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Jared Janes & Jason Snyder reunite after 17 months of Both/And hiatus. In this wide-ranging conversation, they talk about what they've been up to and how their perspectives of the sensemaking/meta/liminal web have changed.

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Jared Janes & Jason Snyder come back one more time to give awards to stand-out Both/And episodes. First, they talk about what they've been up to for the past couple of months and then get to the awards: Most Convivial, Most Intellectually Stimulating, Most Challenging to My Worldview, Most Star-Struck, & MVP. Along the way, they also make a bunch of honorable mentions.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Award Winners

• 22 Meta-Rationality & Sexuality with Jessica

• 37 Dancing with COVID with Sarah McManus

• 42 The Ever-Present with Jeremy Johnson

• 25 Horrorism & Culture with Zero HP Lovecraft

• 29 Reducing Suffering with Evan Sandhoefner

• 14 Paradigm Shifting with Erik Davis

• 19 Contextualizing the Spiritual with Jordan Hall

• 32 Regenerating Earth with Joe Brewer

• 41 Simpol Global Action with John Bunzl

• Mentions
• Donella Meadows' paper, Leverage Points
• Tyson Yunkaporta's book, Sand Talk
• Both/And Meets Growing Down

• 30 Aesthetic Embodiment with Rachel Haywire

• 4 Climate Change Adaptation & Meditation with Udita Sanga

• 24 Religion, Creativity & Deleuze with Justin Murphy

• 9 Analyzing Both And with Nathan Snyder

• 2 Memetic Mediation with Peter Limberg

Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes & Jason Snyder talk about Both/And's hiatus, the sensemaking web, podcasting as a medium, memetic mediation, local community, going 'meta', spirituality, their friendship, COVID, contemporary Vajrayana Buddism, their political triggers, the meta/integral left, GameB, thank you's, the Both/And awards, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Jason's article, The Psychodynamics of Memetic Mediation
• Jared's new Podcast
• Jared & Charlie's Stoa Session
• Twitter Questions
• Joe Brewer
• The Unsettling of America by Wendell Berry
• Where the Crawdads Sing by Delia Owens
• Sand Talk by Tyson Yunkaporta
• The Jim Rutt Show and The Wright Show
• JRS: EP63 Michel Bauwens on P2P & Commons
• Tyson Yunkaporta on the Jim Rutt Show: Part 1 and Part 2
• Aro gTér Buddhism
• Charlie Awbery
• Unified Mindfulness
• Culadasa
• Growing Down Podcast with Jeremy Johnson and Ryan Nakade
• B/A #42 The Ever-Present with Jeremy Johnson

Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Leslie Rogers about what led him to start the Light Dark Institute, being in a sex cult, kink & BDSM, his dark awakening, personality & identity transformation, dark desires, the difference between light & dark personal work, orgasmic meditation & other influences on Leslie's practices, tantra, archetypes & deities, pleasure, healing & processing, triggering & mythopoetic power, tribal psycho technologies, nonduality, Jared's inner cynic, civilization collapse & catastrophe, death, pain as pleasure, humiliation, stoicism, and more.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Jeremy Johnson about what led to his interest in Jean Gebser, the nebulosity of time, non-linear consciousness evolution & developmental theory, Gebser's poetic disposition & extraordinary writing style, the un-perspectival world, integral consciousness, the limits of intellect & complex abstraction, the ever-present, mythical consciousness, pattern & nebulosity, wholeness & the spiritual elements of Gebser's work, process orientation vs systemization, maps as living systems, comparing Gebser's view to Integral levels, the danger of meta-theories, the value of pop art, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Mutations Podcast
• Jeremy's Patreon
• Jeremy's book, Seeing Through the World
• Liminal Magazine
• The Ever-Present Origin by Jean Gebser
• The Phenomenon of Man by Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
• The Progress of This Storm by Andreas Malm
• Jeremy's Side View article, Meta, Modern
• Small Arcs of Larger Circles by Nora Bateson
• Twitter Questions
• Figuring by Maria Popova
• Seeing That Frees by Rob Burbea

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with John Bunzl about why he started Simpol & how it enables global cooperation, his multi-issue approach to global issues, UN target failures, first-mover criteria, the democratic accountability strategy, partisanship, global pandemic preparation, efficiency vs resilience, power in metrics, cooperative competition, biomimicry in Simpol, Simpol's history & progress, the role of the nation-state, regional cooperation, diversity & locality, tyranny, getting involved, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And (recorded 4/21/20)

• Simpol
• The Stoa
• Twitter Questions
• Simpol Policy Information Pack
• The SIMPOL SOLUTION Book

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Jared Janes & Jason Snyder talk about humility, memetic mediation, Patreon goals & perks, acting from uncertainty, embodiment & trauma/baggage, map vs territory, individual vs group development, mindfulness, compassion, nonduality & enlightenment, tantric practice, guru abuse, emerging modern spirituality & the limitations of intellect, the void, subtle sensations & the brilliance of the mundane, constructed cognition, what we're both concentrated on at the moment, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Both/And Patreon
• The Stoa
• Jared's The Good, the True, the Beautiful Series
• Twitter Questions
• B/A: #39 Enabling Collaboration with Richard Bartlett
• Bodhidave Tweet
• Guided Christian Centering Prayer
• Rob Burbea

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Richard Bartlett about what led to his interest in group dynamics, quarantine in Italy, local vs digital collaboration, social enterprise, metamodernism & an action-oriented critique, rivalrous dynamics, the commons, experimentation vs abstraction, GameB, hierarchies, efficiency vs resilience, counter-cultural group dysfunctions, the economic purity delusion, mythopoetic cultural influence, the meta-tribe, memetic mediators & ambassadors, connecting elements of COVID-19, digital/complexity natives, creating digital communitas, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Enspiral | Loomio | The Hum | Microsolidarity.cc
• Elinor Ostrom's 8 Principles for Managing A Commmons
• On Leaving the Church of Social Justice
• Jim Rutt
• Queer Eye
• B/A: #37 Dancing with COVID with Sarah McManus
• Twitter Question
• Jack Murphy
• Memetic Mediators Slack
• B/A: #22 Meta-Rationality & Sexuality with Jessica
• Rebel Wisdom: Predicting the Pandemic, Nora Bateson, Joe Brewer & Jim Rutt
• The Stoa

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Anna Gat about her background & the Interintellect (I.I.), the structure of I.I. salons & how they're adjusting to COVID-19, uncovering our true social needs in quarantine, local vs virtual community, unifying dynamics of global crisis, COVID paradoxes & artifacts, redefining extraordinary & genius, enabling constraints, adversity, governance, memetic mediation, our tribal histories, leadership, what Anna is working on now, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Interintellect
• Anna's article, Good Life
• Article on COVID Responsibility, You’re Part of History Now
• Anna's article, As We May Adult
• B/A #6 Thriving in Modernity with Euvie Ivanova
• Richard Bartlett
• Peter Limberg

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Sarah McManus about her background, her emotional & psychological experience of contracting COVID-19, her ayahuasca shamanic apprenticeship in Peru, helplessness, emotional processing, the Bio-Emotive Framework, Buddhist practices & traditions, suffering, building & integrating new cultural platforms, reframing human development, pandemic fragility, learnings from Burning Man, dynamics of self-isolation, moving forward, chaos, order, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Sarah's Roam Page
• Twitter Questions
• Human Age on Twitter
• Neural Annealing: Toward a Neural Theory of Everything
• Clean Up, Wake Up, Grow Up with Ken Wilber
• Doug Tataryn
• Already Free by Bruce Tift
• INVISIBILIA Podcast: The Reluctant Immortalist
• Star Trek The Next Generation S1E2
• B/A: #35 Erotic Potential with Debby Friday
• Nora Bateson on the Emerge Podcast
• Game B
• The Context Institute - videos on cultural operating systems
• Spiral Dynamics
• Collaborative "nucleation sites"
• Cultures and cultural platforms
• The Circles Maps
• The Egg by Andy Weir
• The Stoa
• Anis Mojgani performs Shake the Dust

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes & Jason Snyder answer Twitter Questions and cover bio-regenerational orientations, COVID-19 induced mindfulness, tragedy & transformation, emotional escape & capture vs wholistic engagement, pluralistic food systems, the potential of minority rule, the role of the curator, the fragility of capitalist systems, future forcing functions, collecting & utilizing mental models, kinetic & meta tribes, skin in the game, learning through failure, tribal exposure & apprenticeship, Jason & Jared's contemplative practices, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Twitter Questions

• 13 Problematizing Food Systems with Stephanie White

• 35 Erotic Potential with Debby Friday

• Nassim Taleb on Minority Rule
• Donella Meadows' Leverage Points Paper
• Donella Meadows' Dancing With Systems
• The Patterning Instinct by Jeremy Lent
• Jim Rutt
• Jason's article, Integrating Mindfulness & Self-Inquiry
• Jared's Guided Meditation on The Stoa
• Jared's Death Session on The Stoa
• Email Both/And

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with musician, artist & writer Debby Friday about reflecting in quarantine, how she sees the erotic as a lifeforce, embodiment & performance, COVID-19 impact on touring artists & what Debby has been doing while social distancing, cultural habit, virus as a ghost, death denial & death drive, tantric practice, creativity, pop music, the power of ritual, the church of social justice, evoking spirit & much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Debby's Blog, CRACKING CLOSER
• Debby's Article, TOGETHER, ALWAYS TOGETHER
• Sabina Spielrein
• Dave Chappelle Acceptance Speech
• Debby Friday Tracks in Episode
  • INDULGE ME, VOID & AMOR FATI from BITCHPUNK
  • FATAL from DEATH DRIVE

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Nathan Spears about his journey from religion to atheism and back again, Orthodox Christianity, modernizing religion, Vervaeke's four ways of knowing, the value of Christian language & story, bridging phenomenology & epistemology, the dynamics of belief, attention & intention, perennial philosophy, the body of Christ, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Nathan on Twitter
• Cognitive Science & the Sacred with Vervaeke & Pageau
• God & Relevance Realization with Vervaeke & Pageau
• Dominion by Tom Holland

• 15 Being a Baha'i Creative with Samah Tokmachi

• The Cloud of Unknowing
• The Mind Illuminated by John Yates
• Enneagram of Personality
• Hammering Hot Iron by Charles Upton

People Mentioned: David Chapman, John Vervaeke, Daniel Thorson, Collin Morris, Jordan Hall, Guy Sengstock, Jonathan Pageau, Shinzen Young, David Bentley Hart

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder have a wide-ranging chat about their podcast supporters, how Both/And could evolve, informal vs formal spiritual practice, stream entry & the path of awakening, exploring perspectives of the 'self', embodied cognition, enactivism, memetic mediation, bioregional living, collapse, xenophobia vs diversity, the future of localism, psychological/cultural development, fluid politics, silence, vulnerability, how Jason & Jared disagree, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Both/And on Patron
• Twitter Questions
• Jason's article, Integrating Mindfulness & Self-Inquiry
• Mind In Life by Evan Thompson
• The Side View
• Peter Linberg
• Memetic Mediation Slack Group

• 32 Regenerating Earth with Joe Brewer

• OODA Loop
• Elinor Ostrom's 8 Principles for Managing A Commmons
• Jeremy Johnson

• 23 Integral Psych & Culture with Mark Forman

• The Imperfect Buddha | Daniel Ingram on Integral Theory
• The Musing Mind Podcast

• 31 Conscious Evolution with Rob Cobbold

• The Jim Rutt Show

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Joe Brewer about the impact of conceptuality on perception & embodiment, the impossibility of understanding planetary collapse & what that means, getting lost in abstraction & duality, personal & ecological trauma, making & breaking conceptual frames, cancerous human thinking, the invisible regenerative revolution, the dynamics of coercion, top-down vs bottom-up regeneration, ecological succession, sustainable life-systems, acting bioregionally, and more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Cargo Cults
• Dr. Zachary Stein
• The Century of the Self
• Joanna Macy
• Twitter Questions
• Donella Meadows' Leverage Points Paper
• Joe's Earth Regenerator Group

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Rob Cobbold about what led him to orient his life towards Conscious Evolution & what its core components are, the shortsightedness of antinatalism, spirituality & dualism, consciousness & ethics, limits of materialism & rationality, global governance, money, debt & interest, alternative currencies, societal flourishing, collapse & much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Meta Twitter Thread
• John Stewart
• Sex, Ecology, Spirituality by Ken Wilber
• Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance by Robert M Pirsig
• Simpol.org
• Rob's Curious Bodhi Interview
• Elinor Ostrom's 8 Principles for Managing A Commmons
• Joe Brewer
• OpenCredit.Network
• Earfh.com

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Rachel Haywire about her presidential candidacy, what led her to art & philosophy, the art right, her view of the memetic tribal landscape, the power of memes, her critique on Jared & Jason's meta tribe, the role & power of aesthetics, psychic fascism, the challenges & benefits of embodiment, pain & suffering, spiritual materialism, embodied VR, politics as aesthetic, tribal immune systems, memetic fashion, the 'NPC' meme, transgressive arts, and much more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Haywire2020.com
• Trigger Warning
• Jason on Embodiment Practice
• Unified Mindfulness
• The Eternal Retreat
• Twitter Questions
• Avant Design
• Thus Spoke Zarathustra

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Evan Sandhoefner about what led him to utilitarianism & effective altruism, the flexibility of utilitarianism & some critiques, pluralistic virtue ethics, whether suffering is necessary & how it may affect animals & humans differently, whether we should remove wild predators to prevent animal suffering, creating unintentional animal suffering, consciousness, ethical meat production & factory farming, localism, universal explainers vs computers, intelligence, and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Givewell
• David Pearce
• David Deutsch
• Twitter Questions
• The Beginning of Infinity by David Deutsch
• Mind in Life by Evan Thompson
• The Ego Tunnel by Thomas Metzinger
• Metzinger & Harris Podcast: The Nature of Consciousness
• Evan's Blog

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with the Commercial Director of Holo/Holochain, David Atkinson. They cover what led David to the Holo team, systems thinking, biomimicry & evolution, the core elements of Holochain, how it compares to the blockchain, scalability, centralization vs decentralization, some potential impacts of this tech, its current phase of development, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Holochain.org
• Holo.host

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Paul Millerd about his career path, Jared's recent leap to self-employment, the incentives of benefits & healthcare, history of firm-based vs contract work, expectations of work & its connection to meaning & dignity, local community, the boundary between work & life, basic income, consumerism, GDP determined lifestyles, shared local commons, self-determination theory, the 40-hour workweek, the pathless path, work as service, complexity of teams & the role of chaos, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Andrew Taggart
• If work dominated your every moment would life be worth living?
• On Bullshit by Harry Frankfurt
• Zachary Stein on The Musing Mind Podcast
• Three Sacred Beliefs Undermining Universal Basic Income
• Drive by Dan Pink
• Twitter Questions

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Michael Brooks about what his show (TMBS) is about, his history with Integral Theory & meditation, his political perspective, the Kurdish situation in Rojava, dangers of idealism & ahistorical thinking, why politics needs spirituality, Michael's view on today's political narratives, his recent meditation retreat, how the Four Quadrants of Integral could impact political discourse, markets vs capitalism, centralization vs decentralization, fractal localism, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Brent Cooper
• Michael Brooks Show
• Hanzi Metamodernism
• Integral Theory
• Exiting the Vampire Castle by Mark Fisher
• Jacobin
• Michael's Article, The Annihilation of Rojava
• Mondragon Corporations
• Globalists by Laboian
• Twitter Questions

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with the anonymous horrorist, Zero HP Lovecraft about why he started writing & where his alias came from, his new book, his creative process & influences, the horrorist aesthetic, the unknowability of our own values, the self & culture as software, media's impact on culture, his view on the future & contemplative development, euphoric depersonalization, the role of pain & suffering, societal hierarchies, cultural colonialism & design, chaos & order, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• God-Shaped Hole
• Erotism: Death and Sensuality
• The Transparency of Evil
• The Gutenberg Galaxy
• Twitter Questions
• Slate Star Codex Article: The PNSE Paper

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with political scientist Justin Murphy about his path to becoming an independent artist & intellectual, what it means to him to be a libertarian communist, foundations of intrinsic human equality, his unique take on Gilles Deleuze in his new book Based Deleuze, creativity, Urbit and more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Justin's Podcast & Site, Other Life
• Episode Twitter Questions

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Integral Psychologist Mark Forman about his journey to Integral theory & transpersonal psychology, how it differs from traditional psych, Integral's four quadrants & levels/stages frameworks, Sam Harris's conversational challenges, perspective-shifting, his reflections on practicing psych, trauma, authoritarian tendencies on the left & right, Trump's cultural impact, the state of the IDW & Integral, his view on metamodernism, and the Freudian unconscious.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Reinventing Organizations by Frederic Laloux
• Jared's Reddit Post
• Sam Harris & Jordan Peterson Conversations
  • Sam Harris Podcast: WHAT IS TRUE?
  • Sam Harris & Jordan Peterson - Vancouver - 1
  • Sam Harris & Jordan Peterson - Vancouver - 2
• Ken Wilber: The Intellectual Dark Web, an Integral Conversation?
• Roy Bhaskar's article What is Critical Realism?
• The Brain and the Inner World: An Introduction to the Neuroscience of the Subjective Experience by Mark Solms
• Twitter Questions
• Mark's Website
• CIT Integral Page

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder have a wide-ranging chat with Jessica (@ssica3003) about her path to meta-rationality, her views on feminism, activism, post-modernism, men's rights, restorative vs retributive justice, utopian thinking, how meta-rationality relates & connects to bisexual life, polyamory, incels, cultural design, and much more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Jessica's blog and YouTube Channel
• David Chapman & his website, Meaningness
• Meta-Rationality
• Summary of Kegan Stage 5 Principles
• Reaching Stage 5 - non STEM
• LessWrong
• Cross+Pollination Zine
• Twitter Questions
• Peter Limberg

• 16 Mind Fitness & Gender with Chance Lunceford

• Hades, an egregore
• Azathoth Egregore: "An Alien God"
• Moloch Egregore: "MEDITATIONS ON MOLOCH"
• Ra Egregore: "Ra"

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk about upcoming episodes, the Both/And Patreon launch, and speculate about the types of emergent collaboration that will arise from it.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Upcoming Guests: Jessica, Mark Forman, Justin Murphy, Paul Millerd, David Atkinson, Michael Brooks, Rob Cobbold of Conscious Evolution, Zero HP Lovecraft
• David Chapman
• Integral Theory
  • Ken Wilber
  • Four Quadrants

• 17 Reflecting on Both/And Episodes & Themes

• 20 What's Metamodern with Linda Ceriello & Greg Dember

• Holochain
• Zero HP Lovecraft Twitter Thread
• Rob Cobbold (Conscious Evo) Interview
• (40:50) Patreon.com/BothAnd
• Gwendolyn Huot
• Christian (@chrxn)
• contact@bothand.info

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Linda Ceriello and Greg Dember about metamodernism as a cultural sensibility, traditionalism, modernism, postmodernism, what led them to start What Is Metamodern?, metamodern methods that media commonly uses, the ways metamodernism is interpreted, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, The Listening Society, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• What Is Metamodern?
• Article: After Postmodernism: Eleven Metamodern Methods in the Arts
• Journal Article: Notes on metamodernism
• Essay: Taxonomy of Metamodern Monsters in Linda's essay (pages 213-214 - login required)
• Linda's Email
• Greg & Linda Suggestions
  • Playlist: Metamodern Music: Indie Rock 1995-2005
  • Video Essay: Rick and Morty: Character Archetypes & Metamodernism
  • Video Essay: Jose Chung's The Bridge to the Metamodern
  • Book: Metamodernism: Historicity, Affect, and Depth after Postmodernism

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Jordan Hall about how spirituality relates to sovereignty, deep code, virtuous feedback loops, individual & cultural development, the logos of robots, intuition, the weird, parenthood and more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Recommended Jordan Interviews
  • Zion 2.0 Podcast: Part 1, Distributed Intelligence & Part 2, Our Future Sense-Making
  • Emerge Podcast: Sovereignty, Resonance, and Liminality
  • Rebel Wisdom: Deep Code: Jordan (Green)Hall Documentary
  • The Jim Rutt Show Interview
  • Other Life Podcast: Deep Code with Jordan Hall
  • Intellectual Explorers Podcast Interview
• John Vervaeke
• Jason on Self inquiry
• Jordan's Article on Sovereignty
• Jim Rutt
• Twitter Questions
• ALTER EGO Video: "Can Extinction Rebellion Unlock Collective Sacrifice?"

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Evan Driscoll about what leads to dysfunctional systems, coordination, social isolation, habits & behaviors that create better collective action, following our passions, burnout, hedonism, contemplative practice & more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Evan's Website
• The Emerge Podcast

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder reflect on recent episodes & themes, their evolving perspectives on memetic mediation, and a laundry list of related topics they think are worth exploring more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Episode #1 Who What Why?
• Baha'i Politics
• Tweet: Why meta?
• Episode #15 Being a Baha'i Creative with Samah Tokmachi
• Episode #16 Mind Fitness & Gender with Chance Lunceford
• Chance on Twitter
• Tweet: The plural universe
• Tweet: Diverging parallel realities
• The Four Quadrants
• Article: Memetic Engineering
• Scott Adams
• Book: The Elephant in the Brain: Hidden Motives in Everyday Life
• Emerge Podcast Episode: Daniel Schmachtenberger - Utopia or Bust
• Episode #10 Culture, Tech & Collaboration with Jess
• Euvie Ivanova
• Future Guests: Evan Driscoll, What Is Metamodern? & Jordan Hall

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Chance Lunceford about what lead him to start podcasting & writing about how to live life to its fullest. They then talk about how Chance approaches mastering the mind and dive deep on how gender impacts us personally & collectively.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Chance's Podcast: Logocentrifugal
• Chance's Website
• Uncommon Mentality: How to Think Like No One Else
• Referenced Men & Women Tweet
• Twitter Questions

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Samah Tokmachi about how the Bahai faith impacts his filmmaking career, many aspects of spiritual & religious life, our relationship with the ego, awakening, our personal & societal shadows, community building and more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Samah's Homepage
• Bahai.org
• BahaiTeachings.org
• YOND3R

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Erik Davis, host of the Expanding Mind podcast, and author of the newly released book, High Weirdness. They discuss a wide range of topics, including eclecticism, psychedelics, philosophy, spirituality, existential dread, esotericism, capitalism meditation & more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Erik's Website
• High Weirdness
• Jean Gebser
• Twitter Questions
• Capitalist Realism by Mark Fisher
• Expanding Mind ep. with Dr. Elliot Wolfson
• Philosophize This! Frankfurt School Series

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Dr. Stephanie White about her research on urban food systems. We discuss her work in Malawi, emergent/local innovation and design, systems thinking, cognitive justice, and more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Department of Community Sustainability
• Diet for a Small Planet
• Alice Waters
• Innovation and Cognitive Justice Blog Post
• Thinking in Systems: A Primer
• Designs for the Pluriverse
• Science and Citizens
• Food Noodle Blog

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Stephen West about why he started the wildly successful Philosophize This! podcast. Then, we go on to talk about the ways philosophy can be useful, it's possible limitations, and dive deep on how Steve's process & mindset affect the way he understands & shares the ideas he covers in the podcast.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Philosophize This!
• Jared's old podcast (Impactful) interview with Steve
• Twitter Questions
• Four Quadrants of Integral Theory

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with David Collins about how his academic & contemplative backgrounds work together. Specifically, we cover the commonalities of contemplative practices from different religions & cultures, how fixating on spiritual language can be problematic, what awakening is in simple terms, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Cloud of Unknowing
• Siddhartha
• Twitter Questions
• Gazzaniga Split Brain Patient 'Joe' Video
• Radio Lab: Unraveling Bolero

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes, Jason Snyder, and Jess (aka @utotranslucence) have a wide-ranging talk about San Francisco vs. Australian culture, social dynamics, analyzing movies, interactions between social and digital technologies, crypto and collaboration, being part of a paper clip maximizer, and much more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Intentional Communities
• Autotranslucence Blog
• Twitter Q&A
• You Were Never Really Here
• Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse

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In this experimental episode, Nathan Snyder talks to Jared Janes and Jason Snyder about why they started the Both And Podcast and what goals they have for it. After the initial interview portion, Nathan analyzes some of the conversation using the Dialectic Thought Form Framework.

In this Episode of Both/And you can find expanded show notes here.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with meditation and dharma teacher Vince Horn about the layers of the self, the ladder of abstraction, metadharma, post-capitalism, and much more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Buddhist Geeks
• David Chapman on Meaningness
• David Chapman on Development Stages & Robert Kegan
• Integral Theory
• Pragmatic Dharma
• Twitter Q&A
• Vince's Homepage

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Conor Barnes about memetic tribes, his disillusioning experience as a radical anarchist and with 'woke' politics, the potential danger of fascism 2.0, and new models of governance.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Memetic Tribes Of Culture War 2.0
• The Grey Pill
• Conor's Quillette article: Sad Radicals
• Three Languages of Politics
• Pinker's Optimism
• Ontario's UBI Test
• Seasteading Institute
• Localism
• The Task Facing Masculinity
• Conor's Instagram

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder have a wide-ranging conversation with Euvie Ivanova. They discuss the ancient art of adulting, society's developmental stage model, technology and the self, the positives and negatives of social media, coddled millennials and anti-fragility, finding the void or 'big self' using contemplative tools, and much more.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Future Thinkers
• Future Thinkers Courses
• Twitter Episode Q&A Thread
• Michael Taft on Working Memory & Awakening
• Future Thinkers Podcast: The Memetic War And Collective Intelligence
• Part 1: How To Be An Adult— Kegan’s Theory of Adult Development
• The Evolving Self by Robert Kegan
• Integral Theory
• David Chapman on Development Stages
• David Chapman's Twitter
• VR Documentary: Syrian Refugee Crisis
• Ayahuasca
• Jared's Twitter Thread on Meditation
• Shinzen Young

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Garrett Dailey about his vision for Aion Media. Then, they talk about the fragmentation of culture and identity, nihilism, libertarianism and externalities, and more!

In this Episode of Both/And

• Aion Media
• Chance Lunceford & James P Dowling
• Master Self
• "God is Dead..."
• Tragedy of the Commons
• Objectivism
• Twitter Q&A
• Memetic Identity Article
• Garret's Recommendations on...
  • Christian Mysticism: Dark Night of the Soul
  • Sufi Islam: The Essential Rumi
  • Zen: Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance
  • Mysticism: Jung the Mystic
  • Symbols & Alchemy: Jung on Symbols
• Terrance McKenna
• The Bhagavad Gita
• Thus Spoke Zarathustra
• The Five Pillars of the Ascendant Mind

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Udita Sanga about her PhD research that uses participatory games and agent-based modeling to study climate change adaptation in Mali. They also discuss her experience with meditation, and how it relates to her work.

In this Episode of Both/And

• Making decisions in times of uncertainty: How farmers in Mali are adapting to climate change
• Udita's MSU Page
• Email Udita

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Adam Robbert about why he started The Side View. Then they explore why the practice element of philosophy has become less present recently, speculate about how it happened, and talk about how we can encourage it today.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Side View
• The Art of Philosophy: Wisdom as a Practice
• What Is Philosophy? by Gilles Deleuze
• Philosophy as a Way of Life: Ancients and Moderns
• Critique of Pure Reason by Immanuel Kant
• What Is Ancient Philosophy? by Pierre Hadot
• Meditations on First Philosophy
• Jason's Article: Decentralizing Cognition: Integrating Mindfulness and Self-Inquiry

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Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder talk with Peter Limberg about what led him to be an intellectual explorer. Then they cover how Peter and Conor Barnes came up with the idea of the Memetic Mediator and what ideas and practices they will likely need.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Memetic Tribes Of Culture War 2.0
• Intellectual Explorers Club Podcast: Jason Snyder - Rise of the Memetic Mediators
• Intellectual Explorers Club
• Stoic Club
• Jared's other Podcast, Impactful
• Wicked Problems
• Noosphere
• Intellectual Explorers Club Podcast: A Prophecy of the Emergent Religion of Narcissism
• Kenneth Folk Tweet
• Integral Philosophy
• Jason's tweet on general advice with or without caveats.
• Seeing That Frees by Rob Burbea
• Spiral Dynamics
• Ken Wilber
• Deepfakes and the New Disinformation War
• Making Sense with Sam Harris: #145 — The Information War
• Why Your Board Needs A Chief Philosophy Officer
• Mike Redmer & Nathan Snyder
• Holacracy: The New Management System for a Rapidly Changing World

Support Both/And by becoming a patron &/or subscribing & reviewing us on iTunes

Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.

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Jared Janes and Jason Snyder introduce themselves, talk about what led them to start the Both And podcast, and why they think better conversations are essential for building bridges in our culture war and creating better ways to live.

In this Episode of Both/And

• The Bahá’í Faith
• Memetic Tribes and Culture War 2.0
• Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha
• A bridge to meta-rationality vs. civilizational collapse
• The Listening Society
• Blind Men & An Elephant
• Liminality on Emerge Podcast
• Podcast: Jason Snyder - Rise of the Memetic Mediators
• The Side View

Support Both/And by becoming a patron &/or subscribing & reviewing us on iTunes

Jared Janes participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn commissions by linking to Amazon. In more human terms, this means that whenever you buy a book on Amazon from a link on here, a small percentage of its price is sent to us.