CG Podcast: Recent Episodes
CG PODCAST
Collateral Global is a UK registered Charity (No. 1195125) dedicated to researching, understanding, and communicating the effectiveness and collateral impacts of the Mandated Non-Pharmaceutical Interventions (MNPIs) taken by governments worldwide in response to the COVID-19 pandemic.
Toby Green joins Frank Armstrong for a wide-ranging discussion based on his new book The Heretic of Cacheu: Struggles Over Life in a Seventeenth-Cenury West African Port. The book exhumes the records of a Portuguese Inquisitorial trial from 1665 into apparently deviant conduct of a half-African, female slave-trader Cacheu – the first African region to be drawn by the Portuguese systematically into the transatlantic slave trade. It also explores the role of the djabakós – traditional healers with knowledge of local herbs and their properties.
Frank and Toby discuss parallels between what occurred during this colonial period and what happened on the African continent during the Covid-19 pandemic, where a range of inappropriate policies have caused lasting harm.
They also discuss heretical ideas about the health of the body and the spirit being integrated that have an application to our own time, especially in the context of excess deaths in many countries increasing since 2021; and the ongoing relevance of the idea that those who diagnose any condition are generally empowered to claim the authority to heal it.
Our recent photography competition winner Ross Novie joins Frank Armstrong to discuss his winning entry, featuring his masked daughter on a family outing to Yellowstone National Park in Montana.
Ross is a TV producer living in Los Angelas who grew increasingly concerned at the impacts of COVID-19 restrictions on his children. In response to his two teenagers being kept out of school for almost a year-and-a-half he founded an organisation called LA Uprising to campaign on their behalf.
This podcast explores how political polarisation and groupthink led to the imposition of some of the United States’ most stringent controls in the state of California, and how a ‘priestly’ caste of experts were deferred to throughout the period, as politicians relied on fear to engineer consent.
In this episode of CG Podcasts, Professor Toby Green (King's College, London) discusses the new book 'In Covid's Wake' with authors Stephen Macedo and Frances E. Lee of the Politics Department of Princeton University.
They discuss the economic and political fallout, the connections between the Covid policies and Trump's election in 2024, and the future for academic and public discussions around the impacts of the Covid years.
Peru’s harsh military-enforced lockdown had devastating effects on education, deepening inequalities and leaving long-term scars on students. Professor Norma Correa Aste, argues school closures were inconsistent, as other sectors remained open, forcing many children to fend for themselves or work in markets instead of learning. Remote education was not an adequate substitute, leading to significant learning losses, especially for the most vulnerable students. Advocates for school reopening faced intense pushback, including personal attacks and censorship, as the debate over pandemic policies grew more polarised. The discussion also highlighted how emergency orders introduced during the pandemic continue to shape government decision-making and public perception, raising concerns about the future of education policy in Peru.
In this podcast Professor Norma Correa Aste, a Peruvian anthropologist, shows how lockdown measures have a detrimental and lasting impact beyond the pandemic, with the government using remote learning for non-health-related reasons such as strikes, protests, sporting events and conferences citing traffic and security concerns.
She says the ongoing reliance on remote learning in Peru reveals a troubling pattern and that school closures disproportionately harm vulnerable students, particularly those without reliable internet or home learning support, deepening educational inequalities. She warns such measures risk widening the gap between privileged and disadvantaged students, with long-term consequences for the country’s future.
In this podcast, Professor Norma Correa Aste, a Peruvian anthropologist, examines the widespread harms in her country caused by COVID-19 lockdown measures. She discusses the disproportionate impact on vulnerable communities, particularly in Latin America, where economic hardship and social inequalities worsened.
Correa Aste highlights the severe consequences of school closures, including learning loss and increased child labour. She critiques the lack of flexibility in public health policies, arguing that rigid lockdowns led to unintended negative outcomes such as mental health crises and economic collapse. She calls for a more balanced approach in future crises, emphasising the need to consider social and economic factors alongside public health measures.
Prof David Paton criticised the UK COVID inquiry for focusing on the wrong questions and not questioning the harms of lockdowns and school closures. He was sceptical about the WHO's willingness to learn from past mistakes, citing their continued support for authoritarian public health measures.
Prof Paton cited his own research on the effects of vaccine mandates in care homes, finding they led to a net loss of 14,000 to 18,000 workers, or 4-7 percent of the workforce, without reducing mortality. He also noted previous COVID infections are likely to provide greater protection than vaccination. Overall, Prof Paton argued that vaccine mandates and strict public health measures had significant negative impacts without clear benefits.
Episode 3 explores the contrasting outcomes of COVID-19 lockdowns in Brazil and Peru. Despite Peru's strict and military lockdown measures, the country suffered a high death toll and severe economic and social consequences. In contrast, Brazil's less stringent restrictions resulted in comparable or lower excess deaths.
The discussion underscores Peru's challenges, including an overwhelmed health system and widespread public fear, which was worsened by limited access to essential resources like medical oxygen. The second wave amplified economic hardships for households and businesses, with lockdowns often creating more problems than solutions. The conversation suggests that adopting a broader global perspective on pandemic strategies could have led to more effective policies.
In this episode, we’re joined by Professor David Paton, a health economist at the University of Nottingham, to reflect on the UK government's response to the COVID-19 pandemic. We’ll examine the costs of lockdown measures, the societal impact, and explore the decision-making process.
A central question in assessing the government's actions is whether they fully considered the costs of their decisions. Rishi Sunak, then Chancellor of the Exchequer, later admitted some Cabinet members tried to raise concerns about the economic and social consequences of lockdowns but were discouraged from speaking out. Professor Paton argues that this highlights a fundamental flaw in the decision-making process, which focused almost entirely on reducing COVID-related deaths and preventing the NHS from being overwhelmed. However, he says this approach overlooked long-term economic and social consequences.
The economic costs were vast. The government spent around £400 billion on measures like the furlough scheme and business support, with £140 billion used to pay people and businesses to stay closed. While some argue these measures were essential, Professor Paton questions what else that money could have been used for, such as improving healthcare or education—services linked to health and longevity. The fiscal consequences are still felt today, with tax increases and cuts to services now on the horizon.
Mental health also suffered, with isolation and uncertainty taking a psychological toll. Professor Paton stresses that these social and mental health costs are just as significant—and harder to quantify—than financial ones.
Prof Paton also argues, the government didn’t explore whether lockdowns were truly effective in reducing COVID cases or saving lives. While some scientific models predicted disaster without lockdowns, they failed to account for the voluntary behavioural changes people were already making. His research shows many people were social distancing and avoiding crowded spaces long before any formal government measures were enforced. Professor Paton says these voluntary actions were likely more impactful than the strict legal mandates that followed.
The podcast also touches on censorship and the suppression of alternative voices during the pandemic. Many experts questioned the effectiveness of lockdowns but faced pressure to conform. Countries like Sweden, which implemented fewer restrictions, fared no worse than those with stricter measures, suggesting there was no one-size-fits-all solution.
Ultimately, Professor Paton argues that future decision-making must include a wider range of voices, with open debate ensuring more balanced and effective responses to public health crises.
In this episode, we discuss the profound impact of school closures and online education during the harsh COVID-19 lockdown in Peru. We talk to Professor Norma Correa Aste, a specialist in social policy and child development, based in Lima. As the mother of two girls, Norma became a high profile campaigner for school and university reopening and better pandemic responses for children, young people and vulnerable families in Peru and Latin America. In Peru, the education system was shut down for nearly two years, during the pandemic from March 2020 to December 2021. Professor Correa highlights the huge challenges faced by children and families, shedding light on the often-overlooked consequences of these decisions.
While shopping centres, stadiums, and other public spaces reopened, schools remained closed, with children left to navigate online lessons in isolation. For many, the shift to remote education exacerbated existing inequalities, as many had no access to the internet, computers, or a stable home environment conducive to learning.
Prof Correa says children’s welfare was not considered in decision-making during the pandemic. In Peru, she says, even pets were allowed outside before children, and public parks were sealed off, making it nearly impossible for children to get fresh air or exercise. Official communications even reinforced the idea that children were major vectors of the virus, further stigmatising them as a threat to public health. The emphasis on safety, while important, often came at the cost of children’s mental health, social development, and access to education.
For children in rural areas or low-income families, the lack of connectivity and technological resources meant remote education was not viable. In many cases, children were forced to leave school to help their families survive, as poverty rates increased and economic hardship worsened. Remote learning, instead of bridging the gap, deepened social inequality, especially for children in public schools who lacked the resources enjoyed by those in private education.
As the situation grew more dire, a group of concerned parents, including Prof Correa formed a grassroots initiative "Volvamos a Clases" (Go Back to Class) calling for children to return to school. Despite intense opposition and misinformation, their efforts eventually led to the reopening of schools in 2022.
This podcast episode highlights the stark contrast between the experiences of children from different socio-economic backgrounds during the pandemic and emphasises the importance of considering the broader social, psychological, and educational costs when making policy decisions. It also serves as a powerful reminder of the need for inclusive policy making that prioritises the well-being of children and addresses the systemic inequalities that were exposed by the pandemic.
In this insightful podcast episode, Professor Norma Correa explores how Peru's strict and prolonged lockdowns during the COVID-19 pandemic profoundly impacted education and poverty. The lockdowns led to a sharp rise in poverty levels from 20 percent to 30 percent, particularly in urban areas where informal employment was as high as 72 percent.
Government interventions, such as cash transfers and company financing, offered some relief, but many vulnerable groups were overlooked. Civil society initiatives, stepped in to support those in need, highlighting the resilience of local communities.
Rural regions faced additional struggles, with limited access to healthcare and essential services worsening existing inequalities. The enforcement of strict measures by the military and police further highlighted the challenges faced by Peru during this period. Despite its harsh lockdown Peru was one of the worst hit countries in the world for Covid deaths.
Prof David Paton, Professor of Industrial Economics from Nottingham University, discussed his research on COVID-19 suppression measures, including vaccine mandates and lockdowns. He said lockdowns - designed to save lives lacked evidence and may have even increased death rates due to reduced non-covid healthcare. Prof Paton criticised the government's decision-making process, emphasising the importance of considering the harms and ethics of public health measures. He also examined the impact of vaccine mandates in care homes, finding no significant reduction in mortality and a net loss of 14,000 to 18,000 care home workers. Prof Paton argued the focus on vaccinating younger, low-risk groups was misguided and unethical because the risks outweighed any potential benefits for them.
Professor Karol Sikora, a leading cancer professor discusses censorship with journalist Lucy Johnston, with particular emphasis on a study about the risks and benefits of masks for children, a social media post by Karol about this study was deleted from LinkedIn.
Professor Sikora criticises the censorship of non-pharmaceutical interventions and vaccine debates online during the pandemic, highlighting the negative impact on cancer diagnosis and treatment.
He argues that the pandemic response was overreactive, leading to delayed cancer diagnoses and poorer outcomes for those patients affected.
The discussion also touches on the need for open debate and evidence-based decision-making in future pandemics.
Graham Brady sits down with journalist Lucy Johnston to discuss his book "Kingmaker," detailing his unique perspective on British politics.
He highlights the negative impacts of pandemic measures, including £400 billion in public debt, NHS backlogs, and increased mental health issues among children. Brady criticized the arbitrary nature of lockdowns and restrictions, noting their ineffectiveness and the government's reluctance to change course. He recounted interactions with the then Prime Minister Boris Johnson, emphasising inconsistencies in policy decisions and the suppression of dissenting scientific views. Brady also addressed the role of big tech in shaping public opinion and the need for nuanced debate on future pandemics.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Geoffrey Shullenberger, an American cultural theorist and editor at Compact magazine, to discuss his latest book (edited with Elena Lange), Covid-19 and the Left: The Tyranny of Fear. We discuss how the political left, in America and Europe, responded to the pandemic both early on and as it unfolded. Despite some significant contributions in critical analysis, the majority of left-leaning thinkers were silent about Covid authoritarian tendencies. Why was this? And what happened? We explore these questions, and situate them in the broader historical changes within leftist thinking and culture that shaped how people reacted to fear, tribal identity and scientific evidence. We end by discussing the legacy of Covid on our cultural landscape.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Rajiv Bhatia, a Stanford primary care physician and former deputy health officer in San Francisco, California. Rajiv discusses his experience challenging the state of emergency in California on ethical and process grounds, including his communication with public health colleagues in the early days of the Covid pandemic. A veteran public health officer, Rajiv also discusses the alarming lack of basic epidemiological analysis in California at the time and the implications of this, as the pandemic evolved, for government policy blindspots and groupthink. We finish by reflecting on the future of pandemic response.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Eric Winsberg, a professor of philosophy at the University of South Florida and British Academy Global Professor at the Department of History and Philosophy, University of Cambridge. Eric is the author (along with Stephanie Harvard) of a recent book, Models in Science and Decision-Making. We discuss his book and how philosophy can help us better understand how models are constructed under conditions of uncertainty, their role in guiding public policy, and how they are influenced by contested value judgements. We end by reflecting on some of the critical lessons from the Covid years for the future of infectious disease modelling and the governance of science.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Christine Van Geyn, a lawyer and the director of litigation at the Canadian Constitutional Foundation. Christine is the author (along with Joanna Baron) of the 2023 book, Pandemic Panic: How Canadian Government Responses to Covid-19 Changed Civil Liberties Forever. We discuss the most egregious civil liberties violations in Canada during Covid, the erosion of legal standards that accompanied them, and the implications of this for the future.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Jacob Stegenga, a philosopher of science and medicine at the University of Cambridge. Prof. Stegenga is the author of the 2018 book, Medical Nihilism, which critiques the quality and completeness of evidence in medical interventions. We discuss medical nihilism in the context of the Covid pandemic and reflect on lessons for the future.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Barbara Katz Rothman, a professor of medical sociology and women's studies at City University of New York. Prof. Rothman is the author of the 2021 book, The Biomedical Empire: Lessons Learned from the Covid-19 Pandemic. We discuss her latest book, birth and death during Covid, and different concepts of medical power. Can we really speak about biomedicine today as a global "empire"? And, if so, what are the implications of this for future pandemic response?
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Sosso Feindouno, a researcher based in France with FERDI (Foundation pour les Etude et Recherche sur les Development Internationale). Dr. Feindouno, along with colleagues, published a recent paper in Social Science and Medicine, where they modelled increases in excess mortality in Africa driven by the socio-economic consequences of lockdown in 2020. We discuss the paper, which is entitled Covid-19's Death Transfer to Sub-Saharan Africa, as well his views on how African scientists and policymakers experienced the pandemic and its policy responses. We end by discussing the role of international organisations in lockdown and what needs to change in future pandemic responses.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Bethany McLean, veteran journalist (Enron scandal and 2008 financial crisis) and contributing editor of Vanity Fair Magazine, to discuss her latest book, The Big Fail: What the Pandemic Revealed about Who America Protects and Who it Leaves Behind. The book, published in 2023 and co-authored with Joe Nocera, explores what went wrong in America during Covid and who, ultimately, is responsible. We discuss, among other things, what motivated her to write the book, the impact of the pandemic on the financial sector, and the legacy of Covid policies on the culture wars.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Cristiano Cadagnone, professor of sociology at the University of Milan, to discuss his recent book, The Leviathan with the Feet of Clay. The book, written in Italian and published in February 2024, concentrates on the harms of Covid policies, the rhetoric of fear, and the ideology of scientism. We discuss Prof. Cadagnone's work during the pandemic and academic and media receptivity to his ideas in the broader context of the Italian state response. Finally, we touch on the upcoming Italian Covid Inquiry and what lessons he thinks have been learnt, and not learnt, for future emergency response in Italy.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Nat Malkus, senior fellow and deputy director of education policy studies at the American Enterprise Institute, to discuss his latest research on the effects of school closures on American children and teenagers. Nat's research on chronic absenteeism was recently featured in a New York Times article, A Crisis of School Absences. We discuss the data on school closures, what is being done in the education sector to address these adverse consequences, and the lessons we have learnt for a future pandemic.
Check out our conversation.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Swedish journalist, Johan Anderberg, to discuss his latest book, The Herd: How Sweden Chose Its Own Path Through the Worst Pandemic in 100 Years. Translated into English in 2022, the book explores the no-lockdown approach taken by Anders Tegnell, Sweden's state epidemiologist during the pandemic, and the influence of his long-term mentor, Johan Giesecke. We discuss what motivated Johan to write the book, how pandemic policies evolved in Sweden, and the key lessons the world should learn from the so-called "Swedish Covid experiment."
Check out our conversation.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Prof. Shahar Hameiri, a political scientist from the University of Queensland, to discuss his latest book, The Locked-up Country: Learning the lessons from Australia's Covid-19 response. Published in 2023, the book explores the multiple governance failures of Australia's Covid response and locates these within their historical context, with particular reference to the regulatory state. We reflect on the authoritarianism of lockdown, the public desirability of Zero Covid and the legacy of the pandemic on society and politics in Australia and beyond.
Check out our conversation.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Piero Stanig, Professor of Political Science at Bocconi University in Italy, to discuss his book, Lockdown Failure (Fallimento Lockdown). They explore the government response in Italy, the legacy of lockdown, and what to expect from the upcoming Italian government Covid Inquiry.
Check out our conversation.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Frank Armstrong, Editor of Cassandra Voices, an Irish public intellectual forum and online news source, to discuss the pandemic experience in Ireland and what we can expect from a possible Irish Covid Inquiry.
Frank has published numerous articles about the Covid-19 pandemic, including on topics like Zero Covid, lockdown, vaccine mandates, and media censorship. We discuss his cumulative knowledge of how the policy and scientific community responded to the crisis in Ireland and how the public interpreted events as they unfolded and in their aftermath today.
Kevin Bardosh sits down with Tara Henley, a well-known Canadian writer and podcaster, to discuss the state of the Canadian media during and after the Covid-19 pandemic.
Tara recently published the 2024 Massey Essay, The Trust Spiral: Restoring Faith in the Media, in the Literary Review of Canada. We discuss her thought provoking essay, including why trust in the mainstream media in Canada has declined significantly in the last decade and what can be done about it.
Check out our conversation.
In this episode Reva Yunus and Aleida Borges talk about the gendered aspects of a very ‘punitive’ pandemic response, especially in the Global South. Dr Aleida Mendes Borges also talks about the book, “Pandemic response and the cost of lockdowns. Global debates from humanities and social sciences”, which she co-edited with Peter Sutoris, Sinéad Murphy and Yossi Nehushtan. Who were the people who paid the highest cost of lockdown? This is the question that this conversation focuses on, serving as an urgent reminder of why lockdowns should never be repeated. Dr Borges offers insights into how the decontextualised, top-down, one-size-fits-all approach to handling the pandemic led to an ignorance of local resources, experiences and concerns. The socioeconomic impact on women received minimal attention despite their insecure economic status and higher vulnerability to such crises, and despite local and global voices pointing to the ‘shadow’ pandemic targeting women since the beginning of lockdowns. Challenges of cramped spaces, safety, poverty and ‘double shifts’ were ignored even as large sections of women workers were declared ‘essential’ workers who faced higher risks and earned lower wages. At the same time, the state used high levels of violence in many parts of the world reflecting a shift in the relationship between state power and citizens, especially marginalised groups.
Dr Borges’ research at the Global institute for women’s leadership at King’s College London focuses on social policy, analysing it through a feminist lens. Reva Yunus is a Lecturer at the University of York and researches gender issues, poverty, precarity and schooling.
In this CG Conversation, Dr Jennie Bristow talks to Professor David Livermore about the consequences of lockdowns and social distancing restrictions for the fabric of social life. As we move on from the pandemic itself, to what extent have the behaviours and mores of pre-Covid times changed? On one hand, dystopian fears about the end of handshakes, hugs, and parties have not materialised. On the other, something subtle has changed in the culture of work and education, and we’re no longer sure what we can take for granted.
David and Jennie also discuss the relationship between politicians, the media, and the public during the pandemic, in the demand for more and more rules restricting social behaviour. Was the government responding to an irrational crowd mentality, or was the fearful demand for rules generated by the exclusion of the public from a calm, balanced discussion about what could and should be done? What did the injunction to ‘be kind’ by obeying all the restrictions do to our deeper understanding of what kindness means, and why it matters? Where do we go from here, in reckoning with the Covid years without allowing them to define us?
Lucy Johnston interviews Toby Green about his revisionist history of the pandemic
In this podcast Lucy Johnston, Health Editor of the Sunday Express, interviews Professor Toby Green (CG steering group) about the new book he has coauthored with Thomas Fazi, The Covid Consensus: The Global Assault on Democracy and the Poor -- A Critique from the Left (The Covid Consensus | Hurst Publishers). Their discussion ranges widely, from the causes of the lockdown response and the functioning of the scientific establishment, to the impacts on the Global South and how Green came to write the book. In the final part they discuss the imperative of debate and discussion of what has happened as a key part of the healing process of the traumas of this pandemic.
One of the editors of the new book published by Routledge -- Pandemic Response and the Cost of Lockdowns: Global Debates from the Humanities and Social Sciences -- Peter Sutoris (assistant Professor, University of York) discusses the book with CG steering group member Professor Toby Green. They range over the response of academics from the humanities and the social sciences, the importance of these disciplines to pandemic response, and the role of fields such as Philosophy and Anthropology to a more balanced response to new diseases.
In this podcast, CG steering committee member Toby Green talks with John Perry, contributor to the London Review of Books, FAIR and other publications on Nicaraguan affairs.
Perry gives the perspective of the pandemic response in Nicaragua and Honduras, 2 neighboring countries in Central America. Honduras's neoliberal government followed the dominant lockdown policy, with harsh policing, and closed schools for 2 years: this led to high levels of excess death, and contributed to the collapse of the Honduran government at the end of 2021.
In Nicaragua, by contrast, the Sandinista left-wing government did not follow a lockdown model for fear of the socioeconomic and educational impacts. Perry describes how this policy proved to be more effective, with lower excess deaths, and a much lower socioeconomic effect to poorer communities. This was also made possible by years of health investment by the Sandinista government, with over 20 state-of-the-art hospitals built in the previous decade which helped to see the country through the first Covid wave.
What could humanities scholars have to say about Covid? Here Caitjan Gainty, a historian of medicine and healthcare at King’s College London, discusses the Covid response with her colleague Daniel Hadas, a lecturer in Latin and Ancient Greek.
In the Covid response, governments and public health authorities opted to side-line the knowledge and discourse of the humanities, in a singled-minded focus on “following the science”. This project of setting aside the humanities was both an illusion and a mistake. An illusion, because science itself is a human activity, and the philosophical and political constraints within which it always operates must be acknowledged. A mistake, because the question of what to do in times of pandemic is not just medical or scientific, but raises that fundamental concern of the humanities, and of all human kind: how we can best live and die.
Accordingly, this conversation considers how a philosophical and spiritual analysis can both help us understand more clearly the forms taken by the Covid response, and point to how a better response, one more in accord with the fullness of human dignity, could be possible in future health crises.
In this CG conversation, Daniel Hadas talks to Caitjan Gainty about how the history of medicine and healthcare can illuminate our attempts to analyse and understand the Covid response. Set in the UK but branching out globally, the conversation winds through some of the thorniest of Covid era issues. Vaccines and vaccine mandates, for example, look quite different when set against the problematic and checkered history of global vaccination campaigns. And so do the logics of lockdown and the other non-pharmaceutical interventions, when considered in the context of evolving national security and public health programs over the past 50 years.
In unravelling these issues, further questions arise: what are the right historical moments, events, currents of thought to turn to when trying to contextualise the pandemic? And where does the way in which we choose to contextualise the Covid response intersect with other larger themes: the relationship between science and politics; the scientific and political imaginaries that govern our views of healthcare and medicine; the very nature and role of health in our lives.
Dr Reginald Oduor, Senior Lecturer in Philosophy at the University of Nairobi, discusses Kenya's experience of lockdowns and vaccine mandates with Collateral Global SAB member Toby Green of King's College, London. The impact of the lockdowns on civil rights, the poor, education, and health are discussed -- and also the impacts that this might have into the future, as ethical and political issues mount up.
There is a big focus also on the question of how to foster debate in an environment of the censorship of dissent. How to create engagement and ensure proper debate going forward is a key task for academics and those engaged in civil society, and a duty of those with concern for the experience and lives of future generations
The Covid-19 pandemic was often described as an ‘unprecedented’ disaster, which required wholly new ways of thinking about, and managing, social life. But what was different about this pandemic to those that have afflicted societies over time?
Sociologists have long been interested in pandemics, because they disrupt the existing social order and throw existing problems and tensions into sharp relief. Yet there seemed to be relatively little critical discussion about the historical and sociological dimensions of the response to Covid-19, or balanced debate about the consequences of organising social and economic life around fear of infection.
In this CG conversation, Jennie Bristow talks to Professor Robert Dingwall about the role of the historical and sociological imagination in making sense of the past two years, and where sociology could have done more to put fear into context.
In this podcast, actor and singer Clifton Duncan discusses the impacts of the Covid restrictions on the world of theatre with CG Scientific Advisory Board member Professor Toby Green. The impacts of Covid restrictions on performers have been devastating, with a strong class dimension.
Clifton and Toby discuss the new dimension of the theatre world, segregation of venues, and the consequences for the future of the performing arts, with a special focus on New York.
Originally released March 2022
Listen to this engaging conversation between two of the most eminent scientists, Professor Bhattacharya and Ioannidis as they look back on the past two years.
Their discussion includes the early seroprevalence studies, Infection Fatality Rates (IFR), precision shielding, the collateral damages caused by lockdowns, and how we can begin to rebuild faith in public health.
Original release March 2022
Collateral Global's Toby Green speaks with Dr Daniel Briggs - a criminologist from Universidad Europea in Madrid, Spain - about flaws in initial COVID-19 risk assessment, the absence of context to inform decision-making, the rush to lockdowns, and the devastating social ramifications of those choices.
Original release 2021
CG’s Professor Toby Green hosts an enlightening discussion with Samuel Adu-Gyamfi, Head of History and Political Science at Kwame Nkrumah University of Science and Technology in Kumasi, Ghana.
Topics discussed include:
-
The impact of lockdown on the informal economy: "Preventing movement is simply taking away the lifeblood of virtually the entire country's economy."
-
The West's misunderstanding of the importance of COVID vaccines in Ghana: "It's like dropping a sugar cube in the ocean. It doesn't make sense."
-
The effect on the dependency ratio: "Those who are breadwinners have now become dependents as they are now going to depend on the government to support them."
-
As well as the accuracy of the COVID death counts and how lockdowns actually accelerated the spread of COVID-19 due to the social architecture and built environments of Ghana.
Toby Green, Professor of Precolonial and Lusophone African History and Culture at King's College, London. Author, A Fistful of Shells and The Covid Consensus: The New Politics of Global Inequality (Hurst). Writes on impacts of Covid restrictions at African Arguments, Prospect, UnHerd, The Wire. Member of CG Scientific Advisory Board.
Samuel Adu-Gyamfi is the Head of History and Political Studies of KNUST. His research focus is in Applied History including the social studies of health and medicine in Africa .Through Applied History, he makes explicit attempt to illuminate current challenges and choices by analyzing historical precedents and analogues. He begins with a current choice or predicament and provides a perspective from history. His current project focuses on epidemics and pandemics in Ghana focusing on Asante.
Originally released in 2021
An enlightening conversation between Professor of Psychology, Ellen Townsend and Professor Carl Heneghan of Oxford’s Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine regarding CG’s latest report on the impact of pandemic restrictions on childhood mental health.
Ellen and Carl discuss:
-
What systematic reviews are and why the evidence they produce is so valuable
-
Why adults have an obligation to deescalate fear in children
-
How pandemic policy responses violate Article 3 of the UN Conventions of the Rights of the Child
-
Why older adolescents fare worse than younger children with respect to mental health
-
How to support young people in recovering their mental health post-pandemic
-
Why we must listen to children
Lucy Johnston interviews Toby Green about his revisionist history of the pandemic
In this podcast Lucy Johnston, Health Editor of the Sunday Express, interviews Professor Toby Green (CG steering group) about the new book he has coauthored with Thomas Fazi, The Covid Consensus: The Global Assault on Democracy and the Poor -- A Critique from the Left (The Covid Consensus | Hurst Publishers). Their discussion ranges widely, from the causes of the lockdown response and the functioning of the scientific establishment, to the impacts on the Global South and how Green came to write the book. In the final part they discuss the imperative of debate and discussion of what has happened as a key part of the healing process of the traumas of this pandemic.
One of the editors of the new book published by Routledge -- Pandemic Response and the Cost of Lockdowns: Global Debates from the Humanities and Social Sciences -- Peter Sutoris (assistant Professor, University of York) discusses the book with CG steering group member Professor Toby Green. They range over the response of academics from the humanities and the social sciences, the importance of these disciplines to pandemic response, and the role of fields such as Philosophy and Anthropology to a more balanced response to new diseases.