Two Tall Guys Talking Sales

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Salespeople rarely lose complex deals because they forgot to follow up. They lose because they never developed a clear hypothesis about how the decision would be made, who would influence it, and what each stakeholder needed to believe. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explain how a practical deal plan helps an AE move beyond the purchasing contact, understand the full buying committee, anticipate competitive threats, and coordinate the internal resources required to win. Using examples from sports, construction, manufacturing, and distribution, they show how disciplined planning improves sales execution, pipeline velocity, and long-term account growth.

Key Topics Discussed Why Every Important Opportunity Needs a Deal Plan — 00:00 Kevin compares deal planning to the preparation elite athletes complete before taking the field. Great players do not simply understand their own position; they study their competition, anticipate likely reactions, and enter the game with a strategy. The same principle applies to B2B sales. A written deal plan increases the likelihood of closing the opportunity faster, executing more effectively, and avoiding preventable losses.

Turning Assumptions into a Written Sales Hypothesis — 01:23 Sean explains that salespeople function as the quarterback of the opportunity. They must determine what they will do, how their teammates will contribute, and how the overall sales process should unfold. A sales hypothesis makes those assumptions visible: who will buy, what problem they are trying to solve, who benefits, and what conditions must exist for the deal to advance. If the hypothesis is not written down, it cannot be tested, improved, or consistently executed.

Looking Beyond the Transactional Buyer — 02:32 A purchasing contact may control the transaction without receiving the greatest value from the product. Sean uses an HVAC compressor example to illustrate the broader stakeholder network: procurement, contractors, electricians, installers, building owners, maintenance teams, and eventual occupants may all influence the decision. Effective value selling requires messaging that addresses each stakeholder's priorities—not merely the requirements of the person issuing the purchase order.

Understanding Decision Criteria and Stakeholder Influence — 05:05 Kevin expands the discussion through construction and engineered-specification sales. Manufacturers may need to influence architects, engineers, distributors, contractors, materials managers, and procurement teams long before an order is placed. Product specifications, installation requirements, availability, regional codes, service levels, and delivery capabilities can all become decision criteria. Strong business acumen allows a seller to connect those operational details to the buyer's desired outcome and measurable ROI.

Mapping the Buying Committee and Informal Relationships — 08:32 Studying competitors is not enough. Salespeople must understand everyone "on the field," including the individuals who benefit from the solution, those who may resist it, and those who influence one another behind the scenes. Sean recommends creating a simple visual stakeholder map: write down the names, circle them, and connect the people who communicate, have worked together, attended school together, or maintain trusted relationships. Mapping the buying committee helps expose the informal decision network that a CRM contact list alone may not reveal.

How Deal Plans Evolve into Account Plans — 10:45 A single stakeholder map supports one opportunity. Repeated deal plans reveal patterns across the account. Over time, the seller develops a record of who influenced previous decisions, why stakeholders supported or resisted the solution, and how internal relationships affected the outcome. That knowledge becomes the foundation of an account plan, giving sales management and Revenue management teams a stronger platform for expansion, retention, and more predictable revenue generation.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson — 00:57 "If you're not doing deal plans for your next deal, you're probably missing an opportunity to either close faster or more effectively, or you might even be increasing the chances that you're going to lose."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 01:44 "You are the quarterback of the team. Your job is to figure out what all of your teammates are going to help you do, but also what you're going to do."

Kevin Lawson — 05:41 "It's just your opinion about who's going to buy, who it's going to benefit—which may be a different person—and then what are the other related people that could have influence over the deal?"

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 09:15 "You need to understand everybody on the court, everybody on the pitch, everybody on the field."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 12:02 "Before long, your deal plans are becoming account plans."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab The B2B Sales Lab is a place where sales professionals and sales leaders can continue developing practical tools for deal planning, account planning, and navigating complex deals. www.b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Choose one of your five most important active opportunities and create a one-page stakeholder map before your next sales meeting.

Write down every person who may buy, use, approve, implement, support, oppose, or benefit from your solution. Circle each name and draw lines showing formal reporting structures and informal relationships. Beside each stakeholder, record four things:

What outcome does this person want?
How will this person evaluate the decision?
Whom does this person influence?
What evidence or messaging does this person need from you?

Then identify the most important relationship you have not yet developed. Define one action that will help you reach that person directly or through an existing contact. This simple exercise turns an opportunity record into an executable deal plan and gives your VP of Sales or sales leader something concrete to coach.

Summary Winning an Enterprise Sales opportunity requires more than activity, product knowledge, or a strong relationship with procurement. The salesperson must understand the full buying committee, recognize the informal lines of influence, align the value proposition with multiple decision criteria, and create a written hypothesis for how the deal will be won. In this episode, Kevin and Sean provide a practical framework for navigating multi-stakeholder deals without adding unnecessary complexity to the sales process. Listen to the episode to learn how a blank sheet of paper, a few circles, and the right questions can sharpen your sales strategy, improve B2B sales pipeline predictability, and turn individual deal knowledge into a scalable account-growth system.

B2B Sales Lab is a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It's a space to ask real questions, share proven practices, and connect with others who are serious about improving revenue performance. Designed and led by veteran sales leaders, the Lab is where strategy meets execution. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales teams rarely fail because the quota was unclear. They fail because the daily behaviors required to reach it were never defined, measured, or reinforced. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey speak with Sindre Haaland, founder and CEO of SalesScreen, about why effective sales management requires leaders to manage the game, not merely watch the scoreboard. The conversation explores sales gamification, revenue architecture, CRM adoption, qualification discipline, and how AI can support more predictable B2B revenue generation without removing the human motivation that drives consistent execution.

Key Topics Discussed Why sales leaders must manage the game, not the scoreboard — 01:19 Revenue targets tell salespeople where they are expected to finish, but they do not explain how to get there. Sindre argues that sales success begins by translating the quota into controllable, revenue-generating activities: calls, meetings, qualified opportunities, pipeline creation, and consistent execution throughout the quarter.

Using gamification to change behavior—not merely celebrate outcomes — 02:19 Most sales contests reward closed business, but a salesperson cannot always control when a complex deal closes. Effective gamification focuses instead on meaningful behaviors that sellers can execute every day. Applied correctly, it can improve motivation, consistency, pipeline velocity, and performance among the middle of the sales team, not just recognize the top performers.

Connecting activity metrics to conversion quality — 04:07 More activity is not automatically better activity. Measuring calls without examining results can produce meaningless behavior and distorted data. Sean, Kevin, and Sindre discuss the importance of combining activity targets with conversion rates, opportunity progression, and clear definitions of what good execution looks like.

Building energy, recognition, and teamwork across the sales organization — 05:25 Sindre describes the moment SalesScreen demonstrated how software could create excitement throughout a sales floor when a deal closed. The larger lesson goes beyond celebration: real-time recognition helps managers reinforce productive behavior, improve engagement, and ensure individual accomplishments are not overlooked inside large sales organizations.

Reverse-engineering the quota through revenue architecture — 08:15 Many sales teams know their targets but have never calculated how many calls, meetings, opportunities, and conversions are required to reach them. Without that basic revenue management discipline, prospecting becomes inconsistent, and the pipeline follows a predictable boom-and-bust cycle. Strong sales processes create continuity before pipeline weakness becomes a forecasting crisis.

Gamifying qualification and opportunity progression in complex B2B sales — 09:25 In enterprise sales, closed deals may occur too infrequently to serve as useful daily performance signals. Teams can instead quantify progress through qualification frameworks such as MEDDPICC and SPICED, including CRM completeness, opportunity advancement, metric validation, and buying committee coverage. This creates better sales coaching data while reinforcing the behaviors that move complex deals forward.

Key Quotes Sindre Haaland — 01:25 "Managers get one thing wrong: they're managing the scoreboard versus managing the game."

Sindre Haaland — 04:07 "If you want to change behavior, you need to be in control of those behaviors."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 03:13 "The things you do at the beginning are going to affect the things that you do two, three, four, six, or ten months from now."

Sindre Haaland — 08:27 "You need to understand how to get to goal and what real activity you need to put in, day in and day out, to get there."

Kevin Lawson — 13:44 "Managing the game, not the scoreboard, is a key behavior."

Additional Resources Sindre Haaland CEO and Founder at SalesScreen can be contacted on LinkedIn at linkedin.com/in/shaaland/ SalesScreen A sales performance management and gamification platform designed to quantify sales processes, reinforce productive activity, increase CRM engagement, and create more predictable sales performance.

MEDDPICCC A qualification framework commonly used in enterprise sales and complex deals to evaluate metrics, the economic buyer, decision criteria, decision process, paperwork process, goal identification, coaches, champions, and competition.

SPICED A sales qualification and discovery framework that helps sellers understand a buyer's situation, pain, impact, critical event, and decision process.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Choose one sales role and reverse-engineer its quarterly quota into a weekly activity model.

Start with the revenue target, then calculate the required number of closed deals, qualified opportunities, first meetings, and prospecting activities based on actual conversion rates. Do not stop at activity volume. Add at least one quality measure at each stage, such as meeting-to-opportunity conversion, MEDDPICC completion, stakeholder engagement, or opportunity progression.

Once the model is built, ask a harder question: Are managers coaching these controllable behaviors every week, or are they simply reviewing the forecast after the damage has already been done?

That distinction determines whether the organization is practicing sales management or merely reporting revenue history.

Summary This episode challenges one of the most persistent weaknesses in B2B sales leadership: setting an ambitious target without building the operating system required to achieve it. Sindre Haaland explains how thoughtful gamification, disciplined sales processes, CRM data, and AI-supported performance insights can help leaders reinforce the right behaviors before the quarter slips away. For VPs of Sales, RevOps leaders, AEs, SDR managers, and business owners seeking better pipeline predictability, stronger CRM adoption, and measurable gains in sales productivity, this conversation provides a practical framework for turning quotas into consistent execution. Listen to the episode to learn why predictable revenue does not begin with the forecast; it begins with the behaviors your team repeats every day.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Most sales discovery questions fail before the buyer even answers them. Questions such as "What keeps you up at night?" and "What challenges are you facing?" have been used so often that buyers respond almost automatically, giving sellers little useful insight. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey challenge sales professionals to replace generic scripts with informed, business-specific questions that improve discovery, uncover operational consequences, and help buyers think differently about their problems. They also explain how artificial intelligence and Generative AI can help sellers prepare deeper question paths, navigate Complex Deals, and establish themselves as trusted advisors rather than interchangeable vendors.

Key Topics Discussed Why generic discovery questions produce generic answers — 00:00 Kevin and Sean open by dismantling familiar questions such as "What are your goals?" and "What keeps you up at night?" Buyers have heard these questions hundreds of times. Strong discovery must demonstrate Business acumen, industry knowledge, and a genuine understanding of the customer's operating environment.

Researching the customer's business before discovery — 01:51 Public information about industries, competitors, economic pressures, and business trends is readily available. Sellers should use frameworks such as PESTEL and the Business Model Canvas to understand what drives the prospect's economics, how the company creates value, and where a proposed solution might improve Revenue generation, ROI, or operational performance.

Using operational questions to expose real business problems — 03:11 Kevin illustrates how questions about month-end close procedures, manual spreadsheets, reporting delays, and disconnected Sales processes can produce a meaningful conversation. The goal is not merely to identify which system a prospect uses. It is to uncover the consequences, workarounds, handoffs, and hidden costs that make change valuable.

Using AI to create better discovery question paths — 05:58 Sean presents a practical method for using ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini, Copilot, or another AI platform to develop branching discovery questions. Instead of asking an AI tool for one generic question list, sellers can ask it to anticipate several possible buyer answers and then generate the appropriate follow-up questions for each response. This turns AI prompts for B2B sales prospecting into preparation for a real business conversation rather than superficial personalization.

Teaching the customer how to buy — 07:00 In Enterprise Sales, buyers often understand their current situation better than they understand the process of selecting and implementing a new solution. Sellers must guide the Buying Committee through workflow changes, implementation tradeoffs, user concerns, and expected outcomes. This is where Value selling becomes practical: the seller connects the solution to the customer's processes, risks, and desired business results.

Improving questions through sales management and peer coaching — 10:03 Kevin explains how a VP of Sales or sales manager can improve discovery without simply criticizing the team's existing questions. Questions should be evaluated based on whether they advance the next step, increase deal value, improve Pipeline Velocity, or strengthen the seller's competitive position. Sales Enablement can also become more effective when AEs, SDRs, and sales leaders exchange successful questions and discuss the order in which they should be asked.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson — 00:00 "Buyers have heard these questions hundreds of times, and they answer them on autopilot."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 00:45 "Questions that show that you understand the business… force your customer or your prospect to have a clearer thought process."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 09:00 "You know more about selling your product than they know about buying your product. You have to lead them through the way."

Kevin Lawson — 12:03 "Stop asking questions the buyer has already heard. Start asking the questions that get the buyer to say, 'I've never thought about that.'"

Additional Resources * PESTEL analysis: A framework for examining the political, economic, social, technological, environmental, and legal forces influencing an industry. * Business Model Canvas: A tool for understanding how a company creates, delivers, and captures value. * The Challenger Sale: A sales methodology centered on teaching customers something valuable, tailoring the conversation, and leading the buying process. * Generative AI platforms: ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini, and Microsoft Copilot can help sellers research industries, anticipate buyer responses, and develop stronger discovery questions. * B2B Sales Lab: A community where sales professionals and sales leaders can develop their sales acumen, discuss active opportunities, and improve their approach to B2B sales.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Create a branching discovery question bank for one customer segment or active opportunity.

Begin with five questions you currently ask during discovery. Eliminate any question the buyer could answer without thinking. Then use an AI tool to generate five plausible responses to each remaining question and develop two or three follow-up questions for every response.

Do not treat the resulting output as a script. Review it for business relevance, arrange the questions in a logical sequence, and identify which questions reveal operational impact, financial consequences, organizational resistance, and decision criteria. Then compare the question bank with a successful AE, SDR, sales manager, or industry peer.

This is a practical form of AI-powered sales coaching and human-in-the-loop automation. AI expands the seller's preparation, but the seller must still apply judgment, listen carefully, and decide which path to pursue. Done well, the exercise improves Sales success, supports B2B sales pipeline predictability, and helps accelerate Complex Deals without replacing the human conversation.

Summary Strong discovery is not a contest to see who can ask the cleverest question. It is evidence that the seller understands the prospect's business well enough to uncover something the buyer has not fully considered. In this episode, Kevin and Sean show how better research, disciplined questioning, sales management coaching, and Generative AI can help sellers move beyond scripted conversations and into meaningful business diagnosis. For sales professionals who want to strengthen their Messaging, improve Value selling, navigate multi-stakeholder deals, and earn the position of trusted advisor, this episode offers a direct and highly practical approach. Listen before your next discovery call—and reconsider every question that allows the buyer to answer on autopilot.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Discovery is not a preliminary conversation before the "real" selling begins. It is where complex B2B deals are either built on credible business value—or quietly undermined by weak assumptions, missing stakeholders, artificial urgency, and an unreliable forecast. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey examine why strong discovery is essential to value selling, accurate revenue management, and sales success. They also explain how experienced sellers use business acumen to uncover operational constraints, quantify ROI, navigate the buying committee, and guide customers through decisions they may not yet understand how to make.

Key Topics Discussed Why weak discovery creates a weak pipeline — 00:28 Poor discovery does not merely cause an awkward sales meeting. It produces shallow opportunities, fake urgency, premature proposals, discount pressure, inaccurate forecasts, and stalled decisions. Sean and Kevin establish discovery as the foundation of effective sales processes and B2B sales pipeline predictability.

Understanding the business reason behind the purchase — 01:27 Knowing what the buyer wants is not enough. Sellers must uncover why the organization needs it, what business problem is driving the investment, who holds influence and authority, and what happens if the problem remains unresolved. This is where business acumen and value selling begin—and where the seller gathers the evidence needed to defend price and demonstrate ROI later in the deal.

Why quoting without discovery makes the salesperson expendable — 02:43 Kevin challenges sellers who rush to educate the prospect, demonstrate features, and produce a quote. If the seller's contribution is limited to product information and pricing, the buyer can often replace that salesperson with a website, product sheet, or artificial intelligence tool. Discovery is what separates professional selling from order processing.

Finding the hidden requirements that can derail complex deals — 04:28 A new CNC machine may require more than equipment and installation. Floor space, structural changes, utilities, drainage, environmental requirements, permits, contractors, and operational disruption may all affect the buying decision. In enterprise sales, the apparent purchase is often only one component of a much larger initiative. Effective discovery exposes those dependencies before they destroy pipeline velocity.

Using expertise to guide the customer's buying process — 07:53 The seller has typically sold the solution more often than the customer has purchased it. That experience creates an obligation—and an advantage. By identifying questions the buyer has not considered, mapping the buying committee, and navigating multi-stakeholder deals, the salesperson becomes a trusted guide rather than another vendor competing on features and price.

How discovery improves forecasting, marketing, and revenue generation — 08:49 Robust discovery strengthens more than the individual opportunity. It improves forecast integrity, exposes the true urgency of the problem, creates better feedback loops with marketing and RevOps, and helps the organization attract more qualified prospects. Weaknesses introduced during discovery inevitably reappear during proposals, negotiations, implementation planning, and closing.

Key Quotes "Discovery is not just the stage of the sales process. Discovery is the foundation of the very deal." — Sean O'Shaughnessey, 00:44

"If you're just doing a volume of quoting with no discovery, your job is in jeopardy. Discovery is what separates us from a product sheet." — Kevin Lawson, 03:56

"You have sold your product more than your customer has bought your product. You know more about selling your product than they know about buying your product." — Sean O'Shaughnessey, 08:08

"Anything you do poorly in discovery is going to show up in the proposal, timeline, close, and negotiation stages." — Kevin Lawson, 10:09

Additional Resources Sean also discusses the B2B Sales Lab, a community where salespeople, sales leaders, founders, AEs, SDRs, and VPs of Sales can discuss active selling challenges, improve their sales strategies, and participate in live office-hours conversations with Kevin and Sean.

Visit: b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Before advancing to your next meaningful opportunity, conduct a discovery-gap review. Write down the business problem, the measurable financial or operational impact, the cost of inaction, the decision-making process, the economic buyer, the key influencers, the implementation requirements, and any external dependencies that could delay approval or execution.

Do not rely on impressions. Identify what you know, what you have merely assumed, and what remains unanswered. Then use the next customer conversation to close the highest-risk gaps before preparing a detailed proposal or committing the opportunity to the forecast. This single discipline can improve value messaging, reduce unnecessary discounting, expose weak opportunities, and prevent late-stage surprises.

Summary Strong discovery gives a seller more than information. It provides the business case, stakeholder map, implementation reality, urgency, and financial logic required to move a complex deal forward. In this episode, Kevin and Sean show why discovery is central to sales management, value selling, forecast accuracy, and sustainable revenue generation—and why skipping it creates problems that no proposal, discount, AI-powered sales coaching platform, or sales enablement strategy can repair later. Listen to the episode before your next discovery meeting, and reconsider whether you are genuinely helping the customer make a sound decision or simply gathering enough information to produce a quote.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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No big topics in this episode. Just a quick acknowledgment that the United States of America is now 250 years old. Go back to your family and enjoy your time with them. Check us out next week when we will be sharing great sales advice again.

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Midyear exposes the truth in every sales organization. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey tackle a problem many business owners, sales leaders, and salespeople quietly face at the halfway point of the year: unclear goals, weak commission plans, soft pipeline discipline, and the temptation to reset expectations instead of fixing the sales processes that created the gap. This is a practical conversation about B2B sales management, quota accountability, revenue generation, pipeline prioritization, and the uncomfortable but necessary work required to improve sales success in the second half of the year.

Key Topics Discussed * Midyear goal setting when the original plan was missing or unclear — 00:00 Sean explains why some companies reach July without properly documented sales goals or commission plans. The corrective action is not complicated, but it is often avoided: write the plan down, align compensation with company priorities, and make sure salespeople know exactly how they are being measured. * Why sales leaders should not casually reset the goal — 02:14 Kevin argues that adjusting the target downward can create a dangerous management precedent. If the number was the right number, the job is to solve the gap through better sales strategies, qualification, activity, referrals, and pipeline focus—not move the scoreboard. * The rare exception to keeping the original quota — 06:34 Sean adds an important leadership caveat. If the CEO or executive team built the number around a product launch, acquisition, market event, or business assumption that never materialized, that is not a salesperson's problem. That is an executive planning problem, and it should be handled honestly. * Pipeline rationalization and better qualification — 09:57 Kevin walks through the discipline of deciding which deals deserve time and which ones do not. Complex deals, unclear next steps, bad-fit opportunities, and stalled prospects all consume selling capacity. Better qualification improves pipeline velocity by giving salespeople time back to pursue better opportunities. * Time management, delegation, and protecting prospecting time — 13:43 Sean warns against the classic sales rollercoaster: closing current business while starving future pipeline. Whether a company uses SDRs, AEs, business development resources, or full-cycle salespeople, every stage of the sales process needs dedicated time. Revenue management requires knowing where the week actually went.

Key Quotes * Sean O'Shaughnessey — 01:14 "You didn't get it done at the first of the year. That doesn't mean you can't do it now." * Kevin Lawson — 03:40 "You never adjust the goal. Your job as a salesperson is to hit the goal or your quota." * Sean O'Shaughnessey — 08:34 "Salespeople can't make their goals for things that are outside of their control." * Kevin Lawson — 10:22 "You've got to figure out which deals are aligned and which ones are not aligned to what you do." * Sean O'Shaughnessey — 14:03 "We were so busy selling that we forgot to sell."

Additional Resources * EOS implementers — referenced as part of the broader business coaching and planning conversations happening at midyear. * FocalPoint and ActionCOACH — mentioned as examples of coaching organizations business owners may turn to when trying to catch up or plan ahead. * Microsoft PTAP — referenced by Kevin as "plan to exceed plan," a useful framing for quota planning and sales performance management. * MEDDPICCC, BANT, and SPICED-style qualification methodologies — referenced as examples of structured approaches to qualification, deal inspection, and sales process discipline. * Marketing-generated digital assets — discussed as one practical source of conversation creation when salespeople are behind and need to rebuild pipeline coverage.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your pipeline and calendar before changing the goal. Identify every active opportunity, mark which deals have clear next steps, remove or deprioritize poor-fit opportunities, and block time this week for prospecting, referral requests, outreach to past customers, and networking. Do not rely on optimism. If an opportunity does not match your ideal customer profile, lacks buyer commitment, or requires too much customization to win, it is likely stealing time from better revenue-generating work.

Summary This episode is a timely midyear inspection for any B2B salesperson, VP of Sales, business owner, or sales management leader who is trying to protect the second half of the year. Kevin and Sean make a clear argument: missed goals are not solved by pretending the number changed. They are solved by stronger qualifications, clearer commission plans, better time allocation, disciplined sales processes, and more honest pipeline review. If you are behind, ahead, or unsure where you really stand, this conversation will help you decide whether you have a quota problem, a planning problem, a pipeline problem, or a leadership problem—and what to do next.

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Paul Anthony Claxton of Digirati Investments for a sharp conversation on venture capital, founder readiness, sales architecture, and why early-stage companies cannot hide behind product obsession or incomplete data. Paul brings a rare blend of Marine Corps reconnaissance discipline, sales leadership, investment judgment, and AI perspective to the table. The result is a fast-moving discussion about Business acumen, customer conversations, market intelligence, Sales processes, and the practical realities of Revenue generation when founders are trying to build something the market may not yet know it needs.

Key Topics Discussed Founder adaptability and the path from Marine to venture capitalist — 00:20 Paul explains how adaptability, opportunity recognition, and power networking shaped his move from the Marines into venture capital. His point lands hard for anyone in sales management: the best salespeople and founders do not simply follow the plan. They adjust when the market, the customer, or life changes direction.

Why investors look beyond the product — 02:19 Paul discusses what he looks for when evaluating founders and companies. Product matters, but it is not enough. Founders need to understand macroeconomics, microeconomics, contracts, deal structure, customer impact, and the broader commercial environment. That is where Business acumen becomes a serious differentiator.

Inventing necessity and creating surrounding market demand — 03:24 Paul introduces Digirati Investments' phrase "inventing necessity" and explains why strong products do more than solve one isolated problem. They create adjacent needs, new sub-industries, and additional opportunities for Revenue generation. This is a useful framing for founders, sales leaders, and anyone building Sales strategies around emerging markets.

The danger of product-centric founders — 04:43 Sean pushes into a critical founder question: how often do companies believe they have a market-changing product before they have validated the market? Paul's answer is direct. Too many founders are product-centric instead of people-centric. Real Sales success starts with human conversations long before the product is fully built.

Data, AI, and consultative selling in modern sales ecosystems — 05:33 Paul argues that strong data flow is essential, but data alone cannot replace human interaction. He connects AI, CRM automation, customer engagement, and consultative selling to a broader point: modern Sales processes need both high-quality data and high-quality conversations.

Reconnaissance, competitor intelligence, and explainable AI — 09:15 Drawing from his Marine background, Paul explains why companies must gather intelligence from both customers and competitors. AI can support that work, but leaders must understand where the data came from and whether it reflects the actual market. Bad assumptions create bad Messaging, weak qualification, and flawed Revenue management decisions.

Key Quotes Paul Anthony Claxton — 00:35 "The best salespeople are the most adaptable people."

Paul Anthony Claxton — 05:33 "A lot of times I'll run across founders that are product-centric instead of being people-centric."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 08:41 "How do you know that what you're doing is going to work if you don't have salespeople out pre-talking and pre-building up what that problem is?"

Paul Anthony Claxton — 09:15 "If you don't have people gathering reconnaissance, it's not just talking to who you think your prospective customers are, but it's also understanding how your competitors qualify."

Kevin Lawson — 11:49 "Not only do we have to know as sellers who our total addressable market is, but our service obtainable market is, but it's important to keep that data current."

Additional Resources Paul Anthony Claxton — Venture capitalist, U.S. Marine, sales architecture thinker, and guest on this episode. https://www.linkedin.com/in/businessmanathletemarine/

Digirati Investments — Paul's investment firm, discussed in the episode through the lens of "inventing necessity."

Explainable AI — Paul's podcast, referenced during the conversation about understanding the origin, quality, and accuracy of AI-driven data.

PaulClaxton.io — Paul's personal website, where you can learn more about his work, investments, and related ventures.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Before investing more time, money, or sales effort into a product, schedule direct market conversations with prospective customers and competitive intelligence reviews. Do not rely only on internal conviction, CRM data, AI summaries, or founder enthusiasm. Validate the problem, study how competitors qualify and sell, and pressure-test whether your Value selling story connects to a real business need. This one discipline improves Sales strategies, sharpens Messaging, and prevents companies from building sales motions around assumptions the market has not confirmed.

Summary This episode is a compact but high-value conversation for founders, investors, sales leaders, and anyone responsible for Revenue generation in an uncertain market. Paul Anthony Claxton brings a different lens to sales and investment evaluation: part Marine reconnaissance, part venture capitalist, part sales architect. Kevin and Sean guide the discussion into the practical questions that matter most: Does the founder understand the market? Is the product creating real necessity? Is the data explainable? Are customer conversations happening early enough to shape the business before money and time are wasted? Listen to this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales if you want a sharper view of founder readiness, modern sales management, AI-informed selling, and the kind of Business acumen required for durable Sales success.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey take on one of the most expensive problems in B2B selling: pipeline clutter. Sellers have limited customer-facing time, and too much of it gets wasted chasing deals that were never truly qualified, never aligned with the ideal client profile, or never likely to close. Kevin and Sean dig into the math, mindset, and sales management discipline required to protect selling time, improve forecast accuracy, and focus on the right opportunities. This conversation connects time management, Business acumen, Sales strategies, Sales processes, Value selling, Messaging, Revenue management, and Revenue generation into one practical question: Are you spending your limited sales time on deals that can actually produce Sales success?

Key Topics Discussed Why seller time is the most valuable sales resource — 00:00 Kevin opens the episode by pointing out that only a fraction of a seller's week is spent directly with customers. The rest disappears into research, reporting, scoping, internal meetings, travel, and administrative drag. That makes time management a revenue issue, not a productivity slogan.

How to identify deals that do not belong in your pipeline — 01:14 Sean challenges sellers to open their CRM and look honestly at the deals expected to close in the next quarter or six months. Do they fit the ideal client profile? Do they look like the kinds of customers the company wins? Or are they sitting in the pipeline because the seller hopes they might become something?

Using quota math to evaluate opportunity cost — 02:45 Sean breaks the problem down to simple math: take the seller's annual working hours, divide by the quota, then adjust for actual customer-facing time. The farther a prospect is from the ideal client profile, the more time it typically consumes. That raises the real question: could the seller create more revenue by focusing on easier, better-fit deals?

The danger of an aspirational pipeline — 04:12 Kevin explains how inflated pipelines create false confidence, poor forecasting, and bad leadership conversations. A pipeline full of hope does not create commissions. A pipeline full of qualified, workable, attainable deals gives sales leaders and sellers better data for decision-making.

Discovery discipline and hard qualification questions — 07:07 Kevin emphasizes the importance of asking hard questions early. Budget, business pain, decision authority, and the pain of change must be tested before a deal moves too far forward. If a seller has issued a proposal to someone who cannot buy, does not control the budget, or cannot define the business problem, the sales process has already drifted.

Becoming your own sales manager — 08:48 Sean pushes sellers to manage their own pipeline with the same honesty they would expect from a strong sales leader. The best salespeople ask themselves whether a deal is real, whether it is efficient, whether it has access, whether the buyer is engaged, and whether it belongs in this year's forecast at all.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson — 00:00 "As sellers, people who are chasing a quota every year, we have one thing that is so precious that it is absolutely paramount for us to pay attention to, and that's our time."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 01:14 "We all know that if we had more time to call on great customers, we'd probably make more money. So let's talk about calling on great customers."

Kevin Lawson — 05:46 "Your commission is driven by your accuracy of closes, not your aspirations. Aspirational deals don't turn into commissions."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 09:09 "The best salespeople are great independent sales managers of themselves."

Kevin Lawson — 12:09 "Simply quota, close rate, number of deals, average deal size. That's really all you need, and it's all stuff that's in your pipeline now."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab — Sean mentions that sellers can use the B2B Sales Lab to pressure-test pipeline questions, get peer feedback, and discuss whether specific opportunities deserve more time and attention. Join the Lab at b2b-sales-lab.com

CRM pipeline review — The episode repeatedly encourages sellers to use their CRM as the source of truth for examining deal fit, timing, stage accuracy, close probability, and forecast quality.

Ideal Client Profile — Kevin and Sean reinforce the importance of understanding which prospects fit the company's best customer profile and which ones sit too far outside the target to justify the time required.

Customer Interaction Hours episode — Kevin refers listeners back to a previous discussion in which Sean explained customer interaction hours and why increasing time in front of the right buyers improves the win position.

Quarterly Business Reviews — Kevin notes that past customers and QBRs can help sellers and sales leaders identify strategic conversations, referral opportunities, and ways to generate more of the right pipeline.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Before your next pipeline review, identify three deals in your CRM that do not clearly fit your ideal client profile, lack decision-maker access, have weak urgency, or keep slipping from one forecast period to the next. For each one, decide whether it should stay active, move to a future follow-up task, or be disqualified. Then have the direct conversation with the buyer: "It does not seem like this is a priority right now. Should we pause this and revisit it later?" That single question protects your time, improves forecast accuracy, and forces cleaner revenue management.

Summary This episode is a practical reminder that sales success is not created by carrying a bigger pipeline; it is created by carrying a more honest one. Kevin and Sean show why bloated pipelines waste time, damage forecasts, and distract sellers from the deals most likely to generate revenue. The conversation is especially useful for salespeople, sales managers, and company leaders who want better sales processes, sharper qualification, stronger messaging, and more disciplined value selling. If your pipeline looks impressive but does not reliably convert, this episode will challenge you to stop admiring the number and start managing the reality.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales takes a practical look at one of the most common sales management mistakes: assuming all salespeople are built for the same job. Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson use a basketball analogy to unpack the difference between hunters, farmers, lone wolves, challengers, relationship sellers, transactional sellers, and trappers. This episode challenges owners, sales leaders, and frontline sellers to examine whether their sales processes, compensation plans, and revenue management expectations actually match the type of salesperson required for Sales success. If your team is underperforming, the issue may not be a lack of effort. It may be role design.

Key Topics Discussed 01:00 — Why Sales Roles Need Clear Definitions Sean opens with a basketball analogy: if you do not understand the positions, the game becomes harder to follow. The same is true in sales. Confusing labels like hunter, farmer, challenger, lone wolf, and trapper can create bad hiring decisions, poor coaching, and broken sales strategies.

02:50 — Do Not Confuse Seller Type with Business Model Kevin draws an important distinction between the kind of salesperson you have and the kind of business you operate. A transactional sales model, a relationship-driven sales model, and an enterprise sales model each require different selling behaviors, messaging, and support structures.

06:20 — Hunters, Farmers, and the Cost of Misalignment Sean explains why a one-time ERP-style sale usually requires a hunter, while repeat-purchase relationships often require a farmer. Asking one type of salesperson to behave like another may be possible, but it is rarely efficient. Sales leaders need Business acumen to know what role the business actually requires.

08:25 — Lone Wolves, Challengers, and Unsupported Sales Teams The discussion turns to lone wolves and challengers, especially in organizations that give salespeople little infrastructure, weak marketing, poor sales processes, or minimal sales enablement. If leadership expects sellers to "just figure it out," they may be selecting for independence while unintentionally creating risk.

09:50 — How to Reshape a Sales Team Without Blowing It Up Kevin warns against the instinct to immediately replace the team. The better move is to take an intellectually honest look at the team's structure, upskill where possible, and decide whether the business needs account managers, customer service support, hunters, or relationship-focused sellers.

12:50 — The Trapper: Building Toward Enterprise Revenue Generation Sean closes by describing the trapper: the salesperson who can hunt, farm, lead, challenge, and plan proactively for larger future opportunities. This is where Value selling becomes more than a technique. It becomes a disciplined approach to expanding from a pilot project to departmental adoption, divisional traction, and eventually enterprise-level revenue generation.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey — 01:07 "Not knowing what the roles are is a big deal. So that same kind of thing happens in a sales arena, where you may not understand what type of salesperson you have or what type of salesperson you need."

Kevin Lawson — 02:51 "It's important to note that just because somebody looks like something doesn't mean that's actually what they are."

Kevin Lawson — 03:51 "You, as a seller, need to understand your business model so that you know how to sell."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 08:08 "Asking one type of salesperson to be another is really difficult to do. That's like asking that point guard to be the center."

Kevin Lawson — 10:39 "Change people before you have to change people."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 14:15 "How do you become proactive? How do you plan for the deal that's going to happen in nine months?"

Additional Resources The Challenger Sale — Referenced during the discussion of lone wolves and challengers, especially the idea that some sellers succeed by taking control of complex customer conversations.

Eliminate Your Competition by Sean O'Shaughnessey — Sean refers to the "trapper" concept from his book as the more complete sales archetype for complex, enterprise-level selling.

B2B Sales Lab — Kevin mentions that this topic will be explored further in B2B Sales Lab office hours, where sellers and sales leaders can dig into the practical work of assessing team fit, role design, and sales execution.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your current sales team against the sales motion your business actually requires.

Do not start with personality labels. Start with the business model. Are you selling once and moving on? Are you expanding accounts over years? Are your deals transactional, relationship-driven, enterprise-level, or a mix? Then map each salesperson against the role the business needs: hunter, farmer, account manager, challenger, lone wolf, or trapper.

The decision that follows is the real work. Some people need coaching. Some need a different seat. Some roles need compensation redesign. Some teams need additional support around account management, customer success, prospecting, or CRM discipline. Sales success improves when the revenue management system fits the people, the process, and the customer buying motion.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a useful listen for any owner, VP of Sales, sales manager, or seller who has ever wondered why a capable salesperson still struggles in the wrong role. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey make the case that sales performance is not only about talent. It is about fit, structure, expectations, and leadership discipline. If your sales strategies are not producing the results you expected, this conversation will help you look beyond activity levels and ask the more important question: Do we have the right people in the right sales roles for how our customers actually buy?

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Opening a prospecting conversation with "we have 180 million contacts" may sound impressive inside the seller's company, but it often misses the buyer's reality. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey challenge salespeople and sales leaders to stop confusing features with value. They unpack why strong Messaging starts with the buyer's problem, how Value selling creates separation, and why better sales management requires sales teams to understand what customers actually buy—not just what sellers think they sell.

Key Topics Discussed

Why "more data" is not the value proposition — 00:00 Sean opens with a sharp critique of prospecting tools that lead with database size. A salesperson does not need 10 million contacts. They need the right four people inside the right account. That distinction is central to effective Sales strategies because activity without relevance does not generate Revenue.

The buyer does not buy your product; they buy the outcome — 01:56 Kevin reframes the discussion around the "why" behind value propositions. Customers rarely wake up wanting sales infrastructure, fractional sales leadership, or backend data aggregation. They want reliability, growth, better decision-making, and improved business performance. That is where real Business acumen enters the sales conversation.

The hospital cleaning example: selling safety, not cleaning supplies — 04:21 Kevin shares a memorable story about a janitorial services salesperson who understood the true value of his work. In a hospital, the outcome was not a clean room. It was a safe, sterile environment for children receiving serious care. That example lands because it shows how Value selling moves beyond product language into buyer consequence.

Sean's college selection story: outcomes beat features — 07:02 Sean explains how his college won his attention not by selling class size, curriculum, or facilities, but by emphasizing employment outcomes. For a young person entering a difficult economy, "graduates get jobs" mattered more than institutional features. The lesson applies directly to modern sales processes: speak to the outcome the buyer is trying to achieve.

Using PONI to uncover what customers really value — 09:33 Sean introduces PONI: Project, Old way, New way, Improvement. It is a simple but powerful way to build case studies, sharpen Messaging, and identify what your product actually does for customers. The improvement is the story. The product is only the mechanism.

Stop training buyers to shop you on price — 10:52 Kevin gets practical about a common sales mistake: opening with "I can save you money." That may feel buyer-friendly, but it teaches the customer to evaluate you on price alone. Strong Revenue management depends on protecting margin, defending value, and guiding the buyer toward profit, growth, reliability, and strategic impact.

Key Quotes

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 00:32 "I have never needed 10 million people that I need to talk to. What I needed was the four people at that company."

Kevin Lawson — 04:21 "You all have the need to sell your product, but your customer may not need to buy your product. They need what your product does for them."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 09:57 "What was the improvement? Go figure that out, and then from that point on, always talk about the improvement."

Kevin Lawson — 11:13 "If all you can do is save them money, you're not adding any other value."

Kevin Lawson — 13:39 "Revenue feeds ego, profit feeds family."

Additional Resources

B2B Sales Lab — Kevin invites listeners to join the B2B Sales Lab for office hours, peer discussion, and deeper work on real-world sales challenges. Visit b2b-sales-lab.com.

PONI Framework — Sean's practical structure for turning customer stories into stronger sales conversations: Project, Old way, New way, Improvement.

CIH and Metrics — Kevin references prior podcast discussions on CIH and metrics as foundational to improving sales execution, qualification, and the probability of success in major opportunities.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Interview your five best customers and ask them to show you how they use your product or service. Do not ask what features they like. Ask what changed. What was harder before? What is easier now? What risk disappeared? What cost came out? What revenue opportunity opened up? Then rewrite your primary sales message around the improvement rather than the product. That single exercise will expose whether your current Messaging supports real Sales success or merely describes what you sell.

Summary

This episode is a direct challenge to lazy positioning. Kevin and Sean are not arguing against features, data, tools, or price discipline; they are arguing against making those things the center of the sales conversation. Buyers care about outcomes, risk, growth, profit, reliability, and internal justification. If your sales management system, Sales strategies, and sales processes do not force sellers to uncover and communicate those outcomes, your team will drift toward feature dumping and price defense. Listen to this episode if you want a sharper way to explain value, protect margin, improve Revenue generation, and turn customer outcomes into sales conversations that actually matter.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In complex B2B sales, the best opportunities rarely move forward because of a single perfect conversation with a single perfect buyer. They move because the seller creates enough meaningful customer interaction to uncover problems, build internal consensus, reduce the risk of being ghosted, and increase the odds of winning larger deals. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dig into Customer Interaction Hours, or CIH. This practical sales management metric helps sellers evaluate the real quality of their meetings, expand influence inside target accounts, and improve Sales success in longer, more competitive sales cycles.

Key Topics Discussed Customer Interaction Hours as a better measure of meeting quality — 00:53 Sean introduces CIH, a metric built around the value of longer meetings with more customer stakeholders. Rather than treating every sales call as equal, CIH forces sellers and sales managers to ask a harder question: Did this meeting create enough interaction to advance the deal?

Why bigger meetings create better sales intelligence — 02:09 Sean explains why larger, longer meetings often reveal more useful information than short, single-threaded conversations. More people in the room usually means more questions, more objections, more hidden politics, and more clues about the real buying process.

How CIH helps sellers stay alive in competitive deals — 05:49 Sean frames one of the episode's central ideas: if the customer is still talking to you, you are still in the deal. CIH gives salespeople a way to measure whether they are creating enough meaningful interaction to remain relevant, especially in enterprise-level opportunities.

Using customer conversations to diagnose business pain — 08:22 Kevin connects CIH to Value selling, Business acumen, and better discovery. When sellers involve more people across the customer's organization, they uncover operational issues, technical constraints, conflicting expectations, and financial priorities that would never surface in a narrow conversation.

Reducing the risk of ghosted deals through multi-threading — 10:19 Sean explains why deals often disappear when sellers know only two or three people within the account. Customer Interaction Hours push sellers to build more relationships, improving deal visibility and making it harder for an opportunity to die quietly.

Applying CIH in small and mid-sized business sales — 11:45 Kevin and Sean make clear that this is not only an enterprise sales strategy. Whether selling to a company of 10 or 10,000, sellers need to understand who influences the buying decision, who uses the product, who owns the risk, and who can block Revenue generation.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey — 01:45 "If you have a relatively long, complicated sales cycle, CIH or Customer Interaction Hours is a great way to think about it."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 05:49 "If we are still talking, then we are still in the deal."

Kevin Lawson — 08:22 "We have to get in front of the right people at the right time with the right message, and getting them talking about their problems is key."

Kevin Lawson — 09:14 "Don't sell the product you have. Sell the problem you solve."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 11:31 "You do not get ghosted if you know a dozen people at the company. It takes a big conspiracy to have 12 people not return your phone call."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 14:22 "Do it yourself because it's a way to keep the salesperson going the right direction and thinking about, 'How do I make my deals bigger, my meetings bigger?'"

Additional Resources Sean invites listeners to continue the conversation inside B2B Sales Lab, where salespeople and sales leaders can ask questions about Customer Interaction Hours, sales metrics, Sales strategies, Sales processes, Messaging, Revenue management, and practical ways to improve complex B2B selling.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Review the last five meaningful sales meetings on your calendar and calculate your Customer Interaction Hours. Look at how long each meeting lasted and how many customer participants were involved, then ask whether your most important opportunities have enough interaction to justify confidence. If your largest deals are built around short meetings with one or two contacts, that is not a pipeline strategy. That is hope wearing a CRM costume.

The next step is direct: choose one active opportunity and identify three additional stakeholders who should care about the business problem you solve. Then create a reason to engage them. Not a generic "checking in" message. A real business reason tied to risk, implementation, financial impact, user adoption, or strategic value.

Summary This episode gives salespeople and sales managers a sharper way to think about deal momentum. Customer Interaction Hours are not just another metric to stuff into a CRM dashboard; they are a practical lens for understanding whether a seller is creating enough customer engagement to win. Kevin and Sean make the case that bigger meetings, broader stakeholder coverage, and deeper conversations are not administrative extras. They are core to Value selling, better qualification, stronger Business acumen, and more predictable Revenue generation. Listen to this episode if you manage complex opportunities, sell into competitive accounts, or want a better way to know whether your sales pipeline is real or just politely optimistic.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Metrics are not just a sales management dashboard issue. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey make the case that salespeople need their own working metrics, the numbers that help them protect commission income, smooth the revenue rollercoaster, improve forecast accuracy, and make better decisions about where to spend time. This is a practical conversation about pipeline coverage, deal velocity, prospecting discipline, relationship touches, product mix, and the sales processes that turn activity into Sales success.

Key Topics Discussed Salesperson Metrics vs. Management Metrics — 00:00 Kevin opens by separating metrics that matter to salespeople from the broader numbers that matter to marketers or sales managers. The real issue is not reporting. It is knowing whether you are doing enough of the right work to make quota.

Pipeline Coverage and Forecasting for Yourself — 01:26 The conversation moves into pipeline coverage, deal movement, and the danger of being able to hit quota without knowing when you will hit it. That gap creates weak forecasting, poor Revenue management, and avoidable stress.

Avoiding the Sales Commission Rollercoaster — 03:41 Sean explains why inconsistent revenue hurts individual salespeople more than sales managers. A manager can average performance across a team, but a salesperson lives with the direct financial impact of pipeline gaps, delayed deals, and uneven prospecting.

Matching Sales Activity to Sales Cycle Length — 05:28 Sean makes the point that a 60-day sales cycle and a six-month sales cycle require different behavior. The salesperson must understand how much time belongs in prospecting, discovery, qualification, scoping, closing, and relationship development.

Measuring Deal Creation and Customer Touches — 07:07 Kevin discusses why the number of new deals created matters, especially when viewed by time period and business model. He also shifts into relationship metrics, including how often salespeople intentionally reconnect with customers, former customers, and referral sources.

Planning to 110% with A, B, and C Deals — 12:12 Sean closes with a practical quota-planning model: build the year around 110%, then break the number into A, B, and C deal sizes. This forces better Sales strategies, sharper prioritization, and more realistic Revenue generation planning.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson — 00:00 "I want to talk about metrics that matter to salespeople, not marketers, not sales managers… but the people out there carrying the bag."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 03:41 "I want to talk about the ability to not ride the rollercoaster."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 05:50 "If you have a six-month sales cycle, same problem, but you have more time to budget it out. You can go a week without prospecting, but you can't go a month without prospecting."

Kevin Lawson — 07:40 "I really like for all sales teams to know how many deals need to come into their pipeline per time period."

Kevin Lawson — 10:24 "Being intentional with the relationship is as important."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 12:34 "Start the year assuming you're going to go to 110%. Build your plan to go to 110%."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab Sean and Kevin referenced the B2B Sales Lab, a community where B2B salespeople can ask questions, get feedback, and talk through real-world Sales strategies, sales processes, Value selling, Messaging, Business acumen, and Revenue generation challenges. Learn more at b2b-sales-lab.com.

Traction by Gino Wickman https://a.co/d/0c9rXQMz Kevin referenced the idea of "traction" while discussing relationship discipline and consistent outreach. The point was not about theory. It was about keeping sales relationships active before the pipeline forces you to care.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Build a simple personal pipeline math model this week.

Start with your annual quota, then plan to 110%. Break that number into A, B, and C deal sizes. Estimate how many of each deal type you need, then work backward into how many opportunities must be created each month based on your close rate and sales cycle length. From there, decide whether your current prospecting, customer outreach, referral activity, and deal advancement work can actually support the number. If the math does not work, the problem is not motivation. It is the plan.

Summary This episode is worth listening to because Kevin and Sean take a topic many salespeople avoid, metrics, and make it directly relevant to the person carrying the number. The conversation is not about building a prettier CRM report or giving sales management more inspection points. It is about using metrics to protect your income, reduce uncertainty, improve your forecast, and make better daily decisions. If you have ever had a great month followed by a weak one, or a full pipeline that somehow failed to convert when you needed it, this episode will sound uncomfortably familiar. More importantly, it gives you a practical way to regain control before the rollercoaster starts again.

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey break down a sales management practice that too many teams underuse: reviewing won deals with the same discipline they apply to lost deals. The conversation moves past celebration alone and into the real operating question: did the team win because the sales process worked, or because someone hit a lucky buzzer-beater? For leaders serious about Sales success, Revenue generation, and building repeatable Sales processes, this episode is a reminder that the best wins are not always the dramatic ones. Often, they are the boring, well-managed, properly documented deals that never should have been in doubt.

Key Topics Discussed Why Won Deal Reviews Matter as Much as Lost Deal Reviews — 00:20 Kevin opens the episode by comparing won deal reviews to a SportsCenter highlight reel. Lost deal reviews help teams understand what went wrong, but won deal reviews reveal whether success came from strong Sales strategies, disciplined execution, or simple luck.

Celebrate the Whole Team, Not Just the Closer — 01:40 Sean emphasizes that a true win often involves more than the salesperson. Proposal writers, credit teams, delivery teams, operations, and others may have played a role. Strong sales management means recognizing the system behind the win, not creating a hero culture around one person.

Buzzer-Beater Wins vs. Controlled Wins — 03:00 Sean challenges leaders to determine whether the deal was won late through a heroic save or whether the team was in control from the beginning. The better business model is not dramatic last-second selling. It is predictable Revenue management through process discipline.

Doing "Winner Stuff" in the Sales Process — 04:06 Kevin lays out the behaviors that separate consistent winners from lucky sellers: good notes, timely follow-up, clear problem statements, expectation management, proper sequencing, and bringing the right people into the deal at the right time. That is where Business acumen meets execution.

Review Wins by Sales Stage, Not Storytelling — 06:41 Sean argues that leaders should avoid letting won deal reviews become casual storytelling sessions. Instead, they should walk the team through each stage in the CRM: discovery, scoping, economic buyer engagement, validation, proposal, and close. That structure turns a win into training, reinforcement, and better future Messaging.

How New Sellers Learn from Won Deal Reviews — 09:27 Kevin explains why won deal reviews are especially valuable for newer reps. They may not yet have their own deep sales stories, but they can learn the questions, positioning, Value selling behaviors, and customer impact examples that successful sellers used.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson — 01:09 "You never know until you start doing the analysis, which is the same thing as not doing the analysis on your lost deals."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 03:40 "Sure, it makes you, puts you on SportsCenter, but let's be honest. Let's be boring. Let's just bring in the revenue."

Kevin Lawson — 05:29 "The simple stuff done well at scale becomes quota-busting kind of behaviors and quota-busting kind of performance."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 07:53 "Step by step, walk through the story as stages of the sales process."

Kevin Lawson — 11:17 "How could I instead go value, impact, value, impact, value? Because that's what drives customer expectation, which drives reputation, which drives stickiness."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 13:40 "When you're doing a win deal, celebrate the win. Really give the right team all of the credit."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab Sean refers listeners to B2B Sales Lab, a community where sales professionals and sales leaders can discuss real sales challenges, share wins, and sharpen their Sales processes. Visit b2b-sales-lab.com to learn more.

Moneyball / Billy Beane Reference Kevin references the Moneyball idea of winning through disciplined, repeatable base hits instead of relying on grand slams. The sales parallel is clear: sustainable Revenue generation comes from consistent execution, not occasional heroics.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Pick one recently won deal and run a formal won deal review by CRM stage. Do not ask the salesperson to "tell the story." Walk through discovery, qualification, scoping, economic buyer access, validation, proposal, negotiation, and close. At each stage, identify what was done well, what was skipped, who contributed, what customer insight was captured, and what should be repeated. The decision you are making is simple: was this win evidence of a repeatable sales process, or was it a lucky outcome dressed up as Sales success?

Summary This episode is a sharp reminder that winning is not enough. Sales leaders have to understand why the team won, whether the win can be repeated, and whether the process created value for the customer before the proposal ever arrived. Kevin and Sean make the case that won deal reviews are not administrative exercises. They are sales management tools that improve business acumen, strengthen messaging, reinforce value selling, and help create a team that wins more often without relying on last-minute heroics. Listen to this episode if your team celebrates wins but has not yet extracted the operating lessons from them.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Lost deals are not just missed revenue. They are evidence. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey challenge the easy excuses salespeople often use after a loss, especially "we lost on price" and "the customer made no decision." The real issue is usually deeper: weak value selling, poor discovery, unclear messaging, bad fit, or a failure to create enough business pain to justify change. If you care about Sales success, Revenue generation, and better Sales processes, this episode gives you a practical way to turn lost deals into better sales management decisions.

Key Topics Discussed Why lost deals teach more than won deals — 00:42 Sean opens with a blunt premise: if you occasionally lose, you have something to learn. Won deals prove you did enough right. Lost deals expose where your Sales strategies, messaging, value creation, qualification, or execution broke down.

Why "we lost on price" is usually the wrong answer — 01:16 Sean and Kevin push back on the idea that price is the real reason deals are lost. Their argument: price objections often reveal that the seller failed to establish enough value, urgency, or business impact. That is a Revenue management problem, not just a discounting problem.

The danger of "no decision" as a sales excuse — 02:00 Kevin reframes "no decision" as a cop-out. If the customer does not act, the salesperson may not have created enough contrast between the pain of staying the same and the pain of change.

Measure losses by stage, count, and dollars — 04:24 Kevin makes an important sales management distinction: losing an early lead is not the same as losing after scoping, quoting, proof of concept, or negotiation. Teams need to know where deals are leaking, how many are being lost, and how much revenue is being lost.

Use lost deal analysis to sharpen your ideal client profile — 10:50 Sean connects lost deals directly to the ICP discipline. If your team repeatedly works hard and still loses with a certain type of prospect, that may not be a sales execution problem. It may be a market selection problem.

RFPs, go/no-go decisions, and disciplined deal reviews — 12:43 Kevin points out that RFPs require a different level of structure. If your team keeps saying, "We never win those," the answer is not to complain. The answer is to inspect the process, build better decision rules, and stop chasing work you were never positioned to win.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey — 00:42 "You will learn more from analyzing your lost deals than analyzing your won deals."

Kevin Lawson — 02:00 "No decision is a cop-out."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 04:09 "You don't lose a deal on price. No salesperson ever loses a deal on price."

Kevin Lawson — 08:40 "Don't ask the five whys, ask the 500 whys when you don't know what's going on in your business."

Sean O'Shaughnessey — 12:21 "Spend that time prospecting for more customers that are just like your ideal client profile, and you'll win rate what's going on."

Kevin Lawson — 12:50 "Often simple is smooth and smooth is fast."

Additional Resources Sean references the classic Strategic Selling gap concept: where the customer is today, where they want to be, and whether the gap is large enough to justify action. https://a.co/d/09kL0gKA

Kevin also mentions the B2B Sales Lab, a private community where salespeople and sales leaders can bring real sales challenges, including lost deals, RFP struggles, ICP questions, and value proposition issues, into a practitioner-led environment for peer review and practical advice. b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Review your last 10 serious lost deals, not unresponsive leads, but real opportunities that reached scoping, proposal, proof of concept, quoting, or negotiation. For each one, document the stage where it was lost, the dollar value, the reason given, the reason you believe is true, the customer type, and whether the prospect matched your ideal client profile. Then look for patterns. The value is not in explaining away one loss. The value is in finding the repeatable leak in your Sales processes.

Summary This episode is a useful listen for any salesperson, sales manager, or business owner who wants better Business acumen around lost opportunities. Sean and Kevin argue that lost-deal analysis is not administrative cleanup. It is one of the fastest paths to better Value selling, sharper Messaging, stronger qualification, and more predictable Revenue generation. The conversation is direct, practical, and uncomfortable in the right way, because it forces the listener to stop accepting vague explanations and start inspecting the sales system. Listen to this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales if you want to improve win rates by learning what your losses are already trying to teach you.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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For many sales teams, the leads problem is not really a leads problem. It is an ideal client profile problem, a value proposition problem, and a focus problem disguised as pipeline activity. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dig into the practical discipline of building a lead list that salespeople can actually use, one grounded in clear ICP definition, sharper Messaging, better Sales processes, and a more realistic understanding of market share. This is a direct, useful conversation for sales leaders, owners, and sellers who want better Revenue generation without wasting effort on prospects they were never built to win.

Key Topics Discussed The three versions of a leads problem — 00:00 Kevin opens with a useful distinction: some companies have no leads, some have too many leads, and some have plenty of the wrong leads. Each problem requires a different sales management response, but all three point back to the same issue: the business has not clearly defined who it should pursue.

Building an ideal client profile before building the list — 01:10 The episode makes a strong case for documenting the ideal client profile in practical, observable terms. Company size, revenue, locations, executive tenure, installed systems, and other demographic signals should inform the list before a seller starts calling. This is where Business acumen begins to separate disciplined Sales strategies from random prospecting.

Using buying signals and psychographics to improve Value selling — 03:00 Kevin explains that the demographic definition is only part of the work. Sellers also need to understand why companies buy, what pressure they are trying to relieve, and what business outcomes matter to them. That is the bridge between raw data and meaningful Value selling.

Learning from your five best customers — 07:44 Sean reframes ICP work around a deceptively simple question: which five customers were the most fun, easiest, fastest, and most valuable to sell? Those companies likely hold the clues to your best future market. Interview them, study them, and use what you learn from them to sharpen your Messaging.

Shrinking the market to improve Sales success — 10:37 Sean challenges the common assumption that a bigger list is better. Most companies cannot sell to, serve, or fulfill every opportunity in their theoretical market. A focused list, built around realistic capacity and high-fit targets, can drive better Sales success than a bloated database full of distractions.

Turning ICP, value proposition, and market share into Revenue management discipline — 13:31 Kevin closes by tying the episode back to the fundamentals: ideal client profile, unique value proposition, Messaging, market share, and the actual people who buy. Strong Revenue management starts when leaders stop treating all leads as equal and begin building repeatable systems around the customers they can serve best.

Key Quotes "Every business has a leads problem. I don't care if you are wildly successful, really struggling, or somewhere in the middle." — Kevin Lawson, 00:13

"If you haven't written down in painstaking detail who you want to attract and sell to, carve out time to do your demographic definition." — Kevin Lawson, 01:45

"Who are the five companies that you sold to that were just fun to sell to? They got your product, your service, your capability, your offering immediately." — Sean O'Shaughnessey, 07:44

"You have more people to sell to than you can possibly imagine. You need to whittle your ideal client profile down." — Sean O'Shaughnessey, 10:12

"We have to find our sweet spot and then lean into it. That's how we make a successful year out of a leads problem." — Kevin Lawson, 14:17

Additional Resources Kevin references several data and research tools that can help sales teams define and build better lead lists, including:

Data Axle through public library access
Apollo
KnowledgeNet
Seamless
ZoomInfo
Crunchbase

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Identify your five best customers and interview them before building or expanding your next lead list.

Do not start with a database. Start with reality. Look at the customers who bought quickly, understood your value, paid appropriately, were good to serve, and represented the kind of business you would gladly replicate. Then ask them deeper questions: how they make money, where they lose money, what pressures are changing in their market, what they value from vendors, and what would make your company more useful to them.

That work will improve your ideal client profile, sharpen your value proposition, and give your salespeople better Messaging for future outreach. More importantly, it forces a decision: are you trying to sell to everyone, or are you building a focused market where your Sales processes can consistently generate Revenue?

Summary This episode is a strong listen for any sales leader, owner, or seller who has mistaken activity for strategy. Kevin and Sean argue that lead generation works only when the target market is defined with sufficient precision to guide action. The conversation moves from ICP and buying signals to market focus, list building, sales capacity, and practical Revenue management. If your pipeline feels too thin, too noisy, or too full of poor-fit opportunities, this episode will help you rethink the problem before you waste another quarter chasing the wrong companies.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey tackle one of the most overlooked drivers of sales success: forecast accuracy. This episode goes beyond the usual conversation about CRM hygiene and quota pressure to get to the real issue: salespeople and sales managers carry critical information that the rest of the company depends on for hiring, staffing, planning, and revenue generation. Sean and Kevin argue that forecasting is not administrative overhead. It is a direct reflection of discovery quality, business acumen, value selling, and the discipline of running strong sales processes. If you want sharper sales management, more credible messaging, and a more reliable path to revenue management, this conversation is worth your time.

Key Topics Discussed Why forecasting is a leadership responsibility, not just a sales task (00:00) Sean opens with a memorable analogy: with great power comes great responsibility. Salespeople hold information no one else in the company has—what is likely to close, when it will close, what the buyer needs, and what revenue is actually coming. That knowledge creates an obligation to communicate with accuracy.

How poor forecast data affects hiring, staffing, and company decisions (02:00) Kevin makes the stakes clear. Forecast data is not trapped inside the sales department. Executive teams use it to make staffing decisions, resource plans, and growth bets. When the data is weak, the business makes bad decisions.

Why discovery is the foundation of accurate forecasting (05:00) Sean ties forecasting directly to discovery. If you do not ask tough questions early, you will eventually pay for it later in the sales cycle. Strong discovery clarifies the customer's business drivers, strengthens messaging, improves value selling, and makes forecast confidence more credible.

Why sales strategies fail when pipeline discipline is weak (08:07) Kevin connects forecasting to pipeline reality. Leaders cannot force a number into existence simply because they want growth. If the top of the funnel, qualification discipline, and relationship development are not in place, the revenue generation target is a fantasy, not a strategy.

Why customers buy outcomes, not features (09:21) Both hosts reinforce a central truth of value selling: buyers care much more about business impact than about technical specifications. The real issue is not the drill, but the hole—and even more than that, what the hole allows them to accomplish.

How inaccurate forecasting damages real people and real businesses (13:13) Sean closes with a story from early in his career that shows the human cost of bad forecasting. A low forecast contributed to layoffs that, in hindsight, were unnecessary. It is a sharp reminder that revenue management is not theoretical. Accuracy matters.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:00) "One of the wisest men in all of sales is a gentleman by the name of Stan Lee."

Kevin Lawson (02:02) "The entire company is basing its hiring and staffing decisions on your data."

Kevin Lawson (03:25) "You have to ask tough questions early."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (07:46) "You document all that, and you tell your boss the truth. It's as simple as that."

Kevin Lawson (11:20) "Put the date that the customer should buy based on the insight you've gleaned, not the date that you want them to buy."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (12:00) "You don't sell the drill, you sell the hole, and more importantly than that, you sell what goes through the hole."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab Sean references the B2B Sales Lab community as a place for sales professionals and sales managers to ask questions, refine their thinking, and improve their skills in areas such as forecasting, sales processes, and revenue generation.

Chris Cocca on the importance of Discover Sean mentions episode 85 featuring Chris Cocca, particularly his point that discovery is the most important part of the sales process. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/transforming-opportunities-chris-coccas-insights-on-perfecting-the-discovery-meeting

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your current pipeline and rewrite the expected close date for every meaningful deal based on buyer evidence, not seller hope.

That means looking at each opportunity and asking: What business issue is driving this purchase? Who has validated the urgency? What internal steps does the customer still need to complete? What evidence supports the date in CRM? This one habit sharpens sales management, improves forecast reliability, strengthens messaging, and forces better value selling. Most missed forecasts are not caused by bad luck. They are caused by untested assumptions that stayed in the pipeline too long.

Summary This episode is a concise but serious discussion about forecasting, discovery, and the responsibility that comes with carrying the company's most important field intelligence. Sean and Kevin do not treat forecasting like a spreadsheet exercise. They treat it as a reflection of business acumen, selling discipline, and the quality of a seller's thinking. If you want better sales strategies, more reliable sales processes, and a stronger grasp of how forecasting affects the entire business, this is an episode worth downloading. It will challenge how you look at your pipeline—and probably how you communicate it.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales gets after a basic truth that too many salespeople ignore: meeting prep is not administrative overhead, it is a competitive weapon. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey break down why organized sellers create better first impressions, ask sharper questions, and build trust faster than competitors who show up improvising. The conversation moves from practical prospect research to the sales management discipline, then to how modern AI tools can reduce prep time without lowering quality. If you care about Sales success, stronger Messaging, and more consistent Revenue generation, this episode gives you a simple edge you can apply immediately.

Key Topics Discussed Why meeting prep still separates serious sellers from average ones (00:00) Kevin opens with a frustration most professionals recognize instantly: the seller who accepted the meeting but clearly did not do the homework. The discussion makes the case that doing the simple things well is still one of the most reliable Sales strategies in B2B selling.

How preparation signals respect, credibility, and Business acumen (01:00) Sean shares an early-career story about using a Wall Street Journal mention to walk into a customer meeting knowing more about the company's current situation than the contact did. The point is not cleverness. It is that informed preparation communicates seriousness and creates trust.

What sellers should actually know before a prospect or customer meeting (03:10) Kevin lays out the practical standard: know the business model, know how the company creates value, understand the people involved, and have a working sales hypothesis. He also ties preparation back to documented ICPs, personas, value propositions, and the broader Sales processes that support effective prospecting.

Using frameworks like PESTEL to improve Value selling conversations (06:19) The conversation moves beyond surface-level research into structured analysis. Kevin explains how frameworks such as PESTEL help a seller understand the customer's operating environment and bring relevant insight into the meeting, which is where real Value selling starts.

How Google Alerts and AI can compress research time without lowering quality (07:25) Sean introduces Google Alerts as a low-friction way to stay current on target accounts and local developments. He then connects that to AI, showing how sellers can save prompts, generate company or industry briefings, and use tools like PESTEL analysis on demand before calls and meetings.

Why current research matters more than favorite tools (12:00) Kevin closes by warning against relying on stale assumptions or outdated tooling. Platforms change. Commercial products evolve. What matters is staying current and using the available tools to support better Revenue management, stronger Messaging, and more informed customer conversations.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:40): "Being ready for a meeting is so simple. It's often overlooked, and it's a huge opportunity to outshine your competition as a seller."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (02:08): "He was so impressed that we knew his business and we knew what was going on about his company that until the last day that I knew him, he always mentioned it."

Kevin Lawson (03:28): "Your ducks in a row means you know the business you're calling on, what they do, how they create value, how you can have your sales hypothesis, how you can create value for them."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (11:19): "There is no excuse that you don't know today's announcement about your prospect when you walk in the door or pick up the phone to contact that prospect."

Kevin Lawson (14:06): "Be current with your research. Be current with the commercially available products so that you can serve your prospects and customers well."

Additional Resources Google Alerts Sean recommends Google Alerts as a simple, proven way to monitor prospect companies, industries, and geographic territories to stay relevant in conversations.

PESTEL Framework Kevin references PESTEL as a useful framework for understanding the political, economic, social, technological, environmental, and legal factors affecting a customer's business.

B2B Sales Lab B2B Sales Lab is a place where sales professionals and sales leaders can work through practical selling and sales management challenges in more depth.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Open your calendar and identify all upcoming prospect meetings and prospecting blocks. Then make the first 15 minutes of each one non-negotiable research time. Use that window to review company news, confirm the contact's role and influence, revisit your ICP and persona fit, and build a working hypothesis about where you can create value. This is a small discipline, but it sharpens Messaging, improves call quality, and separates a seller who is merely active from one who is actually driving Sales success.

Summary This episode is a sharp reminder that strong selling does not begin when the meeting starts. It begins before the meeting exists in the customer's mind. Kevin and Sean show how disciplined preparation improves trust, differentiation, and execution across prospecting, account management, and broader sales management efforts. They also make the modern case clearly: AI should not replace thinking; it should accelerate the research that improves thinking. If you want tighter Sales processes, better value-selling conversations, and more reliable revenue generation, this episode is worth your time.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey turn an informal B2B Sales Lab office-hours conversation into a sharp discussion on pipeline hygiene, forecast accuracy, and the habits that separate serious sellers from hopeful ones. What starts as a conversation about cleaning up Q2 quickly becomes a broader lesson in sales management, business acumen, and personal accountability. They dig into why sloppy CRM data creates bad decisions, why aspirational close dates damage credibility, and why real sales success still comes back to disciplined sales processes and direct customer contact. For sales professionals, sales leaders, and anyone responsible for revenue generation, this episode is a practical reset.

Key Topics Discussed Why pipeline hygiene matters right now (02:11) Kevin opens with a blunt point: whether you are ahead, behind, or exactly on plan, now is the time to clean up your pipeline. Dead leads need to be removed, stalled opportunities need clear next steps, and unrealistic deals need to be moved to a timeline that reflects reality. This is more than administration. It is the foundation of reliable sales management and cleaner revenue management.

The danger of aspirational forecasting (08:08) Sean and Kevin take aim at one of the oldest problems in selling: the fantasy close date. They explain why putting deals into the quarter just to make the pipeline look healthier undermines trust, makes leadership harder, and creates unnecessary scrutiny. Good forecasting is not about optimism. It is about judgment, honest messaging, and the discipline to call a deal what it is.

How to handle slipped deals before they slip again (06:00) Sean breaks down what a slipped deal really means. If an opportunity slips once, it may be explainable. If it slips twice, the seller needs to challenge the underlying need, timing, and pain more aggressively. That turns the conversation from passive deal chasing into value selling, where the seller must re-establish why the problem matters now.

What accurate CRM ownership really signals (10:38) Sean makes the standard clear: if your name is on the deal, the record should reflect your best understanding of reality. That includes dates, scope, amount, risks, and notes. He also draws an important distinction between uncertainty and carelessness. Missing information can be understandable. Failing to document what you do know is not. This is where disciplined sales processes and professional credibility meet.

How strong sellers earn trust and promotion opportunities (14:27) The conversation shifts from data quality to career trajectory. Sean argues that sellers who forecast accurately, exceed quota, and help others improve naturally build the reputation that leads to advancement. Kevin reinforces that when a manager asks you to teach the rest of the team how you work, that is one of the clearest signals that your approach is working.

The KPIs that actually move performance (17:55) As they wrap up, Kevin and Sean focus on useful performance indicators. Not vanity metrics. Not activity for activity's sake. They emphasize developing new relationships, preparing for meetings, asking for next steps, requesting the order, requesting referrals, and increasing one-to-one customer conversations. The point is simple: better sales strategies come from better behaviors, repeated consistently.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (08:26) "Aspirational close date is absolute garbage."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (10:38) "Your name is on the deal… I expect it to be an accurate representation as you understand it."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (19:13) "The metric that always works, always, always works is if you're talking to a customer, you're probably doing good things."

Kevin Lawson (17:04) "He really cares about how many people he helped get to President's Club."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab Sean and Kevin refer throughout the episode to the B2B Sales Lab community, a peer environment for salespeople, sales leaders, and sales professionals who want to sharpen execution, exchange insight, and improve sales success through practical discussion.

Previous episode featuring Joe English (16:53) Kevin references the March 31 episode with Joe English, particularly around leadership, development, and the idea that strong leaders measure success by how many people they help reach top performance.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Run a hard review of every open deal and lead in your CRM this week. Remove dead opportunities, reset unrealistic close dates, document the real blockers, and assign a next step with a deadline. Then identify every deal that has slipped more than once and ask a tougher question: what is the real business pain of not solving this now? That one exercise improves messaging, strengthens forecast credibility, and gives you a cleaner base for revenue generation in the quarter ahead.

Summary This episode is a useful listen for anyone who wants a more credible pipeline, stronger forecasting, and better execution going into the next quarter. Kevin and Sean do not romanticize selling. They treat it as a discipline built on accuracy, ownership, customer contact, and sound judgment. If you care about sales management, sales strategies, value selling, and building the kind of habits that support long-term sales success, this conversation will give you something immediately usable. It is practical, direct, and worth downloading before your next pipeline review.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales digs into a question that sits underneath almost every stalled growth story: why do good companies with solid offerings still fail to scale profitably? Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Joe English of 360 Consulting to unpack what separates random sales activity from a real growth system. The conversation moves past personality-driven selling and into the mechanics of sales management, sales processes, messaging, and execution. Joe makes the case that revenue generation becomes fragile when a business depends on heroics, and durable when leaders build repeatable systems around the right customers, the right value, and the right internal structure. For leaders focused on sales success, business acumen, and profitable scale, this episode is a sharp discussion of how to turn growth into an engineered outcome instead of a hopeful one.

Key Topics Discussed 00:43 – Profitable growth versus growth for its own sake Sean frames the central issue: many companies have decent products and some good processes, yet still are not growing at the rate their model demands. Joe responds by arguing that growth matters only if it produces EBITDA and bankable outcomes, not just top-line growth.

01:42 – The four pillars of a repeatable growth system Joe outlines the foundation he uses with clients: go-to-market, people, process, and execution. His point is straightforward—sales success is not driven by charisma alone. Sustainable revenue generation comes from combining the art of selling with disciplined system design.

04:15 – Why ICP, value selling, and sales processes come first When Kevin asks what Joe looks for first, Joe explains that his advisory process starts by clarifying the ideal customer profile, then refining the company's value propositions, and then documenting the actual sales process. That sequence matters because weak positioning and vague targeting often lead to poor execution downstream.

06:23 – The danger of selling the wrong value Sean raises a common market mistake: companies often describe their offering one way while customers actually buy it for a different reason. That disconnect creates weak messaging, confused sales conversations, and slower growth. Joe agrees and argues that many firms try to be all things to all buyers instead of owning a specific problem they solve exceptionally well.

08:07 – Change management and getting people to adopt better selling habits The conversation shifts into change management, where Joe says the hardest part of any transformation is people. His approach is to help individuals understand how structure, tools, and clearer expectations make them better and more efficient rather than simply creating management overhead.

10:39 – Why sales is often not the strongest function in a growing company Sean asks whether owners truly think their job is to make salespeople great. Joe's answer is nuanced: most owners do want success for their people, but they often only know how to systematize the function they personally came from. In many firms, that means operations is stronger than sales, and sales management becomes an afterthought until growth stalls.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:00) "Success is determined by the eyes of the beholder."

Joe English (01:42) "Growth is super important for any business, right? You're growing or you're shrinking."

Joe English (03:29) "It has to be profitable growth. It can't just be growth for growth's sake."

Joe English (05:38) "How do we have conversations and tell stories to clients that are relevant to them, not us pitching?"

Sean O'Shaughnessey (06:23) "You're not actually talking about what the value is that the customer gets from your product."

Joe English (09:55) "We're here to make you better because if you are successful in your role, that just makes everybody else more successful."

Additional Resources Joe English, 360 Consulting DFW - Joe@360consultingdfw.com

Jim Collins' Good to Great - https://a.co/d/05TQ0K3d

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit whether your company's messaging matches the value your best customers actually receive. That sounds simple, but it is usually where revenue management starts to break. If your team describes the product one way while customers buy it for another outcome, your sales strategies, value selling, and sales processes are all built on a false premise. Start with three questions: Who is our best customer? What problem do they uniquely hire us to solve? What does our sales team say that proves we understand the problem better than our competitors? That exercise forces sharper messaging, stronger sales management, and more reliable revenue generation.

Summary If you care about sales success beyond motivational noise, this episode is worth your time. Kevin, Sean, and Joe English get into the real mechanics of profitable growth: ideal customer profile discipline, stronger messaging, better sales processes, practical change management, and the difference between a founder-dependent business and one built for scale. It is a compact yet useful conversation for leaders trying to improve their business acumen, tighten their sales strategies, and build a company that grows with intention rather than strain.

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This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales tackles a problem most B2B sellers know they should solve but rarely do: how to turn a customer's annual report into practical sales insight. Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson argue that modern selling requires more than relationship instinct and product knowledge. It requires stronger business acumen, sharper messaging, and a willingness to use AI as a real thinking partner. In a compact but highly practical discussion, they show how sales professionals can use a company's 10-K, executive commentary, and AI prompts to uncover priorities, hiring plans, risks, and revenue direction. The result is a smarter approach to discovery, stronger value selling, and more relevant conversations, all of which improve revenue generation and long-term sales success.

Key Topics Discussed Why sales in 2030 will not look like sales in 1990, 2000, 2010, or even 2020 (00:00) Sean opens with a direct challenge to outdated sales practices, arguing that the pace of change is forcing sales leaders and front-line sellers to rethink how they prepare, learn, and compete.

AI versus automation and why both matter to modern sales management (02:00) Kevin draws an important distinction between workflow automation and artificial intelligence, explaining that while this episode focuses on AI, many companies can improve sales processes immediately by exploring both.

How to use a customer's 10-K annual report as a sales intelligence asset (03:22) Sean lays out a practical method for finding and downloading annual reports, then reframes them as a powerful source of insight for discovery calls, QBRs, and strategic account conversations.

How to prompt AI to extract selling insight without making assumptions (07:38) Kevin shares a simple but effective prompting structure that positions AI as a senior analyst tasked with identifying the company's top priorities, using only exact language from the report and transcript.

How to tailor prompts to your offer, industry, and customer problems (10:29) Sean expands the technique by showing why sellers should add their own elevator pitch, industry context, and solution focus so the AI can return insights that are actually useful for sales strategies and revenue management.

Which business questions matter most when mining annual reports (12:00) The conversation moves from theory to execution as Sean suggests high-value questions around projected revenue, hiring plans, geopolitical pressures, tariffs, fuel costs, and lawsuits that could affect a company's direction.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:00) "How you sold in 1990 and 2000 and 2010 in 2020 is not how you're going to sell in 2030."

Kevin Lawson (02:20) "I want AI to be a thinking partner alongside of me."

Kevin Lawson (09:00) "It's so important to understand why it's not just because we don't have the time. It's because the company we're calling on, the prospect is telling us in no uncertain terms what they're about to do."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (12:00) "You can get an immense amount of data about your client, about your prospect by just having AI, your AI assistant, your AI intern to figure all that stuff out."

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab Sean and Kevin reference the B2B Sales Lab as a community for salespeople, sales leaders, and business owners who want to exchange ideas, strengthen sales management capability, and improve how they grow revenue.

Company Investor Relations Pages Sean recommends starting with the customer's own website to locate investor relations materials and annual reports.

SEC Filings / 10-K Reports Kevin specifically notes that sellers should focus on the 10-K annual report rather than confusing it with an 8-K or 10-Q.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Take one target account this week and download its most recent 10-K annual report, plus the executive transcript, if available. Then upload those materials into your preferred AI platform and ask it to identify the company's top five strategic initiatives, expected risks, hiring priorities, and revenue direction using only what is explicitly stated in the source material. This is a meaningful discipline because it strengthens business acumen, improves messaging, and gives you a more credible point of view before your next call. Done consistently, it can elevate both individual sales success and the overall quality of your sales processes.

Summary This episode is a strong listen for any seller, sales leader, or business owner who wants to stop showing up underprepared to important customer conversations. Sean and Kevin take a dense, intimidating source of corporate information and turn it into a usable framework for better discovery, better value selling, and smarter account planning. If you want sharper sales strategies, stronger revenue generation, and a more practical way to use AI in the real world of B2B selling, this episode gives you a concrete place to start.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales gets to the heart of a mistake too many sellers make: they confuse product talk with real value. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey unpack the difference between pain and goals, then push the conversation further into what actually matters in sales success, understanding how buyers measure outcomes, how decisions get made, and how to connect your offer to revenue generation, business acumen, and meaningful results. This is not a discussion about clever wording. It is a discussion about how better sales strategies, sharper messaging, and stronger value selling lead to better sales management and more credible revenue management conversations. If you sell into complex environments, this episode will sharpen the way you think about sales processes and how customers justify change.

Key Topics Discussed Pain vs. goals in the buying decision (01:00) Sean breaks down the practical difference between a problem someone can tolerate and a goal important enough to fund. That distinction matters because many stalled deals are not really lost deals; they were never priority deals in the first place.

Why value selling must be framed in the customer's terms (05:00) Kevin argues that buyers do not care about features, benefits, or polished collateral unless those things connect to outcomes they actually measure. This is a strong lesson in messaging, sales processes, and how sales success depends on tying effort to business value.

How to quantify what matters to the buyer (08:00) The conversation shifts into measurement. Kevin explains that whether you start with pain or start with goals, the real work is quantifying the impact. That means understanding the individual persona, how they are evaluated, what drives their bonus, and what creates personal and professional value for them.

Small deals are often pain deals. Big deals are usually goal deals. (10:00) Sean makes an important distinction for sellers working on larger opportunities. Small purchases often solve immediate operational pain. Larger purchases require alignment with broader corporate priorities, capital allocation, and the economics of long-term return.

How value selling connects cost, payoff, and timing (11:00) Sean brings the discussion back to core business acumen: what does it cost to live with the problem, what does it cost to solve it, and what is the payback? That is where revenue management, value selling, and serious sales strategies stop being theory and start becoming executive-level conversations.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:01) "Don't get wrapped around the axle on words, but get wrapped around the axle on how you're gonna create value for your next deal."

Kevin Lawson (07:03) "Our job as salespeople is to create insights around what value we bring."

Kevin Lawson (09:16) "People don't buy the project, they buy the outcome."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (09:45) "Drills are about putting holes in something else. Buying a drill is worthless."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (11:37) "How much does it cost to put up with it, and how much does it cost to solve it?"

Additional Resources B2B Sales Lab A private community for sales professionals who want help solving real sales problems in a non-public setting. b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Take one active opportunity in your pipeline and force yourself to answer three questions in writing: Is this deal driven by pain or by a goal? How is that pain or goal quantified in business terms? Who inside the account actually has the authority to fund the solution?

That exercise sounds simple, but it exposes weak sales thinking fast. It improves messaging, strengthens value selling, and helps you determine whether you are dealing with a tolerated inconvenience or a real business priority. In practical terms, it will make your sales processes more disciplined and improve your ability to pursue revenue-generating opportunities that can actually close.

Summary This episode is worth your time because it strips away a lot of the lazy thinking that weakens modern selling. Kevin and Sean do not merely debate pain versus goals as abstract concepts. They show why that distinction shapes sales management, sales success, value selling, and the quality of your revenue management conversations. If you want to sharpen your business acumen, improve your sales strategies, and learn how better messaging can move opportunities forward, this episode will give you a more useful way to think about how deals really get done.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey take on a question that exposes more than technique: Are you actually coachable? This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales digs into the connection between coachability, trust, quota attainment, and long-term sales success. Along the way, they move beyond generic advice and into the real mechanics of growth in selling—how coaching sharpens business acumen, improves sales management, strengthens sales processes, and ultimately drives stronger revenue generation. If you care about becoming more effective in high-pressure sales moments, this episode is worth downloading.

Key Topics Discussed Why coachability matters in sales and sales leadership (00:00) Kevin opens by tying coachability to performance, preparation, and intentional execution. Sean expands the lens, arguing that coachability is not just a seller issue. Sales leaders need it too, especially when they are accountable to a CEO, president, CFO, or board and must adapt in real time to what the field is actually seeing.

The difference between getting coaching and applying coaching (03:13) Sean makes a critical distinction: being coachable is not nodding politely at advice. It is trying the idea, evaluating the outcome, and returning with thoughtful feedback about what worked, what missed, and how to adapt the tactic to your own style, messaging, and customer context.

The basketball free-throw analogy for pressure-selling moments (04:29) One of the strongest sections in the episode compares a live sales moment to stepping to the free-throw line with the game on the line. The coach cannot take the shot for you. In the same way, no manager can rescue you when the CEO unexpectedly joins the meeting and says, "Let's make a deal right now." That is where preparation, coaching, and value-selling discipline show up.

Coaching comes from more places than your manager (06:33) Kevin broadens the definition of coach to include peers, internal champions, prospect-side advocates, customers, and even deals you lost. That is an important shift for anyone serious about sales strategies and revenue management. The lesson is simple: if you accept input from only one source, you limit your own development.

Why coachability increases quota attainment (08:24) Kevin makes the case that coachability is not a soft trait. It has hard commercial consequences. Sellers who stay open to wise counsel, surround themselves with strong peers, and learn from feedback tend to improve execution and increase quota attainment. This is where personal growth meets real sales success.

Trust as the real product being sold (09:47) Sean closes with the episode's most durable idea: sellers do not merely sell products or services. They sell trust. Trust in themselves, in the offering, in the company behind it, and in the process that follows the sale. That framing has major implications for messaging, value selling, and every part of the sales process.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (07:51) "If you are not willing in an interview scenario to take coaching and feedback, you're probably not going to make it as a seller."

Kevin Lawson (08:24) "Being coachable has the magic outcome of quota attainment increases."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (03:34) "You need to try the ideas. Now, the key to being coachable though, is to try it, think about what happened, and then respond back to your coach and say, 'I tried to do that and it didn't quite work. What did I miss?'"

Sean O'Shaughnessey (09:47) "You sell trust."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (10:22) "If you always think that I am selling trust... that I am not a liar... that what I tell you, Mr. Prospect, is the truth... we'll do validation events or whatever, but you've got to trust that the product's going to work."

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit one recent coaching moment and ask yourself a harder question than "Did I hear the advice?" Ask, "Did I actually apply it, reflect on the result, and return with a better question?" That is the real test of coachability. Pick one deal, one lost opportunity, or one upcoming customer conversation and intentionally apply a piece of coaching before your next call. Consistently done, this improves business acumen, tightens sales processes, and makes revenue generation more predictable.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is not really about whether you like feedback. It is about whether you can convert feedback into better execution under pressure. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey connect coachability to trust, sales management, messaging, value selling, and the daily behaviors that separate average performers from professionals who consistently create sales success. If you want sharper sales strategies and a more mature approach to revenue management, this conversation offers more than just inspiration. It gives you a standard.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Kris Rudeegraap, Co-CEO of Sendoso, to get brutally practical about one thing most reps underestimate: how to cut through noise without sounding gimmicky or "bribey." This episode breaks down gifting as a repeatable, ethical sales strategy that supports sales management and revenue generation, whether you're trying to break into target accounts, accelerate a stalled deal, or reinforce relationships with customers who already trust you.

Key Topics Discussed * Breaking through the gatekeeper and digital noise with modern sales strategies (00:05) Kevin frames the real question sellers are asking: what actually drives sales success when inboxes are flooded, and attention is scarce? * The "right vs. wrong" of gifting: tactic beats timing (02:13) Kris outlines the difference between thoughtful outreach and a clumsy "gift-for-meeting" move that damages credibility. * Building a gifting sequence inside your sales processes (ABM + long-cycle deals) (03:55) How to use gifting as a deliberate step in your outreach and pipeline motion, not a one-off stunt. * Value selling through gratitude: gifts as relationship reinforcement (04:45) Sean connects gifting to thanking customers for orders and references—small moves that strengthen champions and improve revenue management. * AI-driven gifting: recommendations, timing, messaging, and address intelligence (10:24) Kris explains how AI improves targeting and relevance, reducing research time and enhancing personalization and response rates. * Metrics that matter: win rates, meeting rates, and attribution (11:45) Sean pushes for numbers; Kris shares performance lifts and points listeners to deeper case studies.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (00:05): "How am I actually going to make my number? What is actually going to get through the gatekeeper… and help me meet my number?" * Sean O'Shaughnessey (01:20): "How can we use tools like gifts appropriately so that we're not bribing the customer… but we are making it like, 'wow, these guys are pretty cool. I wanna talk to them.'" * Kris Rudeegraap (02:25): "I don't think the problem is when to send. It's like the tactic of how you're sending is what could be wrong." * Kris Rudeegraap (12:18): "We've seen [win rates] increased up to nine x by using gifting in the sales cycle… and… up to four x increase the likelihood of booking a meeting."

Additional Resources * Sendoso website (case studies and data studies): Sendoso.com * Kris Rudeegraap: kris@sendoso.com https://www.linkedin.com/in/rudeegraap/ * Sendoso on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/sendoso/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Pick 10 target accounts and design a two-touch gifting step that fits your current sales processes. One touch is for prospecting (to earn attention), one touch is for late-stage momentum (to reduce friction). The requirement: pair each gift with a message that tightens messaging around either (a) your value proposition in the customer's world or (b) a real personal detail you've validated. If you can't explain why that specific item fits that specific recipient, don't send it. This is business acumen applied to outreach, not arts-and-crafts.

Summary If your outreach feels interchangeable—and your deals slow down the moment you ask for something—this episode gives you a cleaner play. Kris lays out how gifting can support sales management, sharpen value selling, and improve revenue generation when it's integrated into real sales strategies and measured like any other lever in revenue management. You'll leave with clear guardrails for what not to do, vivid examples of what works, and a practical view of how AI can raise relevance and response rates without adding more busywork.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a rapid-fire masterclass in what actually happens in the field—when sales calls go sideways, when leaders show up unannounced, and when a "small" mistake exposes a bigger gap in sales management. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by fractional VP of Sales Steve Landrum to swap real stories with real lessons: territory planning that's more than a map, sales processes that don't rely on charm, and value selling that holds up under negotiation pressure. If you care about sales success, business acumen, and revenue generation, this one lands.

Key Topics Discussed * 00:42 — The "relationship trap": knowing everything about the buyer… and leaving with no order (sales strategies vs. socializing) * 03:15 — When you bring the boss and forget the basics: doing your homework and reading the room (territory planning and sales management discipline) * 05:53 — Negotiation leverage in the real world: walking away, holding the line, and protecting revenue management * 09:13 — "Two ears, one mouth": listening as a core sales process, not a personality trait * 10:52 — Building a "secondary sales team": referrals, advocates, and credibility that sells before you speak (messaging and value selling)

Key Quotes * Kevin (02:06): "You're building relationships, yes, but you're in sales. You're not in order taking." * Sean (07:23): "I want you to take this $20… because that's as much money as I'm going to lose to you today." * Steve (09:13): "You got two ears and one mouth. Use it accordingly… Use it to that ratio." * Steve (11:11): "A customer… will believe what somebody else says about you before they hear it from you."

Additional Resources * Dale Carnegie principles referenced (listening, getting others talking) — 09:32 * StrengthsFinder concept ("Woo") referenced — 09:51 * Steve Landrum https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-landrum1/ and slandrum@salesxceleration.com — 12:53 * B2B Sales Lab community - b2b-sales-lab.com — 13:35

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast In your next customer conversation, design a 10-minute opening that forces you to earn the right to talk: ask two buyer-centered questions, then stay silent long enough for a real answer. Immediately follow with one "proof prompt" that activates your secondary sales team: "Who else have you seen solve this well—and would you be open to an introduction?" This single move upgrades your sales processes, strengthens your messaging, and improves revenue generation because credibility enters the room before your pitch does.

Summary If you've ever left a meeting thinking, "That went great," only to realize you didn't advance the deal—this episode will feel uncomfortably familiar. Between Kevin's early-career wake-up call, Steve's unannounced visit disaster, and Sean's high-wire negotiation story, the common thread is simple: sales success comes from disciplined sales management, tight sales strategies, and value selling that's backed by proof. Listen for the secondary sales team concept alone—it's one of those ideas that changes how you run calls, how you build pipeline, and how you protect revenue management.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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If you've ever tried to "coach the team" by telling everyone to sell like the top rep, this episode is your reality check. Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson use March Madness, dynasties, and training-room discipline to unpack a serious sales management issue: what kind of coach are you, and are your sales processes actually buildable, or just a personality contest? The conversation lands in a practical place: consistent revenue generation comes from systems, controls, and repeatable sales strategies, not heroics. It also flips the lens to the seller: if you can't explain why you're successful, you can't improve, and you definitely can't teach.

Key Topics Discussed * 01:50 — "What kind of coach are you?" Recruiting stars vs developing talent, and what that means for sales success * 03:10 — The "learning manager" model: systems, controls, and building consistency instead of one-and-done wins * 04:40 — Sean's coaching philosophy: taking B-players with A-player upside and building a winning system around them * 07:00 — Why peer groups accelerate growth: where to workshop messaging, revenue management, and sales processes without doing it in public * 10:05 — The seller's responsibility: understand your own value selling motion so you can replicate it (or fix it)

Key Quotes * Kevin (04:25): "Prospecting needs to be consistent. It can't be something you do and sprint and then stop, and then sprint, and then stop." * Sean (06:20): "I don't necessarily try to get the C to a B, I'm more of a B to an A kind of a coach." * Sean (11:40): "When you say, 'this is how I would respond,' and somebody says, 'why?'… you should have an answer to that question."

Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab: b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Write down your personal "sales success recipe" as a simple, teachable sequence: the 5–7 moves you make that reliably create forward motion (your messaging choices, your cadence, how you qualify, how you handle pushback, how you ask for next steps). For each move, add one sentence answering "why this works." If you can't explain the why, you're not managing a sales process—you're relying on instinct. That limits your business acumen as a seller today and blocks sales management effectiveness if you're ever asked to lead tomorrow.

Summary This episode is a straight conversation about what actually drives revenue generation: leaders who know how they coach, and sellers who know how they sell. Sean and Kevin connect sports coaching to real-world sales strategies, systems, consistency, and measurable controls, then bring it home with a challenge most teams avoid: Can you articulate your process well enough to scale it? If you care about revenue management, team performance, and value selling that survives turnover, this one's worth the listen.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Keith LaHonta to unpack a truth many teams overlook: sales success is rarely a solo act. It is built through mentor-mentee relationships that sharpen judgment, accelerate business acumen, and improve real-world execution. This conversation goes beyond career nostalgia and gets practical about how mentorship strengthens sales management, improves sales processes, and directly impacts revenue generation. If you care about long-term sales success, not just short-term wins, this episode is worth downloading.

Key Topics Discussed * Why mentorship is a sales force multiplier, not a "nice to have" (00:00) The episode opens with a direct challenge to the lone-wolf myth in selling. Kevin frames mentorship as a legacy engine that compounds value over time for both mentors and mentees. * Early-career mentorship lessons that still drive performance today (01:00) Keith shares how his Xerox mentor modeled discipline, consistency, and accountability in the field, showing how foundational coaching habits still shape modern sales strategies. * The "spare tire" story: operational preparedness as a credibility advantage (03:15) A simple field habit: keeping order forms ready becomes a bigger lesson in sales processes: prepare before the call, so opportunity never outruns execution. * Matching the right mentor to the right sales role (04:45) Keith draws a sharp distinction between "hunters" and "farmers," explaining why mentorship must align with role design and expected outcomes in revenue management. * How to identify high-upside mentees and build better development conversations (10:20) Keith explains how he assesses coachability, background, and team orientation in the first 10–15 minutes, critical insight for leaders hiring and developing talent. * Where to find mentorship when your company doesn't provide it (12:50) Sean highlights community-driven mentoring through the B2B Sales Lab, positioning peer mentorship as a practical path to stronger messaging, greater value-selling confidence, and better decision-making.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (00:00): "It is our network of mentors and mentees that are really going to build and establish us as a legacy business." * Keith LaHonta (01:30): "He would do anything I would do… He'd sit with me while I made cold calls… Just the basics to where I would do anything for him." * Keith LaHonta (08:05): "Knowledge is king." * Keith LaHonta (09:05): "Whether it'll lead to a deal or not, I'm not sure, but he gained credibility." * Sean O'Shaughnessey (06:55): "If you are young in your career, [it's time] to actually reach out and try to find people that are going to guide you through this career."

Additional Resources * Keith LaHonta on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/keith-lahonta-11b621/ * B2B Sales Lab – peer-based mentorship community for sales professionals and leaders. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Build and use an "8-Question Credibility Scorecard" for your next prospect meeting. Don't stop at the three obvious discovery questions. Draft eight questions tied to your buyer's business model, operational risks, buying criteria, and success metrics. Then answer as many as possible before the meeting. Why this matters: deeper preparation improves messaging quality, signals business acumen, and supports value selling in live conversations. It also upgrades sales management conversations because reps can be coached against a consistent preparation standard, not a vague effort.

Summary This episode is a practical masterclass on how mentorship improves outcomes across the full commercial system, from hiring and coaching to messaging, execution, and revenue generation. Kevin, Sean, and Keith keep it grounded in real sales behavior, not theory, and show why the right mentor relationship can tighten sales processes, improve decision quality, and elevate sales success over the long term. If you want better sales strategies and stronger, more consistent performance, this is the episode you should listen to, share, and apply immediately.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode, Sean and Kevin get brutally practical about a problem most sellers underestimate: you don't just market your company and your product—you have to market you. If prospects can't trust you, they won't trust your solution, your messaging, or your ability to deliver outcomes. The conversation turns "personal brand" into real sales processes you can run weekly to improve revenue generation, pipeline quality, and long-term sales success.

Key Topics Discussed * Marketing "the salesperson" as the trust layer (00:59–02:05) * "Marketer, market thyself" when you don't have a marketing team (02:50–05:18) * Turn sales calls into content: capture lessons, create proof points, reuse everywhere (03:46–05:00) * Stop living in the calendar: carve out thinking time to improve how you sell (08:05–08:42) * Network sideways to create referrals: market to the people your buyers already trust (09:01–11:39) * Use social presence + networking together so referrals convert faster (12:47–13:33)

Key Quotes * Kevin (02:58): "When you're a salesperson who doesn't have a marketing team behind you… you must market yourself." * Sean (01:17): "The number one thing you have to do is get them to trust you." * Kevin (06:59): "If you're telling your story… you're a much more valuable strategic partner." * Sean (10:23): "You should market to them… those people… may just hear [a problem]… 'Let me introduce you to Mike.'"

Additional Resources * Chris Spanier and Carpe Diem Marketing - https://www.linkedin.com/in/cspanier/ - https://www.carpediemconsultinggroup.com/ * Practical Actionable Marketing - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/practical-actionable-marketing/id1697011310 * The Challenger Sale - https://a.co/d/9ntWVuH * Amy Connor and CMO on Loan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/amyconnor/ - https://cmo-onloan.com/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Block 45 minutes next week—no excuses—and build a simple "trust engine" from your last five sales conversations. Write down the problem, what you recommended, the proof point, and the result (even if it's partial). Turn that into one short post and one longer proof asset (a case study outline, a send-ahead, or a leave-behind). Then take the same story to your partner network—ERP reps, logistics providers, engineers, and adjacent vendors—and make your value-selling narrative easy for them to repeat. This is revenue management at the seller level: consistent story, consistent credibility, consistent pull-through.

Summary If you're serious about sales success, this episode is a reminder that activity isn't the same as progress—and "waiting for marketing" is a hidden excuse. Sean and Kevin lay out sales strategies that make you more credible, more referable, and easier to trust: capture what happens in real deals, convert it into messaging, and distribute it through both social and networking channels. Listen in if you want sales processes that create a cleaner pipeline, faster referrals, and stronger revenue generation without needing a bigger team.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales leaders don't lose deals on product. They lose them on trust signals—especially the ones buyers pick up before the second conversation even happens. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey break down how your team's digital presence either reinforces credibility or quietly undermines it. The throughline is simple: your sellers' profiles and posts are part of sales management, part Messaging, and part Revenue management, because they shape whether prospects believe the conversation is worth having.

Key Topics Discussed * Why your LinkedIn profile is a trust asset, not an online résumé (00:47–03:35) * "We trade in the currency of trust": social capital as a driver of Sales success (03:48–07:42) * Posting cadence that actually supports Revenue generation (and doesn't turn sellers into marketers) (06:05–08:13) * How "problem-first" positioning aligns with Value selling and modern Sales processes (05:19–06:05) * How to create content without "creating content": turn your last sales call into your next post (09:48–11:53) * Practical workflow: voice notes → CRM notes → LinkedIn post, improving Business acumen and forecast quality (12:01–13:11)

Key Quotes * Kevin (03:48): "We trade in the currency of trust." * Sean (02:55): "Do I trust that you're gonna be around next week? 'Cause it looks like you're looking for a job." * Sean (09:03): "You need to make your prospect think… you're essentially trying to sell trust." * Kevin (12:21): "Don't wait till the evening to record your thoughts… use voice to text… copy paste into your CRM."

Additional Resources * The Challenger Sale - https://a.co/d/g8vSYkc * B2B Sales Lab - www.b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Run a "trust audit" on every seller's profile and posting habit, then set one non-negotiable operating standard: after every meaningful customer interaction, capture a 60–90 second voice note answering "What problem did we discuss, what insight did we provide, what changed?" Use that same note twice—paste the clean version into the CRM for tighter sales processes and forecasting, then turn one idea into a short LinkedIn post that frames the customer problem (not the seller's résumé). This is a clean Sales strategy because it upgrades credibility without adding busywork—and it compounds over time.

Summary If your team's pipeline is heavy but conversion is soft, don't ignore the pre-call experience your prospects are having. This episode connects digital presence directly to trust, Value selling, and Revenue generation—and gives you a practical system for turning real sales conversations into credible Messaging that supports Sales success. Listen now if you want your sellers to look like problem-solvers buyers can trust, not candidates quietly shopping for their next role.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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If you're serious about sales success in 2026, this episode is a gut-check and a blueprint. Sean and Kevin break down what a real territory plan looks like (not a fluffy "be more productive" wish list), how to map first-half revenue to specific accounts, and how to build a second-half pipeline before it's an emergency. The throughline is sales management discipline: define the goal, allocate time intentionally, and build a plan that survives reality—because it will get punched in the face.

Key Topics Discussed * Why most reps are under-planned—and why that's unacceptable if you want Sales success (00:00) Sean frames the problem: Day-to-day selling without a plan is a strategy for mediocre revenue generation. * Territory plan vs. account plan: what you should build first (01:00) Territory planning starts with "who will buy and how much," not activity lists or generic prospecting promises. * First-half revenue mapping: list your closeable accounts and expected revenue (02:00) If your sales processes assume a sub-6-month cycle, you should already know which deals can land in the first half. * Second-half pipeline sourcing: identify 3–10 prospect channels, not names (02:31) Kevin ties it to repeatable sales strategies: pipeline creation is a system, not a mood. * Strategic vs. key accounts: time allocation, long-cycle wins, and reputation as an asset (04:00) Kevin introduces a time-based framework: strategic "marriage-level" accounts vs. key near-term wins, and the reputational groundwork that makes both easier. * Pricing, comp alignment, and the real math of revenue management (07:42) If you're "opening a territory," your pricing plan and comp plan have to match the reality of getting noticed versus optimizing margin.

Key Quotes * Sean: "If you fail to plan, then you plan to fail." (00:00) A blunt reminder that planning is not optional if you want predictable revenue generation. * Kevin: "At the top of the sheet, write your goal." (04:00) Start with the outcome, then design your territory plan around time and focus—not random activity. * Sean: "Your plan for 2026 has to equal or exceed your quota." (10:39) Your plan should be a commitment to performance, not a narrative that explains shortfalls in advance. * Sean: "Everybody has a plan until you get punched in the face." (14:00) Build for volatility—plan to 120% so you can still hit quota when reality disrupts your assumptions.

Additional Resources * MEDDPICCC / qualification frameworks referenced as examples of structured sales processes you should use (09:00) * B2B Sales Lab mentioned as a place to get your territory plan reviewed and "beaten up" by experienced sales leaders (14:38)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Write a one-page territory plan today with four elements: (1) your 2026 goal (quota and your 120% number), (2) the list of accounts you expect to close in the first half with revenue per account, (3) 3–10 specific prospecting channels you'll use to source second-half opportunities, and (4) the five companies you will learn so deeply—business model, competitors, how they make/lose money—that your messaging and value selling approach becomes inevitable, not improvised.

Summary Most reps treat territory planning like paperwork. Sean and Kevin treat it like a weapon. If you want sales success that's driven by business acumen—not hope—this episode gives you a practical territory plan structure, a way to allocate time across strategic and key accounts, and a reality-based view of revenue management, pricing, and comp alignment. Listen to it early in the year, build your plan, and you'll start running your territory instead of reacting to it.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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It's January, the scoreboard is still 0 to 0 for most sellers, and the difference between a clean Q1 and a scramble often comes down to one thing: getting to "zero to one" without doing something stupid to win a deal you'll regret. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey use a basketball fast-start analogy to sharpen your Sales strategies for early momentum, tighter Sales processes, and better Revenue management—without defaulting to discounting, panic, or hope-as-a-plan.

Key Topics Discussed

Why the first "bucket" matters in Q1 (and how fast starts change the game) (00:00–02:15)
Zero to one: picking the highest-probability path to get on the board (02:15–05:30)
Buyer readiness: the "fast food vs. interstate exit" test for prioritizing your pipeline (03:00–05:10)
Reverify everything: deals inside 45 days, shifting priorities, and MEDDPIC discipline (06:45–10:20)
Don't get squirrely: protecting Value selling and profitability when you're tempted to "do something crazy" (10:35–13:10)
Sean's practical tax tip: mileage documentation that saves pain later (13:25–14:20)

Key Quotes

Sean: "It's time to score that first bucket. It's time to go." (02:01)
Kevin: "You have to discern as a seller… who is the most likely to buy now." (03:35)
Sean: "Every deal that's on your forecast for the next 45 days, you need to touch base." (08:45)
Kevin: "Pause. Think about the deal you want… you're conditioning somebody how to buy from you." (10:54–11:20)
Sean: "Take a picture of your odometer… you'll thank me a year from now." (13:35)

Additional Resources

MEDDPICCC qualification concepts referenced in the conversation (Champion vs. Coach; reconnecting with the Economic Buyer as the calendar turns).
Mileage-tracking best practice: capture odometer readings now to support business mileage documentation at tax time.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Pick up the phone today and re-verify every deal on your forecast that's expected to close in the next 45 days (and don't accept vague answers). Confirm priorities didn't shift post-holidays, validate your Champion and Coach are still in seat and aligned, and re-confirm the Economic Buyer's expectations and paperwork path. That single discipline move is sales management in action, and it's how you protect Revenue generation without resorting to margin-killing "quick wins."

Summary

If you're sitting at 0% of quota in mid-January, this episode is your gut-check and your playbook. Sean and Kevin cut through the noise with practical Business acumen: prioritize buyers who are ready now, tighten your Messaging around value instead of price, and pressure-test your forecast so Sales success doesn't depend on luck. Listen if you want a fast start that holds up all year—because January habits become full-year outcomes.

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January resets every scoreboard to zero, making your mindset and operating discipline your first competitive advantage. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey break down how to start the year with intentional sales management, tighter Sales processes, and the kind of daily actions that drive Sales success and consistent Revenue generation, especially when Q4 either "drained the swamp" or left you with deals that slipped.

Key Topics Discussed * Why January mindset matters more than motivation (and how to avoid "being behind" by month-end) (00:00) * CRM data hygiene as a revenue lever: clean stages, real close dates, clear next steps (04:20) * Pipeline focus: prioritizing what you can actually work on, and aligning probability to reality (06:35) * Post-Q4 momentum: thank-you outreach that creates new expansion opportunities (08:05) * Prospecting with structure: start with five companies this week, then build the cadence (09:35) * Networking for leverage: partnering with adjacent vendors to unlock access and influence (10:40)

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (04:55): "Stop. Go to your CRM and practice good data hygiene." * Kevin Lawson (05:55): "If someone has to ask you the status of your deal…your notes aren't good enough, your data hygiene isn't good enough." * Sean O'Shaughnessey (02:35): "Q1 started. You have quotas, you have a quota right now, and you have revenue of zero." * Sean O'Shaughnessey (08:10): "Go back and say thank you to every single one of your customers…and one of them is gonna say, 'but we need a little bit more.'"

Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab community (14:35): Join to get feedback, practical coaching, and peer support from sales pros, leaders, and marketers.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Do a 30-minute pipeline reset today. Update your CRM with accurate stages, real close dates, and a clear next step for every active opportunity, then choose five target accounts to contact this week with a message tied to a specific business problem you solve. This single block sharpens your Messaging, improves Revenue management, and forces the Business acumen choices that separate busywork from real Value selling.

Summary If you want a stronger Q1, this episode offers a clean operating model: tighten your Sales strategies and processes early, treat data hygiene as a performance habit, and build momentum through customer outreach, a structured prospecting approach, and intelligent networking. Kevin and Sean keep it practical, direct, and immediately usable, precisely what you need when January starts from zero, and Sales success depends on what you do next.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sean and Kevin are joined by Shannon Muniz, a fractional VP of Sales based in Orlando, for a practical conversation about one of the most expensive tensions in sales management: giving new hires enough runway to become effective, without giving so much patience that it quietly damages revenue management and profitability. They unpack a real hiring story, explain why "industry terminology" can be a misleading early warning sign, and share how leaders can balance coaching, expectations, and accountability so new salespeople (and new sales leaders) ramp up with urgency and clarity. If you're building a team, refining your sales processes, or trying to improve Sales success without burning people out, this episode will sharpen your business acumen fast.

Key Topics Discussed * The patience vs. profitability problem in ramp time (00:30) * A real-world case: when an owner questions a rockstar sales leader after 30 days (02:00) * Tactical onboarding: trade shows, ride-alongs, and accelerating industry "language" (03:45) * Setting expectations for sales cycles vs. quarter-one performance pressure (06:10) * Hiring debate: industry expertise vs. proven selling skill (07:40) * Why strong "Messaging" and open-ended questions travel across industries (13:10)

Key Quotes * Sean: "I believe that it's harder to teach really good sales skills than it is to teach them about an industry." (07:55) * Shannon: "To bring somebody in that has the proven ability to sell and teach them your industry is much easier and much less risky." (09:35) * Kevin: "Are they hiring for potential or are they hiring for production?" (10:55) * Sean: "If you ask good open-ended questions, that means you're gonna have good conversations… and you're potentially gonna close the deal." (13:20)

Additional Resources * Connect with Shannon Muniz: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shannonmuniz/ * Shannon's email: smuniz@salesxceleration.com * www.strategicsalespros.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Build a 30–60 day "Ramp Reality Plan" for every new sales hire (rep or leader): define what "progress" looks like before revenue shows up. Include:

A Messaging immersion plan (ride-alongs + call reviews),
An industry-language accelerator (events, trade shows, competitor research),
Weekly checkpoints that measure leading indicators tied to your sales strategies, not just closed deals.

Then socialize the plan with ownership so expectations align with the actual sales cycle and protect revenue-generation decisions from impatience.

Summary If you've ever hired someone you thought was right, then felt doubt creep in before they even had a fair shot, this episode will feel uncomfortably familiar (in a good way). Sean, Kevin, and Shannon cut through the noise and provide a grounded approach to thinking about ramp time, coaching, and hiring trade-offs that directly impact Sales success. Listen in for a clear framework you can use immediately to strengthen your sales management cadence, reduce mis-hires, and keep your sales processes aligned with real-world performance.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey challenge a dangerous assumption many sellers make: that next year will look just like this year. It won't. In this conversation, they unpack why sales success in 2026 demands a deliberate mindset shift, sharper territory planning, and a renewed focus on value selling. This is a strategic discussion for sales professionals who want to generate revenue without simply working more hours, and who understand that trust, planning, and business acumen are the real currencies of modern sales.

Key Topics Discussed Why 2026 Is Not "Just Another Year" (00:00–01:30) Sean sets the stage by explaining why repeating last year's sales strategies is risky. Revenue growth requires intention, experimentation, and a plan that looks beyond the next deal.

The Mind Shift: Microwave vs. Crockpot Selling (01:30–03:00) Kevin introduces a powerful metaphor for sales management, balancing short-term revenue needs with long-term sales strategies that build trust and pipeline health.

Territory Planning as a Trust-Building Exercise (03:00–05:00) The discussion shifts to territory planning, not as a coverage exercise, but as a way to intentionally build emotional, relational, and product-belief currency in the market.

Deal Mix, Quotas, and Planning for Bigger Wins (05:00–09:30) Sean breaks down how understanding deal size, sales processes, and capacity helps sellers avoid a year filled with small deals that never add up to quota attainment.

Program Sales, Supply Chains, and Selling on Value (09:30–14:30) Kevin dives deep into program sales in manufacturing and consulting environments, illustrating how value selling and messaging around impact, not product, drive revenue management and long-term sales success.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey (05:30): "If you fail to plan, you plan to fail. And worse, you end up just repeating last year. That's boring. Plan to be great."

Kevin Lawson (02:10): "We're not just selling a product. We're selling a currency of trust, and territory planning is how you invest in that currency."

Kevin Lawson (13:45): "We have to stop selling tomorrow like it's just another day. We sell value. We create value. That's the shift."

Additional Resources * Paul Simon, "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover" – referenced for the line "Make a new plan, Stan," as a metaphor for intentional sales planning.

A Significant Actionable Item from This Podcast Build your 2026 territory plan backward from revenue, not activity. Start with your quota plus 20%. Define your ideal deal mix, identify which accounts or regions can realistically support that goal, and map out quarterly milestones. Then review your progress honestly at the end of each quarter and adjust. This single discipline strengthens sales processes, sharpens messaging, and dramatically improves sales success.

Summary This episode is a wake-up call for sellers and sales leaders who are drifting into the new year without a clear plan. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey go beyond surface-level advice to explore how territory planning, value selling, and strategic mindset shifts directly impact revenue generation. If you want 2026 to outperform 2025 and set you up to win in 2027, this conversation will reshape how you think about sales strategies, business acumen, and long-term success.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales slumps don't hit out of nowhere; they're usually born in the quiet moments when strong sellers unintentionally drift from the fundamentals. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey unpack why salespeople often surge at the end of a quarter only to wake up on Monday realizing their pipeline is suddenly empty. They explore the habits that quietly erode performance and highlight the disciplines that sustain sales success, sales processes, and long-term revenue generation.

Whether you're a veteran rep or an emerging sales leader, this episode delivers practical insight, real-world structure, and renewed respect for self-management and deliberate practice.

Key Topics Discussed * Why great sellers still fall into bad habits (00:26) How momentum can hide gaps in discipline—and how quickly a healthy pipeline can vanish. * The three essential responsibilities of every salesperson (02:06) Managing existing customers, presenting to prospects, and staying relentless with prospecting. * The overlooked fourth pillar: Self-development and practice (04:09) Why continuous improvement—and stronger business acumen—has become non-negotiable. * The role of artificial intelligence in improving productivity (07:10) AI won't replace sales reps, but those who master it gain a decisive edge in efficiency and value selling. * Customer Interaction Hours: A powerful KPI for predicting future revenue (08:21) Sean's long-time favorite metric for understanding meeting quality, pipeline health, and revenue management. * How to identify when you're quietly sabotaging next quarter (11:11) Kevin explains the common pattern of strong Q4 performance but weak Q1 results—and how to prevent it.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:26): "Good sellers can have that moment where they look out the windshield and realize they've sold through their pipeline… then wake up Monday morning and there's not much there anymore."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (01:18): "Every salesperson has to be self-managed. One of the strongest classical skills is simply being a self-starter who knows what must get done today."

Kevin Lawson (12:33): "Good sellers close well in Q4, but bad habits in prospecting return a desert of sales in Q1."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (07:30): "Artificial intelligence is not going to replace salespeople, but it is a massive productivity tool—and if you're not staying ahead, you're going to be behind very quickly."

Additional Resources While this episode is highly tactical and self-contained, listeners are encouraged to explore:

LinkedIn Learning courses mentioned indirectly via the discussion on self-development
Peer community groups and certifications for sharpening sales management and leadership skills
AI productivity tools that support prospecting, research, and preparation (no specific products were mentioned)

A Significant Actionable Item from This Podcast Block dedicated time every week for prospecting, no exceptions.

Kevin and Sean both emphasize that Q4 success often masks declining early-stage activity that leads to weak Q1 results. The single best action you can take today is to protect time on your calendar for meeting new people, publishing thought leadership, asking for referrals, and cross-selling.

Do it now, before the urgency of end-of-year deals consumes all available space. Your future pipeline—and your future income—depend on it.

Summary This episode pulls back the curtain on the invisible habits that either sustain high performance or drag down even the most talented sellers. Kevin and Sean bring practical rigor, real-world experience, and a refreshing blend of sales strategies, sales processes, and messaging discipline to help you stay sharp when it counts most. If you've ever ended a quarter strong only to start the next one in a hole, this discussion will help you understand why—and what to do about it.

Download the episode to learn how to reclaim control of your calendar, your pipeline, and your long-term sales success.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Stepping into sales leadership is equal parts exhilarating and disorienting. In this episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey unpack the real emotions, real transitions, and real responsibilities that come with moving from individual sales producer to leading a revenue team. With candid stories, practical frameworks, and relatable missteps, they help new sales leaders navigate uncertainty with confidence. If you've just stepped into a new role or aspire to, this conversation offers clarity, direction, and the mindset you need for sales success.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Shock and Reality of Promotion (≈00:50) Why moving from top producer to sales leader feels like an entirely different profession, and why the first days matter.

Avoiding the "I Know How to Do Your Job Better" Trap (≈01:40) Kevin shares a painful early mistake and the deeper lesson about sales management, humility, and trust-building.
Transition Planning: Urgency vs. Importance (≈02:57) How to use the Eisenhower Matrix to balance existing customers, new responsibilities, and the shift into leadership.
Using Your Sales Skills to Lead Your Team (≈07:30) Sean's powerful reminder: Treat your salespeople like your customers, sell ideas, build trust, and guide behaviors.
Leading from the Front Without Micromanaging (≈09:51) How to allow different working styles, leverage diverse strengths, and build a team culture focused on revenue generation rather than personal heroics.
Building a Winning Culture Where Everyone Rises Together (≈11:28) Kevin outlines why leaders must protect culture, reduce tension, and rally the team around shared goals and value-selling behaviors.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson "You should probably not tell everyone how you would do their job." (≈01:40) A candid reminder that leadership isn't an invitation to dictate; it's an opportunity to understand and elevate.

"Anybody with an abundance mindset wants you to win. Go find the resources." (≈04:38) A call for continuous learning and connection, hallmarks of modern sales strategies.

Sean O'Shaughnessey "Think of the people who report to you as your customer. Don't tell, show. Don't pitch, engender trust." (≈07:30) A profound reframing of sales processes and leadership communication.

"From this point forward, it is not your number anymore. It is our number." (≈10:47) A defining mindset shift for every new sales leader stepping into revenue management.

Additional Resources * Book Referenced: 360° Leader by John Maxwell (≈11:28) Insightful guidance for leading from any position inside an organization. https://a.co/d/iDb6uvc * Community Mentioned: B2B Sales Lab (≈14:24) A private membership community for salespeople and leaders seeking peer-driven support, growth, and shared best practices. b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from This Podcast Create a 30-day leadership transition plan using the Eisenhower Matrix. Before making changes, schedule one-on-one conversations, prioritize responsibilities, and map urgent vs. important tasks. This prioritization will give you the clarity to shift from producer to leader without burning out or dragging customers along with the chaos. This single step dramatically strengthens your early decision-making and establishes credibility with your team and executive leaders.

Summary This episode is an essential guide for anyone stepping into a new sales leadership position or supporting someone who is. Sean and Kevin blend humor, honesty, and practical business acumen to help you avoid the biggest early mistakes and lean into the strengths that earned your promotion in the first place. You'll walk away with strategies to lead from the front, build trust, elevate your team, and create a culture of sales success, messaging clarity, and growth-focused revenue generation. If you're ready to lead well and win together, don't miss this conversation.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson explore one of the most essential—and often overlooked—pillars of sales success: trust. From the first cold call to long-term client relationships, they unpack how credibility, reliability, and integrity form the foundation of effective sales strategies and revenue generation. Whether you're leading a team or refining your sales processes, this episode will help you understand how to build lasting relationships that turn prospects into loyal partners and salespeople into trusted advisors.

Key Topics Discussed (00:00) – The Psychology of Trust in Sales: Why trust—not persuasion—is the real key to closing deals and building relationships.

(03:00) – Reputation and Reliability: Kevin shares why trust is like a muscle that must be trained, refined, and protected.

(06:45) – The Power of Networking and References: Sean explains how trust can be transferred through introductions and why relationships are the lifeblood of value selling.

(10:15) – Becoming a Trusted Advisor: How sales professionals evolve from sellers to strategic partners by demonstrating consistent expertise and business acumen.

(13:00) – Personal Branding and Consistency: Why showing up—both online and in person—reinforces trust and positions you as a credible voice in your industry.

Key Quotes Sean O'Shaughnessey (01:20):

"The challenge in sales is not to convince someone to buy your product—it's to convey trust. The real goal is to become someone they believe in, not just someone selling to them."

Kevin Lawson (04:17):

"Trust is a currency. It's what keeps your professional vessel afloat. You maintain it by showing up, following through, and owning your mistakes."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (07:14):

"The fastest way to build trust with a prospect is through someone they already trust. That's why networking and references are invaluable—they transfer credibility instantly."

Kevin Lawson (12:16):

"Salespeople should be intentional about how they show up in their markets. Be present, publish insights, and make sure everything you do signals that you can be trusted."

Additional Resources * Book: Eliminate Your Competition by Sean O'Shaughnessey – a deeper dive into building credibility and outperforming rivals through sales management and messaging discipline. * LinkedIn Profiles: Connect with Sean and Kevin for insights on sales processes, revenue management, and modern value selling strategies. * B2B Sales Lab Community: A private group for sales professionals looking to refine their sales strategies, gain peer insight, and master trust-based selling.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Post weekly on LinkedIn to build credibility before the first meeting. Don't wait until a buyer meets you to prove your expertise—show it consistently. Share insights about your industry, common customer challenges, or solutions your company provides. Prospects will research you before engaging, and your content is the proof of your business acumen. Regular, relevant posts turn "cold" introductions into warm conversations rooted in trust.

Summary Trust isn't built with a pitch—it's earned through presence, consistency, and credibility. In this episode, Sean and Kevin reveal how the best salespeople create sales success by positioning themselves as trusted advisors rather than product pushers. You'll learn practical ways to enhance trust at every stage of the sales process, from initial outreach to ongoing client relationships. If you want to elevate your revenue generation strategy and strengthen your professional reputation, this conversation is one you can't afford to miss.

🎧 Listen now to discover how mastering trust transforms not only your sales—but your entire business.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this energizing episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explore one of the most relatable challenges in sales—how to break free from a slump. Whether your pipeline has slowed, your motivation has dipped, or you're struggling to find your rhythm again, this episode offers practical, proven techniques to reignite momentum. From the psychology of small wins to building daily discipline and rewarding yourself for progress, Sean and Kevin share timeless lessons that tie sales management, sales success, and revenue generation together into a system for recovery and growth.

Key Topics Discussed * 00:30 – Recognizing a Sales Slump: Kevin compares slumps to sports streaks and discusses how to regain confidence and rhythm through small wins. * 02:10 – Lessons from Joe Girard: Sean shares insights from the world's top car salesman on staying consistent and knowing when to take a break. * 05:10 – The Power of Practice: The hosts discuss repetition and process discipline as key elements in overcoming challenges in sales processes and value selling. * 07:10 – Leadership Through the Slump: Kevin explains how sales management must balance accountability and encouragement during tough times. * 10:15 – Finding Your Happy Place: Sean encourages reps to reconnect with the parts of selling they love to rebuild momentum and business acumen. * 12:40 – Rewarding Progress: The hosts explore how self-reward systems can reinforce good habits and lead to lasting sales success and revenue management.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:54): "Getting out of a slump often only requires one at bat. One pitch and one right feel. It's got to feel right."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (03:42): "The key to getting out of a slump is doing the practice over and over again so that something is rote, something is simple—and then you just go through that motion."

Kevin Lawson (07:35): "As leaders, we own the goal. And when we don't own the goal, we've got to get the big shovel out and start filling in the hole we've left."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (10:31): "When you're in a slump, do something in your job that you enjoy. That will make it easier to get back to doing the hard things."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (13:09): "Reward yourself when you close something meaningful—buy the gift, open the bottle, celebrate the win. It keeps you driven through the next slump."

Additional Resources * How to Sell Anything to Anybody by Joe Girard – The classic sales book mentioned by Sean that explores consistency, attitude, and daily habits in sales.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Create a Personal Reward Ritual. Identify a specific milestone—like closing a deal above quota or hitting a personal performance target—and tie it to a tangible reward that matters to you. Maybe it's a special dinner, a favorite bottle, or new golf gear. This simple habit keeps motivation high and transforms abstract revenue generation goals into emotional wins that reinforce consistent effort.

Summary If you've ever felt the sting of a dry pipeline or the frustration of a lost deal, this episode is your playbook for getting back on track. Kevin and Sean bring a mix of humor, humility, and hard-won insight to help you reconnect with your purpose and rediscover the joy of selling. From mental resets to structured routines, they outline how professional sellers—and sales managers alike—can use momentum, repetition, and reward to break out of a slump and build toward long-term sales success.

🎧 Tune in now to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales—and take the first step toward your next big win.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome Mike Dowhan, founder of Bedrock Sales. Together, they explore one of the most overlooked yet transformative aspects of sales management: the compelling event. Mike brings over two decades of experience helping organizations refine their sales processes, understand buyer motivation, and drive consistent revenue generation. Whether you're a frontline seller or a sales leader guiding a team, this episode unpacks how identifying and leveraging compelling events can be the difference between chasing deals and closing them confidently.

Key Topics Discussed * The Power of the Compelling Event (01:12) – What defines a compelling event and why it's the "why" behind every great sale. * Asking Better Discovery Questions (03:00) – How to uncover the root cause that motivates buyers to act now rather than later. * Getting Permission to Go Deep (07:17) – Why earning trust allows salespeople to ask the tough, business-critical questions. * Compelling Events vs. Compelling Needs (09:53) – The distinction between recognizing a real deadline versus a vague desire for change. * Surfacing the Cost of Inaction (10:38) – How to use timing, impact, and risk to create urgency without manufacturing pressure.

Key Quotes Mike Dowhan (03:49): "What caused you to pick up the phone or take my call today? What's different today than yesterday? That's where you find the real reason a buyer is ready to move."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (02:29): "If there's no compelling event, it becomes very difficult. You're pushing the boulder uphill, fighting the same battle over and over."

Kevin Lawson (12:00): "Finding permission and tracking back to that event is where we create real value, and avoid the trap of commoditization."

Additional Resources * Bedrock Sales – Official Website * Connect with Mike Dowhan on LinkedIn * Email Mike: mike@bedrocksales.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Start every discovery conversation with one simple question:

"What changed today that made you want to talk to me?"

This question reveals your buyer's compelling event, the emotional and operational trigger that drives their need to act. Understanding that moment transforms your sales strategy from reactive to consultative. Use it to align your messaging, reinforce your value-selling approach, and accelerate revenue growth.

Summary In this episode, Kevin and Sean guide listeners through a masterclass on the art of identifying the compelling event, the single element that separates top performers from average sellers. Guest Mike Dowhan shares practical, experience-tested frameworks for discovery, coaching, and sales process alignment that sharpen business acumen and elevate sales success.

If your deals feel stalled or your team struggles with forecasting accuracy, this conversation delivers the clarity you need. Learn how to uncover the "why now" behind every opportunity and drive meaningful progress in your revenue management strategy.

🎧 Listen now to discover how compelling events can transform your sales outcomes—and your entire approach to value selling.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Welcome back to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. In this dynamic episode, the Tall Guys welcome Paul Rafferty from Sales Xceleration to explore the art and science of sales coaching, deal qualification, and the importance of building sales acumen. Paul brings decades of experience in sales management, value selling, and revenue generation, offering a practical framework for sales leaders who want to coach their teams more effectively and for reps who want to stop chasing the wrong deals.

Discover how to transform your team's approach to sales processes—from opportunity scoring to understanding a buyer's "pain chain." This conversation is packed with actionable insights that blend sales strategy, business acumen, and real-world stories you can immediately apply to your own selling environment.

Key Topics Discussed 03:00 — Building a Deal Coaching Framework: Paul introduces his 100-point scorecard system that evaluates the Ideal Prospect Profile, the Pain Chain, and Commitment to Decision. This framework transforms deal reviews into powerful coaching sessions rather than mere forecast updates.

05:10 — The "Pain Chain" and Sales Philosophy: Sean and Paul discuss how understanding buyer pain isn't optional—it's foundational to value selling. Without real pain, there's no compelling reason for your buyer to act.

06:45 — From Friendly to Effective Salesperson: Paul and Sean discuss how friendliness can open doors, but it's teaching and insight that ultimately win deals. Sales success comes from challenging your prospects and helping them think differently.

08:00 — Why Deals Get Stuck: Kevin and Paul explore how most stalled deals trace back to weak discovery. Coaching your team to go deeper early in the sales process prevents gridlock later.

10:30 — The Currency of Knowledge: Paul explains that in modern selling, gifts and lunches no longer move the needle—information does. Great salespeople earn influence by being teachers, not vendors.

Key Quotes Paul Rafferty (03:50): "It's not what you do—it's what they do. The scorecard helps you coach reps to spend time where there's real buying intent, not just big logos."

Sean O'Shaughnessey (05:43): "Salespeople need to understand the theory of sales. Without knowing the frameworks—like the pain chain or solution selling—you're just saying, 'I'm a nice guy, buy from me.'"

Kevin Lawson (08:38): "Most deals go to die in the discovery phase. Coaching means rewinding the tape and helping reps fix what wasn't done early enough."

Paul Rafferty (12:51): "Your currency is information—help your buyer look smart, get promoted, and win internally. That's real value selling."

Additional Resources * Paul Rafferty + prafferty@salesxceleration.com + https://www.linkedin.com/in/pauljrafferty/

Books referenced:
Solution Selling by Michael Bosworth - https://a.co/d/hHtYSiX
The Challenger Sale by Matthew Dixon & Brent Adamson - https://a.co/d/2kJsbDU
Strategic Selling by Robert Miller & Stephen Heiman - https://a.co/d/icPcC6H

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Implement a Deal Coaching Scorecard. Instead of subjective forecasting ("This deal is 70% likely to close"), create an objective scoring model based on:

Ideal Prospect Fit (25 pts) – Does this prospect align with your best customer profile?
Pain Chain (25 pts) – Have they admitted to a real, solvable pain?
Commitment to Decision (50 pts) – Have they engaged decision-makers and committed to next steps?

Use this tool in your next pipeline review. It will sharpen your sales management coaching, improve revenue forecasting, and elevate your team's overall sales success. If you want more information about this scorecard, reach out to Paul Rafferty at his address above.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a masterclass in sales leadership and coaching excellence. Kevin, Sean, and Paul dive deep into how great leaders use structured deal reviews to unlock stalled opportunities, develop their team's business acumen, and create consistent revenue generation. From mastering discovery to building a "pain chain," this discussion challenges sales professionals to move beyond friendliness toward measurable, strategic impact.

If you're a sales leader, coach, or rep who wants to accelerate growth through more innovative sales strategies and actionable messaging, don't miss this episode. Listen now and take your next step toward true sales success.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey tackle one of the most fundamental truths in business and sales leadership: change is inevitable. Whether you're managing a sales team, scaling from $5M to $50M, or repositioning your company for new markets, your success depends on your ability to pivot, intelligently, decisively, and confidently. Sean and Kevin unpack the concept of organizational pivots through real-world examples, from manufacturing supply challenges to Domino's Pizza's legendary turnaround, and offer practical advice for how sales leaders can prepare their teams to thrive through transformation.

Key Topics Discussed * The Only Constant Is Change (00:16) — Why modern business demands leaders who can adapt and guide teams through shifting markets. * The Power of the Pivot (02:52) — Kevin explains what a pivot really means and how small, consistent course corrections can transform outcomes. * Real-World Example: Domino's Pizza Reinvention (06:10) — A masterclass in transparency and messaging that rebuilt a brand from the ground up. * Training as the Foundation of Change (09:21) — Sean breaks down how strategic training helps sales teams pivot effectively into new markets or industries. * Peer Learning and the Role of Community (12:33) — The importance of collaboration, conversation, and communities like the B2B Sales Lab for accelerating sales success.

Key Quotes "As CEOs and sales leaders, we have to lead through change. What got us here is not going to get us there." — Sean O'Shaughnessey (01:34)

"Sometimes people don't need a 180-degree pivot. They just need to be repointed — one degree of change over time can take you somewhere entirely new." — Kevin Lawson (04:42)

"The first part of making a pivot is planting your foot — and that's training. You can't change direction until your team knows how." — Sean O'Shaughnessey (11:22)

Additional Resources * Book Mentioned: Who Moved My Cheese? by Spencer Johnson — A timeless read on navigating change in business and life. https://a.co/d/cCEXuwA * Community Resource: B2B Sales Lab — A peer-driven community for B2B sales professionals and leaders to exchange ideas, test messaging, and sharpen their skills. www.b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Before the day ends, write down five things you could do to change the trajectory of your sales growth or turnaround. Then, rank them:

Which are big strategic plays?
Which are medium-term moves?
Which are quick wins you could execute immediately? Assign probability, effort, and impact to each, then commit to one action this week. Leadership begins with deliberate motion, not massive overhauls.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a must-listen for anyone serious about sales management, revenue generation, and business acumen. Sean and Kevin blend experience and strategy to reveal how great sales leaders pivot, not by abandoning what works, but by rethinking sales processes, evolving messaging, and driving value selling through training and intelligent adaptation. Whether you're running a small sales team or scaling a multimillion-dollar operation, this discussion will inspire you to make the smart moves that lead to long-term sales success and sustainable revenue management.

Tune in, take notes, and start your next pivot today.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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When a company hires or promotes its first sales manager, expectations run high, but clarity can be low. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson unpack what the first 90 days should look like for a new sales leader. Whether you’re a CEO onboarding a new manager or that manager stepping into the role themselves, this discussion provides practical guidance on setting realistic expectations, building trust, and establishing the foundation for long-term sales success and revenue growth.

Key Topics Discussed * Setting Realistic Expectations as an Owner (02:00) Kevin explores how CEOs should frame success during the first 90 days, emphasizing the importance of patience, trust-building, and understanding that sales management transformation takes time. * Avoiding the “Fix This First” Trap (06:30) Sean cautions business owners against dumping old personnel problems on new leaders, explaining why cleaning up someone else’s mess undermines early business acumen and trust. * Building Relationships and Learning the Business (08:30) Sean shares tactical advice for new sales managers: conduct one-on-ones, ride along with reps, and build rapport across departments, marketing, operations, and finance, to master internal sales processes and interdepartmental alignment. * Understanding Internal and External Tools (11:12) Kevin discusses discovering hidden tools and levers, people, systems, vendor programs, or product configurations that can immediately improve team performance and value-selling opportunities. * Repackaging and Aligning Offers to the Market (12:30) The hosts outline how sales leaders can rethink product structures and messaging to better serve customer needs, thereby improving revenue management and profitability.

Key Quotes “Trust is a currency. It has to be earned by customers, by salespeople, by peers, and you can’t buy it in the first 30 days.”, Kevin Lawson (03:00)

“Don’t make your new sales leader the bad guy. If there’s a tough personnel decision, handle it before they start.”, Sean O’Shaughnessey (07:00)

“Learn your company inside and out. If you don’t know who runs manufacturing or how the supply chain works, you can’t lead your salespeople effectively.”, Sean O’Shaughnessey (10:00)

“You might have 20 products, but 100 possible solutions. The smart leader finds ways to repackage and sell in ways the customer actually values.”, Kevin Lawson (13:00)

Additional Resources * Episodes on sales onboarding, marketing alignment, and ideal customer profiling (ICP) were referenced throughout the conversation. * Explore more insights and tools for sales leaders at b2b-sales-lab.com.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Create a 90-Day Integration Plan. If you’re a new sales manager, spend your first month listening and learning. Conduct one-on-ones with every salesperson, schedule cross-department meetings, and document what each function needs from sales. In the second month, identify process gaps and start designing improvements. By the third month, implement one or two visible wins, such as improving forecasting accuracy or clarifying sales messaging, to demonstrate value and build momentum.

Summary Your first 90 days as a sales leader can define your entire tenure. Sean and Kevin reveal that success isn’t about quick wins, it’s about developing relationships, earning trust, and understanding the organization’s systems before making bold changes. For CEOs, this episode provides a masterclass in setting expectations. For new leaders, it’s a roadmap to transition from individual contributor to strategic operator.

Listen to this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales to learn how to step confidently into leadership, master sales strategies, and drive lasting revenue generation through purposeful sales management and business acumen.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

Sean's Assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

Kevin's Assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

B2B Sales Lab is a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It’s a space to ask real questions, share proven practices, and connect with others who are serious about improving revenue performance. Designed and led by veteran sales leaders, the Lab is where strategy meets execution. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the critical relationship between sales and marketing. For small businesses, founder-led sales teams, and even larger organizations, aligning sales processes with marketing efforts is crucial for sustained long-term revenue growth. Sean and Kevin break down practical strategies to ensure your messaging resonates, your sales team is empowered, and your marketing activities directly support sales success. Whether you’re focused on account-based marketing, field events, or digital presence, this episode offers actionable insights on sales management, business acumen, and value selling strategies.

Key Topics Discussed * Marketing and Sales Alignment in Small Businesses (00:33) – Why sales leaders must sometimes wear the marketing hat. * Account-Based Marketing and Customized Messaging (01:20) – How sales professionals can market effectively to their most important accounts. * Field Marketing and Local Presence (04:00) – Using shows, chambers of commerce, and local references to build credibility. * The “And, Not Or” Mindset for Sales Leaders (05:23) – Balancing product, pipeline, and partner relationships to fuel revenue generation. * Digital Presence and Website Strategy (10:00) – Why outsourcing web design and aligning messaging online is key to credibility. * Consistency Between Messaging, Sales, and Marketing Collateral (12:34) – Building trust by keeping everything in sync.

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:57): “Marketing is about getting noticed, getting people to pay attention to you. It’s not about making the sale—that’s what salespeople are for.” * Kevin Lawson (05:23): “The cavalry’s not coming in small business. It’s up to you to do the critical thinking that drives pipeline, customer relationships, and revenue management.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (12:52): “If it’s on the website, then it’s real. That alignment between what sales says and what marketing publishes builds trust.”

Additional Resources * Chamber of Commerce networking events * Professional website design services (local agencies, universities, or freelance designers) * Account-based marketing resources for small and mid-sized businesses

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your messaging for alignment. Take one of your current sales presentations or proposals and compare it directly to your website and marketing collateral. Ask: Do they reinforce each other, or do they create confusion? Any gaps between your sales strategies and marketing assets should be closed immediately. This step builds credibility, strengthens customer trust, and accelerates revenue generation.

Summary Sales and marketing alignment isn’t a luxury—it’s a necessity for sales success. In this episode, Sean and Kevin show how sales leaders can think like marketers, leverage field events, and develop consistent messaging to fuel business growth. If you’re ready to sharpen your sales processes, elevate your value selling, and connect more effectively with your market, this conversation is packed with insights.

🎧 Don’t miss this one—download the episode now and start applying these strategies to your own revenue generation journey!

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As the year draws to a close, sales leaders and professionals are already looking ahead to the next year. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson dig into the perennial challenge of lead generation, the importance of collaborating with marketing, and why proactive planning is essential for sales success. From refining your messaging to building thought leadership, this conversation is packed with strategies to help you drive revenue generation and sharpen your sales processes.

Key Topics Discussed * Why Salespeople Always Say “I Need More Leads” (01:00) * The Importance of Partnering with Marketing for Effective Sales Strategies (03:40) * Going Beyond Marketing—Referrals, Networking, and Thought Leadership (05:07) * Leveraging LinkedIn and Personal Branding to Generate Leads (06:25) * The Three Things Every Salesperson Really Sells (09:00) * Planning with Intention: Mapping the Next 12 Months for Sales Success (12:57)

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:48): “You as a salesperson… it’s your job to sit with the marketing people you have and map out the next 12 months of how to get better leads and cover your territory more effectively.” * Kevin Lawson (03:40): “Go down the hallway, knock on the door and say, here’s what I’m working on, what are you working on, and how can I help? Be a resource, be a partner to marketing.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (09:24): “There are three things you sell: your product, your company, and—most importantly—you.” * Kevin Lawson (13:16): “If you’re only giving 50% effort to your professional practice, you can’t expect championship-level results.”

Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab Community – A peer group for sales professionals to exchange best practices and strengthen their sales management and revenue generation capabilities. Go to https://b2b-sales-lab.com/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Schedule a working session with your marketing team this week. Map out the next 12 months of sales and marketing activities, focusing on how you’ll generate leads, build messaging, and increase visibility in your target accounts. Even if it starts with a simple spreadsheet, writing down the plan creates accountability and aligns sales strategies with marketing efforts.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a must-listen for sales leaders and professionals ready to elevate their business acumen. Sean and Kevin cut through the noise with practical insights on sales processes, value selling, and revenue management. Whether it’s refining your messaging, building your presence on LinkedIn, or creating opportunities for thought leadership, the conversation offers actionable sales strategies to fuel your growth. Tune in now and take the first step toward building a stronger pipeline and accelerating your sales success.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

Sean's Assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

Kevin's Assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales leaders and sales professionals: are your territories setting you up for sales success or holding your team back?

In this episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey tackle the critical role of defining territories, commission plans, and account strategies. From building fair but effective territories to creating actionable plans that drive revenue generation, this conversation blends sales management insight with practical sales strategies to help you win more consistently and grow with intention.

Key Topics Discussed * Defining Territories with Purpose (00:23) – Why intentional design matters more than “spray and pray” selling. * Fairness vs. Evenness in Territories (01:27) – Sean explains why territories don’t need to be identical, but they must be logical and fair to prevent turnover. * How Salespeople Should Approach New Territories (04:53) – Kevin outlines the mindset and business acumen required to succeed under a new commission plan. * Planning Ahead for Sales Success (08:21) – Sean breaks down how early planning impacts Q1 results, revenue management, and long-term sales processes. * The Power of Written Territory and Account Plans (12:23) – Kevin explains how documenting your strategies in a CRM enhances value selling and accountability.

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:10): “When you’re driving down the road, you’re not driving with the mirrors—you’re driving with the windshield. Defining your territory is incredibly important to know where you’re going.” * Kevin Lawson (06:00): “A new commission plan is not an indictment of past performance; it’s your executives telling you how and where they want the company to grow.” * Kevin Lawson (12:42): “When a plan is written, it’s real. You win more often when your goals and account strategies are captured, documented, and revisited.”

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Write down your territory and account growth plan before the new year begins. Identify 20 accounts to expand, document the cast of characters (champions, blockers, decision-makers), and map a path to increase revenue generation. Then, enter this plan into your CRM to hold yourself accountable and align with your company’s sales strategies.

Summary Defining sales territories creates opportunities for consistent sales success, fair expectations, and scalable revenue management. In this episode, Sean and Kevin deliver practical guidance on territory design, commission planning, and how salespeople can leverage written strategies to win bigger deals. Whether you’re a sales leader refining your sales management approach or a salesperson building momentum, this episode is packed with actionable business acumen and proven sales processes to elevate your results.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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As the year draws to a close, sales leaders and business owners face a critical challenge: preparing for growth in the year ahead. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive deep into sales management strategies that set the stage for long-term sales success. From refining compensation plans and aligning territories to planning product lifecycles and avoiding the dreaded “hockey stick” growth trap, this conversation is packed with insights on business acumen, value selling, and revenue generation strategies that every sales leader should master.

Key Topics Discussed * 01:00 – Planning Beyond This Year: Why sales leaders need to start preparing now for next year’s revenue generation and sales processes. * 02:11 – Building Smarter Compensation Plans: Evaluating and refining comp structures to drive sales success and attract top talent. * 03:13 – Product Lifecycle & AI Readiness: How shifts in markets and technology demand updates to your offerings and messaging. * 05:00 – Departmental Alignment for Growth: Understanding how revenue management and sales growth affect every department in your business. * 07:12 – Right People, Right Roles: Assessing whether your sales team is positioned for success in the next stage of your growth plan. * 11:20 – Avoiding the “Hockey Stick” Trap: Why spreading growth evenly across years is a better long-term sales strategy.

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:07): “If I asked you to write out your three-year plan, next year already knocks off the first year. Are you one-third of the way there, or do you need to rethink your path?” * Kevin Lawson (02:33): “Be planning ahead. Compensation plans aren’t a set-and-forget item—you need to revisit them every year to make sure they’re delivering the right results.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (07:59): “Do I have the right people in the right place in my sales organization for next year? Not every salesperson has to leave, but maybe their role needs to evolve.” * Kevin Lawson (11:38): “You don’t want that third year of your plan to be a hockey stick. Don’t put yourself in a position where you suddenly need 40% growth in one year to hit your goals.”

Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab: A peer community for sales leaders and professionals to sharpen strategies, exchange best practices, and get actionable feedback. * EOS Framework: For leaders who want to align messaging, sales strategies, and revenue management with long-term goals.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Review and finalize your sales compensation plans by December 1st. This gives your team enough time to digest changes, ask questions, and align their sales strategies before the new year begins. Waiting until January leaves your salespeople unprepared, which can delay revenue generation and momentum.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales arms you with practical sales management strategies to align your sales processes, compensation plans, and territories with your long-term growth goals. Sean and Kevin reveal how to prepare for next year while avoiding common pitfalls like underperforming roles, misaligned departments, or unrealistic “hockey stick” growth expectations. If you want actionable insights into value selling, revenue management, and positioning your team for lasting sales success, this is an episode you won’t want to miss.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

Sean's Assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

Kevin's Assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey build on last week’s discussion of qualification methodologies and take the conversation further—into how these frameworks should live inside your CRM. From aligning sales processes with the buyer’s journey to enforcing accountability at each stage, this conversation offers practical strategies that every sales leader and salesperson can implement. Expect a deep dive into sales management, revenue generation, sales processes, and how value selling thrives when marketing and sales teams work in sync.

Key Topics Discussed * Why your CRM is the right home for qualification methodologies (00:48) * Best practices for embedding qualification questions into sales processes (02:01) * How sales leaders enforce discipline and consistency across teams (03:18) * Eliminating Excel spreadsheets and consolidating data for effective revenue management (05:12) * Aligning marketing collateral with sales strategies to support qualification and value selling (06:00) * Real-world stories of late-stage deal failures caused by missing buyer-side approvals (10:21)

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (05:12): “Oh, please, oh, please evacuate Excel spreadsheets from your solution guide… For the purposes of this discussion, we want to strenuously avoid having third-party apps disconnected from your system.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (10:40): “There is nothing worse than missing your quarterly number because you didn’t know how they were going to buy… Knowing the paperwork process is the difference between celebrating the win and missing your commission check.” * Kevin Lawson (14:10): “Having a qualification methodology mapped into your CRM, aligned with a buyer’s journey and supported by marketing resources, gives you a fully wrapped system that prevents that dreaded CEO call asking, ‘What’s the status of that deal?’”

Additional Resources * HubSpot Blog: A Guide to Sales Qualification Frameworkshttps://blog.hubspot.com/sales/6-popular-sales-methodologies-summarized * Join the B2B Sales Lab for 90 days free and access practical community discussions on sales strategies, revenue management, and messaging. https://b2b-sales-lab.com * CRM platforms mentioned: HubSpot (https://www.hubspot.com/), Pipedrive (https://www.pipedrive.com/), Salesforce (https://www.salesforce.com/), Membrain (https://www.membrain.com/)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Embed your qualification methodology directly into your CRM, tied to each stage of your sales process.

Don’t let critical deal information reside inside spreadsheets or Word docs; configure your CRM so progression requires those qualification questions to be answered. This not only improves sales accuracy but also enhances revenue management, ensures consistency across your team, and creates alignment with marketing resources to drive value selling.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a must-listen for anyone serious about building sustainable sales success. Sean and Kevin reveal how sales strategies such as qualification methodologies come to life when fully integrated into CRM-driven sales processes. You’ll learn why sales management must prioritize data consistency, how business acumen prevents late-stage deal disasters, and how aligning messaging between sales and marketing fuels stronger revenue generation. If you want practical insights on improving your sales processes and elevating your organization’s performance, download this episode today and start putting these best practices to work.

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey delve into the crucial role of deal qualification in driving sales success. From simple frameworks like BANT to advanced methodologies such as MEDDIC and MEDDPICCC, Kevin and Sean explain how consistent sales processes, value selling, and business acumen can sharpen forecasting, strengthen messaging, and ultimately accelerate revenue generation. Whether you’re managing a sales team or selling solo, this discussion will help you refine your sales strategies and improve your revenue management outcomes.

Key Topics Discussed * The cooking analogy for sales qualification – how preparing a meal mirrors building consistent sales processes * Why full qualification matters – reducing forecast slippage, aligning solutions to customer needs, and driving predictable revenue generation * BANT explained – Budget, Authority, Need, and Timeline as a simple framework for qualifying deals * Beyond BANT – an overview of advanced methodologies such as SPIN, SPICED, and NEAT for value selling in complex deals * Deep dive into MEDDIC and MEDDPICCC – why metrics, the economic buyer, and champions are essential for enterprise-level sales success * The importance of sales management consistency – ensuring every salesperson in an organization qualifies deals with the same discipline

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson : “When you close things better, when you have more deal intelligence or customer intelligence or relationship intelligence gained through a qualifying methodology, you end up being better able to serve a customer.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey : “If you have five salespeople trying to qualify deals, you want them to qualify them the same way—consistency matters because it creates repeatable sales success.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey : “Every deal needs a champion. If you can get a champion to sell for you when you’re not there, you are far more likely to win.”

Additional Resources * HubSpot Blog: A Guide to Sales Qualification Frameworkshttps://blog.hubspot.com/sales/6-popular-sales-methodologies-summarized * The Qualified Sales Leader by John McMahon is an essential read on MEDDIC from one of the most successful sales leaders in software history. https://a.co/d/76089W7 * Join the B2B Sales Lab for 90 days free and access practical community discussions on sales strategies, revenue management, and messaging. https://b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Select and consistently implement one sales qualification framework across all your deals. Whether you adopt BANT for simplicity or MEDDPICCC for enterprise-level selling, consistency in qualification builds stronger forecasts, improves customer alignment, and accelerates revenue generation. Decide on one methodology, train your team, and hold yourself accountable to using it every time.

Why You Should Listen This episode is packed with practical insights for salespeople, managers, and business leaders committed to improving revenue management and sales success. Kevin and Sean take you from everyday analogies to advanced enterprise strategies, showing why consistent qualification is the backbone of predictable growth. If you want sharper sales processes, better forecasting, and stronger messaging that supports value selling, you won’t want to miss this conversation. Download now and start applying these proven sales strategies to your own pipeline.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In today’s fast-changing sales landscape, everyone is talking about AI, automation, and digital tools, but are these the keys to sales success? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey explore why documenting your sales processes, defining your ideal client profile (ICP), and sharpening your value selling approach must come before chasing shiny new technologies. Whether you’re leading a sales team or building revenue generation strategies as a business owner, this episode delivers practical advice for aligning business acumen with modern sales strategies.

Key Topics Discussed * [00:01:00] The foundational role of sales processes: Why documenting your sales processes is more important than rushing into automation or AI. * [00:03:00] Defining your Ideal Client Profile (ICP): How knowing precisely who you should sell to drives revenue management and sales success. * [00:06:00] AI without ICP is useless: Kevin explains why AI and automation fail without strong sales strategies and a written ICP. * [00:09:00] Automating bad processes makes junk faster: Sean shares insights from decades in sales and automation. * [00:12:00] Real growth impact: Data showing how companies with a documented ICP experience higher win rates, deal closure, and long-term revenue generation.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson [00:06:00]: “AI tools don’t work unless they are programmed to know what you’re trying to look for. If your value proposition and ICP aren’t documented, you’ve basically bought another untrained person.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:10:23]: “If you automate a bad process, all you do is make junk faster. Get the basics right first.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:12:57]: “Companies with a documented ICP have an account win rate 68% higher than those without one. That’s the power of clarity in sales processes.”

Additional Resources * Exclusive whitepapers on Ideal Client Profiles and Value Selling Propositions are available inside the B2B Sales Lab Community. www.b2b-sales-lab.com and go to the Sales Resources section. * Previous episode: Winning Sales Strategies for Productive, High-Impact Pipeline Reviews https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/winning-sales-strategies-for-productive-high-impact/id1668686029?i=1000721736213

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Write down your Ideal Client Profile (ICP). Even if you think you already know your best customers, putting it in writing transforms sales management and revenue generation. A written ICP sharpens your messaging, aligns your sales processes, and empowers value selling. Without it, AI tools and automation will fail to deliver meaningful results.

Why You Should Listen If you’re serious about sales success, this episode is a must. Kevin and Sean break through the noise of AI hype to uncover the timeless truths of revenue management, sales strategies, and business acumen. Learn how to strengthen your sales processes, improve messaging, and drive consistent revenue generation. Packed with stories, data, and practical wisdom, this episode equips you with the clarity needed to win more deals and build long-term sales success.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Pipeline reviews don’t need to feel like an ambush. In this episode, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey break down how to turn pipeline meetings into high-value working sessions that improve sales management, strengthen sales processes, and accelerate revenue generation. The conversation focuses on preparation discipline, trust, and transparency, as well as a practical playbook for advancing complex deals through relationship mapping and peer-to-peer executive engagement.

You’ll hear straightforward sales strategies you can implement immediately, whether you lead a large enterprise team or a small, founder-led organization. Expect a sharp focus on business acumen, value selling, and the day-to-day messaging that keeps deals moving. The result is a meeting format that fuels sales success and better revenue management, not another hour of defensive status reporting.

Key Topics Discussed * Make pipeline reviews not suck — Focus the agenda on the few deals that genuinely need help; skip deep dives on healthy opportunities. [~00:00:00] * The salesperson’s prep checklist — Current notes, clear qualification status, and a concrete next step; never open with “I need to get a meeting.” [~00:03:00] * Trust, transparency, and speed — Why open admission of gaps prevents executive “gotchas” and keeps the team collaborative. [~00:04:34–00:05:34] * Taming the “big deal” distraction — How sales leaders manage CEO attention and ensure one opportunity doesn’t hijack the meeting. [~00:07:52–00:08:20] * Relationship mapping for top deals — Title-to-title engagement, executive assignments, and the “11-on-11” football metaphor for flawless execution. [~00:09:00–00:11:55] * Adapting for smaller orgs — Three-on-three analogy, “weaponize” your internal team as peer resources, and coach reps to lead 1:1s. [~00:12:30–00:15:06]

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey [~00:01:36]: “Bring up the ones that hurt, the deals where you need help. Wouldn’t it be nice to get helped in a pipeline review instead of just being told to ‘get your ass out there and go work on it’?” * Kevin Lawson [~00:05:00]: “Transparency is our key that will keep us moving forward and fast. Sales pipeline meetings don’t have to be the Spanish Inquisition.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey [~00:11:34]: “Run your top deals like you’re running a football team, every player knows their assignment, and you execute flawlessly.” * Kevin Lawson [~00:14:33]: “For one-to-ones, the salesperson should be leading the meeting, your job is to coach them to bring challenges you can clear.”

Additional Resources (mentioned in the episode) * Sales Meeting Agenda Templates — Free downloadable agendas for effective pipeline reviews and 1:1s (from Sean and Kevin’s sites). * B2B Sales Lab Community — A peer-led forum to refine sales strategies, strengthen messaging, and accelerate revenue generation. https://b2b-sales-lab.com/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Adopt the “Help-First Pipeline Review” and Relationship Map.

Before your next review, split your pipeline into two lists: On-Track and Needs Help. Use meeting time almost exclusively on the “Needs Help” list. For each flagged deal, arrive with: (1) current status and qualification level, (2) the single next step, and (3) a relationship map that pairs your execs and functional leaders title-to-title with the customer’s counterparts (CEO↔CEO, CFO↔CFO, VP Eng↔VP Eng). Assign those internal players specific outreach tasks and deadlines. This simple shift transforms pipeline reviews into working sessions that improve sales management, sharpen sales processes, and advance value-based conversations, fast.

Two quick tips to lock it in:

Never start with “I need to get a meeting.” Instead, say, “I’m trying to reach Larry; here are the three touches I’ve already made and my next move.”
Preempt “big deal” derailments by updating its status in CRM ahead of time and summarizing it briefly; then return to the prepared “Needs Help” list.

Summary If pipeline reviews feel like public performance reviews, this conversation will reset the culture. Kevin and Sean outline a decisive, repeatable approach that blends business acumen, crisp messaging, and practical value selling to move deals. By prioritizing help over inspection, mapping peer-to-peer relationships, and coaching reps to lead, you’ll turn a dreaded ritual into a lever for sales success and consistent revenue management. Queue it up, your next pipeline meeting can actually be the best hour of your sales week.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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When your sales pipeline hits a wall—or worse, goes completely flat—it can feel like you’re spinning your wheels. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive deep into what to do when your sales team is facing a revenue generation stall. This is a fast-paced, actionable conversation focused entirely on what sales leaders can do to recharge a stalled pipeline—without relying on marketing. Whether you’re in B2B tech, manufacturing, or professional services, this episode will equip you with practical, high-impact tactics to get your sales process moving forward again.

Key Topics Discussed

The “Flat Tire” Sales Pipeline Analogy (00:00) Why pipelines go flat—even after big wins—and how leaders can reframe the issue.
The Power of Referrals and Networking (03:00) Sean’s method for turning satisfied customers into a referral engine—complete with a ready-to-send intro letter.
Expanding Through Customer Proximity and Chambers of Commerce (05:00) Leveraging existing accounts and local business events to rapidly refill the funnel.
Using PESTEL for Industry-Relevant Messaging (07:00) Kevin shares a practical framework for creating insightful sales conversations that show business acumen and relevance.
Requalifying Open Deals with the Right Buyers (08:00) How to use sales processes and CRMs to validate opportunities—and why “access to power” is non-negotiable.
Getting to the Economic Buyer—and Asking for the Order (11:00) A breakdown of how to engage decision-makers, handle their buying criteria, and close with confidence.

Key Quotes

“I don’t care what you sell—coolants, software, promotional gear—if you’re not prospecting today, your pipeline will let you down tomorrow.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:07)

“We’re not a demo organization. If the demo alone sold your product, you wouldn’t need a salesperson.” — Kevin Lawson (10:00)

“If your salespeople can’t tell you who the economic buyer is, it’s time for you to get in the car and go meet them yourself.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (12:00)

Additional Resources Mentioned

B2B Sales Lab Community – A peer-led space for sales professionals and leaders to grow, collaborate, and share sales strategies. (Free 90-day trial with credit card to keep out spammers.) www.b2b-sales-lab.com
PESTEL Framework – A structured approach for bringing value to sales conversations by focusing on Political, Economic, Social, Technological, Environmental, and Legal issues impacting buyers.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Requalify Every Deal in Your Pipeline This Week

Sales leaders: pull your team into a pipeline review and ask a simple, high-stakes question about every open opportunity—“If you walked in with a PO today, could your contact sign it?” If the answer is “no,” that deal is not qualified. Use this exercise to reinforce accountability, focus on real economic buyers, and prioritize deals that can convert into revenue. Don't just forecast—verify.

Why You Should Listen Now

If you’ve ever looked at your pipeline and felt that creeping sense of panic, this episode is your emergency roadside kit. Sean and Kevin don’t waste time with fluff—they deliver real sales strategies rooted in decades of experience with sales management, business acumen, and revenue generation. From value selling tactics to reengaging your best customers, this conversation is loaded with sales success insights you can implement today. Plug in, take notes, and start patching your pipeline with purpose.

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive deep into one of the most misunderstood dynamics in business: the relationship between sales and marketing. Pulled directly from a thought-provoking question inside the B2B Sales Lab community, this conversation explores how sales teams can contribute meaningfully to marketing efforts and why that collaboration drives better revenue generation. Whether you lead a sales team, run marketing campaigns, or wear both hats in a small business, this episode gives you practical strategies to align your teams, sharpen your messaging, and enhance sales success.

Key Topics Discussed * The Role of Sales in Marketing & Content Development (00:00) How sales leaders can become strategic contributors to content and campaign direction. * Being the Voice of the Customer Across the Business (00:02) Why sales must act as a conduit of market intelligence, not just for marketing but across production, delivery, and operations. * Sales Behavior That Builds or Breaks Internal Trust (00:04) The importance of accountability and humility when offering feedback to other departments. * Making Marketing a Regular Part of Sales Meetings (00:08) A tactical breakdown of how to engage marketing in the sales rhythm without derailing productivity. * Field Collaboration: Invite Your Internal Teams to Ride Along (00:10) Why taking engineers or operations managers on customer calls creates stronger cross-functional empathy and better customer experiences. * Marketing Assets: Create Them, Use Them, Give Feedback (00:12) How to close the feedback loop on content effectiveness and ensure sales uses what marketing builds.

Key Quotes “Sales is accountable for driving the revenue, but sales is also accountable for working with marketing to get to a market-facing message that addresses current needs.” — Kevin Lawson (00:00)

“Your job in sales is to be the best-run department in the company. If you’re not, your opinion probably doesn’t matter.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:08)

“Please, oh please, use the tools your marketing team creates for you. If you don’t, that’s on you.” — Kevin Lawson (00:12)

“There’s no better way to get internal teams aligned with customers than to take them on sales calls. Let them breathe your air and eat at Burger King between meetings.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:11)

Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab Community: A peer group for sales professionals focused on sharpening sales processes, messaging, and revenue management. www.b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Hold a joint sales-marketing meeting each quarter.

Schedule a dedicated 30-minute session within your sales team’s recurring meeting where your marketing counterpart joins to review current messaging, upcoming campaigns, and voice-of-the-customer insights. Let marketing ask questions, present new content, and gather sales feedback. Use this as a structured loop to align both teams on business acumen, sales strategies, and revenue goals.

Why You Should Listen Now If you’ve ever wondered why your sales messaging isn’t landing or why marketing feels “out of touch,” this episode is for you. Kevin and Sean pull back the curtain on how high-performing sales organizations dissolve silos, share real-time customer feedback, and co-create assets that drive revenue. Whether you're a VP of Sales, a marketing leader, or a business owner trying to scale effectively, you'll walk away with ideas you can implement this week to align your teams for better revenue generation and sales success. Tune in now and start building the team your customers deserve.

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When a top-performing salesperson refuses to follow the rules, tensions flare, and your culture might suffer. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey tackle a question straight from their B2B Sales Lab community: What do you do with a sales rockstar who drives the rest of the team nuts? If you've ever struggled with managing high-output, low-alignment team members, this conversation is packed with valuable insights, practical strategies, and real-world advice to help you strike a balance between performance and healthy team dynamics. Tune in for battle-tested tips on sales management, building a high-integrity sales culture, and protecting your company's long-term revenue generation strategy.

Key Topics Discussed

Establishing Clear Norms in Sales Teams – Why your “top dog” needs to play by the same rules as everyone else, and how undefined expectations damage sales processes (Approx. 02:00)
The Power of Documented Standards and Culture Alignment – How lack of structure in small businesses creates room for chaos—and what to do about it (Approx. 03:30)
Tactical Solutions for Managing Lone Wolves – Real examples of how to realign high performers through mentorship and responsibility (Approx. 09:00)
Creating a Unified Sales Culture Without Crushing Performance – Why culture eats strategy for breakfast, especially in sales teams (Approx. 04:30)
Using Silence, Expectations, and Consistency to Set Boundaries – Kevin shares how saying “no” and standing firm protects team cohesion and customer relationships (Approx. 12:00)

Key Quotes

"Culture is probably the most important thing you possibly can have—and it starts with setting clear expectations." — Sean O’Shaughnessey (Approx. 06:05)

"Sales culture will eat strategy for breakfast. Culture always wins in the long run." — Kevin Lawson (Approx. 04:39)

"Sometimes you have to accept a little current pain to create future gain for your entire organization." — Kevin Lawson (Approx. 13:00)

"If you're the person who colors outside the lines and won’t adjust… maybe you just don’t belong here." — Sean O’Shaughnessey (Approx. 08:30)

Additional Resources

Learn more about the B2B Sales Lab community: https://b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Assign a High-Performer as a Mentor to Drive Culture Alignment If you’re dealing with a rule-breaking top performer, try this: assign them as a mentor to a junior rep. This strategic move puts them in a leadership position where they must model the very behavior they’ve been resisting, updating the CRM, following your sales strategies, and representing your company messaging. This peer responsibility often encourages cultural realignment without confrontation.

Why You Should Listen to This EpisodeThis episode is a must-listen for sales managers, business owners, and team leaders wrestling with the dilemma of performance vs. process. Sean and Kevin don’t just talk theory—they give real, implementable strategies that can help you protect your sales culture, enforce consistent sales management practices, and drive long-term revenue success. If you're aiming for scalable growth without sacrificing team cohesion, this episode delivers practical wisdom and a few gut-check moments. Hit play and discover how to bring even the most independent salespeople back into the fold—without losing their fire.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this compelling episode, co-hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the crucial distinctions between workflows, automations, and artificial intelligence (AI), and why understanding these differences isn’t just technical trivia, but foundational to improving sales processes, enhancing sales management, and accelerating revenue generation. If you're a sales leader, business owner, or B2B rep striving to improve how you use technology to boost sales success, this episode is a must-listen. Packed with real-world examples and expert commentary, you'll walk away with a clearer understanding of how to integrate automation and AI into your selling environment without losing the human touch that drives value selling.

Key Topics Discussed * The Distinction Between Workflow and Automation (approx. 01:00) Kevin and Sean explain that workflows are rule-based sequences (what should happen), while automations are system-triggered actions (when they happen). * Applying Workflow and Automation to Common Sales Scenarios (approx. 03:00) Sean walks through onboarding, fulfillment, and follow-up processes that can be automated to save time and reduce human error. * The Role of AI in Enhancing Sales Tasks (approx. 05:00) Discover how AI moves beyond automation by adding intelligence and insight, like writing customized thank-you messages or enriching CRM data. * What Sales Leaders Should Expect from Modern CRM Systems (approx. 12:00) Sean lays out a vision of AI-enabled CRMs that proactively suggest key contacts and actions for deeper account penetration. * Creating Sales Infrastructure That Supports Scale (approx. 09:00) Kevin emphasizes how business logic, automation, and AI build a more agile, informed sales team that’s prepared for disruption.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (approx. 00:46): “Workflows are trigger-based events that tell business logic what to do next... but automation is what makes things happen automatically, without human intervention.”

Sean O'Shaughnessey (approx. 05:43): “We used to personalize thank-you letters with a person. Now we can automate that process and use AI to generate something that's still meaningful but takes no time.”

Kevin Lawson (approx. 10:00): “AI plus workflows plus automation creates the bedrock for a better sales organization… a more nimble organization that can adapt to changes in the environment.”

Sean O'Shaughnessey (approx. 13:08): “Does your CRM say, ‘Did you know there are three directors of manufacturing at that company?’ That’s where workflows, automation, and AI converge to fuel revenue growth.”

Additional Resources * Join the B2B Sales Lab Community – A peer-driven space where sales professionals, managers, and leaders exchange insights, share best practices, and build smarter revenue systems.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your CRM and lead-handling processes. Ask yourself: Is my CRM working for me, or am I working for it? Review whether incoming leads are routed automatically, if emails are logged without manual entry, and whether sales leaders receive alerts on stalled opportunities. Implement at least one automation or AI-powered enhancement, such as auto-logging emails or enriching lead data, to eliminate repetitive tasks and enable your team to focus on strategic selling.

Why You Should Listen Now This episode isn’t just a primer on sales tech buzzwords; it’s a blueprint for operational excellence in B2B sales. Kevin and Sean break down complex topics with clarity and offer practical advice that can immediately improve your sales team’s responsiveness, accountability, and business acumen. If you're serious about building a scalable sales infrastructure, aligning your team with cutting-edge sales strategies, and using AI as a force multiplier for your messaging and revenue management, then queue up this episode today. You'll walk away with new ideas, sharper thinking, and a to-do list worth acting on.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Is artificial intelligence coming for your sales job? Not if you understand the power of business acumen, value selling, and strategic adoption of tools that amplify, not replace, human expertise. In this high-impact episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin and Sean tackle the loud claims of AI-induced layoffs with a grounded, practical message for salespeople and sales managers: evolve or fall behind. This is not a doomsday episode; it's a wake-up call, a roadmap, and a motivational boost for anyone in the world of revenue generation, sales processes, and messaging strategy.

Whether you're a frontline salesperson or a VP of sales leading a team, this conversation will inspire you to rethink how you work, what skills future-proof your career, and how AI can become your competitive advantage instead of your competitor.

Key Topics Discussed * The 4 Irreplaceable Skills That Safeguard Sales Careers (01:00) Sean breaks down a framework for evaluating whether your job is AI-proof, hint: if you’re in B2B sales and good at it, you're likely already building a durable edge. * How AI Mirrors the Arrival of the Internet in Sales Evolution (04:10) Kevin draws a compelling parallel between today's AI landscape and the early days of the internet, showing why this shift is just as transformative. * Sales Management and Strategic Value in an AI World (02:46 & 07:31) From leadership and team building to messaging and workflow design, the episode highlights why sales managers need to think beyond quotas and towards long-term enablement. * A Personal Story of Old-School Sales and the Power of Adapting Tools (08:00) Sean shares a nostalgic (and relevant) story about his father’s sales career before personal computers, offering perspective on how sales adapts across generations. * Weaponizing Your Time: Using AI to Amplify Human Strengths (13:00) Kevin delivers a call to action on how to audit your own sales day and offload low-value tasks through automation, freeing up more time for high-impact strategy and consultation.

Key Quotes “You won’t lose your job to AI, you’ll lose your job to a better salesperson who uses AI.” – Sean O’Shaughnessey (01:02)

“If you’re not using AI, or any sales technology, you’re not doing your job. You’re underperforming.” – Kevin Lawson (06:11)

“Sales worked before computers, and it will work after AI. What changes is how well you adapt the tools available.” – Sean O’Shaughnessey (10:04)

“Your time is your greatest asset, and your biggest liability, when you’re not using it to its highest utility.” – Kevin Lawson (14:00)

Additional Resources * Sean’s original blog post on this topic (available in the B2B Sales Lab and LinkedIn) https://newsales.expert/2025/06/b2b-sales-in-the-age-of-ai-why-top-salespeople-will-thrive-while-the-repetitive-roles-disappear/ * B2B Sales Lab community discussion on sales evolution and AI https://b2b-sales-lab.com/ * Tools mentioned: ChatGPT, Perplexity, Gemini (as starting points for AI integration)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit your sales day for repeatable, low-value tasks that can be automated. Pick one of them, like researching prospects, summarizing meeting notes, or drafting follow-ups, and replace it with an AI tool like ChatGPT or Perplexity. You’ll recover time, increase productivity, and move closer to building a modern, AI-augmented sales practice.

Final Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales isn’t about fear, it’s about focus. Sales success today requires a sharp blend of strategic thinking, tool adoption, and human skills that are nearly impossible to replicate. Kevin and Sean lay out a blueprint that every sales leader, rep, and business owner should follow to thrive in this new era. If you’re serious about sales management, value selling, messaging clarity, and staying ahead of disruption, this episode will give you the mindset and tactical clarity to act now. Don’t just listen, level up.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales isn’t about persuasion but service, resilience, and growth. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, co-hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey welcome sales leader and former professional athlete Jeff Parris to explore the fundamental skills that separate elite salespeople from the rest. Drawing on decades of experience, Jeff shares three often-overlooked yet foundational competencies that drive sales success, and they’re not what you’d expect. Whether you're a VP of Sales building a high-performance team or a seller looking to level up, this episode delivers sharp insights on value selling, business acumen, and sales management excellence.

Key Topics Discussed * Why great salespeople see themselves as servants first (approx. 04:00) Jeff outlines why a “motivation to serve” mindset creates stronger client relationships and more consistent revenue generation. * Ego Drive vs. Ego Trip: Understanding the will to win without arrogance (approx. 07:30) Learn how ego drive, a hunger to persuade for the buyer’s benefit, builds durable sales performance. * Curiosity as the gateway to sales mastery (approx. 10:15) Jeff and Sean dig into why curiosity fuels continuous improvement and business acumen across every sales process. * How to coach the “accidental salesperson” into a top performer (approx. 11:45) Kevin asks how people without formal sales backgrounds can thrive by developing the right mindset. * Sales leaders as talent architects: Building high-performance teams (approx. 02:00) Jeff draws on his athletic past to share what makes a sales team championship-worthy.

Key Quotes “Sales isn’t something we do to people, it’s something we do for people.” — Jeff Parris (04:00)

“The real goal of a great salesperson is: ‘Mr. Prospect, let me help you solve that problem.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (05:55)

“Having the right people, with the right skills, in the right seats makes winning so much easier.” — Kevin Lawson (03:36)

“Curiosity leads to better solutions. Every interaction is a chance to learn and improve your craft.” — Jeff Parris (10:50)

Additional Resources * The Challenger Sale by Matthew Dixon & Brent Adamson https://a.co/d/2Zpnlq7 * Connect with Jeff Parris on LinkedIn: Jeffrey Parris - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffparris/ * Learn more at Vector Sales Advisors: https://vectorsalesadvisors.com/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Evaluate your team (and yourself) on the “Service–Drive–Curiosity” Triad. Start by asking three questions:

Does this salesperson show a genuine desire to serve the customer’s goals?
Do they take pride in persuading with purpose, not just for commission but impact?
Are they consistently seeking to learn more about the customer, the industry, and their performance?

Use these questions in your next 1-on-1 or team coaching session to align your talent strategy with the kind of sales success that sustains revenue generation.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode If you're tired of surface-level sales advice, this conversation will challenge your thinking and expand your toolkit. Jeff Parris brings clarity, conviction, and humility to what it means to lead with purpose in today’s complex B2B landscape. From building elite sales teams to refining your individual sales strategy, this episode is packed with practical wisdom for leaders, sellers, and anyone serious about mastering the craft of sales. Tune in now and discover the underestimated traits that drive extraordinary outcomes.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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When marketing professional services, the playbook isn’t the same as product sales, and today’s episode dives into exactly why. Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson are joined by returning guest Chris Spanier, CEO of Carpe Diem Consulting Group and host of the Practical Actionable Marketing podcast. This conversation tackles the nuances of sales strategies for service-based businesses, blending value selling with measurable marketing and aligning both functions for stronger revenue generation. If you're a business owner, consultant, or fractional executive trying to sharpen your sales processes and improve messaging, this episode is a goldmine of practical advice.

🔑 Key Topics Discussed * [02:44] Why traditional product marketing doesn’t work for professional services—and how to adapt * [03:46] The importance of measuring marketing effectiveness and integrating KPIs into the sales process * [07:36] How to position and market services that don’t have tangible “speeds and feeds” * [08:28] Letting go of the fear of “giving away your secret sauce” in thought leadership content * [10:30] Systemizing stories and messaging to scale sales efforts across a growing team * [12:14] How to use lead nurturing email campaigns to drive engagement and trust over time

🗣️ Key Quotes Sean O’Shaughnessey:

“Sales is a really expensive marketing arm if you're not doing really good marketing.” — [05:59]

Kevin Lawson:

“Tell how you win, how you help others win, and how they win when working with you—this is as key as anything in professional services.” — [10:52]

Chris Spanier:

“If you freely share value, people won’t take advantage of you—they’ll start trusting you. That’s the first step in real sales success.” — [08:54] “Marketing is half magic and half numbers. But the numbers—that’s where the proof comes in.” — [04:14]

📚 Additional Resources * B2B Sales Lab - https://b2b-sales-lab.com/ * Practical Actionable Marketing Podcast https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/practical-actionable-marketing/id1697011310 * Chris Spanier’s consulting firm: Carpe Diem Consulting Group (cdcg.us) * Contact Chris: chris@cdcg.us * LinkedIn: Chris Spanier

✅ A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Systemize your lead nurturing. Create a recurring, value-focused email campaign to maintain top-of-mind awareness. Whether your cadence is every three or six weeks, focus 80% on providing helpful insights and only 20% on pitching your services. Tracking measures email open rates and clicks, and then the behavior is aligned with site visits or follow-up outreach. This strategy turns occasional touchpoints into consistent momentum, critical for long-cycle sales in professional services.

🎧 Why You Should Listen Now This episode is packed with strategic clarity and tactical insight for anyone selling invisible services. Whether you're a fractional executive, consultant, or marketing-savvy sales leader, you’ll leave with a more innovative approach to messaging, a stronger understanding of sales and marketing alignment, and actionable ways to drive revenue generation with business acumen. Tune in now and rethink how you build trust and momentum in your professional services pipeline.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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When sales professionals hit a roadblock, where do they turn? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey unveil an exciting new initiative: B2B Sales Lab, a private peer networking community designed to support salespeople, sales managers, and business owners in their journey toward revenue generation excellence. This isn’t just a conversation; rather, we are offering an invitation to join something powerful. If you've ever felt alone in a tough sales challenge or wished for experienced advice on your messaging, sales processes, or strategy, this episode is for you.

Key Topics Discussed

(00:00) Why selling isn’t easy and how sales professionals can benefit from a support network
(00:39) The creation and mission of the B2B Sales Lab community
(01:42) How the platform fosters peer-to-peer learning without judgment or pressure
(02:58) The importance of community in developing strong sales strategies and business acumen
(03:54) Guardrails that make this space safer and more effective than LinkedIn or Facebook groups
(05:00) Why there's a membership fee—and why the first three months are free

Key Quotes

Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:01:00): "We're creating a community where people can get together, bounce ideas off each other without fear—just designed to help."
Kevin Lawson (00:02:58): "It’s unreasonable to think your small sales team has all the answers. But it’s completely reasonable to find a community that does."
Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:04:16): "If you're not a salesperson or sales leader, you're not getting in. This isn't about selling to each other. It’s about growing together."

Additional Resources

B2B Sales Lab Information & Registration: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-lab (Free for the first three months with no obligation.)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Join the B2B Sales Lab. If you've ever wished you had a sounding board for a tough sales call, a creative partner to work through messaging, or a peer to validate your sales strategy, this is your moment. Visit the link in the show notes and apply to join the B2B Sales Lab. The first three months are free, giving you access to experienced sales minds, curated content on value selling and revenue management, and a judgment-free environment to grow your sales acumen. Don’t wait for your next deal to fall through; build your support system today.

Why You Should Listen This episode is a call to action for sales professionals serious about growth. If you’re navigating complex sales cycles, seeking stronger messaging, or simply want a community that understands your world, the B2B Sales Lab might be the resource you've been missing. Kevin and Sean, both seasoned in sales leadership and sales management, offer not just insights but an entire framework to elevate your career. Listen now to learn how to take the next step toward sustainable sales success—and connect with others on the same journey.

Join the B2B Sales Lab community at https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-lab. We look forward to helping you grow your revenue!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by veteran fractional VP of Sales, John McLeod. Together, they dive into a critical topic for today’s sales leaders: embracing artificial intelligence tools without compromising your value proposition, messaging, or sales processes. John brings deep expertise in sales management, business acumen, and revenue generation strategies, offering a measured approach to evaluating sales tech, especially AI solutions, through a risk-and-reward lens. Whether you're a business owner, sales manager, or BDR excited about AI, this conversation grounds you in practical wisdom.

Key Topics Discussed

The Real Risk of AI in Sales (00:01:22): How overreliance on untrained AI tools can misrepresent your brand and do more harm than good.
Sales Productivity vs. Organizational Efficiency (00:02:01): Why the focus shouldn’t just be on doing more faster, but also on syncing with your company's value selling model.
Three Essential AI Use Cases in Sales (00:03:25): Research, qualification, and outreach—and why each comes with its own operational risk.
The Ethical Use of AI and Messaging Integrity (00:07:43): Why maintaining consistent messaging across AI-enabled tools is essential to preserving brand integrity and revenue management.
Training AI for Sales Value (00:10:00): How smart prompt engineering and structured inputs drive better outcomes from generative AI tools.

Key Quotes

John McLeod (00:05:27): “AI tools are meant to be trained. The biggest risk is: are they in fact supporting your unique and distinctive value proposition and holding true to that?”

Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:11:38): “You won’t lose your job to AI—but you might lose it to another salesperson who knows how to use AI more effectively.”

Kevin Lawson (00:09:40): “When you introduce AI and efficiency, that naturally raises the bar of expectation for performance. What is the new normal when you get there?”

Additional Resources

John McLeod’s LinkedIn Profile - https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnmcleod1/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Train Your AI with Purpose: Don’t just “plug and play” AI tools. Take the time to structure your inputs and refine your prompts so that the tool reflects your value, not just generic sales content. Spend time A/B testing different approaches to ensure messaging aligns with your company's strategic sales positioning. Start today by reviewing your most recent outreach generated by AI and ask: “Does this truly represent our value?” If not, retrain your prompts before using them again.

Why You Should Listen Now If you’ve ever been tempted by the next great sales tool or AI platform promising instant leads and effortless sales success, this episode will recalibrate your thinking. John McLeod delivers candid insights on balancing tech adoption with strategic discipline. With Sean and Kevin steering the conversation, this discussion is rich with real-world experience in sales management, messaging, and revenue generation. Tune in now to stay ahead without losing what makes your company valuable.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this high-impact episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome sales acceleration expert Patrick O'Donnell to tackle one of the toughest challenges facing small business CEOs: hiring and onboarding top-performing sales talent. Together, they dive deep into proven sales strategies that help CEOs find strong candidates and keep them engaged, successful, and driving revenue. If you’ve ever hired a salesperson who didn’t work out, or you’re planning to hire your first, this conversation is your roadmap to sales success. From creating a robust onboarding plan to integrating soft skills training and cultural alignment, this episode is packed with value-selling insights you can apply immediately.

Key Topics Discussed:

[00:01:00] Why small business CEOs struggle to attract and retain top salespeople
[00:03:00] Patrick’s proven hiring and onboarding process for sales roles
[00:05:10] The importance of structured 30-60-90 day plans and Sean’s GUTS framework
[00:07:00] Kevin’s NASA Plan for onboarding: A granular, hourly approach to early success
[00:10:00] The role of soft skills and professional development in retaining talent
[00:11:50] A lighthearted look at entrepreneurship: Why Patrick bought a historic Indianapolis tavern

Key Quotes:

"They're in such a hurry to take the sales hat off their head that they hire the first person who looks okay on the surface. That rushed approach almost always ends poorly." – Patrick O'Donnell [00:02:06]

"I hand every new rep a GUTS document—Getting Up To Speed. It’s a 30-60-90 plan that clearly spells out what they need to accomplish. They can be ahead, but they can’t fall behind." – Sean O'Shaughnessey [00:05:10]

"Most small business owners think they have a plan because it's in their head. But if it’s not written down, it doesn’t exist." – Kevin Lawson [00:07:29]

"We want every new hire to be the most professional person in the company, because it's their job to make everyone around them better." – Sean O'Shaughnessey [00:10:35]

Additional Resources:

LinkedIn profile for Patrick O'Donnell https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickwodonnell/
Soft skills training programs referenced by Sean for onboarding enrichment
GUTS (Getting Up To Speed) framework and NASA Plan discussed during onboarding best practices

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Implement a Written 30-60-90 Onboarding Plan with a Two-Week NASA Schedule. Salespeople need clarity to succeed. Whether you're a first-time sales manager or a seasoned executive, stop relying on verbal plans or “tribal knowledge.” Create a written 30-60-90 onboarding plan that details expectations, milestones, and key outcomes. For the first two weeks, apply the NASA method: a daily, hour-by-hour schedule that aligns the new hire with every department, cultural cue, and technical requirement. Doing so sets a strong foundation for success and dramatically reduces early turnover.

Summary Paragraph: If you’re serious about improving your sales management, elevating your sales processes, and building a team that drives real revenue generation, this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is essential listening. Kevin, Sean, and Patrick break down what too many business owners get wrong—and how you can get it right. Whether you're scaling a team or hiring your first rep, these insights around onboarding, messaging, and business acumen will accelerate your journey toward consistent sales success. Press play now and walk away with tools you can use today.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this week’s episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey are joined by the “Elder Statesman” of fractional sales management: John Lee. With nearly four decades of experience and a deep track record of helping companies hire top-performing sales professionals, John shares a masterclass in sales hiring strategy. Whether you’re scaling from a two-person team to ten or trying to avoid costly hiring mistakes, this episode delivers practical, field-tested advice on building elite sales teams, strengthening your sales processes, and aligning talent with company culture.

Don't miss this conversation if you're committed to improving your sales success through smarter hiring, better business acumen, and scalable revenue generation.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Hiring Mindset for Growth Companies (00:01:45) Why hiring rock stars—not warm bodies—matters and how John filters for high performers.
From First Hire to Scaling a Team (00:04:44) CEOs and sales leaders must ask the evolving questions when hiring their 3rd, 5th, or 10th rep.
Psychographics, Not Just Resumes (00:05:24) How John builds candidate profiles that match top performers using behavior and motivation, not just skills.
Parallel Sales and Hiring Processes (00:08:00) Why a successful sales hiring process mirrors your value selling strategy—with defined steps, assessments, and clear messaging.
Avoiding Common Hiring Mistakes (00:11:43) The critical danger of hiring salespeople who are better at selling themselves than your solution.
Top 3 Rules for Hiring Sales Talent (00:13:33) John’s unfiltered checklist for hiring decisions that fuel revenue growth and protect your sales culture.

Key Quotes:

John Lee: “Don’t hire someone who can’t show they’ve been successful—and don’t hire someone who doesn’t fit your culture.” (00:13:57)
Sean O’Shaughnessey: “A salesperson might not be able to sell your product to save their life—but they’re often great at selling themselves. That’s a trap for business owners.” (00:11:55)
Kevin Lawson: “You talk about hiring the way you talk about sales infrastructure—it’s all about process, fit, and purpose.” (00:07:42)

Additional Resources Mentioned:

OMG Sales Candidate Assessment (Objective Management Group) – John’s preferred tool for evaluating candidate sales DNA and fit.
LinkedIn: John Lee - https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnleeportlandoregon/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Design a Hiring Process Like a Sales Process Treat your hiring efforts with the same rigor as your sales process. Start by defining a psychographic profile based on your top performers. Use structured assessments to evaluate “sales DNA” and focus interviews on demonstrated success, not just confidence. Then, make cultural fit a deal-breaker. Great hires aren’t just competent—they’re aligned with your mission, methods, and team dynamics.

Summary Paragraph: This episode is essential listening for sales leaders and business owners looking to scale their teams without sacrificing culture, performance, or momentum. John Lee brings a rare mix of seasoned sales management expertise and real-world hiring acumen to the table. If you want to improve revenue generation through smarter hiring and better sales strategies, you'll find actionable insights packed into every minute. Don’t settle for average; build a sales team that drives success. Tune in now.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this powerful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey are joined once again by Steve Caton, CEO of Altezza Solutions, for a thought-provoking conversation that zeroes in on one of the toughest decisions in sales leadership: when to sell, when to coach, and when to hire. Whether you’re a business owner, VP of Sales, or a player-coach juggling a quota and a team, this episode brings clarity to the strategic inflection point where growth hinges on letting go. With frank discussion, lived experience, and tactical advice, Kevin, Sean, and Steve guide you through the complex terrain of sales management, revenue generation, and scaling your team without sacrificing results.

Key Topics Discussed:

[00:01:58] The pros and cons of player-coach sales roles, and why this model often fails without intentional strategy
[00:05:34] How to create a psychologically safe sales environment where learning from failure drives sales success
[00:07:11] Steve Caton’s personal transition from sales operator to CEO—and how it triggered exponential business growth
[00:09:20] The difference between hiring to "swim faster" and hiring to scale—how business acumen guides the decision
[00:13:00] Real-world use cases for fractional sales roles to test new markets or offerings without disrupting core revenue streams

Key Quotes:

Kevin Lawson [00:04:57]: “Sometimes you have to let people fail. You can’t push them into failure, but you do have to give them the room to learn. The challenge is, as a leader, you're still accountable for that failure.”
Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:04:01]: “It’s much easier to do one thing well. Let great salespeople sell and great managers manage—don’t dilute either role.”
Steve Caton [00:08:30]: “I made the decision to stop selling before I could afford it. Why? Because I knew the payoff would be big. Sometimes, you just have to invest in your business to grow.”
Kevin Lawson [00:11:34]: “A sales process with control metrics, plus intentional feedback loops, informs exactly how and where your business should grow.”

Additional Resources:

Steve Caton https://www.linkedin.com/in/scaton/
Altezza Solutions: www.atezzasolutions.com
Book Mentioned: Great by Choice by Jim Collins (for the “bullets before cannonballs” strategy) https://a.co/d/1j6R6vt

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Reevaluate your team structure and decide: are you scaling or surviving? If you're a business owner or sales leader wearing multiple hats, it's time to assess whether you're enabling growth or capping it. Consider where your time is most valuable—rainmaking, coaching, or closing—and invest in building the right team around you. Start with fractional or part-time hires to test new roles or markets, then double down when the data supports it.

Closing Summary:This episode cuts through the noise around sales team building with a refreshing mix of vulnerability, experience, and strategic depth. Whether you’re weighing your first sales hire or deciding to step out of the player-coach role, Two Tall Guys Talking Sales delivers real-world sales strategies that help you align your messaging, sales processes, and revenue management decisions with long-term growth. Don’t miss this one—it’s 15 minutes of business-building insight that could change the trajectory of your sales organization. Hit play now and discover how letting go might be the smartest way to grow.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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What does it take to scale a sales organization in today’s unpredictable business environment? In this dynamic episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson welcome back Steve Caton, CEO of Altezza Solutions, to unpack the nuances of scaling sales teams, especially through the power of fractional sales professionals. Together, they explore the critical role that sales processes, sales management, and business acumen play in enabling organizations to grow without overspending or compromising performance. Whether you’re navigating the "zero to one" phase or planning your expansion from one rep to five, this episode offers a roadmap for smart, sustainable revenue generation.

Key Topics Discussed * Zero to One vs. One to One Hundred: Two Models for Scaling Sales Teams (00:01:14) Kevin and Steve outline the difference between launching your first rep and accelerating team expansion, with a focus on structured growth. * Fractional Salespeople as a Low-Risk Growth Strategy (00:02:45) Steve explains how the fractional model supports learning, experimentation, and ROI without overcommitting resources too early. * Determining the Right Time to Expand Territories or Add Headcount (00:04:10) The team discusses key signals—like activity level, lead flow, and deal volume—that indicate when it’s time to grow. * Using Leading Indicators vs. Lagging Indicators in Sales Management (00:06:16) Steve shares the importance of measuring inputs (calls, meetings, proposals) over outputs (closed deals) to ensure predictable scale. * The Power of Process-Driven Selling for Sales Success (00:13:08) Sean and Steve emphasize why experienced sales pros rely on systems, not improvisation, and why process must precede people.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:01:34): “Think hockey stick versus gradual—zero to one is about getting that first good hire. That’s when you unlock real scale potential.”

Steve Caton (00:02:45): “Start small, see what works, then expand. That’s the foundation of scalable revenue—and the fractional model makes that possible without spending a crazy amount of money.”

Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:08:00): “Sales is about finding the customer that is going to buy—that’s not just a marketing thing, that’s a sales thing.”

Steve Caton (00:13:08): “Process comes before people. If there’s no process, your reps will build one—and that distracts them from actually selling.”

Additional Resources * Connect with Steve Caton on LinkedIn: (https://www.linkedin.com/in/scaton/) * Explore Altezza Solutions: www.altezzasolutions.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Use leading indicators—not just closed deals—to decide when it’s time to grow your sales team. Many companies scale reactively, hiring after success arrives. But Steve Caton challenges leaders to evaluate the activity level of their reps—calls made, meetings scheduled, deals created—to make data-driven decisions before hitting a bottleneck. If your top performer is maxing out their productive hours, it’s time to split territories, not overload. Review your leading indicators this week and see where your next growth step should begin.

Why You Should Listen This episode is a must-listen for founders, CEOs, and sales leaders trying to build smarter, not just bigger. With deep insight into the value of fractional sales professionals, the importance of sales strategies, and how to use data for effective revenue management, Steve Caton offers a practical, grounded view of what scalable sales success looks like. If you're serious about growing your team without growing your headaches, hit play and take notes.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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When it comes to holding firm on pricing, many salespeople stumble at the finish line, undermining their value and margin in pursuit of a quick win. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explore the essential topic of value selling, especially when offering a premium-priced solution. They break down how business acumen, sales strategy, and relationship-based selling contribute to sales success—and how to confidently command the price your product deserves. If you’ve ever been told you’re “too expensive,” this is your playbook for holding the line and still closing the deal.

Key Topics Discussed * Why customers buy more than just your product—they buy your company and you (00:01:00) * The danger of sending a quote without a conversation (00:02:21) * How sales reps can create momentum in late-stage deals by previewing terms early (00:03:00) * Breaking away from “feeds and speeds” and focusing on business outcomes (00:05:00) * Real-world coaching example: winning a deal despite being $9,000 more expensive (00:08:25) * The importance of sales process alignment with customer learning styles (00:10:48)

Key Quotes “Your customers are not just buying your product—they're buying your company, and they're buying the wisdom of the salesperson.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:00)

“Don’t just throw a document on their desk that says, ‘here’s my price.’ That’s not value selling. That’s transactional noise.” — Kevin Lawson (00:03:21)

“I told her: thank them for the feedback. Tell them you can’t meet the price because you’re delivering something of higher value—and she won the deal.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:09:01)

“If you’re always responding with a discount, you’re not putting forward the confidence that your product actually delivers value.” — Kevin Lawson (00:10:28)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Stop emailing quotes—start previewing them. Before sending out another proposal or quote, schedule a call or meeting with your prospect to review the terms and value proposition. Use that time to reinforce the business impact of your solution and clarify any remaining concerns. This approach increases close rates and reduces last-minute pricing objections, protecting revenue and margin.

Summary In today’s ultra-competitive B2B environment, salespeople must do more than deliver specs—they must deliver confidence. This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales arms you with a clear, repeatable strategy for commanding premium pricing through value selling. If you're serious about improving your sales management, sales processes, and revenue generation tactics, then this 15-minute episode could be the most profitable quarter-hour of your week. Tune in now and elevate your ability to win—without discounting.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this dynamic episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome Canadian SalesXceleration expert Steve Wittal for an in-depth look into the foundations of effective sales strategies. Steve brings decades of experience in startup advisory, sales management, and business growth, sharing a robust framework that simplifies complex growth challenges into four digestible buckets: desirability, clarity, predictability, and deliverability. If you’re a business leader looking to strengthen your sales processes, sharpen your messaging, or improve revenue generation, this conversation is a goldmine.

Key Topics Discussed

The Power of Leadership in Change Management (~01:02) Steve opens by explaining why leadership is the starting point for any growth initiative, especially when change is involved.
The Four Buckets Framework for Growth (~03:00) Steve outlines his method for diagnosing and resolving growth issues by focusing on four pillars: desirability, clarity, predictability, and deliverability.
Desirability and Understanding the Customer’s Pain (~04:00) Why identifying whether your product is a “must-have” or “nice-to-have” is critical to sales success.
The Importance of Clarity and Quantifying the Cost of Inaction (~06:39) Sean and Steve unpack how clarity in messaging and value proposition can move buyers from indecision to action.
Predictability, Scalability, and Sales Playbooks (~09:20) How aligning your sales process with the customer’s buying journey enables scale and drives predictable revenue.
Deliverability and the Voice of the Customer (~10:50) Steve emphasizes the importance of retention, early wins, and referrals as indicators that your solution truly delivers.

Key Quotes

Steve Wittal: “A problem well-defined is a problem half-solved. Before we prescribe, we have to truly understand.” (~02:46)
Kevin Lawson: “When you’ve dotted all those i’s, it makes you a market-facing product. That’s how you achieve market fit.” (~13:25)
Sean O'Shaughnessey: “When a customer comes to you and says, ‘Can you help me solve this?’ — that’s sales nirvana.” (~08:35)

Additional Resources

Connect with Steve Wittal on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevewittal/
Steve’s email: Steve Wittal

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit Your Sales Strategy Through the Four Buckets. Take a moment to evaluate your organization’s performance across Steve’s four key areas:

Desirability: Is your product essential or optional to your buyers?
Clarity: Can your team articulate your value proposition in a way that resonates with prospects and highlights the cost of inaction?
Predictability: Do you have a repeatable sales process that aligns with how your customers buy?
Deliverability: Are you consistently delivering on promises and capturing client feedback to validate success?

This self-assessment will uncover gaps in your current sales approach and point to immediate areas for improvement.

Summary

Whether you're leading a startup or managing a growing sales team, this episode delivers a concise yet powerful framework for achieving sales success. Steve Wittal’s “Four Buckets” offer practical, business acumen–driven insights that will help you reframe your growth strategy and improve every stage of your sales process. If you're serious about improving revenue generation and becoming a trusted advisor in your client relationships, don’t miss this episode. Tune in now and transform your approach to value selling.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey sit down with John Spencer, a seasoned sales leader and founder of Clear Direction Sales Development. Together, they explore the crucial differences between growth and scale, particularly in organizations leaning too heavily on a superstar seller. If you're leading a sales organization that relies on one standout performer—or trying to replicate success across your sales team—this is a must-listen conversation packed with real-world examples and hard-earned wisdom. The trio unpacks why scalable sales processes and strong business acumen matter far more than a single heroic quota-crusher and how to transform your entire team into a consistent revenue-generation engine.

Key Topics Discussed * [00:01:20] The difference between growth and scale—and why one without the other creates risk * [00:02:30] How over-reliance on a “super seller” can mask weak sales infrastructure * [00:04:00] Why building a team of B players can be the key to sales success and organizational growth * [00:06:00] Why your people strategy outweighs even the best sales tech or product * [00:09:00] How aligning your company around Ideal Customer Profiles (ICPs) and value selling accelerates performance * [00:11:00] Inspiring second-tier sellers to level up—and the systems that make that possible

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson [00:00:00]: “What do you do when you’ve got a standout salesperson and you’re trying to scale? Today’s the day to take notes and learn from best practices—and avoid the ones that put you in a bind.”

John Spencer [00:01:50]: “Growth is often just out-hustling the competition. Scale is when your sales management creates repeatable success across the team.”

Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:04:00]: “You can’t build a company on nothing but A players. You need B players who can perform with strong sales processes—that’s how you truly scale.”

John Spencer [00:07:24]: “When one salesperson becomes the center of gravity, the whole company starts working for them. That doesn’t scale.”

John Spencer [00:10:08]: “Let’s align the organization to help the salesperson like they’re a mini-CEO. That’s how we build momentum and create sustainable revenue management.”

Additional Resources * Connect with John Spencer: LinkedIn Profile – John Spencer (https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnspencerinc/) * Company: Clear Direction Sales Development * Contact: Direct phone, email, and Calendly available on John’s LinkedIn

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Stop idolizing your top seller—start systematizing their success. Identify what makes your A player successful, then document and distribute that knowledge across your sales organization. Build a repeatable process that supports B players in becoming high performers. Use Ideal Customer Profiles (ICPs), clear value propositions, and structured onboarding to reduce variance and elevate the middle 60% of your team.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode If your company is stuck in a “hero model” of selling—where success depends on a single superstar—this episode will open your eyes to what’s truly holding your sales strategy back. With practical insights on aligning your team, refining your messaging, and unlocking scalable revenue generation, John Spencer joins Kevin and Sean in a candid conversation that blends military-grade leadership with sales precision. Whether you're a CEO, VP of Sales, or just trying to level up your sales team, this episode is your blueprint for transitioning from hustle-based growth to process-driven scale. Don’t miss it—press play and rethink what it means to grow.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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As Q2 kicks into full gear, it's time to pause and reflect—are you ahead, on pace, or falling behind on your sales targets? In this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey unpack one of a sales leader's most crucial yet often overlooked responsibilities: knowing your numbers. With equal parts practical advice and strategic vision, this conversation walks you through the foundational metrics every sales leader should track—customer acquisition cost, average transaction size, support staffing ratios, and more. Whether you're forecasting growth, scaling headcount, or simply trying to stay ahead of the competition, this episode is your playbook for building a metrics-driven sales organization that thrives.

Key Topics Discussed * Why "Keeping Score" Matters in Sales Leadership (00:00) Kevin kicks off the episode with a strong analogy to competitive sports, emphasizing that tracking performance metrics is non-negotiable for sales leaders aiming to grow. * Building a Forward-Looking Sales Metrics Matrix (00:01) Kevin walks through how to build a simple but powerful matrix using transaction volume, average deal size, and headcount to visualize both current performance and future goals. * Calculating Average Transaction Size and Quota Coverage (00:02) Learn how to reverse-engineer quota achievement by dividing sales goals by average transaction size to determine activity targets for your team. * Understanding Customer Acquisition Cost (CAC) (00:05) Sean breaks down the components of CAC and explains why every sales leader must know this figure to scale sustainably and profitably. * Debunking the “Geopolitics Are Killing Sales” Excuse (00:09) Sean challenges the notion that global events are valid reasons for missed quotas, reinforcing that internal execution and strategic clarity are what really matter. * Aligning Sales Activity with Strategic Growth Goals (00:12) Kevin closes the episode with a systems-thinking approach to leadership, showing how small adjustments in metrics, team development, and compensation can drive exponential growth.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson: "Keeping score is important. Really important. I'm talking like March Madness. Final game. Important." (00:00)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: "If it takes you more than 20 minutes to figure out this information, then you need a better bookkeeping system." (00:06)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: "You need to know what your average deal size is. You need to know how long it takes you to get a customer. Your CRM should be solving that." (00:07)

Kevin Lawson: "We want to gently steer our company towards our goals. So the thinking about this process is all about knowing your numbers." (00:12)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Build Your Sales Metrics Matrix This Week Start with your annual revenue goal. Break it down by the number of salespeople, average transaction value, and number of transactions needed per rep per month. Then layer in your customer acquisition cost, support staffing ratios, and expected margin. This matrix becomes your roadmap for scaling intelligently—whether you're doubling headcount, expanding territory, or just trying to hit a consistent quota.

Episode Summary In a world of uncertainty, Two Tall Guys Talking Sales reminds us that clarity comes from data. Kevin and Sean deliver a compelling, no-nonsense discussion about how to take control of your revenue engine by genuinely understanding the math behind your sales motion. Whether you’re a CEO, VP of Sales, or just starting to lead a team, this episode offers an essential primer on aligning your operations to your goals. Don’t miss this one—it might be the wake-up call your spreadsheet has been waiting for.

👉 Hit play now to future-proof your sales strategy by learning how to know your numbers like a pro.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey welcome business intermediary Tom Gottlieb of Berkshire Hathaway. Tom brings decades of experience in buying, selling, and valuing businesses across the Midwest. The conversation dives deep into what truly drives the value of a company—and how sales leaders and business owners alike can prepare their organizations for a future transition. Whether you’re a business owner considering a sale or a sales executive interested in how sales performance impacts company valuation, this episode delivers invaluable guidance. It’s part education, part strategy session, and all high-value insight.

Key Topics Discussed * The Three Core Approaches to Business Valuation – Asset, income, and comparative market methods explained simply and practically. (04:22) * Preparing a Business for Sale: Lessons from Real Estate – Why “curb appeal” matters for companies and how to improve it over time. (07:36) * What Buyers Want: Sales Growth, Consistency, and Processes – How prospective buyers assess the health of a business beyond profit margins. (09:00) * The Hidden Red Flag: When the Owner Is the Only Salesperson – Risks for buyers and strategies for mitigating dependency on the founder. (13:31) * Leveraging AI to Gain Competitive Market Intelligence – How technology is transforming buyer and seller knowledge in M&A. (11:32)

Key Quotes Tom Gottlieb: “Every buyer wants the same thing: a business that works without the owner. That means strong processes, steady sales growth, and predictable profitability.” (09:01) Sean O’Shaughnessey: “So if you don’t want to stick around after the sale, then train your sales team now—and watch the value of your company go up.” (14:16) Kevin Lawson: “Tom, every time we talk, I walk away with something new. This episode is no exception.” (11:31) Tom Gottlieb: “Buyers rarely show up with a bag of cash. There’s a timeline. A deal doesn’t close in a weekend—it’s often a year-long journey.” (07:00)

Additional Resources * Connect with Tom Gottlieb on LinkedIn * Tom’s Email: tgottlieb@bhhspro.com * Direct Contact: (562) 225-4567 * Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices Professional Realty – Business Brokerage Services

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Start documenting your sales process today. If you are a business owner—or advise one—and the majority of revenue hinges on a single salesperson (often the owner themselves), that’s a red flag for any future buyer. Begin formalizing your sales process, distribute responsibilities among team members, and track sales metrics consistently. This not only improves operational resilience but significantly enhances company value in a potential sale.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode Selling a business isn’t just about profit—it’s about perception, process, and preparedness. In this episode, Kevin and Sean extract wisdom from Tom Gottlieb that applies to any B2B organization considering an exit in the next 3 to 10 years. It’s packed with strategic takeaways, sales insights, and behind-the-scenes truths about what makes a business attractive to buyers. Whether you're a founder, an investor, or a sales leader, this episode will reshape how you think about long-term value creation. Tune in and learn how to make your business sell-ready—starting now.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Welcome back to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey. In this episode, the tall guys dive deep into one of the most critical yet commonly broken elements in any sales organization: the sales funnel. Whether you're stuck with a clunky three-stage process that tells you nothing or overwhelmed with 35 micro-stages that only confuse your reps, Sean and Kevin offer a practical guide to rethinking and rebuilding your pipeline strategy. Packed with metaphors (yes, even superhero ones) and sharp analysis, this episode will leave you inspired to take a hard look at your funnel—and finally fix it.

Key Topics Discussed

Why Most Sales Funnels Are Broken (00:00:45) Sean unpacks the common pitfalls in how companies define and manage their sales stages, including oversimplified or overly complex CRM setups.
Defining Sales Stages Based on the Buyer Journey (00:04:30) Kevin emphasizes the need to align your sales stages with how buyers actually buy—not how your company wants to sell.
How Many Sales Stages Are Too Many? (00:05:00) The guys explore the delicate balance between not enough insight and too much complexity in stage design.
The Case for Multiple Pipelines (00:08:00) When does it make sense to separate budgetary planning pipelines from active sales discussions? Kevin and Sean explain.
What a Healthy Funnel Actually Looks Like (00:10:45) Sean introduces a visual and mathematical approach to evaluating whether your funnel is properly shaped—and what to do if it’s not.

Key Quotes

“The Avengers became a team, not just Iron Man. You need to have a team. Even superhero salespeople like to have support.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:02:50)

“Fixing the funnel starts visually. Does it fit well on one sheet of paper? If not, you’ve already lost the battle for clarity.” — Kevin Lawson (00:04:45)

“Stages should be built to qualify someone into the next step—not just to log an activity. Every transition should represent progress, not busyness.” — Kevin Lawson (00:06:15)

“If your pipeline doesn’t look like a funnel, then you’re either wasting time or losing deals. Probably both.” — Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:12:20)

Additional Resources Referenced * Previous episodes featuring CMO Amy: Deep dives into top-of-funnel strategies, lead quality, and the marketing–sales handoff. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/measuring-marketing-success-with-amy-connor-of-cmo-onloan https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/amy-connor-discusses-salespeople-vs-lead-generation-are-you-using-your-team-wisely * "Chasing Butterflies vs. Building a Garden" episode: A useful metaphorical framework for thinking about inbound sales strategies. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/sales-prospecting-are-you-chasing-leads-or-cultivating-success

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit Your Sales Funnel for Shape and Stage Effectiveness Pull a report from your CRM and visualize your current pipeline by number of deals and total revenue per stage. Does it actually look like a funnel? If it doesn’t, dig deeper. Are your stages aligned with your buyer’s journey? Are reps stuck in certain stages too long? UThis snapshot identifiesgaps and opportunities for stage redefinition or activity refinement.

Summary Whether you’re managing a sales team or closing deals yourself, this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales gives you the blueprint to diagnose and repair a misaligned funnel. Sean and Kevin combine humor, hard truths, and highly actionable insights to help you bring structure and sanity back to your sales process. If you're ready to create a pipeline that reflects how buyers buy—and helps your team win more deals—this episode is a must-listen.

🎧 Listen now and take the first step in fixing your funnel for good.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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As the first quarter comes to a close, sales leaders and professionals must assess their performance and gear up for the challenges and opportunities ahead in Q2. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey break down the essential strategies for both those ahead of plan and those struggling to catch up. From refining your sales process to maximizing customer relationships, this discussion is packed with insights that can help you dominate your numbers in the coming months.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Reality of Q1 Performance and the Need for Urgency (00:00:31) + Why waiting until Q2 to fix Q1 is too late, and how to position yourself for success early in the year.

Strategies for Those Ahead of Plan (00:01:00)
How to maintain momentum, close key deals, and ensure a strong Q4 while staying ahead of quota.
Critical Steps for Those Behind on Quota (00:04:01)
Conducting a win-loss analysis, diagnosing deal flow issues, and fine-tuning lead generation strategies.
The Importance of CRM Usage and Sales Efficiency (00:06:35)
How sales leaders and reps can maximize their CRM to drive efficiency and uncover missed opportunities.
Pricing Strategies and Customer Engagement (00:09:13)
Why now is the time to strengthen relationships with your top customers and confidently raise prices to improve margins.

Key Quotes: * Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:32): “You have a chance at greatness if you are even or ahead at the end of Q1. Now’s the time to double down and make sure you close deals that will set you up for an incredible year.” * Kevin Lawson (00:05:00): “Everyone has a leads problem. Either you don’t have enough, they’re not the right fit, or you’re not communicating your value effectively. That’s where the real focus should be.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:11:00): “Your best customers likely don’t know you as well as you think. Strengthening those relationships can open up new revenue streams and prevent you from falling behind.”

Additional Resources: * Free sales planning tools, lead scoring resources, and ideal client profiles available on Kevin and Sean’s websites. https://newsales.expert/ https://www.lighthousesalesadvisors.com/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Perform a rapid win-loss analysis on your Q1 deals. If you’re ahead, identify the behaviors and strategies that got you there and double down. If you’re behind, determine whether the issue is a lack of quality leads, poor messaging, or weak follow-through. Adjust your sales approach immediately so you can enter Q2 with a clear plan to recover lost ground.

Summary: Whether you’re ahead of plan, right on track, or scrambling to catch up, the strategies discussed in this episode will help you refine your sales process and make Q2 a success. Sean and Kevin share actionable insights on deal flow, CRM optimization, pricing strategies, and customer engagement that will set you up for a strong year. Don’t let another quarter slip away—tune in now to get ahead, stay ahead, and finish the year on top!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

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As a sales leader, are you coaching your team for the long haul, or are you scrambling in the final weeks of the quarter? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey break down the difference between regular season and postseason play—whether in sports or sales. They explore why last-minute Hail Mary strategies can be damaging, how to manage time, and the importance of consistent coaching effectively. With March Madness and The Masters as the backdrop, this conversation is packed with insights to help you refine your sales approach and ensure your team is always in winning form.

Key Topics Discussed * The Sales Tournament Mentality (00:02:00) – What sales teams can learn from March Madness and The Masters, and why only one team wins while the rest lose. * Building a Winning Sales Team (00:03:30) – How business owners can prepare their sales teams to perform under pressure by ensuring the right people are in the right seats. * The Role of Sales Coaching (00:05:00) – Why sales leaders must incorporate skills development into every sales meeting instead of just reviewing the pipeline. * The Pitfalls of End-of-Quarter Desperation (00:07:50) – How last-minute discounting and rushed deals create long-term problems and train customers to buy at a discount. * Mastering Time Management in Sales (00:10:00) – How prioritization and disciplined execution throughout the quarter prevent last-minute chaos and boost consistent performance.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (00:07:53): “If you’re behind in sales right now, don’t throw Hail Marys. Don’t discount. You’re teaching your prospects to wait until the end of the quarter for a better deal—and that’s a losing game.” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:13:00): “You have one thing in sales you can never get back: time. If you wasted today, it’s gone forever. You can’t go back and fix it.” * Kevin Lawson (00:09:00): “Salespeople with commission breath stink. If your only focus is closing the deal before Friday, your prospects will smell it a mile away—and that’s not how you build relationships.”

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Develop a Five-Week Sales Training Plan – Sales leaders should map out the next five sales meetings, dedicating at least five minutes to skills development in each session. Focus on topics such as pipeline progression, prospect qualification, and closing techniques. Training should not be an afterthought—it should be a fundamental part of your sales strategy.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode Whether you’re a sales leader or a frontline salesperson, this episode is your playbook for maintaining momentum all year long. Avoid the common traps of end-of-quarter desperation, build a disciplined approach to sales training, and master the art of time management. Just like in sports, sales success isn’t about last-minute heroics—it’s about consistent execution. Tune in now and take your sales game to the next level!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the art of sales prospecting using an unusual but powerful analogy—chasing butterflies versus building a garden. Are you tirelessly running after leads, or are you cultivating an environment where ideal prospects naturally come to you? Learn how to create a long-term strategy for consistent revenue growth by positioning your business as the go-to solution for your ideal customers.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Butterfly Effect in Sales (00:01:00) – The difference between chasing every lead and strategically attracting the right ones. * Building a Sales Garden (00:02:49) – How to develop a long-term strategy that consistently nurtures and attracts the best-fit prospects. * Marketing & Content Strategy Alignment (00:04:22) – The importance of collaborating with marketing to ensure the right messaging is in place. * The Value of Inbound Leads (00:06:11) – Why leads that come through your marketing efforts are often easier to close and more profitable. * Tactical Steps for Sales Leaders (00:08:00) – Actionable insights for sales managers to help their teams attract, engage, and convert better. * Crafting a Strong Value Proposition (00:10:18) – The foundation of effective lead generation and how to align it with your ideal customer profile.

Key Quotes: * Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:52): “If you’re hungry for revenue, you’re probably running around chasing butterflies. But if you want sustainable growth, you need to create an environment where prospects naturally come to you.” * Kevin Lawson (00:03:55): “Sales leaders, think about your team—have you equipped them with butterfly nets, or have you taught them how to build a garden?” * Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:06:44): “The best prospects aren’t the ones you chase—they’re the ones who find their way to your garden because you’ve built something valuable for them.”

Additional Resources: * Previous episodes featuring Amy Connor on inbound marketing and lead generation. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/amy-connor-discusses-salespeople-vs-lead-generation/id1668686029?i=1000693738159 https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/measuring-marketing-success-with-amy-connor-of-cmo-onloan/id1668686029?i=1000696058066 * Value Proposition Workshop with Sean and Kevin. Learn how to refine your messaging to attract the right clients. Reach out to Kevin or Sean at the contact information below.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: If you’re relying solely on outbound prospecting, start evaluating your value proposition and content strategy today. Align your marketing and sales teams to ensure your messaging is clear, consistent, and tailored to your ideal buyer. Identify gaps in your digital presence and take the first step toward creating a sales garden that nurtures and attracts the right leads.

Final Thoughts: Sales is more than just chasing down deals—it’s creating an ecosystem where prospects feel drawn to your expertise, insights, and solutions. In this episode, Sean and Kevin explain shifting from frantic outbound prospecting to a methodical approach that fosters sustainable revenue growth. Whether you’re a sales leader or an individual contributor, you’ll walk away with practical steps to build your own high-converting sales garden.

Tune in now and take your sales strategy to the next level!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment:

https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

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Welcome back to another episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey! This week, we’re diving deep into the essential topic of measuring marketing effectiveness with special guest Amy Connor, founder of CMO OnLoan. This episode is for you if you’ve ever struggled to connect marketing strategies to real business results. Grab your marketing colleague and tune in—because understanding what’s working (and what’s not) in your marketing is the key to driving sales growth.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Importance of Measuring Marketing Performance (01:08) Many companies don’t track their marketing impact effectively. Amy shares how focusing on key metrics—without overwhelming dashboards—can create a direct path to success. * Sales and Marketing Must Be Aligned (02:09) Customers don’t see marketing and sales as separate—they see one company. Amy explains why integrating both functions is crucial for a seamless customer journey. * Why Vanity Metrics Don’t Matter (02:55) Impressions, clicks, and leads may look impressive, but if they don’t translate to business results, they don’t matter. Learn how to focus on meaningful data that connects to revenue. * The Billboard Advertising Myth (03:12) Can a billboard drive B2B sales? Amy and Sean discuss the realities of traditional advertising and why small businesses should think critically about marketing spend. * Aligning Sales Messaging with Marketing Content (05:57) Sales teams shouldn’t be the only ones communicating key messages. Amy shares why marketing content must reinforce what salespeople say to build trust and shorten sales cycles. * Tactical vs. Strategic Marketing – What’s the Right Balance? (08:29) Should your marketing focus on brand awareness or immediate sales action? Amy explains the difference and how to measure each effectively.

Key Quotes: Amy Connor: “Marketing and sales are part of the customer's journey in a united way. The customer doesn’t see ‘marketing did this and sales did that’—they see the company as a whole.” (01:45)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: “Salespeople start at a disadvantage because buyers inherently don’t trust them. That’s why marketing must reinforce their message to build credibility.” (05:40)

Kevin Lawson: “Up to 70% of the buyer’s journey happens before they talk to sales. If marketing isn’t working ahead of time, you’re already losing.” (07:52)

Additional Resources: * Visit CMO OnLoan for free marketing resources: www.cmo-onloan.com * Connect with Amy Connor on LinkedIn: Amy Connor LinkedIn * Listen to the first episode featuring Amy: Last Week’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/amy-connor-discusses-salespeople-vs-lead-generation/id1668686029?i=1000693738159

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Audit Your Marketing Metrics Take 30 minutes this week to assess what marketing data your company is tracking. Are you focusing on impressions and clicks or lead conversion and revenue impact? Identify one metric that directly connects marketing activity to business growth and make it your priority.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode

Marketing is more than just branding—it’s a revenue-driving function. In this conversation, Amy Connor unpacks how B2B companies can measure what truly matters, align sales and marketing, and ensure every dollar spent on marketing contributes to the bottom line. If you want your marketing efforts to drive real sales results, don’t miss this insightful discussion. Tune in now!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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How do you measure the success of your sales and marketing efforts? If you’ve ever found yourself wondering whether your marketing dollars are actually driving revenue or if your sales team is making the most of their leads, this episode is for you.

Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey sit down with Amy Connor, founder of CMO on Loan, to discuss how marketing and sales should work together for growth. Amy brings her extensive experience from Procter & Gamble, Luxottica, and other top brands to help mid-market companies build marketing confidence, align with sales, and drive measurable results.

Key Topics Discussed * The Basketball Analogy: Why Tracking Performance Matters (~00:01:00) + Just like basketball teams analyze stats post-game, businesses need to measure marketing and sales effectiveness.

How to Decide Between Investing in Sales or Marketing (~00:04:30)
Business owners often wonder whether they should put more resources into sales teams or marketing initiatives—Amy breaks it down.
Aligning Marketing and Sales for Lead Generation (~00:07:30)
Should salespeople generate their own leads, or is there a more efficient way to bring prospects to the table?
The Role of a Fractional CMO: How Businesses Can Engage Marketing Leadership (~00:11:20)
Amy explains how a fractional CMO helps companies make smarter marketing decisions without the full-time executive cost.
A Sneak Peek into Next Week: Measuring Marketing Effectiveness (~00:13:52)
Tune in next week as Amy shares the tools and strategies that help businesses track what’s working and what’s not.

Key Quotes * Sean O’Shaughnessey (~00:06:41): “So many of my clients assume that salespeople will find their own leads, but is that really the best use of their time?” * Amy Connor (~00:07:51): “Your sales team is often being asked to do too much. Something will suffer if they have to hunt for leads and nurture accounts at the same time.” * Kevin Lawson (~00:11:00): “When companies say, ‘I need more sales,’ what they often mean is, ‘I need more leads.’ But are they solving the right problem?”

Additional Resources * Learn more about CMO on Loan and how they help businesses improve marketing effectiveness: www.cmoonloan.com * Connect with Amy Connor on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amyconnor/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Evaluate your marketing and sales alignment. Take a step back and ask:

Do I have a clear process for tracking where leads come from and how they convert?
Is my sales team spending too much time prospecting instead of closing deals?
Would marketing support help my business generate higher-quality leads?

If you’re not sure, it may be time to review your funnel and define a strategy that ensures sales and marketing work together—not in silos.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode This episode is a must-listen for business owners, sales leaders, and marketing professionals looking to make smarter investments in growth. Amy Connor shares real-world insights on how marketing can drive measurable business results and how sales and marketing can function as a united force. Plus, next week’s episode will dive even deeper into how to measure marketing effectiveness, so don’t miss it!

🎧 Download now and take the first step toward a more effective marketing and sales strategy!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Artificial intelligence (AI) is transforming the sales industry, but does that mean salespeople are becoming obsolete? Absolutely not! In this high-energy episode, Kevin and Sean debunk the myth that AI will replace sales professionals. Instead, they reveal how AI can be a game-changing tool for sales success.

From using AI to refine communication to automating time-consuming tasks, this episode is packed with insights on how AI can help sales leaders and reps work smarter, sell better, and stay ahead of the competition. Tune in to discover practical ways to leverage AI, improve efficiency, and dominate your market.

Key Topics Discussed 🔹 Will AI Replace Salespeople? – The truth about AI’s role in sales and why your job isn’t at risk—but your quota might be. (00:00:45)

🔹 The Evolution of Sales Tools – A nostalgic (and hilarious) look at how tools have always changed work processes—remember manual garage doors and TV dials? (00:02:21)

🔹 AI for Writing & Communication – How tools like Grammarly can make your emails, proposals, and presentations sharper, clearer, and more professional. (00:04:00)

🔹 Boosting Productivity with AI – From auto-generating customized sales presentations to intelligent scheduling, AI can free up time for what matters most: selling. (00:06:01)

🔹 The AI-Powered CRM – If your CRM doesn’t have AI integration or a plan for it, it’s time to rethink your strategy. A modern CRM is essential for competitive sales teams. (00:12:00)

Key Quotes 🗣️ Sean O’Shaughnessey: “You are not going to be replaced by AI. You’re going to be replaced by a salesperson using AI.” (00:01:00)

🗣️ Kevin Lawson: “AI isn’t here to take your job—it’s here to make you a better salesperson. Weaponize your tools and sharpen your axe.” (00:07:33)

🗣️ Sean O’Shaughnessey: “Being afraid of AI is like being afraid of Microsoft Word instead of a typewriter.” (00:10:18)

Additional Resources 🔗 Grammarly – AI-powered writing assistant for better emails, proposals, and reports.

🔗 Canva – AI-enhanced design tool for creating presentations and marketing materials in seconds.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast 🚀 Start Using AI Today! Don’t wait—integrate AI into your daily sales routine now. Whether it’s improving your writing with Grammarly, using AI for scheduling, or leveraging AI-powered CRM features, pick one AI tool and start experimenting. The sooner you adopt AI, the further ahead you’ll be.

Final Thoughts AI isn’t a threat—it’s an opportunity. The best salespeople will be the ones who embrace AI to work smarter, sell more efficiently, and build stronger customer relationships. Want to future-proof your sales career? It starts here.

👉 Hit play now and learn how AI can be your competitive advantage in sales!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Time is the most valuable resource for any professional, but for sales managers, it is the linchpin of success. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the critical strategies for effective time management as a sales leader. Whether you’re a new sales manager, an aspiring leader, or a business owner overseeing a sales team, this discussion is packed with insights to help you optimize your calendar, empower your team, and drive performance without falling into the trap of micromanagement.

Key Topics Discussed * The Shift from Salesperson to Sales Manager (00:03:00) Understanding the common pitfalls new sales managers face when transitioning from an individual contributor to a leadership role. * The Role of a Sales Manager: Player vs. Coach (00:04:00) Why sales managers must avoid the “player-coach” mindset and instead focus on leading, mentoring, and enabling their team’s success. * Structuring Your Calendar for Maximum Impact (00:05:45) How to design your weekly schedule to balance coaching, strategy, internal meetings, and team availability while avoiding distractions. * The Power of Shared Calendars and CRMs (00:07:00) Best practices for leveraging shared calendars and CRM tools to improve communication, transparency, and sales efficiency. * Why Sales Managers Should Be Like Basketball Coaches (00:13:30) The importance of stepping back and allowing sales reps to take the lead in deals—coaching them rather than closing for them.

Key Quotes 🗣 Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:02:55): "When you are a sales manager, your job is to make others better. You shouldn't be stealing deals from your sales reps—you should be empowering them to succeed."

🗣 Kevin Lawson (00:04:00): "A player is different from being a coach. Players take direction, coaches give direction. If you’re leading a team, you need to be coaching, not competing."

🗣 Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:14:00): "Watch a basketball game and look at the coach. How many times do they step onto the court to take a free throw for their players? Never. That’s how sales management should work too."

Additional Resources * 📘 The One Minute Manager by Ken Blanchard & Spencer Johnson – A classic guide to leadership and effective management. * 📅 Book Time with Kevin or Sean – Need help refining your sales management strategy? Schedule a consultation (link below in show notes).

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Audit Your Calendar and Block Time for Success Sales managers must structure their schedules intentionally. Take 30 minutes to review your calendar for the upcoming week: ✅ Block out time for coaching your team. ✅ Set aside dedicated slots for strategy and internal meetings. ✅ Ensure your calendar is updated and visible for your team. ✅ Reserve time for proactive sales engagement, like voice-of-the-customer calls.

Making these adjustments will free you from constant firefighting and allow you to lead effectively.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode If you’re a sales manager—or aspiring to be one—this episode is a must-listen. Kevin and Sean deliver practical, real-world strategies to help you break free from micromanagement, structure your time effectively, and lead your team to success. Stop getting caught up in the weeds and start managing like a pro. Listen now and take control of your sales leadership journey!

🎧 Hit play and start optimizing your sales management strategy today! 🚀

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/

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Sales is a game of ups and downs, but what separates top performers from the rest is their ability to keep the funnel full—even when they're closing deals. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the art and science of building a consistent pipeline. They discuss strategic approaches to prospecting, leveraging data tools, and the importance of curiosity in sales conversations. Whether you’re starting fresh in Q1 or looking to level up your approach, this episode is packed with actionable insights to keep your sales engine running smoothly.

Key Topics Discussed 🔹 The Sales Roller Coaster – Why salespeople experience cycles of high revenue followed by dry spells and how to smooth out the dips. (00:01:15)

🔹 The First Step: Re-engage Past Clients – Why checking in with existing customers is the easiest way to generate immediate opportunities. (00:02:23)

🔹 Using Free Data Resources to Prospect – How Data Axle and Apollo.io can help salespeople generate lists of high-potential prospects at no cost. (00:03:00)

🔹 Turning Leads Into Prospects – The difference between having a database of names and actually engaging with real sales opportunities. (00:05:31)

🔹 The Power of Networking and Curiosity – How to leverage your network to gain insights about a company before reaching out to decision-makers. (00:10:39)

🔹 Climbing the Ladder to the Decision-Maker – Why you shouldn’t start at the top and how building relationships within an organization can earn you a trusted introduction. (00:14:37)

Key Quotes 💬 Sean O’Shaughnessey on avoiding the sales roller coaster: "If I go back to my drain-the-swamp analogy, you gotta put water back in the swamp, you gotta let it rain, gotta make it rain." (00:02:02)

💬 Kevin Lawson on the importance of planning: "Too often, salespeople stop after the second or third introduction. Timing is everything—keep going, keep networking, and keep qualifying your ideal client profile." (00:12:39)

💬 Sean O’Shaughnessey on reaching executives: "You cannot send an email to the CEO and expect it to be read. You are just a salesperson. If you want to sell to the top, you need a referral—and probably from someone lower in the organization." (00:14:37)

Additional Resources 📌 Data Axle – A powerful business database often available through public libraries. Check with your local library for free access.

📌 Apollo.io – A free tool offering up to 10,000 business contacts per month to help with prospecting.

📌 Lighthouse Sales Advisors Coaching – Kevin Lawson offers 1:1 coaching to help sales professionals refine their strategies. Learn more here.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Take 30 minutes this week to evaluate your sales pipeline using the “circle exercise.”

Draw a circle and estimate what percentage of your revenue will come from existing clients vs. new clients.
Identify how many new deals you need to hit your quota.
Rank your existing leads based on fit and potential.
Develop a networking plan to move from a name on a list to an engaged prospect.

Doing this exercise will give you clarity on where to focus your efforts and how to strategically fill your pipeline.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode Struggling with an empty pipeline after closing strong last year? You’re not alone. In this fast-paced, insight-packed episode, Kevin and Sean break down the fundamental strategies that separate high-performing salespeople from those stuck on the revenue roller coaster. Whether you’re looking for free prospecting tools, better ways to approach networking, or a foolproof plan to keep your sales funnel full, this episode delivers practical tactics you can apply immediately.

🎧 Tune in now and take control of your sales pipeline!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the art of active listening and its transformative potential in sales. Building on the discussion from last week’s episode about discovery questions, Kevin and Sean provide actionable strategies to improve your listening skills, enhance your client interactions, and ultimately close more deals. Whether you’re a seasoned sales professional or new to the field, this episode is packed with valuable lessons you can apply immediately.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Role of Active Listening in Sales Success Kevin and Sean discuss how active listening differentiates successful salespeople from the rest and why it’s critical for uncovering client pain points. 2. The Power of Note-Taking Kevin shares his transition from paper to digital note-taking and how capturing accurate information leads to better follow-ups and stronger client relationships. 3. Body Language and Visual Cues in Client Meetings Sean emphasizes the importance of leaning forward, maintaining eye contact, and using other non-verbal cues to demonstrate engagement during conversations. 4. Learning from Reporters: Listening Like a Pro Sean compares salespeople to seasoned reporters and outlines how active listening and asking thoughtful follow-up questions can set the stage for impactful discussions. 5. Upskilling Through Active Listening Kevin highlights how organizations can improve their pipeline and closing rates by investing in training that focuses on active listening and effective questioning techniques.

Key Quotes * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “Don’t ever book a meeting without educating the client or making them a better business. That’s the only reason you’re allowed in their office.” (Approx. 8:00) * Kevin Lawson: “Active listening is your skeleton key to unlock doors that were previously closed. It’s the gateway to uncovering real pain points and creating meaningful solutions.” (Approx. 13:15) * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “Leaning forward in your chair isn’t just about posture; it’s a powerful signal to your client that you’re fully engaged and ready to understand their needs.” (Approx. 10:00)

Additional Resources * Sean and Kevin refer to the previous episode on discovery questions as a foundation for this discussion. If you haven’t listened to it, consider downloading it for additional context.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Apply Active Listening in Your Next Sales Call In your next client interaction, focus on active listening by using these three steps:

Lean forward and maintain engaged body language.
Paraphrase the client’s statements to ensure understanding.
Take detailed notes and review them to tailor your follow-up responses.

These small adjustments can make a significant difference in the quality of your client conversations and help you close more deals.

Summary Paragraph: Active listening isn’t just a soft skill; it’s a sales superpower. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin and Sean unravel the nuances of listening to clients, capturing their pain points, and building trust through meaningful interactions. With tips ranging from non-verbal cues to the tactical use of note-taking, this conversation equips you with tools to elevate your sales game. Whether you're preparing for a discovery call, a QBR, or a cold call, this episode is a must-listen for actionable insights. Tune in and transform the way you engage with your clients.

Happy listening—and selling!

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey tackle one of the most critical yet underestimated aspects of sales: the discovery call. Are you guilty of “winging it” during these pivotal conversations? Tune in as Kevin and Sean break down the importance of crafting a tailored question bank, share actionable tips to elevate your discovery process, and reveal how asking the right questions can transform your sales game. If you're looking to close more deals and gain the respect of your prospects, this is the episode for you.

Key Topics Discussed * The Danger of Winging It in Discovery Calls (Approx. 00:00:00) Kevin and Sean explain why improvising during discovery calls can lead to missed opportunities and how a question bank can save the day. * Building an Effective Question Bank (Approx. 00:01:00) Learn how to create a dynamic set of questions tailored to different industries and titles, ensuring every prospect feels understood. * The Power of Open-Ended Questions (Approx. 00:05:00) Discover why “what” and “how” questions are more effective than “why” questions in fostering productive, trust-building conversations. * The ROI of Better Discovery Questions (Approx. 00:07:00) Explore how better discovery leads to more accurate forecasts, stronger relationships, and increased respect from prospects. * Refining Your Question Bank Over Time (Approx. 00:12:00) Kevin and Sean emphasize the importance of regularly reviewing and updating your questions to stay relevant and effective.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: “You should never ask a question on a discovery call that you could find the answer to with public information. That’s a waste of your prospect’s time and shows you haven’t earned their business.” (Approx. 00:10:27) * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “Why questions feel like interrogation. Great discovery questions start with what and how—they build trust and uncover real insights.” (Approx. 00:06:25) * Kevin Lawson: “Writing down your questions allows you to tweak, hone, and refine them. It’s the preparation that separates good sellers from great ones.” (Approx. 00:09:05)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Start Your Own Question Bank Today Set aside 30 minutes to brainstorm 10-15 open-ended questions for your next discovery call. Categorize them by industry and prospect title. Use these questions in your next call, then evaluate their effectiveness. Adjust and refine over time to create a winning formula.

Summary Paragraph Mastering the discovery call is essential for any successful salesperson, and in this episode, Kevin and Sean provide the ultimate guide to getting it right. From crafting a versatile question bank to leveraging open-ended questions that build trust and uncover insights, this episode is packed with actionable advice to transform your sales process. Don’t miss this opportunity to elevate your skills and close more deals—listen now and discover the art of the perfect discovery call!

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Cold calling is dead—or so claims our guest, Ben Victorica, in this thought-provoking Two Tall Guys Talking Sales episode. Hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive deep with Ben into the challenges of modern sales pipelines and explore why traditional outreach methods are no longer effective. Together, they uncover how relationship selling, fueled by emotional intelligence and strategic connections, is reshaping the future of sales. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting out, this episode is packed with actionable insights you can't afford to miss.

Key Topics Discussed

Why Cold Calling is Ineffective Today Ben discusses the inefficiency of cold outreach in the modern era, citing Bank of America’s 2021 decision to ban cold calling as a pivotal moment in sales strategy. (Approx. 00:01:00)
The Economics of Cold Outreach vs. Relationship Selling Sean explains the hidden costs of cold calling, emphasizing the expensive hourly rate of quota-bearing sales reps and its low ROI. (Approx. 00:02:20)
Leveraging LinkedIn for Strategic Connections Ben provides a practical, step-by-step guide to mining LinkedIn connections for warm referrals, using your network intelligently without costly tools. (Approx. 00:05:35)
The Role of Emotional Intelligence in Modern Sales Kevin and Ben discuss how sales professionals can use emotional intelligence and relationship intelligence tools to identify and nurture stronger business relationships. (Approx. 00:10:45)
Maximizing Relationship Capital with Technology Ben introduces KnowledgeNet, a tool that helps sales teams unlock and scale their relationship capital to drive business growth. (Approx. 00:12:00)

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: “Top of funnel cold outreach with no relationship is nearly impossible—it’s a cost line on any P&L.” (Approx. 00:04:48) * Sean O’Shaughnessey: “If you hand someone a list of 100 people you’d like an introduction to, you’ll get zero. But ask for five or ten, and you’ll get meaningful connections.” (Approx. 00:07:45) * Ben Victorica: “Cold calling is dead. Relationship selling instead.” (Approx. 00:01:49)

Additional Resources Mentioned * KnowledgeNet.ai: A powerful tool to uncover and leverage relationship capital within your organization. Visit KnowledgeNet * Wall Street Journal 2021 Article: Referenced by Ben regarding Bank of America’s decision to ban cold calling - https://www.wsj.com/articles/bank-of-americas-merrill-lynch-to-ban-trainee-brokers-from-making-cold-calls-11621850400.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Use LinkedIn as a referral engine. List key LinkedIn connections that align with your ideal customer profile. Then, approach your strongest network contacts—your “super connectors”—with a curated list of five to ten potential introductions. Respect their time and include a pre-written email template to make the referral process seamless.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode The sales landscape has shifted, and the old playbook of cold calling no longer delivers results. This episode offers a fresh perspective on building pipelines using strategic relationships and modern tools like KnowledgeNet. Packed with real-world advice from Kevin, Sean, and Ben, this conversation will inspire you to rethink your sales approach. Ready to ditch outdated tactics and embrace the future of selling? Tune in now to gain the edge you need.

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For most of us, our revenue-to-date is going back to zero. We are 0% of quota YTD. Time to go out and blow away your quota.

Happy New Year from Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey.

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Keven Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey thank you for your gift of listening to us talk about Sales. We hope we have returned that gift by imparting some wisdom that can make you more successful.

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In this compelling episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the heart of sales motivation and goal setting. They share relatable stories, actionable insights, and practical strategies for salespeople and sales leaders. Using a vivid sports analogy, Sean sets the tone for an episode packed with strategies to stay driven—even when the path isn’t clear. Whether you're grappling with setting goals or maximizing your commission potential, this episode is a goldmine for actionable advice and personal growth.

Key Topics Discussed

The Athlete Analogy: Personal Motivation Meets Team Success (0:00) Sean parallels a high school sprinter's rigorous training and the dedication needed to succeed in sales.
The Importance of Personal "Why" in Sales Motivation (6:00) Kevin and Sean explore how individual motivations—whether financial goals, family obligations, or personal growth—shape sales performance.
Breaking Down Your Sales Math to Achieve Success (10:00) Kevin explains how to reverse-engineer your earnings goal, calculate deal requirements, and align your activities with desired outcomes.
Creating Personal Rewards for Milestone Achievements (9:00) Sean shares a story about a salesperson’s unique approach to celebrating significant deals and how small rewards can drive consistent motivation.
The Art of Setting Goals When None Are Provided (3:30) Kevin and Sean discuss practical steps for creating your own sales targets when your organization hasn’t assigned any.

Key Quotes

Sean O'Shaughnessey (2:00): "What motivates you as a salesperson to do incredibly well? What are you doing to achieve your goals, and because you achieve your goals, maybe you're inspiring someone else on your team to do the same."
Kevin Lawson (4:29): "If you're not given a goal, do the math that gets you to success. It starts with understanding your economic driver and building a plan from there."
Sean O'Shaughnessey (9:20): "Choose something unique to reward yourself when something good happens. It’s a motivator for the day and can become the beginning of your career motivation."

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Reverse-engineer your sales goals for 2024. Start by defining your desired income, break it down into weekly targets, and calculate how many deals you need to close. Then, analyze your closing rates to determine how many leads and opportunities you need to generate. Finally, track your progress weekly and adjust your strategy to stay on course.

Summary Paragraph This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales delivers powerful insights into staying motivated and setting actionable sales goals. Sean and Kevin expertly weave relatable analogies with proven strategies to help you master the art of self-motivation and goal achievement. Whether you're working towards a personal milestone or aiming to inspire your team, this episode provides the tools to elevate your performance. Tune in and take control of your sales journey today!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

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In this thought-provoking episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive into the transformative power of technology in sales and operations. From the essentials of adopting a CRM to leveraging AI and automation, Kevin and Sean discuss how modern businesses can streamline operations, boost productivity, and prepare for the future. Whether you’re managing a small team or a large enterprise, this episode will provide actionable insights into creating an integrated tech stack that supports growth and resilience.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Importance of a CRM System (Approx. 00:01:00)

* Why every organization needs a CRM to centralize and share data across teams, from sales to manufacturing.
* How a CRM can prevent revenue loss during sales team transitions.

Building an Integrated Tech Stack (Approx. 00:03:00)
- Understanding the interconnectedness of CRM, ERP, and project management tools.
- Simplifying operations with modern, cloud-based solutions.
- Preparing for the AI Revolution (Approx. 00:04:00)
- How AI and machine learning are redefining operational workflows.
- Why having an AI strategy is essential for staying competitive.
- Forecasting and Automation (Approx. 00:09:00)
- Leveraging technology to improve forecasting, pipeline management, and resource allocation.
- Automating routine tasks for efficiency and scalability.
- The Role of Sales and Marketing Alignment (Approx. 00:11:00)
- Why sales and marketing collaboration is critical for success.
- How technology bridges the gap between these teams.

Key Quotes * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “Your journey to 2035 starts right now. By staying on outdated tools, you’re not just behind—you’re making it harder to catch up later.” (Approx. 00:06:06) * Kevin Lawson: “Technology is now part of the fabric of how we do business. If you want to grow and scale—or even just survive—adopting the right tools is the right battle to fight.” (Approx. 00:02:34) * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “Revenue solves all problems in companies, but only if your systems are set up to support it.” (Approx. 00:12:23)

Additional Resources * McKinsey Report on AI in Business: September 2024 Edition. * HubSpot Marketplace: Tools to integrate CRM with calling apps and social media management platforms. * Ninety.io: Software for tracking KPIs and achieving quarterly goals.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Start with Your CRM: Evaluate your current CRM system (or lack thereof) and its integration with other business tools. Focus on centralizing data and enabling seamless communication between teams. This single step can drastically improve productivity, forecasting accuracy, and cross-functional collaboration.

Why You Should Listen This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a must-listen for anyone looking to future-proof their business. Kevin and Sean offer practical advice and actionable strategies to help you streamline operations, adopt cutting-edge technologies, and align your team for success. Whether you’re planning for 2025 or 2035, the insights shared in this episode will set you on the path to achieving your goals.

Tune in and discover how to take your sales operations to the next level!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Happy Thanksgiving! We hope that you have much to be thankful for. Kevin and Sean

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In this episode of “Two Tall Guys Talking Sales,” Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the critical tools every modern salesperson needs to thrive. Whether you're equipping yourself in a tech-limited environment or looking to amplify your selling power with affordable tools, Kevin and Sean share practical insights from their decades of experience in sales and technology. This episode is packed with actionable advice for sales professionals looking to streamline their workflows and close deals more efficiently.

Key Topics Discussed * [00:01:00] Taking Notes Efficiently: The duo discusses tools like Evernote, OneNote, and even native apps like Notes, emphasizing the importance of accessible, synchronized note-taking for sales success. * [00:03:00] CRM Essentials: Why Outlook or spreadsheets don’t cut it as CRMs and affordable alternatives like HubSpot and Insightly that can transform your sales process. * [00:05:00] Integration is Key: Kevin highlights how integrating tools like email, CRMs, and AI writing assistants such as ChatGPT or Claude can create a seamless selling experience. * [00:07:30] Managing Mileage and Expenses: Sean introduces tools like MileIQ and Expensify to streamline mileage tracking and expense management for busy salespeople. * [00:12:00] Staying Top of Mind: How CRMs help salespeople maintain relationships by tracking the timing and content of client interactions.

Key Quotes * Kevin [00:05:00]: “Integrate everything. All of your tools should talk to each other—most of that, you’ll find under the marketplace of your CRM.” * Sean [00:04:00]: “Outlook is not a CRM. Gmail is not a CRM. They’re just tools. A true CRM system will help you relate multiple people together at the same company and keep track of your progress.” * Kevin [00:13:30]: “When we write to reconnect, it’s not about us; it’s about them. The fewer times you say ‘I, me, or my’ in an email, the better your message will land.”

Additional Resources * HubSpot CRM: A free CRM option for individual salespeople to manage contacts and deals. * Insightly CRM: A free CRM option for individual salespeople to manage contacts and deals. * MileIQ: A mileage-tracking app that simplifies expense reporting. * Expensify: A freemium tool to manage receipts and expenses with ease. * ChatGPT and Claude: AI writing tools that improve email and content creation for sales professionals. * Grammarly: An AI-powered writing assistant that enhances communication by providing real-time feedback on grammar, clarity, tone, and style across various platforms and devices.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Build your integrated tech stack now. Start by selecting a free CRM like HubSpot or Insightly, then add complementary tools for note-taking, mileage tracking, and email integration. Use AI tools like ChatGPT to refine your communications and ensure every tool in your stack works seamlessly.

Summary Whether you’re a tech-savvy salesperson or just starting to explore the power of modern tools, this episode offers a roadmap for building an affordable, effective sales tech stack. Kevin and Sean provide real-world examples and practical advice to help you stay organized, build stronger client relationships, and close deals faster. Don’t miss this episode—it could be the catalyst for taking your sales game to the next level. Listen now!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639 You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another compelling episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey! Kevin and Sean dive deep into a central challenge for sales teams: identifying ideal customers and building a robust prospect list. In this episode, they uncover practical strategies, share indispensable tools, and illustrate how a strong grasp of your customer can turn prospects into loyal clients. Whether you’re part of a lean sales team or managing large territories, this episode is loaded with insights to help you grow.

Key Topics Discussed * Building Your Prospect List (approx. 2:00): Kevin introduces the concept of creating an ideal prospect list and breaks down the importance of strategic targeting beyond mere proximity or broad industry fit. * Activating and Leveraging Networks (approx. 3:00): Both hosts discuss the value of networking to uncover warm referrals, emphasizing the need to build a customized, one-to-one outreach strategy. * Effective Tools for Targeting Customers (approx. 4:45): Sean and Kevin highlight essential tools like LinkedIn Sales Navigator, KnowledgeNet, and AI-powered tools like Perplexity to streamline the process of finding and qualifying leads. * Understanding the Customer’s Goals and Structure (approx. 7:20): Sean shares a story about understanding internal company dynamics and how knowing a prospect’s structure and goals helps in creating value-oriented solutions. * Actionable Research Insights (approx. 10:15): The duo dives into practical research techniques to understand client organizations and stakeholders, stressing that informed sellers are empowered sellers.

Key Quotes * Kevin: “To build a good prospect list, it doesn’t have to mean endless hours on Google or hundreds of cold calls. With the right tools, you can have a list ready before lunch.” (approx. 5:55) * Sean: “Your job isn’t just to sell a product; it’s to solve a problem. When you start with that goal, the sale becomes almost inevitable.” (approx. 14:40) * Kevin: “Whether you’re a team of one or a team of five, using the tools at hand to maximize your reach and impact makes you competitive.” (approx. 13:00)

Additional Resources * LinkedIn Sales Navigator * KnowledgeNet * Perplexity.ai

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Leverage AI-powered tools to gain deeper insights into target companies and individuals before engaging in outreach. By using resources like Perplexity to understand a client’s structure, goals, and decision-making processes, salespeople can craft highly personalized solutions that add immediate value. In the episode, Sean challenged people to use Perplexity to research his fellow co-host, Kevin Lawson. Here is that Perplexity search: https://www.perplexity.ai/search/can-you-help-me-with-informati-Hdjvd9OgQTWFXrODrlhHnQ

In this episode, Kevin and Sean clarify that sales is about more than products—it’s about partnerships. Discover how to empower yourself with the right tools, refine your approach to prospecting, and bring authentic value to each client. Tune in to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales for actionable strategies to transform how you engage, connect, and close.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the challenges and strategies of managing large sales territories, especially for teams with fewer than five sellers. Reflecting on their extensive sales careers, they explore the intricacies of balancing time, travel, and targeting the right clients when facing expansive regions. Kevin and Sean share actionable insights on refining the ideal client profile (ICP) and discuss how small business owners and sales leaders can make intentional, high-impact decisions in their outreach efforts. Tune in to discover effective approaches to optimizing sales territories and maximizing limited resources to achieve sustainable growth in the new year.

Key Topics Discussed * The Impact of Large Sales Territories on Small Teams (00:01:38): Kevin and Sean discuss the demands of covering extensive sales regions, whether a few states or half the country and why focus and territory management are crucial for smaller sales teams. * The Importance of Ideal Client Profiles (00:04:57): Sean explains how understanding and refining your ICP can simplify prospecting, ensure each lead mirrors your most valuable clients, and avoid wasted effort on non-ideal targets. * Leveraging Top Clients for Networking and Referrals (00:09:03): Sean and Kevin emphasize the value of networking over cold prospecting, suggesting that current clients can provide introductions and case studies that open doors to similar high-potential accounts. * Using Personas to Deepen Client Relationships (00:11:00): Kevin discusses how personas complement the ICP by focusing on individual motivators, ensuring sellers speak directly to what matters most to each prospect. * Strategic Territory Planning for the Coming Year (00:12:59): The hosts explain how to plan for realistic, growth-oriented targets and advise on which regions and clients to prioritize based on resources and client potential.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson (00:05:34): "When you have less than five sellers on your team, your ideal client profile becomes really, really important… Look at your prospect list and ask yourself: do they fit my ICP? It’s something you can do today, quickly." * Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:10:48): "If you have the world as your territory…your quota needs to be based on how many people you can actually see and deal with—not on everyone who could theoretically buy your product." * Kevin Lawson (00:11:18): "Ask yourself this: how does your ideal client persona earn a bonus? If your product doesn’t align with what matters to them, you’re likely speaking to the wrong person."

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Refine Your Ideal Client Profile and Persona Today: Identify your top 10 favorite customers and analyze their shared traits. Compare these traits to your current prospect list, removing prospects that don’t align with your top client characteristics. This simple but powerful action helps ensure you’re spending time on prospects more likely to become valuable clients.

Closing Summary:As you prepare for the upcoming year, Kevin and Sean's conversation provides invaluable advice for small sales teams navigating large territories. Whether you're a business owner, a solo seller, or a sales leader with a lean team, this episode reveals practical tactics for honing in on your ideal client profile, leveraging client relationships, and maximizing the impact of each sales call. Dive in to learn how to set your sales strategy up for success, and walk away with actionable tips you can implement immediately. Listen now and take your sales approach to new heights with Two Tall Guys Talking Sales!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639 You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of “Two Tall Guys Talking Sales,” hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive into the unique challenges and opportunities of hiring your second salesperson. Many small business owners face a pivotal moment when they bring on a sales team member who may know the company but not the ins and outs of professional selling. Join Kevin and Sean as they explore how to make the first and second salespeople truly effective, how to ramp up revenue, and how to know when it's time to expand your sales team. Packed with actionable insights, this episode is a roadmap for business leaders looking to maximize their early sales hires and foster sustainable growth.

Key Topics Discussed:

The First Sales Hire: Opportunity or Risk? - Sean and Kevin discuss the challenges owners face when hiring a single salesperson who may lack deep sales expertise (00:00:17).
How to Make Your Second Sales Hire Successful - Kevin emphasizes the importance of a structured onboarding process focused on accountability, consistent communication, and setting measurable outcomes for new hires (00:02:24).
The Power of Accountability and Communication - Kevin and Sean lay out practical steps for holding a first salesperson accountable and how to provide actionable, regular feedback for improved performance (00:04:00).
Setting Success Metrics and Revenue Goals - Sean covers the critical role of defining success metrics and how to know when it's time to hire a second salesperson or replace your current one (00:06:31).
Shortening the Sales Ramp-Up Time - Kevin challenges the assumption that onboarding takes years, urging owners to implement processes that cut onboarding from years to months (00:10:00).
Revenue Abundance Mindset - Sean closes with a motivational segment about the abundance of revenue potential in every industry, stressing the importance of targeting the ideal client profile (00:12:23).

Key Quotes:

Kevin: “The ‘how’ question is so important. How do we get someone into our organization in a way where they feel valued, are producing value, and we can all measure and feel the growth of that value throughout the organization?” (00:02:39)
Sean: “If you're concerned that the salesperson is successful, but you’re not quite there, start by pushing two numbers—closing deals faster or bringing in more revenue per deal.” (00:07:55)
Kevin: “We need you as an owner to set a goal for yourself that this year, this next 12 months, you’re going to reduce the ramp time to one year. And in three years, we’re going from a two-year ramp to a 90-day ramp.” (00:10:24)
Sean: “There’s an abundance of people out there who want to buy your product and who have problems you can solve. Go after your ideal client profile, help them achieve their goals, and you will find more revenue than you ever imagined.” (00:14:23)

Additional Resources:

Sean’s Book - Eliminate Your Competition - Referenced as a comprehensive guide for building sales plans. Available for purchase on major book retailers’ websites. https://amzn.to/2K37ugx

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

Set Regular Checkpoints for New Sales Hires - Create a structured, regular feedback and accountability process for any new salesperson. Schedule weekly check-ins to evaluate progress on specific metrics such as speed of closing deals and revenue per deal. Adjust goals as needed to encourage growth and provide timely support.

Summary: Whether you’re just starting to build your sales team or looking to improve your existing process, this episode of “Two Tall Guys Talking Sales” with Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey offers practical advice to drive real change. They dive deep into how to turn your first and second salesperson into a powerhouse by fostering accountability, clear communication, and a strategic growth mindset. Subscribe now and get ready to learn from the experts how to structure, support, and scale your sales efforts—taking your business to new heights.

Eliminate Your Competition: A Trapper’s Guide to Increasing Your Commission

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In this episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey, take listeners on a journey to understand the power of non-sales roles in supporting a sales-centric culture. Expanding on prior discussions about sales planning and execution, they explore how professionals outside the sales department—think programmers, customer service reps, delivery drivers, and even truckers—can play a pivotal role in enhancing client satisfaction and identifying new opportunities. Kevin and Sean dive into practical steps sales leaders can take to foster a collaborative environment where everyone contributes to sales success, making this an unmissable episode for business leaders, sales professionals, and anyone looking to understand the value of cross-functional synergy in achieving enterprise growth.

Key Topics Discussed * The Sales Quadrant Framework [00:01:00]: Kevin and Sean introduce a framework for effective sales planning, dividing it into four quadrants: Strategy, Process, People, and KPIs. This framework guides leaders on fostering a holistic sales ecosystem. * Sales for Non-Salespeople: Defining the Role [00:01:40]: The hosts discuss how non-sales team members, from programmers to quality agents, can pass along valuable customer insights without selling directly. It’s about listening and relaying information to sales, not cold calls or quotas. * Leveraging Customer Interactions for Insight [00:03:14]: Sean shares a vivid example from his software background, where consultants gathering customer feedback created substantial upsell opportunities. He emphasizes the value of customer-facing team members in providing sales with a view from the trenches. * Building Relationships Across Teams [00:07:00]: Kevin discusses strategies to align cross-functional team goals with sales objectives, creating a supportive network that encourages the entire team to spot potential sales opportunities. * The Importance of Gratitude and Recognition [00:12:07]: Sean underscores the value of acknowledging and thanking team members who help sales, reinforcing their role in supporting company-wide goals and deepening relationships across departments.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: “We're not asking non-salespeople to sell, but we are asking them to raise their hand when they see something we might need to know about to help our customers better.” [00:01:59] * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “In every company, people need help achieving their goals. And often, the folks who see where we can help the most aren’t in the sales department—they’re on the front lines, interacting with customers daily.” [00:04:11] * Kevin Lawson: “Be a better person in business. Support your teammates, your vendors, and your community, and that support will circle back, lifting everyone’s success.” [00:14:04] * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “A simple ‘thank you’ can be the most valuable recognition, and it builds bridges with your team. Make it a habit.” [00:12:46]

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Empower Non-Sales Team Members to Listen for Opportunities Sales leaders should hold short training sessions or casual discussions with non-sales staff, educating them on key signals that may indicate an opportunity. Encourage these team members to feel comfortable sharing insights with sales and clarify that they won’t be pressured to sell—just to observe and communicate.

Summary: This Two Tall Guys Talking Sales episode delivers essential insights for any sales-driven organization. Kevin and Sean emphasize the untapped potential within non-sales teams, showing how they can indirectly yet powerfully support sales efforts by sharing customer feedback and needs. With practical strategies for fostering collaboration and recognizing the contributions of non-sales staff, this episode is a must-listen for sales leaders looking to unlock every possible avenue of client satisfaction and revenue growth. Tune in and discover how even a small tweak in team communication can significantly impact your bottom line.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639 You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome back to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales! In this episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the nuts and bolts of individual sales planning. This conversation moves beyond just hitting quotas—it’s about creating a personal strategy that drives you toward success. Whether you’re starting fresh in a new fiscal year or planning for growth, Kevin and Sean have you covered with actionable advice, real-world examples, and inspiration for developing your own winning sales plan. Get ready to sharpen your tools and plan to exceed your quota!

Key Topics Discussed * Building Your Sales Plan (2:00): Sean breaks down the critical elements of creating your personal sales plan, including setting a quota, calculating the number of deals you need to close, and how to push yourself beyond expectations. * Analyzing Your Existing Customer Base (4:10): Kevin emphasizes the importance of understanding your existing customers, maintaining relationships, and strategically growing accounts that can carry you through the year. * Knowing Your Competitors and Market (6:30): Both hosts discuss the significance of competitor analysis and knowing your market, down to the behaviors and needs of your customers. * Planning for New Accounts (9:00): Sean challenges listeners to add new accounts to their plan and start treating those prospective clients like they are essential to your financial future. * Collaborating with Marketing (11:00): Sean and Kevin stress the importance of working hand-in-hand with your marketing team to fill the gaps in your sales plan and generate quality leads.

Key Quotes * Sean (2:50): “If you’re supposed to do 50 deals to hit your million-dollar quota, guess what? You have to do 60. We’re going over quota—no excuses!” * Kevin (4:40): “Am I taking care of the customers that I know I should be taking care of? Yes or no. It’s really straightforward.” * Kevin (5:50): “Know who your competitors are, and know who you want to do business with. Don’t just rely on marketing to tell you—figure it out for yourself.” * Sean (9:55): “You need to think of these prospective accounts as your best friends. If they are important to your success, know everything about them.”

Additional Resources * If you missed last week’s episode on Building a Sales Plan That Works: Aligning Vision with Execution, go back and listen for an in-depth look at building sales strategies from a leadership perspective. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/building-a-sales-plan-that-works-aligning-vision-with-execution

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Identify 20 new accounts you do not currently have a relationship with and begin learning everything about them—competitors, pain points, goals, and market behaviors. Integrating these targets into your sales plan today can set you up for growth and success as early as January.

Summary This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is packed with valuable insights for every sales professional looking to take control of their personal sales plan. Kevin and Sean encourage you to meet your quota and exceed it by going the extra mile—analyzing existing customers, targeting new ones, understanding your competitors, and working closely with marketing to generate leads. Whether you’re an individual salesperson or a sales leader, this conversation will leave you energized and ready to tackle the coming months with a winning strategy. Don't miss this episode!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessy, your hosts on Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, as they delve into the crucial topic of building a comprehensive corporate sales plan. Fresh off last week’s enlightening episode with Richard Cogswell, Kevin and Sean are back to share actionable strategies for creating a robust sales plan that aligns with corporate goals, ensures sales team success, and drives growth. Whether you’re a VP of Sales or a business owner looking to scale, this episode is packed with insights to help you reach your sales targets effectively.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Importance of Sales Plan Alignment (Approx. 01:32) Kevin explains why sales reps and leaders must understand and align with the company's long-term vision, ensuring goals cascade from top-level leadership to every sales team member. * Bottom-Up vs. Top-Down Sales Planning (Approx. 03:17) Sean and Kevin outline the tactical approaches to sales planning, with bottom-up focusing on individual sales potential and top-down focusing on company-wide aspirations and limitations. * Risk-Adjusted Goal Setting (Approx. 02:55) Kevin highlights how to factor in both realistic and aspirational targets while accounting for potential risks, offering a pragmatic approach to sales planning. * Understanding Limiting Factors in Sales Growth (Approx. 06:30) Sean shares an example of a client that couldn’t scale due to manufacturing constraints, emphasizing the need to account for operational bottlenecks in the sales plan. * The Value of Discovery Questions (Approx. 08:45) Sean underscores the importance of including tailored discovery questions for different buyer personas, ensuring salespeople are prepared to ask the right questions during prospecting.

Key Quotes: * Kevin Lawson: "As a VP of Sales, my compensation was directly tied to helping the board, the leader, the owner achieve their vision. What we’re doing is creating alignment between the company’s big picture and the sales team's tactical execution." (Approx. 01:32) * Sean O'Shaughnessy: "When you're thinking top-down, think about what your limitations are for delivering on those goals. It's not just about setting lofty sales targets; it's about asking, ‘How are we going to deliver on this?’" (Approx. 05:10)

Additional Resources: * Previous Episode: If you missed last week's discussion with Richard Cogswell on culture and developing sales plans, be sure to catch up for more insights that build upon today’s conversation. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/building-a-mission-led-sales-culture-insights-from-richard-cogswell

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Write down the top 10 companies that fit your ideal client profile but aren’t currently customers. Challenge your sales team to convert at least one of these prospects into a paying customer by year-end. The simple act of documenting these targets can dramatically improve your chances of success by keeping everyone focused and accountable.

Summary: In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin and Sean lay out the blueprint for developing a high-impact sales plan that aligns with your company’s goals and sales targets. With practical examples and actionable advice, they explain how to approach sales planning from both the bottom-up and top-down perspectives, highlighting the importance of understanding your business’s limitations and opportunities for growth. If you’re looking to elevate your sales strategy, this episode is a must-listen!

Don't miss out on this engaging conversation that could help you transform your sales results—download the episode now! Happy selling! To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment:

https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Richard Cogswell, a 20-year sales veteran and author who leads the APAC region in the FinTech space. Richard shares his journey from commission-only sales in the insurance industry to becoming a B2B sales leader in the complex world of payments. Together, they discuss the critical importance of developing a mission-led culture, the pitfalls of sales leadership without a plan, and actionable strategies for creating a structured sales environment.

Join the conversation as they explore how sales leaders can move beyond the typical financial-year focus and elevate their teams with clarity, focus, and purpose. Whether you're a sales leader or a single contributor looking to up your game, this episode is packed with insights to help you build a more robust sales foundation.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Importance of a Go-to-Market Sales Plan (00:01:47): Richard highlights why many organizations lack an articulated sales strategy and the repercussions this can have on cross-functional alignment and growth.
From Surviving Year-to-Year to a Mission-Led Culture (00:04:22): The hosts dive into how sales leaders can shift from short-term financial targets to a long-term, mission-driven approach.
Creating a Structured Sales Environment (00:06:18): Richard explains the necessity of documenting your big bets and aligning your team with cross-functional partners.
Identifying and Empowering Sales Leaders (00:11:00): Learn how to recognize key players within your team and use them to foster growth and cohesion.
The Power of Salespeople Creating Their Own Plans (00:12:48): Richard shares the importance of involving sales reps in the planning process and how it strengthens accountability and execution.

Key Quotes:

Richard Cogswell: "If you're a commercial leader and you don't have a structured sales plan, I'm sorry, but that is your responsibility to create one. How else do you align your team and cross-functional leaders toward the same goals?" (00:03:18)
Sean O'Shaughnessey: "You have to have a plan. Kevin and I are often brought in as fractional VPs of sales, and the first thing we see is the absence of a plan, which is exactly why we’re needed." (00:04:43)
Kevin Lawson: "I love what you said about getting beyond the fiscal year focus and building a mission-led culture. That’s a simple, but powerful, shift every sales leader needs to understand." (00:10:31)

Additional Resources:

Richard Cogswell’s book, The Cultural Sales Leader: Sustaining People, Attaining Results, is available on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, and other retailers. https://a.co/d/1sc187j
Connect with Richard on LinkedIn for more insights into sales leadership and cultural transformation in business. https://www.linkedin.com/in/richardcogswell/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Sales leaders should implement a one-page sales plan for their team. This document should clearly define the financial goals, top priorities, values and behaviors expected, and specific actions needed to achieve success. Ensure this plan is regularly revisited and adjusted to align with short-term and long-term goals.

Summary: In this episode, Richard Cogswell brings a wealth of experience to the table, sharing his journey from commission-only sales to leading an entire region in the FinTech industry. His insights into the necessity of structured sales plans, mission-led cultures, and empowering sales leaders are invaluable for anyone in sales leadership or aspiring to be. Whether you're managing a team or just starting out, the principles Richard discusses can help take your sales strategy from surviving to thriving. Don't miss this chance to learn how to build a focused, intentional sales culture that drives long-term success!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment:

https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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As the year winds down and football season takes over, Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson remind us that it’s time for sales leaders to focus on the coming year. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Sean and Kevin dive into actionable strategies for building a strong foundation in FY25, including compensation plan design, strategic projects, and investing in your sales team. Whether you’re a sales leader, business owner, or manager, this episode provides expert advice on how to finish strong and gear up for the year ahead.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Importance of Sales Compensation Plans (00:01:57): Sean and Kevin highlight the need to deliver next year’s compensation plans by December 1st and the impact of “cliffs” and “escalators” on driving end-of-year sales. * Prioritizing Strategic Projects for FY25 (00:08:00): From technology investments to adding resources, the hosts explain how to plan for success beyond basic sales goals. * Incentivizing Sales Success Without Caps (00:04:38): Kevin discusses why capping commissions can limit growth, and how uncapped plans can drive higher performance and retention. * Skills Building as a Strategic Investment (00:09:22): Sean encourages sales leaders to invest in skill development, particularly for small businesses, to boost overall sales team performance. * Assessing Your Sales Organization (00:13:51): Sean and Kevin emphasize the value of conducting a sales assessment to identify areas for improvement before the new year begins.

Key Quotes: * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "The time to write your sales compensation plan is October 15th or November 1st so you can deliver it by December. This year is what we’re being graded on, so we need to finish strong." (00:03:48) * Kevin Lawson: "If you're trying to 3x, 4x, 5x your business, putting a cap on commissions will stall that growth. We need to incentivize success, not limit it." (00:05:19) * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "It's not just about closing deals, it’s about investing in your team’s skills so they can deliver more revenue next year." (00:10:24)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Deliver your sales compensation plans by December 1st. Incorporate "cliffs" to incentivize end-of-year performance and use "escalators" to reward ongoing success throughout the year. This structure not only pushes deals forward but ensures your team is focused on finishing the year strong and starting the next with momentum.

Summary: Don’t wait until January to plan your sales strategy! In this episode, Kevin and Sean break down the crucial elements you need to set your team up for success in FY25, from delivering well-timed compensation plans to strategic project planning and skills development. Tune in now for expert advice and practical tips on how to finish this year strong and hit the ground running next year.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment:

https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explore the complexities of rapid sales growth. While many companies aspire to grow, not all are ready for the operational strain accompanying success. The hosts share insights on scaling systems, optimizing sales operations, and ensuring growth doesn’t break your business. This episode offers actionable strategies for businesses facing fast-paced expansion, from onboarding salespeople to expanding infrastructure.

Key Topics Discussed: * Recognizing the Pain of Growth (00:01:00) Sean discusses the challenge of managing growth when sales outpace operational capabilities, posing critical questions about when to add resources like marketing or legal support. * Building Systems That Scale (00:02:30) Kevin shares how building robust, repeatable processes—whether hiring one salesperson or ten—ensures sustainable and scalable growth. * When to Hire Sales Support Staff (00:03:32) The discussion highlights the importance of adding operational roles such as sales analysts or revenue operations personnel to ease the workload on sales teams. * Maximizing Sales Efficiency (00:07:14) Sean advises identifying which tasks to delegate from high-performing salespeople to specialists, increasing overall efficiency and productivity. * Tailoring Sales Strategy to Industry Needs (00:09:26) Kevin elaborates on how different industries may require unique sales strategies, emphasizing the need to adapt based on business size and market demands.

Key Quotes: * Sean: "We need to grow, but can the rest of the organization grow with us?" (00:05:00) * Kevin: "Growth is a cash event. Growth is a change event. When you 2x, 3x a business in sales, you often break things." (00:02:48) * Sean: "Think about how much time high-performing people spend doing things that are not high-performing tasks, and figure out how you can take that off their plate." (00:12:52)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Conduct a time audit for your sales team. Identify non-sales tasks that consume their time, such as data entry or order processing. Delegate these tasks to a dedicated admin or sales operations role. This can significantly boost productivity and allow your top performers to focus on closing deals.

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean break down the key challenges of scaling a business during periods of fast growth. They offer practical advice on creating efficient processes, hiring the right support staff, and ensuring your sales operations keep pace with your revenue expansion. Whether your company is rapidly expanding or preparing for future growth, this episode is packed with actionable insights that can help you maintain momentum without breaking your business. Tune in to learn how to balance growth and efficiency for long-term success!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this insightful episode, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into practical strategies for deepening relationships and boosting sales without extensive outreach efforts. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting out, this episode is packed with actionable tips to enhance your sales approach by focusing on the people you already know.

Key Topics Discussed: * Building Relationships with Minimal Effort (00:01:03) - Strategies to maintain and strengthen relationships with minimal outreach, including personalized interactions beyond generic newsletters. * Utilizing Personal Interests in Sales (00:03:11) - How personal interests and hobbies can be leveraged to maintain contact with clients and build a deeper connection. * The Importance of Customized Communication (00:08:44) - Discuss how tailored communication can enhance customer relationships and trust. * Systematizing Relationship Management (00:12:51) - Sean's methodical approach to managing relationships through strategic use of CRM and personalized content. * Sales as a Guiding Principle (00:13:00) - How consistent, targeted outreach is foundational to a successful sales strategy and organizational culture.

Key Quotes: * Kevin: "The currency of trust is what we're building here... The idea that I'm passionate about running is an example of, Hey, we want to pay attention to our customers." (00:06:10) * Sean: "Just send an article that made you think of them... This personal touch is what keeps the relationship strong and their interest in doing business with you alive." (00:04:00)

Additional Resources: * Book: "Atomic Habits" by James Clear - referenced by Kevin as a core to building better processes - https://a.co/d/cHE8akb

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Daily Personalized Outreach: Dedicate a few minutes daily to send personalized articles or messages to a few contacts. This habit keeps the relationship warm and ensures you remain top of mind, increasing the likelihood of continued business and referrals.

Summary This episode is a gold mine for anyone looking to effectively maintain and grow their sales networks. Kevin and Sean break down the art of nurturing relationships with existing contacts through simple yet impactful daily habits. By integrating personalized communication and maintaining a consistent presence, sales professionals can foster deeper connections and ensure a robust network. If you want to refine your sales and relationship management approach, this episode is a must-listen.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639 You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in a dynamic episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where they dive deep into the essential elements of crafting an effective sales strategy. Whether you're a sales newbie or a seasoned pro, this episode promises insights into refining your approach to acquiring new clients and boosting your sales performance.

Key Topics Discussed: * Ideal Client Profiles (Approx. 00:01:00): Discover the power of tailoring your approach to fit the perfect client profile and why it's the cornerstone of any successful sales strategy. * Messaging in Sales (Approx. 00:03:27): Learn the art of crafting messages that resonate with your target audience, ensuring your communication aligns perfectly with their expectations and needs. * Designing Compelling Offers (Approx. 00:06:31): Explore how to frame your products or services in a way that emphasizes their value and addresses the aspirational needs of your clients. * Strategic Alignment (Approx. 00:12:11): Understand the synergy between client profiles, messaging, and offers and how aligning these elements can lead to sales success. * Sales Process Optimization (Approx. 00:10:59): Gain insights into organizing your sales strategies to ensure they are effective, repeatable, and scalable.

Key Quotes: * Kevin: "If you're a dentist and all you get is people with foot pain, you're sending out the wrong message about your practice." (Approx. 00:03:52) * Sean: "The goal for really selling and eliminating your competition and really setting yourself up for success is to teach them to aspire to something greater." (Approx. 00:09:04)

Additional Resources: * "Strategic Selling" by Miller Heiman - A seminal book on sales strategies, mentioned for its impactful concepts that have shaped modern sales approaches. - https://a.co/d/iPykhyA * RAIN Group Sales Training - Recommended for those looking to further their understanding of sales aspirations and strategic customer alignment.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Reflect on Your Client Profiles: Take a moment to revisit and refine your ideal client profiles. This exercise will help ensure that your sales messaging and offers are perfectly tailored to meet your target audience's specific needs and aspirations, significantly increasing your chances of closing more deals.

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean break down the intricate dance of aligning client profiles, messaging, and offers to craft a sales strategy that meets and exceeds expectations. Their conversation is filled with actionable advice backed by real-world examples and seasoned insights, making it a must-listen for anyone looking to enhance their sales effectiveness. Tune in to refine your approach and learn how to construct sales pitches that are heard and truly resonate.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10-question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=28995327 You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this riveting episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explore the often overlooked nuances of effective sales training and coaching. Listen in as they share their seasoned insights on transforming routine sales training into a dynamic tool for substantial growth and success in sales.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Misconception of Sales Training Returns [00:00:20] Sean questions salespeople's low expectations regarding training, sparking a discussion on the intrinsic value of continuous professional development. * The Role of Sales Leaders in Training [00:01:00] Kevin emphasizes the critical role of sales leaders in setting the right expectations and fostering an environment conducive to growth, drawing parallels with professional sports training regimes. * Training vs. Coaching [00:07:05] The conversation pivots to the essential distinction between sales training and coaching, highlighting how each plays a unique role in a salesperson’s career. * Integration of Training into Routine [00:06:22] Kevin discusses the challenges of integrating training into the normal workflow of sales teams and the importance of practice and repetition. * The Power of Reinforcement [00:04:05] Sean underscores the necessity of reinforcing training through regular coaching, using the analogy of professional athletes to illustrate his point.

Key Quotes: * Kevin: "We practice every day for the championship game. We don’t play the championship game every day. It’s about getting that 1 percent edge." [00:01:14] * Sean: "You forget 80 percent of what you heard after two weeks. It's the coaching after the fact that reinforces the entire attitude and the daily behavior of what you learned in the class." [00:03:40]

Additional Resources: * MEDDPICCC Sales Methodology - Mentioned multiple times throughout the podcast, this methodology is crucial for understanding customer dynamics and improving sales strategies. You can learn more about MEDDPICCC at https://youtu.be/RBcGmyeBp1I?si=No_0Ob1V4Wch6erI

Summary: Join Kevin and Sean as they dissect the common pitfalls of sales training and explore effective strategies to make learning stick. They share invaluable advice on how sales leaders can profoundly influence their teams' performance through intentional coaching and robust training frameworks. This episode is a must-listen for sales professionals eager to elevate their game and harness the full potential of their training experiences.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Reflect on your current approach to sales training and coaching. Are you actively ensuring that your team learns new concepts and applies them consistently? Consider adopting a more structured follow-up coaching plan to reinforce new skills and knowledge, enhancing the overall effectiveness of training sessions.

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy 10 question assessment: https://salesxceleration.com/sales-agility-assessment/?locationid=26671639 You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in this milestone 100th episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales." They take a nostalgic trip down memory lane, revisiting the evolution of their podcast from simple LinkedIn live events to a thriving sales discussion platform on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. They delve into their personal growth, the transformative insights gained, and the invaluable lessons they’ve shared across 100 episodes.

Key Topics Discussed: * Evolution of the Podcast [00:00:21]: Kevin and Sean reflect on the technological and methodological shifts they've embraced to enhance their podcast experience. * Insights on Sales Excellence [00:01:35]: Sean shares his journey of continuous learning in sales, emphasizing the wisdom imparted by Kevin and its impact on his professional development. * Role of Content Creation [00:03:11]: Kevin discusses the significance of creating and repurposing valuable content, drawing parallels with daily writing practices to improve skill. * Interviews with Industry Experts [00:04:14]: The hosts highlight the diverse insights gained from interviews with visionaries across various sectors, from SaaS founders to business coaches. * Future of the Podcast [00:08:31]: Looking ahead, Kevin outlines their aspirations to scale the podcast’s impact and deepen listener engagement.

Key Quotes: * Kevin [00:00:00]: "It's basically a stack of wires and plastic...a lost and found of sorts for electronics equipment." * Sean [00:01:35]: "Listening to Kevin explain sales is insightful...I have learned an immense amount in the last 100 episodes."

Additional Resources: * Books by Zig Ziglar mentioned for deeper insights into effective sales strategies. - https://www.amazon.com/stores/author/B000AP7VIY * Previous episodes on building a comprehensive sales process.

https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e1-inaugural-episode-why-should-a-company-assess-its-practices-in-sales
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e2-how-do-you-determine-your-companys-sales-objectives-each-year
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e3-are-your-sales-representatives-consistently-hitting-their-assigned-quotas
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e4-how-do-you-compensate-your-salespeople
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e5-do-you-have-a-documented-sales-process-that-is-followed-all-the-time
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e6-how-do-salespeople-retain-client-information-and-document-sales-opportunities
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e8-can-your-salespeople-clearly-communicate-your-unique-selling-proposition-what-makes-you-different-than-your-competition
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e9-do-you-have-a-dashboard-view-into-the-major-determinants-of-sales-success
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e10-do-you-feel-you-have-the-right-salespeople-to-get-you-where-you-want-to-go
https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/e11-does-your-organization-hold-salespeople-accountable-for-lack-of-performance

Summary: This 100th episode is a celebration and a testament to continuous improvement and shared growth in the sales world. Kevin and Sean unpack the layers of learning they've experienced and the wealth of knowledge they’ve gathered from various experts. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or a newcomer to the field, this episode offers a wealth of practical advice, humor, and insights that can transform your approach to sales and leadership.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast: Adopt the practice of discussing and refining your craft regularly. As highlighted by Kevin, talking about your sales strategies and processes, much like writers improve by writing daily, can significantly enhance your expertise and execution in sales.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they edge closer to their milestone 100th episode, diving deep into the critical components of a successful sales organization.

Episode 99 zooms in on the third pillar: "Process." Kevin revisits his iconic saying, exploring the significance of a repeatable sales process and the consequences of lacking one, framed by rich personal anecdotes and professional insights.

Don't miss this episode packed with practical advice on refining your sales techniques and strategies.

Key Topics Discussed: * The Importance of a Repeatable Sales Process: Discussing the necessity of having a structured approach to sales. [00:00:44] * Emotional Intelligence and Its Impact on Sales: Exploring how emotional intelligence influences sales interactions and outcomes. [00:01:19] * The Role of Discovery in Sales Success: Emphasizing discovery as a critical phase in understanding customer needs. [00:04:23] * Integrating Marketing and Sales for Better Customer Acquisition: How aligning marketing and sales efforts can enhance customer acquisition strategies. [00:06:59] * The Essential Nature of Trust in Sales: Identifying trust as the cornerstone of successful sales relationships. [00:05:24] * Sales Process Alignment with Buyer's Journey: Highlighting the importance of aligning the sales process with the buyer's procedures and expectations. [00:11:17]

Key Quotes: * Kevin: "If you don't have a repeatable sales process, you don't have a repeatable sales process." [00:00:44] * Sean: "Sales is nothing more than the transferring of trust." [00:05:24]

Additional Resources: * Harvard Business Review Study on Sales Process Effectiveness - Mentioned by Kevin as a source confirming the impact of a documented process on sales performance. [00:13:48] - https://hbr.org/2015/01/companies-with-a-formal-sales-process-generate-more-revenue

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean unpack the essence of a repeatable sales process and its undeniable role in achieving consistent success. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or new to the field, this discussion offers invaluable insights into making your sales efforts more effective and efficient. From the foundational role of trust to integrating marketing and sales, this episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to enhance their sales strategies.

As we approach the 100th episode, stay tuned for more wisdom from "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales." Ready to elevate your sales game? Listen to this episode now on your favorite podcast platform!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey on this revealing episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" where they dive deep into the intricacies of hiring and motivating sales teams. Whether you're a solopreneur or heading a growing business, this episode delivers crucial insights into creating a robust sales force to propel your business forward.

Key Topics Discussed * Hiring Challenges and Solutions [00:00:00]: Kevin opens the discussion by highlighting the universal challenge of hiring effective sales personnel, emphasizing their critical role in delivering solutions to the market. * Diversity in Sales Recruitment [00:01:19]: Sean expands on the need for a varied recruitment strategy that aligns with business geography and market scope, from local to global scales. * Strategic Hiring Practices [00:02:00]: The conversation shifts towards strategic hiring, avoiding common pitfalls, and setting up a structured hiring process. * Aligning Sales and Hiring Processes [00:03:42]: Kevin parallels the sales process with hiring, stressing the importance of a methodical approach to selecting the right candidates. * Cultural Fit and Skills Assessment [00:04:52]: This section discusses the importance of cultural fit and rigorous skills assessment in the hiring process, which ensures candidates align with company values and capabilities. * Long-term Sales Success [00:06:48]: Sean discusses the broader implications of hiring decisions for long-term sales success and the essential qualities of a top-notch salesperson.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson [00:00:00]: "When it comes down to delivering your solution to the market, that solution is often sold and carried forward by a salesperson." * Sean O'Shaughnessey [00:02:17]: "You can't have the strategy to grow at 3X this year if you don't have enough people or a big enough factory."

Additional Resources * Episode with Steve Caton: Revisit the discussion on alternatives to hiring and outsourcing parts of the sales department. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/from-zero-to-sales-hero-steve-catons-strategies-for-small-business-growth * Predictive Analysis Tests: Objective Management Group (OMG) is the leading provider of sales team analyses, salesperson evaluations, and sales candidate assessments. https://salesxceleration.com/news-events/sales-xceleration-and-objective-management-group-partner-to-optimize-your-sales-team/

Summary In this episode, Kevin and Sean tackle the often-overlooked but vital elements of building a successful sales team. From the necessity of a diverse hiring strategy to aligning the recruitment process with your business’s sales methodology, they cover a spectrum of topics that promise to enhance your hiring practices. Insightful, practical, and filled with expert advice, this episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to scale their sales efforts effectively. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" to transform your approach to hiring and watch your business grow!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they dive into the intricacies of sales strategy, drawing parallels to planning a family vacation. As we edge closer to our 100th episode, this session unpacks why having a well-documented and aligned business plan is crucial—akin to knowing your vacation destination to ensure everything goes smoothly. Whether you're a business owner or a sales professional, this episode provides vital insights into simplifying and aligning your sales strategy for maximum effectiveness.

Key Topics Discussed * Vacation Planning and Sales Goals (00:00 - 02:00): Sean compares vacation planning to setting sales goals, emphasizing the importance of a clear destination or objective. * Aligning Strategies Across Teams (02:01 - 03:47): Kevin explores how aligning individual, team, and organizational strategies can streamline efforts and enhance outcomes. * Simplifying the Sales Process (03:48 - 05:07): The conversation shifts towards simplifying the sales process to make it easy to understand, teach, and implement. * Setting Realistic Goals and Expectations (05:08 - 07:00): Sean stresses the necessity of setting achievable goals that reflect the company's operational capabilities and strategic direction. * Operational Alignment with Sales Targets (07:01 - 09:00): The discussion touches on ensuring operational capabilities can support the sales targets set.

Key Quotes * Sean (01:44): "Just like when you're planning your vacation, you kind of have to make sure everybody understands that we are going to get on a plane on this date, at this time." * Kevin (03:01): "People spend more time thinking about their vacation than they do about their sales strategy. And that's a miss, but it's one that we can quickly and simply fix."

Summary In this enlightening episode, Kevin and Sean draw an engaging analogy between planning a vacation and formulating a sales strategy. They emphasize the importance of clear goals, alignment across the organization, and simplicity in execution. The hosts share personal anecdotes and decades of sales leadership experience, demonstrating how thoughtful planning can lead to predictable and successful sales outcomes. Tune in to gain actionable insights that could transform your approach to sales strategy. Download this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" on your favorite podcast platform today, and don't forget to subscribe for more valuable discussions!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they welcome back Steve Caton for another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales." This week, they delve deeper into the world of part-time salespeople, discussing the essential tools, traits, and strategies that make them highly effective for businesses. Whether you're a CEO, sales leader, or aspiring salesperson, this episode is packed with valuable advice and actionable tips.

Key Topics Discussed: * Preparing Part-Time Salespeople for Success (00:00:24): Steve Caton outlines the key factors in readying salespeople for part-time roles, emphasizing the importance of adaptability, trust-building, and research. * Traits of Effective Part-Time Salespeople (00:04:16): Discover the personality traits and experience levels that Steve looks for when recruiting part-time salespeople, including adaptability, organizational skills, and systematic approaches. * Measuring Success and Setting Expectations (00:07:22): Kevin and Steve discuss how to set and measure success metrics for part-time salespeople, focusing on sales activity and CRM usage. * Transitioning from Part-Time to Full-Time Salespeople (00:10:18): Learn about the process and considerations when a company is ready to transition from part-time to full-time sales roles. * Differentiating from Appointment Setting Services (00:11:58): Steve explains how his company focuses on the closer role, highlighting the need for leads and the differences from traditional appointment-setting services.

Key Quotes: * Steve Caton (00:01:46): "The salesperson needs to have shown that they've actually done some research on the company like they actually know about the business before they step in and start having the first conversation with the business owner." * Sean O'Shaughnessey (00:03:26): "Every salesperson that's looking for a job needs to be able to do those things as well. You need to say, I add value. I know I'm going to ask questions. I'm trying to learn the backstory of the company." * Kevin Lawson (00:07:22): "How do you measure the success of a new salesperson that you've plugged into one of your first customers? What’s the dialogue there?"

Summary: This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a must-listen for anyone interested in the dynamics of part-time sales roles and how they can significantly impact business growth. Steve Caton shares his expertise on preparing salespeople, measuring their success, and transitioning them into full-time roles. With practical advice and real-world examples, this episode offers a comprehensive guide for sales leaders and business owners aiming to optimize their sales strategies. Tune in now to learn from the best and take your sales team to the next level!

You can reach out to Steve Caton at Altezza Solutions - steve.caton@altezzasolutions.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/scaton/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by Steve Caton, CEO and Founder of Altezza Solutions. Steve shares his insights on how to build effective sales systems for emerging growth companies and provides a unique perspective on hiring part-time experienced salespeople. Dive into this episode to learn about the challenges and solutions in developing a robust sales strategy for small to mid-sized businesses.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Introduction to Steve Caton and Altezza Solutions (00:00:15)

* Steve discusses the inception of Altezza Solutions and his motivation behind starting the company.

Challenges of Hiring Salespeople for Emerging Companies (00:02:36)
- Steve talks about the common difficulties small companies face when hiring their first salesperson and offers an innovative part-time solution.
- Importance of Sales Infrastructure (00:04:55)
- The hosts and Steve explore the critical components of a sales infrastructure necessary for a sales team to thrive.
- Salesperson Integration and Training (00:11:44)
- Steve outlines a detailed onboarding process for new salespeople, emphasizing the first three months of integration.
- Preparing for Business Exits (00:07:12)
- Discussion on how business owners can enhance their company’s valuation by building a self-sufficient sales team before planning an exit.

Key Quotes * Steve Caton: “The convincing piece wasn’t as hard as I thought it would be because it was almost like the reaction was, ‘Dang, I never even thought about that. That makes a ton of sense.’” (00:03:58) * Kevin Lawson: “Sales organizations that are evolved, mature, robust, they attract talent...let's build the organization we all want to work for that attracts the right talent.” (00:10:15) * Sean O'Shaughnessey: “One of the challenges that I have heard from my business broker friends is that when the CEO is the salesperson...they really struggle with the selling of the company.” (00:06:53)

Summary Don't miss this enlightening episode with Steve Caton, where he shares invaluable advice on building a scalable sales infrastructure and the benefits of hiring part-time sales professionals. Whether you're a business owner looking to strengthen your sales team or a sales professional seeking new strategies, this episode offers practical insights and actionable steps. Tune in next week for more in-depth discussions with Steve on creating successful sales organizations.

You can reach out to Steve Caton at Altezza Solutions - steve.caton@altezzasolutions.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/scaton/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to a special edition of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with your hosts, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. As we celebrate Independence Day this week, we're bringing you a brief yet powerful episode filled with actionable sales insights and heartfelt holiday wishes. Whether you're relaxing with family or catching up on work, this episode is designed to give you a quick boost of sales motivation and inspiration.

Additional Resources:

Lighthouse Sales Advisors - https://www.lighthousesalesadvisors.com/
Lighthouse Sales Advisors Resources - https://www.lighthousesalesadvisors.com/salesresources
Sean's New Sales Expert Page - http://newsales.expert/
Sean’s Skin Knees Blog - http://newsales.expert/blog/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another enriching episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the art of sales with special guest Tom Daly from Focus Insights Group. In this episode, we explore the concept of servant leadership in sales and how giving more can ultimately lead to receiving more in business and personal growth.

Key Topics Discussed: * Servant Leadership in Sales [00:01:00 - 00:10:00]: Tom Daly discusses the importance of building productive referral networks and how servant leadership has helped him succeed in sales.

The Power of Giving Freely [00:05:00 - 00:08:00]: A detailed exploration of how giving without expecting immediate returns can foster long-term business relationships and personal satisfaction.
Balancing Generosity with Business Acumen [00:05:20 - 00:06:30]: Kevin probes the delicate balance between generosity and ensuring business viability.
Community and Collaboration [00:06:43 - 00:07:33]: The significance of a supportive community within the sales acceleration network, emphasizing collective success over individual gains.
Sales as a Helping Profession [00:08:21 - 00:09:52]: Sean reflects on the philosophy that sales should focus on helping and solving problems rather than just transactional interactions.

Key Quotes: * Kevin Lawson: "There's probably some who have given so much that they're not monetizing. They're probably actually even struggling to close deals." [00:05:20]

Tom Daly: "Sometimes the best thing we can do is really share that with others and say, you should give it a try." [00:01:50]
Sean O'Shaughnessey: "Stop selling and start helping. If salespeople just keep that as the philosophy, life will be better for everybody." [00:08:21]

Additional Resources: * Focus Insights Group website: http://www.focusinsightsgroup.com

The phrase "Stop selling and start helping" is often associated with Zig Ziglar, a renowned motivational speaker and sales trainer. This concept is central to his sales philosophy, which emphasizes building relationships and providing value as the cornerstone of sales success. Ziglar discusses this approach in several of his books, but it is most prominently featured in "Secrets of Closing the Sale." This book provides insights into how understanding and meeting the needs of others can enhance both personal and professional success in sales. https://a.co/d/00rz6fiR

Summary: This episode is a treasure trove for anyone looking to refine their sales approach through genuine connections and servant leadership. Tom Daly's insights, backed by Kevin and Sean's probing questions and observations, make it clear that in sales, sometimes giving freely helps build trust and opens up new avenues for growth and satisfaction. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting, this conversation will inspire you to think about sales more humanely and productively. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" to transform how you engage with clients and colleagues, fostering a community of mutual success and growth.

You can reach out to Tom Daly at Focus Insights Group & Sales Xceleration at - tdaly@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tom-d-4796bb/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in a compelling episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," which delves into the power of networking and relationship management in sales. Whether you are a seasoned sales professional or just starting, this episode offers invaluable insights into maximizing your sales ecosystem without overwhelming your contacts.

Key Topics Discussed: * Activating Your Network [00:00:00]: Kevin highlights the importance of leveraging existing relationships and simple, actionable strategies to enhance your sales pipeline. * Realistic Relationship Management [00:01:36]: Sean discusses the practical aspects of maintaining a manageable network that can drive business growth. * Frequency of Contact [00:04:54]: Explore how often to engage with your network, including referral partners and past customers, without becoming a nuisance. * Digital Communication vs. Personal Interaction [00:06:00]: This section dissects the balance between digital outreach and personal connection to optimize relationship value. * Segmenting Contacts [00:08:29]: Sean shares his method of categorizing contacts into A, B, and C lists to tailor communication frequency and maintain effectiveness.

Key Quotes: * Kevin: "Activating your network, your existing known sphere of influence, your sales ecosystem, your personal brand has connections to a lot of people." [00:00:29] * Sean: "You don't need thousands. You need tens of maybe hundreds of people that you are constantly having communication with." [00:03:01]

Summary: This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a treasure trove for anyone looking to refine their approach to sales networking. Kevin and Sean break down the art of maintaining relationships in a way that's both effective and respectful to your contacts' time. Their discussion provides practical steps and thought-provoking strategies to ensure you are not just another name in your clients' inboxes but a valued connection driving mutual growth. Tune in to discover how to make networking simple, actionable, and impactful. Don't miss this opportunity to transform your sales approach by strengthening the very relationships that define your success. Join Kevin and Sean as they guide you through optimizing your sales network for maximum return.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where our hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the complexities and strategies of sales. In this episode, they explore the nuanced dynamics of selling through distribution and understanding the real needs of your customers. Whether you're a seasoned sales veteran or just starting in your career, this episode offers a wealth of knowledge on refining your sales approach to maximize effectiveness and customer satisfaction.

Key Topics Discussed: 1. Selling Through Distribution: Sean shares his early career mistakes and the pivotal lessons of focusing beyond just the product features. 2. Understanding Your Customer's Needs: Strategies to grasp what the end-user truly requires from a product, rather than just its specifications. 3. The Importance of Simplicity in Sales: Kevin emphasizes how simplifying your sales message can vastly improve understanding and efficiency in sales processes. 4. Sales Training and Knowledge Transfer: Both hosts discuss how proper training and knowledge sharing with channel partners and sales teams can lead to better sales outcomes. 5. The Role of Value in Sales: How to communicate the unique value of a product or service to stand out in a competitive market. 6. Referral Partnerships and Networks: Sean elaborates on the significance of nurturing relationships with referral partners to enhance lead generation for smaller businesses.

Key Quotes: * Sean: "Don't just sell the drill, or the hole, sell what's going into the hole. Understanding what the salesperson needs to hear, not just the end consumer, transforms your approach." * Kevin: "Complex is the enemy of progress. In your sales life, focus on how the end-user will benefit from the product. This simplification is key."

Summary Join Kevin and Sean in a robust discussion that challenges conventional sales tactics and encourages a more thoughtful, value-oriented approach. This episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to enhance their sales strategies and truly understand the layers of effective selling. From refining your pitch to recognizing your true customer, the insights shared here are designed to transform your sales approach and propel your career forward. Don’t miss this opportunity to learn from the experts and make your sales efforts more impactful. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" for this and more transformative sales discussions.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales." This week, they welcome back Chris Goade from 360 Consulting in Dallas. Chris dives deep into the importance of customer retention and intentional engagement strategies. Discover how to transform average customers into great ones and learn practical techniques to elevate your sales game.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Defining Ideal Customers: Chris emphasizes the need for businesses to understand and define what makes a great customer, moving beyond just high revenue. 2. Intentional Customer Interactions: Pre-call planning and intentionality in customer meetings are important to foster deeper relationships and uncover more business opportunities. 3. Handling Customer Problems: How addressing and solving problems can turn challenging customers into loyal advocates. 4. Roadmapping Conversations: Strategies for sales leaders to guide their teams in having structured, meaningful conversations with clients. 5. Growing Existing Customers: Real-world examples of how focusing on existing customers can lead to significant business growth without new customer acquisition. 6. Salesperson Development: Techniques to help salespeople grow comfortable with engaging higher-level executives and having more strategic business conversations.

Key Quotes * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "Reaching out to existing clients and understanding their evolving needs opens up numerous opportunities for both the client and the business." * Chris Goade: "Every problem is an opportunity depending on how you handle it. Some of the best customers I've had were ones we solved big problems for." * Kevin Lawson: "Understanding your customer’s business through frameworks like PESTEL can dramatically improve the quality of your conversations."

Additional Resources * PESTEL Framework: Learn about analyzing the macro-environmental factors that impact a business. - https://blog.oxfordcollegeofmarketing.com/2016/06/30/pestel-analysis/ * Business Model Canvas: A strategic management tool for developing new or documenting existing business models. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Model_Canvas * Sales Xceleration Framework: Explore the framework that Chris Goade and his team use to manage and grow sales organizations. - https://salesxceleration.com/client-solutions/

Summary Chris Goade highlights the often-overlooked strategy of maximizing existing customer relationships in this episode. With practical advice and real-world examples, Chris, Kevin, and Sean discuss how intentionality, problem-solving, and strategic engagement can transform your sales approach. Whether you're a seasoned sales leader or new to the field, this episode is packed with actionable insights you won't want to miss. Tune in to elevate your sales strategy and achieve greater success with your current customer base.

You can reach out to Chris of 360 Consulting & Sales Xceleration - cgoade@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-goade-535b2831/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in this compelling episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," featuring seasoned sales acceleration advisor Chris Goade. As a pioneer in the field from Dallas-Fort Worth, Chris brings a wealth of experience from top companies like Dr. Pepper, PepsiCo, and 3M. Delve into the intricacies of building effective sales processes and learn firsthand about the transformative power of structured sales strategies.

Key Topics Discussed * Building Effective Sales Teams: How creating structured processes can accelerate sales performance. * Sales Process Fundamentals: Chris outlines the critical pillars of a successful sales process, including lead generation and customer relationship management. * Transitioning from Corporate to Consulting: Chris shares his journey from corporate sales to starting his own consulting business and the lessons learned. * The Evolution of Sales Tools and Techniques: Discussion on how sales strategies have adapted over time, especially in response to technological advancements. * Maintaining Customer Relationships: The importance of nurturing existing relationships to foster long-term business growth.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson: "Being a VP of sales should not just be about managing whether your team made their dials today—it's about much more substantial leadership roles."

Sean O'Shaughnessey: "There is no silver bullet in sales, just a lot of hard work and the right processes."

Chris Goade: "Every great sales organization has four key pillars."

Summary This episode sheds light on the foundational aspects of sales and emphasizes the transition from traditional to modern sales techniques, underpinned by robust processes and real-world experiences. Chris Goade's journey from corporate leadership to impactful consultancy provides invaluable lessons for sales professionals across all levels. If you aim to revamp your sales strategy or gain insights from a top sales advisor, this episode is a must-listen. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" for this enriching discussion, and stay tuned for more expert advice on enhancing your sales processes and customer relationships. Don't miss next week's episode, where Chris will delve deeper into maintaining long-term customer relationships.

You can reach out to Chris of 360 Consulting & Sales Xceleration - cgoade@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-goade-535b2831/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where we continue our vibrant discussion this week with special guest Tom Morgan, a former collegiate basketball coach turned sales strategy guru. Diving into the parallels between sports coaching and sales management, this episode is packed with strategic insights to enhance your sales team's performance as the quarter and year draw to a close.

Key Topics Discussed: 1. The Importance of Early and Ongoing Preparation: Starting strong from the beginning of the year or season sets teams up for success. 2. Fundamentals in Sports and Sales: A comparison of essential practices like the three-man weave in basketball to fundamental sales activities such as prospecting and client interaction. 3. Role of Support Players in Success: Discuss how each team member's effective execution of their role enhances overall performance. 4. Impact of Precision and Timing: The critical nature of precise actions and decisions in the closing moments of a game or sales quarter. 5. Role Clarity and Consistent Language in Sales Teams: How clear definitions and consistent communication within teams can streamline processes and improve outcomes. 6. Creative and Effective Role-Playing: Innovative approaches to role-playing that increase engagement and effectiveness in training sessions.

Key Quotes: * Kevin Lawson: "Doing the easy things well translates into doing the hard things more effectively." * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "The ability to do it over and over again, make mistakes in practice so that I didn't make that same mistake in the game." * Tom Morgan: "It's those fundamentals... You start to practice those key details. As you get into your sales process, those are the things when you get to the end of a quarter, you're relying on best practices."

Summary: Whether you're a sales novice or a seasoned leader, this episode offers invaluable lessons on preparation, practice, and execution that are crucial for any high-stakes environment, not just in sales or sports. Tom Morgan's expertise in translating athletic coaching techniques into sales strategies provides listeners practical tools and thoughtful strategies to elevate their teams' performance. Tune in to harness these techniques and ensure your team is ready and fundamentally conditioned for success at the quarter's end. Don't miss out on this game-changing discussion—perfect for anyone looking to enhance their strategic approach to sales management.

You can reach out to Tom at Breakthrough Sales Solutions LLC & Sales Xceleration - tmorgan@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tom-morgan-csl-sales-strategist-61a5489/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this engaging episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome special guest Tom Morgan from Sales Xceleration. Join us as Tom shares intriguing insights from his vast experience in optimizing sales teams by drawing compelling parallels between youth sports coaching and sales management. Broadcasting all the way from Portland, Maine, Tom brings a fresh perspective on effective sales strategies and team dynamics.

Key Topics Discussed: * Youth Sports and Sales Dynamics: Tom discusses how early coaching experiences with youth sports like soccer and basketball can mirror the strategies used in sales team management. * Role Clarity in Sales: The conversation dives into the importance of defining clear roles within sales teams to avoid the "bumblebee soccer" chaos of everyone chasing the same goal without a strategy. * Optimizing Small Sales Teams: Tom provides actionable advice on managing and maximizing the efficiency of small sales teams through role alignment and daily standups. * Strategic Alignment with Team Strengths: Insights into aligning sales team members with roles that match their strengths and interests to maximize performance. * Importance of Daily Standup Meetings: The significance of daily meetings to set clear objectives and ensure team alignment is discussed, drawing parallels to sports coaching practices.

Key Quotes: * Kevin Lawson: "When you talk about lack of role clarity, it's like coaching a young soccer team. It really rears its ugly head in the day in and day out of sales." * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "Leveraging small teams effectively is crucial, as they lack the breadth and depth of larger corporate teams. How we coach through that is essential." * Tom Morgan: "In a sales team, just like in sports, getting the right people into the right roles based on their strengths and interests is crucial for success."

Summary: Dive into this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales to uncover how the principles of coaching, team dynamics, and strategic play in sports can be effectively translated into building winning sales teams. Whether you're a CEO, a seasoned sales leader, or a new salesperson, this discussion will equip you with practical strategies to enhance role clarity and drive team performance. Don't miss out on these valuable insights—tune in now to transform your sales approach and achieve new heights in your sales career.

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Welcome to this week’s episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by Chris Cocca, a sales expert, to discuss the vital aspects of discovery meetings and qualifying prospects for a robust sales pipeline. Tune in as they delve into the methodologies that distinguish successful sales strategies, particularly focusing on the RAIN training concept and the essential practice of understanding client aspirations and afflictions.

Key Topics Discussed:

RAIN Training and Strategic Selling: Chris Cocca shares insights into how RAIN training complements traditional strategic selling concepts, helping salespeople better understand where their clients currently are and where they aim to be.
Aspirations and Afflictions: The discussion highlights the importance of understanding clients' aspirations and afflictions to maximize the perceived value of offered solutions.
Gap Analysis in Sales: Kevin underscores the importance of gap analysis in sales processes, emphasizing how salespeople should position themselves as solutions within the business context.
The Role of CRM Systems: Chris stresses the significance of CRM systems in capturing and utilizing quality data for sales success, illustrating how technology underpins effective sales strategies.
Role-Playing for Sales Training: A discussion on the practical application of role-playing exercises as a method to enhance sales personnel's discovery skills.
The Importance of Proper Discovery: Sean wraps up the discussion by reinforcing the necessity of a well-executed discovery process, which is crucial for improving sales outcomes.

Key Quotes:

Kevin Lawson: "I love that you're tying the gap analysis because as salespeople, we need to be thinking about that gap because it's the, where do I fit into this business as a solution?"
Sean O'Shaughnessey: "Practice makes easy for asking discovery questions. Asking those business-related questions. Curious how you do that."
Chris Cocca: "The further apart that those aspirations and afflictions are, the more value you can show because you've got a lot to work with. If that gap is really narrow and you don't define that really well, guess what happens? It's all about price."

Additional Resources:

"Strategic Selling" by Miller Heiman https://a.co/d/6qJH9ME
RAIN Sales Training Platform https://salesxceleration.com/news-events/transform-your-sales-performance-with-rain-group-and-sales-xceleration/

Summary:

This episode is a treasure trove of insights for any sales professional looking to sharpen their discovery skills and improve their sales strategy. From understanding the critical role of CRM systems to mastering the art of asking the right questions during client meetings, our guests cover it all. Whether you're a seasoned sales leader or a new salesperson, this discussion offers valuable techniques that can be immediately implemented to enhance your sales process and ultimately drive better results. Don’t miss out—listen now and transform your sales approach!

Join us next week for more insightful discussions on Two Tall Guys Talking Sales.

You can reach out to Chris at Chris Cocca Strategic Sales & Sales Xceleration - ccocca@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/chriscocca1/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this invigorating episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the crucial nuances of discovery meetings with the seasoned sales leader, Chris Cocca. They explore why many deals falter at this stage and how refining the process can dramatically enhance sales outcomes. Tune in to gain deep insights on optimizing discovery meetings to ensure you're not just participating but capitalizing on these opportunities.

Key Topics Discussed:

Understanding Discovery Meetings: A primer on what constitutes a discovery meeting and its pivotal role in sales.
Common Pitfalls in Discovery: Chris Cocca discusses the frequent missteps that lead to lost deals post-discovery, emphasizing the need for thorough preparation and engagement.
Refining the Process: Strategies for new and seasoned sales professionals to craft effective discovery processes within their organizations.
Probing Beyond Surface-Level: Techniques for digging deeper during these meetings to uncover clients' real needs and pain points.
Impact Questions: How to frame questions that reveal the true impact of solutions on a client’s business, which are essential for closing deals.
Managing Multiple Discovery Meetings: This section discusses the feasibility and strategic approach to conducting more than one discovery meeting, depending on the deal size.

Key Quotes:

Kevin Lawson: “9 out of 10 losses are a result of a miss during the discovery stage. This implies a critical look at our processes and the necessity for thorough post-mortems on losses.”
Sean O'Shaughnessey: “It’s hard to pre-write the third and fourth questions because they are unique to each opportunity. How do you coach your salespeople to dig deeper?”
Chris Cocca: “The first answer is never the full answer. You've got to probe deeper. It's about asking the right impact questions to truly understand the client's pain and needs.”

Summary:

Don’t miss this compelling episode where Kevin, Sean, and Chris dissect the art of the discovery meeting—a stage where many promising deals are lost. Discover actionable strategies to refine your approach, ask the right questions, and ultimately, secure a successful outcome. Whether you're a rookie in sales or a seasoned veteran, this discussion will equip you with the insights to transform your discovery process and achieve better alignment with client needs. Tune in now to ensure your next discovery meeting paves the way to a closed deal, not a missed opportunity!

Remember to download this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales to hear the full conversation and improve your sales strategies today!

You can reach out to Chris at Chris Cocca Strategic Sales & Sales Xceleration - ccocca@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/chriscocca1/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this insightful episode, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey discuss common pitfalls in sales management and strategies for maintaining customer relationships through effective tools like CRM systems. If you’ve ever missed a deal due to a forgotten follow-up or struggled with customer engagement, this episode is packed with practical advice to enhance your sales processes and hit your targets consistently.

Key Topics Discussed * The Importance of Follow-up: How missing follow-ups can impact sales and solutions to prevent these issues. * Effective Use of CRM Systems: Exploring how CRM systems can streamline operations and ensure nothing slips through the cracks. * Project Management and Deadline Adherence: Discussing the critical role of timely project delivery in sales success. * Real-world Sales Challenges: Analyzing scenarios from retail and construction to understand complex sales dynamics. * Building Lasting Customer Relationships: Strategies for staying top of mind without being overtly sales-driven. * Tools vs. Human Effort in Sales: Balancing technology and personal effort in managing customer relationships.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson: "There's nobody else accountable for that but me and my brain. I've missed a quarterly quota because I wasn't diligent and thoughtful enough about my follow-up."

Sean O'Shaughnessey: "We need to just take care of our customers. Embracing the value of a CRM system is crucial because today, most of us don't have someone taking care of all the details for us."

Kevin Lawson: "If you're not asking your clients, 'When do you need this by?' or 'How much do you need at what time?' then you’re not really managing your sales effectively."

Summary Whether you’re a seasoned sales professional or just starting out, this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a treasure trove of knowledge. Kevin and Sean tackle the realities of sales management, from the undeniable benefits of using CRM systems to ensuring punctuality in project deadlines. They share personal anecdotes and real-world examples that highlight common mistakes and pitfalls and offer actionable solutions to enhance your sales strategy. Tune in to learn how to leverage technology to boost your sales performance and build stronger, lasting customer relationships. Don't miss out on transforming your sales approach—listen to this episode today!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this enlightening episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey continue their engaging dialogue with Marc Metz, a seasoned expert in the sales and business transition arena. Building on the momentum of their previous conversation, they delve into the intricacies of transitioning a business through an Employee Stock Ownership Plan (ESOP). Marc shares firsthand experiences and practical insights, making this a must-listen for business owners contemplating a transition that rewards employees and preserves the company's legacy.

Key Topics Discussed * The ESOP Transition Model: An exploration of the ESOP as a unique strategy for business transition, focusing on its structure, benefits, and challenges. Marc shares a compelling case study of a construction company making this significant shift. * Management and Structural Challenges: Discusses the critical need for a clear management structure post-transition, emphasizing the importance of placing the right people in the right positions and avoiding the pitfalls of rapid corporatization. * Preparation and Strategy: Offers valuable advice on preparing for an ESOP transition, including the slow and deliberate evaluation of candidates for leadership roles within the new ownership structure. * Sales Team Dynamics Post-Transition: Examines the role of the sales team during and after the transition to employee ownership, highlighting strategies to rejuvenate and realign sales efforts with the company’s new direction.

Key Quotes * Kevin: "It's interesting that we talk about helping people avoid landmines. So Sean and I use a lot of our past experience to talk about where we skinned our knees so that others don't have to." * Sean: "I'm a big believer in three salespeople become four, four become five, five becomes six. And you use that existing run rate that you got from the first three, first four, first five to pay for that next one. And you grow profitably by doing that." * Marc: "Go slow. I'll tell you one thing is if the owner can do it three to five years before they're actually ready to sell, it's going to provide dividends to them and they're going to have a better multiple more money in their pocket."

Additional Resources * Traction by Gino Wickman: Recommended reading for listeners interested in understanding the EOS model and the GWC concept (Get it, Want it, Capacity to do it) that Marc references during the discussion. https://a.co/d/eE4MhQj

Summary For any business owner pondering the path to employee ownership, this episode offers a wealth of knowledge, cautionary tales, and strategic advice. Through Marc Metz's experienced lens, listeners gain an understanding of the ESOP model's complexities, the importance of careful planning and execution, and the pivotal role of sales leadership in navigating a business's transition. Whether you're in the early stages of considering an ESOP or looking to optimize your sales team post-transition, this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is an invaluable resource. Tune in to equip yourself with the insights needed to ensure a smooth and successful transition to employee ownership.

You can reach out to Marc Metz at https://www.linkedin.com/in/new-sales-marc-metz/ and mmetz@salesxceleration.com

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this riveting episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome a special guest, Marc Metz, President of Optimus Sales Group. Together, they delve into the critical yet often overlooked topic of business transitions, providing invaluable insights and strategies for companies navigating the journey from one generation to the next. This episode is a treasure trove of knowledge for business owners, sales leaders, and anyone involved in the business's lifecycle.

Key Topics Discussed * Business Transition Strategies: Marc Metz shares his expertise on the three main ways businesses transition: selling to an outsider, passing on to family members, and employee stock ownership programs. Each method comes with its unique set of challenges and opportunities. * Overcoming Overvaluation and Sales Dependencies: A common stumbling block for businesses pre-sale is the overvaluation of the company and the heavy reliance on the owner for sales. Metz discusses strategies to realign expectations and decentralize sales efforts. * The Importance of Building a Business to Sell: Metz emphasizes the critical nature of preparing a business for sale from day one. This involves creating robust systems and processes that ensure the business can thrive independently of the current owner. * Sales Team Dynamics in Transitions: The discussion highlights the potential pitfalls and strategies around managing key sales personnel during a transition, ensuring their loyalty, and maintaining sales momentum under new ownership.

Key Quotes * Kevin: "How do they, get ready to get ready to sell? If they wake up tomorrow and say, I want to sell by April, they might be, might be challenged. But if they wake up and say in a few Aprils, in a few years from now. What might the recipe be that you would prescribe because you've been there done that?" * Sean: "So I want to build on this topic a little bit more. Let's play the scenario out. ... It's just a good employee. Been around, been very loyal to the company. ... And now you're trying to sell that. So I'm, I'm foreseeing a problem of if I'm a buyer of that business, I'm saying, well, how loyal is that one salesperson?" * Marc: "The first exercise I recommend to these guys and gals is hey, look what happens if you get hit by a bus tomorrow? What's going to happen to your business? Think about that and start putting things in place That'll mitigate that risk because that's the very very first thing and I'm talking all aspects operations sales financial, all of those things, look at everything."

Summary Whether you're a business owner contemplating the future, a sales leader navigating changes, or simply interested in the dynamics of business transitions, this episode is a must-listen. Kevin, Sean, and Marc provide a rich discussion filled with actionable advice, real-world experiences, and strategic insights designed to equip you with the tools you need to navigate the complex landscape of business transitions. Don't miss this opportunity to learn from the experts and ensure the legacy and longevity of your business. Tune into this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales for a deep dive into preparing your business for the next chapter.

You can reach out to Marc Metz at https://www.linkedin.com/in/new-sales-marc-metz/ and mmetz@salesxceleration.com

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this engaging episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," we're treated to an insightful session with Enrico Parodi, a seasoned sales consultant with a rich international background and a passion for transforming sales organizations. With host Sean O'Shaughnessey guiding the conversation, listeners are invited to explore the nuanced world of sales strategies, focusing on developing the ideal client profile and crafting an effective sales coverage model.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Importance of an Ideal Client Profile: Enrico stresses the significance of targeting the market segment where a company's chances of success are highest. Identifying and understanding the ideal customer is crucial for solving their problems effectively and differentiating oneself in the competitive landscape.
Crafting an Effective Sales Coverage Model: The discussion delves into the optimal structuring of a sales team to pursue business goals efficiently. Enrico emphasizes the need for a blend of specialized roles and skills within a sales organization tailored to different sales process stages, from business development to closing complex deals.
Balancing Skills and Roles in Small Sales Teams: Addressing the challenges faced by companies with limited sales personnel, Enrico and Sean explore strategies for dividing responsibilities among team members. They discuss leveraging referrals, partnerships, and marketing functions to optimize the sales process without overburdening salespeople.
Utilizing CRM Systems for Referral Tracking: The conversation highlights innovative uses of CRM systems to effectively manage and nurture referral networks. Companies can foster relationships that drive growth and success by categorizing contacts as potential customers and influential partners.
The Power of Networking and Referrals: Enrico advocates for a proactive approach to building a network of referral sources. By engaging with industry associations and establishing partnerships, sales teams can generate warm leads that significantly increase the chances of closing deals.

Key Quotes:

Enrico Parodi: "If you want to achieve your business goals, you need to go after the part of the market where you have the highest chances for success."

Summary: This episode offers a treasure trove of wisdom for sales professionals and business leaders alike. Enrico Parodi, with his deep expertise and practical approach, along with Sean O'Shaughnessey's thoughtful probing, unveils the keys to sculpting a sales strategy that identifies the ideal customer and aligns the sales force effectively to pursue those targets. Whether you're part of a small team looking to maximize resources or a seasoned sales leader seeking fresh insights, this discussion is a must-listen for anyone eager to elevate their sales game.

You can reach out to Enrico Parodi at https://www.linkedin.com/in/enricoparodi/ and eparodi@salesxceleration.com

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey on "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" for another enriching episode, this time featuring the insightful Tom Daly from Focus Insights Group. Building on the momentum of our previous conversation last episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Tom delves deeper into the world of sales, sharing his expertise on nurturing new talent and guiding companies to refine their sales strategies for sustained success. Whether you're a fledgling salesperson or a seasoned executive, Tom's advice is bound to enlighten and inspire.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Transitioning from Pitch Person to Business Leader: Tom offers invaluable advice for new sales professionals on how to evolve from knowing just the features and benefits of their products to becoming strategic business advisors to their clients. 2. The Importance of a Structured Onboarding Program: Emphasizing the critical role of a meticulously planned onboarding process to ensure new salespeople are set up for success from day one. 3. Role of Sales Management in Nurturing New Talent: Discussion on how sales managers should not just be top sales producers but mentors who demonstrate, guide, and provide constructive feedback to their teams. 4. Building a Sales Strategy: Tom underlines the necessity for sales managers to have a clear, actionable sales strategy aligned with the company's business plan to drive success. 5. Sales as a Business Management Function: Reinforcing the concept that effective sales management is synonymous with astute business management, focusing on strategic planning and execution.

Key Quotes Tom Daley:

"You have to demonstrate. Then you have to do it. Then you have to have somebody try it, then you have to critique them and then you have to show them again and rinse and repeat."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"I really try to teach my salespeople to think like a business person. It helps them a lot when they start to negotiate because now we can negotiate like a business person as opposed to a salesperson that wants a commission check."

Kevin Lawson:

"Practice makes easy, not practice makes perfect. Practice makes easy because, man, I love your phrase. It's an unnatural human behavior to start cold calling."

Additional Resources * Sales Xceleration: Tom's brand and passion, offering sales optimization services. - www.salesxceleration.com * Focus Insights Group, LLC: Learn more about Tom's consultancy, aiding clients to achieve their best sales year. - Focus Insights Group, LLC

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" with Tom Daly has been a deep dive into the art and science of building a successful sales career and managing a sales team effectively. Tom's seasoned perspective sheds light on the transition from being a pitch-focused salesperson to a strategic business advisor, offering actionable strategies for salespeople at every stage of their career. With a focus on the importance of structured onboarding, the critical role of sales management, and the development of a solid sales strategy, this conversation is a treasure trove for anyone looking to elevate their sales game.

If you're a new salesperson looking to make your mark, a sales manager aiming to nurture your team, or a CEO striving for sales excellence, this episode is packed with wisdom you won't want to miss. Download now and start transforming your sales approach today.

You can reach out to Tom Daly at Focus Insights Group - https://salesxceleration.bullseyelocations.com/salesxceleration/greater%20orlando%20area/fl/tom-daly--greater%20orlando%20area-fl-29820526 - tdaly@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tom-d-4796bb/

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In this sports-oriented episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive into the fascinating parallels between March Madness NCAA basketball tournaments and sales strategies. Kevin and Sean take this opportunity to explore how the tournament's structure and the season leading up to it offer valuable lessons for developing winning sales strategies.

Key Topics Discussed: 1. Preseason Preparation and Regular Season: The significance of constant improvement and team synergy throughout the sales season to refine strategies, similar to a basketball team's journey to the NCAA tournament. 2. Tournament Strategy and Sales Planning: Drawing analogies from the NCAA's regional competitions and seed rankings to sales approaches, market positioning, and competitive analysis. 3. Winning the Customer Relationship: Identifying the final sales deal as the 'national championship game,' focusing on strategic planning and execution to win customer trust and secure business. 4. Overcoming Adversity and Learning from Losses: The importance of analyzing lost sales opportunities (akin to unexpected tournament upsets) to understand and improve future sales tactics. 5. Sales Team Dynamics and Individual Growth: Encouraging personal development and adapting roles within the sales team for optimal performance, paralleled with a basketball team’s adjustment to injuries and game dynamics.

Key Quotes: * "The trophy in sales is the customer relationship." - Kevin Lawson * "Only one team ends the season with a victory; similarly, in sales, there's only one winner." - Sean O'Shaughnessey * "It's important to win through better execution of the plan... and hard work." - Sean O'Shaughnessey * "We've got to figure out our place in the market... It's the same progression in business." - Kevin Lawson

Additional Resources: MEDDPICCC for sales strategy and the importance of opportunity qualification - https://youtu.be/RBcGmyeBp1I?si=gaGL1CWYbEKxFbVr

Summary: This episode is a masterclass for sales professionals and leaders looking to elevate their game by drawing inspiration from the structure, strategy, and spirit of March Madness. Kevin and Sean's dialogue serves as a reminder of the importance of preparation, strategy, resilience, and continuous learning in the quest to win in sales. As the NCAA tournament captivates basketball fans, let it also inspire sales teams to strive for excellence, adapt to challenges, and ultimately clinch their championship trophy: a successful and lasting customer relationship.

Tune in for a mix of sports enthusiasm and sales wisdom, and don't miss next week's episode, where Tom Daly shares his expertise on sales growth. You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Dive into the world of sales with "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey engage in a candid conversation with Tom Daly from Focus Insights Group. This episode, rich with insights and anecdotes, peels back the layers of what makes or breaks sales strategies, highlighting the crucial elements of successful sales encounters. Join us as Tom shares his wealth of experience, offering invaluable advice to sales novices and veterans alike on how to excel in the sales domain.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Journey from Sales Novice to Expert: Tom reflects on the early, often challenging days of sales, underscoring the importance of mentorship and learning. 2. Aligning Sales with Business Goals: How to ensure sales strategies are not only effective but also align with broader business objectives. 3. The Role of a Salesperson as a Business Advisor: Moving beyond the traditional sales role to become an indispensable partner to clients. 4. Building Trust and Credibility in Sales: Strategies for salespeople to become trusted advisors, leading to long-term client relationships and referrals. 5. The Importance of Process and Structure in Sales: Tom emphasizes the need for a disciplined approach to sales, akin to accounting, for scalability and predictability. 6. Advice for CEOs on Sales Process Management: Insights on how CEOs can foster a more structured and effective sales process within their organizations.

Key Quotes Tom Daly:

"The professionals that are awesome at sales, they just simply like helping. And they like helping people in a critical way where they can't help themselves."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"Sales is about transferring trust... It's easier to transfer trust when it's your company. It's harder when you're a salesperson."

Kevin Lawson:

"Understanding your market and understanding your value proposition is really important. When you marry those together... you become that trusted advisor."

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" delves into the essence of successful selling, from the foundational days of learning the ropes to mastering the art of becoming a business advisor rather than just a salesperson. Tom Daly, with his extensive experience and passion for sales, shares practical advice on how salespeople can truly make a difference by focusing on their clients' needs and dreams. Whether you're a budding salesperson looking to improve your skills or a CEO striving for sales excellence within your organization, this conversation offers a trove of insights and strategies to help you achieve your goals.

Tune in to this episode for a compelling dive into effective sales practices with Tom Daley, and discover how to transform your sales approach from transactional to transformational.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey continue their conversation with Chris Spanier, a seasoned marketing expert and the founder of Carpe Diem Consulting Group. Building on the momentum from last week's discussion on storytelling and marketing alignment, Chris delves deeper into strategies for small businesses aiming to enhance their sales and marketing focus without the luxury of a large budget. Tune in to discover actionable advice for fostering a productive partnership between sales and marketing teams and driving company growth.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Budget Discipline Across Business Sizes: Chris emphasizes the importance of budget discipline, whether in a small business or a corporate setting, and the need for strategic alignment between sales and marketing. 2. Building Sales and Marketing Synergy: Insight into initiating fruitful conversations between sales and marketing to identify common goals, target audiences, and strategies for mutual success. 3. Tactics for Limited Budgets: Practical approaches for small businesses to test marketing strategies efficiently and affordably, including rapid iteration and leveraging insights for improvement. 4. The Importance of Sales and Marketing Collaboration: Chris discusses the transformative impact of sales and marketing working in harmony, sharing a real-life example of this partnership leading to significant business success. 5. Advice for CEOs on Differentiating Sales and Marketing: Tips for company leaders to understand the distinct roles of sales and marketing, fostering a collaborative rather than hierarchical relationship.

Key Quotes Chris Spanier:

"When sales and marketing start talking together, and they start planning and supporting each other, then suddenly, it's like, you're not the enemy. You're actually an incredible asset and an ally."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"Marketing and sales are partners in this journey of customer acquisition and revenue growth, not a hand-off relationship."

Kevin Lawson:

"What do you wish we as salespeople would ask you first before we say, how are you getting us more leads?"

Additional Resources * Carpe Diem Consulting Group: Chris Spanier's marketing consultancy that serves as a bridge for small to medium-sized businesses seeking to establish or enhance their marketing efforts. - https://www.carpediemconsultinggroup.com/

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is essential listening for small business owners, sales leaders, and marketing professionals striving for growth in a competitive marketplace. Chris Spanier shares invaluable insights on making the most of limited budgets, the critical importance of sales and marketing collaboration, and strategic approaches to achieving company-wide success. Through real-life examples and practical advice, Chris, Kevin, and Sean illuminate a path forward for businesses looking to cultivate a powerful synergy between sales and marketing. Don't miss this opportunity to learn from a marketing expert dedicated to helping companies seize the day and achieve their goals.

Ready to transform your sales and marketing strategy? Download this episode now for expert guidance on driving profitability and growth in your business. You can reach out to Chris Spanier at Carpe Diem Consulting Group - https://www.carpediemconsultinggroup.com/ - chris@carpediemcg.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/cspanier/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this enlightening episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome Chris Spanier, a marketing maven with deep expertise in fostering collaboration between sales and marketing teams. Chris shares his insights on building synergy around B2B sales cycles and how to effectively align sales and marketing efforts for maximum impact. Join us as we delve into the dynamics of this crucial partnership and uncover strategies for achieving mutual success.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Bridging the Gap Between Sales and Marketing: Chris emphasizes the importance of sales and marketing teams working in harmony, rather than at odds, to capitalize on every opportunity. 2. The Power of Collaboration: Insights into how open communication and shared goals can transform sales and marketing teams into formidable allies. 3. Storytelling as a Sales and Marketing Tool: The discussion highlights how compelling narratives can engage prospects and reflect their needs, ultimately driving success. 4. Feedback Loops and Iterative Improvement: Chris advocates for continuous dialogue between sales and marketing to refine strategies and better serve customers. 5. The Role of Leadership in Fostering Unity: Exploring how leadership can motivate sales and marketing teams to work together through shared incentives and aligned objectives.

Key Quotes Chris Spanier:

"It's just so powerful when you have sales and marketing coming alongside together and working together. It's just great."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"Marketing and sales are partners. One is not the customer of the other; they're partners in this journey of customer acquisition."

Kevin Lawson:

"Can you dig in, get a handhold on how storytelling has a major role in how we go to market, whether you have an internal or external [marketing department]?"

Additional Resources * The Story Brand by Donald Miller: Recommended reading for understanding the impact of storytelling in marketing and sales. - https://a.co/d/j7bFMOx * Simon Sinek's "Find Your Why": A guide to discovering the purpose that drives you and your business. - https://a.co/d/8vJWo7O

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a must-listen for anyone involved in the intricate dance between sales and marketing. Chris Spanier sheds light on the significance of unity and collaboration for achieving common business goals. Through a blend of personal anecdotes and actionable advice, Chris, Kevin, and Sean explore how storytelling, shared objectives, and regular feedback can transform the relationship between sales and marketing into a dynamic partnership. Whether you're a sales manager, marketing director, or CEO, this conversation offers valuable insights on aligning your teams for success.

Tune in to discover how you can leverage the combined strengths of your sales and marketing teams to drive growth and create meaningful customer relationships. Download this episode now and start building a more cohesive, effective approach to your business strategy. You can reach out to Chris Spanier at Carpe Diem Consulting Group - https://www.carpediemconsultinggroup.com/ - chris@carpediemcg.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/cspanier/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey on "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" for a captivating conversation with special guest Jeff Clair, a fractional VP of sales and the brain behind ClairVoyant Consulting LLC. In this episode, Jeff shares his invaluable insights on the power of storytelling in sales, offering practical tips for salespeople to engage and connect with their prospects effectively. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or new to the field, this discussion is packed with advice to elevate your sales approach through compelling storytelling.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Art of Storytelling in Sales: Jeff emphasizes the importance of storytelling as a memorable and impactful way to communicate with prospects. 2. Remembering and Crafting Stories: Insights into how salespeople can remember and craft stories that resonate with their audience, making the prospect the hero of the story. 3. The Role of Salespeople as Guides: Drawing parallels from popular movies, Jeff illustrates how salespeople should position themselves as guides in their storytelling, akin to characters like Yoda in "Star Wars." 4. Practicing Storytelling: The significance of practicing storytelling within sales teams, including role-playing exercises to refine this skill. 5. Connecting Stories to the Buyer's Journey: Jeff connects the dots on how storytelling fits into the buyer's journey, providing a framework for new and seasoned sales professionals to enhance their sales strategies. 6. Role-Playing and Feedback: An exploration of effective training techniques, including role-playing, to help salespeople become more engaging and confident storytellers.

Key Quotes Jeff Clair:

"People tend not to remember the facts, but they remember stories...great storytellers infuse different senses, which is really great."

Kevin Lawson:

"Practice makes easy. Not practice makes perfect...there's always room for improvement."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"Practice allows you to figure out how to do it better...those people in small organizations tend not to practice enough."

Additional Resources * The Story Brand by Donald Miller: Recommended reading for salespeople and marketing professionals to master the art of storytelling in business.

Summary This insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" dives deep into the transformative role of storytelling in the sales process. Jeff Clair, with his rich experience in sales leadership, shares why stories captivate, how to craft them effectively, and the importance of salespeople seeing themselves as guides for their prospects. Through role-playing and practice, Jeff underscores the significance of confidence and personalization in storytelling, ensuring that each story resonates deeply with the intended audience. This discussion is a must-listen for anyone looking to harness the power of storytelling to not just sell, but to connect and inspire action.

Elevate your sales game with the art of storytelling. Download this episode now and transform how you engage with your prospects.

You can reach out to Jeff Clair at ClairVoyant Consulting & Sales Xceleration - https://salesxceleration.bullseyelocations.com/salesxceleration/advisors/jeff-clair/26869400 - jclair@clairvoyantconsulting.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffclair/ You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Dive into the world of sales excellence with "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," as hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey welcome Jeff Clair from ClairVoyant Consulting LLC. In this compelling episode, Jeff, a seasoned fractional VP of Sales, shares his East Coast insights into overcoming common sales challenges, utilizing innovative strategies, and enhancing the sales process. Join us as we explore the nuances of sales from different regional perspectives, offering valuable advice for sales professionals across the spectrum.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Importance of a Defined Sales Process: Jeff emphasizes the critical role of having a structured sales process and how the lack of one can lead to salespeople 'winging it.' 2. Utilizing CRM for Sales Success: The discussion highlights how CRM tools can delineate sales stages, aiding salespeople in navigating from lead generation to closing. 3. Referral Strategies: The panel delves into the potential of referrals in sales and why many salespeople hesitate to ask for them, missing out on valuable opportunities. 4. Closing Techniques and Challenges: Jeff shares insights into the common hurdles salespeople face when closing deals and the strategic importance of asking the right questions. 5. The Power of Storytelling in Sales: Jeff advocates for storytelling as a technique to connect with prospects, positioning them as the 'hero' of their journey with your product or service. 6. Guidance over Selling: The notion that successful salespeople guide rather than sell to their prospects, encouraging sales teams to adopt a consultative approach.

Key Quotes Jeff Clair:

"Nobody really sells people anything...successful salespeople identify needs, desires, wants, and then satisfies those needs, desires, or wants with the product that they have."

Kevin Lawson:

"Facts tell and stories sell...we're going to unpack how stories sell in our next episode."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"A salesperson is a guide...they are experts in selling their product. The prospect probably is not an expert in buying that thing."

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a treasure trove for anyone looking to sharpen their sales skills. With Jeff Clair's expertise, the discussion sheds light on critical aspects of the sales process, from the initial lead generation to the final close. By addressing the common pitfalls salespeople encounter and offering strategies to overcome them, Jeff, Kevin, and Sean provide listeners with actionable advice to elevate their sales game. Whether you're a seasoned VP of Sales or a sales professional looking to improve your approach, this episode is packed with insights that can transform your sales strategy and lead to greater success. Tune in to learn how to navigate the sales process with confidence, leverage your CRM effectively, and harness the power of storytelling to connect with your prospects on a deeper level.

You can reach out to Jeff Clair at ClairVoyant Consulting & Sales Xceleration - https://salesxceleration.bullseyelocations.com/salesxceleration/advisors/jeff-clair/26869400 - jclair@clairvoyantconsulting.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffclair/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this enlightening episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the perennial challenges sales professionals face: the need for more leads and adding value to existing leads. They share their expert insights on building robust sales pipelines, identifying ideal customer profiles, and effective strategies for increasing sales efficiency. Whether you're a CEO, sales manager, or a salesperson, this episode offers valuable guidance to enhance your sales performance.

Key Topics Discussed 1. Building a More Robust Pipeline: Strategies to improve pipeline quality for sustained income generation. 2. Ideal Customer Profiling: Understanding the difference between short-term accessible prospects and long-term ideal customers. 3. Resource Management: Tackling the universal challenge of limited resources in sales organizations. 4. Prospecting Techniques: The importance of referrals, networking, and leveraging platforms like LinkedIn. 5. Prioritizing Sales Efforts: Focusing on the probability of closing deals rather than just deal size or closing dates. 6. Consistency in Sales Activities: How regular, focused efforts in different stages of sales lead to better results.

Key Quotes Kevin Lawson:

"We actually encourage them to manage their deals and their communication priorities by the probability of closing... When all these things come together, it's insane how fast your pipeline will grow and how fast deals will close."

Sean O'Shaughnessey:

"You have to be stingy. You have to choose where to invest appropriately, and you have to constantly invest... Every quarter, every month, every week, every day, you need to set aside time that you are investing in your business."

Summary This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a goldmine for anyone looking to enhance their sales process. Kevin and Sean offer a deep dive into the nuances of building a strong sales pipeline, effectively utilizing resources, and the art of prioritizing prospects. Their conversation is not just theoretical; it's filled with practical, actionable advice that can be implemented immediately. This episode is a must-listen if you're seeking to transform your sales approach, be it as a CEO, a sales manager, or a frontline salesperson. Tune in to discover how you can revolutionize your sales strategy and achieve remarkable results.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" with hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. In this episode, we delve into the nuances of building a robust sales pipeline, focusing on creating a team of buyers rather than sellers. This discussion is crucial for sales leaders, managers, and salespeople across various industries, whether involved in enterprise sales, repetitive sales, consumable sales, or professional services.

Key Topics Discussed:

Building Multi-Threaded Relationships: The importance of establishing connections with multiple decision-makers and influencers in the client's organization.
Strategies for New Salespeople: Tactics for entering new territories and identifying potential clients.
The Role of Sales Leaders: How sales managers can support their team in expanding their client base and building a more robust sales pipeline.
Understanding the Buying Committee: Navigating through the dynamics of group decision-making in sales.
Effective Pipeline Management: Strategies for maintaining and enriching the sales pipeline throughout the year.
The Power of Referrals and Trust: Leveraging trust and referrals to enhance sales effectiveness.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "It's not about how complex our questions need to be to get crazy insightful answers... it's really about doing the simple things well."
Sean: "Don't just focus on the VP or director... remember that every influencer in the organization will sway that top person."

Additional Resources:

RACI - https://www.forbes.com/advisor/business/raci-chart/
MEDDPICCC sales methodology for identifying key decision-makers and influencers - http://newsales.expert/2023/10/unlocking-sales-potential-with-meddpiccc-a-comprehensive-guide/
The concept of the Power Matrix in sales - https://www.thetrapper.com/2021/11/18/welcome-to-the-power-matrix/

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean provide valuable insights into building a successful sales pipeline, emphasizing the importance of multi-threaded relationships and understanding the dynamics of the buying committee. They offer practical strategies for new and experienced sales professionals and guidance for sales leaders on supporting their teams. This episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to enhance their sales process and achieve better results in their sales endeavors. Join us next week for more on building quality relationships and effective pipeline management in sales.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the challenges and strategies of breaking into new territories, especially in consumable sales. This episode is a treasure trove of wisdom for salespeople and leaders navigating the competitive landscape of selling products that are regularly consumed by customers. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting in a new territory, this episode offers valuable insights into crafting successful sales strategies.

Key Topics Discussed:

Strategies for New Salespeople in Established Territories: Understanding how to enter and grow in a territory with established competition.
Importance of Being a Trusted Advisor: The role of salespeople in becoming integral to their customers' operations and decision-making processes.
Selling Beyond the Product: Emphasizing the value of the salesperson and the company in addition to the product itself.
Differentiating in a Competitive Market: How to stand out when selling products that are similar to what competitors offer.
Leveraging Non-Traditional ICPs (Ideal Client Profiles): Finding success by targeting non-traditional clients who may only purchase specific items from the sales line.
Building and Sustaining Customer Relationships: Strategies for maintaining long-term customer relationships in consumable sales.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "You've got to give somebody enough reason to give us a try. Whether you've gone through Sandler, that 'give us a try' is a strategy or it's a pricing strategy, product strategy, and where you play in the market."
Sean: "You need to get that prospect, that company that isn't buying from you today, to buy something from you. You need to start to develop that relationship. You earn the right to sell more to them."

Additional Resources:

Book: "Challenger Sale" – Recommended by Sean for understanding how to challenge and drive customer businesses - https://a.co/d/hOtMIGp.
Sandler Training – Mentioned by Kevin as a resource for sales strategies - https://www.sandler.com/.

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean provide a comprehensive guide on effectively breaking into new territories, especially in industries where products are consumed regularly. They emphasize the importance of being more than just a salesperson; being a trusted advisor and an integral part of the customer's business. The discussion covers strategies for differentiating in a competitive market, leveraging non-traditional client profiles, and building sustainable customer relationships. This episode is a must-listen for sales professionals looking to expand their reach and deepen their impact in new territories. Join us next week for more insights on "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales."

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey, delve into the often-overlooked realm of consumable sales. In this episode, they explore strategies for making that initial sale and ensuring repeat business in a competitive market. Whether you're selling paper, steel, lubricants, or any consumable product, this episode is packed with valuable insights for sales professionals at all levels.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Importance of Being a Trusted Advisor: Understanding the significance of building solid customer advisory relationships in consumable sales.
Selling Beyond the Product: How to add value and differentiate yourself when selling widely available products that are similar across competitors.
Strategies for New Territory Development: Tips for sales leaders and salespeople on effectively breaking into and growing new sales territories.
Crafting a Unique Selling Proposition (USP): The necessity of developing a compelling USP, even for distributors of similar products.
Role of Sales Managers and CEOs: The importance of leadership in providing tools and processes to support the sales team in delivering value.
Maintaining Customer Satisfaction: Strategies for keeping customers engaged and ensuring repeat business in a competitive environment.

Key Quotes:

Sean: "The value you bring is you. The value you bring is your ability to understand the prospect, your ability to guide the prospect."
Kevin: "Figure out for yourself what makes the most value for your customers. When they say, 'thank you,' what do they say thank you for?"

Additional Resources:

Book: "Challenger Sale" – Recommended for understanding the concept of challenging and driving customer business - https://a.co/d/cIUwphe.
Book: "Eliminate Your Competition" by Sean O'Shaughnessey https://a.co/d/4qCVNEP.

Summary:

In this episode, Kevin and Sean provide a deep dive into the world of consumable sales, emphasizing the importance of being more than just a salesperson – being a trusted advisor. They discuss the necessity of understanding your product and your customer, crafting a unique selling proposition, and the critical role of sales managers and CEOs in empowering their teams. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting, this episode offers practical advice and strategies to excel in the competitive market of consumable sales. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" for these and more invaluable sales insights.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosted by Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. In this episode, the duo delves into the often overlooked but crucial sales aspect - selling consumable products. They explore strategies and insights for salespeople who deal with regularly consumed and repurchased products, such as manufacturing supplies, paper products, and even everyday items like toilet paper.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Unique Challenges of Selling Consumable Products: Understanding the dynamics of selling products that are regularly used up and repurchased.
Strategic Sales Approaches: How to effectively sell consumable products in competitive markets.
The Importance of Value Proposition: Emphasizing the significance of a unique selling proposition (USP) in consumable product sales.
Salesperson's Role in Consumable Sales: The critical impact of the salesperson's understanding of the customer's business and needs.
Territory Management and Growth Strategies: Effective methods for expanding sales territories and managing customer accounts.
Cross-Selling and Team Collaboration: Leveraging the strengths of a sales team through cross-pollination of skills and coaching.

Key Quotes:

Sean: "In the environment we're talking about here, where it's a consumable product... the quality of the salesperson comes to play in a big way."
Kevin: "You need to know where and how you compete. It's as simple as that. Who do I call on? How do I compete? Is it price? Is it value?"

Additional Resources:

Sean O'Shaughnessey's book "Eliminate Your Competition" for more in-depth sales strategies - https://amzn.to/2K37ugx

Summary: In this episode, Kevin and Sean provide valuable insights into the world of selling consumable products. They emphasize the importance of understanding the unique challenges of this market, including the need for a strong value proposition and the crucial role of the salesperson in understanding and meeting customer needs. The discussion also covers effective territory management and the benefits of leveraging team strengths for cross-selling. This episode is a must-listen for sales professionals looking to excel in the consumable products market and for those seeking to enhance their sales strategies in competitive environments.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

Listen to this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales to gain valuable insights and strategies for excelling in the consumable products market, and to learn how to effectively grow your sales territory and manage customer relationships.

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the art of salesmanship. In this episode, Sean, author of "Eliminate Your Competition," shares his expertise on outmaneuvering the competition and achieving sales success in 2024. Join us for a deep dive into the strategies that can transform your sales approach and set you up for a prosperous year.

Key Topics Discussed:

Understanding Competition: Sean emphasizes the importance of competition in sales, explaining how it can actually benefit the sales process by reducing the likelihood of a 'no decision' outcome.
Five Sales Strategies: Sean outlines the five fundamental sales strategies - Frontal, Flanking, Fragment, Defend, and Develop - and explains how each can be effectively utilized in different sales scenarios.
Strategy in Detail:
1. Frontal Strategy: Focused on leveraging clear advantages over competitors, requiring excellence in execution and resource intensity.
2. Flanking Strategy: Involves shifting the customer's focus to new issues that favor your solution, requiring a deep understanding of the customer's needs.
3. Fragment Strategy: Useful for politically weaker positions or less feature-rich products, focusing on a subset of issues.
4. Defend Strategy: Essential for existing customers, focusing on expanding influence and defending against competitors.
5. Develop Strategy: Ideal for long-term engagement where immediate purchase isn't imminent, focusing on building credibility and relationships.
Salesperson Types and Strategies: Sean discusses how different types of salespeople, like hunters, farmers, and gatherers, may prefer different strategies based on their strengths and sales approach.

Key Quotes:

Sean: "Competition is a good thing in sales. It often means you're more likely to avoid losing a deal to No Decision."

Additional Resources:

Book: "Eliminate Your Competition: A Trapper’s Guide to Increasing Your Commission" by Sean O'Shaughnessey, available wherever books are sold - https://amzn.to/2K37ugx .

Summary: In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Sean O'Shaughnessey shares invaluable insights from his book "Eliminate Your Competition," guiding listeners through various sales strategies to outsmart competitors in 2024. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or new to the field, this episode offers a wealth of knowledge on how to approach sales challenges creatively and effectively. Tune in to learn how to adapt these strategies to your sales style and set yourself up for a successful year in sales.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to a special holiday edition of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey share a heartwarming and reflective episode. As we wind down the year, Kevin and Sean take a moment to step back from the hustle of sales strategies and focus on the essence of the holiday season, sharing personal anecdotes and extending warm wishes to their listeners.

Key Topics Discussed:

Holiday Reflections: Sean reminisces about a memorable holiday season experience that involved closing a deal in a unique and personal setting.
Work-Life Balance: The importance of taking time during the holidays to relax and spend quality time with family and loved ones.
Community Involvement: Kevin highlights the significance of giving back to the community and shares insights into their volunteer work.
Building a Supportive Community: The hosts discuss their plans to continue developing their podcast and CEO workshop series in the coming year, emphasizing the value of free resources and support for the sales community.
The Spirit of Giving: A reminder to consider how we can contribute positively to others' lives, especially during the holiday season.

Key Quotes:

Sean: "Just have a good time with your family right now."
Kevin: "In this season of giving, think about how you can give to others. Happy holidays."

Summary: In this heartwarming episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Kevin and Sean step away from their usual sales-focused discussions to embrace the holiday spirit. They share personal stories, emphasize the importance of family time, and encourage listeners to engage in community service. This episode is a gentle reminder of the joy and fulfillment that comes from giving back and spending time with loved ones. Tune in for a dose of holiday cheer and inspiration to carry into the new year.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the crucial topic of building a new pipeline for business growth. In this episode, Kevin shares his expertise on net new pipeline growth, offering valuable strategies for sales leaders and teams to enhance their sales processes and achieve success.

Key Topics Discussed:

Net New Pipeline Growth: Kevin emphasizes the importance of building a net new pipeline, focusing on strategic and tactical levels to drive sales success.
Activities That Matter: The discussion highlights the significance of consistent, purposeful activities that contribute to sales success, moving beyond quotas to meaningful engagement.
Sales and Marketing Synergy: Kevin stresses the need for sales and marketing to work harmoniously, focusing on acquiring and retaining customers through collaborative efforts.
Role of Sales Leaders: The episode delves into the responsibilities of sales leaders in ensuring their teams focus on the right activities and engage with the right prospects.
Importance of Sales Process and CRM: Kevin discusses how a well-structured sales process and effective CRM usage are crucial for managing and converting leads effectively.
Personal and Professional Brand Building: The conversation touches upon the importance of salespeople growing their network and brand to attract the ideal client profiles.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "Activities do matter... It's about doing the things consistently over time that we know return success."
Kevin: "Sales and marketing should be complimentary, not adversarial... Our whole goal is to acquire and retain customers."
Kevin: "As salespeople, we have a responsibility to be intentional... about creating enough relevant content via activity to get in front of the right people."

Additional Resources:

Sales methodologies like MEDDPICCC, SOAR, and BANT.

Summary Paragraph: In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Kevin Lawson discusses the critical aspect of building a new pipeline for business growth. He provides a comprehensive overview of the strategies and activities necessary for sales success, emphasizing the synergy between sales and marketing, the role of sales leaders, and the importance of a well-structured sales process. This episode is a treasure trove of insights for sales professionals looking to enhance their approach to sales and achieve their goals in the coming year. Don't miss this opportunity to learn from the experts and elevate your sales game.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey engage in a compelling conversation with Paul Fuller, the Chief Revenue Officer of Membrain. In this episode, they delve into the challenges and strategies of leading a sales team, especially as we approach the new year with fresh goals and targets.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Role of a Chief Revenue Officer: Paul Fuller shares his experiences and responsibilities in driving sales and revenue growth.
Motivating Sales Teams for the New Year: Strategies to inspire and prepare sales teams for achieving new goals as the fiscal year resets.
The Importance of Sales Methodology and CRM Tools: Discussion on how effective sales methodologies and CRM tools can enhance sales performance.
Setting Realistic Sales Goals: Balancing company needs with individual salesperson goals for optimal performance.
The Art and Science of Sales: Exploring the blend of methodical processes and creative problem-solving in sales.

Key Quotes:

Paul Fuller: "Our why is to elevate the sales profession. It's about empowering ourselves, our partners, and the companies we work with."
Kevin Lawson: "Good management is always good management, whether you're doing it with high technology influence or low technology influence."
Sean O'Shaughnessey: "How do you find that importance in what you sell and in your life, especially when it's not as inherently exciting as some products?"

Additional Resources:

"Baseline Selling" - https://www.amazon.com/Baseline-Selling-Superstar-Already-Baseball/dp/1420895672/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1702133791&sr=8-1
"Changing the Game" - https://www.amazon.com/Changing-Game-New-Way-Sell/dp/0671671359/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2UFXI3VVT0XKK&keywords=changing+the+game+larry+wilson&qid=1702133745&sprefix=Changing+the+game+by+larry%2Caps%2C103&sr=8-1
"The Jolt Effect" - https://www.amazon.com/JOLT-Effect-Performers-Overcome-Indecision-ebook/dp/B09NX3G2WX/ref=sr_1_1?crid=N0IT45T8Q8SP&keywords=%22The+Jolt+Effect%22&qid=1701642144&sprefix=the+jolt+effect+%2Caps%2C118&sr=8-1
Membrain CRM: A sales optimization platform mentioned by Paul Fuller - https://www.membrain.com/.

Summary Paragraph: This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a must-listen for sales professionals seeking to start the new year on a strong note. With Paul Fuller's insights on effective sales leadership, the importance of CRM tools, and the art of sales, listeners are equipped with valuable strategies to elevate their sales game. Whether you're a seasoned sales leader or new to the field, this episode offers practical advice and motivation to achieve your sales goals in the upcoming year.

You can reach out to Paul Full of Membrain at https://www.linkedin.com/in/psfuller/.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

The Jolt Effect: How High Performers Overcome Customer Indecision

Baseline Selling: How to Become a Sales Superstar by Using What You Already Know About the Game of Baseball

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Welcome to another engaging episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by a special guest, Paul Fuller, the Chief Revenue Officer at Membrain. In this episode, they dive deep into the world of CRM systems, discussing how salespeople can be more productive and the evolving role of technology in sales. Get ready for an insightful conversation that challenges conventional CRM perspectives and offers fresh strategies for sales success.

Key Topics Discussed:

Redefining CRM Systems: Exploring the shift from traditional CRM to sales optimization platforms and how this impacts sales productivity.
Sales Methodology Integration: The importance of embedding sales methodologies within CRM systems for effective sales processes.
Empowering Salespeople: How CRM should facilitate sales activities, asking the right questions at the right time to guide sales professionals.
Complexity in B2B Sales: Addressing the increasing complexity and committee-based decision-making in B2B sales through effective CRM tools.
Balancing Technology and Relationships: The role of technology in sales and the importance of focusing on relationships over automation.

Key Quotes:

Paul Fuller: "If every minute spent in this platform by a salesperson is not effectively helping them sell, then we're doing something wrong."
Kevin Lawson: "CRM has taken on a whole new life here, but I'm really curious about your opinion. How does sales excellence evolve with a good CRM tool?"
Sean O'Shaughnessey: "There's a lot of companies out there that now have more conference room buying or committee buying, and you've got to cover all of these people."

Additional Resources:

"The Jolt Effect" - A book recommended by Paul Fuller, discussing the fear of messing up in decision-making - https://www.amazon.com/JOLT-Effect-Performers-Overcome-Indecision-ebook/dp/B09NX3G2WX/ref=sr_1_1?crid=N0IT45T8Q8SP&keywords=%22The+Jolt+Effect%22&qid=1701642144&sprefix=the+jolt+effect+%2Caps%2C118&sr=8-1
"Changing the Game" by Larry Wilson - A book mentioned by Paul Fuller, focusing on buyer roles and decision-making processes - https://www.amazon.com/Changing-Game-New-Way-Sell/dp/0671671359/ref=sr_1_1?crid=136WAUDMJHM9C&keywords=%22Changing+the+Game%22+by+Larry+Wilson&qid=1701642108&sprefix=changing+the+game+by+larry+wilson%2Caps%2C117&sr=8-1
Membrain - The sales optimization platform discussed in the episode - https://www.membrain.com/

Summary Paragraph: In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin and Sean, along with guest Paul Fuller, delve into transforming CRM systems into tools that genuinely enhance sales productivity. They discuss the integration of sales methodologies into CRM platforms, the challenges of complex B2B sales, and the crucial balance between leveraging technology and nurturing relationships in sales. This conversation is a must-listen for sales professionals seeking to optimize their CRM usage and enhance their sales strategies. Tune in for more insights, and join us again next week for another enlightening discussion with Paul Fuller.

You can reach out to Paul Full of Membrain at https://www.linkedin.com/in/psfuller/.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Sales Strategy Isn't Just About Hitting Numbers: It's Your Operational Backbone for Success A well-defined sales strategy is indispensable for long-term business success. Importance of Market Segmentation Don't fall into the trap of a one-size-fits-all approach. Market segmentation is your tool to tailor unique strategies for distinct customer profiles, ensuring maximized reach and impact. Crafting a Unique Selling Proposition (USP) A compelling USP is your golden ticket in a saturated market. Your competitive edge makes your offer not just another option but the go-to solution for your target audience. Sales Process Flowchart: Consistency is Key A detailed sales process flowchart is the backbone of your sales execution. It provides a replicable structure and methodology, helping your team stay aligned and focused while enabling timely interventions to address bottlenecks. Balance Short-term Gains and Long-term Objectives Quick wins can boost morale but cannot derail your broader goals. CEOs must ensure alignment between immediate gains and long-term strategic objectives, further amplified when integrated with marketing initiatives. Culture of Continuous Learning Stagnation is your enemy. Cultivate a culture where past data serves as a scoreboard and a treasure trove of insights for future strategy adjustments. Regular Reviews for Adaptability The market won’t wait for you to catch up. Periodic reviews and adjustments ensure your strategy is a living, breathing entity, agile enough to adapt to market conditions and competitive pressures. Remember, a well-defined, adaptable sales strategy is the key to corporate excellence. Take control and be the strategic architect of your company's success.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the critical aspects of sales, especially as the year winds down. This episode is a must-listen for sales professionals looking to close their year on a high note. Kevin and Sean share their seasoned perspectives on prioritizing deals, managing customer relationships, and the art of effectively closing sales without succumbing to the pressure of year-end discounts.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Importance of Prioritizing Deals: Understanding how to focus on deals with the highest probability of closing. 2. Effective Sales Strategies for Year-End: Tactics to avoid unnecessary discounts and focus on profitable deals. 3. Building and Maintaining Customer Trust: Strategies for nurturing trust and client relationships. 4. Time Management in Sales: Maximizing efficiency and effectiveness in the final sales push of the year. 5. Navigating Internal Processes and Decision-Makers: Tips for understanding and working within a client's internal purchasing processes. 6. Post-December 15th Strategies: How to engage with clients after the critical sales period.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: "Focusing on the right things is never a wrong thing. This is a time management moment. Don’t get caught up in the hype of what’s my biggest deal. Get caught up in the hype of what relationships have I secured." * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "You need to focus on getting deals done that are profitable for the company. Don’t focus on what if I gave him a 22 percent discount that was only good for the next three days? Those are bad deals for the profitability of your company."

Summary Paragraph This episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" is a treasure trove of wisdom for sales professionals. Kevin and Sean, with their extensive experience, offer invaluable advice on prioritizing deals, building trust, and closing the year strongly without falling into the discount trap. Their conversation is not just about strategies but also about the mindset required to succeed in sales. This episode is your go-to resource if you want to refine your sales approach, especially as the year ends. Tune in to gain insights that could transform your sales journey!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Kevin and Sean hope our listeners have much to be thankful for in 2023. Most of you will be taking time off this week so we have kept this episode short.

Remember, when you get back to work on Monday after Thanksgiving, you will only have about three weeks of selling time left in the year. It is really hard to close significant business after December 15!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another insightful episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the B2B sales management, sharing their extensive knowledge and experience. This episode is a must listen for sales professionals who handle the entire sales cycle, from lead generation to closing deals. Kevin and Sean explore effective strategies to avoid the pitfalls of one-dimensional outreach and the rollercoaster effect in sales. Their conversation is packed with actionable advice, making it an invaluable resource for anyone looking to enhance their sales skills.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Full Sales Cycle Challenge: Understanding the complexities of managing every stage of the sales process.
Diversifying Outreach Strategies: The importance of using multiple channels and methods in sales outreach.
Avoiding the Rollercoaster Effect: Strategies to maintain a consistent pipeline and steady revenue flow.
Building and Utilizing a Robust Contact List: Effective ways to create and engage with a list of potential leads.
The Art of Persistent Outreach: How repeated, varied contacts can lead to successful conversions.
Personalizing Sales Approaches: Tailoring strategies to meet the specific needs and preferences of potential clients.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "We need to be pulling all these threads to weave the cloth that we want to cover our table."
Sean: "You need to make them smarter. And in order to do it, just like when you were in high school, when you were in college, and you were trying to learn a new subject, learn a new thing, did you ever have it where your professor was trying to teach you something? It just wasn't sticking."

Additional Resources:

LinkedIn Sales Navigator - https://www.linkedin.com/products/linkedin-sales-navigator/
Seamless AI - https://seamless.ai/
Knowledge Net - https://knowledgenet.ai/
"Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" CEO Workshop Series - https://www.linkedin.com/events/twotallguysceoworkshop-defining7120530607968800768/comments/
Sean's Beers and Biz Public Networking Group - https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9155649/

Summary Paragraph: In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Kevin and Sean provide a treasure trove of insights for sales professionals. They emphasize the importance of a multi-faceted outreach strategy, consistent engagement, and personalization in the sales process. Their practical tips and real-world examples make this episode a valuable listen for anyone in sales, from newbies to seasoned pros. Tune in to learn how to transform your sales approach, build a robust pipeline, and achieve consistent success in your sales career.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Join hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they dive into the crucial topic of preparing for annual sales kickoffs in this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales. With the holiday season just around the corner, our hosts share their expert strategies for transitioning from holiday cheer to sales gear.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Importance of Annual Kickoff Meetings: Discover why these meetings are vital for setting the tone for the fiscal year and how they can energize your sales team.
Planning for Success: Learn the steps to plan an effective sales meeting that isn't just another PowerPoint marathon.
Choosing the Right Venue: Understand the significance of selecting a venue outside your usual office space to foster creativity and focus.
Involving Key Players: Get insights on who should be part of your sales kickoff to maximize impact, including departments beyond sales.
Guest Speakers and Motivation: Explore the benefits of inviting guest speakers to inspire your team and why it's crucial to think outside the box.
Community and Team Bonding: Find out how community service can be a powerful team-building exercise and contribute to a positive company culture.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "You don't just wake up and hit quota. You don't wake up and pull off an annual sales meeting. It's time to climb the mountain."

Sean: "2023 is over. Now you're at 2024 and guess what? You haven't sold a single thing yet. It's time to energize the team and get them going."

Summary Paragraph:

In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin and Sean provide a masterclass on transforming the annual sales kickoff from a dreaded event into a dynamic and motivating experience. They emphasize the need for meticulous planning, the power of a change in scenery, and the importance of including diverse voices and departments. With their practical advice and real-world examples, this episode is a must-listen for sales leaders and team members looking to start their fiscal year with a bang. Tune in to ensure your next sales meeting is not only productive but also truly inspiring.

Remember to subscribe to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales for more valuable insights on sales strategies and leadership. Happy selling!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Are you struggling to create a sales compensation plan that aligns with your business goals and motivates your sales team? Look no further! In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the intricacies of crafting effective sales compensation plans. With decades of experience in sales and management, Kevin and Sean share invaluable insights on how to set up your sales team for success. Whether you're a startup aiming for your first million or an established business looking to optimize, this episode is a must-listen!

Key Topics Discussed * The Importance of Timely Compensation Plans: Why releasing compensation plans in line with the fiscal year is crucial for sales teams. * Simplicity is Key: The need for straightforward, easy-to-understand compensation plans. * Aligning Compensation with Business Goals: How to incentivize behaviors that align with your company's objectives. * Understanding Costs and Profitability: The role of CEOs and CFOs in determining the budget for sales commissions. * Attracting Talent with Compensation Plans: How a well-structured plan can be a recruitment tool for top sales talent.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: "Compensation plans are the bedrock for someone's income. And we should treat it as such, not as a cost line." * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "The magic of writing a great compensation plan is to make sure that you maximize the things that you want to maximize to grow your business within that budget that you put together."

Additional Resources * Management by Objective (MBO): A management model for setting and tracking objectives. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/management-by-objectives.asp * EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System): A set of simple concepts and practical tools to help entrepreneurs get what they want from their businesses. https://www.eosworldwide.com/

Summary Don't miss out on this episode if you're looking to revamp or create a sales compensation plan that truly works. Kevin and Sean offer a comprehensive guide that covers everything from the timing of releasing plans to aligning them with your business goals. Tune in to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales and equip yourself with the knowledge to build a compensation plan that not only retains but also attracts top sales talent. Start setting your sales team—and your business—up for success today!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to a special episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosted by seasoned sales professionals Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. Today’s episode is a goldmine for small business owners, consultants, and sales teams who are looking to scale and outperform their competition.

This is the audio version of a CEO Workshop that was recorded on LinkedIn on October 19. You can watch entire webinar (along with the slides) by going to https://www.linkedin.com/events/avoidingb2bsalesmistakesthatare7113890627339128832/comments/

Sean O'Shaughnessy and Kevin Lawson have decided to release these workshops as podcast episodes. The topic of this episode is Avoiding B2B sales Mistakes that Limit Growth. Kevin explains the importance of avoiding mistakes and continuously refining sales strategies and skills. He also discusses the challenges faced by businesses, such as rising costs and limited resources. Inflation, the Consumer Price Index, and labor costs are impacting business owners. Kevin advises businesses to adjust their prices accordingly to maintain margins. He emphasizes the need for strategic and tactical management to overcome market factors that affect business outcomes. The goal is to increase the value of the business for future saleability.

Kevin also discusses the importance of being strategic and tactical in business. He emphasizes the need to be organized, focused, and create relevant content. Salespeople should also think like marketers to attract customers.

Kevin then discuss responding to RFPs (Request for Proposals) and suggests that businesses should decide whether or not to respond based on their industry and goals. He highlight the low success rate of RFPs and encourages evaluating if it's worth investing time in them.

The next topic is Sales Playbooks, which are comprehensive documents that help train sales teams by outlining best practices and providing guidance on communication with clients. Kevin explains the benefits of having a Sales Playbook but acknowledges that many businesses may not have one or have had lackluster results with them. Finally, Kevin suggests starting with documenting a typical sales process as a foundational step towards creating an effective Sales Playbook.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Are you tired of potential customers walking away after hearing your pitch? Do you struggle with aligning your sales process with your customer's goals? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve into the critical elements that can make or break your sales cycle. From understanding your customer's pain points to crafting a sales hypothesis that aligns with their goals, this episode is a goldmine of actionable insights for salespeople, sales leaders, and business owners alike.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Importance of Aligning with Customer Goals: Understanding your customer's objectives is crucial for closing deals. 2. The Discovery Process: How to ask the right questions to uncover your customers' real challenges. 3. Leveraging Public Information: Utilizing annual reports and other public documents to tailor your sales approach. 4. Sales Hypothesis and Marketing Message: Crafting a compelling narrative that resonates with your target audience. 5. Ideal Customer Profile (ICP) and Target Account Lists: How to identify and prioritize the companies that are most likely to benefit from your product or service.

Key Quotes * Kevin: "Listen, pay attention to the words that are coming out of your mouth. 'Cause they're telling you how they need to change their own lives. And if that happens to align with the solution you're offering, you might have a sale." * Sean: "Your annual report is almost like saying, 'Hey, sales guys come sell to me, but only talk about this one little thing.' Money will be spent on everything the CEO lists as issues in the annual report."

Additional Resources * Annual Reports: A treasure trove of information for understanding a public company's goals and challenges. * Trade Organization Information: Useful for gaining insights into small and medium-sized businesses. * SWOT Analysis: A strategic tool for understanding your strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, and threats in the sales process.

Summary This episode is a must-listen if you're looking to supercharge your sales process, shorten your sales cycle, and ultimately boost your bottom line. Kevin and Sean offer a comprehensive guide to understanding your customer's needs and aligning your sales strategy accordingly. Don't miss out on these game-changing insights that could be the key to unlocking your next big deal. Tune in now!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another riveting episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with your hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. This episode is a treasure trove for CEOs, VPs of Sales, and salespeople who are looking to scale their businesses profitably. Dive in as Kevin and Sean dissect the importance of consistency in sales processes, the role of EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) in achieving this, and how to identify your most profitable customers. If you're struggling to grow beyond a certain revenue point, this episode is your roadmap to breaking that barrier.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Importance of Consistency in Sales: How maintaining a consistent approach can standardize your sales processes and messaging. 2. EOS and Sales: How the Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) can set the foundation for a consistent and profitable sales strategy. 3. Identifying Profitable Customers: Why you should focus on selling to companies that are not just your favorites, but are also profitable for your business. 4. Sales Organization Structure: The need for formalizing reporting structures, job descriptions, and goals within the sales department. 5. Tools for Systematic Growth: How tools and services can help you identify look-alike audiences and scale your business.

Key Quotes * Kevin Lawson: "If you don't have a repeatable sales process, you don't have a repeatable sales process. You must have absolute consistency." * Sean O'Shaughnessey: "Don't pick your favorite customers, pick your most profitable customers and identify companies that are just like that and then go sell to them."

Additional Resources * Book Mention: "Selling The Wheel" - https://www.amazon.com/Selling-Wheel-Choosing-Company-Customers-ebook/dp/B000FC0U0I/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2E0EPQJ66PI5Q&keywords=selling+the+wheel+jeff+cox&qid=1697544950&sprefix=selling+the+whe%2Caps%2C77&sr=8-1 * Previous Podcast Episodes: Building and Scaling Successful Sales Teams: A Conversation with Tim Warren of Helium SEO (https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/building-and-scaling-successful-sales-teams-a-conversation-with-tim-warren-of-helium-seo) and Part 2 - Building and Scaling Successful Sales Teams: A Conversation with Tim Warren of Helium SEO (https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/part-2-building-and-scaling-successful-sales-teams-a-conversation-with-tim-warren-of-helium-seo)

Summary If you're stuck in the rut of inconsistent sales processes or you're unsure how to scale your business profitably, this episode is a must-listen. Kevin and Sean offer actionable insights and tools to help you standardize your sales processes, identify your most profitable customers, and set your business on a path to exponential growth. Don't miss out on these invaluable lessons from two seasoned sales experts. Tune in now!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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If you've got your first 10 customers and are wondering, "What next?" then this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is essential listening. Hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey explore the transformational journey from acquiring your first customers to scaling up your business. Dive into critical topics like product-market fit, market messaging, the role of the CEO as a salesperson, and much more. Arm yourself with practical, real-world advice to take your business to the next level.

Key Topics Discussed The Crucial Jump from 10 to 50 Customers Kevin and Sean examine the strategic shift required when you're looking to grow from 10 customers to a more substantial customer base. They stress the importance of formalizing and aligning your offering with a well-defined buyer persona.

Understanding Buyer Personas A recurring topic was the art and science of buyer personas. Kevin emphasizes the need to revisit and revise these as your business evolves. The objective is to understand who you’re selling to and what problem you’re solving for them.

Sales Leadership & Standardization Sean explores the standardization of sales processes and offerings, particularly for scaling from a one-person operation to a multi-person sales team. This standardization is crucial for scalability and profitability.

The Role of the CEO in Sales The hosts delve into the inevitable shift in the sales role of the CEO as the company grows. While the CEO might be heavily involved in sales initially, scaling to 50 or 100 customers requires a dedicated sales team.

Selling Tools vs. Selling Solutions Sean provides a compelling analogy between selling tools and selling solutions. He emphasizes the importance of selling a standardized product rather than a customizable toolkit, using historical examples like Henry Ford and Steve Jobs.

Key Quotes Kevin: "One challenge I see here that sales leaders need to solve is how to formalize and standardize the attraction process."

Sean: "You need to really start focusing on who do you sell to, what problem do you really solve, and how do you sell this thing so that other people can sell for you."

Summary Don't miss this episode if you're gearing up for rapid growth. Both Kevin and Sean provide actionable insights that will equip you to transition from a startup to a scalable business. With a blend of theoretical knowledge and real-world advice, they lay down a roadmap for you to follow. Whether you're a CEO doing sales, a startup looking to break into the market, or a sales leader aiming for standardization, this episode is your guide to elevating your sales game. Tune in now to pave the way for your business growth!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosted by Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. This episode is a must-listen for sales professionals, managers, and business leaders who want to understand how to recover when they've skipped a step in the sales process. Kevin and Sean delve into the nuances of backing up, requalifying deals, and how to engage your champions effectively. Whether you're dealing with large corporations or small family-owned businesses, this episode offers actionable insights to help you get back on track and close deals successfully.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Realization Moment: Recognizing that you've skipped a step in the sales process and how to recover without losing trust. 2. The Role of a Champion: How to engage your champion to help you navigate through the complexities of the deal. 3. Resource Limitations: Understanding the constraints that every company faces, regardless of its size, and how to address them. 4. Requalifying Deals: The importance of requalifying a deal, especially one that previously went to a 'no decision'. 5. Sales Process in Small Businesses: How the sales process differs when dealing with small family-owned businesses and how to adapt your approach.

Key Quotes * Kevin: "Skipping steps happens, and when you have that realization moment, it's not a moment to try and beat somebody up." * Sean: "You got to go to your champion and say, help me out. Save me because I'm in a bad way. I need to get all these people on board." * Kevin: "We have to really forecast those because we could invest a lot of money. The most expensive way to buy an ERP is to buy it twice."

Additional Resources * Last week's episode on the consequences of skipping steps in the sales process. https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/site/mastering-the-sales-process-the-cost-of-skipping-steps

Summary Don't miss this episode if you want to master the art of recovering from missed steps in your sales process. Kevin and Sean provide theoretical knowledge, practical steps, and real-world advice that can be immediately applied to your sales strategies. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or new to the field, this episode will equip you with the tools to navigate complex deals and emerge successful. Tune in now to elevate your sales game!

Ready to dive in? Click here to listen to this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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This special episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales comes from a recent CEO Workshop put on by Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson. It was taken from a LinkedIn Live presentation that aired on September 29, 2023. You can listen to this episode or click over to the LinkedIn Live presentation at https://www.linkedin.com/events/ceoworkshop-understandyourclien7106962760084688896/ Are you a sales leader or CEO looking to supercharge your sales strategy? In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve deep into the art of understanding your client's business to sell more effectively. Sean, a seasoned sales expert, shares invaluable insights on transitioning from being just a vendor to becoming a trusted advisor. This episode is a treasure trove of actionable advice, real-world examples, and strategies that can be immediately implemented to elevate your sales game.

Key Topics Discussed 1. The Power Matrix: Learn how to identify and engage with key stakeholders in your client's organization, from decision-makers to influencers. 2. Consultative Selling: Discover the essence of becoming a trusted advisor rather than just a vendor and how this approach can significantly impact your sales. 3. Financial Acumen: Understand why knowing your client's financial position can give you a competitive edge and how to gather this information. 4. Interdepartmental Relationships: Sean discusses the importance of having touchpoints across various departments in your client's organization and how it can lead to a more tailored sales pitch. 5. Customer Journey Mapping: Learn how to map out the customer journey to gain a 360-degree understanding of your client's needs and motivations.

Key Quotes from Sean * "You elevate yourself from a vendor to a partner in the B2B sales arena." * "Your proposition becomes not just a response to an RFP, but a comprehensive strategy of partnership." * "This alignment leads to a consultative selling approach, one that evolves from being transactional to being deeply relational."

Additional Resources * Sean's book on sales strategies "Eliminate Your Competition" You may purchase “Eliminate Your Competition” from your favorite book retailer. The ebook version is available at the most popular retailers such as Apple, Amazon, Barnes & Noble. The paperback version is also widely available at such retailers as Amazon, Barnes & Noble, and Books A Million. * The CEO workshop "Avoiding B2B Sales Mistakes That Are Limiting Revenue Growth" scheduled for Thursday, October 19, at 10:00 A.M. Eastern. Register at https://www.linkedin.com/events/7113890627339128832/comments/

Summary Paragraph Don't miss this enlightening special episode that promises to transform your approach to B2B sales. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or a CEO looking to revamp your sales strategy, this episode offers a comprehensive guide to understanding your client's business like never before. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" and equip yourself with the tools and insights to become not just a vendor but a strategic partner in your client's success journey. Subscribe today and stay ahead of the sales game!

Ready to take your sales strategy to the next level? Click the download button now and dive into this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales."

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In this episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve deep into the intricacies of the sales process. Sean opens up about his impatience with time-wasting and the challenges he's faced with sales reps skipping crucial steps in the sales process. Kevin emphasizes the importance of understanding why steps are skipped, whether it's due to reluctance or irrelevance. Both hosts stress the significance of aligning the sales process with the decision-making process of the customer. They also touch upon the financial implications of not following the sales process, highlighting the potential costs and the importance of cost containment. The episode concludes with a teaser for the next episode, where they will discuss how to recover when a step is skipped.

Key Topics Discussed:

The importance of following the sales process.
Reasons why salespeople skip steps in the process.
The financial implications of not adhering to the sales process.
Aligning the sales process with the customer's decision-making process.
The concept of cost containment in sales.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "The process is what drives your business. It's what helps you forecast, determine cash flows."
Sean: "The danger of not asking questions high enough and not following your sales process is when you don't allow your sales process to drive the decision process by the buyer."

Summary: Dive into the world of sales with Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they unpack the essence of the sales process. From understanding why steps are skipped to the financial repercussions of not adhering to the process, this episode is a goldmine of insights for anyone in the sales industry. Whether you're a CEO, a sales rep, or just curious about the intricacies of sales, this episode promises valuable takeaways. And stay tuned for the next episode, where the duo will explore how to bounce back when a step in the sales process is missed. Don't miss out on this enlightening discussion!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Dive deep into the heart of sales and sales leadership with Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey as they unravel the essence of problem-solving in the sales arena. This episode isn't just about identifying problems but understanding the art of solving them. If you aim to transition from just selling a product to becoming a trusted advisor, this episode is your roadmap.

Key Topics Discussed:

The importance of becoming a trusted advisor in sales.
Building and maintaining long-lasting relationships with clients.
The role of curiosity in understanding a client's business.
The significance of being well-read and informed about current business challenges.
Networking is a tool for gaining insights and asking better questions.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "How you become a trusted advisor is solving a business problem, not selling a product."
Sean: "The key to the kingdom is to become a trusted advisor to your client. So that that advisor says, I wonder what Kevin thinks about this."
Kevin: "Are you the person who's reliable? Do you always cancel at the last minute? Do you put somebody to voicemail every time and forget to call them back? That's a withdrawal from the trusted advisor list."
Sean: "The key is don't just show up as a salesperson. Don't just show up as a vendor. Show up as an interested third party that is trying to figure out about their business."

Additional Resources:

CEO Workshop: A live video session with Kevin and Sean, focusing on understanding customer businesses and the challenges therein. https://www.linkedin.com/events/ceoworkshop-understandyourclien7106962760084688896/comments/

Summary: In this enlightening episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Kevin and Sean emphasize the importance of evolving from a mere salesperson to a trusted advisor. They discuss the nuances of building genuine relationships, the significance of being curious, and the need to be well-informed about the business landscape. Whether you're a sales newbie or a seasoned professional, this episode offers invaluable insights that can transform your approach to sales. Don't miss out on this opportunity to elevate your sales game. Tune in now!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Join hosts Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson as they delve deep into the art of sales, emphasizing the importance of trust, personal branding, and the role of a salesperson in today's market. In this episode, they discuss the nuances of transferring trust, the significance of personal branding, and how sales leaders can guide their teams to success.

Key Topics Discussed:

Transferring Trust: The essence of sales lies in transferring trust from the salesperson to the prospect, ensuring decisions are made in the desired timeframe.
Three Pillars of Sales: Selling your company, your product, and most importantly, yourself.
Personal Branding: The importance of building a personal brand that accelerates trust and how sales leaders can foster this among their teams.
LinkedIn and References: Utilizing LinkedIn as a tool for validation and building credibility.
Professional Appearance: The impact of a salesperson's appearance on the perception of trust and professionalism.
Empathy and Curiosity: Starting conversations with genuine interest and understanding of the client's business.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "To build trust early, you have to be referenceable... People could commercially find us, so to speak."
Sean: "You sell your company. You sell your product, and you sell yourself."
Kevin: "Nine-tenths of the law is perception."
Sean: "The more you understand your client's business, the bigger your brand will be."

Additional Resources:

LinkedIn - A platform for professional networking and validation.
WKRP in Cincinnati - A classic TV show mentioned in the context of professional appearance.

Summary: In a world where trust is paramount, Kevin and Sean highlight the significance of personal branding in the sales process. From the importance of being referenceable on platforms like LinkedIn to the impact of professional appearance, this episode offers a comprehensive guide for salespeople and leaders alike. Whether you're a seasoned sales professional or just starting out, the insights shared will undoubtedly enhance your approach. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" every Tuesday for more invaluable sales advice!

Don't miss out on this enlightening conversation about trust, personal branding, and the evolving world of sales. Listen now!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with your hosts, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. In this riveting episode, we take a deep dive into the often talked about but seldom mastered topic: Buyer Personas. Whether you're listening on a Tuesday drive back home or on a Wednesday morning commute to work, this episode is packed with actionable insights to set you up for the rest of your week, month, and quarter. Tune in to find out how to create accurate buyer personas that can help you make smarter sales and marketing decisions.

📝 Key Topics Discussed: * Defining Buyer Personas: Kevin and Sean explore what a buyer persona really is and why it's crucial for sales success. * The Importance of SWOT Analysis: Kevin explains that creating a buyer persona isn't a one-off task; it begins with understanding your SWOT (Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, and Threats) analysis. * Ideal Client Profiles & Unique Selling Proposition: Why understanding these can help fine-tune your buyer personas. * Digging into Demographics and Psychographics: How to gather and utilize this data to develop detailed buyer personas. * Quarterly Business Reviews (QBRs): Sean shares insights into who should be involved in these reviews and the type of questions that can help enrich your buyer personas.

🗨️ Key Quotes: * "If you're out there and wondering how to get this process started, thinking that you've already done a SWOT analysis...now's the time to talk about buyer personas." - Kevin Lawson * "Salespeople are valuable. Salespeople are important to the sales process. And it is your job to teach your company about your customers." - Sean O'Shaughnessey * "Salespeople are great people day in day out. We shouldn't have to pay a tax because of bad salespeople doing bad things in the marketplace." - Kevin Lawson

📚 Additional Resources: * HubSpot's Buyer Persona Templates * SWOT Analysis Guide

🎧 Why You Should Listen: Crafting an accurate and effective buyer persona isn't just a task; it's an art. This episode provides not only the theory but also the actionable steps you can take to create buyer personas that resonate with your target market. From initial concepts to understanding your customer needs during a QBR, Kevin and Sean have packed this episode with tools you can use immediately. Listen now to avoid the pitfalls and fast-track your way to sales success.

Ready to revolutionize your sales approach? Hit that download button and tune in now! 🎧

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Dive deep into the world of competitive analysis with Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey in this engaging episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales. In the fast-paced world of sales, it's not just about knowing your product, but about understanding your competition, your customers, and the nuances that drive decisions. Let Kevin and Sean guide you through actionable insights to elevate your sales game.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Power of Competitive Analysis: Unlock the benefits of understanding your competition and how it empowers you as a sales leader.
Understanding 'No Decision': Learn why some prospects choose to remain indecisive and how you can navigate this challenge effectively.
The Role of SWOT in Sales: Deciphering how SWOT, PESTEL, and SOAR analyses can help shape your sales strategies.
Unpacking Unique Selling Proposition (USP): Knowing your USP and leveraging it against your competitors is important.
Importance of Feedback in Pricing: Sean emphasizes the need for real-time feedback, especially when your price points are met with resistance.
The Salesperson as a Guide: The role of a salesperson is to guide clients, understand their needs, and sell existing products confidently.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "No decision comes, in my opinion, when you haven't done a good job qualifying the prospect."
Sean: "Looking at companies that are massively successful... It's just a good way for a company to get better. Looking at those people and learning from them is really, really important."
Kevin: "If you've already thought through how they measure value, you know how to talk to them. You become a better salesperson because you put in the work."
Sean: "Your job is to sell the product that exists today, not the product that you wish they would hurry up and build."

Additional Resources:

Microsoft's package offerings
Previous episode on Competitive Analysis

Summary:
In the competitive realm of sales, it's not just about standing out, but about understanding every piece of the puzzle. Whether it's diving deep into SWOT analyses, ensuring that your pricing strategy aligns with market expectations, or guiding your client toward a mutually beneficial decision, every step matters. Join Kevin and Sean as they unpack these topics and more, providing you with actionable strategies to ensure your sales pitch stands out. If you're serious about mastering the art of sales, this is an episode you won't want to miss. Dive in now!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this invigorating episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive deep into the realm of competition in sales. From understanding the various forms competition can take to harnessing the power of artificial intelligence in competitive analysis, this episode is packed with insights and actionable advice for sales professionals at all levels.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Essence of Competition in Sales: Why understanding and overcoming your competition is crucial.
Recognizing Different Types of Competition: Beyond direct competitors, why the 'no decision' outcome is the hidden enemy.
Leveraging SWOT Analysis: Sean and Kevin's take on its relevance and how to use it effectively for competitive advantage.
The Role of Artificial Intelligence in Sales: How tools like Chat GPT can help get a leg up on your competition.
The Importance of Competitive Awareness: Why 57% of companies are at a disadvantage and how not to be one of them.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "Every professional sports team watches game film... we're sales professionals. We should be watching the game film of sorts."
Sean: "Who is your prospect talking to? That is your competition."
Kevin: "Doing nothing is unacceptable. It's like prospecting. If you don't prospect, that is an unacceptable behavior."
Sean: "If you're in a small company right now, you need to figure out, you need to be one of the 43%, not one of the 57%."

Additional Resources:

Eliminate Your Competition by Sean O'Shaughnessey.
Sales Xceleration's national research on companies' competitive awareness.
Tools like Chat GPT for AI-based SWOT analysis.

Don't be a part of the 57% that remains oblivious to their competition. Whether you're in the early stages of your sales journey or a seasoned professional, Sean and Kevin's insights from this episode offer invaluable strategies and tools to elevate your game. Tune in to "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" to get the upper hand, understand your market better, and, ultimately, eliminate your competition.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Get ready to unlock the secrets of mastering the sales game with Two Tall Guys Talking Sales! This episode delves into the nuances of key performance indicators (KPIs), their significance in measuring sales efficiency, and the art of mentorship among salespeople. Listen as our hosts Sean and Kevin uncover the analogy of KPIs and share insights about setting the right measures for salespeople at various career stages.

Key Topics Discussed:

Understanding Leading vs. Lagging Indicators: Foreseeing future trends and not just measuring past achievements is important.
KPIs and the Marriage Analogy: Setting the right measures to cultivate relationships, just as one nurtures a romantic relationship.
Differentiating KPIs for New vs. Veteran Salespeople: Tailoring strategies for those new to the profession, the company, or the industry.
The Power of Mentorship: Leveraging the experiences of veteran salespeople and fostering growth among younger salespeople.
Sales Training and Coaching: How combining formal sales training with hands-on coaching can amplify results.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "KPIs are not about only the number of deals you sold. It's about, 'Am I doing the right behaviors over time?'"
Sean: "Those KPIs can't be a hundred percent looking backward. We need to look ahead and say, what are we doing to generate business?"
Kevin: "Activity measures for new salespeople are different. I'm talking about doing the well-researched, planned prospecting call."
Sean: "The real advantage of The RAIN Group is its training combined with my coaching."

Additional Resources:

CEO workshop series: A detailed session on 'dashboards for CEOs', focusing more on current pipeline activities. https://www.linkedin.com/events/6917582648336875520/comments/ and also available at https://youtu.be/Oz9HTyQtz8o
The RAIN Group: Renowned sales training organization that combines training with actionable coaching. Contact Sean at Sean@NewSales.Expert for more information about this, or contact Kevin at kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com for more information.

Summary Paragraph: With a blend of engaging analogies, actionable insights, and personal experiences, Sean and Kevin illuminate the complex world of sales KPIs. Whether you're a seasoned salesperson or just beginning your journey, this episode is packed with nuggets of wisdom that can transform your approach to sales. Dive deep into the essence of mentorship, discover the right measures for tracking success, and unearth the significance of forward-looking indicators. Don't miss out on this chance to elevate your sales strategies and metrics. Listen now and redefine your sales mastery with Two Tall Guys Talking Sales!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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Welcome to another riveting episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with your dynamic hosts, Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson. In this episode, our duo takes on a subject that stirs strong emotions in the sales world: micromanagement. With a combined experience of several decades in sales, Sean and Kevin delve into their philosophies, personal experiences, and provide actionable insights on transitioning from micromanagement to effective leadership. Whether you're a salesperson, a manager, or a business leader, you're going to find value in their candid conversation.

Key Topics Discussed:

Micromanagement in Sales: Sean's personal aversion to micromanagement, his challenges, and how he navigated them during his 38-year career.
Transitioning from Micromanaging to Leadership: Kevin’s insights into the delicate balance between engaging the team and inadvertently falling into micromanagement.
Differentiating Between Green and Seasoned Salespeople: How to manage new salespeople who need structure versus seasoned reps who require trust.
The Importance of Trust in a Sales Team: Bad examples of trust violations and the cultivation of a culture of trust within the sales organization.
Becoming a Leader: Strategies and practical advice for transitioning from a micromanager to a leader, and the value it brings to the sales culture.

Key Quotes:

Sean: "I despised anybody who was going to drive me day to day, ask me every single thing, question every single deal just didn't fit well with my personality."
Kevin: "How can I help? That's how the shift comes in my mind from a micromanager to an effective leader. Instead of asking detail, detail, detail, they're asking about resource, resource, strategy, that's the big shift for me."

In this engaging episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Sean and Kevin don't just identify the problems associated with micromanagement but provide actionable insights and solutions for how to evolve into an effective leader. Whether you're just beginning in sales or leading a team, their candid conversation will offer you strategies to avoid micromanagement, build trust within your team, and create a culture of success. Don't miss this chance to learn from two seasoned sales veterans - tune in to this episode and take your sales leadership skills to the next level!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Welcome to another exciting episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey. On this episode, we delve into the vital world of outbound sales in a post-COVID landscape. We discuss strategies for creating an effective outbound pipeline, reflecting on our experiences with trade shows, and how to nail your unique value proposition. Discover how to master omnichannel outreach and understand why persistence is key in today's competitive market.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Trade Show Experience: Kevin and Sean open up about the highs and lows of trade shows and how the pandemic has shifted the industry’s focus from this traditional method of sales and marketing.
Creating an Effective Outbound Pipeline: Our hosts emphasize the importance of having a clear, unique value proposition and understanding how it can resonate with your potential customers.
Omni Channel Outreach: Kevin and Sean highlight the significance of reaching out to prospects across various channels - emails, phone calls, social media, and even traditional mail. They discuss the need for persistence in reaching out and making numerous touches to get a prospect's attention.
Prospecting and Value Proposition: Sean shares insights on how a value proposition can differ based on the industry and target audience. They talk about understanding and tailoring your value proposition to your audience for better customer engagement.
Leveraging Tools for Sales Outreach: The hosts discuss a range of tools that can assist in streamlining and tracking your outreach efforts, from LinkedIn prospecting tools to CRMs and even task management tools.

Key Quotes:

Kevin: "Trade shows in a pre COVID environment were the lifeblood of many sales organizations... But here we are in a post-COVID world, and what we saw in the midst of COVID was pipeline evacuation."
Sean: "The first thing I tell everybody is, "What are you going to say, and what makes it unique and valuable to your prospects?"
Sean: "Your unique value proposition may be targeted to a specific customer and you might have a different one targeted to a different customer... but then you need to make unique messaging for every one of those and unique tries for each one of those."

Additional Resources:

CRM Tools
LinkedIn prospecting tools
Task management tools (Asana, Trello, Monday.com)

Summary:

In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey offer a practical, insightful guide to successfully navigating outbound sales in our new normal. They share their expertise in creating a compelling, unique value proposition, omnichannel outreach's importance, and persistence's role in sales. You'll gain a wealth of advice, from understanding your value in a specific industry to leveraging various outreach tools to streamline and enhance your prospecting process. Listen to this episode for a deep dive into the tactics and strategies that can reshape your approach to outbound sales.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson get tactical on sales prospecting. They dive deep into sales strategies and tactics, discussing how to build momentum for the latter half of the year and beyond. Whether your sales pipeline is currently thriving or needs a refill, this episode offers valuable insights that apply to all sales situations.

Key Topics Discussed

The Art of Prospecting: Uncover practical ways to refill your sales pipeline effectively, leveraging both direct and networking-based prospecting.
Direct vs Networking-based Prospecting: Understand the differences, subtleties, and strategies in both approaches and learn how to optimize them based on your business context and audience.
Balancing Prospecting Behaviors: Discover the importance of inbound marketing, outbound sales force, and customer success models in driving a well-rounded prospecting strategy.
Sales Funnel Structure: Explore the analogy of a three-legged stool representing a solid sales structure consisting of networking, direct prospecting, and customer referrals.
Building Trust within Your Network: Learn the value of trust-building within your network for long-term sales success and how to ensure your network is well-informed about your product/service offerings.

Key Quotes

"Prospecting your network requires a different focus and a different type of how you present yourself because you're not asking someone for business. You're asking to have someone else introduce you to the right prospect for you." - Kevin Lawson

"Don't depend on any one thing to always work within your organization. In fact, you will be more successful if all three of those legs are just as strong and just as good because if you only have two legs working well, you don't have that third leg, you've got a weak stool, you're going to fall over." - Sean O'Shaughnessey

Additional Resources

The Sandler training, particularly the KARE acronym (Keep, Attain, Recapture, Expand), was mentioned as a beneficial framework for customer strategy focus.

Summary

In the latest episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson provide a tactical guide to refueling your sales pipeline. Drawing on their extensive experience in the field, they share the intricacies of direct prospecting and networking-based prospecting. They stress the importance of balance and resilience in a successful sales strategy, using the metaphor of a three-legged stool to represent a robust sales structure. Listen in to gain valuable insights on trust-building within your network, effectively prospecting your existing customers, and crafting an efficient sales strategy. No matter where you are in your sales journey, this episode promises practical advice and strategies to help you boost your sales performance.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey delve deep into the salesperson's value in the modern sales process. Our hosts discuss how the role of the salesperson has evolved with the advent of the internet and the importance of building trust with potential buyers. They also talk about redefining buyer needs and how to differentiate your product or service in the market.

Key Topics Discussed

The Salesperson as a Value Carrier: With a wealth of information available online, the salesperson's role is to add value to a buyer's perceived problem.
The Importance of Trust: Building and transferring trust from the seller to the buyer is the essence of a successful sale.
Unique Selling Propositions: Every salesperson has a unique aspect of their product, their company, and themselves.
Redefining Buyer Problems: It's important for the salesperson to understand the root cause of the buyer's problem to provide a tailored solution.
Ask Better Questions: To create value separation and reframe buyer problems, salespeople need to ask insightful questions.

Key Quotes

From Sean: “Sales is nothing more than the transfer of trust from me because I trust my product... Transferring that trust to the buyer and having the buyer then have that trust that I can actually solve the problem that's at hand is what sales is all about."

From Kevin: “The salesperson and sales leader, their whole job is to become the differentiators. The salesperson has to become that value. And it's not just a value of, 'Hey, I'm different. Hey, I'm cheaper.' We're not competing on price here; we're competing on actual customer-facing value."

In the age of readily available online information, a salesperson's job is no longer just about conveying product details. It's about building trust, understanding the root of the customer's problem, and providing them with unique solutions. Join Kevin and Sean in this enlightening episode as they redefine the role of the modern salesperson and provide actionable insights to excel in the evolving sales landscape. If you're ready to take your sales skills to the next level, this episode is a must-listen. Remember, sales success is not just about selling a product but also about being the value a buyer seeks.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey deep-dive into the crucial topic of assigning the right person to the sales leadership role within a company, and the risks and opportunities that come with it. Leveraging their experiences in sales consultancy and drawing from the wisdom of thought leaders and successful entrepreneurs, they explore how CEOs can de-risk their company's growth potential by stepping back from direct sales and fostering a culture of accountability, infrastructure, and high performance in their sales teams.

Key Topics Discussed:

The Risk of CEO-led Sales: The episode starts with a discussion on the potential risks of having a CEO or owner-operator as the sales leader, emphasizing how this could constrain business growth.
The Theory of Constraints: The hosts explain the theory of constraints using a compelling example from a book called The Goal, drawing parallels to how constraints can hinder sales and growth within a company.
Building a Sales Organization: They delve into the necessity of professional salespeople and a dedicated sales manager to bring in new revenue, enabling the CEO to focus on larger issues within the organization.
EOS and Right Person, Right Seat: Sean mentions EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) and the importance of having the right person in the right seat to drive growth, particularly once a company reaches a certain size.
Building a High-Performance Culture: The hosts discuss how to build a high-performance sales culture that is systematic and repeatable, using examples from sports dynasties and successful companies.

Key Quotes:

"What is the risk of the owner-operator being the only salesperson or the sales leader when the person is leading the company and leading sales? What you end up with is a business that is constrained by the amount of time that leader has." - Kevin Lawson
"If you want to know how we know this, it's cuz we've done this a few times, we've worked with a number of businesses and this is how we help people grow." - Kevin Lawson
"It's okay to ask for help, but it's also very important that you have experts doing the job as much as possible so that you can be very, very effective at driving performance and driving your company forward." - Sean O'Shaughnessey

Additional Resources:

The Goal by Eliyahu M. Goldratt (https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement/dp/0884271951)
Traction by Gino Wickman (https://www.amazon.com/Traction-Get-Grip-Your-Business/dp/1936661837)
Previous episodes featuring Tim Warren, CEO of Helium SEO - https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/building-and-scaling-successful-sales-teams-a-conversation-with-tim-warren-of-helium-seo and https://sites.libsyn.com/458454/part-2-building-and-scaling-successful-sales-teams-a-conversation-with-tim-warren-of-helium-seo

In this episode, Kevin and Sean break down the importance of implementing a well-structured sales team and the necessity for CEOs to delegate sales leadership. They highlight the risks of an owner-operator leading sales and how it can limit business growth. Using their experience and the wisdom of successful entrepreneurs, they provide valuable insights into creating a systematic, repeatable, and high-performance sales culture. So, if you're an entrepreneur looking to streamline your sales process and drive your company forward, this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a must-listen. You won't want to miss it!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

The Goal: A Process of Ongoing Improvement - 30th Anniversary Edition

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The hosts of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales wish you a Happy Independence Day!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson delve into the crucial difference between a Marketing Qualified Lead (MQL) and a Sales Qualified Lead (SQL). They explain how the two require different types of messaging and engagement and highlight the importance of refining the process of transitioning leads from one category to another.

Key Topics Discussed * Differences between MQLs and SQLs: Kevin begins the episode by comparing the difference in approach between MQLs and SQLs to the difference in speaking to a large group vs. one-on-one conversations. The messaging and engagement are distinct, and as an MQL transitions into an SQL, the engagement becomes more personalized and directed. * Avoiding Pipeline Clutter: Sean reflects on instances when leads aren't adequately transitioned from marketing to sales, causing clutter and inefficiency in the sales pipeline. He emphasizes the importance of discerning when a prospect needs more time to be ready to progress in the sales process and re-engaging them through marketing efforts. * Sales-Marketing Synergy: Kevin stresses the need for sales and marketing teams to collaborate efficiently. Sales leaders should be grateful for the groundwork done by marketing teams as they set the stage for more specific conversations with leads. * Understanding Lead Progression: Kevin and Sean recommend salespeople understand a lead's journey from an MQL to an SQL. Knowing how a lead has interacted with the brand helps salespeople improve lead quality and engagement. * The Importance of Problem Identification: Sean insists on the importance of early identification of the problem you're solving for the lead. If the salesperson is convinced they can solve a specific issue, the lead becomes an SQL, and the task shifts to convincing the customer of the solution.

Key Quotes * Sean: "Sales brings in revenue. Customers get a product in return, and that keeps everybody employed and going forward." * Kevin: "Marketing and sales all have the same goal, sell more. It's how we stay employed."

Additional Resources * 'The Sales Acceleration Formula' by Mark Roberge, mentioned by Kevin as a recommended read.

This episode is a must-listen for those looking to understand the crucial transition from MQLs to SQLs, how to avoid pipeline clutter, and the importance of a symbiotic relationship between sales and marketing. Whether you're in B2B sales, a startup, or an established company, you'll find invaluable insights to apply to your sales processes.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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On this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, co-hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive into a crucial aspect of successful sales: managing and organizing a sales pipeline.

Episode Highlights: 1. The Pipeline Mess: Sales pipelines, just like a room full of kids' sports gear, can often become a chaotic. Sean and Kevin discuss the importance of maintaining a clear and clean pipeline for better sales results. 2. Salespeople vs. Customers: Sean brings attention to an essential difference between a prospect exploring an idea and a prospect making a purchase. Just because a customer is talking to a salesperson doesn't mean they're buying. 3. Clarifying Sales Terminology: Kevin emphasizes the importance of using correct terminology. He defines a lead as a piece of data and a prospect as someone engaged in an active sales discussion. Establishing this common language helps untangle potential confusion in the pipeline. 4. Understanding the Buying Process: Sean explains the importance of knowing where you stand with the customer. He suggests asking, "Does the prospect know they're buying something?" If the answer is no, it may still be early in the buying process. 5. Economic Buyer and Decision-making: Both Sean and Kevin delve into the role of the Economic Buyer, who can control a budget and make purchasing decisions. They illustrate how understanding the different roles within the buying process can optimize the sales strategy. 6. Goals vs. Pain: Sean warns against focusing solely on pain points and emphasizes that it's essential to consider the customer's goals. The failure to achieve a goal can often be a bigger pain point and, therefore, a more significant motivator to make a purchase.

Listen to the episode to get actionable advice on managing your sales pipeline effectively. Ideal for sales leaders, business owners, and salespersons, this episode is packed with insights, real-life experiences, and strategies to boost your sales results. If you're looking to tidy up your pipeline and refine your sales strategies, this episode is a must-listen.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this dynamic episode of the "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales" podcast, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey, delve into the importance of strategy in successful sales performance. Using a navigational analogy, the hosts discuss how just like using an app like Waze, successful sales also requires anticipation and understanding of the challenges on the way.

Drawing parallels between navigation and sales, Kevin and Sean underscore the value of proactive strategic planning. From the importance of mapping out the sales process akin to charting a route on a map to responding to unforeseen challenges, just like navigating detours on a road trip, they highlight how a robust strategy can guide salespeople from the starting point to their goals effectively.

Touching on subjects like the sales process, tactics, and mid-year sales strategy, the hosts shed light on the importance of a sales process, likening it to a paper map providing a general path. They discuss how technology today allows for more dynamic navigation, reflecting on how modern sales techniques can help efficiently reach sales targets.

Kevin shares the difference between strategy and tactics, comparing a sales strategy to a commander's intent in the military, emphasizing that strategies are generally long-term. Sean continues the conversation, sharing how salespeople can be proactive in their strategy, planning in advance for predictable stages in the sales process.

On a practical note, the duo also discusses how sales leaders can help their teams distinguish between strategy, tactics, and to-do items, nurturing their understanding and development in the sales process. Lastly, the hosts touch on the importance of strategic planning for the coming year, even when in the middle of the current one.

Listeners are sure to find actionable insights and practical advice in this episode that could help them to formulate effective sales strategies and tactics, streamline their sales processes, and drive their sales performance forward.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this enlightening episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson delve into the fundamental aspect of setting clear expectations in sales, mirroring the way parents do with their children. With mid-year reviews around the corner, it's time to reflect, analyze, and readjust your sales strategies.

Kevin starts with a compelling anecdote about his childhood bedtime routine to explain the critical importance of clear communication and setting expectations. The duo emphasizes that salespeople and leaders must carry the same burden to ensure success. They then transition into discussing data, people, and customers, shedding light on how they interplay in the sales ecosystem.

Sean broadens the conversation to the art of adaptation and how market changes could necessitate mid-year modifications to sales processes. This aspect is brought into sharp focus with the unprecedented disruptions caused by the Covid-19 pandemic. Both hosts agree on the necessity of data-informed decision-making, underlining the importance of balancing past performance with future potential. They delve into the aspects that contribute to understanding a customer's potential, including market changes and various environmental factors.

Kevin and Sean also touch upon the essentiality of upskilling the sales team, the significance of coaching, and the benefit of taking a hard look at individual performance. The conversation concludes with a detailed discussion on data analysis, with both hosts advocating for leveraging your CRM system for a thorough assessment of your sales process, the documentation, and the distribution of deals.

So, whether you're a seasoned salesperson or new to the game, this episode is filled with vital insights that you can incorporate into your sales strategy, setting you up for success in the latter half of the year.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson discuss the importance of standing out and differentiating oneself in the competitive world of sales. They explore how salespeople can escape the commodity mindset and become trusted advisors to their clients, ultimately leading to more money and success.

Key takeaways from the episode include:

The importance of differentiating oneself in the sales process
Understanding and embracing the role of an expert in your field
"The Challenger Sale" book's approach, and its impact on sales success
The dangers of proposing too early and devaluing your offering
Creating value for your clients by helping them be successful
Evaluating and improving your sales pipeline to increase revenue

The hosts also mention insightful books and previous podcast guests, such as Kelly Crandall and Jim Hardwick (both Fractional Sales VPs aligned with Sales Xceleration), who provide valuable perspectives on sales and leadership.

Sean and Kevin encourage our listeners to reach out with any questions or topics they would like to see covered in future episodes.

Don't miss this episode full of practical advice and insights on improving your sales game, adding value to your clients, and ultimately making more money. Listen now to learn from the experts, and start transforming your sales approach today!

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this thought-provoking podcast, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey dive into the challenges salespeople face when their sales process doesn't align with the buyer's journey. Using the example of a beer industry manufacturer, they explore the difficulties encountered when dealing with prospects who are only interested in the price and user count and how this can lead to feeling like a commodity. This insightful discussion underscores the importance of adapting to the buyer's journey to sell more effectively.

As the conversation continues, Sean and Kevin emphasize the need to understand the buyer's process, from recognizing the signs of a good prospect to determining the right time to buy. They highlight the importance of asking the right questions, listening to the buyer, and identifying their current position in the evaluation process. The hosts also discuss the concept of commercial teaching, which involves meeting prospects at their level of knowledge about the industry, solution, or product.

In addition, the duo addresses the challenge of long sales cycles and the factors that contribute to them, such as not understanding where the buyer is in their journey or not setting up for success earlier in the sales process. They encourage salespeople to be self-reflective and analyze their pipelines, identifying deals that may be stuck or taking longer than expected due to a lack of alignment with the buyer's journey.

Furthermore, Kevin and Sean touch upon the importance of knowing the buyer persona, recognizing that different people within an organization have different perspectives and needs. By understanding the type of person you're speaking with, salespeople can connect more quickly and effectively.

The podcast concludes with a challenge for salespeople to be introspective and consider how they can better align their sales process with the buyer's journey for improved results.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this episode of the podcast, Kevin and Sean discuss the necessity for sales leaders to adapt their advice and strategies in today's ever-changing environment. With the numerous changes and challenges that businesses face every day, sales leaders must constantly evolve and stay ahead of the curve to help their teams succeed.

The discussion touches on how being a trusted advisor to clients is crucial for success regardless of market shifts and economic turmoil. The ability to understand and professionally empathize with clients and their challenges allows salespeople to effectively guide clients and prospects toward solutions. Emphasizing the significance of leading indicators in sales activities and reframing value propositions according to clients' perspectives is vital.

To achieve enduring success, sales leaders must instill the importance of understanding a prospect's business, its competitors, and its market value to the sales team. This will ultimately make them trusted advisors to their clients and help them navigate the complex and ever-changing business landscape.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this inspiring episode of "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," the hosts, Sean and Kevin, welcome Jim Hardwick, Chief Community Officer for Sales Xceleration and Fractional VP of Sales.

As a seasoned sales professional with 36 years of experience in healthcare, Jim shares his journey from climbing the corporate ladder to finding purpose and joy in his current role. He attributes his newfound happiness to a paradigm shift towards serving others, a realization sparked by a life-changing trip to Kenya, where he and his wife started a dental clinic.

Discussing the importance of servant leadership in building better sales organizations, Jim emphasizes the impact of serving clients, employees, and the community. He believes that when business owners and sales leaders focus on understanding and helping their employees achieve their goals and aspirations, the entire organization benefits. This approach creates a positive work environment that fosters employee loyalty and drives business growth.

Moreover, Jim stresses the significance of actively listening to employees, valuing their input, and being open to change. Servant leadership, according to Jim, extends beyond grand gestures; it encompasses small acts of kindness and attentiveness, creating a ripple effect that ultimately comes back to the giver tenfold.

In this engaging conversation, Jim Hardwick leaves the audience with the powerful message of giving freely without keeping score and embracing a mentality of service instead of taking. His uplifting stories and passion for serving others will surely inspire listeners to adopt a more intentional and compassionate approach in their personal and professional lives.

You can reach out to Jim Hardwick at Aspire Sales & Sales Xceleration - jhardwick@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimhardwick/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this podcast episode, Kevin and Sean discuss how to help a top-performing salesperson get through a slump and back on track. They emphasize the importance of a time-based sales strategy and keeping an eye on the early stages of a sale, such as lead generation and relationship building. They recommend reinforcing the positive aspects of a salesperson's work and ensuring they are following the right process to build an effective pipeline.

They also suggest an intellectually honest approach to pipeline management to evaluate the pipeline's health and identify areas that need improvement. This involves looking at close rates and the average time taken to close deals. Moreover, they discuss setting realistic goals for salespeople, focusing on the right activities for the right prospects, and practicing delivering the right message to the target market.

They stress the importance of patience and confidence-building for salespeople in a slump, as well as celebrating successes. Lastly, they highlight the role of a sales leader in supporting their team members rather than taking over their tasks.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this engaging podcast episode, hosts Kevin and Sean dive into the crucial topic of rewarding effort and results during sales meetings. They emphasize the importance of recognizing salespeople's achievements through monetary rewards, acknowledgment, and praise. The hosts discuss the impact of consistent processes for catching people doing things right and sharing best practices among sales teams. They also touch upon the idea of self-reward for sales practitioners, encouraging them to celebrate their successes.

Throughout the conversation, Sean and Kevin provide actionable advice and tools for sales leaders to cultivate a positive work environment, ultimately leading to better results. They also highlight the human aspect of sales, acknowledging the challenges that salespeople face daily.

If you're a sales leader or a sales practitioner looking for valuable insights and strategies to elevate your team's performance, don't miss out on this podcast. Subscribe now on your favorite podcast player to stay up-to-date with the latest episodes and learn from industry experts like Kevin and Sean. Happy listening and happy selling!

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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In this podcast, Tim Warren, CEO of Helium-SEO, discusses his approach to handling difficult situations in a sales environment. He emphasizes the importance of coaching opportunities and scaling through challenges or problems with existing salespeople. Tim shares his approach to handling a situation where an account manager did not provide the level of service they were supposed to, causing a client to feel that the service level had dropped. He stresses the importance of being open, honest, and transparent, taking responsibility, and having a plan to fix the issue. As a CEO, Tim wants to show his team how to take ownership and responsibility for handling similar situations and eventually be able to handle them independently.

Tim emphasizes the importance of building a strong culture in a business. According to Tim, a company's culture should be grounded in its core values, which should guide the behavior and actions of every team member. The culture should be so strong that it feels like a cult, somewhere between a business and a religion. Tim believes that a strong company culture can significantly impact business success by attracting and retaining top talent and creating an environment where everyone feels valued, motivated, and committed to achieving the company's goals.

To maintain the company's culture, Tim emphasizes the importance of hiring according to core values and being strict with those values when people do not live up to them. He suggests promoting and praising team members who embody the company's core values. By doing so, it reinforces the importance of these values and helps to maintain the culture. Overall, Tim believes that building and maintaining a solid company culture is essential for business success.

You can reach Tim at https://www.linkedin.com/in/timwarrenhelium/ and Helium SEO is at https://helium-seo.com/.

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this podcast, Kevin and Sean talk to Tim Warren, the founder and CEO of Helium SEO. Tim talks about his background and how he got into sales. He discusses his experience in building technical engineering-focused SEO and SEM campaigns for mid-size and enterprise clients. He also explains how his company has been able to drive higher ROI for its clients.

Tim shares his leadership journey as a sales leader and how he has learned that star salespeople don't always make great coaches. He emphasizes the importance of having a sales process in place and training salespeople effectively to ensure consistency in performance. Tim also talks about the challenges of growing a sales team, such as hiring the right people and scaling the team without sacrificing quality. He reinforces why his LinkedIn profile says that he is "Recruiting rockstars to build Helium to $100M. Are you ready to take your career to the next level?"

This podcast provides insights into Tim Warren's sales journey and his approach to building and leading successful sales teams.

You can reach Tim at https://www.linkedin.com/in/timwarrenhelium/ and Helium SEO is at https://helium-seo.com/.

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Kevin and Sean continue to discuss the importance of staying relevant to customers and prospects.

In the first part of the podcast, Sean interviews Megan O’Hara of EasyIT about the challenges of reaching customers in the digital age, where everyone is bombarded with emails and messages. They discuss the importance of being authentic, providing value, and standing out from the competition. They also emphasize the need for salespeople to adapt to changing technology and stay up to date with new tools and platforms. They touch upon topics such as personal branding, content creation, and the role of social media in sales. Megan does this by sending out her video series called Mondays with Megan, and she goes into detail about how this helps her grow her business.

In the second part of the podcast, Kevin and Sean praise sales professional Megan for her effective approach to engaging with prospects and customers. They highlight the value of her short, actionable tips and tricks, which immediately benefit to her listeners. They also discuss the importance of constantly learning and improving, regardless of age or experience. They end the podcast by emphasizing the three things that every salesperson sells: their product, their company, and themselves.

Overall, the podcast provides valuable insights and tips for sales professionals on how to stay relevant, provide value, and engage with customers in the digital age. It emphasizes the importance of authenticity, personal branding, and continuous learning and improvement. The podcast also highlights the potential impact of short, actionable content in driving customer engagement and business growth.

You can reach Megan at https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-o-hara-0b71b5a7/

You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

Mondays with Megan can be found at https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLlJUGvMaVOLm64wul81R51Aj-2JuM2mxL

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Kelly Crandall returns to Two Tall Guys Talking Sales for her second episode in two weeks. Kelly is an expert in sales after working in the corporate world, running a small business, providing Fractional Sales Leadership for her customers in Florida, and now is the Visionary for Sales Xceleration.

This episode centers around building a strong value proposition and creating a sales strategy that resonates with customers. In this particular episode, the topic of discussion is the third area of the sales process and how it can help build trust with customers.

Kelly has agreed to stick around for the second episode, where she focuses on the validation needed to create trust.

A great sales strategy starts with answering the questions of why act and why act now. Then answer the question of why choose us. Then you need to validate that your product solves the problem so that you can have the conversation about trust (because #b2bsales is simply the transferring of the trust from the sales team to the prospect). The hosts and the guest emphasize the importance of having all three areas covered to create a strong value proposition.

Kelly explains that proof is the key. Salespeople should be authentic, transparent, and empathetic while using data and statistics to support their claims. Testimonials, case studies, and stories help build trust with customers. The goal is to anticipate objections and provide proof in advance.

Salespeople transfer their trust in the product to the prospect. The hosts also explain that salespeople sell three things: the product, the company that makes the product, and themselves as salespeople. Building trust is an essential part of the selling process.

Validation events can be expensive for young companies. Owners should help get customer testimonials and create case studies to leverage for future sales pitches.

This podcast episode provides a comprehensive overview of creating trust and how it can help build customer revenue. Kelly emphasizes the importance of having all three areas covered to create a strong value proposition. She provides practical tips on using proof to build trust and anticipate objections.

This podcast episode is a valuable resource for anyone looking to improve their sales strategy and build a stronger value proposition.

You can reach out to Kelly at Kelly Crandal - Next Level Strategies, LLC & Sales Xceleration - kcrandall@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellycrandall1/

You can reach out to Kevin at Kevin Lawson - Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at Sean O'Shaughnessey - New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Kevin and Sean have a special guest for this episode! Kelly Crandall of Sales Xceleration and Next Level Strategies.

Kelly is a sales expert who works as an advisor to help mid to small-size businesses build a path to more sales. The topic of the conversation is "The Sales Skills Required to Communicate Your Value Proposition to Win More Deals." Kelly talks about the importance of value proposition and its broader concept that focuses on why buyers should buy from a company. She stresses the importance of customizing the value proposition to each client and the need to consider customer feedback, industry trends, and client resonance.

According to Kelly, a strong value proposition can help businesses gain customer loyalty, win more sales, and charge premium fees. However, she highlights that companies need to tailor the concept of the value proposition to each client, which requires a customized approach. The conversation also highlights that teaching salespeople how to articulate their value proposition compellingly and tangibly is critical. Therefore, businesses must shift their thought process and create a value proposition based on customer feedback, needs, and industry trends.

Kelly has a background in sales, sales leadership, and entrepreneurship, and her experience indicates that any company can learn to create a strong value proposition. However, it requires a tailored approach that considers each client's specific needs and requirements. The conversation provides valuable insights for businesses and salespeople on the importance of customizing the value proposition and the benefits of having a solid value proposition.

You can reach out to Kelly at: Kelly Crandal - Next Level Strategies, LLC & Sales Xceleration - kcrandall@salesxceleration.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellycrandall1/

You can reach out to Sean at: Sean O'Shaughnessey - New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

You can reach out to Kevin at: Kevin Lawson - Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

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In this episode of "Two Tall Guys talking Sales," Sean and Kevin provide insights on how to conduct effective sales meetings that focus on education and training. They suggest assigning individual salespeople to research topics or chapters of a book to teach the team, ensuring everyone becomes an authority on the topic. The hosts stress the importance of repetition and testing knowledge by applying it to specific accounts or situations. They also highlight the need to have clear goals and contribute directly to revenue growth in every meeting. The hosts further discuss the importance of continuous education in sales, suggesting attending conferences, reading books and articles, and practicing role play. They emphasize the value of asking questions to peers and customers to gain insights into their needs and preferences. The hosts recommend a three-column format when approaching prospects or customers and conclude by advising sales leaders to sell their new ideas to their team members instead of telling them what to do.

You can reach out to Kevin at: Kevin Lawson - Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

You can reach out to Sean at: Sean O'Shaughnessey - New Sales Expert, LLC & Sales Xceleration - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

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Your sales meeting should discuss the highest priority topics that require immediate attention. For broader issues, it is recommended to use other venues. To stay on point, it is important to control the agenda and flow of the meeting. Additionally, meeting minutes should be kept short and focused on action items to ensure that tasks are completed following the meeting.

To promote growth, discussing one or two topics deeply rather than many topics lightly is recommended. This will encourage open dialogue and feedback among team members, which can help to generate new ideas and insights. It is important not to play with new meeting tools until you are proficient to avoid wasting time.

Assigning specific tasks to individuals following each meeting is also essential to ensure that projects progress. Additionally, it is recommended to have a team member present at each meeting to learn leadership skills and be acknowledged for their contributions. Following these guidelines can make meetings more productive and focused, and the team can work together to achieve their goals.

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Efficient and effective meetings are essential for the success of any business, and the EOS L10 meetings have become increasingly popular in recent times. It is important for all meetings to start and end on time, avoiding rewarding tardiness and respecting everyone's schedule. It is crucial to address individuals who regularly arrive late in private. In addition, time management is key to ensuring that each topic is discussed within the allotted time frame, and sales meetings should be approached similarly to a sales call. By adhering to these guidelines, the sales department can increase productivity and achieve its goals promptly and efficiently.

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Regular sales team meetings are essential to keep salespeople informed, productive and on the same page. Before scheduling a sales team meeting, make sure to have a good reason for doing so. Possible topics for sales team meetings could include reviewing sales goals and strategies, discussing new leads, customer information and product updates, giving recognition to salespeople for their accomplishments, pinpointing any areas of improvement and brainstorming solutions as a team. Finally, make sure to end the meeting on a positive note! If a meeting isn't necessary or appropriate after all, consider other ways to communicate with your sales team such as through email or hosting an online webinar.

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Discuss the role of a salesperson in their 1:1 meetings with a manager

Prepare for the meeting

Don't micro-manage

Explain how to set goals and objectives for these meetings

Describe the importance of tracking progress and updating managers on results

Offer tips on how to stay motivated and accountable during 1:1s

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In this episode, Sean and Kevin discuss the struggle of a sales turnaround. Aside from being patient and following a plan:

Define what a turnaround means for your specific sales department
Outline a plan of action that meets or exceeds the expectations of upper management
Communicate the program to all members of your sales team and get their buy-in
Execute the program and track progress regularly
Celebrate successes along the way, but stay focused on the ultimate goal
Adjust course as necessary based on feedback from management and results achieved

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Sean O'Shaughnessey recently did a CEO Workshop on Key Account (or Named Account) sales management best practices. In this episode, Kevin and Sean dig into one of the ancillary topics that wasn't fully explored in that CEO Workshop.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales: Recent Episodes

Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey