks about his gardener as the man he knows with the most integrity and how his house cleaner is a close 2nd - Lupe’s success story
Mark talks about teaching his kids to do what they say
The guys discuss punctuality and “Island Time”
How does integrity change from culture to culture
How about mistakes and forgiveness
People with integrity take personal responsibility
Mark talks about how he trained his employees to be responsible regardless
Mark talks about service people and those who take responsibility and those who don’t
Holding the door open for women…everybody. And when people don’t say thank you
What about forgiveness and integrity
All the words the are right underneath integrity
You can’t be a leader without integrity…people won’t follow you
Jim sales call story
Mark’s mentorship story and self respect
When you play stupid games you win stupid prizes
Jim’s 2nd sales story - game playing.
Mark talks about his new hedge fund buddy and his integrity checking approach
Mark asks Jim about why people stay in jobs where they are being disrespected
Jim has a great counterpoint to Mark’s position
Your integrity will be put to the test
Mark starts with saying he thinks he has a brand and it’s a work in progress
Mark talks about asking friends what his superpower is. Communication was the common thread
Think of a phrase, start using it, keep using it
Jim brings up the difference between company brands and personal brands
Mark loves the word authenticity, but ironically to claim to be authentic means you’re not
Mark brings up Bill Campbell and The Trillion Dollar Coach
Jim struggles with the personal component of branding and wants to figure it out. We don’t naturally celebrate our accomplishments . It’s generational
Things need to make sense. The goal is to be authentic and consistent
The goal is to help others
Jim brings up the $1000 cup of coffee in the context of how we might offer our services
Mark agrees that people need to be qualified and have skin in the game
He talks about being a podcast guest as a marketing strategy
Jim takes the topic deeper and gets interested in the psychology of qualifying prospects…we need to qualifying them
Mark shares the context of being the editor of the podcast. Our stuff is good
What are you worth? How much should I charge?
Jim loves the idea of agency. Everyone needs an agent
We should be agents
The Wall Street Journal article about mid life crisis/transition coaching space
Jim’s take on the article is a bit different. He shares his wife’s experience at a women’s retreat
Mark appreciates the need for community and purpose
The value of being of service
Mark talks about the hiring process and his project helping a couple of kids looking to start a recruiting company
Mark shares the idea of mastermind groups
Jim recognizes that the work is helping people rebrand themselves
Mark brings up Larry Bird, Bob Wolfe and Red Auerbach
Then Tom Brady and Bill Belichick and ego
Let’s be agents for aspirational clients
Jim opens with a story about his disappointment and shies away from talking about himself
Mark jumps in and shares how he has had to disappoint people as a recruiter for 35 years…sorry man you didn’t get the job
Jim reminds us that it’s a big deal for him to even fill out an application because he has dysgraphia. Mark reminds Jim of how he should be proud of having overcome this limitation
Jim then shares how one little dissapointment brings every other disappointment in your life rushing into your consciousness and you beat yourself up. This can help you reanalyze things but it can also be challenging
Mark brings in his kids and how they were abandoned in the divorce. Getting rejected blows and watching others get disappointed is rough
Mark talks about being empathetic and Jim makes the point that he’s sharing less
The less you share the easier life is
The guys talk about cutting each other off and the way they communicate on the podcast
Mark talks a bit more about his divorce and how it impacted the sale of the company. His disappointment in one of his partners and how his other partner was awesome
Jim brings back in Mark’s recruiting experience disappointing people. Mark get’s into more detail about feedback in the interview process
Mark talks about how the ego plays into disappointment
Jim mentions he isn’t set up well to fail because he succeeded early in life. It also is a time to reflect on how to get better
Mark brings God into the discussion
Mark reflects on his mother and sister. What part of this disappointment could he influence
Is compassions better response
Mark talks about how competition is both a friend and foe
Jim agrees. He then brings creativity and Anthony Bourdain and Robin Williams
Dopamine
Why would someone take his own life?
Mark asks Jim, how should you behave when you have to disappoint someone
Jim says call. No text, no email. Compassion and empathy
Mark says if possible, face to face
Mark cites his recent article about the lousy feedback step in the interview process
Mark brings up Monty Python and the Life of Brian - man being woman
In the context of social media - reaction to your online posting/articles
Jim shares his online application experiences
Mark wants to talk about recapping the takeaways
Humanity, compassion and context. Person to person
How should we handle disappointment ourselves
Jim and Mark agree…don’t complain and don’t share all your disappointments
Nobody gives a shit about you or your stuff
Jim has a 14 year old house guest. She has come for the 3rd summer.Jim and she get a long
He discusses what he is learning from her as well as mentoring her
When he uses a word she doesn’t understand he asks her to Google it and screen shot for reuse later in life
He tells her he thinks she will do great things
Mark says to tell her not to ever do anything because someone says she should
Mark talks about the subconscious and how Jim’s mentorship could change her life
One of the words Jim and his guest Googled the word subconscious and how unconscious is related
Jim reads the definition of “subconscious”
Mark says he heard that we are formed by the age of 4 or 5 and then your environment kicks in. Parents, friends, relatives, worldview, etc…
Jim recognizes his responsibility as a role model
Mark also recognizes the importance of mentorship. Then he goes into how we have control over our thoughts yet rarely exercise control over them
Mark talks about his dream and how it was so positive rather than the normal conflict memory
The guys talk about dreams in specific and general and Mark attributes it to his inner work
We can control ourselves and our subconcious thoughts toward a better life
You either get bitter or you get better and its a choice
Jim talks a bit more about his house guest
Mark talks about a call with his friend and his question about the kids
Mark told his friend that he was happiest that all 3 kids take responsibility for their own happiness
Once you figure out it’s all up to you, things get better
Jim talks about fabricated fun spots and the guys agree they don’t like them
They both share childhood vacation stories
Mark asks what are those subconscious things that are “in his way”?
Jim texts some writing on the subconscious mind he found online and Mark reads them…in the opposite order than he was meant to:)
The writing/articles focus on both the subconscious mind and some words by Freud
The articles really relate to the guys discussion and then Jim brings back in the application of some of these principles to his 14 year old guest…very cool
Mark talks about our obligation to model and mentor to teach people how manage their emotions and awareness
Jim doesn’t think older people will be convinced to change their mind and Mark agrees…except for his dad:)
You have to listen well and you have to pay attention
Both guys agree not to look to others for happiness
Jim tells his wonderful mentorship stories with the football teams of his alma mater. He’s done it for 15 years and accomplished a ton over the years. Great stories!!
Mark shares his stories working with the homeless kids
Mark speaks directly to middle aged men and their choices about controlling their happiness
Jim talks about one particular coach and how we all have our story
Jim thinks that without sports he’d be in jail
Mark shares a Denzel Washington story
Jim says it doesn’t have to be a father that mentors, just a good man who wants to
Jim starts curious about my idea about ageism as a topic
I’m 61 and Jim is 58
70 is the new 50 Mark talks about the lag between having a new trend and when we catch up
Mark talks about the logic behind dismissing solely based on age
Jim brings up output and Jim casts some doubt about
Mark talks about remote vs productivity, vs context
Mark talks about the frailty of youth and the benefits of experience
Mentorship - experience and wisdom
It’s time to leave a mark…a legacy
Jim - you get bitter or you get better
Mark speaks to Jim’s dysleksia
Jim talks about his father in-law losing his filter
Mark talks about the people who choose better
Being negative is easy. Being positive takes work
Mark’s default is not opting for anger
Another of Jim’s favorite quotes…reading and writing
Mark reflects on Jim’s dyslexia
Mark brings his dad in again and talks about his ability to make you feel special
Our kids are distracted
Mark gets a bit emotional about safe spaces and victimhood
Jim jumps in to defend young people
Jim talks about our fathers being learners - intellectually deep and interesting
Mark puts his perspective back in. He loves young people
Let’s just reconsider the value of experience
We complicate things more when we’re young
We’re making things complicated
Jim talks about how there is so much change
Threads vs Twitter
Where is this going?
Jim brings up Government tech collusion
Mark says why don’t we know more sooner when bad things happen. Evidence should be available sooner and people should be punished
Don’t think like everyone else
Pay attention and choose better
Let’s talk law enforcement. Mark says it must be really difficult to be a cop now
Same with politicians
Jim brings up the BLM protests and he says it’s a tipping point. Mayors and Governors giving orders for police to stand down
Jim says it’s weak leadership
Mark talks about getting arrested at age 12 - “bumper skiing”
Jim talks about crime and the lack of consequences as well as the current state of San Francisco
How did we get here? Laws not being enforced
Mark describes what he believes the hierarchy - cops, criminals and DA’s
Are DA’s being selectively selected - Liberal versus conservative
Mark says the data does not support systemic racism and the problem is much deeper
Jim talks about being arrested as a young man and how it curbed his behavior. Drinking and driving at 14 and how he talked his way out of it
Mark has respect for the police from his parents
Both guys talk about being held to account by their parents
The best police candidates are shying away and older cops are retiring early
Jim tells positive cop stories and how it’s different now
If you physically accost a cop, you lose your rights
Both guys agree cops demand respect and we need them to avoid chaos
We need to let cops enforce the laws
Jim talks about too much law enforcement being a challenge too
Both guys also said that cops need to behave correctly
How we form our opinions about cops
Mark gets arrested again!
Jim talks about teaching young men how to treat cops and then tells about an interaction with cops at his home during a party for high school football players
One lesson is that you need to also know your rights as well as being calm and respectful with cops
Jim knew he had a life lesson opportunity with the kids
Mark praises Jim’s mentorship and Jim says we need to help the police
Mark tells two more “getting arrested” stories
The boys talk about how challenging it is to be a cop and how Mark was essentially racialy profiled - AKA great police work and that he felt no inclination to press charges - they were trying to protect us
Jim finishes with a story about some cousins who spent time in prison and how he reconnected with one of his cousins who got out of jail. The officer who arrested him became a mentor to the ex con. He said the officer saved his life
We don’t celebrate the good things cops do
Mark says the cop thing is bigger than just the cops. It’s society too
Jim starts with resistance is part of life
He uses weight lifting as an example
The results occur over time with consistency
Mark talks about resistances due to ego and that resistance is a sign of progress
Everyone has the same issues
Jim says it happens early and forever
The guys love their sports:)
Resistance is physical, emotional, and spiritual
Resistance feels bad, but it’s good and your results manifest over time
Mark admits to a fear of success and Jim disagrees
Mark talks about getting criticized on line
Jim quotes - “If you’re not failing you’re not trying hard enough” and “don’t wish it was easier, wish you were better” and “I’;d rather die trying”
Mark tells about his first big risk and not being scared at all
Jim recognizes different stages of life and why young people’s ignorance can be a gift.
Jim brings ego back into the discussion
The guys discuss professional athletics and retirement as well as Jim’s most recent fundraiser. Jim puts his ego aside later in life
Mark says if you need your ego to get something done you’re probably doing the wrong thing
Mark talks about his older brother and his retirement from flying jet fighters
Jim talks about the importance of humility
Mark says humility is a strength not a weakness
Jim recalls taking his son to the US Open and his rugby finals loss as a youngster
Mark talks about his kids always listening and watching him
Jim tells his story about his Japanese assistant and shares some Japanese culture - what you do, not what you say
Mark reminds us that getting gut punched means you’re making progress
The guys end with self awareness, self evaluation and self execution
Mark starts out with western medicine and frames it from raising kids to present day
The guys both believe the system is broken
Jim wants to personalize the story…his dad passed before Covid and ht family is grateful he passed able to be with family 2019
Jim talks about his friend who died alone during Covid, who died from a “Covid related” issue
He tells a third story about people losing everything to the healthcare system in the last days of their lives
Mark tells his childhood story of his knee prognosis - surgery or no surgery
Mark tells the story about his dog and pediatrician:)
Question everything
Mark talks about taking the kids to doctors when they were young
The pharmaceutical industry and it’s corruption
The guys talk about nurses and doctors and the system and it’s broken nature
Jim talks about the fact that they “practice” medicine and are flawed
Then they go into our food system and the poison that is our food
Mark asks, “aren’t we responsible for our own health?” And then transitions into the holistic alternative
The whole medical industry contributes to the problem
Mark talks about his fathers health journey - 94 years young
Mark talks about personal choices
Jim talks about the placebo effect
Mark and Jim disagree about doctors, Mark is more skeptical
Mark blames all the institutions surrounding the delivery of care - CDC, FDA, AMA, insurance companies, etc…
Jim talks about the collusion between all these entities
Mark throws Fauci under the bus with all the other politicians
Mark talks about questioning doctors and the gender confusion issue
Medicine is a business, it’s a profit driven business
Jim shares a story about his neck surgery then and now from his rugby days…very compelling…second opinions
Mark applauds Jim’s decision
They both talk about emotional issues manifesting into physical maladies
Doctors are human and therefore imperfect - you need to question diagnosis and how many different entities are driving medical decisions
Jim shares some personal details about some behaviors that impact his health
Mark talks about self care and tells his daughter’s “sting” experience with the department of health
Jim says if you walk into a doctors office, you’ll walk out sick
Mark tells his story about the heart surgeon who had a heart attack and how it changed his approach to wellness
Jim shares his carnivore diet story
Mark concludes about how fear makes people do things they wouldn’t normal do
Covid was a farce and take your health into your own hands
Make good choices. The choice is yours
Jim says do the right thing 80% of the time and you'll be good
Mark’s mic was off but the sound is good enough and the content is too good to do it over
Mark starts with a great quote from Denzel Washington
Jim says the imperfection is the perfection
Todays topic is around the idea of giving up or quitting and letting go
Jim talks about quitting as a normal feeling but that actually quitting brings about regret…he’d rather die trying
Mark talks about quitting being necessary to make space for new things…or people
The guys talk about being harmed by people that you need to let go
Jim states that hanging on or chasing relationships is giving up your dignity or is it compassion?
Jim shares a couple of stories about friendships lost and old friendships renewed
As life gets complicated you have to make choices and some of those choices are hard
Sometimes people disappear for good reason and come back later
Mark quotes his dad “If you’re not being taken advantage of every once in a while, you’re not being nice enough to people”
The guys bring up self awareness and self worth as guiding emotions in the context of ego
Jim talks about the value of forgiveness and how hard it is
Mark talks about reconnecting with his mentor after 25 years…why it took so long and how nice it is
Jim catches Mark saying “you don’t really know why though do you?”
Jim talks about friends growing bitter and not better and how difficult it is…Mark agrees and talks specifically about health
As soon as you give up on your health, everything else follows
The guys bring up quitting on family
Mark mentions the daughter in-law and mother-in law challenge and the relationship with his own mother
Jim asks what about when people quit on us?
The guys both cite personal examples
Both guys cite conditional relationships they experienced
Mark talks about revisiting self-awareness daily because of how circumstances change and evolve sometimes really fast
Mark talks about having choices when time is freed up and how choosing to serve others is a great choice
Jim puts the topic in the context of Mark’s career advisory services
And how important career decisions are in the context of life
Jim quotes the book “Strength to Strength” regarding your second half of life regarding lessening capabilities and developing wisdom
Mark cites his dad as a great role model
Jim talks about his sister and a recent call he got from her that was quite validating. Mark talks about his sister in a very different light
He talks about what he calls “conditional” relationships and how he won’t stay in them
Then the guys talk about different ways of quitting and how sometimes we get back together because we forget why we quit in the first place
We can get back together when both people come back lovingly and with the benefit of the doubt
This episode starts “mid idea’ with Jim sharing where he thinks “it” started
What “it” turns out to be is leadership and the division of ideology known as “woke” and “rational”:)
Mark tells his story about the Russian spy who defected. How he said on a tv talk show in the 70’s that the Russians have been infecting our schools with a socialist/communist
The guys cite the Bud Light and Target incidents where they tried to serve the LGBTQ community and it blew up in their face
Mark reflects back on some DEI discussion we had and how it leads to having unqualified people in positions of power. Identity politics
Mark says we need to hold people accountable and Jim is encouraged by the Bid Light debacle
Jim mentions white guilt and entitlement at the core of this issue and then he brings up Blackrock and the DEI/ESG initiatives being pushed back on.
Both guys are optimistic that the wokeness is not sustainable
Mark and Jim consider all of it propaganda
Mark tells his story about the first time seeing a white person kneeling and apologizing to a black person
BLM is going bankrupt and the owners are crooks
Mark says no one is willing to say…you have to look at historical behavior through the lens of when it was taking place…not today
Media. Academia, Hollywood and Political leaders are dividing us
Jim says “we’ve been comprised” and the guys discuss the Biden crime family in the context of no accountability
Mark brings up Jan 6th and our lack of trust in our leadership and then talks about a PhD scientist interviewed about the climate change hoax
The guys bring up the wind turbine mess and Al Gore’s crimes
Mark says they’re scaring our kids
Jim moves on to the Covid scam and the fear behind driving continued mask use
Mark says fear is driving all of it and the misuse of compassion
Jim quotes Malcolm X and how his warnings have come true
Jim speaks about the great equalizer - sports
The guys disagree and then come around about how to solve the problems in the poor black communities
Mark brings up the Swamp and entitlement
The guys speak a bit about the immigration challenge and how it make no sense
Mark makes a point that we are making decisions with no plan for the long term repercussions
Jim talks about what it means to be an American
The guys think it’s all a lack of leadership
Then Trump comes up again and Jim speaks about the globalist agenda
Mark goes to the freedom of speech pushback
Jim tells his Def Leopard story to close in the context of privilege and white guilt
Mark closes out with his “troubles” in the bag story
The podcast starts off with Jim talking about emotional intelligence and how people park their cars:) He also feels pretty strongly about the questions people ask and how intently they listen to your answer Mark speaks to the importance of active listening and authenticity. Being in the moment in a world of distraction Jim distinguishes between fleeting contact online and face to face contact over a few hours of time Jim is asked “what’s the secret to a successful marriage?” He breaks down how important it is to change and evolve together. You reinvent yourselves as you age and mature and learn Jim’s friends discuss prior marriages and learning Mark discusses his divorce and being a single dad. He open’s up about his new relationship with his girlfriend Jim open’s up about his struggles and his wife’s transition from stressful high profile work and graceful retirement…and the empty nest condition Jim sites how simple men are and how complicated women can be and how we all evolve We need to celebrate the differences between men and women Mark talks about learning from mistakes and hardship. He goes on about the importance of communication and the search for meaning, learning and growth Jim says we choose to either grow better or bitter in and around the 40’s or 50’s Mark brings up his dad’a ability to evolve and learn - learning and evolving keeps you young Mark’s daughter has a wonderful friendship with one of his own friends Couples often evolve. Sometimes one does and the other does Mark talks about how bitter was never an option for him. It’s a choice and it requires work Jim talks about the energy people give off. Good and bad People are attracted to positive aura and repelled from negative Mark comes in hot and he needs to be conscious of settling down and keeping space when he enters a room Mark talks about his new relationship and how different it is at 61 years old Jim talks about some of the challenges young people face Mark talks about the importance of communication and the dangers of poor communication How helpful sincere apologies can be Jim adds some perspective on death and losing loved ones and reflects on his father’s legacy Mark concludes that everything in life is a choice
Just another reminder this podcast is raw. No intro, no outro, no ads or music. Just solid content The guys explain the flywheel foundation for the podcast. Then Mark and Jim discuss the most recent CNN Interview with Donald Trump and the current divided political landscape. Mark suggests that we’re moving back to the middle. Next Jim opens up about the Trump CNN Townhall interview. Jim listened to the interview on the radio…no video and how unique that experience was. Then it’s off to the races about Trump and Biden. Those are our best two choices? Really. Mark and Jim disagree and agree on various political views and the SWAMP enters the conversation. The guys discuss our legal system and why DEI doesn’t work. The latest Bud Light marketing fiasco. Mark is optimistic about the future. Jim says the mainstream media is falling down. Then the guys talk team sports and how team sports mirror how a free society works. Will there be any choices besides Biden and Trump?
We did this season raw. No intro's or outro's, no music, no ads...just interesting content. Mark and Jim explain the "Flywheel Of Self Awareness" and how it serves as the foundational structure of the podcast. Then they talk about the current hiring landscape, how DEI isn’t what people think it is and more. They discuss different ways of looking for work and how humanity is gone from the process. Then it’s on to more creative ways to package yourself and your work to make you more “hirable” for potential employers and/or clients. Jim talks about the advantages of AI for someone who is, for example dyslexic such as Jim himself. Writing becomes so much easier it’s literally a game changer. The guys close out with some more AI predictions and finally some insights on what makes men happy…Enjoy
On today’s episode Mark + Jim focus on every aspect of health in your life - the physical, mental and emotional. They both share the importance of eating whole, clean foods and how it has changed their lives. As well as making time for exercise and adjusting their routines as they have gotten older. They also speak on some heated political issues and how the mental health crisis just might be at the root of it all.
Here are few specific topics they dive into during this conversation that you dont want to miss:
- How Mark had to put his ego aside and try Yoga and then it changed his life.
- The 5 Tibetan Rites as another alternative for exercise. Google it!
- Practicing the Wim Hof Breathing Method and how Mark got his 92 year old dad to do it too.
- The importance of what you eat and put into your body and how it is non-negotiable for feeling good and aging well.
- How to navigate not having enough time for exercise in your life.
- Why diets don't work.
- Finding forms of exercise you actually enjoy and that are gentle on your body.
- The incredible impact of doing Dr Don Wood’s program in person and Jim’s experience going through it.
- Cheaper and more realistic ways to eat healthier. Mark and Jim share food recs and meal prep ideas.
- How Covid-19 has affected our mental health as a collective.
- How gun violence plays into the mental health issue.
Resources:
Hannahs 3 Day Gut Reset: https://go.hannahaylward.com/3-day-gut
The Get A Helmet Podcast for Anxiety Help: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/get-a-helmet/id1320506226
The Inspired Performance Institute, Dr. Don Wood's Program: https://www.inspiredperformanceinstitute.com/a/21845/jZCwnLQj
On today’s episode Mark + Jim dive into the topic of Identity. All of the sports you played, conversations you’ve had, experiences dating all the way back to childhood play a role in how you see the world. They make you who you are. Every human experiences trauma, whether it be big or small. This conversation unpacks how trauma plays out in your life and what you can do to move past it.
“Every single one of us has experienced trauma. Some of it is recognizable and memorable and some of it is not. Some of it we don’t remember. Some of it is extreme, like sexual abuse and some of it is less so, like getting yelled at. If unaddressed it festers in our subconscious and attacks us as if it’s happening right now.” - Mark
Other Topics covered during this episode:
- Playing sports while growing up and how it shaped the men they are today, both good and bad.
- Jim’s history winning 3 national championships as a Rugby player
- Checking in with your level of self worth as you move through life
- How having too much success early on in life can hurt you
- Handling hardship with grace and accountability as one of the most important things you can do in life.
- The importance of your actions matching your words.
- Leading by example for your family and friends.
- How fathers can put too much pressure on their children to perform in sports.
- How detrimental it is for children when parents try to live vicariously through them.
- Jim’s journey with concussions and how Dr. Wood’s program (The Inspired Performance Institute) helped him heal his depression
- The emotional impact of the inevitable transitions in your life and how to support yourself through them.
- Unpacking how trauma (events from your past) lives in your subconscious and why we need to work to rewire our minds.
- Jim’s journey with dyslexia and dysgraphia (trouble reading).
- Dealing with your struggles head on and not suppressing them or else they get a lot worse.
- How we live in an addictive culture and over work, over consume and over perform.
Resources:
- Book Jim Mentioned is The Season of Life by Jim Rohn
- https://www.7pillarsglobal.com/professional-track
- Mark Aylward's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aylwardmark/
- Jim Gurule's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimgurule/
- Learn more about the Inspired Performance Institute and Dr. Wood’s Program: https://www.inspiredperformanceinstitute.com/a/21845/jZCwnLQj
On today’s episode Mark + Jim dive into the topic of careers. This conversation goes really deep into truly getting to know what it is you love to do and giving yourself permission to go there in the first place. They also discuss finding a job at this stage of life, taking big risks, sales and how the job market has changed tremendously.
Here’s a sneak peek of what you’ll hear on this episode:
“If you had your druthers and you could find the intersection between what youre passionate about, what youre good enough at that you could teach other people and that you can monetize -- that intersection is the gold.”
“The vast majority of people I speak to aren’t doing what they want to be doing.”
Other topics discussed:
-Finding new work as a middle aged man
-Men lacking confidence and how that causes big issues in the workplace
-Being bored and unfulfilled with your work and caught in the limiting belief that there isn’t something more aligned for you
-The pressures men feel to provide
-How the hiring market has changed and that most jobs don’t require a college degree anymore
-The importance of telling your story versus sharing your credentials
-Finding the intersection between what you’re really good at and what you love
-outdated sales tactics
-The incredible results they have both witnessed through The Inspired Performance Institute in helping people make big transitions in life and move past any subconscious blocks
-The role your subconscious plays in your career choices
-Finding a mentor and not trying to navigate these decisions on your own
Resources mentioned on this episode:
The Inspired Performance Institute: https://www.inspiredperformanceinstitute.com/a/21845/jZCwnLQj
Link to Mark’s free career workbook to find your purpose: https://www.7pillarsglobal.com/professional-track
Mark Aylward's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aylwardmark/
Jim Gurule's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimgurule/
Books mentioned during the episode:
You Must Be Out of Your Mind
Emotional Concussions
On today’s episode of the Imperfect Men’s Club Podcast, Mark and Jim dive into the topic of relationships and the number one priority being to nurture your relationship to self.
Here is a sneak peek of what you will hear…
“You want to be held accountable? Have a conversation with one of your kids.”
“Once you decide you are in it for the long term, whatever that means to you, you’ve got to sit down and talk about sh*t. You gotta talk about religion, sex, money, children, expectations.”
“After having raised two daughters, they really taught me how to listen. One of the other keys to a successful relationship is to listen.”
Other topics discussed during this episode:
-How listening can be the most powerful tool in relationships.
-When you marry someone, you marry their family.
-Processing trauma from your past to benefit the relationship you have with yourself and with your spouse
-How men tend to cover up trauma from their past with business or athletic achievements
-The self awareness required to not bring your past into your present relationship
-The work that goes into a healthy marriage.
Here’s where to find us:
Mark Aylward's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aylwardmark/
Jim Gurule's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimgurule/
Imperfectmensclub.com
If you would like to learn more about healing trauma through the Inspired Performance Institute, you can do so here: https://www.inspiredperformanceinstitute.com/a/21845/jZCwnLQj
Welcome to the Imperfect Mens Club Podcast! We are so happy that you are here. The show kick offs with a little insight into Mark's work as a Career Mentor + Jim's as a Futurist + Inventor.
Here is a sneak peek of what you will hear:
“If you fell down the expectation was that you were just going to get up and rub some dirt on it. As much as that is maybe outdated, wouldn’t it be great to find this intersection between masculinity and empathy?” - Mark
"It's not what happens to you, it's how you respond to what happens to you. That is a decision.” - Jim
Topics we hit on during this episode:
-Why we are here and what we will talk about in future episodes, what you will get out of this show
-How Jim + Mark Met through the Inspired Performance Institute while Jim was searching for help with his brain health
-Finding alternatives for your mental health struggles that really work
-How moving through moments of vulnerability is empowering
-Men and emotions
You can learn more about the Inspired Performance Institute and Dr. Don Wood's work here: https://www.inspiredperformanceinstitute.com/a/21845/jZCwnLQj
Please visit our website to learn more and to read full show notes: imperfectmensclub.com
We are here to have open, honest and sometimes difficult conversations to help other middle aged men in the world be the best versions of themselves they can be. From everything to relationships, health and professional development, we are here to create conscious space for men just like you to reach your full potential.