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If you've been on your Peloton bike, Tread or App since 2021, you've probably taken a class with Camila Ramón. She was the first Spanish speaking instructor on the bike and since her inaugural ride, she's brought the music, culture and body positivity she wanted to see more of in the world.

We spend our time on the episode talking about how she came to fall back in love with movement after years of dance, the importance of music to her, and what it's like to work at Peloton.

But the thing that was most delightful to me was just experiencing the silliness wrapped up in someone you should take very seriously. Camila knows how and when to crack a joke to make you comfortable, but she also has a big important story to tell that can make even more people feel seen in fitness.

Resources:* Find Camila Ramón's Peloton classes * Follow Camila on Instagram * Read Shape's article about Camila * Read The LA Times piece about Camila Ramon

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What started as a personal challenge for Kayla Jeter seven years ago has evolved into a global sensation. From May 1 until August 31, 100MilesofSummer challenges thousands of participants across the country to simply log 100 miles. That amounts to 25 miles a month and approximately 6 miles a week.

And to make this challenge even more doable, participants can walk, run, jog or roll those miles.

I met Kayla just after she moved to Chicago and was making her way in the city in her post-professional sports career. Her vision for this summer program has always been clear (and fun to watch): create change in the sport of running to make it more inviting and inclusive.

In our conversation, you'll hear a lot about where 100MilesofSummer came from, the role of movement and community in dealing with grief, and the power of community to help you achieve your goals.

And in the seventh year of the challenge, there are some really big updates - aside from reaching folks on other continents.

• Kayla and her team created a community home on the Circle Platform.
• Kayla and her team launched their own platform-agnostic miles tracker (so if you love Nike's app, use it. If you're a Strava stan, go crazy. You'll just log your miles for the challenge on the tracker separately.)

Resources:* Follow Kayla on Instagram * Follow 100MilesofSummer on Instagram * Join the 100MilesofSummer Circle community * Start using the tracker * Read the Chicago Tribune's Feature Story on Kayla's journey and goals * We chat about Kayla's insane experience taking on Lululemon Further and running more than 200 miles in six days. Here's her synopsis and details from Lululemon on the project.

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Haley Shapley, author of the book "Strong Like Her" is a walking history book of women's foray into sports and strength.

That's because she literally wrote the book on it ("Strong Like Her," which is now available in paperback). After the author entered a bodybuilding competition, she had the eye-opening experience of hearing first-hand the outdated ideas about women's strength. So, she started looking into the people she calls, "our Muscular Foremothers."

"Don't lift too heavy," "No man will find you attractive," and "you look like a man." No matter how much we try to move past these ideas, we still encounter them them. In our conversation, Haley talks through the rule breakers in strength as well as the link between gender, strength, feminism and suffrage.

In this conversation, you'll hear some really interesting stories of strength - some that may be new to you:

• The story of Ada Anderson and the sport of Pedestrianism, who smashed attendance records for her feats of walking.
• Cynisca and the loophole that allowed her to be the first woman to win in the Olympics in the four-horse chariot race
• Pudgy Stockton, who was not only a weightlifter, but also a gymnast

Resources:* Find Haley Shapley online * Get "Strong Like Her" wherever you get books * Follow Haley Shapley on Instagram * And get excited for her next project, Night Owl

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I was never the kid who sought out a jump rope for fun, I wasn’t counting how many jumps I could do uninterrupted, and I wasn’t doing double dutch. However, as an adult I was handed a jump rope to work out and after a couple of minutes, I was gassed. So I incorporated it into workouts and developed a love for how much I hated it.

At one point, I was even teaching a fitness class called “Ropes Gone Wild,” but that’s a story for a different day.

So when CrossRope reached out, promising to make jumping rope at home a fun part of your workout (with a connected fitness component), I tried it, I loved it, and I selected a 25-minute workout my first time back to jumping rope. That was a mistake - my poor calves.

And in the world, we’re going back to hybrid everything - hybrid work, hybrid workout. I know for me, if I choose to work out at home, it's because I’m in a time crunch, so I need whatever I do at home to be efficient.

So today, we’re talking to two experts from Crossrope: Dave Hunt, Founder and CEO of Crossrope, and Jennika Landon, a Crossrope Trainer (who I’m pretty sure is also a molecular biologist). We’re going to dig in to making at home workouts fit your time and your lifestyle.

References: * CrossRope * CrossRope on Instagram * Dave Hunt on LinkedIn * Jennika Landon on LinkedIn

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As a lifelong learner, I feel pretty fortunate that I get to interview smart people, innovators, and inventors and say, "teach me something."

And this week, the big question was about Essential Fatty Acids. What makes a fatty acid essential? Spoiler: you have to ingest it and your body needs it for important functions. And what about saturated vs. unsaturated fats?

We dig in with the co-founders of Fatty15, Stephanie and Eric Venn-Watson, on the discovery of the essential fatty acid you'll find in the Fatty15 capsules: C15:0.

And the best part? Stephanie was studying dolphins when she made this discovery.

Resources:

• Fatty15: the company that Eric and Stephanie co-founded
• Stephanie Venn-Watson's TED Talk about her discovery that C15:0 is an essential fatty acid.
• From The Washington Post: mounting research that C15:0 deficiency is linked to diseases like Fatty Liver Disease
• My first interview with Stephanie and Eric

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The thing about being human is that we’re born ready to discover the world - the sights, the sounds, what makes us happy, what scares us, and even who we are. Our identity is something that comes to us piece by piece as we mature and explore the world around us. Can you imagine living a life that fully supports you discovering your identity?

Today, we’re speaking with Dr. Gwen Bass about her work in creating identity-affirming environments that promote belonging. She also wrote a book Called Immaculate Misconception about her journey to finding her biological siblings who shared a sperm donor as well as her family that was created around love and belonging.

She was one of the first children conceived in the '80s to two lesbian moms.That journey of identity and hiding her identity in certain situations and being accepted in others shaped her research and her academic work since.

In this conversation, she talks about risk factors and protective factors for identity.

Dr. Gwen shares some steps that leaders can take to ensure that folks know that they an be themselves while not getting in the way of others needs being met. We talk about how the concepts of belonging apply to the fitness space. Dr. Gwen chats through how yoga is an exceptionally inclusive fitness space because of the ways instructors cue leveling up and down, using props.

She talks about:

• Leadership in a fitness space
• Music in a fitness space
• The language used in a fitness
• The Peloton App and how the instructors take the modifications and how important that modeling is

References:

• Dr. Gwen Bass
• Immaculate Misconception
• Dr. Gwen Bass on aSweatLife.com
• Peloton Digital fitness

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We kicked off season 9 of the podcast a bit later than expected. We learned of the untimely and unexpected passing of Ryan Deffet this fall - aSweatLife's friend and the longtime editor of this podcast. We waited to come back until we could mourn Ryan and find a way to properly memorialize him.

His friends and band mates from The Space Gators allowed us to use a song that featured Ryan on vocals called "Somewhere To Be" at the upfront of the episode. We hope you'll take the time to listen to that beautiful song in this week's episode.

We spend this episode going over what's to come on aSweatLife (including big updates for the Ambassador program) and on our podcast. As we come back this season, you'll hear us talking to experts who we ask to teach us something.

We're excited for you to come along with us on this journey.

Show notes:* Remember Ryan Deffet with us and give his band The Space Gators, a follow * The aSweatLife Ambassador program * Email the aSweatLife team if you want to partner for aSweatLife's Studio of the Month * the Ultramarathoner that Kelly fangirled over: Courtney Dauwalter * Our new community platform, Circle * The Tour du Mont Blanc * Kelly's trip on the Tour Du Mont Blanc, summarized * Get a glimpse at my officiating skills (and the cutest wedding ever) and the moment we all waited for * Reflections from summer from Jeana's Instagram

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It has admittedly been a weird week or so on the Internet. We went from learning that aliens might be super real (told you, Gideon) to moving on. Maybe it was the full moon, who knows.

So, we decompressed and talked it over on our monthly tête-à-tête - our podcast episode that we call "Let's Talk About It." Sure, we spent a little bit of time talking about aliens and whether or not they're just tourist, but we also covered which astrology apps we like and what we're saving on Instagram and TikTok.

On this week's episode, you'll hear from me, Jeana Anderson Cohen, and from the Senior Director of Communities at aSweatLife, Kelly Matkovich. Joining us is Dana Farber who runs Moonstone marketing and works with aSweatLife on content strategy and social media.

Resources:* What Dana is saving on social: Snack queen baked potato dip * What Dana is saving on social: Women living alone - extra lock * What Dana is saving on social: Treehouse glamping in Washington * What Kelly is saving on social: Heel hook * What Kelly is saving on social: Tour de mont blanc * What Kelly is saving on social: Derma planing * UFO hearings * Therabody smart goggles * Mystic Monday * Horoscope app: Co-star * Horoscope app: Pattern * Horoscope app: Sanctuary * Astrology app: The chani app * Tarot card app: mystic monday * Dana’s playlists for moods: sad * Dana’s playlists for moods: stay in bed * Dana’s playlists for moods: Lazy Afternoon * Therabody Smart Goggles

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Have you ever seen a small, round sensor on the back of someone’s arm? For a long time, those continuous glucose monitors were only used for monitoring the blood glucose of those with Diabetes. My grandfather had diabetes and he would check his blood glucose twice a day using a finger prick. I remember distinctly the sound of the little device - it was like a stapler - I also remember the curse words that would follow.

So, I assumed as I was putting the Freestyle Libre on the back of my arm that it would be as painful as the finger pricks. It was not. And for two weeks, I wore it and dutifully trained the January.ai App to help me understand and control my blood glucose.

It created something called a "digital twin" which learned which behaviors led to blood sugar spikes and valleys. If creating a digital twin of yourself sounds scary, and like the robots are coming. Well, the robots are coming anyway, so, we might as well team up with them to make our lives better.

Joining me today is Noosheen Hashemi, CEO and Founder of January.ai, which uses AI to help manage your glucose and predict the impact of key behaviors on our body’s unique metabolism.

Resources:* January.ai * Follow January on Instagram * Abbott will be releasing more sensors * Eliud Kipchoge on using the Abbott sensor for marathon training * Exercise and blood glucose (american diabetes association) * Noosheen’s daughter on Instagram * How blood glucose testing works with testing strips

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If we were on TikTok right now, I’d be referring to myself as an “anxiety girlie” and as such, I have tried many, many anxiety coping mechanisms and recently, I discovered the Quiet Mind weighted pillow and I am super in love.

And joining me today on the podcast is Mikey Goldman, creator of Quiet Mind. We talk through where the idea came from, and a few of his big backers, like Nick woodman of GoPro and Chad Hurley of YouTube.

We also discuss the reasons Mikey created Quiet Mind - a diagnosis of ADHD and managing the symptoms that came multiple medications.

References: * Quiet Mind - code ASWEATLIFE - gets 15% Off! * Thingtesting's take on Quiet Mind * Scholarly article about Deep Pressure Stimulation on Autism * The effects of deep pressure on Anxiety * Better Homes and Gardens on the Launch of Quiet Mind * Hugging a pillow while sleeping - advice from the Quiet Mind blog

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I'm the kind of friend that keeps up with people through their posts. And this year, it's been pretty hard to miss what my friend AND yours Gideon Akande is up to: he committed to doing 365 consecutive days of movement. He's calling it Project 365, and it's a lot less daunting than you might think.

On this week's episode of the podcast, I asked Gideon to share the rules of his challenge - he didn't love the word "rules," but shared the guidelines nonetheless. Basically, he can do anything for exercise at any time of the day as long as it's "concentrated exercise" for a minimum of 15 minutes. So taking a walk for exercise versus taking a walk to commute and counting the multi-task.

At first, I was worried about his recovery. "He'll burn out!" I thought. But on a closer look, he's doing this in a safe and strategic way. (It's almost like he's a personal trainer or something).

So we talk about WHY he started and I found it completely relatable. As a new dad, he found himself moving less. And because movement is a big part of his life as a three-time Chicago Golden Gloves champion, trainer, and national winner of the Men’s Health Next Top Trainer competition.

He lives for movement and wanted to make sure he was walking the walk.

I loved this entire conversation, but my favorite part was hearing what Gideon has learned in more than six months of this challenge. I won't spoil it for you, but the key word is JOY.

Resources: * Gideon Akande on Instagram * Get a 7-day trial of the get Fit with Giddy app * Body Bar Pilates * Gideon’s favorite Nigerian Foods: Iyan and Efo Riro * Restore Hyper Wellness * According to Live Sciences, you can work out every day IF you’re strategic. * Train moment * Lululemon Experiential (where you can find Gideon on the schedule) * Rise nation * Swish house * Communities: Movement * Northern Lights visible in Chicago this Wednesday July 12

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This week, in passing we mentioned that at the end of the aSweatLife summer intern’s time with us we would sit down and tell her everything we had to learn the hard way after college graduation. Then we realized that we should probably record it as it’s hot on our minds and is really the only thing we can think about this week.

Ever since we had the conversation as a team, I thought about the things that I learned through whisper networks or by falling on my face. They were innumerable. So, we’re not going to gatekeep it.

Julia had good questions for us:Work related

• How should I go about getting a job?
• What’s the best advice you could give to someone interviewing for a job?
• What are your musts when it comes to looking for a job?

Personal

• What’s one thing you would like your senior college self to know?
• How should a 20 year old come about looking for friends after college?
• How would you advice a 20 year old to get used to a 9-5pm
• What do you guys think about a hobby as a career?

And we prepared a little advice for her:* At work - * if someone says something IMPORTANT to you with just their voice, follow up with an email asking them to confirm. Get shit in writing. * It's okay to quit a job if you don't have another job lined up AND find mentors * Our advice on life: * Ask questions. * Have the best time with your friends - go out, go to restaurants, travel - do all the things * Our advice as old married ladies * Jeana: In my early 20s, I spent so much time wondering and worrying about whether the person I had been on one or two dates with liked me and very little time on whether I liked them. As soon as I started asking that question, “Do I like them? Have they earned my mindspace?” Things shifted for me. * Kelly: I wish I would have dated MORE And live on your own

And the aSweatLife Ambassadors shared some guidance:Honestly, this was my favorite part: sourcing guidance from this group of really unique humans. Here's what they said:

• "Staying in a crappy job too long can let some good jobs get away from you, and can be detrimental to your self esteem." - Mariah B.
• "Know your worth and don’t be afraid to negotiate your salary! I was too scared to right out of college and was basically slapped with minimum wage wrapped up as a “salary” because I thought I couldn’t ask for anything else." -Sydney M.
• "More for personal life, but do what you want to do, even if it means going for it solo! I spent some years thinking I just wouldn’t do things bc my friends weren’t also interested in doing them, but now have embraced just going for it. I’ve gone to things solo and left with acquaintances with the same interests. Or just left solo with a great experience lol." -Sarah S.
• "Work is not who you are, and is not everything. You can always change things if they aren’t for you, you can always reinvent yourself, you can always advocate for yourself. Nothing has to be a linear path to the top." - CC
• "Two things ... One of them is from the Olsen twins… 1. No is a full sentence. (thanks Olsen twins). 2. You don't have to have things figured out. Like ever. There is no point in life at which you need to have the perfect job or be married or have kids or it's too late." -Tahnee L.
• "If you can afford to - you can take vacation even if you don't have paid time off available / used up." -Amy G.
• "2 bits of career advice learned the hard way. 1) Sometimes not getting the job has nothing to do with you. You met the qualifications, you interviewed well, it felt like a fit. There’s too many unknowns to you. The company culture, the culture of the team you’d be joining, internal candidates, etc. I spent a lot of time being hard on myself and it wasn’t until I became a hiring manager that I realized I could’ve saved myself some heartache by accounting for the unknowns. 2) At every job you will ever have, even if you own your own business, you are replaceable. It may not be done the same way, or as well even but, there are people who can do what you do to some degree. Keep that mindset and perhaps it’ll save you some serious abuse of work/life boundaries and burnout early in your career that I learned the hard way." -Alexis R.

Resources:* Ladies Get Paid * Ask a Manager is a great resource for any question for your career * Questions that Julia sourced from the Internet * January.ai

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During aSweatLife’s annual event, Sweatworking Week, we met a lot of new people. We love that about Sweatworking Week. And they had questions about where aSweatLife came from and why. We figured we might as well share the story since you’re asking.

So this week, we turned the tables and Kelly Matkovich, who leads aSweatLife's ambassador program interviewed Jeana Anderson Cohen, founder/CEO of aSweatLife.

We talk over the beginning of aSweatLife, where the ambassadorship came from, our first revenue stream and what keeps us going today.

References:

• aSweatLife
• aSweatLife ambassadors
• Podcast episode from Jan 4th; Ambassador program
• From Fast Company: How Dabbling Helps Your Career
• Devil’s Thumb Ranch
• Oura Ring

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At aSweatLife, we always say that everything is better with friends. And because of that, we get to spend time meeting entrepreneurs and tastemakers in the wellness space. Like a lot of them. But when one of the aSweatLife ambassadors mentioned the brand Literally Outside on our private slack channel, we dug into this Chicago-based brand and knew we needed to become friends.

Joining us today is Steffan Williams, the Founder and Chief Executive Outsider at Literally Outside! Literally Outside is a lifestyle brand on a mission to empower everyone to feel comfortable exploring the great outdoors. It’s black-owned, operated by two cousins, and supported by a team of family.

Literally Outside is one of the few Black-owned outdoor lifestyle companies in the US. That brand has transparent values that you'll hear us talk about on the episode. It's conscious, soulful, accessible, and adventurous.

Literally Outside wants to change the narrative of what it looks like to be “outdoorsy” so everyone can feel like they belong in the outdoors. On the episode, we talk about the idea of their slogan, “Outsiders Welcome.”

Resources:

• Find Steffan Williams on LinkedIn
• Discover Literally Outside
• Follow Literally Outside on Instagram
• Learn more about the Collab with Cody Hudson of Struggle Inc.
• Listen to the Episode of How I Built This Featuring Ty Haney that we talked about
• We talk about SweatworkingWeek, learn more
• “A good plan today, is better than a perfect plan tomorrow” the Edge Movie
• Black people outside
• Tortugas hiking club
• Very Human Social
• Friday Morning Swim Club

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To start off the month, we like to touch base as a team and bring whatever we're thinking about to the table. This week, we talked through three big questions:

Kelly had a very specific ask for shorts for running. She has a very specific need for shorts that are High waisted, have a brief liner, have a 4 inch inseam, have Storage and come in a neutral color. We didn't have a ton to offer her on that front, so we'd love your help.

Dana talked through her co-working needs. She's ready to co-work again and asked for some ideas as to where.

As for me? I wanted to know everyone's skincare routine. You'll notice in our resources that we spent a lot of time talking about our favorite brands.

We also chatted through a tiny topic: Romcoms. We talked about the best and the worst of the genre as well as some of our favorite movies to rewatch.

And a delightful addition: you'll hear from aSweatLife's summer intern Julia who has a lot to say about both skincare and romcoms.

References:

• Tracksmith
• Lululemon Align Shorts
• On running cloud ultra
• Working from
• Desk pass
• Outset skin care
• Rare beauty makeup
• Laneige Lip Sleeping Mask
• Cryo Spoon
• Scratch goods coffee undereye
• Indie Lee brightening face wash
• Moonjuice plump jelly
• Ilia lip mask
• Aavrani
• ITK Skincare
• CeraVe
• Rose water spray - NOW foods

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At aSweatLife, we always say that everything is better with friends. And that's not just to be cute - high quality bonds are the clearest predictor of longevity. Not to be dramatic, but making friends and spending time with them is a matter of life or less life.

Maybe you remember, but the past couple of years have been rough from a friendship perspective - you know what I mean. And many people took the pandemic to be an opportunity to reevaluate their surroundings, their happiness, and their living situations. I can't count how many people I know who moved or took off to become digital nomads. Moving can be a challenge from a connection standpoint.

Today, on the podcast, I’m speaking to someone today who took what could have been an isolating experience and she made it friendly.

Here's what Maggie Umberger said in her article on aSweatLife about making friends during her digital nomad year.

“From my time traveling the country over the last year, I learned an unexpected lesson I didn’t set out to receive. When I packed up the car to head west, the itinerary was set for places I’d never been and where I didn’t know a soul. I left thinking this was going to be a journey into isolation. I learned it was a journey — one that’s only just beginning — towards connection."

So we talk about why she and her partner took off for adventure and what they learned along the way.

• Follow Maggie Umberger
• Do yoga with Maggie
• Maggie's challenge to make friends on the road
• Un-steal-able bike, Fortified
• The Book about making friends as an adult, You Will Find Your People by Lane Moore
• The book Demon Copperhead by Barbara Kingsolver

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Stop for a second and ask yourself the following: if you meet a woman who tells you she isn't drinking, do you assume she's pregnant? Don't lie to me.

I spent nearly a year as a mostly sober - ok, fine a California-mostly-sober person. I went on Lexipro last May and I liked not feeling anxious and depressed, but I did not enjoy browning out. So, out with the booze and out with the blues. After nearly a year of the pregnant pauses (that's a lazy pun) that followed explaining that I wasn't drinking, I just started saying, "and no, I'm not pregnant."

Christina Heiser, whose voice you'll hear on the podcast this week, stopped drinking in December of 2021 and kept it up. She's a journalist, and so, she's observed and written about how it felt, the impact and why she did it. After she penned 5 Things That Happened When I Quit Drinking for a Year, I knew I'd found a kindred spirit.

We spend some time on the episode talking about our gluten stuff and she and I connected on how easy it is to accidentally eat gluten while you are impaired.

And because she is incredibly prepared at all times, Christina also came with her own links and resources. So don't hesitate to dive into her favorite influencers, products and links.

References: * 5 Things That Happened When I Quit Drinking for a Year * N/A drinks: * Boisson - an online N/A marketplace * Better Rhodes - an online N/A marketplace * Ghia * Hoplark * Monday * CleanCo * Giesen * Quit Lit (books about drinking less) * Quit Like a Woman by Holly Whitaker * The Unexpected Joy of Being Sober by Catherine Gray * Drinking Games by Sarah Levy * The Dry Challenge by Hilary Sheinbaum * Sober influencers * @shestayssober (Sarah Pottieger) * @noboozebabes (Shea Gomez) * @joinsoberish (Kayla Lyons) * @themindfulmocktail (Natalie Battaglia)

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A couple of months ago, I saw the signature microweights on the Omorpho gear for the first time in the background of a workout on Bravo's Summerhouse. I thought, "What's that future-wear?" And then went on with my life. (Yes, I watch Bravo, but I wouldn't call myself a Bravo-holic. Except, please ask me about Scandoval if you see me in the wild.)

So when I got my Omorpho G-tight and G-tank for myself, I couldn't fathom how this futuristic athletic apparel weighing in at under 2 pounds could enhance my workout. That is until I wore the outfit to an Interval workout at Studio Three. The treadmill inclines and sprints were decidedly more challenging. So, when I sat down to chat with Stefan Olander - former Nike heavy-hitter and cofounder/CEO of Omorpho - I understood the insight the brand was tapping into.

On the episode, I reference the CrossFit workout Murph, which was my point of reference for using a weighted vest to increase intensity. You'll hear Stefan share that a Murph workout was actually a big inspiration for the company.

But weighted vests were heavy, and I didn't have any burning desire to add 10 percent of my bodyweight or more to my upper body for a workout. But Omorpho weighs much less than a typical weighted vest and its evenly distributes the weight all over your body in the tanks and tights that I tried.

On this week's episode, we dive into the science and the design of Omorpho.

References: * Omorpho * Follow Omorpho on instagram * Murph, the CrossFit workout that started it all * Awe, the book by Dacher Keltner that I’m obsessed with and have talked about on this podcast several times * Simulated hypergravity study (which shows that athletes got stronger and faster with added weight) * The Omorpho App * The study that upended what we know about calories and metabolism * Dr. Huberman and cold * Wim Hof and cold * What’s biohacking?

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"When nothing is certain, anything is possible."

Heidi Zimmer, founder of Wild Rice Retreat said that on this week's episode of the podcast, and I furiously wrote it down. Because even though she was talking about the uncertainty of breaking ground on the project she'd worked on for years in March of 2020, I felt like it applied to absolutely everything.

And today, Wild Rice Rice Retreat is thriving on the shores of Bayfield, Wisconsin. With stunning views of Lake Superior (my favorite Great Lake) and access to miles of trails, this shoreline oasis is as much about being in nature as it is about integrating wellness into your life.

And its price point - around $300 a night for meals, lodging, and yoga programming - is staggeringly low compared to some of the options available. Heidi's vision is to make wellness travel accessible - and to do it all in the north woods of Wisconsin.

Hear all about it on this week's episode!

Resources: * Learn more about Wild Rice Retreat * Follow Wild Rice Retreat on Instagram * Meet Heidi Zimmer * The time I visited Wild Rice Retreat * The book: Braiding Sweet Grass * Mary Rice of Bayfield, Wisconsin and how her memory lives on * Wild Rice Restaurant * The architect behind Wild Rice Retreat, David Salmela * Chequamegon-Nicolet National Forest * The Apostle Islands * Heidi's recommended book, Unreasonable Hospitality * My recommended book, Awe * Something Heidi is loving this week: Kapha Season, a concept in Ayurveda * Something I'm loving this week: Cryospoon

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Every month, we hit the record button as a team to talk about what we're loving, eating, watching, and how we're moving. This week, Head of Community at aSweatLife, Kelly Matkovich; aSweatLife's partner Dana Farber, who runs Moonstone Marketing; and I all brought three things to discuss.

Here's what came up:

• Sleep: Kelly wanted to know how we're sleeping, what we use to go to sleep, and she makes a great pitch for the Hatch alarm clock
• Pickleball: Kelly's getting really into it pickleball and she tells us why
• A Trader Joe's snack that disappointed Dana
• Dana's current favorite workout, P.volve
• The Amazon show Jury Duty
• The Hoxton’s Working Form_ Relay desks

I accidentally gave medical advice three times. Please consult your physician before doing anything I tell Kelly and Dana to do.

Resources:* Crunchy curls from TJ’s * Raspberry shortbread sandwich cookies * Trader joe’s dried pineapple * The cut, People working multiple jobs to afford Erehwon * The cut, outsourcing my orgasm * Calm, the magnesium supplement * Demon Copperhead - the book * Pineapple Street - the book * P.volve - the workout * Chunky socks - the necessity * Erica Marie - the incredible trainer * Vuori t-shirt - Kelly's go-to workout shirt * Cotopaxi windbreaker - Kelly's windbreaker * Jury Duty, watch every second of it. * The Hoxton’s _workingFrom * HeyDay facials * A beginner's Guide to Pickleball on aSweatLife * An entire episode of this podcast about pickleball * Seventh heaven tiktok recaps * Shrinking on Apple TV * Superglue and cuts, guidance from the Mayo Clini

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April showers are bringing May flowers, we're also seeing running goals on the horizon. That's why we're running with hundreds of ambassadors from across the nation who are training for for a 5k. For some of us, it’s just for the fun of it, for some it’s to get faster, and for others it’s simply to do the thing.

It can be easy to think of running shoes as another accessory for your fit-fit (see what I did there), but we know that for runners, shoes are your equipment for your sport. We brought Todd Falker into the digital studio to talk about shoes, innovation and why it matters for running.

Todd is fast, and in the course of this conversation, I invited myself to spectate his next trail race. Because how often do you get to watch someone run fast, far and on trails?!

References:

• Puma Running innovation ft. Todd Falker
• Your guide to Running Shoes Ft. Conor Cashin
• The Cheap Marathon, it costs $26.20
• Ready for a super science-y review of super critical foaming? Here you go!
• Puma runner, Annie Frisbie
• Puma runner, Hendrich Pfieffer
• RC Malden
• The mile high run club
• Slow AF Run Club
• The Hansen’s Marathon Method
• Figure out your Sun, Moon, and Rising signs

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As aSweatLife's #GoalForIt running program kicks off, we're bringing together aSweatLife Ambassadors from across the nation to train and run for a 5k. For some of us, it's just for the fun of it, for some it's to get faster, and for others it's simply to do the thing.

We always say that everything is better with friends here at aSweatLife. And that especially applies to running. So today on the podcast, we’re talking about community and running. We've brought one of our resident community builders, Nimbe Juarez onto the podcast to talk about why community matters for running, where to find it, and how to create it for yourself.

Nimbe has a self-proclaimed, "love-hate relationship" with running, but for her the idea of running with friends keeps her coming back. She organizes a monthly event that she calls "friends-running" to bring an all-paces community together to run.

On the episode, we talk about our relationship with running, running groups we admire, and running with donkeys.

References: * aSweatLife ambassadors (people like Nimbe who get cool stuff and programming to do together) * Nimbe Juarez on Instagram * TORTUGAS Run Club * Family style Run Club * midway mile chasers * 3run2 * Puma running * Your guide to Running Shoes * Alexi Pappa's book, Bravey * Alexi Pappas wrote the for Runner’s World on the WHY behind community * Nimbe’s resource on Community, “If you want to go Faster or Farther, Join a Running Group.” * Aftershokz Headphones * Burro racing in Colorado is evidently a thing

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It’s the first podcast of the month. We're coming at you to share some things we’re thinking about. We’ll shoot the breeze, share things we love and try to crack each other up.

This week, we're catching up on the podcast on food, friendship, fitness and fun. Each of us (Dana, Kelly and I) are bringing two topics we want to chat through to the episode.

Here's what we cover:

• Cottage Cheese
• Traveling with friends
• The Barbie Movie, marketing, and trailer
• Passover food
• Jeana's #30Daysoffriends challenge
• Love is Blind Season 4
• And we all talk about our favorite comfort TV

Resources: * Mt lions and what to know about them * Good culture cottage cheese, because cottage cheese is trending * Splitwise for all of your travel needs * The Barbie movie trailer * Greta gerwig, the director of Barbie * Evan Ross Katz * ICYMI, Barbie Girl by Aqua * Fun things to do with leftover Matzo * P.volve * Love is Blind * Rewatching TV shows is good for your anxiety * Pod meets world * Salty Face Tanning Water

And our very important list of comfort TV

• The Office
• 30 Rock
• Ted Lasso
• Friends
• New Girl
• Parks and Rec
• Schitt’s Creek
• aSweatLife's TikTok
• Cottage Cheese TikTok Recipes
• Thrillist's Cottage Cheese ideas

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It's our favorite time of the breakdown of the State of Fitness - your predictions. We love to hear what you think is coming in the world of wellness and what you're over. First and foremost, this is a fun time for all of us to guess, joke around, and have a great time making wild predictions.

This week, we dig into a few things you think are coming for the State of Fitness and we also share what WE think we'll see in the future of fitness.

Here's a look at what you think is coming:Read more about the state of fitness predictions here. We talk through each other these and share some of our own thoughts on these.

• Prediction #1: We’ll title this “the robots are coming”
• Prediction #2: Digital fitness is Dead.
• Prediction #3: Fitness in gyms and studios will make a full comeback.
• Prediction #4: People need gyms to connect.
• Prediction #5: Pickleball.
• Prediction #6: We’ll title this, “In this economy?”
• Prediction #7: A new love for low-impact fitness.

And also, for reference, I misled Dana with such confidence over the pronunciation of the word Harbinger. Turns out that she was right and I was wrong. Please see the pronunciation.

References: * State of Fitness * Netflix and Nike partnership * Chat GPT * SVB's failure and why it matters to the economy * Bank collapses and why they matter * Mindbody’s Wellness Index * Casper Ter Kuile and his book The Power of Ritual * The Apple TV show Shrinking * Pickleball is the fastest Growing Sport in America * Toss and Spin * Why consumers are bad at predictors of their own future behavior * Chris the founder of Toss and Spin on aSweatLife's podcast * Mayweather Boxing Acquisition * Xponential and princess cruise * Web3 Swagger Society by Robin Arzon

Big questions we're left with:* How did our ancestors work out?

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So, on the podcast all month, we've been talking about the State of Fitness and this week is no different, but we're delving into the mental health of it all.

One thing we're been touching on all month is how venture capital flowed into fitness - which in its purest form is community. And while cash gives things like groeth, cash taketh away when it demands insane metrics.

We saw that with connected fitness and talked about it on last week's podcast.

This week, I said aloud, "I hope there's not a way that cash can ruin mental health and mindfulness ... except if it becomes a luxury."

And then Kristen Geil who used to be our Editor in Chief texted me this profile piece about Peoplehood. That article in the LA Times states, "some experts express skepticism about these new programs, which could be viewed as commodifying human relationships."

Fear not, mindfulness can be accessible to all until someone finds a way to charge for breathing.

Regardless of the capital of it all, it was important for us to include mental health in this year’s state of fitness survey. This week we talk through what you told us about your mental health and mindfulness practices. We share data, correlations, and wild assumptions.

Why?

A study we love to quote is the Harvard Study of Adult Development, which tells us that the easiest way to predict a long and happy life is the strong social connections one has. Several studies found that people’s level of satisfaction with their relationships at age 50 was a better predictor of physical health than their cholesterol levels were.

On the flip side, according to the CDC, Social isolation significantly increased a person's risk of premature death from all causes, a risk that may rival things like smoking and physical inactivity. Social isolation was associated with about a 50% increased risk of dementia.

Friendship and mental health really, really matter for your quality of life and longevity. And that’s why we’re all here at aSweatLife.

So listen to what we have to say about the state of fitness and your mental health.

Resource: * State of Fitness * The Harvard Study of Adult Development * The CDC's findings on social isolation * Studies on mindfulness * Headspace funding * Calm funding * Open Mindfulness Studio funding * Awe by Dacher Keltner * Josie and The Pussycats * The Game, book * This Works Sleep Spray * Spotify ‘00s Rock Anthems Playlist * Back to the beach * The Daily Calm in the calm app

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We recorded this podcast while I sat next to my Peloton, a machine that got me through the pandemic - Jess Simms, Tunde, Cody, Alex, Robin, all came at me live into my home while I - like everyone else in the world, looked for some normalcy.

But cut to a more normal fitness world and there my Peloton sits, unused by me since July of 2022. And don’t get me wrong - I loved that thing while I loved it, but I am a person who uses fitness as a form of social connection.

I use in-person fitness for high-fives, for small-to-medium talk - like the “How are you, we’ve met before, right? I love your set. It’s an amazon dupe? No way.”

I prefer medium to deep talk if given the choice, But interactions like these are really good for you, according to Discover Magazine.

And during the pandemic, I kept describing what I missed - barista interactions, check-out interactions, and yes, the casual, "I love your socks with the funny saying" interactions.

So, when the coast was clear, I was back with a vengeance and I moved on from my Peloton. But I’m not everyone. So, we continued to ask big questions of our audience about what they’re using in their digital routines and what we found was super interesting. We’re digging in on what readers told us about digital fitness and connected fitness this week based on our State of Fitness report.

So this week, we're digging into digital and connected fitness - Are you still doing it? And why?

References: * State of Fitness * Lululemon’s Mirror Acquisition * Lululemon Q4’22 quarterly earnings report * Lululemon Earnings Call * Lululemon price drop * Peloton commercial * Future Fit Peloton Stats * Technavio Future of connected fitness * Fitt Insider’s connected fitness report * Discover Magazine on small Talk * Presence

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This month on the podcast, we're breaking down the intricacies of the State of Fitness Report we published in February. There is a lot to unpack in all of the historical data we're comparing and in all of the incredible insights you share with us.

Last week, we talked a lot about your fitness spending habits and this week we’re digging into what you’re doing with your precious time dedicated to movement.

Because we want to evaluate how far we’ve swung back on the pendulum, we’ll be doing a lot of comparison and contrast between 2022 data, our 2021 survey, the mid-2020 pandemic survey, and pre-pandemic numbers.

We take data-driven guesses on why walking is the number one fitness format, whether cycling will make a come-back to pre-COVID numbers, and why we're all picking up heavy things again.

Hot takes on this episode* Yoga Teacher Training is a pyramid scheme. (Don't @ us - we're not the first to say this) * "Walking has cauliflower's publicist" * a lot of women got into the true crime thing, thus, Dana guesses, there is more interest in strength * We would welcome men to walk in hoards (like women in groups like Chicago Girls Walk and City Girls Who Walk) if - and only if - they wear crop tops and crocs.

References:

• State of Fitness
• Sweat Fitness Studio (where Kelly taught)
• CrossTown Fitness (where Jeana taught)
• The book,The Power
• Coming Soon, The Power on Amazon Prime
• Alo Moves
• Stoned+Toned
• STRIDE Fitness
• The Hill, what is TikTok’s hot girl walk
• Jeana: The CDC’s Physical Activity Guidelines
• Coworking day @ The Hoxton
• Puma trail running shoes
• Studio Three and Foxtrot

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We've been collecting consumer data on fitness habits and spending since 2017, so we have numbers that show just how quickly things really did change over the Pandemic.

We’re be breaking down our State of Fitness survey and its results on our podcast all month, This week, we're starting with spending. We talk about how much we - the hosts - are spending, what you told us you're spending and what percent of you are getting your fitness for free. We also dig into a metric that is purely post pandemic: return-to-gym.

I hate to bring it up again, but underlying all of this is the pandemic and its wax and wane. It did something to us and that something was behavior change on a massive scale.

It’s a fact that behavior change is extremely hard, but it is the underlying principle that drives the fitness industry. Ans along with that, habit adoption is nearly impossible. We all know the stats around New Years resolutions - most people make them and drop them by February. And it’s not because we don’t WANT to adopt the behaviors we set out to adopt, it’s because we are creatures of habit operating on autopilot. From one of my favorite podcasts, Hidden Brain, “About 43 percent of everyday actions are done repeatedly almost every day in the same context." So knocking someone out of autopilot to do something new takes a change in motivation and - depending on the human, some sort of reward.

Covid created a petri dish wherein our habits were turned off - we couldn’t go to the office, we couldn’t go to the gym, childcare was non-existent. That left the human race open for new things in the confines of our homes.

Here’s what McKinsey had to say on that “When consumers are surprised and delighted by new experiences, even long-held beliefs can change, making consumers more willing to repeat the behavior, even when the trigger (in this case, the COVID-19 pandemic) is no longer present. In other words, this is a unique moment in time during which companies can reinforce and shape behavioral shifts to position their products and brands better for the next normal.”

So the data we’re talking about this month will dig into what changed, what went back to normal, and what stuck. And this week, specifically, we’re talking about the financial side of it all.

Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Resources:* State of Fitness * The theoretical model of behavior change * Hidden Brain on behavior change and habits * Consumer behavior change from McKinsey * Popsugar - How Pilates Healed my relationship with exercise * Mind Body Wellness Index

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If you’ve ever watched Shark Tank or pitched your own business, you’re familiar with the concept of addressable market, or total addressable market (TAM). It’s an ever important metric to determine whether the thing you’re talking about has room for growth or - to put it simply - a way to quantify how many people care or could care about the thing you’re selling.

I told you that to tell you this: Pickleball is booming.

A couple of facts point us in that direction, but most importantly, market size. According to Marketwatch, The global pickleball Paddle market - that’s just paddles - was valued at $126.5 million in 2019 and is expected to reach $218.2 million by the end of 2026.

People are making pickleball a business and business is booming. But outside of that, regular humans are loving the game: according to the Sport and Fitness Industry Association, it’s the fastest growing sport in the US. How big is it? 4.8 million people played it in 2021.

There’s even a major league of pickleball, which - get this, wants to bring the number of people playing pickleball in the US up to 30 million by 2030.

Investors in Major league pickleball include Naomi Osaka, Kevin Durant, Patrick Mahomes, Lebron James, Tom Brady, Heidi Klum, and Budweiser just to name a few. By the way, pro Pickleball is going to be interesting - there’s going to be relegation and promotion - if you’ve watched Ted Lasso (or European football in general), you’re familiar with the drama of that.

So, on this week's episode of the podcast, we dig in. We talk about how we found the game, Chris shares what led him to build a business in the racket sports space, and we generally just have a fantastic time.

References:

• Toss and Spin
• Toss and Spin on Instagram
• Chris on aSweatLife, Why is everyone you know playing Pickleball
• The New York Times, Pickleball Wars
• From aSweatLife, A workout to prepare to play pickleball
• From market watch, Pickleball paddle market size
• The Wall Street Journal, Pickleball investments
• NPR, Inside America’s Fastest Growing Sport
• Kevin Durant and pickleball
• Forbes, celebrity Pickleball investments
• Bloomberg Business of Sports Podcast, Celebrity investors in Pickleball (ft. Jason Kelly who has also been on this podcast)
• A Global overview of the Pickleball Market Size
• Breakpoint on NetFlix
• Tennis player, Nick Kyrgios
• Tyson McGuffin, Pro pickleball player sponsored by Sketcher
• Kelly’s thing she loves Flora Hemp Spirits
• Jeana’s thing she loves, The State of Fitness

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Content warning: we talk about sex on this episode.

So recently, we started to notice Ashley Martens - a health and wellness writer who lends her pen to aSweatLife as well as Women’s Health, Red Book and Delish - covering more of what we'd call "saucy content."

It started after some jerk ghosted her. By the way, human adults, don't ghost each other. Have a tough convo and move on. K? And as she pitched article after article that touched on sexual health, we were loving the angles she was exploring. Never before had we seen the word "orgasm" on the site so much. And as she digs into sexual health more and more, we wanted to know what she'd learned.

And I think it's important in adulthood to re-educate ourselves. Sex ed focused on reproduction and diseases at best, and at worst, it completely demonized the act. Bad sex ed leaves kids with more questions and no one to ask about them besides the internet or other equally confused teens.

But when you think of all of the things that come with sex, like relationships, boundaries, consent, pleasure, and - sure, if you choose - babies, there’s so much to learn.

So join us as we work through our comfort levels in discussing sex, dating, the $13 billion dollar US sex toy industry, and anything else that comes up.

Resources: * Ashley Martens on aSweatLife * Ashley Martens on Instagram * How to Maintain Your Mental Health While Online Dating * So, You Haven’t Had Sex For… Awhile. Here’s How to Approach Your (Second) First Time * The Benefits of Female Masturbation * An Open Letter to the Man Who Jilted Me * The Benefits of Sleeping Naked * All of the different types of orgasms * The best sexual positions for your lifestyle * How to have multiple Orgasms * Kelly's resource, The What’s Happening with my Body book * Kelly's resource, Big Mouth the TV Show * Ashley’s source for sex toy industry * Jeana's resource, Come as You Are the book * Ashley's current fitness obsession, The Rehab Lab * Jeana's current puppy necessity, The Roodie

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You know that person who reminds you that Mercury is in retrograde and they ask new friends to share their astrological signs? It’s me.

And we love leaning into the woo-woo in a fun and approachable way around aSweatLife. Each week, aSweatLife ambassadors get an email with everything fun that’s happening AND one of the Ambassadors, Mary Kessinger, writes a horoscope.

So when Twyla Adkins raised her hand to write a piece for aSweatLife about the right workout for your sun, moon and rising sign, we were all about it.

Quick, a primer on sun, moon and rising from Alex Caiola, or the high priestess of Brooklyn, who Twyla interviewed for this piece:

"The sun sign gives insight into your personality and what naturally attracts you ... The rising sign also known as the ascendant sets up our first house, which is the house of identity, our body in some respects ... It’s how we encounter everything and move through the world. Your rising sign is important when it comes to exercise or how we want movement to fit into our lives. Our emotional needs might impact our workout preferences too. Sometimes your go-to exercise just doesn’t align with your current emotional state. That’s why your moon sign, representing your emotional self, matters."

And so, on the episode this week, we dig into the world of woo-woo and what it means to us.

References: * By Twyla Atkins, The Best Workout for Your Sun, Moon, and Rising Sign. * If you’re unfamiliar with your big three, you can find them hereor work with an astrologer like Caiola * From the NYPost, What are the sun, moon and rising sign? * Follow Twyla Atkins on Instagram * Follow Kelly’s Pic, Veya Coffee, which creates adult pop-tarts * Follow Odyssey Elixir, jeana’s pic * Mind your Manners on Netflix * The Costar App * The Flora Pod for plants * Astrology for the Soul, Jan Spiller * Kim Krans and The WIld Unkown online and on Instagram

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On the pages of aSweatLife in 2020, Kensli Diggs penned a piece that called on readers to use friendship to see the perspectives of others from different walks of life. It was titled Why it’s so Important to Diversify Your Friend Group.

She said, “It’s important to diversify your friend group because it’s important to develop a familiarization and understanding of other people’s backgrounds.”

Since, we’ve seen that piece get more traffic than any other on aSweatLife, which means that people around the world have read the piece that starts with a big question. Kensli writes, “A Reuters poll completed in 2013 and cited by NBC News states that “about 40 percent of white Americans and about 25 percent of non-white Americans are surrounded exclusively by friends of their own race.” The United States still remains very segregated today, and racial prejudice is at the heart of this issue. But how do we break past these barriers to form genuine friendships?“

So, this week, nearly three years after publication, we revisit the piece with Kensli to talk through the guidance and what she would update about the piece.

This episode was recorded before the murder of Tyre Nichols, but we want to recognize that similar conversations are happening today as those that were happening in June of 2020. Remember to check on each other and to ask before sharing links to videos to avoid traumatizing or re-traumatizing each other.

References: * Follow Kensli Diggs * By Kensli Diggs, Why it’s so Important to Diversify Your Friend Group. * Kensli’s Project, Diversity in Wellness photo series - a photo from the first shoot, From the second shoot, and from the photoshoot with kids * From Pew Research - Data on cancel culture * Free Museum Days in Chicago * Meet Jeana’s puppy on Instagram * From Greater Good at Berkeley, How many hours does it take to make to friend * The Racial Healing Handbook * From The Huffington Post, It's Time To Broaden Your Friend Group. Here's How To Start * Follow: @daniellebayardjackson * The Dyson Air Wrap

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Chances are that if you're reading this, social media was introduced in your lifetime. Whether or not that means you have vivid memories of retrieving the AOL CD ROM from the mailbox and begging your parents to set it up on your Gateway PC (which came in a cowprint box) is another thing.

If all of that resonated with you, email me at Jeana@asweatlife.com to commiserate about the series finale of Full House or your lower back pain.

A considerable amount of time has passed since connection to the internet came after you endured a minute of dialing-up. And in that time, we've seen wifi prevalence,

MySpace, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and TikTok. This week, we cover TikTok, which came onto the scene in China (or a version of it, anyway) in 2016. And in the U.S., TikTok was largely popularized as families, COVID pods, and pre-teens danced and danced and danced again during the pandemic.

And TikTok has been called addictive, which can be in part to its extremely intelligent Algorithm. It gains a quick understanding of who you are, what you care about, or who you’re attracted to.

So, if you’re watching videos on a topic like weight loss, it could start to serve you dangerous content that pushes you towards disordered eating. On the flip side, if you’re looking for motivation to move your body and feel stronger, it could start to serve you exactly what you need. Or you could get nudged into a 75 Hard.

That's why we loved aSweatLife writer David Robertson's coverage of fitness challenges and trends on TikTok and how to tell if they're safe. On this week's episode, we talk about his guidance as well as our own personal feelings about the social media we're consuming.

Resources:* By David Robertson How to determine if a TikTok trend is safe * David Robertson on Instagram * By Sarah Beerman Mental health TikTok on aSweatLife * NYTimes The Egyption revolution that began on Facebook * Wikipedia dedicated to Twitter revolutions * The history of TikTok according to Wikipedia * NBC News: TikTok surpassed google * NYTimes: How TikTok’s algorithm works * What’s a 75 Hard? * By Chanel Kenner How to do a weekly social media detox * She said, the movie

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Trigger warning: on this episode, we discuss pregnancy and loss. If you're not in a place to hear that, skip it and come back next week. Take care of yourself.

Amanda Lauren, a contributor at aSweatLife and a lot of other publications, has covered a tried and true beat for about five years around here: Wellness and lifestyle. We love reading her take on the way movement bumps up against fashion, self care, and trends.

But over the last year, she's been sharing a look inside something really personal - her experience trying to conceive. Last February, she shared the raw feelings around her pregnancy loss. She tackled conversations around infertility in June. Then, in December, she shared how being pregnant now is changing the way she looks at her body and what it can do.

And pregnancy loss, pregnancy, and parenting are all such a personal and complicated topics - hello, we're coming to you from the United States in the year 2023. But Amanda's candor on the issue and her willingness to share her own internal monologue feels like it could help other women.

Pregnancy loss is fairly common - According to March of Dimes, for women who know they’re pregnant, about 10 to 15 in 100 pregnancies (10 to 15 percent) end in miscarriage.

Common or not, the emotional toll has often been untreated or undertreated.

According to the American Psychological Association, The tragedy of miscarriage has traditionally been private, an event grieved largely by the mother, on her own. Health-care professionals advised these women that the sadness would grow less pronounced over time, especially following a successful pregnancy. But new research suggests that some women may mourn for much longer than expected, even after the birth of a healthy child, although the range and severity of the symptoms may vary. That's also true for men, as new studies have found that men grieve over a miscarriage more than once thought.

So we talked through it all on this week's episode, specifically, her most recent piece on the topic - How Getting Pregnant After Miscarriage Changed My Fitness Routine. She's honest, open, and willing to share her thoughts on the subject.

Resources:

• Follow Amanda Lauren on Instagram
• By Amanda: How Getting Pregnant After Miscarriage Changed My Fitness Routine
• By Amanda: Here’s What No One Will Tell You About Having A Miscarriage
• By Amanda: How to Have Conversations About Infertility
• Podcast on Trying to conceive
• Podcast episode on Pelvic floor recovery
• Podcast on the mental health side of pregnancy
• Podcast on Roe v. Wade and your access to care
• Birthrates in the US (census bureau data)
• Money.com - It’s increasingly expensive to raise a child in the U.S.
• Miscarriage stats - Mayo Clinic
• Depression and Anxiety Following Early Pregnancy Loss: Recommendations for Primary Care Providers

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Welcome to Season 8 of #WeGotGoals, the podcast by aSweatLife.com. We’re doing things a little differently this season, featuring topics from our crew of expert writers, responding to moments in pop culture, or whatever the hell we feel like talking about.

This week, we’re talking about body image … and since our team is practically all female and a lot of our readers and ambassadors are female, we’re going to be referencing body image for women - although we know men deal with their own complicated set of body image stuff too.

This week, you'll hear from Amy Potter, an aSweatLife Ambassador, Professional trainer and the author of the article on aSweatLife.com that inspired this week’s episode: 7 Steps to Build a Better Body Image. That’s the kind of how-to content we need more of in our lives.

Resources:* How to Improve your body image on aSweatLife * Amy Potter on Instagram * Ladies Who Lift * NEDA * A history of body image ideals on Katie Couric Media * WomensHealth.gov resources on body image * How to compliment a female without saying "skinny" * Turkey chili from Ambitious Kitchen * Half Days Ski Attire

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My mantra going into 2023 in general is "this should be fun." It's meant to be a not-so-gentle reminder that I started aSweatLife for joy - I wanted to fill my own life with joy and hopefully help others do the same too.

For me there are too sides to this idea: the first is actively seeking out ways to add fun to my life and the other is eliminating the stuff that is depleting my joy. Don't deplete my joy, you guys.

When it comes to aSweatLife's podcast - #WeGotGoals - I've been interviewing people by myself for a while. When thinking about adding more joy to the experience of podcasting, I remembered one of my other favorite catch phrases: Everything Is Better With Friends.

So I asked, nudged, pushed - whatever - one of my favorite people on the planet Kelly Matkovich into a co-host position. Kelly is aSweatLife's Head of Community, so she brings with her that experience of what folks in our community want and need. I'm already having more fun.

All seasons, you'll hear us diving deeper with authors and experts who were featured on the pages of aSweatLife.com. We'll ask the big WHY behind the pieces that cover fitness, friendship, fun, and food.

And on every episode, we'll give you a glimpse into what we're loving, our favorite resources, and what's good in our lives.

On this, the first episode of the season, Kelly and I share more about our journeys with aSweatLife, and I shared something new and noteworthy with Kelly (just when she thought she knew everything about me), we also dig into what we're looking forward to this season.

Listen and make sure to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts like Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Resources:* Nuuly - Kelly's go-to for clothes * The Vibrant years - out current book club book, and the first book from Mindy Kaling's Mindy's Book Studio on Amazon * Movement that brings you joy - the piece on aSweatLife from Sarah Beerman that Kelly loved

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This is the final episode of the seventh season of #WeGotGoals and we’re excited to kick off our annual State of Fitness survey with this episode. We’ve been keeping our fingers on the pulse of what you do to stay fit, recover and how you spend your money on wellness. And this year, we’re adding some questions about mental health.

On this week’s episode, you’ll hear references to data from our state of fitness survey.

A key number we’ve kept our eyes on over the years is the trend of our mostly female readers spending more and more time picking up heavy things and putting them back down. We’ve loved watching strength training grow in popularity. Obviously a few things have led to the ebb and flow of women in the weight room.

Historically, women often felt welcome in different spaces in the gym - namely the aerobics studio - and there were a lot of reasons why that is. But the ‘70s were a pivotal time for women in sport and exercise. It was that decade in which we saw the invention of the sports bra, the passing of Title IV, and brands like Jazzercise get women moving in more cardio formats. But backwards beliefs about testosterone, sexuality and the appearance of strength often kept women from lifting. As the decades went on, programs like Les Mills Body Pump which debuted in the ‘90s made strength training a part of that same space where women were already welcome.

Cut to today - we’ve watched strength grow in popularity - even with the pandemic closing down gyms and studios. Strength has been the most popular form of exercise we've seen in our state of fitness survey for the past 4 years running. And aSweatLife readers told us that they invested in equipment to do their own at-home workouts during the pandemic.

As I spoke to Jarrod Saracco, the COO at World Gym this week, we talked a lot about the shifting needs of the big box gym consumer. A big box gym is just that, a large physical space with equipment that gives its members the autonomy to choose when and how they work out. So they generally find lots of equipment, cardio machines and some classes.

But Saracco said that strength is on the rise at World Gym too, causing the franchisor to create a strength-only model of the gym: World Gym Legacy. Saracco talks us through the embrace of strength and the instagram trends associated with strength at World Gym’s strength-forward model - from a glute-only strength area called “booty boulevard” and designated selfie rooms.

You’ll also hear Saracco and I talk about metrics we’ve been monitoring since the pandemic: return to gym. I’m excited to see some updated stats in our survey that’s live now,, but in September of 2021, 41.1% of respondents told us that they had returned to an IRL gym. Saracco and I talked about what we think that number will be now, but World Gym has seen a high number of customers return to the gym.

Resources:

• Learn more about World Gym
• Follow Jarrod on LinkedIn
• Read the results from the 2021 state of Fitness
• Take our 2022 state of fitness survey

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This week on the podcast, you’re going to hear a lot about “the universe” and listening to intuition from Robin Samples, the Founder of Bare Feet Power Yoga.

Robin Samples and I both got into business around the same time - about 10 years ago. And over these 10 years it got easier and easier for me to scootch into the territory of woo-woo. I get the feeling that Robin’s journey to the spiritual was quicker than mine - she just brought her community along with her when she felt it was ready.

And that’s the thing about Bare Feet Power Yoga - for Robin, the yoga has always been important, but I’ve heard her talk a lot about getting beyond the physical practice for years. You’ll hear us talk about a few of the ways Bare Feet has tapped into yoga off the mat, from retreats to workshops to programming that revolves around cannabis.

Robin’s focus has always been on building community and giving that community what it needed, which allowed her to make subtle changes when she needed and big changes when the world demanded it.

Robin operates one of the only pay-what-you-can studios, an option that gives more people access to the practice of yoga. Drop-in yogis have the option to pay on a sliding scale - $20 for a little extra assistance, $24 for regular-price drop-ins, and $28 to pay-it-forward, which is a pricing tier that helps to subsidize another person’s discounted class.

If $20 is out-of-reach, Bare Feet has always had the option of joining the karma crew, which offers an additional way to make yoga a part of your life for the low, low price of karma. Reach out to the studio if you're interested in joining the Karma Crew.

And that evolution has also allowed Robin to try things, create space for a range of teachers and develop the kind of studio that not only fosters movement, but also a greater sense of connection to one's self, their community, and - for those who choose to tap into the spiritual side of the practice - the universe.

Resources: * Bare Feet Power Yoga * Follow Bare Feet Power Yoga on Instagram * AND you can check Bare Feet Power Yoga's workshops to join Cannabliss 12/9 * Contact Bare Feet Power Yoga if you want to join the Karma Crew * Double Rainbow Guy (who recently passed away)

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I’ve gotten to chat with Brrrn co-founders Johnny Adamic and Jimmy Martin a few times since meeting them in 2018. I’d like to remind you that 2018 was a time before the proliferation of zoom, so our first interview was conducted via freeconferencecall.com.

I remember vividly chatting with the pair in 2018. They were equal parts entertaining and excited about a super-specific niche in fitness (cold temperature training). I have a memory of the thought, “it’s a shame that I’m the only one listening to this recording” as I wrote the article for aSweatLife.com.

Call this take two. I genuinely like these guys. I looked forward to this interview for the past couple of days because I knew it would be a really good time. And I really like every person who comes onto the podcast, but some people make me nervous in a way that Jimmy and Johnny do not. They’re a mix of charming, smart and funny that you know endears people to them.

And I think that is the essence of the brand they’ve created. Charming, welcoming and smart. You’ll hear them talk about it on the episode, but they’re an insanely perfect match for where the world went after they opened their studio in the heart of New York City.

Jimmy worked with SNL and studied at the Upright Citizens Brigade - or UCB as it’s called in the biz - and cut his teeth on production before the world shut down. He also has that improv-er ability to problem solve through the “yes, and.” They both have it, actually, you’ll hear Johnny say, “To yes, and that, Jimmy …”

And Johnny studied public health in New York City and worked for Mayor Bloomberg. He can and will throw science at you in an approachable way.

So together, they chose to create cold training spaces when the rest of the world was only counting workouts that got them as hot and sweaty as humanly possible. And it was there that they fell in love with training on a slide board and there that they started manifesting their future partner and investor, Apolo Ohno.

So when the pandemic hit, I don’t want to undervalue the stress they went through, but they accepted it, and built on what was in front of them. They “yes, and” ed the pandemic and build an ecommerce business after finding a US-based partner to manufacture an at-home version of the slide board.

And there’s a lot to love about Brrrn besides the guys who created it, including their growing list of studios and gyms where you can find their programming as well as certifications for trainers to get Continuing education Credits. We hardly even scratched the surface.

Resources:

• Learn more about training at home with Brrrn
• See the Brrrn Board in action (youTube video)
• Follow @brrrn on Instagram
• Follow @JohnnyAdamic on Instagram
• Follow @JimmyTMartin (the quadfather) on Instagram
• The first time Jimmy and Johhny were on aSweatLife
• A brief introduction to Lateral training by Shape.com
• The Study on Cold plunges they reference by Huberman
• Find the Brrrn Bundle on our Move Holiday Gift Guide
• Just for fun: The movie we talk about - Nobody, starring Bob Odenkirk
• Just for fun: the actress I adoringly talk about, D'Arcy Carden

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This week on #WeGotGoals, I’m speaking with the woman behind [solidcore], Anne Mahlum. And before that, she started the not-for-profit Back on My Feet, and soon to come, she’s heading up her new venture in the fitness space: Ambition.

One thing I noticed the first time I met Anne Mahlum on a lobby bench at the opening of Chicago's first [solidcore] is this: She fills up a room with her presence - and the name of that presence is the same name of her coming in 2023 concept: ambition.

Ambition. A word that is often spat out of the mouths of those speaking about women along with competitive or loud.

In a Harvard Business Review article that featured the findings from interviews with high achieving women, “ambition” was, for these women, associated with egotism, selfishness, self-aggrandizement, or the manipulative use of others for one’s own ends. For men? Ambition was considered a necessary and desirable part of their lives.

Anne Mahlum is not shy about her ambition, that is one indisputable truth about her. She is not shy about her goals, either. She shared here on this very podcast a few years ago her goal to have 100 [solidcore] locations open by the end of 2020. We all know what 2020 did to business goals, but if you google her, you’ll find that same goal listed in a litany of publications.

I get the sense from her that she’s growing and learning every day, personally and professionally.

She’s had challenges as she seeks out her big goals - she shares pretty openly about all of it - from disordered eating that followed her family’s split. She was injured severely in a 2019 jet ski accident that led to several surgeries that you’ll hear about this week.

She was sued by Sabastian Lagree, the founder of the Lagree method and that lawsuit (and the countersuit by [solidcore]) was settled privately. She was sued by an ex-boyfriend who claimed to be co-owner of [solidcore]. That was also settled.

In our interview this week, Anne also mentions what she calls a “hit piece” by buzzfeed, which shared interviews from 25 current and former [solidore] employees.

Through all of it, I get the sense that her ambition is more her blessing than her burden. So why not name your business that: Ambition.

With all of that said, I know one thing for sure, she’s a human with a singular focus. She has her sights set on a goal probably two or three goals ahead of what she tells me in this interview, and she absolutely believes in her ability to achieve it.

Resources:* Anne on Instagram * [solidcore] * [solidcore] on Instagram * Ambition’s website * Women and ambition, HBR * Fundraising for Ambition by Anne Mahlum * A photo of Anne as founder of Back on My Feet * Back on my feet * One of the success stories from Back on My Feet * Her reaction to a piece about stepping down as CEO from [solidcore]

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On this week's episode of the podcast, you'll hear a lot of references to the University of Wisconsin-Madison. I'm an alumna and our guest - Sam Karl, co-founder and president of Kamps Fitness - is an alumnus. You'll hear a lot about the campus and its hot spots.

And I have never really cared that much about sports, which is sort of the thing that ties alums to their universities for years and years. I experience no pang of guilt if I don't know the Badgers' standing in the Big 10 or wherever else standings matter. I do, however, feel a sense of attachment to a place on campus, which was very much connected to my routine: The SERF, or the Southeast Recreational Facility. Aka, my campus gym.

You'll hear on the episode that I just learned that the SERF was demolished (and they didn't even call to let me know) and replaced with an even bigger facility, The Nick. I think the new, bigger and better facility is incredibly representative of the increasing value that college students are placing on wellness.

Meanwhile, Kamps Fitness, opened its first location on a strip of campus known for its bars, restaurants and general debauchery - State Street, right across from the bar that I remember being "tough on IDs," State Street Brats.

And Sam shares what it took to open that fitness hot spot and why he and his brother and co-founder Ari Karl chose the campus. You'll hear about their creative go-to-market strategy, how they've created a flat org chart within Kamps Fitness and why Sam decided to leave his career as a lawyer behind to pursue this business.

We talk about the highs and the lows, including closing for COVID, learning when a location just isn't going to work, and what it's like to work with family.

Resources:* Get your classes at a Kamps Fitness location near you * Follow @KampsFit on Instagram * More about the demolition of the SERF * More about the Nick at the University of Wisconsin-Madison * ClassPass Best studio in Madison in 2019 * KAMPS fitness is offering you, aSweatLife listeners a discount. Use code "ASWEATLIFE20" to get 20% off all packages and drop in classes

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Content warning: In this episode of the podcast, we mention the concept of suicide in the context of prevention and raising awareness. If you’re listening with young ears or if you’re just not in a place to hear that today, skip this episode and come back

I’ve never met Kacee Must, founder of Citizen Yoga in real life. We met during the pandemic and have zoomed through our relationship. We talked in February of 2021 when she’d been teaching yoga online for almost a year. We talked in April, when I was on her podcast and both of us were sitting in makeshift offices - me in my parents' basement, and Kacee somewhere warm. We talked shortly after she gave birth to her daughter this spring and again just recently to record this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

Kacee Must is the kind of person who shares openly about the good, the bad, and how she sees the world. And it’s that kind of open sharing that led to me feeling like I understand who Kacee is as a person even though the two of us have only talked on Zoom a total of four times.

Like, I don't know how tall she is, but I would consider her a friend, if you get what I’m saying.

That’s because one of the ways to fast-track human connection is to share something you’ve been through and to listen intently to the things being shared by the person you’re speaking to. For Kacee, every time she speaks about her business and why it came to be, she has to open up about one of the worst things that happened to her family - and often that leads to a “I’ve been through that too” moment.

Because the loss of her sister Miya to suicide was the impetus to creating Citizen Yoga. And today, she exists to create community and connection for people to prevent anyone else from living that.

That’s because loneliness has been found to be linked to an increased risk of suicide and self harm, studies that I’ve linked to in the show notes have shown. And, conversely, researchers from Brown and George Mason University found that social support is associated with decreased likelihood of a suicide.

Kacee and her team live that mission - most businesses start with what they do online, but Citizen starts with why. And that kind of commitment has led to serious community support. Each year, they pack The University of Michigan’s Big House - what the college football stadium is known as - with a thousand people who are there to talk about and give money to suicide prevention.

And on today's episode, you'll hear that Kacee is currently working on solving another crisis of community she saw in her own life - she felt a disconnect and loneliness as she went through postpartum recovery. She envisions a place where birthing parents can heal, connect and learn from each other. Honestly, the way she described her project she’s creating with two other co-founders, makes me - someone very much riding the fence about parenthood - a little less hesitant.

That’s the kind of effect Kacee wants to have on the world - she exists to make hard things less so and bring into the light the moments of our lives that were often relegated to the shadows.

Resources: * Want to try Citizen Yoga for yourself? Get 1 month free of the on-demand platform with promo code "asweatlife" and 5 classes for $25 in-studio at the Bloomfield, Mi, Detroit, MI, Royal Oak, MI or live online with the same code. * Learn more about Citizen Yoga * Follow Citizen Yoga on Instagram * Follow Kacee Must on Instagram * We mention Zingerman's and the book on Servant Leadership by ZIngerman's * Kacee talks about using FitGrid for streaming classes * The link betweenn lonliness and suicide (Research conducted at the Institute of Health and Wellbeing, University of Glasgow, United Kingdom) * Social support as a protective factor in suicide prevention (Researchers from Brown University and George Mason University) * You also hear from Citizen Yoga Community member Samantha Foon

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Free MVMT Shop is a concept Ashley Rockwood conceived after retiring from dancing professionally - she wanted to create a space for herself in fitness that she didn’t see. She got a really good deal in a former dry cleaning location and viola, her first pop-up featuring dance, cardio, yoga, and sculpt had popped.

You’ll hear her speak to it, but since 2018, Free Mvmt Shop has lived in 6 different homes across Chicago. And through all of that Ashley achieved most of her goals that she shared on episode 85 of the podcast (we're close to 300 now) and came out of the pandemic more profitable than before.

For her, like many others, the pandemic was a time to streamline and get in touch with what resonates with your community. And Free Mvmt Shop’s community was looking for JOY.

That’s because the way Ashley and her crew teach is intuitively tied to happiness. A smile will stay on your face as you take a class virtually or IRL. I can attest to that as an untrained dancer - I used to say “not a dancer,” but everyone with a body is a dancer.

The first time I took a class at Free Mvmt Shop, I was intimidated and worried that I would get the movements wrong, or look like an idiot. I did get the movements wrong, and who knows what I looked like, but I had an incredible time.

Ashley also gets real about how the pandemic and doing everything digitally eventually took a toll on her mental health. I think we all can resonate with that feeling.

Resources: * The first time Ashley was on the podcast * Learn more about Free Mvmt Shop * Learn more about BASH Kid's club * Follow Free Mvmt Shop on Instagram * Follow Ashley on Instagram * Watch Ashley dance with Beyonce * The Joy Workout From The New York Times * Follow the ambassador your hear from in the episode, Anchisa Pipatpinyopong, on Instagram * And, for your entertainment, here's me doing Ballet for Runners with Ashley * And listening to this week’s episode featuring Ashley Rockwood gets you a totally free class at Free Mvmt Shop. Use code FREESWEAT for a free class at freemvmtshop.com. * The book I referenced, Play * The running team with great apparel that Ashley referenced, Tin Man Elite

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The indoor rowing machine - or erg - has been in use since the fourth century when an Athenian Admiral created a rudimentary version to train his army. And since, innovators from Concept2 helped to commercialize the indoor rowing machine and CrossFit got millions of people across the world onto the erg in their intense workouts.

And this week on the podcast, I spoke with two innovators who helped take rowing from the corner of the gym floor to the center of a workout.

Debra Strougo and Eric Von Frohlich, are the husband and wife team who created Row House in 2014. Their mission was to bring the sport of rowing to the masses and make it accessible. They saw the sport as accessible to all entry points into fitness, whether you’re just starting out on a fitness journey or whether you’re an olympic rower looking for somewhere to practice.

And to hear them tell it, they crafted their own education to learn the ins and outs of studio fitness after writing down what would become the plan to build Row House on a napkin. They dug into studio management and operations in a way that they hadn’t learned when they met working at Equinox in New York City.

And this week on the podcast, they take us through that whole journey of ideating, building the brand in New York City, and inevitably selling their business to Xponential Fitness - the franchising brand that also owns Pure Barre, Rumble, Cycle Bar, AKT, Stretch Lab, Stride, Yoga six and Club Pilates.

And, just for listening, you can get a free first class at your nearest Row House, simply download the Row House app and click try a class. Or visit this link.

Resources:

• Take your First class at Row House for free
• Read more about the Acquisition in 2018
• Invention of the Erg (rowing machine)
• Learn more about Concept2

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This week I interviewed Todd Wadler, CEO of Box Union and Title Boxing Club, and Felicia Alexander CRO of Box Union and Title Boxing Club, and it was clear that their partnership plays on both of their strengths. This pair is bold and thoughtful, which you’ll hear throughout the episode.

And if you're wondering how you missed that Box Union, which had three locations before the pandemic, acquired Title Boxing Club, you'll hear all about it in the episode. Luckily, or because Todd had the foresight that Box Union needed to raise as much money as possible, Box Union was extremely well capitalized before the pandemic.

So, when opportunity came knocking, they were ready to acquire it. And overnight, they were the largest boxing brand in the United States. More on that from Club Industry here.

There’s a saying in boxing that the punch you don’t see coming is the one that knocks you out - I think we can safely say no one saw that gigantic move coming.

They also give incredible guidance for leading a team that I took notes on during our interview, because I never want to forget it. So, if you hear a little clickity clack when they’re explaining their playbook on culture that’s why. You’ll hear more on this later, but be ready to open the notes app on your phone to write down "Freedom within a framework," having a "Growth mindset" and the idea of "we not me."

We also spend some time talking about an organization that is close to my family's heart: Rock Steady Boxing, a boxing program that was created to provide a uniquely effective form of physical exercise to people who are living with Parkinson’s Disease. My father-in-law was diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease in the past few years, and he found his way to Rock Steady Boxing, which helps him in innumerable ways.

One tangible way Rock Steady Boxing helps folks with Parkinson's, according to The New York Times is this: “Boxing’s varied and high-intensity workouts offer a blend of strength and cardiovascular conditioning that improves agility, coordination and balance, and which may be especially beneficial for people with neurological disorders such as Parkinson’s disease.”

Felicia recently joined the board at Rock Steady Boxing and is helping to bring the organization to even more locations.

Resources:

• Box Union
• Box Union on Instagram
• Title Boxing Club
• Title Boxing Club on Instagram
• More on Box Union's acquisition of Title Boxing Club
• Rock Steady Boxing
• The New York Times, For Some Parkinson’s Patients, Boxing Can Be Therapy
• And because we LOVE giving listeners a little something special, you can get a totally free month of membership to Title Boxing Club OnDemand. Use code aSweatLife to get 30 days for free, after that, the membership rate goes up to $19.99 monthly.

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New York City has the same thing going for fitness that it has for every other industry: if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere. I mean, granted, something that’s on the fringes of woo-woo and cult-fitness may not do great in Fargo. But for the most part, if New Yorkers will pack a class, it has a certain mile-a-minute effectiveness and cool factor that the rest of the country can get on board with.

Fhitting Room stood out for a few reasons that you’ll hear come out on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals featuring its founder Kari Saitowitz.

I was lucky enough to take class with Eric - Fhitting Room’s Head Coach - in 2017. I reset my account password so I could confirm that fact for sure. And when I took my first class, Fhitting room used to have two coaches in every single class. It was like a workout and a show - Eric and Jason (his co-teacher) - bantered the entire class. I remember feeling expertly coached and entertained. Here's a photo for evidence.

I can still picture that flatiron studio and I haven’t been there in five years. Kettlebells, assault bikes, TRXs, Ski ergs - honestly anything you can think of to spike your heart rate and get you stronger with heavy reps. And you’ll hear Kari talk about this in the episode, but I also felt incredibly safe moving through that room. When space is limited as it often is on the island of Manhattan, you have to make every inch count.

Twist! Fhitting Room coaches LOVE kettlebells - the gym is sort of built around making that little heavy friend accessible. When you’re swinging a ballistic object around like a kettlebell, packing people in like sardines can compromise that safety.

Fhitting Room makes sure every piece of equipment has a home and every class participant does too. When I walked in, I was given a number and that number corresponded to a spot on the ceiling. I stood under my number like a good little Fhitter.

Kari also digs into the nitty gritty of her passions around this concept - she learned to love Kettle bells with a personal trainer and didn’t let go of it. She knew she needed to make it easier for time-crunched people like her to pack more efficient workouts into their days.

And she built it, taking her love of branding and diving in with a team. Fhitting Room caught the attention of New York City’s fitness enthusiasts and elites - getting coverage in Vogue, Vanity Fair, Well and Good, and was included in my favorite piece that covered boutique fitness in 2017. The Wall Street Journal included Fhitting Room in its round up of “Fitness Studios Too Tough for Mere Mortals.”

For the record, that Wall Street Journal piece defined a burpee for the reader as “dropping to the floor in a squat/push-up move called a burpee.”

But I bring that up to set the tone for a thriving studio that very much needed to adapt and evolve quickly as soon as COVID-19 hit New York City. Kari recalls her studio’s quick action in creating a plan, “that could sustain the business even if COVID lasted a year.” Her foresight likely saved the business as they never did a single class for free - allowing them to keep trainers employed and their community working out together.

Pivoting quickly also earned FHitting Room even more press as Kari appeared on New York Time, The Today Show, Cheddar TV and so many others.

Kari shares how the business is coming out of COVID. She shares some of the cost efficient ways they’re growing and her vision to bring kettle bells to even more people. We can't wait for you to hear the episode.

Resources:* Get your free first class from Fhitting Room. Use the code SWEATLIFEFHIT at checkout to redeem your first class free for an in-studio or at-home! * Follow @FhittingRoom on Instagram * Fhitting Room in The Wall Street Journal * Fhitting Room in Vanity Fair * Fhitting Room in Vogue * Fhitting Room in Well + Good * Fhitting Room in The New York Times * Fhitting Room on The Today Show * Fhitting Room on Cheddar News * You'll also hear from aSweatLife ambassador Nimbe Juarez, follow her on Instagram

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Ask anyone who’s been on a Versa Climber what they think of the machine and the first reaction will be a look that you’ll recognize quickly as a combo of fear and respect. It’s a machine that earns the title of love/hate. You might love how much you can get done so quickly, but you might hate how much you have to do so quickly. You know what I’m saying.

Today, on #WeGotGoals, we’ll be spending a lot of time talking about the Versa Climber, a machine that’s featured prominently at the center of Rise Nation’s studios' 30-minute classes.

Jason Walsh, the founder of Rise Nation, brought the Versa Climber to his clients after seeing them get injured on more traditional cardio equipment. The Versa Climber had been a fixture in weight rooms, but it hadn’t yet hit the celebrity-trainer and everyday-athlete circuits. Seeing success in his one-on-one sessions with celebrity clients, Jason brought it to a room full of people - enter Rise Nation Los Angeles. And now Rise Nation - with locations in New York City, Cleveland, Chicago, Los Angeles, and Dallas - counts itself as one of Mark Cuban’s investments.

But before there was a Rise Nation, someone had to create the Versa Climber. Before developing the Versa Climber, Dick Charnitski, patented the technology to track your heart rate in a wrist watch. Investors were like, “Nah. Pass. We don’t think anyone will care.” Rejected, but not deterred, Charnitski went back to the garage to create something else.

Enter the Versa Climber.

That brings us about up to speed as we meet Meg Flynn, who has been a part of the Rise Nation family since it expanded from its first studio to Cleveland. Meg, whether by luck or cosmic force, lived above that Rise Nation studio as she pursued a career as an orthopedic surgeon. Yes, DOCTOR Meg operates the Chicago Rise Nation studio as well as practicing as an orthopedic surgeon.

Dr. Meg, Like Jason Walsh, Like Dick Charnitski, is never satisfied with the status quo. So you’ll hear from her what it was like to find this machine, this method, and this community. And she’ll also explain why it was so important for her to bring Rise Nation to Chicago.

She shares the effort it took to open the studio through the pandemic and how this method taps into the athlete in her.

Resources:

• Learn more about Rise Nation
• Follow Rise Nation and Rise Nation Chicago on Instagram
• Follow Meg Flynn on Instagram
• Meet the founder of the Versa Climber
• Meet the founder of Rise Nation, Jason Walsh
• Learn more about Mark Cuban Companies
• Get a free first class at Rise Nation. Use code ‘freeclass’. to get a free first class at rise-nation.com.

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We could talk all day about the pressure of being discovered as a teenage model like Erin Heatherton, co-founder of Chicago-based studio Resistance Chicago, was. She was scouted on the street at 17 and would go on to walk in high fashion shows as well as Victoria's Secret Fashion shows. The pressure comes from being expected to stay that way - a teenage girl - for your foreseeable future.

Erin recently wrote about it, and I’ll quote her instead.

“At the peak of my career, there was constant pressure to stay very thin. Even early on, maintaining industry standards was a full time job, but it was possible for my body type at the time. I took my fitness seriously and was motivated by the validation I received … As I got older, I continued to work hard, but the “fit” version of my body looked different. I built my career and my self image on positive feedback that came naturally when I was younger and the foundation crumbled when that feedback turned negative. Shoots and agency meetings that were once fun and rewarding felt depleting and incredibly taxing on my self esteem. I was training twice a day and religiously monitoring the quality of my diet, but my body would simply not return to its 18-year-old shape.”

We gloss over this on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, but before leaving New York City and moving back to Chicago, Erin started to hate fitness. It had become a thing she had to do to whip her body into the shape that was being demanded of her. It was not a thing she enjoyed anymore. So she spent a year not working out, not smoking and getting back in touch with herself.

So when she went to her first Lagree class, it was - as she describes it - humbling. I would say that a humbling experience can knock you off your path, but for her, it was the beginning of a couple of special things: a new relationship with fitness that was healthier and a new relationship with her person. In the middle of her journey to rediscover fitness in a more joyful way, Erin also found Karol Kocemba, who would become her co-founder at Resistance and her fiancé.

They dated, they Lagree’d, and he fell for the fitness modality too and started nudging her to making this passion a business.

I've taken a couple of classes at resistance and the environment is comfortable, small and attentive. The focus is on form and Erin is a born instructor. On the episode, you'll hear her describe the nerves she felt before teaching, but I think she does all of the things that are very important for a good class. She makes you do hard things with a smile. She praises loudly, but corrects quietly. She greets new students at the door instead of waiting for them to wander in.

She tells me on the episode that feels empowered now by serving people and making them feel good about their bodies and the strength they feel. Contrast that with making herself miserable to maintain an impossible standard that’s sold as “beauty.”

I’m excited for you to hear the story of Erin and Karol's studio and of finding each other.

Resources:* Learn more about Resistance Chicago * Follow Resistance on Instagram * Read more on Resistance's blog * Get a discount on classes at Resistance Chicago. Select "Intro 3-Pack $59" here and enter the Promo code "asweatlife" to get 50% off. * You'll also her from Jasmine Ruschmann on the episode who tried class at Resistance too.

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Conik Runyon's education in culture started as a kid, going to the Anytime Fitness conferences with his dad and seeing people who loved that brand so much that they tattooed the logo on their bodies.

And today, he's the owner of Basecamp Fitness Chicago, a newer entrant into the fitness scene. And I don’t even really want to mention his dad except to say this: Conik was born into a world of fitness culture as the son of Chuck Runyon, Co-founder of Anytime fitness and CEO of Self-Esteem Brands (which owns and operates franchise brands like Anytime Fitness, The Bar method, Waxing the City and Basecamp Fitness). Conik graduated from college in 2021 and lobbied to open the first Basecamp fitness location in Chicago.

The education in culture under his dad served him as he set off to learn on his own and operate his own business. To read between the lines, Conik appreciates what he’s learned, but has a fire in his belly to create something for himself.

You’ll hear him share how he builds culture among the members at the newest Basecamp Fitness in Chicago. And honestly, it’s like a textbook in community building that flows out of him, but at the heart of his methodology is making members the center of the universe at Basecamp, celebrating them and never letting them feel alone in class.

For example, I went to a class last week - I'm kind of there a lot - and in my class, there was a woman who was new to class on the bike next to me.

The manager, who was also taking class, singled me out and said, don’t let her get lost. And then said, “Ellen, stick with Jeana.” I felt responsible for her - I really did - so I checked in with her throughout class to make sure she was ok.

And that might feel like a small thing, but it’s actually a really, really big thing if you’re new to class. The management team made sure that someone checked in on her, learned her name, and had her back while she experienced something new.

And all of that was happening while Conik wasn’t even there - he talks about how he leads in a way that empowers his time to try new things, solve problems on their own and be accountable for the members in the space.

For listening, you’ll also have access to a special offer, which is good for one free week at all Basecamp locations nationwide. Check our show notes for the link and for more information on where you can find basecamp.

Resources:* Get a free week at Basecamp Fitness (any location) here. * Learn more about Basecamp Fitness * Follow Basecamp Fitness on Instagram * Follow Basecamp Fitness Chicago on Instagram * Follow Conik on Instagram * On this episode, you’ll also hear from Brooke Daniels, an aSweatLife ambassador who is loving Basecamp right now.

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[This episode is supported by Athletic Greens. You can get an AG1 subscription and a free gift: a FREE 1 year supply of immune-supporting Vitamin D and 5 free travel packs with your first purchase at athleticgreens.com/asweatlife.]

I’ve come to know Bonnie Micheli and Tracy Roemer, co-founders of Shred415, as a package deal. I can't actually remember seeing one without the other. I've also learned to look at them as eager collaborators and mentors, but I'm willing to bet a lot of people in fitness do.

On this episode you’ll hear a lot about the workout at Shred415, and the business of running a franchise. But what’s more inferred is the most important part about this pair - their relationship. It’s clear that their bond keeps them connected as leaders, allowing them someone to celebrate with when things are good, and someone to lean on when things aren’t going as planned. Read: a global pandemic.

This duo explain their origin story on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, but more than that, you’ll hear them get real about what it takes to open a studio and scale it. You’ll hear about the long days, and the hard parts - like those first few months when they were hoping they were onto something at Shred415, but didn't have the sign-ups to prove it yet. You’ll also hear about the good times, like seeing their big dreams come to life, and taking their concept from corporate-only to franchising.

They’re masters of bootstrapping, which they talk about, going from one studio to a second when they literally could not support another human in class. In the early days, when there was no room for a marketing budget, they figured it out, leveraged the power of Facebook before we all met and learned to loathe the algorithm and, even more importantly, they learned to leverage the power of moms who loved the kids room and were building friendships in the walls of Shred415.

They’ve also created, by the way, a workout people love that gets them moving on treadmills and lifting weights on benches. As a workout, it has introduced so many people to strength training who maybe wouldn’t have lifted heavy weights otherwise.

You’ll hear on the episode from aSweatLife ambassador Cathy Mekondo who shares why she’s taken more than 100 Shred415 classes.

And before recording this episode, I looked back through the archives for this piece of history on aSweatLife, but I took my very first Shred415 class early in the days of aSweatLife, September 11, 2012, to be exact. And I wrote about it at-length, I’m pretty sure I described every single movement we did in that class.

Here are a few of my favorite takeaways:

• “Maybe it was me, but the last set on the benches had me counting the minutes until the end as the instructor threw in burpees.” I can read my sneer through the lines, listener. I had just met burpees before I took shred, and I did not like them.
• “The instructor had to work as hard as the class to keep it going, keeping time and calling out the changing exercises. He also had to adjust the TRX straps between sets. It didn’t look easy, but he did a great job.” And that’s true - instructors in SHRED415 classes have to do a lot of work to manage their classes, especially when they’re full.

Remember, you can get 2 free SHRED415 classes to use in a week in Chicagoland, Indianapolis and St Louis. Just email info@shred415.com to redeem.

Resources: * Find a Shred415 near you * Follow Shred415 on Instagram * aSweatLife: The first time I took SHRED415 * EY Entrepreneur of the Year 2015 * Shred415's announcement of franchising

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We're using our 7th season of our podcast to celebrate fitness - its creators, innovators and everything in between. We made sure to include goodies from the studios and brand we’re chatting with for you, so make sure to listen, share with a friend and try something new.

And a HUGE thanks to Athletic Greens for its support for this episode. You can get an AG1 subscription and a free gift: a FREE 1 year supply of immune-supporting Vitamin D and 5 free travel packs with your first purchase at athleticgreens.com/asweatlife.

On now, here's why we love POMSQUAD Fitness.

Cheerleading wasn’t really a part of my life growing up - I mean it was and it wasn’t. In Minnesota, I don’t remember there being an insane cheer competition culture with all of the things that come with that.

And maybe I don’t remember because I’ve blocked it out. I’ve never uttered this aloud, but I actually really wanted to be a cheerleader. Where I grew up in Anoka, Minnesota, there was a specific set of cheerleaders who I considered to be elite. The Hockey Cheerleaders. They’d sit in the student section, leading the crowd in PTA-approved cheers. But they really shined between the second and third period, when they’d lace up their figure skates and do a little ice performance.

And on home game days, they wore their uniforms to school. That maroon and white uniform - swoon. I wanted it so badly, but I was terrified of the tryout process. So I never put myself out there. I know now that the experience I just described is uniquely Minnesotan, but the experience of not trying something because you're worried you'll be left out is not.

So when Matthew Hollis, cofounder of POMSQUAD Fitness explained that he received a grant to study cheerleading for a year, he came at it from a dance and performance background. And as he tells it, he spent his adolescence as a gay teenager wishing he didn't have to play a sport with a ball and that he could hang out with the cheerleaders instead. I didn't try out for cheer because I didn't want to be rejected and Matthew didn't try because he didn't feel like he could without being rejected.

So, in adulthood, Matthew studied cheer and his knowledge and appreciation for the sport only grew. That earned him a spot in a dance showcase where he shared his newfound craft. That’s when what would become POMSQUAD Fitness caught his cofounder Jena Ertel's eye. She offered to run all of the non-choreography pieces of the business.

If you’ve ever had the opportunity to experience this duo together, they are electric. They teach with a thread of comedy and a sense of authenticity that makes it clear that they’re EXACTLY 100 percent themselves.

POMSQUAD Fitness, as they’ve created it, is a world that gives you, a functioning adult the opportunity to take all of the fun parts of cheer - like dancing, having fun, and yelling - and reject any of the pieces that may have left you out in the past, like a tryout, what other people will think, and uniforms in limited sizes. And their teaching style gives you the permission to be exactly 100 percent yourself too.

On this week’s episode, you’ll hear from Matthew and Jena about how they’re perfecting the model of scaling themselves to train cheer captains across the world. You’ll hear the genesis of their captain names - and that piece might surprise you.

I can't wait for you to hear where they plan to take the brand next.

Resources:* Learn more about POMSQUAD Fitness where to find classes online and near you * Follow @POMSQUADFitness on Instagram * Learn more about the self-paced training and get 15% off with code ASL15 * Chicago: Join POMSQUAD Fitness IRL August 14, 2022 at 10:30 am - listeners and readers get $5 off with code ASL5

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This episode of #WeGotGoals marks the start of our seventh season of the podcast. Because we're celebrating the 10th anniversary of aSweatLife, we made sure to include goodies from the studios we're chatting with for you, so make sure to listen, share with a friend and try something new.

And also, make sure you don't miss a single episode by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts including Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

When I started aSweatLife, I felt like I was constantly doing research. I would walk down the streets of Chicago with my head on a swivel, exploring new studios opening their first location or expanding to the market. If you remember, 5 to 10 years ago, it was an insane time for studio fitness. New concepts, new hybrids, and star instructors were building brands with no end in sight.

I remember walking down Erie street in Chicago’s River North neighborhood in 2015, and seeing this beautiful, old brick building wrapped in billboards that told us Studio Three was “coming soon.” After an extensive rehab of the building and buildout, it opened with three different fitness offerings in its walls. The interval studio had strength, rowers, and treadmills for all sorts of heart-racing workouts. The yoga studio was light, airy and heated. And the cycle studio was an arena of bikes, so everyone had the best seat in the house.

This week on the podcast, we’re speaking to David Blitz, co-founder and CEO of Studio Three. You’ll hear from David about what led him to become obsessed with studio fitness and inevitably to open the first location.

And that first location is where I discovered Studio Three, taking classes as a general participant and hosting events with aSweatLife. I have memories of incredible, restorative yoga, intervals on a rower with some of my favorite instructors and workouts on the bike - both back when Studio Three was a Peloton production studio and after it broke away and created its own unique technology.

For aSweatLife, Studio Three was a dream location for events. It was the perfect place to do our favorite kind of event: the crawl - or three 30-minute versions of classes, generally strength, cardio and yoga. We specifically loved that we didn’t have to worry about concocting a rain plan there.

And this balance that we sought for a crawl was the same balance David and team wanted to create for athletes like you and me (yes, we’re all athletes) to cross train for whatever goals we’re chasing.

From that first location in Chicago’s River North, Studio Three expanded to Lincoln Park, Fulton Market and has locations planned for Austin, Texas and Miami, Florida.

And, you’ll hear us speak to the way Studio Three pivoted during the ongoing global pandemic to keep its staff employed and its community moving. You’ll also hear about the launch of the Studio Three app (on both iOS and Android) as well as some exciting new features coming soon.

Resources:

Listen to the episode to get access to the studio's offer!

Find Studio Three online and check when its coming to you

Follow Studio Three on Instagram on TikTok

Follow David Blitz on Instagram

Follow Priya Shah on Instagram

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[Trigger warning: in this episode, we mention pregnancy loss]

So, every year on my birthday, I get a reading from a psychic, she’s the High Priestess of Brooklyn. She does my tarot cards, my astrology, and tells me an outlook for the year - it’s a whole thing.

Two years ago, she gave me a timeline of when a baby could come into my life. It was the middle of a pandemic, I had just gone through an insane medical thing - so all signs should have pointed to, “no, thank you” for me.

However, my first reaction was, “what else are we doing?” So I went to an OBGyni, took out my IUD and bought some pre-natal vitamins.

Meanwhile, I neglected to tell my husband the plan from the cosmos and the doctor until I came home with those gigantic pills. We, of course, had a discussion, during which we realized that our timing was not aligned with the timing of the stars.

But I come back to those pre-natal vitamins, time and time again. Sitting in a giant container in my cupboard. Doctors tell us to take them before trying to conceive, and while pregnant, but why and which vitamins really matter?

Then a few months ago, I met the co-founders of WeNatal, Ronit Menashe and Vida Delrahim. They met while working at Nike and became fast friends. They bonded over the shared experience of pregnancy loss and Ronit did what a nutrition-obsessed human does. She started looking at studies and consulting with experts like Dr. Mark Hyman to try to figure out how to optimize her chances of having a successful pregnancy.

And she came to find that the sperm of it all is often left out of the nutrition equation for people trying to conceive. Often, the burden of fertility and infertility is put on the human giving birth, but that’s really only one piece.

So here’s the lunacy: sperm regenerates around every 70-ish days, but it could as quickly as every 40 days according to new studies. That means prenatal vitamins for men can have a real impact on the quality of sperm, and quickly.

So together, the pair created a prenatal vitamin that’s meant to address this, creating vitamins for both men and women who are trying to conceive that address the very unique needs of each side of the coin.

And I want to acknowledge that all sorts of families are bringing life into the world, with two mommies, two daddies, or just one loving parent. And WeNatal serves those needs too - now we just need to get men’s prenatal vitamins into sperm banks …

It's also important to note that as a human or a couple is trying to conceive they can do absolutely everything "right" and still need help with fertility. That's more than OK.

Ronit, Vida and I discuss a lot of pregnancy nutrition questions I have as well as what it took to formulate these vitamins. I’m excited for you to hear this interview, no matter if you never want kids, are riding a fence, or are trying to conceive right now.

Resources:

• Learn more about WeNatal and learn more about the research they'd done
• Follow @We_Natal on Instagram
• Stats and facts on sperm regeneration here.
• Woman is born with all of the eggs she’ll ever have
• Folate Study: You'll hear the pair discuss folate on the episode. Here's more about why: In a 2018 study - Thirty couples with fertility problems lasting for at least 4 years were included in this program. At least one of the partners was a carrier of the MTHFR genetic mutation which we know 40-50% of people have. The couples were given 600 micrograms of folate per day for 3 months, Thirteen of the couples were able to conceive.
• Extensive research has been conducted to study the effect of antioxidant therapy in improving male fertility. .
• Taking the right amount of nutrients for women AND men before pregnancy assists in the growth, development, and long-term health of future children. Antioxidants may increase male fertility four-fold and can increase the chance of a successful pregnancy by up to five times.
• Men's health tied to pregnancy loss
• Sperm counts have dropped 60% since 1973 and could reach zero by 2045.
• New research suggests that sperm plays a greater role in pregnancy success and healthy offspring than we ever realized. Scientists observed sperm "communicating" with the female immune system with triggered changes in gene expression of the female's immune signaling molecules. This supported acceptance of the new embryo and reduced risk of pregnancy loss.

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I remember the praise Heidi Klum received when she walked the runway a mere 5 weeks after giving birth to her third child. As much as the internet could go crazy in 2009, it did, praising her for being back to work and having her pre-baby body back for the Victoria Secret Fashion show that fall.

There’s this phrase “bounce back” that has been a part of the postpartum vernacular for as long as I can remember. It’s a standard that women have long held themselves (and each other) to - that your body should be exactly what it was before you cooked a human inside of it.

In the past few years, we’ve seen a rejection of the bounce-back culture - for so many reasons including allowing your body to heal. Because mere mortals are comparing themselves to the Heidi Klums or the Instagram highlights of the world, we are destined to neglect the actual care our bodies need after a major change like pregnancy.

We’re continuing our deep dive into the decision to grow your family. This week, we spoke with two different doctors of physical therapy who are both expecting at the time of recording.

For this episode, I wanted to focus on two key elements of recovery - recovery to return to athletic pursuits and recovery of the muscles that make up your pelvic floor. To do that I tapped two experts that I trust with these big questions.

Alexis Griffin is a doctor of Physical Therapy and managing partner at the Kollective, in Austin, TX. She and I discussed the changes that your body experiences during pregnancy, how they impact performance, and getting back to your training objectives after baby.

Specializing in the pelvic floor, Erin Conroy is a doctor of physical therapy and the owner of West Town Physical Therapy in Chicago. Erin is an Orthopedic Clinical Specialist (OCS) and Pelvic Floor physical therapist. She and I talk about why the pelvic floor matters. Before, during and after pregnancy.

Whether you’re currently expecting, if you’re postpartum or if you’re never expecting to grow your family, I want you to walk away from these conversations with compassion for yourself and others who have been through childbirth.

I want us to create more realistic goals for the next generation of humans, like allowing for healing and returning to the gym in a way that allows you to be pain-free for life.

Resources: * Follow Alexis Griffen, DPT on Instagram and find her at The Kollective in Austin, TX * Follow Erin Conroy, DPT on Instagram and find her at West Town Physical Therapy * Learn more about the pelvic floor * Learn more about the musculoskeletal changes your body goes through during pregnancy here * More on postpartum recovery from What to Expect

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Anne Helen Peterson, the writer responsible for the popular substack “culture study” is responsible for a lot of writing that makes you think in a sneaky way, like her celebrity profiles that serve as cultural mirrors. She wrote a piece about Armie Hammer that asks why Hollywood gave this guy so many chances that I think about a lot. (I’ve linked to that in the show notes), She’s written about work culture and its expansion into the rest of our lives on her substack and in the book she co-authored with Charlie Warzel titled “Out of Office.”

She’s also covered the culture of domestic labor, particularly how it impacts women today as they care for their children and their aging parents. In a piece titled, “forced to care” (which is a reference to a book by Evelyn Nakano Glennm by the same name) Anne stated the thing that I’ve been thinking about in not so many words as I considered having a family in this pandemic-y world.

“What we have, then, is a caregiving paradigm — not just for kids, but for elders and other adults — that relies heavily on proximity to family and presumed willingness. For those without those things, there are two options: 1) pay a lot of money for help, or 2) figure it out your damn self.”

And that mental exercise is something that a lot of current and prospective parents go through as they’re creating a plan to care for the human lives they’re responsible for.

We’re in the middle of a deep dive on deciding to grow your family or not. And in this episode, we’re covering the mental side of parenting, from making the decision (and yes that counts deciding NOT to grow your family), to communicating with a partner in parenting if you have one, to setting boundaries.

And more and more American humans are choosing not to add to their families as the world feels more uncertain and expensive. Birthrates were already dropping before 2020 they’d been falling for 6 straight years, but 9 months into the pandemic in December of 2020, the New York Times reported births had declined by about 8 percent - the steepest drop yet.

The hard truth of the pandemic is the erasure of systems that allowed caretakers to also be in the workforce. ​​For the sake of stats, we’re going to talk about female caretakers taking on an increased burden, but I know that plenty of different folks who are the primary caretaker have been rocked by these same factors.

Before the pandemic - in January of 2020 - women achieved a very important milestone - they made up more than half of the workforce. Cut to today, 56 percent of American women are working for pay, the lowest level since 1986. Often to take on childcare or eldercare without any safe or affordable options, women left their jobs to do that work.

And I haven’t even started on the lack of paid maternity leave and the complete dearth of options for people like me who are entrepreneurs. Couple that with the fact that we’re still hearing stories about parents going back to work immediately, or taking a zoom from labor and delivery and we are being sent a very convoluted message - that mom’s are important, but we won’t do anything to make their lives or recovery easier. That moms are important, but not more important than the workforce.

Here’s the thing, I could and can talk all day about the systemic problems around growing a family, but you walk by me with a baby and forget it. I love those squishy little humans. I want to have a conversation with them about why they think grass grows, read them a story and help name their stupid stuffed animals.

That’s because I know that I would love a child if my husband and I choose to have one. I tear up at the thought of it. We’re genetically programmed to bond with these tiny humans. Generally, that bond brings a new purpose to the lives of their parents. But purpose from that bond does not negate the stress we just talked about. A study from Princeton University and Stony Brook University found that parents and non-parents have similar levels of life satisfaction, but parents experienced both more daily joy and more daily stress than non-parents.

It’s a confusing existence.

But for those listening who have always wanted a family, the changing work world and evolving systems of care might not change anything for you except for the conversations you’re having with your loved ones. The thing I want this episode to do for YOU, no matter who you are is to give you tools to advocate for your mental health and language to ask for help if you experience very normal, very treatable things like PPD and PPA.

And Postpartum Depression, NPR reports, impacts an estimated 1 in 7 pregnant women and new mothers, but less than 20% get treated.

That’s why we spoke to Tera Gurney for this week’s episode on the mental health impacts of the decision. Tera is a Licensed Clinical Social worker who focuses on working with parents and survivors of sexual violence and she comes at this topic from a practical, nonjudgemental place.

She and I talk about mental health in three distinct phases, before making the decision to grow your family. The time while you wait for baby after taking the plunge, and after the baby arrives. She shares tools for diving into decision making if you have a partner in parenting and tools for talking to your family if you’re feeling pressured.

And to quote our guest this week, “you are the best parent for your child” and a quote from me, that I say to my husband, “the best decision is the one you make.”

Resources:

• Find Tera Gurney online and book a workshop with her
• Subscribe to and support the Culture Study, a Discord by Anne Helen Petersen
• “Out Of Office” by Charlie Warzel and Anne Helen Petersen
• Ten Long Years of Trying to Make armie Hammer Happen, Anne Helen Petersen for Buzzfeed News
• The New York Times, More Kids? After the Last Two Years? No Thanks.
• The New York Times, The U.S. Birthrate Has Dropped Again. The Pandemic May Be Accelerating the Decline.
• The New York Times, Women in the workforce during COVID-19 interactive
• CNBC, Does Having Children Make you Happier
• The princeton/Stonybrook study on Parenting and life satisfaction
• Neuroscience News, Moms at Highest Risk for Postpartum Depression Identified
• NPR, 'A Lifeline' For Doctors Helps Them Treat Postpartum Depression

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[CW: There's discussion of the concepts of sex, birth control and abortion in this episode. If you're listening around smaller humans who haven't had the talk yet, prepare to do some explaining.]

So if you’ve been following along and listening to #WeGotGoals this season, we’ve been diving deep into topics we care about and want to learn more about. We’ve talked about the history of fitness, mental health, diet culture and sustainability.

This month, we were all set to talk about making the choice to grow your family or not.

My husband and I are in the midst of making that decision. We got married not really knowing the answer, so I had big plans to talk through things like choosing not to have children, fertility, loss, cost of caring for a family and more.

Cut to the recent revelation that the Supreme Court was close to overturning Roe v. Wade, which was the supreme court case that established a woman’s right to an abortion based on a constitutional right to privacy in 1973.

So suddenly the idea of focusing on making a reproductive choice felt like it required a better introduction. We regrouped for a couple of weeks, talked to a few experts and rearranged our interviews.

Now you’ll hear from experts on Fertility and Maternal nutrition, as well as experts in recovering postpartum.

But we’re starting with Dr. Sophia Yen. the CEO/Co-Founder of Pandia Health. She is Board Certified in Adolescent Medicine with more than 20 years of experience in medicine. She graduated from MIT, UCSF Medical School, and UC Berkeley with a MPH in Maternal Child Health. She serves as a Clinical Associate Professor at Stanford Medical School in the department of Pediatrics in the Division of Adolescent Medicine. She’s also founded three non-profit organizations and has given a TEDx talk on making periods optional.

She thinks a lot about birth control, prevention of STIs and access to education on those things.

Dr. Yen and I discussed the step that many women who have access take way before ever thinking about a family - birth control. We also discuss the impact of overturning Roe v. Wade on reproductive rights in general and more.

We also talk specifically through questions the community wanted answered about Roe V. Wade, IVF, about specific brands of birth control, about the impact of birth control on your ability to conceive (spoiler: your ability to conceive should returned to normal with all birth control types, the main difference is how long it takes to return to normal).

Resources: * Dr. Yen Created a video on YouTube about the topic of Roe v. Wade and how it impacts your access to emergency contraception. * Learn more about Pandia Health and code "Asweatlife" gets you $5 off telemedicine (we aren't making a commission, they're just being nice) * Follow Pandia health on TikTok, Instagram, Facebook and Twitter * Learn more about Plan C non profit that has all the info on medication abortion with legal/medical advice lines * Learn more about NNAF: National Network of Abortion funds and donate to 80+ abortion funds * Learn more about Condom Depot that Dr. Yen talked about * Learn more about PCOS (polycystic ovary syndrome) * Dr. Yen also believes that Periods should be optional for anyone with a uterus. Welcome to her TED talk (but, actually).

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Here’s a fun stat for you: In 2018, the North American sports market had a value of about 71.06 billion U.S. dollars. Sports have a huge influence on the way we spend our dollars, whether it’s to shell out for a ticket to the Super Bowl, or grabbing a certain candy bar because their Super Bowl ad made you laugh.

So… what if we harnessed that power of influence for good? That’s what we explore today with Zoe Morse, a defender for the Chicago Red Stars soccer team. Growing up in East Lansing, Michigan, Zoe lived, laughed, loved, and lake life-d her way through her childhood. But when she arrived in Charlottesville to attend University of Virginia, she realized just how much she’d taken her proximity to nature and fresh water for granted (especially after witnessing the Flint water crisis).

In college, Zoe balanced studies in environmental science with soccer practice, while also founding a group called Green Athletics that advocated for sustainable changes in the athletic department. Now, as a second year player in Chicago, she’s found creative ways to continue her passion for sustainability. For example, she was certified with the Chicago Conservation Corps through the Peggy Notebaert Nature Museum, empowering her to lead local sustainability projects. She’s also a member of EcoAthletes, a group of athletes and activists teaming up to mount a comeback against climate change.

And most recently, Zoe was named the official Sustainability Ambassador for the Chicago Red Stars, a brand new position that Zoe says shows the club’s commitment to sustainability issues. As the Sustainability Ambassador, Zoe will continue her advocacy work for the environment and making suggestions for ways the club can improve their sustainability efforts. Eventually, they hope that other women’s soccer clubs will have their own sustainability ambassadors, so they can work together to effect change on a broader scale. As a young league, the women’s professional soccer league has the freedom to establish sustainability-forward practices and partnerships, and we’re excited to see how they do it.

About Zoe Morse:Zoe Morse, originally from East Lansing, MI, was drafted by the Red Stars in the 2020 NWSL Draft. That year Morse made her NWSL debut June 27 against the Washington Spirit. She went on to appear in six matches in the Challenge Cup and three matches in the Fall Series. At the University of Virginia, Morse was an All-Region Second Team selection by United Soccer Coaches, named to the ACC Championship All-Tournament Team and the CoSIDA Academic All-District second team.

Resources:* Follow Zoe on Instagram and Twitter * Learn more about EcoAthletes * Zoe mentions looking up to Lu Barnes of the OL Reign - follow Lu here * Follow the Chicago Red Stars on Instagram to learn more about their sustainability efforts, and view their schedule (and buy tickets!) here (The game Zoe mentions at Soldier Field is on July 30 - buy tickets here) * At the end, I mention that I think there's research backing up group exercise and social bonding. I was right!

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I recently became the proud owner of a VERY cute little Bamboozle compost bin (which you can find on Goldune, the e-commerce site of previous podcast guest Azora Zoe). The only problem: no idea how to use it in a city.

Luckily, Liam Donnelly, CEO and founder of WasteNot Compost, came on to give me the breakdown on composting (pun slightly intended). This will blow your mind: Liam has been running his own composting business since he was 15 years old, when he started transporting the compost from a local coffee shop to his parents' backyard in Lincoln Square. Since then, he's built WasteNot compost into a zero-emissions business serving most of Chicagoland with an all-electric fleet.

In this episode, you'll hear Liam share his delightful and fascinating origin story. We also cover composting tips for beginners, what you can and cannot compost, and the most common misconceptions about composting that Liam runs into.

Listen to the episode on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you find podcasts. And if you want to join WasteNot, they're giving new residential sign-ups a $22 credit. Use code EARTHMONTH22 by 4/30/22 to redeem. (And learn more about their services here)

About Liam Donnelly:While working at a cafe on the north side of Chicago, Liam began WasteNot at the age of 15. Realizing there was a better use for compostables — and without a license — Liam biked around Chicago servicing members with a trailer. Devoted to operating a sustainable company sustainably, he worked to transform WasteNot’s humble beginnings into the largest all-electric fleet in Illinois. An alum of Loyola University Chicago’s School of Environmental Sustainability (SES), Liam loves all things sustainable and has over ten years’ experience in the waste industry.

Resources for this episode:* Ready to join WasteNot? They're giving new residential sign-ups a $22 credit. Use code EARTHMONTH22 by 4/30/22 to redeem. (And learn more about their services here) * Not sure what you can and can't composter? Here's a handy com-poster for you (see what they did there?). * While WasteNot provides you with a compost bucket, I'm also partial to these cute little Bamboozle pails. * Follow WasteNot on Instagram.

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Today we bring on Nicole Loher, a strategist, adjunct professor at NYU, and climate change advocate in New York. After accidentally becoming a competitive triathlete, Nicole now balances her passions for training and for climate change policy (with a little bit of fashion thrown in – yes, she contains multitudes). She talks us through Climate Policy 101 and what the Green New Deal actually means. Plus, she overviews the Bipartisan Infrastructure Deal that Biden recently signed.

We also talk about “climate anxiety,” the feeling of dread that’s induced by the thought of the future of the climate), and how that might affect women differently than men. (And food for thought: the search term “climate anxiety” hit its peak popularity in August of 2021, and it’s remained popular since). And similar to Azora Zoe’s perspective that “sustainability is a spectrum,” Nicole also explains why it’s a myth that you don’t have to be a perfect climate activist to be an effective climate activist.

One of the most fascinating themes running through our conversation was something surprisingly uplifting: climate change is not the fault nor the responsibility of any one individual. Moreover, Nicole identifies as a “climate optimist” who believes there’s time to turn this Spaceship Earth around.

“It’s not an individual’s job to solve the climate crisis,” she says in this episode. “This is a bigger issue that should fall on the shoulders of corporations in tandem with policy pushing those corporations.” She also points to the factoid that it only takes 3.5 percent of a population to move a movement along – which seems totally manageable.

About Nicole Loher:Nicole Loher is a triathlete and fitness enthusiast as well as a student at Columbia University and a professor at New York University and the Fashion Institute of Technology. Her work sits at the intersection of insights, strategy and emerging technology to help tell stories that advance complex climate communications goals. Her strategic work has received multiple awards (Shorties, Drum), has been recognized in the press (Forbes, Adweek), and is featured in the Smithsonian. She is currently finishing her Master's at Columbia University's Climate School with a focus on policy and communications and consulting for a variety of climate and solution focused organizations. In her down time, she’s an Adjunct Professor at NYU, where she’s led the creation and development of the school’s first social media course curriculum and social media certificate. She has also overseen the research and publishing of two white papers with a focus on the influence of social media on consumer behavior. She’s a Council on Foreign Relations member focused on advancing the conversation around climate change within corporations, she has her own column focused on discussing the implications of future climate policy, and she ghostwrites for a swath of technology executives on various topics within emerging climate tech.

Resources for this episode:* The Google Trends report for the phrase “climate anxiety” * From The New York Times: Climate Change Enters the Therapy Room * Find Nicole on Instagram and Twitter, where she shares her takes on climate policy * Nicole recommends Carbon Brief Daily as a great starting point for the most updated climate news * Heading to D.C.? Stop by the Smithsonian to see Nicole’s work in the Futures that Work exhibit (she contributed to the Hypergiant Eos BioReactor)

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I had a startling realization today: the tradition of Earth Month is actually not that much older than I am. According to the Smithsonian Magazine, Earth Month’s roots (pun intended) come from an environmental crisis. In 1969, a major oil spill along the Santa Barbara coastline led to roughly 3 million gallons of oil spreading across 35 miles. It’s hard to properly communicate the magnitude of this environmental disaster. But to those who saw it, they knew instantly it was a life-changing moment. In fact, in January 1970, The New York Times’ environment correspondent called it the “ecological ‘shot heard round the world.'”

In the spring of 1970, Gaylord Nelson, a politician from Wisconsin, came up with “Earth Day,” as it’d later be called, as a national day of learning. Strategically set in April, around spring break and finals, Earth Day relied heavily on students and youth to lead the movement (so yes, Greta Thunberg has predecessors).

Facing political pressure from the rise of environmental activism, President Richard Nixon founded the Environmental Protection Agency at the end of 1970. The Clean Water Act passed a couple of years later, and by the end of the decade, media coverage about environmental issues had quadrupled.

There’s obviously a lot more. But in the interest of time, I’ll stop my history lesson there in order to focus on today. Climate change is one of the major ongoing traumatic events facing our population. Global warming is leading to catastrophic storms. Deforestation is forcing animals and insects out of their natural habitats and leading to a loss of biodiversity. An overreliance on fossil fuels is increasing air pollution, which in turn increases our risk of respiratory diseases. It’s a lot, to say the least.

And to be honest, I feel a little daunted taking on this topic. Let’s make this clear, I’m far from an expert on environmental policies and I am not a model of sustainability. But that’s exactly why I’m so excited to welcome the guest you’ll hear from today - Azora Zoe Paknad, the founder of Goldune.

Goldune is a curated online marketplace that focuses on sustainable, eco-friendly brands that make sustainability less beige. One of their core tenets is that sustainability is a spectrum, and we can’t let the shame of wondering if we’re doing the right thing stop us from doing the best choice in the moment.

In this episode, you’ll hear Azora Zoe share how Goldune helps consumers make a better choice when shopping. She also reveals what standards they look for when vetting products for the site, and her perspective on “greenwashing” (don’t worry, we’ll define it if you don’t know what it is). We end with a fun little round-up of Azora Zoe’s favorite health and wellness adjacent products on Goldune. So, make sure you have their website pulled up so you’re ready to browse.

More about Azora Zoe PaknadAfter a multi-role tenure at Food52 working in all things home, kitchen and food, Azora Zoe founded Goldune in late 2020. Besides making sustainability less granola, Azora Zoe is a big fan of bread and gluten in all its forms, a collector of first and second edition Nancy Drew books, and a terrible but enthusiastic surfer.

Get busy subscribing!* Subscribe, rate, and review on Apple podcasts * Subscribe, rate, and review on Spotify

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[Content warning: The bulk of this episode talks about the concept of sexual assault. If you’re not ready to hear that, we get it. Next week, Kristen will be back with a less triggering episode.]

You’ve probably heard some version of these stats, but every 68 seconds, an American is sexually assaulted. And according to RAINN, 54 percent of those people are between the ages of 18-34. And depending on the source, 10-20 percent of men will experience sexual violence in their life.

So chances are, you or someone you love has been impacted by this issue. And for me, it's personal. I’m a survivor of sexual assault. For a while I just didn’t talk about it because talking about it hadn’t gone super well in the past.

I was 16 when it happened, so I didn’t want to go to therapy and I just wanted it to go away. But that’s not how trauma works. Brene Brown said, “Shame needs three things to grow exponentially in our lives: secrecy, silence, and judgment." And friends, did I have those things in droves.

But when I’d realize it was affecting me, I’d share with the wrong people or without the language I actually needed to express myself and their eyes would dart around. No one would know what to say, and I’d think to myself, “OK, noted, we don’t talk about rape.” So, eventually I just stopped talking about it, altogether.

But that’s the paradox of sexual violence. It’s something that feels like it belongs in the shadows of your past, but the longer you leave it there, the harder it is to deal with. Victims often face symptoms like PTSD, chronic pain and higher instances of substance abuse.

That’s why we were so happy to meet the young changemakers behind the platform Receptify. Receptify is working to solve the problem of sexual violence at college campuses, according to RAINN, Women ages 18-24 who are college students are 3 times more likely than women in general to experience sexual violence.

On today’s episode, you’ll hear from Ryan Manthy the CEO of receptify - and you might not hear it in his voice, but he’s a sophomore studying computer science at the Illinois Institute of Technology. And his entire team is made up of college students who experienced this problem first hand as survivors themselves of friends of a survivor. They’ve all navigated the system of resources and wanted to help create a better way.

We heard from the Receptify team at the #Sweatworking Summit's pitch competition, where the team took home the top prize.

Show notes:

• Want to email Ryan and his team? Do it here: ryan@receptify.io
• RAINN stats
• If you or anyone you love needs help navigating the aftermath of sexual violence, RAINN has resources for you

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[Content warning: on this week’s episode, we’re going to talk about mental illness and there will be brief mentions of other potentially triggering things like sexual violence and the end of life. If you’re not ready to listen to that, skip ahead to the next one.]

It’s 2022, and therapy is trending. We’re living in a time when people are putting things like, “therapy is sexy on sweatshirts.” And still, Forbes reported in February of 2021 that 47% of Americans believe that seeking therapy is a sign of weakness.

How can that possibly be?

If you’ve ever been the first person you know to deal with something, you get it. It’s hard to talk about something before you have the language to do it. And add the fear of sharing the thing you’re going through and being met with silence. That’s what living in stigma feels like, but what does being stigmatized do to you?

According to Psychiatry.org, stigma is the idea that a person with a mental illness is dangerous, incompetent, to blame for their mental illness. And if you’re living with a stigmatized mental illness or disorder, stigma holds you back.

You’re less likely to seek help or treatment and less likely to stay with treatment, you’re more likely to socially isolate; you experience a lack of understanding by family, friends, coworkers, or others; have fewer opportunities for work, school or social activities or trouble finding housing; you’re more likely to experience bullying, physical violence or harassment; Health insurance probably doesn't adequately cover your mental illness treatment; and you live with the belief that you'll never succeed at certain challenges or that you can't improve your situation.

Stigma is hopelessness - it trains us to believe that we are all alone and the only person who has gone through the thing we’re going through. When I hear stigma described - it sounds an awful lot like the dementors in Harry Potter, which brought those feelings of hopelessness.

When we posted the #Sweatworking Summit pitch competition, which was focused on making mental health more accessible, the tags and mentions of Ariana Alejandra Gibson CEO and founder of The Stigma App came rolling in.

So much so, that she and I decided we should get on the phone and figure out what we have in common. I learned pretty quickly that Ariana's default is vulnerability. But it hasn't always been.

Her journey mirrors a lot of ours.

Ariana is a documentary filmmaker and mental health activist who spent her early career as a creative director and brand strategist for companies ranging from tech startups to Fortune 500s. She is the Founder and CEO of STIGMA App, a new mental health app that uses storytelling to fight loneliness and improve mental health.

She is also one of the 46 percent of Americans who will personally experience mental illness in their lifetimes and believes the only way to normalize conversations about mental health is to be brave enough to have them. So, Ariana shares very openly about where the platform came from - her father’s schizophrenia, her husband’s childhood trauma, and the death of one of her best friends. And that means that every time she talks about the platform, she has to open up about all of that. She gets to model living a life outside of stigma every single day.

I can't wait for you to hear my interview with Ariana.

Resources:* Learn more about Stigma * Follow Stigma on Instagram * Follow Stigma on TikTok * The Danger of a Single Story (The TED Talk Ariana referenced)

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[Content warning: We’re going to be speaking about trauma of all sorts this week on the podcast, including mentions of domestic violence and sexual violence. If that’s not something you want to read/hear, skip this one and come back next week.]

Trauma - we’ve heard the word a lot over the past two years. It’s one of those feelings that you kind of know it when it happens - some part of you - big or small - is changed by it.

And we can quote the platitudes people post in instagram comments here: like what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. Or everything happens for a reason. Or they’re in a better place. Or pressure makes diamonds. But honestly, Kelly Clarkson song or not, trauma is hard and we need time to honor the suck of it all.

We’re continuing our deep dive into mental health on our podcast #WeGotGoals with an expert in trauma, Candyce "Ce" Anderson, M.S., L.P.C., author and licensed therapist serving Alabama, Georgia, Washington, D.C. and Ohio. She’s the founder and Chief Executive Officer of the private practice Revita Therapy and Wellness, located in Montgomery, Alabama. Her work centers around black women.

Ce has appeared on plenty of places you get news because of her expertise in domestic violence and sexual assault recovery. She’s taken that knowledge and put it into her book Love Taps, which I read as a manual to identify red flags of abuse early.

Ce and I spoke about two different kinds of trauma, small t trauma, and big T trauma. Small t can be found in events that overwhelm our ability to cope like divorce, conflict, and leaving a job abruptly. Big T trauma is triggered by events that are extraordinary and significant, leaving a person feeling powerless and possessing little control in their environment.

In the name of honoring the suck of trauma, I’d like to take a few minutes to acknowledge the accumulated effect of trauma we’ve all experienced over the past few years. We’ve had our normals ripped away from us, that’s a Big T for the entire planet Earth. We’ve navigated the disappointment of canceled or changed life events, and parenting without help - chalk up a couple of small ts. In silence, many of us on the planet were forced to stay indoors in situations that weren’t safe during this time with no real place to escape, Big T. And layer on racism, anti-semitism, war, political turmoil - that’s more trauma.

We’ve all been through a lot - and that’s just in the past two years. So let's start to untangle that trauma, shall we?

Have you ever seen that graphic about trauma that therapists love to show you when you’re just starting to work on it? It’s basically a tangled knot of string with one end that’s starting to be untangled. The knot represents the ways we start to incorporate the trauma into the way we look at the rest of the world. Trauma isn’t just a blip in the timeline, it can become a piece of our whole worldview and present as PTSD, making it hard to sleep, dream, live or walk down the street.

Ce and I spend a lot of our time speaking about some of the treatments that have been shown to be effective for trauma like EMDR or Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing and Brainspotting, which was new to me. Ce told me Brainspotting is revolutionary, especially for those in the BIPOC community who can use that therapy as a way to lead and feel empowered in healing from trauma.

And by the way, if you’re listening to this episode and you feel pulled to talk to someone - good. I promise you, trauma is better out than in and better processed with someone who is trained to help you navigate it.

Resources: * Ce Anderson on Instagram * More about Revita Therapy and Wellness * More about Ce Anderson * Big T vs. Small t trauma * More on Brainspotting and where to find a clinician trained in Brainspotting * More on EMDR and where to find a clinician trained in EMDR

Other episodes in this deep dive: * Dr. Jamie Goldstein on Finding The Mental Health Tools That Work for You

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[Content warning: On this episode, you’ll hear me mention sexual assault briefly - if you’re not ready to hear that. Skip this one and come back next week.]

Captain understatement here: It’s been two challenging years to be alive on planet earth. And so this shared trauma led to more and more people experiencing reemerging, worsened or totally new mental health issues.

Personally, I had just started seeing a new therapist right before the lockdowns. I remember our last in-person session before the screens came between us, I didn’t think I’d continue - I remember saying it would be just two weeks.

I remember our sessions in April, May, and June of 2020. I’d talk about the stress over the shifts we had to make so quickly as a business. I’d cry about the first fund of the PPP drying up. I’d work through the stress I felt around keeping my team together. I cried in therapy so that I could keep it together the rest of the time. I’m so grateful that I started therapy before COVID.

We know that it’s harder to feel like a balanced human in 2022, but how hard, exactly?

According to NAMI, the national alliance on mental illness, 1 in 5 US adults experienced mental illness in 2020 and 1 in 20 experienced serious mental illness. And with the backdrop of the pandemic, the need for mental health tools, care and therapy soared.

According to the New York Times, as more Americans felt the squeeze of stress, anxiety and depression, there simply weren’t enough therapists to meet the demand.

Regardless of all of that, 48% of Americans have sought some form of mental health treatment in the past year, according to the American Psychological Association.

We're diving into mental health all monthSo, we’re starting this deep dive into mental health with someone who can help us think about the spectrum of tools for your mental health. If you can’t get into a 1:1 session with a therapist, maybe a group is right for you. If you’re not ready for that, maybe there’s an app that can help.

Our guest this week, Dr. Jamie Goldstein, is a licensed clinical psychologist, author, and Emotional Fitness instructor at Coa. I’ve taken her emotional fitness for leaders class - paid for it with my own money, guys, so this is not sponcon. She’s incredible at creating space for adult humans to learn and grow together.

You’ll hear us speak about how to find a therapist, how to get the most out of your sessions, and how to work on your mental health when you’re not in crisis.

Resources:* Learn more about COA * Get Dr. Jamie Goldstein's book, "How To Adult, A Practical Guide" * Catch Coa at the #Sweatworking Summit * Follow Dr. Jamie Goldstein or Coa on Instagram

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Find this episode with Anthony Vennare on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you enjoyed our conversation, you know what to do – rate and review!

If you asked 1999 Kristen what the future of fitness looked like, she would have shamelessly stolen tropes from Zenon: Girl of the 21st Century. Workouts led by a holographic fitness instructor, pick-up games of anti-gravity basketball, and silver scrunchies holding our hair in space buns were all BOUND to be in place by 2049. And if we got to do our fitness from an international space station, all the better.

Well, we’re about halfway between the point where Zenon came out, in 1999, and when it takes place in 2049. Seems like a great time to check in on the future of fitness, right?

In our final episode on our deep dive on the history of fitness, we bring on Anthony Vennare, CEO and co-founder of Fitt and an active investor in the fitness space.

As the curator of the Fitt Insider newsletter, Anthony spends a significant amount of time exploring everything from the resurgence of magic mushrooms to healthcare funded fitness; I consistently open his newsletter to scrounge for new wellness brands and get a mini-deep dive on a niche wellness topic. After all, as Anthony points out in this episode, “everything is wellness” – and the future of fitness includes more than just trending workouts.

Anthony and his brother and co-founder, Joe, also invest in early-stage companies across health, wellness, fitness & nutrition. Their portfolio companies include some big names: Balanced, obe fitness, Future, Superset and more.

In this episode, you’ll hear Anthony talk through his top four future of fitness predictions: outdoor recreation, accountability as a service, services and apps to help you age well, and how companies can monetize habit and behavior change. We get into our shared passion for pickleball, the allure of wellness retirement communities, and the gamification of fitness. It might not be what Zenon had envisioned, but in our eyes, the future of fitness is still pretty fascinating.

Links and resources* Find Anthony on Twitter * Catch up on Fitt Insider and subscribe here * Previous Fitt Insider newsletters in which Anthony goes more in-depth on topics we discuss in this episode: * Issue No. 117: Aging Well * Issue No. 154: Recreation's Renaissance * Issue No. 164: What's Trending in 2022 * Issue No. 169: Fitness Comes Full Circle * Listen to the Fitt Insider podcast * Our 2019 interview with Anthony

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In this special bonus episode of #WeGotGoals, Jason Kelly of Bloomberg returns to discuss Peloton’s recent roller coaster in-depth. We talk exclusively about the Peloton rollercoaster, whether that’s a sign of real trouble for the at-home fitness industry, a potential Peloton sale, the continued saga of the mysterious Peloton Rower, and why we still believe in the brand.

Links:

Jason on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jasonkellynews

Jason on Bloomberg’s QuickTake series: https://www.bloomberg.com/qt

Jason’s book, Sweat Equity: Inside the New Economy of Mind and Body: https://amzn.to/3H3qKYN

Resources and Articles Mentioned:

From Margins: Peloton Valuations and Innovation

https://www.readmargins.com/p/peloton-valuations-and-innovation?r=2f1r

From Vox: Peloton’s problems aren’t just Peloton’s

https://www.vox.com/recode/22925513/peloton-recall-gyms-nordictrack-mirror

The Blackwells Group powerpoint presentation:

https://twitter.com/LiamKillingstad/status/1491154905595215877

From the New York Times: Peloton’s future is uncertain after a swift fall from pandemic stardom.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/08/business/peloton-ceo-layoffs-earnings.html?searchResultPosition=3

From Bloomberg: Kevin Mayer on investors misreading the demand for at-home fitness

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-02-11/falcons-owner-tackles-flores-controversy-power-players-update

From aSweatLife: Flywheel’s Acquisition and What That Means for the Business of Fitness

https://asweatlife.com/2020/01/flywheel-acquired-by-town-sports-international/

From aSweatLife: Should You Keep Paying for ClassPass? https://asweatlife.com/2016/04/should-you-keep-paying-for-classpass/

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Let’s start this episode off with a few numbers, courtesy of the excellent and meticulous Nicholas Rizzo at the website RunRepeat.com.

In 2019, the fitness industry was valued at $159 billion - yes, billion with a B. Which, at the time, was the most it had ever been valued at. When the pandemic hit in 2020, the industry then experienced a 32% decline - not surprising, but still a painful number. Now, as I write this on February 16, 2022, the fitness industry’s valuation seems to be almost back to pre-pandemic levels.

Online/digital fitness, fitness apps, fitness equipment, and fitness trackers all experienced significant growth in the pandemic. By 2028, the online/digital fitness industry is projected to have the highest growth rate of 33.10% per year. The classic brick and mortar gym, on the other hand, is predicted to grow much more slowly, at a rate of around 7% per year.

Now, let’s dig into what aSweatLife’s own research has shown over the past few years. (And as a side note, I highly recommend diving into RunRepeat’s research yourself - it’s fascinating and well worth your time, we’ll link to it in the show notes).

In 2018, respondents to our annual State of Fitness survey spent an average of $125 per month, give or take a few cents, on fitness. That number has consistently declined year-over-year - and then when the pandemic hit, that average dropped to $45 per month. That’s around a 64% drop in monthly fitness spend in our audience, which is a much steeper decline than what RunRepeat’s numbers showed about the industry as a whole. In the fall of 2021, monthly fitness spend creeped back up to $51 - but that’s still dramatically lower than the 2018 to 2020 years.

(Of course, the necessary caveats here are: we know our audience is fitness obsessed, and we know they’re mostly millennial women in urban areas, all of which affect their access and willingness to spend or save on fitness.)

As they say - you’ve got to follow the money. By tracking consumer spending on fitness, we can build theories about how that spend reflects the value our society places on physical activity. And the way our audience spends money on fitness is something we love to geek out on at aSweatLife - in fact, I’ll refer you to several in-depth pieces Jeana has written over the years about the business of fitness, including some of her best work from when ClassPass ditched their unlimited model.

And because this is a topic we find so fascinating, we pulled in the big guns: Jason Kelly, Chief Correspondent at Bloomberg Quicktake and the Author of Sweat Equity: Inside the New Economy of Mind and Body, a portrait of the booming fitness economy. Jason understands the world of private equity and public offerings, and he keeps a close pulse on how the fitness industry’s money moves, so to speak.

In this episode, you’ll hear Jason and I talk about how the community aspect of fitness factors into making fitness a compelling investment, the successes of both high-cost and low-cost fitness businesses, and the business of celebrity fitness instructors.

And stay tuned for a bonus episode with Jason dropping later this week: Our original episode was recorded on February 3, and as you’ll hear, we spent a good chunk of time talking about Peloton as a pandemic fitness darling. Then, I went on vacation and all hell broke loose at Peloton. Jason was kind enough to jump back on the mic with me on February 16, a week before the day this episode drops, so we could process together what the heck is happening at Peloton and what that says about the broader state of fitness. Look for that in your feed in the next couple of days.

Links and resources* Find Jason on Twitter here * WatchJason on Bloomberg’s QuickTake series * Jeana and I both loved Jason’s book, Sweat Equity: Inside the New Economy of Mind and Body * Jason on Bloomberg Quicktake in June of 2021 on How the Pandemic Changed the Fitness Industry * Jeana's extensive writing for aSweatLife on the business of fitness: Should You Keep Paying for ClassPass? and Flywheel Just Got Acquired – Here's What That Means * Fitness industry research from RunRepeat and aSweatLife

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Who’s the first female fitness figure you vividly remember? For me, it’s Mia Hamm. I was 10 years old in 1999, when Mia and the U.S. women won the World Cup in an epic shootout. And yes, that was the one with the Brandi Chastain sports bra moment.

By the time I was participating in sports, TItle IX had been around for nearly 20 years. The 90s felt like women were really stepping into their athletic power through sports. But long before I was born, women had been quietly - and then loudly- crusading for the physical benefits of exercise, talking about why women both needed and deserved to work out.

It all starts with a dynamic young woman named Bonnie Prudden. Her report to President Eisenhower on how America’s children were physically unfit led to the formation of the President’s Council on Youth Fitness and yes, that dreaded test you might have taken in elementary school. But before she was shaking hands with the president, Bonnie was an expert rock climber, a mountaineer, and the owner of an old elementary school. She turned that school into the Institute for Physical Fitness, housing three gyms, two dance studios, an obstacle course, and America’s first climbing wall. In many ways, we credit Bonnie as the pioneer in women’s fitness. Before her, women were afraid to exercise because they were told their uterus would fall out if they did. Yes, really.

I’d never heard of Bonnie Prudden, and I’m guessing Bonnie is a stranger to you, too. And I know she wasn’t the only female fitness leader lost to time. That’s why we’re talking to Danielle Friedman, author of Let’s Get Physical: How Women Discovered Exercise and Reshaped the World. Danielle’s book was inspired by a viral essay she wrote for The Cut about the secret sexual history of barre. When she saw the response to her article, Danielle realized that there was a rich history of women in fitness.

Decade by decade, Danielle covers the evolution of women in fitness, from barre to running to yoga to strength training. She highlights moments of cultural revolution, like when Jazzercise was a part of the Opening Ceremonies of the 1984 Olympics, and when Jane Fonda found her way into millions of Americans’ homes throughout her insanely popular workout videos.

Through it all, Danielle carefully analyzes the messaging women heard about their bodies – what the ideal figure was and how they could get it through exercise. Right now, we’re at a time when women are encouraged to exercise to get strong, and to feel empowered. But not so long ago, the messaging was much more reductive, even from the women we now recognize as heroines in fitness history. Anecdotally, I know a lot of women who have struggled with disordered relationships to exercise and body image. It was eye-opening to realize the extent to which these aren’t new issues.

So, here’s what you can look forward to in this interview. Danielle gives me a quick overview of the history of women in fitness. We also get into how women’s clothes evolved to support the moving woman (the sports bra, after all, is a relatively recent invention), and Black women who were instrumental in changing fitness. Finally, we end with what she would add to her book now if she had the opportunity to write a pandemic-specific chapter.

About Danielle FriedmanDanielle Friedman is an award-winning journalist whose feature writing has appeared in The New York Times, The Cut, Vogue, Harper's Bazaar, Glamour, Health, and other publications. She has worked as a senior editor at NBC News Digital and The Daily Beast, and she began her career as a nonfiction book editor at the Penguin imprints Hudson Street Press and Plume. She lives in New York City with her husband and son.

Links:* Just because: it's still awesome to watch the 1999 Women's World Cup shootout * Danielle's viral essay on The Cut: The Secret Sexual History of the Barre Workout * Danielle on Instagram: Come for the author, stay for her jazzy retro exercise graphics * Danielle for In Style: How the Leotard Dress Code of the '80s Set the Stage for Your Yoga Pants * Buy Let's Get Physical on Amazon, Bookshop.org, or wherever books are sold

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Before I moved to Chicago in 2011, my concept of fitness was split into two dichotomies: sports, which I had retired from upon graduating high school, and the elliptical at my university’s tiny, carpeted gym. That is to say, working out to stay skinny.

But my arrival in Chicago gave me what happiness researcher Gretchen Rubin calls the “fresh start effect” - the chance to rebuild my relationship with fitness anew. And unbeknownst to me, I moved to this major metropolis right on as two major fitness trends were becoming mainstream: running and boutique group fitness classes.

Running, I reasoned, would be a good way for me to exercise because it was largely free and I lived a mile from the lakefront, which was a novelty to me at the time. And after a couple of years, I moved from downtown to Lincoln Park, right as Nike opened a Nike Training Club studio above their Armitage shop and began offering free - yes, free - classes every single day of the week (real ones, remember?). Quickly, fitness became a landmark in the History of Kristen; it was through running and group fitness that I met many of my best friends, my boyfriend, and Jeana, who had just started a fitness-focused blog as a fun side project that is now both of our full time jobs. And now, it’s probably safe to assume that if you were to ask a random Instagram acquaintance what they know about me, they’d mention fitness in some capacity - second only to my dog, Phoebe.

Fitness has been such a significant part of my life, and I was really excited when Jeana suggested we do the History of Fitness as our second deep-dive series on the podcast. My own perspective of the fitness industry runs both narrow and deep; I know a ton about the fitness industry’s most important verticals as they exist today, but before the mid-90s, I didn’t have a great grasp of how fitness, sports, and recreation have evolved over time. To be honest, I wasn’t even totally sure why Jane Fonda was so important to fitness until taking on this project.

At times, I sort of feel like Anne Hathway in The Devil Wears Prada - the scene where Meryl / Miranda absolutely tears Hathaway’s character Andy apart for not understanding the significance of Andy wearing a cerulean sweater. And worse, for not respecting the hundreds of people and the years of fashion history that brought her cerulean sweater to the shelves.

I don’t want to be Andy, for many reasons. So, I’m taking y’all along with me as I dive into the history of fitness. We’re starting at the very beginning - like literally, going all the way back to ancient Greece and Renaissance-era Italy.

In this episode, you’ll meet Bill Hayes, the author of Sweat: A History of Exercise. His book is part history, part memoir, and it traces the different origins of exercise as they evolve. He flips between analyzing the past and memorializing the future, so you’re left with a better context for the cultural and scientific history of exercise and how it’s affected our view of exercise today.

Bill is a complete delight, and I’m excited to share this interview with y’all. A few highlights: we meet Mercuriale, whose seminal text De arte gymnastica aimed to revive the lost Greek art of exercising. We gush about the joy and satisfaction of swimming, as well as the flow state one can find in boxing. Bill gives a brief context for women in the pre-20th century history of exercise (and we'll get more into women's place in the fitness movement next week), and I learn for the first time ever that Plato wasn't his real name (plus who gave him the nickname Plato and why).

The Links:* Buy Bill's excellent book Sweat: A History of Exercise on Amazon, Bookshop.org, or wherever you get your books * Learn about his other books on his website, BillHayes.com * Chat with him on Twitter @billhayesnyc and view his photography on Instagram @billhayesphotography * An excerpt/adaption of Sweat can be found in this article Bill recently wrote for the New York Times: Sometimes You Have to Hate Exercise Before You Can Love It Again * The Devil Wears Prada scene mentioned in the intro, just for fun

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Content warning: In this episode, we’re going to be discussing eating disorders and diets. There’s also a brief mention of sexual assault. If those aren’t topics you’re ready to listen to, skip this one and come back.

Speaker, lawyer and writer Savala Nolan was put on her first diet at four years old. That means someone who thought they were protecting her from the world instead taught her that the world would not be friendly to her body. That's an idea that so many human beings internalize early in life - kids are smart and they're always watching.

She shared a look at some of the ways she tried to change her her body and shame her body into submission in an early version of an essay that ended up in her book Don't Let It Get You Down.

We're wrapping up our month-long deep dive into diet culture on our podcast #WeGotGoals with a conversation featuring Savala Nolan. In her book, she shares perspectives on intersectionality as a woman who has a mixed-race identity, who came from poverty, but also experienced wealth, who has lived in both a thin body and a fat body.

And she shares openly the ways that the prism of identity shapes and shades the world and how she’s learned from dating, working, going through a traumatic labor and delivery, and raising a daughter. And she shares how she inevitably quit dieting too.

This interview with Nolan represents a point that's important to make in a conversation about diet culture: that the driving force behind diet culture is fatphobia, and, as Nolan argues with solid historical evidence in a piece for Health, fatphobia is rooted in racism.

That theme also shines through in her book, which I ready from cover-to-cover over a weekend. Three essays in particular speak to diet culture in Don’t Let It Get You Down, titled "The Body Endures," "Fat in Ways White Girls Don’t Understand," and "Little Satin Bomber Jacket."

The book and our interview get into topics on poverty, race, diet-culture and fatphobia and if my hearty recommendation of the book isn't enough, you don't have to take my word for it.

The New York Times Book Review calls it “[A] standout collection...a brutal, beautifully rendered narrative.”

The San Francisco Chronicle said is "[Written with] unflinching honesty that is both revelatory and unsettling”

“A vibrant and thoughtful collection.” —Roxane Gay

Resources: * Buy her book Don't Let It Get You Down wherever you get your books * Use this handy discussion guide for the book Don't Let It Get You Down * Savala mentions this importance of the social determinants of health, here's a look at those * We discuss the difference between body neutrality and body positivity * Ready the piece in Health we discussed, "The reason my disordered eating went unnoticed by almost everyone" * This piece in Vogue appears in the book as well, with a few additional details as Savala gained access to archives "Say Their Names: Breonna Taylor, My Great-Great-Grandmother, and Me" * This piece in TIME also appears in the book and is deeply sad, "My Father's Life Was Shaped by Racism. So Was His Death"

Other episodes in this deep dive on Diet Culture: * Dr. Lindo Bacon shares the research that led to Heath At Every Size * Judith Matz explains more on the psychology of your body on a diet * Dr. Alexis Conason on living diet-free

Some FAQs What’s a diet? Any time you make a change in how you eat for the purpose of weight loss. * What is diet culture? A belief that thinness is a moral virtue and thinness is health. Therefore, it’s worth doing anything to achieve that status and when you get to that status, you’ll be happier and healthier. * What exactly is obesity? And should you use that word when talking about someone else’s weight? In short, it’s complicated, based on the BMI which has its own problems* and no. Here’s more research on the words we use and weight stigma. * Why did we choose to use the word “fat”? The word fat is being reclaimed by many – especially those within the fat acceptance movement. To some, this word is loaded and will remain loaded; we want to honor that and we understand that. If we could address everyone on a 1:1 basis, we would use your words of choice (like Dr. Conason talks through). More on the word fat.

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Content warning: on this episode in in this post we’re going to be discussing eating disorders, eating disorder recovery, and diets. If those aren’t topics you’re ready to listen to, skip this one and come back.

This is our third week of our deep dive into the topic on diet culture on our podcast #WeGotGoals and we're getting to the question that started it all with Dr. Alexis Conason: what should we do instead of diet (more on the flaw in that question shortly).

But first, Dr. Conason is a clinical psychologist and certified eating disorder specialist in private practice in New York City. She’s a sought-after speaker, a researcher who has published in peer-reviewed journals, and is widely viewed as an expert on the topics of mindful eating, body image, and diet culture in the media.

She’s also the founder of The Anti-Diet Plan, a weight-inclusive online mindful eating program and is the author of The Diet-Free Revolution: 10 Steps to Free Yourself from the Diet-Cycle with Mindful Eating and Radical Self-Acceptance.

The book is an incredible resource for those looking to rebuild a relationship with food and their bodies that's rooted in a trust that your body is built to tell you what it needs. Diets teach you to rely on an external plan or lifestyle for your meals, leading you to ask questions like, "If I shouldn't diet, what should I eat?" And it was midway through the interview with Dr. Conason when I realize that the question itself is rooted in diet culture.

As a reminder, diet culture and its overarching idea that if we fit a certain body type we’ll be happy and diets are the way to get there. And because of that, we muting our bodies' signals to eat less in hopes of shrinking. Many of us spend so much of our lives on diets and feeling dissatisfied with our bodies, that nearly ninety percent of women report body dissatisfaction, Dr. Conason shared.

And this whole thing is a vicious cycle, body dissatisfaction is linked to things like depression and eating disorders.

In our interview, we talk through the 10-step process in her book Diet-Free Revolution that helps to get back in touch with the cues your body intelligently has built into it like hunger, cravings, and fullness. We also dive into how her start in obesity research led her to dedicate her life to anti-diet work instead of putting people on diets.

Resources: * The Anti-Diet Plan, which also includes some free resources and details who should and should not take on this plan * The Diet-Free Revolution book * More on fasting and stress in women * Evidence that diets don't work * More on body dissatisfaction from researchers at the University of Wisconsin, who also examine how race and gender play a role

Past episodes in this deep dive into diet culture: * Dr. Lindo Bacon shares the research that led to Heath At Every Size * Judith Matz explains more on the psychology of your body on a diet

Some FAQs What’s a diet? Any time you make a change in how you eat for the purpose of weight loss. * What is diet culture? A belief that thinness is a moral virtue and thinness is health. Therefore, it’s worth doing anything to achieve that status and when you get to that status, you’ll be happier and healthier. * What exactly is obesity? And should you use that word when talking about someone else’s weight? In short, it’s complicated, based on the BMI which has its own problems* and no. Here’s more research on the words we use and weight stigma. * Why did we choose to use the word "fat"? The word fat is being reclaimed by many - especially those within the fat acceptance movement. To some, this word is loaded and will remain loaded, we want to honor that and we understand that. If we could address everyone on a 1:1 basis, we would use your words of choice (like Dr. Conason talks through). More on the word fat.

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Just a quick content warning: on this episode and in this post, we’re going to be discussing eating disorders and diets. If that’s not a topic you’re ready to listen to, skip this one and come back. We get it.

We're in our second week of our deep dive into diet culture on our podcast, #WeGotGoals. And this week, we're speaking to Judith Matz, LCSW, ACSW. In terms of our deep dive, think of this episode as an intro to what diet culture is and a 101 on how to get out of it.

Judith Matz is a therapist and nationally recognized speaker on the topics of diet culture, binge eating, emotional eating, body image, and weight stigma. She has her own journey with dieting and she shares on the episode how she inevitably broke up with her scale and made a professional choice to dedicate her professional life to undoing what diets have done to human beings.

Matz is the co-author of the books The Diet Survivor’s Handbook and Beyond a Shadow of a Diet. She also co-created two card decks that are meant to make an anti-diet and body positive lifestyle more accessible - The Making Peace with Food card deck and the Body Positivity card deck.

We looked to her for her expertise in diets and diet culture for us. Read that as, I asked the stupid questions so you don't have to.

You’ll hear her define a diet as “Any time you make a change in how you eat for the purpose of weight loss.” I’ve been reading anti-diet books in public this month as I prepare for these interviews, and I’ve heard from a lot of people about their systems that aren’t diets - they're more like do’s and don’ts. According to Matz, your system is a diet if you're doing it to lose weight.

And you’ll also hear her define diet culture, which might as well be, “well, it’s in the air you breathe,” but for the purpose of this conversation, it’s “a belief that thinness is a moral virtue and thinness is health. Therefore, it’s worth doing anything to achieve that status and when you get to that status, you’ll be happier and healthier.”

So, as we dive deeper, I’m convinced that diet culture is basically the matrix - our minds are so occupied with the illusion in front of us that if we just lose weight, we’ll have the life of our dreams. We’re so occupied, in fact, that we’re willing to ignore the fact that you’ll hear from several experts this month on diets and diet culture. Diets simply do not work.

As Matz puts it, there’s only a 3-5% chance that a diet will work - and there isn’t a single program or plan that has the research to support sustained weight loss over 2-5 years.

Resources:* Judith Matz has a private practice in the Chicago area, which you can learn more about at www.judithmatz.com * Follow Matz on Instagram @judmatz * Matz's book The Diet Survivor's handbook is a good place to start if you're breaking out of diets - she reminds you that you haven't failed at diets - they've failed you. * Matz goes through her Making Peace with Food card deck in our conversation * You'll hear Matz mention the book Sick Enough by Jennifer L. Gaudiani in reference to eating disorder recovery

Past episodes in this month's deep dive:* A Deep Dive into Diet Culture with Dr. Lindo Bacon, pioneer in the HAES movement

Here are some of the frequently asked questions I’ve heard since talking about this project as well as some resources (you’ll also hear other experts speak to these this month): What's a diet? Any time you make a change in how you eat for the purpose of weight loss. * What is diet culture? A belief that thinness is a moral virtue and thinness is health. Therefore, it’s worth doing anything to achieve that status and when you get to that status, you’ll be happier and healthier. * What exactly is obesity? And should you use that word when talking about someone else’s weight? In short, it’s complicated, based on the BMI which has its own problems* and no. Here’s more research on the words we use and weight stigma. * How do we know what our set point is? Ugh, it’s complicated. But, you’l hear Dr. Bacon speak about how a body behaves when below it. (see the Keys’ study “During the semi-starvation phase [about 1,500 calories a day] the changes were dramatic. Beyond the gaunt appearance of the men, there were significant decreases in their strength and stamina, body temperature, heart rate and sex drive. The psychological effects were significant as well. Hunger made the men obsessed with food. They would dream and fantasize about food, read and talk about food and savor the two meals a day they were given.”) * How are we supposed to eat? That is literally the question that started this all and you’ll hear more specific answers to this question throughout the month (From both Judith Matz and Dr. Alexis Conason, who you'll hear from next week), but when I spoke with Dr. Conason, it was clear that the question itself was rooted in diet culture. Damn it. Our bodies have cues that we’ll speak to in the coming weeks that we’ve conditioned ourselves to ignore.

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Content warning: in this post and on this episode, we’re going to be discussing eating disorders and diets. If that’s not a topic you’re ready to listen to, skip this one and come back. We get it.

Dr. Lindo Bacon, whose pronouns are they/them, wasn't an easy interview to get. They're a force in the emerging research that supports the health at every size (HAES) movement and in the movement to end fat stigma. They also authored the books "Health at Every Size," and "Radical Belonging," as well as co-authoring "Body Respect." Dr. Bacon also required a little convincing as to why a media outlet called "aSweatLife" cared about being a part of the conversation on diet culture. And that concern wasn't without merit.

For years, we've avoided talk of diets on aSweatLife - sure, you'll see a reference here or there to a name-brand diet - but we've said for years that we don't want to tell you what to eat or not eat.

Indulge me for a minute here - I spent the first 18 years of my life in Minnesota. If you've heard of "Minnesota nice" the concept would be more aptly named, "Minnesota avoidance." My people don't talk about things that are uncomfortable and will even go so far as to lie to retail associates. "I'll be back later for this," we say holding up an item of clothing we tried on and hated. Everyone knows you're not coming back.

So as we were approaching our 6th year of the podcast, #WeGotGoals, we decided as a team to talk about the things we've avoided or that we truly just want to learn more about, starting with diet culture.

In not participating in the conversation about diets, we weren't doing any work to undo their negative impact.

That brings us to the start of our deep dive on diet culture over the month of January. We chose this month to tackle this topic because we know the messages you're being inundated with right now - yesterday, I lost count of how many commercials offered me a chance to lose weight or get my money back. Over the month, we're featuring four experts who each have a unique point of view in the diet culture space - therapists, researchers, experts in eating disorder recovery, and those with lived experience.

And we're starting with Dr. Bacon because they have the education and background to support the fact that over a person's lifetime, diets simply do not work, which you'll hear all about in the episode. You'll also hear about the emotional effects of dieting that their work validated.

Dr. Bacon is a curious human, pursuing several degrees to understand their body and the relationship between the size of a body and health. They went to graduate school for psychology, pursued another graduate degree in Exercise Physiology, and finally landed on a PhD in physiology from the University of California, Davis. That’s where they did their research that led to the book "Health at Every Size."

Their peer reviewed research found this: "Concern has arisen that this weight focused paradigm is not only ineffective at producing thinner, healthier bodies, but also damaging, contributing to food and body preoccupation, repeated cycles of weight loss and regain, distraction from other personal health goals and wider health determinants, reduced self-esteem, eating disorders, other health decrement, and weight stigmatization and discrimination [6–8]."

Needless to say, they know their stuff and they are an expert in not only the negative impact of dieting, but also, the medical stigma that those living in larger bodies face, as well as the identities that intersect with weight, like socioeconomic status, gender, and race.

Resources: * Dr. Bacon's website has a litany of resources on fat stigma, HAES, as well as resources for those working in health and fitness. * The Maintenance phase podcast episode I reference titled "Is Fat Bad for You" is an excellent listen if you want to know more about the challenge of doing science-based anti-diet research. * Research by Dr. Bacon and team that resulted from the research they conducted around HAES: Weight Science: Evaluating the Evidence for a Paradigm Shift. * The Keys’ study that we reference (if you've taken intro psychology, you've probably read about it), in which 36 men starved themselves for research at the University of Minnesota. * You'll hear us reference the theory of a body's set point (on this episode and throughout the month) here's more on that * On the episode, we chose to use the word, "fat" you'll hear that throughout the episode. We made that choice because of the fat acceptance movement, which you can learn a lot about through this podcast from NPR. * Why is the fat acceptance movement a thing? It's basically a movement to change the world for those experiencing anti-fat bias, which you can read more about from Harvard Business Review (why HBR? Because anti-fat bias prevents people from getting jobs).

Here are some of the frequently asked questions I've heard since talking about this project as well as some resources (you'll also hear other experts speak to these this month): What exactly is obesity? And should you use that word when talking about someone else's weight? In short, it's complicated, based on the BMI which has its own problems and no. Here's more on how the Mayo Clinic talks about it. * How do we know what our set point is? Ugh, it's complicated. But, you'l hear Dr. Bacon speak about how a body behaves when below it. (see the Keys' study "During the semi-starvation phase [about 1,500 calories a day] the changes were dramatic. Beyond the gaunt appearance of the men, there were significant decreases in their strength and stamina, body temperature, heart rate and sex drive. The psychological effects were significant as well. Hunger made the men obsessed with food. They would dream and fantasize about food, read and talk about food and savor the two meals a day they were given.") * How are we supposed to eat?* That is literally the question that started this all and you'll hear more specific answers to this question throughout the month (From both Judith Matz and Dr. Alexis Conason), but when I spoke with Dr. Conason, it was clear that the question itself was rooted in diet culture. Damn it. Our bodies have cues that we'll speak to in the coming weeks that we've conditioned ourselves to ignore.

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[Content warning: In this post and the podcast episode, we're going to discuss THC. If you're not yet 21 years old, your brain isn't fully developed - wait for that and then try THC responsibly if you feel like it. If you don't want to hear us talk about THC, just skip to the next episode.]

When I was in high school, my entry point to cannabis - like anyone who graduated from high school in the early aughts - was strictly illicit. There was a guy named Sky who always had really strong weed - what one who may not know better would call "good." I was pretty straight laced in high school, but I would have done anything for him to notice me. So, one night I smoked his very strong weed and spiraled into a brain tornado of my parents being disappointed in me. I mean, we also finally made out that night, but you weight the good against the bad, and I'd say this was still a net-negative.

Until recreational cannabis was legalized in Illinois, that was my framework: THC turns your brain into your worst anxieties until it wears off. "No, thank you," I'd say.

Enter our team's cannabis sherpa, Marie Goodman, who explained dosing, the entourage effect (when you consume THC and CBD at the same time), and also introduced us all to Cann. Cann bills itself as a micro-dosed social tonic. These beverages have 2 mg of THC and 4 mg of CBD, which are infused in beverages with adult and fancy flavors like Lemon Lavender, Blood Orange Cardamom, and Grapefruit Rosemary.

Jake Bullock, co-founder and CEO of Cann explained that the flavors are designed to be interesting, but they also lead with the familiar. You know what blood orange is, but you might not know what cardamom tastes like, which allows it to feel familiar, but also adventurous.

And for reference, 2 mg of THC is like a 4 on a scale of 1-100 and sky's weed was a 99. Bullock says that this is for a very specific reason: so you can consume cannabis like you would alcohol. Have a drink or two for a restrained evening or a few more to level up your buzz.

And Bullock's frame of reference for cannabis is a little different from mine, you'll hear him explain that in the episode. He grew up in Colorado, the first state to legalize recreational use, and that fact was in the back of his mind as he pursued his MBA at Stanford. He knew early on that he wanted to make cannabis more social and unlock the potential of infusing THC into beverages. And that's what he worked on while he was at school, the early prototype of Cann.

His co-founder and friend from their days at Bain and Company, Luke Anderson tried the product early. Bullock recalls him saying, "Make this or I will." So his friend and an early believer became a co-founder.

On the episode, you'll also hear Bullock talk about - in very loose terms - his excitement for on-premise consumption and the creation of "the bar of the future." Honestly, nothing gets me more excited than the idea of a bar where I can hear you talk and I don't have to scream, "WHAT?" constantly.

And as Cann marches towards the future, they have some big-name believers. The Goop Queen herself Gwyneth Paltrow invested an undisclosed amount along with Rebel Wilson, Ruby Rose, Darren Criss and Baron Davis when the group closed a funding round in late 2020.

Resources: Find Cann at your local dispensary Follow @DrinkCann on Instagram You can read about Cann's commitment to equity and social justice here.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Have you ever had a conversation with your mother or your grandmother about her experiences with menopause? Chances are, if you're identify as a man or if you haven't neared menopause yet, the answer is "no." I had my first conversation with my mom about menopause after aSweatLife hosted a panel on women's health featuring fertility, women's health and birth control specialists. I learned an incredible amount about her health - and according to Dr. Roohi Jeelani who spoke at that panel - my own future.

"The clearest indication of when you'll reach menopause is when your mom and her mom did." I had absolutely no idea when that had happened.

And that quiet we-don't-talk-about-this-here attitude led to the dearth of products and knowledge being shared as Sally Mueller entered menopause. She went to a doctor at the Mayo Clinic - she lives nearby in Minnesota - who recommended products that looked and felt sterile, medical and boring.

She'd spent her career creating products that fit into holes in the market and she felt in her core that this was another big opportunity. Today, not only does Womaness create luxurious skincare for face, neck and body, they're also pioneering products built for sexual health and feminine health for women experiencing perimenopause and menopause.

"We built a line around the major symptoms of menopause ... almost every women goes through a lot of skin changes during menopause because of the loss of estrogen. So we have seven different skews just in skin and body. Our most famous one is "Let's Neck," which is a neck and décolletage serum which is great with this cooling rolling ball." Mueller explained as she talked through the creams, lotions and potions you can find at Target and on Womaness.com.

But another huge piece of Womaness's mission is having the conversations that so many women have had behind closed doors or in hushed tones with doctors, except Womaness is doing it on a really big platform in a really loud voice. The brand's blog, The Ness and Facebook group "The After Party" are there to serve that mission.

Let's Neck. The Ness. The After Party. They're great at branding. And that cute and clever language is by design, Mueller told me. She'd worked on millennial brands and didn't see a single reason why the fun she was having in creating the look, feel, and love she was building for those brands couldn't apply to Womaness too.

After speaking to Sally a couple of times, I've come to think of Womaness as a really beautiful, accessible suite of products that's also owning "the talk" for menopause. And thank goodness they are. Imagine if no one talked to you about getting your period, and you just had to whisper until you found a friend who had gone through it too.

Yikes.

References:* Find Womaness at Target and on Womaness.com * Get the Night Cream that is beloved by women of all ages * Follow @MyWomaness on Instagram * Grace and Frankie: I had to reference Grace and Frankie when Sally mentioned the vibrator and personal lubricant Womaness created. The protagonists create something similar on the show - obviously, theirs was pretend.

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"If we have children, we risk pay cuts from our sponsors during pregnancy and afterward. It’s one example of a sports industry where the rules are still mostly made for and by men." - Allyson Felix.

In the 250 episodes of our podcast, #WeGotGoals, we've had some really interesting goal-getters on the airwaves. We interview wellness entrepreneurs, athletes, and authors who fit in aSweatLife's view of wellness. We're focused on the things that add to your life and happiness, by the way, not the things that make you fixate on becoming less.

And among those high achievers that we've interviewed, Allyson Felix was our 33rd episode. The episode aired in December of 2017, which she later revealed in a New York Times opinion piece was the beginning of an incredibly tumultuous time for her career.

Her contract with Nike was up and she was in the process of negotiating a new contract.

She'd also decided to have a family - a challenging decision for any human being, let alone a working mom, let alone working mom in one of the careers that wasn't offering any financial or legal protections for women - a professional, sponsored athlete. And so, while she was in the midst of contract negotiations, she was pregnant, which put her at a disadvantage. As she put it, "Despite all my victories, Nike wanted to pay me 70 percent less than before."

Felix believed that her desire to have a family shouldn't be the end of her career as a professional athlete, so the negotiations stalled when she asked for specific guarantees around that. In case you missed it, Felix signed with Athleta as the brand's first sponsored athlete in July of 2019 and the contract included "full protection during maternity."

All of that is background as we think about this time capsule of what Felix told us in this episode: she wanted to get to the Tokyo Olympics in 2020. We now know that the games would be held in 2021 because of a global pandemic.

So if we stop to think about everything she had to overcome to get to the games and achieve her goal, it's staggering. Being without a sponsor for a year and a half, racing while hiding a pregnancy, recovering from pregnancy and a traumatic birthing experience that led her to stand up for all Black moms, who are at a greater risk of death during childbirth, and a global pandemic that pushed her age at the time of the Olympics from 34- to 35-years-old, which was a tie with the oldest female medalist in track, Evelyn Ashford.

So as you listen to the episode, keep all of that in mind. She's casually stating her goals, while wave after wave of "no you can't" and "it's impossible" are coming for her. She simply does not possess an ounce of quit.

Oh and by the way, at the time of this interview, she had 9 Olympic medals and she left Tokyo with enough medals to bring her Olympic total up to 15. That'll show 'em.

And as a footnote, since Felix and a multitude of other brave female athletes spoke out, brands have changed their policies for female athletes in droves and smaller brands are presenting new opportunities for these athletes. Nike is among them.

So, we're really just re-running this to remind you that you can achieve your big goals against, big, big obstacles and to say thank you to Allyson Felix for her courage and strength.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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If you follow us on Instagram (you really should follow us on Instagram), we've been sharing the stories of ambassadors from all over as they set and achieve their goals. And as we close the ambassador application today (at the time of publication), we wanted to celebrate some of the stories of our ambassadors. The program focuses on goals because we believe that seeing other humans say the things they want to achieve and celebrating each other along the way is incredibly powerful for your own belief that you can do big things. It also makes for a really incredible community that has your back.

Oh and by-the-by, you can apply until the end of the day today. You should definitely apply.

On this episode, you'll hear people who set and achieved goals to move, to launch creative projects, to build their families, and to change careers. And we love hearing how different each one of these goal-getters looked at her goals and how she went about achieving them.

You'll also hear how the pandemic changed career goals and sped up goals to move across the country.

Here's who we talked to: * Kelly Matkovich shared what it's been like to be an ambassador who eventually joined our team full time and how the pandemic sped up her move to Colorado * Hanna Cetkovic shares how her goals have shifted after accomplishing things like advancing in her career, buying a home and getting her MBA to one focused on relationships and her fertility journey. * Kensli Diggs notes how her career, life and family have all shifted and she's been able to focuse on creative projects like her #DiversityinWellness * Follow Jax Turyna on Instagram and watch as she launches her new career as a Holistic Health Coach

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Think back to the most stressful time in your life. What were your coping strategies? What good habits were the first to go as you struggled to stay afloat? Did your evening reading take a backseat to Below Deck reruns, or maybe you shut yourself off from your friends instead of seeking their support?

It all sounds familiar, right? (And maybe, just maybe, those examples are from my own personal life.) In times of stress, our reactions are probably to crawl inward, to take the easiest way out, and to avoid anything that feels like extra work. But what if that's the exact opposite of what we should be doing?

That's what Dr. Samantha Boardman and I talked about in today's podcast episode. In her new book, Everyday Vitality: How to Turn Stress Into Strength, Dr. Boardman shares science-backed strategies for building resilience and vitality—that sense of aliveness and energy that makes you feel like a human being. According to Dr. Boardman, that vitality comes from connection with others, engaging in challenging experiences, and finding a sense of purpose in something beyond yourself. With actionable advice rooted in positive psychology, this book is chock-full of ways to add a little energy to your life, especially in times of major stress.

All that is a very wordy way to say this: this book sums up the things we've been talking about at aSweatLife for a very, very long time (especially the chapters on human connection).

In this podcast episode, you'll hear Dr. Boardman talk about how getting fired by a patient changed her career trajectory, why looking at her phone less was a major past goal of hers, and her current process goal of doing 20 minutes of yoga, three times a week.

Resources:

• Buy Everyday Vitality on Amazon or Bookshop.org
• Find Dr. Boardman's website here
• Follow Dr. Boardman on Instagram @positive_prescription and on Twitter @sambmd
• The article mentioned from aSweatLife.com: Do Virtual Friendships Have As Much Value As IRL Friendships?

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Content Warning: this post and the associated podcast audio mention the concept of sexual violence and human trafficking. You'll also hear themes of substance abuse in the episode. If you or anyone you know were impacted by any of these things, there are resources for you below, but we understand if you want to skip this episode.

If you were at #SweatworkingWeek with us in Chicago, Shandi Nichols was there, gigantic smile across her face at her Boss Gloss table. If you had a chance to speak to her about the business, you may have caught a glimpse of the purpose that's driving her business.

At the early stages of building Boss Gloss, a scalp and hair-thickening treatment that's "kitchen sink product for your hair that does everything" she knew she wanted to work with and hire survivors of human trafficking. But the more she talked to these survivors, the more she realized her own healing journey of surviving sexual assault was still very much in-progress.

We spend a lot of this episode talking about that - healing from trauma - because once you start that process, it's kind of hard to believe you ever lived any other way.

And going into the interview, neither Shandi nor I realized how similar our stories were. I'm also a survivor of sexual assault, which I only started talking about this year - and our timelines for finally getting help are almost identical. Dark night of the soul, reach out for help from rock bottom, and start therapy during the pandemic. The treatment we both sought: EMDR, which stands for Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing.

So for both of us, you'll hear a sense of "I never thought I'd feel this good again" throughout the interview. And that's because when you've lived with a trauma, and believed all of the lies you start to tell yourself, it's easy to believe that the rest of your existence is going to feel that way - prickly - unless you've done something to numb or create distance between you and the rest of the world.

And for Shandi, part of her healing journey was eliminating the tendency to numb the pain - she chose to get sober, which she also talks about.

But the interesting thing about this episode is how for Shandi, the most important goal was healing. She put everything else on hold to do that - even her brand new business, Boss Gloss. And now that she's through the hardest part of her recovery journey, she's ready to take on the world with a product that's not only made of incredible ingredients, but also makes the world better by aligning with her purpose to help women live full lives after the trauma of human trafficking.

Resources: * Get help, seek resources, or donate to RAINN - the organization that funds the national Sexual Assualt Crisis Hotline (the number I called when I was 16) * Find a therapist near you with Psychology Today * Find a licensed therapist who is trained to practice EMDR * Better Help offers Financial Aid for therapy * The Loveland Foundation offers financial aid to Black women seeking therapy * Learn more about getting help if you're grappling with substance abuse - like Alcoholics Anonymous. * Learn more about human trafficking via Polaris Project * Take Stanford's course on International Women's Health and Human Rights on Coursera for free * And finally, learn all about Boss Gloss.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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As Stephen Lease, CEO/Co-Founder of goodr, notes, he's a high achiever at this point in his life—but by all accounts, it wasn't a linear journey. After surviving high school and founding five failed companies, he's now the merry leader of goodr, our favorite makers of affordable, functional, and fun sunglasses. His lightbulb moment came when he was going for a run and realized that all the sunglasses out there were overengineered and still totally ugly (not acceptable for a guy as fashion-forward as Stephen, as you'll see in the YouTube version of this podcast).

But beyond sunglasses, goodr is known for their company culture, which Stephen and I dive into as well. Goodr grew a ton during the pandemic (remember, everyone was running all the time, and we needed cheap sunglasses). Stephen explains how he evolved goodr's strong company culture and scrappy mentality as they scaled, plus the role deck and feedback loops he wisely built into the company's structure right from the beginning.

And as for Stephen's goals? For his past goals, he talks about his love of a process goal and how he's integrated that into various running goals and push-up goals that he lovingly ropes his friends and co-workers into. And for the future, he's working on building a way to work remotely for a month at a time from an international city, and Stephen also expands on why he's learning to play the ukelele.

About Stephen Lease, CEO/Co-Founder of goodr: Stephen’s spirit animal is an octopus, he’s soul-bonded with a basset hound, and he is 16% flamingo. He’s currently the CEO (Chief Executive Octopus) of the sunglasses brand goodr and the co-host of the CULTURE goodr Podcast.

Since Stephen co-founded goodr in 2015 (his sixth company), goodr has grown to over 75 employees, is sold in over 3,000 doors worldwide, and has won numerous awards, including “Gear of the Year” by Runner’s World Magazine, and “Best Places to Work” by Inc. Magazine.

He would love it if it were due to his brand-building knowledge and emotional intelligence, but it’s mostly due to surrounding himself with people smartr, nicr, and funnr than him.

Resources: * Shop goodr's latest sunglasses drop here * Say hi to goodr on Instagram @goodr and to Stephen @stephenlease

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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We've had our eyes on The Sill since someone on the team who's younger and cooler than I am described this Warby-Parker-for-plants to the team and insisted that it be listed on our gift guide.

Eliza Blank, founder and CEO of The Sill, felt the call to make nature more accessible to everyone through beautiful potted plants - even someone who isn't horticulturally inclined in the slightest. And through small moments with nature, she knew that she could give people the feel-good benefits of caring for something green, like reduced stress, better indoor air, and improved focus.

Yes, plants can do all of that.

And on this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear Eliza explain how moving from a lush, green area, where she could literally ground herself by putting her feet in the grass, to a series of concrete rectangles when she was enrolled at NYU, made her truly appreciate what plants did for her.

So, that lack of green and the way she sought it out in the city led to the seed of the idea that would become The Sill as she cultivated her skills in branding in her early career. By the time she struck out to dig into the potting soil and build The Sill, she was ready to do everything from build the brand to handle customer service to dig in and care for the plants herself.

I can't wait for you to hear from this delightful human who really IS happier around plants. Who isn't, though.

Resources:

• Follow The Sill on Instagram where the brand shares a LOT of helpful plant info
• How to keep your plants alive while on vacation, which Eliza references in the episode

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Courtney Phillips is the co-founder of Gumbo Media, a storytelling platform and content engine that expands the narrative of Black life. She's also the co-founder of Gumbo Fit, a unique community powered by Nike Running that thoughtfully bridges the worlds of underrepresented populations and the fitness mainstream through a diversity of programming and content curation, while prioritizing the coalescing of Black and Brown fitness and wellness enthusiasts across Chicago to start, with a particular focus on South and West-side communities.

In this episode, Courtney and Kristen talk about how Courtney's built a grassroots community for running, why running isn't as accessible to Black and Brown communities as you may think, and what her big goals for the future are.

Resources

• Find out when you can run with Courtney and Gumbo Fit on their Instagram (and Courtney's on IG @courtneynphillips)
• Learn more about Gumbo Fit in this awesome video with Nike, "Sport Changes Everything"
• Courtney and her co-host/Gumbo Fit's Programs Coordinator Ian Gonzales just launched their podcast, The Runner's Club. Check it out, subscribe, and download right here.
• Other Black and Brown fitness and running communities Courtney recommends checking out: 7 on Sundays, Black Chicago Runners, Men Run Deez Streets, and Running Diversity (and scroll through who @GumboFit follows for even more inspiration)
• Bonus read: With Each Run, A City Shaken By Racism Is 'Finding The Greater Good' (NYTimes)

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When I reached out to Lesley Eccels - co-founder of fantasy sports app FanDuel and founder of the relationship health app Relish - it was the height of sheltering at home. Because of that, events coalesced that made me absolutely want to talk to her. I'd found Relish as my husband and I were at each others' throats one day - it was probably about the dishes, if I'm being honest.

And shortly after my husband and I started using Relish, he listened to the book Billion Dollar Fantasy by Albert Chen on Audible. The book outlines Lesley's and her husband Nigel Eccels' path to building, scaling and selling FanDuel - and ultimately to Lesley founding Relish. Something that's discussed in the book is a now legally contested deal at the end of Lesley's time at FanDuel, which you can read more about in the Wall Street Journal and let your blood boil with mine.

"She's a badass," my husband noted and I composed an email.

On this week's episode of #WeGotgoals, you'll hear Lesley talk about building a tech ecosystem in Edinburgh, Scotland, from which FanDuel sprang and now Relish will use that same pool of tech talent. She mentions the unicorns coming out of that city continue to grow.

Lesley and I also talked about how she sets goals, and she's a visionary, not only in what she creates, but also how she sets goals. She creates a 10-year vision and then sets daily goals laddering up to that vision. When she set out to build FanDuel, that meant she was fully focused on creating a totally new and disruptive technology. If you followed FanDuel, you know they had to fight to carve out a space for fantasy sports betting known as "games of skill." Going to battle to do something totally unique in a market? That's pretty disruptive.

And as she looks at Relish, her sights are set on concepts that are much bigger than just your romantic relationships - it's about all of your relationships and your happiness, she said. But for now, the platform focuses on romantic relationships because Lesley became obsessed with a problem. "Most couples are unhappy for 6 years before they do anything about it," she said.

You'll hear more about her, the research she's done and her big, big vision on this week's episode.

Resources:

• Billion Dollar Fantasy by Albert Chen
• Try Relish in your own romantic relationships

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Here's a sobering statistic that keeps Ashley Connell up at night: 43% of women leave the workforce to have children, and if out for just 3 years, a woman loses 37% of compensation power (Harvard Business Review).

But at the same time, research shows that having women in leadership roles benefits the company in major, measurable ways. For example, firms with female CEOs often perform better in the stock market than those with male CEOs, and one study showed that female CEOs achieve up to 18 percent higher revenue per employee than male CEOs.

So why the gender pay gap, if the benefits of having working mothers on your team are so obvious? That's what Ashley and I get into on this episode of #WeGotGoals, as we discuss the motivation behind the Prowess Project.

The Prowess Project solves for two problems: first, teams struggling to find easy-to-hire, flexible talent that “hit the ground” running, and second, educated, experienced women who paused their careers, many to become caretakers, who want to get back into the workforce but can't find flexible, empowering jobs. By vetting and certifying these women in the latest tech tools, remote work, empathy and project management, Prowess Project matches them up with roles based on the skills needed and behavior compatibility with the new team.

Ashley's passion for Prowess Project and women in the workforce rings clearly with every word she says in this interview. Along the way, we'll hear her talk about her previous big goal of working and living abroad as an adult, her advice to women entering the workforce at this moment in time, and what industries she thinks are most welcoming to women after a pause in their career.

Episode resources: * The New York Times article we mentioned on the she-cession * Connect with Ashley on LinkedIn here * Learn more about the Prowess Project here * And from aSweatLife: How to ask for (and get) a raise

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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When we met Beau Schmitt, co-founder of Sunday Scaries, he exuded an overwhelming sense of chill. But like so many entrepreneurs in wellness, his story is one of finding his purpose through adversity.

He and his co-founder Mike owned a bar with upwards of 50 employees - a time of 14-hour days and "putting out little tiny fires" all the time. Around 2015, they were looking for something to calm them down without setting them up for failure the next morning. A friend turned them onto CBD - a cannabinoid that's now pretty ubiquitous in food, beverage, beauty and more.

After they had trouble finding CBD online with a good purchase experience and with a certificate of analysis (COA), Beau and Mike decided to create their own brand of CBD that filled in those blanks for stressed out young professionals. The pair launched Sunday Scaries in 2017 and that also came on the heels of losing Beau's dad suddenly at only 63 years old.

You'll hear about that on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals as well as Beau's goals - which right now surround starting a family. Beau and I had a real conversation about trying to conceive from a gent's perspective. We discuss TTC as cis, straight people, but we both realize there's a whole spectrum of people trying to conceive or build families in a variety of ways. Regardless of your family's structure or who you love, the process can be shrouded in this weird, taboo, mystery, which isn't good for anyone's mental health.

So we talked about it. I tried my best not to be weird and I mostly succeeded.

We also dug into Sunday Scaries' brand values, which all started from a simple question of "Why is Ryan Reynolds as Deadpool on all of your printed collateral?" and spun into a really interesting conversation on how the brand's culture came to be. After doing a values exercise a few years ago using an infrastructure from Rocket Fuel, they landed on these core values

• Be an antihero - or acknowledge your imperfections
• Delivering Happiness - do whatever they can for the customer
• Grow or die - They look at performance like a tree, they want to grow their roots along with their branches
• Keep it 100 - They ask each other for honesty about interactions with each other and the tough stuff in life
• Let's get ready to Rumble - They come to the office ready to celebrate each others' wins

On the episode, you'll also hear Beau talk about these other resources: * Get Sunday Scaries for 20% off with Code LIFE20 here * Follow Sunday Scaries on Instagram * One of the books Beau mentioned: Delivering Happiness (The Tony Hsieh story) * Another Book Beau mentioned as a part of his morning routine: The One Thing * Rocket Fuel, which Beau mentioned as a source of inspiration for the company's values exercise

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Leaned up against his car, Brian Kent, waited outside of my home on a winter morning in Chicago with a proof of his book "Walked On" tucked under his arm. I've known Kent for a while - we trained together, we worked together, and I consider him a friend.

On the pages of the book he hands me are the formative years of his life as an athlete spelled out in the details of opportunities and setbacks, which seem to occur in alternating order. I've heard some of the stories - I knew he met his wife in Nebraska, I knew he inevitably signed a contract with the Chicago White Sox (a team I vowed to care about at least a little when I married my husband) - but together, all at once it spells out a different kind of story of the college athlete. The story of the athletes without advocates trying to navigate an insanely complicated and ever-changing system.

On this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, Kent and I discuss why he wrote the book, what it took to finally put fingers to keyboard and the goal of writing it all down in the first place.

And to hear Kent tell it, it's not a cautionary tale, really. It's a story of learning to find an internal motivation to keep going for the love of being good at something and pushing yourself to perform. He wants that message to make its way to young athletes everywhere - being good for the sake of that alone, not praise - especially those who want to stick with a sport into college.

It's also a story of being at the right place at the right time a few times over - born to a great coach, promised a scholarship at a Big10 University (you'll have to read the book to see how that turns out), working at a gym at the exact time a Chicago White Sox talent scout works out. It takes hard work and luck.

But it's also another reason to protect young and impressionable athletes trying desperately to make it in the college athletics business. For every very resilient athlete like Kent, there's another who develops mental health concerns, injuries, have their playing time cut without explanation, or start to question why they're spending a full-time job's worth of time on something. In a report by Harvard Athletics, varsity sports reported on attrition from sports in general, noting that one in four varsity athletes leave their sports by senior year, while many other Division I schools report attrition around 30 percent.

You'll hear Kent and I talk about this and more on this week's episode.

Resources: * Get the Book "Walked On: Life Lessons From A Two-Sport Non-Scholarship College Athlete" * Follow Brian Kent on Instagram * Find Brian everywhere he trains

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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One of my favorite things in the world is to find and try new products trying to shake up the grocery store. Cruising through food-instagram, I stumbled upon Lovebird Foods, which felt like a growing better-for-you brand. After three clicks that led to a half hour down this company's organic, whole-food cereal rabbit hole. I bought a three-pack of this cereal that's made of good stuff like cassava flour, honey, coconut oil, collagen, and sea salt.

It's all stuff I can eat with my extra sensitive colon after I had a few inches of it removed last summer. I never thought I would have cereal again.

And I immediately emailed the founder, Parker Brook, to learn more about him and the company he created. After connecting, I knew that I needed to have him on the podcast.

On this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, he talks about why he created Lovebird Cereal, his autoimmune disorders, and why the company donates 20% of proceeds to childhood cancer. You'll also hear a lot about his key stakeholder, his daughter Yuki. Her birth led to a lot of the changes he made in his own health journey, trying to gain energy from food rather than ending every day drained. She also gets to test the goods before they make it to you and me.

And cutest of all: he named the company after his nickname for her, "Lovebird." Get you a partner who can parent like that.

Resources:

• The cereal is currently on pre-order (people love this stuff) and the next pre-order shipment should go out next week-ish. Parker assured us that there's "more than he knows what to do with" so orders should ship pretty quickly after next week.
• Follow lovebird on Instagram, you'll get lots of cute Yuki moments
• Read the lovebird story in Parker's words

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Vizer, an app that allows you to track your steps and donate meals, is currently one of the most popular Health and Fitness apps in the app store. If my email inbox is any indication, there are approximately infinity new wellness apps created every day. Vizer is doing something right - its users have donated 1.32 million meals to date.

This app's concept is incredibly simple as you'll hear Dylan Barbour, co-founder and CGO, and Samantha Pantazopoulos, co-founder and CEO, explain on this week's episode of the podcast. As soon as a user hits 30 minutes of exercise or 10,000 steps in a day, they're able to donate a meal, which is furnished by one of Vizer's promotional partners. Move your body and do good.

There are also a number of other perks for users like discounts and rewards with Vizer's expansive partnership network.

In just under four years, the pair - who are not only co-founders, but also cousins - created and built the app to what it is today. The idea for it came to Pantazopoulos, who was fresh out of undergrad and just 21-years old, as she looked to live a healthier lifestyle. Barbour, the elder cousin, was 24 years old and left a job at Morgan Stanley - with benefits, he points out on the episode - to bet on his little cousin's idea.

Somewhere between the launch of the Vizer app and today, Barbour (whose fandom knows him as Dylan B.) took a hiatus to join the ranks of bachelor nation. He was on season 15 of the Bachelorette and Season 6 of Bachelor in Paradise where he met and proposed to Hannah G.

For anyone who has grown a business and scaled it with a lean team, the idea of your co-founder going to film a reality TV show on an island where they're without a phone and computer for weeks at a time would probably give you a fever and chills. Pantazopoulos expressed that basic sentiment - without the part about the fever - she was reluctant to run the business without her co-founder.

Today, she says that Hannah G is the best thing that's ever happened to Barbour.

Listen to what they're working on, why they got started and more. And if you watch the video version of the podcast, their cousin-dynamic and general Zac-Efron-ness is delightful.

Resources:

• Download the Vizer App on iOS or Android
• Follow Vizer on instagram
• Read about the $1million start-up prize Vizer split with one other company in 2019

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"When we saw the initial purchase orders come in, they were larger than the revenue from our previous year," Chomps CEO and co-founder Pete Maldonado said of getting the bootstrapped businesses' goods into Trader Joes. "We had to survive on the cash we had in the bank and we absolutely did not have the cash for this kind of production run."

So, he and co-founder and COO Rashid Ali put in the work to raise just over $1m from eight separate lenders from Friday to Monday - without giving up any equity.

If you've ever bootstrapped a company or borrowed money from friends who know you well enough to write a check for a six-digit figure, you absolutely know that the story of launching nationally with Trader Joe's was exciting - but was also an incredibly stressful time.

"We were going from producing 10,000-20,000 pounds a month to 300,000 pounds," Ali shared. "It put pressure on everything."

And after a few months, it was a huge relief to pay off their friends and family. "We actually started sleeping after that," Maldonado added.

And on this week's episode of the podcast, you'll hear how they scaled from an e-commerce brand to a brand that's available in a staggering amount of places: on Amazon, Chomps.com, Walmart.com, Thrive Market and in more than 11,000 grocery stores in the US and Canada (with 4,200 more grocery locations coming online in July).

It's an inspiring story from a lot of angles, like the care they take to make a positive impact on nutrition, the environment and animal welfare. But I'm mostly here for their odd-couple dynamic, which is a delight to watch. They joke that they needed couples therapy when they started working together because they're so different.

But they also share a lot of the same values, which I suspect is why the partnership has worked. You'll hear them talk about the way they think about growth, how their ideas about feeding people changed as their families grew, and and so much more on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals.

Resources: * Find Chomps online * You'll hear lots of love for many Chomps flavors including the newest flavor, Pepperoni Turkey * Pete and Rashid drop hints on new potential flavors and products throughout the episode * Pete mentions a product that got the Chomps team through the Pandemic - the Vertiball

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Content warning: this podcast episode and the post that accompany it briefly discuss eating disorders, recovery from eating disorders, and size discrimination within eating disorder recover.

On May 20, we created a panel to close out our Take a Mental Health Day event called Loving Yourself Today. We think the conversation from that panel was so important that we want to make it available to you as an episode on our podcast, #WeGotGoals.

During that talk, we discussed the language we use to describe our own bodies and others' bodies, a much-needed intermediary step between body negativity and body positivity, and the relationship between all of that and mental health.

This conversation featured tastemakers in the size inclusive space - Charlotte Oxnam founder of Cue the Curves and Gianluca Russo, founder of the Power of Plus - who spoke on the body positivity movement, adding color from their lived experiences as well as the experiences of their communities. And rounding out the conversation, Dr. Marisa Toups anchored us to a perspective in mental health and represented our partner Project Healthy Minds.

Our moderator is a voice that will be familiar to you if you attended our #Sweatworking Summit in February, Natali Villarruel. She's a marathoner, triathlete, Team USA member, body positivity advocate and so much more.

What we heard universally is that the act of self-love is an ongoing journey, not a destination. And because it's a journey, that journey is as different as each individual.

“I’m working towards body positivity, but that also means I’m working my way out of body negativity," Oxnam said. "I really like having that beautiful middle step of body neutrality.”

And body neutrality resonated for all of the attendees and panelists - it's a soft, forgiving middle ground, described as "a philosophy that you should focus on what your body can do for you rather than what it looks like." Whereas body positivity can leave those attempting to practice it feeling shame if they don't love their bodies every moment of every day.

"One of the best things about being a human is that we get to go on that journey," Russo said.

And on the topic of being an ally, each panelist has words of wisdom to share. "People walk around believing about themselves what they’ve had reflected to them," Dr. Toups shared on language.

And for Villarruel, the value of being an ally who works in the intersections is most powerful for her - specifically when putting your money where your mouth is. "Seek out brands that not only have extended sizes but also show different races and abilities," she said.

For, Russo, it's about knowing when to speak and when to listen. "Amplify other voices - especially those that fall under deeper marginalization and intersections. I think when you take the time to do that It really has the biggest impact and the best impact. It doesn’t matter how many conversations we have, if we don’t have that lived experience."

Resources: * Join the community that Charlotte Oxnam founded, Cue the Curves * Take part in the conversation with Gianluca Russo on @thepowerofplus.co and watch for the release of his book, The Power of Plus * Find resource from Project Healthy Minds for nearly every category of mental health needs * Follow Natali on Instagram to cheer her on as she trains for her next milestone, to meet her lizard, or to learn more about plants and good beer

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

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Charlotte Oxnam has a presence. She showcased that during Chicago StartUp Week when she wowed the judges all the way to taking home the top prize in a sea of some incredible competition. I was lucky enough to judge that group of competitors and I haven't let Oxnam get rid of me since.

She's the founder of a platform that's equal parts community and commerce and meant to serve the needs of plus size women as they shop for apparel. Cue the Curves is the answer for the women’s plus-size apparel market, which is vastly underserved. It's valued at 9.8 billion U.S. dollars as of 2019, and the average woman lives in what's considered to be plus-size clothing - wearing a 14-16 on average.

We've been talking about size inclusion all month on #WeGotGoals and we've spent a lot of time on apparel - it's not because clothes are the most important thing, but they are a thing that touches our lives every day. Today, women who wear sizes outside of what's considered a "straight size" face a dramatically different shopping experience that's equal parts rejection and trying not to get your hopes up.

That's what Oxnam hopes to solve.

In today's episode, she tells a beautiful story of her best friend - who wears straight sizes - creating an inclusive shopping experience for her at the mall. Oxnam tells us that her friend researched where she could shop and spent time in those stores, even when Oxnam protested, "but you can't shop there."

"Yeah, but you can," Oxnam's friend said.

And in a way, that's what Oxnam is hoping to build with Cue the Curves, a network of friends who watch out for each other in a way that is unique to best friends in a dressing room. And on this week's episode, you'll hear this 19-year-old talk about how she sees the problem and how she'd solve the problem. Oxnam is currently a sophomore at Northwestern University studying engineering and we can't wait to hear where she takes this thing.

Resources:

• Join the Cue the Curves community
• Read Oxnam's reaction to winning Chicago StartUp Week's pitch competition
• Follow @CueTheCurves on Instagram

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You’re going to hear from Sarah Piggot on this week’s episode - she was our guest last week and she’s the host this week as we continue to highlight more voices doing big things in body positivity. Coach Kanoa Greene was at the top of Sarah's list of inspiring humans she wanted to interview for this series.

And there's a good reason why: she's getting a lot of attention for modeling her belief in the fact that plus size bodies can do everything through movement and surfing. She spends a lot of the interview talking through what it took for her to learn to surf, which she astutely describes as "riding a piece of fiberglass on moving water.”

As a native of the Hawaiian island of O'ahu, she'd grown up around surfing. But before her, she hadn’t seen anyone who looked like her surfing. So she announced her plan to learn, and "embraced her body every step of the way."

She’s been featured in Self, Glamour and Essence Magazine and so many other places. Her workouts can be found on the Joyn App - which is a body-inclusive fitness platform that's getting attention for its body neutrality.

And something you'll hear about in the episode - she created a series of Plus Size retreats. And while the pandemic caused delays on her plans, she's currently working on bringing together a group of 25 women on the Greek Island of Crete for a private yoga retreat sept 27-October 2.

"Plus sized women often don’t a space that’s catered just to us," she said. So she created it.

Resources:

• You'll hear Kanoa talk about some of her favorite brands right now (Day/Won and Lolagetts)
• Learn more about the Plus-Size Retreat
• Follow Kanoa on Instagram
• Try her workouts on the Joyn app for free

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CW: Eating disorders are discussed in this episode.

About a month ago, we got an email from an aSweatLife ambassador Sarah Piggot who wanted to talk about what it was like to be a part of the aSweatLife community as a plus-size person. And this topic - inclusion and equity for people of all sizes in the fitness community - has been bubbling up inside and outside of our community a lot.

And so we worked with Sarah to create a mini-series on #WeGotGoals to discuss it.

Sarah Piggott started her blog, OfficiallyCurvy, once she decided to give up dieting and love her body as it is. This journey didn’t happen overnight. As Sarah “struggled” with her weight and to find clothes in her size pretty much her whole life, she challenged herself to run 13.1 miles. After dropping a half size or so when she completed the half marathon, she told herself, “alright, this is me.” Sarah, aka OfficiallyCurvy, showcases plus and size inclusive functional wardrobe staples and that you can be healthy at every size.

So, in tandem with Mental Health Awareness Month, we're doing a series of interviews with and by Sarah on the topic of size inclusion, body positivity and diet culture. We chose to do this during Mental Health Awareness Month because the ways we think and talk about our own bodies and others' bodies deeply impact our mental health.

On this episode, we touch on everything from learning to love our bodies, buying clothes, and the foods we eat. And Sarah reflects on her first interaction with aSweatLife and the way she felt going into it.

"When I was stalking the aSweatLife community, I never wanted to attend an event because everyone seemed so fit, and I didn't want to be the only plus sized person there. Then I went to the summit and I was like, 'I'm not the only one.'

You'll also hear in the episode that the topic of shopping for clothes hit a nerve with Sarah, and that's because just before the recording of this episode, LOFT quietly announced in a reply to a tweet that they would be pulling back their extended size offering and would only be making sizes 00-18/XXS - XXL.

At the end of the episode, Sarah explains how to support your friends who wear extended sizes: "The best way to support plus size is to shop where you shop and ask them if they're size-inclusive, and then ask them 'why not?'" One thing you can do is message @loft and ask them why they're discontinuing the line. Sarah's parting thought on the episode is something we think everyone can get behind.

"I just want people to think all bodies are beautiful and speak to it actually," she said "I want to walk into a fitness class or gym and not feel judged. That is my goal for the fitness industry"

Resources:

• Athleta piece on aSweatLife.com on the relaunch of Athleta's extended sizing
• Locally to Chicago, where aSweatLife is HQ'd, listeners can email Tera Gurney for a chance to win a $50 gift card to Athleta
• Find Sarah on Instagram @OfficiallyCurvy
• Read Sarah's piece about finding body positivity through a half marathon

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When Kristen Recommended The Power of Ritual by Casper ter Kuile, I grabbed onto the title. Ritual was exactly what I was missing in my pandemic life. Sure, I was doing a lot of the same things each day, but I wasn't doing them with the attention, intention and repetition that make a ritual.

And Kristen has never pointed me towards a book that wasn't worth my time.

What I didn't realize before I was pouring over the pages of ter Kuile's book (in a nightly bath/book ritual, thank you very much) was how much his writing style would make me want to be his friend. He's delightful on the page, and, as you'll hear on this week's episode (and if you've listened to him on podcasts Harry Potter and the Sacred Text or The Real Question, you already know this), he's even more delightful if you have the chance to speak with him.

But beyond being our new best friend, he's dedicated his professional life to rituals and community as a Harvard Divinity fellow (and so much more). As ter Kuile puts it, he gets to think about community and religion all the time as a job and how people can live lives of meaning, connection and purpose. But for the sake of understanding exactly how cool he is, I've taken the liberty of summarizing:

• Education: Masters of Divinity and Public Policy from Harvard University - he's a Ministry Innovation Fellow at Harvard Divinity School.
• Author: The Power of Ritual (HarperOne), co-authored “How We Gather” - his work has been featured in the New York Times, Vice, The Atlantic, and the Washington Post.
• Podcast host: co-host of the award-winning podcast Harry Potter and the Sacred Text, co-host of The Real Question.
• Founder: co-founder of startup Sacred Design Lab - a research and design consultancy working to create a culture of belonging and becoming. Co-founded Campaign Bootcamp and the UK Youth Climate Coalition, both training and mobilizing young activists.

But how he got there is the most interesting part. He was raised without a religious background, but was really interested in bringing the cultural and community lens to secular culture. That's how he - a human who grew up by all accounts as an atheist - decided to go to divinity school.

In this episode he recounts feeling rejected by religion as a gay teenager and so he "rejected it right back." That's why he says, most of his research is focused not on the beliefs of religion, but on the practices. And after years of that work, he's found that each of those practices gives a home for meaning and helps him pay attention to the things that matter most.

Listen to the full episode for reflections on writing a book and where you'll see ter Kuile once he achieves his future goal (hint: TV).

To say that Kristen and I loved interviewing Casper ter Kuile together is a super understatement. If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it, please).

Resources:

• How We Gather: a paper ter Kuile co-authored that examined where unaffiliated millennials were gathering (spoiler: it's a lot of fitness communities)
• The Power of Ritual: This is Casper's book that we absolutely recommend buying or checking out from your local library
• Harry Potter and the Sacred Text: this is the podcast that he was involved in producing for more than five years (and just semi-retired from)
• The Real Question: from the same team that brought you Harry Potter and the Sacred Text, every episode of this podcast has made me cry (in a good way, but I also have a lot of feelings)
• Follow Casper ter Kuile on Instagram

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Bri Zborowski and Kaycee Jones knew that Apolla Performance's socks would have a major impact on the dance community, a world notorious for punishing training schedules and injuries that can start in youth dancers. And with their roots in dance, they felt comfortable launching their compression sock for the audience they knew so intimately.

But at the same time, their aspirations go way beyond dance studios; in fact, they're not too shy to say that they want one million people wearing their socks by 2025. And yes, if you do the math, that means they're more than ready to expand into fitness studios, homes, airplanes, and more—because Apolla is for everyone with feet.

On this episode of #WeGotGoals, Kaycee and Bri share their origin story, which begins on a family vacation to a small Florida beach town. Then, you'll hear more about prevalence of injuries in dance and how Apolla Performance socks were created specifically to address these types of injuries. Bri and Kaycee also share the resources they've been building and how they've been educating their community using Instagram Live, plus what they're doing to help support studios affected by the pandemic and the racial injustice movement in the United States. Finally, they share their big goals for the future: getting Apolla compression socks on the feet of one million people within four years, and continuing to do good for Apolla's community.

Resources:

• Want to try Apolla socks for yourself? Use promo code ASweatLife.Com5 for 5% off your order, and don't be shy—they offer their socks risk-free, and If you don’t fall in love with them in 14-days and notice the difference, you can return them for a refund.
• Learn more about the Apolla Performance difference here
• For the latest on what classes and discussions Apolla is hosting, check out their Instagram account here

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A little over a year ago, the rug was pulled out from under so many fitness instructors who had relied on the traditional gym or studio model. Depending on the state and its laws, many of those trainers and instructors were 1099 contractors and weren't eligible for unemployment.

As studios closed and their customers tried to figure out which room was best to sweat in, many trainers were quickly thrust into entrepreneurship without much of a safety net.

That was sort of the case for Erin Schirack and her partner in creating the dance fitness brand MVFitness, Bobby O'Brien, except for one twist.

MVFitness launched pre-pandemic and was hosting pop-up classes at the Essex Hotel. After The Day The World Stood Still, which is how I'd like to stylize the start of the pandemic henceforth, the pair started to create a grueling schedule of free instagram LIVE classes.

You've heard this story before if you spent any time on Instagram in March of 2020.

After the calamity of constant livestreams, the pair turned to The DJ Firm to create higher quality workout content - it had recently converted its space into a production studio. In their first MVFitness recording session, Schirack pitched a new business idea.

She wanted to create a single platform where people anywhere could experience trainers based in Chicago.

“We really wanted to create this platform with a sense of bringing the Chicago fitness community together and elevating on the national platform of all of these other on-demand streaming services," she told me.

And so, the founders of the DJ Firm - Eric Sampson and Sye Young - along with O'Brien and Schirack all formed a new company together: Chi-society. You'll hear all about the why and where they want to see this company go in this week's episode of #WeGotGoals.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

Resources:

• Try Chi-Society free for three days
• Try MVFitness, the cardio dance fitness company, that Erin co-founded with Bobby Gouse
• Follow @Chi-Society on Instagram

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We've watched Bande grow from founder obsession to growing community living on a tech platform. And in creating a social network for boutique fitness, Rebecca Balyasny, CEO and Founder of Bande, has truly put herself into brand new territory.

She's not new to setting goals and achieving, which you'll hear about on the podcast episode, but she IS new to starting her own business in the fitness space. Previous to founding Bande, she had a career she loved in finance - and while at Prudential she raised her hand to fundraise a $2 billion fund - a challenge that took her more than a year and left her "boss's boss's boss" scratching their head because "no one had ever volunteered for that kind of challenge before.

And through that experience and her work with founders and startups, she caught the bug, second-hand.

"I’ve always been really interested in founders and entrepreneurs and their stories and what they went through," she explained, noting that, "No one can ever tell you what it’s like until you experience it"

Bande, though, scratches a new itch for her. Solving a problem that was nagging at her - and doing it in an elegant way.

"It was an idea born out of covid and just desperation to both connect with friends and get in the best workouts possible," She said. "It was really accelerated during COVID and I realized that there was nothing out there that allowed you to connect socially with your friends and get in a great workout and I just saw that whitespace."

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

Resources:

• Try Bande for free for 7 days
• Read more about the tech Bande is building in this #Longread
• Follow Bande on Instagram

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In this podcast episode, you'll hear Liz Hernandez, Founder and Creator of WORDAFUL, facilitate a signature WORDAFUL workshop. Through WORDAFUL, Liz has created a new form of storytelling that she hopes will encourage and connect you to the power of words. She believes we can create new realities for ourselves by changing our internal and external dialogue, ones that support more meaningful relationships and lives.

Liz Hernandez is a Mexican American Emmy-nominated television personality and journalist. As a former radio host and entertainment reporter for Access Hollywood, E! News and MTV, her career has been built on words, but no chapter more meaningful than the one she is currently living with WORDAFUL, a video and live event series that focuses on the importance of how we communicate with others and ourselves. Our thoughts and words from yesterday are what make up our lives today.

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When we met Nadya Okamoto for the first time, it was clear that she had a story to tell. Being able to share her story as an advocate gave her a thrill, but it also was trying for her mental health.

She'll discuss the ways her natural inclination to organize communities for causes drove her to create. She'll also share the ways that building a movement all while running from trauma ultimately led her to check into rehab.

In her keynote talk from aSweatLife's #Sweatworking Summit, she shares how the way she looks at menstruation and period poverty was also shaped by her own experience of housing insecurity.

You'll hear her speak about what led to founding Period Inc in 2014 as a high schooler to help distribute menstrual hygiene products and to help end a state imposed tax on menstrual products – or, the period tax. She published her book Period Power: A Manifesto for the Menstrual Movement in 2018. And this year, she co-founded a company built around changing the period experience, August, most notably removing the shame from the experience.

Resources:

• Get involved with Period
• Follow August on Instagram
• Buy her book
• Follow Nadya on Instagram

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This week's episode of #WeGotGoals features content from the #Sweatworking Summit - and honestly, it's been challenging to wait to post this until now. During Nicole Cardoza's keynote, the crowd was moved and I was a human goosebump.

Connecting with Cardoza and hearing her say, "yes" to speaking at the #Sweatworking Summit helped us to create something that we were truly proud of. Cardoza is the brains behind Anti-Racism Daily, Wellemental, and the author of Mindful Moves. She's also the creator of Reclamation Ventures, which invests in underestimated entrepreneurs in the wellness industry.

And she delivered a keynote with a poise that felt superhuman given what she and Texas - where she zoomed in from - had gone through that week.

The week of the #Sweatworking Summit was the very same one during which Texas was hit with a winter that led to the death of at least 26 people and the loss of power and safe water for millions in the state.

You'll hear her reference that as well as the response to community need in Texas throughout the talk. You'll also hear some of the parallels between what happened in Texas and the state of the wellness industry in her talk.

But the central and guiding question for Cardoza's work is this: "What would it look like if we were operating in a system where being well was a right?" And when you think about her career and what she's built, of course that's the question. Equity, access, and information for children to learn yoga and mindfulness, for underestimated BIPOC founders creating wellness businesses, and for all communities to simply be well.

The world of wellness she's building is one of abundance.

"There is enough for all of us to have access to wellbeing and wellness," she said. "It takes community care for all of us to be well - otherwise it’s an individual practice."

Listen to the whole talk in Apple and Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals and leave us a rating while you’re at it.

Resources:At the start of her talk, you'll hear Nicole deliver a land acknowledgement. If you've never heard a land acknowledgement before or if you'd like to simply learn more, this is an excellent primer.

• Not signed up for Anti-racism Daily yet? Do that here.
• Are you an underestimated founder? Apply for an impact grant here.
• Nicole referenced a public and racist incident that set the Internet ablaze when Yoga Journal. Here's what happened in her words.

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Peloton's Jess Sims comes on the podcast to share her journey from teaching in a classroom to teaching in a Peloton studio. You'll hear her share more about her transition from education to fitness, why she didn't audition for Peloton when she was first invited to, her current big goal of prioritizing herself, and how she's reconnecting with others during the pandemic. You'll also get to enjoy some guest barks and growls from Sienna Grace and Shiloh.

Jess Sims is a Peloton instructor in New York City who teaches classes on the Tread, on the Floor, and on the Bike, bringing her background in athletics and her relatable leadership style to the Peloton community. But before that, she was an educator and a Teach For America alum, who taught a variety of grade levels and held many different administrative positions within schools, including principal. In 2016, Jess left her Masters degree and career in education behind to pursue her first and obvious love: fitness. In Fall 2018, Jess joined the Peloton family, and she recently became a Reebok athlete and a dog mom two times over.

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I was speaking with someone over the weekend and I mentioned the theme of the #Sweatworking Summit: equity and inclusion in wellness.

"Is anyone trying to keep people out?" was the question that followed.

And if you haven't felt unwelcome in a space, like an "only," or a "token" ever in your life, it takes effort - and a willingness to be uncomfortable - to see the signs of it. This panel from the #Sweatworking Summit - The Relationship Between Representation and Inspiration in Endurance Sports - is the answer to that question.

Yes, in big ways and in small ways, through systems and through rules, obstacles are created to impede athletes with different body shapes and sizes, skin tones, countries of origins, languages spoken, religions, and gender identities.

In this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear a recording of our panel from the #Sweatworking Summit titled, "The Relationship Between Representation and Inspiration in Endurance Sports." You'll hear from moderator and Team USA member Natali Villaruel as well as a panel of other athletes that she hand-selected: Khadijah Diggs, Erin Hamilton and John Young.

Khadijah Diggs’ mission is to promote a positive image of Muslim women and Islam in general through sport. Erin Hamilton’s passion and focus are fighting for transgender rights, equality and inclusion in all sports, as well as being a strong advocate for mental health and traumatic brain injury awareness. As the first person with dwarfism to race in an Ironman distance race, John Young loves to inspire others with Dwarfism to see their own potential through sport.

Each panelist shares stories from the starting line or from the triathlon transition area during which they had specific encounters or interactions with people who questioned their right to race.

You'll hear them talk about how to cheer for someone you don't know, what it's like to buy a triathlon kit for a body larger than 2X, how some of the governing bodies of sport are setting rules without the people the rules impact at the table.

You'll also hear Natali tell a harrowing tale of an international triathlon race that included a swim through jellyfish-infested waters.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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When Dustin Kendrick first graced your television screen on Season 15 of The Bachelorette, you probably noticed his fantastic suit choices, his eye-catching nose ring, and the fact that he managed to stay out of the drama while making it pretty far in the season (a sure sign that he was well-liked by all). But what you didn't see on screen is Dustin's passion for volunteering and giving back on a weekly basis—a passion that he's translated into founding Guaranteed Karma.

Guaranteed Karma hooks you up with organizations you can volunteer with; then, once you've finished your shift, you're rewarded with perks from different local businesses around the city. The karma is instant, and the inspiration to continue volunteering sticks around long after.

Dustin talks us through his background with philanthropy, from how he personally prioritizes volunteering on a weekly basis to different creative ways he's gotten others involved in giving back.

Then, in this week's Goals to Go segment, Dustin advises Nimbe Juarez about how she can best network and build relationships to help her scholarship fund grow. [info about scholarship here]

Resources:

• Here's how to volunteer with Guaranteed Karma (they also update opportunities and perks on Instagram at @guaranteed_karma)
• Learn more about Nimbe's "Aim High, Dream Big" scholarship fund here (includes information about how to apply!)
• Keep up with Dustin on Instagram at @dustinbkendrick (where you'll be the first to hear about his latest venture, a canned cocktail made with fresh fruit, and the podcast he's starting with former Bachelor and now-roommate, Peter Weber)
• Follow Nimbe on Instagram at @fitfooddreams and cheer on her triathlon training journey!

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Shanna Missett Nelson's childhood was probably a little different than the average kid.

"I grew up just thinking that every mom put on a leotard and tights several times a day and ran out the door to teach a bunch of women who really adored them exercise," she said of her mom Judi Sheppard Missett, founder of Jazzercise.

And if you heard the recent episode of How I Built This with Guy Raz (one of our favorite podcasts besides #WeGotGoals, obviously) featuring Judi Sheppard Missett, you heard a story of her teaching at a local rec center and collecting cash for classes. Holding onto the dough? Missett Nelson, who joked that she spent her childhood as an accountant for her mom's budding Jazzercise business.

I wanted to invite Missett Nelson back on the podcast (we talked to her the first time in March of 2019) when we received a question from community member Amy Gumbs. Gumbs is busy building an online training business. And the kicker? She wants that business to stand the test of time.

That's what Jazzercise has done so well: adapt. They're still here because they're not the fitness company you know from the '80s. We know that they're really good at changing over time, but how did they do during the pandemic?

Missett Nelson, President at Jazzercise, talked us through the big and small things the company did to keep the global fitness community moving, including taking a financial loss to offer every Jazzercise member across the globe access to Jazzercise OnDemand at the start of the pandemic.

You'll also hear some excellent leadership advice, big goals that Jazzercise has for the future of its memberships, and real talk on navigating the needs of franchisees as a franchisor.

Resources:

• Jazzercise OnDemand
• Jazzercise franchising and classes
• Jazzercise's preferred platform for streaming: Intellivideo
• How I Built This with Judy Sheppard Missett
• Jazzercise on Instagram and Facebook
• Amy Gumbs online training business and her instagram

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Welcome to a #WeGotGoals episode that'll have you itching to chalk up and scale a wall at your local indoor rock climbing facility... or, at the very least, daydream about summiting your next mountain.

Claire Bao, general manager of Brooklyn Boulders in Chicago and lululemon Ambassador, is a 10-year climbing veteran who ironically discovered her love for the sport while attending college in the flat Midwest. And surprisingly, Claire was afraid of heights until she began climbing and opening herself up to new challenges, with the help of several mentors in the community. We talk about how social relationships are so vital to climbing, especially when you're new to the sport. And fittingly, she's working towards a big goal of building the climbing community wherever she is, while growing as a leader, growing relationships, and making the sport feel as welcoming as possible.

In this weeks Goals to Go section, we hear from listener Hester Lam, who needs help overcoming mindset as she attempts to scale her first 5.10. She's experiencing some mental blocks around the challenge associated with 5.10 routes, even if she knows the rating system can be subjective. They go over tips and suggestions from Claire, like practicing the same route over and over again and recognizing that failure is part of the process.

Resources:

• Rock climbing glossary and lingo from REI
• Want something to watch this weekend? We recommend Free Solo, the documentary about how climber Alex Honnold and his amazing achievement of climbing the face of the world’s most famous rock—the 3,000ft El Capitan in Yosemite National Park—without a rope
• Curious about climbing for a total newbie? Check out Brooklyn Boulders' intro climbing classes here.
• Find Claire on Instagram @Claire.Bao (and enjoy the adorable dogs Bowie and Bella), and cheer Hester on in her climbing adventures at @HesterInTheWild.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Since moving on from her role at aSweatLife, Maggie Umberger hosted the first and meticulously planned retreat that she though would be the basis of her own business, pivoted into an online community with a membership and on-demand classes (because, #pandemic), and continued to deepen her practice as a movement Coach.

Her last day with the company was less than a year ago. That's the speed with which she executes the things she's passionate about - I saw that in my four years working with Maggie and it's a delight to watch from not-so-far.

August 8, 2016 was Maggie Umberger's first day of work at aSweatLife. That date has been etched into my memory because it was the date when things really got real around aSweatLife. I remember this feeling of excitement and existential dread that fought each other on her first day - and I imagine that's the exact feeling I'll experience if I ever have kids.

Finally there was help, but that help came with a very real responsibility that I didn't take lightly - I had to make sure we at least had her covered financially.

I knew how I remembered Maggie's time at aSweatLife, but when we received a listener question from Jess Hook, founder of Believe in Blank Marketing, I knew I needed Maggie's memory and experience from growing from the two of us to more.

Jess wanted to know how to grow from her team of two to five this year. That's something that I knew Maggie could help add color to in ways that I've started to block out. For example - when there are only two of you running a week like restaurant week for fitness (#SweatworkingWeek) and you're both sick, the solution is DayQuil. I had completely blocked that out.

You'll hear us talk about Maggie's time with aSweatLife, what she's created since, what she learned through the experience and more - and of course her big, hairy audacious goals.

And you'll hear some listener questions that will give you a glimpse into how Maggie's planning to grow beyond this year too.

Resources:

• Yael Shy on #WeGotGoals (an episode Maggie hosted)
• Book a class with Maggie

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Melissa Stockwell is an aSweatLife favorite (yes, we play favorites occasionally). We've written about Stockwell as the founder of Dare2Tri, an organization that helps athletes of all abilities take on the challenge of the swim-bike-run. We went to her to get advice for athletes who are scared to "tri" for the first time, and she appeared on our podcast in 2018 to talk through her journey to becoming a Paralympic triathlete—a title she's hoping to earn again in the Tokyo Summer Paralympics this summer, if all goes well.

Now, we called on Stockwell one more time to shed her wisdom on our new podcast segment, Goals to Go, in which we bring in an expert to answer a question and give advice to a member of our community. In this episode, you'll hear Stockwell advise Sarah Foote about bike training for her first triathlon. Foote, an experienced endurance athlete who loves her pandemic Peloton, has been training on her own and with Edge Athletic Lounge; she comes to Stockwell with "a million questions." You'll hear them talk candidly and enthusiastically about selecting the right bike for your first triathlon, plus how to manage time and energy when balancing the three disciplines.

And bonus: in the listener-submitted Q&A at the end, you'll hear more about Melissa's (exhausting) training + life schedule, how she recovers, how she prepares for the Paralympics, and how COVID affected her goal-setting and motivational techniques.

Resources

• Follow Melissa's journey to Tokyo on Instagram and her personal website
• Get the latest updates on the 2021 Paralympics
• Are you scared to "tri"? Read this.
• Cheer Sarah on @sfootey on Instagram and at @spinnykitty_ on the Peloton leaderboard

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In the four years we've hosted #WeGotGoals, we've interviewed more than 200 high achievers about their goals. We've learned a lot about their goals and the ways they've found success through these interviews. And as we kick off our fifth season, we think you should get that same opportunity.

So, this year, we're playing goal-getting match maker. We're bringing on listeners who have big questions about their goals or people who are just plain stuck. We'll hear the experts' stories, but we'll also hear questions from people like you who want to know thing like, "how do I train for a triathlon if my gym's pool is close?" or "How do I create a business in the wellness space that's built to last?"

To kick it off, we're welcoming Luke Saunders, CEO/Founder of Farmer's Fridge to the podcast. Under his leadership, Farmer's Fridge has a big goal: changing the supply chain to allow easier access to healthy food.

And that's his North Star, Saunders explained. And having one big guiding goal just so happens to be the way that goal setting works best for him. The big "aspirational" goal guides him and a short term goal keeps him moving down the path.

Saunders has lived that way - one goal at a time - since coming up with the idea for Farmer's Fridge in 2011. It was then that he realized how hard it was to find a healthy meal while driving up to 1,000 miles a week across the midwest for his sales job. He was sick of eating what he could find at gas stations, fast food restaurants and grocery stores and he had a big idea to make wholesome food easier to get your hands on.

So he and his team created contactless vending machines and a totally new vertical food service model to go with them.

Saunders talks about the beginnings of Farmer's Fridge and shares how his childhood, the pandemic, and his actual desire to achieve goals have all impacted the business since launching in 2013.

His biggest pieces of advice for setting and achieving your goals? First, document it: this is the thing I want to accomplish and by when. Second, it has to actually speak to you, he said, “If you’re not obsessed with that goal, then let it go.”

Goals to Go, a listener question from Chelsea Stegman, RD Saunders - a seasoned mentor - also takes questions from Chelsea Stegman, a Registered Dietitian who is building a business to help “active professionals reduce burnout, manage weight, feel strong, and sustain it."

Stegman asked about finding her niche in business. In the episode, you'll hear Saunders dive into just plain good advice, like:

• Risk management in entrepreneurship and a concept called "letting go of the vine"
• How to spend your money and what's the best way to invest it when you're just getting your business off the ground
• And some good general business advice: "The first three years are really a blur, but you have to get through those to see traction."

Other resources:

• The chickpea cookie dough recipe you might not even know you love yet - we don't technically have it, but we do have the ingredients of the bites you asked about, here (We'd recommend using similar ratios to this recipe from The Kitchn)
  • Cashew
  • Oats
  • Maple Syrup
  • Cacao Nibs
  • Vanilla Bean Paste
• Luke's article in Fast Company in which he shares his internal feedback process
• Farmer's Fridge is hiring - they're adding a lot of bright minds to their development team
• Farmer's Fridge delivers! Listeners can get $10 off their first delivery order here!

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In today's podcast episode, we talk to Colleen Werner, the CEO and founder of Lulafit, a wellness company aimed at modernizing wellbeing to empower people in their everyday lives. She's an alumni of The University of Michigan and former professional ballet dancer.

You'll hear Colleen talk about:

• Why it was so important to Colleen that Lulafit be a company that she herself would want to work for—including hiring people full-time (rather than contractors) to offer health insurance, a 401k, and benefits.
• The unexpected upsides she's found from slowing down during the pandemic.
• Lulafit's upcoming app launch and what new features it'll offer their customers.
• And how she's learned to lead with empathy during the pandemic.

Resources:

• Lulafit's website and Instagram

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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According to a 2017 study from the American Psychological Association, work is the third-most common source of stress in the United States (only two percentage points behind the future of our nation). And with that one Buzzfeed article still making the rounds and having recently become a book, it's clear that the office (virtual or physical) is the birthplace of much of Americans' stress right now.

So if the stress starts in the workplace, could mental healthcare and coaching start in the workplace, too? That's what Boon Health is hoping.

Founded by Alex Simmons and Chris Henrichs, Boon Health offers a holistic, flexible, and approachable system for mental healthcare in the workplace. You know how frustrating it is to try and find a new dentist—let alone a mental health professional you vibe with—through your insurance website? Think of Boon Health as the MUCH more user-friendly version of that.

The seed for Boon Health became when Alex found himself exhausted by an always-on career in investment banking and private equity. He realized that most mental healthcare offered by employers was only reactive, meant to treat a crisis. But Alex didn't necessarily feel "in crisis" most days and didn't want to be labeled someone with mental health issues—so he found himself ignoring any resources offered by his company.

Now, as Alex and Chris tell us in this interview, Boon Health aims to lay the groundwork to prevent crises in the first place by through their blend of mental health seminars, personalized coaching, and group wellness events.

And one of the things that makes Boon Health so unique is that they also offer coaching and professional development. You'll hear Alex and Chris talk about how during the pandemic, they've seen that employees still want professional development and growth; Boon Health offers that with their coaching services.

Resources:

• Boon Health's website
• How Millennials Became the Burnout Generation by Anne Helen Petersen
• Can't Even: How Millennials Became the Burnout Generation by Anne Helen Petersen

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They'd spent their childhoods 15 miles away from each other in the Bay Area, but it took Boston University pairing the two as random roommates for them to meet. That was their first lucky moment, but the path that led Felicity Chen and Christine Yi to co-found Potli was a mix of lucky moments like that and real, inspiring, hard work.

After graduation, Chen returned to the Bay are to discover that her dad had picked up a hobby to help with her mom's asthma: he was bee-keeping in the family's back yard.

For Chen, that was a big "aha" when she realized that she "wanted to put some weed into honey" to make it easier for her mom to conceptualize eating a product like that.

While the two dreamed of their future company, Chen built a resume while doing business development for tech juggernauts and Yi honed her skills as a management consultant focusing on entertainment.

Today, Potli creates olive oils, chili oils, and different skews of honey - including their new Dream Honey, made with CBD, CBN, a pinch of THC (if you're buying in California) and melatonin. And that honey, by the way, is still harvested from Chen's family home.

Potli is a food company or a cannabis company, depending on the angle from which you're looking. They make "multi-tasking products," Yi said. "Really meticulously sourced, beautifully, minimally processed raw ingredients and then infuse them with health products like cannabis."

On this week's episode, you'll hear all about the goals that took this pair from friends to inspired entrepreneurs.

Resources:

• Learn about Dream Honey
• Dip your toes into cooking with hemp
• Try the CBD apple cider vinegar that the pair recommended to me

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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As a breakfast enthusiast who conned her friends into a Waffle House Club in high school, I've held a passion for breakfast food for a long time. So when we had a chance to interview Emily Groden, founder of Evergreen, about her clean, frozen waffle brand, I metaphorically elbowed Jeana aside and said "I GOT THIS."

Groden has maybe one of the most impressive backgrounds I've ever come across: undergrad at Yale, law school at Harvard, and a career in Big Law, all going according to her life's plan. As a competitive college swimmer, Groden knew about the importance of fueling herself with nutritious ingredients, and a few undergrad Then, one night, Netflix roulette landed her on Chef's Table and an episode about Alinea—and it inspired her so much that she sent a cold email to Alinea's founder Nick Kokonas asking if he needed a lawyer.

At Alinea and Tock, the reservation software Kokonas also co-founded, Groden learned the importance of being innovative and following her gut, asking why things "had" to be a certain way. You'll hear how that expansive mindset led to her founding Evergreen and more in this interview.

Resources:

• Need waffles ASAP? Check out Evergreen here and find Evergreen in stores near you here.
• A supercut of Leslie Knope and waffles
• Evergreen's drool-worthy Instagram feed
• How to make egg cups with your Evergreen waffles

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Over the years of hosting #WeGotGoals, we’ve heard a lot of founders tell us that they want to “Revolutionize X” or “Shake up Y.” But when David Rabie, the founder and CEO of Tovala told me that he's going to “revolutionize home cooking,” I absolutely believe him.

That's because I talked to him three years ago just after Tovala started selling to the masses, and I've watched the company deliver on the promises they made.

Tovala’s countertop cooking device uses a barcode to tell a smart oven how to combine steaming, convection, broiling and toasting to produce a chef’s kiss meal. And they promise less than a minute of prep.

Rabie says that’s all intended to give you “the best parts of home cooking, but none of the messy stuff – like prepping.” Salmon, he said, will steam, bake and broil as it cooks, giving you a perfectly baked, caramelized meal.

But the journey from idea to that smart counter-top oven has been winding, rewarding, and full of the kind of moments that occupy entrepreneurs' dreams. In this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear about Tovala's journey to winning the New Venture Challenge at The University of Chicago's Booth School of Business, their time at Y-Combinator, and their successful kick-starter campaign – which, by the way, meant that the company had to build a food production process and fulfill 1,000 orders.

At the time of our interview, Rabie had recently closed a $20 million funding round - the company's Series-B. And as he put it, "Yeah, that's a lot of money."

Resources:

• Learn more about Tovala and check out its weekly menu
• If you want to reminisce at how far company has come, look back at the sheer delight as Tovala (originally named Maestro) won the New Venture Challenge at the University of Chicago, Booth School of Business
• Learn more about Y Combinator and go to their free Start-up School, you don’t even have to apply for that.

Find Tovala and its menu online and look for a really incredible deal for both Black Friday and Cyber Monday. The Tovala Smart Oven, which normally retails for $299, will be on sale for Black Friday and Cyber Monday for just $99 with 6 meal deliveries. You can also get a deal with the code ASWEATLIFE for $50 off before 1/31/2021.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Peloton has been one of the buzzwords of the pandemic, but the attention is nothing new to Jess King. A lifelong performer with a resume that includes Cirque du Soleil and So You Think You Can Dance?, King's charisma was so magnetic that when she was recruited by Peloton, it didn't matter that she'd never even been on a spin bike before. The fact that she was a natural performer was what made her attractive to the Peloton team—and last year, she took that same beginner's mentality as she embarked on a two-year long journey to train as a Tread instructor.

Listen to this podcast episode to hear:

• How Jess found her start in fitness at a young age
• What she loves about being a beginner
• How she took the initiative to become a Tread instructor in training
• What the Peloton team did to help her succeed
• Plus, a super-personal family goal she and her new fiancée, Sophia Urista, are moving towards

Find Jess on Instagram @jesskingnyc (that's where you can find her most up-to-date schedule, PS), subscribe to her YouTube channel here, and learn more about her motivational style and playlist choices here.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Alex Caiola, the High Priestess of Brooklyn, thought it was normal to know all about the family histories and intentions of the people who she interviewed as an executive recruiter. This is until she had a psychic reading.

"You're a very psychic woman," she was told. And I was struck by how bad for business that would be for a psychic to tell someone else they were psychic too if they weren't absolutely certain about the information.

"You're psychic too," is a little more direct than, "You're going to meet a woman who will be very important to you." You can look at your life and the things you know and the answer is binary—yes, you are or no, you're not.

Alex started honing her claircognizance—which is the term for when you just know something—while she was working at SoulCycle. The perfect place to work on a little inner woo-woo, she explained. And in that time, she kept pulling a card from her tarot deck over and over again: The High Priestess, a card that signifies the kind of inner knowing that Alex was honing.

And so she listened, launched her business, and named it High Priestess of Brooklyn for the card that nudged her to do it.

In this episode of the podcast, you'll hear Alex explain that she was gifted her first tarot deck—the same first tarot deck that I was gifted. And, because we like each other and both have an appreciation for woo-woo, we started the episode by pulling tarot cards about our friendship. Along with maximum friendship and woo-woo, you'll also hear about Alex's goals, what it takes to write the horoscopes you find online and more.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

Resources:

• The Wild Unknown Tarot
• Birth charts (try something like Cafe Astrology)
• Alex's podcast - Priestesses Prescribe
• What's psychic knowing or claircognizance
• More astrology: Astrology zone, Astrology Twins

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“Really, I just feel like I’m above all things a creative,” 11-year NFL veteran Israel Idonije explained as he was describing his post-football business ventures.

Today, Idonije is truly stretching those his creative muscles on a lot of different ventures.

Israel is the founder of iF Charities, which has programs that have contributed to the lives of over 10,000 youth in Chicago, Winnipeg and West Africa. As an entrepreneur, Israel has started several successful business ventures. His company blessed stands as the industry leader in communion supplies, and ATHLiTACOMiCS develops custom comic content and properties. He also cofounded Crypto Key Stack and launched FBRK (fabric) Impact House, a 40,000 square-foot, first of its kind philanthropic hub in the heart of Chicago’s Loop.

But when he talks about it, one business really has his heart.

He opened RSTR, a gym in Chicago’s South Loop last year is focusing on building that community and the business’s future – yes, even during the pandemic.

This level and breadth of accomplishment didn’t come from nothing. Idonije’s family drilled the idea of goals into him.

“Growing up, we were very strict in our household, and as a part of our daily routine, we needed to journal,” Idonije recalled.

And in those journals at 13, he set himself on path that was close to where he ended up.

He wanted to play for the Chicago Bulls alongside Michael Jordan. What’s that saying? Shoot for the Bulls and you’ll end up among the Bears.

In this episode, you’ll hear about Idonije’s other childhood goals (and some of them might make you love him more) as well as his plans for retirement.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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I met Chris Fanucchi about a year ago, just as he'd started to build the company he's currently working on now: Bitewell. But go on a conversation journey with Chris—like you will in this week's episode of #WeGotGoals—and you'll notice that his brain works differently.

To the question, "How'd you go from winning an innovation competition in college to starting Bitewell?"

"Let me tell you about my step-grandfather named Stan - he's an author and the only guy in Illinois to wear a cowboy hat all the time,” he started.

When Kristen Geil, our Chief Content Officer asked him about the state of consumer packaged goods in an article about Bitewell, he told her about his favorite website in middle school: hotnewhiphop.com.

But in years of talking to entrepreneurs, I've seen over and over again that the way their synapses fire forces them to see the world differently. What does Hot New Hip Hop have to do with CPG? The volume of new food products can be easy to get lost in—Fanucchi wants to help you to find what's hot in the new stuff. What does Step-grandpa Stan who wears a cowboy hat have to do with Bitewell? He doesn't want YOU, dear reader, to have to carry around your own gluten free roll when you go out to eat at a restaurant—like Stan does.

On this episode, you'll hear Chris describe his journey from taking second place in an innovation competition at DePaul to creating his own study of entrepreneurship.

Resources:

• We allude to aSweatLife's Bitebox, which you should absolutely buy if you're looking for something to take on your next adventure. (Get $5 off the aSweatLife Bitebox with promo code "SWEAT", too!)
• Chris talks about some of the products he worked on in early days like Koia and Limitless (we've also had his Koia co-founder Maya French on #WeGotGoals)
• Follow @BitewellCo

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Any time Beyoncé endorses something, our ears perk up—so naturally, we were psyched to host Michael Tennant, founder of CEO of Curiosity Lab, on #WeGotGoals this week. Michael is a thoughtful, creative entrepreneur who's focused on working with businesses that are mission-driven and aligned with his team's values. His card game, Actually Curious, went viral, and our team fell in love with its friendship-making appeal and how it helps you connect to others on a deeper level.

In 2017, Michael founded Curiosity Lab, a boutique marketing agency that builds products and experiences that change narratives. In 2018, he created a viral deep conversation card game called Actually Curious, which is designed to bring people close and spread tools for empathy (www.actuallycurious.com) and has been featured in Beyoncé's Black Parade List, Goop, Cosmopolitan, Thrive, Man Repeller, and more. Michael’s long term ambition is to build a thriving integrated products, media, and services business, from communities of color and intended to unite the world.

On this episode, you'll hear Michael Tennant share some of the projects that have meant the most to him. Plus, he and Kristen take turns playing Actually Curious on the air, hitting on topics like bad dates and the three people we spend the most time with. And of course, we hit on all the requisite goal-getting topics you know and love.

Resources:

• We highly endorse the Actually Curious cards—buy your set here.
• The Actually Curious Instagram just did a major deep dive on black-owned businesses to support. Find the highlight here.
• Follow Actually Curious on Instagram: @actuallyc_rious

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This podcast was recorded in partnership with ZYN. As always, we only partner with brands, products, and experiences we truly love. Want to try ZYN for yourself? Get 25% off using this link or with code “asweatlife” at checkout!

Asim Khan grew up knowing that turmeric was at the heart of many of his family's cures and treatments. Everything from the common cold to knee pain after a soccer match was treated with some variation of the root, whether as a spice in a curry or as part of a topical paste.

But it took a family trip to Pakistan in 2016 for Khan to realize just how influential turmeric could be, and how passionate he was about bringing its healing powers to others. Along with his brother, Qasim, Khan came back to the States and immediately started researching turmeric and learning more about its bioactive ingredient, curcumin. (Learn more about curcumin here.) They started experimenting, mixing up blends of curcumin and piperine along with vitamins C and D for extra immunity-boosting.

On this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear Khan, the co-founder of ZYN, share his "a-ha!" moment with curcumin and what it was like to pivot from finance to a completely new industry. He also schools us in Ayurvedic principles, the role of piperine in turmeric-infused drinks, and how being B-Corp™ certified reflects ZYN's commitment to whole-life balance and being a force for good.

Resources:

• Here's more info on why turmeric (and thus curcumin) should always be combined with black pepper
• There's tons of research and medical studies about curcumin—ZYN has a great rundown of them here.
• A fabulous turmeric face mask

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Liz Lefkofsky and her husband, Eric Lefkofsky joined the Giving Pledge in 2013. For those not familiar, the Giving Pledge is an initiative started by Bill and Melinda Gates and Warren Buffet that invites billionaires to give the majority of their wealth away.

"He makes the money and I give it away," Liz joked of the division of labor between her husband—who has the co-founder title on companies like Tempus,Groupon, Echo Global Logistics, InnerWorkings, and Mediaocean—and her, the Executive Director of the Lefkofsky Family Foundation.

The pledge was merely a comma in the sentence explaining Liz's lifetime of philanthropy and non-profit work. For Liz, giving is who she is, and that identity started in childhood when she lost her sister to a brain tumor, which resulted in her mother founding the American Brain Tumor Association. After spending her early career working in non-profits in Chicago, she continued her work with the Lefkofsky Family Foundation, which contributes to initiatives in education, human rights, medical research, and the arts.

Today, through VING! she works to give teenagers the experience of philanthropy and the opportunity to be the eyes and ears of the foundation.

VING! asks teenagers ages 14-18 living in the United states to answer the question, "If you had $1,000 to give, who would you give it to and why?" That simple question has garnered the support of celebrities like Kristen Bell (swoon) —especially during the current pandemic when VING! committed more than $250,000 to those in need.

In the first five years of VING!'s existence, the project gave 300 total checks away, but during the COVID-19 crisis, they've more than doubled that number, Liz told me.

"The delivery in-person is a precious moment ... the kids cry, the recipient cries and I cry almost every time," Liz said, noting that accommodations have been made to allow the teens to safely deliver these checks during COVID—either via Zoom or wearing masks and from a distance.

Liz's big goal for the future? To inspire a new generation with empathy and giving.

"This is $1,000 to give, but you can VING! every day," she said. "I just want VING! to be a moment and a movement where we can just do something kind for each other."

Listen to this week's episode and share VING! with a teenager you want to see empowered to give.

Resources:

• Teenagers: Nominate someone to receive a VING! by sending a 2-minute video here.
• Success Bound: the curriculum for middle schoolers
• High School Bound: The search engine to help master high school choice.
• The Yale Happiness class on Coursera "The Science of Wellbeing"

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week on the podcast, Kristen talks to Dr. Jen Welter, the NFL’s first female coach, the first female running back in men’s pro football, founder of GrrridIron Girls, and recent children's author. Her remarkable career in women’s football includes two gold medals with Team USA, four World Championships, and eight All-Star selections, Dr. Jen was the first female running back signed to a men’s professional team. Blending her passion for the game with a powerful, unique communication style, she broke through the biggest boys club of all, the NFL, as the first female coach in the league and the Madden NFL 20 video game. Crystallizing her journey into a playbook for overall success, she published “Play Big, Lessons in Living Limitless from the First Woman to Coach in the NFL.”

You'll hear how Dr. Jen went from tennis to rugby to football, why getting her PhD was so important to her, and how she found an opportunity in the pandemic to write a book series aimed at helping children cope with the weird world we're in right now.

Some helpful resources as you listen:

• Dr. Jen's website, where you can find out more about her achievements
• From Sports Illustrated: Jen Welter and the Backstory on the NFL's Female Coach Pioneer
• The Critter Fitter books on Amazon

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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"March 16th hit and the dumpster fire that was March and April followed." Jenny Duranski, owner and founder of Lena Rose Beauty, recalled. "It's hard to be proud of anything ... you just dig in and do anything you have to do to survive."

Although that sounds dark and bleak, Jenny is not. She's just incredibly focused on the goal of creating a clean beauty space. Her obsession with green beauty was sparked during her days as a nail technician when she developed mysterious ailments from working around chemicals.

That was her "there's got to be a better way" moment that nudged her into becoming an "accidental entrepreneur."

She studied up on cleaner solutions, even joining the Campaign for Safe Cosmetics before ultimately opening her business. Today, Lena Rose stands Chicago’s first green beauty boutique and spa, focusing on vegan, non-toxic, “farm-to-facial” services and products that are 100 percent safe for your body.

But as a brick-and-mortar business, the COVID-19 pandemic presented its challenges. During the shut-down, Duranski released a six-product line to bring the spa home to spa-regulars. She was also one of the entrepreneurs selected to be a part of the 10,000 Small Businesses Program by Goldman Sachs.

Listen to Jenny's big goals, how she involved her daughter in the business and what she has on the docket for the business next.

Resources:

• Listeners can use code "ASWEATLIFE" for 15% off at checkout to try Lena Rose for themselves.
• The Lena Rose House line
• 10,000 Small Businesses Program through Goldman Sach's
• Is Pluto a planet? No, but NASA gave it a follow up prize: Dwarf Planet
• The Wild Unknown Tarot Deck, which we used to pull a card for Jenny

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Confronting divorce in a foreign country, jobless, and without connections. That's the rock-bottom is where Jayel Lewis found herself just before she started to build her career as a personal trainer.

With experience under her belt, she moved back state-side from Germany and built a thriving multi-national, virtual training business (before everyone had to).

On this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear about those moments from Lewis, who is a certified personal trainer and nutritionist who has trained internationally, worked with the United States Air Force, and is currently based in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

Today, she teaches trainers across the globe how to scale their businesses in a way that allows them to build careers without burning out, the Fitness Curriculum

In our conversation, you'll hear:

• What it was like to go through a divorce in a foreign country without a support system
• Some perspectives on failure including, "Failing your way into" something.
• Why coaches need coaching too
• About Jayel's program that helps fitness professionals make more money off of their fitness businesses, the Fitness Curriculum

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In this #WeGotGoals episode, Kristen talks with Erika De La Cruz, a TV personality, best-selling author, and founder of Passion to Paycheck, a lifestyle conference and community. Erika shares how she overcame homelessness to thrive in the entertainment and media industry. She and Kristen discuss why goals are another thing that's better with friends, what you can't forget when making a vision board, and....

More about Erika De La Cruz:

Erika De La Cruz is a Mini-Mega Boss: Best Selling Author of Passionistas, and Founder of Passion to Paycheck, lifestyle conference and community. The California State Senate has named her “The Millennial to Watch” and she has shared her journey as a first generation Mexican American and survivor of the 2009 American economy crash with publications like Forbes, TODAY, Huffington Post, Entrepreneur and Vogue. Optimism and hope brought her out of her mentality of defeat and allowed her to create a life she loves: helping bring global access to positive emotional health & personal power for women everywhere. You can currently watch her on this season of Dream Life, which follows Serena De Comarmond, a seasoned international love-guru, airing Sundays at 10 am on Hulu and FYI Network.

Resources for this episode:

• Find out more about Erika here, and follow her on Instagram here
• Interested in Passion to Paycheck? Learn more here!
• Want to watch Erika on Dream Life? Find out everything about the series here.
• More about transcendental meditation here

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With 61 episodes of The Daily Distance under our belts, Kristen and Jeana come together to reflect on the two-month mini-podcast series and what they learned from our guests. Plus, they give a preview for what's next on the #WeGotGoals podcast and how they're continuing to evolve for Season 4.

Among other things, Kristen and Jeana reflect on these episodes:

• Barry's Chief Instructor and Nike Master Trainer Kate LeMere on redefining what success looks like as a high achiever
• AKT Fitness President Melissa Chordock on blocking time off on your calendar
• Scout Sobel on finding gratitude when every day looks the same
• 305 Fitness Founder Sadie Kurzban on sleep
• Dr. Melinda Ring on caution fatigue
• Simple Mills Founder Katlin Smith on her best cooking secret
• The simplest piece of advice EVER from Better Blends founder John Redmond
• BALA Co-Founder Natalie Holloway on pandemic hobbies
• Jeana's latest passion, Girl & the Goatceries

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This podcast is in partnership with The Kimpton Gray. Tired of working from your couch or being constantly distracted during your work day? Use the Gray as your personal home office for the day or night -with flexible check-in and check-out policies. We’ll include a mini bar credit for yummy snacks, bottled waters, your workday essentials like phone chargers and ear buds, travel-sized sanitizer and in-room Keurig coffee to keep you fueled.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Meredith LeJeune is a PR powerhouseand a yoga instructor to boot. With twins and a newborn in her house, she knows the value of a minute—which is why her recommendation is to do just one asana (or pose) when you need a little yoga but don't have time for a full flow. We talk more about which poses she especially recommends, whether her kids are into yoga, how yoga helped her transition into working for herself, and more.

Resources

• Meredith's Instagram page, where she regularly posts yoga flows and more
• Meredith's day job is running her own PR consulting agency, Thought Bubble Communications—they have an Instagram, too!
• The yoga classes and online resources Meredith recommends: Alo Yoga, lululemon, Fightmaster Yoga, Boho Beautiful Yoga, and Yoga with Adriene.
• Jamie Surya Yoga, where Meredith did her Yoga Teacher Training
• How to do the thread the needle asana Meredith recommends

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This podcast is in partnership with The Kimpton Gray Hotel Chicago. Book your perfect summer vacation at The Kimpton Gray Hotel Chicago, located only 4 blocks from Millennium Park, Maggie Daley Park, The Art Institute and the Chicago Yacht Club. Our summer getaway package includes a gourmet picnic lunch from Roanoke Restaurant that features options such as a deluxe Charcuterie Board, Smoked Salmon, and Mediterranean Vegetarian options, for you to enjoy while indulging in the City of Chicago’s outdoor attractions this summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

We were so inspired by Scandinavian culture last week, we had to learn more about how they get outdoors in all kinds of weather without wimping out like we do. So, we talked to Leslie Axvig, co-founder and co-CEO of Aktiv Style, a Scandinavian-curated collection of activewear that's timeless, stylish, and functional for every adventure. Leslie's best quarantine recommendations are daily walks with her family and a standing Peloton date with her BFF. We talk about the Nordic lifestyle (two words: mitten dryers!!), how the right clothes make any weather bearable, her favorite Peloton rides, and more.

And bonus! Aktiv Style has a special deal for its aSweatLife listeners: get $20 off any purchase over $100 with promo code SWEAT20.

Resources:

• Shop Aktiv Style here, and don't forget to use promo code SWEAT20 for $20 off your $100 purchase!
• Browse their curated activewear collections on their Instagram

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week aSweatLife is partnered with N!CK’S, the first and only light ice cream that is actually, truly, creamy. N!CK’s is a Swedish brand that believes healthfulness shouldn’t compromise flavor. Spoon-soft and never icy, N!CK’S has no added sugar and only 220-360 calories per PINT. That means you get a compromise-free healthy and TASTY treat, without the calories. And it’s the perfect way to start summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Tash Crudup is #goals. This professional dancer and choreographer has danced with Rihanna, Lourde, Kanye, and JLO, and she also appeared on the NBC show World of Dance in Season 3. She recently launched Lil Vegan Shawty, a resource house for vegan lifestyle including food and recipes, environmental imprint, fashion, volunteering, workout plans and more. She joins Kristen on The Daily Distance to share her recommendation: herbal tea for every occasion. She schools Kristen in what tulsi tea is, why veganism doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing mentality, and what might surprise you about being a professional dancer.

Resources:

• Lil Vegan Shawty, Tash's new venture and a resource for all things vegan
• Tash's Instagram, for gorgeous photos and more peeks into her life
• Want to try tulsi tea for yourself? Here you go!

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week aSweatLife is partnered with N!CK’S, the first and only light ice cream that is actually, truly, creamy. N!CK’s is a Swedish brand that believes healthfulness shouldn’t compromise flavor. Spoon-soft and never icy, N!CK’S has no added sugar and only 220-360 calories per PINT. That means you get a compromise-free healthy and TASTY treat, without the calories. And it’s the perfect way to start summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Karen Malkin is a board certified health coach, a certified eating psychology coach, and a brain health coach. She comes on The Daily Distance to share advice on how to drop any judgment from your food choices and ways to show yourself more compassion. We talk about getting rid of the "shoulds," what people are struggling with most during the pandemic, and how she's helping the healthcare workers of Chicago.

Resources:

• Karen's Instagram and Facebook
• Karen's website, where you can find out more about her 14 Day Transformation detox series

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week aSweatLife is partnered with N!CK’S, the first and only light ice cream that is actually, truly, creamy. N!CK’s is a Swedish brand that believes healthfulness shouldn’t compromise flavor. Spoon-soft and never icy, N!CK’S has no added sugar and only 220-360 calories per PINT. That means you get a compromise-free healthy and TASTY treat, without the calories. And it’s the perfect way to start summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today we talk to Niclas "Nick" Luthman, founder of N!CK'S and co-founder of LUB Foods. After being diagnosed as pre-diabetic, Nick changed his diet and lifestyle dramatically—but with a serious sweet tooth, he quickly looked for ways to get his fix and still keep his blood sugar in check. He shares why intermittent fasting and a ketogenic diet have worked for him, how the Swedish concept of "lagom" fits in with intermittent fasting, and how N!CK'S came to be. Plus, how Nick learned that he has the same taste for sugar as a seven-year-old.

Want to try N!CK'S for yourself? Shop their creamy ice cream here online or click here to find them in a store near you!

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week aSweatLife is partnered with N!CK’S, the first and only light ice cream that is actually, truly, creamy. N!CK’s is a Swedish brand that believes healthfulness shouldn’t compromise flavor. Spoon-soft and never icy, N!CK’S has no added sugar and only 220-360 calories per PINT. That means you get a compromise-free healthy and TASTY treat, without the calories. And it’s the perfect way to start summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Kate Van Horn is a tarot reader and healer, a business mentor, and the creator of The Elements candles. Her combination of savvy business mind and spiritual intuition give her a balanced outlook on life. She talks us through pulling your own tarot cards, what activities you might do after pulling your cards, how to set the mood before you shuffle the deck, and her favorite decks for beginners.

Note that Kate was doing her tarot card reading and shuffling in read time, so you might hear some light shuffling and tapping in the background!

Resources:

• Kate's website, where you can book a virtual tarot card reading with her or sign up for her (Full) Circle Tarot Course
• Kate's Instagram, where she videos her daily card pulls
• The two decks she recommends for beginners: The Rider Waite tarot deck and the Wild Unknown tarot set (although note! She doesn't recommend buying tarot decks online if you can avoid it—it's much better to visit a store in person and see what deck resonates with you)

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week aSweatLife is partnered with N!CK’S, the first and only light ice cream that is actually, truly, creamy. N!CK's is a Swedish brand that believes healthfulness shouldn’t compromise flavor. Spoon-soft and never icy, N!CK’S has no added sugar and only 220-360 calories per PINT. That means you get a compromise-free healthy and TASTY treat, without the calories. And it's the perfect way to start summer.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Felicia Alexander is the co-founder of BoxUnion, a boxing studio that pairs beats with punches so that you box to the beat, bringing a whole new challenge to an already tough workout. Today, she's recommending taking the time to fill your own cup, especially by spending time with yourself in the mornings. We talk about her morning routine, how neither of us is a front-row candidate for any SoulCycle class, and more.

Resources:

• BoxUnion's website, where you can find their digital workouts (plus, promo code STAYSTRONG gets you two months after your 14-day trial for just $20)

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week's podcast episodes are in partnership with The Kimpton Gray in downtown Chicago. Can’t wait for a day of much-needed pampering? Join us at the Gray and relax in one of our suite’s deep soaking tubs. Our weekend spa bathtub escape package provides you with an assortment of bath salts, an eye mask and a bottle of wine or Prosecco or try out or beloved DIY gin and tonic bar en suite to celebrate yourself as you sip and chill in our custom Kimpton Gray bathrobes and slippers.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Warning: This episode will make you want to drink. Mikel Noriega is the co-founder and COO of Elenita, a canned mezcal cocktail with mouth-watering natural flavors. Mikel admits to not being into morning routines or meditation; instead, he finds his drive and focus from big picture dreaming. Listen to hear what excites him about Elenita's future, how he balances major dreaming with granular day-to-day tasks, and his number one tip for anyone who's new to drinking mezcal.

Resources:

• Marie's love letter to mezcal
• Order Elenita online here
• Here's their Instagram page, where they do frequent giveaways
• Everything you need to know about mezcal

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week's episodes are in partnership with The Kimpton Gray. The Kimpton Gray Hotel is ready for summer! Think of us for your weekend getaway with great offers, packages and parking available. Check out our website to see options that range from private in-room virtual wellness sessions to enjoying a summer afternoon picnic in the park. We have something for everyone to enjoy.

podcast

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

We're huge fans of Amber Vittoria, a NYC-based artist and illustrator. Her art focuses on femininity and embracing the female form, and the colors are banging (that's a technical art term). After she hosted a doodle workshop with us, we knew she had to come on the podcast to share a quarantine creativity tip, and boy, did she come through. Listen for an easy drawing exercise that might convince you you're the next Picasso.

Resources:

• Amber's website and her Instagram
• Amber's Happy Socks collection, guaranteed to make you smile

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week's episodes are in partnership with the Kimpton Gray Hotel. As we navigate through COVID-19 together, the Kimpton Gray Hotel has remained open and the team has been working diligently to ensure that our community can travel safely and in style once again. Our policies and procedures offer guests and employees the highest degree of safety and peace-of-mind. From everyone at the Gray - we look forward to welcoming you soon!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Natalie Holloway, the co-founder of BALA, knows a thing or two about timing—you'll hear it in the story of how she appeared on Shark Tank. And with time being top of mind during the pandemic, she's recommending that you use some of this extra time to pick up a hobby, whether that's fitness, learning a language, or launching your side hustle.

Resources

• BALA on goop, where Natalie expects product to be restocked next
• BALA on Instagram, where they announce their restocked retailers
• BALA on the Internet, where you can be the first to know about an upcoming new product launch (!!)
• Isaac Boots, Natalie's quarantine workout obsession

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week’s podcast episodes are in partnership with NOW Foods, a leading natural products manufacturer offering more than 1,400 products, including vitamins and supplements, sports nutrition, foods, beauty & health, and essential oils. We like to think of NOW as our trusted wellness solution you can count on. Now through May 31, 2020, enjoy 20% off your purchase at nowfoods.com using promo code “asweatlife”.*

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Surprise! It's all Kristen today, and she's more than a little loopy from waking up early with a puppy who doesn't understand time zones. She shares two recommendations from her recent shelter-in-place experience, one silly and one a little more (but not a lot more) serious. Tune in to hear Kristen expound on peanut butter, Outer Banks, and what's worthy of our attention in a screen economy.

Resources

• Kristen's powdered peanut butter of choice
• That's it. That's the most important resource.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

*Offer valid 5/15/20 through 11:59 PM Central Standard Time 5/31/20. Offer valid only on products found at nowfoods.com. Prices are as shown. Some exclusions apply. Must use coupon code ASWEATLIFE in the Promotion Code field at checkout. While supplies last at nowfoods.com. This offer does not apply to applicable taxes or shipping and handling. Offer cannot be used on previous purchases. NOW Health Group, Inc. has the right to end any promotion at any time.

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This week’s podcast episodes are in partnership with NOW Foods, a leading natural products manufacturer offering more than 1,400 products, including vitamins and supplements, sports nutrition, foods, beauty & health, and essential oils. We like to think of NOW as our trusted wellness solution you can count on. Now through May 31, 2020, enjoy 20% off your purchase at nowfoods.com using promo code “asweatlife”.*

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

After a trip to the Mayo Clinic and countless sleepless nights, John Redmond was diagnosed with ulcerative colitis and encouraged to totally change his diet to one that was light on fruits and vegetables and heavy on processed foods. John Redmond knew there had to be a better way, and after a dietitian recommended a smoothie regimen, he went out to find a way to make a convenient, affordable single-serve option. Thus, Better Blends was born.

John and Kristen banter about his morning routine, why he drinks two cups of hot water every morning, his culinary aspirations that he's fallen short of during quarantine, and more. This episode feels like two buddies chatting—it's sure to make you smile.

Resources

• Find out where Better Blends is sold on their website
• Follow Better Blends on Instagram and flood their DMs with questions about John's version of "banana bread"

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

*Offer valid 5/15/20 through 11:59 PM Central Standard Time 5/31/20. Offer valid only on products found at nowfoods.com. Prices are as shown. Some exclusions apply. Must use coupon code ASWEATLIFE in the Promotion Code field at checkout. While supplies last at nowfoods.com. This offer does not apply to applicable taxes or shipping and handling. Offer cannot be used on previous purchases. NOW Health Group, Inc. has the right to end any promotion at any time.

View Details

This week’s podcast episodes are in partnership with NOW Foods, a leading natural products manufacturer offering more than 1,400 products, including vitamins and supplements, sports nutrition, foods, beauty & health, and essential oils. We like to think of NOW as our trusted wellness solution you can count on. Now through May 31, 2020, enjoy 20% off your purchase at nowfoods.com using promo code “asweatlife”.*

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, we hear from wellness innovator and Ayurveda expert Dr. Avanti Kumar Singh. Dr. Singh talks us through what effects inhaling and exhaling have on your body, and we explore how stopping to take three full breaths and few times a day can impact your mindset and your nervous system. No fancy breathwork or weird counting required—she tells you three super easy ways to lengthen your inhale and exhale for noticeable results.

Resources

• Dr. Singh on the Internet—plus, her just-launched podcast
• Her Instagram, where her DMs are open to answer all of your questions about breathing, Ayurveda, and more
• Her advice on how to breathe for more energy, a lot of which we touch on during this podcast

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

*Offer valid 5/15/20 through 11:59 PM Central Standard Time 5/31/20. Offer valid only on products found at nowfoods.com. Prices are as shown. Some exclusions apply. Must use coupon code ASWEATLIFE in the Promotion Code field at checkout. While supplies last at nowfoods.com. This offer does not apply to applicable taxes or shipping and handling. Offer cannot be used on previous purchases. NOW Health Group, Inc. has the right to end any promotion at any time.

View Details

This week’s podcast episodes are in partnership with NOW Foods, a leading natural products manufacturer offering more than 1,400 products, including vitamins and supplements, sports nutrition, foods, beauty & health, and essential oils. We like to think of NOW as our trusted wellness solution you can count on. Now through May 31, 2020, enjoy 20% off your purchase at nowfoods.com using promo code “asweatlife”.*

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Emily Griffith, founders of Lil Bucks, comes on the podcast today with two purposes: one, to explain what the heck sprouted buckwheat seeds are (and how to eat them), and two, to recommend connecting your pandemic culinary explorations to past (or future!) travel aspirations while also practicing things you can take with you post-quarantine. We hear about a near-disastrous Indian cooking attempt that got a little too real, Emily's go-to coconut curry sauce, how to create a restaurant-like atmosphere at home, and more.

Resources

• The granola butter Emily recommends
• Lil Bucks website, where you can find all the cool ways you can use sprouted buckwheat seeds in Emily's array of recipes (and, find them at a Whole Foods near you!)
• Lil Bucks Instgram, for gorgeously curated bowl inspo

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

*Offer valid 5/15/20 through 11:59 PM Central Standard Time 5/31/20. Offer valid only on products found at nowfoods.com. Prices are as shown. Some exclusions apply. Must use coupon code ASWEATLIFE in the Promotion Code field at checkout. While supplies last at nowfoods.com. This offer does not apply to applicable taxes or shipping and handling. Offer cannot be used on previous purchases. NOW Health Group, Inc. has the right to end any promotion at any time.

View Details

This week's podcast episodes are in partnership with NOW Foods, a leading natural products manufacturer offering more than 1,400 products, including vitamins and supplements, sports nutrition, foods, beauty & health, and essential oils. We like to think of NOW as our trusted wellness solution you can count on. Now through May 31, 2020, enjoy 20% off your purchase at nowfoods.com using promo code "asweatlife".*

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Bridget Connelly is the CEO and Co-Founder of Luna Bay, a female-owned and operated hard kombucha company taking over the country one store at a time. She shares her special twist on the Ivy Lee Method, a productivity strategy where you prioritize your top six tasks for the next day to reduce decision fatigue. Her version includes a book or a podcast she wants to engage with, three people she's sending happiness too, and more. Here's how this method can work for you, too.

Resources:

• Luna Bay Booch's website, where you can find Luna Bay in stores in Illinois, Colorado, California, and soon on the East Coast.
• Luna Bay's Instagram
• More about the Ivy Lee Method

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

*Offer valid 5/15/20 through 11:59 PM Central Standard Time 5/31/20. Offer valid only on products found at nowfoods.com. Prices are as shown. Some exclusions apply. Must use coupon code ASWEATLIFE in the Promotion Code field at checkout. While supplies last at nowfoods.com. This offer does not apply to applicable taxes or shipping and handling. Offer cannot be used on previous purchases. NOW Health Group, Inc. has the right to end any promotion at any time.

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This podcast episode is sponsored by Simple Mills, a company on a mission to make healthy eating simple so people can thrive. While we’re sheltering and baking our hearts out, Simple Mills’ super easy baking mixes have made us look like pros when we post the finished product to Instagram. From bread, to muffins, to pizza dough and more, Simple Mills baking mixes have 25% less sugar than other baking mixes and use only simple, whole food ingredients. Visit them at simplemills.com or follow them on social @SimpleMills for wellness tips and delicious recipe inspiration.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today's guest is Lisa Kendrick, a registered dietician/nutritionist on Dr. Valter Longo's team at Create Cures Foundation. She's currently backing Create Cures Foundation's COVID-19 relief efforts in providing free nutrition/wellness consultations during this time to US victims and first responders.

Her tip: use this time at home to reset your circadian rhythm. We discuss why now's the time to do so, and Li breaks the process down into three tips. We also get delightfully sidetracked discussing how to "eat the rainbow" and eat seasonally, plus how our sleep affects our diet and vice versa.

Resources:

• More about the Create Cures Foundation on their website, Facebook, and Instagram
• What to eat (and avoid) to improve your sleep quality

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

View Details

This podcast episode is sponsored by Simple Mills, a company on a mission to make healthy eating simple so people can thrive. While we’re sheltering and baking our hearts out, Simple Mills’ super easy baking mixes have made us look like pros when we post the finished product to Instagram. From bread, to muffins, to pizza dough and more, Simple Mills baking mixes have 25% less sugar than other baking mixes and use only simple, whole food ingredients. Visit them at simplemills.com or follow them on social @SimpleMills for wellness tips and delicious recipe inspiration.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Jessica Zweig, Founder and CEO of SimplyBe., knows a thing or two about human connection; in fact, SimplyBe. is a personal branding agency built on the idea that the power is in the people, and everyone has a story to tell. She's a go-to for all things human connection, authenticity, and (in a non-pandemic world) travel.

She comes on the Daily Distance and shares her two must-haves for a happy day: a morning with movement and meditation. We talk about her two current fitness obsessions, why morning workouts are working for us right now, and how her current fitness routine reflects how far she's come in loving and appreciating her body.

Resources:

• Visit SimplyBe.'s website to learn more about their services and get in the know about the new e-course they're launching next week, or follow them on Instagram
• Hang out with Jessica on Instagram and get her full story on her website
• Jessica's two current fitness obsessions: Melissa Wood Health and Taryn Toomey's The Class

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

View Details

This podcast episode is sponsored by Simple Mills, a company on a mission to make healthy eating simple so people can thrive. While we’re sheltering and baking our hearts out, Simple Mills’ super easy baking mixes have made us look like pros when we post the finished product to Instagram. From bread, to muffins, to pizza dough and more, Simple Mills baking mixes have 25% less sugar than other baking mixes and use only simple, whole food ingredients. Visit them at simplemills.com or follow them on social @SimpleMills for wellness tips and delicious recipe inspiration.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today's special guest is Katlin Smith, CEO and Founder of Simple Mills. She comes on to share her secret weapon in supporting organic farmers, avoiding the grocery store, and avoiding a cooking rut: farm boxes. We chat about what surprising ingredient she's mastered cooking with, how she stays creative in the kitchen, and why it's so important for her to support the food service industry right now.

Resources:

• Katlin's previous episode of #WeGotGoals and her appearance on our #FearlessFriday series (plus, our first-ever interview with Katlin)
• The Chicagoland farm boxes Katlin personally recommends: Local Foods (they're currently revamping their farm boxes, but never fear—you can still get all your locally sourced grocery must-haves via Mercato), Fresh Picks by Irv and Shelly, and Green City Market.
• Simple Mills on the internet: their website and their Instagram.
• In addition to their website, you can buy Simple Mills online via Amazon, Thrive Market, and Target.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

View Details

This podcast episode is sponsored by Simple Mills, a company on a mission to make healthy eating simple so people can thrive. While we’re sheltering and baking our hearts out, Simple Mills’ super easy baking mixes have made us look like pros when we post the finished product to Instagram. From bread, to muffins, to pizza dough and more, Simple Mills baking mixes have 25% less sugar than other baking mixes and use only simple, whole food ingredients. Visit them at simplemills.com or follow them on social @SimpleMills for wellness tips and delicious recipe inspiration.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

If you've been on one of our Zoom workshops in the past month (and if you haven't, get on that), you've probably see Marie Goodman's pixelated face smiling back at you. As the brains behind aSweatLife's partnerships, Marie leads the charge on collaborating with brands we love in unique, exciting ways (like tonight's Plant Parenthood workshop with The Sill). When she's not scouring LinkedIn or brainstorming how to bring a virtual fiesta to life, she's working on superhUe, the CBD-infused beverage brand she founded last year.

Today, Marie shares why she made a list of things she always used to say she "didn't have time" for and how it's helping her appreciate the extra hours in her weeks. We talk French press, long walks, attempts to learn golf, and more in this all-aSweatLife episode.

Resources:

• Want to tip us off to a brand you think aSweatLife should partner with? Or, want to team up with us to create something awesome? Email Marie at marie@asweatlife.com.
• Learn more about superhUe on their website and on their IG. Bonus—if you place a superhUe order now, you can shout out a healthcare worker and superhUe will send them a complimentary three-pack sampler!

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

View Details

This podcast episode is sponsored by Simple Mills, a company on a mission to make healthy eating simple so people can thrive. While we're sheltering and baking our hearts out, Simple Mills' super easy baking mixes have made us look like pros when we post the finished product to Instagram. From bread, to muffins, to pizza dough and more, Simple Mills baking mixes have 25% less sugar than other baking mixes and use only simple, whole food ingredients. Visit them at simplemills.com or follow them on social @SimpleMills for wellness tips and delicious recipe inspiration.

podcast

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Meet Tiffany Louise, a professional coach, speaker, author, and licensed clinical social worker. In her work with individuals and couples, Tiffany's sharing one simple yet impactful communication shift: forgoing the word "you" in an argument and replacing it with "I feel...". Listen to this episode to hear what mindset shifts occur when you ditch the "you," what the difference is between a therapist and coach, and how to follow your "I feel" statement for a productive, validating conversation.

Resources:

• Tiffany's past appearance on #WeGotGoals
• Tiffany's website, where you can find out more about how to work with her

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This episode of The Daily Distance is brought to you by The Roosevelt Collection, a Chicago destination in the heart of the South Loop neighborhood where life meets leisure. While we keep our distance, The Roosevelt Collection is helping us to sweat, eat, shop and relax together. They’re looking forward to seeing you in real life soon.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Dr. Melinda Ring, Executive Director of the Osher Center for Integrative Medicine at Northwestern University, comes on the podcast today to share her holistic philosophy on how to deal with caution fatigue and the chronic stress we're all experiencing right now. Listen to hear ideas about how to identify caution fatigue in yourself, why she doesn't think there's any such thing as a "good meditator," and what tracking apps she recommends to make sure all your health and wellness buckets are full.

Resources

• The apps Dr. Ring mentions: Remente and the My Wellness Center app by the University of Arizona Andrew Weil Center for Integrative Medicine
• More about clinical care at the Osher Center for Integrative Medicine
• More about the academic work happening at the Osher Center

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This episode of The Daily Distance is brought to you by The Roosevelt Collection, a Chicago destination in the heart of the South Loop neighborhood where life meets leisure. While we keep our distance, The Roosevelt Collection is helping us to sweat, eat, shop and relax together. They’re looking forward to seeing you in real life soon.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Ariel Upton, co-founder of the TODAY I DID IT RIGHT Approach and Self-Connection Journal, is a ray of sunshine traveling over the airwaves from Sweden. She joins the Daily Distance to teach us all about one of the "rights" found in the TIDIR journal: the PPT list. In this exercise, you identify the ten most essential people, places, and things in your life. We talk about why making this list is helpful for both present-you and future-you reflecting on this crazy time, plus Kristen shares what made her lists (spoiler alert: always peanut butter).

Resources:

• Use code ASL15 for 15% off a self-connection journal or a digital edition of a self-connection journal on the Today I Did It Right website!
• Join Ariel's morning writing group, Morning Rightness, right here or by emailing ariel@todayididitright.com
• The Today I Did It Right Instagram

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This episode of The Daily Distance is brought to you by The Roosevelt Collection, a Chicago destination in the heart of the South Loop neighborhood where life meets leisure. While we keep our distance, The Roosevelt Collection is helping us to sweat, eat, shop and relax together. They’re looking forward to seeing you in real life soon.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Dr. April Segal is a medically-trained pharmacist and owner of Remedy, a holistic pharmacy in the Little Italy neighborhood of San Diego. Today, she comes on the Daily Distance to encourage readers to use this extra time at home to really track the nutrients you're taking in so you can figure out if you're deficient in anything. We talk about the best app for tracking your nutrients, her real thoughts on Vitamin B shots, and what nutrient we might all be surprised to learn we're probably deficient in.

Resources:

• More about Remedy here (and yes, they're available for virtual consults right now!)
• Cronometer, the app she recommends for tracking
• More from aSweatLife on vitamins, what to know about Vitamin B12, and how Vitamin D could affect your gut health

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This episode of The Daily Distance is brought to you by The Roosevelt Collection, a Chicago destination in the heart of the South Loop neighborhood where life meets leisure. While we keep our distance, The Roosevelt Collection is helping us to sweat, eat, shop and relax together. They’re looking forward to seeing you in real life soon.

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Sadie Kurzban, founder of 305 Fitness, comes on today to talk about a passion she and Kristen share: sleeping. We talk about when Sadie wakes up these days, her thoughts on nighttime (and morning) routines, and what she recommends you do if you wake up at 4am and can't go back to sleep (been there, done that).

Resources:

• Sadie's Instagram and 305 Fitness on Instagram
• Here's the full rundown of everything 305 Fitness is doing virtually and how you can join in the fun
• Sadie's past appearance on #WeGotGoals

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Whitney Eckis, founder and CEO of Eckis Marketing and host of the Under the Influence podcast, is no stranger to hustle; after all, she built her own full service creative marketing agency from the ground up three years ago. But in the era of Covid-19, she's discovered the value of slowing down, checking in, and staying intentional—that's where her "mental wealth" check-in comes into play. Listen to hear Whitney's mental wealth check-in strategy and how you can try it too; plus, Whitney shares her thoughts on the roles and responsibilities of influencers during the pandemic.

Resources:

• Whitney's guide to her mental wealth check-in
• Whitney on Instagram and her personal website
• More about Eckis Marketing
• Featured episodes of the Under the Influence podcast

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Jason Loebig is a longtime friend of aSweatLife and expert at living the best day ever, in addition to being the co-founder of Live Better Co. and a Chicago founding trainer at Barry's. He jumps on the podcast today to share his tips for maintaining boundaries, the best place to run right now in Chicago, and his physical workspace must-haves for a productive day.

Resources:

• Find Jason on Instagram here and find Live Better Co. on Instagram here
• Sign up for Live Better's weekly newsletter here
• Live Better Co. is hosting a FREE two-day virtual retreat May 8-10 — they'll cover everything you need to know to upgrade your life. Learn more and sign up here.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Meet Scout Sobel, founder of PR agency Scout's Agency and one-half of the sister team behind Okay, Sis podcast. After being diagnosed with a severe case of bipolar disorder fourteen years ago, Scout has added several mental health tools to her toolkit, and today, we discuss her favorite one—gratitude. We talk about finding gratitude when the days are all strikingly similar, what it's like quarantining with (and without) family, and how her mental health disorder has been a strength during this time.

Resources:

• Scout's Instagram and website
• Okay, Sis podcast on iTunes and their Instagram
• Scout's PR agency, Scout's Agency

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today we bring on an old friend of aSweatLife, chef Alia Dalal (whom you may remember from our virtual spa night a few weeks ago). Contrary to all of our expectations, Alia's recommendation has nothing to do with food or cooking (so don't expect any tips for your sourdough starter). Instead, she's advising us to start stream-of-consciousness journaling. She and Kristen talk about the different names and methods for this journaling process (The Artist's Way, anyone?), how she sets herself up for this ritual, and why this ritual is better on paper than on a computer.

Resources

• Alia's website and Instagram
• Here's what The Artist's Way is
• More aSweatLife articles on journaling

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Kate Manson, founder of Tarot, comes on the podcast to share Tarot's origin story and her foray into CBD. She also dishes out advice for tuning in to your body, how to recognize and fight burnout, and her favorite herbs for stress.

Resources:

• Here's where to learn more about Tarot CBD
• Our favorite adaptogens for stress

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Get ready for some deep inhalations. Today, Kristen talks to Joy Dushay, a holistic life guide, breath work facilitator, spiritual teacher, and an intuitive. Joy talks Kristen through a round of diaphragmatic breathing and shares the "why" behind this breathwork practice. We promise, you'll feel instantly more relaxed after a few rounds of this breathing.

Resources:

• Joy's website and Instagram
• How to use deep breathing for instant stress relief
• Get more from your workout with these breathing techniques

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

For those of you who haven't come across her on the Internet yet, Ali Levine is a TV Personality, podcaster at Striptd Down With Ali Levine, influencer, and fashion expert. She's also mom to a toddler and expecting her second in mid-May. We go over her go-to strategies for coping right now, and Kristen learns in real-time what affirmation cards are when Ali pulls one for them. We close with advice for pregnant moms specifically and learn why Ali thinks water cures everything.

Resources:

• Ali's website and Instagram
• Ali's podcast, Striptd Down with Ali Levine
• The affirmation card deck Ali uses

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Kirstie Castaneira Biehl, aSweatLife ambassador and an event planner in real life, calls in to chat with Kristen. Feeling uninspired by daily gratitude when every day feels the same, Kirstie decided to start a "what I'm proud of" journal, where she keeps track of anything she's done that day that made her feel accomplished (even if that's drinking a bottle of wine). They also chat book recommendations,

Resources:

• Kirstie's Instagram, where you can join her accountability journey (tag her in yours!)
• The books we mentioned: The New Jim Crow and The Four Agreements

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Melissa Chordock, President of AKT, comes on the podcast today with one primary tip that's helping her get her workouts in: blocking off her calendar for her daily workouts and getting her team's buy-in to keep that time sacred. We discuss the virtues of calendar-blocking as well as the importance of changing clothes, their plans to tie-dye, and why the simple act of wearing an extra ring is making Melissa happy.

Resources:

• The AKT website and Instagram
• The AKT on-demand workout, AKT Go
• The tie-dye kit Kristen is using and the perfectly low-quality sweatshirt she's tie-dying

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Asher Gottesman is our guest today, a mental health expert and founder and executive chairman of Transcend Recovery Community. He’s also the host of his own podcast, Showing Up with Asher G. His recommendation: three tricks for resetting your day, no matter what time it is—because it's never too late for a fresh start. He offers advice for morning, evening, and times of stress. Plus, an argument for releasing all of your anger in a cathartic screaming session or by taking a baseball bat to a stuffed animal.

Resources:

• Asher's podcast, Showing Up With Asher Gottesman
• Asher's website, where you can learn more about how he's creating community through conversation
• Asher's Instagram and Twitter, where you can drop him a DM

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Lou DeFrancisco, President of StretchLab, comes on the podcast today to discuss why he prioritizes getting up before anyone in his household and what he does with those few minutes of quiet. He also shares why his morning routine actually starts the night before, and the new activity his family is doing together during quarantine.

Resources:

• A guest post from Lou on aSweatLife: Is Recovery the New HIIT? How The Fitness Industry Can Encourage Recovery and Where the Vertical is Headed
• More about StretchLab
• StretchLab on Instagram

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week’s digital content is sponsored by our friends at Lifeway Foods, the leading US supplier of kefir. Kefir is a cultured dairy drink with protein, vitamin D, and 12 live and active probiotics, which may support a healthy digestive and immune system. Show your guts some love with Lifeway Kefir!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

On this Friday's episode, Kristen connects with Ridge Davis, Master Instructor at The Wall in Los Angeles and celebrity fitness trainer. He's encouraging us to "win the morning," which doesn't have to be as intense as what Kristen initially assumed. He also drops one tip for fitness trainers working mostly virtually right now about how they can connect with their clients and provide a space for positivity.

Resources:

• Ridge's Instagram, where you can find his weekly IG Live schedule
• Ridge's professional website, where you can find more of his virtual workout options
• Past feature on aSweatLife: "How The WALL Breaks Down Barriers"
• The WALL, the Los Angeles fitness studio where Ridge is a master trainer

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week’s digital content is sponsored by our friends at Lifeway Foods, the leading US supplier of kefir. Kefir is a cultured dairy drink with protein, vitamin D, and 12 live and active probiotics, which may support a healthy digestive and immune system. Show your guts some love with Lifeway Kefir!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, Kristen connects with international woman of mystery Emily Eliza Moyer. A career strategist, educator, and coach, Emily wants listeners to dedicate a little of their time to learning something new—and it doesn't even have to be something "productive." We discuss the intricacies of making pizza dough, why she's trying to pick up French, and more. We also tap into Emily's specific expertise to ask what listeners should use this time to consider for their big-picture career, and what free resources are available to knowledge-seekers on the Internet.

Resources:

• The Science of Well-Being [free course]
• Emily's professional website and LinkedIn profile
• Emily's next (free!) workshop on Monday, 4/20: How to Emotionally Process Your Layoff

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week’s digital content is sponsored by our friends at Lifeway Foods, the leading US supplier of kefir. Kefir is a cultured dairy drink with protein, vitamin D, and 12 live and active probiotics, which may support a healthy digestive and immune system. Show your guts some love with Lifeway Kefir!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, Kristen chats with a familiar podcast guest—Julie Smolyanksy, CEO of Lifeway Foods, whom you may remember from this past #WeGotGoals episode. Julie shares how she's prioritizing her health during the pandemic, and she surprises Kristen with several unexpected uses for kefir in your quarantine recipes (one word: prosecco. Six words: not as weird as it sounds). She also shares her wealth of knowledge on the intersection between gut health and brain health, as well as what fascinating findings are being discovered in that area.

Want more Lifeway in your life and your kitchen? Join us on Thursday, 4/16 at 6pm CDT for a smoothie social hour! More details here.

Resources:

• Julie's previous appearance on #WeGotGoals
• Julie's cookbook, The Kefir Cookbook
• Lifeway's website and Instagram channel

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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This week’s digital content is sponsored by our friends at Lifeway Foods, the leading US supplier of kefir. Kefir is a cultured dairy drink with protein, vitamin D, and 12 live and active probiotics, which may support a healthy digestive and immune system. Show your guts some love with Lifeway Kefir!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Hannah Corbin, founding Peloton instructor, comes on the podcast today to share her insight on treating your body the way you'd treat someone you love. We explore what this means physically and mentally; plus, Hannah shares why it was so special recording Peloton's newest dance cardio offerings and bonus tips for stretching when you're working from home and sedentary.

Resources:

• Hannah's Instagram
• Hannah's Peloton bio
• New users: Sign up by April 30 and get 90 days free of the Peloton digital app
• Hannah's 10 Minute Foam Rolling: Chest and Back stretch
• Hannah's 10 Minute Hip Stretch

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This week’s digital content is sponsored by our friends at Lifeway Foods, the leading US supplier of kefir. Kefir is a cultured dairy drink with protein, vitamin D, and 12 live and active probiotics, which may support a healthy digestive and immune system. Show your guts some love with Lifeway Kefir!

Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, Kristen brings on Carrie Jackson Cheadle, a past guest and co-author (alongside Cindy Kuzma) of Rebound: Train Your Mind to Bounce Back Stronger from Sports Injuries. Carrie is a Mental Skills Coach and Certified Mental Performance Consultant, and she has tons of mental tricks up her sleeve to help you build resilience, whether you're an injured athlete or dealing with a global pandemic. Her recommendation: try using a pen and paper to write down your daily schedule. Here's why she recommends it, how doing so affects your brain, and how you can still show yourself grace and flexibility, even while following a pseudo-schedule.

Resources:

• Carrie's website
• Carrie's Twitter and Instagram
• The Injured Athletes Club
• Rebound: Train Your Mind to Bounce Back Stronger from Sports Injuries

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, Kristen connects with Elsa Guenther, a Rochester-based health coach. She's encouraging us to practice positive self-talk, especially at a time when we all need to be giving ourselves grace. Talk to yourself like you would talk to your best friend, smile even if you don't feel like it, and see how that changes your mindset and your actions. Remember, you talk to yourself more often than you talk to anyone else—so make the conversation a happy one.

Resources:

• Elsa's Instagram
• RISE podcast Episode 141: How to Choose Joy (Yes, Even Today) with Gretchen Rubin
• "Act the Way You Want to Feel" by Gretchen Rubin
• 5 Sneaky Negative Words and Thoughts to Banish From Your Brain

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

It's a familiar voice on the airwaves today—Maggie Umberger is on the other line, sharing her wisdom and good vibes with us. Although she was in training for a (now cancelled) triathlon in Miami this month, she decided to take the sign from the universe to ease out of intense training. Now, she's beginning her workouts with a few minutes of stretching to tune into her body and let it wake up gently. And, if after those few minutes, she's not feeling the workout, Maggie's not forcing it and is instead being grateful to herself for that little stretch on its own.

Resources:

• Maggie's Instagram
• Sign up for Maggie's email list here!

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, it's a just-Kristen episode, and she's recommending going outside first thing in the morning (insert all the caveats that you should do so under responsible social-distancing guidelines). Here's why a dose of nature is so beneficial in the AM.

Resources:

• 10 Reasons to Start Your Day Outside

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

This Tuesday, Kristen catches up with Steph Dietz. She's on the brand marketing team at sweetgreen (and helping them do a ton of rad outreach in the healthcare community) and moonlights as a boxing instructor at Shadowbox Chicago. As a fellow person who strugglers to work out at home (me, the other person is me), she's recommending creating a space in your home for workouts that you truly love. For Steph, that means keeping her yoga mat rolled out 24/7 and accenting that space with meditation cushions and a favorite candle—and if she can make it happen in a West Loop studio, maybe you can too.

Resources:

• Steph's teaching on the aSweatLife Facebook page LIVE on Thursday morning at 7am CDT—here's where she'll be teaching a Shadowbox-inspired workout.
• Steph's Instagram, filled with delicious looking #eatzbydietz.
• Here's where you can find the latest Shadowbox virtual workout schedule to enjoy the jab, cross, hook at home.

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, Kristen laughs it up with fellow aSweatLife employee Kelly Matkovich, our Director of Communities. Kelly is taking full advantage of having a (nice, clean) bathtub for the first time in her adult life, and the two go into a surprisingly deep dive on bath culture, atmosphere, and the surprising bath ingredient that's actually meant for your coffee.

Resources:

• Epsom salts with lavender for a soothing bedtime soak
• Terrasoul superfoods organic coconut milk powder (really)

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Today, you'll hear Kristen talk to Kate LeMere, a Nike Master Train and Director of Marketing at Barry's. Kate's a totally driven high-achiever, but her recommendation is to reframe what your vision of success looks like right now, as we all adjust to new routines and new normals. Listen to hear how she organizes her priorities while brushing her teeth, her thoughts on social media highlights, and what her big win was this week.

Resources:

• Kate's Instagram
• Kate's blog, The Four Percent
• Barry's IGTV schedule for live at-home workouts

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this podcast episode, Kristen hears from Tim Cohen, co-founder of Ethos Training Systems in Chicago. He's got a ton of movement-related certifications under his belt, and he's a Kinstretch black belt—so it's no wonder he recommends starting your day with some gentle stretching to warm up your limbs. In fact, Tim shares that humans are the only animals that don't automatically stretch in the mornings.

Resources:

• Ethos is leading virtual Kinstretch classes at 8am and 12pm on Instagram Live here (You can also slide into their DMs for info on virtual training!)
• Tim's morning mobility routine (bonus: clocks in at less than nine minutes)
• More about Tim's gym, Ethos

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this podcast episode, Kristen chats with Gideon Akande, a Men's Health top trainer, RIPTENSITY program creator, and Shadowbox Chicago founding instructor. His tip? Connecting with others over the phone to add positivity to your day—and maybe even reaching out to people you don't know whose work you admire. You'll also get an inside look at how Gideon thinks the fitness industry will change as a result of the current pandemic.

Resources:

• Gideon's website
• Gideon's Instagram, where he's posting a ton of great at-home workout content
• Gideon's Facebook page

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this episode, personal trainer and owner of Ladies Who Lift Rae Reichlin give her professional advice on what so many of us are struggling with right now—at-home workouts. Her recommendations: set a specific time aside to work out and have a plan ready to go before you even start the workout. Plus, she offers tips on how to make the most out of strength training at home, even when you don't have barbells or heavy weights around.

Resources:

• Rae's professional website, Ladies Who Lift
• Rae's Instagram, where she posts a TON of great at-home workouts with minimal or no equipment

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador and fellow podcaster Kacie Diamond talks about spring cleaning as an antidote to stocking up on toilet paper and canned goods.

Resources we discuss:

• Kacie's podcast, Cold Sweat Podcast
• What to Know About Clutter and Your Mental Health
• Tips From A Professional Clutter Clearer
• How to Spring Clean Your Kitchen
• 4 Tips on Managing Clutter from Gretchen Rubin
• How to Declutter Your Home in a Month

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this podcast episode, author, podcast, and freelance writer Cindy Kuzmarecommends slooooooowing down. Listen to hear what specific incident (and minor injury) led her to realize she needed to slow down and how she's incorporating that mental cue into her everyday life.

Resources:

• By Cindy: How to Find Credible Information in a Pandemic
• Also by Cindy: A Bioethicist's Guide to COVID-19

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, get some work done, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this podcast episode, professional organizer Sarah Parisi recommends avoiding the grocery store and instead getting creative by clearing out foods already in your pantry and freezer. She also gives some little known tips about makeup expiration dates, and we talk our favorite resources to help us get creative with cooking.

Resources:

• Sarah's professional website
• PaleOMG
• Cookie and Kate's round-up of pantry staple recipes

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this podcast episode, Dawn Jackson Blatner, RD and dietitian to the stars, recommends virtual happy hours (after a slight detour into our mutual obsession with TikTok). We chat about how virtual happy hours are providing a comforting connection to loved ones right now, what apps we're chatting on, and the twist on happy hour that Kristen made her friends do last weekend.

Resources:

• Houseparty app
• Dawn's TikTok profile
• Dawn's website

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador Alexis Allegra shares how she's using this slowed-down time to re-focus on the goals she's set for herself. With extra time on your hands, she recommends really taking the time to plan out those small, bite-sized chunks you can tackle that will eventually ladder up into a huge accomplishment. PLUS, a bonus work-from-home tip to add to your rotation!

Resources to help:

• Why to set weekly and monthly goals—and how to do it

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance, a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador and co-founder of Luminous Life Kate Lynch-Leeney talks about how she's using this time at home to reconnect with a meditation practice using the Ten Percent Happier app. She also shares her super-simple daily gratitude practice.

Resources we discuss:

• Kate's business, Luminous Life
• Suja Juice
• Ten Percent Happier app
• And, how to limit your screen time on an iPhone: Settings > Screen Time > Downtime

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador and fellow podcaster Julia Lynch talks about using time blocking to find a balance between working on her full-time job and working on her passion projects.

Resources we discuss:

• Julia's series on rejection for aSweatLife
• Julia's blog, Julia in the City
• Julia's podcast, Content for Another Day
• How Time Tracking Helped Me Set New Year's Resolutions
• How Laura Vanderkam Uses Time Tracking to Achieve Big Goals
• How to Track Time and Boost Your Productivity

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador Sarah Meskill recommends taking this time to stick to a morning routine—one that’s the same on weekdays AND weekends.

Resources Elise recommends:

• Built In > https://builtin.com/
• Hired > https://hired.com/
• Indeed > https://www.indeed.com/
• Google Careers > https://careers.google.com/jobs
• Simply Hired > https://www.simplyhired.com/
• LinkedIn Jobs > https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/
• Glassdoor > https://www.glassdoor.com/Job/index.htm

She also recommends searching for Slack channels in your industry, especially if you're in a tech-related field.

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador Sarah Meskill recommends taking this time to stick to a morning routine—one that's the same on weekdays AND weekends.

Resources we mentioned:

• Sarah's Instagram with pictures of her dog, Jameson
• How to Build Your Perfect Morning Routine

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Ambassador Hanna Cetkovic recommends adding in a daily dose of culture by streaming Broadway musicals, symphony performances, and museum tours. It's basically The Finer Things Club, but with a fun social distancing twist!

Resources mentioned:

• aSweatLife's sound bath with Lofti
• The Metropolitan Opera of New York app for streaming (Note from Hanna- every day without commitment, they’ll have one opera in ‘preview’ section; otherwise, there's a seven-day free trial)
• Broadway musicals via Broadway On Demand on Amazon Prime (some included with Amazon Prime; others free with BroadwayHD trial on Prime Video Channels)
• Seattle Symphony performs "Baby Got Back"
• Chicago Art Institute app information

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Welcome to the Daily Distance a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. In these short episodes, we’re bringing you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

In this mini-pod, Founder/CEO of aSweatLife Jeana Anderson Cohen discusses how she's scheduling time to cuddle her dog and how she's taking an overall approach to offering comfort to others right now.

Want the Daily Distance in your feed? Subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Hey goal getters, and welcome to a new daily series from the creators of #WeGotGoals. I’m Kristen Geil, editor-in-chief of aSweatLife.com.

We know a LOT is changing, and fast, and the uncertainty, the change in routine, and the social distancing can be a lot for a brain to handle.

That’s why we decided to use this feed to bring you one daily goal you can set for yourself during this chaotic time- one actionable thing you can do to move your body, connect with a friend, prioritize your mental health, and practice a little bit of self-care.

Everyone is looking for any way to feel better right now, and we hope this little mini-series will improve your day in some small, measurable way. We’re calling this little interlude the "Daily Distance,” and we’re collaborating with friends of aSweatLife to get a diverse set of perspectives in hopes that you’ll find at least one idea to improve your mindset and your day.

Want to be featured? Email me! Kristen at asweatlife.com. In the meantime, here’s my tip:

Cook a goddamn FEAST for breakfast or lunch. The time for intermittent fasting has passed. You need fuel to stay healthy, and you need an activity to distract you- something that takes longer than pouring cereal into a bowl (although I’ll totally confess to comfort-buying Cinnamon Toast Crunch last night).

I love this idea because it takes a pretty mundane activity- feeding yourself- and makes it an EVENT. You get to get creative. Don your Alison Roman hat and find a way to combine anchovies with a savory breakfast salad, or grab those dusty red lentils from the back of the pantry and make up a stew to use them in. Got a beloved multi-step recipe that you always crave but shy away from because gosh, it takes so much time? It’s now or never, listeners.

Personally, I did this twice today: I made an acai bowl for breakfast, which almost tricked me into thinking I was breaking my fast at Real Good or Graze. Then, I channeled that momentum into putting my own spin on an internet-famous recipe from Alison Roman- #thestew. I feel super accomplished, and I feel nourished from the inside out. Plus, I literally have all the time in the world to actually do the dishes and clean up after myself.

So, tomorrow, I challenge you to set this small daily goal: cook yourself an actual breakfast or lunch that feels fancy or exciting - if you need ideas, we have tons of recipes on asweatlife.com.. And, take a picture of us and tag us @asweatlife so we can drool from a distance.

We’ll see you on the internet tomorrow, goal-getters, for more tips from our community. Until then, stay safe, and cheers to going the distance together.

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Eddie Sandoval set out to bring a traditional food from his homeland to the masses—while supporting those who shared his heritage. Betina Gozo has used her influence as a celebrity trainer to marshall resources for children in need, through the Dance With Mweyne Foundation.

And Steve Umberger, co-host Maggie’s dad, used his theatrical talents in an entirely new way, inspiring dialogue between very different communities in their hometown of Charlotte, North Carolina.

This past quarter, we talked to these inspiring guests—and more—on the #WeGotGoals podcast, as we explored the theme of Contributing Generously. Along the way, we were struck by the way these big thinkers followed their guts to big-hearted accomplishments, and found more than a few gems that changed the way we thought about our own altruism.

We discuss:

• 2:26: The powerful moments that stood out for us from our interviews
• 6:40: The way intuition guided guests to worthwhile endeavors
• 10:40: How some of their efforts had multiple layers and dimensions
• 11:33: How they knew when it was time to dig in on a goal—and when it was time to move on
• 14:46: Why giving back sometimes requires separating yourself from the outcome of your efforts
• 16:20: Why, and how, to make an impact in your own backyard
• 18:02: Specificity, and how it can help you achieve somewhat nebulous-seeming aims
• 19:06: How we fared on our own goals for contributing generously last quarter (and the help we’d like moving forward)
• 20:06: What you can expect in season 4 of the #WeGotGoals podcast, heading your way after a short break!
• 26:51: Some news from me, your co-host Cindy Kuzma, about that next season. My heartfelt thanks to the team, and to you, our listeners, for your support these past three years—and I look forward to joining you.

Links/resources we mention:

• Previous episodes: Roundtable reshare of Chicago fitness equity guests; Sarah Larson Levey from the #SweatWorkingSummit; Anne Mahlum of [solidcore]; Mind-Body-Soul Connector and former dancer Robert Brace; Pinole Blue’s Eddie Sandoval; theater director Steve Umberger; celebrity trainer Betina Gozo; Alison Rootberg, founder of Wellness4Every1; Sarah Neukom and Matt Woodburn of ESP Presents and Exchange312; and our previous hostful episode

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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During this quarter of the #WeGotGoals podcast, we've had the opportunity to interview guests who have big goals to contribute generously to their respective communities. I couldn't help but recall an impactful episode we shared last season - a round table discussion among four separate guests about making wellness accessible and inclusive for all.

On this episode, Cindy Kuzma chats with Caullen Hudson, Tanya Lozano, Allison Rootberg and Ashley Rockwood - all fitness movers and shakers in Chicago who are doing big things for their communities.

From this episode, you'll hear them talk about the uphill battles they've faced (and continue to face) in their pursuit to make lasting contributions to the organizations they run.

Alison Rootberg is the Founder of Wellness4Every1, which aims to provide quality wellness programming to corporations while giving back to the community. These programs aim to educate and increase the health and productivity of everyone participating.

Caullen Hudson is the founder of SoapBox Productions, a film and social activism non-profit which utilizes media to power and sustain social movements for a more equitable and creative world. His team produces scripted narratives, documentaries, promotionals, written articles, educational initiatives, and Caullen himself uses his own fitness platform to reach even more individuals to start important conversations.

Tanya Lozano is the founder of Healthy Hood, which was created to address the 20-year life expectancy gap in Chicago between communities such as Pilsen and other, higher income communities. In partnership with the Youth Health Service Corps, Healthy Hood provides quality fitness and dance classes at an affordable price to the underserved.

Ashley Rockwood is the founder of Free MVMT Shop, first a pop-up space in Chicago and now a brick-and-mortar location in the heart of Lincoln Park. It is a space built to make people feel totally comfortable to come in, drop their expectations at the door, and just move.

Remember you can subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it if you can! It helps others find us!). And stay tuned for next week when we wrap up Season Three of the #WeGotGoals Podcast and let you know where we're headed in Season Four!

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Sarah Larson Levey, founder and CEO of Y7 Studio, hopped on stage as our keynote speaker, visibly pregnant and spilling truths at the #SweatworkingSummit January 25 and 26. And along with dropping knowledge ("It's like this now") the opening date of Y7's Chicago location (March 12) like one of the albums that plays in class, Larson Levey also opened up about the tough moments that came with building her yoga empire.

Along with the success she's experienced, like being featured on the cover of INC and earning countless other accolades, Larson Levey dealt with her share of personal challenges. In being extremely open about those struggles - like having two pregnancies end in miscarriage over the past two years - she empowered our #SweatworkingSummit attendees to share their own struggles, too.

In this episode, we discuss:

• 4:30: Sarah explains the totally-free Y7 Studio pop-up that started her on the journey to studio ownership in 2013.
• 5:41: Sarah talks through the injury that led her down a path to try yoga - her doctor pointed her towards yoga.
• 8:00: Sarah explains a Y7 Studio class and why the music played is a pivotal part in the programming,
• 9:40: Sarah talks about co-founding Y7 with her husband Mason Levey (who was her fiancé at the time - he's also been featured on #WeGotGoals with his company Wave Meditation) and how their skill-sets complimented each other.
• 11:15: We talk about her accolades - everything from being on the Cover of INC to Create and Cultivate's 100 women to watch
• 15:30: Sarah talks about how she learned skills in business, which she definitely did not major in.
• 16:30: Sarah explains the service mindset at Y7 and how her expectations for the consumer experience came to be from her background in fashion.
• 18:30: Sarah talks about taking on private equity funding to grow the business and how that changed things for her.
• 21:00: Sarah talks about getting a "work divorce" from her husband with whom she founded Y7, what working together did to their relationship, and what she learned.
• 25:00: we talk sacrifices and how sometimes starting a business can lead to other thing falling to the wayside. Sarah talks about how in the early days, she played a lot of roles and worked a lot of hours.
• 29:00: Advice on building your own path - this is when Sarah talks about staying focused and learning who to take advice from.
• 31:00: On learning to put on blinders to keep your focus - for everything from understanding negative client feedback to how to look at new competitors as they emerge.
• 34:30: Who the most important person in the studio is (spoiler: it's the front desk staff).
• 36:30: Sarah talks about her lack of a morning routine and how there are elements of Y7 Studio that were created to help her trick herself into wellness.
• 40:00: Sarah shares the best piece of advice she's ever gotten - "It's like this now," and unpacks the simple phrase.
• 41:30: Sarah shares one piece of advice for anyone who is trying to start anything. "Start now."
• 42:30: Sarah shares her big goals for 2020 - opening 5 studios this year in new cities other than NYC and LA.
• 43:20: We take questions from the audience - one audience member and studio owner asked about how to implement consistent feedback and create a consistent customer experience.
• 46:00: One audience member asked about the balance between taking feedback and staying true to your vision. "Your never going to be everything to everyone," Sarah said.
• 48:20: One audience member asked about personal growth and mindfulness. Sarah advocates for therapy and counseling - and talks through going to couples' counseling with her husband.
• 51:00: One audience member asked about Sarah's pregnancy and her plan for the future. Sarah talks through the two miscarriages she had over the two years before this pregnancy and how that's given her a long time to think about the kind of parent she wants to be.

Resources:

• The coach that Sarah uses Collaborative Coaching
• Y7's Chicago location (and its founding membership)

If you love this episode and Sarah Larson Levey as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Anne Mahlum could write a book on audacious goals. First, she went from running a regular route past a shelter to launching a national non-profit, Back on My Feet, that uses logging miles as a way to combat homelessness. Then, she started a chain of fitness studios—[solidcore]—that’s gone from two locations to 68 and counting since just 2013.

And oh yeah, she’s also run a marathon on every continent—including, most recently, Antarctica, where she took on 26.2 miles with just seven weeks of training.

Next up, she’s aiming to run the Rock n Roll Marathon in Washington, D.C. That might not seem so bold, until you learn that she was in a serious jetski accident last summer that left her with a compound fracture in her femur. That means she’ll be lining up for the race less than 10 months later—but she won’t be alone, as more than 600 people have pledged to train and race with her, as part of a team she’ll calling [stronger] together 2020.

When I talked with Anne for this episode for #WeGotGoals, it’s clear that she’s highly motivated by a desire to share something she’s passionate about, whether it’s running or recovery or a killer strength-training workout. In this episode, she talks about how she’s learned to listen to her inner voice, embrace her values, and prepare for setbacks ahead of time, so she can continue to move forward.

We discuss:

• 2:31: How she took Back on my Feet from idea to reality
• 6:38: What made her decide to move on
• 8:51: How she’s learned to listen to her intuition and get in touch with her values
• 12:59: The narrative that keeps many of us from going for big goals
• 14:24: What [solidcore] is and why she feels so strongly about spreading it across the country (and beyond)
• 21:46: How her identity as an athlete is fueling her recovery from injury, and why the marathon goal has been so critical
• 25:50: Exactly how she’s approaching rehab, both physically and mentally, to achieve that goal
• 27:52: Why preparing for the worst actually helps her do her best
• 33:32: Her big goal for the future of [solidcore]—100 studios by the end of 2020—and how she’ll get there
• 35:02: The one line she’ll never say in business
• 40:00: Her biggest pieces of advice for overcoming obstacles

Links/resources we mention:

• Anne’s website and Instagram
• Back on My Feet
• [solidcore]
• The [stronger] together team

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Robert Brace is, to say the least, a man of many interests. A London-born former ballet dancer, he now resides in New York as the founder of Brace Life Studios. His nickname in the wellness world? The "Mind-Body-Soul Connector," from his deep understanding and critical thinking on the ways our brains, bodies, and spirituality interact and influence each other.

On this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear Robert and his delightful British accent describe his life-altering back injury, the viral stunt that made him a celebrity overnight, and why his incredibly huge future goal is so important to him.

Notes from the episode:

• 4:10: We hear how Robert got to New York from London and the back injury that changed his life.
• 11:15: We hear Robert's big goal he's achieved from the past: opening his own fitness studio, which came from a dream of having a place of his own to put his philosophy into practice. Plus, how his background as a minister helps him meet people where they're at.
• 13:15: The viral publicity stunt that put Robert (and his abs) on the map.
• 15:55: We get into (a lack of) diversity in the wellness industry and how Robert's community at Brace Life Studios is providing space for women of color specifically.
• 18:10: Robert digs into what the "mind-body-soul" connection is and how soulfulness fits into physical movement.
• 26:50: We talk about the BodySense class at Brace Life Studios and how instructors integrate mindfulness into class programming.
• 31:35: How Robert gives generously by sharing the principles of healthy living with underserved communities.
• 36:15: Robert's big goal that he's working towards right now: creating a mind-body-soul movement that transcends him. No big deal. We dive into what that means and why he's so passionate about that goal (plus, an interesting interpretation of the "your body is a temple" phrase we've all heard before).
• 39:38: Robert's perspective on Jillian Michaels and her comments about Lizzo—plus what most critics have missed about this interaction.

Links we mentioned:

• BodySense, the signature class format at Brace Life Studios
• Brace Life Studios website and Instagram
• Robert Brace's Instagram
• ReSOULutions 2020, Robert's free 30-day online challenge to kick start your mind body soul transformation for 2020.
• Jillian Michaels and her comments on Lizzo
• The New York Times article about weight loss show "winners" and how the vast majority of them fail to maintain their new weight.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Long after they moved from Mexico to Wichita, Kansas, Eddie Sandoval’s parents still savored the taste of home. Each time the family went back to Mexico for a visit, they’d pick up some pinole—roasted, ground corn that’s made into baked goods and drinks. Eddie remembers mixing it with water to quench thirst in the summer, and sipping it warm with cinnamon and sugar in the winter.

Wichita has a sizeable population of people who have immigrated from Mexico. Still, the Sandovals couldn’t find their beloved beverage nearby. So, Eddie decided to start a company to provide it.

On this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, he explains how and why. One key motivator was the Tarahumara—the sandal-wearing ultrarunning tribe made famous by the book Born to Run. They hail from the same region of Mexico as the Sandovals, and drink pinole to power their endurance efforts.

During Christmas break of his senior year at Wichita State University, Eddie tracked down a supplier of organic, non-genetically modified blue corn (given its hue by the same types of health-promoting antioxidants as blueberries). He loaded up a truck in Mexico and drove it back to his parents’ garage. That was the start of Pinole Blue, a company that now sells powders, energy bites, cookies, and tortillas online and in close to 300 stores in 18 states.

In line with our focus on Contributing Generously, giving back has always been central to Eddie’s business model—a portion of his proceeds go to benefit the Tarahumara, and he’s sponsored Tarahumara runner Lorena Ramírez. On this episode, we discuss:

• 2:29: Exactly what pinole is, and why it’s so popular with the Tarahumara
• 4:48: Why Eddie decided to start a business as a college student
• 6:38: The big goal he’s accomplished, and why keeping a focus on generosity has been critical
• 10:25: The first steps to getting the word out—including Craig’s List and Facebook marketplace—and the big break that helped him take things to the next level
• 13:39: Challenges he’s faced along the way (including some top-notch cornmeal puns—the grind never stops!)
• 15:53: How his age—he’s still only 24—both hinders and helps him
• 17:37: The advantages pinole has as a fuel for athletes
• 20:07: His big goals for the future, including the dream sports stars he’d love to sponsor
• 24:57: How he stays balanced as a busy entrepreneur
• 25:49: His number-one secret to success thus far

Links/resources we mention:

• The Pinole Blue website, Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook pages
• Born to Run: A Hidden Tribe, Superathletes, and the Greatest Race the World Has Never Seen, the 2009 book by Christopher McDougall
• Start Something That Matters, the book by TOMS Shoes and One for One founder Blake Mycoskie
• Lorena, Light-Footed Woman, the Netflix documentary about Tarahumara runner Lorena Ramírez

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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On this episode of #WeGotGoals, we heard from Steve Umberger, professional theater director and creative director at Playworks Group. After founding and leading the first and only professional theater company in Charlotte, North Carolina for 25 years, Umberger shifted gears to make what he loved about theater - its ability to connect people on the most human level - the doorway into important conversations our culture tends to shy away from.

Beginning in 2018, he launched two projects that allowed two groups of people - one of a homeless population and one of an aging population inside a nursing home - to share their stories in ways they never told (or would dream of telling) before. Ultimately, the formation of these scripts culminated in two live productions performed for sold-out audiences, plus documentaries filmed throughout the process.

On the podcast, we talk about the impact live theater had on how the audience viewed and interacted with these stories.

"Just like the power to gather in any community—in fitness, or whatever the group is—but in live theater, there is a real union between what's going on on stage and what's happening in the audience," Umberger said. "There's a commonality that begins to happen that literally can change you in lots of ways."

But even more than that, we talk about the impact of community on an even deeper level, for the individuals who participated in the creation of the project in the first place.

"They were very different groups ... the retirement community is set for life, and the homeless population, a very different story ... and yet, both of these groups came to be as tight ... as a real family.

"People are people regardless of their economic status or life circumstances."

Highlights:

• 5m: Umberger talks about his interest in exploring how theater and documentary style work could be combined to portray real stories, and real words from real people who had not previously been given a platform to share their stories.
• 8m 28s: Umberger explains his mindset on manifesting the things you want and need in order to make accomplishing your goals a reality.
• 9m 42s: We approach the topic of the benefits art—and especially live performance—holds to offer perspective on culture and society.
• 12m 28s: Umberger shared how the two big projects, Call Me By My Name and Acting Our Age, came to be.
• 15m 37s: Umberger describes the initial goal of getting these stories on stage, but how over two years of consistent work on the projects, the goals morphed and in some ways, surpassed what he imagined.
• 24m 07s: We talk about the impact of working on a small scale, with a small group of people, on a deeper level that creates lasting, meaningful change and the potential for much greater impact outside of that small group.
• 27m 08s: Umberger shares the big goal he's proud to have accomplished thus far.
• 30m: Drilling the power of community one notch deeper, Umberger acknowledges that making your dreams a reality is only possible with colleagues around you to support you.
• 34m 40s: Umberger shares his goal for the audience when you see these productions or documentaries.
• 39m 05s: Umberger talks about the strength of humanity within the groups he got to know, the aging and the homeless populations.
• 43m 40s: Umberger shares his advice for reaching communities in a meaningful way - big and small - based on what he's learned.

Resources mentioned:

• Call Me By My Name by Playworks Group
• Acting our Age by Playworks Group
• Sydney Pollack
• SteveUmberger.com

Listen to this podcast about this director's big goal to share a marginalized community's story, what he learned about himself in the process, and what we can take away as a lesson for our own goal-setting endeavors.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Celebrity Trainer Betina Gozo and I met in a gym before "Celebrity Trainer" came before her name, though she's always had a larger-than-life spirit. With a light and infectious energy, she's a human tractor ray.

It was only natural that we took our in-class relationship to the next level: after a few workouts led by Betina, I asked her to be my friend.

And over these years we've seen each other grow, change and evolve. The most marked change took place for Betina after she moved away from her home-town of Chicago - first to Portland, then to Los Angeles.

Today, Betina is the founder of the Dance With Mweyne Foundation, a Nike Global Master Trainer, and sits on the Women's Health Magazine's Advisory Board. She also trains famous people in her spare time.

You can hear us catch up about her goals, what she's proud of and how she's changing the world on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals.

• 2:20: Betina shares how she tries to define herself by what she does, not by her titles, (but if you want to get fancy, she's a Nike Master Trainer and is on Women's Health's Advisory Board)
• 4:30: Betina talks about one of her original goals: to be the "nice version of" a celebrity trainer you've seen on reality TV.
• 6:35: Jeana and Betina talk about how their friendship started and evolved.
• 7:35: Betina talks about the life of playing in a cover band in Chicago and running the bar/bat mitzvah circuit.
• 9:20: Betina talks about being selected as Women's Health's Next Top Fitness Star and how she benefitted from the relationship.
• 12:20: Betina shares how her foundation - Dance with Mweyne - started from a trip that she took to Kenya.
• 15:15: Betina outlines the evolution of the foundation - fundraising, creating community and raising awareness.
• 18:54: Betina talks about how she's protecting herself, her sleep, and her recovery "so that she can give to others."
• 21:00: Betina talks about her future goal: integrating her passion for Dance with Mweyne and her life as a fitness professional.
• 22:20: Betina shares the mission at the heart of Dance With Mweyne - disability awareness.
• 24:22: Betina talks about embracing the turns of life, especially as she integrated her life as an entertainer, a fitness professional, as an aid for a friend with special needs.
• 26:29: Betina talks through the experience of intuition and how it guides her - for everything from starting her foundation to moving to LA.
• 28:20: Betina talks about her Sneaker Ball event that raised funds for Dance with Mweyne.

Resources mentioned:

• The Women's Guide to Strength Training
• Dance With Mweyne
• Michelle Obama's book Becoming

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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In the spirit of our current "Contributing Generously" theme, we went back to a past podcast guest who's deeply involved in the intersection of Chicago's public schools and health and wellness. Meet Alison Rootberg, a long-time friend of aSweatLife and founder of Wellness4Every1, a Chicago wellness company building strategic partnerships to fund arts and physical education opportunities for Chicago students.

As Rootberg started teaching dance classes around Chicago, she was shocked to find that many schools didn't have art, music, dance, or theater —and she realized there was an opportunity to help, funding Wellness4Every1 as a result. Eventually, that mission also evolved to expanding programming to build social and emotional skills through activities like yoga, meditation, and mindfulness. And she does it all on a budget, too: Wellness4Every1's whole budget revolves around $4 per student per hour, she tells me in this interview.

This year, Wellness4Every1 is focusing on physical education, which is the most underserved program in Chicago Public Schools. Even more significantly, they want to provide resources for every single Chicago Public School—all 600+ of them. That's what we in the start-up business call 10x-ing it, and it's NOT easy.

Undaunted, Rootberg says, "my whole life, I always kind of had these big ideas, and people were like, 'I don't know that that's possible...,' and I'm like "Oh, well, watch! Here we go." Listen to this episode and try NOT to fall in love with Rootberg's optimism and genuine desire to help—we dare you.

Highlights:

• 8m 40s: Rootberg discusses a big goal from her past: creating a new source of funding for Chicago Public Schools through Wellness4Every1.
• 12m: Rootberg discusses her big goal for next year: expanding Wellness4Every1 to working with all Chicago Public Schools (over 600 of them!)
• 14m: Rootberg explains why physical education is the most failed class in CPS high schools and offers a few thoughts on how we could modify PE curriculum.
• 17m 45s: Rootberg shares the origin of the monthly #Sweat4OurSchools workouts and how they were born out of a bit of failure.
• 21m 15s: We discuss how Wellness4Every1 has leveraged community to further their mission.
• 27m 30s: Rootberg's favorite success stories and warm, fuzzy feelings that make it all worth it. "It's those personal connections that were a huge foundation for us creating our programming."
• 29m 40s: We discuss Give Back Gifts, Wellness4Every1's December giving initiative with Maelle, Lifeway Kefir, Addison-Ashland Florist, and Imperfect Foods.

Resources mentioned:

• These Four Chicagoans Are Using Fitness to Make a Big Difference in Their Communities—and You Can Help Them (live #WeGotGoals podcast recording)
• Wellness4Every1's website (including where you can find their #Sweat4OurSchools monthly events around Chicago)
• On Your Mark Training (check out their GORGEOUS West Side location)
• Allison in another piece on aSweatLife.com: In-School Programs Teaching Kids Confidence Through Movement
• SeaWheeze Half Marathon in Vancouver
• LiveBetter Co.
• More information about Give Back Gifts

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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If you’re looking to infuse your holiday shopping with some extra meaning, look no further than BIDE Market—it’s a fully sustainable, plastic-free, vegan, and cruelty-free shopping experience that will fill Wicker Park’s Exchange312 from 10 a.m. to 6 p.m. this Sunday, Dec. 15. Besides vendors, there’ll be talks, panels, and refreshments, all from ethical brands.

The conscious marketplace represents just the kind of purpose-driven, yet still luxurious experience Exchange312’s founders—passionate entrepreneurs Sarah Neukom and Matt Woodburn—had in mind when creating the space, as well as their event company that’s headquartered there, ESP Presents.

Sarah and Matt hosted us in the gorgeous venue to tape this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, where Sarah explained how her background in event planning for a cancer center informs their current work; the fulfillment they get from creating memorable fundraising and other experiences; and all the failures and successes they’ve shared along the way.

On this episode, we discuss:

• 3:58: How this power couple—partners in business and life— joined forces
• 7:29: The dual meaning behind the name ESP Presents
• 9:13: Why missing out on a big goal was the best thing that could have happened to Sarah
• 11:46: What she learned about reading the signs, including the wise words of a steakhouse valent
• 13:26: The hard lessons entrepreneurship has taught Matt about goals, and why he doesn’t always like setting them
• 17:35: How their partnership works, and takes them through 16- to 18-hour workdays (followed by evenings of house-painting)
• 26:11: The way they’ve built a team that works hard and still has heart
• 28:51: Why it’s so important to them to help charities tell their stories
• 31:09: Why enabling others’ success tops Matt’s list of future goals
• 32:38: The potential for international expansion—and why Sarah isn’t afraid of big, scary goals, even if she doesn’t yet know how to reach them

Links/resources we mention:

• BIDE Market
• Exchange312, 1714 W Division St.
• Chop Shop, 2033 W. North Ave.
• Dana-Farber Cancer Institute

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Now that Thanksgiving has passed and the calendar reads December, there’s no denying the holiday season is upon us. In the spirit of gratitude and giving, we at the #WeGotGoals podcast have chosen to focus our fourth, and final, segment of season 3 on the theme of Contributing Generously.

It’s not really a stretch for us—all along, we’ve noticed most of the goal-getters we have on the show aren’t motivated by merely money, fame, or prestige. Nearly all have a bigger picture in mind, a vision of some way they can leave the world a better place than they found it.

This quarter, we’ll bring this element to the fore, focusing on guests who have philanthropy, service, or selflessness at the core of their efforts.

We kick things off, as we always do, with a hostful episode. This week, the four of us—me (Cindy Kuzma), Jeana Anderson Cohen, Kristen Geil, and Maggie Umberger—first recap some of the lessons from our past segment on Better, Faster, Stronger (including how we netted out on our goals for those few months). Then, we delve into what Contributing Generously means to us, and how we’ll make it a priority as we explore the topic with our guests in these upcoming months.

Check out this episode to hear:

• 1:33: What we learned about the importance of recovery
• 4:19: Why getting better, faster, and stronger is often as much psychological as physical
• 5:55 Why progress comes under stress, and how high achievers overcome obstacles along the way to achievement
• 7:39: Our top takeaways from our guests, including having flexibility in your process; using all the resources at your disposal; and working in sprints
• 10:53: How we fared on our own better, faster, and stronger goals—including some unanticipated obstacles and pleasant surprises
• 16:13: Why we decided to focus our final segment of season 3 on contributing generously, and how we define that
• 16:49: The goals we’ve accomplished along these lines in the past, including fundraising on relay teams and supporting aSweatLife ambassadors in their charitable efforts
• 20:07: Our hacks for making service a priority, even when life gets busy
• 22:26: Where we find inspiration for giving back, including a touching story about Maggie’s father
• 24:21: The big, generous goals we’re setting for ourselves this quarter

Links/resources we mention:

• Episode 123, on which Kristen interviews me and Carrie Jackson Cheadle
• Episode 118, with Tevia Celli
• Episode 128, with Autumn Calabrese
• Episode 124, with Jay DeCoons
• Episode 121, with Jillian Bell and Paul Downs Colaizzo
• The Greater Chicago Food Depository
• An article about how the Chicago Public Library eliminated most fines
• Mission Propelle

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, including on Apple and Spotify (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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"The right thing is always the right thing."

That quote is inscribed on the wall at Fitt's headquarters in Pittsburgh where brothers Anthony and Joe Vennare built their location-based wellness discovery empire. And, more importantly, it drives every decision the company makes.

I spoke to Anthony Vennare, CEO and co-founder of Fitt for this week's episode of #WeGotGoals at the absolute perfect moment: just after Fitt closed a fundraising round that included MINDBODY's participation as a strategic investor. This, Anthony explained, was a big goal for the company from the moment it started to build what Fitt is today.

As an outsider, it's been fun to watch Fitt grow, innovate and help wellness-minded people discover new healthy experiences. But after speaking to Anthony, it would be impossible not to root for him - he's relentless, hardworking, disciplined and grounded. You'll hear that shine on today's episode - it explains much of the company's success.

On this episode:

2:15: Anthony explains Fitt in his own words, describing the location-based platform that's in more than 30 global cities.

3:15: Anthony talks about his childhood, his first job cutting grass and why he enlisted in the Marine Corps at the age of 17 - noting that his dad was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer just after he left for training.

6:41: Anthony shares how he, his brother and a team of friends converted a 12,000 square foot indoor skate park into a gym and how they were able to rent it for $1,500/month. At 21-years-old, he built a business and scaled that to 40 locations and a proprietary certification program called Kettlebell Cardio.

8:20: Anthony shares how he and his brother Joe decided to sell the gym and move into online media - keeping their eyes on Eater, Infatuation and Thrillist and deciding to build something similar for fitness and healthy living.

11:15: Anthony talks about Fitt's strategic partnership with MINDBODY - a relationship that took two years to build.

13:00: Anthony describes the unique positioning of Fitt in smaller markets like Cleveland, Pittsburgh and Minneapolis.

14:00: Anthony shares his secret to success - "I am just exhausting" and also talks about how his industry-facing content from Fitt Insider helped in getting his first meeting with MINDBODY.

16:45: Anthony teases the big vision for how Fitt's content will impact users of MINDBODY

17:30: Anthony speaks to the future of Fitt, including making the product the best it can be and his aspirations for potential acquisitions to truly reach a huge audience.

19:30: Anthony shares that about 30 percent of FITT's audience is made up of people who are traveling and what Fitt's building to empower that audience.

22:00: Anthony talks about what it's like working with his brother and how he lives way within his means and simply (he rides a vespa and doesn't own a car, by the way).

25:00: Anthony talks about he and his brother's unique take on business: creating companies that "fill voids in other companies."

Resources:

• FITT Insider
• Anthony Vennare on LinkedIn where he shares a lot of industry reports and updates

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It's not every day you get to talk to someone who's Kardashian-adjacent (although we love catching up with Gunnar Peterson whenever we can). So it was with a little bit of stomach-fluttering that I dialed in to interview Autumn Calabrese, a 15-year veteran trainer who first made her mark in the industry with Beachbody's on-demand workouts and has since expanded into nutrition, cookbooks, a clothing line, and now a stint on E!'s Revenge Body with Khloe Kardashian.

But immediately, Calabrese's warm, Midwestern-nice tone came through over the line, and we connected like old pals as we chatted about goals, her dance background, modeling a healthy lifestyle for her son, and more.

One thing that stuck out to me: "Progress comes under stress," she told me, in regards to why it's so important to switch up your fitness routine in order to see results. "Not bad stress, but you need a stressor—you need time under tension with your weights to build muscle, you need to train in different capacities so that you can get stronger and you can get faster—not getting stuck."

And while she was talking about fitness specifically, I'll be making "progress comes under stress" a mantra for my professional life, too. Dealing with a website redesign and a gift guide launch in the same month? Progress comes under stress. Your host server breaks because you've had too much traffic? Progress comes under stress. You just got that promotion and you're having a bit of imposter syndrome? Progress comes under stress.

Keep that motto in the back of your head as you listen to this episode and carry it with you for the rest of the week—and let us know how it helps you.

On this episode, you'll hear:

• 4:30: Calabrese talks about her past big goal of wanting to help people in the fitness and nutrition space on a grander scale than just meeting clients one-on-one, a goal she achieved with the help of Beachbody's massive platform.
• 5:45: On social media's impact on the training industry: "You still have to have hustle, it's just a different kind of hustle."
• 10:30: On filming for Beachbody, demonstrating a workout as if she's explaining it to a girlfriend, and how she visualizes the at-home client as she's coaching.
• 13:15: On what helps her feel better, faster, and stronger: "Nutrition is 90 percent of the problem or the solution."
• 15:30: On why your fitness routine needs to be switched up in order to see results.
• 17:15: How Calabrese switches up her fitness routine herself.
• 18:22: Did Calabrese's outlook on fitness change after she had her son? Surprisingly, no—here's why.
• 20:15: Calabrese's go-to mental health and self-care practices.
• 22:50: Calabrese on the ~mysterious~ big goals she's working on for the future—and why she thinks it's so important to say your big goals aloud. "I wouldn't be where I am right now without a lot of people" who asked me about what else I was working on. "You can't be afraid to promote yourself."
• 27:00: On why New Year's resolutions might actually hinder your goals.

Resources:

Autumn's website

Autumn's fitness videos and nutrition plans

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The Barre Code - an immensely goal-focused fitness brand - gathers its franchisees for a conference once a year to provide support, guidance and tools for growth in the year to come. Rare is it that one is able to sit down in a room of entrepreneurs who are creating versions of the same business in different parts of the country. Sure, in franchising there are variables. Location, competition, saturation, population density all play a factor, but The Barre Code tries to make owning a fitness studio feel like a path that's already been paved for you.

And this year, four franchisees stood out as exemplary in their pursuit of goals. This episode of the #WeGotGoals podcast is a LIVE episode and a look into the goals driving these four entrepreneurs building The Barre Code brand.

And consider this mandatory listening if you have any desire to own a fitness studio. You'll catch some of the numbers you'll want to meet and challenges you may face.

1:52: we kick off the live portion of the pod

2:28: Jeana defines the failure-win - or the FIN that we first heard from Jillian Lorenz, co-founder and co-CEO of The Barre Code on an episode of #WeGotGoals.

2:49: We meet the panelists

• Kim Burla- who owns a Barre Code in New Lennox, IL
• Janelle Herbert - who co-owns 3 Barre Code locations in metro Detroit
• Lindsay Irrer- who co-owns 3 Barre Code locations in metro Detroit
• Kellian Kiron - who owns two locations in Madison, WI

8:20: Jeana wraps up the big goals that each of the founders named in a bow - community, having each other to lean on, having a plan and sticking to it.

9:08: We talk about loneliness - it can be a looming factor in starting a business. Each of these small business owners talks through what they do to avoid loneliness.

12:20: Creating and following a plan.

15:40: We discuss failures that each of these small business owners have experienced over the lifetime of their businesses.

18:00: Janelle and Lindsay talk through the time when they needed to close one of their three studio locations for a rebuild (and a move) for six weeks - and what they did to keep all of their members.

22:00: Kim, Janelle, Lindsay and Kellian all share the big goals that they're going after in the future - Lindsay reminds everyone to take it back to the big WHY as they're setting big goals.

26:40: We took a questions from the audience. Michelle from Cincinnati asks the burning question - "What keeps you up at night?"

28:00: We took a questions from the audience. Marla from Newport Beach, CA asks the one thing each owner has down to build their following - online and IRL.

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, on Apple, Spotify, and more (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Mason Levey didn’t intend to start a nationally recognized yoga studio chain, but over six years ago he and his wife Sarah Levey came across the need to connect people to the benefits of yoga in a more palatable, modern way. They started Y7 Studio, a music-driven hot yoga concept in Brooklyn, and today, Mason still sits on the board of Y7 as the business spreads across the country and the brand permeates the world of modern yoga. It is now, Mason explains, that he sees the same inflection point for the modernization of meditation.

“There are a lot of offerings and a lot of interest, but all the brands, all the content, all the experiences kind of sit in this one bucket or framework. Could I bring something to the market where I would actually enjoy meditation, look forward to it, and get really excited about it?”

And perhaps an even more targeted question, “Is there a way to use music to bring mindfulness to more people, more quickly?”

With the drive to break the misconceptions about meditation, in 2018, Mason began his second wellness-focused endeavor with his co-founder, Brad Warsh, WAVE. This week, we heard from Mason on the #WeGotGoals podcast about how tuning in, slowing down, and learning to go with the flow – both in practice leading up to and after launching WAVE – makes him better, faster, and stronger.

What is WAVE meditation all about?

Similar to the concept of Y7, WAVE intends to bring meditation to the masses by making the practice something people want – or rather, crave – to do. This isn’t a silent meditation. This is a fully immersive, at-home meditation experience. It’s beat-driven practice, with carefully curated tracks made uniquely for WAVE and designed to help you get in your zone.

The app component of WAVE is only part one. Its ability to be a truly immersive outlet is brought to life with noise canceling headphones and a cushion that allows you feel the beat of the music through vibration, in tandem with the beats you select to meditate with.

“You hear the track in your ears, and you feel the track in your body,” Levey said. “And what that does is it creates this really immersive experience that allows you to stay really present. You’re not distracted by anything else that’s going on. It’s kind of like a whole new way to practice meditation.”

The impact of music

For Levey, music is the key component missing from what’s available in streaming mediation today. A lot of the time, it’s an afterthought of just a guided voice, he explains.

“It can feel kind of sterile, kind of like a lecture.”

To better identify what we wanted the experience to be like, he did his research. Levey tried different types of technology with virtual reality, video games, and vibro-acoustic therapy, and ultimately the immersive WAVE experiential app and program was born.

Levey’s personal meditation journey

For Levey, yoga came first but meditation has become a key component to his daily routine. He uses WAVE at least 10 minutes per day for the cumulative benefits he feels from the practice.

“Meditation gives me time to reflect. When I reflect, I have a better perspective on things, and when I have a better perspective, I can make much better choices. And when I make better choices, I’m creating positive change or making waves in my life and with the people around me.”

And some of the other ways Levey is making waves? A big goal he and his wife achieved in 2018 was landing a spot on the cover of Inc. Magazine's Annual Inc 5000 List.

“That dream came true in a bigger way than I ever imagined,” Levey said.

And through the power of music, Levey intends to take WAVE to new heights.

How music plugs into big goals for the future

Levey firmly believes that meditation doesn’t have to be done in silence or sitting in a certain position. A big goal on the horizon that aims to remove the barriers to trying meditation is to bring in a musician with substantial influence and culture to create original music in a collaborative way.

Without giving too much away about this episode, you expect to hear more about where mindfulness is trending, what we can may start to see in relation to tech and mindfulness integration, and the barriers Levey and team see to simply starting a meditation practice.

If you Zen out to this podcast episode with Mason Levey, the co-founder of the WAVE meditation app, we’d love it if you took a moment to leave us a rating or a review. You can do that anywhere you get your podcasts (like iTunes or Spotify!) And if you want to try WAVE for yourself, the code wegotgoals will get you $50 off your kit.

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On this episode of #WeGotGoals, DeCoons relives his journey with The Bar Method - from acquiring it to leading it to selling it to Self Esteem Brands. He shares the bumps in the roads and what it took to realize his strengths as a leader.

Here’s what you’ll hear in this #WeGotGoals episode:

• 4:25: How Jay's time at the Private Equity firm Summit Partners was his training ground to understand entrepreneurship
• 5:55: Jay describes a big goal he accomplished in the past and the journey to acquire and run The Bar method with a group of private investors.
• 7:40: Jay speaks to his experience at YogaWorks and how it helped him to understand what it takes to run a successful studio - everything from knowing P&L to creating relationships across the industry like the one he built with Burr Leonard, founder of The Bar Method. .
• 8:50: Jay shares his take on networking and relationships, "Just trust in doing the right thing and where you can be helpful and it can lead to amazing opportunities down the road that you have no idea of today."
• 11:15: Jay gives great advice about how to hire for your weaknesses and the benefits of partners with complementary skills - especially when you're setting big goals and managing change.
• 14:10: Jay speaks to failure, being hard on yourself and a concept he calls being "radically supported in your role." This is a piece of the episode that every entrepreneur should listen to if they ever feel like they can't do everything. Jay talks about why you can't and how to find support.
• 16:45: Jay speaks to joining forces with Self Esteem Brands and why it affords his team to get to their goals faster.
• 20:10: Jeana compares Jay's options to grow The Bar Method without an acquisition vs. growing with an acquisition to endurance racing A-goals and B-goals. Jay describes how to keep thinking big even when cash-strapped.
• 22:20: Jay speaks to The Bar Method's early foray into Video OnDemand content for members.
• 25:00: Jay describes the workout at The Bar Method and how it impacts you mind, body and soul - and how the corporate culture of setting goals trickles down to members tackling big goals.
• 27:50: Jay talks about one of his favorite books about goals - Traction by Gino Wickman - and how he uses concepts from it in business like quarterly rocks, "90-day goals," and "from X to Y by when."
• 30:30: Jay talks about his personal goals and how he and his wife set goals for themselves and their 7-, 5-, and 2-year-old kids. Jeana and Jay set a new goal for Jay to try to get out on a date night with his wife more frequently - starting with one date every three weeks with his wife.
• 33:15: Jay describes his journaling routine and why gratitude is important to help him to see how lucky he is.

Resources we mention throughout the episode:

• Traction by Gino Wickman

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, on Apple, Spotify, and more (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Chances are, if you've been a runner, a cyclist, or even a studio fitness-er for a decent amount of time, you've battled injury at some point. In their new book Rebound: Train Your Mind to Bounce Back Stronger from Sports Injuries, Carrie Jackson Cheadle and Cindy Kuzma address not just the physical side of recovering from injury, but also the mental side. Calling this a book doesn't do it justice, though; Rebound is really more of a resource and a workbook, with nearly 50 thought-provoking exercises included that are designed to give the reader tangible ways to mentally rebound from injury to come back better, faster, and stronger.

Listen to this episode to hear all about how Cheadle and Kuzma came up with the concept of the book, how they made the most of the injured athletes community while writing the book, and of course, what their big goals are for the future.

Here's what you'll hear in this #WeGotGoals episode:

• 4:26: How a sports psychology class in undergrad led Carrie to realize the strategies discussed were just as useful for athletes as they were for practitioners, and ultimately planted the seed for Rebound.
• 6:05: A big goal Carrie and Cindy have achieved in the past, why it was important to them, and how they got there.
• 10:00: Why Carrie and Cindy decided it was important to write a book expressly for athletes using research on mental strategies for recovery.
• 13:15: The stories of injured athletes that stood out, including Jacki Gemelos and Kevin Ogar.
• 17:15: How community played a role in Rebound, both in the research discussed in the book and in the actual writing process.
• 22:00: Carrie and Cindy's favorite mental exercises from the book, including the emotion decoder, energy conservation, and good news/bad news.
• 27:50: The surprising thing Cindy noticed about the phrase "everything happens for a reason" among injured athletes.
• 32:00: Carrie and Cindy's big goals for the future.

Links and resources we mentioned:

• Rebound: Train Your Mind to Bounce Back Stronger from Sports Injuries
• The Injured Athletes Club website
• The Injured Athletes Club Facebook group
• The Injured Athletes Club podcast

If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, on Apple, Spotify, and more (and hey, leave us a rating while you’re at it!).

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Tune in to aSweatLife’s channels (like our podcast, Instagram, or the blog; wherever you like to connect – we’re there) and you’ll hear us talk about goals or goal setting in some capacity. To put it lightly, we heart them, big time. But especially with the aSweatLife Ambassador program (which you can read more about applying to here!) our conversation is driven by goals.

Every year, after we open the Ambassador application and welcome in a new crew of goal getters, we kick off the year by explaining that this isn’t just a group of people who like to work out. This is a group of people who are here to go on a journey, to set big goals, say them out loud, and help every other face in the crowd go after their goals too. It’s essentially a giant support system in setting and achieving big, scary goals. And we’d be hypocrites if we didn’t set some big ones on our own.

That’s why this hostful podcast episode, led by Jeana Anderson Cohen and Maggie Umberger of aSweatLife, takes a closer look at the BHAGs we set for ourselves and our Ambassador program in 2019.

We wanted to dedicate the year to creating workshops and experiences that explored the concept of self-love. We did this because we were genuinely curious about the definitions of self-love and how we could better embody its practices on a daily basis (something much easier said than done). You’ll hear more about this in the episode, we don’t want to give it all way.

But this episode of #WeGotGoals serves another purpose. Every month, aSweatLife Ambassadors receive unique content (think: workshops and other digital tools to add to their goal setting and getting tool kit). So to kick off the aSweatLife Ambassador 2020 application, we want to share one of those resources with you in this limited edition podcast release.

After listening to the hostful episode, you’ll have four mini workshops to stream and listen to totally free. These are resources created for Ambassadors, some by Ambassadors. Under one umbrella theme, each mini workshop takes you through a short guided session exploring what it means to deepen your relationships with:

1. Yourself
2. Your digital footprint
3. Other relationships you may struggle with
4. Your life

Get right to listening here, and read a little more about each mini workshop below. Like what you hear and want to learn more about the Ambassadorship? Read about it here and apply for the program. The application will be open from October 14 – November 15 at 11:59 pm CST and you’ll be notified if you’ve been selected to be an Ambassador in 2020 by December 2, 2019.

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There’s a chill in the air, a blue line down the street, and Grant Park is getting stocked up with Porta-Potties. That can only mean one thing: It’s Chicago Marathon week!

As 40,000 runners prepare to travel 26.2 miles around Chicago this Sunday, three of your #WeGotGoals co-hosts—Kristen, Cindy, and Jeana—sat down and relived some of our marathon memories … the highs, the lows, and everything in between. It turns out, running produces both highly hilarious moments and deep revelations that shape the way we live our lives.

And—perhaps this is what we in journalism call “burying the lead”—we also had the chance to chat with two very special guests. Jillian Bell is the star, and Paul Downs Colaizzo the writer and director, of the film “Brittany Runs a Marathon,” playing in Chicago now. They share some of their big goals and talk more about the lessons of the film.

Check out this episode to hear:

• All about our first marathons: 1:14
• How our motivations changed as we pursued this big goal: 4:48
• The funniest thing that happened to us in training or while racing: 8:22
• The most profound realizations we had along the way: 14:59
• What we thought about the movie (including reasons to go see it): 17:53
• Jillian’s writing goal, and what it took to make it happen: 20:32
• How Paul literally took himself back to school: 22:39
• A theme of the movie—”little goals”—and what it means to them: 23:50
• Why friends and supporters matter in achieving your goals (and advice for how to tell if you’re surrounding yourself with the right people): 26:03
• Paul and Jillian’s big goals for the future, including some intriguing projects we can’t wait to learn more about: 27:29

Links/resources we mention:

• “Running Is a Great Coping Mechanism for Grief,” the article Cindy wrote for VICE for which Kristen graciously shared her story
• “Here’s Why You Should Take Walk Breaks During Your Next Race,” a Runner’s World article by Cindy
• The photo of Cindy running Boston in the rain in 2018
• More about “Brittany Runs a Marathon,” and where to find showtimes

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John Bogosian, Founder and CEO of ZingFit, is easily spotted at wellness conferences - he walks a floor confidently and has a natural gravitational pull that draws people in to talk to him - that, and he's always in a ZingFit hat and a blazer.

After a few conferences where I saw this same phenomenon over and over, I had a distinct impression of him as intimidating.

Then at a conference in New York City, he approached our booth and earnestly asked a couple of questions, and then I asked a couple of questions. And before I knew it, we were having a conversation about the state of fitness.

He's certainly direct, passionate and accomplished, but intimidating, he is not.

When that conversation turned into a podcast interview for #WeGotGoals, I should have expected more surprises from Bogosian. The biggest? Choosing to forego fundraising for the first seven years of ZingFit's existence, instead growing slowly and intentionally.

A quick primer for the podcast interview and for the rest of this article: investopedia defines bootstrapping as "building a company from the ground up with nothing but personal savings and, with luck, the cash coming in from the first sale." Technology companies - like ZingFit - often seek venture capital, which is "financing that investors provide to startup companies and small businesses that are believed to have long-term growth potential." But taking on that funding means you have to meet VC expectations (and eventually - if everything goes according to plan - give that money back x10).

When Bogosian was approached by the team at SoulCycle as "the tech guy in the Hamptons" he built something special for them. The product we know today as Zingfit started as a technology solution to empower SoulCycle to create the experience riders expect today: bookable spots in the room full of bikes.

He knew he was onto something, but instead of growing as large as possible as fast as possible, he made the decision to continue to bootstrap their business and grow slowly, on purpose. "We said that we're not going to take more than 12 studios a month ... we essentially created a waiting list."

The studios that they did accept did something that no one could have predicted: They helped to launch it.

"They would be so invested in this that they would help us with the QA, they would help us with roll-out, they would help us with feature feedback and I think we really ended up with a different kind of product because of the process," Bogosian said.

And today, ZingFit serves the boutique fitness industry with a product that Bogosian says is really special in the space - it takes the care you experience at the front desk and makes it digital.

Today, they onboard more than 12 studios per month - but not by much Bogosian says - and it's just in time for ZingFit to take on their first round of fundraising.

Listen to the goals that got Bogosian to where he is today and those that are pulling ZingFit into the future on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals. Get this episode on iTunes, Spotify, or anywhere else you get your podcasts. And if you have a second to show a little love by leaving us a five star review, we’d really appreciate it!

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Talking to Anna Renderer, host of a milion POPSUGAR Fitness videos you've no doubt seen and sweated to on YouTube, is a weird cross between feeling like you're being hugged and feeling like you're getting a shot of adrenaline straight to the goal-getting part of your brain. She exclaims, she gushes, she lets you in on her secrets—and you're left with a completely different mindset on your goals on to-do list.

I met Renderer in August at the MINDBODY Bold Conference, where we sat for an interview before she took the stage as a presenter. After our conversation, I knew we needed to get her on the #WeGotGoals podcast, and Renderer was more than game, especially once she heard the theme was Better, Faster, Stronger.

"I'm ALL about that!" I distinctly remember her saying in a tone of voice that was equivalent to a fist pump.

And after hearing more about her background in high performance and the clarity with which she sets her goals, it's clear to me why Renderer is so successful. She told me herself: she's got the hoo-rah, but she's also got the do-rah.

What she means by that, she explains, is yes, she's got the strength of a thousand cheerleaders when it comes to enthusiasm for goal-setting and achieving. But she's also incredibly practical when it comes to her own strategies and productivity habits, which she shared with me on the podcast.

"If there's one thing you can do with your productivity," she tells me, "focus on the needle movers. Now that I can't do ALL this stuff, what do I NEED to do? Block time to solely focus on action steps that get you closer to those projects getting completed."

And like our team, Renderer is a big believer in the power of saying goals out loud—in fact, that's how she heard about the available role with POPSUGAR Fitness.

At a Venice Beach barbecue, Renderer was talking about her passion for serving others and how she was setting her sights on working in fitness to help others get more out of their lives. Another attendee overheard her big dreams, and reached out later saying he'd heard about this role as a part-time YouTube fitness host for POPSUGAR and thought she'd be perfect. Three million subscribers later, it's clear that Renderer was in fact the perfect fit for the job—but she never would have gotten her chance if she hadn't been vocal about her audacious dreams.

Finally, for those of you looking for those specific, actionable tips YOU can use to be better, faster, and stronger in all areas of your life, listen to the very end of this episode: Renderer lets me in on her STRONG method, where each letter stands for a healthy habit that keeps her at her peak. They're all easy enough that you can do them in just a few minutes, and trust me when I say they're habits I'm going to incorporate into my day, too.

You can find Anna Renderer on Instagram and learn more about her coaching services on her website. If you love this episode as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to podcasts, on Apple, Spotify, and more (and hey, leave us a rating while you're at it!).

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An epic fail at work. A blowout with—even a split from—the love of your life. A life-altering piece of medical news. Every day, people carry all this—and more—into spin studios in Chicago and around the country.

Inside those walls, they seek an hour or so of peace, of active meditation.

“You’re riding to the rhythm of the music, you’re sweaty, you’re working really hard,” Tevia Celli told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals. “You walk into a class and you've got all this stuff on your mind; you’re weighted. Somewhere, pedal stroke after pedal stroke, you're letting that go and becoming present.”

Few people understand this transformational process better than Celli. Back in 1998, she opened one of the very first spin studios, Body & Soul, in Los Angeles. She ran it for more than a decade, then stayed in the business to work as a master instructor at Flywheel and then an independent consultant.

Now, she’s the Director of Education at CycleBar Franchising, where she trains and develops a team of 1,800-plus instructors at 200 studios and counting. “I have to figure out a way to stay in these people’s heads and keep them inspired and motivated and committed,” she said.

Since she stepped into the role, she’s developed a few nuts-and-bolts strategies to achieve this. CycleStarYou, for instance, gathers newer hires and master instructors for an immersive, in-person educational experience. An online forum allows these CycleStars to continue sharing long after they’re back in their home markets.

But to truly encourage the type of authenticity and motivational power CycleBar seeks requires leading by example. In our interview, it’s swiftly clear that Celli doesn’t hold back in sharing her personal highs and lows. That includes a serious medical event of her own—a diagnosis of multiple sclerosis at age 41—and the complete life overhaul she embarked on in its aftermath.

For Celli, managing the disease involved less in the way of prescription medication and more along the lines of meditation, therapy, adopting a plant-based diet, and even, painfully, ending some close relationships.

“In this day and age, as we’re being more accountable for our health and our wellbeing, it’s not just what we put into our body, it’s what we allow to take up space in our energy as well,” she said. “I have to make sure I’m as centered and balanced as I can be, no matter what comes my way.”

Tackling the disease on her own terms—and getting back to teaching cycling, something doctors told her she’d likely never do again—stands as the goal she’s most proud to have accomplished. And as CycleBar continues to expand, she hopes the growing network of CycleStar instructors embrace their own setbacks as catalysts for empowerment.

“We want people to be authentic, and to really use what they go through,” she said. “Say, ‘you know, I understand how hard it is to get here. Some days it’s hard for me too.’” Only then will they be able to be, in her words, “positive change-makers in their community,” shifting their students toward the best possible version of themselves.

Listen to the full episode to hear more about why Celli considers the group fitness experience so magical; the path she took to recognizing her self-worth; and why what she calls “permission to heal” is so critical to achieving any goal.

If you like what you hear, please subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. We’d be grateful if you’d leave us a rating or a review, which helps other goal-getters find their way to us.

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Erin Oprea arrived at 10:59:59 am on the morning of our #WeGotGoals recording. Scheduled for 11 am, I noted how punctual she was, despite the fact she walked all the way from the opposite side of town to get the our recording studio. Over the next hour, I grew increasingly impressed by Erin, a personal trainer to stars like Kacey Musgraves and Carrie Underwood, author of The 4x4 Diet, and expert in virtual training, recipe planning and sold out workout tours across the U.S.

[Love Erin Oprea already and want to work out with her in Chicago? She's visiting this weekend for THREE workout opportunities—click here to learn more!]

In fact, Erin is one of those people you just want to know everything about once you meet her and learn a few key things about her.

Like the fact that she was a Marine, and made history when she was appointed to lead the first female platoon attached to the infantry in a war zone.

This fact is likely a major contributor to the next most fascinating thing I found out when chatting with Erin for the podcast. She is the definition of full-out fun with a capital F, but you better believe she's got a strict regimen that enables her to fit in everything she's passionate about.

Erin trains upwards of 11 clients every day, so her working day generally starts by 5 am. Afternoons are filled with "media time" - working on books, virtual training, press, etc. - and then comes her personal workout time. In the episode, you'll hear her say, "I'm not good at sleep," but that when it comes down to it, it's either sleep or work out, and she's not willing to let go of her "play time" (also known as her own time in the gym). On Saturdays at 4 pm, you might catch her at Whiskey Row in Nashville with her homemade beet juice and tequila cocktail in hand.

But then again, to accomplish what she has, achieved the level of recognition she attained, and to still train celebrity clients with their own crazy schedules on a regular basis, how else would you manage your time?

And even with a huge list of accomplishments, can you guess what she told me when I asked her what big goal she's most proud of? "I see that I have so much more to hit... I don't know at what point my mind is going to say, wow, you've done a good job. You're successful."

The moment that really stuck out to me out of our entire interview was how she described new, big goals.

Until she sees the right opportunity, little ideas stay in the back of her mind, lying dormant. As soon as the moment is right, that idea bubbles to the surface and takes over everything in its path.

"I am in overdrive and I will work 24/7 until I hit what I decide I want to hit, and that's how my mind works," Erin says.

Right now, the big goal that's still in its sleepy phase is starting an activewear line of her own. And my money's on us seeing one hit stores sooner rather than later, if we are to use any of Erin's previous massive achievements and passion for her job as our guide.

But ultimately, Erin's continuous forward momentum is rooted in the simple fact that she knows who she is, where she's been, and what her purpose is.

"Every experience in your life leads you to the next thing," she reasons. "You learn so much. I never would have thought this is what I would be doing today. I planned on retiring in the Marine Corps..."

But now that she is where she is, she reasons: "All I wanted was to train people to feel better and be happy. I want to see people happy."

You'll hear a consistent theme across this episode. It doesn't matter to Erin that she's considered one of the most well known trainers in the industry, she wants to be your biggest cheerleader. She is hell bent on making sure you feel supported in your fitness path wherever you are, and to help you smile and see the beauty in movement along the journey.

When I asked Erin some parting advice, she answered, "Change your perspective... there are so many people in the world that cannot move, and we don't cherish it enough."

Run, don't walk (or you know, walking is fine, as long as you're not sitting) to listen to this episode of #WeGotGoals with Erin Oprea. If you love it as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to them, on Apple, Spotify, and more.

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"I’m so far ahead of the curve, I made the curve," Sue Hitzmann said as I asked her about trends in the fitness space and how she carved out a niche where none existed. And if you listen closely enough on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, you can hear me reflexively snap my fingers at the sound of that unadulterated swagger.

That confidence grew from a few factors that Hitzmann talks through - paving her own path, spreading the knowledge she'd earned, and learning to listen to and hone her gut.

And if you're not familiar with the method she created yet, you will be soon. The MELT Method® is Hitzmann's brain child. It's a simple self-treatment designed to help you and your muscles stay healthy, youthful, and active for a lifetime. At its core, it can be termed a recovery method, one of the top trends we saw going into 2019, but you'll hear from Hitzmann, there's more to it than that.

Carving her own unique path As a Freshman at NYU, Hitzmann started her college education focused on TV and Film, but kept coming back to the field of science - "as a hobby." When she couldn't deny her love of human anatomy any longer, she changed majors and pursued a degree in Exercise Science - Anatomy and Physiology.

But before NYU, there was one fateful day when Hitzmann just happened to be at the gym when an aerobics instructor didn't show up. A 16-year-old Hitzmann - a regular in that class - helmed the class herself and was soon a certified instructor, teaching sold out classes like Jazzercize. Because she paid attention to where she felt the happiest, she started on a journey that would inevitably lead her to The MELT Method.

Sharing the secret sauce Hitzmann dove deep, learning everything she could about the muscular system and diving deep into fascia - a word you'll hear throughout the episode. And #ICYMI, fascia is the connective tissue that - well, connects everything. Your muscles, your organs - everything. And it's just starting to get the attention that Hitzmann has always thought it truly deserves.

"When I wanted to talk about fascia, I realized that my language wasn’t resonating with people," she remembered. "I so desperately wanted to get that message out there."

She found other ways and words to get that message out there, starting by working hands on with clients at her private practice Body Language NYC. And as clients sought ways to get the same treatment from Hitzmann when they weren't in-clinic, she started to innovate and give a few clients the tools to DIY MELT.

From those few clients, it turned into a manual. From that manual it became a New York Times Best Selling book The Melt Method. From that book, Hitzmann found the stage to get in front of thousands of fitness and wellness professionals that she'd train in The Melt Method.

Learning to listen to and hone her gut You'll hear Hitzmann speak about intuition and energy throughout the episode. And when I pressed her about times when she'd failed to listen to her intuition, she said that when she ignored her gut, she ultimately failed.

And it's not lost on me that "energy" and "intuition" lean heavily on the idea that things are more connected than they may seem. It seems completely fitting for Hitzmann. The part of the body she's spent her life devoted to is fascia - the tissue that shows that very same thing in the body - everything is just a little bit more connected than it seems.

Ready to melt into this great podcast? All season, you’ve heard from guests who have done big things related to building community, making the world a better place, getting better, stronger, and faster, and giving generously. If you love it as much as we do, subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to them, on Apple, Spotify, and more.

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They stand guard over our water supply, ensure the seafood we take from it is sustainable, and produce yoga mats, socks, skin care, and more in environmentally and socially conscious ways.

The guests we welcomed to #WeGotGoals for our recent segment on creating a better earth inspired us with their passion and creativity. While climate change remains the challenge of our time, we’re grateful to them for their efforts to address it.

As Jeana, Kristen, Maggie, and I explain on this week’s hostful episode, these goal-getters reminded us that every small action counts. For one thing, tiny steps collectively produce bigger changes. What’s more, these shifts to our routines encourage us to be more mindful about our place in the world around us.

We share the recommendations for everyday action that resonated with us, including:

• Connecting with the natural world so you’re more aware and conscious of your place in it
• Considering what resources you can share, rather than having to own individually, from clothes to cars
• Asking questions of the brands you’re buying about how they’re approaching sustainability
• Conserving water when you can, whether that’s through low-flow toilets or not running your dishwasher/washing machine until they’re full

And, we reported back on our own eco-conscious goals for the month. I mostly succeeded in taking Divvy for short trips (though I realized five miles is a bit farther than I realized). Kristen reduced her Lyft budget; Maggie used her own silverware—and coffee mug—more often; and Jeana consciously cut down her meat consumption.

Even if we didn’t the exact dollar figures or numbers we’d laid out, we all made progress—and armed with the information we’ve gained in the process, are inspired to continue these efforts.

As we head into the next quarter, we’re excited to talk with guests who touch on the theme Better, Faster, Stronger. We have an exciting lineup planned, from fitness industry insiders to film actors and directors to business leaders—all people working to stay at the top of their game, literally and figuratively.

Through all our conversations with high achievers over these past two-plus years, we already know achieving these types of goals takes not only hard work, but also a balance of recovery (in the equation popularized by authors Brad Stulberg and Steve Magness, stress plus rest equals growth).

On this ep, you’ll hear us talk through our highlight reels—from boxing gyms to weightlifting competitions to swimming pools and boardrooms—and outline our own Bigger, Faster, Stronger goals for the season ahead.

Jeana, for instance, wants to build a chain of healthy routines into her workdays, so she shows up her best for herself and her team. Maggie—now fresh off her first triathlon experience—plans to tackle another. Kristen hopes to bring mindfulness into her workouts. And me? I hope to better my writing career by putting more pitches out there, so I can get more used to rejection along with increasing my chances of more wins.

Of course, we’ll update you on how we fare with all these goals by the end of the quarter. And meanwhile, we want to know: What does Better, Faster, Stronger mean to you? And how can YOU aim to master the stress plus rest equation to achieve your most amibitous goals?

You can listen to #WeGotGoals wherever you get your podcasts, including on Spotify. And if you like what you hear, we’d love if you could subscribe, then leave us a rating or a review.

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Ten minutes before my interview with Ryan Horwath of Sitka Salmon Shares, I looked at my list of questions and bolded the one that I felt was most important to a gripping interview:

ASK HIM ABOUT THE FISH TUBE.

The fish tube, in case you weren't on the Internet over the last couple of weeks, is basically what it sounds like: a video of fisherman placing salmon into a giant pneumatic tube that shoots them over a dam, thus shortening their migration from days to minutes. And for whatever reason, it spawned a ton of viral content, as the Internet is wont to do (this version was my favorite).

So, you could say I had some hard-hitting stuff planned.

In all seriousness, I was really excited to talk to Horwath about how Sitka Salmon Shares works to prevent overfishing by connecting Alaskan fishermen to consumers in the mainland. As a member of the board of directors for Sitka Salmon Shares, Horwath knows a ton about the fishing industry and all the sustainability issues that are top-of-mind at the moment; he also serves as the Kodiak Fleet Manager and Western New York Coordinator, and yes, he fishes, too.

Sitka Salmon Shares works similarly to a CSA: members purchase "shares" of a harvest. Those shares then act as preorders, guiding the fishermen and women in how much fish to catch. Because they have prescriptive orders to fill, the fisherfolk can be more discerning with quality, too, leading to a tastier, healthier, ethically-caught fish.

In our interview, Horwath gave me Sustainable Fishing 101, outlining the basics, clueing me in to the difference between wild-caught and farm-raised salmon (and trust me, after hearing his explanation about how color is added to farm-raised salmon you'll want to commit to wild-caught for LIFE), and why we should all be a little wary of the genetically-engineered salmon that the FDA just approved with minimal labeling.

And yes, Horwath and I do chat briefly about the fish tubes—you'll have to listen to the end to hear about it.

One last thing before I set you loose to listen to this episode: if you've got a killer salmon recipe, Sitka Salmon Shares is hosting their annual recipe contest, and the winner gets an all-expenses paid trip for two to Sitka, Alaska in Spring 2020! More details are right here, but it's pretty simple—and yours truly will be one of the judges. Show us what you've got!

If you feel like you learned something from my conversation with Ryan (or you just want to share your favorite meme version of the fish tube), leave us a rating or a review wherever you get your podcasts, like iTunes or Spotify. We’d really appreciate it!

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As is common with a lot of small businesses, Gabe Kennedy and his co-founder Hudson Gaines-Ross launched Plant People with a few thousand dollars in their pockets. With unique individual backgrounds and a shared interest in holistic healing after both endured serious injuries, they decided to create Plant People.

But in opening up the conversation with Gabe about Plant People on this episode of #WeGotGoals, I quickly got the sense we were going to be talking about much more than CBD droplets, capsules and balms.

For Gabe, using natural, holistic methods to heal after his spine injury was a no-brainer. But throughout his long road to recovery, he realized just how unique his story was.

His parents are herbalists and acupuncturists, so Gabe grew up around the concept of natural medicine. And his love for natural, delicious, home-cooked food had him cooking at age 14. He graduated at the top of his class at the Culinary Institute of America.

But where does that lead one to starting a business like Plant People? A simple sentence to describe the business, Gabe says, is a "CBD company" - but he continues in the episode to explain how and why Plant People is much more than that.

"We really are here to celebrate the power of all plants. We're operating at this intersection of plant wellness and modern science."

That's why you'll find Plant People in more places than just online. You'll find Gabe and Hudson hosting dinners utilizing their CBD drops in their dinner menus. And trust me, when you hear Gabe talk about a mindfully crafted lavender sorbet dessert infused with CBD, your next move will be Googling "Plant People dinner event calendar."

And do you know what we didn't even get around to talking about on the episode? Gabe's impressive resume as chef - he won ABC's The Taste (where he was named "America’s best undiscovered cook" by Anthony Bourdain, Nigella Lawson, Marcus Samuelsson and Ludo Lefebvre), and served as the private chef for an impressive list of people, including the Clinton family.

All that is to say, Gabe is up to a lot right now and has his eyes set firmly on the future.

Another pillar to Plant People's foundation is for advocacy and education. There is still a lot to learn about this industry, but Gabe's excited about its potential to give back to the land and the economy as it grows.

"Hemp has the power to be regenerative," Gabe says. "[We're] excited to see what systems we support as the industry grows."

And as for personal big goal on the horizon? He's thinking big for Plant People but sticking with small, attainable goals for his daily life.

"I need to meditate, take care of my mind, move my body a little bit, I want to listen to some great music, I need to get a little bit of sunshine and I need to have some awesome food. If I can do those things every day, it's a pretty great day."

Intrigued by Plant People and want to try it out for yourself? Order here and take 15% off your first order with code, WEGOTGOALS (excludes subscriptions and merchandise). Pop in your earbuds and make this episode of #WeGotGoals part of your morning or evening. If you feel like it helped you have a better day, leave us a rating or a review wherever you get your podcasts, like iTunes or Spotify. We'd really appreciate it!

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We play volleyball on the beach and stand-up paddle board in the lake, run miles and drink rosé along the Riverwalk. This spring, storms sprung up approximately every other day, saturating us (May was the wettest on record, since we began keeping track in 1871).

It’s easy, in Chicago, to take water for granted—we’re surrounded by it.

But Debra Shore, a commissioner at the Metropolitan Water Reclamation District of Greater Chicago since 2006, cautions us against this carelessness, especially in the face of climate change. On this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, Shore implores us to be more thoughtful about how we use and protect this vital resource.

After all, our bodies are made up of 50 to 60 percent water, and there are more humans than ever to soak it all up.

“There are no substitutes for fresh water and it's the substance on which almost all life depends,” she said. “Whether we are good stewards or not is going to be increasingly important in the future.”

If you’re wondering exactly what the Metropolitan Water Reclamation District is, you’re not alone—Shore admits she frequently has to explain the agency’s work. When we decided to do a segment on creating a better earth, I knew I wanted to have her on to educate us. The MWRD, as it’s known, is charged with both protecting the water we drink and reclaiming what falls from the sky.

The agency’s roots go back to 1889. As Chicago’s population first began to boom, its residents dumped waste of all types—human, animal, and industrial—into the river, which flowed into Lake Michigan. Then, as now, the lake served as the source of our drinking water.

“Not a good idea to put raw sewage into your drinking water,” Shore said. “And indeed, people were getting sick from cholera and typhoid and other waterborne diseases. So the city planners at the time knew that Chicago could not continue to grow if they didn't have a safe, secure source of drinking water.”

Officials came up with an ingenious plan—in a brilliant feat of engineering, they dug canals that reversed the flow of the river, carrying these toxins away from the lake instead. And, they established the Sanitary District of Chicago, which would later become the MWRD, to stand guard over the drinking-water supply.

Now, the MWRD oversees wastewater treatment and stormwater management for a massive 882.1-square-area encompassing Chicago and 128 suburbs. That’s a total of 10.35 million people whose hydration needs the agency meets (and whose basements it keeps from flooding).

Shore’s personal interest in conservation began back in her Brownie days, where she and her troopmates collected leaves and learned about nature on hikes. Her best friend’s family brought her on frequent camping and backpacking trips to places like Colorado and New Mexico.

After she moved back to her native Chicago in 1982 (she spent some time in Dallas, Baltimore, and Providence), Shore aimed to commune with the landscape around her. “I found out about a group of volunteers who go out to the Cook County Forest Preserves and engage in habitat restoration, trying to restore health to the remnant prairies and oakwoods and wetlands that are part of our precious forest preserve system,” she said.

She found the work purposeful and personally therapeutic: “A writer named Bill Jordan has said that restoration is a reciprocal act, that in working to restore nature, it restores us, our bodies and our spirits. I certainly found that to be true.”

That led her to help launch a quarterly publication called Chicago Wilderness in 1997, and eventually, to run for office. Those in power didn’t always listen to the on-the-ground experiences of forest preserve volunteers, she realized; she suspected that with her conservation background, she could make a difference.

So she participated in a candidate training program called the Illinois Women's Institute for Leadership, through the Democratic Women in Illinois. She wasn’t sure exactly where to plug in until someone approached her in 2005 about running for a seat on the MWRD.

She began harnessing her various social networks—the conservation community, the LGBTQ community, the Jewish community, and politically minded people she’d met through volunteering for presidential candidate Howard Dean—to build the support she’d need to win a countywide election. (Which she did, handily, and has then been re-elected twice since.)

Assembling coalitions has also been an important part of her work as a commissioner, helping her achieve some big goals during her 12 years of service, Shore told me. One accomplishment she’s particularly proud of is an ordinance to expand a safe, secure collection program to dispose of unused or expired medicine, which otherwise pollutes our water and harms the health of humans, animals, and plants.

Pharmaceutical companies weren’t in favor, in part because similar programs in other states require them to pay for these efforts to collect and dispose of the drugs.

“This fits within this model called product stewardship, where the maker of a product, whether it's paint or tires or electronics, should be responsible for the whole life cycle of the product,” she said.

To move the process along, Shore and her fellow board members emphasized the broad nature of the problem.

“One of the things we learned is that 50 percent of the people who become addicted to prescription drugs start with the drug dealer in their own home, namely their medicine cabinet,” she said.

So, they enlisted public safety experts, police and sheriff departments, and public health departments, along with representatives of the environmental community.

“We had a broad and diverse coalition of people who came to the county board and provided testimony and lent their names in support of this. And it's really hard to object to something like that,” she said.

If you’re inspired to do more by these types of arguments or the threat of climate change, Shore has advice for you. For one thing, vote for public officials who pledge to protect the earth. You can educate yourself by reading the annual reports Shore writes each year—they are incredibly well-crafted and engaging—and signing up for her email newsletter.

There, she shares important updates as well as everyday actions we can all take to be more mindful of our water use and minimize our impact on climate change. Some she divulged on the show include:

• Run the dishwater only when it’s full; similarly, don’t do half-loads of laundry
• Collect the water that runs before your shower heats up and use it to water plants or flush toilets
• Cut down on car use; consolidate your errands or take public transit instead
• If you own your own home, switch to low-flow toilets, and consider more natural landscaping instead of a lawn

Listen to the full episode for more on Shore’s journey and her practical advice, including an answer to the age-old question of whether it’s better to throw food scraps away or use your garbage disposal, if you have one. And if you like what you hear, please subscribe, rate and review the show on Spotify, Stitcher, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts—that helps other goal-getters find the show.

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Ben Katz is the co-founder of Haven Co-Living, a concept that allows like-minded people to live together in beautiful multi-million dollar homes just six blocks from Venice Beach in California. The amenities abound in these stunning homes, but the bedrooms are shared at an affordable monthly rate of $1,000 by yogis, Soul Cycle instructors, and nurses.

While the name “co-living” may be new, it’s really a rebrand of a concept that’s been around since nearly the dawn of time, known by other names like "village," "commune," or "family."

This gathering of like-minded humans who are health and wellness professionals, Katz and his team hypothesize, will create financial freedom and opportunity in large cities. Haven will hone its focus in on cities “where the rent-to-income ratio is 35 percent or higher,” allowing future residents of Haven to have a “safe and secure place to live that doesn’t make you keep a job you hate.”

I can’t imagine a single 20-something who didn’t just consider sharing a bedroom for that kind of freedom.

Outside of the financial reasons to co-live, there’s a built-in community that comes from sharing a kitchen: humans are happier when they have other people around them. This instinct to gather in groups is rooted in our survival as a species. “According to biology, neuroscience, psychology, and more, our bodies actually tend to work better when we’re around not alone,” NBC reported based on findings from The Greater Good Science Center at The University of California, Berkeley.

Katz and I could have talked about community for the entire interview, and probably could launch our own show about the topic, but the concept of circling the wagons of this particular community around the ideals of wellness is certainly interesting. I’ve always believed that if you give adults something to talk about and permission to form a bond, friendship is forged much more easily.

Haven does just that. It gives the community something to talk about – wellness – and permission to form bonds at community programming ranging from daily yoga practices, to watch-parties in the shared movie theater, and to regular chef-created family dinners.

And according to Katz, wellness-minded people simply make better roommates.

“When I think about community, I want to reinforce positive values and I think health and wellness - caring about your fitness caring about clean eating - translates to positive work ethic, translates to positive selection bias in terms of the kind of people who would want to be involved in that community.” Katz goes on to describe how the community at-large is more focused on mindfulness, “And mindful people make better neighbors.”

It's important to note that before starting what's essentially a modern, built-to-be-Instagrammed commune, Katz spent time working for the man. It's an unlikely beginning, but as he talks through it in our interview on #WeGotGoals, it was formative for the next couple of legs on his journey. His experience on Wall Street showed him the "disrespect by the big banks" towards the ordinary consumer that led to the Occupy Wall Street movement. That knowledge and purpose made Katz a pretty dangerous force as he started an online bank: card.com.

He’s a believer in the idea of The Lean Startup, a concept that we at aSweatLife couldn’t advocate for more, especially if you’re testing or bootstrapping a business. Card.com went on to raise more than $18.6 million, according to Crunchbase and Katz progressed a lot as a leader - learning to trust his team to be experts in the things he simply isn't.

You'll see that trust come into play as Katz navigates the differences between himself and Haven's community. Today, the average age of a resident is 26 years old. Katz in contrast is a 40-year-old who followed a largely traditional path.

He trusts his people to guide him.

“I’m really reliant on this woman named Leslie Scofield who sets the tone for the community,” Katz said. And in case you haven’t Googled “Leslie Scofield” yet, it’s extremely important to note that the first image Google returns is one with her and Oprah.

Outside of his backers and employees, though, the most important people Katz is counting on are the people in the community. Katz shared how they're already showing up for each other in ways he never could have predicted or programmed.

And that, goal getters, is a community-builder's dream.

Be sure to follow along as Haven continues to grow on Instagram at @CoLivingatHaven and if you're considering co-living with Haven, be sure to apply soon and tell them aSweatLife sent you for preferential treatment.

And while we're talking about preferential treatment, we're really into YOUR preferential treatment. If you like the show, give us a five-star review wherever you get your podcasts like iTunes and Spotify. Thanks for listening and being a part of our community.

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There's a level of trust necessary for committing to a hair stylist. Not only does the stylist have to know his or her stuff, but you have to feel comfortable enough around him or her for both long, awkward silences and heart-to-heart conversations you never thought you'd have while wearing a full-body cape around your neck. And sure, "hair grows out," eventually, but try telling that to my twelve-year-old self after that one time the stylist cut my bangs distressingly short—if I'd felt an instant connection with my stylist and felt comfortable putting the kibosh on those bangs, maybe I wouldn't have had to wear a baseball cap for the entire summer.

That familiarity is hard to achieve in person, and even harder to simulate over a podcast phone line—but as soon as I dialed in with Sarah Potempa, Erin Potempa-Wall, and Emily Potempa, I felt like I was in the friendliest, most uplifting salon of my life, with three hair fairy godmothers constantly affirming how awesome we all were. (And this was after 20+ minutes of technical malfunctions, which is enough to make even the kindest of podcast guests a little prickly—not so for the Potempa sisters, who were gracious and flexible throughout).

After years talking to beauty editors about the struggles of educating regular people about achieving those always-popular beachy waves, Sarah took it upon herself to invent the Beachwaver, a rotating curling iron that makes it easy for even the least coordinated among us to look effortlessly put together. She partnered with her sister Erin, who left her gig as a corporate lawyer to help navigate the business world and all the patents, trademarks, and more of the less glamorous parts of entrepreneurship. They were later joined by Emily, who was the first person to ever try the Beachwaver and whose production experience on shows like Top Chef helped immensely with the Beachwaver's initial launch on QVC.

And in keeping with our current focus on building a better Earth, one of their big goals right now is "building up our platform so we can use it for good," explains Erin, who's the go-to sister for sustainability and environmental initiatives within The Beachwaver Co.

"As a company, we're taking a very serious look at our supply chain," Erin continues. "We view it as we have this opportunity to bring out great product, but we also have a responsibility to do so in an environmentally sustainable manner," which is showcased in their brand-new wet line, the Make Waves collection.

Their commitment to creating a better world isn't limited to the physical environment; Beachwaver also made a splash (pun totally intended) when they sponsored the World Surf League's Maui Beachwaver Pro competition. Last fall, the World Surf League announced that starting in the 2019 season, they’re awarding equal prize money in men’s and women’s competitions, making it the first (and only) US-based global sports to do so.

"As a brand, we are female-founded and self-funded, and we're a company that wants to partner with like-minded groups," Sarah explained. "It was a really cool opportunity for us, and we were so motivated by these women, and they do deserve the equal pay!"

"When we're looking at who we partner with, we want to make sure it's in line with our brand mission statement," Erin adds on. "A part of our mission statement is empowerment. Empowerment for us is really at the core of who we are as a women-owned company. We're out there every day fighting the good fight, if you will, and it's these little steps coupled with these larger partnerships that we hope someday is really truly going to make a difference."

But as motivating as it was to hear about their commitment to equal pay and then environment, my favorite part of the interview came at the very end, when I asked each sister to tell me about a specific strength held by each of her other sisters.

I'm not going to lie, it got a little dusty in the recording room as I listened to Erin gush about Sarah's ability to make anyone from a supermodel to a mom getting a makeover feel beautiful, or while I heard Sarah compliment Emily on her ability to become friends with anybody in any part of the world.

The sisters agreed. "Everyone listening should go do this! Call your sister, call your mom," said Sarah.

"It's a tough world out there!" added Erin. "It's nice to hear those things once in awhile."

So take this as an official action item, listeners: listen to this podcast, and then take a second to call, text, or email a woman you love and tell them something specific you think they're awesome at. You'll make their day.

And it would make OUR day if you rated or reviewed us on iTunes and Spotify. Thanks for listening and being a part of our community.

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In a culture hyper focused on health, wellness, and overall wellbeing, we're inundated with "organic" this and "100% natural" that. It would almost be more strange to read a label that didn't tout some kind of eco-friendly or health-conscious accreditation.

But for Town and Anchor, the labels behind the brand's namesake stand for much more than just keeping up with the Jones's. I sat down with Parisa Morris, co-founder of Town and Anchor, for this episode of #WeGotGoals. While in the interview, I got a glimpse behind the curtain of a business that aims to truly walk the walk when it comes to setting industry standards for sustainability and health.

Town and Anchor is an all-natural, vegan, zero waste skincare company based out of Chicago, created on the premise of creating a much-needed change in the beauty industry. Morris founded the company alongside her husband five years ago very nearly by accident, which you'll hear Morris talk more about in the episode.

One of my favorite moments of the interview? The decision she had to make when faced with sampling a 16-ounce plastic bottle to hold Town and Anchor's new line of body cleanser.

"I was holding [the bottle in my hands] looking at it and thought, 'I can't order 500 more of these. I can't be responsible for this plastic that everyone else is going to end up having," Morris told me as she recalled the moment, almost as if it were happening all over again. "I don't know if they're going to recycle it, and even if they do recycle, about 90% of [our] garbage is not recycled. A very small amount actually ends up getting recycled, and I didn't want my name on that."

This was the moment I could see that Morris's personal goals to make the earth a better place to live were the driving force for her business. And sometimes, that drive to do better, to be better, and to set a better example, means setting logic aside.

"Logic has been one of our biggest enemies," she said.

In this episode you'll also hear from Morris what it means for a company to be truly vegan and cruelty-free - more buzzwords all to often thrown around.

Her reasoning to never budge on quality?

"Our body is mostly skin, and we absorb 65% of what we put onto our skin," Morris said.

Little by little, Morris has introduced a minimalistic lifestyle, wherever possible using only the products she knows where absolutely all the ingredients come from, but that has been and continues to be a journey for her.

Her biggest advice to individuals and to companies who want to bring environmental sustainability and quality to the forefront of their practices is to start small. It doesn't have to be daunting to pick one thing you care a lot about and focus on that. Eventually, you can create positive change for the earth with your own habits if you stick to it.

If you live in Chicago, you can find Morris at the Town and Anchor booth of the first Bide Market pop-up September 15 at Exchange 312. Bide Market, hosted by Town and Anchor is the first sustainable, luxury shopping experience.

"We'll have like-minded vendors and conscious consumers under the same roof," Morris said. "We'll have sustainable activists coming in, doing speeches, and we'll have a panel discussion. We want to build a community in Chicago, where sustainability isn't just a trending topic. We're embracing it and our actions are now greater than the things we post on Facebook or on Instagram. We're taking the steps towards making an actual change - and I think that has to be done with a community."

And if you live just about anywhere else in the world, you can try out Town and Anchor products for a discount. Just pop in the code WEGOTGOALS20 at checkout.

Like what you hear on #WeGotGoals? Please subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you’d be so kind as to leave us a rating or a review, that will help us continue to grow our own community of goal-getters.

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Each goal-getter and how they set out to to achieve big things is as unique as his or her own fingerprint. Nothing has been made clearer by interviewing more than 100 people about this very subject for our podcast #WeGotGoals than this point. And for Emmett Williams, President and Partner at MyZone, goal setting runs through his veins and is both his currency and his love language.

His currency: In MyZone's Chicago office - the largest of several across the globe - I sat across from Williams as he spoke fluent Goal. He rattled off resources, goal-setting theories by CEOs from Fortune 500 companies, and used "BHAG" as a noun as comfortably as we do at the aSweatLife offices.

MyZone is a company built on a foundation of goals for goal oriented gyms and studios with metrics-minded members. Today, MyZone can be found in more than 6,000 health clubs and studios and it's being used by more than one million consumers across the world.

Ask Williams if he's satisfied with that, and he'll share that MyZone's "BHAG is to make 100 million people feel good about exercise." And while that number may feel batty, Williams is dead serious about it - you'll hear it in his delivery on the podcast.

When you pair Williams' laser-focus on goals with his deep knowledge and experience in fitness - it would hard to imagine what sort of obstacle it may actually take to stop him.

And you'll hear him describe the path to achieving goals on an organizational level illustratively. He uses the metaphor of a boat navigating a river, avoiding obstacles, maintaining a competitive moat, and being aware of where their customers are. The diagram he's talking through will be helpful for those two minutes (and probably something you'll steal for your next strategy session).

His Love Language: As fluently as he speaks in KPIs at work, Williams and his family are all communicating in BHAGs at home too. His family, he said, sets goals together at the beginning of the year and they check on those goals on Sundays. I pictured Williams, his wife, his 10-year-old daughter and his 8-year-old son sitting around a dining room table, grading their goals, "Red, Orange and Green" just like the leaders at MyZone.

And on first brush, the tracking of a family's goals via powerpoint and the listing the things each should "stop, start and continue" in pursuit of said goals, might sound extreme. But for Williams, it provides actionable insights into his kids' worlds, struggles and accomplishments.

And it also serves as a handy mechanism for managing the health of his marriage - he and his wife rate their own interactions in the same way: Red, Orange and Green.

"If we see too many weeks in a row of orange ... and we haven't been able to crack that and send it back to green, we know it's time for a date night," he said.

Listen to this week's episode for inspiration to set and track your own goals in and out of the office on #WeGotGoals.

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A good mani leaves you feeling polished, strong, and put-together—ready to face whatever challenges the day brings you. But often, the process of procuring it poses a conundrum.

You could go for a high-end service at a swanky spa, if you have the cash and spare time. Or, you might choose an inexpensive yet inefficient neighborhood spot that leaves you feeling vaguely icky about the inequity between customers and employees—especially in light of a brutal New York Times expose several years ago that detailed horrific labor conditions in the industry.

Our guests this week on the #WeGotGoals podcast, ezza nails co-founders Ale Breuer and Kim Marsh, are passionate about changing this situation for everyone involved—driving, as Marsh has put it, “the nail care revolution.”

Breuer and Marsh joined me in the studio, fresh from opening their second location and closing their seed-round funding of $1.5 million, to share how they’re creating a better earth by improving conditions for the women living on it.

From the customer perspective, the ezza experience screams busy millennial professional. You can book your appointment (and choose your polish color) online, come in as early as 7 a.m. or as late as 8:30 p.m., join as a member for a significant price break, and pay and tip without touching cash.

But most importantly, you can feel good about the business you’re supporting. “What truly, truly makes us different is we empower women on both sides of the manicure table,” Breuer said. It’s a mission that’s always been critical to the Teach for America alumnae, who met while earning their MBAs at the University of Chicago’s Booth School of Business.

That empowerment begins with a shift in language; employees are called “squadmates,” for one thing. But it’s not mere terminology. They’re paid fair wages, receive opportunities for education and advancement, and work flexible part-time or full-time schedules.

Breuer had the idea for elevating nail care early on during her MBA program. She experimented with mobile services and a pop-up shop before Marsh joined as her partner, and the two decided the business needed permanent addresses to provide a consistent, branded experience.

Opening the first location ranks as the pair’s standout achievement. “What’s great about brick and mortar is that you can actually be inside your business and see what you have built,” Breuer said. “That first day, when we opened and we had customers come in and members come in to our business, was truly one of a kind.”

Getting there wasn’t easy; they heard “no” plenty of times along the way, especially from male potential investors. Persisting—being “tough as nails,” per their tagline—involved recruiting a top-notch team of other female leaders, seeking out mentors among other entrepreneurs, and adjusting the way they pitched the business, focusing on the opportunity instead of solely empowerment and citing success stories like Drybar.

In 2017, they won $75,000 in the Booth New Venture Challenge, which helped them get the doors open. Now, they have hard data (including hundreds of members) to prove their concept. When we spoke—just two weeks out from opening their second spot—they were fully booked there 24 hours in advance.

Breuer and Marsh drive this growth by being “near-maniacal” about setting goals and monitoring progress toward them, on a monthly and even weekly basis. They’re always striving for better net promoter scores for both customers and squadmates—how likely people are to recommend booking a service at ezza, or working there.

Though they’re fine-tuned to operational details, Marsh and Breuer also hold true to their core values, including staying powerfully positive. Squad members write each other notes of support and gratitude on core value notepads; squad outings and appreciation days are regular occurrences.

After all, if the team enjoys their work and love coming in, customers will take notice. “It’s so different when you think about a nail salon visit versus having a nail home—an experience in a community that you feel a connection to,” Marsh said.

That atmosphere and dedicated clientele and staff, they believe, will drive them toward their next big goal: taking the brand nationwide. To truly shift an entire industry toward equity and fair labor practices, they’ll need to secure enough market share so that other salons will have to follow suit. This winter, they’ll start fundraising again for their series A round—this time, with a passionate group of investors, squadmates, and members already on board.

Listen to the full episode to hear more about what Breuer learned when she went to nail school, how her mom inspired the company’s name, and all the other ways they’re working toward their goal of nationwide nail domination.

If you’re in Chicago, you can visit ezza nails at 240 E. Illinois St. in Streeterville, 180 N. Wacker Dr. in the Loop, and within the year, in the West Loop, too. And wherever you are—follow them online or on Instagram for updates on when they’ll be in YOUR neighborhood.

Like what you hear on #WeGotGoals? Pplease subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you’d be so kind as to leave us a rating or a review, that will help us continue to grow our own community of goal-getters.

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As a college student, Michael Mader never thought he'd start a business that would seek to end homelessness for youths on a city-wide and nation-wide scale. But then again, he also didn't foresee a traumatic brain injury that would require an emotional and financial support system for months on end, either.

As Mader told me on this episode of #WeGotGoals, "I was unable to go to school, I was unable to work, and had to heavily rely on my support group - so family and friends that were there for me to drive me to my doctor's appointments, to help me with grocery shopping, cover rent, as well as emotional support - I recognized that without that group of people I could have easily ended up being homeless."

It took a scary turn of events to force Mader to see a terrible reality for many others - especially young people - who have similar situations and don't have that same network of support to fall back on. This was his inspiration, his drive, to do something about that reality and create real, tangible change.

Enter: Hippy Feet, a sock company on the surface, a support group for individuals who don't have one underneath.

In September 2016, while Mader was in recovery, he launched Hippy Feet with his partner, Sam Harper, as a buy-one-give-one program, but they very quickly realized they could do much more.

"About 11 months in, we began developing a program that we call pop-up employment," Mader said. "We bring our packaging and processes directly to homeless youth drop-in centers and shelters. We provide employment to people ages 16 - 23 who are experiencing homelessness, and we employ them to package every pair of our socks."

The concept is simple, but the impact of doing more than donating warm clothes to the homeless has become increasingly powerful year over year. Hippy Feet has become a helping hand that keeps on helping as homeless youth go through their pop-up employment programs. First, it's a consistent source of income. It then helps these young adults form a consistent track record of work, which can be leveraged to gain additional internships, entry level jobs, and more references to continue on a path towards a career.

And if that's not a tall enough task, maintaining eco-friendly, sustainable processes as an integral part of the business is still a top priority for Mader and his team.

"We make all of our products domestically, and we're focused on using environmentally friendly yarn to make the majority of our socks and apparel products. It's a process that uses 99% less water than growing traditional cotton would. We've saved over 14 million gallons of water just through using recycled yarns," he said. "It's available, it's just a matter of committing to [the practices]."

Mader may only be three years into the business, and just a few years out of college himself, but he's got both big dreams for the future of Hippy Feet and big advice to listeners of this podcast.

He challenges us to go for it, if we have an idea that we want to make happen. "People stray away at the fear of failure; let fear be a motivator, but don't let it consume you," Mader said.

If you listen to this episode of #WeGotGoals with Michael Mader and enjoy hearing his story, we'd love it if you'd leave us a rating or a review. It helps us share Mader's story and other big goal getters' stories like his with the world. Don’t forget, you can listen to this episode through the link at the top of this post, or via iTunes, Spotify and wherever else you get your podcasts.

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"Why are you guys obsessed with eating crickets?"

"This is a weird IG story."

"Gross."

"

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When we kicked off Season 3 of #WeGotGoals, we set out to walk the walk by setting small goals within each quarter of this goal-focused podcast to curate guests who are doing big things in the areas which we care most about.

For instance, over the last few months we brought community building to the forefront of our goal focus. We interviewed grassroots community developers like the founder of Sofar Sounds and community director of Girls Night In. We brought guests like Shanna Missett Nelson, President of Jazzercise, and Bonnie Michele and Tracy Roemer who started Shred415 together, onto the podcast to talk about scaling a small community into a global phenomenon. We caught up with professional adventurer Hilaree Nelson about the role community plays in going after big solo goals, and Coss Marte, founder of ConBody, on the meaning of community after solitary confinement.

And as we head into the next quarter, we're just as excited for our next round-up of guests and the theme we're setting major goals to focus on: creating a better earth.

All four of the #WeGotGoals podcast hosts are well aware of how big of an issue we're taking on. With statements as clearly defined as the United Nations's declaration that “Climate Change is the defining issue of our time and we are at a defining moment," we couldn't not dedicate at least a quarter of our year to highlighting what highly successful entrepreneurs are doing to better our earth.

And at the same time that we focus on the macro, we're taking the next few months to focus on what we can do on a micro scale to have a more positive impact on the environment around us. In this host-ful podcast episode to kick it all off, listen to the hosts are setting goals to do to build in eco-friendly habits into their daily lives.

Like Kristen, who wants to reduce her plastic waste at the grocery store in a few key ways, or Maggie who wants to bring her reusable wood cutlery with her to avoid taking plastic silverware during all her lunches out. Jeana would like to eliminate as much meat and dairy from her diet as possible (one of the biggest ways to reduce your impact on the earth), and Cindy plans to use her newly purchase Divvy membership to bike anywhere within five miles of her home for the foreseeable future.

We're eager to hear: what small ways do you implement eco-friendly practices to your daily life? How do you integrate them in a way that feels natural? What else would you like to try to do that you haven't set as a goal yet?

We're so excited to kick off this new quarter of #WeGotGoals with you! You can catch up on the last season of community builders wherever you get your podcasts, like aSweatLife.com, iTunes, and Spotify. And if you wouldn't mind leaving us a little love in a rating or a review, we'd really appreciate it.

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On #WeGotGoals podcast episode 102, I interviewed the founder of 305 (305 Fitness, that is), Sadie Kurzban. When she was only 24, Kurzban was putting the finishing touches on the first physical space for 305 Fitness in the heart of New York City, a project that was four times as expensive as she planned, while the rest of her pals from college were simply enjoying their second year out of college.

"I was sitting there thinking, what did I just do? I was super scared," Kurzban told me in this episode. But it was at this point - a point at which many people may deem the stress to be insurmountable - that Kurzban believed in herself and the mission she founded the company on. Not only did she get past her fears of owning one studio, but she then went on to open more locations in four cities and certify over 60 more national instructors to teach the 305 Fitness method.

Back in 2012, Kurzban had a vision to take her passion for dance and a desire to create change in the fitness industry (and to make it more accessible and relatable to all shapes, sizes and types of people). Helpfully, she also had a $25,000 grant won from a pitch competition in college, which she used to start 305 Fitness.

All of these powerful reasons gave her sustained momentum to make it through the ups and downs that come from starting anything from scratch. As she phrases it, "It was adrenaline, just this one goal, [to] just open it, just open it." But you'll hear in this episode what happened next.

"It was actually about a week after we opened and I had a moment to sit with myself and I thought, 'Oh my god, I don't know if I want this anymore.'"

I'm speaking for myself but I'm sure I'm not alone in saying it is an all too familiar thought for us goal-getters. Her candor about being so laser-focused on one goal, to then nearly wish it away after achieving it, was refreshing and had me head-nodding through our long distance interview.

Kurzban isn't afraid to share her challenges, to be open about where she's struggled along her journey to founding one of the most popular dance fitness workouts in the country right now - or say that while everything can look amazing from the outside, Instagram is most definitely not reality.

You'll also hear her talk about the ever-present challenge of fundraising as a female.

"It's really gross how little investment there is in female teams; it's even grosser how little investment there is in women of color," she said.

As for her goals for the future, there are many you'll hear her talk about, but on the list:

"I'm totally going to become an investor in female-led businesses." Kurzban went on to cite this study from Boston Consulting Group, which explains that women, on average, generate twice as much revenue for every dollar invested in start-ups in comparison to their male counterparts.

Pop your earbuds in and hit "play" on Sadie Kurzban's episode of #WeGotGoals to hear more about her passion for movement, for changing the fitness industry, and supporting other female-led start-ups. You can get this episode here, on iTunes, on Spotify, or anywhere else you get your podcasts. And if you have a second to show a little love by leaving us a five star review, we'd really appreciate it!

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Even if you're not familiar (yet) with She Can & She Did or the Badass Lady Gang, you probably know who Kelly Roberts is thanks to her viral 15 minutes back in 2014, when she ran a half marathon and took selfies with an unsuspecting hot guy every mile. The popular Buzzfeed post inspired a blog, and from there, Roberts has taken on the mantle of relatable "struggle runner" to women worldwide.

Candidly referring to herself as a former president of the I Hate Running Club, Roberts now trains to one day qualify for the Boston Marathon, and she wants women worldwide to realize that strength comes in different shapes, sizes, and body types (she even crowdsourced a sports bra guide to help women of all sizes find a suitable sports bra for them, pointing out that not having a fitting, functional sports bra can be a major obstacle to being active). On She Can & She Did, she invites women to share their stories through stories, art, images, and more. (And Roberts herself has represented a non-traditional image of strength in prominent media spots with Nike and Runner's World.)

Meanwhile, Roberts created the Badass Lady Gang (BALG) to be a free fitness movement (a la November Project) that empowers women to connect with others while getting active. The best part? No runner is ever left behind, as Roberts structures BALG workouts to ensure all runners are within shouting distance of each other and succeeding together is a built-in element.

"It is a running crew," Roberts explains, "but it's truly a come as you are community. You could be an Olympic trials qualifier or on day one of a fitness journey—both of you will get a really fun workout. [We always say] community first, a really fun workout second."

And although Roberts has her hands in a variety of communities now, it wasn't always that easy. Roberts spoke about struggling to find her niche when she moved to NYC, especially as a former theater major who was used to having casts and crews to hang out with. Now, one of her current goals (outside of training for Boston) is to put more effort into having a social life and incorporating the arts back into her life, whether through improv workshops or sketch writing classes.

We think you'll love listening to Kelly Roberts and her infectious enthusiasm in this week's #WeGotGoals episode, which you can listen to here, on iTunes, on Spotify, or anywhere you get your podcasts. Show a little love by leaving us a five star review if you have a second, please and thank you!

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Bonnie Micheli and Tracy Roemer - co-founders of Shred415 - are sort of a package deal. Together, they go by Bonnie and Tracy, populating a shared Instagram under the name with photos of the two of them, sharing an office where each sits under their first initial, taking vacations with their families together. In fact, it was during this interview that I realized that I had not ever pronounced their last names aloud.

And at aSweatLife, we use a style that was beaten into me in Journalism School - spelling out a full name and listing a title on first mention (Bonnie Micheli and Tracy Roemer - co-founders of Shred415) and then referring to that person by their last name from that point forward. And although I will follow that style, I must note how difficult it's going to be, which is a true win for the pair who have successfully branded themselves by their first names together and created a world for themselves built around fitness.

"I think we're sisters at this point," Micheli said of the pair that met in line at Starbucks and bonded over their shared love of fitness.

Roemer spent her early career at Bally Total Fitness, creating a new focus on lifestyle within the former fitness giant, but when life brought her to Chicago, she worked at PowerPlate in their studio and eventually was the General Manager of David Barton Gym. Micheli had just started teaching Barre at Dailey Method, although her deep passion for fitness fueled her through her early career as a traveling computer programmer.

Together, they bonded over their shared love of fitness and their desire to create a treadmill and strength training format.

And eight years ago when Micheli and Roemer opened their first Shred415 location, Roemer recalls where the fitness industry was: fitness fanatics were committed to their routines, but not to their gyms. Those who wanted to do their favorite fitness classes bought class-packs, not memberships. A departure from big-box gyms and their commitment-focused memberships.

"Everything comes back full-circle," Roemer mused. "I feel like we're back in this full-circle cycle where we started with big box gyms and people were paying memberships ... there's a lot more competition in the playing field now and we've all come back to trying to capture our clients and have recurring revenue and memberships."

And lot of other elements have changed through the near-decade of Shred415. The pair can now count themselves as franchisors. As the brand first grew, it was corporate-owned - a model in which one controlling entity invests in and opens all locations. That's a slower way to grow, especially as the Shred415 community called for expansion outside of Chicago.

"We were receiving emails from people across the country wanting us to get to their city, their town, their state," Roemer remembers.

But after winning EY Entrepreneur of the Year in 2015, Micheli and Roemer made a life-changing connect with OrangeTheory founder Ellen Latham who talked them through franchising and how it can supercharge their nationwide growth.

Today, you can find Shred415 across the nation, run by franchisees who fell in love with the brand and even some who started as instructors in Chicago and took the brand with them to other cities and states.

At the heart of this expanding empire, though, are two friends who were lucky enough to meet in line at a coffee shop and somehow managed to find their perfect match in business.

"The second we worked together it was such an incredible partnership from day one, we, just have each others' best interests in mind," Micheli said.

Find Shred415 locations nationwide, and soon globally. Work out with Bonnie and Tracy on the SweatWorking App and if you already love Shred415 and want to open one yourself, you can find out more about franchising here.

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Go back in time with me for a minute, back to when I climbed Mount Kilimanjaro in Tanzania (and wrote about it, here). After the trip, I found it incredibly hard to distill the experience into a two-sentence answer I could call upon when people asked me how the trip went. It was awesome, it was emotional, it was awful at times and joyful at others, and the aspect of doing this insane achievement with my close family put a whole different layer on things.

Fast forward to my podcast interview with Hilaree Nelson, an explorer and ski mountaineer, and I finally felt like I'd found someone who could truly relate to my unique experience. That's because Hilaree also climbed Kilimanjaro with her family, who ranged in age from four years old to 74 years old. The highs were high and the lows were low, and by the time we wrapped up that portion of the interview, I had almost forgotten that I wasn't talking to a close friend—I was talking to someone who's climbed two 8,000 meter peaks (Everest and Lhotse) in 24 hours; who's skied DOWN from the Himalayan summit of Cho Oyu in Tibet; and who's summited a terrifyingly named mountain called the Peak of Evil.

Safe to say that our similarities begin and end at Mount Kilimanjaro.

But Nelson and I still connected over a lot over the rest of our conversation. In keeping with our theme of community, I heard first-hand stories of times when a community that you trust and communicate well with meant the difference between life and death—death, in this case, coming in the form of an endless, can't-see-the-bottom crevasse that one fellow climber narrowly avoided (you'll hear me audibly gasp at least two times during this part of the interview).

What I found really interesting was the way Nelson spoke about the "yin and yang" of working with your climbing partner. When one partner is down, she's found, the other partner is able to bring the positive energy and keep the party moving along, and that positivity is something she strives to embody in her expeditions and her new role as team captain of The North Face Global Athlete Team.

She also spoke at length about the communities that allow her to be a professional adventurer: both the fellow athletes that inspire her to reach new heights (literally), and her close-knit community that helps care for her children and provide that hands-on support so she can travel the world.

If you're in Chicago and you found yourself on the edge of your seat during this interview like I did, you can see Nelson speak live on May 7 at Roosevelt University as part of her role with National Geographic. Her talk, the "Point Of No Return," details a harrowing expedition to a remote peak in Myanmar, during which the biggest challenge she faced was more than the restricted rations, the challenging conditions, and risk of hypothermia—it was managing the clashing personalities that could put everyone in grave danger. You can bet I'll be there, and I already know my heart rate will be elevated just listening to her speak.

Like this interview? Show us by rating or reviewing us! Don't forget, you can listen to this episode through the link at the top of this post, or via iTunes, Spotify and wherever else you get your podcasts.

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Ten years ago, when Rafe Offer created Sofar Sounds, he had no idea what kind of global community he would build. He didn't know how badly people needed real, tangible, human connection. He was just frustrated with his experiences at concerts by musical artists he knew and respected.

With the drive to improve his own listening experience, Offer came up with a relatively simple idea: invite artists into people's homes to play an intimate set. The audience would kindly be asked to not use their phones and hold off on getting up to get drinks during the experience. Offer describes that first experience as something that truly allowed for connection. It felt so good, they decided to do it again, and then again. By the third living room concert, the line to enter was out the door - and Offer and his co-founders knew they were onto something.

Since that first concert in London in 2009, Sofar Sounds has reached 400 cities, with over 20,000 concerts played in various living rooms, on rooftops and in small retail spaces around the world.

And although Offer was always passionate about his music, prior to launching this global phenomenon he held titles like Global Marketing Director for Disney and for Coca-Cola, as well as Director of Innovation at Diageo. In this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear him talk about sensing the need to let go of his role in marketing for a major brand and pursue this idea of Sofar Sounds with all his might.

The concept, to "be in the moment, [to] take it all in," as Offer says, was - and is - universal.

"People all around the world really felt the same way. Wherever we are in the world, we crave that," he says.

The thing Offer's most proud to say he's accomplished - even after an impressive career creating campaigns for the likes of Coca-Cola and Disney - has everything to do with this massive, like-minded community Sofar has created through small, intimate experiences.

And as far as big goals for the future, well, you can read them for yourself on his LinkedIn profile. Not unlike another #WeGotGoals guest, Sarah Robb O'Hagan, who lists her failures on her LinkedIn page, Offer sees the platform as an opportunity to make a statement.

"As soon as I say [my goal] to somebody and start diving in, you already sort of feel like you're on your way," he says. "And publishing it is another way of saying it out loud...it just helps reinforce it that this is real."

After you listen to this episode of #WeGotGoals (and subscribe wherever you like to get your podcasts - like Apple or Spotify!) you can check out what Sofar Sounds concerts are playing in a neighborhood near you.

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"I do think that I’ve become the patron saint of failure," Sarah Robb O'Hagan said as I spoke to her for the #WeGotGoals podcast with a laugh. But that's exactly what made me pay attention when I met her two years ago: a special sort of grit that's simultaneously powerful and vulnerable.

On this week's episode, Robb O'Hagan and I talk about her goals, sure, and they're well worth a listen, but I was most struck by her retelling of childhood in New Zealand. It's also telling to note what was dominating the news when we spoke - it was in close proximity to the college cheating scandal that made "Aunt Becky" trend on twitter and days after a terrorist attack devastated a mosque in New Zealand. And in the background, we had rescheduled our interview so that Robb O'Hagan could attend a vigil in a mosque in New York City shoulder-to-shoulder with a grieving community.

Robb O'Hagan is naturally an introspective person, but I'd think that because of this convergence of factors, you'll catch a certain nostalgia in this interview - a mix of gratitude for her upbringing and a connection to home.

And just like everyone on the podcast before her, I asked Robb O'Hagan to share a big goal she set and achieved in the past. For her it was leaving New Zealand, which could be misconstrued as out of alignment with a deep love for her home. But after listening - and re-listening - I would argue that it was her upbringing there that gave her the courage and confidence she needed to laugh in the face of a challenge.

Growing up in land of "50 million sheep and 5 million people," she delightfully explains, her parents empowered her to "figure it out." Their parenting style? The opposite of helicopter or snowplow parents, a fact that makes her profoundly grateful.

ICYMI, a snowplow parent amounts to a parent who actively works to eliminate the threat of hardships and failures for their children. In Robb O'Hagan's book Extreme YOU: Step Up. Stand Out. Kick Ass. Repeat. she writes about taking big risks and dealing with big failures.

Risks, failures, and big wins pepper her resume - in fact, her LinkedIn profile lists the failures in every role she's held. Taking big risks led her to a role where she was "in over her head" at Virgin Megastores, which got her exactly one week of severance. Big risks also led her to the successful rebrand of Gatorade, a move she was initially skewered for in the media, but under her leadership, it turned out to be a winning strategy.

And as she speaks about her goals for the future, she talks about her desire to change the face of leadership in business and the world, speaking with pride about Jacinda Ardern, the Prime Minister of New Zealand.

You'll hear her speak about mentorship, leadership and the climb, but you'll also hear her give a simple piece of advice to change your personal worldview today.

"Pick a complete stranger in the office that [you] don’t normally spend time with and ask them to go to lunch," she said. "It will blow your mind."

Listen to this episode of #WeGotGoals featuring Sarah Robb O'Hagan wherever you get your podcasts on Apple, Spotify, and more. This season, you’ll hear guests who have done big things related to building community, making the world a better place, getting better, stronger, and faster, and giving generously.

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Some athletes aim to run or bike faster, others to score more points or lift heavier. But those at Chicago’s EDGE Athlete Lounge have the same underlying target: “becoming better people and helping each other attain whatever goal is in front of them.”

Robyn LaLonde and her husband Brian opened EDGE about five years ago as a space where athletes can “do hard things together,” she told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

The idea came to the couple when they were training for an Ironman triathlon and found that, even after hours together on the ride or run, they wanted to keep hanging out with their training partners.

The only obvious location was a bar, but the LaLondes thought there must be another option. So they went about creating it, opening a spot that feels like the sweatiest living room you can imagine.

There are plenty of recovery tools—from ice baths to lasers to inflatable compression boots—along with bike trainers, Woodway treadmills, and training classes. The facilities draw high performers from CrossFitters to triathletes, but as LaLonde said, “technology has always been secondary to the human interaction and empowerment that happens.”

Bringing the EDGE vision to life was the hardest thing LaLonde has ever done, she told me—she’s quite honest about the struggles, financially, emotionally, and physically. By the end of the buildout, she and Brian were low on cash and completing tasks such as painting and laying carpet with their own hands.

They got through it with some sleep deprivation, advice from good friends, and a mantra they’d developed on a cycling trip: “You’re already on the mountain.”

In other words, once you start pedaling to the top of a peak, any push forward will get you closer to your goal. Your pace might feel slower than you’d like, your final destination a bit shrouded in fog. Still, steady progress beats doubt and anxiety every time, and you can remind yourself it’s all a bit easier on the downhill.

After the doors opened and athletes streamed in, LaLonde began to see the community she’d always envisioned take shape. She, Brian, and the staff take many active steps to encourage its growth. When new members sign up, there’s space on the form for their athletic goals and mantras, so coaches get to know them on a deeper level right from the start. EDGE hosts cheer zones at races, gathers for off-site events from bocce ball tournaments to service projects, and communicates through newsletters, social media, and their very own podcast.

But many of the connections made there are organic and natural. After all, when you’re sweating hard next to someone—or relaxing in boots or shivering in an ice bath—there’s almost no choice but to chat. Even athletes from very different sports can “cross-pollinate,” connecting on what’s similar and learning from what’s different about each others’ pursuits.

When it’s time for a race or competition, everyone’s out there in their EDGE gear, supporting one another in person and virtually (another key to community? “Plenty of schwag,” LaLonde said). The results are impressive—for instance, 93 percent of EDGE athletes who toed the line at last fall’s Chicago Marathon finished their first 26.2 or set a personal record.

Perhaps more importantly, when someone faces a struggle outside of sports, the community comes through again. For instance, when the LaLonde’s beloved pug Bruce passed away suddenly last year, their kitchen was stocked with food and their offices filled with flowers. “It was the kindest thing,” she said. “We were like, ‘whoa, yeah, this is a special group.’”

Listen to the full episode of #WeGotGoals for more on EDGE, and if you’re in Chicago, you can check out the space for yourself at 1747 N. Elston Ave.

We’re talking community for the rest of April and May on #WeGotGoals. The rest of the season, we’ll hear from goal-getters who are making the world a better place, getting better, stronger, and faster, and giving generously. You can subscribe on your favorite pod platform—including iTunes, Spotify, and Stitcher—and if you like what you hear, please take a minute to rate and review the show so others can find us.

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I have a few things that I wholeheartedly recommend to anyone who will listen to me: the fancy Medjool dates from Trader Joe's, my acupressure mat, the book Station Eleven. And for the past few months, I've added Girls' Night In to that list.

Girls' Night In (GNI) is an email newsletter that goes out every Friday, and it's dedicated to all things self-care and the joy of staying in. Expect to get a blend of product recommendations, buzzworthy conversation topics, and a few #longreads to kill those last few hours at your desk.

It's no secret around here that I love the written word, and I have a special fascination with email newsletters in particular (in no small part because I have occasionally tried to force my friends to read my own recaps of The Bachelor by spamming their inboxes with my long-winded musings). The feeling of writing a long, thought-out email and then sending it into the internet is a special kind of vulnerability—will anyone respond? Is someone going to get that obscure Drake lyric? Did I misspell occasionally?

But GNI has taken a traditionally one-way communication—the email—and brought it into a real life community. That feat is exactly why I decided I wanted to interview Olivia Rogine for our feature on community.

Olivia is the Community and Experiences Lead at Girls' Night In, meaning she's responsible for bringing GNI experiences to life and create a community where members can build meaningful connections (not unlike a #Sweatworking event).

Ironically, Olivia's own self-care suffered when she first began to get involved with GNI. After cold-emailing GNI founder Alisha Ramos (a move I personally identified with, since that's how I connected with Jeana way back when), Olivia began working part-time as a GNI Book Club host. But as her passion and involvement with GNI ramped up, so did her full-time work life, leading to Olivia burning the candle at both ends and neglecting her self-care priorities.

Now that she's full-time at GNI, Olivia is dedicated to building an inclusive, diverse community of GNI readers.

"The most important thing in building a community is building that common ground with inclusivity and empathy," she explained to me, when I asked . "Making those introductions, finding people that have commonalities, and introducing community members to one another"—those all go a long way in turning Internet strangers into real-life buddies.

And as far as Olivia's own goals that she's working towards? This year, she's all about taking control over her personal finance—a form of what we referred to as "boring self-care." That goal led us to talking about how self-care is often viewed as a privileged activity; after all, the people who can take part in the most Insta-friendly self-care routines (you know EXACTLY which face mask and bubble bath posts I'm talking about) have the free time and the budget to do that performative self-care.

But, Olivia pointed out, some of the most important self-care we do is free and wouldn't be that interesting to post about. Olivia, for example, loves meal planning and taking her time writing her grocery list, cooking, and knowing that she's nourishing her body for the week ahead—a ritual she developed as a child growing up in an agricultural community.

I could go on and on about the intersection of self-care and community, but I think it'll be easier for you to listen to the episode yourself. You can listen to the podcast here, on iTunes, Spotify, or anywhere you get your podcasts. Like us? Let us know! Leave us a rating or a review; it'd mean the world to us.

And if you're obsessed with self-care and staying in on a Friday night, a) we were meant to be friends, and b) you can sign up for the Girls' Night In newsletter right here (don't be surprised if you find yourself forwarding the newsletters to your besties every single week), and fall instantly in love with their Instagram @girlsnightinclub.

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By the time Coss Marte, Founder and CEO of ConBody, landed in solitary confinement at Rikers Island Prison he was ready for a new path. And that path would eventually lead him to create a fitness sensation with a built-in cause component that landed him in The New York Times, Buzz Feed, Elle, Vice, and The Startup podcast.

While sitting alone in his cell 23 hours a day, he reflected on his ninth incarceration. This time, he had gotten his own health in-check, losing 70 pounds through prison cell calisthenics. After helping himself, he helped other inmates get healthy too, 20 of them lost 1,000 pounds combined.

And it's hard to understand what solitary confinement does to a person unless you've researched it extensively or lived it, but it is certainly not something one would ever hope for. During this interview, I referenced solitary confinement as "an opportunity" for Marte as he noted that its within the tiny cell, in the dead of summer that he finds his inspiration for ConBody.

That's a cringeworthy moment for me now, but I didn't want to edit it out. It's an important moment to illustrate why it's hard for the formerly incarcerated to readjust or find work: it's difficult for the outside world to understand what they've been through.

And outside from difficulty understanding, landing a job is nearly impossible for someone with a felony on his record. According to the National Institute of Justice, within five years of release, about three-quarters (76.6 percent) of released prisoners were rearrested.

So, when Marte set out to build ConBody, he also set out to create jobs for the formerly incarcerated. As he built the business, he built a pipeline of people who were currently in the prison system, starting right back at Rikers Island.

But how do you make the prison where you were once an inmate embrace you as a peer? For Marte, it took a big goal and a little luck.

After leaving prison, Marte set goals with a program buicalled Defy Ventures - which supports the incarcerated and formerly incarcerated to become successful, legal entrepreneurs and employees - empowered him to reach for achievements he thought were impossible. You'll hear about some of those on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, but one opportunity that came out of Defy Ventures seemed plucked right out of the universe for Marte: he was asked to speak at a conference for prison wardens and police officers in New Orleans.

Marte is a natural marketer and when his session at the conference was empty, he corralled wardens from other sessions, filling his room and sharing his story with them.

"It was the first time they really listened to someone who was incarcerated," Marte said, remembering how the business card for the Deputy Commissioner of Rikers Island landed in his hand.

Today, Marte is building bridges not only into the prison system, but also between the formerly incarcerated and the young working professional who come into his gym.

"The audience that really comes to our classes is really people who have never met people who have been incarcerated," he said.

Marte noted that using the word "Con" in the name caused a little strife with advocates for the formerly incarcerated, but that branding helped him gain some confidence in his mission. In the beginning of this business venture, when his fitness company was still called Coss Athletics, he would share his story at the beginning of every class.

"I’ve had people walk away from the class because of that," he said.

Owning the word "con" and building a business around it? "For me, it just felt like freedom," Marte said.

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My first memory of fitness was in, you guessed it, a Jazzercise class. In elementary school I had a few classes at my dance studio, but that didn't feel like a workout. (And why should it? It was dance. It was just fun!) It wasn't until my aunt dragged me to her Jazzercise class one summer afternoon, and I was sandwiched between so many adult women dancing furiously for an hour, dripping sweat and repeatedly giving each other high fives between songs, that I made the connection: dance and fitness might very well be the same thing.

And for women across the nation and the world, Jazzercise was the first form of dance fitness to ever allow them to feel good - to genuinely have a good time - while working out.

"When Jazzercise began, there really wasn't a fitness industry, " Shanna Missett Nelson, President of Jazzercise and daughter of Jazzercise founder Judi Missett told me.

When Judi Missett saw women dropping out of her dance classes in school, she wanted to know why. The women loved to dance, but they weren't as interested in being corrected, as they weren't training to become professionals. And that's when the lightbulb moment hit.

"My mom was just a dancer who took her love of dance and music and movement and realized that she was onto something. She never set out to make a company."

But a fitness company she no doubt created. Not only did it become a full fledged business, she created a worldwide phenomenon. 2019 marks Jazzercise's 50th anniversary for the 8,300 plus franchises that exist in 32 countries.

On this episode of #WeGotGoals, you'll hear Missett Nelson share what it was like to grow up with a mom who ran a business from compassion, love and sheer joy. You'll also get a taste for the flip side of the coin - the hard skills it takes to keep momentum going for a worldwide brand that had to roll with the punches and the changing tides of the fitness industry for over 50 years.

"There's not many companies in the fitness industry that have been around this long," Missett Nelson explained. "We kind of grew into the industry and the industry grew around us."

There was no precedent for how to navigate the changing fitness industry quite like Jazzercise has had to do. It was, after all, one of the first to start franchising by training new instructors long distance through VHS's.

Missett Nelson shares what she believes makes up the secret sauce to success (hint: it's less of a secret and more about just doing what you do well without trying to be something you're not). And she talks about some of her biggest goals and accomplishments, growing up wit the business, becoming an instructor, a corporate location owner and now president of the company.

To hear her share the ups and downs of running the business from a strategic perspective and a creative one is fascinating.

And, it wouldn't be a #WeGotGoals episode if we didn't ask our guests to share the big, scary goal they're going after now. Missett Nelson is excited about taking their franchises along the journey of more digital components to Jazzercise - whether that's through training, choreography dissemination, or additional classes. When you hear the passion behind Missett Nelson's voice for what she does and what her female-led, female-driven business creates for the world, you'll see why they have 50 more years of jazz hands in their future.

Like hearing what these goal getters have to say? This season, you'll hear guests who have done big things related to building community, making the world a better place, getting better, stronger, and faster, and giving generously. You can subscribe to the #WeGotGoals podcast wherever you like to listen to them, on Apple, Spotify, and more.

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Runners might travel the streets of their city for years without noticing some of the art that decorates alleys, buildings, and walls. Marnie Kunz aims to change that—and to bridge gaps between the communities of athletes, artists, and local businesses while she’s at it.

Through her company, Runstreet, she hosts approximately three- to four-mile guided art runs at a relaxed pace through New York and other major cities (a goal she’s particularly proud of—leveraging sponsorships and other relationships to expand into new locations).

“It’s a way to connect to people while staying inspired on the run,” she told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

The idea came to her about four years ago. She was already a running coach and a blogger; on her own runs around the city, she’d find street art, then document it on social media. Her followers eventually started asking questions about what they were seeing.

“I thought, well, I’ll just organize an event where we run and go to the art and I can show people,” she said. “That’s easier than replying to all these comments.”

From there, interest grew relatively quickly. In large part, that relates to the sense of community that begins the moment runners sign up for an art run. Because it’s clear the event isn’t competitive, people who might hesitate to race a 5K or join a regular group workout tend to feel more welcome, Kunz said.

Once they arrive, they swiftly start to discover the sense of belonging running provides. “When you’re running, you’re actively doing something, and runners always have stuff to talk about,” she said. “It opens people up because on the run, you kind of let down your guard.”

Over time, they might come to learn what Kunz has: running boost resilience to life’s tough times, in part because of the bonds between athletes. “What running means to me is just overall health and also connection with other runners,” she said. “Runners tend to be very reliable and they make great friends you can always count on. So you see them supporting each other in other areas of their lives.”

Learning more about their neighborhoods also helps foster that sense of interrelatedness. Many runs start and end at local businesses or benefit area charities. Plus, Kunz does research beforehand on the art they’ll pass and allows time for participants to pause and consider it (as well as snap selfies, of course).

Art can tell you a lot about a community, she said. Look closely, and you’ll see signs of the struggles—she’s guided runners past scenes of gentrification, immigration, and environmental destruction. Or, you might get a sense of a city’s aesthetic style, or even its silly quirks (she points to pizza art in Chicago and New York as examples).

Sometimes, the runners have a chance to learn from the artists firsthand—several have actually joined Runstreet runs. Watching them interact, she’s realized the two groups can learn a lot from each other.

Goal-oriented, data-focused runners might benefit from artists’ creativity and mindfulness: “It kind of helps to take a step back and just appreciate the experience of it and appreciate just being in the moment,” she said. Meanwhile, artists have found inspiration of their own in runners’ discipline.

The relationship continues long after the sweating’s done; photographer Marques Jackson tags along on most of the group’s events, and participants receive a host of high-quality images to post, share, and tag each other in afterward.

Kunz collectively calls both the runners on her art runs and those she leads in weekly track workouts in NYC the Wolfpack. Alone, she said, lone wolves struggle. “But as a pack, they're able to hunt more and to succeed more and survive,” she said. Using the hashtag #JointheWolfpack, even if you can’t come on a run in person, represents “a way to boost each other up,” she said.

Listen to the full episode and check out Runstreet’s website and Instagram feed to earn how you can join, IRL or virtually—Kunz and her team have runs planned in cities across the country, some of which have creative and community-building themes (think: a dog run that will benefit Second Chance Rescue, pride runs in NYC and Philly, and a Daydream 5K Art Run & Festival in Chicago this summer).

If you like what you hear, please subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or your podcasting app of choice. And if you’d be so kind as to leave us a rating or a review, that will help us continue to grow our own community of goal-getters.

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On the first two seasons of #WeGotGoals, we sought out individual goal-getters that we admired, whose missions aligned with ours and whose passions we found motivating and inspirational. Standouts like Kate Field of The Kombucha Shop, Jillian Lorenz of The Barre Code, Sarah Spain of ESPN, and Jen Ator of Women's Health all graced our airwaves, sharing their invaluable advice and inspiring us to dream even bigger.

And while the heart of that won't change during season 3 of the pod, we decided to take advantage of the fresh start of a new season. This year, we're structuring our season around four big themes we care a lot about, and we'll highlight goal-getting guests who are doing big things as a part of that theme.

Not quite sure what we mean? Here's a sneak peek at what our podcast calendar will look like in the coming year:

From March through May, we'll interview guests working towards the greater goal of building community. You'll hear from the founder of the Runstreet community and the daughter of the founder of Jazzercise, who's taking action to keep Jazzercise modern and fun for anyone.

From June through August, we'll focus on guests dedicated towards creating a better Earth. Who knows? Maybe you'll be convinced to try cricket protein powder by the end of our episode with Robyn Shapiro.

From September through November, our guests will be working towards getting better, stronger, and faster. Expect to feel motivated to switch up your workout routine and bust through your PR roof after listening to these episodes.

And finally, from December through February, we'll interview goal-getters who are contributing generously to their communities and giving back in ways that will inspire us all to feel more connected to the people and places around us.

In this episode of the pod, we discuss why we felt motivated to switch things up and who our dream guests would be for this season (and if any of you dream guests are out there listening, you can email us at wegotgoals@asweatlife.com).

For more hints and ideas of what we'll be covering in Season 3 of #WeGotGoals, listen to our podcast on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Got two seconds? Leave us a rating or a review to help us start Season 3 off on a high note.

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Readers and listeners, today marks a special day in aSweatLife chronology. Today we celebrate Episode 90 of the #WeGotGoals podcast. And it's not just special because it's episode number 90; we're also celebrating our two-year anniversary of sharing big time goal getters' stories on this podcast platform.

We've had just about 90 guests on our podcast over the past two years—from Olympians to world champion runners, from critically acclaimed authors to activists, Survivor contestants to leadership coaches, world traveling yogis to some of the best chefs in the business. They've all shared big goals they're proud to say aloud and state for all of you, the listeners, what they're working towards in the future.

In this very special #WeGotGoals season finale episode, you'll hear five (yes, five!) hosts share some of their favorite lessons learned from podcast guests over the last year, as well as a few goals they tackled on their own.

Upon reflecting over 90 episodes chock-full of rich information, helpful tips, and life lessons accrued over countless failures that led to the major successes from our guests, you'll hear the five hosts discuss the duality of tapping into cumulative courage to go after those things that really "scite" (scare and excite) you, as Denise Sauriol says, and tapping into what flows naturally to find your stride, as Scott Hopson tends to do.

You'll get to walk down memory lane with the hosts as they recap Stephanie Izard's tips for when stress piles up too high, and hear why they're all crushing on Kate Field for the way she handled the Sharks of Shark Tank.

The stories we hear on the #WeGotGoals are vast; our guests come from different industries and have very different tactics to set their big, hairy, audacious goals. The common denominator among all these high achievers, though, is their openness to share what they've done, and where they're headed - two qualities we admire greatly at aSweatLife.

Listen to this episode dedicated to the invaluable lessons learned from over two years of hearing how high achievers set and accomplish the scary goals that set them apart from their competitors. And, if you like what you hear, keep listening as we launch Season Three with some big podcasting goals of our own. Season Three airs March 6, but you can leave the pod a rating or a review anytime you'd like. Catch us on Spotify, iTunes, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for being a loyal listener!

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When The Barre Code first opened its doors in River North eight years ago, there was something different about it from the start.

Rather than touting what women could lose—weight, say, or “cottage cheese”—founders Jillian Lorenz and Ariana Chernin instead put their focus squarely on what each and every person who walked in the doors could gain.

“Our studios are so much more than just fitness,” Lorenz told me at a special live recording of #WeGotGoals at the Hotel Moxy in Chicago. “We use fitness as a vehicle to provide self-acceptance and love to ourselves, and then support others in their pursuit to find their own.”

The approach helped start a sea change in the fitness world overall, Lorenz said. Now that The Barre Code is a national franchise—with 59 locations sold and 31 open, and plans for an even larger expansion—she hopes they’ll continue to set the tone for a broader definition of well-being.

Launching that franchise program is one big goal Lorenz is particularly proud of, and getting there was more hard work than it may seem from the outside. Ensuring the brand stays intact as it grows has required first carefully selecting studio owners—“they’re likeminded women; they’re passionate; their work ethic is solid and strong,” Lorenz said. “They breathe, live, and sweat The Barre Code.”

Then, her team works incredibly hard to make sure these franchisees have all the tools they need to deliver not only a kick-ass workout, but a total empowerment experience. “Spreading the sparkle dust” involves not only inspiration, but also nuts-and-bolds deliverables like an intranet and step-by-step guides to launching a business and marketing.

Being an entrepreneur and the co-CEO—she and Chernin share the title, something else she discussed in this episode—while also growing a family hasn’t been easy. Lorenz just had her third child, a son named Lyric, and she said that’s put her life in a bit more flux.

She balances it all by surrounding herself with a great team, including a partner she trusts and adores. “Life as an entrepreneur is hard,” she said. “You have to do it with somebody you really love.”

That person doesn’t have to be your soul sister necessarily—though she said Chernin is “like a sister to me”—but you do need to pair up with a person you appreciate and trust and with whom you can evolve and explore new ideas and interests. “You have to really respect and care for that person so that you can make it through together,” she said.

She and Chernin balance each other out in part because “she’s the more aggressive go-getter natural entrepreneur … and I worry a lot by nature,” Lorenz said. But a change she made last year in her daily routine proved particularly useful in managing that worry: incorporating just 10 minutes of daily meditation.

To do it, she set aside a block of time at the same hour each day, then experimented with different guided meditations and videos—including Headspace and Abraham Hicks. “That small change of 10 minutes really changed a tremendous amount of stress in my life,” Lorenz said. Not only was she able to navigate pregnancy with much less anxiety, she felt the benefits carry over into her work life, too.

“Being a CEO of a company this size, you have to have a clear mind and you have to have a positive outlook because things are never going to go as planned,” she said. “You can do all the preparation work, but things are going to come up and you have to take it in the moment and make decisions.”

With that sense of focus and purpose, she and her team plan to continue taking The Barre Code in new and trend-setting directions. She and Chernin recently brought on their first partner, a company that specializes in franchising, and are looking to eventually go global.

And, they’re also taking the experience to where the customer is, partnering with the SweatWorking app to deliver mobile workouts “so people can Barre Code with us out of their homes.”

Listen to the full episode to hear more, including how The Barre Code delivers the same message of self-love and empowerment through your phone; her advice for fledgling fitness entrepreneurs; and how you can take a class with Lorenz (and even with Lyric).

Like what you hear? You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Overcast, or any other podcasting app. And if you don’t mind adding a rating or a review, that helps other people find the show too.

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One of the workplace hazards of recording a podcast is that a lot of the time, we end up recording over the phone. And with that medium—especially if it's the first time you're ever talking to this person beyond email—developing a good chemistry between host and guest is kind of a 50-50 toss-up. You might get along like a house on fire (which is a really weird phrase, by the way), or you might wait out awkward pauses during which you're not sure whose turn it is to speak or whether it'll completely kill the story if you interject.

So as I plugged in my headphones to call Kate Field, CEO and founder of The Kombucha Shop, I was prepared for either experience. I had my customary Type-A list of carefully worded questions ready to go, grouped by category in case the conversation well ran dry and I needed the switch topics. I am nothing if not a good list-maker.

But my lists went almost completely to the wayside the second I heard Kate's warm voice log onto our recording platform. It's a true talent to be able to convey charisma and likability through just your voice, but within just a couple of minutes of chatting with Kate and going over pre-recording housekeeping, I was convinced that we were meant to be best friends (an emotion I later cemented when her dog loudly barked during the podcast, upset at being left out and demanding to be heard on #WeGotGoals).

Kate comes from the nonprofit world in Washington, DC, where she worked as a program coordinator for the Capitol Area Food Bank. A large portion of her job involved teaching underserved communities how to grocery shop and cook balanced meals for themselves on a budget, and it was during this time she realized that she could be a part of the solution to making less sugary beverage options available to the masses at a low price.

With just $800 of her own money, Kate began building brew-your-own kombucha kits and selling them. Eventually, her side hustle became a full-time job, and she was so successful that the producers of Shark Tank noticed and asked her to apply for the show. The result? A $350,000 deal with Barbara Corcoran and Sarah Blakely of Spanx, and a whole new world of opportunity.

You'll hear Kate's origin story, what she learned in her nonprofit work that she still carries with her today, and yes, a lot of behind the scenes info about what it's like to be on Shark Tank. You'll also hear her discuss what big goals she's set for herself in the past (including what scary big number she decided to aim for when setting earnings goals for herself) and the self-care goal she's working towards right now.

If you love Kate's interview as much as I did, please rate or review us on iTunes, and make sure to subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for being a loyal listener!

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One of the workplace hazards of recording a podcast is that a lot of the time, we end up recording over the phone. And with that medium—especially if it's the first time you're ever talking to this person beyond email—developing a good chemistry between host and guest is kind of a 50-50 toss-up. You might get along like a house on fire (which is a really weird phrase, by the way), or you might wait out awkward pauses during which you're not sure whose turn it is to speak or whether it'll completely kill the story if you interject.

So as I plugged in my headphones to call Kate Field, CEO and founder of The Kombucha Shop, I was prepared for either experience. I had my customary Type-A list of carefully worded questions ready to go, grouped by category in case the conversation well ran dry and I needed the switch topics. I am nothing if not a good list-maker.

But my lists went almost completely to the wayside the second I heard Kate's warm voice log onto our recording platform. It's a true talent to be able to convey charisma and likability through just your voice, but within just a couple of minutes of chatting with Kate and going over pre-recording housekeeping, I was convinced that we were meant to be best friends (an emotion I later cemented when her dog loudly barked during the podcast, upset at being left out and demanding to be heard on #WeGotGoals).

Kate comes from the nonprofit world in Washington, DC, where she worked as a program coordinator for the Capitol Area Food Bank. A large portion of her job involved teaching underserved communities how to grocery shop and cook balanced meals for themselves on a budget, and it was during this time she realized that she could be a part of the solution to making less sugary beverage options available to the masses at a low price.

With just $800 of her own money, Kate began building brew-your-own kombucha kits and selling them. Eventually, her side hustle became a full-time job, and she was so successful that the producers of Shark Tank noticed and asked her to apply for the show. The result? A $350,000 deal with Barbara Corcoran and Sarah Blakely of Spanx, and a whole new world of opportunity.

You'll hear Kate's origin story, what she learned in her nonprofit work that she still carries with her today, and yes, a lot of behind the scenes info about what it's like to be on Shark Tank. You'll also hear her discuss what big goals she's set for herself in the past (including what scary big number she decided to aim for when setting earnings goals for herself) and the self-care goal she's working towards right now.

If you love Kate's interview as much as I did, please rate or review us on iTunes, and make sure to subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for being a loyal listener!

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When you look at problems like systematic oppression, the 20-year life expectancy gap between people of color and Caucasian communities, a lack of physical activity programming for kids, or even stigma about accessing mental health services … well, it’s easy to feel a bit overwhelmed.

The high achievers on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, however, chose to face these issues head-on rather than shrinking from them. Each one has created a unique way to improve their communities—all using fitness as a catalyst.

As part of the #SweatworkingWeek last month, CLIF presented a Lunch and Learn called Fitness Is for Everyone: Perspectives in Equity. Immediately afterward, the four panelists took a few steps around the corner into the podcast studio and continued the conversation.

Here at aSweatLife, we’re always looking for ways to expand access to the benefits of an active lifestyle, so no one encounters a barrier to living their best lives. So, we were happy to learn more about each of these panelists’ innovative and impressive efforts. Our guests are:

• Alison Rootberg, Founder of Wellness4Every1, described how her organization offers corporate wellness programs that support wellness programs in schools. Each employee is matched to a specific student, creating a personal connection that expands beyond the financial.
• Tanya Lozano, Founder of Healthy Hood. Based in Pilsen, Healthy Hood offers $5 fitness and dance classes that appeal to people in the surrounding community—think Trap Yoga and Latin Dance—taught by instructors of color, and also provides food and nutrition education through a community garden.
• Ashley Rockwood, Founder of Free MVMT Shop, shared the story of her pop-up studio just a couple of weeks ago on #WeGotGoals. This week, she expanded on her ambitions, including the idea of incorporating dance-based movement therapy.
• Caullen Hudson, also a repeat guest and Founder of SoapBox Productions, a film and social activism non-profit. Among many other efforts—including a successful campaign to bar a problematic judge from being re-elected—the organization has put on several Fitness Against Fascism events.

We know you won’t be able to listen to this conversation without wanting to do your part. Fortunately, each panelist offers some solid ideas at the end for how to move the needle and open opportunities for fitness to more people in the city—and beyond (and even to address inequities outside the fitness world).

Whether it’s giving time or money to these organizations, having difficult conversations with your family members, or donating used fitness gear or yoga mats, there’s bound to a way you can contribute. One huge way to make your voice heard, of course, is to vote—if you’re in Chicago, municipal elections are Feb. 26.

Like what you hear? You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Overcast, or any other podcasting app. Adding a rating or a review, if you’re so inclined, helps other people find the show too. And you can also join us, live and in person, at The Moxy this Thursday, February 7; we’ll be talking with Jillian Lorenz, co-founder of The Barre Code. Recording starts at 6 pm, and this event is totally free! More details here.

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Here's a behind-the-podcasting-scenes nugget for you: before I interview anyone for our podcast, I obsessively Google them, usually all within the last 45 minutes leading up to our scheduled interview time. I like to think all the information will be fresh in my head then; it's definitely not cramming, or anything. Right?

So it was at approximately 1:17 pm that I called Marie, our Director of Partnerships, who met Maya French (co-founder of Koia) at a past #SweatworkingWeek Fitness Festival. When I asked Marie what I should talk to Maya about, she immediately texted back: "OMG I LOVE HER. Do you have like 2 mins and I can call you? Would be easier than texting haha."

Once on the phone, Marie adorably gushed about how helpful Maya's been to Marie and her business partner as they start their own beverage company. As a Forbes 30 Under 30 recipient with potential partners beating down her door, Marie spoke about how Maya somehow found the time to answer Marie's industry questions by sending thoughtful, structured paragraphs of helpful information emailed within the hour (no small feat, especially when you're working around the clock to launch a new product line).

It's no secret that aSweatLife loves Shine Theory, and we firmly believe there's enough success to go around — I immediately knew that I wanted to ask Maya about mentorship, especially as a female in a traditionally male-dominated industry.

Tune into the podcast to listen to Maya's takes on the importance of giving back, whether it's to others in her industry or to the community she comes from in Chicago. We also touched on how this incredibly successful entrepreneur puts passion before arbitrary goal-setting, and how she kept herself open to a world of possibilities before realizing she was meant to co-found Koia.

If you like what you hear, great news! You can rate or review us on iTunes (each star counts, and we appreciate all of you who have taken the time to review us already!). AND, for your IRL podcast fix, we'll be recording live at The Moxy on Thursday, February 7 with Jillian Lorenz, co-founder of The Barre Code. We'll start recording at 6 pm, and this event is totally free — more details here!

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The concept of the pop-up shop changed the way businesses think about brick-and-mortar retail. If you're a small business owner who doesn't want to sign a seven-year lease before you've proven your concept, you don't have to. Trailblazers - big and small - have reinvented retail by creating short-term opportunities in retail to test concepts, using underutilized space and social media to fill those spaces for a moment in time.

Ashley Rockwood, founder of FREE MVMT Shop is that for fitness. Rockwood created a permanent idea in the FREE MVMT Shop - a movement studio - but its location changes periodically. This idea is pushing Chicagoans to step out of their ordinary routines and into new neighborhoods, all while FREE MVMT Shop acts as a temporary tenant in commercial real estate spaces. Rockwood's first pop-up was on Southport and her second is in Lincoln Park.

After I caught wind of what she was creating, Rockwood and I met via Instagram as modern friends are wont to do. In today's digitally connected world, you can feel like you truly know someone if you follow them, even if you never meet. But Rockwood - and FREE MVMT Shop - are meant to be experienced in real life.

After a conversation peppered with the words "collaboration" and "partnership," I stopped into FREE MVMT Show for a few classes, including my personal joy-factory, Ballet for Runners.

It was clear that we would continue to use business as an excuse to be friends.

And as we recorded this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, Rockwood and I talked about what's driving her to keep working on the dream others think is crazy, how dancing with Beyoncé helped and what she knows she capable of doing (anything she puts her mind to).

Listen and subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Overcast, or any other podcasting app. Adding a rating or a review, if you’re so inclined, helps other people find the show too.

And remember - YOU could be featured as one of our real-life goal-getters in an upcoming episode. Just send a voice memo with your first name and your hometown, then a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.

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Dr. Mark Cucuzzella is the author of the new book Run for Your Life—all about how to achieve longevity in the sport—and has finished marathons in under three hours for 30 straight years. But at one point earlier in his career, he was told he’d have to give up running altogether.

For this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, I caught up with Cucuzzella in Austin at The Running Event, a trade show for running retailers. The way he overcame setbacks serves as a powerful example of charting your own path to your goals—and how slow, steady progress really can lead to major accomplishments.

Cucuzzella—who’s now a professor at West Virginia University School of Medicine, a family physician, shoe-store owner, and race director, among other titles—started running in high school. Back then, he told me, coaches and sports scientists didn’t understand nearly as much as they do now about training methods and biomechanics. “We just ran as hard as we could until we broke, repeat,” he said.

He continued to train through college and beyond, finding the sport provided a welcome source of stress relief and focus during medical school. And he ran well—he came close to qualifying for the 2000 Olympic Trials in the marathon. The time he needed was two hours and 22 minutes; he ran a 2:24:42 at the Chicago Marathon in 1999.

But he was still training hard, putting his body through more than it could bear. After that race, he needed surgery to correct a bent big toe and arthritis in his foot. His doctors said he’d never run again, at least not any more than a jog—and definitely not at a competitive level.

By then, Cucuzzella knew enough not to accept that without questioning. “I’d realized pretty early in my medical career … things were constantly changing,” he said.

Referencing a historic Harvard commencement address, he said: “Half of what we learned in med school is wrong. We’re just spending a career trying to find out the half that’s right.”

Besides, he had a border collie mix who wasn’t satisfied with walking. So, he began jogging slowly. About six months later, he lined up at the Marine Corps Marathon without ever picking up the pace on this training runs—and finished in less than two and a half hours, taking third place.

What’s more, he felt a sense of peace and joy while doing it: “I’d never felt that easy before in a marathon,” he said. “it just opened the doors to all the things yet to discover.”

Since then, he’s kept nearly all his running easy, only speeding up during a few key workouts leading up to a race. As a result, he hasn’t missed a day due to injury. His low-key approach to training and his method of open-minded self-experimentation, rather than blindly accepting conventional wisdom, form the basis for his career—and his new book.

It’s a volume jam-packed with ways to assess where you are as an athlete and suggestions for small changes based on the results. “It’s like a little menu,” he said. Using the self-tests he provides can help you identify your weaknesses in mobility, nutrition, and even sport psychology—whether that’s tight hips, an over-reliance on sugary carbs, or a mind panicked by stress—and start to shift them so you can not only run more and better but also live a longer, healthier life.

And healthier is the key, Cucuzzella stresses. Though Americans tend to live long lives, our “healthspan”—the amount of time we survive without major medical problems—ranks low. Fortunately, he said, there’s a lot we can do to care for our bodies and reduce our risk of chronic diseases.

Listen to the full episode of #WeGotGoals to hear more about how Cucuzzella is trying to put his ideas into action on a larger scale (for instance, speaking out about his opinions on the Dietary Guidelines for Americans); how writing the book was like running a marathon (or perhaps 19 marathons); and how big goals and challenges like races add not only motivation but also meaning to our lives.

Like what you hear? You can subscribe to the podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Overcast, or any other podcasting app. Adding a rating or a review, if you’re so inclined, helps other people find the show too.

And don’t stop there, goal-getters—YOU could be featured as one of our real-life goal-getters in an upcoming episode. Just send a voice memo with your first name and your hometown, then a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.

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Ryan Kikkert, now Executive Chef of The Little Beet Table, a Chicago and New York-based restaurant concept, began his career journey as a journalism major. Deep down, though, the moment he set foot in a restaurant kitchen he felt drawn to its beautiful chaos.

While completing his undergraduate degree in advertising and public relations, he ultimately knew he'd use it to aid this other passion - working his way into the restaurant industry and creating a name for himself - as it quickly became the only thing he could see himself doing for a career.

"Being a chef is a marketing-driven business," Kikkert told me on this episode of #WeGotGoals. As the head chef, and at times the face of the business, sometimes you're the one creating hype for the restaurant. He translated a lot of his advertising and PR skills into restaurant marketing, making what he does now a big melting pot (no pun intended) of all the things he is passionate about.

But his journey to the position of executive chef of a very on-trend, vegetable forward and largely gluten-free dining experience in one of the food capitals of the world was not a rocket ship to stardom.

Kikkert explains that the restaurant industry - like many others - can be cutthroat. Young chefs have to look out for themselves, find their own mentors, learn on their feet, and figure out how to fix mistakes quickly, because time is of the essence in every kitchen setting. And what's more, other chefs often see you as competition and aren't necessarily ready and willing to help you succeed.

But that's just what Kikkert wants to make his goal now that he's established. He knows where many other younger chefs are and how they feel. He knows what it's like to feel like a small fish in a big pond (that big pond being Chicago when he left Milwaukee for this job opportunity).

Kikkert strikes the balance of lending a hand to others when they need it, while still putting a huge focus on maintaining a beginner's mindset himself.

"Part of the process and excitement of this career is constantly learning and constantly trying new things," Kikkert said.

If you ask him what is favorite thing to cook is, he'll tell you "something I made last week."

And, you won't find him eating at the same restaurant twice. His eyes are always open to what's out there, what new concepts are being tested.

For Kikkert, a lot of those new concepts are actually practiced and perfected right at his home restaurant, The Little Beet Table. It's one of the first places to offer an almost entirely gluten-free menu.

And although the restaurant industry can be as stressful as it sounds, Kikkert likes to describe it like "a dance - you learn to work with it, and you find calm within the chaos."

I equate this phrase to just about every scenario in life; chaos may be all around, but you're in charge of how you react to it, how you let (or don't let) it affect you.

Listen to the whole #WeGotGoals episode with Chef Ryan Kikkert here, on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you like to stream your podcasts. And if you like what you hear, please leave us a rating or a review, we would really appreciate it.

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We're highlighting episodes of our podcast #WeGotGoals this month that taught us something or stayed with us for one reason or another.

I spent my life watching women break into sports — but so has anyone born after 1972 when Title IX passed. In 1995 at 10-years-old, I saw the first women's hockey team in my puck-worshiping Minnesota town and vividly remember the town's debate around girls playing the sport. In 1997, women played basketball professionally with the creation of the WNBA. And with this, women fought be a part of sports media — a fight to get coverage and a fight to get airtime as female sports reporters.

It never really felt like my fight until I started to meet the women who earned their places within sports — either competing or reporting on them.

One woman of particular impact is Sarah Spain who we spoke with on episode 11 o. She's effortlessly hilarious, dazzlingly professional, a natural athlete, a human sports statistics bible, and she's not afraid to take a stand. And damn it if she didn't make me care a little bit about sports.

When Cindy Kuzma interviewed Spain for #WeGotGoals, the pair discussed life at ESPN, how Spain, a heptathlete at Cornell, used the drive from competition on the track to be the best into her professional life. She positioned herself within a world that respects a meritocracy — believing that if you set your sights on something and are the best at it, that hard work and talent is rewarded.

And though Spain boasts of thick skin and the ability to put her head down to do the work, she's seen her share of harassment — both online and in the workplace. Spain teamed up with Julie DiCaro and Just Not Sports to create a PSA about the kind of online harassment they face online, #MoreThanMean, which is as tough to watch as I'm sure it is to live through.

And the timing of this episode is interesting — June of 2017 — just before #MeToo got women talking (again) in October of 2017.

This episode of #WeGotGoals offers a glimpse at a real example of a women working in the media who hadn't reported a specific sexual harassment incident because she feared reputational harm, not being considered for a job, or — worst of all — being blacklisted for rejecting the advances of a man in power.

“I don’t want that to be the first thing when you Google search me to be that I got X fired or Y fired — and that sucks," Spain said.

She has since detailed an incident that's all of those things on her podcast, That's What She Said.

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As one of the hosts of the #WeGotGoals podcast, I've had the privilege of hearing from insanely cool goal getters, entrepreneurs, CEOs, and leaders in the health and wellness industry. This week, though, I wanted to revisit an episode that fellow co-host Jeana Anderson Cohen led months ago. Episode 37 is with Jen Ator, Fitness Director of Women's Health.

In this episode, you'll hear Ator talk about a truly wild goal she trained for and accomplished: The World Championship IRONMAN at Kona. I wanted to revisit this episode for a few reasons. First, hearing Ator talk about the training process, what she calls "the most transformative thing" she's ever done, had my jaw on the floor for about 30 full minutes.

Ator went from a fitness enthusiast, someone who ran a few miles a week, to training for six months straight to swim 2.4 miles, bike 112 miles, and run a full marathon, all in one go. She describes being terrified at first to say "yes" to the challenge, but ultimately, she decided it was an opportunity to show herself what she was made of.

"I'll try, and I'll try my best. Win, lose, or draw, I'll put everything into it," Ator says in the episode.

As a fitness enthusiast without any desire to pursue that kind of physical challenge right now, I listened to Ator's journey to becoming an IRONMAN with reverence, but I also took away more life lessons about setting goals for myself than I expected.

Ator didn't know how all the pieces would come together, but she knew she was going to show up to Kona on a set date in six months, and she just stuck with it. It wasn't easy - you'll hear in the episode, she had lots of ups and downs - but she never wavered in her commitment to being there and showing up for it.

In life, going for something that is truly scary, that you're not sure how or even if you'll accomplish it, is part of the process. Ator's story reminds me to get out of my own way and say yes to that big, audacious goal, no matter what that self-doubting voice in the back of my head may be saying.

Most importantly, Ator reminds us that even when you're doing something that is as hard as completing a 17-hour endurance challenge, there's always a reason to find gratitude for the moment. On the morning of the IRONMAN, Ator's alarm said "Cherish this day," and she hasn't deleted it from her phone since.

Ator's story about the challenge is inspiring, and I took her words to heart on so many levels, for so many reasons. From all of us at #WeGotGoals, we hope you enjoy this episode as much as we did. And if you like what you hear, be sure to rate and review #WeGotGoals on iTunes and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts - including Spotify!

And remember, if you want to be featured as one of our real-life goal-getters in an upcoming episode, just send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to Cindy at cindy@asweatlife.com.

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Ironically, it's often during the "most wonderful time of the year" that time becomes a rarefied commodity. Ads and jingles and carols are pressing the importance of spending quality time with loved ones, but between shopping, holiday parties, pageants, and oh yeah, all the stuff that occupies your time in any normal week, you're hard-pressed to spend quality time with anything besides your Mary Poppins-esque work/gym/random White Elephant present bag.

I'm guilty of this too, and that's exactly why I decided to take 30 minutes and revisit this old episode with Laura Vanderkam, a time-tracking expert and author of I Know How She Does It.

Not only do Laura and Maggie discuss tried-and-true techniques for tracking your time, but they also talk in a bigger sense about the story you create about your time. For example, why do some people feel calm about time management while others feel stressed? Why do some of us feel like we have to be stressed or anxious about time in order to feel busy or productive? How come we often use "busy" as a mood and an answer to "How are you?" instead of actually having a conversation with the person asking us?

This week, I'm taking control of my time by instituting my own time-tracking challenge so I can see how long it ACTUALLY takes me to pick up a bottle of wine for a hostess gift rather than convincing myself I can squeeze in just one more errand in the ten minutes before I call an Uber. And with that data, I'm going to try and be brutally honest with myself — does where I spend my time coincide with my seasonal values of quality evenings with family and friends, my favorite holiday traditions (hi, Brew Lights!), and staying active throughout the shorter daylight hours?

I challenge you to do the same — let me know how it goes over at @asweatlife.com. This episode may be a re-run, but we recorded a new intro explaining what drew me to this particular episode and why we wanted to reshare it, so take a listen (we're doing that for each episode this month — think of it as the Best of #WeGotGoals).

For the long road trips and lounging at airports we all have coming up, you can find back episodes of #WeGotGoals onSpotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app.

And in lieu of a holiday present this year, the best thing you could get us is the gift of two minutes of your time, by leaving us a rating or a review.

Feeling bold? If you want to be featured as one of our real-life goal-getters in an upcoming episode, just send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to Cindy at cindy@asweatlife.com.

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Sure, there’s a lot to be said for shiny new presents left underneath the tree (and we have a whopping 10 gift guides to help you in that effort).

In other cases, though, great treasures come from digging deep in the back of your closet or dresser drawer to find that shirt you’d forgotten you bought, that necklace you were gifted by your grandmother, or some other item you once wore regularly but is now long-buried.

This holiday season, the #WeGotGoals team is unearthing some of our shiniest gems from the past. If you tuned in somewhere along the way of our almost two-year run (yep, we’ve been at this podcasting thing for a while), you might not have heard these episodes at all. But even if you did, dusting them off and listening to them again might reveal new wisdom in a different era of your life.

That was certainly true for me when I thought back on this interview Jeana did with wheelchair racing superstar Amanda McGrory, which originally aired in July of 2017. As I mention in the new intro, one thing that struck me was McGrory’s recommitment to the same goal, but with a different process.

I’m currently entering a new cycle of my career—finishing one big project and having eyes open to what’s next. The idea that I could set my sights on similar long-term targets, while experimenting with new ways to get there, has already resulted in a renewed sense of motivation and energy for me.

Also—I’ve long admired the way wheelchair athletes like McGrory view their roles as examples, showing others with disabilities just what’s possible. And as I thought about that a little bit more, I realized that if I put myself on the other side of that sort of equation, I could adopt a much deeper appreciation for others’ successes.

I’m sure I’m not the only one who’s sometimes hit with a twinge of envy when someone younger than me achieves a professional milestone or peak I haven’t hit (or, on the flip side, when someone older than me runs a better race or a faster time). I’ve long tried to use this type of feeling to my advantage, letting it guide me toward projects I’m passionate about. After all, if I’m jealous of someone else for doing it, it might just be something I want to put focused effort toward myself.

But I feel like, following McGrory’s line of logic, I can also take that a step further. What if I view others’ triumphs as examples of what I too could do, guiding lights showing me what could be possible if I merely put my mind to it and work hard along the way?

Sure, there’s competition in writing and in running, and just because one person achieved something doesn’t mean I will too. But it also doesn’t mean I won’t, and in some cases, it’s the push I need to get me to whatever the next level might be. It’s an added layer to something like Ann Friedman’s Shine Theory or the idea that there’s enough success to go around, and thinking of it that way deepens the authenticity of it for me.

Jeana, Kristen, and Maggie will be sharing updates on prior episodes in the next few weeks as well—so if you like what you hear, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review.

Oh, and stick around till the end, where we’re going strong with real-life goals from YOU, our listener. Want to be featured on an upcoming episode? Just send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.

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To some, success might mean setting a clear goal, then crushing it. But Tim Faith, research and development brewer at Goose Island here in Chicago, knows sometimes the biggest wins come when you adjust your aims along the way.

Take sports. In high school, Faith thought he’d play football. After two weeks of camp, he realized the complexity of the game didn’t suit him. “I’d rather run in a straight line and call it a day,” he told me at Goose Island’s Fulton Street Tap Room, where we recorded this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

So he joined the cross-country team instead. He was fast, and kept speeding up even after he graduated—his personal-best 5K time of 15:25 came after college. He ran his first of three Chicago Marathons in 2015, and his fastest the next year (a 2:44—and while that’s a swift 6:15 per mile, he knows he’s capable of finishing even faster).

More than anything, running became a part of his lifestyle, something that manages stress, connects him with friends, and fuels the creativity required to dream up new brews at one of the country’s most influential breweries.

Brewing itself came about due to a course correction. Originally, Faith planned to go to medical school. A running injury the summer before his junior year of college left him with time on his hands; he had a friend who brewed, a process Faith found fascinating. “I realized I was a pretty boring person because all I did was run,” he said. So, he started dabbling in homebrewing, too.

He spent part of the next year working at a medical company in Australia—and drinking his way to a better understanding of lagers and ales. “I ended up spending my life savings on beer,” he said. He pasted labels and scribbled notes into a beer journal, impressions that would inspire his own creations later on.

When he got back, Faith scraped together the cash to buy better equipment, then changed his major to microbiology in hopes of entering the beer industry. He did an internship at Great River Brewery in Iowa and got a job there after graduating. After a stint at New Holland in Michigan, he landed at Goose Island five years ago.

In his role as R&D brewer, Faith helps the company keep pace with the fast-moving world of craft brewing by constantly innovating, whether that means developing new beers or fine-tuning existing ones. Plus, he sees his operation as critical to staff morale.

“Being a part of a production brewery, a lot of the brewers don’t have the opportunity like they would at a brewpub to create new things,” he said. If one of them has an idea—say, a beer made with raspberry juice or coffee beans, or sparked by a song or a conversation—they can bring it to his single-room pilot brewery-within-a-brewery to test it out. “We’re also servicing that engagement aspect. Everybody wants to create; that’s why they became brewers in the first place.”

From the time inspiration strikes a Goose Island brewer until you’re poured a frosty glass, each beer must go through a strict process. First, the creator has to figure out how to execute the idea. “Beer is not a single-ingredient beverage,” he said. “You’re working with water, malt, hops, and yeast. Each one of those parameters on top of temperature and other variables will create something completely different. It’s almost like knowing a language and how to speak through each one of those factors.”

After the beverage is analyzed for chemical composition, sensory qualities like aroma, and safety, it reaches the ultimate evaluation of flavor—the tasting panel. At Goose Island, they’re held daily at 9 and 11 a.m. Beer’s rated on a scale of nine and perfection is rare—“I don’t think I’ve ever seen anything get eight and a half or nine,” Faith said—and often, there’s a philosophical discussion of its attributes.

There, too, goals sometimes change. “Having everybody together in the same room and discussing the beer in the first place really helps mold your perceptions of what you originally wanted and what improvements you might want to implement,” he said. “But you can still stand your ground too and just be like, ‘This is exactly what I wanted. Nine out of nine.’”

Between tasting panels, evening events, and the tap deck that’s perched above the brewery’s main floor, Faith has plenty of opportunities to imbibe. So how exactly does he keep running so fast while drinking so much?

Early on, he learned how to reduce the impact of intoxication on his training—do workouts early in the morning if he has to, alternate beer and water, cut back the week before a race (in fact, training under the influence while racing sober has led to some of his best performances, he said). He keeps a stash of recovery tools—yoga mats, lacrosse balls—tucked into a walkway of the brewery no one uses, so he can stretch and roll his quads and IT bands during the workday.

He also merges his passions in other ways, including meeting up with a weekly run club that leaves from the brewery and joining Goose Island teams for events like the Shamrock Shuffle, the Ragnar relay from Madison to Chicago, and the marathon.

Oh, and about the marathon—that’s one more instance in which he altered his target en route. This year, he’d planned to run a fast time again, but a calf cramp at mile 16 thwarted his efforts. So he moved on to his B goal—running exactly 3:12, in honor of the brewery’s flagship 312 urban wheat ale (a feat he’d also accomplished in 2015). Combine that with his 312 bib number—a gift from the marathon to Goose Island—and the result is a near-perfect finish-line photo.

Listen to the full episode to hear more about some of the beers Faith has created, his goal for next year’s Shamrock Shuffle, and a preview of what might come to a tap near you soon (including, maybe, an electrolyte beer brewed specifically for runners). And since you can’t taste a podcast, you can also drop by the Goose Island Taproom yourself—it’s at 1800 W Fulton St.

If you like what you hear, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review. And if you want to be featured as one of our real-life goal-getters in an upcoming episode, just send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.

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Prior to Thanksgiving week, aSweatLife hosted a breakfast-and-learn focused on gratitude practices - a buzzy topic to be sure, but one that we were excited to talk about in a very different way.

Editor In Chief Kristen Geil led us through a few gratitude visualization exercises, and we all went into the day feeling all kinds of warm-fuzzies alongside the rest of the 50 attendees. On this episode of the podcast, the four hosts break down what we did during that breakfast-and-learn and why we did it, as well as what our own gratitude practices look like.

A few weeks before the breakfast-and-learn, we asked attendees to do the following: Submit three photos from your camera roll on your phone that make you feel grateful. As you're searching, look for the hidden gems, and make sure you select at least two photos you don't mind sharing with the group.

Together, Geil led the group through visual gratitude exercises, and if you're looking for a way to bring your family together this upcoming holiday week and beyond, you're going to want to jot down these notes, too.

3 gratitude exercises to try this Thanksgiving With Photo #1: Take 3-5 minutes to jot down any notes about one of the photos you selected. Depending on how big your group is, you can have everyone share one thing they wrote down. Answer the following questions to get the creative juices flowing:

• To someone who doesn’t know you, what does this image show?
• What does this image represent to you?
• How did you feel at the moment this photo was taken?
• How do you feel looking back on it today?
• Why did you choose to print this photo?

With Photo #2: Select a photo you don't mind having others look at and write notes about. The second exercise is a group activity. You'll spread out photos next to a slip of paper around the room. Each participant will walk around and write down what he or she sees in the photo. It could be a guess as to why you think someone selected the photo, or just jot down what you observe and what you find to be extraordinary within the shot.

Fellow podcast host Jeana Anderson Cohen watched this exercise unfold and told us on this week's #WeGotGoals episode, "Everyone was just completely delighted when they got back to their photos. I was overcome by the amount of positivity that came through the room."

"it was a good way to stretch those gratitude muscles," Geil added.

With Photo #3: Practicing gratitude is never a one-and-done deal, it's a muscle you have to continue to work on. So with this third photo, we offered a few ways to allow this exercise to live and breathe outside the walls of the breakfast-and-learn. Either share the photo on your favorite form of social media along with the reason why you're grateful for the moment, or start a separate album in your phone of the photos you don't plan to post to Instagram, but the ones you want to save for the moments you need an extra mood boost or reminder why you do have so much to be grateful for.

Listen to the podcast to hear why we loved the element of the visual exercise so much, and how different the different the exercise felt when we could actually hold a 4 x 6 print of some of our most cherished photos from the past year.

What else we talked about on this episode On this episode, we also share what we learned from some of our previous guests this year and how we have implemented some of their gratitude regimens in our own daily routines.

Anderson Cohen pulls from Laura Vanderkam and Stephanie Izard in her amalgamation of different practices which culminates in writing three separate lists every day. Each morning, she writes what makes today different from other days, because as Vanderkam explains in her episode, creating special moments deepens memories and makes time feel like it's literally expanding. Anderson Cohen also writes three things she's grateful for to start out each morning. At the end of the day, she writes an accomplishment list (or as Danni Allen likes to call it, a "ta-da list" versus a to-do list).

For Geil, the Five Minute Journal is a current favorite each morning, but she's also a fan of The Happiness Planner (and hey, we heard from the founder of this brand on #WeGotGoals, too)!

Cindy Kuzma celebrated her seven-year anniversary in going full-time free lance this past year, and to commemorate, she thought about the people who helped her along her journey and wrote dedicated emails to someone different each week.

"I got to reconnect with people, and think back on those moments when someone believed in me ... I got to make their lives a little bit better, too," she said.

Beyond how a gratitude practice can improve your own health and happiness, Kuzma reminded us all of something. You never know how you can help others by telling them you're grateful.

Ready to gather your people for the gratitude exercises we talk about on today's episode? You can listen to #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — including Spotify! If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating and a review. Make sure to listen all the way through, because at the end, we heard from a real-life goal-getter just like you – Sarah Russo. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to Cindy Kuzma at cindy@asweatlife.com.)

Oh - and if you listen all the way through this episode you'll hear us give a shoutout to Lil Jon for this particularly uplifting track. If it gets stuck in your head this upcoming Thanksgiving week then, well, you're welcome.

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(Please note that this episode has explicit language)

Meet Jacqueline Gould, wellness coach and shining individual who knows exactly who she is and where her true north lies. Gould's journey onto the #WeGotGoals podcast began in quite the opposite state, however, as she describes her past as one where she had "zero self-worth."

I interviewed Gould about the path that led her to founding a company in which she aims to reach girls and women everywhere to help them light their fire, or as she likes to call, ignite their own "inner babe."

On the episode, you'll hear us talk about some pivotal moments in Gould's young life that led her to founding the company, like her experience in a clinical outpatient program which did ultimately help her overcome an eating disorder, but still left her feeling lonely and unseen.

"I know it's because I didn't have that person back then who could really look me in the eye and be like, 'I see you,'" Gould told me during our chat.

This realization led Gould to becoming a certified coach. Now, she works with women who have therapists or those who are just looking for coaching, to help them find their "inner babes."

"Think of Your Inner Babe as self connection - that uniqueness, that magic. That is your Babe. We have to find her, we have to ignite her, and we have to set that bitch free."

We also talked about just how relatable the idea of the "inner babe" is. At first, Gould imagined working solely with girls who fell into the age and demographic from where she drew on her own personal experiences to create the brand and the program. But she quickly learned that this type of coaching program could help women of any age and at any stage in their lives.

So when she talked about where Your Inner Babe is headed, her big, scary goal to say aloud (which actually doesn't scare her at all, as you'll hear in the episode) is to reach as many women as possible.

In fact, she practices a type of journaling activity that involves writing her own future biography. She'll write her future accomplishments in the present tense and in the third person, as though someone else was already writing about the big things she's done.

This tactic, she told me, is a shift from her old ways of dreaming too small. After a teacher scolded her for dreaming unrealistically she listened for too long. But now, post-creation of Your Inner Babe, she tells herself, "Hey Jacq, dream bigger. Go bigger."

In this way, Gould is quite literally shaping her own narrative and laying the groundwork for her own success. Gould works with women anywhere, Chicago local or by FaceTime around the country.

Listen to the whole episode to hear more powerful conversation from Jacq Gould, the inspiration for Your Inner Babe, and what you can do to tap into yours. And if you liked this episode, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review.

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At least once a week, I have a slight crisis of environment. We're lucky enough to work from home pretty regularly, but as anyone who works from home full-time can tell you, it's not always all it's cracked up to be, and there eventually comes a time where you're going to go batshit insane if you have to stare at your home's walls for another minute. But at the same time, leaving to go somewhere else wouldn't necessarily be an improvement — sure, you could go to the corner coffee shop, but the outlets are usually taken and the lattes are criminally overpriced. What's a woman to do?

Molly Goodson lived that conundrum over and over again as a remote worker herself. As an added layer of complexity, she and her friends were starting to plan workout dates more and more often — but the struggle to hang out post-sweat was real. Most studios were too small for comfy conversations, so they'd have to change locations, often after waiting for a shower in crowded locker rooms. (And as Molly was telling me this, I was vigorously nodding, silently stopping myself from saying, "Oh my god, me too!" after every sentence)

Recognizing all of those issues, she realized a place was needed where women could have a sort of home away from home, with space for work, play, socializing, working out, and trying new things. Thus, The Assembly was born and built in the heart of San Francisco's Mission District.

But unlike what you might see at a WeWork or The Wing, The Assembly uses health and wellness as the unifying theme across the open, airy old church it inhabits. Like aSweatLife, Goodson recognizes that your best life can come with fitness as the catalyst, even if the best moments of your day happen outside of that gym. Their daily schedule is a dream whether you're a health nut or just a little wellness-curious. Yes, there's the usual yoga, meditation, and run clubs, but you'll also see workshops on negotiation, watercolor painting, and indigo dyeing.

"I felt that as I was getting older, health and fitness was something I made a point to prioritize... truly it is the biggest thing I do on a daily basis for my mental health," shared Goodson.

Her lightbulb moments came when leaving her job in the media world.

"I had this nagging thought in my head about this idea, this topic of changing the way we speak about health and wellness, and how do you actually build community into a topic a lot of people throw the word around in," explains Goodson.

As she was thinking about community and wandering the city looking for that elusive perfect co-working space, Goodson was also reading about new health and wellness trends like cupping or reiki. She was curious about trying them out, but realized it was tough to actually go out and find a practitioner. Those three layers — community, co-working, and trying new things — combined to form the foundation of The Assembly.

So on a goal-focused podcast, I had to ask Goodson how The Assembly helps foster goal-setting and achieving among its members. She immediately launched into an impressive analysis of all the different ways The Assembly's staff and environment are optimized for helping members achieve goals in three different areas: fitness goals, professional goals, and social goals.

You'll have to listen to the episode to get the full rundown, but the one that affected me the most was hearing her talk about social goals; all too often, we focus on that next promotion or that faster mile as the only types of measurable goals worth chasing after. But shouldn't it be just as important to set goals for yourself to make a new friend, get back in touch with an old one, or organize a friends' night out for you and your core women?

Goodson and her crew think so — and that's why her staff is specially trained to engage with members, ask about their interests, and even make introductions between members who might get along or have a common interest.

Whether it's in a workout studio in Chicago or in the historic church that houses The Assembly, everything really is better with friends. (Including podcast ratings and reviews — if you liked this episode with Molly Goodson, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review.)

Want to visit The Assembly for yourself? Click here for more info on how to say hi IRL.

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Chef Stephanie Izard invited me into the in the basement of her restaurant Girl and the Goat while the staff prepared for parties, evening service and nationwide expansion. And while we talked about goals, business, family and what it takes to be a boss, we were just steps away from where the the story of an empire sprawling all took place.

She's planted her adorable goat logo all around Chicago's west loop at Little Goat Diner, Duck Duck Goat, Goat Group Catering, and Baobing.

Titles for someone as accomplished as Izard are almost better suited for a wikipedia entry. Chef and Partner at all of the hot spots in Chicago's West Loop as well as the author of two books - Girl in the Kitchen and Gather and Graze. And if you've ever turned on the Food Network, you know her face from her victories on Top Chef and Iron Chef.

But what you don't know about Chef Izard is that she's sort of my idol - she's a lot of people's idol. She's brimming with the kind of humility you only find in the midwest, packed with the work ethic that carried her from restaurant opening to restaurant opening. Her nose is to the grindstone, she lets creativity guide her, and she makes delicious food - and that's why she's so lovable. The Top Chef audience agreed, voting her The People's Choice during her season -making her to first to ever win the People's Choice and the title of Top Chef.

"It always catches me off guard, like 'Oh yeah, I'm supposed to be inspiring.'" Izard told me as I inquired about the young chefs who reach out to her for advice.

And all of the things she's accomplished, you'll hear on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, were the result of letting creativity and inspiration guide her. That's why people look up to her. She's not in the habit of writing down goals, but instead listening to the voice that won't let her get comfortable. Leaning into challenge is the stuff that builds legacies.

And all of this is why every interaction I've had with Izard has been memorable - I make reference to a few of them throughout the interview. But none was more crystalized than the time she answered my desperate tweet more than eight years ago to get my mom (a gigantic Top Chef and Izard fan) into the newly opened Girl and the Goat, putting us at the Chef's table and stopping by to hug my mom.

I walked away from that dinner knowing that I wanted to care about something as much as Izard did.

After you listen to Chef Stephanie Izard on #WeGotGoals, you're sure to walk away hungry. Stop by any of her restaurants (you'll have to wait just a little bit longer for Girl and The Goat in LA). And if you can't wait for a Goat restaurant to experience her food, buy her spices and sauces wherever you live.

If you like what you hear, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review.

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Maybe you’ll be lining up next weekend at the TCS New York City Marathon, or watching the Bank of America Chicago Marathon has you pondering a big race of your own. Or perhaps you’re facing a job change or another challenge in your life that has you “scited”—scared but excited—hoping you can handle it but afraid you’ll fall short.

Coach, author, marathoner, and aSweatLife ambassador Denise Sauriol has a message for you: You can do it, and even if you think you’ve failed, the struggle will be worth it. “Do things you think you can’t do. It will transform you on the other side,” she told me on #WeGotGoals. “That's when we are really showing up in our lives.”

For this week’s episode, we headed back to the Hotel Moxy the week before the Chicago Marathon to soak up some pre-race run-spiration from the woman her runners call the “marathon whisperer.”

Sauriol was fresh off the publication of her new book—Me, You & 26.2: Coach Denise’s Guide to Get YOU TO YOUR First Marathon—and was about to take on her 100th marathon that weekend. (Post-recording update: she finished, in a time of 4:52:39 and what just might have been a personal-record in smiles, high fives, and megaphone-enhanced cheers along the way.)

In a week that found her bouncing between media appearances, her own final race preparations, and pep talks with the nearly 200 runners she was coaching through the event, Sauriol’s joy was palpable. In many ways, these successes represented the culmination of the dream she’d gone after two years ago, when she quit her job in accounting after 26 years to coach runners full-time. In another of her trademark Denise-isms, she called this “de-corporation,” or “a goal that has filled my soul.”

Walking away from a steady income and the only professional life she’d known wasn’t easy. Sauriol recalled sitting in her therapist’s office the week before she was supposed to go back to school for another advanced degree. The therapist asked what would make Sauriol truly happy. “And I said, ‘Well, I just want to help people. I want to share running with everyone,’” she said.

A master’s probably wasn’t necessary in order to do that, the therapist pointed out. “She said, getting that degree is like having to go to Florida and going to California to get there. So the next day I emailed Northwestern and dropped out of the program,” Sauriol said. “I texted my therapist and I said, ‘I canceled my trip to California.’” Six weeks later, she booked her ticket to Florida by giving her notice.

Even once she’d made the decision, Sauriol faced doubts. Running a business, even if it’s your dream job, has its challenges. “It's not all rainbows and unicorns,” she said. To get through the tough spots, she’s harnessed what she called “cumulative courage.” She reflects back on other things she didn’t think she could do but accomplished anyway, including her first marathon back in 1994 and the 98 others along the way, and reminds herself she has the strength to get through.

The more I talked with Sauriol, the more I realized cumulative courage extends beyond an individual’s achievements. In fact, it’s yet another reason that, per the maxim on constant repeat here at aSweatLife, “everything is better with friends.” The power with which Sauriol believes in her runners fuels them to greater distances and bigger accomplishments than they ever thought possible. Watching them crush their goals, in turn, reminds her to think more broadly about her own capabilities.

“When I get overwhelmed or stuck on which route I should take, I don't stay there. The feedback and the connection I'm making with people that were once strangers—seeing them do things they didn't think they can do or seeing them finally believe in themselves like I believe in them—counteracts when I'm overwhelmed,” she said.

Sauriol will call on that cumulative courage to continue growing her business: “I’m not done with it,” she said, and I certainly believe her. She’ll also use it to conquer her fear of heights for her next big fitness goal. For more on what that is—and many more simple, solid tips for tapping into the collective strength we all share—listen to the full episode. Stick around till the end for a real-life goal from one of Sauriol’s runners; and hey, if you want to be featured on an upcoming episode, email a voice memo to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.

If you like what you hear, please subscribe to #WeGotGoals on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or any other podcasting app, and while you’re at it, leave us a rating or a review. Thanks so much for listening!

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For so many of us, setting SMART goals feels natural. It feels like the most promising way to achieve success. For Paddy Spence, CEO and Chairman of Zevia, there's a time and place for time-boxed, specific goals, but there's also room for much, much more when it comes to goal setting.

On this episode of #WeGotGoals, I got a dose of Spence's refreshing take on non-binary goal setting, and heard how it played into his business journey that led him to purchase the massive sugar-free soft drink brand.

"You plot your course, but you just don't know where you're going to go," Spence said. "I knew I wanted to run a business, I knew I wanted to be in the natural foods industry, and didn't know much beyond that."

His first post-graduate school job was with Kashi cereals, a time he describes as "constant discovery, learning, and trial and error."

Spence explained further his non-linear journey, with steps forward and equal or more steps backward, while exploring the natural foods industry. But he attributes his outlook on goals in a non-binary way as what really led him to success and helped him stay sane along the way.

"Accomplishment is never linear. It's a zig-zag, it's lumpy. There were so many twists along the way."

And if you only see goals as black or white, achieved or not achieved, those twists along your journey can be quite de-motivating. So Spence uses the words "more" and "less" to define some of the things he works toward.

Like "Spend more time with my kids, or floss my teeth more. What's more? it just means 'more.' The finish line type of goals are satisfying, but so many of the things we try to do on a daily basis, there's no finish line. There's no finish line to being a good dad. There's no finish line to being healthy. It's all about continuous improvement."

But Spence also has this keen awareness that success can be both a continuous journey and, simultaneously, something you've already achieved.

"We don't tell ourselves that enough," Spence noted. Too often, he told me, he sees young people that believe "'If I don't do steps X, Y and Z I won't have succeeded.'

"I tell people, you know what, you've already succeeded. You're a college grad, you're in a job, you have a roof over your head, you have a paycheck. That sounds pretty good to me. Success isn't something that's out in the future, it's within our grasp today."

This summer, Spence suffered from a detached retina, an experience that, although necessitated an eight-week intense recovery period, allowed him to ultimately see clearly what was most meaningful in his life.

Post-surgery, Spence couldn't read, write, lie down, exercise or travel for eight weeks.

"I had to sit in a dark room for that period of time and really couldn't do much. One of the things I realized is how much I was missing, how much I missed the interaction with my family and co-workers ... It made me so much more grateful for everything - to be able to see, to interact with people, to be able to take my kids to school."

And during that time, Spence did what he could: he meditated. "It's a joke to say you're good or not good at meditation, but I know I got a lot better of those eight weeks."

Of the things Spence values most, his family is at the very top. In fact, one of the biggest goals he's proud to say he's achieved is all around his connection to his family.

In this episode you'll hear just how much he values it, the steps he's taken to keep his time and attention prioritized on family, and how he continues to use meditation to set his daily intention on what's most important in his life for his family and for Zevia.

Hear the full episode with Paddy Spence on #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — including Spotify! If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating and a review.

And remember, if you're working on a big goal, small goal, or a new goal setting method for yourself, we want to hear about it! Send your stories and lessons learned as a voice memo to Cindy Kuzma at cindy@asweatlife.com and you could be featured on a future episode of #WeGotGoals.

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“There’s something about the power of a group to push you to your limits so that even when you're on your own, you're stronger,” Cindy Kuzma astutely summarized the theme of community through the lens of the marathon world record holder Eliud Kipchoge.

And on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, we talk through community and how a supportive group can help one person achieve bigger things than he or she thought possible. And that's the way community manifests itself at aSweatLife - the support of the group enhances the goals of everyone.

We're constantly beating the drum of "everything is better with friends" and we took the opportunity to say that phrase at least a dozen times on this week's episode.And on a host-full episode, you'll also hear stories from inside the walls of aSweatLife, in particular, how we learned to not only embrace a community, but to start to make it a part of the fabric of everything we do.

And community is especially top of mind as we close the aSweatLife Ambassador applications.

"The ambassadorship has allowed us to walk the walk," Maggie Umberger, Director of Communities at aSweatLife said, talking through how the ambassadorship came about and where it is today.

But building community is not without its challenges when you're a team of introverts. All four of the hosts on #WeGotGoals, while they may love people, need time to themselves to charge their batteries. We talk through our individual strategies for recharging throughout the episode.

We also took this chance to revisit stories from high achievers who achieved their goals with the power a community.

Kurt Seidensticker, Founder and CEO of Vital Proteins told us in episode 39 about how his team worked to support the vision he'd set forth.

Tim and Jessica Murphy of Bib Rave told us in Episode 53 that their network of ambassadors helped to create the vibrant community that now reviews races across the nation and supports the brands that power running.

Jim Huether, CEO of HyperIce sees the power when a group is unified in its goals, he told us in episode 59. “I’ve learned that you have to make sure the entire team is always on the same page. You have to foster an environment within your company where people are working together collectively and not against each other," he said. "If you do that, you set up the whole organization for success.”

Caullen Hudson told us in episode 68 about how he uses his company Soapbox Productions and Organizing to empower a community to take action for social causes.

You can listen to #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — including Spotify! If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating and a review. Make sure to listen all the way through, because at the end, we heard from a real-life goal-getter just like you - Kristen Wilk. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to Cindy Kuzma at cindy@asweatlife.com.)

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When a lifelong learner falls in love with fitness, you get Edward J. Buckley Jr., CEO of Peerfit, a universal account for fitness that is accessed as an employee benefit through major insurance providers.

And Buckley and his team didn't just create a better way to do workplace wellness, they did it the hard way - connecting the healthcare and the fitness industries.

“How do you build a bridge between traditional healthcare and all the incentives that go in the fitness industry?” Buckley said, "We like to say, 'it's a billion dollar bridge, we'll build it for you.'"

After years of work proving out the Peerfit model, the group celebrated signing a contract with its first major insurance carrier. But after the champagne bottles (or matcha, it's a fitness company after all), the carrier told them they needed to renegotiate the contract - or they would "tear the contract up."

Overcoming obstacles is a big part of starting a company, but Buckley and team had to fight for their lives. “Put the blinders on and look at the path back up the mountain - not look how far I fell or how could they do this to me," Buckley said.

That attitude to learn and work through mistakes came from an overall lifelong thirst to learn - from pursuing his PhD to sending his board of directors more updates than they need.

"If you’re constantly getting input and you’re constantly learning, you never really have to have a big learning moment," Buckley said.

And to empower his team to learn the same way, Buckley and the company's leadership are less concerned about where their team works and at what hours and are more concerned with rewarding great talent.

Peerfit was recently ranked on the 2018 Top Company Cultures List by Entrepreneur, which is a remarkable feat by itself, but even more remarkable when that culture was created entirely digitally. Employees work entirely remotely, which Buckley sees as an advantage to recruit top talent across the country.

That sort of innovative business culture led Peerfit to close its recent round of funding - its $8 million series B - and to create a super-secret startup within the startup that Buckley said will help to double Peerfit’s core business.

Catch Buckley making a lot of appearances on the company's Instagram and listen to a lot more about his goals - personal and professional - on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, available anywhere you get your podcasts (like Spotify!). Don’t forget to listen all the way through for a real-life goal getter (and if you want to be featured on the pod as a goal-getter, email Cindy and cindy@asweatlife.com). Feeling generous? Take five seconds and leave a rating and a review on iTunes so we can continue to reach listeners around the world.

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As little kids, most of us entertain the idea of becoming a pro athlete at one point or another. In 1996, for example, I was seven years old and totally convinced that I was going to become the next Brandi Chastain and spend my days on a soccer field, having abs and shooting penalty kicks.

So what if you had that opportunity — the chance to be a pro athlete and achieve a lifelong goal that's limited to a select percentage of the population — and you turned it down?

Even crazier, what if you had that opportunity in three different sports and you turned it down each time?

That's the choice trainer Pat Gilles was fortunate enough to face — and the reason he turned down professional careers in hockey, golf, and sailing led me to view goals from a different perspective.

"I didn't know at the time exactly which path would be better or not," admits Gilles, who won the title of America's Most Inspiring Trainer in 2017. "All I did was trust my gut. And I always say, I don't think there's a wrong decision — you just have to be willing to deal with those consequences."

Gilles shared with me the motivation behind saying no to those lucrative opportunities and the benefits that come with them: he knew that as a professional athlete, he'd be limited in the impact he could have on others. As a coach, meanwhile, he can personally affect as many people as he can get through the doors of his Madison, WI gym (Pat's Gym) and through his remote coaching business.

In the wake of his almost-pro career, Gilles has dedicated himself to spreading a love of health and fitness as far as he can reach. In return, America's most inspiring trainer feels motivated himself by his clients and the people he works with.

"On a daily basis, I'm working with all these individuals on different goals," Gilles explains. "They inspire me, to be honest. If they can do it, I can do it. I always say, I want to lead from the front... so every day, the athletes I work with are an inspiration to me."

But surprisingly, when we asked him about a big goal that he's accomplished in the past, winning America's Most Inspiring Trainer or having incredible success in three sports wasn't what Gilles brought up. Instead, he spoke thoughtfully about mental toughness and the steps he takes to develop that skill. One prime example: running Ironman Madison when he, a power athlete, HATED endurance sports — especially running.

"For the whole time, a year of training, I told myself I loved running. The minute I stopped doing Ironman and completed that goal, I no longer loved running, and I was more realistic with myself," Gilles laughs. "But it's kind of tricking the mind into something, and if you believe it enough and tell yourself enough, your body will follow that advice."

And if he were to fail? Well, another part of the mental toughness regime Gilles has developed is embracing failure (something we're all too familiar with on #WeGotGoals).

Says Gilles reasonably, "Failure is a good thing. Failure leads to better things, and we learn a lot from failure." His most memorable failure? Not making the Olympic team for sailing — a failure that ultimately taught him how to work harder, achieve more, and learn from that situation.

Hear more about Pat Gilles and his thoughts on failure, mental toughness, goal-setting, and what it was like winning America's Most Inspiring Trainer on this episode of #WeGotGoals, available anywhere you get your podcasts (like Spotify!). Don't forget to listen all the way through for a real-life goal getter (and if you want to be featured on the pod as a goal-getter, email Cindy and cindy@asweatlife.com). Feeling generous? Take five seconds and leave a rating and a review on iTunes so we can continue to reach listeners around the world.

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Caullen Hudson is always seeking to inspire - it's just a little different from place to place. In the gym, he's encouraging fitness enthusiasts and flipping tires. Outside of the gym at the company where he's Founder and Executive Producer - SoapBox Productions - he's encouraging youth and flipping aldermen.

On this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, Hudson talks about the intersection of wellness, race, and media. His spot on the Venn diagram is right where those worlds intersect and he uses his spot to spread ideas and encourage action. In naming and branding his company, the soapbox sends a pretty clear message about what he and his business partner David A. Moran are creating. SoapBox Productions creates media - or micro-docs, as the teams calls them - to spread an idea and encourage incremental change.

It all started with a documentary that Hudson produced as a Film Student at DePaul University when he studied and documented the parallels between drill rap and activism in Chicago. That project - Chi DNA - continues to live on as a multi-media project from film to editorial to a web presence. And if you're wondering what "drill rap" is, it's a form of rap that's steeped in Chicago's south side and often includes themes of violence and gang references - Chief Keef is widely associated with popularizing this form of hip-hop.

Also discovered at DePaul - his love for fitness. It all started when a friend asked him to take on Shaun T.'s Insanity workouts. When he did, he fell for the kind of cardio that comes with bodyweight workouts, high knees and burpees. And as soon as he saw that DePaul was auditioning new fitness instructors for a bodyweight-specific fitness class, he took it as a sign.

As those two vocations grew in parallel, Hudson saw opportunities to fight against racism, fascism and sexism in big and small ways. Inside the gym, it's as simple as renaming an exercise "person-maker" instead of "man-maker." As a producer and community organizer, he's supporting high school aged students in West Garfield Park who are organizing to fight against the erection of a Police Academy.

Throughout this week's #WeGotGoals episode, you'll hear Hudson reference the project, #NoCopAcademy. To fully understand it, spend 3.5 minutes on this video.

If you were moved by that short video, it's on purpose Hudson said. The arts help people understand larger social issues. “They may not read a research paper, but they’re going to watch a documentary that will help them understand,” he said.

You can listen to #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — including Spotify! If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating and a review. Make sure to listen all the way through, because at the end, we heard from a real-life goal-getter just like you. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.)

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Amanda McGrory rekindled her love for her sport—wheelchair racing—by going back to graduate school.

Late July founder and CEO Nicole Bernard Dawes finds sanity and stress management when she steps out of the office and onto her Peloton bike.

Exhale executive vice president Fred DeVito never set aside his passion for music, continuing to play the upright string bass even as he built a high-powered career in the fitness industry.

Based on these examples from our high-achieving guests, we at #WeGotGoals HQ set out on our own experiments, pledging to try new things or re-engage with activities we’d loved in the past. On this week’s hostful episode, we reported back on what we found.

Jeana Anderson Cohen signed up for a three-day intensive course at improv institution Second City. Each day featured eight hours in the classroom and a nightly homework assignment to write a four-page script. “It was hard. It was fun. It was revealing. It was everything,” Cohen said.

Ultimately, the course provided just the creative boost she was craving. And working on “yes, and”—a vital component of improv that demands actors accept and build on their collaborators’ ideas—tapped into an attitude of openness she’s carried back to her work.

“It gets me out of my own head. My ideas aren’t the only ideas,” she said. “Rather than saying ‘Yes, and how about we do it this other way?’ It’s more like, ‘Yes, and I hear where you’re coming from, that’s really smart and we could add onto it.”

Maggie Umberger felt particularly inspired by her podcast interview with author and time-management expert Laura Vanderkam. Building novelty into your routine, even when you’re busy, ultimately convinces your brain you have more time, Vanderkam pointed out.

So Umberger begin dedicating precious hours to things she’s said she enjoys, but had slipped off her schedule. Some are brand-new to her: She’s started writing her own stand-up comedy routine. She also revisited her past as a dancer by heading to an advanced hip-hop class.

“For so long I didn’t go back to the studio,” she said. “I knew I used to be better and I didn’t want to feel bad at something that I used to feel good at.”

In some ways, her fears were confirmed. “It was humbling. I was terrible,” she said (though the rest of us wondered if she was “regular-person bad” or just “former dancer bad,” which is probably pretty different). Getting out there and doing it anyway—even if she tripped over some of the choreography—reminded her that she could survive minor setbacks, and even have fun and create meaningful memories along the way.

That’s similar to what Kristen Geil learned from her experiment: making homemade sushi. Geil admitted to being a creature of habit. Her anxiety begins growing when she doesn’t have a plan for the day, week, and month.

For the sake of the podcast, she bravely broke from her routine of assembling meals in bowls and ventured to a fish market, where she bought all the necessary ingredients. She started making the meal at 9 a.m. on a Thursday, which felt rebellious in and of itself.

Sure, she didn’t completely change her ways: “I didn’t eat it until that night because I’m not a monster,” she said. But the effort paid off in more ways than one. “It led most immediately to my boyfriend coming home the next night with scallops and making this incredible gourmet zucchini noodle, homemade Alfredo sauce, and sautéed scallops meal”—thus kicking off a mini-competition to one-up each other in the kitchen, with delicious results.

Bigger picture, it made Geil feel accomplished, and more open-minded about her options. “Once you show yourself that you can add something new into the day, that you can change up the routine, it becomes so much more possible to do it,” she said.

And as for me—I’ve always loved live music, either at festivals or indoors at clubs. In recent years, I haven’t made it a priority. There are lots of good reasons for that, from time to money to early-morning workouts that mean I’m often going to the bed by the time the opening act’s warming up.

When I fall away from it, I forget how moving music can be—and the experience of watching artists craft it live can never be recreated on a Spotify playlist. So this summer, I picked a few live shows and even one day of a festival, packed my fanny pack with eyedrops and earplugs, and showed up.

Doing so not only gave me welcome, mindful breaks from all the focused work I do in writing and running, it also allowed me to challenge my self-definition a bit. Yes, I’m often more tired than I used to be—but I’m not too old and worn-down to hit an 11 p.m. Lollapalooza aftershow if I plan it right. And, if the act is as fantastic as Lizzo, I might even dance a little (though, I can assure you, I’ll always be far more terrible than Maggie).

Listen to the full episode to hear more about our experiences, the links we saw to our past episode on failure and resilience, and what new things we’re planning to try next.

You can listen to #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — including Spotify! If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating and a review. Make sure to listen all the way through, because at the end, we heard from a real-life goal-getter just like you. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to me at cindy@asweatlife.com.)

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From the way he talks, you'd think Devan Kline (co-founder and CEO of Burn Boot Camp and author of Stop Starting Over: Transform Your Fitness By Mastering Your Psychology) grew up in an idyllic suburban community, with plenty of room to play T-ball and adoring parents who cheered him on from the sidelines as he played baseball from elementary school all the way through a minor league stint with the San Francisco Giants.

You'd be way, way wrong.

As Kline will matter-of-factly tell you, he grew up in an abusive environment in Battle Creek, Michigan.

"It was rough, you know? It forced me to grow up really quickly at a young age. Twelve, 13 years old I was dealing with mental and emotional stresses that I see some of my peers at the CEO level in the fitness industry struggle with."

But maybe it's a testament to his perspective on life that Kline has grown to appreciate the silver lining in wanting to spend as little time at home as possible.

"I pretty much knew what was waiting for me at home on any given day. I used the field to escape. I played basketball and football, but baseball was my passion. I knew that if I left early and got home late, I could avoid some of the turbulence that would be going on in the household."

Today, Kline is the co-founder and CEO of Burn Boot Camp, a female-focused gym with 153 open locations (and growing every day). That nationwide phenomenon that boasts over 40,000 clients across 37 states? It started in a parking lot, with Kline handing out free t-shirts to any woman who said they'd work out with him. Glamorous, right?

Kline's focus on women stemmed from his days as a professional baseball player, when he was sent to live with host families while on the road (and which you can read more about here). He recognized what the women he lived with often couldn't — that they spent so much time taking care of others, they often neglected taking care of themselves.

"Sometimes it was very apparent that there was some unhappiness, and I started thinking... the self-love wasn't there a lot of the time. You largely saw lack of energy, lack of motivation to move their body, lack of nutrition knowledge, lack of desire to even gain nutrition knowledge."

After noticing this unhappiness, Kline realized that he could serve as an inspiration for these families he was staying with — and thus, a lifelong passion was recognized.

And while the conversation of women "having it all" seems to tend towards a "balancing" metaphor, Kline outright rejects the concept of a balance beam. That's because he sees that analogy as implying that in order to add something to your life, you have to take away something else — and often something you love.

Instead, Kline operates from a philosophy of abundance, or what our newly minted improv expert Jeana Anderson Cohen would call "yes, and." His argument? There's always room for more things you love — and often, you feel more energized by adding those passions to your life rather than limiting them in the interest of having more time.

Listen to Devan Kline's episode of #WeGotGoals to feel inspired by his journey from an abusive home to CEO of the fast-growing fitness franchise, Burn Boot Camp. Want to see if there's a Burn Boot Camp near you? Check their locations here — and let us know how it went.

You can listen to #WeGotGoals anywhere you get your podcasts — and yes, that now includes Spotify! And make sure to listen all the way through, because we heard from a real-life goal-getter just like you. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

Start transcript:

[0:00]

Jeana: Welcome to We Got Goals, a podcast by asweatlife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen. With me, I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen.

Kristen: Good morning Jeana.

Maggie: Good morning Jeana.

Jeana: And Kristen this week you talked to Devan Kline, co-founder of the fitness franchise phenomenon, Burn Boot Camp.

Kristen: Yeah. So, I spoke with Devan Kline who've featured on asweatlife.com before. But it was great to get to talk to him. To learn more about how he came up with the idea for Burn Boot Camp. And he's also just come out with a book. So, he's a new author. And he wrote a book called Stop Starting Over: Transform Your Fitness by Mastering Your Psychology.

Maggie: And he was pretty open about, you know, where he came from and what his childhood was like and how he ended up where he is today. What can you share about that experience and listening to him?

Kristen: Yeah. So, Devan had a really rough childhood and he will tell you very openly that he grew up with abusive parents who were alcoholics and addicted to violence in a really poor area of Battle Creek, Michigan where he's from. And part of the reason he became such a gifted athlete. He ended up playing in the minor leagues for the San Francisco Giants if you weren't familiar. But part of the reason that drove him to that success is because he knew if he left the gym and went home, there was a really solid chance that he was gonna get beat up. So he would stay late at the gym. He would practice. He would lift. He would work on his techniques. And the work that he put in during those hours really affected his ability to play college baseball and get noticed by the baseball professional scouts. So, it was a horrible situation for him to be in. But it was amazing to me how he was able to find that silver lining and connect back to how his childhood had a good impact on him, even when it was such a depressing and traumatic situation for a child to be in.

Jeana: And today Burn Boot Camp serves a lot of women across the country. And he found sort of this love and respect for women for a lot of reasons. But mostly one main reason. Can you speak to how he found that reason and what that reason is?

Kristen: So when he was in the minor league for the San Francisco Giants, these minor league players. I don't think this is a widely known fact, but they stay with host families to help keep costs down and to assimilate with living in that new area. So, he sort of found his passion for training and for helping others by watching his host moms. And noticing how they spend so much time taking care of everybody else in the family first. That they put themselves last. And he wanted to help his host moms, you know, learn how to take care of themselves first. And he cited the airplane oxygen mask situation. You know, like you need to be able to put on your own oxygen mask before you can help those around you. So throughout that... as he sort of conceptualized Burn Boot Camp and reached out to his first clientele. And even now that they have countless franchises and clients. Women are still his main focus because he feels so strongly about teaching them as he called it, "To be selfless by being selfish." So I thought that was a really interesting way of, you know, viewing taking care of yourself. And a different method of self-care is that it allows you to take care of other people as well, once you sort of get your own self on lock. So today if you go into Burn Boot Camp, you're going to see that the majority of their clients are women. And that's all because of Devan's focus and of his experience of staying with host families.

Maggie: And in terms of trying new things or adding to your passions, Devan has a pretty interesting view on what balance means. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Kristen: Yeah. And I think this is something that also comes directly from his working with women most of the time. Is that there's this idea of being on a balance beam and, you know, how does do it? How does she balance it all? How does she juggle it all? And a lot of that mentality assumes that if you want to add something in, you have to take something else away. And he comes from what I would call more of a philosophy of abundance. Where he argues that there's always more room for the things that you love without having to take away from other things you love. And I think that's a really important concept. I know we all feel in this room that they are only so many hours of a day and so many hours in which you can accomplish certain things. And I just love the idea of feeling more connected by adding more to your life. Instead of rushing to take away things to make room for something else. So that's definitely something I am carrying with me throughout the rest of my life after working with Devan on this episode.

[4:55]

Jeana: What an inspiring interview. I can't wait to hear from Devan, author of the new book Stop Starting Over and CEO of Burn Boot Camp. Here is Kristen with Devan. And stick around goal-getter. At the end of this episode, you'll hear from someone who's out there achieving big goals or setting big goals, just like you.

Kristen: Welcome to the We Got Goals podcast. My name is Kristen Geil and with me over the internet, today is Devan Kline. The co-founder and CEO of Burn Boot Camp. The fastest ever growing fitness franchise in the nation. And recent author, new author of a book that recently came out in August called Stop Starting Over: Transform Your Fitness by Mastering Your Psychology. Devan, how are you today?

Devan: I'm doing fantastic. And thank you so much for having me. That was an excellent intro and I really appreciate you having me on. It's a privilege.

Kristen: Of course. We had spoken with you, I think earlier this year. I think Maggie spoke with you about the Burn Boot Camp franchise. And we're excited to dig into that today. As well as, learn a little bit more about how you approach goal-setting. Because you've had a really interesting life. And it seems like you just keep setting this higher and higher milestones for yourself and you keep hitting them. So, I think there' s a lot that we can learn.

Devan: Yeah. No, I'm excited. I hooked up with you guys not too long ago. We have a mutual friend and we have some Chicago area locations. And I know that's where your home base is. So, we flew up and met with you guys and had a nice little workout. And we walked around the downtown streets of the windy city and recorded some stuff. It was really, really fun. It's been great to get to know you and the team.

Kristen: And if I'm not mistaken you are from the Midwest area originally, correct?

Devan: Originally I'm from Battle Creek, Michigan. And I played baseball at Central Michigan University which obviously kept me in Michigan for... in the Midwest. Ended up getting the opportunity to play with the San Francisco Giants which broadened the scope of geography a little bit. I was able to, you know, see most of this country. And some of the Western Hemisphere and that ultimately led me to Naples, Florida where I stayed and began my personal training career. And then, you know, fast forward 18 months after that, I'm 24 years old and starting Burn Boot Camp literally in a parking lot in Charlotte, North Carolina. With no connections, about $600 worth of rusty dumbbells and a whole lot of ambition, that's for sure.

Kristen: Well, I want to get in deeper to that story. That was a great overview. Tell me about growing up. Were you always an athlete or was that something that you worked hard at over the course of your childhood and through high school and college?

Devan: Yeah. My father and his father were both very good athletes. So, there is some genetics that come. I wasn't as talented as they were before me. So, I really had to work hard. And I had a pretty rough upbringing, you know. And I never tell this story for sympathy. I only tell it to make the rest of the story contextual. Growing up in Battle Creek, Michigan in, you know, what most people would call the ghetto with parents who were addicted to drugs and alcohol. And more of the effect on my life was their physical violence addiction they had to each other and myself and my siblings. It was rough, you know. I mean, it forced me to grow up really quickly at a young age. 12, 13 years old I'm dealing with mental and emotional stresses that I see some of peers now at the CEO level in the fitness industry struggle with. And I was able to... I pretty much knew what was waiting for me at home on any given day. And so I used the field to escape. I played basketball, football but more importantly baseball was my passion. And I used the field to escape. I knew that if I would leave home early and get home late that I could avoid some of the turblance that might be going on in the household. And, you know, but I just thought that's how it was. I thought that's how kids lived. And it wasn't until I got outside of Battle Creek, Michigan and outside of my home til I realized that normal American families problems weren't drug abuse, for the most part. Drug abuse and physical violence. But moreso, lethargy and lack of happiness due to fitness and nutrition. So, I always worked hard, you know. And that, I'll never change my ubrining because it taught me how to be a man. It taught me. Like if I would've had the parents that I wish I would've had now. I wouldn't be the man that I'm proud to be today. And so I'm always, always, always gonna be grateful for that.

[9:28]

Kristen: Well thank you for sharing with us. It sounds like a very harrowing childhood and it's really amazing to see how you've come from that background to be such a positive influential figure in the world. Not even just in the health and fitness industry. How were you able to stay so goal-oriented when you were growing up in that abusive environment? It seems like it'd be so easy to just do what it takes to skate by, you know. Do the bare minimum in baseball practice or homework or whatever you were doing at the time. How were you able to achieve such great goals when you were growing up that way?

Devan: Yeah, and I write about this in my book Stop Starting Over. And it's really a decision that you make and like I said when I was a young kid, I was a little bit more grown up than I had to be. Because of the things I was going through. But life's circumstances, the events that happen to us that really condition who we are. Each one of those events and there's usually a few of them that are significant in all of our lives. I'm sure you can think back and think of a couple events that helped define who you are today. Like all of us can. You know, for me it was about being conscious and understanding that life is a blessing depending on the angle. And I always had the mentality. Like once I found that I was good at baseball, I knew that was my ticket. I knew that my upbringing led me to being on the field. Which led me to, you know, having some baseline talent. But really getting to the level that I played at which .0002% of college baseball players even get to was the fact that I had work ethic. And it was built into me. So I think it was really just a decision that I made at 12 or 13 years old once you start to become conscious about your surroundings and you start to make friends in different parts of the city. You start to take a look at your life and say like what is this... what does this mean. Yeah, this event is happening to me. Does this mean that I'm a bad kid? Does this mean I have shitty parents? Does this mean that I was put in this position so that I could overcome this to then inspire teammates? And inspire other people that I'm surrounded by? And I really took the later and I ran with it. I defined my situation as something that was going to progress me through my life and teach me the principals spiritually, mentally, physically, emotionally. That I needed in order to excel at a rate that was in congruency with my ambitions. And so, I was always a very ambitious kid. An entrepreneur at a very young age. Flipping... you know, I used to flip. I don't know if you remember pogs. I used to flip and sell pogs.

Kristen: Yes.

Devan: Pokemon cards. I used to sell. When I was sixteen I had a car flipping business. I sold like 5 cars over a summer. And you know, so that's always been in me. And so, it was a combination of things. You know, being broke was never fun and I wanted to utilize the situation I was placed in to do good for the world. And not utilize it to complain. Because that's what a lot of people do. And I wanted to show them there's a different light.

Kristen: Well, I think you've done that and then some. I would love to hear a little bit more about your story of being drafted by the San Francisco Giants. Can you tell me a little bit about, you know, maybe that last year of playing college ball? Like when you first started to realize that you had a real shot at this. And then what it was like being drafted, playing and staying with the host families. That I know impacted Burn Boot Camp.

Devan: Yeah, so between college and the professional ranks. I played in the minor league system. I just want to make that clear. Some people...

Kristen: Sure.

Devan: When I, you know. They're like "Oh, you're in the big leagues, I never heard of you." I'm like, "You never heard of me because I played the minor leagues with the other hundred guys that you've never heard of." But, nonetheless, it was a shot that I'm grateful for. And when I got drafted. Actually, when I was a sophomore in college I knew that I was good enough because people were telling me that I was good enough.

Kristen: Mm-hmm.

[13:21]

Devan: And I got the opportunity to travel the country during the summer, every year in college, that I was there. I was there for 3 years. And I would stay with host families and host families are basically, for those that don't know. They're basically a family that will take you in and treat you like their kid. Like their son for a summer and, you know, when you're there half the time and on the road half the time. But when you're there, helping you out with your laundry and making you food and just taking care because we're putting our heart and soul into the game. And I started to realize these people that I'm staying with are so grateful for life and they're so grateful for their family but there's still a similar unhappiness that I'm feeling here that I felt in my family. But it's not apples to apples. Like what is it? What is it that's causing some anger and overwhelm and frustration within the households that I'm staying at. Because you can sense those things when you're staying in someone's house. I mean, you get full access. It's like a reality television show. And you know, sometimes it was very apparent that there was unhappiness. And just started thinking. You know, it wasn't abuse. It wasn't physical violence. It wasn't drug abuse. It was unhappiness. Like the self-love wasn't there a lot of times. Like people didn't... they didn't love themselves. And this is an observation of me staying with dozens of host families. And I have stories traveling around and staying with them. You largely saw like lack of energy, lack of motivation to move their body, lack of nutrition knowledge, lack of desire to even gain nutrition knowledge, you know. And so I realized because I had, had to put that work in. You know, being a less than talented athlete to get to where I was. I had to eat well. I had to hit the weight room. I had to take care of my body and I was just doing it. And my host families, some didn't really care and I didn't really see them much. But most of them who were bought in, who loved the game, who wanted to come and watch our games and be bought into our lives. I was an inspiration to them without really even trying. And that's when I knew that I had a God-given talent to motivate people, to move people to real action and to influence their lives. And so when I got drafted by the San Francisco Giants that same thing continued because you still travel in the summer, you still stay with host families in the minor leagues. And, you know, it wasn't like. They weren't like aha moments as I'm there. Cause I'm focused on baseball, right. Like I had no Plan B. It was like make the big leagues and that's it. And so once I got released. You know, I really reflected on what else I was passionate about. And it wasn't long before I realized that helping people live a happier life was my mission.

Kristen: Devan, one of the questions we ask everybody who comes on this podcast is what is a goal that you've achieved in the past, why was it important to you and how did you get there? And I'm really interested to hear your answer considering the past that we just discussed.

Devan: So I think the most memorable goal achievement that I've ever had was two of them really. The biggest one in my mind was becoming a nationwide franchise. I think that when I first started Burn Boot Camp in a parking lot like I had mentioned. I had $600 to my name. We had 0 resources in the Charlotte area meaning we didn't know anybody. You know, we didn't have any leverage. We didn't know any media contacts. And you know, to start in a parking lot. Grow a movement, more than. I think it's a movement more than a brand. And grow it to the point where you're talking about 1,000 locations coast-to-coast. And being one fo the most globally dominant fitness brands on the planet that ever existed. I mean, that's my biggest accomplishment professionally. Is finishing what we call the FDD, the Franchise Disclosure document. That creates a platform for you to be legal to award franchises in all the states. That moment in, this was, October 2014. This was about 2 years after I got released. I stayed in Naples, Florida as a personal trainer for about 18 months. Moved up to Charlotte as I mentioned about 8 months, 9 months or so. And we started working on the franchise. October 2014 rolls around, we start it and we finished it in February 2015. And the first, I had a franchise coach who was helping me out with all of my legal documents. And he basically was like, "Yeah, Devan. Your concept's pretty good." And he's like if you do 3 in your first year, you know, you're really, really successful." And in my mind, it's like "okay, this guy is full of shit. I'm gonna do 3 in my first week." So, I ended up actually doing 10 locations, awarding 10 locations in my first, my very first week of announcing. So, it was... it was an incredible jumpstart. It was surreal. It created momentum. It's something that I'm always going to look back on and be like. I think goal achievement exists because of decision-making. And the decision that we made to take this route and to scaling this brand. Not only benefits my wife and I. You know, and able to grow fast and become financially free. But also just seeing how many clients that we impact on a daily basis. Reading all of the emails. Like people who are on the brink of suicide sending me emails and saying a video or a podcast or, you know, a blog post changed their life and shifted their mindset. All of that because of one decision to become a franchise and to scale the experience fast. I'm always going to be most proud professionally of that one decision to go for it. Because it's a scary thing to do. Franchising’s very capital intensive and a lot of franchise systems fail, so. No failure in our eyes though.

Kristen: One thing that I think is really interesting too is you balancing, on one hand, you've got this incredibly fast growing franchise with I think over 20,000 clients and counting. But at the same time.

Devan: I want to make a correction right there. 141,118 but who's counting.

Kristen: Holy cow! Oh my gosh. Well, my stats were outdated so awesome. That is amazing to hear. So, how do you balance that with a strong sense of community and family that I know is important to you and your wife in founding this company?

[19:40]

Devan: I think the question is great. And I did write about this in Stop Starting Over. And I think the reason, why a lot of the questions I get, and it ended up going into the book is because of our mindset. And it's not of balance. Like we're not trying to balance being a big brand versus being a family-oriented brand versus having our own family versus our work and professional and personal lives. Like we... Morgan and I believe in holistic integration. And it's something Arianna Huffington talks a lot about it. She's well known for this. But it's like taking everything that you care about in your life and making sure that you don't have to put big thick walls between your personal and professional life. We want to have an atmosphere where we love what we do. We love the people that we do it with. They love us back. And every day we can get up. And no matter how big we get, it's not going anywhere. Because everything starts and stops with the leadership of an organization or a family. And Morgan and I are the leaders and we genuinely and authentically believe in our hearts that our members are our family. Like they're our family. In my speech last night at my book launch the last thing that I said was, you know, "Thank you guys for showing me what family truly means because I've never had one like this before." So, family is built into the culture, authenticity is built into the culture. And Morgan and I are leading, and that's just who we are as people. So, I think it really trickles down through our franchise partners to our head trainers to their support trainers to our, what we call, brand ambassadors at our front desks. And through our clients and then even through our clients to their families. Which I think is one of the reasons that we're growing so fast because we're really able to take an emotional and mental approach and spiritual approach. Not just a physical approach. Which creates a whole different dynamic and a lot of people will be like, "I love Burn. I've never exercised before and I don't know what it is. There's something different about it and I love it." And you hear that all the time, over and over and over. And I think it is because of that reason. We just don't, we don't try to balance things. The nature of a balance beam is in order to have, you know, it even, you have to take away or add to. And I want all of the areas in our life to be in the black, if you will. I don't ever want to withdraw too much from my spirituality to

run the business or withdraw too much from my family to focus on a book. Or focus on a book so hard that I lose my own fitness. So it's just integrating everything so that, you know, you can do two things at once. I can have a conversation with Morgan at night and bond with her over what's going on in the business and it makes life a whole lot easier.

Kristen: I love that. It's a philosophy of adding in instead of taking away things. And I think that's really valuable. You also touched on this when you said the leadership trickles down not just within an organization but also within a family. And I know that a big part of your Boot Camp philosophy is making the moms' health a priority in families. Because so many times, moms have the tendency to be the caretaker for everyone else but not their own physical or emotional or mental strength. So, I'd love to know more about how you came to that realization. What influenced you to make that focus on women and moms, specifically, and empowering them through Burn Boot Camp?

[23:06]

Devan: Yeah, no it started when I was staying with all of my host families as we talked about before. And I think that was really, like I said, it wasn't an aha moment where I was like man, you know, I want to be a trainer that focuses on families health. And, you know, if you take a look at family dynamics like, as much as us guys don't really like to admit it, our wives and the women in our lives are pretty much the rulers of the world. And they're the leaders. And so, realizing that if you could impact a mom's health. You can impact a mom's mentality. You can impact more so her happiness. Well then you're really able to get through to the family because, you know, they always say, "Happy wife, happy life." It's so cliche but it's so true. And when the mom of a household is living in vitality. When they're living in energy. When they have, when they feel like they're giving and giving and giving but their also filling themselves up too so that they can give more. I think that's really what changed the game for a lot of clients originally here in Huntersville, North Carolina. Just north of Charlotte where we started. Who really helped me create a voice surrounding moms. Like so many, so many moms. Gosh, it's really frustrating sometimes and also an opportunity. But also frustrating to hear moms say, "I'm just a mom." Like, I just want to take a moment to address this real quick. Any moms listening to this because if you think you're just a mom, you have to know that you're so much more than that. You're a caregiver. You're a nurturer, a chef, an entertainer, an educator, a taxi driver. I mean the list goes on and on and on. You do so many things and you excel at each one. That there's no way to justify that thought that you're just a mom. You are a freaking rock star and you need to own that. And when I started leading Burn Boot Camp in the parking lot, I told my clients, I told my moms. I'm going to change the world and I don't care who's in my way. I'm gonna help change this world and leave it a better place than when I found it. And people thought I was crazy. The program originally started as Fit Community of Moms, which we kind of dropped that tagline because now we are accessible to men and women and children. But that was really how it started. That was the grassroots concepts. Just because I noticed how prevalent the just a mom mentality was. So to the women of Huntersville, North Carolina, if y'all are listening to this. Like you guys have created a movement and y'all banded together. And you've gotten rid of those poisonous thoughts for yourself and now you're helping millions of other moms do it. And, you know, moms aren't saying around here that they're just a mom anymore. Now they're like, they're the all star, they're the rock star and I shout them out, put them on a pedestal. And I think every mom who realizes that selfishness is not selfish whatsoever. When you're doing it for the right reasons. You don't have to be a selfish person. You don't have to be, in the truest sense of the word. You can be selfless by being selfish when you are pouring into yourself. When you put your oxygen mask before applying the oxygen mask to other people. You breathe life in your self first, so that you can give energy through them and you don't have to try hard. So take care of yourself. Make yourself the number 1 priority in your own life. Above all else. And I know how difficult that is over spirituality and over family. But you have to because if you don't, how are you ever going to find the energy to give outwardly.

Kristen: Wow. I'm not a mom but I feel really inspired right now. To go, go out and take care of myself. So, thank you.

Devan: It starts before you're a mom by the way. But it just gets harder when... Cause I have kids now. And I started this movement before I had children. And it definitely gets harder but I know that there's no excuses now. Cause it used to be like, "Devan, okay. I get you can say that. You're a 24-year-old kid that's not even married yet. And you don't have kids, you don't understand." Well, it's all about the paradigm, right? How are you, what lens are you looking at it through? And so, when I started having children. I have two, Cameron and Maxwell. She's 2 and he's 7 months. I felt it. But it was about adjusting and it was about adapting. And so, it's definitely possible and people are doing it all over the place. So don't think you're an anomaly if, you know, you have kids and it becomes a struggle. But, start practicing before kids, alright. Because once you get there, you don't want that radical shift. You want to be able to kind of progressively ease your way into children and healthy lifestyle.

Kristen: Yeah, let's go into that a little bit more. Cause that was actually something I wanted to talk to you about because a lot of listeners are women who maybe aren't married or don't have kids yet. So how would you encourage them to set strong goals and habits now to set them up for success, if and when they do have a family down the line?

Devan: Yeah, no I think ultimately. And I talk about this a lot in Stop Starting Over. This concept of the North Star. I've utilized this, I actually have a tattoo on my back to prove it.

Kristen: Oh my gosh, you've committed.

[27:52]

Devan: Yeah, I committed a long time ago. As 21 or 22 years old playing baseball. I committed to this concept. And the concept was that I have an outcome, a singular outcome that I want my life to be. And I have, I answered the questions what do I want, as simple as that sounds. And why do I really want it? And create clear definitions surrounding those two questions because that gives you clarity. It gives you a GPS as you're going through your life. On a daily basis, we have the opportunity to create rituals in our lives. And those rituals, which most people call habits, things you do repeatedly over and over as a ritual. And are those in alignment with this North Star concept in your life or are they not. So I've always had kind of top of mind. And I put it in the book literally as North Star. And I branded the book with stars and everything because I thought it was super important to realize that no matter where you are in your life today, you have to be doing things that align with your ultimate outcome of your life. Like there can't be internal conflicts. If there are, then you have to make sure that you're self-aware enough, which is a highly underrated skill. If you're self-aware enough to take a look at your life from a 30,000 story foot view. And say, look dude or dudette this ritual, this thing that I'm doing in this life isn't getting me to this ultimate outcome that I'm after. You can also visual a North Star like a perfect day. Like if you had to live a perfect day what exactly would you do. If you had to live a day over and over again with no limitations, no consequences. What would you do when you get up, what would you do then next, and what you do at lunch and what would you do next. What would your day look like. And that is a great exercise because you get an opportunity to look at your life with no limitations. Like we, some of us struggle so hard to find our passion when it's right in front of us. Answer that question, if I had to live a perfect day over and over what would it look like with no limitations. That will give you an opportunity to define what you're passionate about with you having to ask yourself that weird question, what am I passionate about. Because you're gonna do the things over and over every single day. Only the things that you love cause you're stuck with them. So one of those two things or both and I write about both of them in the book, can give you that guidance throughout your life. So, I can't sit here on a podcast and tell anybody that exercising 5 days a week and eating only plants and a little bit of protein. And, you know, like the generic fitness stuff. I can't tell them that because I don't know if that's what makes people happy or not. I know that my personal decisions align with my outcome and part of my outcome is to live a long time so that I can see my great-grandchildren grow up. But I can't tell people you should exercise 3 times a week for 15 minutes or 6 times a week for an hour. It's like you have to do you. I know people, including myself that you're so freaking busy all the time. And it's a real thing. Like real business. Not like thumbing through Instagram or Facebook or something. And sometimes you can only get 10 minutes or 15 minutes in a day. But it's a must that you do it. That's your own decision. So you, I think people have to work backwards. That's my answer. You have to look at what you want your life to be in 50 years from today. Realize that we all have decades left, we all can grow. None of us are perfect. And you have to reverse engineer that life so there's internal conflicts. So that, you know, you can't complain about your job but then also binge watch House of Cards for 5 hours every night. You can't do that. If you're happy binge-watching House of Cards who am I to tell you that you shouldn't be doing that. And that's what I'm all about, is finding ways to create happiness. But if you're complaining about your job and you're watching House of Cards, now there is an internal conflict. So, I'm just really, really passionate about reverse engineering and becoming self-aware along the way.

Kristen: And how does that concept of reverse engineering tie into the Stop Starting Over mentality that you titled your book after?

Devan: Yeah. So many people, think about it. You hear it all the time, right? Oh, I'll just start next Monday. Or I'm starting a diet plan tomorrow. Or, you know, it's New Years. It's New Years resolution time. I'm making a new years resolution. But you've made the same one the last 7 years. There's no progression there. So, reverse engineering really ties into Stop Starting Over because what you do is you create this North Star that I'm talking about. Again, what you really want, specific to you. And why you really want it, specific to you. And that becomes, that becomes this outcome. For example, I think, it put it into context. For my life, I want to live past 90 years old because I want to see my children grow. And during my life, I want to be a business builder because I know that it'll provide for my family financially the way my parents could never provide for me. And my wife is the most important thing to me in the world and I want her to feel proud of her life and proud of what she does for a living and what her identity is. And, you know, why do I really want it? Well, because I think that love is the most important thing. And the only asset that we truly own and that we can control. And so then you just got to work backwards from there. You got to say, okay, alright. That's my ultimate outcome of my life. Okay, today is going to the cupboard and eating a whole bag of Oreos gonna help me live til I'm 90 years old. And the answer is no, so there's an internal conflict there. And so, reverse engineering and having that North Star, it's basically a GPS on your way to get to your ultimate outcome. It's giving you a way to make decisions throughout your entire day. Answering the question, does this align with my North Star. And that's all reverse engineering really is. So Stop Starting Over is basically teaching you philosophically how to do that. If you're looking for a 30-day meal plan, 30-day exercise program, don't even buy my book because it's not gonna help you. This is for people who are at rock bottom, who really need direction with their lives and don't have a mentor like I didn't when I was young. Or people who are living life at a really high level that want to take it to the next level. It's not gonna speak much to people in the middle who are just content with mediocre.

Kristen: One thing that you've also said across your book and across your platforms that I've really honed in on is that success is 90% psychology and 10% strategy. I would love to hear a little bit more about how you came to realize that and it seems like that ties in perfectly to the Stop Starting Over. Because if you get your mind right. If you get that North Star clarified in your brain then that's got you almost all the way to success already.

[34:36]

Devan: It's all about belief. I mean, if you really look at successful people versus unsuccessful people it's the amount of conviction that they have in their own belief system. And a belief is nothing more than thoughts you continue to think over and over and buy into. And, you know, 90/10 rule. 90%, you know, success is 90% psychology and 10% mechanics is basically saying that the reason why you're starting over and over and over and over is. Because you're 90% focused on the mechanics and you're 10% focused on the foundational psychology that's gonna allow you to create belief systems and delete old belief systems that were installed into you from a young age. You know, inappropriately by a parent or a teacher. Or you had a dad who told you, you were the fat kid and now you identify as the fat kid and now you think that it's all about losing the fat. When really it's about taking a step back and saying. Psychology is the foundation to success, period. I wish I could say it's 100% psychology and 0% mechanics but strategies do take a part. You know, you have to work out and you have to eat right. But look if I asked a room full of 1,000 people is it true or false that you have to eat healthy often and exercise often to become a more healthy person. How many people would say true? All of them, right. So if 100% of people understand the knowledge and then our obesity rates and our rate of overweight American citizens is nearly 70%, 5% higher than it was 5 years ago. Then there's a serious disconnect there, isn't there.

Kristen: Yeah.

Devan: Everyone knows what to do but nobody's doing it. I mean, that's a pretty big void. That's a pretty big problem. And that's what I wanted to do with this 90/10 rule is address that. The reason that you know things but you're not doing them is cause you believe in your head, your thought processes tell you that knowledge is power. Knowledge is not power, knowledge is only potential power and unless you take action on top of that knowledge then it's never going to, you're never gonna make any real changes. So it's about putting priorities in order and Stop Starting Over really gives foundational principles spiritually, mentally, emotionally, physically that allow people to examine their own psychology. It's not my job to tell you how you should think. The best leaders in the world ask the best questions. And so, throughout the book, you're gonna to see questions being asked of you and exercises for you to do. There's a workbook that goes along with it that you can download on my closed Facebook page called Stop Starting Over. And, it really is a tool for people to really start to understand 90/10. And if you don't have 90/10 rule down and you don't believe it, well then you're gonna to believe things like it is what it is. I'm just overweight, it is what it is. Or I'm not a fitness person. You're gonna have these types of beliefs because you've never questioned them. So I'm getting people to question the way they think.

Kristen: Well speaking of big questions, I think we've got just enough time for me ask you the last question that we ask everybody who comes on our podcast. And that is, what's a big goal you have for the future, why is it important to you and what steps are you taking to get there?

[37:52]

Devan: I am a big thinker. I think anybody that follows me or is a part of our organizations know that. We have 400 franchise partners, 800 trainers, 36 people on our headquarter team and they all know that the crazy stuff that Devan comes up with usually comes to fruition a year or two down the road. So maybe we should start believing him a little bit more when he's talking crazy. But with my energy, with my wife's energy, with our team's energy that we all have collectively with the momentum of all of our clients out there in Burn Nation. We have this 15 and 15 rule. 15,000 Burn Boot Camps over the next 15 years. And we live by that. We truly believe it. We really believe it with conviction that that's going to happen. We're already legal in Canada. We'll begin awarding franchises in Ontario, in Toronto specifically, in Vancouver. We'll be in the UK, some countries in Europe, Ireland, France, Germany, Spain, New Zealand, Australia. Those things are all coming and they're coming very, very soon. Like within the next year. And so, it's already starting. So for me, I want to continue to impact people and use Burn Boot Camp as a distribution platform for positivity and for kindness and for psychology and for education. I want to control. I want to take the conversation away from big marketing companies, big food marketing companies specifically and big medical companies. And I want to shift the conversation to our side because the number one reason why I believe that, especially America, is where it is today. Isn't because people try to sit around and be fat, sick and lazy. We're not trying to do that. That's not our ambitions. But the conversation, the education, the knowledge that we're being fed is largely misleading. I think Facebook, Instagram, YouTube do a beautiful job of commoditizing distribution platforms to get people's voice, like mine, out there in the world. And I think a combination of wanting to lead the charge conversationally, in terms of health and real change. And having a physical platform for people to partner with me to do so in our Burn Boot Camp franchise system is a perfect storm to create the next biggest franchise that's ever existed, fitness franchise.

Kristen: Well I can't wait to see Burn Boot Camp in a neighborhood near me. Devan, thank you so much for coming on today. Before you go, can you tell us where our listeners can find you on the internet? Where they can download your book? And where they can find a Burn Boot Camp?

Devan: So, Stop Starting Over right now is on Amazon. If you liked this podcast and you want to dive deeper, my podcast also goes into a lot of concepts. You can search it iTunes, GooglePlay, Stitcher, iHeartRadio, pretty much any syndication platform. I'm really everywhere, Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, anywhere, IGTV. Wherever you feel like you hang out the most and content platform that you like, I'm there. The quickest way to get a hold of me is to just DM me on Instagram. I answer a lot of those. I'm pretty active over there. And, you know, I really look forward to helping people. My wife and I sit in bed every night for 45 minutes to an hour and share stories of clients who we're communicating with and help people. And it's just part of our lives and we love to do it. So, chances are... I can't get to all the DMs nowadays. I used to be able to. But chances are that we will have a conversation at some point if you really want the help. So reach out.

Cindy: He goal getters, Cindy Kuzma here. Just popping back in to let you know that we are about to play a goal from one of you, our listeners! We would love to hear from you, that's right you! If you'd like to be featured on this podcast just record a voice memo with a goal that you've crushed, a goal that you have for the future and how you plan to get there or your best goal-getting tip. Email it to Cindy@aSweatLife.com. And you could be featured on an upcoming episode. Here is one of you with your goals.

Zajana: I'm Zajana Das and I'm from Chicago, Illinois.

Ana: My name is Ana and I'm also from Chicago, Illinois.

Zajana: So, Ana and I both have a love for healthy foods. And it's something that we've talked about since the day we met. On our first day of adult work. We've been discussing this year about how we can start a brand that really represents us and our passion for health food.

Ana: Yes and so we kind of looked at what we want to share with the world and with our community and we looked at it from being active, authentic and ambitious. And then just sharing those three different qualities through a lifestyle and through the food that we put out there.

Zajana: And how we plan on getting there. I think it's been a little bit of trial and error. But something that we've come to learn about ourselves and A Sweat Life helped us learn about during one of the Breakfast and Learns is that we have to tell other people about our goals. So you know, I told my goal to Ana and she kind of echoed that was one of her goals as well. So that accountability has led us to really step up and come up with a game plan and a business idea for our goals.

Ana: Yes and to add to that I will say that for both of us it's important to be detailed. And not just have a big grand goal out there. But kind of set up steps that will help us achieve that goal. So, you know, whether it is making a big business plan or setting up a marketing strategy, creating a brand image that we believe in. So taking concrete steps along the way to make it happen.

Zajana: Definitely.

Cindy: This podcast is asweatlife.com production and it’s another thing that’s better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts including on Spotify. And while you’re there if you could leave us a rating or a review we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to Jay Mono, for our theme music, to our guest this week, Devan Kline, to Cathy Lye for editing, to TechNexus for the recording studio, and of course to you, our listeners.

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Adam Whiting, now a well-known yoga teacher around the world for his smart sequencing and anatomical focus in class, was at one time just trying to understand what was going wrong in his body. After seeing doctor after doctor in Manhattan, trying to diagnose massive dizzy spells, headaches and seemingly random spouts of numbness throughout his body, he was told by all accounts that his body was "fine."

"I was diagnosed with having anxiety disorder and panic attacks," Whiting told me. "And it didn't fit for me, because it wasn't presenting itself as anxiety. I wasn't stressed. I wasn't depressed. And in my mind, at that point, my knowledge about anxiety disorder was so limited that I was sort of in denial."

At that time, Whiting was working in New York as a musician. But in order to pay the bills, he worked nine-to-five at an insurance agency - a job which, he describes, was a major catalyst for his anxiety disorder and also the catalyst for him finding what he was truly meant to be doing.

"A friend introduced me to asana, to postural yoga. After several months of just doing yoga...I could feel the anxiety start to unwrap itself. It was just the most amazing feeling of actually feeling safe in my own skin again."

After feeling how yoga helped and healed him, he knew it was something he wanted to teach. From that point forward, he launched into his first teacher training. He began teaching right away, supplemented that with playing music, and didn't look back.

And even though it became a greater hustle to make ends meet, it was all building towards a greater purpose, or Dharma, as you'll hear Whiting describe in the episode.

He started teaching more and more classes, then began traveling for workshops, and then started running trainings and retreats, all in addition to playing music on the side and weaving it into his teaching repertoire.

He describes it as all part of a tapestry in "whatever this career is."

Whiting sums it up nicely, but his tapestry is composed of many moving pieces that all move him in the direction where he wants to take his career and his life. From moving to Australia to lead trainings alongside owner of Power Living Duncan Peak, to hosting retreats across the world, to moving back to the U.S. to lead his first 200-hour yoga teacher training on his own, Whiting lets meditation be his guide in setting goals for his future.

And rather than setting traditional, tangible goals, Whiting is focused on following his Dharma. He sees those action items to achieve more as the logistics to align in order to go after something bigger.

"I absolutely do have goals of running more teacher trainings, of having my advanced 300-hour training up and running, of having a tour in Australia and running retreats in Australia and Bali. But in my mind, I sort of think of them as logistical things to align so that I can look out past that and set my sails towards that journey with the knowledge that the winds are going to blow me somewhere completely unexpected, but also with the the trust that wherever I end up is where I'm supposed to be."

Listen to Adam Whiting’s episode of the #WeGotGoals podcast to hear more about how he views Dharma, his purpose and duty in life, and the way he views goals that ladder up to that. Thanks to Cody Hughes for the photo used in this post.

You can listen anywhere you get your podcasts (including Spotify!) and if you like what you hear, please leave us a rating or a review. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

Start transcript:

[0:00]

Jeana: Welcome to We Got Goals, a podcast by asweatlife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen with me I have Maggie Umberger and Cindy Kuzma.

Cindy: Good morning Jeana.

Maggie: Morning Jeana.

Jeana: Good morning. Maggie, this week you spoke to Adam Whiting. And you actually got to do that interview from home.

Maggie: I did. I talked to Adam who is a yoga instructor. Who I think started teaching in Charlotte, North Carolina. Where I am from. And then has since moved to Australia and then back to North Carolina. But he continues to lead trainings and retreats and experiences across the world. In Bali. In Sri Lanka. In throughout Australia. He's taught at Wanderlust. He teaches in a lot of places. I've always just really respected his classes. I have loved them and I wanted to know a little more about his journey to yoga. How he got to the idea of wanting to teach internationally. Because that is a whole other track of teaching that I don't know a lot about. So I was really excited to get to talk to him and then I was home. So I got to do it in person before taking one of his awesome classes.

Cindy: Oh, that's so great and it sounds like not just what he said but how he said it left an impact on you.

Maggie: It did. And I didn't even say this to him after. So if he listens to this episode he'll be like, "Oh, she didn't tell me that." But I was noticing how mindful he was as he was answering any of the questions that I asked. Or response to something he would say. And thinking about that a little bit more. And even like closing his eyes. Taking time to answer mindfully. I don't do that always. And so I think we don't always love silence and we kind of mumble through things until we get to the point. But he was just really thoughtful about what he wanted to say. And then speaking to that versus talking around the point at all. So I thought that was probably a testament to, in general, his journey toward mindfulness as a teacher. He didn't begin teaching yoga with this meditation center. He actually talks about this in the episode of being very anxious and having anxiety attacks and not really sure of what was going on in his body. He was a musician in New York. Doing that grind of working other jobs. Sitting at a desk while he was trying to have gigs at night and make it as a musician in New York. He was getting beat down through that grind. And so meditation actually, when he was introduced to it just had him sitting with his thoughts more. And he didn't really like that. And so the Asana practice, the movement piece of yoga was what keyed him into a different way of life. Or a different kind of thought pattern. And that he could get out of that anxiousness mode. So the meditation piece came later as I learned. But it really is like a stronghold to his practice and how he teaches now.

Jeana: And Maggie, Adam almost didn't do this interview at all, right? And this isn't the first time this has happened to us. Can you talk a little bit about why he sort of has trouble with the concept of goals?

Maggie: Yeah, he asked me like, "Is it okay if I don't really have goals. If we do this interview?" And I always think any input on how people view goals is beneficial. However, you see it. Whether you notice or, you know, want to kind of go down the path that one of these goal-getters goes down. Or you kind of take that at face value and choose something different. That's what's cool about this podcast is there's so many different viewpoints. And he said that he's worked with brands and at companies where setting goals has been a central piece of the puzzle. And so he understands it. And he knows that there's benefits to setting a ten-year vision and going after it. And then really executing on your one-year goals to make that ten-year vision a reality. But for him, what's he's found along the way is that he is much more in tune with the idea of dharma. Dharma he says is widely known as your calling but really it's more like your duty. Like your purpose. Why are you put on this earth? And you've got to find that. You've got to search for that. And then you've got to do it. And so that's really what leads him. And that seems ambiguous. And that can be scary. Like that's scary for me to think about. Just, oh my god, what is the one reason I'm here on this earth. But that doesn't really scare him. That's more of like what lights him up. And I think when he speaks about that you'll hear just how much of a guiding force that is for and all of the teachers he has learned from and how teaches now.

Jeana: Well what a mindful way to think about goals and we're so excited to hear this interview with Maggie and Adam. Keep those earpods in goal-getters. There's more to this episode at the end. We'll hear from people just like you out there achieving big goals or trying new things or maybe just setting big goals.

[4:56]

Maggie: So I'm here with Adam Whiting. Who I have had the pleasure of taking class from many times before he moved to Australia. He's a yoga instructor traveling around the world teaching yoga. Also a musician. You're many things Adam and I'm really, really excited to get to talk to you about your journey as not just a yoga teacher but I mean really as a teacher. For a lot of different people across the world. It's a pleasure to have you on our podcast. So thank you for joining us.

Adam: Absolutely. Thanks so much for having me. It is completely my pleasure.

Maggie: So I did take your class probably first six years ago. Before you moved. And I remember it was like a Wednesday night, 8-9pm or something. And it was a class that I felt like changed my life. I loved it.

Adam: Oh wow.

Maggie: Yeah, it was just like the transitions were so interesting and you had such a unique perspective. And I remember the savasana was like 15 minutes long. And I had never had that before. And I so appreciated it. So before we jump into talking all about goals. I would love for the listeners at home to just get to hear your journey to yoga, just really briefly.

[6:14]

Adam: Yeah, absolutely. The story sort of starts in New York City. And I was living there. I moved up there in 2001. And lived up there for a few years. While I was up there I started getting some pretty massive dizzy spells. Some pretty massive headaches. Some random parts of my body, my arm, my face, my legs, were going numb at random times. And I really wasn't sure what was happening. And after taking a tour around several medical professionals, neurologists, doctors, general doctors, MRIs, spinal taps, blood tests. They basically all came to the conclusion that my body was fine. And I was diagnosed with having anxiety disorder and panic attacks. And it didn't fit for me because it wasn't presenting itself as anxiety. Like I wasn't stressed. I wasn't depressed. And in my mind at that point, my knowledge about anxiety disorder was so limited that for me I was sort of in denial. Saying no these are physical symptoms. These are symptoms that I'm getting headaches, I'm getting dizzy. This is physical things. Something has to be physically wrong with me. And it took this really compassionate doctor speaking to me about. Well, she actually made a bargain with me. She's like listen. I understand where you're coming from but let's put you on these anti-anxiety medications for just a little bit. And if your symptoms go away then we can talk, right. Then if you come in believing that this is actually what's going on with you then we can work around different ways to sort of treat the symptoms. So I agreed. And lo and behold she was right. And immediately, I started sort of seeking different ways to address the issues. Medication worked wonderfully for me but I also knew that it wasn't something that I wanted to be reliant on long-term. And I knew that there were other answers out there for me. So I started looking at meditation as the means to heal and to move on from this. And to be completely honest with you, meditation in and of itself actually made it worse. Because I was at that point, just in this state of just. I didn't realize how stressed I was. I didn't realize how just overflowing with anxiety I was. This was just post September 11th and the city was in turmoil. And the world was in turmoil. And to be there during that time. I didn't really realize how deeply those rivers of anxiety were flowing. So when I was asked to sit in the stillness of meditation it actually triggered more anxiety. And it triggered more panic attacks. So I moved away from that. And then finally, you know, a dear friend of mine introduced me to Asana, to a postural yoga. And after several months of just doing postural yoga I could finally start to feel that sort of barbed wire of anxiety, you know, start to unwrap itself from my being. And it was just the most amazing feeling of actually feeling safe in my own skin again. But like I said, not realizing how unsafe I felt. And then I started exploring more meditation with the postural yoga. And immediately when I felt how amazing this practice was. And how much it served to help me and heal me. I knew it was something that I wanted to teach. Pretty immediately, I knew that this was calling out to me to share. So after getting my first yoga teacher training certification. I just jumped into teaching right away. And, you know, I was young and fresh and so passionate about it. It's funny looking back on those first classes those, you know, six, seven, eight years ago. I sort of shake my head a little bit. Of like, oh my god those classes must have been awful. But I think that's sort of true in any sort of medium you care so much about. And as you grow and evolve and mature, your teaching and your skill and your craft evolves and matures. So hopefully, eight years from now when I look back at the classes I'm teaching now I'll be appalled because I've learned that much more in the eight years. So after teaching. I was in Charlotte, North Carolina for a few years teaching. And I got this amazing opportunity to teach in Australia. This wonderful man, teacher, business owner. His name is Duncan Peak, owns Power Living Australia Yoga. And that is a group of nine studios around Australia and New Zealand. And after some sort of back-and-forth and a wonderful trip to Australia. I agreed to move out to Sydney and help coach their teachers and lead their teacher trainings. And travel around to the cities in Australia where they have studios. And teach classes, run workshops, run teacher trainings and, you know, also run retreats in Bali for our teacher trainings. So it was an amazing few years of really quick growth. Really rapid education on my part. And just to be in that part of the world was unbelievable. It's still some of the most beautiful places I've ever been are there. So I lived there for a few years and it was absolutely amazing. But towards the end of those few years, I could feel these little strings pulling my heart back to America. My family's here and we'd always been really, really tight. And in Australia, just being able to come back once a year was amazing but it wasn't quite enough. And there were some issues with family stuff that were really pulling me back to be home. To be closer with family. And it also sort of aligned really beautifully with my desire to be an independent yoga teacher. Working out in Australia was absolutely amazing but I was also working for another brand. And it was an amazing brand but it was a brand that wasn't Adam Whiting or Adam Whiting Yoga. It was another brand. And there's always been a craving inside of my journey and my career to just speak from my own voice and teach my own trainings in the way that I've learned. And the way that I want to share. Without really, it might sound blunt, but without really having to answer to anybody else. So in moving back to America and back to Charlotte. And running my first teacher training here which is an independent Adam Whiting Yoga Teacher Training. It feels amazing to be able to, you know, put my stamp on the certificates. And say that, you know, these students learned from me. And to be able to craft my own calendar and run my own events. And just sort of again, it sounds blunt, but not to have to answer to anybody else. To be able to craft my own future in the way that I want it is really encouraging and I'm really excited about the next few years.

Maggie: I hear probably something that a lot of people would nod their head at and say that they want to be in charge of their own destinies too.

Adam: Absolutely.

[14:28]

Maggie: And that's a huge, like. I can imagine that feeling, that calling inside you. Cause I feel it in me. And I feel like so many people. Especially now, that there are so many avenues to create your own path. That it isn't the 9-5 structure of jobs as much as it used to be. Especially in the recent years. So I wonder, what for you was some of the helpful guides in pushing along this path. To create it for yourself. Because while I know a lot of people want it. It's another to actually go for it and do it.

[15:02]

Adam: Yeah, absolutely. It's I think my journey is not quite a typical journey. My journey started playing the guitar. As you said, I'm a musician. And I started playing the guitar when I was eleven or twelve. And I was only playing it for a couple of years. And just by sort of coincidence and I think we'll talk a little bit more about coincidences later. The guitar teacher that I had was graduating from college. And he said, "Okay. I'm leaving you. I can't teach you anymore. But there's this amazing school. And I want you to go down for a summer session." So and that was University of North Carolina School of the Arts. And it was between my eighth and ninth grade year. And I studied there for a few weeks. And it was my first sort of time away from home. And I remember I was really homesick. And I think I cried a lot on the phone with my mom. It was terrifying being away from home that young for me. But then basically by the time I got back home from the training or the summer session, the guitar teacher at this university had called my mother. And said that he wanted me to study there full-time. So I studied at this university, at this conservatory for seven years. Through high school, through my undergrad. And immediately that's when I moved up to New York City. And when I got to New York was the first time I ever had that real 9-5 job. And, you know, like any musician in New York, especially. You're a musician which means you're unloading trucks. Or you're a waiter. Or you're, you know, working data entry at an insurance agency. Which is what I was doing in a cubicle from 9-5. And I think that working that job was one of the catalysts for one. One of the catalysts for my anxiety disorder and my stress because I was so deeply unhappy there. But because of that was the catalyst for me getting out. You know, and I remember the day that I quit and it was. I remember walking around. It was in downtown New York, in Manhattan. And I remember walking around after I had resigned. And I was sort of like halfway smiling, halfway crying, like halfway like I don't know how I'm going to make a living now. But I had no choice. It was one of those things that comes up with me quite often is I don't have a choice right now. So this is the path that I'm going to walk down. So from there on out, I pretty much just started hoofing it as a musician. I started teaching lessons. I started performing as much as I could. I recorded an album. And I was still unloading trucks at a Crate & Barrel in midtown at the same time. So I was still working jobs to pay my rent. But there was always this sort of, just this hustle, of you've got to do this. Because you don't really have a choice. And then I moved back to Charlotte. And when I moved back to Charlotte from New York. One, the cost of living was significantly less. So I was really surprised that I could make a living as a musician at that point. You know, gigging on the weekends and teaching lessons. And then teaching yoga. And all of a sudden teaching yoga so sort of started to take precedence. And I started teaching more and more classes. And then I started traveling for workshops. And then I started running trainings. And then retreats. And it was sort of this beautiful crescendo where more and more yoga opportunities were coming and the music opportunities were sort of fading away. And what's beautiful now is that they've both sort of come together. Like I'm still playing music, we're running Kirtans. This, you know, traditional chants in yoga. And recording a cd. And it's sort of come together in this beautiful tapestry of whatever this career is. But I think what you said is really important. Is that I think the definition of career is really changing. That the idea of that 9-5 job that my dad had where he worked for Federal Express from out of college until the day he died. Really it still exists but it's not. I don't think it's really the stronghold that it used to be. And now there's sort of this freedom of creating what you want to create for your life, for your job, for your career. And it still terrifies me. Because I'm sitting here. You know, meandering into my late thirties. And really happy with my career and really happy with where everything is right now. But I'm also thinking about retirement funds and do I want to be teaching yoga when I'm in my fifties. Or what's going to happen and how am I going to create this financial stability that. You know, if I did follow the path of my father or my grandfather that they had the retirement funds and the IRAs and all of this stuff set up which I don't have. And part of me gets really terrified about that and then part of me also is just sort of trusting, right? Part of me just sort of thinks. Okay, well here we are. And this is the path that I'm moving through in this lifetime. And, you know, these first few decades I've figured it out. So hopefully I'll continue to figure it out.

Maggie: I think it's a good mentality. I mean if your past is any track record for the future, you will figure it out. So let's talk about big goals. The biggest question that we ask on the podcast is what's one big goal that you've accomplished that you're proud to say that you did and how you got there?

[21:07]

Adam: It's interesting. I knew that you were going to ask this question and I've spent some time these past couple of days sort of hovering around that question. And I really didn't come up with one goal. Because I'm not really the type of person that sort of makes a goal list. Or a vision chart. And, you know, through my teaching and yoga I've interacted with several brands who have put me through that sort of, you know, vision statements and ten-year goals and five-year goals and one-year goals. And I think that's very helpful and I think there's a lot to be said for that. But at the same time even when I was doing it. It wasn't really lighting me up. Like it wasn't inspiring me for the future. For creating something that moved me closer towards whatever those goals are. It actually sort of intimidated me a little bit. So I was like well I don't know. I don't want to set this goal that I'm not sure of this house or this family or this career. Like I want these goals and I want these visions but I also want to be able to flow. And if I didn't have that idea of flow in my life. I wouldn't have ended up in Australia or Bali or back here. And I don't think I'd be where I was right now. So there's something to be said for. In yoga, we call it Sankalpa and Sankalpa means intention. In yoga, we speak towards the word dharma a lot. I think it's softly and steadily turning into a phrase that might be a bit overused these days. Or maybe mistranslated is a better way of saying it. But in dharma, a lot of people think of dharma as being your calling. But the more accurate translation actually means your duty. I think that's a little bit more accurate because it's not just what am I inspired to do. It's like what do I have to do? Like why was I put here on this earth? And I have to with everything that I have and with my entire being and with my entire life I have to find that. I have to find my calling. Why I'm here. It's my duty. And for me, instead of charting out ten-year, five-year, one-year. The way that I've sort of navigated through it is more silence. More meditation. More introspection. And when I sort of back away and take those times of stillness and of meditation. I feel like I'm shedding away the layers of the external thought patterns. Of my doubts and of my worry. And of that constant negative chatter that lives in my head and a lot of other people's heads. To just sort of sit in my center. To sit in my being for a little while. And to actually listen. And to listen to what my heart truly wants. And it's in that listening that my compass sort of sets itself. And what the yogic tradition believes is that once you find that connection to your source. That connection to your calling. And you notice, we could several words here. We could use the word the universe, we could use the word divinity, we could use the word grace. But when you start to notice the essences of that force, that power, that energy resonating in your life. That energy starts to notice you noticing her. And she begins to unfold for you. And what I mean by that. One of my favorite quotes which may or may not be tattooed somewhere on my body in some way. Is an Emerson quote which is, "The world makes way for the man who knows which way he is going." It really resonates with the Vedic knowledge, with the yogic knowledge of once you have discovered your dharma. Your path down this life and you set your sails and you start moving in that direction. The world has a beautiful way of creating the path for you. And it's not going to be the path that you think it is. You know, it's not going to be the route that you think you should be going down. But it is a path that if you trust it, it will lead you to somewhere beyond your wildest expectations. So in goals, I absolutely do have goals. Goals of, you know, in 2019 running some more teacher trainings. Of having my advanced 300-hour training up and running. Of having a tour in Australia. And running retreats in Australia and Bali. And these are sort of, I guess we can consider them short-term, one-year goals. But in my mind I sort of think of them as logistical things to align. So that I can sort of look out past that. And like I said set my sails towards that journey with the knowledge and the expectations that the winds are going to blow me somewhere completely unexpected. But also with the trust that wherever I end up is where I'm supposed to be.

Maggie: I have a two-part question. Or maybe two separate questions.

Adam: Okay.

Maggie: First, do you know what your duty is now?

[26:55]

Adam: Okay, interesting. So good. I'm leading a teacher training here in Charlotte. And we just, and I think a couple weekends ago we just had this conversation. There's this beautiful book. It's called The Great Work of Your Life by Stephen Cope. And it's this modern sort of retelling. Not necessarily retelling but a modern analysis of the Bhagavad Gita. And it talks about all of these characters who've found their calling. And they pursued it. And we had this big conversation with our trainees. And some of them knew and some of them didn't. And some of them were really stressed out that they didn't know. And some of them were really disappointed that they didn't. And some of them weren't sure that it was right. And it was really revealing. And we have a retreat coming up in a couple of weeks where we will go through a process of finding their dharma. Or I don't know that puts a lot of pressure on the retreat. Let's say getting closer to discovering it. In my journey in discovering it and what I've found. And this is through working with an amazing book called the Four Desires written by an amazing yoga teacher named Rod Stryker. He puts you through several writing exercises. In several different manners which pulls away sort of this layered thought of what dharma really is. And I think in Western wrapping we often think of dharma as your career, like your job. And if not that, maybe it's your family. And if not that, maybe it's something along those lines. And when I went through this, these exercises through this book and through working with Rod Stryker. I came upon what he calls your dharma code. And it takes several sort of drafts. And several pages of writing and crossing out and editing and writing and crossing out and editing. And I came upon one, and the person I was working with had me read it out loud. And as soon as I read it out loud. I looked and she looked at me. And she said, "Nope, that's not it." And my feelings were really hurt. And I was like what do you mean, this is it? And she asked me, "Were you editing yourself along the way when you were writing? Were you trying to steer the ship in a different direction? Were you editing along the way?" And I was like "No...yes." And I looked back at what I was writing and I was like totally I was. Because I thought I knew the answer already. And I wasn't leading myself into being vulnerable and open. So we tore it up. We started over again. Rewrote it all over again. And then at the end of this process. She said, "Okay, read it to me again." And the dharma code that I wrote was, "I share my story with the world without hesitation or doubt." And as soon as I said that I saw her face light up. And my face lit up. And she said, "Did you feel that?" And I was like, "I don't know what it was but I felt it." And it was just as soon as I read it, it was this surge of energy running through every cell in my body. You know an energy that we call alignment. And I was like oh, it totally redefined this idea of dharma for me. It's that I've always been a storyteller. As a musician, as a songwriter, as a yoga teacher or a workshop and a training facilitator. It's always been about a story. And sharing a story. And when this dharma code came about saying I share my story with the world without doubt or hesitation. It landed in a way that it didn't define me. In a way of putting boundaries around me. But it defined me in a way of lifting me up and giving myself permission to pursue these dreams with everything that I have. And that's the second teaching of the Bhagavad Gita which we said before. You know, the first teaching is find your dharma. Find why you were put here. Because you being in a body that is breathing and alive right now is nothing short of a miracle. And there's a reason for it. So step one is to find that. And then step number two is to pursue it with everything that you have. With absolutely every cell of your body. And in finding this dharma code. That little, short little sentence. It was, it felt like somebody put a match to my fuse. And all of a sudden just this rocket was about to go off. It felt unreal.

Maggie: Like you could almost get out of your own way.

Adam: Absolutely. Yes, absolutely. And I was in my way more than I wasn't. And I still am, right? It still happens where I'm just like tripping over myself. Because my mind and my chatter and my doubt gets in the way. But, you know, all it takes is that, those moments of daily meditation and coming back to that dharma code. Which is like, oh yeah. I get it now.

Maggie: That actually is a good segway to my other piece of the question. Because I'm interested in hearing you talk about the space in between where you went from being anxious by sitting with yourself and trying to meditate. And then to having such solace with meditation and really cherishing that time. How did you find that? Or how did that progression in your life happen?

[33:09]

Adam: Yeah, absolutely. For the first several years of my yoga practice, it was really predominantly a postural yoga practice. It was an Asana practice. And meditation was an off and on thing. You know, I would do meditation when I was in teacher training or when I was studying or when I was on a retreat with my teacher. And it was something that I always knew the benefit of. But never committed to a daily practice. And then several years ago, I made a trip to India during a pilgrimage called the Kumbh Mela. And the Kumbh Mela is every twelve years. It's this pilgrimage at the banks of the Ganges River. In a little town Allahabad. Not that little. But it is the biggest gathering of human beings in the planet. I think it's some 80 million people make the pilgrimage to what's known as the Sangam. And the Sangam is the confluence, the joining together of the Ganges River, the Jamuna River and the mystical Sarasvati River. And every twelve years, it's the alignment of the planets is said that that spot in the planet is the third eye of the planet. And every twelve years, the third eye opens. So if you are lucky enough to bathe yourself in the Ganges at this time. It's said it's so holy that your sins are forgiven, your children's sins are forgiven and your grandchildren's sins are forgiven. It was beautiful. It was amazing. It was one of those pilgrimages that words can't really capture. We were staying, our campgrounds for this pilgrimage was about a kilometer downriver from the actual Kumbh Mela. But there were millions and millions and millions of people in this festival ground, pilgrimage grounds and there were 24-hour chants happening. Fires burning. Just millions and millions of people. And that energy was just rolling down the Ganges. The smoke was rolling down the Ganges. You could hear the chants. And it just sounded, in the middle of the night you would wake up and you would just hear [...]. Of just these chants happening and the energy was palpable. It was amazing. And I was there with Rod Stryker and another great teacher. His teacher, Pandit Rajmani Tigunait. And it was there that I really found my meditation practice. We worked a lot with mantra. We worked a lot with different sort of meditation techniques. That finally just sang. You know, it felt like music to me. It felt like a song. And I think, you know, in the years prior when I was working in yoga and trying to find this meditation practice. I couldn't really find it because I didn't really have a teacher. Like I didn't have someone to teach me the technique. You know, it's like trying to do a handstand but you're just alone in your room. And you're just flinging yourself up and down. And there is nobody there to tell you the technique to get into it. Meditation was the same way. So I finally had found a teacher. I had found somebody to lead me into the technique and to guide me and to answer my questions and to relieve my doubt. And so for years after that, I was meditating in this japa mantra practice. Which is a repetition of a mantra. And it's the practice that I've relied on heavily throughout these last several years. And then when I was in Australia I met another amazing yoga teacher, meditation teacher. And his name is Jonni Pollard. And his organization is called One Giant Mind. And his manner and his way of speaking about meditation and teaching mediation is profound in it's simplicity. What he is doing now is he working to strip away all of the pretenses, all of the structure on meditation. That for a lot of people can seem really daunting and really intimidating. And his technique is so simple but it's so refined. So I've started studying with him. And I'm actually right now moving through his teacher training to become a certified meditation teacher in One Giant Mind. And it's this very simple mantra. It's this very simple beautiful process. That you just sit down for twenty minutes twice a day. And right now, that's the practice for me that's having the most profound effects. You know, I will always be a fan of postural yoga. I will always be a fan of moving my body and finding freedom through that movement. But right now, in this sort of journey through the meditation practice which is now spanning a couple decades. Meditation is where I find the clarity, the peace, and the reconnection to myself that I'm so often missing. And in trying to teach others now. In my teacher trainings and in the retreats, the skill and the craft of meditation. It really is learning a new practice and it's creating and cultivating these new habits. But without fail if I can get one of my students to sit down for 30 days straight of meditation, then they're in it. They're in it for life. Because within those 30 days they have noticed such a profound shift in their connection to joy, in their calmness, in their balance, in just their way of being. The way that Jonni Pollack often says it, "You know those points in your life where, you find yourself just happy for no reason. Like you're sitting and watching a sunset. Or you're walking your dog. Or something beautiful happens and just this like really gentle wave of contentment and happiness sort of waves over you, washes over you." He says that's your natural way of being, right? That should not be an anomaly. That should be your regular state of being. And connecting to a meditation practice lets you access that state of being with such ease. And it's been a practice that has saved me several times. And like I've said, I love Asana and I love moving my body and I love sweating. But for me now, the postural yoga practice and the meditation practice are two sides of the same coin that I don't really want to live without either of them.

[40:34]

Maggie: So the last question which you sort of touched on. And I think maybe it wraps up a lot of the things that we're talking about of kind of getting out of your own way. Or being able to sit to really know where you want to go and where you can live out your duty or your dharma. Maybe that kind of comes up in this question of what's a big goal that you see for the future, that you want and why do you want it? Or how do you plan on getting there?

[41:01]

Adam: Yeah. About a year ago. Or it's been a little bit more now. A year and a half to two years ago. I had a pretty catastrophic injury. My L4/L5 disc blew and the extruded disc actually wrapped around one of my spinal nerves. And I lost function of my left leg and I lost feeling in my left leg. And coming from a state of yoga aware and movement where I really define myself as a mover. As a postural yoga practitioner. To have that taken away from me was heartbreaking. I mean the pain was excruciating. But it also forced me to redefine where I stand as a teacher in this practice. And after the surgery. And after the rehab. And reintroducing my body into this movement practice was so enlightening. One in terms of what my body was capable of doing. Or more accurately what it's no longer capable of doing. How to be okay with that. But also looking back over the past ten years of moving my body in Asana and being able to see really clearly with. Hindsight is 20/20. Being able to see really clearly the movements that I shouldn't have been doing. The transitions that I shouldn't have been doing. The fighting my body to try to get deeper mobility. To try to get a deeper forward fold. To try to get the legs behind my head. That, you know, in hindsight really was just ego. It was really me just fighting to prove something that was really pointless in the first place. And what I find now that I'm back on the mat, back in my practice. Is that I'm still so inspired by the movement. I'm still so inspired by the Asana. And it is an exploration and it is a joy to find new ways to move. It's an art. It's just like music. It's like songwriting. It's creating a sequence and moving your body through the sequence. It's dance. It's songwriting. It's poetry. But what I've found is that there needs to be science behind the art. There needs to be knowledge behind the art. And in all bluntness and in all openness. I think that is lacking, that knowledge is lacking. Especially in the new yoga teachers around today. Which we were all there. I was a new yoga teacher. And I was just sort of making it up as I went along. But one of my goals now is to. Number one always keep refining the way that I teach. And to keep building my knowledge base so that my knowledge of anatomy, of the biomechanics of the body, of how bodies are supposed to move and how to keep people safe is always growing. But now on top of that. Now that I've become. I've been teaching teachers how to teach. My goal is to educate yoga teachers in how to keep people safe. In how to try to in as many instances as possible avoid the injuries that we all get so often. I mean, yoga is movement and in movement, there is inherent risk. Right, there is inherent risk in hamstring pulls or wrist injuries or shoulder injuries. Like it's going to happen. And, you know, if you compare yoga to American football the risk level is quite low. But what I see is that the level of injuries in this practice is much higher than it should be. And it's much higher than it should be because I think there are inherent flaws in the structure of how we train and certify teachers. Which is a really long conversation probably for another day. But I think it's really important to, number one allow the people who are so passionate about yoga and who really want to teach the yoga to allow them to teach. But I want to in my trainings guide them to teach in a way that is knowledgeable and educated and is capable of moving people through their practice in a safe and empowering way. So in creating my 200-hour program and in 2019 unveiling my advanced 300-hour program. That's really the goal of it. Number one, get people meditating. And as always learn about the philosophy, the vedas, the mantra, learn about the heart of the yoga. But at the same time heavily immerse them in anatomy, in functional anatomy, in alignment. In getting people to understand what safe movements are. What aren't safe movements. What transitions we shouldn't be combining. And how we can continue to watch this beautiful methodology of yoga grow in the amazing expansive way that it has been growing. But to ensure that it's growing in a mindful and responsible way.

Maggie: So Adam, how can people find you and listen to you through your new cd? And keep up with where you are and where you're going?

Adam: Yeah. So the website is adamwhitingyoga.com and everything on social media. Well, Instagram and Facebook is Adam Whiting Yoga as well. So Adam Whiting Yoga and you can find me anywhere. And the new cd is hopefully coming out sometime in 2019. Fingers crossed. I'm really excited about that. But the partners that I'm working at are touring musicians in Australia. So we have just a little bit to go. So hopefully the stars will align and we'll be able to get that sooner rather than later.

Maggie: Thank you so much for joining me on this podcast, We Got Goals. And it was an honor to have you.

Adam: The pleasure was all mine. Thanks so much.

Cindy: He goal-getters. It's Cindy Kuzma. Just checking in to let you know that we're about to play another goal from one of you, our listeners! If you would like to be featured on an upcoming episode of We Got Goals here on A Sweat Life. You can record a voice memo with a goal you've set, a goal you've achieved, just maybe your dharma, your purpose. Whatever you want to tell us about that's related to goals. Record that, send it to Cindy@aSweatLife.com. And we could feature you on an upcoming episode. Thanks for listening and here is one of your goals.

Britney: I am Britney and I am from Southern Indiana. One goal getting strategy that's worked very well for me is keeping my goals to myself. Which is a little different then what some people do. But I've found that it helps me because it helps me make more attainable goals rather than goals I share on social media that maybe are a little more grandious then they should be or aren't quite as fleshed out as they should be. You know, we're in the age where we want to share everything with everyone on social media. And sometimes in my experience, it's worked best for me to just keep it between me and myself. A really good example was when I was finding my new job. I kept it kind of vague when I talked to people about it. And I just said you know I'm hunting. And I wrote down everything I wanted out of my job. I wanted very specific benefits and I wanted a very specific atmosphere and culture. And I just kind of went after it and found it. And it was nice because I wasn't cluttering it with other people's kind of input. And it was just me and my goal.

[50:00]

Cindy: This podcast is asweatlife.com production and it’s another thing that’s better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts including on Spotify. And while you’re there if you could leave us a rating or a review we would be so grateful. Special thanks to Jay Mono, for our theme music, to our guest this week, Adam Whiting, to TechNexus for the recording studio, and to Kathy Lai for editing. And of course to you, our listeners.

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Triathlete and coach Sharone Aharon faced some obstacles en route to completing his first Ironman.

First of all, he’d never done any type of multisport event. He didn’t own a bike. His longest run was about 20 minutes, done as part of his training for the Israeli Secret Service. The first time he got into the pool, he swam 200 yards—then went to the locker room and threw up.

Still, 10 months later, he finished the 2.4-mile swim, 112-mile bike, and full 26.2-mile marathon at Ironman KONA.

As Aharon explained to me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, getting there required a combination of confidence and naïveté.

“I didn’t have a doubt in my mind that I would make it,” he says. “Look at little kids—when they fall down, they don’t think, ‘OK, I will not ever try again.’ I think that’s what happened. I was this little kid who found a toy and dedicated his entire being to that.”

Plenty of challenges—he calls them “mosquitos,” because they sting but aren’t serious—popped up along the way. Still, so many things fell into place. He immediately got a sponsor, a client who supported his goals despite his lack of a track record. Even the fact that he was able to get into Kona in the first place was unusual and remarkable, he notes.

All this validated what seemed like an out-of-the blue decision at the time—but eventually led to to an entirely new career. “It just came up from within, from the core of my being,” he says. “I can’t explain it.”

“But at this point, it’s part of the way I coach my athletes, how to really engage with their emotions and their goals, and how to combine them together to produce great training and great racing.”

Over the 20 years since that first race, Aharon’s helped thousands of athletes achieve similar ambitious goals through Well-Fit, a triathlon training program he launched in 1998. In 2009, he built a bricks-and-mortar facility. There, at 1700 W. Hubbard St., athletes can strength train (alone or in group classes), swim in Endless Pools, ride bike trainers, and run on treadmills as they train for marathons, triathlons, and other endurance events.

“We took an individual sport and we made it a team sport, and we do that at Well-Fit all the time,” he says. “We have a team of people all competing individually, but because they work together, they actually achieve greater success.”

Well-Fit does have an elite team, members of which tend to finish races on the podium. But you don’t have to be an experienced athlete to take advantage of all the facility offers, Aharon says. You just need a dedication and a willingness to invest in yourself.

At first, “the notion was that Well-Fit is only for fast people. So I said, no … we are making people fast. That’s what we can do. What we realized is that people who come here and get the most benefit are people who care about their results,” he says.

How do you go from merely aspiring toward better performances to making them happen? In our chat, Aharon spills a few clues:

• Don’t skip the tough stuff. Endurance athletes often think long, slow distance will get them through a race. But the top performers stay in touch with high-intensity efforts and serious strength training, too. “We do need to use those high-end muscle fibers and energy systems,” he says. Also, don’t shy away from obstacles like wind or rain during training. Unless it’s truly dangerous to be outside, embracing the elements will only prepare you for what you may face on race day.
• “Surrender to the training plan,” he says. But don’t make it a cookie-cutter one; if you can, invest in a personalized plan and a coach who knows your life, then put your trust in that system. Don’t overthink your strategy or your workouts—just show up and do them. That said, a coach can help you fine-tune if your life starts to go haywire. During times of personal or professional stress, adjusting your plan to do less may be the best way to perform well without breaking down your body, he notes.
• Embrace cutting-edge technology. Novel methods and elements keep you mentally and physically engaged. Well-Fit has a brand-new bike room, complete with individual touch screens. Athletes can tap into group classes, choose from hundreds of pre-programmed workouts, or even just stream Netflix. And in a super-cool development, they’ve installed one of the few altitude rooms in the country, which simulates what it’s like to train in the thin mountain air. Athletes who log just one to two high-intensity sessions there per week have been winning races, setting personal bests, and recovering more quickly so they can do it all over again, he notes. “You train less, and you gain more. Who doesn’t want that?” he says.

In fact, Aharon’s next goal—besides carving out more time for his own training—is to make his style of altitude training more widespread and accessible everywhere. Seeing others’ success on the program only fuels him to reach higher in business and in the sport.

Listen to Sharone Aharon’s episode of the #WeGotGoals podcast for more tidbits on performing your best, and check out the Well-Fit website for more about altitude training options—and all of the group’s other plans and perks.

You can listen anywhere you get your podcasts (including Spotify!). If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating or a review. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

[0:00]

Jeana: Welcome to We Got Goals, a podcast by asweatlife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen with me I have Kristen Geil and Cindy Kuzma.

Kristen: Good morning Jeana.

Cindy: Good morning Jeana.

Jeana: Good morning. Cindy this week you spoke with Sharone Aharon, right?

Cindy: I did, Sharone is a triathlete, a coach and the owner of Well Fit Performance. Which is a pretty sweet triathlon performance here in Chicago. It's been around a long time. He's seen countless athletes achieve their goals and he's achieved some pretty cool goals himself. So it's great to talk with him.

Kristen: And Cindy you talked to him about the first time he completed an Iron Man. And it sounds like he went in with a level of blissful ignorance, maybe not quite knowing what he was getting himself into. How did that work out for him?

Cindy: Well, it actually worked out pretty well. In fact, he thinks that is one of the secrets of his success. He had been in this really secret service which is super fascinating and then he was a personal trainer for a while. He was kind of getting bored and not really sure what direction he was going to go next. So he just decided one day that he was going to train for an Iron Man. He didn't really know how to do it. But he just had this childlike approach to having fun and being excited about the training. Of course then he did some planning and got a little bit more serious about some of the hard work he was going to have to do along the way. But he really thinks that that ability to not even contemplate failure helped him achieve success. He went on to finish that first Iron Man and many more since. And then to build a whole incredible career around the sport today.

Jeana: And today he's helping take athletes to new heights in one way or another, right Cindy?

Cindy: That's also true. He has kind of taken that same approach. We talked a lot about kind of the ways, the secrets to success for all endurance athletes. And he really does think it's a combination of committing to a goal and also maintaining some of that childlike excitement and wonder. And you can see that in the way that he runs his business. He's focused, he's serious, he's intense, he has a goal but he also wants to do new things that are fun and exciting for both him and the athletes he coaches. So one of the exciting and fun things that he's done is put in an altitude room in Well Fit. I got a chance to try it out. It was a pretty cool experience basically you go in there and you work really hard for a really short period of time. And if you swap out a couple of your hard workouts on flat land for a couple workouts in that room when you're training for a triathlon or marathon, Sharone really thinks that you could do some pretty incredible things to achieve your goals. So it's kind of a cool option for athletes here in the Chicago area. And it was interesting to hear him talk about how he not only wants to use it to help athletes here. It's part of his goal to kind of share this with athletes across the country and really kind of get this idea into the sport.

Jeana: It's like moving to Colorado but not actually having to.

Cindy: Right, exactly. Although there are mountains painted on the wall so if you narrow your focus a little bit you can pretend.

Kristen: Cindy, it sounds like he enjoys coaching not just the elite athletes at the marathon and the triathlon level but anyone who's interested in investing in themselves and in improving. How does he approach training people who are maybe not at the elite level but still want to make a difference in their training.

Cindy: Yeah, I would say that he kind of treats everyone the same. Which is, you know, if you are committed to your goal and you really want to improve and invest in yourself. He's going to help you get to where you want to be. And it doesn't matter if you are on they have a Well Fit elite team and you could be a really incredible athlete on that team. Or you could be walking into Well Fit wanting to do your first triathlon. And he supports everyone kind of the same way. As long as you take yourself seriously and take your training seriously and commit to it. He's going to take a holistic approach to help you reach your goals. And my sense from my interactions with him is that if you are coached by him you're going to work hard. But you're also going to feel like you have a community there to support you and you're going to have fun while you do it. So that's really, he views all of those as important elements to success.

Jeana: That's incredible Cindy, I can't wait to hear your full interview with Sharone. Hey goal-getters, don't go anywhere. If you stick around to the end of the episode you'll hear from people just like you out there achieving their goals. And here's Cindy with Sharone.

[4:53]

Cindy: This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here on the We Got Goals podcast with Sharone Aharon of Well Fit. And Sharone, thank you so much for joining us on the We Got Goals podcast today.

Sharone: Oh, it's my pleasure. Thank you very much for inviting me.

Cindy: So if we have listeners who are triathletes or other endurance athletes here in the Chicago area they probably know of Well Fit. You've been here, you've been around a long time. But for those of our listeners in other places or who don't know about it, tell me a little bit about where we are, where we're sitting today. And who comes here.

Sharone: Okay. So we have been operating since '98, it started as a small venture for me trying to make a little bit of income while racing myself. Iron Man races. My sponsor decided that I'm too old to be a sponsored athlete. And they said I should go find a job. I decided to open the Well Fit training services and basically started to works with endurance athletes. Mainly at the quality workouts, we didn't really do let's go run on the lakefront in two rows and support each other this way. But we were focusing more on the bike on trainers, we started that program in '99. And run interval programs on the track which was back in, I believe it was 2000. And then swim technique level 1, 2, and 3 back in 2003. And then in 2009, we decided to open the Well Fit training center. Which was a one stop shop. Most likely the first one in the country for endurance athletes with [...] trainers, endless pool, gym floor. And recently we upgraded all that and added an altitude training facility.

Cindy: Yeah, I'm really interested to talk with you about that at some point. And how that's helping athletes achieve their goals. But, you know, I can't imagine how many athletes you've helped over those years. So I know you have an incredible perspective on how they've achieved their goals. But we're here today to talk some about your goals too. So let's just go ahead and start with the first big question that we ask everyone on We Got Goals which is, Sharone, what is a goal you've achieved, why was it important to you and how did you get there.

Sharone: So definitely the first Iron Man race that I've done. It was back in '98. Actually '96 I graduated from, did my masters degree in physiology. I quit my last job, a position at the Israeli secret service and then kind of was underpaid personal trainer. And decided I got to do something different. One day I woke up and I said I'm going to do the Iron Man. It's funny because I didn't really think about it much. It wasn't like oh, [...] place or anything like that. It was literally over a weekend, I thought what do I want to do. You know, I had a bunch of triathlete magazines in my apartment. Back then it was like 12 pages. You know, that's about it. And I said yeah, that's what I want to do. And probably 10 months later I was in Kona racing day. The only Iron Man those days in Hawaii. Which was amazing, unbelievable. But I can't say, I can not say that I sat down and really thought about, you know, where do I go and what do I do. And how I want my life to be and my career. It just came out from within. From the core of my being. It just popped out. I guess it was sitting there for a while. And I just didn't pay attention. And one day, boom it came out and it was like probably the best move of my life. And we're twenty years later now from my first Iron Man. And I've done so much within the sport and within the community. It just was an amazing result.

Cindy: Wow, so ten months basically from when you decided this is what I'm going to do to there you are in Kona. What did that look like? I mean, if you didn't really think through logically step-by-step. How did you go about making it happen?

Sharone: So, the first thing I did is I said was "Okay, I'm going to do this." The next day I went to the pool and swan 200 yards and threw up for a half an hour in the locker room.

Cindy: No.

[8:52]

Sharone: That's a real story. I didn't own a bike and 20 minutes was my long run. Back in the secret service we were supposed to run 2k in 13 minutes. So we thought if you run for 20 minutes that's long enough. And this is where I started. I had the physiology background. I used to work at the Israeli Olympic training center and that was my schooling about. And I sat down and wrote, I think it took me 3 weeks to write a year long training program that will take me through several peaks in the season. And it's all based on a one-pager I found online. You know those days where you click on an address online and then you go to work and at 8:00 at night it finally pops up because it's so slow. That's exactly what happened. And this is how it all started. And there was few obstacles in the way. Not necessarily obstacles but I call it mosquitoes. They bite you and you pay attention to them and then you just forget about them and keep going. But the funny thing is that I didn't have a doubt in my mouth that I wouldn't make it. I was that naive but I think that's what created the success. It was unbelievable.

Cindy: Okay, so where do you think that confidence came from? Maybe naivety as you say but it must have originated somewhere.

Sharone: I think sometimes, we look at little kids. When they fall down, they don't think okay, I'll not ever try again. You know, I think that's what happened. I was this little kid who used to find the toy and dedicated his entire being to do that. Tell you a little story, three months later there was a seminar produced by I think it was Fleet Feet. Six hours with Mark Ellen who won Hawaii six times after seven times he tried. And he was trying to promote that the Sydney Olympics and a camp to do the actual course a day before the race. And I came to him at the end of the seminar and I said, "Hi Mark. My name is Sharone and I'd like to do the Iron Man." He said, "Great, how many years are you training?" I said, "We'll I haven't really started." And he said well maybe you want to start on the shorter ones and then go to the Olympic and then maybe the half Iron Man and then maybe three years down the road do the Iron Man. I said okay. Then the next question was I would like to have a sponsor. How do I find a sponsor? He started laughing and said "Listen, why don't you start training, get good, win some local races, some regional races, get an agent and he'll find you a sponsor." I said, "okay." The next day I had a sponsor. A full board sponsor that every [...] today will like it. Not because I was so good. I was not. But I told this story to one of my clients, and they said okay we'll sponsor you. Just like that. And I don't know what it is. I didn't even have to convince my client. Just tell the story. And things just got into place along with the entire year. It was just, I can't explain it. We would need more than just this podcast to deal with that.

Cindy: I know, right.

Sharone: At this point, I mean it's part of the way I coach my athletes of how to really engage with their emotions and how to really engage with their goals and how to combine the two together to produce great training and great racing.

Cindy: So for you it sounds like it really started with that passion and excitement. And that belief in yourself.

Sharone: Absolutely. I don't know if I had to say, okay I'm believing in myself. It just was natural. It was sitting there and it was again as I said before. I didn't think it would go a different way. And one day I got a phone call, alright you're coming. But that's a totally different story about how I got it and what happened after that. So it was fantastic.

Cindy: Okay, well we can go into that story or I don't know. Tell me about some of the other mosquitoes that might have come up along the way and how you overcame them.

[13:04]

Sharone: You know, I'd been carrying two surgeries with my knees. And I was thinking I don't know how that's going to go. You know, I always ran with some kind of a brace on my knee. But then I decided okay, I'm in a training program. I know that with my profession you need to do swim, bike, runs, strength training. Nutrition is important. So I started incorporating basic strength training exercises into my plan three times a week. I never had to use a brace in my training since '98. Before that I had to run with a brace. So strength training just by doing it and nothing complicated. Today, we have so many different exercises and systems and the core like this and the core like that. Basic strength and conditioning program and it was phenomenal. That took care of my knee problems. You know, one of the races. I think the earlier races, I think it was second year. All of the new equipment come about. We used to race with speedos. I mean we didn't have all this fantastic gear. Wetsuits usually something that we borrowed from surfing. And not necessarily for. But in any event, you go into a race and I think it was in Saint Anthony in Florida. And all of a sudden you have a flat, but it's actually not a flat. You don't have a hole there but the extender of your wheel fell out and took the valve with it. But I forgot to put an extender on the replacement tire. So now, I have a replacement tire but I don't have an extender so there's no way to pump the tire. So here I am walking my bike back to transition and I remember my wife's face was like why are you walking. So this is something. So you learn over the time and I think a lot of the things we did back then. We created our equipment rather than bought our equipment. Because you need to be very creative about how to put stuff on the bike and you know how to carry extra nutrition. My coach was one of the best coaches in the country, Brock Fry. He coached his wife, Heather [...] who won in '98. And then he coached Peter Reed for a few years as well. And he once told me if you want to carry a lot of calories but not a lot of bottles, what you do is, you make a gel. You add more of the powder into your bottle. Said okay, I'll make a gel. So here I am making my gel and the whole day, it was 4.5 hour bike ride. My stomach is just killing me, I just don't understand what's going on. And that evening we had a phone call and he says to me, so what did you with your nutritious. I said, oh I made a gel but it really didn't sit well in my stomach. He says, what kind of a bottle did you use. I said I used a small bottle. And how many scoops did you put in? I said fifteen. He yelled from the other side of the line. My wife was in the kitchen and she heard him yelling 15! It was so funny. So this is another thing. So again you learn. Trips to Kona are phenomenal because they teach you to love wind. Up until that point I was going on lakefront. As a matter of fact, my longest ride was on the lakefront I went up and down three times.

Cindy: That's a pretty long ride.

Sharone: Right. And today we have other [...]. So that was an interesting day. But I was always trying to avoid the wind. And after my first trip to Kona you realize it's all wind. So that day I made the decision to fall in love with the wind. And just go against it as much as I could. And it's made a huge difference.

Cindy: That's is actually an interesting point and I bet that comes up a lot with the athletes that you coach, right? You might have this goal and then you're training to reach that goal. And when you're training sometimes you make a choice that makes things a little bit more comfortable or easier in that moment but maybe that doesn't quite prepare you as well for what you're going to actually face.

Sharone: Absolutely, and I think that's another thing. Talking about the being a kid personality. Go try whatever you feel, right. And sometimes, my daughter when she was in kindergarten, every time they needed to put the toys away she would run to the bathroom. You know, it's like very convenient. So, I think that's the approach I took with the wind going into this whole Chicago wind scenario. I think the more you change to rain, change weather condition, you learn a lot more. And then one of the elements that we really work hard on is really learning the races. What is the race look like, what the conditions are, what other conditions you might encounter. Maybe not, they weren't their last year. So for example, we always plan for hot weather and cold weather. You know, because that can change. I mean we had Iron Man Wisconsin, 55 and rainy and we had Iron Man Wisconsin at 95. So you have to prepare and that can change. I mean think about the marathon this year in Boston, a couple years earlier too. It was freezing cold. And this is one of the elements we really work on how to prepare for that. And we do go out in those conditions. I have a statement, I borrowed that from Hebrew, something we use in Israel. You're not made out of sugar. You've got to go out there and do it. If it's dangerous, yes of course back up. But if it's rainy, there's no reason not to train. You know, especially not in the summer here in Chicago.

Cindy: Well it's interesting too because it does take that combination of both the passion and the energy and the excitement of the child plus like the logical grown up planning brain too, right? And I imagine you put those both together when you have athletes training.

[18:51]

Sharone: Of course. So the planning part really goes with systematic planning. I mean this is what we do with everyone. There are certain volumes that we have to hit at certain time during the season. And certain time you just reduce the volume to almost none. And focus on race pace or high intensity stuff. I think as endurance athletes we don't do enough of high intensity and we lose that element. Although high intensity intervals. I dare say cross-fit style training will work really well for us. Because we do need to use those high end muscle fibers or energy systems. My story, I used to play basketball and soccer because I really loved running after the ball. And my first year in Iron Man, I basically did times that it was hard for me to break until my third year. Again, because I came into the sport with fitness that no endurance athlete has which is the basketball fitness, the stop-and-go fitness, which is all your joint basically. And the high end energy system which you do in basketball and soccer and don't really touch in endurance sport. So I had no problem running PR every half marathon I did within a half Iron Man. Which was faster than my only half marathon times. But then you lose that and it took me, I had to spend another two years to gain that back. So just to say how important that high-end exercise and how team sports conditioning could benefit endurance athletes. And we're afraid to touch on it because it's not in the protocol. I actually talked to one of the more known coaches, run coaches in the city. And I talked to them about a certain training method. We're runners, we're not doing that. And that's I think sometimes where the problem is. When you're so tight into that modalities that you really don't gain that extra edge, I would say. That maybe have you PR'd. And we can talk about that maybe later.

Cindy: Yeah, right.

Sharone: About people PRing with different modalities.

Cindy: Right, you get really focused on what you're doing. So for you though, how did that feel? And when you kind of started in the sport and you were doing really well because you had that fitness background. And then you realized okay, wait. And it took longer to get back to that point. How did that feel? And how did you manage that?

Sharone: I think the second year of Iron Man racing was really. It wasn't devastating but I was really surprised with what happened. I had more experience, I trained more. I probably trained smarter when it comes to endurance sport. But I lost that high-end fitness. And I was frustrated and I didn't know what was going on. And then, you know, I said let's go back to and analyze what was happening. And then I start to add some stuff. So I start to add playing soccer in the off season. So I gained that fitness in the off season. As long as you don't get injured. You know, you're fine. You know, during a lot of work with a basketball. You're a lot of change in direction, not necessarily playing because that's really hard on your body. Especially as you get older, you know. But I start to incorporate those things into my plan. Not necessarily on a weekly basis. I added a lot more variety into my track workouts. A lot more variety into my bike workouts. That are not necessarily the template of the regular endurance sport. You know swim, bike and run.

Cindy: So, I mean this does lead into another question I was going to ask you. Which was, you've worked with so many endurance athletes through the years. What do you see as some of the most common obstacles to endurance athletes achieving their goals. And it sounds like maybe one of them is kind of a narrow mindset or not being open to these other modalities and other ideas that might benefit them in their sport.

[23:07]

Sharone: I think if they start here then they're already used to it. And I think in trying to draw them in and see that for someone who has experience. And they said well if I hit these three elements, goals in swim, bike and run then I'm set. And I don't think that's usually the case. It's much harder to get them into looking at something different. And it's the same thing with the coaches. Coaches work in a certain way and they have a certain level of success. Sometimes you need to add something else into the element. For example, the first thing is strength training. More conventional. Not just working on the core and the stability. And I think this is like all of a sudden strength training because core and stability. Which is important but what about strength. Absolute strength. You know, doing a squat. You know, year round. Things like that. So again, going back if it's our athletes it's not so hard. The other element is that people need to surrender to the training plan, I call it. Not to overthink it. And sometimes just go do it. While doing it you have to be present and really absorb what you're doing. But you have to surrender to it. Many times, and that's one of the things that we did really well is that we took an individual sport and we made it a team sport. And we do it at Well Fit all the time. We have a team of people that all compete individually but because they work together rather than lonely at their basement. They actually achieve greater success. Everybody pushes each other. Everybody supports each other. One of the elements with these people is how to reduce the competitiveness during training and really focus on what you do and who you are. Get the support from your fellow athletes without mentally get devastated when this guy is so much faster than you are on the track. But you're faster than him in the swimming pool. Or things like that. The other element is how lifestyle, how your life gets in the way of your sport. And I'm sure a lot of athletes can relate to that. This morning I sat down with an athlete, phenomenal athlete. And she's preparing for the 70.3 World Championship in South Africa in a few weeks. And also life going sideways and everything is overwhelming. Everything, work and training. So we sat down and we just started to move things around. And fix and even let go of some of the workouts. You know what, you don't need that. Let's just focus on these elements and do that. And sometimes the athlete gets up from their seat and says wow. That's really helpful. And sometimes, I don't know if I'm going to be ready if we're going to do all that change, you know. I mean this is the kind of program, course we set up. Now I'm starting to take stuff out and that can be very demotivating for them. So.

Cindy: But I do think that, that's so huge. And you see athletes struggle with that for sure. That you know, you're body is one system and it can absorb only so much stress from any source. Whether it's your training or your life. And that is where having a coach and as you say, kind of surrendering to the process or trusting in that individual to guide you through that and adjust. That's where that's really important, right? I'd imagine that's something that the athletes here really benefit from.

Sharone: Right, and here's the thing. Going into some of the things, there's a huge trend right now of online coaching. And I think that will work only if there's a conversation. Not an email, a conversation. In my mind, a conversation between the athlete and the coach on a regular basis. Or/and seeing the athlete. And that's why I love the training facility because so many of the athletes that we coach actually are coming and training here. So even if I don't coach them per-say on every individual workout. I get to see them. I see how they look. I don't even have to talk to them. I see how they look, I see how they walk, I see how they interact. And I definitely see how their data looks like and I can that's a lot more. Many more tools that I can use in order to coach the athletes. We try to do send and forget kind of programs. I just don't believe in it. It's not that people can not. I think experienced athletes can do that, highly motivated athletes can do that. I just don't think that this is good for the beginner athletes. To have a program somewhere online and have an email every now and then. I think there's got to be more interaction to coach somebody. It's an active, not a passive event. And I think this is where the facility comes from. The other element of what we did here is secured a community. A family. We [...] changes forever. Once a Well Fitter always a Well Fitter. Whether you like it or not.

Cindy: Yeah. That's great. Well no, I know that's such a huge element. As you say, it can be all three of these sports and any endurance sport can be a lonely endeavor if you're out there training for yourself, by yourself. So it is great to have that support system. For sure. So, you know, when I came here and visited you a couple weeks ago. We were chatting then too and you talked a little bit about the kind of athlete that might be a good fit to be coached by you. And the kind of athlete that makes a good Well Fit athlete. Tell me a little bit about what you're kind of looking for or what makes a good fit for someone here. Like could anyone come here and have success or are their certain qualities that make this a better kind of a facility for some people than others.

[28:55]

Sharone: So it's funny, many. Back I think in 2007, we created the first elite training program. It was the first of a kind in the country and what we did is we saw a lot of programs for beginners. Where you train together and you get the support, you get the coach. But there was no training program for elite athletes, people that already performed really well. I worked with the US triathlon program, initial program for a few years. And I realized that if we compare ourselves to the European. European has a huge pipeline because everything there is club teams. In the US we didn't have club teams. And the recruitment for the training program was through the universities. And usually if you're a great swimmer but not qualifying for the Olympic and you can maybe run, then we'll make you a triathlete. That was kind of the agenda. So I created the first elite training program here in Chicago. And that kind of gave us a bad name. Because here we are coming with the elite program. Which the name was Well Fit Elite which was another bad problem. Because they associate that with, you know, the other things that we do. And we're going to a race and all of a sudden Well Fit Elite take the podium for every age group. And the notion was Well Fit was only for fast people. So I said no, no, no. We are making people fast. That's what we can do. What we realized is that people that come here and get the most benefit are people that care about their results. If you just want to do one triathlon, we can help you. If you want to get the full benefit is you need to care about your performance. I think this is when you're going to get the most when you come here. Many, many times we heard that we charge too little because of how we deliver the program and what the level of the coach is. Not to say that other programs aren't good. There's definitely a fit for everything. And the more program we have the better it is for the industry. If you care about your results, you want to improve. Whether you just started or you're already this is the place for you. We always think about, what is the cutting edge training routine that will get you there. We started [...] about training on bike trainers back in '99. We did track workouts before, I believe, any other marathon program back in the early 2000s. We opened a facility before anybody else for endurance sport that encompass all of the element. That's the way I think. And then we created the community. And it's not that simple. And go back to goals, that was not necessarily my goal but that was my passion. And it become what it is today. People tell me look what you've created. I say what are you talking about. To me it just is.

Cindy: Yeah. It's the building years. So you have the strength training facility here. You have the bike trainers, new bike trainers, right. Brand new Bikram. You have all of the training programs. So triathlon programs, elite and non right. And marathon training programs too. And then the altitude room. So tell me more about that and how that is helping athletes achieve their goals.

[32:22]

Sharone: So it's interesting, I was bored. Truly, we've been doing it for almost 20 years. And I was like okay, there's a lot of people that do that now. There's a lot of coaches and there's a lot of people with studios. And I had to do something a little different that would excite me and maybe benefit the athletes. And what we did, we updated the bike room. So now we probably have the most sophisticated bike room in the country. Where everyone has their own personal screen. Touch screen with their own programming. So they can tap into our entire, probably more than 400 workouts. And do it themselves. They can create a pool workouts that their coach give them. Whether they're a Well Fit coach or not a Well Fit coach. But then if they're bored and they want to do the group workout they press a button and they go into the system. And they see everybody around. And it's all on their private screen. And if they want to watch Netflix while they're working out they can do that too on the screen. So that was the upgrade. We took another 2,000 square foot and we put it in there. The next thing was I needed to do a game changer. And for many years, since the mid 2000s, I was thinking there was more to altitude then just going up in the mountains and training. So I did a little bit of investigation and I realized that Australia has 16 altitude training centers. England has six. US had 5. I've been to 3 and only 1 of them does something with it. So I decided that's it. And we opened the altitude training center. There's such enormous benefit to training at altitude, at high intensity. If I say one sentence about it, you train less and you gain more. I mean who doesn't want that. And since February we had many athletes train there. They are crashing their PRs on a regular basis. They're winning. They're going to a race, do an Iron Man and then a week later PR the half marathon. It's just unbelievable. I'm a little bit, oh my god. What's it, what's in the air, you know. There's a lot of science behind it. There's a lot of research behind it. And like anything else that is so great. Like for example strength training. Back in the '70s the conclusion was that strength training does not help swimmers and runners because it interferes with their coordination. Now we can't even think about doing any kind of sport without strength training. Same thing happened with altitude training, similar to altitude training. Up until I believe 2006 was the first breakthrough research. [...] the only way you can benefit is to go in the mountains. I mean, the answer I was getting from people was yeah, live high, train low. The funny thing about this is there was only one research back in '95 that proved that in Salt Lake City. It's still the gold standard. But how many people can actually do that? And we brought it to the everyday person. We brought the altitude into the everyday person. And we have workouts that are as long as 25 minutes or about an hour. We have nothing over an hour. You don't need to be there over an hour. If you actually do something over an hour in there, chances are you're not going to get as much benefit. So I'm excited as you can see. Right, so the recommend that depending on how much time you have. If you have limited time, we tell you need to be there twice a week high intensity workout. Replace the high intensity workout you have on your program right now. Don't add it to it. And then do it about, up to about a week before your race. The benefits last for about 2 to 4 weeks depending on, you know, who you are. And look at the benefits a little by doing a maintenance program. But the people, some of the people we coach here have been in the room twice a week since February. And let's just say this if you're at more than 4 weeks, go for 1 to more than 4 weeks. Just be there, use it as part of your plan. The biggest market that we're are actually getting into is mountaineers. We are getting a lot of people are going to Kilimanjaro. People that go to any kind of mountain around the world. Whether it's a big hike or a technical climb. They come here and we have a testing protocol for them. And we have a training protocol for them. Or they're just, I just want to do my own thing in the room.

Cindy: Yeah, one of our co-hosts on this podcast, Kristen Geil, climbed Kilimanjaro last year. And I think she found out about the altitude room right before she was going to leave. So she's like, ahh, I didn't have time but she would have loved to incorporate that. Well that's great for those athletes and I would imagine too. I mean when I think about it, you know, with my training. I've been marathon training for years now. Even just the idea of having something new and exciting like that is appealing, right? And something that gives you an extra edge. So I would imagine that does feed back into your goal of engaging people's emotions and passions a little bit too. How does that kind of fit together? You know, using that new technology does it help with emotions in that way.

[37:42]

Sharone: Absolutely, I think one of the things about this trending routine because it's such high intensity intervals. That's what we want to do. We want to trigger the high-end of your fitness in altitude so you actually get two workouts in one. And it's definitely bringing something new into the endurance sport. The endurance sport you have to have your pace. You have to make sure it's tempo and tempo, and 5k is 5k, and 10k is 10k. And here we bring you into a room and says no you're going to run at 5% elevation for 30 seconds as fast as you can. It's not a 5k, it's not a 10k. You're going to get on that bike and you press that lever to level 10 and you spin as hard you can for 10 seconds. And you might do it 15 times. Now 15 times of 10 seconds. About 2.5 minutes of a workout that will give you benefits in 4 week `that you won't gain in a year in training regularly for an hour to an hour and a half for that period of time. There is a lot of research compare protocols like this between doing it in an altitude and not altitude. And you see it, it's like 25% difference. 25-35% difference in benefit between doing the same thing outside and inside. And it's phenomenal. It's great. It brings in, people want to try it, people want to try it. We are pioneers in this and I think once people see the results. And it takes about two weeks to start saying, hmm something is clicking. Like for example, I was working very hard on that 10 second sprints but two weeks later you realize they're recovering a lot faster between those sprints. So you can maintain the power output. Not just get to it and go down. Or you can go and bike another 45 minutes outside of the bike room. So within 2 weeks you can see that. In 4 weeks you can start seeing performance benefits like in races. One of the biggest things we've heard is that the hills are getting flatter. Meaning we don't lose as much pace going up the hill. And then we have a lot more power towards the end of the race. So we feel a lot stronger finishing the race. I'm not going to give my example from this last weekend. Or maybe I should. So I raced in Santa Rosa. They cancelled the swim. And so we started a time trial and my last section which was about 10 miles was the fastest on the bike. Fastest 10 miles on the bike of the entire race. And it's not that we all of a sudden got wind that pushed me. It was significantly faster by like 3 miles an hour, faster on the bike. And I think, I believe it's only due to the training in the altitude room. I came into the race with very little volume. So I can't say that my training was perfect. What I did focus on is purely going into the room twice a week. And I can see that also riding with my friends. All of a sudden then don't drop me like they normally do.

Cindy: Well that does lead into the other question we have on We Got Goals which is about your goals for the future. If you had to name one thing that you kind of have your sites set on, it could be a personal athletic goal, it could be a goal with the altitude training room or how many athletes here you want to help. What is a goal you have for the future and how do you plan to get there?

Sharone: So can I have two goals?

Cindy: I suppose you can. We'll allow it.

Sharone: So you know one of the things as a coach that came from being an athlete is one of the biggest challenges I had. Especially with this operation we have down here. Is how you see the athlete that you coach. In the beginning they're becoming at your level and then they're surpassing you because of a lot of different reasons. And one of them is because you lose fitness. And one of my goals is to go back to training on a regular basis so I can go into a race and enjoy racing it. I mean I still race but it's I need to train more. So that's one goal to just get back into being an athlete again. The second goal which is probably more important these days. It would be what am I going to do with a business. And my goal is to incorporate this new concept onto training. Encompass in a training facility like we have here into more locations. Make it a part of people's routine. Make altitude training a part of coaches and athletes template for training. And we do a lot of work with this at this point with a lot of lectures. With a lot of open houses. We just started a beta program. This is phenomenal. I'm so excited about this. It's basically invited, we sent application out to ask people to apply for that beta program. And the beta program basically is a six week program where we take people from different levels, beginner athletes, advanced athletes, cyclists, and triathletes, runners. And we walk them through the training plan and we have baseline training and then post intervention training but testing. And we're so excited we have 12 athletes and 1 junior athlete that are participating. We had more than 50 applicants. And we had to choose. It's hard to say who can not go. But one of the early programs that we did is exactly the program we're delivering in this beta program. We had a marathon runner, she was stuck at 3:45 for 9 marathons. She did 4 weeks in the altitude room, 2 sessions a week in her approach to her marathon which was a spring marathon. An April marathon and she PRed by 9 minutes. Now we know that in Chicago spring marathons are not usually the best marathon you're going to have because it's very hard to train. She PRed by 9 minutes. And now she's not thinking just breaking that 3:45 but Boston. So I'm excited to see how these athletes, what the benefits are. Some of them are going to world championship in triathlon, some of them are going into the marathon, some of them are doing some ultras, so I'm excited.

Cindy: Yeah, well and that probably fuels your own goals as an athlete to. I mean it must be hard to carve, especially when you have this new kind of venture that you're trying to get off the ground. It probably is hard to carve out that time for your own training. How is that going to look practically for you? Are you going to block more time for it or what are some of the ways you're going to make that happen?

[44:35]

Sharone: It's simple, I think I already answered this. Surrender to the plan. It is, it really truly is surrender to the plan. I have a plan, I write my own training program. Sometimes it's a little bit unrealistic but I make the adjustment. But once it's there surrender to the plan. I'm [...] a little less which gives me a little bit more time. But there's always something to do. You sit down and the list is from here to nowhere. You need to first of all find the time that is most comfortable for you to train. For example, I'm an afternoon kind of guy. Not necessarily a morning kind of guy. Sometimes I have to train in the morning. But I train in the afternoon. So I do all of my work until 2:00/3:00. All my long runs are done at like noon. I go to lakefront at noon, people think I'm crazy. I don't mind, I get a good tan out of the workout. But I think fitting it to where it fits best. And I think when you come to work at some point, the brain stops working. And that's the point where you instead of fighting it, you get up and do the thing. And then you come back and you're a lot fresher. And you can have a little more sense in your answers and a little more sense in your emails and a little more sense in anything else you do.

Cindy: Surrender to the plan. I love it.

Sharone: Exactly, that's what it is. Yeah.

Cindy: Well this has been such a great conversation. Thank you so much for joining us today. And We Got Goals really appreciate your time.

Sharone: Fantastic, thank you.

Cindy: He goal getters, Cindy Kuzma again here. Just checking in to let you know that you're about to hear a goal from one of you, our listeners! If you would like to share your goal on the We Got Goals podcast, we would love to hear from you. All you have to do is record an audio memo or mp3 wav file. Email it to me at Cindy@aSweatLife.com. And you could be featured here on an upcoming episode. Thanks so much for listening and here is one of you with your goals.

Mariah: I'm Mariah Boyd from Chicago, Illinois. I have found that just telling everybody in my life, big people, small people, random acquaintances my goal has really helped me stay accountable. I made a New Years goal this year to reduce my paper towel use at work and I told a random friend of a friend. I saw her five months later and she said hey hows that paper towel goal going? And I said, I completely forgot I set that goal. And so just her bringing it back up made me refocus on the goal and I have successfully reduced my paper towel use. Environmental issues are a really big thing for me. And I'm a dentist so I wash my hands a thousand times a day. So I just know I'm throwing away so much paper and it really kind of affects me and makes me feel bad. So trying to eliminate that as much as possible has just made me feel better about myself and my impact on the environment.

Cindy: This podcast is asweatlife.com production and it’s another thing that’s better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts including now on Spotify. And while you’re there if you could leave us a rating or a review we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to Jay Mono, for our theme music, to our guest this week, Sharone Aharon, to TechNexus for the recording studio, to our editor this week Kathy Lai, and of course to your for listening.

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Some of the best athletes in the world. Founders and CEOs. Authors of bestselling books, internationally known fitness gurus, even reality television stars.

For 62 episodes now, we on the #WeGotGoals team have had the good fortune to interview some pretty impressive individuals. We’ve learned so much about what’s powered them to the top (and we hope you have, too!).

But the more goal-getters we talked with, the more something dawned on us. Nearly every single one of them had a failure story, a way they fell short en route to what they viewed as their biggest high. What’s more, they nearly all volunteered to share it with us in a conversation about what was most essential to their achievements.

So co-hosts Jeana Anderson Cohen, Maggie Umberger, Kristen Geil and I took a moment to do another guest-less but host-ful episode--we’ll be recording one of these every month or so from now on--to discuss what these failure stories taught us about resilience.

Resilience--something Cohen admits she’s “kind of obsessed with” lately--amounts to the ability to recover quickly from difficulties, adapt to shifting circumstances, and thrive despite, or perhaps even because of, setbacks.

What enables some people to emerge triumphant from situations that would crush a normal human? Our guests offer us clues. Some leaned on a support network, others took the opportunity to reflect and refocus, and a few stayed laser-focused on a bigger, long-term goal. All, it seems, had incorporated their failures into the narratives that made them the high achievers they are today.

We talked through some of the failures that stood out for us over the past year-plus of episodes. For me, it was when Dr. Ari Levy failed his medical boards--then retook them, and now owns a successful practice, SHIFT. Or when Kathrine Switzer nearly got pulled off the course at the 1967 Boston Marathon, but chose to finish instead, and make history.

Cohen contrasts these with the story of Lee Kemp. The wrestler made the U.S. Olympic team in 1980; then, the country boycotted the Games. That failure was beyond his control and irreconcilable, and still fuels the way he lives his life today.

The setback that stood out for Geil was Jessica Zweig, who’s now the founder and CEO of the SimplyBe agency. Before that, she co-founded Cheeky Chicago--and from all outward appearances, was hugely successful. But inside, she felt so conflicted she eventually became physically sick.

For Umberger, Stephanie Johnson’s tale of applying for Survivor for17 years straight--and ultimately getting kicked off before the merge--highlighted the way success and failure aren’t always necessarily black and white. And Maaria Mozaffar, who failed the bar exam five times before moving on to succeed as a civil rights attorney, author, and activist, showed just how powerful persistence can truly be.

In the midst of reflecting on what we’d heard from our guests, we shared our own failure stories--career aspirations gone awry, opportunities missed, times we felt like fish out of water. I think we’d all agree those experiences shaped us and led us to where we are today (a spot we all seem pretty pleased with). And, we discussed the ways we’ll continue to build self-care and coping skills into our daily lives so we can nurture our resistance and boost others up along the way.

A few things we brought up:

• The book Grit, by Angela Duckworth
• The Mind Body Soul challenge on the Sweatworking App
• Ira Glass on the taste gap

Have a failure story of your own? We’d love to hear it. Share it with us in the comments, or--better yet--record a voice memo and send it to cindy@asweatlife.com. You could be featured on #WeGotGoals in the future.

Listen to the full episode anywhere you get your podcasts—including, now, on Spotify! If you like what you hear, please help us spread the word by leaving a rating or a review. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners.

[0:00]

Jeana: Welcome to We Got Goals, a podcast by ASweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. But this week we are talking about past episodes of Goals and most notably about failure and resilience. I’m Jeana Anderson Cohen, with me I have Cindy Kuzma, Maggie Umberger, and Kristen Gial.

Woman 1: Morning Jeana.

Woman 2: Hello.

Woman 3: Hi.

Jeana: So I know that we all have a lot of episodes that were our favorites. And a lot of guests who were highly motivational and have gone through a lot of things. And we wanted to take this time on this week’s episode to talk through those guests. So Cindy, can you tell me about a guest who failed, got back up, that resonated with you.

Cindy: Oh my gosh, well I mean the first thing that really struck me when talking about this topic was, I kind of thought back through all the episodes, and pulled out some of the notable failures and there's so many and just that pure volume is really encouraging. Because we have some darn impressive people on the show and almost every single one of them has a failure story and some of them are huge failure stories. It’s just a part of success. And that in and of itself was just something that stuck me when as I was thinking about this. One of the individual failure stories that spoke to me a lot was way back to, I think it was maybe episode 5 or 6. Dr. Ari Levy, now he’s a physician, he owns his own medical practice. Sort of a holistic health practice here in Chicago, Shift. But he failed his medical boards the first time he took them. And what really struck me about that story was that he realized that it wasn’t. You know it’s one thing to kind of fail when you take a step too far or when you’re really ambitious. And you’re aren’t quite ready for the next challenge. But he realized he failed because he didn’t do the work. He didn’t study enough, he didn’t prepare, he didn’t dedicate the time. And so he had an extra layer of shame and guilt on top of his just plain failing the medical boards. And then with that comes all the questions of what’s going to happen to my career, am I going to lose my job, am I ever going to be a successful physician when I can’t even pass this exam. What he did next, that struck me again was despite that shame and guilt, he really leaned on his support network. And we all need to do that when we fail but sometimes it's extra hard when we kind of realize that we contributed to our own failure. We're so still deserving of that support and we need to reach out to people, kind of get past ourselves, get past that shame and guilt. And connect with the people who care about us regardless of whether we failed because we tried our best and just couldn’t make it or whether we failed because we realized that we maybe could have tried a little bit harder. And then, you know, he harnessed his support system and needed them to take the next step. Which was to retake the exam. And, you know, he had to study when he was like planning his wedding so he really had to rely on the support of people like his fiance, now his wife, to help guide him through that. The end result we know now is he passed, he has a successful practice. Just I took so much from that difference between being disappointed in an outcome and being disappointed in yourself. There are differences between those but you can come back from either one of those.

Jeana: And I mean talk about having to get over yourself in order to move forward. Like, what you’re saying in leaning on somebody. It requires you owning up to and really acknowledging those mistakes or failures. And I think that also resonates with me because in general when we mess up we want to quickly get back on our feet and just do the right thing or try to right the wrong without maybe acknowledging, like okay this is was a mistake, what do I have to learn from it. And he probably, you know, took that time to really like learn something from it versus just going forward, powering on, almost like getting up too quickly, I guess without without taking the time to internalize and figure out what there is to learn from the mistake, the stumble, the failure, whatever you want to call it. So yeah I resonate with that as well Cindy.

Cindy: Jeana, was there a particular story that stood out to you?

[4:21]

Jeana: Well I think sort of bouncing off of Ari’s story, Lee Kemp is sort of on the flipside. Ari knew that his failure he sort of had a part in. He could fix it himself and he caused it in some way, himself. And he took power over that. On the flipside there is Lee Kemp who qualified for the US Olympics and the United States subsequently boycotted the Olympics, the year that he qualified. So to him it was completely out of his hands. He did the work, he tried his hardest and he was totally powerless in that situation. And if you go back and listen to the episode, today he is still not over it. Because of the fact that he couldn’t do anything to rectify it. He’s taken power of his life in a lot of other ways. He’s taken power of his life in speaking to people and he’s really channeled that energy into doing good for the world. But he wasn’t able to go back and undo it. And he wasn’t able to get that original goal. And I think that’s the interesting part of it. Is that sometimes you can go through something hard and still achieve your original goal. And sometimes you go through something hard and you have to change course because there is no other choice. So I think that’s sort of the comparison and the contrast here. Lee Kemp is an amazing athlete, he’s an amazing father, now he’s an amazing coach, speaker and author. But those weren’t probably things that he thought would be his path. At the beginning, at the onset.

Cindy: That’s interesting. It’s interesting to think about what resilience means in that context. And what does it mean to kind of let go and accept that past outcome. I mean clearly he has moved on and had incredible success but as you say, there is still a piece of him that still feels that loss. And how do you kind of rectify that? And does it matter ultimately to your future success? Is there some value maybe in hanging onto a little bit of that past regret to fuel you, I wonder. I don’t know, what do you guys think?

Maggie: I think this is a really cool example of how success, failure, it’s not black or white. That’s one of the biggest takeaways that I think I’ve gotten from a lot of our guests. Is that there are points of success and points of failure. And sometimes, they’re intermixed and intertwined. And it’s just part of life and it’s almost like the story that you create around it that is what fuels you to go forward. And it isn’t the action or the thing that happens it’s the thing that happens next. And how you handle, how you react to whatever does happen.

Kristen: My story that resonated with me is a little bit different than the one that you guys put forward. I was really drawn to Jessica Zweig’s story in episode 40 and her failure wasn't so much a business failure or you know not reaching a certain goal she had set. But it was the fact that she was suffering from a chronic illness so severe that she had to have surgery. And on the inside that's what was happening but on the outside she looks like a highly successful person to everybody else. And I think about that contrast a lot because I'm pretty sure that's something that everyone in this room has experienced it one point or the other. It's that old saying about how like a duck looks so calm floating on water but then underneath its feet are like furiously peddling. And you can't see all the churning and all the work that's happening to try and just keep that duck afloat. And so Jessica, to give a little bit of a background if you haven't heard this episode. She was running Cheeky Chicago. She had a great brand. She had a great team. She was very well known throughout Chicago and was doing amazing. But inside she was really suffering and she was putting herself through the ringer. And ended up really needing to take a step back and take time off. And eventually, she ended up leaving Cheeky Chicago and eventually she started her own personal branding company, SimplyBe. But that’s just something that I think about a lot. It’s just she looked so successful to everybody else, she looked like she was the epitome of one of the goal setting, high achievers we talk about. But inside she felt like she was failing and just that contrast is something that I think affects a lot of us more than we realize or more that we are comfortable talking about.

Jeana: I mean that's so true with the the world that is social media now. That we're only showing the highlights or mostly showing the highlights. Or even when we talk about the struggles, we talk about them from you know the lens of a really pretty photo that presents what the struggle is going to be built beneath it. And I think everyone, everywhere can relate to that on some level. Whether it's you're the person who is feeling those feelings of like ahh, I'm really struggling even though I’m going to post this beautiful photo. Or you're the person kind of scrolling through your social channels and you're feeling like why am I the only one that feels left out of this perfect world.

Maggie: I think the thing about all of this is it makes it hard to feel like anybody else has failed. Because people don't talk about about their failures as much. So when we’re posting our highlight reels. And we’re guilty of this to at A Sweat Life. When we’re posting our highlight reels. It’s hard to know what else is happening. So I think the world around us and we as well, need to be better about saying what we are going through. And what failures it took or how many failures or the mountain of failures that came before to lead to whatever it you’re showing people. Because we owe it to each other to be honest about the experience that it took to get to whatever mountaintop your shouting from.

[9:58]

Cindy: And I think equally important too is to kind of give some shout-outs along the way on the mountaintop. There was recently an article on Runner’s World, I didn’t write it. But a runner, an elite runner talked about the fact that she was having a relapse of her eating disorder. And she posted in the middle of it. And she’s like this is unusual. Usually you hear the after I beat this, everything is great now. I went through struggle but here I am on the other side. Which is I think, critical. We need those messages. We need hope and we need to know that even when people are successful, they have gone through struggles along the way. But we also need to be able to stand with each other in those struggles a little bit more, I think. And some openness along the way and showing people what it's actually like in the moment. That if we had a little bit more of that, it would be interesting to see how that affected everyone's viewpoints on all of this. So we can maybe get a glimpse of those legs paddling while the duck was still in the water and not just when it was, you know, flying through the air sitting on the shore.

Maggie: Going back to that idea of failure/success not being black and white. One of the stories that we've gotten to share, Kristen was when you interviewed Stephanie from Survivor. She worked so hard, she had this crazy story of trying to get on Survivor. That was a huge goal for her. She applied 17 times and eventually got on the show only to be voted off without getting to the very end. And I think about the stories that we hear. Sometimes these big massive failure stories that turn into success. That's not always a really massive failure or a really massive success on either spectrum. It sometimes just part of life that feels off or feels kind of good. And I think one of my stories of failure is one of those where it was kind of a success but kind of a failure. I don't really know. It's just kind of like how I interpret the way that I left my first job and moved into my second one.

Cindy: I'm intrigued Maggie, talk more about your own failure story.

Maggie: Well, so when I originally thought I was going to go into advertising. I felt like I had this really cool story of going into my first career where I was not initially asked back for the interview and I kept calling the ad agency saying I would really like this interview. I think that would really do great things at this company. And they eventually called me back as sort of a last minute, someone cancelled. Okay I guess we'll bring her in and then they ended up really liking me and bringing me on board for this program. And I was like oh my god, this is going to be the launching point of being the underdog and then doing great in this career. And then I kind of missed the mark and I was like not doing the things that I thought I was going to be able to do. I had the opportunity to work on a global account where there were not a lot of other planners. And I really wanted to show that I was so good at what I was doing that oh my god she should be promoted to senior planner right away. It was like the opportunity to do really great and then I just was like in over my head. I didn't get to produce the work that I wanted to when I was there. And I battled kind of with myself. Am I not cut out for this because I'm not smart enough for this or is this not really my calling that I thought it was. And so I kind struggled with like, how much do I just keep treading water to do this thing that I set out to do. Or is not that I'm not smart and that it's just I'm kind of pushing my energy in the wrong direction. And so I kind of toyed with that for like a year. Of just feeling like stuck and not sure why and not sure if I quit, if quitting really was quitting and giving up. Or if it was changing course because that's what I felt like I was more called to do and I chose to shift the course. And I still think about that time in those days when I was working really hard but not feeling like I was producing good work and it sort of does feel like a failure. I was like I really wanted to leave a better mark on that time. And it didn't pan out that way but I wouldn't have traded that decision for anything because I am in a much better place now. And so I know that I learned a lot from that. But I haven't really told that story or thought about it until we started thinking about these other failure stories and that black and white. And so I kind of for the first time really acknowledged that kind of feels like a failure but it also feels like a success. So it's like this weird balance for me.

[14:26]

Kristen: Maggie, our stories are super similar. So I'm going to jump in here too. The job that I was at before this, I was hired as an in house copywriter. So I was working on digital marketing stuff for a company that made travel mugs and water bottles. And it was great, and comfortable and right in my wheel house and I felt like I was doing good things. And then of course something happens and the company gets acquired. And everything changes as soon as your feeling great. And the decision they made was that all copywriters would be located in Hoboken, New Jersey. So I had a few options at this point. I could move to Hoboken which was never really an option. I could take a layoff or my manager really wanted to keep my around. She was like well we have positions opening in this office working on displays. Which like literally that means the things that you see in drug stores and grocery stores that hold our water bottles and travel mugs. And they needed people to be like helping create the displays and work with manufacturers and procurement and supplies. And I was like alright, I'm a reasonably smart person. I should be able to figure this out. How hard can it be if all these other people in the office are doing it too. And I started and it was awful. I had the most anxiety going into work every single day and opening my email would give me anxiety. And I just absolutely hated every single aspect of it. To the point where I would not do anything because I was too afraid to take a step in the wrong direction. And so I would just ignore emails and put off responding to them. Or I would leave a meeting and deliberately not do the action items that I was supposed to. And that went on for a little while and eventually I was like this is not working. I am taking this layoff. Get me out of here. And even though it felt like such a failure at the time, I definitely called my dad crying and upset that I felt like how could I not get this? I'm a smart person, this should not be that hard. It just wasn't even what I wanted to be doing. So eventually I took that layoff and it was the best thing. And that's what led to me doing this podcast. I reached out to you guys about working on the podcast when I was in that period and eventually it set the stage for me to doing some freelance work and building my skills as a writer. And led me here eventually. I feel like it's not really a failure. It was more like a test drive that you could back off from pretty easily. So that god I am not working on displays.

Maggie: Kristen, I never knew that part of your story. And working with you now, I just think like oh my god she's so good at her job. I never would assume you would feel like you were bad at your job and I think that's the point of conversation that we don't always have with our coworkers, with our friends. We have a view of someone else and that's just the story you tell yourself and you just don't know the whole story, you don't know the whole picture. So A, thank you for sharing that. And it's just cool because I'm sure everybody has that moment of like ugh, they're perfect or ugh they do everything right to their bosses, to their friends, to their family. And we just don't have the whole story ever.

Jeana: I also think it's interesting because Kristen and I. Or mostly I [...] Kristen's sister. So Kristen's sister is entering her career, first time, first job within a similar position to Maggie. Where she was entry level, not really. I mean everyone goes through work before they get to their first job. But I wanted to dole out a piece of advice to Kristen's sister, Rachel, before she figured it out for herself. Because I think everyone deserves to know this before they find it out themselves that you're going to feel bad at your first job, no matter what. You're going to spend months, maybe years feeling like your not as smart as you were before. Feeling like someone else can do it better and just feeling beaten down. Based on what I've seen other people say, based on my own experiences. And I feel like people need to tell college graduates this more. I don't think it's maybe the best graduation speech. But I do think graduate, entry-level employees deserve to know that there not going to feel maybe like their best selves for a little bit. Because they will be surrounded by other people who can teach them and that's the opportunity, is to learn and look at that as the opportunity to find new information. To maybe be humbled a little bit. But it's so hard to do because you come from a world where you're maybe in leadership roles, where you're the best at everything you do, you were the top of your class and suddenly you're surrounded by people with ten years of experience beyond what you have. And that's tough but it's also an opportunity.

Cindy: And I think it's interesting in creative fields too because you also get into this, I've heard [...] of this American Life talk about it before. When you're quality standards, you kind of recognize what's good and what isn't. And you realize you're not actually capable of producing something good yet. That you can watch something, you can listen to something, you can read something and recognize this is quality work. And then you can look at what you're doing and you're like this is, this is not there yet. But you don't really know how to bridge that gap and there's going to be quite some time before you get the experience required to get to the level of quality that you know is what is demanded of you or what you really appreciate about other people's works. So I think that's an extra layer of challenge that I think we all face as we continue to go through our careers too. And appreciate the work of our peers and mentors and people we look up to in our fields.

[19:57]

Jeana: It also takes recognizing your own progress too. And just looking back and saying here's where I was, here's what I was doing and here's the work I'm producing now, wow that's better. If I look back and read a piece I wrote in college, I had no voice at all. And now I read what I write and I enjoy my own voice. Which is a silly thing to say but I like reading my own work back now. Which is fun.

Cindy: What I think is interesting about both of your stories Kristen and Maggie is that point where you have to define success for yourself and how do you know when you're letting yourself down versus when you would be better served to move in a different direction. I think that takes some serious self-reflection and I don't know, Jeana have you been in a situation where you had that kind of a struggle and how did you kind of deal with that?

Jeana: Have I ever? So I think there are a couple of key points in my career where I felt knocked down. And knocked down is probably the best way to put it. Early on, my first interview I was dead set on working in PR and advertising but I didn't, I don't think I really knew what it was or what I would be doing in particular. I ended up doing social media for large brands for the bulk of my sort of agency life. Which was super fun but over sort of the time I spent in agency world, I always felt like I wasn't a fit. I felt like I was a fish out of water. And what I've learned is that a fish out of water either must change to fit the world or the world must change to fit the fish. There is no other way that that story can end. So I wasn't ready to change to fit the world, so I left it. But I did spend a lot of time in the agency world learning from it. Learning to be better at the work I put out, learning to be more of a perfectionist, learning to take my time on doing good work and really learning what good client-facing work and PowerPoints looked like. Which sounds silly but we actually do produce a lot of PowerPoint decks at A Sweat Life. And I thank I thank you very much agency world for that skill but the cultural thing was never right for me so I sort of had to make a choice to leave that world and focus entirely on A Sweat Life where we can form our own culture.

Cindy: That's such a sophisticated view and it's really I think if you can make that shift while you're in the while you're in the middle of a situation, how powerful is that? It makes me think of about Katherine Switzer, which is another kind of failure story that stood out for me. You know, think about this, she was the first woman to ever officially run the Boston Marathon and the way she tells the story, she signed up with her initials K.B. Switzer not because she was trying to fool anyone. Even though there had never been a woman officially running the marathon before she checked the rules it didn't say woman could run it. She didn't think she was really doing anything wrong and then she signs up for the race, she gets there, everyone around is nice. She starts the race and then mile two the race director comes at comes at her at her, leaps at her out of a truck and is like "What are you doing? Give me that number!" I'm sure it wasn't quite so clean even. And if you can imagine, you thought you were following the rules and then suddenly someone came along and was like you did everything wrong and the shame and the guilt that she felt in that moment, really made her almost want to quit. And she almost did. But she really quickly realized the opportunity that okay actually I need to finish this race of people believe that women can do it and then soon after. That moment changed her whole life. Those photographers went viral as things could in, you know, the 1960s. And you know, she has since then become a true activist. And her entire life, now she's in her seventies. She has been one of the figureheads for the entire women's running movement. So it seems like the more quickly you can distinguish between the parts of if that are true failure or the parts of it that are kind of beyond your control and the parts of it that you can take and apply to something else in your life, the more success you can have in the long run.

Jeana: And just building off of that point, Cindy. You know, Maaria Mozaffar who is a political activist failed the bar five times. So she had this vision of this is what I want to do and I think that's something that a lot of our guests have had. It's like this intuition and this gut feeling of this is right and this what I want to be doing. And then any failure along the way is just a little hurdle to get over, a stumble to get over but that is worth it. And the converse side of that we're talking about is when the failure presents itself that shows that like maybe I'm in the wrong place. I've got to shift direction. There's like that intuition, gut telling you to move somewhere else versus whatever those stumbles are along the way. It's just making me stronger to get to that vision. Have you experienced either one of those, like that intuition telling you yes or that intuition telling you maybe no?

[24:48]

Cindy: That's interesting. That actually leads into my failure story a little bit. Because what I think of as one of my bigger failures in the past few years was the failure to give myself an opportunity that I felt like I should have. I am a freelance writer and I've collaborated on one book before. And I had someone approach me about writing a book of my own that had to do with running which is my favorite topic. And you know I was really excited about it. And I talked about it. And I worked with this person. And you know it got to the point where I had to make a decision and I got advice from other people. And I kind of, you know, wasn't sure because of some things that had to do with the business aspects of it. And I ultimately ended up turning that opportunity down. For reasons that were, some of them were really solid at the time and some of them probably were more related to fear and self-doubt. And, you know, I kind of walked away from it, I felt fine about it. And then they got someone else to write this book. And then when I saw the book come out, I had really severe emotional gut reaction that I was not expecting. It really caught me off guard. I suddenly started to feel like I had walked away from an opportunity that I would never get again. That it was just you know a totally wrong decision and that I had just blown it. I hadn't even given myself the chance to see what I could do with it. So again, you can't go back and fix the past. But what I learned from that was maybe I needed to trust my intuition a little bit more. That even though there are people telling me okay, you have these solid business reasons for not doing this particular thing. But sometimes your gut just has to kind of win out over that. And it also taught me that I really wanted my name on the cover of a book. And so you know, I took that and I pursued that and I collaborated with a new collaborator and now I'm working on a new book that will have my name on the cover and hers. And it's something that I'm really proud of and excited about. And I can't wait to see it come out. So, you know, it took some hard work and some tears to get there but I did feel like I was able to access that. And it did it was like a course correction and it taught me to that it maybe I did need to trust my intuition a little bit more and sometimes it's hard to do.

Maggie: That is like the epitome of resilience to me. We talk about resilience in the face of things happening to you and how do you recover, come back from them. And we talk about resilience when you make a mistake and then you have to kind of course correct from that. And then there's the kind of resilience where, you know, you don't act and then you have to kind of navigate the waters around what did or didn't happen after inaction. And I think these are all three different things that happen in our lives all the time but resilience is that thing. It is the ability to grow from it. To notice that time when you're in that churn, when you're in the struggle and not just passively think okay this will soon be over, this too shall pass. But to find the moments that you can learn from, to forgive yourself, immediate forgiveness for whatever has to be, whatever you have to do to feel right for yourself and by yourself. And then to move forward into a more positive place. And that can happen in a short amount of time, it can take years like with Lee Kemp. All of these stories, it's different ways that resilience comes about. But all of our incredible guests have this gut that I think is super strong. And I think that is the essence of resilience to me.

Kristen: Yeah, and to really hammer home one of the points that you just made. Jeana and I were talking yesterday about our failure stories and you know, what we were going to talk about on podcast today. And I was telling her, like my memory must just suck because I don't know what I'm going to talk about. Like I can't really think of a failure to choose. And I know I've definitely failed but I'm having a really hard time remembering specific instances. And she looked at me and she was like that's because your resilient. And that's a really interesting interpretation. That I honestly felt like a light bulb had gone off over my head. It was like oh, it's not that I've never failed. It's just that my perspective has shifted. And maybe resilience isn't something that you recognize in the moment or that can even happen right away. It's definitely a time intensive course of action. So Jeana, I know you've been reading about resilience a lot lately. And learning a lot about it.

[28:52]

Jeana: I'm sort of obsessed with it. So I'm going to read one sentence: "A pair of researchers found that resilience was defined most as the ability to recover from setbacks, adaptable to change and to keep going in the face of adversity." And that was reported in the Harvard Business Review. And what's most important about that is that it's all of the things that Maggie just talked about. It's setbacks, it's actual failure. It's things just not going your way. So I think failure can be defined in a lot of buckets. Choosing to see it as failure is one thing, choosing to see it as a course correction is another thing. I think I've always chosen to see anything going wrong as an opportunity. Which might just be my internal optimism but it also be resilience. Which you can also [...], which is very interesting. So Angela Duckworth wrote the book Grit, and she wrote a lot about gritty parenting, how to be more gritty yourself and how to just define your own grittiness. Her book Grit is worth a read. Resilience in general though is a big, big link to happiness. People who can go through setback and failures and find a way out tend to be happier, science shows that. And resilience is linked to happiness because it also tends to be linked to habits and outlooks that lead you to be happier in general. I know we did a full happiness mantra on the sweat working app linked to resilience. And we created what call the resilience toolkit. If you want to do this exercise at home, you can create your own sort of endorphin building practice that can help you mentally as well as physically pull yourself out of that moment of failure. And there are a couple other things that you can do we'll link to that sort of mantra building in the show notes too.

Maggie: And I'll just tack onto the last thing that you said Jeana. When you mentioned how it's resilience is linked to happiness because sort of the habits that you build. And I think there's another link to American Psychology Association that says that resilience is ordinary, not extraordinary. Because it happens everyday. So it's like creating the habits that you can trust. That you, that you will that work for you. Whether it is you know, just a workout everyday, a workout in the morning or workout at night, whatever routine fits your model best. That you can lean on when you need it. And it's like creating the tools like you're saying to build yourself back up when you're faltering. Because those ebbs and flows of life are constantly happening. And I should practice what I preach because I will let those ebbs and flows kind of affect me on a daily basis or on a weekly basis. That I think that's a place for me where I can start to hone those skills a little bit more is finding whether it's a mediation in the morning, or a walk without my phone. Taking the time, carving it out that would really help me build those habits and kind of insert resilience here.

Cindy: Right, because it's really easy when things are going well for you to kind of forget the habits that create your sort of coping reserves, right? And all resilience is, is having coping reserves that are greater than the challenges that you face. And recognizing that when those challenges outstretch your resources and your ability to handle them, that you need to reach out for help. But building those habits in every day and remembering to do that, even when we're feeling good I think is a great way to build up our stores of resilience. So that we can not only help ourselves but that we can help those around us when they're challenges outpace what they can handle at that moment too. I will say that listening to the stories of failure and resilience on We Got Goals and talking about them with you all has been just a treat and a really fantastic way for us to all think about and build our resilience too. So thank you all for sharing your failure stories and for being a part of this podcast today. And this podcast in general.

Jeana: Thank you Cindy.

Kristen: Thanks guys, it felt good.

Maggie: I'm about to go take a walk without my phone.

Cindy: Bold move Maggie. Thank you again.

Jeana: And stick around listener, after this you'll hear from a real life goal-getter taking about their goals and maybe their resilience.

Cindy: Hey goal-getters, Cindy Kuzma here. We have a special treat for you. Just like we have been having these past few weeks. It's a real-life goal from one of you, our listeners. If you'd like to record a goal and have it be featured on this very podcast. You can record an audio memo on your phone, on your computer, however you'd like to do it. And email it to me at Cindy@aSweatLife.com. You could be featured here on We Got Goals in the week ahead. Thank you so much for listening and here is one of your goals.

[33:45]

Kelly: My name is Kelly and I'm from Chicago. A big goal I've achieved in the past year is a career goal for myself. I left a full time job back in August working in the hospitality industry and I have a big passion for fitness and health. So I wanted to start my own company and I did so back in December. It the ultimate fitness experience and I actually have my very first client event next week. So I think a big part of that was being in a career for the past nine years, I was just ready for a big change. And I have this big passion for fitness and health. And I also want to help other people. So you've seen my kind of my contact list of my career skills from event planning and working the hospitality industry. I decided to combine the two of hospitality and [...] fitness and health in that industry. Because I think everyone deserves to take care of themselves and just make a better life for themselves. So working on that together and now the future is just adding more clients to the list and making a career for myself working on my own and maybe building a team in the future. So really excited about it, really excited about these career goals that I've put into this. You can find me on Instagram at KellySnyder_FitLife or FitLifeExperience is company and FitLifeExperience.com is the website which is actually still being built. But it will be up and running. And definitely find me on social media.

Cindy: This podcast is A Sweat Life Production and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share us with yours. You can find us wherever you get your podcast including it now on Spotify. While you're there, if you could leave us a rating or review we would be so grateful. Special thanks to Jay Mono for our theme music, to all of our hosts for being our guests this week on this hostful episode and to TechNexus for the recording studio.

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Sometimes, we’ll have a guest on the #WeGotGoals podcast who doesn’t actually like or set goals (I’m looking at you, Dawn Jackson Blatner and Josh Katt). For whatever reason, they don’t connect to the term, or they’ve employed a different paradigm to accomplish great things.

Which is fantastic—one of the best things about the show, in our humble opinions, is the glimpse at the wide variety of paths high achievers have taken to reach success.

But this week’s guest, Nicole Bernard Dawes, has the opposite perspective. Goals drive nearly everything the founder and CEO does. She aims to set both ambitious aspirations—say, starting an organic snack company, Late July Snacks, that hit $100 million in sales this year—and small mini-targets, including what she wants to get out of each business meeting. And she’s not afraid to lay them all on the line.

“If you don’t even know what you want, you’re definitely not going to get it,” she says. “And I think clearly articulating what you want helps people.

Setting goals helped Dawes recover from an incredibly difficult year in 2009. First there was the recession. Then her father Steve Bernard—her co-founder (and, before that, the founder of Cape Cod Potato Chips)—passed away from pancreatic cancer. When he died, the bank called the loan, leaving Dawes and her husband/business partner Peter scrambling to raise cash.

“Through that, it forced my husband and I to take a hard look at kind of who we were at Late July and what we wanted this company to really become,” Dawes says. What did they decide and how did they pull through? In our interview, Dawes shares seven lessons that kept her moving forward.

1. Find the right people …

One of the most critical changes Late July made the following year was to the hiring process. Being qualified to work at the company, they decided, meant more than just having the right education and experience. Dawes began looking for people who’d make a positive addition to the environment, and spent a significant amount of time having multiple team members interview each candidate. In some cases, that meant positions went unfilled for years, a stressor in a fast-growing company. However, the result was worth it: “I truly believe today that we have the most wonderful team in our industry,” she says. “We have a group of people that wakes up every day ready to support each other and believes in the company and believes in the products.”

1. … and a purpose you’re passionate about.

Dawes made another big decision in the wake of her father’s passing: to leave cookies behind and enter the tortilla chip market. That was no small shift—cookies made up $2 million of the company’s $9 million in sales at the time. However, Dawes felt strongly she wanted to steer the company in a healthier direction. Of course, she wasn’t satisfied with just any crunchy nibble. She aimed to create the number-one tortilla chip in the natural-food business. “Singular focus on being number one requires all your effort, and all your team’s effort,” she says. “No matter what our team was doing, we always kept that goal in the back of our mind.

1. Start new things small and build.

It took a year to perfect and introduce the tortilla chips, and they got off to a rocky start. “That was a little bit scary because we had just bet our entire company's future on this launch,” Dawes says. That taught her Late July needed to build brand awareness in this new space. So, they spent the next year concentrating on a few key accounts, securing a foothold there before spreading their wings to the larger marketplace. That focus helped them course correct quickly. “I think we might have become the number three in the first year,” Dawes says.

1. Deliver quality.

That rapid rise was built on superior flavor. As the daughter of a potato-chip mogul father and a mother who owned a health food store in Cape Cod, Dawes prioritizes making food that’s both nutritious and delicious. “I’ve always believed that as a natural products brand, we have an obligation for the entire industry to make our products taste great,” she says. “When a consumer has a bad experience with one natural product, they make an assumption about everything.” And to succeed in the highly competitive salty snack realm requires repeat business: “No consumer is ever going to buy a snack twice if they don't like the way it tastes.”

1. Stay open to feedback.

How, exactly, does Late July makes its chips so scrumptious? Besides constant comparison to competitors and making sure the whole team is eating—and loving—them, Dawes says they stay alert for constructive criticism. She applies this philosophy to all areas of her life and business; it’s a key component of her overall positive outlook. “We’re all just kind of learning and growing, and none of us are perfect. The more receptive you are to hearing things that could be done better, the more likely you are to improve faster,” she says.

1. Set goals outside the boardroom, too.

Looking to the future, Dawes is aiming for Late July to dominate the salsa category too (they’re in the midst of launching that line, and popcorn, right now). However, she also gives her personal life high priority by setting goals there, too. Her big goal is to be available to her two sons, now ages 16 and almost 12. She puts it in practice by working from home more and eating family dinner together four or five nights a week. And, she encourages her employees to take similar steps. “We all have lives, and when you’re a high-achieving person, you have to not hide that,” she says. “It’s OK—it doesn’t make you less of a productive person to prioritize your private life.”

1. Sweat it out. “I manage stress, I think, weirdly well,” Dawes says. Some of that may come naturally, but she also finds a solid fitness routine enables her to perform her best (a sentiment that makes us smile here at aSweatLife). A couple of years ago, Dawes got a Peloton bike—and thinks they should be standard issue for any entrepreneur. Now, she has no excuse not to knock out a 20-minute ride, even on her busiest days.

Listen to Nicole Benard Dawes’ full episode anywhere you get your podcasts—including, now, on Spotify! If you like what you hear, please help us spread the word by leaving a rating or a review. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

Begin transcript:

Jeana: Welcome to #WeGotGoals a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high-achievers about their goals. I’m Jeana Anderson Cohen. With me I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger.

Maggie: Morning Jeana!

Cindy: Good morning Jeana!

Jeana: Good Morning! And Cindy, this week you to Nicole.

Cindy: I did! I interviewed Nicole Bernard Dawes who is the founder and CEO of Late July, an organic snack food company. We have some people on the podcast who are actually not a big fan of goals. Nicole loves goals! She thinks you should set them in every part of your life. And so it was a joy to talk to her for this podcast.

Jeana: And her goals are shifting, I know she had big goals built around business but her future goals are built more around her family life. Right?

Cindy: Right, and I think she still has a lot of big business goals too. But I was really struck by the way she talked about her intentionality with her family. Her kids are actually a little bit older. Her boys are teenagers now and she’s realizing that they kind of require a different level of energy. Like when kids are little, you have to be around them, you have to take them places, you’re coordinating logistics. But when they get to like the age that which they’re they’re kind of becoming self-sufficient people, they have deep questions about the world. She was realizing that she needs to preserve her energy. She wants to be there for them as they kind of navigate the world and answer those questions for them and be a person who’s present in their life. And she realizes that just like you have to set a goal to reach a dollar amount in sales for your business. If you want that, if it’s a priority for you, you have to set that goal. And then you have to figure out how to make the rest of your life work with that. So she’s done things like work from home more often or structure her day in different ways so that she can make sure that she’s there for them in enough quantity and quality of time to be the kind of mother that she wants to be.

Jeana: And as she’s managing all of these areas of her life and continuing to grow this already fast growing company, she’s under a lot of stress as is easy to imagine. But she is pretty good at managing that stress. And one of her key tools to going after her big accomplishments and continuing to manage her stress is buying a Peloton bike, right?

Cindy: Yeah, this makes all of our hearts happy at a Sweat Life to hear her talk about how important fitness has been in achieving her goals and maintaining a balance to her lifestyle. Well I say balance, she doesn’t believe in that word balance which is something I think we can all relate to a little bit. Because she doesn’t feel like the person who goes into the office is a different person then the person who sits down at the dinner table with her family. That said, she did notice that when things got really busy, one thing that kind of slipped by the wasteside was her fitness routine. And she started to realize that was affecting her productivity, her mood, her state of mind and eventually would affect her health which would be extra bad for someone who runs essentially a health food company. So she was trying to figure out how to make that work again. She set that goal and worked backward to figure out how to achieve it. And realized that having a bike in her home where she had no excuse to not do a 20 minute ride any day of the week was really important to her. So it was kind of a treat to hear that. In fact, she said she thinks a Peloton bike should be given to every entrepreneur. It should just be like standard equipment when you start your own business. So that was great to hear.

Jeana: I’ll take one of those please. What a delight to hear from such a great entrepreneur about her goals and how they’ve shifted over the years. Here is Cindy with Nicole. And stick around, at the end of the episode we’re hearing from you, listeners!

Cindy: This is Cindy Kuzma and I’m here on the #WeGotGoals podcast with Nicole Bernard Dawes who’s the founder and CEO of Late July. Nicole, thank you so much for joining us today.

Nicole: Oh Cindy, thank you so much for having me. I’m really excited about this podcast.

Cindy: Well, I’m glad to hear it! We’re excited too. So most of our listeners are people who are conscious about what they eat and who love a good snack so they probably already know your brand. But just in case, can you tell us just a little bit about Late July and the products you sell?

Nicole: Sure, Late July organic snacks is a predominately a tortilla chip company. Right now we make several varieties of organic tortilla chips and range from our most healthy which is a multigrain tortilla chip that has all sorts of wonderful grains and seeds in it. To our more seasoned jalapeno lime tortilla chips which are one of my personal favorites and my kids personal favorites. They’re super delicious and they are a great snack any time. We also make a line of crackers and sandwich crackers.

Cindy: And that’s kind of how it all started, right? Way back in 2001 because you couldn’t find a way to fulfill your pregnancy cravings with organic real ingredients. Am I getting that right?

Nicole: That is correct. I was pregnant, I actually started this company when I was pregnant with my first son which is one of those things that at the time seemed like a really good idea because you haven’t had a child yet. But I grew up in sort of a unique situation. My mom had a health food store and my dad owned a potato chip company. So I think that I’m the natural product of when those two people have a child, you’re bound to have somebody who could create a natural product that is a little bit more delicious. And that was my experience with my mom’s health food store in the 1970s was that all of the products, you know had the right idea but they really tasted bad. I mean, it was a pretty sad shelf full of crackers that I had in my childhood. But because my father was really into food and he loved to cook and he also started a potato chip company, K Pop Potato Chips. You know, food and health food, in particular, because of my mom was a big focus of my life. But even back then I knew that health food stores could do better. So when I was pregnant with my first son, I was actually living in New York City at the time. And I really desperately wanted a saltine cracker. It was early in my pregnancy. Because I was highly determined to find one, I went to like six natural food stores. And I couldn’t find anything. I mean, all of the crackers were very similar to what my mom had back in the 70s. I mean, that part of the health food store hadn’t evolved at all. I think it’s like people stereotype natural foods, you know they taste like the cardboard box that they’re packed in. That was very true of what I was finding when I was walking around those New York City health food stores back in 2002. So it dawned on me that even though other parts of the health food store had evolved since my mom’s. That part of the store was very much stuck in the 70s and I knew that I had to do something about it.

Cindy: So, you’ve come a long way since then. I know you have something like 30 employees and the number one tortilla chip in that natural and organic aisle where you were looking for it before. And a chance to hit $100 million in sales for the year. And that's just professionally. Personally, I know you have the family, the sons that you mentioned and a husband who's your business partner. So I presume that you have a lot of accomplishments to choose from. But as we always do on #WeGotGoals, we’re going to ask you to narrow it down today. We ask everyone two big questions and the first one is the one I’m going to pose right now. Nicole, what’s a big goal you’ve achieved, why was it important to you and how did you get there?

Nicole: I just want to mention one thing, we did already pass $100 million in sales.

Cindy: Oh, wonderful.

Nicole: You know, I love goal-setting. I think it’s a really important part of achieving. And understanding really what you’re trying to achieve is very, very important I think how we got where we are today. And you know those goals have changed so much since I first started the company and I'm kind of constantly checking and updating those goals. You know there's so many that have been a part of getting us to where we are. But you know just narrowing down a couple that I particularly think helped us. One is way back I mean I'm going to stay back in 2010, my husband and I we run the company together and we set a goal for our team. We discovered that one of the things that we love the most about our company was kind of the way our team work together. But we had a couple of people that we really felt weren't as positive members of the team. So we decided that we were going to revamp the entire way that we did hiring and set a goal to have our entire company be the kind of people that we really wanted to be around. That was supportive of each other just to make our company one of the best places to work that we possibly could. What made that goal a little bit harder back in 2010 is we didn't have as much money back then to pay what you needed to pay. There was a lot of challenges to kind of reaching that goal. But ultimately it also meant that would have to leave positions unfilled potentially until we kind of found that perfect fit. And so what we decided to do was instead of just hiring for a position, we started hiring for cultural fit. And completely changed the way that we interviewed people so instead of just posting a position, looking for a set of criteria, having one or two people interview that person and then hiring the most qualified candidate we decided that the term qualified had a lot of other meanings. And you know that stretched far beyond just hitting the the check boxes of right school major, right past experience and for some of the positions it required us leaving them open for a couple of years actually. And I would say that, I can officially say we met this goal about 4 years after we set it. It took that long to finally get all the open positions filled the way that we wanted to fill them. And I truly believe today that we have the most wonderful team in our industry. I mean everybody thoroughly enjoys working together, we have a group of people that that wakes up everyday ready to support each other and believes in the company and believes in the products.

Cindy: That's so interesting because so often people think of goals and really hard, tangible, data-driven terms and that's such an interesting one to set. How did you sort of check, you talked about kind of checking for a progress against those things. How did it, I mean other than just filling those positions. Like what are some ways that you sort of really gauged how successful that effort was?

Nicole: I think just employee morale and job satisfaction. Just seeing how our team worked together and also it mean really it's it a tangible filling open positions. I mean at the time when we set it we had the open positions that we needed to fill and under our like new new approach. So once those positions were filled and you know all future positions were done that way. It just became our way of life.

Cindy: I’d imagine that was a bit of a struggle at first with your existing employees trying to communicate that message and explain to them why it might take a little bit longer to get the help that you needed. But ultimately I'm sure they could come to understand to how important this was for the health of the whole team how did you kind of navigate that transitional period.

Nicole: It is, it actually is very hard. I mean still because it typically took us longer to fill positions than we did in the past and when you’re growing fast that can be a huge problem. But I think what everyone came to realize very quickly was it was much better to have a team that we all enjoyed being around and you know really truly supported each other, than just filling a position. And you know, people became believers in the process. Because they were all part of it too. You know, when somebody joined the company they were typically interviewed by five or six people versus just one or two. Anybody that they might potentially be working with and even a few people they wouldn’t be working with on a day to day process. So everyone kind of bought into it and plus they saw the results.

Cindy: And when you think about how that affects your day to day business any can you think of some examples where the team has worked together in a way that you think they might not have been able to before

Nicole: Yeah. One of the things that I think is really interesting is when I look at I mean our sales team. We, our sales team works very differently than most sales teams. We have a team that completely doesn't compete against each other. Which I think makes us ultimately more powerful. Our sales team isn't kind of bonused individually. We really look at it as we're all in this together. And what that has meant for some members of that team is they might have something come up like a family emergency, for example. And they can’t go to, this is a true life story, it actually happened. They can’t go to like the most important meeting for their most important customer of the year. And so one of their peers will step in and go to that meeting. Now, in a typical company that might be a threat because if that person performs and does well and then there's a chance that that could kind of come back to impact. Particularly in sales where people tend to be a little bit possessive of their customers. And in our case, the way that we work that’s just one co-worker helping another.

Cindy: How do you sort of structure things, so that requires both kind of a different attitude and also like a really different incentive system as you say, right? How are some of the, what are some of the ways that plays out in the way that you kind of actually structure the company?

Nicole: Well I think it, one of ways that plays out is you know we encourage a lot of cross functionality. People to kind of understand not just their role but how their role impacts the rest of the company. And particularly team members that they work with all the time but even team members that they just sort of brush up against [...] with like the various things that they’re working on. Because I think when you understand your role in greater context you understand how your choices and your decisions affect the people that you're working with versus when you are very siloed you really don't understand and you don't have a lot of concern for how your choices impact the people that you work with.

Cindy: So where do you think all of these ideas came from for you? I mean when you talk about it now it it strikes me that some of this must have come out of the very difficult year that that you had in 2009. Which I mean first of all I'm very sorry for the loss of your father, I know that that was a tough time. And that you went through some learnings in terms of getting comfortable with areas of the business that you didn't know much about before that you weren't as involved in before. Is that something that kind of informed the way you've set up this newer hiring structure?

Nicole: I mean it is, I mean really as you mentioned 2009 was just an incredibly difficult year. I mean personally, professionally, really in every way. It was the death of my father somebody who you know, hero, mentor, somebody who I kind of looked up to and felt I really needed. To his death resulting in our bank triggering a death of a member clause in our loan agreement. And forcing us in the height of the recession to replace debt and the significant amount of debt for the company. And ultimately kind of through that it forced my husband I to take a hard look at who we were at Late July and what we wanted this company to really become. And a couple of interesting things happened. One, we decided life is short you just don't, you really as an entrepreneur I have an incredibly positive outlook and usually my brain can't even compute failure. I mean it just doesn’t go there and I actually, I manage stress I think kind of weirdly well but kind of even given all that we just took a hard look at who we wanted to be and how we wanted to feel and how we wanted our team members to feel. And out of that we just really needed late July to be a place that. People were passionate about our mission already. But just that people were passionate about the work experience they were having. And I think bigger than that even for Peter and I was deciding who Late July wanted to be as a company. And part of kind of our early days in the cracker side of our business was something that I think was really important to building our foundation and discovering what we cared about from a mission standpoint. But the products were I think, they tasted great but I just I didn't have the passion that I needed to for where our company was headed and we made a lot of difficult decisions that year in addition to revamping the personality side of our company and the culture side of our company. We decided that as a brand we wanted to stand for something a little bit more in terms of health. And we actually decided to get out of cookies which was a significant amount of our business at that time. We were doing probably $9 million in sales and cookies were $2 million of them. So it was a big deal. And go into tortilla chips which was something both my husband and I really really were passionate about. I tried to get my father to launch them at K Pop Potato Chips but he felt pretty strongly that they were a potato chip company and that was sort of out of their area of expertise. But I felt really strongly about them and so did my husband. And this kind of comes to our next goal which I think is really probably a crazier one. But as a cracker company, we decided we wanted to become the number one tortilla chip in the natural business, in the natural aisle. And coming out of this incredibly difficult year, that was what we had decided to become. And in 2010, we started working on tortilla chips. And taking our company in this completely new direction.

Cindy: Once you had finally decided this. What were some of the steps along the way that took you from okay we're going to go this whole new way to achieving that success? To being the number one tortilla chip in this aisle?

Nicole: Well step one was just launching the tortilla chips, which took us almost the full year. And they officially hit shelves in December of 2010. And they were not off to the greatest start. You know, which I think was a little bit scary because we had just bet our entire company’s future on this launch. You know, and I think that was kind of the first big learning for us. Was okay, we’re going into this new category, it’s much more competitive. You know, you have to sell a lot more tortilla chips to succeed than you do crackers. So you know we kind of dug in to really understand what was causing that and we realized that because we were kind of new to this category we needed to build our brand awareness. So we just picked a couple of accounts, really built up our brand in those before kind of spreading our wings into a broader amount of stores. So we spent that full year just succeeding in the couple of accounts that we were in. And in relatively short order, I think when you kind of put your mind to it like that, we were. I think we might have become the number 3 or something in the first year. So we right away, in the accounts we were in got a high degree of success. And I attribute that to the taste of our products. It’s one thing you really need the repeat consumers and I’ve always believed that as a natural products brand, we have an obligation for the entire industry to make our products taste great. Because when the consumer has a bad experience with one natural product they make an assumption about everything. And in addition to the obligation to the greater industry, no consumer is ever going to buy a snack twice if they don’t like the way it tastes.

Cindy: Right, right. So how do you go about making sure that they do taste great?

Nicole: You know, I think in addition to constantly testing our products versus our competitors and making sure that everyone in our company's eating them and loving them. It's being really ready to hear criticisms and understand how to make things better. Until you're 100% satisfied never launch a product. So many people launch just to meet deadlines or they need a new item. We've never done that at Late July. Until something is 100% ready it will not be for sale. No matter what.

Cindy: That’s interesting to hear you say. And also its interesting to kind of hear you say how you set about launching the tortilla chips. That you really did go deep into a couple markets because one of the things that I was wondering was. You know you haven't necessarily launched a new line since then until now or a major new product anyway. And that seems like different from the way many food companies operate. It seems like for you it’s been kind of an intentional strategy to go slow and to focus more on taste and perfection. Than on just chasing the next new thing. Would you say that’s been part of your success?

Nicole: Absolutely, I mean you know the tortilla market is huge and for us there was really no need to expand past that. You know, particularly for the early days of our launch. Singular focus on kind of becoming the number one requires all of your effort and your team's effort. When we felt like spreading ourselves too thin would just kind of deal reaching that goal.

Cindy: Are there kind of practical ways as you as went along this route that you kind of reinforce that focus within your team and to your employees?

Nicole: I mean, I think it's interesting is that the name of this podcast as #WeGotGoals. And you know I think every meeting should have a goal. And, you know, no matter what our team was doing, we always kept that goal in the back of our mind. In particular, when it came to the tortilla chips. I think that understanding how you’re tracking versus your goal too. So you know in an account or in a retailer, where do you rank? And how are you doing? And making sure that every time you're meeting with someone, you're understanding what you're hoping to get out of that meeting. That sounds very simple but it's also very very important.

Cindy: Right, I remember reading an example of one of your early sales calls where someone asked you what is there anything else you want to talk about. And you said yeah I actually just what your answer. It’s so simple but as you say really effective, right? That you just knew what you wanted and you put it on the line and and then you ended up getting what you needed out of that meeting, right?

Nicole: Yeah, I mean that’s an excellent example. A lot of that came from just sheer desperation in that meeting. But if you don't even know what you want your definitely not going to get it. And I think clearly articulating what you want helps people. It helps. We’re all in this together, in our industry. And certainly within the company and understanding kind of what your objectives are and how that other person can help you achieve them is really a great step in actually achieving them.

Cindy: Right, and it seems like that kind of mindset shift can also help with what you were just talking about in terms of responding to criticism too, right? That if you keep in mind that your ultimate goal, what you really want, is to improve your product. Then you can sort of start to see people who are giving you that feedback even if it's somewhat negative as people who are helping you along the way versus people who are sort of out to get you, right? It seems like that would be a much more optimistic way to look at that.

Nicole: Well I think that’s absolutely true and I mean I think that's true for everything. We're all just kind of learning and growing and none of us are perfect. So you know the more receptive you are too kind of hearing things that could be done better, the more likely you are to improve faster.

Cindy: So now you are in the middle of launching two new product lines - salsa and popcorn. Why did you decide that now was the time to do that and why these particular products?

Nicole: Well the salsa I think is an obvious choice for a tortilla chip company. We're constantly being asked to partner with salsas and plus they're just like right next to the tortilla chips in the store. And I love making salsa at home but it’s not always practical. Sometimes you just need a shelf-stable salsa that you can take with you wherever you’re going. And this is again something that we worked on for many, many years because I was very reluctant to get into salsa because fresh salsa just tastes so much better than jar salsa. But ultimately we determine that there was enough of a need for having a shelf-stable salsa that you can just take with you anywhere that didn't require refrigeration and we were able to come up with one that we were proud of. So we felt it was time to launch it. And I think also with the salsa it’s interesting, not a lot of people are doing certified organic in salsa. And sometimes we feel that that’s our role in a category too. To kind of push people towards certified organic, certainly in tortilla chips. Us coming in as a certified organic tortilla chip has really shifted the category. We’re seeing more and more people experimenting with organic particularly now that we are the number one tortilla in both the natural aisle and the natural aisle of grocery stores. We’re number one in both. People are realizing that the number one can be organic. There are enough consumers out there that do want that, that do care about that. As long as it tastes great, I think in salsa that’s something that people weren’t really pushing that envelope. The majority of salsa out there isn’t certified organic.

Cindy: So, this may or may not lead to the next question but it is about the future. What is a big goal that you have for the future and how do you plan to achieve that whether that's salsa related or are completely different?

Nicole: I think it’s interesting, I also feel like as an entrepreneur it's important to have goals outside of work as well. And you know as I look to my future, my kids are getting older. I have an almost 16 year old, an almost 12 year old. I feel like kind of stepping back a little bit and looking at my family for personal inspiration for my goals. Is how can I balance a little bit better kind of my two worlds. And the whole idea of work-life balance I feel like is a little bit of a sham. Particularly for entrepreneurs. I never unplug or turn off. Even on vacation but I do feel like it’s interesting. You know you think when your kids get older, it requires a little bit less for parents. But I’m finding the opposite is actually true. That you really do need to be more to available and more present for them as they’re getting into their teenage years. So trying to kind of figure out how to balance everything. And I almost hate to use the word balance just because it’s kind of an unreachable goal. But that’s something that I’ve been personally working on as far as future. And I know that’s not work related but I think it’s very important for entrepreneurs. To kind of have personal goals too. And some of the things I’ve been experimenting with are working from home some days. We have the company set up so that it allows flexibility so that other people can do that too. Making sure that we’re eating dinner as a family if not five, at least four nights out of the week. Kind of mini goals I’ve set along the way for us and with the ultimate goal of making sure that I am present and available as my kids kind of enter this next phase of their life.

Cindy: I'm actually really glad to hear you say that. Something that does strike me. I actually don't have kids but when I think about kids growing from small children where they have a lot of physical needs and then when they need to be driven places at cetera to now. Where maybe they have as you're saying like sort of higher-level needs that take more of your brain power to, to serve. Even if they don't always take as much actual time in terms of transit or cooking or or whatever those physical needs are. So I think it's really interesting the way you're thinking about how to make all of this this fit.

Nicole: You know, I think it's interesting that even for our employees that don't have kids. I think it's just kind of learning too. That is okay, doesn't make you less successful of a person to kind of prioritize your private life. And that not to make that a conversation that should be hidden away. I know that when we have people who join Late July that come from much, much larger companies,, it’s a conversation people are reluctant to have. People don’t want to say we’ll I’m not available then because I have to go to my kids school or I’m not available because I have to help like an elderly parent. Or I have to take my dog to the vet. Whatever it is, we all have lives and when you’re a high achieving person you have to not hide that. I think we all have to be okay with putting that out front and having open conversations about it. Because the reality is everybody has obligations outside of work and you know it’s not something to be ashamed of. I think it’s something that as long as you’re achieving and getting your job done and it’s not impacting co-workers negatively, we should learn how to accommodate each other in a healthy way.

Cindy: And you have sort of some different factors in your particular situation too because, you know, you started this as a family business. An

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There's something to learn by listening to any individual's success story, but when the story starts with being kicked out of high school at 15, one can get pulled especially quickly into hearing how it panned out.

I found myself at the edge of my seat while sitting across from Pivotal Coaching Co-Founder Scott Hopson for the latest #WeGotGoals podcast episode interview because that was exactly how his story started.

If you're in the training industry, maybe you've attended continuing education sessions through NASM, EXOS, The Gray Institute, or Power Plate International; if so, you've probably studied Hopson's material or done a workshop with him. He also helped launch Midtown Athletic Club, Chicago's first urban sports resort with 575,000 square feet of health and wellness amenities. And, as the co-founder of PTA Global, he's coached countless personal trainers in a unique approach focused on behavioral science.

Essentially, Hopson has worked his entire professional life on becoming the best version of himself as a personal trainer, but he's also dedicated his life to the fitness industry from a practical coaching, educational, and business perspective. And with the prestigious laundry list of titles he possesses, you can imagine why I found it unbelievable that it all started with being kicked out of school.

But, as Hopson told me during the interview, when he decided he wanted to turn his life around, he started at the source where he felt like he was always home, the one place where he felt "in flow" amidst it all - with his coaches when he was playing sports.

He held onto the memory of being coached and let that passion drive him forward. Now, helping others achieve their movement goals makes him feel alive, and he's equally passionate about training other coaches to bring out their fullest potential and thus, inspire clients to become the best version of themselves too.

The most interesting thing about our interview, though, had nothing to do with fitness and everything to do with the human behind the science of coaching. In order to go after the "what" (whether that's a specific fitness goal or any other transformational goal in your life), "you have to articulate the 'why,'" Hopson said.

Ultimately, understanding that it's not about him as a coach at all when he's in a coaching session has helped him understand how to navigate every other kind of partnership and communication in his life.

"If I'm going to coach you, I've got to create an environment for you to train yourself, because I can't do it," Hopson said. "That'd be quite arrogant and ignorant of me to believe I can. If I create an environment for you to change yourself, that affects how I communicate to you, how I listen, do I have empathy? And I apply that to my business relationships. Am I listening? Am I willing to consider the possibility that they don't only have a point of view, but they might actually change mine?"

Hopson also mentioned that he leans into his intuition to help guide his unique, nonlinear career path and what big goals he goes after.

"I'm at my happiest, and in flow, where nothing else matters than that present moment, when I'm being of service to someone as a coach," he said.

I commented on how lucky he was to know that feeling - a feeling of just being in total flow. He replied that we all have it, in some way, shape or form. We just have to notice and be open to tapping into it.

"It doesn’t happen every day, [but] there are things you can do to connect you back to it if you lose it – whether it’s prayer or meditation, or whatever it is that connects you to that thing," Hopson said.

Listen to Scott Hopson's episode of the #WeGotGoals podcast to hear one success story you likely won't ever forget. You can listen anywhere you get your podcasts (did we mention, we're on Spotify now?) If you like what you hear, please leave us a rating or a review! We'd really appreciate it. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

Transcript:

Jeana: Welcome to #WeGotGoals a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high-achievers about their goals. I’m Jeana Anderson Cohen. With me I have Maggie Umberger and Cindy Kuzma.

Maggie: Morning Jeana!

Cindy: Good morning Jeana!

Jeana: Morning! Maggie, you talked to Scott Hobson this week, right?

Maggie: I did! I spoke with Scott Hobson and he has a lot of roles which I will try to give you in the upfront here but he will do a better job of talking about the many companies that he has started. And from his career trajectory, he’s been a personal trainer, he has coached coaches. He still loves to coach people on how to help other people achieve their goals. He is the founder, co-founder of PTA Global as well as Pivotal Coaching. But essentially what he does, is he helps people move better. Whether that is individuals or people within big gyms or at really large conferences and for fitness professionals across the world. He’s been to 40 countries to teach. He’s also an author, a writer, and a speaker. And I was so lucky to get to speak to him about his goals of which he has many.

Jeana: But he also failed big once, right Maggie?

Maggie: I didn’t realize this. I didn’t know this until we were talking for this interview, but he was kicked out of high school. And he kind of tossed it out there and I was honestly shocked because he has done so many things. He is the co-founder of Pivotal coaching which is a world-wide coaching business now. And I was honestly surprised because he is so accomplished. He’s so well spoken, he’s so driven. But I learned that he did get kicked out of high school and it took something for him to realize that in order for him to turn his life around he needed to find the thing that made him feel like he was in flow, is what he calls it. And when he feels like he’s in flow, he knows he’s doing the right thing and the only thing that he felt that kind of sensibility around was when with his rugby team and when he was being coached by his coaches. He felt like he was at home and he wanted to do that more. He wanted to do that in any capacity he could, so he became a personal trainer. He kept going back to school, he kept learning more and his fervor for learning more about human movement and just how people behave around fitness. It’s a much broader topic for him then just like what happens in a coaching session. And he’s really turned that enthusiasm, is what he calls it. This spirit for understanding how people move into his life-long career. Which is huge leaps and bounds away from getting kicked out of high school years ago.

Jeana: And he feels like it’s important to coach the humans who are doing the movement and not actually coach the movement. Which is an interesting semantic issue, it’s an interesting word choice. What does he mean by that and how does that fit into his overall philosophy?

Maggie: So Scott has the wherewithal to know that what happens in the gym is only a tiny part of your day. And he knows that as long as you just throw anatomical cues at people it’s going to go over their head. They have to find their why. And so he’s become really, really passionate about helping other coaches learn how to speak to people to meet them where they are and to really influence and inspire change for people on a greater level than just going through the motions of a program, of going through the workout. We say this all the time at aSweatLife that fitness can be the catalyst to you living your best life and that what happens in the gym can absolutely affect you life outside of the gym if you let it. If you want it to and he has started to focus a lot of the training and the protocols within Pivotal Coaching around human behavior and how can what coaches do in your training sessions influence how that training session goes. It's so much more of an emotional thing than just a physical thing which is interestingly a large part of the conversation that we had was just about how connected to his own emotional well-being he is. Like when he’s not in flow as I was saying, he knows it and he needs to make a change. And that's what happened when he was director of a really large facility that he's still incredibly involved with and he loves it very much. But when he was doing a role that he could do but he felt a little bit more stressed by being in it. It was apparent to him that he needed to make a change and he could be a better asset in a different capacity. So that when he could actually get back to working with people, for people and helping. Really his passion is working with coaches then he could really feel, do better work, help people on a greater scale. And so that's been his guiding force, like getting within the process, finding the joy, finding the payoff in the process is what he says. Not just that the end goal or whatever the thing he's trying to accomplish gets checked off the list. It's about feeling the way he needs to feel all along the way.

Jeana: What an incredible story of overcoming obstacles and finding your true path I can't wait to hear Maggie talk to Scott. And stick around at the end of the episode we’re hearing from you listeners.

Maggie: Thanks so much for joining me Scott, on the We’ve Got Goals Podcast.

Scott: I'm excited.

Maggie: We're excited to have you! So Scott for the listeners at home I know that you do a lot of jobs and that they probably sometimes they overlap, sometimes they’re different. You're a one-on-one coach, your a group coach, you have managed big facilities, you also coached on a global scale and your a founder of a couple companies. For the listeners can you give a little brief description of, I know you said what you do on a daily basis is different, but how you spend your days and what your general title is?

Scott: Yeah, it’s wonderful. Well I mean the single biggest thing right now is I’m a co-founder of Pivotal. We’re a development company. And our mission is really simple it's to empower people to fulfill their potential. And our clientele if you will is anyone that has a passion for movement. So what I do on a daily basis could be considered coaching - one-on-one, groups, and teams from everyday people at health clubs to Olympic-level teams I work with all of them. But my real passion is teaching and you could say I coach the coaches. So what I travel the world doing, I think I've been to about 40 different countries by now, I coach coaches on how to be a better coach. We can talk later about what that includes maybe. But I also consult. Having been an operator for 20 years building health clubs, big beautiful sports resorts around the world. I know what it takes to actually build facilities, operate facilities, manage people, sales marketing, membership and on it goes. But ultimately I think it all comes down to coaching. I’m in the people industry and my job is to build meaningful relationships and I think that’s what coaches do. I don’t know if that makes sense, but that’s kind of what on any given day one of those is what I’m doing or all of those is what I’m doing.

Maggie: That’s fascinating. Not only the breadth of what you do but the depth to which you do it. So like you're talking about working on the business side of the athletic club and building out a club. And then also building out an amazing coaching staff and helping people become better coaches. And then helping individuals also reach their fitness goals. It just runs the gamut.

Scott: Yeah, it does.

Maggie: Did you start as a personal trainer yeah in terms of profession?

Scott: Yeah, in terms of profession that's the first real professional job I had. But I've been in the movement industry my whole life the only thing that's really kept me sane through life's adventures that don't all start out the way you want them to. But that one kind of bedrock of always connecting to why I'm here has been either playing sport, coaching sport, moving, coaching people, something to do with this idea of I'm here to move and I'm here to help people move. Not just physically but towards their dreams in life, you know? So 1998 is when I became a personal trainer and fitness instructor in the UK, in London. But immediately, the minute I was in the industry I knew this was only part of what I was going to do here. And that's when I went back to school to become a physical education teacher. Which is the problem when you get kicked out of high school at 15.

Maggie: Wait a minute, should we go back and ask about that?

Scott: There would need to be some whiskey in the room. Yeah you're talking to a guy that didn't even graduate high school at 15. I left and then when I realized “oh, I probably should have stuck around” I was 24, 25 and I decided I wanted to go back and become a coach and a physical education teacher. So the problem is that you've got to graduate high school first. So believe it or not I was a 25 year old in school with a bunch of teenagers.

Maggie: Wow!

Scott: Yeah, that’s where it started for me. Actually, I answer it that way because that’s where it started, was the realization that I needed to do something different with my life. And I found out pretty quickly it was in this area of movement and coaching. That was my only real love in life, was playing sport and being coached. So how do I do that, Okay I'll go to university. Okay, how do you do that, you’ve got to graduate high school. Problem, big problem. So I had to go back in order to go forwards and then it's been an unbelievable journey since then just exploring all the possibilities in this industry, you know? And there's multiple Industries- it's not just fitness, it's not just performance, it’s wellness, it's all of it really. You know?

Maggie: Oh, yeah. And it’s a huge world. And it can feel, it seems like you have this outlook that is just wide-eyed and excited versus daunted. You know, because you talk about there being so many facets to movement, and to health and wellness. That I can get intimidated by where do I spend my time?

Scott: Where do I begin?

Maggie: What to learn. Oh my god, there is so much to learn.

Scott: There is.

Maggie: But, based on what I’ve seen and how you have grown your career. You’ve just gone after the things you wanted to go after. And created your career based on what excites you.

Scott: That’s probably quite accurate actually. For me we’ve also got passion. But I’ve kind of shifted. I think passion is a good thing. If you aint got it, it’s too darn hard to do anything. You know?

Maggie: Yeah.

Scott: But for me it’s become more enthusiasm. And it sounds like semantics but that word. When you’re enthusiastic about something. Like it literally means to be in spirit, right? It means to be, the payoff is in the process. I think you've got to passionately follow where the payoff is in the process. Whatever that is in your life. Like that burning desire to do something just because the act of doing it is the payoff. And that really sums up my career. Every few years there seems to be another door opens or something says no, you should take a left here. When my best laid plans said to take a right but something says in me says no, you’re supposed to follow that. It leads to failure, a ton actually but if your enthusiastic. The saying about enthusiasm, it's the ability to keep falling on your face and not care anyway. That’s a big part of enthusiasm.

Maggie: Well, I think that kind of transitions to the question that we ask on #WeGotGoals, which is what's one big goal that you're proud to say you've accomplished and how did you get there?

Scott: Wow, that's I knew you were going to ask it and it's surprisingly difficult to answer, right because you don't want to sound trite or have too much levity. But the reality is there's two things that all stand out. One is, one of the company’s that I'm a founder of is PTA Global, Personal Training Academy Global, we launched that out of nothing. We literally traveled the world. Me and my five brothers who created it. Not biological brothers and we asked every health club we had worked with in 40 different countries. What are your problems? What are your pains? And we built personal training certification to answer their problems. Not just based on whatever we thought was the best way to train. We actually tried to build something on what people needed rather than what we thought. Then we went out and recruited 26 of the best educators in our industry. Many of whom we were told they won’t even be in the same room as each other. They had conflicting opinions, philosophies, they argue. We got them all in the same room to write PTA Global. All of them in the same room and we launched it in 2009 which was the worst economic time. Little did we know what was coming. And now we're 35, 40 countries, you know? And it all just came from sharing a common purpose, you know what I mean? That drive, that desire to do something. So that stands out professionally as the best thing I've done in my career so far. Is to truly just go all in, we all quit our jobs with salaries and put all our chips in. And said it's this or nothing. Just once we have to try and do the right thing, rather than to do things right and it cost us everything we had. If we didn't sell, we didn't eat. If it wasn't successful, it was on us there was no one to blame, no corporate structure or nothing. It was incredible! I'll tell you that's the biggest achievement in my career other than being in it in the first place. Because it wasn't easy for me to be in it in the first place you know I talked about getting kicked out of school and I had to go back to college. I was the first person in my entire family history that has ever done anything outside of high school. And I think just having to pay for your own way you know what I mean despite life willingness to say you can't do it.

Maggie: Where did you learn that? Where do you think that drive comes from? That just openness to enthusiasm and willingness to lean into it.

Scott: Truthfully, I think for me it was just not failing a lot, but really discovering who I was in the first. I think some people it's wonderful they seem to have the playbook, they come with it. They can be like oh this is what it's like to be a good person. Or this is what it's like to follow your dreams. But that wasn't my experience. My experience was a lot of failure and a lot of pain and alot of looking at who I was at first. And then finally when you hit it enough bumps you say holy crap I’ve got to change something. The second part is you can’t do it alone. I've been very blessed to have people that showed up right on time. When I needed help so I think surrounding yourself with the people that you hope to become you know what I mean. I mean truly looking at people, I don't know what it is that you have but I want that. Whether it's their spiritual fitness, their ability to be kind, their ability to be successful in business. Like you clearly have something I don't, where I lack or and I'm unable to see. I should probably surround myself with people like you and try to learn it, you know? And it's really those two ingredients and that burning desire. For me to pick up a book and study coaching and movement or isn't a drudge, it's a joy. You know what I mean? When I'm bored it's the first thing I want to do. Wow I’d love to learn more about [...] or how did that Olympic coach win it for the fourth year in a row. Whatever. I'm fascinated with not just human movement but with the human being inside it. So I think when you're fascinated, I think that curiosity, that’s the word.

Maggie: Yeah.

Scott: You’ve got to have a relentless curiosity for whatever you’re passionate about. You know?

Maggie: Yeah, absolutely! Did PTA Global come about, you said you visited countries you visited the big clubs that you worked with and answered some of their problems or their needs. Was it also an equal part you finding those extra elements that you were excited about. Like what's inside a human being and how can we help them feel their best while they're working out. Those little nuances, did that kind of come together as the marriage. Is that what PTA Global is?

Scott: 100%, yes. if you're going to solve a problem, you’ve got to first know what that problem is. And the key to getting clarity is to ask better questions. If you keep asking the same questions, it doesn’t matter about how many ways you phrase it. So part of the fascination was what are the real problems of our industry. We’ve got 300 times more education than we’ve ever had, we’ve got more gyms and health clubs than we’ve ever had and we’ve got more billions of dollars invested in health and wellness than we’ve ever had. Yet we’ve got less human beings moving than anytime in human history. We’ve got more disease, disability and dysfunction than anytime in human history. And believe it or not we have the first generation of youth with a lower life expectancy than their parents. If that don't make you wake up like our kids are scheduled to die younger than we are. It’s supposed to be the opposite. We're keeping old people live longer and sicker and younger people are dying sooner with more sickness. So part of it was that we've got to solve this problem. But the other part wow I've got to go find something that maybe isn't there or I've got to find the missing link. There’s that journey of discovery, right? The merging of that and the guys and girls we did it with are geniuses in their respective fields. Nutrition, behavioral change, movement, anatomy, whatever it is. So to actually go to each of these leaders and get their take on how it answer that. It was, you don't get many opportunities in life to do that to. Say here are the problems let's go speak to the world's best and find out how they might solve it. And then bring it back to the people who asked for it. That really was the journey.

Maggie: So for the listeners at home what does PTA Global do or what does that certification earn you?

Scott: A couple of things. One, if you woke up today as a fitness enthusiast and said man I would love to become a professional coach, a personal trainer or a fitness professional, you have to get legally certified. Now you can do it the right way or the wrong way. The wrong way is you could go online trough some swipe your finger, take an exam, call yourself professional. Or you can go study, whether it’s 6, 9, 12 month program. Some of them are two years, actually study the human body anatomy, kinesiology, program design, behavior. Then you have to sit for an actual exam and there's a practical in a room. One of those companies is PTA Global, we created a brand new approach to becoming a globally certified fitness professional. So if you take our course whether you're in Dubai, London, Amsterdam. You are legally certified anywhere in the world to practice in this profession. So that's kind of a big deal. It very much a behavioral change approach, we say when you find the why, you find the what. Everyone’s got a what, weight loss, weight gain, whatever it is. Until I find the why, the chances are we aren’t going to get you there. So that's how our philosophy is meeting people where they need to be met. And then we have advanced curriculums. One of them is called Exercise and Stress Management. We are nothing but a bunch of cells that get stressed on a daily basis. And how I move today is as much to do with my nutrition, my sleep, my emotions as much as it is my posture and flexibility, you know? So we can go on a very deep journey with you. And that then that leaves into Pivotal, my company now, which is that my passion is to travel the world and connect those dots. With the operators, with the product manufacturers, with the educators, with the certification bodies. We work with all them to bring people together to connect dots. So we travel the world, me and Haley, creating partnerships between global leaders. Delivering education for these people, creating education for them. One of our biggest passions is to teach the teachers. When you're in a room of a hundred coaches you’re really touching hundreds of thousands of people, right?

Maggie: Sure.

Scott: But when you’re in a room of 50 teachers your reaching exponentially more. So that’s what Pivotal does. We’ve kind of gone even bigger, how do we touch the most people to empower and fulfill their potential. Whether it is the club operator, whether it is the coach, whether it is the educator. And that was really the birth of Pivotal. Was to take everything I learned at PTA Global and kind of go one layer deeper. Which is really connecting people. I can’t think of one single movement in human history that hasn’t come from those first followers finding their fanatical fans and on and on it goes. So that’s kind of our gig now.

Maggie: Yeah. So this conversation that is generally focused on goals. Is interesting to me I think to ask this question about how you’ve worked with people in the fitness world, in the fitness realm about how to tap into their why by them articulating their what. And then going through the behavior change process to get them to meet their goals. And how has that potentially shaped the way you view goals?

Scott: Utterly, completely. You know one of my most important values to me is authenticity. Sometimes I feel like saying no experience, no opinion, you know? How can you coach someone one-on-one personal training or in small group or large group and hope to not only inspire but guide them to transformation. Because really everyone is looking for a transformation. No one wants to be what they are. You want to be more than they are. You want to be the best version of yourself you can. So if I want to coach you my job really is to create an environment for you to change yourself because I can’t do it. It’d be quite arrogant and ignorant for me to think I can. So behavioral change, this whole view point is if I create an environment for you to change yourself that affects how I communicate to you, how I listen, do I have empathy can I be a GPS because you're coming today and you're stressed because you’ve had 15 coffees, you didn't eat, didn't sleep, you busted up with your partner. Okay that changed our program like instantly. How do I create on demand based on your behavior. So what that does authentically as coach for me. Man am I applying that to myself? Am I applying that to my business relationships? Am I listening when I’m speaking to my partners? Am I willing to consider maybe the possibility that they don’t really have a point of view but it might actually change mine. That’s empathetic listening. I'm going to listen at a level where I actually might realize that I'm wrong. Do you know how hard that is as a personal trainer because we always think we're right. Don’t eat this, do eat that. Stop doing that, go to bed on time., Okay, you just told them to change their whole life and you're there for maybe 3 hours a week out of the 168. So you're like 2% of their life but you've asked them to change a hundred percent of their life. That seems a bit drastic and you're not there to pick up the pieces because there's going to be a lot of falling pieces. When you ask someone to change everything. What if their partner doesn't like that? What if it means now, when everyone else is eating fried chicken. They’re saying “ugh, couldn’t we have grilled it?”. But no one else in the family likes grilled. And on it goes. So it's affected everything I do because it makes me stop and go am I applying that same principle to my life? And is what I'm asking them to maybe consider doing, have I consider the choices in my life today or this week? Am I making the right choices for myself? That's authentic. So when someone says I come in today Scott. No I didn't fix my nutrition plan, I didn't work out three times this week, empathy would say man I know how that feels. There’s no judgment. It’s just like I know how that feels. Now ask more questions. What would your block? What was your break? What do you want to do about it? That's shifted how I am in my relationships and life for the most part this aint about me, right? I wish it was. Then my script would work.

Maggie: Well it's interesting because the world of fitness has like you said kind of blown up. And everyone has a place in it in a really cool way. Brands are part of it. Different kinds of fitness have become hybrids and people aren’t just one thing were multiple things. And I think that's an awesome thing that health and wellness has become a little bit more top of mind. But I also think that creates a lot more ego about who is right and who is wrong so the idea of taking it back, maybe I’m wrong is probably very slim to none in the health and wellness world.

Scott: One of my favorite quotes I heard was in 2004, it was at a conference I was speaking at called Meeting of the Minds. And it was like TED talks back in the day every presenter got 20 minutes and they were leaders and what they did. It was incredible I got to ask to present, I was the new kid on the block. I heard this guy say, “I’m pretty sure standing here today, after 30 years as a world-class Olympic coach”, which he was and educator. “He said 50% of what I’m about to tell you is complete BS.” So everyone laughs. And he goes, “The real problem is I’m not sure anymore which 50%.” And it really struck me. That’s probably the wisest thing anyone in this room is going to say all day. There is what I think is right and there is what I know, I don’t know. Then there is what I don’t know, I don’t know. And in every area of research in every industry, every few years there’s like wow that changes what we think about technology or medicine. And yet our industry for the most part still wants to practice fitness the way we did 30 years ago. Even though what we’ve learned about the body and the mind is dramatically more evolved. So you go into these operators and you see them building clubs the same way they did 30 years ago. If medicine followed that it would be a problem, right? And so to your point, I think fitness itself needs to be dramatically redefined. Because fitness just means your fit to perform the task that you were here to perform. So what is that? Your a mum wants to pick up her kids is different from someone who wants to look better naked that’s different from someone. It’s just you know? So the industry itself could really do with redefining a little bit of its purpose I think. Because we are more wellness, we are more healthful. We should be. I think fitness itself is what could with a little bit of a tweak.

Maggie: Yeah, yeah. So moving forward, as you look down the line. Whether it's tomorrow kind of goal or 10 years down the line. What is a big goal you hope to accomplish?

Scott: I've got too many, I think.

Maggie: That's okay.

Scott: I think for me, I would love, love for us to get rid of names like personal trainer and instructor. And I’d love for us to get rid of the definitions of I’m a yogi, I’m a pilates, or I’m a [...]. We’re coaches, I know I keep saying it. We’re coaches and what’s fascinating about the word is it comes from the 14th century. Like the stagecoach, it was a vehicle of transportation that carries people from where they are to where they’re going. So I always like to say you can be a personal trainer, you can be an instructor but what people are looking for is to go from where they are to where they want to be. From who they are to who they want to become. When you’re a coach you’re this vehicle of transportation, you know? And you remember your coaches, the good and the bad. I think we’re bigger than just trainers and instructors. But what I would love to see, is if we could all come together to say this is what we agree on this is how we coach the human being inside the human body. These are our ingredients for human movement. The thing about ingredients are you can create infinite different recipes. But we’ve got to agree on the ingredients, surely. A world class chef can cook all different kinds of cuisines. But they know the food, they know the ingredients, they know their basics. And I don’t think we have that. So if I go to physical therapy [...], there’s not a lot of respect for the fitness professional world or the professional training world. There’s not a lot of respect for the group exercise instructor. You go into mind body and there is a complete dissonance between what you’re do in a yoga studio versus what you do in a swimming pool. Movement is movement. Coaching is coaching. And human beings are human beings, man. I would love for us to just have a commonality around those basic ingredients. I really would and that’s kind of what my journey now of Pivotal is about. Is because I can be in a room with physical therapists looking at movement assessments, joint mechanics, knee pain, back pain. The next day I’m at a conference with 300 people going through small group training. And [..] understand is I’ve actually given them the same ingredients, just a different recipe. It absolutely blows my mind sometimes. People go, “Oh yeah, you do the rehab stuff and you do the small group.” I’m like I do movement and coaching.

Maggie: Yeah, and from the consumer side of it. Like, it can be taxing to go to so many professionals. Not only for your own dollar that you’re just doling out to hear the latest and greatest from this party and then you hear a contradictory thing from another person. Then you’re like where do I spend my money? But it’s also like how do I get better from this injury? Or how do I actually perform better in this goal that I’m trying to reach fitness-wise? That can be really hard on the just fitness enthusiast.

Scott: Go back even more right. The person who’s not enthusiastic about it

Maggie: Right.

Scott: So your mom and dad passed away when they were say 55. You’re 53, 54. You’re one year away from the exact age where you might have lost your parents. Your sedentary, you're overweight, you're in pain, you don't move. It's not lack of information or lack of education. You need to move, everyone knows. Exercise is probably gonna do. Going to bed on time is probably a good idea. You pick up a cigarette packet it's got a picture of death on it with a cross. It's kind of very ignorant of us to think people need more education they don't they don't. They don’t need education. But they haven't found a meaningful and relevant reason to do it that outweighs the reasons not to do it. And so I would suggest that what we need to do as a movement and industry is get back to coaching human beings. Because when you find the what you find the why. But, we just got back from China, here’s my example. And it blows my mind. It's one of the hottest places to go and travel. I don't speak Mandarin. Very very to no English. Not that there has to be but it makes it hard to even get a cup of coffee let alone eat or move around. And loads of smoking. Loads of pollution. Crazy packed busy. But everywhere you go is movement. I’m not lying, there’s eighty, ninety year old people riding bikes in the middle of a busy cross-section. Music’s playing, you turn around someone’s just doing [...]. You walk to the nearest park, hundreds of old people dancing, doing pull-ups and then they drop, no lie. Light up a cigarette and get back on their bike. No obesity, I don’t see the diabetes. I see people moving in ways that make them feel good. It’s nearly always in a community. They’re not doing it alone.

Maggie: Right.

Scott: Do you know what I mean? I think we really need to look at that part of it. Is how do people want to move? What's their style of moment? What's emotionally attaching to them? Not just physically but emotionally attaching. And so we put people in boxes and there’s good to that. Chances are they've already had a bad experience most people have exercised their life. Most people have failed at it. It goes all the way back to that crappy gym teacher who told you we're good enough. There’s a lot of emotional triggers going on as soon as they walk through the door. And they're met by trainers that often are wearing shirts that are 3 sizes too small. It’s not the most enticing model of movement. And I think we can shift it. It wouldn’t take too much. The shift come from the neck up. Not the neck down. So I hope, my biggest goal coming is that Pivotal really, we just would like to leave the world a little bit better than we found it. And so if we could get more people moving more often that’s a win. But more importantly, in ways where the payoff is in the process. They move because it feels good. They move because emotionally connects them. Not, “Oh, I have to do it.” I've got to do it. Or I’m doing it just for an outcome - weight loss or whatever it is. We know that doesn't work, it never has worked. If it does is short-term. I move because I love to move. Some days I swing a tennis racket, some days it’s playing rugby, some days it’s lifting weights. I move because I just love to move. I think everyone is wired to move, we just haven’t worked out how they want to move.

Maggie: So, if we were to imagine that I were coming in for a first time coaching session with you, And it probably begins a little bit more about the conversation and what's happening neck up versus alright let’s do this functional screening and figure out where your compensations are. What would be some of the questions that you’d ask me as the client to tap into something.

Scott: Wow, wow, wow.

Maggie: A reason for moving.

Scott: I love what you said because let’s call that the client intake consultation, whatever it is. There is a movement screening involved. There is a nutritional screening involved. But it starts with a motivational interview. And so one of the first questions we’ll ask. Repeat the questions you feel comfortable with. Because if I create emotional insecurity right out the gate, I’m already a threat to you. So the first questions can’t be too deep or you’re immediately thinking I don’t know if I like you or trust you, why on earth would I tell you that. So we even teach, not just the kind of questions but the sequencing, the language, all of it. But one of the first things would be what is the single most important goal you would like to achieve in your time with me. Okay, there’s a couple of big words in there. Not all your goals, the single most important in your time with me. Another big question right out of the gate is what are your expectations of me in the next 60 minutes. Because I need you to know right out the gate that I am here for you, it’s all about you. But I’m accountable, right? If I go to the doctor and they misdiagnosis me or prescribe me to wrong medicine, I’m holding them accountable. What are your expectations of me. If I got type A directed, I like just tell them what to do and just make sure I know why we’re doing it and kick my butt. Okay. You’re not a high-five kind of guy. You just told me a lot of information on how to coach you. But someone else might say, I have no idea where to start. So giving you an entire game plan in 60 minutes is overwhelming, confusing and the opposite of what you asked for. The only thing I need to give you is the one next thing, then you do it and you’re going to feel like a success. Another question we might ask would be we get further into the questionnaire and we say 1 through 10, 10 is most important, 1 is least important. How important is it that you are successful moving toward your goal? We don’t judge it. If I say a 5 out of 10, that’s wonderful. Why is it not a 2? We don’t go to how can I make it a 10? Why is it not a 2? Because you’re already thinking that. Oh, it wasn’t a 2 so I’m not bad as I think. I’m not as behind as I think. Yeah, it was a 5 that is important to me. We’re reinforcing in your brain with your words. And you’ll get things, oh it’s not a 2 because if I don’t change now it could be too late. Or it’s not a 2 because I waited to long and my pain has gotten worse. They start to unravel the magic. But then another question and this will be the last example I give you. Will be 1 through 10, 10 is the most confident, 1 is the least confident. How confident are you, you can successfully achieve your goal? If someone says oh, I’m an 8 out of 10. Interesting, because it was only a 5 out of 10 for importance. But it’s nearly a 10 out of 10 on confidence. So you’re really confident about a goal that’s not that important. Or it could be opposite, it’s really important but I’m not confident. Two completely different people to coach. We literally have an entire script of motivational questions that are based in neuroscience and behavioral change. Not just the language but the sequence. So by the time you get to the end and you do a summary, they say how did you get all of that out of me. Number two, you clearly listened. But most important, they say I just admitted that to myself outloud and another human being. That is the start of a valuable change. Is getting clear on what you’re willing to do and ready to do versus not. So there’s not sets and reps, there’s no calories, or anything. What’s your why? And are you ready and willing to change at this time because if you’re not it’s a trainwreck. And I’d be irresponsible to offer you to do it, quite honestly.

Maggie: What I think is really fascinating about everything that you just outlined and all the questions that you brought up the word goal with. Those questions could be transitioned from a pre-coaching session to a goal setting session for your career, for your family, for how you want to set up your life at home or whatever it is. It’s how you do anything is how you do everything.

Scott: Yes.

Maggie: And so I think, at aSweatLife we do really believe that like what happens at the gym is not just that little box of time in the gym and then you leave and your gone. It’s those things that come up in there can carry out to the rest of your life if you let them. And it’s just about.

Scott: It’s supposed to, right?

Maggie: Right. And it can in a really positive way if you’re open to it. And if you say. Oh yeah, this small victory I did do this thing that was awesome. I’m going to go carry it into my meeting at work. Then I’m going to do the next thing that’s awesome. So it’s really fascinating and really cool to hear because it is just a conversation around like how do we feel about goals, in general.

Scott: Yeah. And what do I mean by goal? Is that just the outcome, is that the process. How will I know when I’ve got there. Measurably and subjectively. How do I know when I’ve actually got there. Most goals are subjective. I want to be in less pain, I want to feel better. That’s a subjective goal. How do we know when we’re there when you’ve arrived? And finally, how do you want to get there. Are you a kind of person who says I’ve got to get on the freeway and get there as quick as possible? Okay, but then it’s the freeway and it’s concrete jungle and there’s lots of in and out. No, I’d rather take the scenic route. I’d rather go slow and take in the sights. So there’s where you’re going and then there’s how you want to get there. But invariably there is going to be traffic and roadwork. So as a coach, you’ve got to be a GPS and recalculate the route. Which for me, in my experience is every session. You can just see it emotionally in people when you get used to coaching wise. Something just happened where you stopped enjoying this session, that didn’t feel good. Maybe I said something that wasn’t. You know? Or maybe I didn’t listen to something you needed me to listen. I saw something in my client, the entire posture changed. You better recalculate right now. And so for us, we’d say most people what they emotionally care about is outside the gym. There is very little emotional connection to the dumbell. So yes, in groups that’s different. Don’t get me wrong. That sense of tribe, community, relationships, being part of something bigger than yourself, agreed. But in one-on-one, I would honestly say that most people what they care about is outside the gym. They’re hoping what they transform inside the gym makes that better out. That’s what they’re trying to improve is their life outside the gym. And the people who care about their life inside the gym are the people who work inside the gym. Quite honestly most clients don’t.

Maggie: So, I want to pull it back to you for a minute. Because you’ve talked about going from not finishing high school at first. To where you are now which is cofounder of multiple companies. And a huge contributor to what we know about modern fitness today. You’ve written 50 or more accredited courses that people now go through to get their own certifications. And how you’ve gone from one step to the next. When you look back on it now, what do you think was your guiding force throughout? Or has that changed?

Scott: That’s a really great questions. Today, looking back I’ve got a different lens than if you had asked me a year ago or ten years ago, right? But the common thread is to truly be of service. I know it sounds really cheesy but from PGA Global to Pivotal to coaching people or teams or kids. And a lot of what I do is volunteer work in the community. A lot of the teams that I coach, the high schools and the local soccer leagues. It’s all volunteer work, right. I find that I’m at my most happiest, in flow. When you’re not thing about the bills or the money. When nothing else matters in that present moment is when I’m being of service to someone as a coach. Whether it’s the teacher coach, the sports coach, as a coach. And it could be 4:00 on a Friday night, pouring rain on Foster Lake shore where I coach soccer. And we’ve got out ten year old kids, our eleven year old kids, our sixteen year old high school girls and it’s pouring with rain and it’s 25 degrees. The time just flies. And you get home soaked and cold and you think I want to do it again. It’s those moments where you feel that in flow there is something going on in you. You know what I mean? There’s an internal something directing you. So the single biggest directive force is that, I find that when I’m of service to people, selfishly it seems to make me feel really great. So maybe that’s one good use for being selfish [...]. And I really do want to know that it mattered, to be honest mate. I want to know that the work I do matters. I guess I can only speak for myself but man some many times you go through life and you think did anything I do today make a blind bit of difference. Do you know what I mean? Or, in some cases made it worse. But at the end of the day you want to know that your life made a difference. To someone or something bigger than yourself. I think that’s the biggest directing force I’ve had is the sense of I think this makes a difference. I just have a feeling this makes a difference. I don’t know if that answered your question or if it was too esoteric. I can make it more pragmatic if you want.

Maggie: No, I think that it gives me goosebumps because I think that’s what everyone wants to some degree. And that’s a really special thing to find your flow. I don’t know that we can all say that we have it enough. We have probably been in flow at some point in our lives. But maybe we’re not attuned enough to saying this is it, how do I recreate this. It seems like you do have that awareness sort of around what is the secret sauce to when you’re feeling in flow and how you can keep doing it. Or keep bringing it back as much as possible. Would you agree?

Scott: Yeah. I think the struggle for all of us, myself included is I think we do know what that is. There’s just an innate knowing, you know? It like saying I don't know if I love my kids. You know you love your kids. You can’t find the words. You know, right? But life, we allow ourselves to be distracted by what’s urgent rather than important. By what’s demanding. So I’ve often taken jobs that didn’t feel good. Because the money was a safety net. Or the benefits were a safety net. Or whatever it was, even though I knew there was a big [...] I would love and yeah it’s in my industry. And then a year in you’re like, this is not me. But you go along because now you’ve got bills and kids. We do and that’s real man. But at some stage you know you can’t die with your music in you. That’s for sure.

Maggie: Yeah.

Scott: You know what I mean?

Maggie: Right.

Scott: It’s like being in flow is when you sit down and you’re writing. I write alot for work and also non-work stuff. And you’ll just be in flow and you have it going you don’t realize 3 or 4 hours are gone and it’s 20 pages on the floor. And you realize crap, I didn’t number them. Because you’re just in flow. It doesn’t happen every day. It doesn’t and there’s things you have to do to reconnect to it when you lose it. You know, there’s prayer or meditation, whatever it is that connects you to that thing. For some people, it’s playing sport. It’s dance.

Maggie: Yeah.

Scott: When you feel disconnected, you better reconnect. You know. You have to because that is really painful being constantly disconnected from your source, your flow. That’s a really painful existence, for me it was. Often, what sparks me into reconnecting is how much more miserable do I have to get before I reclaim happiness, you know? How much more self-pity, wallowing. Sometimes you have to say hold on, there’s what happens to you and then it’s how you react to it. And sometimes you have to say stop that’s enough. I’m going to reconnect to what makes me feel good. I’m going to go back to where I’m in flow. And it requires a leap very often. And Pivotal started when, two years ago. I had been at Midtown Athletic Club as their national director for five years rebuilding the facilities, re-recruiting the coaches, developing Midtown University, it was huge projects. And I realized I was getting more into operations again. More into PNLs and that’s what the job deserves and that’s what they deserve. But in my mind I thought maybe I could manipulate it to be more education so that wasn’t fair. So I had a wonderful chat with an incredible COO, John Brady. And [...] changed. It was like I need to reclaim and he said Scott just do what you love and you’re great at. That’s why I recruited you in the first place. And I went home and I realized I need to make a change. Loved the club, loved the people but I wasn’t in flow anymore. I made two phone calls on the way home that day to two leaders in the industry that I hadn’t spoken to in years. I said what would you say if I said I was available to write education, deliver education, and teach teachers again. Within 24 hours, I had a plane trip to China and I was in boardrooms speaking to these leaders. And I came home to Haley and I said I think we need to start a company. But you honestly need to stop doing one thing that wasn’t making you happy but do it the right way. Don’t just cut and run. Consider other people. And then took this leap of faith, like these two names came to me and it was like wow, they’re leaders man. Should I really call them. They picked up immediately and said I want you on a plane. And it was that reminder light that when you say yes to life it conspires to help you, you know what I mean? That’s my experience but you’ve got to do the work. It doesn’t just come. It’s not Mary Poppins sitting around and hope that if I meditate good things come. No, you’ve got to meditate but then you’ve got to take action, right? It takes a lot of work. Relentless effort, actually. Relentless effort and I think that’s the final piece. For successful people I see is, if it sounds like a lot of work, it’s because it is.

Maggie: It’s probably ten times more than it even sounds like.

Scott: Success is always hard work whether in love relationships, raising your kids, business life. To be good at anything is probably going to take a bloody lot of work. But if you’re enthusiastic and you’re in flow more often than not, even on the bad days it’s like you know what, I can do that.

Maggie: Well this has been an awesome conversation. Thank you so much for joining me on the podcast, Scott.

Scott: Thanks for having me! I hope the listeners get something out of the crazy stuff that comes out but it was an honor. It was really nice.

Cindy: He goal getters, co-host and producer Cindy Kuzma here. Just letting you know that we have coming up for you now a goal from one of you, our listeners. This is another one recorded live at the Michelob Ultra Sweatworking Week Fitness Festival last month. If you want to share one of your goals with us, whether it’s a goal you achieved, a goal your setting up to achieve, even a piece of goal-getting advice that you’d like to share you could do that and you could be featured on this very podcast. All you have to do is record it and email it in mp3, wav, whatever kind of file you want to Cindy@aSweatLife.com. Thanks and here is you and one of your goals.

Speaker: So I set a couple of goals earlier this year and I noticed that one thing I didn’t do was have accountability in a plan. So I find myself now it’s June and I haven’t accomplished the goals that I set for myself. Because I haven’t set those checkpoints to say, hey, you know how are you going to get there? Have you been doing everything on a daily basis, on a weekly basis? And then just that accountability. So whether that’s telling someone and having them check in with you, or just saying by first quarter I’m going to accomplish this and then next quarter I’m going to accomplish that. And then I just found myself not having achieved anything. So, for the second part of the year I’m going to reset and visit some different goals and create strategies that are more focused around holding myself accountable for those specific plans.

Cindy: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma and it’s another thing that’s better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe pretty much anywhere you get your podcasts including now on Spotify. And while you’re there if you could leave us a rating or review we would be so grateful. Special thanks to Jay Mono, for our theme music, to our guest this week, Scott Hobson, and to TechNexus for the recording studio. And of course, to you our listeners.

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Elite runner Jordan Hasay had a goal of winning this year’s Boston Marathon. And she had a good shot—in her first marathon, in Boston last year, Hasay finished third and ran a faster first marathon than any other woman in U.S. history by almost a full three minutes (her 2:23:00 bettered Kara Goucher’s record of 2:25:53, set in 2008).

Last fall at the Bank of America Chicago Marathon, she once again finished third, and improved her time to 2:20:57. Magazine profiles were written about her chances.

But this past April 16 was not her day—and not, in her case, because of the epically bad race conditions that knocked out so many other athletes. As Hasay explains on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, a stress fracture sidelined her the day before the race.

“You put so much into the preparation and then I got so close to being able to race,” she tells me. “When you do set a goal and then you're not able to achieve it or even—I mean, not even being able to toe the start line, that's really tough.”

Hasay took about a week to wallow (which, research shows, is actually good for you, in moderation). Then, she refocused and moved ahead. She set new goals for improving her weaknesses. She worked on strength in the weight room, flexibility on the yoga mat. She called her dad proudly when she did a 30-second handstand.

Eventually, those small goals added up to an emerging comeback. A mile became a mile and a half became 55 per week. That sounds like a lot to us mere mortals, but to someone like Hasay who typically puts in 100-plus when building up for a marathon, it's still far from her normal.

But she’s getting there, and feeling good about her prospects. When Hasay started doing faster workouts again, she and her coach Alberto Salazar noticed improvements. “He goes, it's the yoga! Your stride looks so good!” she says.

Those of us in Chicago will get a chance to see that stride in action gain this fall, when she’ll be back here with her sights set on placing higher than third and beating the American record of 2:19:36 (set in 2006 in London by Deena Kastor).

This injury wasn’t the first time Hasay has overcome obstacles. In fact, her current successes were made possible, in part, by challenges. “You can find the positive in anything,” she says. “I try not to see anything as a negative.”

She’s been running since she was 12. In high school and college, she was a legitimate star on the track—at 16, she ran the 1500 meters in the Olympic Trials. But when she graduated and turned pro, in her words, “I wasn’t having the success that I wanted.”

Like most elite athletes, she revels in the process, enjoying even the tough days. Still, as much as she loved running, she began to realize she needed to refocus to achieve her long-term goals of winning medals on an international level, at the Olympics or a world championship. “You have to see some outcomes in order to keep staying motivated,” she says.

Moving from the track to the roads, and from shorter distances up to the full 26.2-mile marathon, was something she’d always planned on eventually. Actually making the leap was scary. After all, if she hadn’t been any good at it, she would’ve had to refocus entirely.

In October 2016, she ran her first longer road race—the USATF 10 Mile Championships in St. Paul, Minnesota—and won. That gave her a glimmer of renewed hope. Now that she has two successful marathons under her belt, she feels confident she’s on the right path.

“Sometimes when you are setting a goal that helps,” she says. “If you keep trying to go back to the same thing like I was on the track—I have all these memories where I was trying to hit a certain time or pace and I just kind of failed. So maybe just change it up. It’s still running, but it was just totally different kind of vibe for me."

“It’s nice that I found the distance I was really born for,” she says.

All this came in the midst of yet another significant setback. In a sad story I’m grateful she was willing to open up about, Hasay’s mother—her best friend—passed away in 2016, after the 10-mile race but a few months before that first Boston Marathon.

Though she was devastated, Hasay channeled her grief into greatness in her marathon debut. She visualized her mother there with her, drawing strength from her memories and the foundation her family and faith had given her. In an interview afterward, she cried, saying she knew her mom would be proud.

A journal in which she wrote letters to her mother, intertwined with her running log, helped Hasay in the tough weeks and months after. So did spending time with her family—she, her father, and her brother remain extremely tight-knit. “We’re all doing really well, which I’m just thankful for and that kind of propels me forward,” she says.

Listen to her on the full episode of #WeGotGoals on Apple Podcasts here. You’ll hear more about the value she places on rest and recovery, what she cooks for dinner, and how much she can deadlift (hint: WAY more than you’d think for a marathon runner—she’s posted her strength-training routines on Instagram to prove it).

If you like the show as much as we do, be sure to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and leave it a rating and a review — it really does help. And stick around until the end of the episode, where you’ll hear a goal from one of you, our listeners. (Want to be featured on a future episode? Send a voice memo with a goal you’ve crushed, a goal you’re eyeing, or your best goal-getting tip to cindy@asweatlife.com.)

JAC: 00:16 Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen, and with me I have Maggie Umberger and Cindy Kuzma.

CK: 00:16 Good morning Jeana.

MU: 00:21 Hey Jeana. How's it going?

JAC: 00:24 I'm doing great and I'm very excited for this week's episode. Cindy, you talk to an incredible athlete, someone who had the fastest U.S. marathon debut, Jordan Hasay.

CK: 00:36 I did. I spoke to Jordan, who, as you mentioned, had an amazing debut in the Boston Marathon last year. She also ran the Chicago Marathon last year where she came in third with an even better time of two hours, 20 minutes and 57 seconds, which is blistering fast and she's coming back to run Chicago again this fall, so she was in town and I had a chance to sit down with her and it was wonderful.

JAC: 00:58 And Jordan hasn't always had the smoothest sort of training record. There was a moment where she encountered injury, right?

CK: 01:05 Yes. She in fact was supposed to run the Boston Marathon again this year and was injured right beforehand. She had a stress fracture in her foot. I mean literally, I think it was maybe two days or even a day before the race, she ended up dropping out, which was really difficult for her. But she-- we talked--you know, how I have a special affinity for injured athletes, it's something that I work out a lot, I'm working on a book about it. And she did something that I think is really common among successful athletes and people who successfully navigate injury, which was she set new goals related to recovering from her injury. So she was of course upset that she couldn't run the race and also disappointed to put a break in her training and found it difficult. But she said, OK, well what can I work on instead. She started trying to address her weaknesses. She worked more on strength and flexibility. She started doing a lot more yoga and then when she started running again, she could really see some of the benefits to that. And you know, we kind of talked a little bit about how she wasn't entirely sure how much of the benefit of the yoga was physical and how much of it was mental. But if it gives you the confidence to continue on toward your bigger goals, like it honestly ultimately doesn't even matter and it's certainly a lot better than sitting around feeling sorry for yourself. So I thought it was really incredible the way she was able to kind of navigate that.

MU: 02:17 We hear a lot about her, her resilience across this entire episode, which is really an inspiration to hear, to listen to. She has a few other moments of difficulty and sadness and disappointment in her past, but she uses them to fuel her, to inspire herself into inspire others. Can you talk a little bit about that?

CK: 02:39 Yeah. So in addition to just the, the kind of immense pressure that's on someone who's an athlete at this level, um, she had a really sad personal moment right before the Boston Marathon, the first one that she ran, her mother suddenly passed away in November. And I was grateful to, to Jordan for being open and talking with us about this. She really, as sad as she was, and as hard as it was, I mean her mom was her best friend and they used to run together, and her mom was the reason that she got into running in the first place. She really channeled her mom. I mean, during that race she talked about running for her mom so she could be her mom's shining star. She wears her mom's engagement ring on her left hand and she realized she had been practicing, grabbing her water bottles.

CK: 03:18 When you're an elite runner, you don't get water from the water table like everyone else says you have like a special bottle with your own special mix prepared in it and so you can reach out and grab it. But she had only practiced with her right hand and the bottles were on the left. So she kind of was like, hey mom, I need your help. Like with these bottles. So even down to like that really small level, she envisioned her mom there with her. And when she finished and had this amazing race, she thanked her mom and, and you know, said that that performance was for her. And that really gave her, you know, I think it gave her not only a way to help cope with her grief, but it gave her goals and her life a new meaning because now she was doing it for someone who, who she had lost.

CK: 03:55 So you know, that I know has been really--her ability to talk openly about it too, has been really, I think, helpful for other people who have been in that situation. And I know she hears from other people who have gone through losses and we all go through difficult moments. We might not all lose someone as as close as she was to her mom at such a pivotal stage. But, but I think other people definitely have really gravitated toward that moment of resilience and really taken inspiration from how she's able to still be sad and still be a human being, but also elevate herself to even newer heights and in the midst of these difficult challenges.

JAC: 04:31 What a story of grit and resilience. I can't wait to hear your full talk with Jordan and I'm sure everyone at home will love it too. Here's Cindy with Jordan. And be sure to stick around until the end of the episode when we'll be hearing from a listener just like you who's out there achieving big, big goals.

CK: 04:58 This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here with Jordan Hasay on the #WeGotGoals podcast. Jordan, thank you so much for being here with us today. Really appreciate it.

JH: 05:05 Oh, thanks Cindy. It's great being here.

CK: 05:07 So, Jordan, for those listeners who don't know you, tell us a little bit about who you are and how you spend your days.

JH: 05:14 So I'm a professional runner for Nike. I run the marathon. I've run two marathons so far. Boston and Chicago and I'll be running Chicago in 2018 again, and that's why we're here in Chicago. Basically my day is run eat sleep. I have the best job ever. I feel really blessed to be able to do what I love as living. So I'm just waking up, eating, do my first run and then maybe doing something in the gym and then uh, having some lunch, taking a nap and then doing another run. Having dinner and going to sleep, so it's pretty simple, but it's definitely a lot of hard work and training and preparation, but I just love the process of it and just, I just enjoy the routine. I enjoy every day. It might get boring for some people, but I just love doing the same thing day in.

CK: 06:09 Well, I'm definitely going to be interested in hearing how that factors into your goals because I know, um, it's one thing to have those big goals, right? But it's another thing to be really invested in the process along the way. So we do talk to a lot of, a lot of elite athletes here on #WeGotGoals and that does seem to be something that they have in common. You know, they have big goals but they break it down into step by step and they enjoy the process. So is, is that kind of how you approach those big goals that you have too.

JH: 06:35 Yeah, I think that's super, super important. Obviously you want to have your kind of long-term goals that you're looking at. Just to have that, I guess that end motivation, but it's really just about the day to day successes and I, I've been going through an injury. I had to pull out of Boston this past year because I had a stress fracture unfortunately. So it's really just been about the little wins for me right now. Just starting back. I started back with one mile and then a mile and a half the next day and said since didn't really slow slow process. So I just try to focus on, okay, what did I do well today? And uh, seeing seeing that as a win and not getting intimidated by how far you have to go to to get back to the level that I was at in order to reach the goals that I want to achieve.

JH: 07:22 So I think just just doing that, breaking it down and then having a routine is really helpful too, so you don't even have to think about it. That's--yeah, I'd say that's my number one thing. Just routine because sometimes you just--yeah, I get tired too, like everyone else. I have--my workouts are hard and the easy days are still really hard, I'm doing a lot of miles so having the routine helps just because it's like a checklist, just making sure you get it done and then you look back and say, okay, yeah, I did all this and that will hopefully just set you up for your goal.

CK: 08:00 Yeah. I'm sorry about your injury. First of all, I was in Boston this year too and um, yeah, I know how disappointing that must have been. Um, but yeah, I also write a lot about injury and athletes and I've been talking to athletes who've been injured and that does seem like something that people have in common when they get through injury is they kind of set new goals just like you're talking about. And I've seen you post that, you know, you were kind of focusing on some of your weaknesses while you were injured too and kind of setting goals in that regard. So can you talk a little bit about how that helped you as you were going through that recovery process?

JH: 08:33 Yeah, you know, it's been super fun. Uh, I just, I kind of took a week where I was super bummed out just because I put you put so much into the preparation and then I got so close to being able to race and it was my goal to win Boston this year. So that was, that was tough because when you do set a goal and then you're, you're not able to achieve it or even, I mean not even being able to toe the start line, that's really tough. So then take a couple, give yourself time to take a breather. But then yeah, I've been doing a lot of strengthening, flexibility work. I'm big into the yoga right now. So yeah, just like little goals. I would come home. I was in California for my break and tell my dad I did a handstand for 30 seconds today!

JH: 09:20 And then just just like mastering the different poses and said it's been kind of a good outlet for me and I think we're seeing it--my coach, I did my first interval workout two days ago and I did the first one and he goes, it's the Yoga! Your stride look so good! So it's really nice if you just kind of stick with it that it does, it does seem like it pays off. You know, it was really, I was so happy that day just because it's, it is frustrating. It's like, Oh, I'm driving to yoga class, JI would much rather be out running but just doing this, I don't know if it's gonna work, but just got to trust it and yeah, I keep saying trust the process, but it really is true. You just got to, got to go through it and you know, sometimes things you try stuff and it doesn't work out but you just just keep trying.

JH: 10:10 I guess that's the beauty of it is that--and also I think that you can, you can create, you can find the positive in anything. So I never really see anything as, as I try not to see anything as a negative, you know, so I think half of the battle is mental. So both my coach and I had to that example of the year say, OK, yeah, she did--this is working. Maybe my stride looks exactly the same as it did, but we're just, you know, in our minds we're saying OK, yeah, I do feel better. I feel like I'm getting more movement. So I think you can sort of not trick yourself, but if you're putting in the, like I said, if you're putting in the work then you've got that foundation. So mentally you can have that whether or not it's actually making a 100 percent difference or 50 percent,I think just having that knowing that you did something, you were trying, is important.

CK: 11:06 Yeah, absolutely. Because if you take that time when you're injured to kind of build on build on that foundation, like you said, like whether it is truly a physical change in your body or a psychological change that then you're able to kind of view that to tell yourself a story about that time that you spend it the best way you can, right? And that gives you that confidence.

JH: 11:25 Right, yeah. It's not like I, it's better than toeing the line thinking, oh gosh, the past seven weeks I've been just sitting on my couch moping around doing nothing. It's like, well, I've nothing else to do in the day, so I'm just going to stretch. It's like, yeah, I just basically telling him that like, yeah, I've been nothing to do all day, so I've just been stretching and apparently it paid off!

CK: 11:47 Awesome, well, we look forward to seeing that beautiful, even more beautiful stride here in Chicago in October.

JH: 11:47 Thank you.

CK: 11:56 So Jordan, on the #WeGotGoals podcast. We ask one big question, or we ask two big questions, but the first big question is what is the big goal that you've achieved? Why was it important to you and how did you get there? And you have so many accomplishments to choose from, but if you had to highlight one, what would you say?

JH: 12:12 Yeah, so I guess my biggest goal recently has been moving up to the marathon distance. So I've been running since I was 12 years old and mainly did the track. I was in the Olympic Trials when I was 16 years old in the 1500 meters, so far cry from the marathon. And then ran the 5K and 10K in college and then when I turned professional I just wasn't having the success that I wanted on the track. I finished ninth in the 10 k at the Olympic trials, or maybe it was 13th, I don't remember. It was far back there and I just eventually--one of my goals, I'd like to get an Olympic medal or a world championship medals, so it just didn't seem realistic if I'm not even making national teams. So my coach and I sat down and said, why don't we try the longer distances?

JH: 13:03 So I started to train for more of the half marathon type stuff and ran a 10 miler that October and won and that went really well, and then debuted in the half in January in 1:09, 1:08 something. And then, and so that went well and then yeah, just really had to work again, it's all about the process. So I increased my miles, did some longer long runs, some 25 milers--and it was tough. It's definitely different training. And then yeah, just going into Boston though, I felt super prepared. My coach one Boston himself, so he kind of knows what he's doing in terms of coaching the marathon, which is nice and I just had to mentally be really tough and not be intimidated by the distance. But for some reason on the start line I just felt super calm and super ready and I think that going into any marathon you just have to be super confident in your preparation.

JH: 13:59 And again I keep saying it but yeah, if you just go through the process then that kind of gives you the confidence that you can at least have the best shot to go after your goal even if it's just all about trying but just putting in the work to give yourself the best chance. So I felt toeing the line in Boston, I felt like that's what I had done. And so I was able to go out with the lead pack because they were going at 2:25 pace, which was kind of what we thought I could run, which was great because if they're going to run any faster, I was planning on kind of hanging back just because it's my first one and I wanted to have a positive experience. And thankfully I did. And was there, uh, the lead pack kept getting smaller and smaller and then there were five of us and um, Edna Kipligat made a big move about mile 18, which I couldn't handle but held on for third and was two minutes ahead of my goal time, 2:23.

JH: 14:55 So that's kinda what I also like about the marathon is that you can have a certain time goal. But at least for myself, I've always kind of surpassed it maybe because I just go into the race with like, I don't think you can have like a super specific time goal. You just got to put in all the prep and every buildups different and just be, be as prepared as you can. But it's such a long race that so much can change and the weather can impact it. So it's just really about having your best performance in whatever the time is going to be or the place that's what it's going to be. Well, you can--yeah, I guess everyone has to deal with the same conditions so you can kind of factor in the place more so. I guess that was more my goal and my second one was I got third in Boston.

JH: 15:40 Ok, Jordan now, no, no lower than third. So that's kind of the same for, you know, this year I want to keep moving up placewise as well as timewise. But I think that's what was nice for me is that in the marathon I just really had no expectations. So sometimes when you are setting a goal that helps. If you keep trying to go back to the same thing--like I was on the track and I have all these memories where I was trying to hit a certain time or pace and I just kind of failed. So maybe just change it up and it's still running, but it was just totally different kind of vibe for me being on the road and then just having that longer distance. So I think that really helped for me. Just having that change of pace.

CK: 16:20 Yeah. What was it hard for you at all? I mean, did you sort of feel sad about leaving the track behind or how did you kind of adjust your mindset and your goals?

JH: 16:28 Uh, I. Well, yeah, I mean like I said, I had been doing it for so long that it is, it's kind of refreshing. It's like a different sport. Uh, that's what my coach said after my first half you said we just needed to enter you in a different sport of road racing. So it's just--the track was a lot of pressure and when you've been doing it for so long and then I was so good in high school that people do put a lot of expectations on you and I put a lot of expectations on myself as well. So when you're at the top, there's really no leeway. Like you can go down a little bit bit that you just, it's, it's a lot to be able to stay, stay there for so many years. So it was just nice to sort of have that weight off my shoulders of the track and not have to keep doing the same thing.

JH: 17:16 I think we just kept going back to my training and trying different things and it just wasn't working so it's just nice that I can go and I can train for the marathon and I know it works and I know that it translates to a successful race. So you do have to, in terms of goals I think have to have. You have to do see some outcomes in order to keep staying motivated. I mean I love running. I would have. I mean I would keep running. My mom, when I finished the further back in the Olympic trials, she's like, well you know, at least you're out there and someone's got to finish in the back places, and it's fine, like you can keep doing that. And I'm like yeah mom. But like, I dunno if I, I don't really want to keep doing that. Like I would, I enjoy the day to day, but it is nice to finish a little bit higher up if you're more gifted in a certain distance. So I think that it was nice. So they found the distance that I'm really born for.

CK: 18:18 Wow, that's got to be an incredible feeling to feel like you've found that for sure.

JH: 18:22 Yeah. It was definitely kind of a like excitement and relief at the same time because we had always said again, when I didn't have success at the track, oh, you're going to be great at the marathon one day the marathon is going to be your distance. And that can sort of be like good and bad because it's like kind of a fallback. So one day if I do try the marathon it takes courage to actually try it. And then if I didn't do well at it, that would have been tough. Now it's really nice to say that I, I did do well at it and especially I think my second marathon I was, I was pretty nervous because I was like, oh, you know what, if that was just a one off, whatnot, you never know. So I think that it's only gotten, the third one's kind of nice because I know I've already had two good ones, so it's two I think is enough to say, okay, yeah, I can have a reasonably successful one no matter what, as long as I just go in and try and the preparation goes well. Again, it's all about staying healthy as I learned from Boston and just not overdoing it, so I got to just be really smart in this buildup. But other than that, I'm just thankful that that. Yeah, it seems like that's my, that's my race.

CK: 19:36 Yeah. It seems to be working for you.

JH: 19:36 Thanks.

CK: 19:40 Well, you mentioned your mom and if you're comfortable talking about it a little bit, I know you lost her a couple of years ago before that, that first race and I can't even imagine how hard that was for you, but I know that just like we were talking about with injury, you, you really have used that to inspire you and feel you end. Um, you know, you've talked about how you run to be her shining star and I think it's really incredible, like kind of how you've, you've dealt with that and I wondered if you could talk about that a little bit, if you're comfortable, how that has maybe even given some of your goals that are different and a new meaning.

JH: 20:16 Yeah, thanks. I think it's definitely been a super tough. She was my best friend and she's the reason that I started out running. She would run her six-mile route every day and when I started junior high track, not the first couple of years, but once I started to get more serious into it she'd let me run a four mile loop with her. And then Christmas, I got to run the six mile loop one year, so she was really the reason that I gotten into it and you know, why I am as good as I am because talking about goals, um, she taught me everything about that routine. And it's funny because when she passed people would say, well, let's talk about what, what did you guys enjoy doing? Like, what would you do, can you go do that? And I'm like, well, what I do every day is what we would do.

JH: 21:04 It just miss having her with me while I'm doing it. So, so I'm just thankful for that. Like it all the foundations that she instilled in me. So in a way it's like just continuing on our, our passion together. So I felt like she's obviously still, still was always with me in, um, it was really, it was in November before and I was stay being in Boston that year. So she had known about the, that I was moving to the marathon. I had just won that 10 mile race a couple of weeks before she passed away. So, you know, we had it written on the calendar to run Boston and everything, so I think in a way that kind of helped me through the loss because I was just so inspired to uh, keep training hard and that just just, yeah, it helped me through it and, but a lot of people I've seen kind of the, the finish of Boston and I was so emotional and I didn't really plan it that way but I just, I felt like in that race she was just really with me and I were her engagement ring on my left hand and I was super nervous about grabbing the bottles and my first marathon ever.

JH: 22:14 And so the tables were actually on the left side and we'd only been practicing with my right hand, so I was just thinking, "Oh mom help me." And I didn't miss a single bottles so that was cool. And then just, yeah, just having her in my head and then my dad was there, my aunt. So it's nice to have my family as well who have been just an incredible support as is my brother. Yeah, I just crossed the line and just started her and I knew she'd be knew she'd be proud of me and yeah, for just keeping going and uh, felt felt her spirit. So it was, yeah, it's just super emotional and it's still, you still definitely have your ups and downs, but I think it's important and it's helped me to be able to kind of have this platform people have reached out and makes me realize I'm not the only one.

JH: 23:05 Everyone has losses and like I said in Boston, so many people lost loved ones on the day of the bombing, so just really puts it into perspective. So I was kind of running for everyone out there that had lost loved ones and still want to go back and win Boston one day for that reason. Uh, so thankfully I'm young and have several years to try to go back, but yeah, I just, it's tough not having her here and seeing the success, but I know that she's, she would be just super, super proud. I mean everyone around me is just so supportive and has, I mean my dad's great and we've become best friends, snow and no one can ever replace her, but we're all just so close and my brother's, he's two years younger too and he's, he started training for the marathon now, so we're all, we're all doing really well, which I'm just thankful for and that kind of propels me forward.

CK: 24:03 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I saw that. He just ran his first half.

JH: 24:06 Yes. Yeah. And I, I feel so bad this--so week so I'm coaching him kind of and he, his knee is bugging him so I feel like I gave him too much, or what did I do? It's so funny to like be from that perspective. Yeah, I guess this is kind of, yeah, in terms of goal setting too, it's you are invested in that in your athlete and now it gives me a different yeah, a different perspective from why my coaches are saying, oh, how'd you feel on this run and this and that. And sometimes I feel like it's redundant, but then I realized, well you're not the one out there, so you didn't know how you're feeling. And then when he said he kind of had a pain this week, I thought, oh no, I've injured him. I've really cut back on everything. So it just, it's been fun.

CK: 24:54 Probably gives you a whole new perspective on what Alberto does.

JH: 24:54 Yeah.

CK: 24:58 Oh my gosh. So the second big question we have here on, on #WeGotGoals is about the future, about a big goal you have for the future and how you plan to get there. And you've mentioned some things here and there and obviously you knew you were coming back to Chicago and you have maybe Tokyo in, in your sights, but I don't know if you, if you had to sort of name one specific goal and how you plan to get there. Um, what would you say?

JH:

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In December 2017, I called Laura Vanderkam to ask her what I needed to know about time tracking if I was going to attempt to do it. What's time tracking? It's exactly what it sounds like - keeping tabs on how you spend your time all day, every day, for as long as you want - and I was intrigued by the prospect of attempting to do it.

After reading Vanderkam's book I Know How She Does It, I knew I wanted to track my time for at least a week to see what I could learn (hint: so much). One of my biggest takeaways was that by analyzing the data on how you do spend your time, you can make better-informed decisions about how you want to spend your time and how you're going to do that.

When Vanderkam came out with her latest book, Off The Clock, I knew there was no better time to have her as a guest on our podcast, #WeGotGoals.

We've interviewed some pretty hardcore goal-setters and getters in the past, and discussed anything from how someone might attempt to sell every cup of coffee in the entire world, to doing whatever it takes to become the fastest woman in the world.

Vanderkam is a high achiever whose goals take a different spin: she led the goal setting conversation with what she calls "better than nothing goals" - not Big, Hairy, and Audacious, but incredibly powerful nonetheless.

Case in point, Vanderkam has run at least one mile a day for more than 500 consecutive days. She talks about how that wouldn't have been possible if she'd set a goal to run a marathon or even to run 30 miles a week, but that one mile is "like nothing," she says, and she's really content with and proud of that goal and the way it makes her feel.

Clearly, Vankderkam is a process-driven person versus an outcome-based goal setter, as proven by her three year time-tracking streak. Prior to writing I Know How She Does It, she set the big goal to track all of her time for one year. Turns out, she liked the accountability it gave her so much, she just kept going. And the lessons she learned over three years of tracking time - plus input from other case studies and experts - make up the newest addition to her collection as an author Off The Clock.

What time tracking taught her All of this tracking has helped her as she sets goals and spends her time in two key ways:

1. She remembers how she spent her time more fondly and with gratitude: By looking over her own spreadsheets to reflect back on where the hours went, Vanderkam sees all the things she's done - something our brains don't tend to do without bias. Vanderkam notes that our brains have the tendency to remember the negative over the positive (a phenomenon that's been tested and proven), but she's able to reminisce on her past more fondly and strip some of those negative connotations away.

2. She's able to separate the days from one another: She also took notice of what habits she tends to fall into and asks herself, "How is today going to be different from other days?" Vanderkam does this because it helps her to expand time by making memories more, well, memorable.

"When the brain thinks about time, its sense of memory perception is affected by how many memories you have in that unit of time," Vanderkam says. When we talk about time flying by, she continues, we're experiencing the shortcut our brain takes to group similar memories together. "So that's how life starts to disappear into these memory sinkholes."

Sure, we need routines to help us make decisions quickly and efficiently, but what are we turning into a routine that would be more fun if we did something otherwise? Vanderkam encourages doing things differently, from trying something new to simply walking a different route to work to make your brain remember days differently and apart from each other.

Ready to hear all of her big goals? Listen to her on the full episode of #WeGotGoals on Apple Podcasts here. You'll hear the big goals she's outlined for the future and why she's still tracking her time down to the half-hour each and every day.

If you like the show as much as we do, be sure to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and leave it a rating and a review it really does help. And stick around until the end of the episode, goal getters. We have real life goal getting to share from a listener.

Transcript:

C:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen Geil.

MU:Morning, Jeana.

KG:Hey Jeana.

JAC:Thanks for joining me ladies. Maggie, you did the podcast today and you interviewed Laura Vanderkam.

MU:I did. I interviewed Laura Vanderkam, who is a writer, an author, a speaker. She's written so many books that just the title alone makes you just think, I need to read this book. Recently she just finished off the clock and so it has just been released. She's a time management expert. She tracks her own time. She helps other people become more productive by analyzing how they spend their time and it's a really fascinating job that she has, that she's also turned into a career in multiple different facets. So companies work with her, she works with individuals and she, she tracks her time personally and kind of describes her experience doing that as well.

JAC:Now when you say time tracking, it gives me flashbacks to agency life, but she means it differently, right? Maggie?

MU:Yes and no. She tracks her time down to the 30 minute increment, which does remind me of agency life for having to remember who you're working with and what clients you're working on, all the way down to the quarter hour. But Laura tracks our time by analyzing where she spends her time with work, with her personal life and doing life admin things. She keeps the categories really broad, but it gives her information about really where she's spending her time and what her habits are and if she is aligning what her goals are with where she is spending her days.

JAC:Super interesting and she even gets right down to the sleep time, which you'll hear more about in the episode. I don't want to blow it for you. But Maggie, I know you tracked your time personally right around the New Year, so you have experience with this.

MU:I do, I got to interview her already for just a phone conversation and ask her how to go about starting to do this task because it seems pretty daunting at first, but she, she told me not to get too bogged down or in the weeds with it. I could keep it really general, but just to keep a log and I did it in my google calendar of how I'm spending my time. And it did a lot of things for me as in terms of showed me where I was spending more time than I thought. Sometimes I would say that I was completely bogged down with some assignment or some piece of work and then when I looked at where I was spending that time, sometimes it was just in the transition of getting from place to place and so it wasn't actually with that task or whatever it was.

MU:It's just a nice way to see where you're actually spending time and then the story you create around that. But it also helped me see where I could be a little bit more productive and so if I would put it in my calendar that I was going to do it. I actually did it during and I try to do that more often than not. But when I was doing that exercise, I was super accountable to myself by saying this is realistically going to take me 90 minutes and then I would make sure it took me 90 minutes and if I needed more time I would carve out a separate hour or whatever it was later in my week so that I could be really realistic about how long things were going to take me. I was checking more things off of my to-do list and I felt like I was actually doing the things I was said I was going to be doing.

KG:Maggie, Laura also mentioned something that I had never heard of before that she called better than nothing. Goals. Can you give us an idea of what that is?

MU:Yeah. So, and I also don't want to spoil it in the episode either, but we could have talked forever about just time tracking because it is really fascinating. But, uh, the idea of looking at time tracking and how it can help you set your goals is something that we kind of focus this episode on. She talks a little bit about those better than nothing goals. And one of those, um, goals that she has was just running a mile every day. She talks about it being almost like nothing. Like she could just slough it off and just that could, she could attain that goal no matter what. But if she set even a medium sized goal of trying to run x number of miles in a week, even that could get too daunting.

MU:Like forget setting a goal to run a half marathon or a marathon, like when we're busy, sometimes our bigger goals that we want to do start to feel like shoulds or need to dos. And then more like burdens. So the goal is that she keeps pretty small and almost like a no brainer achievement are the ones that she can feel really, really proud of every single day. And I totally resonated with that. Like if I think I can't make it to a workout class, but I can do 10 squats, that's better than nothing, and it's a nice, almost refreshing take on feeling accomplished.

JAC:One other concept that I thought was really interesting and I grabbed onto was the idea that time is sort of collapsible and expandable based on the novelty of your experiences, whether you're doing the same routine things every single day or whether you're going out of your way to experience new things. I always talk about how my life every day is a little bit different, so maybe we're living very long days around here, but can you talk a little bit about that, Maggie?

MU:Yes, absolutely. So Laura talks about how our brains condense things and make things a little bit more truncated in order for us to remember things in sort of blocks of time. And when we create habits that's really valuable for being efficient and for getting more things done. Habits are a very useful tool for us, but those habits can then lead to us doing very routine things that our brain starts to chunk together and that's where we start to have those thoughts like, where did the week go, where did the time go? And so she talks about just switching your routine ever so slightly, in big ways if you can, but even if it's just walking a different way to work, it's going to help your brain think differently about a routine thing and then it's going to actually create a little bit more opportunity for you to have memories of that time and so therefore your time becomes more valuable, more memorable. It was a different and unique take on the power of a routine. I think we all agree that they're important to have, but just thinking about how to make today a little different than yesterday and a little different than tomorrow places more value on the present moment.

KG:It sounds amazing and as someone who lives and dies by my planner, my google calendar, I cannot wait to learn more about Laura's tips. So here is Maggie with Laura.

JAC:And stick around listener for the end of the episode where you'll hear from real life goal getters and what they're achieving out there in the real world today.

MU:Welcome, Laura to the #WeGotGoals podcast. I am Maggie with aSweatLife and I'm so excited to get to talk to you today about not only the launch of your new book Off the Clock: Feel Less Busy While Getting More Done, but also about what we love to talk about on this podcast, which is going after and achieving really big goals and getting to talk to high achievers and entrepreneurs and CEOs in different industries about how they think and go after big goals. And so, so this is going to be a really, really fun conversation I feel, but thank you again for, for taking the time to be on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

LV:Thank you so much for having me.

MU:So I know this is gonna sound kind of funny, probably considering your line of work, but I always like to ask the question to our guests, how you spend your days just for some listeners at home who might not know about the time tracking work that you do.

LV:Yeah, so I’m, I write books on and I speak on the topic of time management and productivity. I pretty much work out of my home office most days. That's where I'm recording this from. I live outside Philadelphia. I get up in the morning, get my four kids breakfast and ready and all that good stuff. Three of them go off to school. I have a sitter for the youngest one and then I work during the day. My work is about how people spend their time and how they can spend it better. I probably travel once every week or two to go give speeches different places on the topic, but if I'm not speaking that I'm here writing books and articles and running a podcast and blog and all that good stuff. Kids see activities after school, dinner, homework, you know, all that good stuff. So that's pretty much my life.

MU:And so you've written, you've written many books, but the last book that just came out on the 29th of May I want to hear a little bit about what inspired you to, to talk about how people feel about time and their perceptions about time.

LV:Well, I've long been fascinated by why some people who seem to have a lot going on in their lives still feel very relaxed about time. You know, some people who are, who have a lot going on, run around like chickens with their heads cut off going, I'm so busy, I'm so busy. But some people just act like they have all the time in the world and I say, well, what is the difference? Why do some people feel calm about time while others feel stressed? And so for Off the Clock I decided to explore this question more deeply and I did some research on it too. I had 900 people with full time jobs who also had families track their time for a day, March 27, 2017, and then I asked them questions about how they felt about their time so that I could then compare the schedules of people who felt starved for time with those who felt like time was abundant and the strategies that I learned from those books are what make up the book Off the Clock.

MU:And I'm sure I could ask a gazillion questions just based on that little snippet, but one thing that really sticks out to me is the idea that I think it's prevalent that we think we have to be stressed for time or kind of like we don't have enough time and that kind of sense of urgency in order to feel productive or successful. Did you feel like that coming for, or based on your research or that you maybe saw based on seeing some people that felt more productive versus not?

LV:Yeah, I mean I think time is often just what we perceive it as and there's this idea that if we're not filling every minute we're not being productive, but in fact I think the opposite is often true. Having open space in your schedule is a great way to kind of invite opportunities into your life. If you think about it, you know, having a longer conversation with someone in the hallway might lead to a new way of working on a project or if somebody who reports to you has these great ideas, she wants to come and talk about like you don't want to be like, yeah, I got an eight-minute window at 4:12 come back then. You want to actually be able to have these conversations and I think not filling every available minute is what leaves time for these things to happen.

MU:Exactly. I think about the little time tracking exercise that I did when I actually got to speak with you before I did it, and doing a 30 minute, in in blocks of time of 30 minutes all week long, just for one week I noticed certain things that I was spending time on that I didn't think that I prioritized and somehow I did and then vice versa, the things I thought I prioritized, I didn't really spend time doing so there was some disconnect there, but I think I. I probably said that I was busier than I actually was based on looking at the time, looking at the data, so I think that's one piece of this book that I love getting to read the data behind it. Can you talk a little bit about some of the overarching themes that you saw based on pulling 900 studies per se?

LV:Yeah. No, I mean I think you're not alone in finding that how we perceive time as often not the way we actually spend our time. We all have stories we tell ourselves about where the time really goes and and those are often not based on real data, like not on reality. I don't know a better way to say this, that they're not rooted in reality at all. Which is what always strikes me as hilarious when you read these studies out there and be like, Americans are increasingly sleep deprived. Well where did that number come from? Well you asked a bunch of people how much they think they sleep on a typical night. Well, what is a typical night? Did they actually record it or is that what they thought they slept? Are they remembering like the worst night in the last week or the best night? Are they thinking Tuesday night? Are they thinking Saturday night? Like what? What is this? And and and in fact when you have people keep track of it, like the Americant Time Use Survey, which is this huge study that has thousands of Americans track their time rolling through the year finds that in fact the amount of sleep Americans is getting is going up. It has risen by in a statistically significant amount over the past 15 years. You never read that anywhere like you never actually hear people say, whoa, actually, we're sleeping more than we were in the past, which is actually true. Yet we prefer the story of like, oh, we're increasingly sleep deprived. Anyway. A little bit of my own tangent on this because I, you know, I think that's so much of what we talk about in our modern society of time is not actually based on data. It is based on what people think they do with their time and it is not true.

LV:That's it. Going back to my 900 people tracking their time. I mean, there's some fascinating things, I mean, one is that, you know, people who are intentional about their time, who actually think about what they want to do before they are in that unit of time, are far more likely to make progress on their goals. I mean, that doesn't seem very surprising when you think about it, but I think a lot of people just sort of roll around with time I mean it keeps passing whether we think about how we spend it or not. And so like eventually you're gonna be on the other side of tomorrow. Like tomorrow will have come and tomorrow will have gone. But if you think about how you would like to spend tomorrow, that vastly increases the chances that tomorrow is spent doing things you care about. So not, not surprising, but uh, but you can see that in, in, in how people spend their time.

LV:You know, kind of an interesting phenomenon that is more unexpected is, is that people who felt like they had a lot of time, were far more likely to do kind of fun interesting out of the ordinary things on the March Monday that I had them record. I mean we're talking like a normal March Monday and the people with the biggest highest time perception scores were doing stuff like going to salsa dancing lessons on Monday night and you know, on some of them might say, well, oh, once you put commitments into your time, then you have less time because you've filled your time with stuff and to a degree that's true if you're filling your time with things you don't actually want to be doing. But when you fill your time with things that you want to do and that you find interesting and exciting and novel and all that, you actually feel like you have more time because in your mind you become the kind of person who can go to salsa dancing lessons on a Monday night and clearly you must be the kind of person who has time for that. And so you feel like you have time for the things that matter to you. So I found that kind of interesting too.

MU: That is so fascinating because it really is all about our perception and this kind of leads into the conversation about goals, which is something that we're pretty obsessed with a aSweatLife thinking not just about fitness goals, but any type of goal that you go after. I'm interested to know. I want to get to our big question that I'll ask you, but based on your research and the the countless hours that you've spent studying sort of the process by which people live, has it, does it make you think one way or another about setting goals?

LV:Well, I explore the topic of goal setting a little bit in Off the Clock. I think often the way people go about setting goals is problematic. We have a tendency to focus on outcomes, which makes sense on some level. I mean that's what you kind of. I mean that seems like what a good goal would be. Like I want to, you know, run a mile in 7 minutes or I want to lose 15 pounds or I want to bench press x amount of pounds or whatever it is, right? They seem like very good ways to set goals. They're specific, they're measurable. The issue is that, you know, outcomes can often be achieved by many means, some of which are good and some of which are not. I mean the quickest way to lose 10 pounds is to get the stomach flu, but I don't really recommend it.

LV:And that's not, that's not what you really meant. Like hopefully the, the reason to lose 10 pounds is that it's, it's part of a healthier lifestyle that you are taking care of your body in great ways and so I think focusing more on process goals is better, because those tend to be within your control and when you focus on things that are within your control, you have more of a sense of agency and that's just more motivational in general. I also think that setting very small process goals to the point where I call them like better than nothing goals. They're just better than nothing. They're not huge, but they're better than nothing. Also increases the chances that we stick with them. So. So one example is I've actually been running every day since December 24, 2016, so I've run at least a mile every day, for it's over 500 days now.

MU:Oh my gosh.

LV:If I had, if I had set a goal of saying like, Oh, I need to run three miles every day or five miles every day, there's no way I would've stuck with it, right? And in fact, if I'd even set a goal probably saying like 30 miles a week or something, I wouldn't have stuck with it. But one mile is like nothing, right. You know, it's, it's not that much. I can run it in 10 minutes or less, like I can run it in eight minutes if I'm running fast, but it's, you know, so once I normally run one mile, I'm fine to keep going. It's just saying, okay, well I'm just going to run that. Like it's just a few minutes, I'll run it and then it can go on my day. I can always find 10 minutes in my life to, to run. So, you know, setting a very small goal means I don't feel any resistance to sticking with it and that's what's made it possible to run more than 500 days in a row now.

MU:A small tangential question to that. By running those one mile a day, like making that habit for yourself, did it lead you to setting a goal, like since I already run every day, maybe I'll train for this half marathon? Did it lead to bigger goals?

LV:I don't know that it has per se. I mean partly because I've done races in the past and one of the things I was doing with this daily goal is kind of getting away from the whole race thing. So I was a bit burnt out on that. I can say that since I've started running a mile a day, I’m definitely faster. I've been able to run faster miles. Uh, I recently did a 10 mile race that it was just, I was running with somebody else, so I was running a little bit slower than I would have, but I felt like at the end of it I could have kept going for quite a ways. I mean, it's interesting to run a race and, and feel very strong through it, you know, and I can tell things like that with, with the running, you know, I mean maybe I'll set some other goals for right now. I think I'm happy with a mile a day. I don't know that I need to pile onto that one.

MU:Yeah, no, I, that's, that's a fantastic goal. So getting onto the big question that we ask all of our guests is what is one big goal, whether it's this year or just in the past that you've accomplished and why was it important to you slash how did you get there?

LV:Well, I certainly wanted to write books in my life. I've always wanted to be a writer and I am. And so that's pretty cool and sometimes when I have some issues with like, oh, things aren't going how I want or whatever, you know, I remind myself of that, like I could be doing something totally different with my life that I don't want to be doing, and in fact that I'm getting to write as a living is pretty cool. So I think reminding yourself of these goals that you have achieved can be very helpful for those moments we all have when we're feeling a little bit down on life in general.

MU:I completely agree with that. I think it's also very compelling for me to hear you talk about kind of acknowledging your accomplishments because that is in essence kind of using the data that you've been collecting for more than just seeing the data like you, you're, you're using it in your real life as well to notice those accomplishments along the way.

LV:One of the great things about tracking my time and you're like, wow, okay, so this is one of these kind of funny women. She runs a mile a day, she tracks all of her time, like, you know, okay, I'm a bit of a freak on some of these tracking things, but I, I have tracked my time in half hour blocks for three years at this point. Not that anyone else needs to do that. I do think tracking a week in life is very useful just to see where the time goes, but I have one of the best things about is not just saying, oh well I have time here. I could do x, y, or Z. I also get to look back on these logs and say like, Oh, you know, life, life is pretty good. Like I might feel like, oh, what am I actually doing with myself? And then I look back on a log and be like, wow, that's pretty cool. You know, in one week I gave two speeches and wrote this and also took my kids to an amusement park and went for a good dinner this place, and saw an art museum. I'm like, wow, that's kind of a lot to happen in one week. And I think looking back on my time logs reminds of those sorts of things, that life isn't just whatever your current annoyance is. Um, it's a bit broader than that.

MU:Absolutely. I think there's, I think it's common for us to complain if there, if there's a reason to complain versus think about the good and just project the good and then kind of bring in, bring in more good into your life. It's, it's easier to just lean on something that wasn't so great versus boasting about what is great. But that's what's so cool about the exercise of time tracking because it, it doesn't lie, it is what it is right in front of you.

LV:The brain naturally focuses on the negative. I mean that's just sort of an assumed state in life. And so I think you have to be very conscious of calling your attention to good things because you know, bad stuff will, will kick you in the face, but a good stuff, not so much.

LV:How, how did you, or at what point did you decide to start tracking your time? Was it based off of seeing other accomplished people? Do it or just a curiosity?

LV:Well, I think originally it was more a curiosity and because I've been writing about time management for so long and then one of the exercises I always have people do is to track their time like I, you know, had had hundreds of people track their time over the years and I had tracked various weeks here and there, you know, fair play, right? If I'm asking other people to do what I should do it as well. But, but what happened in April of 2015 as I just had this idea, well what if I undertake this project of trying to track my time for a year is what my original goal was. And it was, I knew it was going to be kind of a busy year. I had a different book coming out then it was called I Know How She Does It in June of 2015. I had also just had my fourth child in January of 2015.

LV:So it was it, you know, and it was gonna be an interesting year in terms of adjusting to having life with four kids, having this book come out, my speaking career was kind of taking off, so lots of lots of exciting things going on and I wanted to see, well what does life really look like on this sort of half hour by hour basis? So I started tracking continuously and then just kept going. I mean I got into a rhythm of it. It doesn't really take me much time. It takes me about three minutes a day. I check in maybe three or four times during the day and write down what I've done since the last time I checked in. At the end of the week. I look over the week and then save it and then I've probably every six months or so I do a bigger, deeper dive into my time log, see where the time has gone. Add up different categories, things like that, work, sleep, whatever time in the car, housework, doing whatever it is I'm doing.

LV:So you know, every, every six months or so, add that up and get the data on that. I guess I just, I wanted to see where the time went and I knew obviously I could write about it being a time management person I could probably turn it into something and I, I did and it was actually a great the project bore a lot of fruit for me, which is, which is wonderful in terms of my professional life, but I found it so interesting that I just kept going and so, you know, in Off the Clock I talk about basically three years of time tracking data and talk about what other people have learned as well.

MU:And, and you also traveled to speak, as you said, and work with companies. I'm talking about productivity and time management and so I'm curious to know maybe in that setting when you're thinking about just the productivity at work and your work life, what are some big misconceptions that companies or people have about productivity at work?

LV:Well, I think one of the worst things that happens is people start to associate work with the term scheduled meeting. Having these two become sort of intertwined with each other and, and it's very easy for companies to sort of slip into this issue of people being booked in constant meetings. Obviously other people have stuff that we need to work with and they have ideas they have, you know, they help us with projects and they don't tend to show up at our desk at the exact moment that we want them to. So hence you schedule meetings. I mean there are reasons that this happens, but when, when people start packing their schedules too tightly, you know, a, everything runs over and so, so then nothing is ever happening when it's supposed to happen. People don't just call each other because they feel like you need to have a scheduled meeting so then you're waiting for two days to get on somebody's calendar to just get a very quick answer for something that probably didn't need to happen anyway.

LV:Like people don't have space in their calendars to deal with things that come up because they're already so packed in. And so, you know, I think you really have to push back against it. The first question should always be not like, oh, are you free to have a meeting then? It’s like, well, do we actually need to meet? And so if people can start thinking about that question first or this, could we just have a two minute conversation right now and solve this issue? Like why do we need to have a meeting? Or do all these people need to be in this room for absolutely every single minute of this meeting and if not like, well why are they there? Are people being able to multitask while they're on this conference call? If so, then they probably don't need to be on the call because their presence wasn't required. All of these are good questions to ask. I think, you know, we can all waste our own time and that's fine, but when you get six people in a room and you're wasting all of their time, that starts to get expensive pretty fast. So treating time a wee bit more preciously would be a major breakthrough for a lot of places.

MU:And, and I hear you talk about, you know, time is money from, from a company or a corporate perspective, but also those realizations or kind of questions to ask apply to individuals as well. And I think about how people go after goals and then are not sure why they're not getting there and probably taking inventory and getting that real time feedback, analyzing like what are you actually doing with your time? Could I be spending it a little bit differently? Is it going in the direction towards where I want to be heading? Can yield faster, more productive results.

LV:Oh definitely. Um, yeah, I think we all need to be aware of where our time goes and when you are aware of where it's going and then you ask what you would like to spend your time doing, you vastly increase the chances that that is what you actually spend your time doing.

MU:And I love that question. Like where, how do I want to be spending my time? And another question that you pose in off the clock is how is today going to be different from other days, which really spoke to me. Can you, can you talk a little bit more about, I guess the power behind asking questions like that and if there are other ones that you typically ask yourself?

LV:Yeah, I mean the reason to ask why is today different from other days is that adult life winds up having a high degree of similarity day today. You know, if you think about when you were a kid and you're experiencing a lot of firsts and new things and you're like a teenager or something, you have a lot of memories of this time because of that novelty. The brain, when it thinks about time, its sense of time perception is affected by how many memories you have of that unit of time. So if you think about like the first day of a vacation to somewhere interesting, it seems very long because your brain is taking in all this new information. It doesn't know what of it is important. So it's trying to remember all of it and that makes time seem a lot faster than if you're just doing the same thing day in, day out.

LV:I mean, if you've commuted to work in the same way for the past like 500 days, you're not—your brain is that remembering each of those 500 days of sort of just remembers one day and and so that's how life starts to disappear into these memory sinkholes that whole years pass by without seeming very different from each other. So, you know, some of this is inevitable. I mean, I'm not saying you need to commute 500 different ways to work because that's not really gonna happen. But if you ask yourself this question, how is today different from other days, then that can nudge you to think about how I could make today slightly more memorable. Like could I plan in some mini adventure into my day? Like let's say you always walk by some little stationery store on your way into work from the parking garage.

LV:And you’re like, oh, I should stop there sometime. Well, why don't you do it? Go in there, explore it, see maybe you'll find something really cool or, you know, grab your colleagues and go have a picnic lunch somewhere. Um, or maybe you go for a bike ride on that trail you've been eyeing after work or try a new restaurant or something, you know, there's just a million ways you could do little tiny adventures into your life or put in some sort of emotional intensity like speak to someone you've been meaning to speak to and actually have a good conversation with them. But doing these things makes a day memorable and when you have more memories of a day, then time seems to expand and that's what keeps time some sort of slipping through our fingers.

MU:That's so, so fascinating to me because that is when I think about wanting to achieve big things, ultimately it's every single day that would get me there and doing something like that means everyday becomes more meaningful. Like you say, like you talk about the process being the ultimate goal, setting yourself up for success when you elevate the process. So I love that because it makes it tangible. It makes it doable every single day.

LV:Yeah. No, I think that that, I mean we can't do everything every single day, but certainly how we live our daily lives is important.

MU:So this leads me to the next big question. What is a big goal now that you want to go after in the future or that you are going after and how do you plan on getting there?

LV:Well, let's see. I mean I do set goals. I think one interesting goal that I'm trying to think about is a philanthropic goal and I know that sounds funny, like I'm not, you know, Bill Gates here, but we could all be more intentional about our charitable giving. Like, what we give money to and what we're hoping to do with it and I would like to spend some time this year thinking about that. I have an interest in new music and I have been a donor for a choir I was part of for years in New York. I left New York but I've still donated money to it that runs a competition for young composers that comes up with new music every year and I've enjoyed doing that and I'd like to do more of that. I'd like to have some more new music come to be, new choral music come to be and you know, it's generally less expensive than you might think to support this sort of thing, but you know, being a real patron of the arts in that sense, would be cool. I want to think about how I want to go about doing that.

MU:Very cool. So, so I want to make sure that people know how, how they can find you. Not only can they now buy your book, Off the Clock, Feel Less Busy While Getting More Done. They can listen to your podcast, Best of Both Worlds. And then how else can people find you and what do you want them to know about all of these different channels?

LV:Uh, yes. You can come find me at my website, LauraVanderkam.com. Listen to my podcast, the Best of Both Worlds and the check out my time management books like Off the Clock, which is recently out now on May 29 and the others as well.

MU:And if people want to start time tracking, you have some sources for them to go about this process on your website too.

LV:Yeah, if you come to my website, you can fill out the subscription form. I'll mail you a time log. You can do that. You can also just Google Vanderkam manage your time if you want to find it directly. But yeah, you can download these timesheets. Use the 30-minute log, which is what I do. The 15-minute log is also there. Some people like to get a little bit more granular on their time tracking details. So yeah, no, I think it's really fascinating to see where the time goes and once you do you can decide what you like, what you don’t; celebrate what's working and maybe change things that aren't.

MU:I love it. Thank you so much for spending the time, the 30 minutes of precious time on your calendar to speak with me for the podcast. It was, it was a wonderful conversation.

LV:Well thank you so much.

CK:Hey, goal-getters! This is co host and producer Cindy Kuzma here. Just checking into the to know that we are once again bringing you a goal from one of you, a goal-getter out in the community, this one we recorded live at the SweatWorkingWeek Michelob Ultra Fitness Festival last month, and hey, if you'd like to hear about your goal, if you have one in mind or one that you've accomplished or one that you're setting your sights on and you want to tell us about it, we would love to have you as part of this podcast. So here's what you can do. You can record a quick audio memo on your iphone, android, whatever kind of phone you have, and email it to me, cindy@asweatlife.com, and you could be on this very podcast. Just say your name, where you're from, and then tell us about your goal. Thank you so much for listening and here is one of your goals.

M:My name is Meg, I'm from St Louis, but I've lived in Chicago for just over two years and a big goal that I have for the future that I'm currently working on is to really dive into fitness and wellness as more of a career path and something that I'm doing currently is I'm studying for my NASM certification, which hopefully I will be certified very soon and then from there just doing more and more events like this, networking with people, meeting with lots of likeminded individuals in both of the industries of wellness and fitness and just learning as much as I can and hopefully eventually creating a client base and just helping people as much as I can with my knowledge and growing knowledge and fitness and nutrition and holistic wellness.

CK:This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and while you're there, please leave us a rating or review. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Laura Vanderkam; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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Julie Smolyanksy is a tough woman to nail down.

Not in terms of her schedule — although she is all over the place, having recently published her first book, The Kefir Cookbook, while running Lifeway Foods full-time as CEO and President.

Instead, over the course of our conversation on the #WeGotGoals podcast, I found myself trying — and repeatedly failing — to put Smolyanksy neatly in a box that I could easily write 500 words on in a blog post.

Smolyanksy is a CEO/President, sure. But she's also been the first female CEO of a publicly held firm (when she took over Lifeway Foods in 2002 after her father's unexpected death). She's a mother and a feminist activist, identities that drive her decisions as a businesswoman who wants to set a strong example for her daughters. She's an immigrant who came to the United States as an infant with her parents, who brought kefir with them as a taste of Eastern Europe and later turned it into a $12 million business (up to $120 million in 2017). She's sharp as a tack and incredibly organized and detail-oriented, but she's a believer in holistic health and says things like "the universe is going to give me what I need" without a hint of irony.

Needless to say, my head was spinning as we sat down to talk, knowing there were so many dimensions to this woman. But interestingly, one of the things we talked about was the benefit of ignoring your brain and listening to your gut, something Smolyansky got a crash course in when she lost her phone in Mexico for a few days.

"It was like sort of the universe doing a wake up call like 'Julie, stop, stop, slow down, stop, listen to yourself, listen to your body, you're spinning out of control,'" Smolyanksy revealed.

Without her phone to distract her outwardly, Smolyanksy spent her days doing yoga, meditating, and journaling, only to find that hip pain she had dealt with since pregnancy had mysteriously disappeared after a particularly cathartic meditation.

"I think that was this moment of following my intuition," mused Smolyanksy, noting how after that realization, she was able to look back in her life at times she had ignored her gut instincts only to regret it later.

Today, Smolyanksy hones her intuition through regular SoulCycle classes, running, enjoying the occasional glass of red wine — and of course, incorporating kefir into her diet regularly.

"What we're learning now about the microbiome, I am blown away by how important it is having that gut, which we call a second brain now, how important it is to have one that's running well. When it's healthy, it's like magic."

Listen to Smolyanksy's episode of #WeGotGoals wherever you get your podcasts to learn more about taking over the family business during a tumultuous, grief-filled time, plus how she feels her identity as a feminist impacts her daughters and what it's like to be the only young, immigrant female CEO in a room full of old, white males. To get more of #WeGotGoals, make sure you subscribe and leave a rating or a review so others can hear these stories, too.

Psst... don't stop listening when the interview portion is over. We saved a few minutes at the end of the podcast to devote to real-life goal-getters like you, and we'll hear from one inspiring goal-getter each week.

Start Transcript:

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JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen and with me I have Maggie Umberger and Kristin Geil.

KG: Good morning, Jeana.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning and today Kristen, you talk to a real boss.

KG: Yes. I talked to Julie Smolansky who is the president and CEO of Lifeway Kefir.

JAC: And Julie was not the first president and CEO of Lifeway Kefir. She sort of stumbled into or was thrust into that role under some not so ideal circumstances, but really thrived there, right?

KG: Yeah, exactly. So Lifeway Kefir is Julie's family business. It was started by her father. Her mom contributed a lot as well, and she and her brother actually both grew up working for her father and learning the ins and outs of running Lifeway Kefir. Then in 2002, her dad passed away very suddenly from a heart attack and at that time Lifeway Kefir was about a $12,000,000 business. Julie took over the next day as CEO and president and began running the company. It made her the youngest female to be the CEO of a publicly held company at that time. She was somewhere around 27, so very young, but since she's been in that role, she has grown Lifeway Kefir to $120,000,000 as of last year, 2017. So we talked a little bit about how tough it must have been to be thrown into the CEO role in such dark circumstances, but she actually had a really unique perspective on it. She thought that having to take over as CEO right away was her father's way of leaving her a project where she could direct her energies and help work through her grief without being totally consumed by it.

MU: And we've gotten to speak to many different CEOs and entrepreneurs on this podcast and one thing that has come up as a theme that I found pretty interesting is how certain people have talked about the importance of their intuition and how they have really, really leaned on it and making decisions. And so it's obviously not something that they take lightly and Julie is one of those CEOs as well. Is that right?

KG: Yeah, so a little bit of backstory. We obviously talked a lot about Lifeway Kefir and how kefir is so good for your gut health with all of the probiotics, so in the biological sense, Julie's always thinking about the gut, right, but we also talked a little bit about how she's learned to hone her intuition and listen to her other gut, so to speak, and how that served her in the business world and she told a story that you'll hear about losing her phone for a few days in Mexico and how she learned to just figure stuff out without technology and she offers some really good advice for anyone who's looking to disconnect a little bit and really hone in to their inner self and driving their own decision making without outside influences.

KG: And I think that's another thing you'll hear come through this podcast a lot is I feel like there's really two sides to Julie. You know, on one hand she's a really sharp business woman. Always thinking about her next move. She just wrote a book that recently came out. So she's very savvy in that sense of the word, but she also speaks really beautifully about listening to the universe and learning how to hone her intuition and she's a little more woo-woo than what you might expect from a CEO, especially someone who is such a young CEO in a tough business world. So I think you'll get a lot out of this interview guys.

JAC: And we can't wait to hear Kristin with Julie. It sounds like it was a really great interview. And stick around listener for the end of the episode where you'll hear from real life goal-getters and what they're achieving out there in the real world today. Here's the show.

KG: Welcome to #WeGotGoals. My name is Kristen Geil and today I am here with Julie Smolansky, the president and CEO of Lifeway Kefir. Julie, how are you today?

JS: I'm doing great. How are you?

KG: I’m great. We're so excited to have you on today. Lifeway Kefir has been a friend of aSweatLife for awhile now and we've gotten used to trying your delicious kefir products at all of our SweatWorking events and we're especially excited to have you on today too because we're going to hear more about the book that you've recently published. So thank you for being here today. First of all, we'll start off with the question that we ask everybody who comes on this podcast and that is, what is a big goal that you've achieved in the past. Why was it important to you and what steps did you take to get there?

JS: Well, one of my goals for quite a while has been to write a book and I finally did. I just published the Kefir Cookbook and it took me quite awhile to write and it was a challenging for a variety of reasons, but we did it. I'm super proud of it. I share a lot of great stories from my life, my family's life. I touch on a lot of various issues from being an immigrant and a refugee to a female entrepreneur to a mom. Um, so, you know, even though it's a cookbook, it's very personal and I, I think it was sort of like the appetizer to my first kind of entry into publishing and writing. But yeah, that I am right now just kind of sitting back and watching the book have its impact and being able to talk to my customers and various people as I kind of tour around the country and hear about how kefir has improved people's lives. It's been very, very touching to me. So I'm, I'm kind of just enjoying this moment right now.

KG: And you mentioned just now that the Kefir Cookbook is more than just an actual cookbook. I've flipped through it a little bit and it seems like there's a lot of stories of your family woven in. How did your family influenced the conception and the actual writing of this book?

JS: Yeah, so I mean, you know, my father passed away, which is how I ended up as the CEO of Lifeway. Uh, he passed away about 16 years ago now. And so he, for me, it was sort of writing some of the stories that were important to me to share that I wanted to sort of document and leave for next generations because those stories become diluted over time or lost. And so now these are kind of forever and you know, it seems a very natural platform to use food to tell these stories. It's, it's become natural for me to like share a picture and say something about it. And I actually think social media really helped me kind of find the inspiration and my voice in that. So when I, I feel like I got good at it through social media, then it became very natural to do it in a more formal published way, organized neatly, you know, strategically. And then with my mom, you know, a lot of recipes kind of were hers, you know, there's a handful that were hers that I had to call and ask her, you know, how to make things or I forgot how to do certain Russian recipes that, which is our, our background. We immigrated from the former Soviet Union in 1976. So, you know, kind of grew up with these old old worlds, Russian Ukrainian recipes, and then there were some stories that I'd forgotten that, you know, I didn't even know that she shared with me that were just kind of fun. And you know, and I think about how far we've actually come when I, I'm very humbled by these stories because, you know, my mom and dad both grew up in a country in communist Russia after the war there, experienced lots of challenges, adversities, political persecution, religious persecution, poverty, hunger, sickness.

JS: Like when I think about just how far my mom went to the bathroom in an outhouse, you know, and, and when I think about the rooms and the situations I've been so blessed to be in, it's incredibly—I just get filled with gratitude. So to be able to kind of tell those stories. And then like I said, like they’re, I grew up with them, but now they're like neatly organized, indexed official. There's a Dewey Decimal system number two, it, um, it's just, I'm just so proud of it. And then, you know, I think it's a great way to bring attention to certain issues like immigration, like refugees, like why it's important to support diversity and how that impacts and, and you know, the fact that because America, because Chicago opened its arms to us, we were able to bring kefir, which is a staple in eastern Europe here to the United States and the impact of this product have kefir of probiotics, of gut health, of us leading that conversation for the last 30 years. That becomes incredibly rewarding. I think it's a great example. So I think when I think about the conversations that are being had on a kind of a bigger level, I think it's a great example. Hard to argue with it.

KG: Lifeway Kefir is a family business. Can you tell us a little bit about how it was founded, what your first role within the company ism and how that has all grown and developed over the past. How many years has it even been?

JS: So it's been 16 years. Yeah. My Dad passed away June ninth in 2002. So I'm coming up to his 16th anniversary and my 16 years of being the CEO. So he, he had a sudden heart attack at the age of 55 and died on a beautiful sunny morning in Chicago and the next day my brother and I essentially took over the company. He was 23, he had just graduated college. He had been with us for about six, six months. I had been with my dad for about five years and I had left—I had intended on becoming a psychologist and I was in grad school, but serendipity brought me to the company kind of on a more formal way and I had decided to leave grad school and I didn't come back for my second year and went full time with my dad and worked with him five years side by side, really learned all the elements of business, kind of a lot of his philosophy and whatnot and it was a great time for us because we. I really got a chance to sort of heal our relationship because I had grown up with both of my parents running businesses as immigrants to the new country, they really, you know, they didn't, I think when we talk about balance and whatnot, that's such a luxury because as immigrants you don't even have that conversation.

JS: It's just a nonexistent topic because they're just head down working, getting their feet into the country and putting food on the table literally. And I as, as I kind of got to know my dad and some of his challenges I, a different level of respect sort of started to happen or just like an understanding of how much that both him and my mother had taken on. Not that they were perfect, but it's just, uh, a different level of understanding. So anyways, he passed away. I ended up taking over with my brother. I become the CEO. He's the CFO and we just grow it from about 12 million to about 130 today. We're, I feel like on the cusp of another kind of growth spurt right now. Of course, probiotics are having a moment as everyone knows. Gut health is having a moment. I don't think it's going away.

JS: We're just learning about the microbiome and the bacteria that that is so critical for our health and wellbeing. You know, it's a 2000-year-old product that's just making its way here to the United States. It's 30 years is nothing actually considering its long 2,000 year history. What our relatives knew in the Caucus mountains in Europe, they said that 2000 years ago when they tried this product that they had a sense of wellbeing when they consumed it, they called it the champagne of dairy and a gift from the gods and they intuitively in their gut, you know, no pun intended, kind of realized and knew that they felt good when they consumed kefir. Well, fast forward to 1908, Élie Metchnikoff did the first science research around kefir and its influence on our health and our wellbeing and he won the Nobel Prize for it. So for now, the last hundred years we've had science and medical research backing up what and our ancestors knew intuitively that kefir is actually really good for you, very beneficial to the body.

JS: And so in the last hundred years, we've just advanced on that research and science and it's now, it's like unbelievable what's happening, the incredible breakthroughs that are happening, even we knew that it was good for your digestive and your immunity, you know, your health from a physical perspective. But now we're learning that it's even beneficial for mental health. So we now know that gut health influences your stress, anxiety, depression, all of the mental health and, and like incredible research that's coming out around microbiome and mental health, but all health. And so, you know, we're, we're just really excited about kind of sharing that information. I mean, it survived by word of mouth, by storytelling, by oral history and storytelling, word of mouth. And now with social media, that of course elevates and explodes it and so we can really get the word out around the, you know, when you make certain food choices and certain lifestyle choices, you choose to heal yourself.

JS: You choose to love yourself. You choose to love your family or community for a very like, you know, there's no risk. It's not like a pharmaceutical drug that has side effects. There's the only side effect is that you feel good, you know, that's the, that's the impact. So that becomes incredibly rewarding to try to get it into the hands into as many people get this information out and support communities that are trying to do this. Um, I think that's kind of if, if, if that's the purpose, my life purpose, then I think I've lived a good life. Yeah.

KG: When you took over Lifeway Foods in 2002, you became the youngest female CEO of a publicly held firm. But unlike most CEOs who have time to grow into the role, you were thrust into it really unexpectedly. What was that like and what did that teach you about your leadership and goal setting style?

JS: Yeah, I mean it was incredibly challenging. Of course, on one hand, you know, I was mourning the loss of my father, but it sort of, it gave me a place to focus and put that energy. It gave me an outlet. I almost think like he was sort of looking over me and like handed this project to me. Like here, instead of feeling sorry for yourself, go work on this. That's very much him. And I really was, I constantly thought about this mantra that failure was not an option, that my parents had gone through so much. My family had gone through so much blood, sweat and tears to get to this point that I wasn't gonna let it all just fall apart. And I mean, I had backlash. I had older men who tried to undercut, you know, my role and prevent this from happening. And it took a lot of courage for me to stand up to a, you know, a bunch of older white men and say no, and I'm gonna run it and I'm going to kick ass at it.

JS: I mean, I kind of, I knew that I would. And then I think, you know what? I guess what I thought about was that my parents came with no money, no friends, no language. They didn't have a network. Here I was, graduated, uh, you know, schooled in the United States with a network for the most part, access to network already with, you know, a $12,000,000 business now. It's just like, don't fuck it up. I just, I think that was the biggest thing is that I just did not want it to fail and I knew that we were onto something. I mean I had known that we were really on the cost of some major growth, that the country was sort of ready and just starting to be prepared to make big food changes and food habits and all of that, which all came true and being first to market with so important, which we were and I had grown up in the business.

JS: So I had sort of, these were normal conversations in terms of business. It became intuitive to me on how to run a business and I had always been a leader my whole life. I mean I watched my parents be leaders and pioneers and pave the path for other immigrants and lead in their community. And of course in their businesses. You know, my greatest role model was my mother and she had started a deli two years after settling in the seventies, opened the first Russian deli, didn't speak English, really, you know, learned English, watching General Hospital actually, and started doing international deals all over the world and she was so brave and courageous. So I had these great examples and great role models. I thought the least I could do is sort of rise up and show them what they had kind of built. And I learned, yeah, I learned what I was made of.

JS: I learned that I could really go through the fire and come out of it OK and come out stronger that I can persevere, that I'm tenacious, that I am resilient. All of those things. I knew that I was. I mean I knew that I was in the past, but I, this was like the challenge. You know, it was interesting because I had just run my first marathon the year before my dad passed away and he challenged me. He was like, you know, it started because we sponsored a lot of marathons and races. So I sort of saw, I was always athletic, but I had seen these people, old, young, all different body shapes running this crazy distance and I remember seeing like an 80, 90 year old man running and I thought, my gosh, if he can run a marathon, I should be able to do this.

JS: You know, I'd been a figure skater for 15 years. I played tennis, I rode horses, I was super athletic but I'd never been a runner and not that distance. But picked up some shoes, started running and my dad saw me cross the finish line and he didn't believe that I was going to do it. He's like 26 miles, that's crazy. You would never be able to do it. And once he gave me that challenge I had to prove him wrong of course. And, and I did. And I thought that was a great lesson also for me and that, you know, I learned that I can challenge myself, set goals, that I don't have to be the first. You don't have to win the thing. I can still do it and have a great experience. And seeing him see me cross the finish line was very important for me as well. So I'm happy that he got to see that. I think it's probably a metaphor that at that point he knew that I could probably do anything at that point I think is what he realized. And I don't know, maybe it was just his time and mine.

KG: I love the way you talked about yourself so confidently just now. Like I am tenacious, I am this, I am that like you seem to really know yourself and have that inner confidence, but I'm guessing it wasn't always that way. Did you ever have imposter syndrome when you were starting out as such a young female CEO? And if so, like what kind of pep talks did you give to yourself to pump yourself up before going into a room of these white American men and what would you recommend for other young females maybe just starting off in business, who have those same feelings of not being quite as confident as you are now?

JS: Yeah, I mean, yeah, I had to work at it. I was not always so confident of course. It was a couple things. I had a few series of success, you know, I had a few wins behind me, so when you get good and sort of master something and you can feel yourself master it, that builds your confidence. So I had done that repeatedly over and over, whether that was, you know, public speaking or writing something or launching a new product or selling a new product. All of those things help build my confidence in business and then I started to realize that every person, no matter who they were, had something to offer to being in the room, that we were all there to learn a lesson from each other and so then it, I feel like it got equalized in my head. Maybe the other person didn't know, but all it took was for me to feel confident.

JS: That didn't matter really what the other person felt. I started to see that I would show up in rooms and people wanted to hear from me. People wanted to hear what I thought about things. Think about like social media was blowing up, here I was a woman on social media, dominating social media because women were, you know, at the time when social media was sort of happening, and this is about when I was took over Lifeway, we really carved a place. Our voice really became powerful in, in social media. We're creating content, we're selling merchandise, starting businesses, all these things. And so I realized I had this asset to offer that and a certain skillset that all was very like intuitive that sometimes I saw men struggle with and so I started to feel like, okay, we each have something to offer, like you have a great skill in this area.

JS: I have a skill in this area. And I felt like there was kind of greater currency in leveraging both of those and that we're kind of all equal. And I, it was these kinds of small thoughts in my head. And then of course having children really exponentially grew my confidence because now I couldn't even live in fear anymore. It was just absolutely not an option. I had to really rise because, you know, I have two little girls that I want to create a better world for them and the only way to do that is completely to let go of all fear and to live out my true life purpose and show them and model that for them because I really want that for them more than I want anything else is for them to be able to really live fearlessly and fiercely with all the power that they can take and to, to ask for as much power that they can.

JS: We have a lot of work to make up for here as genders and, and uh, and for power. And so I spent time with various coaches. I had a group of other executives who, you know, gave me accountability that helped me in certain areas where I was challenged. I leaned on friends of course, and I have a really good support around me of people who help me when I'm not necessarily feeling at my best. And then I feel like, again, I've, I've just tried to learn like I don't think anything's really a failure or a mistake if you've learned something from it and I always want to find those lessons and so then it becomes a nice little dance that you do with the universe to keep building on those skills, keep shedding more, you know, more of that fear and just letting it go and really kind of getting to the essence of who you are, what you want to be, what you want to project out into the world, what you want mirrored back to you. Those are all kind of important things. I think that as I kind of think about the next decade, two decades of my life that I want to think about.

KG: You mentioned wanting to be a good role model for your young girls in terms of how you grow the business and in terms of how you live fearlessly. Did you have any other female CEO role models that you looked up to when you were starting out or that you've developed over the past 16 years?

JS: Yeah. Actually one was actually Christie Hefner here in Chicago. She so, so when was in college and I came home and my dad was watching CNN with a special of her being featured and my dad turned to me and said, look what she's done. She took over her father's company. I want you to do that. I want you to be like her. And I feel like that was a really important statement that he gave me.

JS: It kinda gave me a good push to know that I could do it, that he wanted that for me, gave me a lot of confidence and so I did actually look at her life sort of how she carved out her role as a CEO and then we've become friends. So I definitely lean on her just for friendship, but advice and whatnot, mentorship. Um, and I've sought out many kind of female business groups and communities. Like the Fortune most powerful women community is a great one; here in Chicago there's the Chicago Network and C200 as a national one for females and in business. But there's so many now. I mean it's really great. It is so important, I think, you know, if you can't see it, you can't be at. And it's still so rare. I mean, and I think we just dropped 25 percent on the Fortune 500 list of female CEOs and there's only like, well there were 21 last time I looked.

JS: I haven't checked the news in the last couple of days that keeps seeing those headlines. I'm guessing we dropped. So that's nothing. You know, we're less than 20 percent in Congress and there's only been like five female governors. I mean we're really underrepresented. Behind the camera, we’re like less than six percent or something. I mean, don't quote the numbers. It's been a while since I looked at them, but we're, you know, our stories are not really told our, we're not really visible. There's no like, like here I'm on the board of the Women's History Museum. There no single standing museum actually that represents the history of women's accomplishments and we've been doing and building this country and the world from the beginning of time. But there's nothing to point to concretely. And so I really start. I started noticing that there is just a lack of women in power, a lack of women in media, lack of women, you know, running heads of companies, a lack of female titans, a lack of women in every single area.

JS: I mean we’re there, but our stories aren't told, but, and we're not there at equal numbers either. And likewise, you know, where are the men raising the kids? I mean they're there obviously, but I think when we reach gender parity, where it’s like 50/50 and equal responsibilities in the household and in corporations and whatnot and throughout government and all of these areas that I think we will have a better, safer, healthier world, a more peaceful world, a more, I don't know, meaningful world. And I think the time has come. I think the last eight, nine months have proved that we are not going to take it sitting down and that we're gonna come together, that we're stronger together. That, you know, when our voice collectively it's fierce, it’s unstoppable. The, you know, when many women come together, when the most powerful women come together and share the truth about their lives, about their accomplishments, about their challenges, about all of it, that the world actually stops and listens and starts to make changes.

JS: I think we're just at the very beginning of this reckoning. I think there's going to be so many conversations. So I think the next generation, I have personally acted in a way that I have wanted to evolve, not just for myself but for the next generation. I think I, you know, I've personally been an activist since I was 15. I am exhausted. I am personally exhausted for the last 30 some years and I think it's really great that the next generation has been activated and has been empowered with tools, with social media, with role models, with voices, with many of us pulling them up and saying, yeah, go talk, share, go. You know, go do all the really important things. Hold men accountable. I think that is when we start to change the world. And so if I could have just done that for my girls, if they speak loudly and demand for some of these changes, then that's a good thing.

KG: When it comes to being empowered to find your voice and listen to your intuition, I feel like that's a lot easier said than done. And I know that's something that you sort of hinted at it at the beginning of this interview was how kefir can actually help you listen to your gut, not just because it's good for your gut health, but it might help you find your intuition and you know, dive into that mental benefit as well. So I'm curious to know what some of the strategies you've developed for actually listening to your gut are in honing your intuition as a woman throughout the years as a CEO. Yeah. I'm really just interested to hear about listening to your gut as it is.

JS: Yeah. That actually listening to my gut has become a really fun way to live. More and more, I feel that there are no coincidences, that everything is sort of happening for a reason, that we're living these sort of alternative universe lives, multiple lives, whatever. I know it sounds so crazy, but whatever. I feel like, well, we're so distracted from these, our intuition. We run such busy lives. We're completely on social media or in our electronics, just in our electronics, actually. We, I personally have sort of lost sight of my own intuition and it took me a minute to stop and actually lose my phone for three days in Tulum. I shared this story in the book and it took me these three days where I lost my phone, had to get in touch with myself, had to rely on friends and community to get me from out of Mexico into New York with no money, no phone, no nothing, and for a couple of days just shut down and think. And I healed parts of my body and it was like sort of the universe doing a wake up call like Julie, stop, stop, slow down, stop, listen to yourself, listen to your body, you’re spinning out of control.

JS: And I was, I was completely setting and I was processing a lot of things that were kind of going on in the last couple of years. And finally the world took my phone away and made me pause and a lot of things started to come to me. And I started taking notes and I started journaling and went inward. I meditated, I did yoga, you know, over these three days. And I had had this really bad hip pain for about six years and I kept blaming it on my pregnancy and I started realizing that it had nothing to do with my pregnancy but more to do with a whole lot of shame and all these other various issues. And I remember doing this meditation and just this moment of like release and this feeling just left me and it just walked away into the ocean because we were oceanside. And I started to like cry.

JS: Like I was sobbing. And the next day I notice I'm walking around through the sand and my hip doesn't hurt. And I'm like, wait, this is so weird. If my hip doesn't hurt. And then it basically has kind of stayed that way and I think that was this moment of following my intuition where I didn't have time to go to this conference. I went to Tulum to do this, this thing. It was like not the best time for me to do it, but I just said, you know what? The universe just is gonna give me what I need. I don't know what I need, but you know, I'm just going to go and I'm just gonna let it happen. And it did and it, the universe gave me exactly what I needed and it's this thing, this is this, this moment of following my gut. And I started realizing that I'd actually done it all all the time.

JS: I just didn't know I was doing it. And as I look back now, hindsight 20/20, I see all these moments where I followed my gut were something intuitively something called to me. And every time when I didn't listen, I made a mistake and I started realizing over and over again that the times that I've talked myself out of things that I have wanted to do, that I, my heart pulled me to. I lived in pain and suffering and when I started to get in touch with those feelings, both not living intuitively and living intuitively, it was night and day and the, I don't want to say luck because everything is hard work. And I—somebody just said this, I think it was Shonda Rimes just that, don't use the word luck. It cheapens all my hard work. And that's absolutely true. It's like I worked really hard to get to this point and now it's just continuing to ask myself these questions, giving myself time to think and feel.

JS: Mostly, uh, I think I've mostly lived in my mind, in my head and letting my intuition lead me now is so much more intuitive, but it's, it's very natural. It's, and it's, I think a skill set that women have because we have an amazing intuition. We have this maternal female intuition that is very hard to touch and once you realize it, it's unstoppable and it's, I think a skill that will be leveraged and can be monetized. I think corporations want that because you can go to all the Harvard schools and Ivy League schools and you can run every spreadsheet in the world, but there are some things that you need to like know intuitively in your heart. That's a very magical, special gift and I think many of us have it, which is a lot of intuitives in the world. I think that's a skill that will continue to be important in our world.

JS: But yeah, so you know, writing, taking time, processing, making positive food choices, you know, living sorta as clean of a life as I could. A couple glasses of wine never hurt anybody. Taking time to exercise and rest. Exercise, like I love running, I love spinning, or you know, I do SoulCycle. These are the times when I do get to focus on my heart and my emotions and my feelings and what I think sort of are, are things that I want to work on, accomplish challenge, learned from all of it. I think that's really what it's all about. That on I, once I started to realize that impact that food had and specifically key fair because it is just the easiest—when I learned about now what we're learning about the microbiome, I am blown away by how, how important having that second the gut, which we call a second brain now, how important when that's running well, when it's healthy, it's like magic the way that you move through the world. It's really, really special and I think it's a lifelong process. I don't think it's like, OK, I'm going to do this for a week. It's forever. It is for me at least that I think it's like healing myself is sort of healing my community. That again, I think about when I, we’re all just like mirrors for each other. So if I crave a healthy, safe world where you know there's love and there's abundance and there's safety and spirituality, then that's what I need to find in myself so that I can see that. So that became really important to me and yeah, I think there's just these basic elements we have to live for lifestyle, forever, and that's it. Leave the next generation with the same, you know, these lessons and tools. Like I feel like I definitely banged my head against the wall for a long time and it took me awhile to sort of learn this, but I've done it actually fairly early.

JS: A lot of people do it much later in life. I was kind pushed into learning this probably a lot quicker than many people do. So I think if I can expedite that process for other people, like I just think, think about the evolution that can happen so much quicker. You know, when younger people are at this level already in their teens or in their 20s, what else can they do when they're not spending so much time healing? Because that it is exhausting. It is absolutely exhausting to get to this place, but it's a lot of work, but there's so many great rewards. I'm almost there, almost reached what I wanted to do.

KG: Well, you’ve inspired me to go chuck my phone out a window the next chance I get, but in the meantime I feel like we could talk to you forever about your perspective as an immigrant, as a female CEO, as an activist, as a mom, but we have to wrap this up eventually, so we'll have to save some for the next part, the next part 2 of having Julie on the podcast, someday. We’ll close with the question that we ask everybody who comes on this, which is part two of our intro question: What's a big goal that you have for the future? Why is it important to you and what steps are you taking to get there today?

JS: Oh boy, there’s, I mean, just one is too hard. I want to write another book. Eventually I want to write sort of my memoirs. There's still a handful of years I feel that I need to live and a few more chapters left to right before I really do that. Mostly right now I'm focused on of course growing my business, but that's, that's actually not that hard. I mean, it is, it's hard. Of course it's always hard, but you know that I feel like I could do with fairly smoothly.

JS: I've mostly spent the last 16 plus, even 20 years if you add at the beginning of my career. I've spent the last 20 years focused on my career and then growing my family. I think right now I'm really focused on my heart and myself and healing myself, healing my community of course, um, was a sort of in a lot that's happened for me personally in the last couple of years. I'm just trying to process it. I want to enjoy the work that I've done and the energy that I've put out and sort of sit back and watch how, how that looks and see all of this effort and celebrate it. And I guess I want to just fall in love in the deepest, most sacred way. And that's probably with myself. That seems to be really important to me right now. I think it's time to really, really deeply, I guess fall in love with myself and the world.

KG: I think that's a perfect sentiment to end on. Julie, thank you so much for being here today. Where can we find the Kefir Cookbook?

JS: So the Kefir Cookbook is available on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Whole Foods has it on the shelf. Independent bookstores, you know, all the places that you buy your books.

KG: Perfect. Well, I know we're looking forward to trying out the recipes and again, thank you so much for being here with us today on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

JS: Thank you so much for having me.

CK: Great. Hey goal getters. This is co-host and producer Cindy Kuzma here.We’re about to play another one of your goals. This one was also recorded live at the Hotel Moxy. We've got a few more coming up for you in the weeks ahead that we recorded live at the Michelob Ultra SweatWorkingWeek Fitness Festival a couple weeks ago as well. Stay tuned too because soon we are going to have a way for you to email or call us with your goals and you can be a part of this very podcast. Thank you so much for listening. And here is your goal.

JB: My name is Jaime black. I am a podcaster based in Chicago.

CK: Excellent. And Jaime, what is a big goal that you have accomplished and how did you get there or what is the goal you have for the future?

JB: That's a good question. I was just, I was just told about 40 seconds ago that I'm doing this. So, um, you know, for me a big goal that I have ahead of me this year is a—well I guess I should say this, a big goal I had recently in the last year was setting up a podcasting class. I teach a podcasting class through a few different platforms like AirBN&B experiences and Dabble. And so getting that up and running was a goal in 2017 and now that that is running, you know, the way that it works is people physically come to my studio space in Pilsen and take the class in person. So my new goal for this year is to really get the, um, the online component of that class active. I have it on one platform. There's like three or four other platforms I'm trying to get it on. So just building the podcasting class that people can take it in person or online and you know, like we're here today because of all the podcast stuff, everything I do is just podcasts related.

CK: So, but ah, getting that online presence. So that's like a multifaceted goal, right? Because first you have to figure out the technology and then you have to figure out the marketing. So what are some of the things that you're doing to, to bring that all together?

JB: Yeah, there's a lot of steps to building an online class and I'm very new to it. I have it on one platform called teachable. And that was a learning experience because I do a lot of audio work, but I don't do a lot of video work. So taking a class that I teach, it's three hours long and building video content around that when again, I'm not a video producer first and foremost, that was a learning experience and now now that it happened on one platform, I've got to reformat in and kind of retool it so that it could live on a few different platforms. Each of which have their own format and model and you know, kind of activation level. So, you know, it's just plugging these things into different platforms. And uh, and then once it's even alive, then of course you have to actually, like you said, market it, get it out there. And that's just the beginning of getting it just posted on a platform.

CK: So how do you plan to get the word out?

JB: I think I want to tell me like, just promoted on youtube and I'm like, Oh man, it's going to be more video work, isn't it? But I think, yeah, I think that's what it's going to come down to as short video clips that are going, like help promote and talk about the class and you know, how it can help people learn how to podcast because we're here today because podcasting is really great. So this is a really good time to learn how to become a podcaster because there are resources like this booth here at the Moxy Chicago. Um, and it's just in general, it's, we're in this time now where people are really passionate about podcasts and a lot of people are really finding them.

CK: It's true, it's true. So how do people find you and your classes?

JB: Yeah, great question. So you can look at dynastypodcasts.com, it's plural. So dynastypodcasts.com with the s at the end of podcasts. I'm, we've got links to the class there and I'm always active on twitter. My twitter is Jamie black, jaimeblack. So I'm always posting my links. If you see me go six hours, without tweeting, like call my parents, something's really wrong, so yeah.

CK: Awesome Jamie, well thank you for all of your help here today and thank you so much for sharing your goal.

JB: Well thank you for letting me help with this podcast.

CK: This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and if you have a chance to leave us a rating and a review while you're there, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Julie Smolansky; and to TechNexus for the recording studio.

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If there's one thing I've learned from listening to over a year of #WeGotGoals, it's that building a business or achieving a major goal is rarely as easy as these rockstar goal-getters make it seem.

But for Katlin Smith, keeping things simple is the secret ingredient to her success with Simple Mills, an all-natural baking mix and foods company that uses recognizable, natural ingredients in place of things like high-fructose corn syrup and artificial ingredients.

Smith started Simple Mills in 2012, right after she began cleaning up her diet and cutting out processed food and sugar. Almost instantly, a lightbulb went off in her head.

"Growing up, I learned okay, food affects your weight, it affects your digestive system. But never did I think that food could affect your immune system or the other things we're learning about now, like anxiety, depression, or cancer. And it was just stunning to me that food can affect those things."

Armed with these realizations, Smith realized she had to do something to change how people eat — and thus, Simple Mills was born.

And even though the premise of Simple Mills was — and continues to be — clean, nutritious foods for a better life, Smith has never shied away from a great mission that expands beyond the grocery store aisle. In fact, once she realized how much her health was affected by a clean, unprocessed diet, Smith went home and did something I truly identify with: she made a list.

But not just any list. "I brainstormed 10 different ways that I could impact the way that people are eating and what they're eating and how many kinds of whole foods they're eating," Smith shared. "It ranged everything from going and getting my master's in public health to starting a natural food company that would help change what people are eating."

(Spoiler alert: that last one is the idea that won out)

Recently, Smith was able to participate in a life-changing trip made available through her inclusion on the 2017 Forbes' 30 Under 30 list. With about 85 other attendees, Smith traveled all over Israel, including at the Syrian and Jordan border, learning about all the complexities behind the conflict in the Middle East.

Seems heavy for something that looks like a press tour on the surface, right? Yes — but according to Smith, the trip helped open her eyes to the larger complexities facing the world, in addition to sparking ideas for how she and Simple Mills can have an impact in spaces larger than grocery stores.

"There were two key realizations for me on that trip," Smith reflected. "The first was that what we have today we can take for granted really easily, and things can change. The other thing that I really thought coming out of that trip was just how not simple conflict is."

Even more surprising about the trip? It was entirely paid for by Schusterman, the company who invited Smith and the other attendees. So what was the catch?

No catch, revealed Smith — just a firm reminder that with great power comes great responsibility, and all the standout attendees on the trip had the means to truly change the world. Fresh off the trip when we talked, Smith takes that responsibility incredibly seriously and intends to start by using Simple Mills as a platform to change the food industry. From there, the sky's the limit.

"I do plan on doing more things with my life than just Simple Mills. There are a lot of problems in the world, and a lot of problems to solve and I think that if you have like the energy and the resources to impact the world, you absolutely should."

We can't wait to see what Smith does next. Listen to Katlin talk to me about her goals on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals by downloading his episode wherever you get your podcasts. If you like the show as much as we do, be sure to subscribe and leave it a rating and a review.

And! Don't take out your earbuds before you listen to the end of this podcast — we've got a real-life goal from a goal-getter like you that you've got to tune in for.

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talked to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Kristin Geil and Maggie Umberger.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

KG: Hey Jeana.

JAC: Good morning

MU: Kristen, this week you got to speak to Katlin Smith, who is the founder and CEO of Simple Mills.

KG: That's right. Maggie. I got to chat with Katlin Smith who has been a friend of aSweatLife for awhile and it's been so exciting watching her company grow from when she first founded it back in 2013 while she was still working as a full time consultant at Deloitte. It was really interesting and inspiring to hear her talk about how she would wake up at 4 in the morning, bake for a few hours and then go right to her full time job and yeah, I think we got a lot of great information out of her from this interview.

JAC: And we've talked to Katlin a few times just through the years and seeing the company grow, but this is really the first time we've heard her talk about how she's really introspective. Can you speak to that?

KG: Yeah, so Katlin is a self described introvert, which I always think is really fascinating for people who are entrepreneurs and CEOs who—she also mentioned she's in meetings, you know, 70 to 80 percent of her day, so I was really interested to hear how she balances that side of her personality with being such a forward facing public persona. So we got to talking about what helps her recharge from being in front of people all the time, always talking, always in conversations and I think the tips that she offered for how to recharge as a business leader who's an introvert will be really helpful for our listeners.

MU: Speaking of being a business leader, she was one of Forbes’ 2017, 30 under 30 business leaders. So she just came back from an incredible trip to Israel and you got to speak to her just off of coming home from that trip.

KG: Yeah. So Katlin was one of Forbes 30 under 30 last year and one of the perks that she was offered is that another company sponsors a full-blown trip to Israel for anyone who's graduated, so to speak, from the 30 under 30 class. And this company covers everything from airfare to hotels to experiences. And Katlin was talking about how amazing it was and how they kept blowing her mind with all the different experiences that she and I think it was roughly 80 other people got to have. But when she and her other travelers, we're asking the trip leaders, you know, what's the catch? Why did you bring us all here? The trip leaders, were simply saying that they wanted these business leaders of the present and of the future to realize how much power they truly have when it comes to changing the world.

KG: And you know, she quoted the old Spiderman line with great power comes great responsibility. And I thought that was really interesting because Katlin started Simple Mills, she said, to change the way people eat, which is not a small feat in and of itself. But now after this trip, it really seems like she's thinking much more globally about how she and her company can impact the world in ways beyond just how we eat and where we grocery shop.

JAC: And it's important to note that what simple mills makes is baked goods and sort of the Betty Crocker-esque products that are gluten-free and made out of whole foods and whole ingredients. And as someone who eats gluten free, it was incredibly impactful for me because I am an added Cheezit in years and Simple Mills has a product, a cracker, that's just like a Cheezit. So can you talk a little bit about why she started down this journey to make this gluten-free whole food option?

KG: Yep. You'll hear the full story in the interview, but she was suffering from things like joint pain and seasonal allergies and she was trying to think of different ways that she could remedy herself and different ways that she could eat and live her life so that she could feel the best possible. So that's really how Simple Mills started. But she, this wasn't her only idea. She, at one point she said she brainstorm 10 different ways that she could change the way the world eats and Simple Mills was the one that stuck. So it's a really interesting story and I think people are going to love this interview.

MU: We cannot wait to hear it. Here is Kristen with Katlin.

JAC: Hey, stick around. At the end of this episode, you'll hear from some real life goal-getters who will tell you the goals that they've achieved and the goals they're going after.

KG: Welcome to #WeGotGoals. My name is Kristen Geil and I am here with Katlin Smith, the CEO and founder of Simple Mills. Katlin, how are you?

KS: Doing great. Thank you for having me.

KG: No problem. We are super excited to have you here on the podcast. We've had you on a panel to speak before, we;ve featured you on the blog several times, but this will be the first time that we really get to sit down and hear your story in an audio sense. So we're really excited. First of all, let's start off with the big goal that we ask everybody about on this podcast. What is a big goal that you have worked toward in the past? Why was it important to you and what did you do to get there?

KS: Yeah, so that's that. That will probably be a pretty long answer. I think starting Simple Mills was a huge thing for me. So I started this company about five years ago. So around that time I cleaned up my diet. I took out a lot of the processed food, a lot of the sugar, and when I did my joint pain went away, my seasonal allergies went away. I had loads more energy and it really shocked me because I, growing up I, I think I learned about, OK, food affects your weight. It affects your digestive system, but never did I think that food could affect your immune system or that, the other things we're learning about now, like anxiety, depression, cancer, all of these things that we're seeing skyrocketing rates of. And it was just stunning to me that food can affect those things. And so once I learned that I felt a, I felt like I had to do something, like there was just no option about it. It's funny because sometimes people ask me like, oh, how did you decide? Like how did you know if you were going to start it or not? And in my mind there was no option. It was just like I have to do something about this. And so I actually went home one day and I brainstormed 10 different ways that I could impact the way that people are eating and what they're eating and how many kind of whole foods they're eating.

KS: And it ranged everything from going and getting my master's in public health to starting a natural food company that would help change what people are eating. So it was the natural food company route that I went. And so the whole idea for simple mills is starting this food company that makes all of these kind of traditional things that you love eating, that are convenient to eat, that are tasty to eat. And instead of making them out of tons of carbs and sugar and processed ingredients and things you can't pronounce, making them out of things that you actually want to be eating more of like almonds or coconut flour or sunflower seeds, but putting it in that same like recognizable shape, texture, flavor, and my thought with that and, and I think what I've seen over the past five years is that by doing that, you're able to slowly change what people are eating so that it's not just, okay, you have to go and follow this, like this polarized diet of gluten free or Paleo, which our products are, but instead it's, here's a product that here's a way to like, eat, eat really great food without necessarily sacrificing the convenience or the flavor or what have you.

KS: So yeah, I mean the big goal, it's changing what people eat and changing the expectation of what people eat. The second thing that I'll say about that is that when you change what's out there, and I, I really didn't, I kind of underestimated this in the beginning, but when you change what's out there, you change the average of what's out there. So when you look at the shelf now in Whole Foods or in Jewel or Target or Kroger, which are all places where we're sold. We've raised the average of what's sitting on the shelf and so what that means is that other players who are sitting on the shelf also have to change their game and so if consumers come to expect, OK, maybe this shouldn't have so much sugar or maybe this shouldn't have as many processed ingredients then other players will change what they're doing as well. And so I like to say that a rising tide raises all boats and so part of our mission is not just changing what our consumers eat, but changing what our competitors’ consumers eat as well.

KG: Thinking back to when you first had the idea for Simple Mills in 2013, now we're super used to seeing things in the grocery store aisles like ice cream alternatives or dairy free milk or gluten free everything, but that wasn't the case when you first had the idea for Simple Mills. Was that an advantage or a disadvantage being kind of a outlier in the food industry when you started?

KS: I think that we came in at just the right time. I think that if we had come in three years earlier, it might've been too early because what really happened and the reason why we, why we see that today is there's this general awakening that's happening, that's happened with me personally and it has happened with a lot of our consumers, which is that people are realizing that the food that they eat affects how they feel and what they're able to do on a daily basis, and this has been in large part enabled by influencers, by people talking online about their diets. This has been kind of something that's come about at the same time that kind of this entire influencer community and people researching, well, what if I, what if I tried this, what happens? And and researching it for themselves versus relying solely on the advice of a healthcare practitioner. And so I think that without that trend, next to kind of putting our products on the shelf, I'm not sure that it would have taken quite as quickly, but now that people are making that association, it's been. It's been a lot easier.

KG: Let's go back a little bit. You said that when you brainstormed these 10 ideas that you could change the way people eat, one of them was creating a natural foods company. Were you into baking and cooking growing up, or was this just more of a whim that you decided to act on?

KS: Yeah, no, I was not into, I was not into baking growing up, which I feel like is a very unpopular answer to that question. But it, it really goes back to the determination and the belief that this needed to happen. I was and will do whatever it takes to, to make this idea possible and I think that that's one of the things that, you know, you talk about goals, or starting businesses. I think that there's just a lot of determination and discipline required to make any one of these ideas of success and so it takes doing the things that you did you don't necessarily want to be doing. So like for example, I, I'm an introvert. You wouldn't guess it, but I'm an introvert and I, I hate cold calling. It is like the worst, worst, worst thing to do in my mind.

KG: I got chills just hearing you say that I'm the same way. It sounds like the worst punishment somebody could give me.

KS: Yeah, exactly. And so like for the first year I actually had to assign an entire day per week to cold calling and I think that, not to say that baking was like cold calling, but it wasn't a passion of mine but I probably went through 90 different recipes just to get the first iterations that tasted really awesome on the market. You do what it takes to make it work.

KG: When you had the idea for Simple Mills, you were working in consulting and that had been your background for awhile. How did that help drive you and creating simple mills? What traits could you develop? What skills have you learned that helped you when you decided to get this business off the ground from a side hustle to a full time job?

KS: Yeah, so I don't think I would be here today or at least be where we are today without my background in consulting. It was just such a fantastic place to start my career. So I started as a management consultant at Deloitte and was there for for three years. I think one, it taught me a lot about hard work, analytics, what it like, just general professionalism, like basic skills that it takes to be a successful CEO, honestly. There’s—I will say that there's other things that I've had to learn on the other side in order to scale past the first point in the business, but I think consulting really got me through the first stages where it helped me attract investors because I had my stuff together. I could develop a model, I could figure out what my cost of goods was. I could figure out a supply chain. So it gave me a lot of the business, the business fundamentals,

KG: And at some point you decided to go back to business school to learn the things beyond the fundamentals. What was it like running a company and going to business school at the same time?

KS: Yeah. So I, about a year into the business I—well I guess we were just starting in our first stores. Yeah. So when we were starting in our first stores, I started at Chicago Booth to get my MBA and it was—I started out as a full time student and the business just kept getting busier and busier and busier. I think what became really important was having a clear prioritization of what mattered. So I think that a lot of people go to business school and say like, I'm going to start a business while I'm in business school and they try to do the business 100 percent, and they tried to do school 100 percent, and the social component 100 percent. For me it was the business gets number one period, and then anything else on the side that's, that's good too.

KG: It’s a bonus.

KS: It’s a bonus and so I went from taking three classes to two classes to one class and then that last class I think I attended about half of the actual classes themselves. Yeah, and it's not to say the program’s not amazing because I learned so much in that short time I was there, but I, I really had to focus on the business, and so when it came to, I need to make a customer phone call versus go to class, it was customer phone call every time

KG: Last year. You got a really exciting honor in 2017 when you were named to the Forbes 30 under 30 list, what was it like getting that phone call?

KS: It was really incredible. I just couldn't believe it. A lot of things. A lot of things that in building the business are very humbling because it at the end of the day, like I think that if I had looked at somebody on the Forbes 30 under 30 list five to 10 years ago, I would've thought, oh my gosh, and put that person up on a pedestal. But I think through this process you, you learn that the CEOs, the entrepreneurs, the people on that list were all just real people.

KG: How did things change for you and Simple Mills after that award?

KS: It made it a little bit easier to get press, but I don't think that there’s—this goes back to this other theory that I don't think there's any one thing that makes breaks a business. It's really easy to look at things and say, oh my gosh, this is going to be the thing that makes it. Or this is going to be the thing that that breaks it for us. And that actually creates a lot of stress as well but I think that businesses are made by a million tiny good decisions and just netting out on the positive end of that. So you'll still make bad decisions, you'll still have bad things that happen or things that you at least perceived to be bad things, but there's a bunch of tiny little things have to go right.

KG: You were telling us before we actually started recording that you just got back from a really exciting trip to Israel. Can you tell us a little bit more about that?

KS: Yeah, yeah. So I was out there with 85 Forbes 30 under 30 I guess, winners from the past couple of years. We were there with an organization called Schusterman and we were traveling around all over, all over Israel. We went to the Syrian border, the Jordan border. We spent a lot of time in Jerusalem and we had a, we actually had a guide the entire, the entire trip who was telling us all about the complexity of the region and, and just, it's really stunning because I think that it's really easy to look on the conflict in the Middle East and, and kind of simplify it from over here and also to say like, oh, that's just, you know, they have conflict, we don't have conflict. We're kind of in a way, we kind of look at it as we're above that. We're like, oh no, we know better than to have that level of conflict in our country.

KS: But I think what, what really there were two key realizations for me on that trip. The first of which is there was that what we have today we can take for granted really easily and things can change The other thing that I really, that I really thought coming out of that trip was just how not simple conflict is. And for example, in the Middle East, like how much the conflict is connected to personal identity and, and even like the soil itself and the land itself. And it's just very easy to say like, oh yeah, all it takes us like a peace treaty and somebody can just come in and work that out.

KS: But even as we're establishing the embassy in Jerusalem and it's causing this uprising, it you can see just how not simple it is, is it's not as simple as drawing lines and boundaries. But just really such a phenomenal trip I was sharing that they Schusterman actually pays for the entire trip, which is just stunning. The entire trip we were sitting there asking, so what is the catch? What is the catch? Why? Why do you bring us out here? And they said really for two reasons, one, for you to understand the complexity and for that complexity to color the decisions that you make, the degree to which you impact the world and, and, and the second is you guys are all poised to make a really positive impact on the world. And with great power comes great responsibility and, and that’s—so go out and do amazing things.

KG: No pressure.

KS: Yeah, no pressure.

KG: Well, with Simple Mills though you had already had a big vision in mind to change the way people eat. Was it interesting to think about how you can change people's lives outside of your products?

KS: Yeah, I think for, I think for me, my lifelong mission has always been to to leave the world in a better place than I found it with everything that I do. I think for right now I see so much potential for Simple Mills to impact the food space, which I consider extremely important. It impacts everything that—how we feel, our personal relationships. For example, if you're more anxious, like how, how that's going to impact your personal relationships, your personal happiness. I think that there's so much there and there's also so much left for us to bite off and chew. So first of all going to focus on that. That's my disclaimer, but I, I do plan on doing more things with my life than, than just Simple Mills as well. There are a lot of, a lot of problems in the world and a lot of problems to solve and I think that if you have like the energy and the, I guess like the resources to impact the world, you absolutely should and really take advantage of all of the people who have invested in you that this brings up another point which is there's this experiment out there where they put two people in a room to play Monopoly and they give one person more money and another person less money and we'll just use money as a, as an analogy for now, but more resources and they have them play the game.

KS: And inevitably the person who had more money coming into the game wins the game. And they always ask the person who won, OK, so why did you win? And they always point back to, oh, I made this particularly great decision here. Or I got really lucky with that roll of the dice. But they never point back to the fact that they started the game with more resources. And so the interesting lesson there is that we kind of overlook the role that, that resources play in how people arrive at their, at their destinations, and so particularly if you're sitting in a place where you've had a lot of people who have invested in your education, who have invested in, in your learning, you have that much more responsibility to use those resources and, and to kind of bring other people up and along and, and invest in other people.

KG: Who invested in you early on? Not moneywise necessarily, but time and energy and support?

KS: Oh my gosh, there's been so many people that it's like you can look back to so many people who have, who have changed the way that you operate. I mean, and even started certainly with, with your parents putting in just like so much time and effort. I do remember this point in time when I was in high school and my mom looked at me and she said, You're gonna do, you're gonna do great things. And I think that was actually a self fulfilling prophecy. I don't think necessarily that I was going to do great things. But because she believed in me and believed that I was going to, that I felt like I had to. So I think that's one. I mean I also, I think more recently another, another one has been one of my mentors. So I met my professional coach, I guess I was about a year into the business and we instantly clicked and I realized that she just had such a phenomenal understanding of people and how people operate.

KS: And I said, I have to work with you. I, I, I don't understand these things very well. Let's, let's work more on this. And so since then she's actually been my coach and now is a coach for our entire 35 person team. But I think I think working with her, and we can talk more about this, but I think working with her has really helped develop me into a leader who can lead a team of 35 versus lead a team of four to five. But again, there's just been so many people throughout my history that I can look back on.

KG: I'm really curious about this professional coach, especially since you have a background in management consulting. Were you just super aware that this existed and this was something you could benefit from or how did you find out about her even?

KS: Yeah. I had no idea that that really existed and actually at the time she wasn't even a leadership coach. She was an operations consultant. Today she has a, a very large leadership consulting practice that works for a number of entrepreneurs here in Chicago and other cities. But I think there is—I had a business school professor who said that being an entrepreneur is one of the most downwardly mobile professionals that are out there.

KG: That's encouraging.

KS: Very encouraging. So I mean I think going in knowing that is actually really helpful because it helps you realize that you shouldn't take being the CEO of a company for granted, that just because you started the company doesn't mean that you stay in that role, and that many, many entrepreneurs don't make it because you have to grow super quickly. So where if you were in a large corporation going from managing, you know, two people to 10 people to 20 people to, you know, maybe 100 people might take a number of a number of years and career moves. Like that might be a 10 year shift. You're making those shifts super quickly as an entrepreneur and so you need something to help accelerate that learning or you just might not make it, and so when I met her I realized that she had the capacity to accelerate my learning and so that's why I started working with her.

KG: You're getting a crash course. Sounds like.

KS: Yeah, there's something to be said for. I still believe that most things that you learn, you learn off of your mistakes, but there's something to be said for learning off the first time you make the mistake versus the fifth time.

KG: Well we spend a lot of time on this podcast talking about your successes and goals you've achieved, but what was the time when you failed?

KS: I think for me, the greatest failures in this business have been failures as a leader. They've been places where I've come home at the end of the day and thought, you shouldn't have said that or you shouldn't have said that that way. And knowing too that you impacted somebody else's day. Those are the toughest places because you can't really take it back. You can only move forward. There’s been times where you know, you call somebody out in a meeting and and you know that that wasn't the best way to handle it, for example, and the only thing that you can do is learn from it and say there's a reason why this happened and I'm not gonna do that again, or I won't do it this way again, and then you move forward.

KG: You've also mentioned being an introvert just even on this podcast, yet you traveled with a bunch of strangers to Israel and you're the CEO of a 35 person company. What do you do to sort of give yourself that time to recharge when you're spending all of your day in meetings, talking to people like me talking to the press, all of that.

KS: Yeah. I think the. I think the recharging is super important and actually a number of my entrepreneur friends are also introverts. It's quite funny that we were like this class of, I’m sure there are extroverts out there too, but we’re this class of people who do spend their entire days talking yet their preference is not to. I think first of all, making sure that you allocate sufficient time for thinking and so I have a couple things that I do to make sure that I fit that in. The first is I love flying and I love sitting on a plane because no one, no one talks to me while I'm sitting on a plane. There's nothing to interrupt me. There's no phone calls, there’s text messages. I can sit there and I can stare out the window and think about what problems we need to solve or how to solve those problems.

KS: Another is taking decently frequent but short vacation. I like to think that vacation if done right, is actually something that helps your job versus versus hinders it. And so I'll take for example, a long weekend to somewhere in Arizona where I'll go hiking. I'll spend time reading, reading books that helped develop me professionally and personally and develop the way that I, the way that I see the world. And and so then as a result of that, you can kind of create faster learning cycles so that you can learn from the things that you're doing a lot faster. So I might take a particular concept. So for example, one concept that has required a lot of continuous work on my part is this idea that perfectionism is not on the excellence scale. So …

KG: I need hear more about this. What does that mean?

KS: It's that, it's basically that if you create a spectrum of from not excellent to excellent, perfectionism doesn't exist on there. And I think growing up in consulting or even a lot of corporations believe this, there's like this belief of no defects. So if you make a mistake, it's not OK. And so then you live your life trying not to make mistakes versus trying things out. And what happens when you try things out is, is you do make mistakes and, and it's OK sometimes or a lot of times you learn from those mistakes. And or you figured you figured out something that you wouldn't otherwise instead of spending your time optimizing something that doesn't need to be optimized. And, but this is like, this is like a lifelong skill, this isn't a OK, just get the concept and all of a sudden it's in place, it's that you have to try it, work on it, go back, relearn it, and then continue to iterate on the concept for, to, to really get it. And so then I'll read books on this topic and then go into real life, try to apply it, and then next time I go on vacation, read more books on it and recognize where I, where I haven't quite lived up to it and figure out ways to do it better moving forward.

KG: That idea of embracing mistakes as learning opportunities, is that something that trickles down to your team at Simple Mills?

KS: Yeah. We've actually, we've actually done entire trainings on perfectionism, but part of, I mean, part of it there is we are a very, we’re a very high achieving group and so we actually did, we did studies on, on our levels of perfectionism and our levels of perfectionism are actually higher than the doctors going through Harvard Medical School.

KG: Wow.

KS: So that's a problem.

KG: Oh my gosh.

KS: Again, not on the excellence scale.

KG: Wow, that is crazy.

KS: Yeah, and so we've had to. We've put a number of things in place to say, OK, it's OK to skin your knees. It's OK to make mistakes. It's OK to come out and say something, even if it's even if it's in the end, not right. And so really embracing, embracing failure and saying that's OK, or embracing it when somebody goes out on a limb and and not quickly shooting down the idea or saying no and making it a little bit more comfortable to be wrong.

KG: All right, let's end with the other question that we ask everybody else who comes on this podcast. What is a big goal you have for the future? Why is it important to you and how do you think you'll get there?

KS: So I, I, I am so incredibly passionate about, about changing the way that people eat. It's, it is a huge mission for, for me and and Simple Mills. I think that there's still so much that needs to be done here. We've, we've made such great progress in the past five years, so we're in, we’re in about 13,000 stores. We are the largest natural baking mix brand, the second largest natural cracker brand, which is, which is really neat to see, but I feel like we're just at the tip of the iceberg. There's so much more that we can be doing in terms of brand awareness and getting our products out there, but even more than that, I think there is so much more that we can be doing to to really change the way that people are eating and helping more people eat simple ingredient real food and so while I won't completely share exactly how we're going to get there, I think my mission is really democratizing real food and there's a lot more up our sleeve.

KG: What do you mean by real food?

KS: Making it something that that's accessible to a lot more people.

KG: In terms of accessible at grocery stores, price points, just it being there in general, all of the above?

KS: All of the above. Making it easy, making it so that having real food in your pantry is a, is a common occurrence.

KG: Well, we can't wait to see how you get there. I know we'll be keeping our eyes on you for the next few years to come and beyond. So Katlin, thank you so much for being on #WeGotGoals today.

KS: Thank you for having me.

CK: Hey, goal getters. Cindy Kuzma, co-host and producer here just popping in to let you know that we are about to play another one of your goals. That's right. A goal that was set and crushed by one of you, our listeners. This one was recorded during one of our live sessions at the Hotel Moxy and we also recorded a few more at the Michelob Ultra Fitness Festival at the end of SweatWorkingWeek earlier this month. Start thinking about whether you have a goal you'd like to share with us too. Soon, we’re going to have a way for you to send in your goals and you could appear right here on this very podcast. In the meantime, thank you so much for listening and here's our next real life goal-getter.

CK: Tell me your name again.

J: My name’s Jose.

CK: Jose, it's good to meet you, Jose. Jose from Chicago?

J: Yeah. Jose from Chicago.

CK Okay. Tell us, Jose, either about a big goal that you reached and how you got there or about a big goal you have for the future, one or the other.

J: Um, so I guess the biggest goal that I have reached already was I joined the military when I was 18 airborne infantry and I made it back in one piece. So that was a good goal to have.

CK: Yeah. Yeah. So where did you, where did you go?

J: Um, I was stationed in Anchorage, Alaska and I deployed to Iraq for 15 months and I was in Afghanistan for a year.

CK: Oh my gosh. Wow. So how did you do that? You know, I mean, obviously some of it is just being in the right place at the right time, but um, you know, what do you think were some of the things that lead to you having a successful military career?

J: Oh, definitely. Um, the team that I was on in the people that I worked with. Working in a team and being able to get each other's backs like that definitely protecting each other when you're not looking, um, helps for survival and also just all the training that we did, like constantly training all the time, all the time for every possible scenario that you could possibly imagine.

CK: Wow. And does that training and that experience, I mean as, how long have you been back now?

J: Um, I got out in 2010 like late 2010. Yeah. And I've had actually, now that I think about it, every job I've had outside of the military has been like in the service industry, like restaurant or a bartender or a or something like that. So like working in some sort of team capacity I guess.

CK: Yeah, and you have to think on your feet and be prepared for anything and react to what's going on around you. So I'm sure that training serves you really well.

J: Yeah.

CK: Well thank you for your service, first of all, and congratulations on being here and, and on your new job here at the Hote Moxie, right?

J: For sure. Yeah. Yeah.

CK: Well thank you so much for sharing your goal with us. Really appreciate it.

CK: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and while you're there, if you could leave us a rating or a review, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Katlin Smith; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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As president of the U.S. expansion at F45 Training - the Australian-born fitness franchise - Marc Marano's job is as much sales as it is strategy. He's here to make Americans fall in love with F45 - and to get more franchisees in the process.

And as you'll hear Marano talk through on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, getting to F45 - the big goal he accomplished - required a giant leap away from his family's legacy business passed down from his grandfather to his father and finally to his cousin and him.

As difficult as it was for him to leave the business in property, for Marano, it was even more difficult to watch friend Rob Deutsche. He opened the first F45 in Australia in 2014. “He was former banker, but again like me, decided to hang the tie up for the last time because he needed something better in his life,” Marano recalled.

After six months of careful deliberation, Marano made his decision.

"That goal was achieved only to walk out of a business that I knew everything about to walk into the fitness world that I had only ever been a consumer," he said.

Now the he's in the fitness world, there's no turning back and no slowing down as he chases his next big goal - total market penetration. The franchise is in 22 states in two years.

"In the last 24 months, we've awarded over 300 F45 studios in the U.S. We have currently, I would say it's just about to topple over 100 studios that have opened," Marano said. "We are awarding anywhere between 20 and 50 studios across the country a month."

How's he doing it? "By traveling wherever I have to go, by speaking to whoever I have to."

Uprooting his life on one beach in Australia to another beach in the US, Marano moved to spread F45 to the US from Los Angeles. But he isn't going it alone - he noted that his fiancé Emma Rose - also Australian and known for her time on the Bachelor Australia - has been a steadying presence in his life. A big goal he stated for the future was building a family of six kids.

But first he'll have to wait for his life to settle down - he spends more time in the air, traveling to new F45 locations than he does on the ground.

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JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger.

MU: Morning, Jeana.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Hello.

MU: Jeana, you spoke with Marc Marano, the head of North American Expansion of F45 training this week.

JAC: I did. Marc Morano's whole job is to plant as many F45 franchises across the United States as possible, which is super interesting because it's a fitness franchise that comes from Australia, which Marc, you'll hear say in the interview, is not super common for Australia, it's not a franchise sort of country. It's more of like a one shop family owned kind of country.

MU: Well, funnily enough, he also left his family business to do this job. Right?

JAC: He did, yeah. It was a a real emotional struggle for mark as he sort of looked at an opportunity to work with F45, which was started by his friend and help grow that company beyond the borders beyond the continent and country of Australia.

CK: It's interesting too, right, because he kind of talked about even though he had a love for his family business and it was emotional for him to walk away, he had this sense of freedom in doing something that was a little bit more meaningful to him even though ultimately he was then going to be executing someone else's vision instead of carrying his own family legacy forward. Can you talk about how we kind of sorted through all that?

JAC: It was a difficult decision, but at the end of it all, he said that he followed his heart, which is important at the end of the day because you have to get up everyday and do a job. You're spending most of your time at a job and I think what it came down to is he surrounded himself in business originally with family. It was the company that he was working for, it was a multigenerational. Companies started in Australia in real estate that was handed down to him and his cousin by his father and his uncle. He has a big family and family is a huge priority to him. So as he was looking at the business and walking away from it, he did so really respectfully and after some heartfelt conversations because he wanted at that point to follow a passion project and to do something different. He didn't really talk through sort of the idea of legacy, but I would imagine that he had to think long and hard about legacy and about what he was walking away from because he talks about how his father is his, his greatest inspiration and I can only imagine how difficult that must have been. But now mark is on an airplane a lot of the time traveling from city to city in the United States. He's based in L.A. now, he and his Instagram famous slash the Bachelor, Australia famous fiancee, get to travel a lot together and get to do some of this work side by side because her job is really portable and he talked about how having her by his side made it a whole lot less lonely. Because again, I would imagine that going from being surrounded by a support system of your family to sort of striking out on your own is totally different and it's sort of a unique challenge, but here he is doing it and he's built his own sort of family and support system within that business as well.

CK: So we're really excited about hearing this interview with Marc and Jeana.

JAC: And stick around listener for the end of the episode where you'll hear from real life goal-getters and what they're achieving out there in the real world today.

JAC: I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen and I'm here with Marc Marano on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

MM: Thanks Jeana, thank you for having me on.

JAC: So mark, how do you spend your days?

MM: Now, I'm very fortunate to be in a career path that um, and we'll go into that a little bit later, but in something that I really, truly love. I felt that for a long time, even though I was working in a position with family and in a family business and you know, putting on that suit and tie every day that I was a corporate refugee, I use the term corporate refugee because I was not working for the man so to speak, but I was working in a career path that was financially rewarding, but it wasn't giving me any soulful gratification.

JAC: That sort of tells me what led you to do what you do every single day, but what you do every single day is F45 and you are in charge of ...

MM: I'm the president of the U.S. expansion at F45 training, so I try and bring F45, which is the world's fastest growing fitness franchise, to people around the U.S.

JAC: World's fastest growing fitness franchise. That is a big title and a big responsibility for someone who's in charge of bringing it to the United States. Wouldn't you say?

MM: Very much so. Very much so.

JAC: Is it a, is it a lot of sort of responsibility to continue that growth?

MM: Yeah, I mean we're not in any great rush. This has been a very organically grown business. To give you a little bit of the history of F45. We were born in Australia in 2014. One studio, a very good friend of mine, Rob Deutsch, opened up a group training facility. He was former banker, but again like me, decided to hang the tie up for the last time because he needed something better in his life. He opened up a group training facility and kept asking me to come along and try it and I was happy in the existence that I was currently living in both work life and in my exercise life, but to support a friend. I said, OK, I'll come and try it. and was immediately addicted immediately. So much so that fast forward a couple of years I decided to leave my family business to pursue journey of bringing F45 to everyone's life.

JAC: And before we get into the big questions, obviously F45 is a big part of your life, but it, it sounds like F45. You two were born in Australia and I've had to transport or transplant yourself from your homeland to the US. So what has that process been like?

MM: I think Americans and Australians are, they have a lot of similarities and you know, I'm based predominantly in, and I use that loosely, but I'm based predominantly in Los Angeles where our headquarters is in the U.S. Um, the transformation from Australia, Sydney, Australia, which is a coastal city, beautiful beaches, to Los Angeles, which again is a coastal city, beautiful beaches was not a huge culture shock, you know, and I've had the pleasure now of seeing so many different cities of America, meeting so many great people. Every city almost of America for me is like a different country, you know, you have so many different cultures from east to west, north to south.

JAC: We are a hardy stock in Chicago where we are right now filming this or recording this. So I hope that we've been friendly to you.

MM: Chicago is definitely in my top three cities of America.

JAC: Big thumbs up to that. So let's get into the questions. Marc, can you tell me about a big goal that you've accomplished, why it was important to you and how you got there?

MM: Yeah, so for the better part of six months, I knew that I wanted to leave--I don't like the term leave because I was working with family, but I wanted to transport myself from corporate Australia, being in involved in property, in a family business, to joining friends and family at F45. It was just a really super difficult decision to make. The process was not easy. My family thought immediately that I was making a mistake. It was a business that was handed down from my grandfather to my father and his brother and then from my father and his brother when they passed to my cousin and I, and we ran the business for almost 20 years. So that was a very--but the goal was there. The intention was there. I was freed almost when my cousin who was my business partner, gave me the keys to the car and said, go for it.

MM: You know, if this is the decision you wanted to make, then you know what's right in your heart and that goal was achieved only to walk out of a business that I knew everything about to walk into the fitness world that I had only ever been a consumer. I'd never been somebody that was trying to welcome F45 into or, or any business into their life. I'd never been in franchising. Australia is not a big franchise country, so it was exciting. It was nerve wracking, but that goal was achieved and now when I look back, the obstacles that I had to overcome were not that big, when I look back in hindsight.

JAC: So it sounds like there was an emotional obstacle more than anything else because you had to follow your heart out of your family business and into something that was calling to you that you didn't necessarily know that much about. How has your relationship been with your family after?

MM: Fine. Fine. I mean family's most important. It's one of my pillars of, of how I live my life. It's family first, always, and now I have another family. You know, with everyone that I've been involved in with F45, all of the I look after the expansion of the franchise, so I try and find people who we are partnering with to open up their own business and a lot of them have shared the same journey that I currently did where they were potentially stuck behind that desk, what I call the corporate refugee, you know, doing something for 10 or 15 years that they did because they thought it was right or because they went to college and they studied accounting or business or banking and that's what they did because it was the natural progression and they ultimately love the fitness industry and they wanted to help change other people's lives as well as potentially owning their own business in the search for that ultimate financial freedom that everyone wants.

JAC: Would you say you're very risk averse?

MM: Me? No, not me.

JAC: It didn't take a lot for you to overcome fear because there wasn't that much there, right?

MM: Um, the fear was I think more so letting people down. The fear that I had was, am I, am I not making the right decision for Marc Marano, but am I letting down my family? Am I letting down my father who's not with us anymore? You know, there was still--he still is the one person I look up to in life. He's my mentor even though he hasn't been with us for so long. That was the fear of letting my family down, fear of letting my, my mother and my sister who aren't part of the business, but I'm making a decision that ultimately they're going to have consequences because they're going to have to put up with me if this doesn't work, you know? So that was the, the, the biggest fear I had not in the actual work itself because fitness, anybody who likes fitness, anybody who has an affinity with exercise, you know, it's, we're helping people. So if you're involved in fitness, whether you're on the consumer side or you're a personal trainer or you are a, an owner of a gym, I think the motive there is fantastic because you're, you're looking at helping people. So the gratification you get from that is incredible because you're having somebody say to you at the end of the day, thank you know, thank you for changing my life. Thank you for a great workout. Thank you for helping me on that one exercise that I was having difficulty with.

JAC: So it sounds like you changed sort of the expectations that, that maybe you were thinking about. You went from worrying about letting people down to thinking about all of the people who you could help or lift up.

MM: Yeah, very much, very much. And fast forward, again after the real estate is I owned and I owned a couple F45s, I started them in Australia and it was from the onset that I saw that change in people, change in not only people's energy levels, the community that were built around it, the amazement people were by the actual product itself and that really inspired me. It really uplifted me to go out and bring this to more people. That's I guess where the journey started in America for me was I have complete belief in it like most people would in their own product, you know, so there's obviously a bias there, but I tell people in the first educational step that they have to take in any career, but talking about F45 is I say go and take a class, just go and see what F45 is. I believe that they will love it, but they need to go and appreciate exactly why the world over has fallen in love with this product is just to go and try the product

JAC: sweatlife we always talk about how fitness is the catalyst for living your best life and it sounds like through F45 you're helping other people do that, but you two are probably living a better life. Would you say that's true?

MM: I am. I mean I. There are sacrifices in I'm traveling a lot, but greater good is, you know, I am taking advantage of seeing some incredible cities around the country. My health has probably been better now than it ever has been. Working in the fitness industry, it's kind of, they go hand in hand. I am Italian, so sometimes my food deviates a little bit been in. I've been very fortunate in being able to travel. My life is much happier and healthier and I'm so grateful that my partner has been able to share the journey with me. She's been probably my biggest support system since the onset since I was in the US breaking ground, staying in Airbnbs and hotels and getting on a plane and flying people around the country to see F45. That was the extent of what I was really doing was I was literally saying to somebody who I felt could be a great candidate in opening up their own studio was saying, I'll meet you in X, Y, Z, or meet you at this city because there's a studio open. Let's fly there together. We'll take a class together and we can talk about the product and that's how it really started, you know.

JAC: And just to touch briefly on your partner, I know that you were mentioning that she's been a great supporter of yours. The entrepreneurial journey is lonely. Being able to bring someone along the way with you is incredible and some listeners at home may recognize your fiance from

MM: instagram, instagram, she's insta famous--she's probably gonna kill me if she hears this. She's an an influencer, a blogger and my fiance now.

JAC: Congratulations.

MM: Thank you. And she's been, as I said, the biggest support system for me and to all of the listeners who have the, the privilege of sharing their journey with somebody else and having that support, it really does strengthen you, you know, to be able to move mountains.

JAC: And it probably does help that she can do her job most anywhere so she can really be there with you along the way.

MM: Yeah, very much so.

JAC: Soet's get to the second question, the future. So talk to me about a big goal that you have for the future and how you intend to get there.

MM: Right. So I believe in all my heart that F45 is the greatest training platform on the planet, I really do. So my goal is to bring F45's name into every home in the U.S. especially that's that's my immediate goal. How do I intend on doing that? By traveling wherever I have to go, by speaking to whoever I have to, by making sure that every single one of you listeners out there pick up your phone, Google F45, find the closest destination to where you are. Seeing whether or not it is something that you love as much as I do, as much as the rest of the world do, and I guarantee it'll change your life. There is four, for example, there are four challenges we do a year which is called the Body Transformation Challenge that incredibly changes people's energy levels, their body-- obviously, it's called the Body Transformation Challenge. Where F45 has, it delivers you meal recipes. It gives you a point system on what your daily routine is, your sleep, what you should be cutting out of your diet, and we have people that literally changed their life after eight weeks. You know, we had a studio that I own. I had a lady who wrote a letter to the head trainer to tell her that she had tried everything. She had tried every product in the marketplace. She had tried to do it herself and just could not change. She did two, eight week challenges in a row and she lost over 70 pounds, which was life changing. It truly is life changing, something like that. So what I want to do is I want everyone in the U.S. to try an F45 studio. That might be a big goal, but I believe that we could open three to 4,000 studios across the country and at least give people the opportunity of seeing the success that I've witnessed around the world.

JAC: So let's break that down. There are two sort of big goals within that goal and there's one that's sort of the, we'll call it the intangible, 100 percent penetration in the United States, which is lofty, but we like a lofty goal, a big hairy audacious goal here at aSweatLife. And then there was the more tangible goal, which was the 3,000 to 4,000 physical bricks on the ground studios in the U.S. How is it going so far?

MM: We have awarded in the last 24 months, we've awarded over 300 F45 studios in the U.S. We have currently, I would say it's just about to topple over 100 studios that have opened. Tomorrow for anybody that's in Chicago, and I don't know when this is going out, but Schaumburg in Chicago, he's actually opening. Very much looking forward to seeing that studio, I hear Schaumburg's a beautiful part of Chicago I've not been there yet. Yeah. We hope to have by the close of 2018, we hope to have 200 studios opened in the US. We are awarding anywhere between 20 and 50 studios across the country a month and the more we open, the more people, as I said it is infectious. It's something that people become addicted to very, very quickly. And it's amazing how many people that go and exercise inside of the studio turn into their own business owner. They turn into franchisees themselves from seeing the magic that occurs inside of a studio, the communities and families that have built inside of that studio

JAC: And for for a studio that is franchise driven, there are two sort of audiences. There are the owners and there are the consumers. So for your owners, you're empowering them. With that I a different set of tools and resources and for your consumers, you're empowering them through fitness. When it comes to your owners, what have you sort of seen as far as personal journeys and success?

MM: So the owners of F45 studios, if we were to look into in a room filled with people who were the owners of the studio? And I would say the personal trainer who has always had that heart to bring fitness to people's lives to help them along their fitness journey but has never really had a financial roadmap laid out for them. F45 is, we being a franchiser, we've really tried to simplify that for them. There is the, the pure investor who looks at the dollars and cents, you know, they look at 100 businesses and they see the financial sense in F45 and they plug in their employment staff and, and, and away they go. And then there's the, like me, there's the corporate refugee who has sat behind the desk for far too long doing what they do in a monotonous wave for far too long.

MM: They're tired of being tired and they want to bring their own business to the market. Something that they believe in, something that they can bring their skillset, whether it's on the floor or behind the scenes, they want to go and open up their own business across the board. So we have now 1100 studios awarded around the world in over 40 countries, about 40 percent, 39-40 percent of our franchisees own more than one location. So the and that, that's a really great success point for me is for somebody who's never owned their own business, somebody who's never been involved in fitness to go and open up a studio and the success that they see there, they call me and then that's the best phone call I can ever have is Marc, I'm ready to open up my second studio. For me, that's it's very empowering. It's that is the gratification that I didn't have in my former life was to have somebody that they're passionate about, someone that has never owned their own business to open up an F45 studio and a short time afterwards call me and say I'm ready for number two and that's shows me the success that we're seeing.

JAC: And gym ownership is hard. We hear time and time again from people who start their own gyms and scale them themselves and build number two and number three, that that process is very challenging. So how are you sort of helping these owners go from taking your idea or F45's idea and building a business from from sort of the point where they sign the contract forward?

MM: We basically have a five day orientation course to get them from zero to 60--you say zero to 60, here in America we say zero to 100 kilometers and miles. We get them from zero to 60 during that five-day course in everything. Marketing campaigns, client interaction, what the collateral that we offer in our intellectual operations manual that they have access to in how to set up the studio. The biggest access point, the biggest assistance, the biggest tool that we afford our franchisees with is the F45TV. F45 TV is a technology system placed around a studio so that you as the consumer would walk in and you would see nine televisions around a studio of which when you're about to embark into this group training class, you will see each of the exercises actually video taped and displayed on these monitors.

MM: You also have timing technology on there. So what it in essence does is your group training exercise program that you're about to embark on, is pre programmed F45 itself three weeks in advance. So you as the owner, you as the trainer, you don't have to worry about that constant headache. How do I innovate my workout tomorrow? How do I create a new product, a new platform that's going to excite my clients tomorrow? So we've already done that for you so that you as the owner building out your studio, building your business, you know, giving, giving everything you can to that investment is, the biggest headache is looked after. We also have a F45 FM, so we have over 800 playlists that have been worked out for you that you can plug in. The way that we have these systems, processes and procedures in place really allows the investor, the gym owner to scale their business, worrying about who in the organizational chart they need to plug in to the respective fields. Personally, head trainers, a membership manager, a studio manager, and it allows them to replicate that very easily.

JAC: So you started your journey with F45 and 2015. What has been your greatest learning about the fitness industry in that time?

MM: My biggest learning experience in the fitness industry, and I'm going to compare it to my previous world, was, I was in property and property is something that you either can or can't do, that that's it. You either can go and buy a property or you just, you know, you don't have the means to. Fitness is very different because firstly our entry point is very small relatively to an investment and people from all walks of life--it's, that's what the incredible part is, all love fitness in some capacity. I remember high school, college, university, the camaraderie you had in sports and when you went into your working life, you miss that. You miss, you know, the competitiveness, the, the sports I miss that. I missed being able to just go and run around and whatever it was that soccer, basketball, football, tennis, whatever it was. And I think in the fitness world, everyone who is still enamored with health and fitness, love that camaraderie.

MM: They love the community. There's a number of fitness organizations around the world that are based the success on that community. You know, F45 now has an incredibly growing, fast-growing community. So that was one of the first things was the biggest thing was that my client, whether it was inside of one of my studios or it was somebody that was looking to to open their own business, was huge. It was anyone could, could go and open up their own business. You know, they just had to have the desire, the passion, and the want that. That's the big thing is for all those people who are motivated by being an entrepreneur motivated by potentially opening up their own business is number one, you have to take that first step from the precipice of the, of that cliff. And number two is that desire needs to be there. And you mentioned how difficult owning gyms were. Not that I disagree with you.

JAC: You can disagree.

MM: Can I?

JAC: Yeah.

MM: I disagree. I think that running a gym is not a difficult business. I think that your desire, your want is the same as those people who are coming in there. You don't need, we're not a big box. You don't need 10,000 members to making an F45 successful. Two to 400 members and and you know, you've built your community, your highly profitable and it's a very easy career path to be happy, you know, to have that soulfully rewarding daily wake up as to what you're doing.

JAC: It's an. It's an interesting take because I, I guess the reason why I say owning a fitness studio is challenging is because when you're, when you're going from perhaps someone who has a passion for fitness, but maybe you haven't owned a business before or you're starting from scratch, you're starting all of your systems from scratch too, from getting a lease on a property to hiring a staff to marketing that. So I think we're saying the same thing, but I think we're saying them differently. So going it alone ...

MM: Going it alone very, yeah very much.

JAC: Challenging. But if you have sort of the systems in place and perhaps the help to get you there can be a lot easier. And that's what I think I hear you saying that F45 does.

MM: That's I guess at F45 is tested, tried, trued, failed so many times now in the past that we have not the magic recipe, but we understand I guess what, what footpath people need to take to to reach that success point and any business is not going to be a walk in the park. Anybody that's opening up any business, whether it's a retailer, a fitness business or otherwise, you know, there's always going to be obstacles and challenges. But that's what makes the journey so much better.

JAC: Well, let's talk about. Let's talk about your big hairy audacious goal now. The goal of 100 percent penetration in the United States. Every American citizen trying F45. We love a BHAG here at #WeGotGoals; we've had other entrepreneurs tell us that they wanted to have a 100 percent penetration in coffee production for example, when we talked to Matt Matros who started Limitless Coffee, that was his big goal. So when you go from saying a goal like that allowed to actually executing the steps to get there, what do you actually do and what? What does it look like for you? Do you set small goals along the way? Do you envision the big goal everyday as you start your day? What? What actually goes into it?

MM: My goal, my goal setting techniques is to make sure that it's not a wishlist in any goal setting, whether it's I'm writing my New Year's resolutions, but they were more goals than they are resolutions is there needs to be trigger points, there needs to be milestones that are achieved from go to whoa. So in my hairy--what did you call it?

JAC: Big hairy audacious goal.

MM: Big hairy audacious goal. Big hairy audacious goal. OK.

JAC: BHAG.

MM: So in my BHAG my milestones are to number one, open up as many studios as I can in as many states as I can. So we are in 22 states in 24 months, which has been a huge success. It makes it a lot easier for me because of the overwhelming response from people who also want to bring F45 into their journey to call me and say, Marc, I'm, I'm, I'm intrigued. You know, I don't know if I'm interested, but I'm intrigued. Tell me more. And the first thing I say is the first thing I said to you is you need to go and try a class. The more states and more cities that we have it in, which is my small, my first goal, the easier it is to facilitate people visiting a studio and people experiencing it. 40th five, the, the conversion rate of people that go and see a studio to people that want to bring F45 into their life is incredible. Whether it's as a consumer or potentially owning their own it, it is overwhelming. Yeah, and I guess one of the reasons why we are seeing the growth we're seeing so, so rapidly around the world.

JAC: So let's talk about personal goals before we wrap this up. We talked a lot about business; I know you're engaged and getting married in the future. Are there any other sort of personal goals or health and wellness goals that you're striving to accomplish outside of work?

MM: I'd love to do a triathlon.

JAC: Like an Ironman?

MM: Yeah, but um, I've never been the strongest of swimmers and I'm Australian, so it's difficult to say to people because we have to swim at school five days a week, but I don't ...

JAC: At all ages?

MM: From you're, when you're 12 years old you must swim. I can swim, but I'm just not a triathlon swimmer. I'd love to go back to playing sports. Yeah. I had a couple of injuries in, in my youth and through work I just always put them to the side. Um, I feel like F45 is actually made me stronger in the, my knees aren't the best, but F45 was able to, to, because of the functional movement, it was able to strengthen my, my injury. So I'd love to go and play sports again. Personal, which is the most important, is marriage and a hundred kids.

JAC: 100 kids!

MM: Well I want six.

JAC: You want six kids? So what's interesting is I've always wanted to ask this question, but man, so I'm very excited for it. How are you going to balance it all? Six kids and this big career.

MM: It can happen. My Mother's one of 20.

JAC: One of 20!

MM: Yes, same mother and father.

JAC: How many cousins do you have?

MM: On my mother's side? Just over 50. Wow. First cousins. First generation cousins. Yeah.

JAC: Okay. So you want to have a family as well. That's incredible. Is there anything else that you want to talk about in regards to F45, your goal and the future that we didn't touch on?

MM: The only thing that I want to say F45 has been a truly life changing experience for me and for so many people. Google F45, go and take a class, I guarantee you'll like it. That's it.

JAC: Thank you so much Marc for being on #WeGotGoals, truly enjoyed chatting with you and we hope that you continue down your path towards your BHAG.

MM: Thank you. Thank you so much Jeana.

CK: Hey, goal-getters, cohost and producer Cindy Kuzma here. Coming up next, we've got something special for you. It's one of your goals recorded live last month at the Hotel Moxy. We also recorded a few more real-life goals last weekend at the Michelob Ultra #SweatWorkingWeek Fitness Festival. We're going to have those for you in the weeks ahead also in the weeks ahead, stay tuned because we're going to give you lots of new opportunities and ways to share your goals and be a part of this awesome goal-getting community on #WeGotGoals. Thank you so much for listening, and here is one of your goals.

JAC: David from Chicago. So can you tell me about either a big goal that you set and achieved or a big goal that you have set for the future?

D: So, uh, one of the things that I'm really into besides my freelance contracting is competitive volleyball.

JAC: I love where this is going.

D: Not, not connected at all to have different facets of life course. Uh, so I got it back into volleyball that I'd been playing as a kid and then got back into it as an adult, had some knee injuries and then was like, but I was like really encouraged to like, I want to like be really good at this again. And uh, I got back into playing some leagues. I got back into doing some travel tournaments actually as well. Um, it's sort of a, it wasn't, not a concrete goal, but I was like, I want to be, even though I'm like about to turn 30 years old, like I want to be the best volleyball player that I can right now and keep getting better at it and I'm, at least right now, I feel like I've certainly succeeded in it and gotten better. Um, and one of the ways that I've done that is crazily finding a gym that specializes in kettlebells, so they operate under this thing called strong first.

D: Um, so it's all kettlebell technique. And when I went in the first day had no idea what I was doing. I walked in and was just like, why not? Let's give it a try. This place is around the corner from my apartment and I have just been now going for almost two years consistently, like three times a week and like my body feels completely different than it did two years ago. No more knee pain. I have like lost 30 pounds and I'm just like in the strongest, best shape of my entire life and I'm like, had my 30th birthday a couple years ago. And I'm also like feeling like I'm at the best peak volleyball that I've ever been at in my entire life.

JAC: Well that is fascinating, first of all because it's, it's sort of like, most people share goals that are professionally linked and I love, I love hearing that your goal is sort of outside of the four walls of work or probably for you sometimes four walls, sometimes coffee shop walls. So I'm interested to hear how people in your life react to you saying I want to be the best volleyball player.

D: Um, it's interesting because I think I grew up in my sister's footsteps. She was a volleyball player first and I think um, she has been really encouraging about it and um, is really proud. Um, and I think, uh, the people that I played volleyball with are also really excited and they've even been the ones to tell me actually that they notice my improvement more so than I have, like I was at a tournament last month and someone just stopped me that I'd been playing with for years and they're like, I just want to let you know, like, you're not only playing better physically but also mentally like I can tell you're just making better decisions on the court. So actually everybody around me has been really positive and pointing it out and maybe even more than I realize

JAC: This is incredible. Last question and then I'm going to set you free. Have you noticed that your ability to crush it on the volleyball court has impacted your ability to crush it at work?

D: You know, not that I've seen yet, but I have, I can tell that I'm at least an entertaining thoughts of taking a step forward and like doing things that I wouldn't have tried before from a career standpoint or at least even like putting myself out there to find another client and I think it is all wrapped up in this same sort of mindset of just like I'm succeeding at what I set my mind to. Everything's going great. Like, what do I have to lose?

JAC: So the work that you're putting in in the gym is impacting the rest of your life. That's incredible. So thank you for sharing your goal with us.

D: Yeah, my pleasure.

CK: This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. One of the best ways to do that is to listen wherever you get your podcasts and then leave us a rating or review in Apple Podcasts or iTunes. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Marc Morano; to TechNexus for the recording studio and of course to you, our listeners.

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Chef Josh Katt, the founder and CEO of Kitchfix, isn’t a goal guy. In fact, when I posed the first of our two big questions on #WeGotGoals—what’s a big goal you’ve achieved, why was it important to you, and how did you get there?—he couldn’t really come up with an answer.

Don’t take that to mean he’s achieved less than other guests we’ve had on the show. In about five years, Katt has built Kitchfix from a small personal chef business into a citywide meal delivery and catering company. He has more than 60 employees and a Gold Coast storefront, not to mention packaged products like Paleo granola and waffles available in-store and online, nationwide.

Maybe it’s just a matter of semantics. Katt prefers to discuss things in terms of passions and beliefs, guiding principles he aims to follow. Eating a healthy, nourishing diet. Knowing where your food comes from. Treating your customers well at every step of the transaction—while also doing right by your employees.

Those core elements have taken Katt far beyond where he might have dreamed when he first moved to Chicago from Michigan in 2006. Back then, he thought he’d cook in fine-dining restaurants. Soon, though, he realized the late-night, hard-knock lifestyle just wasn’t what he wanted in the long term.

Katt explored a number of different food-related jobs throughout the city, including catering and retail. He worked with a non-profit called Common Threads that taught kids about healthy dishes from around the world. There, he met a woman who asked if he could work as her personal chef. He jumped at the chance, but there was a catch—she was recovering from cancer and eating an anti-inflammatory diet.

Katt dove into reading and research, and realized his farm-to-table cooking experience in Michigan aligned perfectly with the type of nourishing dishes her recovery required. What’s more, his heart and soul became part of the recipe. “I really took to the idea that food is very powerful,” Katt says. “It can heal your body.”

One client became a few became a few more. Katt eventually realized he could bring costs down by investing in a kitchen—then, of course, he needed a few more clients to make the rent on that space. He worked with gyms to spread the word about his healthy, convenient options. Each step was essentially guided by combining financial practicalities with his guiding principles.

“How am I going to make my paycheck? I don’t want to go work in a restaurant. I love cooking, I love having flexibility, so what do I need to do to make that happen?” he asked himself.

Kitchfix became the answer. And though he didn’t always know he’d start a company, he did know he’d work hard to help make peoples’ lives better.

Now, he does that not only by feeding customers nutritious, delicious meals—he also aims to correct some of the imbalances he’s observed in the life of food-service workers (and the bigger-picture economic disparities he saw in the city). So, he offers jobs to those with criminal records and others who might not be able to find work elsewhere, paying them fairly and including benefits.

The stories of transformation, both among those who prepare and devour his meals, fuel him. One woman received thousands of dollars of Kitchfix funds as gifts to sustain her through chemotherapy. Another family was able to delay putting their father in assisted living thanks to the availability of meal delivery.

“Now I'm a little removed from the day to day, but I get to see these cool things my team is doing for people,” he says. “This thing that I created five years ago is now doing those things for people; people are using it for good and I'm not really partaking in the actual cooking as much as I used to. It’s a pretty cool feeling.”

Katt continues to learn in his transition out of the kitchen and toward scaling his principles into an expanding enterprise. In addition to business development, “part of my growth is really establishing some systems and structure for the team,” he says. “Communicating the vision and communicating the passion that we're talking about is important. Hiring the right people is important. We do food service a lot differently than the average restaurant.”

He's coming to appreciate the need for strategy and using terms like “10x” and “BHAG.” But Katt’s goal-getting advice for anyone else who has a deeply held conviction and a desire to make it something bigger remains simple. Don’t think too hard, he says—just take the leap.

“I may be on one end of the spectrum of not thinking first or setting a goal and just going for it; there’s certainly room for goals and thought,” he says. “But a lot of people get hung up on that stage, right? Like it's too cerebral and they're not just doing it. So I would say just take a chance, go for it. You'll regret it later if you don’t.”

Listen to this week’s episode to hear more about Katt’s own eating habits, the one thing he’d change about the Kitchfix menu if he could do it all over, and his big, ambitious goals for the future (one will make you toss your nachos and hot dogs in surprise).

And stick around till the end of the episode to hear our first installment of your own big goals! If you enjoy it, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Kristin Geil and Cindy Kuzma.

CK:Good morning, Jeana.

KG:Hi Jeana.

JAC:Good morning. And Cindy, this week you did the podcast live recorded from the Moxy Hotel.

CK:I did. So again, you might hear a little bit of background noise. It was a really exciting evening at the Moxy Hotel, but I spoke with Chef Josh Katt of Kitchfix.

JAC:And Chef Josh Katt of kitchfix has been evolving the way that he sets goals over the years. Wouldn't you say that's right?

CK:Absolutely. I mean he is one of the few guests that we have who has come on and said, yeah, I don't really set goals. Um, that's not really my thing or that hasn't been my thing. Yet he's managed to build a pretty successful business despite not having really intentionally set out with a goal to do so. He works really hard. He has these sort of guiding principles and passions that he's followed and the opportunities have found him, but now that he has kind of stepped away from the chef role and into the CEO role, he's definitely thinking that he needs to focus a little bit more on goals. He's using terms like BHAG and 10x and things that we hear entrepreneurs and ceos talk about when they talk about goals. So I think he has recognized that the way he has done things in the past worked to get him to a certain point and now that he's responsible for a big company and lots of people, he's. He's adjusting his approach to goals and exploring how these new options might work for him.

KG:And one thing we know about Kitchfix from working with them and sampling everything on their menu for so many years is that they really care about their customer and being transparent about what food they're serving you, what ingredients they're using, where they're sourcing things from. So we know that they care about the forward facing aspect of the company. But Josh spoke a little bit to how he also makes sure his back of house staff and employees are taken care of as well.

CK:Yeah, I thought that was a really interesting and compelling--I mean, one of the reasons honestly, he started the company in the first place was he found restaurant life to be a lot harder than he had anticipated. There's late nights, there's low pay, there's no benefits. It's a lifestyle that can be really hard on people and in addition to building a business that serves healthy food to people who have had cancer or people who are sick, anyone who wants an anti-inflammatory Paleo Whole30 compliant diet, he's also really focused on making life better in all aspects for those workers. So you know, he wants to hire people who maybe don't have a good chance to get a job somewhere else. He wants to give them regular hours and pay and benefits and just create opportunity in the restaurant and catering and food service world. That makes life a little bit better and a little bit different. It's almost like the antithesis of the gig economy right now, which is really kind of refreshing because you have a lot of workers who are not being treated well, but so it's really great to see a company starting from the beginning with that passion and that responsibility to to workers as well as customers

JAC:And we know and love Josh Katt and I've had his food over the years and have seen the company grow so we can't wait to hear this interview with you, Cindy. And stick around listener for the end of the episode where you'll hear from real-life goal getters and what they're achieving out there in the real world today.

CK:And I am Cindy Kuzma and I'm here with Josh Katt who is Chef Josh and CEO of Kitchfix. Josh, thank you so much for being with us today on #WeGotGoals.

JK:Thank you for having me. Love being here. This is great.

CK:So for those of our audience here at the Moxy and also our listeners at home who don't know Kitchfix, I was a little bit about what it is.

JK:Sure. Kitchfix, I started it as a meal delivery service. So we serve fully prepared, Paleo, Whole30 meals. You don't have to prep or anything, you just throw them in your microwave or oven. We deliver those all over Chicago. We have about 55 items on our menu every week. We also sell some granola, all Paleo. We sell Paleo waffles, Paleo granola bars, and those are available in Whole Foods and Sprouts around the country. And then we do catering as well. So we got a bunch of things going on. Really everything is founded on the healthy food philosophy and sourcing philosophy.

CK:You do have a lot going on these days at Kitchfix and I know you've had quite a career path from, from chef to CEO. Did you think back in 2006 when you moved here to Chicago that this is where you'd be sitting today with all of this happening?

JK:Yeah, I know. I came to Chicago really to focus on cooking. I really wanted to learn from some of the best chefs in Chicago. We have an amazing talent pool here of chefs, so after culinary school I'm from originally from Michigan, came down to Chicago to work in a fine dining restaurant where the chef had experience working at the French Laundry and just decided that I wanted to like commit my life to learning all about fine cuisine and all the techniques involved in that and actually pretty quickly in that experience here in Chicago, I realized that wasn't the life for me and I started looking around in different parts of the food world for something that I had a little bit more work life balance.

JK:I didn't love the idea of spending my whole life working 10 a.m. to 2 a.m. every day and falling asleep on the train and all that sort of thing that the guys around me were doing because it was such a hard life. So started exploring other things and ended up in tons of different food businesses throughout Chicago. It was pretty interesting.

CK:And I know the genesis of Kitchfix came out of some, an experience you had as a personal chef, right?

JK:Yeah. Yeah. So I decided to explore catering and sort of like retail outlets that served prepared foods. I ended up partnering with a nonprofit, working with them called Common Threads and teaching kids how to prepare healthy food from different countries throughout the world. It was like an afterschool program. So I would go and entertain these 12 year old kids, get them to eat pad Thai or peanut soup, all these really kind of cool dishes. And really it was like the food was great that we were making and it was a blast. And during that time someone needed a personal chef, someone that was involved in the nonprofit actually. And so I was like, yeah, I got some spare time I'd love to, I'd love to do that and she said, OK, I'm recovering from cancer and you know, can you make the antiinflammatory diet for me, can you learn about it?

JK:And so I started exploring that and really took to the idea that food is very powerful. It can be functional, it's not all about just, you know, consumption. It can, it can heal your body and really realized that my background at farm to table cuisine really lent itself well to that style of cooking and so, started making her food and you know, my, my heart and soul was in it and she loved it and loved all the food I was doing and ended up telling all of her friends. And soon as I was going house to house to house to house and one day I was like, you know, I should get my own kitchen and start doing deliveries. And that's, that's really like the genesis of, of Kitchfix was, you know, that whole process.

CK:Fascinating. So how do you go about that? I mean, obviously you knew a lot about food and you were already teaching these children about some healthy, delicious things by the anti inflammatory diet is like a whole other kind of ballgame. How did you educate yourself?

JK:Reading a lot of books, anticancer, Dr. Weil is another author. He's actually one of the founders of True Food Kitchen. So at the time there was only one of those restaurants, now there's probably 15 and so yeah, I mean really back then there wasn't a lot--there wasn't really, I don't think Protein Bar was around. There was just nothing. And so today it's pretty commonplace. We probably all drink something with turmeric in it, you know, at least once or twice a week and that just wasn't there then. And so you know I had a big opportunity and got to kind of ride the wave of health and nutrition early on.

CK:Yeah, yeah. You definitely seemed to ahead of the curve there. So this kind of leads into it, you know, we've talked about this long way you've come and this amazing company you've built, but Josh, if you had to answer our big question--which you do because you're on #WeGotGoals ...

JK:Wait, what is this called?

CK:Our big question, our first big question on #WeGotGoals is what is a big goal you've achieved, why was it important to you and how did you get there? So how would you answer that?

JK:I was thinking about this question prior to coming on here and I realized that I just am not a big goal guy. I don't really operate like that and I and I don't necessarily think it's a good thing, but personally and kind of how I've gotten to this point is just I'm all about passion and belief and really about getting excited about doing things that are good and good for people. And so personally I think now as I move out of chef and sort of, you know, this art more artistic side and getting more into the CEO role, which I'm in now, it's, goals are a little bit more important. So I'm learning how to apply that focus that I think a goal gives you to my life and the business that I'm running, so I actually couldn't, can't really think of a big goal that I've really like strived for and checked off my list, but it's something that I'm certainly looking to embrace in the future.

CK:Interesting. I'll be interested to hear how you're going about that, but let's talk about that. That passion and that belief. So obviously if you built this great company without necessarily setting out to do it, where did you feel that passion and that belief and how did you kind of know that hey, this is something bigger than just this one person or just these few people that I'm cooking for, starting out cooking for people in their homes and seeing that people were willing to pay me. I think at the time I just needed to charge $40 for a meal, which is outrageous, right? So seeing that people would pay for that. I was able to sort of leverage those clients of mine and eventually I was like, OK, if I got a kitchen, I could charge them less, they could eat my food more consistently and that was sort of like, it was almost like early on I needed to do it just to survive. I needed to make money and so, you know, it's like, how am I going to make more money? How am I gonna make my paycheck? I don't want to go work in a restaurant. I love cooking, I love having flexibility, so what do I need to do to make that happen?

JK:And I always just kinda growing up, always thought outside of the box and never really wanted to be a um, never really wanted the corporate life I guess. So it made sense to me, just kind of do my own thing and that's ended up getting my own kitchen and so forth. And then it was all of a sudden I had my own kitchen and it was like, Oh man, I need to pay rent now. It's crap. How do I find more customers? And so again, early on it was like this, everything, like I needed to do these things and, but it was all founded on a passion for making really good food and, and not only just, I mean this, this is like where the chef part comes out and the artist I suppose. So it's not about just good food, it's about good service, it's about positive energy in everything that you're doing and you can make good food but just throw it on somebody's table and walk away or forget to follow up on something. And that's part of, that's part of the whole experience, right? So I've always been passionate about start to finish of the whole eating process. I guess the feeding window. I could go on and on about it. So it's just being passionate about every single step and yeah.

CK:Yeah. That's interesting. So it sounds like, I mean, again, part of what you're saying is each step in your company's evolution was sort of driven by financial incentive, but, but in a way, OK, well how can you make this work financially in a way that also upholds those values and beliefs? And passions that you had.

JK:That's right. Yeah. That's been, that's been something that has kept us set apart from others too, is that we had a really high standard for the sourcing of our ingredients, the limited use of things that are inflammatory or sort of, you know, just things that can be shortcuts in some kitchens. And I think as I've evolved over the last few years and you know, it's tough to really say like all of these foods are bad and Kitchfix doesn't use them because they're awful because that's not always the case. And we didn't use oats for a long time and oats are great. A lot of things that we do are Paleo and so you don't really put oats in those things, but I just think, you know, everything in moderation is, is really what it's all about. But still, I think there's so much in our lives, there's a lot of opportunities for excess and there's a lot of opportunities to eat things that are bad. And so the thing I love about Kitchfix is we provide like a really healthy, you don't have to think about it solution for your life that is like primo healthy really does something for you so you don't have to, you know, you can go eat pizza on the weekend and you can enjoy yourself and know that you're kind of going back to like a really healthy, clean lifestyle, you know, Sunday through Tuesday or Wednesday, or Thursday.

CK:So that's interesting that you mentioned that about the oats, because I was curious how you keep tabs on the nutrition research and the science of how you're sort of nutritional philosophy at Kitchfix evolves or if it does,

JK:We don't really, for our meal delivery service and for the products we're selling to Whole Foods and sprouts, like we've kind of taken a stance of Paleo and in a sense, you know, we do some grains on our prepared foods menu, so we'll do, we'll do your, like local and organic brown rice and quinoa, we'll do. That's really as far as we go in terms of the grain realm, but we could certainly--like, cheese is OK I think for some people, I think there's things that are fine for people, but I think sort of what we go back to at Kitchfix is like do we really need to include it or can we just make good food without it and why not fill your body with clean, delicious vegetables and high quality proteins and good oils and herbs and spices. That's fine. We don't need to be everything to everyone. You can get all that stuff, you can get cheese and bread and good other grains elsewhere. Just this is what we are. So that's kind of how we stay grounded. I think the one thing I would change is having corn like in our, like fresh corn. That's the one thing I'm like, man, if I, if I'm ever going to change one thing about our meal delivery is some good summer corn.

CK:Yeah, there's something special.

JK:But we're like corn-free.

CK:So talk to me, Josh, a little bit about Whole30 because I think that's, it seems like that's been a pretty important part of the development of Kitchfix. So how did that relationship come about? And I guess maybe we can start by explaining to people who don't know what Whole30 is a little bit about it, but how did that relationship come about and what role has that played?

JK:Sure. So Whole30, if you're not familiar, it's really like an amped up Paleo diet. It's no grains, no gluten, no dairy, no soy, no corn, no added sweeteners whatsoever. And then they really take it a step further and really challenge you to eliminate things that you kind of use as a crutch. So if you were to find a donut, for example, that had Whole30 compliant ingredients, they would advise you do not eat that because it's similar. It's very similar. And you can make, you can make a donut taste really sweet and delicious without sugar. You can use apple juice concentrate or things like that. So really Melissa, the founder, is big on stop--it's really like about food freedom and getting away from things that you're bingeing on. So that's Whole30. And I met Melissa at an event we were doing. We did Whole30 appetizers for her, she was speaking and we went out to dinner and a couple of others and really just I had heard about it. I had done research. People had asked us about it and hadn't really considered going out full force with Whole30 in terms of changing our menu, but so after talking with her and hearing her passion and seeing the influence that she had, it just made sense for us to really start to provide that because I think it's a resource for people who don't cook, don't have time, but want to change their life, their dependency on certain foods that it was a cool solution that we can provide for people.

CK:Did that make a big difference in your business too, in terms of calling attention to it?

JK:Yeah. No, it's been great. They're a fantastic partner. They really care and they're really, I think with power, which I think Melissa and the brand has, comes a lot of responsibility and I believe that they handle that pretty well, so it's been cool to be a part of that. Yeah, it's been good for us, but I think yeah, I mean it's been really cool to see people respond and be able to come to us for that solution in their life, which wasn't totally available before from our menu.

CK:Yeah, so I am curious, do you have like stories of people who had transformations among your clientele at that kind of inspire you to keep moving?

JK:Sure, yeah. We have stories, yeah, we get testimonials quite a bit from people who are coming to us for Whole30 diets. I mean people come to us for all sorts of solutions in their life for people who are going through an illness that need to eat really healthy to people who want to lose weight. We had one customer who was given a gift card by about 20 or 30 people and they ended up giving her like thousands of dollars.

JK:She was going through chemo, just so she could have healthy good food. We had another family who provided food for their, I think it was their dad and because we could provide him food regularly, he was able to not go into assisted living right away, you know, he was able to kind of stay out and I think one of the coolest things about running your own business is as you grow you get to like, because now I'm like a little removed from like day to day, right? But I get to see these cool things that my team is doing for people, right? And so like they're providing like this thing that I created five years ago is now doing those things for people, that is people are using it for good and I'm not, you know, really partaking in the actual cooking, you know, as much as I used to. So I don't know, it's pretty, pretty cool feeling.

CK:Yeah. That's, that's incredible. Oh my gosh. What incredible stories and also what a great idea for like someone to who knows someone who's going through something like that for them. So yeah, let's talk about that a little bit more because as you mentioned, you're not cooking as much day to day and you talked about kind of the challenges in transitioning and learning more of the business side and the goal side. So what are some of the ways that you're doing that?

JK:Naturally when we, when I first started the company, I started to separate myself from the kitchen. I can't, I don't know why It just felt natural in some ways. I think cooking is so, it's very, it's a riot, but it's also a lot of hard, hard work and I knew that in order for me to grow the business I needed to use my brain in a different way and so I knew that I needed, I could communicate well my passion to others and then I could go out and try to grow the business. And so that's kind of what I started doing pretty early on, but I'm still involved regularly with the whole food process, you know, meeting with our chefs, talking about menu items and what, uh, what is the, what are the latest trends, what can we do to improve certain parts of the operation. Honestly, like our meal delivery service is basically run by our amazing staff.

JK:They can do every part; they're brilliant people. They come up with amazing food and I and I really can kind of step back and work on other parts of the business so we have catering that we're doing and kind of building this unique offering of really healthy food that we serve to sports teams, we serve to backstage for artists. And that's a whole different world. It's not necessarily Kitchfix per se all the time, but it's, it's still very passion driven and all about health and wellness and really good service. So like I kind of am starting all these little businesses within Kitchfix, which is pretty fun, yeah.

CK:So how do you, how does that scale, like how do you make sure that commitment to service at every step along the way is a part of all of these businesses when you can't obviously be hands on in every single aspect.

JK:I mean that's part of my growth is really establishing some systems and structure for the team to say to them, hey, these are the things that I really want to see on a regular basis and this is part of your job. So doing things like that, communicating the vision and communicating the passion that we're talking about is important. Hiring the right people is important. We do food service a lot differently than the average restaurant. You know, kind of my experience in the restaurant world early on was that really like sold-out life or working the line and grinding it out, no time for a family, it's all about the food. I didn't really like that. I felt like this. There's an opportunity for something different and there's like people getting paid, you know, I think when I moved to Chicago I got paid like 80 bucks a day for like 16 hours.

JK:It's like, that's acceptable because you're learning from a great chef and you know, maybe someday you'll make it, but like so many people like burnout or become drug addicts or alcoholics. It's like rough life. So at Kitchfix, I always said I don't want to work at night really. Right. I want to have most of my nights free, which sometimes is the case. I want to try to do things differently. I want to pay my workers well, I want to give them sick leave. I want to, I want to just take care of them because they're the ones that are doing the work and as an owner and CEO they have--yes, my job is hard and it's burdensome and when an employee steals, they steal directly from me. If an employee gets hurt, I pay for it. So I'm ultimately responsible, but at the end of the day like I want to take care of them and treat them really well and so that's something that I think is pretty cool about Kitchfix food services that were all about that. We treat our kitchen staff very well and take care of them and they have I think really good lives and I can't wait to keep improving that for people with, for my team. Yeah.

CK:That's really cool. So that your motivation is not only the people that you're serving, but the people who are working for you and making their lives better. I know you too, you hire people too through programs that kind of give people a second chance who might not otherwise be able to get a job. And I was wondering kind of where that came from and now it's a little bit, it's clearer to me where some of that passion comes from. But can you talk a little bit more about that?

JK:Yeah, sure. When I moved to Chicago I kind of saw the disparity throughout the city and you know, traveling from the west side to the east side, or south side up here and seeing homeless people on the street and I just never really had that exposure in a small beach town in Michigan. It kind of like, shook me pretty hard when I first moved here and I just knew that I didn't mean I didn't know I was going to start something, but I knew that I always wanted to kind of give back. That was sort of why I got involved in the nonprofit and knew that I could offer food always seemed like an amazing opportunity to get people involved and teach them a skill that maybe they could grow into something really great someday. So at Kitchfix we reserve a few of our spots in the kitchen-- well actually really early on when we first started, we partnered with a church, that was our first kitchen and I made an agreement with them that we would hire people from like second chance programs to help me with, in the kitchen.

JK:And so like my first two hires were people, these two women from the CARA program who had no food experience and they were helping me in the kitchen and I was training them and it. And then, uh, my business took off and I was like, wow, I need someone really to help me. Like some real chefs in here and so the vision sort of changed at first and then a year and a half later, we had seven people working and these two ladies were still there with me. I took everyone in this room. We had gotten this opportunity to help out with a sports team and I was like, hey guys, we have this sweet opportunity. I'm so excited to share with you to be that you can be a part of it and you know, you just have to take a background check.

JKAnd like everyone in that room was like, I know I can't. I wouldn't pass. And so like it was that kind of at that point that I realized a lot of my team is really, even though I might not have found them from CARA or Growing Home or we just started working with refugee, someone that like basically help works with refugees and now they're placing them in jobs. A lot of stuff that we were hiring was already having issues finding work. Right? So like I had an already a source of people that I could really take care of and mold and not take advantage of. And so I realized that I was already doing that even even though I wasn't like purposely hiring from CaRA for all of my employees. So overall I think that's, and now we have a like our system is for, for prep and things like that and our kitchen like Thursdays and Fridays arem we get in like all of our sweet potatoes and cauliflower, like all of these, like this special is that we're using hundreds of pounds of and you have to peel all those things and it's like very basic work.

JK:And so we have those positions reserved for inch, you know, like entry level positions for people that do need the practice of showing up for work on time, standing up all day. Those are things that not everyone know. Honestly. It's hard for anyone that doesn't do that. Right? I mean like if you go to stand up all day and like peel a potato, it would not be fun. You'd be like, I'm losing my mind. But it does take practice. So we give those opportunities, we've had some really cool stories as of late and we're excited to kind of keep growing that part of our business.

CK:And you have something like 60 total employees?

JK:Yeah, 60, over. Seems like less but our, um, like VP of finance keeps telling me it's more, so I guess we have more.

CK:Yeah, so again, you, you've done all this growing. You've, you've taken care of both the people that you're serving food to and the people who are serving the food and the people who are preparing the food and you've done this all without setting intentional goals, many of them. You've said now that you're thinking more along these lines of goals. So that brings us to the next big question on #WeGotGoals. Do you have a goal for the future and how might you plan to get there?

JK:Sure, great question. I think, you know, I kinda have certainly have some strategy that we've developed for how we plan to approach the next five years. But I think so, like one of those goals is we want to be in 3,000 stores with all of our products that we have out. So we have Paleo granola bars, we have paleo frozen waffles and paleo granola that we sell and whole foods weren't about with each of those, about 350, 400 stores now. So seeing 10x growth at least in the next four years with each of those products. And then I think another one that's kind of like my big hairy audacious goal is to like take over all of the food service at like a stadium. I know that's not very, it's not very Kitchfixy in terms of what you know about our brand, but we've done some work in that space more so in the realm that we are making healthy really delicious food, but there's like a monopoly on stadiums for food service. It's run by like two or three companies and I think there's some opportunity to do it differently. And so my 10-year goal is to like run a stadium.

CK:Do you have a specific one in mind?

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Runners on the Lakeshore Path spend miles with their noses down, but starting August 2017, there was a reason to look up just north of LaSalle Street. The Shore Club is an oasis on the Lakefront that Lisa Jaroscak and her two partners - Robbie Schloss and Nick Thayer - helped to create.

The day that this location opened its doors, Jaroscak told us that she accomplished a big goal that took months of hard work and endless creativity. She talked through what that meant for her on this week's episode of our podcast, #WeGotGoals (a live episode that we recorded at the new Moxy Chicago).

That goal and its achievement may seem like a departure from where Jaroscak started her professional journey. Just five years ago, Jaroscak graduated from college with formal training as an operatic soprano.

But as any musician learns, getting paid to perform your craft comes with a lot of hustle. And that hustle propelled Jaroscak to find opportunities - opportunities to book other artists and to eventually produce music festivals and events.

When she found the site that would become The Shore Club, her eyes were already open to opportunities and she was willing to put in the work to make it happen. The rest of the pieces fell into place after Jaroscak trusted her gut and charged ahead to bring her project to life.

Listen to this week's episode and you'll hear Jaroscak discuss how she met her partners, the inspiration for the Shore Club, and who you should never ask an opera singer to belt out a note for you (she never actually discussed that, but I did ask her to sing a note and realized to my horror that it was like asking a sprinter to run their fastest 40-meter dash, totally cold).

And if you enjoy #WeGotGoals, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. This week's episode is a special episode. We recorded it live at the Moxy Hotel Chicago, which just opened up so you may hear a little bit of background noise and a little bit of music, but that's really just the ambiance and the fun of the Moxy coming through on this episode. Let's get to the show. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen and with me I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen Geil.

MU:Hi Jeana, how's it going?

KG:Hey Jeana.

JAC:What's up, goal-getters?

MU:Jeana, this week you spoke with Lisa Jaroscak of the Shore Club.

JAC:I did, so Lisa does a lot of things, the Shore Club being one of them. And I say a lot of things because it's actually sort of staggering. She currently is involved with, a partner of or leading at four different companies across Chicago. Everything from the seasonal work that's involved in the Shore Club, which is a restaurant located on Chicago Park District land right on the lake shore. It's really beautiful and one-of-a-kind. She's also involved in some planning and event logistics and operations, so her work really spreads from that sort of hospitality mindset.

MU:So the Shore Club is newer to Chicago even though people have been running on the lake shore path for a very long time. This is a new addition to what tourists and locals can experience alike, and I think it's a need for the lake shore. So when Lisa saw this space, she almost became obsessed with the goal of creating it and creating that opportunity for people to experience what she had in her mind.

JAC:Yeah. She's absolutely a fixator, which I say in a way that is incredibly positive because I too am a fixator and when I say she fixates, she talked about how she saw the space on the lake shore path that would become the Shore Club and at first, she saw it as a perfect venue to host an event for one of her clients and then as she started to dig into the logistics of actually opening a restaurant or an event space on Chicago Park District property, she realized really quickly that it needed to be open and available and accessible to all Chicago residents. So a restaurant was the clear way to go.

JAC:The Shore Club is inspired by beautiful beaches across the world, how Lisa puts it, and really when you see it, it makes sense because it looks like something you could find in Greece. It looks like something you'd find in the south of Italy or France or Croatia, wherever you'd want to go to a beautiful beach with great beach food or snacks to share. This place really represents that and I. But I think what's most striking, even though the design is incredible and even though the place is remarkable, I think what's really striking about it is that Lisa is so young.

JAC:She's out of college in a handful of years, so she hasn't been in the workforce for a super long time. Her professional training was in music and she sort of had this idea, had this dream, had this vision and found the people to help her execute it. And when that vision was like create this beautiful place that was healthy, that that really reflected the lake rather than taking away from it. What she created was truly remarkable, especially given her age and experience.

KG:And it seems like in your interview, even though she's so young and she's already accomplished so much, she stayed really humble throughout it all.

JAC:She's super humble and I'm going to point to a couple of things for that, one being just the hard work that goes into event production in general and hospitality in general. Sometimes when you hustle all the time, it's hard to sort of spend a lot of time on ego. And the other one being where we're both from.

JAC:So we're from Minnesota, she's from a town that borders mine. I'm from Anoka, she's from Coon Rapids and we are a hardy stock, the Minnesota people, we work hard and we do not take compliments well. So when you hear her sort of speak to her own accomplishments, it, it's sort of those things where it's just she's put her nose down, she's worked really hard probably for her entire life. And now you're really sort of seeing that pay off.

MU:On this podcast. We get to talk to high achievers and how and talk to them about how they approach goals in general. And some are really opposed to thinking far ahead and they really like living in the present moment, but it seemed to me like the way that you talk about, uh, how hard she works in what she's doing. It doesn't, doesn't leave her much room to talk about the big goals in the future. It's really just driving forward and kind of digging down into that hard work. Would you say that that sort of her mindset about goal setting in general?

JAC:Yes. And she also knows that she wants more of these restaurant brands. She wants to be a restaurant group and have a restaurant brand that's known across the country. So I, I think that she's present in the work that goes into making a successful brand, but she's not removed from the path that leads you to future growth.

KG:Another thing Lisa mentioned in the interview was how important it was for her to find the right partner for the Shore Club. Can you talk a little bit more about why this was so important to her?

JAC:The partnership was incredibly important to Lisa in creating the Shore Club because she needed help in areas where she hadn't had experience, so when she started to get connections and pointed towards people who were a friend of a friend or were from where she's from or went to church camp with her in one case, she started having these conversations about the vision and the dream and and sort of was able to see the synapses fire in other people and the connections get formed.

JAC:You'll hear her talk about the gentleman who would eventually become her partner and how she just knew she had a gut feeling that he would come to this meeting and he would be her path forward. So even though he was an hour late, which I will tell you, does not strike a Minnesotan well. We are punctual people. She stayed. She waited because she just knew intuitively that this meeting was important. Whether he would end up being her partner or not. And he ended up being her partner.

MU:We're so excited to hear this full interview with Jeana and Lisa. So here it is.

JAC:I'm here with Lisa Jaroscak on an episode of #WeGotGoals. Lisa, how's it going?

LJ:It's going good. Pretty busy, but good. ]

JAC:And you're busy for a lot of reasons which we'll get to, but we're here actually doing a live episode at the brand new Moxy Hotel here in Chicago. So shout-out to Moxy for hosting us in this incredible podcast studio. But Lisa, you've got a lot going on right now before we get into the big question. So talk me through how you spent today.

LJ:Oh Man, today. Well, I got up and I picked up some popcorn from Garrett's Popcorn for a favor, for a wedding that I'm doing this coming weekend. And then after that we moved on and I went to Shore Club. We're opening this weekend on Friday and we're getting ready. We have our friends and family opening tonight and getting the space set and we had a photo shoot today.

JAC:It's a busy day.

LJ:Yeah, definitely.

JAC:And you have not always been in the business of food and beverage and hospitality. Right? You started your career more so in music. Can you talk me through how you made the leap from music into hospitality?

LJ:Yeah, so my background being in music kind of started with, you know, I was performing a lot and I did a lot of gigs all around town and I was touring for a little while and then from there it just seemed like a natural progression to get more into the production side of things and booking. So I was working with some other artists and helping them book for like festivals and private events and corporate events, all sorts of different things. And then from there, you know, it was like, OK, so you're getting the artists. So now can you get the sound? Can you get the stage, can you get the lights, can you get the tent, can you get the mobile stage unit, all of that. And suddenly you're, you're producing the whole event.

JAC:And when we talk about artists, you're not talking about just like an artist, no one's heard of, you're talking about Chance the Rapper, you're talking about O.A.R. and some other big names. So you're being very humble about your background.

LJ:Yeah, I think working in some of the large festivals--I've worked on Lollapalooza, I've worked on the NFL draft, different things like that that are bringing in, you know, high level talent that are coming in and performing for large masses of people. They are absolutely excited. And, and when you talk about like working with the artists, you are, you know, for me, I'm in the background and I'm setting up the stages, I'm setting the microphones, I'm collaborating with all the vendors that are involved in making it happen.

JAC:So talk me through how you started the Shore Club, before we jump into your big goals.

LJ:Yeah. So man, three years ago I was working with the Chicago Bears and Soldier Field and I was working on some tailgating events and from there I met a gentleman that was working, working with the Park District and he introduced me to this space. And when I was first looking at it, I thought of it as being an event venue because I thought it would be a great place to host people and as the process kept going, I started realizing it needed to be public and the way to do that is to make it into a restaurant and you know, there really weren't a lot of restaurants on the lake front, especially restaurants that do high end food. And so we started going after it and I got introduced to my partner, Robbie Schloss about two and a half years ago.

LJ:So about six months into my process. And from there he and I like hit the ground running, talking to everybody, telling everybody about it and you know, talking with all of the, the people at large with the, with the city.

JAC:And I also know that you're from the same place that I'm from. You're from Minnesota and we Minnesotans are hardy stock. We're hard workers. So as soon as I met you and got to know that fact, I figured that it made it a lot of sense that you're going to answer the next question I'm about to ask you the way you're going to answer it. How many businesses do you currently work for or own right now?

LJ:Fou. I was counting them. I was like going through the list.

JAC:Can you name them and that you do it each?

LJ:Yeah, so I obviously am an owner with Shore Club Chicago on North Avenue Beach. I'm the executive director at First in Flight Entertainment and Event Productions, which is the event production festival side of things and entertainment booking and then I am a lead planner and destination wedding planner with Storybook Weddings and Events, and I am the co-owner of Thrive Event Consulting.

JAC:So nothing much.

LJ:No, I'm. I have a boring life and I sit at home a lot.

JAC:You just shared with me before we got started that you grocery shop for the first time yesterday.

LJ:Yeah, for like in a month, you know, it's OK. I work at a restaurant. So you use scrap things together.

JAC:Absolutely. So let's get down to it. Let's talk about your big goal. Can you tell me about a big goal that you accomplished, how you got there and why it was important to you?

LJ:Well, I definitely think that Shore Club is that goal that I've kind of gone after and it's happening. I did not come from a background in, in raising any sort of venture capital; working in restaurants--I like, you know, waited tables in college. That was my extent of it, but you know, I saw this, this place on the beach and I just, I couldn't let it go. I kept, I kept thinking about it and it started in one place and it has grown into something completely different but still in reference to what it started as. And it just develops because you have to, you have to let it go where it's going to go based off of other people's opinions in order to actually make it happen. You have to evolve your plan and I think a lot of that I, I pay a testament to my partners with Shore Club, you know, their background being more on the restaurant and venue side of things.

LJ:They really helped guide me on that side of it. My experience in tenting and poppop concepting really helped Shore Club pop up and so, you know, I think just like never giving up and always being able to be flexible in order to make your goal and your dream come true. And I think for me one of the most satisfying moments was last year we did the grand opening of Shore Club on August 14th. We had over 400 people there and like to see 400 people like of, you know, Chicago socialites and, and PR people and people that are working with major news organizations coming to this place. That was just an idea in your head and like to watch them just enjoying themselves and, and celebrating within it. I mean, it was so surreal for me and you know, I'm really excited going into this season about it being even closer to where I wanted it to be and I'm excited for people to enjoy it again this season.

JAC:So you talked about the Shore Club being, your big goal and the vision that you had when you first saw this venue. So can you talk me through what your original vision was and how it evolved as you brought on partners and started getting feedback?

LJ:Yeah. So as I mentioned before, it was like, I thought it was just going to be an event venue and I was like, oh, we're going to host weddings and corporate parties and like, we'll be closed when we're not rented out, was kind of like what I originally thought. And then from there, you know, learning from the Park District because I didn't know. It's like it had to be a public entity and the way that we did that was was making it into a restaurant. And so with that comes a whole other slew of issues that you have to tackle.

LJ:I mean it's exciting, but for me, you know, bringing in my partner Robbie at the time and later on Nick Thayer, you know, it was like, it was going to be just the outdoor space and the tented area. And then it evolved that we have the, it's called the oasis where people can like rent a cabana day bed or sun bed and they can enjoy like bottles of champagne and bottle service out there and like trays of shared foods. And you know, I think that in the beginning it was supposed to be kind of this blank canvas that people would bring in their own stuff and like decorate it the way they want to like an event space, you know, like a ballroom or, or I dunno Shay down on Orleans or whatever. And it's like now it's evolved into this whole place that people come in and they're like, oh wow, you know, like I don't have to bring anything in.

LJ:Like it's all here. It's our, it's already decorated. And, and to watch people everyday, like hanging out in the space and having like regulars. It's so bizarre and exciting. You know, I think that a lot of it too for me in the journey was I, I didn't know everything that I was getting into. I just had this end goal idea and, but like the steps to get there, it takes so much more than I knew at the time when I started, you know, going through, you know, meeting with people from the city and going through permitting and going through meeting with the neighborhood committee and like getting everybody's input and like changing your plans so that it can accommodate what their, their goals are because at the end of the day we want the public to be excited about what we're bringing there. So yeah, that's a little bit about how things started in comparison to where they are now.

JAC:And I'm interested too, because I know that you studied music in college. I'm interested to hear how you've sort of learned the lessons in business that you've learned that have helped you be so successful.

LJ:Well, I think being in music you have to market yourself and nobody's going to get the gigs for you until you're at a certain level. So, you know, it was about, I, I studied opera performance and you know, people would say, oh, it's a dying art. It's like, or, and, and maybe, maybe it is, but for me it was something I was incredibly passionate about and so it was about getting myself out there, doing the research to figure out like where auditions were. Where, you know, for me, I was a soprano so I was looking for companies that were doing productions that would fit my voice, getting out there for summer programs, getting out there, you know, I, I ended up transferring to a conservatory, you know, like what was the best thing for my career and moving forward and I think that it really, it really takes like you learning that you need to support you in your goals and that everybody else's opinion--take it, but also like don't lose sight of what your end goal is and like let, let opinions help guide you, but don't let them dictate where you're going.

JAC:That's great advice and I think it's especially great advice for anyone who's taking on money or partners. Which leads me to my next question about a big goal you've accomplished. So how did you pick the partners that were right for you and for Shore Club?

LJ:Well, OK. It's a funny story actually being from Minnesota, so I grew up in Coon Rapids, Minnesota and I went to a good Lutheran church as most Minnesotans do and I went to church camp and a very good friend of mine, Noah Kraft who owns Kraft Lighting here in Chicago. We grew up together going to church camp and when I was, when I had moved to Chicago, he lived here too and he does like a lot of lighting and sound installations across the city in like for Lettuce Entertain You venues and and all over. So he was working on a project with Robbie.

LJ:So I presented the idea of Shore Club to him because I knew like he wouldn't steal it. And so then he, I was like, so what do I do now? Like I've never raised money. I don't know anything about like entering things into a POS system. I don't know about hiring staff. Like I don't know these things. And so he ended up introducing me to Robbie. He was like, Robbie's a good guy, you know, he will, you know, he'll help you and he'll give you his ideas. And then I had scheduled coffee with Robbie at the Chicago Athletic Association and he was an hour late, but I stayed because I was like, he's my chance. So I stayed there for an hour and he like, called me in a panic and he was like, Oh my God, my Outlook Calendar, something crazy happened. I was like, it's OK.

LJ:It's OK. So he came. I presented the idea and like I think that he, you know, he like played it cool. He was like, yeah, yeah, I think it's a, I think it's a good idea. And then afterwards, like I heard this later from, from his wife being like, oh my God, he came back and he was like super amped about the project. Like he tried to play it totally cool. But then through, through Robbie, so you know, we started hitting the ground running and we were working together. There were other people that I thought would be involved then later weren't. And then like through time I feel like it weeds the wrong people out because you just stay dedicated to the goal and if people aren't dedicated then they kind of drop off. And then from there Nick Thayer was like, he texted the wrong Robbie, so he ended up texting Robbie on accident and then they ended up getting together and he told them about Shore Club.

LJ:And then Nick was all about it. Then I met nick and then all of us were, we decided to do this together and then you know, to go full circle. Nick and Noah from church camp had worked together previously so everybody knew each other. And so we opened up things. And I think one of the most amazing things about our partnership is that like we each have our thing that we know that we're really good at and we don't get in each other's way, but we'll come to each other if we have, if we have a question and like we have team meetings and say like, OK, what do we think about this? And, and I love having three because it's like, then it's never one against the other, it's like usually somebody agrees with one of them and then we like convince the other ones that we're right or, or that we're wrong, you know, and I think that that has been such a valuable part.

LJ:And like Robbie, Nick and I are like, we're also like, we're really good friends. So outside of work, even though that's kind of like, oh all we do and talk about, it's like I also know that like Robbie would have my back and Nick would have my back in, in life in general too. And I think when you have that trust, it just leads itself to being a great place for a business to thrive and grow.

JAC:OK. Two rapid fire questions, before we get into your future goals. One, do you still sing?

LJ:Yes.

JAC:Can you sing a note for us?

LJ:Oh, I don't want to do that.

JAC:Don't do it. You don't have. As soon as I asked, I was like, that's probably rude. Two: Do you think that someone who is from Minnesota or who is not from Minnesota would have stayed for an hour for that coffee?

LJ:Oh man.

JAC:I think that's a very Minnesota thing to do.

LJ:Yeah. I mean my friend told me he was a good guy. Like I believed him. He was worth the wait and like I just took out my laptop and got some other stuff done and I was like, if he doesn't show he doesn't show, but at least I got some work done in the meantime and then. And then he showed and it was like history. History was writing itself.

JAC:And the rest is history. So let's jump in to a big goal you have for the future. So can you talk me through a big goal you hope to accomplish--you've already done so much--and how you plan to get there?

LJ:Yeah, so I think that one of my big goals or I guess a collective goal of Robbie, Nick and myself as a, you know, we're, we want to open more places and that's something that's on our horizon.

LJ:And I think, you know, we want to get to a place where we're a well established hospitality group here in Chicago and hopefully nationwide and I think that that's something that we're creating a good foundation in making sure that we have kind of all of our bases covered and through the way that the public has just, I dunno, just captured our hearts and just really taken us in as even though we're like new kids on the block, so to say as a group together, I'm excited for what the future has to hold of other endeavors. I think that, you know, the three of us are pretty creative individuals and we're, all three of us are, you know, we're not afraid to get our hands dirty and so I'm excited moving forward of what those other projects are going to be. And yeah, I mean I hope that we open 20 properties someday.

JAC:Get to say those big goals aloud.

LJ:Yes.

JAC:Well thank you Lisa for joining me on the #WeGotGoals podcast. Before we sign off, would you tell me where you want to open next, if you were to open your second location?

LJ:We're looking in the loop or in the Fulton Market area.

JAC:Hot.

LJ:Definitely. I'm a big believer in like go where the people are.

JAC:I didn't know what to say then but hot came out, so here we are. Thank you for joining me. It has been a pleasure and you can find Lisa, by the way, at the Shore Club all summer long opening-- announcing tomorrow its fitness lineup, so don't miss that.

LJ:Yeah.

CK:This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and if you get a chance to leave us a rating or review while you're there, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; our guest this week, Lisa Jaroscak; and to Moxy Chicago Downtown for hosting our live podcast event.

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A group of deer or sheep is a herd. A collection of ferrets, a business. (Seriously.) But what’s the best term for a community of runners?

If you’re Tim and Jessica Murphy, you call them the BibRave Pros. And in four short years, you gather more than 100 of them, working to connect them to each other, to races, and to related brands so the whole sport benefits.

For this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, I caught up with the power couple and BibRave co-foundres before last month’s Boston Marathon. I’ve known them since BibRave’s early days here in Chicago (they now live in Portland), and wanted to learn more about how they’ve built such an engaged, inspiring collective of socially savvy athletes.

“I love talking about community and what the word actually means, because I feel like it gets used and sort of abused a lot,” Tim said. Not any group of app or website users, customers, or past participants qualifies. “It’s not a community until there becomes this sort of interconnected fabric where they’re all concerned with one another’s wellbeing, and they’re cheering for each other, and they’re sad with each other. There is a genuine connection between them.”

Runners naturally tend to flock together, but Jessica and Tim don’t take the bonds between their BibRave Pros for granted. First, they focus on choosing the right people—not necessarily those with the biggest following, but athletes who are positive, empathetic, diverse, and have struggles and triumphs that everyday runners can relate to. “We want to embody the fun and communal aspect of running,” Jessica said.

From there, the BibRave team—five staffers total—works hard to keep these ambassadors engaged. Every Tuesday at 8 p.m. Central time, they host a popular Twitter chat (follow it at #BibChat) about a different running-related topic. They also produce a weekly podcast. And, they work to create opportunities for affiliated runners to interact in real life, at races and other events (starting with signature bright-orange singlets that make them relatively easy to spot).

The evolution of the BibRave community transformed the entire direction of the company. When they launched BibRave about four years ago, the Murphys envisioned it as a Yelp or TripAdvisor for races, featuring user-generated content to help runners share and learn from each other’s experiences.

Eventually, they noticed how engaged and invested running influencers became in the BibRave brand. Around 2015, Jessica said, they had a light-bulb moment that shifted their business model.

“When we were out talking to other partners and other people in the industry, one thing that struck us was people want experts in social media and in community and we have that, but we’re kind of only using it to serve BibRave,” she said. “What if we started to use it to serve other people in the industry?”

BibRave pivoted and now works with brand and races to get their products and events into the hands and race calendars of influential runners across the country. Those runners, the BibRave Pros, have the opportunity to try new things. And, the running world as a whole benefits from learning about the latest and greatest from peers they can identify with—a win-win-win that involves transparency, hard work, and lots of moments of celebration along the way.

“To become a part of those people’s running lives has just been amazing,” Tim said. “To watch people hitting accomplishments they didn’t think they could hit and bringing everybody along for the journey—that’s very, very cool. It wasn’t something that we could have known was a goal, but I think it’s something we’ve been really proud of so far.”

Jessica and Tim had another goal that wasn’t explicit but that they’re proud to have crushed: creating a company that could sustain both of them. While Tim went full-time at BibRave about two years ago, Jessica didn’t do so until early this year, after stints at LinkedIn, Nike, and Runner’s World.

That period of time created some stress—Jessica often traveled for work, which limited the time they could spend together both personally and working on BibRave. But ultimately, the lessons she learned in those roles have brought incredible value to BibRave. And now that they do spend what Tim called a “ridiculous” amount of time together, they’ve found they actually feel less guilt and conflict.

“We have our moments where we’re in work; we can then more strictly define moments where we’re not,” Jessica said. “I feel like we have a better balance. And we do work really well together because we complement each other with different skills and talents. As we do that more, I feel like we’re hitting a good stride.”

We’ve interviewed co-founders before (including Julia Carmona and Lauren Katzberg of Stylisted), but never a pair that were life partners in addition to business partners. (That’s despite the fact that aSweatLife’s very own founder & CEO Jeana Anderson Cohen is married to her co-founder, Justin Cohen.) Tim and Jessica say learning to talk calmly and openly about work has, in turn, improved their marriage.

“You have your communication style sort of hard stop, right? That’s just how you most effectively communicate,” Tim said. He now knows the best way to ask Jessica a question—to give her a heads-up and set some context—and employs it whether he wants to inquire about a business deal or where they should go for dinner.

Listen to this week’s episode to learn more about the signposting communication technique they use at work and in life, what it takes to become a BibRave Pro, and the Murphy’s big goals for the future, including transforming the road-racing experience for the better. If you enjoy it, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

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JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Maggie Umberger and Cindy Kuzma.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning.

CK: Jeana, registration I know has been open for a little while now for something super exciting here at aSweatLife. Do you to want to talk about that a little bit?

JAC:I’d love to. So every year, twice a year aSweatLife hosts a week that's like restaurant week for fitness across Chicago. We create a schedule. We challenge people to try new things and to meet new people and you can find that schedule on aSweatLife.com, but every morning we will be encouraging people to set and achieve big goals just like we do on this podcast and every evening we'll be exploring new neighborhoods through the culture of sweat. We will finish the whole week with a fitness festival and we can't wait to see you there.

CK:And what are the dates for this week of awesomeness?

JAC: June 4th through the 9th. We can't wait.

CK: So if you're listening in real time, sign up now and if you're listening to this later on, I know there's going to be another amazing SweatWorking week soon.

JAC:Of course, but Cindy, this week you did the interview with two goal-getters.

CK:Yes. I talked to Tim and Jessica Murphy who are a couple and they are also the co-founders of BibRave, which is a pretty cool website and community and company focused on runners that started right here in Chicago.

JAC:And speaking of couples, I know that Tim and Jessica are married. I too am married to a co-founder of my company. He was my husband before he was a co-founder. Did they have any advice or guidance for couples who work together in that way?

CK:It's interesting. We did get into this maybe even a little bit more than they thought. After this interview. They were kind of like, oh, we didn't realize this was going to turn into like a talk about our marriage, but it kind of did and and it was great. Two big things. One was they started the company together, but Tim went full-time there before Jessica did and he said that that was actually really motivating to him, that he wanted to work really hard to make it worthy of her being there full-time, um, because he thought that she was just so good and so talented at what she did, that he wanted to make it a proposition that she was really excited about bringing her considerable skills to that community full time. The other thing that they said was that working together now full time has actually improved their marriage, that they have a specific way of talking to each other about business problems where he kind of sets the tone and gives her some context, lets her know what's coming next and what's required of her to answer a specific question that he's like, I don't need that, but she does. And communicating that way in business has made me realize, oh, the communication that we have in our marriage is so much better when I use that same technique in our marriage too and, and everything just becomes simpler. So it was really interesting to hear them talk about that a bit.

MU: Bibrave has an incredible community across the country, not only online but in real life that I had no idea really how big it was until hearing them talk about it and then looking up a little bit more since I'm not a runner myself, but I see how much importance they place on community and then their definition of it was also very interesting. Can you talk a little bit about how they define community and what their standards are for it?

CK: Yeah, so when they started BibRave, it was initially just a website for race reviews and now it really has grown into this community. And what they realized along the way was that the idea of community, it isn't enough just to be like, oh, people use the site, they show up, they're the community. They have to be really intentional about building that community online and as you say, offline. So they're always doing things to increase engagement. Like they have this great twitter chat that encourages people to talk to each other and they've really worked hard on giving runners more opportunity to meet up in real life. They've tried to organize meetups at races, they've tried to connect people in regions so that these BibRave pros who see each other all the time online can then solidify that relationship in real life and they've really seen the power of that community, help people achieve their running goals and life goals, and that's something I know you all see at aSweatLife too with your ambassadors, how you bring people together.

CK:It's not enough to just sort of text or tweet at people. It's really about coming together and being intentional about talking about your goals and how you plan to achieve them.

JAC: It's been so exciting to watch the community that BibRave has grown and I can't wait for this interview. Here is Cindy, with Jessica and Tim.

CK:This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here with Jessica and Tim Murphy, the co-founders of BibRave. Tim and Jessica, thank you so much for joining me today on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

JM: Thanks for having us. We're super excited to chat with you.

TM: It is a pleasure to be on.

CK: So I'm really looking forward to talking with you both because I have known you for awhile and I've seen BibRave grow so much overtime and we're here in Boston for the marathon, which makes things even more exciting. There's always such a fun energy around running and around this race and I know it's a place that we kind of get to reconnect every year. So it's so cool. So I wondered if you could start by kind of introducing us to BibRave a little bit, telling us what it is and the role that each of you play in it.

JM:Alright, I'll start. So BibRave started as like a Yelp or Tripadvisor for race reviews. We wanted a place where people could come together and share with other runners their experiences and since then it's grown into this huge community of runners who not only share race reviews, but now we work with different brands. And other races so that we have a community of influencers that can review races and products, share their experiences with others and just bring people together of all experiences and different types of shapes and bodies and sizes and goals and have objectives.

TM:Yes, so when we first got started, we were kind of looking at ways that we could establish own social media presence.

TM:So we started a twitter chat which became pretty popular pretty quickly. It was centered around the Hashtag #bibchat. And noticed that a group of people coming back week after week, month after month, were running bloggers and so we thought why not bring them all together to use their collective audiences and readers and followers help races and brands to reach more runners? And so that's how we started our community of influencers known as the BibRave Pros.

CK: And I definitely want to hear more about the BibRave pros and kind of what it takes to be one. But first I want to talk about the beginning a little bit. I know that BibRave started because of a sub optimal personal experience that you had. Right? I wondering if you could talk to our listeners a little bit about that.

JM:Yes, and I feel comfortable talking about this because the race that I had a suboptimal experience is no longer around. It was formerly known as the Suntrust National Marathon. It was, has since then been bought by Rock ’n Roll and obviously they put their Rock ’n Roll footprint on it, so I think a lot of things a bit buttoned up, but it was only my second marathon ever and I trained through the Chicago winters, which was horrible. I paid many and spent time to travel there and I just felt like, ah, if I could have had the experience that I had in Chicago, it would have made this, that much more worth it and so we really wanted to start it so that people could learn from other people's experiences and I was very big into user generated content, wanting to hear from my peers what their experiences were.

TM:Yeah. We, if I remember correctly, Jessica had done a good amount of research, but she was only finding like races’ Facebook pages, which are not necessarily like the most authentic reviews because we don't know if any of those were changed by the race or anything like that. Like it's just not something that is owned by the users. And the other option was like forums, which is just a terrible user experience. So I do remember both of us thinking, how is there not a more definitive place to find out what runners think of a race beforehand? And that's kind of the initial phase for the the idea for BibRave.

CK: And I know it's kind of grown and changed and you've accomplished so much since then. So what we talk about on the #WeGotGoals podcast, we ask two big questions and the first one is what is a big goal that you've achieved? Why was it important to you and how did you get there? So I figured in the context of BibRave you've accomplished a lot, but is there kind of one, one thing either collectively or individually within the company that you would highlight as something you're particularly proud of?

TM: So just sort of like as it relates to Jessica and I have, this is now both of our full time jobs and so that has been really gratifying for both of us because it started as an idea and we both put a lot of hard work into it and just had a lot of challenging situations from that come with starting any kind of business and so just getting it off the ground at all and then having it become like an actual thing so to speak and then something that we can both work on full time and you know, there's, there's five of us now on the team.

TM:So that personally has just been really gratifying. And was, it was a goal whether or not we stated it explicitly or not. I think that we both ultimately wanted it to be our thing. And right now it is.

CK: Yeah. I think I remember talking to you closer to the beginning, I believe you said that was a goal. Maybe you were like, I think it was a goal, so it is really cool to watch that and to see you and not even just the two of you. Like you said you have five and then you have this whole other community of people supporting you. So it's been incredible.

TM: And one thing I would add, like I think if we, I, I kind of wish we had been more honest with ourselves about it being a goal. I think we probably didn't have enough confidence or we didn’t, we didn't really talk about it and we're pretty goal-driven people, we’re very like planning-focused and I just don't know that we were ever super honest about that being a goal and I don't know if it was because we didn't know if it was realistic or we didn't want to face the reality of it not coming to pass. So we didn't talk about it too much, but I still think it was ultimately something that we wanted to do and it's just, I wish we had been a little bit more explicit about it.

JM:One thing I will say is I tend to be more risk averse and I feel like Tim is much more willing to take on new risks. So it's no surprise four years into it, Tim went fulltime on BibRave two years ago and I'm just now coming full time on BibRave as of three or four months ago. I think if we were jumping both feet in the deep end right away, we would have both gone full time, but I think we eased into it. The benefit in hindsight is that our business has evolved so much since we first started. What we're doing now is not at all what we envisioned we would be doing when we launched BibRave and to me, one thing that I'm the most proud of is that I think we've evolved our business to mold to needs that we see in the running industry. As we go to conferences and we go to events and we hear the needs of brands and race directors and that's what I'm super proud of is that we haven't said this is our plan and we're sticking to it and we're so rigid in how we've defined our business. We've been able to evolve and launch new projects as a result of needs that we've seen.

CK:Yeah. I was interested in kind of how you go about aligning—It seems like you found a sweet spot aligning the goals of your BibRave pros and the brands that you work with and the races that you work with, but it's probably like a little bit of a balancing act to figure out where everyone's goals do align, so how do you kind of navigate that? How do you work with, with everyone to make sure that you keep everyone's goals aligned, if that makes sense?

TM: Yeah. I think that it's critical for everything to be very win win, win for our partners, for the BibRave pros and for the brand and I've been thinking about this more and more recently. We're trying to pull together like a mission statement of sorts and I will not try to speak extemporaneously about how that's been going so far, but really like one of the things just sort of like to touch on the BibRave pro aspect and to also go back to goals for the company.

TM:It's been immensely satisfying to see this community of not just the BibRave Pros, which are like the community of running bloggers that we have sort of in our in our family, but also the BibRave community in general. To just become a part of those people's running lives has just been amazing and to watch accomplishments, people to be hitting accomplishments that they didn't think they could hit and bringing everybody along for the journey. That's very, very cool and it, it wasn't something that we could have known was a goal, but I think it's something that we've been really proud of so far. As far as like how to keep the balance in act there. It's really just trying to be honest about everybody's priorities and not just like taking things for granted. So never trying to take the brand partners or race partners for granted, never taking the BibRave Pros for granted and really just trying to focus on everything being win, win, win.

JM:When we started with the BibRave Pros, at first it was a community just to serve BibRave and I think when we were out talking to other partners and other people in the industry, one thing that struck us was people want experts in social media and in community and we have that, but we're kind of only using it to serve BibRave. But what if we started to use it to serve other people in the industry and that was like the light bulb moment for us probably like around 2015 and when we started to again then leverage our community to help kind of other brands and companies. So I again, I, I pat ourselves on the back in hindsight that we were able to do that. I don't think we knew at that time it would grow into the business that is now. So super excited that it has.

JM:And then things like last year we launched the BibRave 100, which again was just seeing a need that there was no place that had a definitive list year over year, the way you think of like the U.S. News and World Report top colleges that was the Bible when we were kids about where you would find like the best colleges to go to and we really want this to become that and we feel like we have the right community to do it. We have the right kind of like social savvy to get the word out and to get people to participate. And again that wasn't part of our original plan, but has become now a pillar of what we do.

CK: And the BibRave 100. That's just like a list of awesome races, right?

JM: Yeah, it is top 20 marathons, top 20 half marathons, top 15 10Ks, top 15 5ks. And then we have three top 10 lists of categories that the runners get to vote on. So last year it was the best medal, the best scenery, and then best race management.

CK:Tell me about these BibRave Pros. How many you have now and what it kind of takes to be one of these days.

TM: So there are 100-plus BibRave pros, maybe like 110, 115. But to become a BibRave pro, we don't have like a super specific or rigid or singular requirement. Like when we first got started we thought okay, we need people who have, I don't know, 20,000 followers on twitter and that's a made up number, but it was then too. We were like, we just need size. We didn't know any better and we didn't see the most like genuine content coming out of those people. And that's not to say that it can't exist, but that wasn't our experience. So we started actually like leaning into more of this sort of micro influencer space. People who have had a few thousand followers on twitter, maybe the same on Instagram.

TM:Some are much bigger than that, but you know, people who are relatable running personalities, people who struggle with things like weight gain or injury or plateauing or just, you know, burnout. Things that all runners are kind of like dealing with, the BibRave pros are examples of those things and they can help people overcome those difficulties. They can help them feel more empowered to hit their goals. Like they're just a much more relatable and inspiring group of people. So definitely not like a singular cookie cutter. You must fit into this and you must check this box. We have, you know, BibRave Pros apply and we take a look at their entire social profile. Some of them are more influential in real life, they lead running groups, things like that. So we definitely try to look at the entirety of the person.

JM:Another big thing for us I think is kind of attitude and personality. Like we want to embody the fun and the communal aspect of running and also being in the running and racing space, we know that there are realities of business that happen, especially for a ton of our race partners. There are things that can happen on a race day that are just unavoidable. No matter how closely you can plan or how detailed you can plan, things are going to happen with any live event. And so we want people who kind of like have empathy that things can happen, who want to know what has happened and are not, I'm just being necessarily negative when critiquing, if it's a race or a product. So we try to imbue kind of like what constructive criticism I guess or like positive thinking and that empathy that comes from knowing what's going on behind the scenes because they're more educated, they kind of know everything that goes on behind the scenes.

TM:That doesn't require like a Pollyanna lens at all, but it's much more like a productive approach. And uh, so yeah, it's kind of all ties back into like the, the holistic approach of like who is this person, what are they about and will they kind of fit in with the larger BibRave Pro family.

CK: And that makes sense. And as you say, because you're not just building a service for brands, you're building a community too. So that is all so important. Talk to me a little bit more about community and how you all have seen the power of community in running, whether it's among the BibRave pros or even when you talk about your own running goals.

TM: So this is actually like I, I love talking about community and what the actual, what the word actually means because I feel like it gets used and sort of abused a lot.

TM:A lot of people say, oh, this is our community and I'll ask like, what does that mean when you say your community? And sometimes they'll be like, oh, it's our users if it's like an app company. And I'm like, that always makes me a little uncomfortable because I'm like, there's not necessarily a community. It could be, but just the fact that you have readers or users or even followers does not make them community. Or if they’re your past participants for an event or a past customer, like it's not a community until there becomes this sort of like interconnected fabric where they're all like concerned with one another's wellbeing and they're cheering for each other and they're sad with each other. Like there is a genuine connection between them. They're not just people who happen to call themselves the same thing. So that's kind of how I differentiate it. It's more than just a collection. It's sort of like an integrated collection

JM:And I think, you know, Tim was mentioning we're working on this idea of the mission statement. Community is at the heart of that, but I think ultimately defining our definition of community will become critical to that vision because I do think we define it in different ways than a lot of people.

CK: That's interesting. And for you all personally, how has having this community, I mean has it kind of reflected back in other parts of your life too? Like in your running or in your personal goals?

TM: Yeah. We were talking with some people at the expo today and we're talking with a brand partner and they had somebody who they knew come up and start chatting and so then the five of us, the four of us were chatting or the five of us and it turns out that one of them is next door neighbors with one of our BibRave Pros. So she saw my shirt and she's like, oh my God, guys are with BibRave, my friend runs with you guys. And when we were like, Oh, who's your friend? Like we obviously will know who it is, and she said who it was and it was just like those kinds of interactions are very cool because you get to see more of their life and more of their friends and things like that, but also just watching them run races they didn't think that they would otherwise be running, whether that's a distance they didn't think they could conquer or a time they didn't think they could hit. That has been super cool to watch unfold throughout the BibRave Pro scene.

JM:We also have some pros who have become like BRFs or best running friends with other pros across the country and have considered themselves BRFs for years before actually meeting in person, which is like a really powerful thing to think, I can consider you my best running friend but we haven't met and then now we're meeting for the first time in two years. Or just this past spring, one of our BibRave pros was at a marathon and one of our race partners, the race director was there running and trying to run a BQ time and our BibRave Pro is there running the half and so afterwards he was there and like caught a, you know, a picture of the race director on mile 25 and like, and they know each other through BibRave and they feel connected that way. Like that is a really kind of cool thing to just feel the community. It's a very big one, but then it seems smaller in those small moments.

CK: That has got to be incredibly gratifying. Wow. To think that you created this and then those kinds of connections happen.

JM: Absolutely.

CK: So it's interesting and they want to talk about your goals for the future too, but you know, how do you think that you'll be able to keep that kind of community if, if BibRave continues to grow.

JM: So we are grappling with this as every I would say company does or any type of community does as you grow. Part of it I think is Tim and I staying involved in the community We have a community manager that manages our pros and we want to empower her and you know, I will say in the past year or two we kind of took a step back because we wanted it to be like her thing.

JM:But then we had heard honestly from our pros that they felt like we were not connected to them. So now we're just staying involved and it, and it's a learning for us because at first we thought well we're going to empower you to be the person that manages them, but now we know they still want to feel like we as co-founders and owners are invested in them. So that's part of it. Two, I think with any community, there's one, I obviously like the regional connection, so we have different regions and they have little micro communities within them but also the connections that happen within races. So we're finding different ways for people to meet new people within the community and not just talk to like the same 10 people that they've known for a long time. And I'm hoping that way, even though it's 100 and may become more people, find new ways to connect with more people.

TM:Yeah. And I would just say sort of echoing a little bit with Jess said, finding new ways for them to interact with one another and finding new ways for us to interact with them. So part of our own podcast is just our way of sort of putting a voice to the BibRave brand for us to create content. We weren't doing like a blog or anything so we thought the podcast would be a really good way for us to still be communicating with the BibRave community and sort of putting our own content out there. So just looking for more opportunities like that will be, it is in will be important to us in the next two to four years.

CK: And yes we should say too, you all have an excellent podcast and we will make sure to put a link to that in the show notes. And on the blog post too. So you've touched on this a couple times, but I want to ask about it a little more explicitly too. You are co-founders, you are married. How do you navigate that kind of relationship?

JM: To be honest, it wasn't for me immediately obvious that like, yes, we're going to hit this moment where we're both going to work on this full time. I think as Tim said earlier, we didn't explicitly say that at the beginning even though like in your mind that would be a dream. I will say super honestly, when I was working full time doing different gigs and Tim was working on BibRave full time, I was traveling a lot and oftentimes I would feel like stress because I would call him like after the work day, the 15 minutes we get to catch up and we were talking about the BibRave, like we weren't catching up as husband and wife and that would be really frustrating. And also I would feel almost sometimes a sense of guilt, like I'm not giving as much as I should, but I only have so much time. Now I actually feel that we're both working on it full time. We have our moments where we're in work, we can then more strictly define moments where we're not. So even though we're spending so much time together, I feel like where we have a better balance and we do work really well together because we complement each other with different skills and talents and as we do that more I feel like we're hitting a good stride. So.

TM:Yeah, I was definitely like, I'm not like a super possessive person but I was more like possessive just because, so Jessica is like a crazy baller. She's super smart, she's creative as hell. Like she was doing such amazing work for other brands and I wanted her to do that for our brand. So I was always pushing her to maybe find a way and, and you know, at some point it wasn't that obvious like we didn't know if the business could sustain both of us and she like, for her to stop working for another company would mean like an income source for the family goes away. So you have to like, come to grips with that reality, but that definitely was like my big motivator. I wanted her to be putting her talents to work for this thing that we had and it was, you know, I think that the, the tension that she talked about was totally on me, but I do agree that now that we're both like in it full time, it's been a very cooperative—we spend like a ridiculous amount of time together, but we almost had to do a, an impromptu trip to Florida like last week and traveling to Florida from Oregon is a really long way and it's like just a huge pain in the ass. But we looked at it and we're like, okay, it's not that big of a deal. We're just going to be like traveling together. If it was just Jessica going or just me going, it's more of a drag, but we're like, oh, we'll just go together. That'll be cool. The trip didn't even end up happening, but when we realized it wa

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One of the more endearing parts of my personality (I hope) is my tendency to go ALL IN on reality television shows, as friends who have been forced to receive my weekly email recaps of The Bachelor and The Challenge will attest to (yes, I still watch The Challenge and am in the Bill Simmons/David Jacoby camp of considering it America's fifth professional sport).

But I'm late to the Survivor franchise, which is mildly embarrassing considering it's considered by many to be the greatest reality television competition of all time, with the greatest host of all time (Jeff Probst) behind the wheel.

When I began watching this season, I immediately noticed one contestant whose passion and positivity jumped through the screen — and when I learned she was from the Chicago area, a yogi who had quit her job in corporate finance, and a self-published author on the subject of female solo travel, well, I knew I had to talk to her.

The first thing you realize when talking to Stephanie Johnson of Survivor: Ghost Island is that everything she says has the subtle hint of an exclamation point at the end of it. That enthusiasm persists even in situations that would leave the rest of us despondent — like being randomly chosen for exile on Ghost Island, a precarious situation that Johnson knew would likely lead to her being voted off at the next tribal council. But instead of wallowing on Ghost Island, Johnson took comfort in enjoying her present and mentally resetting from the 24/7 nature of Survivor's social game.

"What I allowed myself to do for that 24 hours that I was out there was to flip out of game mind and just be in Fiji on a beach by myself," shared Johnson. "And so I climbed up on top of the rocks and I watched this sunset. I collected shells, I sat, and I had this cry fest. I just kind of allowed myself to be in the moment and experience it."

She continued, "I knew that I was going to be in trouble if we lost, so I really wanted to soak it up, and that ended up being my last sunset in Fiji was alone on Ghost Island. I didn't want to go out, but I'm glad that I was able to at least watch [the sunset] and take advantage of it — and kind of do that alone."

The second thing is that when Johnson goes in on a big goal, she goes ALL. IN. Like quitting her job in corporate finance to immediately travel to Hawaii for a month-long yoga teacher training. Or like deciding to trek and backpack solo through nearly 50 miles of Patagonia, despite never having taken on a journey of that magnitude before. Or, like watching the first season of Survivor in 2000 and deciding it was her destiny to be on the show — and then applying for 17 years in a row until the casting department decided it was time to put her on.

Reminisced Johnson, "I was sitting in my college dorm room at Utah State University, and the show came on and it sparked a sense of wonder and adventure in me, and it was something that I didn't know existed until I saw these crazy people out on an island surviving — but for some reason that seemed so appealing to me. And so I started applying season two and I can't even tell you how many applications I have sent in over the years because we used to have to do them on VHS tapes!"

The beauty in Johnson's story comes from the fact that while she was constantly applying to Survivor, she was finding fulfillment in her life in other ways — and eventually, chasing those passions became what got her cast on season 36.

"At some point you have to just go on and live your life and keep pursuing the dream. You have to carve your own path and your own journey and your own experiences," Johnson believes.

And that life event that eventually led to her (finally) getting cast?

"Honestly, it happened because of Ironman Arizona — that's when I caught their attention. It's like I said: I needed to build up this life experience, but [the triathlon] was just my passion. I never went in to triathlon or running with the intention that it would get me on Survivor, but by doing what I loved and just following my heart and my curiosities it, [Survivor] came to me. It was just like the domino effect: one thing after the other, after the other, until it finally transpired."

And while she may not have won this season of Survivor, Johnson isn't done chasing big goals — and she gave us an exclusive on what's coming up next for her.

"I am going to enter the world of real legit ultra running, and I want to do a 100 mile race so I'm going to be planning on doing that sometime soon." Johnson confides. "After being in Patagonia out there in the mountains, it really spurred that desire to do these hundred mile endurance races that I see all my friends doing, and it seems almost like a spiritual experience. I know that sounds really weird, but I really want to tap into that mental strength that it takes to do that."

After listening to our interview, you can watch Johnson in the live reunion finale of Survivor: Ghost Island on Wednesday, May 23. And if you enjoyed listening, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com, on which we talked to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Kristen Geil and Cindy Kuzma.

CK:Good morning, Jeana.

KG: Morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning.

CK: Uh, Jeana, I know that this is kind of a big day. It's a big week. You have a pretty big announcement at aSweaLlife this week, right?

JAC:Yes. This week we announced our fifth #SweatWorkingWeek. #SweatWorking Week is like restaurant week for fitness here in Chicago. We get really excited about it. We create a schedule, we invite everybody to participate in a week where we invite them to try new things and meet new people. And this time around we'll have breakfast and learns every morning, where we're will help people set and achieve big goals. And then we'll also have big events every evening built around neighborhoods and exploring those neighborhoods through fitness. The whole week will end in a fitness festival which will be announced later this week.

CK:And when is this week of awesomeness?

JAC:The next one will be in June 4th through the 9th. The 9th will be the fitness festival. So come on down, come on down.

JAC: Now let's get to the show. Kristen, you did the interview this week and it was super exciting. I know because you are a fan of reality TV. So talk me through this.

KG:Yes, I am a reality TV junkie and this week I spoke with Stephanie Johnson who is on this current season of Survivor called Ghost Island and it's airing right now on Wednesday nights and I think there is a couple of weeks left before the finale.

JAC:So she talked to you in real time about how she ended up on the show and how she ended up on the show was a story of not quitting. So tell me how many times did she apply to be on survivor?

KG:So Stephanie told me that she watched the very first season of Survivor and applied every single season after that, once, twice a year. I think it ended up being about 17 years that she was constantly applying for this television show and she is the type of person who when she decides she wants something, she goes all in. And that's just another example of how she really sets her mind to something and will work to achieve it. But what I also thought was interesting about her persistence in applying to Survivor was that it was never the only focus of her life. Throughout it, she was finding other ways to fulfill herself, whether it was by quitting her job in corporate finance, becoming a yoga teacher and eventually training for an Ironman triathlon. And it was after she completed that Ironman that the Survivor casting production crew decided that was the special thing that made them want her on the show this time. So by fulfilling her life in other areas, she was actually, although unwittingly working towards her dream of being on Survivor.

CK: And it sounds like Stephanie has this really amazing ability to kind of take something that might be difficult or challenging and turn it into an opportunity. And she did that on the show when she was sent to Ghost Island, right? Can you talk a little bit about that?

KG: Yes. So on this season, the Ghost Island twist, was that your. At any time, you could be randomly chosen to go to this Ghost Island, which was basically exile. So Stephanie was chosen, she randomly drew the stone that would send her to Ghost Island and it's looked on as a downside because you're taken out of the politicking before a tribal council vote, so it's never an advantage to go to Ghost Island necessarily. And Stephanie also knew that she was sort of on the bottom of her tribe that particular week.

KG:So getting sent to Ghost Island was probably the nail in her coffin, but instead of getting really frustrated about how she couldn't do anything about the situation and how she was taken out of the game somewhat unfairly, she decided to turn it into a positive and she focused on the fact that she was alone on a beautiful desert island in Fiji and just really appreciate her gorgeous surroundings and sort of get her mind reset from the constant game mode when you're on a reality competition like Survivor. And I thought that was really beautiful. I thought that was a great perspective shift and it was so, it was done so consciously and so mindfully that I can see how it fits in with her personality that will come through in our interview.

CK: I thought this was a great one, and as someone who does not watch Survivor, I was actually really fascinated by it and I think I'm going to have to go back and catch up on the season now, so thanks for doing this interview Kristen, and I am excited to share it. Here's Kristen with Stephanie.

KG: Welcome to the #WeGotGoals podcast. My name is Kristen Geil and today I am here with Stephanie Johnson, who was most recently on this current season of Survivor: Ghost Island. Stephanie, how are you today?

SJ: I’m great. How are you doing?

KG: Oh, I'm good. It's actually a warm weather day in Chicago for once, so I feel like everyone just starts off their day on a better foot once the weather gets up like this.

SJ: Exactly. I feel like springtime just popped up and everybody's outside now. It's fantastic.

KG: Well, I know who you are. Obviously because I am a Survivor fan and I've been keeping up with the season, but can you give our listeners a quick introduction of just who Stephanie Johnson is?

SJ: Um, well, I was, like you said most recently on the 36th season of Survivor, Ghost Island, which was a huge dream and goal of mine since season one, episode one.

SJ:So it was an incredible experience to finally live out my dream. I've done two Ironman events, full Ironmen, and a handful of half Ironmen, I do ultra marathons, marathons, and then I'm also a yoga instructor, meditation coach, Reiki Master. I have a female triathlon clothing line. So I'm kind of all over the place. I am most recently an author, writing about travel, which is something that I am extremely passionate as well.

KG: Yeah. It sounds like you have your hands in a little bit of everything, but I know that before you were a yoga teacher, you worked in corporate finance, which seems like the complete opposite of everything you are doing today.

SJ: Oh, it's totally the opposite. So I grew up in Boise, Idaho and you know, small town and all I ever wanted to do was move to a big city and work in a high-rise and work in finance.

SJ:And so I went to college for it. I moved out to the big city. I got my high-rise, I got my job and I did it throughout my 20s. But then I just realized that, you know, even though I had pursued that dream and made it come true that after doing it for a certain amount of years, it just wasn't my dream anymore and that it was OK that that was my dream, and it was also OK that that wasn't my dream anymore and it was just time to pursue the next thing and what it was that I wanted to do for the rest of my life and create a career. So I quit my corporate job and I went off to a Yoga Ashram in Hawaii for a month and did a complete immersion in yoga and meditation and came back and like you said, drastically different career path.

KG: And it seems like you didn't even dip your toe in the water a little bit. Like you went in all out when you decided you wanted to switch things up.

SJ: Oh yeah, it was, it was just boom, done. And I had looked into different programs that took a year, but I'm kind of an intense, passionate personality. So for me just throwing myself into five hours of meditation a day and five hours of practice and you know, we had these long, 15-hour days at the Ashram, but that just fit my personality best and it was what was relatable and how I was able to learn everything. It was definitely, you know, that immersion, passionate, intense situation catered to my learning style.

KG: And it seems like that's an aspect of your personality that makes you so well suited for endurance races and triathlons. Is that how you found triathlon or how did you get started with those?

SJ: You know, triathlon came later to me. I was always active. I did yoga, I went to the gym, but it wasn't until I was later in my 20s and then really it was when I started going through my divorce and I was leaving my religion and I needed some sort of structure in the chaos of my life and I was turning 30 and I thought, you know, running a marathon has always been on my bucket list. I have these crazy runner friends that do it all the time, so why don't I just do a marathon add it into the mix. And it ended up being perfect for me though because for four days a week I had that absolute structure and the great and amazing thing about marathon training, especially when it's your first time and you're really coming from no athletic running base, is you see the improvements week by week. You see your endurance.

SJ:You all of a sudden are running 16 miles for a training run and you couldn't run 16 minutes eight weeks ago, you know? So it was an incredible inner strength building and inner confidence building experience for me to train for that very first marathon and I got hooked after that. I loved the running community. I loved the support that I was getting, the friends that I was meeting and so that's when I got hooked is when I turned 30 and I ran that first marathon and it completely changed my perception of myself and the course of my life, to be honest.

KG: I’ve had a few marathons under my belt and I can totally relate to what you're saying about how training for that first one, you get addicted to adding a little bit of mileage each week and you're like, I've never done this distance before. I've never run this far. And each week it gets a little bit more exciting to push your limits and see what your body can do.

SJ: Yeah, it's. It is. It's a, it's a little bit like you said, kind of like an addiction just to see like what else can I do? What am I capable of? If I can do this, can I do that? And I mean, we definitely all have our limitations, but it's very fascinating seeing that that strength grow and build and like I said, it's just such a confidence booster. And so that's how I got into the running portion of triathlon. I, you know, I was doing the running portion before I even dabbled into triathlon.

KG: Well, let's go back. Let's back up a little bit because you've already described so many interesting and varied accomplishments. I'm really interested to hear your answer to the first big question we ask everyone who comes on the podcast and that is, what is a big goal you've achieved in the past, why was it important to you and how did you get to achieving that goal?

SJ: You know, it's, it's, I have, I have three that I could, I could say.

KG: Let's go for it, why not?

SJ: Well then we'll just, we'll just go for it. Like you said. Okay. So the first would be definitely Ironman. And it did come to me later on in life as a goal. You know, it was never a life goal. I thought that people were like crazy who did that type of thing. I didn't know how to swim laps at all, but once I started swimming and I took that chance on myself and I had. I met a friend who was, he was 86 and we just bonded and he, he became my swim coach and we, we just, we had so much fun training that as soon as I caught onto swimming, I knew I wanted to go the full way and it was a huge goal and a huge dream to eventually do a full Ironman even though I had no idea how I was going to physically do 140 miles in a day.

SJ:140.6. I guess you gotta add in the .6. Exactly. But it became really important to me because it was like I, like I mentioned with the marathon, it was something that I focused on every single day and it brought a sense of community to me. It brought so many new friends and I loved being able to see what I was actually capable of because that to me was the impossible. It was completely impossible in my head, before I made up my mind that I was going to do it, and even sitting there at the start line of Ironman Arizona in 2015, I thought to myself, this is freaking impossible. What am I doing? I need to run off and go to Denny's and get some pancakes instead of starting this long day that I'm about to have. Like, what am I doing? So until you actually cross that line, it does seem impossible, but you know, it became hugely important to me just on a personal level to, to accomplish this and to kind of prove to myself that I was capable of this and it was important to me to show my children that you can do anything you set your mind to.

SJ:You know, I always preach that on social media, dream big. You can do anything. But if I'm not walking the walk, I should not be talking the talk because that's another huge thing with me is I like to be authentic and vulnerable and very real. And I feel like if I'm telling my kids, you know, you can do this, you can do anything. I need to be able to back that up with proof, so on a personal level it was important to me, but then as a mother it was extremely important to me as well.

KG: Well, that's enough for one goal. That was just the first one. What other, what were the two other ones you mentioned?

SJ: You know, definitely Survivor, like getting onto Survivor was, like I said, a 17 year goal for me, I knew I wanted to be on the second I started watching that show and I remember exactly where I was when I started watching it.

SJ:I was sitting in my college dorm room at Utah State University and the show came on and it was, it sparked a sense of wonder and adventure in me and it was something that I didn't know existed until I saw these crazy people out on an island surviving, but for some reason that seemed so appealing to me. And so I started applying season 2 and I can't even tell you how many applications I have sent in over the years because we used to have to do them on VHS tapes. Like, oh my gosh, you know, like you even like, remember, VHS tapes. It was crazy. It was crazy hard to actually get a video into them and you had to mail it in. And so I sent those in. I went to open casting calls, I, you know, and then finally, you know, now they do it on the Internet. So I would have been able to just send things in.

SJ:So when I got the call that it was just, it was mind blowing to me that all that persistence finally paid off and it's just, it I can't describe like you know it for 17 years, you think about something most every week because it's on, you know, nine months out of the year and then it finally happens and you realize that, you know, you have this huge dream that you want and you're doing everything you can. But at some point you have to just go on and live your life and keep, keep pursuing the dream. But you have to carve your own, you know, your own path and your own journey and your own experiences. Because in the end, when I look back, you know, the woman that I am today is not the, obviously not the same person I was 15 years ago and the life experience that I have now and who I am now as the person that needed to be on the show and meet the people that I met and so it's just timing is everything, but 17 years is a really long time.

KG:It makes me wonder what the casting crew was thinking the entire time we're going to if they just flipped through the applications every year. And were like, Oh, here's Stephanie again. Still at it. And then I wonder what made them decide now was the right time to cast you?

SJ: Yeah, it's crazy. And I, and you know it honestly, it happened because of Ironman Arizona, you know, that's when I caught their attention. And so it is, you know, if you look at like the series of events in a life as you know, almost like dominoes falling one after the next. It's like I said, I needed to build up this life experience, but it was just my passion. I never went in to triathlon or running with the intention that it would get me on Survivor, but by doing what I loved and just following my heart and my curiosities it, you know, it came to me, so it was just, it's like the domino effect, one thing after the other, after the other until it finally transpired.

SJ:But yeah, it was kind of a crazy, crazy scenario how it all happened.

KG: Yeah, that's amazing. It's wild how those things work out, but it seems to show that it was meant to be. And while you were fulfilling your own passions, it was just leading you the direction that you are supposed to be going all along.

SJ: Yes, exactly. Exactly. Life has a funny way of doing that.

KG: Yeah, it sure does. Well, I want to come back to your Survivor journey, but let's go ahead and knock that third big goal out because I'm super curious to hear what this one is going to be.

SJ: Yeah. So the third one is writing and writing. I've always loved to write and I always had this spark of curiosity of what it would be like to be a writer, but I'm not classically trained. I never went to college for it.

SJ:It was just something that I, I did and I, you know, I have a blog and everything and I, I write articles and do different things, but I always wanted to write a book on something, but he just never knew what it was. Like what was my thing? And I vividly remember, this happened after I was voted out of survivor and I was talking to one of the other contestants and, you know, I'm like, Geez, like I feel like I just reached my big goal. It's time to set a new one now, you know, because I'm very goal oriented person and it's like I needed something else. And I said, I've been talking about this for years, so I want to become an author. And so when I got home I realized that my thing was solo traveling as a, as a woman.

SJ:And I wanted to write about my experience with that. And you know, I tried the publishing route, I tried to go through, you know, different publishers and editors and it's just a crazy process. So I finally said, look, we live in a day and age when you can literally do anything yourself. Musicians can get their music out on Spotify and artists can get their work out on Instagram. And I'm like, why can't I publish a book? And so I researched and I researched and you know, all the backend work that goes into figuring out how do you write, edit and publish a book? And I figured it all out, you know, with it definitely took months and months of research. But I finally did it. And so publishing my first book was a huge goal for me that I reached. And it's only the beginning—I feel that it’s something that I created and it's my, it's like my little baby and now I'm going to fuel that and add onto that and just continue on with it because I really enjoy creating these books, especially on travel. So yeah. So that was a, that was the other one, is becoming an author, a published author.

KG:Congratulations on that is someone who makes a living cranking out thousand word blog posts several times a day. The idea of writing a full book is daunting to say the least. So it's amazing that you were able to take that dream and figure out a path to make it happen yourself.

SJ: Yeah. Well thank you.

KG: Let's go back to your time on Survivor. When the show started, I'm assuming that your goal like everyone else to was to win, and to outlast everybody else.

SJ: Yes.

KG: But what specific strategies were you trying to go about making that happen? What was your game plan?

SJ:You know, you definitely go in with the intention to win. I wanted to enjoy the experience because I had wanted this for so long, but you also like just with my personality, I had such a burning passion to win and you start the game and you look around and immediately I wanted to create strong social bonds with people. I knew that my social skills were going to be what would get me the furthest. I actually didn't tell anybody out there that I did triathlon or that I was a runner. I didn't want them to know my endurance and that I had that mental strength to really push through. So I told them, you know, I did yoga and I lift some weights and stuff, but he really kept a lot of that part hidden. So I knew that I had to rely on a lot of my social strength and building relationships and just being able to relate to people and I did. I mean I created really great bonds with a lot of people out there, very personal and you know, I had a lot of very intimate moments with people. And so that was initially my strategy going in was to create those bonds.

KG:And you said it yourself. The social aspect of the game is so big in Survivor. What did you take away from your time on the show in terms of learning how to get along with a group of strangers, especially when everyone's trying to accomplish the same thing?

SJ:Oh man, there's so much that I took away. It's, it's hard because you're in a scenario where you are, you know, the first night you all are sleeping in your bra and underwear and in bikini's next to each other for body heat. So you become really, really raw and close with these people very fast and there's like a very intimate bond that you make with these people very quickly and it's very deep and that part is very real. But yet you're in a game setting where it's not real life. And so you have to navigate between what conversations are real and what's not real. And you know, I'm definitely a lover, and not a hater, fighter. So it was hard for me, you know, a couple of the votes to, to vote people out. But you, you realize also you have to flip your mind back that you're in a game for you know a million dollars and if you want to stay, you have to. You have to be able to lie, cheat, and steal to get to the end. Yet you really do create real bonds and feelings towards these people because like I said, you have just this intimate, raw like down to like primal, like eating and, and warmth and sleeping with each other really quick. So I think that it taught me how quickly you can bond with people that you have nothing in common with, nothing, and from all different walks of life, you know, when you're stuck in a very primal situation basically. So it's been interesting taking those relationships also out of the game and how deep those relationships are, friendships that we've made are based on based on that, that connection that you make those first few days.

KG:Yeah. It seems like it's something that you guys have in common because obviously so few of the population is able to experience that. So it's a really strong bonding moment between all of you.

SJ:Yes, definitely. And that human connection is, it's very real and you know, you're, you're taken away from your phones and you're having real conversations with people eye to eye where you're, you have no distractions, of you know your phone going off or taking care of the kids or you have to do go, go to work or do this or that and so it makes you realize how much technology plays into our relationships and when you come out of the game, I bet it's like I crave more of that, that real relationship with people, you know, I don't want to have an only texting relationship with somebody because I know what it feels like to sit down with somebody without a cell phone and have a really deep conversation and laugh and cry or whatever you end up doing, but without any distractions. And so it does make you want to discover more depth in relationships when you get out of the game or at least it has for me.

KG:And that's interesting too considering your scenes and theme was Ghost Island, which plays off isolation from the community and you made a trip to Ghost Island right before you were voted off. What was that isolation like for you and how were you able to navigate it by yourself?

SJ:So you know, I do a lot of solo travel so I'm very used to being alone and I thought, no problem, I've got this, like and I was very excited to go to Ghost Island because you get to play for an advantage. And at the time where I was at I did not know that you didn't get an advantage because all I knew from Jacob and Kellen is that you get to at least play for an advantage. Jacob did and got, you know, the legacy advantage and Kellen just decided not to because she didn't want a chance to lose her vote. So when I got there and I got that I couldn't play a game. That is, that was this sinking feeling for me because I knew I was already in trouble and now I'm isolated and now I can’t, I don't have any advantage and now I'm stuck on a freaking island by myself.

SJ:And so I just, I had a feeling like I was in bad shape if we lost the next immunity challenge. So what I allowed myself to do is for that 24 hours that I was out there, whatever it was, is flip out of game mind and just be in Fiji on a beach by myself. And so I climbed up on top of the rocks and I watched the sunset. I collected shells, you know, I definitely like, you see me on the show. I cry all that. I, I'm like the resident crier of the group. Like I sat and I had like this cry fest. I miss my kids, but I like was collecting like I said shells and stones and you know, I sat in the water and just tried to like bathe because you know, that's how we, that's how we wash out there and it's just in the ocean.

SJ:And the one advantage that we had out there is this massive thing of rice. So I ate until I almost threw up like this rice and yeah, so I just kind of allowed myself to be in the moment and experience it. And I, you know, I did go through my mind any scenario that I could come up with for back at camp when I came back, but I knew that I was, I knew that I was going to be in trouble if we lost, so I really wanted to soak up and that ended up being my last sunset in Fiji was alone on Ghost Island. Well last sunset on the show, last sunset on the show was on Ghost Island. So I really, I really do feel like I didn't want to go out, but I'm glad that I was able to at least watch it and take advantage of it and kind of do that alone.

KG:That's such a beautiful sentiment because I can see how being in such an uncomfortable environment would really magnify your feelings. Like the highest would feel really high and the lows would feel really low. So it's really impressive that you were able to tap into some mindfulness to

View Details

Four and a half years ago, Jim Huether saw the potential behind a niche industry before it became one of the most sought-after spaces for brands to play in or companies to launch out of.

"In 2014, I remember everybody said the recovery and movement space, it's too small ... you can never create a sustainable global business in the recovery space," Huether recalled.

But, as he likes to point out, "You have to know that you're going to have naysayers, and if you have naysayers, it usually means you're doing something right."

Huether took his passion for working with small, emerging companies and figuring out how to scale them, and he applied it to Hyperice.

Hyperice, launched in 2010 specifically for high-performance athletes, produced tools and technology to speed up recovery, prevent injury, and enhance movement through the use of vibration technology, heat, ice, and compression. Today, you can find Hyperice products in gyms, studios, and everyday athletes' homes all over the world.

When Huether linked up with Hyperice, he - like Hyperice's founder Anthony Katz - believed the Hyperice product wasn't just an interesting, unique new tool. He believed it had the power to benefit athletes all around the world, professional and everyday alike. Huether was drawn to the challenge of taking a company with a lot of promise and a solid product to the next level: he wanted Hyperice to become the fastest growing company in sports.

And when Huether came on board as CEO in 2015 that became his big, hairy, audacious goal.

"When I came on, there was one product," he said. "It was a good, innovative product and there were some bright spots around the brand, but we really needed a new strategy, new goals and objectives, we needed a lot of new members to the team that were motivated and creative, and we needed to continue to evolve and build the best products in the world. We had to be relentless in creating innovative products and [we had to] challenge ourselves to continue to come up with those products."

Huether attributes a solid strategy that his entire team was on board with, an intense work ethic to strive for the best product innovations in the world, and a healthy sense of competition to achieving that goal.

His marker of success? In August 2016, Hyperice was named #96 on the Inc 500 list of fastest growing private companies in America (at 3300% growth).

For Huether, the growth of the company's culture (and not just the ping-pong table in the office, he notes, but rather a culture built on work ethic and sense of collaboration) has to remain in lock-step in order to keep growing at this trajectory and to go after those bigger, even hairier, more audacious goals for the future.

"I've learned that you have to make sure the entire team is always on the same page. You have to foster an environment within your company where people are working together collectively and not against each other. If you do that, you set up the whole organization for success."

He's doing something right and bringing in some good ju-ju for sure, because the company experienced its single greatest success yet with the launch of the Hypervolt.

"Probably our biggest success as a company was the launch of of the Hypervolt. We sold out in seven hours," Huether said. "We were sold out all over the world."

Huether alluded to the idea that the success of the Hypervolt was in large part because the world was ready for the innovation, and Hyperice is well on its way to positioning itself as a true leader in the recovery and movement space.

From serving only high-end, niche recovery tools to professional athletes to offering everyday athletes knowledge, tools and technology about how to move better, warm-up more efficiently and recover more efficiently, Huether has a new goal on the horizon.

"My biggest goal," Huether began with excitement behind his voice, "I want Hyperice to be on the list of the world's most innovative companies.

"Our vision and mission has evolved into helping everybody move more efficiently ... [and] to change the way people think about movement, mobility, warm-up, health, and wellness, and it's become really exciting."

As Huether sees it, helping individuals improve one of the most important aspects of human nature - movement - can change their entire lives for the better.

"As science evolves, if we can be that leader, providing people with tools and technology to help people achieve their goals, we can change the world and we can be one of the most innovative companies on the planet."

Hear this interview for yourself on this week’s episode. And if you like what you hear, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

Episode transcript:

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by a aSweatLife.com. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning and Maggie, you spoke with Jim from HyperIce this week.

MU: I did. I, I got to talk to Jim Huether. He's the CEO of Hyperice. Hyperice, is a movement enhancement technology company and for anyone who's never experienced a Hyperice device before, it is kind of like a foam roller, but nothing like a foam roller because it vibrates and it is not made of foam at all, but it has grown incredibly quickly in the last couple years and now that Jim is CEO, it's his job to see this company through to become one of the most innovative companies in the world is what he hopes for.

JAC: And Jim is CEO but not the founder, which is an interesting position to be in because his job is to take that company, take its innovation and its ideas and make it profitable, but he's super focused on team. Can you talk a little bit about that, Maggie?

MU: Yeah. It was a really refreshing thing for me to hear him say because he does come from a background of helping companies grow and become profitable. However, as CEO he sees it as one of his big roles to help his team see the goal and the vision together and to help everyone get on that same page to help this company become what he envisions it to be and it's already one of the fastest growing in America, but to become the most innovative in the world and is what Jim told me he envisions, but part of being growth minded for him, it's not just him seeing numbers on a page and what a title of a company looks like, but really what the entire team is helping create and build together. So it's not as much competitive as it is supportive from the inside is what I took from him.

CK: And it's interesting too just the whole industry because it has been sort of niche but recovery. I know I'm a runner and you all know from your experience in the fitness world like it's really moving from high level athletics to the rest of the world. How has, does he see Hyperice’s role in taking recovery to the masses?

MU: I think the company in general is really fascinating because I did a little research as to where it came from and we didn't end up talking about this on the podcast, but really Hyperice at first was technology meant for professional athletes and college athletes and it wasn't even the products that we use today as in the Vyper and the Sphere, which we'll talk a little bit about in the episode, but Hyperice has been a part of that journey of helping people become and think of themselves as athletes and I think that we all consider ourselves athletes now and I love that. I don't think there's anything wrong with that just because we don't play on a professional, team but if you are athletic everyday, if you do something that you sweat with every single day, your body needs to recover and the tools that Hyperice created helps athletes everyday athletes and professional alike recover and get stronger over time. So I, I think seeing that a few years ago was almost revolutionary because people didn't see it as a market or see it as a possibility and now we're all kind of getting on board with recovering like athletes make sense if we are pushing our bodies like athletes.

CK: Awesome. Yeah. It was really interesting to hear his take on this. It's a great interview. So I'm excited to share it. Here is Maggie with Jim.

MU: So I'm Maggie Umberger; I’m joined today on the #WeGotGoals podcast by Jim Huether, he’s the CEO of Hyperice, which is one of the fastest growing companies in America. So thank you so much Jim, for joining us.

JH: Thank you. Appreciate it. I'm really excited about this. So thank you.

MU: Yeah. So I just, I want to get right into it with you and I'd love to start just by hearing a little bit about your journey to becoming CEO of Hyperice, one of these incredibly fast growing and amazingly niche but exciting companies, tech companies now. Um, so what led you to this spot that you're sitting in now?

JH: Yeah. Great question. And I was always very motivated. I went back to business school once I graduated. I was working in sales and marketing for Anschutz Entertainment Group, which is a sports and entertainment company. I mean I went back actually to graduate school, this is probably about 15 years ago, maybe 13 years ago and became really inspired around small and emerging companies and how they scale and I think there are Harvard Business Reviews that we did in school, way back that were really exciting to me. I really enjoyed looking at different companies and figuring out the mistakes they've made or the successes that they had and why those successes or mistakes happen. So I became really inspired early on in the kind of entrepreneurial route and trying to, you know, work with businesses and work with challenging companies and learn how to grow and create opportunities with those. So I'd worked with a couple of startup companies in the concussion space, which is a really kind of a big and emerging field from 2005 and still, I mean it's very topical, people are looking at new innovative ways to create football helmet technology, baseball helmet technology to mitigate concussion.

JH: So I worked for a couple companies early on trying to kind of evolve that space and create tools and technology to advance that space and, and really enjoyed it, but started to hear a lot of information from athletes and influencers about how big recovery, health and wellness was becoming in the space. So I got really inspired around the recovery space and actually was mutually introduced to the founder of Hyperice about four and a half years ago. We had very similar visions on where we could take Hyperice. At the time the was company was struggling a little bit and needed some, a little bit more leadership and strategy. But there were some really great bright spots so we were able to join forces in 2014 and you know, really kind of turn the tide of this company and turn it into one of the fastest growing companies in sports, which has been a phenomenal journey.

MU: Incredible. And I think it's in sports and it's in everyday athletes’ lives now and for people who might not know Hyperice, it's a global recovery and movement enhancement technology company. So you're creating products for people to feel better and do whatever they're doing, whatever sport that is better and more effectively. And so growing from working with athletes because Hyperice traditionally or originally was more geared towards high performing professional and college athletes. Right?

JH: Yup.

MU: And so you've kind of grown to work for the everyday athlete. Is that been part of your journey?

JH: Exactly. You hit it spot on. So it's very interesting. One of the goals that I had when I joined Hyperice in 14 and was, you know, I wanted this company to be the fastest growing company in sports and at the time, not to get too into the business side, but the company was losing a lot of money and it just needed to, needed a new trajectory and new strategy, new people, new leadership, all those things that organizations sometimes can shift and grow, so we really focused on being the fastest growing company in sports and we spent a lot of time and energy working with athletes, working in sports performance professionals, working with forward thinking facilities to kind of create that premium awareness in the space. What we've found since then and we did, we did accomplish that goal. We were listed on the Inc 500, two years ago, number 96 fastest growing companies in the U.S., private companies in the U.S. and I believe on that list we were one of three of the fastest growing companies in sports on that list, but what we've found recently is this space as much larger than that. We're now, you know, our vision and mission has really evolved into helping everybody move more efficiently, helping everybody recover more efficiently, which is really exciting because there's so many channels and areas of growth that we can focus on really to change the way people think about movement, mobility, warmup, health and wellness, and it's become really exciting.

MU: Has it shifted the way that you think about recovery personally?

JH: It has. It really has, you know, and I think for me I'm more excited about opportunities that I never even knew existed when I joined in 2014, for example, massage therapy and physical therapy and corporate wellness, military, those are all channels that really need health wellness improvements. They need new tools and technology and innovations in recovery and movement to help them perform better, whether that be in a workplace or on the battlegrounds. Those are all really important and imperative things and if we can improve performance and we can improve health and wellness in those channels, we can have a drastic effect on the world and how people view health and wellness, which, which is also something that we're really striving towards.

MU: I think that's a, it's a really interesting point that it's a trend that recovery has started to seep into everyone's, I guess, forefront of our minds when it comes to, and finally, when it comes to thinking about working out, seeing the other side of it, because I think that we've begun to round the bend of going from hardcore workout, just kill yourself at every single workout, no matter what kind of athlete you are to now seeing how the other side is the most important, if you're going to be able to return to the gym to do what you do every day.

JH: Definitely.

MU: So, so going back to, to you personally or or within Hyperice, the main question of this podcast is what is a big goal that you've accomplished and how did you get there? So for you, Jim, what? What is that?

JH: Yeah, and I think one of those goals, I mean it really was the fastest growing company in sports goal when I joined was something that I thought we could accomplish. When I came on, there was one product and it was a, it was an innovative product and a great product. And there were some good bright spots around the brand, but we really needed a new strategy. We need new goals and objectives. We needed a, a lot of new members to the team that were motivated and creative and we needed to continue to evolve and build the best products in the world, right? We had to be relentless in creating innovative products and challenge ourselves to continue to come up with those products and not rest on our laurels with one or two products. Right? And then we need to work hard. So I think those all were equal contributors.

JH: But you know, the first one, setting a strategy that is just so important. You're, the basis of your strategy and you can adapt your strategy, really can be the foundation of your success, knowing, okay, maybe we're doing things we don't want to do things how they've been done in the past, right? We don't just follow what other people have done. We have to look at new innovative ways as time goes on and there's more advancements and tools and technologies to create a model and a structure that works for us and works for our type of business, so we did something completely outside the box in that regards and to to accomplish those goals you have to have the right people. So that was another piece that was incredibly important. Finding a team of people that were highly motivated, had great work ethic and even if they didn't have a lot of experience, which a lot of our employees did not when they, when they joined Hyperice, finding the right people that would want to grow and learn with the organization and that would like to be challenged. So we could accomplish all those strategies and goals that we had put together. So it really, you know, those kind of four things, strategy, team, obviously focusing on building the best products in the world, and then having that work ethic and sense of competition and teamwork within the organization, but trying to put ourselves in a position where we could be the leading company in the space, contributed towards, you know, gaining that notoriety on the inc 500 list and being one of the fastest growing companies in sports.

MU: And it's, that's a huge title now, to be one of the fastest growing companies in, in sports and so I'm sure that the innovation that you are pushing for it isn't going to stop, right? So and case in point, the Hypervolt which you just launched, can you talk to me a little bit about that recent launch for the company?

JH: Yeah, absolutely. So the Hypervolt is a vibration massage device, it has multiple speeds, you have variable levels of treatment. Can be used either by a practitioner or just self use. Been an incredible success really to help with range of motion, circulation, targeted myofascial release, um really an amazing product that we spent actually three years innovating. So we started this project at the end of actually the beginning of 2015 and about exactly three years later we're able to launch it. One of our, probably our biggest success as a company was the launch of the Hypervolt. We actually sold out in seven hours and oh my God, yeah, had to order a ton of product. We were sold out all over the world too, which was amazing. Companies like Japan, China, Korea, Hong Kong, Canada, sold out all over the world, ordered more product and got on the line with our manufacturers. We have to speed up production, sold out of our first batch of product in 16 days.

JH: So it's been really fun and I think it's, it's been the perfect storm for us with this product launch because the product is amazing, really is, and you know that that goes to the team and our technology team really focusing and our engineering team, making sure it was the best product possible. Um, but really you have an amazing product with an evolving brand. Our team here has done a lot of work creating great relationships and creating a brand around leadership in, in recovery and movement. And then the market was really excited and ready for a product like this, a portable device that was technologically oriented that you could use in a clinic or at your home and the relationships that we had as a company were evolved. So I think all four of those things came together and created this perfect storm. And the buzz and awareness worldwide was beyond what we had forecasted that it was really incredible to see.

MU: So I'm thinking about how when you're innovative, when you are this forward thinking there's got to be a little bit of lag time to get people on board. Would you say that there are, or what are some of the barriers that you've experienced since you've been onboard with Hyperice too? To get people to see things from your more forward thinking perspective on recovery?

JH: I think we've been able to foster a culture here where we encourage every member on the team to think outside the box. I know that sounds cliche sometime, but, but we really mean it. We really encourage our team members to throw ideas out there, throw ideas that may be way too far in the future, but crazy concepts that we can consider and keeping in our mind and any idea could come to life in this company. There's been times where people in accounting or people that had nothing to do with the sales or product or marketing teams have came up with a great idea that we've put into effect immediately and that's one of the benefits of being a small, hard working team. We're adaptable and we’re nimble, so I think, you know, really creating the foundation of a culture within the organization that people feel like they can always contribute new ideas has really helped.

JH: And a great example of this is our engineer or our VP of Product and Engineering. We had him joined one of our marketing and sales meetings about let's say three months ago and we were talking about ways to show and demonstrate vibration and he came up with an idea. He said, hey, why don't we use this thermal imaging technology on some new technology where you take a video of a human and as the product is going over the body, it shows the temperature changes in your body. So very technical looks really cool. And we ended up trying it, it was very visually stunning and it became the lead in our marketing campaign, but that was somebody who had zero marketing experience and was more of a product development expert. So you know, those types of things only happen when the culture is right and people feel as if they can collaborate and share their ideas. So that's something that we've really worked on within this company.

MU: That's fantastic. I love that. I mean it's, it's the idea that. What is the saying about rising boats lift? Oh no, I'm going to mess it up. A rising tide lifts all boats, but just that everyone can bring something to the table. So for you, I'm really interested to ask you more about where your passion lies of kind of solving problems and putting puzzle pieces together to help this company grow in a way that is sustainable and that you can think on the cutting edge of technology and then bring that to the world. Like how do you stay fresh for yourself and to see problems as exciting versus as daunting because that can get to be the case for big companies?

JH: I'm really inspired, you know, with business growth and sometimes it seems strange like when I tell people this, but to me I played a little bit of baseball back in the day and there's that competitive edge that you have in that sense of competition to overcome challenges and adversity and I think that was kind of ingrained in my DNA and I kind of took some of the things I learned there, some of the successes and failures I had there into the business world and I really enjoy it. I really enjoy finding challenges and creating strategies to overcome them and trying new things that may not work or have never been done before and seeing if they work and if they don’t, adapting them. When it goes back to what I mentioned about business school and it was really those Harvard Business Reviews that we did in my MBA school that really inspired me to look at different companies and, and find new ways to, to spin or find new ways to adapt and create new opportunities to create your own business model.

JH: So that's been really exciting for me and it's been something that, you know, I kind of get inspired by the challenge. When I joined Hyperice again, it was a, there were some great spots. The founder is very brand oriented, creative and we work very well together. There were just, there was some issues with the strategy and some issues with things within the organization that we had to fix and it took us about two to three years to go from losing millions to making millions and it was a long, hard road. But we built the company the right way and because of that, it's one of the reasons we're having so much success now is we built a great foundation. We are flexible, we're able to adapt, we are creative and those types of things. As any small emerging company, you have to have confidence in what you're doing, you really do.

JH: And you have to know that you're going to have naysayers and if you have naysayers, it’s, it usually means you're doing something right. I remember in 2014 everybody said, Oh, the recovery and movement space, it's too small. You know, it's never going to be, you can never create a sustainable global business in the recovery space. That's just not going to happen. Well, no one thought an online bookstore could do $178 billion and no one thought, you know, an executive at Paypal could, could send an electric car into space on a rocket. So I think, you know, having confidence in what you're doing and staying true to the vision is really important.

MU: Yeah. Yeah. And being okay with kind of stepping into a place that doesn't have all the steps laid out for you. It seems like a place where you really thrive.

JH: I agree. Yeah. It really is. Trying to find areas and things that have never been done before and not being afraid to fail. And if you fail a little bit and a project or, or a strategy doesn't work, then you learn from it and you try something else and you go after it, you know wholeheartedly and give your best in one of those items will work.

MU: Do you have an example that you kind of go back to as a learning moment for you that kind of gave you that confidence to pivot and to get excited about challenges versus getting worn down by them?

JH: In one of my previous companies, which you know I was an executive and I was on the management team in a leadership position, but I was not the chief executive officer. I learned that you have to really make sure that the entire team is always on the same page and you really have to foster an environment within your company where people are working together collectively and not against each other and I think if you do that, you know, you end up setting the whole organization up for success and you know, something we've done here with our team who are all very highly motivated. We have a lot of just unbelievable team members here that are young, hungry, motivated, work hard, maybe don't have a lot of experience, but everybody's incentivized for team goals. Everybody's working towards the same goals and achievements. So that competition we create is actually competition not within the organization. It's external, right? Everybody here, there's no competition amongst each other and I think that gets more minds and more creativity within the organization. So that piece of it I think is, has been really important and I've learned that from the past where I've seen organizations that, you know, maybe pit people against each other or don't have everybody bought in to the same mission and vision that can kind of tear apart a company culture and tear apart the direction of the company. So I did. I think I learned that in some experiences in the past.

MU: Glad to hear you say that I think because in my mind that makes total sense that it doesn't matter what your goals, visionary, you know, dreams for a company are, it's the people within the company that are going to be together in getting you there. So it has to come back to who is in the office every single day making the machine run.

JH: Exactly. Exactly.

MU: So going forward, our next big question for this podcast is, what is a big goal that you have on your horizons is whether it's right now in the future or down the line in the future? And how do you plan on getting there?

JH: Ah, OK. So I would say that my biggest goal, something that I really want to achieve, I want Hyperice to be on the list of the world's most innovative companies and you know, that list, FastCompany has a list, I believe; Fortune also has a list. But being able to achieve that would be, would be amazing and I think it's possible. It may take us a couple years, but really you know, to be on that list for me would mean that, you know, we not only had an amazing product, an amazing set of products, but we had an amazing strategy. We had an amazing team for us to be able to position ourselves that way and scale globally and I think that would be an amazing accomplishment. That is doable. Because when you look at this space, how important is health and wellness? I mean it's one of the most important aspects of human nature, so to speak.

JH: So if we can help people move more efficiently, if we can help people recover more efficiently, if we can help people perform, whether it be at the workplace or on a football field, whatever it may be, you know, we can change people's lives for the better and if we continue to advance that as science evolves and people learn more about the human body and they learn more about health and wellness, if we can be that leader providing tools and technology to help people achieve their goals within health and wellness, I mean we can change the world and we can be one of the most innovative companies on the planet. So that's something that we're really, really striving to do. And me personally, when that day happens, I'll be pretty pumped up.

MU: Oh man, OK, I want to throw a curve ball question at you, but if you don't, if you don't have an answer, that's absolutely fine, but do you have a story of someone who has used like the Sphere or the Vyper or maybe it's the Hypervolt now, it's just this incredible recovery or like athletic story, more like everyday athlete story that is just like, wow, we are changing the world based on this one person's story. You know, there's gotta be more than more of those out there.

JH: I would say it was really, really great to hear that both Steph Curry and Lebron James took our, our Vyper product with them basically to practice on the plane to the location like they actually had their own personal unit that they took for mobility and warm up. That was pretty cool to hear. We had am athlete in Japan, very famous pitcher who actually played for the Red Sox here and then also played in Japan, who basically said that it completely enhanced his rage of motion and fixed a shoulder surgery that he had, so the vibration therapy used in the HyperSphere helped him recover. When you had seen multiple physicians and could not get his shoulder right, so that was a really awesome story. We have members of the US military, write us all the time and say that they have more energy and you know they're able to move more efficiently in that space, which feels really good that we're doing something for our soldiers, so that's been amazing. We have just the general fitness enthusiasts. We had one the other day who said that his back had been locked up for months and he was using the Vyper on his lower back and it freed him up and he was able to move more efficiently than he had in 10 years. That was incredible. These are all stories we share within our team just to get people more and more inspired and motivated about what we're doing. Yeah, I think those would be three that to me are pretty cool.

MU: I love that. It’s true though. I think people don't expect it when when they try it out the first time and they're like, oh my gosh, what is this? And then they kind of like get used to it and now I have people in my classes all the time saying like, can you bring that to class next time? So it's like kind of addicting, which is really fun. So is there anything else I didn't ask you, goal wise, things that you guys as a team or just you yourself are going after? Personally?

JH: I would say I think you covered a lot. I mean I think that it's exciting to be able to have a company that is very successful on the business side that aligns with something that you're personally passionate about. And I think that's very rare, but I think for all entrepreneurs or executives or just you know, people in the workforce, it's easier to be very passionate about something that you enjoy every day.

JH: Like Sunday nights come and I'm ready to go, I'm ready to be in Monday morning. I'm chomping at the bit to get after it Monday morning. And that's because I was able to choose kind of a space in the area of business that I really liked. But I think it's rewarding to be in a company that we worked really hard to make sure that financially it was secure and thriving, but is also having this dramatic effect on the world as it relates to health and wellness. Both of those things to me are really inspiring and I hope that we can kind of inspire others to find different areas of business that you're passionate about and go after those and commit your energy to it. Because when you do that, good things generally happen.

MU: So that is the perfect segue to one last final question that that's on my mind. It's that when you have an idea, if you have a, a nugget of, an idea that you're passionate about, but you're not really sure. Like say you are that visionary type that doesn't necessarily know how to get from A to B to Z in the growth minded perspective that you have. Do you have a piece of advice to share with someone who's at that stage of just vision?

JH: Yeah, I definitely do. I think everybody should—you know, ideas. There's a big difference between coming up with an idea and making it a reality, right? And there's a, there's a big difference between coming up with a great concept and then building a, you know, a strong business around it and sometimes people with great ideas who are very innovative and forward thinking can execute great ideas and maybe they need a partner to take that idea or that product or whatever it may be or a concept and bring it to reality and that's okay, right? There's strength and weaknesses out there and sometimes partnerships can be very effective if people are, are aligned on the vision and the mission and they kind of see the same end game. So you know, so I always tell young entrepreneurs like go after it, like definitely go after it, but create a strategy first, right?

JH: Make sure you have a plan and if you need to find great partners who may be strong in areas that can compliment what you're doing and make it more of a reality, then go, there is nothing wrong with that. You know, find a great team. Like this company. Hyperice would not be nearly what we are without the great team that we have, right? And that's been one of the things that, that, uh, I'm maybe most proud of is that we were able to instill a culture and a culture is more than having a ping pong table or a coffee machine in the office. It's really about that work ethic and collaboration and you know, people being challenged daily so that they aspire and grow. So to answer your question more succinctly, I would say that you can find a partner in something, somebody that you can kind of bounce ideas off that helps a lot of young entrepreneurs who maybe are not sure whether or not to dive into something or not.

MU: That's amazing. Thank you so much for joining me and for sharing your story. I can't wait to see Hyperice on the world's most innovative companies list. {robably sooner than we all think.

JH: I hope so, I hope so. We’re—It won't be from lack of effort if we don't make it. That's for sure.

MU: Well, thank you very much, again, Jim it was an awesome pleasure to speak with you.

JH: Likewise. Thank you for having me on. Keep up the great work. Really appreciate it.

CK: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and if you could please leave us a rating or review on apple podcasts, we will be so grateful. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Jim Huether; and to TechNexus for the recording studio.

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Some people would view the loss of a leg as a tragedy, or at least, a significant obstacle to pursuing the path they’d painstakingly planned out for themselves.

For Melissa Stockwell, my guest on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, losing a limb offered a second chance at a lifelong aspiration.

As a young gymnast, she’d always dreamed of going to the Olympics. She practiced twice a day. Her walls were covered in Team USA posters, her entire life decorated in red, white, and blue.

Her love for her country eventually took her to the Army and to Iraq, where in 2004 a roadside bomb took her leg.

While recovering at Walter Reed Army Medical Center, she learned about the U.S. Paralympics. That, she knew, was where she needed to be.

“Here I was, an athlete with a physical disability, and I was being told that I could compete on the world’s biggest athletic stage and represent a country that I defended over in Iraq,” she says. “What greater honor would it be to wear that USA uniform on that stage?”

Stockwell picked a sport—swimming—and trained hard. She made it to her first Games in 2008 in Beijing. The experience was incredible but the results, not what she’d hoped. So she transitioned to triathlon, stayed dedicated, and won a bronze medal at the 2016 Rio Paralympic Games.

Standing next to her teammates on the podium—Americans took all three medals—was the ultimate payoff for all her challenges and sacrifices, she says. And it was all the more meaningful for having come after another major feat—having her son, Dallas.

“To be in Rio on that podium as a medal-winning mom was really just really one of my greatest accomplishments,” she says. “I mean, when I think of that moment, I think about everything that went into it and just how amazing it was to be there.”

Her path to the medal stand offers one compelling example of the way she digs deep to find the positive in any situation. But it’s far from the only way she’s wrested control of her own narrative, turning challenges into opportunities to transcend them.

Sure, balancing training, speaking gigs, her role with the Dare2Tri Paratriathlon Club (which she co-founded), and two kids under the age of 4 often proves tricky. But rather than bemoan her lack of time, she maximizes every 15 minutes, and draws a deeper motivation to push ahead from her children and the athletes who come through the Dare2Tri program.

Of course, training comes with its peaks and valleys, days of exceeding your expectations interspersed with not-so-great rides, swims, and runs. Each day, she pinpoints one thing she did that drew her closer to her goal, even if was as simple as getting off the couch.

And yes, she’ll be 40 by the time of the next Paralympics, in Tokyo. Her competitors are far younger, have fewer responsibilities. But age has brought her wisdom and a desire to show her children—she now has two, including eight-month-old Millie—that hard work pays off.

So she’ll do everything she can to make it there. We won’t be surprised to see her on the podium again in 2020.

Hear more about how Stockwell is working to involve women in the sport as chair of the USA Triathlon Women’s Committee, what tips she has for other busy moms trying to achieve big goals, and the special way she commemorates the day she lost her leg on this week’s episode. And if you like what you hear, subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

Episode transcript:

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me,I have Kristen Geil and Cindy Kuzma.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

KG: Hi Jeana.

JAC: Good morning. And Cindy, you did the interview this week with Melissa Stockwell. Isn't that right?

CK:Yeah, I'm Melissa Stockwell is a Paralympic triathlete. And she's also a veteran, she started an organization called Dare2Tri that helps other athletes with disabilities get into the sport of triathlon and fall in love with it as much as she did. She's an incredible guest and I was so excited to talk with her.

KG:Melissa lost her leg in Iraq and throughout it all she's remained incredibly positive. How was she able to do so with such a traumatic experience in her past?

CK:Yeah. I wonder how much of that is sort of integral to her personality and how much of it she learned along the way, But she really focuses a lot on finding the silver lining in difficult experiences. In fact, there's a great story about how she kind of has turned the loss of her leg around. I don't want to give too much away because it's, um, pretty fantastic the way she's turned that into a positive for herself, but really she just focuses on finding whatever she can to kind of make the story her own out of whatever obstacles she's faced and overcome. And you know, you can't control everything in life she talks about, but you can control your reaction to it. And she has really tried to do that to make her reaction in a positive one.

JAC:And along the way, going through that experience in them becoming an athlete, she adopted this sort of interesting way to set and achieve big goals. Can you talk about how she uses small steps to achieve big goals?

CK:Sure. Like many of the accomplished athletes we have on the podcast, you have to have a big goal, right? Like you want to be a Paralympian, an Olympian, and you want to be the best in the world, but it's pretty hard to just set your sights on that and then wait for it to happen. Right. You have to do a lot of work along the way and she talks about how she every day just tries to do whatever she can to achieve that goal. And then at the end of the day she writes down one thing she did that took her closer to her goal. So even if things didn't go exactly the way she planned, even if she had a run that wasn't great, at least she got out there and ran or she did something she didn't want to do and that took her a step closer to our goal and then she can reflect on all of those accomplishments later on and realize how much hard work she really did and how she's prepared to achieve what she set out to achieve.

KG:And her life would be easy enough if all she had to do was train for triathlons or whatever sport she's competing in. But of course, that's never the only thing you're doing with your life at one time. There's always other things that demand your attention and your time. So how is she able to manage her priorities with a family and with a career?

CK:So, she definitely has a lot more responsibilities now with the family, but that actually has helped her connect to a deeper motivation to her sport so she can't always do as much training, but she is really motivated to stay active and to show her daughter and all the other women out there that you can continue to have a career and a full life and be an accomplished athlete. So I think connecting to that really helps her continue to achieve.

JAC: And here’s Cindy, with Melissa.

CK: All right. This is Cindy Kuzma from aSweatLife and I am here on the #WeGotGoals podcast with Melissa Stockwell, who’s a Paralympian, and the co-founder of the Dare2Tri program. Melissa, thank you so much for joining us on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

MS:Thank you for having me. Excited to be here.

CKNow. Melissa, you just came back from a couple of trips I know, including to Sarasota for the American Championships. Is that right?

MS:I did. I, um, in my first race back kind of post having my baby Millie who is eight months old today. So yes, I was down in Sarasota doing a race and it went quite well, much better than I expected it to.

CK:That's always awesome when we have those victories when we don't even expect them. Right, right. Exactly. So Melissa, I know you were an athlete from an early age, you were a gymnast growing up. Right?

MS:I was. So I was a big gymnast, so it was kind of my definitely my thing growing up, you know, I think as all young aspiring gymnasts do you know, dreamt of going to the Olympics and being an Olympic gymnast and had posters all over my room and you know, red, white and blue everywhere and gymnastics before school after school. And that was definitely what I hoped to do.

CK:Yeah. I often think that people who have that early experience of being an athlete that really often shapes the way you think about goals and opportunities for the rest of your life. Do you think that that was the case for you?

MS:I definitely think it helped. You know, obviously when I was younger I had had two legs, I had both of my legs. I didn't really know any different, I’d always been kind of goal-driven, so wanting to dream big and reach high and my parents kind of let me do that, which I think has shaped my life kind of this many years later and as I've grown up it's kind of allowed me to do, to do just that and just to keep going with it.

CK:So how did you get from those early days to Iraq? What, what led you to service and what goal did you hope to accomplish there?

MS:So I realized at a young age kind of, you know, how lucky we were to live in the country that we live in and always wanting to be in the military and to be in the Army. So I made that a reality in college when I joined ROTC and then, and when I graduated in 2002, I was commissioned as an officer and two years later I ended up being deployed over to Iraq. So, you know, I joined, I joined the army, I mean pretty short and simple. I love our country. I wanted to give back. That was really my, my main reason for, for putting the uniform on

CK:And I know it didn't take too long after that before you had a change of plans. I know it was April 13th, 2004 when your convoy hit an IED and, and you lost your leg and we're talking now a little bit before that day in 2018 and I know you have a special tradition for our commemorating that, which maybe we'll talk about later. But what I'd kind of love to hear about first is, is how you shifted your goals and your mindset while you were recovering. Talk to me a little bit about the moment you kind of set your sights on the Paralympics and what effect having a big, audacious goal like that had on your rehab, both physically and mentally.

MS:So. So after I lost my leg, I wasn't, you know, I was 24 years old, didn't really know what my life would be and I did all my recovery at Walter Reed Army Medical Center and being there and being surrounded by so many other soldiers who had worse injuries than my own kind of helped me realize how lucky I was. So I wanted to kind of live my life for them and that those, that no longer could and have given that ultimate sacrifice. So after I learned to walk and wear a prosthetic, I learned about the US Paralympics and you know, having dreamt to go on to the Olympics as a young child and that never happened and it was almost like I had a second chance because here I was an athlete with a physical disability and I was being told that I could compete on the world's biggest athletic stage.

MS:Represent a country that I defended over in Iraq. And I mean, what greater honor would it be to wear that USA uniform on that stage. So a dream was born pretty quickly of wanting to be a Paralympian and you know, I kinda set right to it, you know, somehow, some way I want it to be a Paralympian and it was kind of a natural goal I feel, you know, I think just having been an athlete growing up, been an athlete in the past, it was just kind of something that fell into my lap and the realization that if I worked hard enough and picked a sport and dedicated myself to it, that I could actually get there.

CK:and, and you made it not once but twice in two different sports and I know you took home the bronze medal in triathlon in Rio in an American sweep, which was so incredible. And those are just two of the many things you've accomplished since then. So this kind of feels like a good time to transition into the first big question we always ask on #WeGotGoals and that is what is one big goal you've achieved, why it was important to you and how you got there?

MS:So definitely when I think about the past many years, the one that stands out is winning a bronze medal at the 2016 Rio Paralympic Games in the sport of triathlon. It was— everything that came with it. Everything from losing my leg over in Iraq to competing in the 2008 Paralympic Games in swimming, but not doing as well athletically as I thought they could, and then continuing with it and turn into the sport of triathlon, having my son Dallas and then trying to come back from that to make it to Rio, kind of everything that went that moment. All the dedication, the hard work, the sacrifice of having to be away sometimes from my family for training, for racing, the team that I was with, my coaches, my, my mentors, my family, everyone that kind of believed in me to get there, to be in Rio, on that podium as a medal winning mom was really just really one of my greatest accomplishments. I mean, when I think of that moment, I think about everything that went into it and just how amazing it was to be there.

CK:I'm getting chills hearing you talk about it. We've talked to several elite athletes on this podcast and I'm always so curious about how they approach goals because it seems so overwhelming to say, like, my goal is to win a Paralympic medal be a world champion or be the best in the world and it seems like most people kind of break goals down into smaller chunks and maybe make them process goals versus outcome goals. Um, what did that look like for you when you were training hard for that, for those games? How did you approach goal setting?

MS:So you're right, so goals, I mean you have this huge goal, like if you have a huge goal, it doesn't, it doesn't happen overnight. You don't. I don't say, Oh I'm going to qualify for Rio in the Paralympics and then wake up the next day and do it. It takes days and months and years of training and really believing that you can. So really, yeah, kind of taking it down into, into each day. So, you know, every day I wake up, I do my training and at the end of the day I kind of look back and I say, OK, what's one thing I did today that got me closer to my goal? And some days it's something as little as, I didn't want to go on my run, but I got up off the couch or I, I, I did what I had to do to make it happen. Whether the run was a good run or not, it doesn't matter some days.

MS:What matters is just that you got out there and you did it when you didn't want to do it that day. Another day you look back and you say, wow, that run was amazing. I had this time goal and not only did I make it, but I surpassed it, and then that kind of makes all those other days of training that didn't go so well worth it and it kind of pushes you for the next block of training. So goals I think have to be broken down into little chunks and little steps at the end of every day. You can look back at your day and I guarantee you that whatever it is, even if it's the smallest little thing, there's something in that day that got you closer to that goal and some days they’re hard to find, other days are easier, but at the end of the, at the end of the day, you didn't have a good day. If it's a bad day, find the positive in it, find something that got you closer to that goal because it's there. Sometimes you have to just look a little bit deeper.

CK:I love that so much and I can see how if you kind of stacked those moments on top of each other, you would also really stoke your confidence. Like you say, that is such an important of it too. Not just the physical preparation but the mental preparation.

MS:Exactly, and you know, I think everything in life and especially goals as well. It's not this, it's not just an upward trajectory, right? I mean there's dips and there's valleys and there's peaks and—but it's a gradual, if you stick with it and if you stick with believing in yourself, having a team surrounding yourself with people that want you to get there, want you to, you know, reach those goals. The gradual trend is up, but it might, it’s all about when it does dip down, when you do have those valleys about not getting up and keep moving forward.

CK:So how do you keep track of this moment? Are you a person who has a paper training log? Do you do it online or do you have some way that you are really capturing all of this to use later on?

MS:So I used to have it written down where every day or either every night before I go to bed, I would write down what I did that day or the three good things that I did. And then every morning I would write down three things that I wanted to achieve that day. Since my daughter was born eight months ago. I have yet to continue that because I was kind of busy with, you know, middle of the night feedings and not, not a lot of sleep, but something that I should definitely start now that that’s getting a little bit better. I should start again because I think having it written down and being able to go back and look at that and you know, six months down the road, going back and looking back at the things that I achieved six months prior and realizing how far I've come from them can really help.

CK:Yeah, absolutely. Well, I think that's what's so powerful about having those little rituals too, is that sometimes life does get crazy and you kind of move away from them. They give you something really sort of tangible to get back to, right. Like, you know, you can do that again.

MS: Yeah, absolutely.

CK: Let's talk a little bit now about Dare2Tri, which is an organization I know helps so many other athletes achieve their goals. What motivated you to launch it and how has it grown since?

MS:Yeah, so back in 2011. Two of my friends, Dan Tun and Keri Serota and myself co founded Dare2Tri Paratriathlon Club. Obviously I'm an athlete with a physical disability and both Dan and Carrie are able-bodied athletes, but they’ve had worked with adaptive athletics all their life. So all of us were triathletes and kind of realized how much sports can impact somebody's life at all, but especially somebody with a disability. So we decided that we're going to start Dare2Tri and get however many athletes we could find that had physical disabilities and show them that they could do, not only be an athlete but they could be a triathlete. So we launched it back in 2011. It's based in the Chicago area and we had the modest goal to get eight athletes to do a triathlon that first year that had, where there was a amputation, visual impairments, spinal cord injury, and really provide the athletes with everything they needed to do a triathlon.

MS:So expensive adaptive equipment, coaching, training and really helping them get to that starting line, so we started it and it grew faster than we ever could have imagined. Not only did we get eight athletes to that starting line in the first year, I think we were upwards in the, in the mid twenties, 24 athletes and then this many years later, seven years later, we have over 300 athletes on our roster. We have year round programming, we have camps, we had clinics, we have two, three-day camps, one that's for military, one that's for anybody with a physical disability and it's been really impressive and incredibly rewarding just to see how many lives we've impacted. Because you take somebody who has a disability, you know, take a youth athlete who's eight years old, they're in a wheelchair. Neither they or their families, you know, they're not sure kind of what their lives can be and how, that it doesn't matter if you’re in a wheelchair or not you can still accomplish whatever you want and you see them get to that starting line, cross the finish line and just kind of see that self confidence not only in them but in their families as well. And it, it's, it's really incredible. Our motto is one inspires many and our athletes inspire both on and off the race course.

CK:Oh, that's got to give you fuel for your own accomplishments too, just seeing these athletes do things that they didn't think were possible for them.

MS:Oh yeah, 100 percent. I do a lot of speaking around the nation and I get asked a lot like who inspires me and I am 100 percent inspired by our athletes. You know, anybody that doesn't think they could do something and they decide to go and try it and they realize that not only are they good at it and can they do it, but they actually enjoy it and then they continue on with it. So you know, our athletes in swear, anybody that sees them, but they help with my own goals and my own motivation as well.

CK:I know that that's not the only way that you're working to help other athletes achieve their goals. You're also chair of the USA Triathlon Women's Committee. Tell me about that role and what goals do you hope to accomplish through that leadership position?

MS:So USA triathlon has a good number of committees and the women's committee, which I recently the chair of, our goal is to get women into the sport of triathlon. So if any triathletes are listening, especially female triathletes, I think somebody asks you, Oh, what do you do and you say, Oh, I'm a triathlete, I swim, I bike, I run. And a lot of the response you get from women are, Oh, I could never do that. But the reality of it is actually yes, you can do that. So it's really what we hope to do as a committee is to really kind of break down those barriers. And when somebody, when a woman says, oh, I could never do that, you say, actually, yes you can. And this is why you can because there is a community of women athletes that are going to help mentor you to get there because there is a race you can go to and to start your career in triathlon. You can start out in a women's only triathlon or a women's only race and this is a uniform that, that you can wear and isn't it cool? You can pick from these colors and you know, it's not about winning the race, it's just about being out there and doing the race, so really kind of trying to break down those barriers on why women can be a triathlete and really to help them achieve it and to get to that finish line.

CK:That's such an incredible goal. What does that look like in terms of like how you go about that? I mean are there conferences or is it just like individual outreach or group outreach? How, how practically speaking are. Is that committee working to make this a reality?

MS:Yeah, it's kind of a combination of. So we have some partnerships with various other foundations kind of around the nation where each one of us has an athlete that we're mentoring to become a triathlete this year. We also provide grants, so grants to individuals that want to do their first triathlon to kind of help with travel or to help with coaching or to kind of help initiate the process on getting to that starting line. We also have grants that we give to women that are triathletes that are kind of looking to expand their leadership capabilities within triathlon, so if they’re a triathlon coach, but they want to take it to the next level and become a, get certified to coach athletes with disabilities or become a coach at the collegiate level to really kind of help women become advocates kind of within their own lives and kind of take that next step just so there's more females on the coaching level as well, so we provide resources on our Facebook page, it’s USA triathlon women's committee tips for women on how they can get into the sport and just hoping that women will take a liking and realize that they can do it also.

CK:That's great that there's both informational and and financial support. I know that those are both really big needs for women who may be considering this kind of a sport. So that's, that's incredible. And thanks for giving the facebook page too. Because, yeah, I was going to ask how women can find out more about this. So that's perfect. The second big question that we always ask and #WeGotGoals is about a future goal you have and how you plan to get there and you've touched on some big goals that you have for the different organizations you're involved with. But I wonder what's, what's next for Melissa Stockwell? What's a goal you have personally?

MS:So I have two young kids. I have an eight month old and I have a three year old and my husband Brian. And my kids motivate me to want to be, to dream even bigger and I want to kind of dream big and hopes that they see me dream big and they had big dreams of their own someday. So you know, I'm very athletically driven. I've found I have a passion behind sports and just the way it really makes me feel and just kind of proving to myself that I can still have these big goals, athletic goals, whether or not I have one leg or two. So for me, 2020 is the next Paralympic Games for triathlon and it is definitely a goal of mine in coming back from after having my daughter Millie eight months ago is not an easy thing to do, you know, a lot of my competitors are much younger than I am, no families, so the training dynamic is very different but the goal of showing them that I will be 40 years old, and as a 40 year old triathlete that has two young kids and I can still be out there on the course and not only that I can still be out there and be fast and keep up with them as well.

MS:So that is definitely one of my big goals is to try and make it to Tokyo and kind of have that be my final Paralympic Games and just to do it to prove that I can and to challenge myself and just to show my kids that you put in the work and dreams can come true.

CK:That's incredible to hear. And so interesting to hear too about how your motivation has changed a little bit or at least maybe expanded. I feel like often when I do talk to athletes who have long careers like you, they do find that like as life goes on, they find even more reasons to get out there and more fuel for the fire and, and more ways to stay motivated. So it's fantastic to hear that that's the case for you.

MS:Yes, definitely.

CK:And obviously that is like sort of a logistical challenge too, to train with the family. What are one or two of the things that have shifted for you and what advice do you give other people about fitting it all in when you have a family and, and want to train at a high level.

MS:It's hard. There's never enough hours in the day, there weren’t before I had kids and now there definitely aren't. So I think fitting in what you can when you can and my coach had taught me that, that if I have 15 minutes to go on a run before kids, I would've thought that's not even worth it. Why would I even go for 15 minutes? But you go and you run a mile or a mile and a half, and instead of doing nothing that day while you've just gotten a mile in and those miles add up and they make a difference. The other things I've had to do is just kind of adjust my time so you know, instead of waking up and having breakfast and then doing whatever I do and then doing my workout, I again, I had to do what I can when I can. So in the summer when it's not cold and icy, I was known to put my kids down to bed because of course you want to spend as much time as you can with them. So I put him down to bed, 8:30 PM, put on a reflector vest, put on my headlamp and actually on my run around the neighborhood. Things that I never thought I would do that in order to make it work. It's things like that that you have to do. So get that headlamp, get that reflector vest. Use, if you have 15 minutes, take those 15 minutes and do what you can with that much. Really just any little time that you have throughout the day, just doing what you can when you can.

CK:Yeah. I think it's just like we were talking earlier about, you know, noticing your accomplishments for the day like that—all those little bits definitely add up to something much greater in the long run.

MS:Yes, yes they do.

CK:When you speak or give advice to others, what are, what are one or two of the key lessons you share about overcoming obstacles that come up in route to your goals?

MS:When we're younger, we have, you know, you have these dreams of what you want your life to be like, right? Like you want be a doctor, you want to live in this area, you want to be married, you want to have kids, but it never happens that way. I think the older we get, the more we realize that you can't really plan your life because you can plan it to an extent, but there's so many obstacles and kind of twists and turns that happen that you're not prepared for because you don’t, there are so unexpected, but I think knowing that those things happen, that those roadblocks come up and that there's going to be diversions you know, to get to where you want to get and just the ability to really accept them and to really, to overcome them and to find a silver lining because it's hard to find a silver lining, but it is there.

MS:And to really kind of dig deep and find a way to make whatever difficulties come your way, like to make them almost desirable and to make it so you end up even better. On the other side, you, you learn from your challenges and you make, in turn, they make you better in the long run. Another thing is to do that, you have to. You have to believe in yourself, but you also have to, you know when these obstacles come your way, you, you have the power to choose how you want to react to them. So that's kind of the beauty in life, right? You can choose for them to get to you and put you down or you can choose to help them make your life even better. So to try to choose to take the high road and you know, to help them make your life as good as you want it to be. So we can all choose what we want our life's path to be like. And just to try to choose to make your path to good one.

CK:Those stories we tell ourselves definitely so powerful and can really shape our experiences and our future. I know. So I mean along those lines, April 13th is coming up and we mentioned this earlier, but talk to me a little bit about how you commemorate this because I think that it's such a great example of what you were just talking about.

MS:Yeah. So, um, it is coming up, but I'll just a few weeks now. So every April 13th, which is a day that I lost my leg over in Iraq, every year we actually celebrate the day. So I named what’s left of my leg Little Leg and we have a birthday for Little Leg. So this year will be Little Leg’s, sounds kind of crazy to me but 14th birthday, which, I can’t believe it’s been 14 years. But it's really a celebration, so family and friends drive in or fly in. We celebrate the day. We celebrate not just Little Leg’s life or my life, but really everybody's life because in the day to day lives that we live, it's easy to get kind of caught up in everything that's going on, but when you take a moment or a day to kind of take a step back and to think about your life and it’s, we’re all very lucky to live the lives that we do. So just to take a day to celebrate that and to be with your loved ones and to celebrate, to dance, to, to eat cake, to, to share some drinks and just to kind of enjoy, enjoy life.

CK:Well Melissa, that's such good advice and thank you so much for joining us on the #WeGotGoals podcast. Before I let you go, how can people find you and keep track of you and keep tabs on the celebrating that you're doing and all of the accomplishments that you have in the future?

MS:Social media is obviously the best way. I do have a website that's melissastockwell.com. On Facebook, it’s Melissa StockwellUSA and then on both Twitter and Instagram it’s mstockwell01. So I encourage everyone to kind of follow along. I promise that there is never really a dull moment

CK:And lots of adorable baby photos, that's for sure. Well thank you again Melissa. It's been great talking with you. Really appreciate your time.

MS: Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

CK:This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and if you give us a rating or review while you're there, we would be so grateful. Special things to J. Mano for our theme music; to a guest this week, Melissa Stockwell; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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"The one with the hair" is a moniker she's come to embrace. In 2015, Heidi Stevens considered her then-new photo for her Chicago Tribune column "Balancing Act" unremarkable - until her inbox flooded with commentary from her readers.

She shared a few in a piece for the Chicago Tribune, with gems like.

"For heaven sake, comb your hair."

"My neighbors and I give you permission to shoot your hairdresser."

While Stevens was taken aback by this overwhelming response to a style that is arguably on-trend and beach-y, she took it in-stride and sought to learn why readers were so quick to comment on her appearance along with that of her female colleagues.

She wrote this of the surprising responses: "Each one takes me aback. Not because my hair is above reproach, but because my hair is completely beside the point. It's unremarkable in appearance (not dyed fuchsia, not shaved on one side) and has no relevance to my job: I'm not a model; I'm not selling hair products; I don't work at a salon."

She continued, "Is this really where we're stuck as a culture? At a place where we drown out women's voices with critiques of their hair?"

It was this delightful refusal to be put into an Instagram filter that caught national attention - Today.com, NY Daily News, and AOL - and landed Stevens squarely in my Facebook news feed. She quickly became one of my feminist icons and her column a must-read.

She's written about numerous topics besides her hair (like parenting, the #MeToo movement, health and her reactions to what's happening in the world around her), but people like me keep bringing up the hair incident. And through her writing, I feel like she and I are on grab-a-coffee terms, but I've never gotten to ask her the most pressing question we have around aSweatLife: What are her big goals?

This week on the #WeGotGoals podcast, Stevens popped by to answer that and she shared her 20-year journey with the Chicago Tribune, working across the publication - from an intern to a section editor to a columnist. As we talked through her tenure, she shared that landing her column was the goal that made her the proudest.

"I found myself really called ... to help other people and women especially feel less alone in whatever they were going through," she explained why it means to much to connect with readers week after week.

With an extraordinary tenure, Stevens clearly loves the Chicago Tribune and the field of journalism.

It struck me that this was the tone as I talked to Stevens just before she and 45 other Chicago Tribune Journalists announced they were forming a union, The Chicago Tribune Guild. It's a brave move that has been historically unsupported by a consolidating journalism industry - at least leading to the sale of a publication (the Los Angeles Times) and at-worst the scrubbing of the web of any trace that the publication ever existed (Gothamist/DNA Info).

Listen to this week's episode of #WeGotGoals, and follow @HeidiStevens13 to feel more connected and @CTGuild to support Stevens' brand of journalism.

Episode transcript:

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen and with me I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen Geil.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

KG: Hi Jeana.

JAC: Hello

KG: Jeana, this week you spoke with Heidi Stevens.

JAC: I did. I spoke with Heidi Stevens, who's been someone I've looked to for advice, for guidance, but she just didn't know it until recently. She has a column in the Chicago Tribune.

MU: nd can you talk a little bit about what that column is because it's incredibly interesting for us at aSweatLife and really for women in general.

JAC: Heidi's column is called Balancing Act and it is a daily column, but she has a few online days and then two print days in the Chicago Tribune. She talks about everything from parenting to feminism to her reactions to news. And it's been incredible to sort of watch her along the way. I started reading her column about three years ago after I caught wind of it when she had this interesting incident with her hair of all things and her readers’ reaction to her hair, but she's been writing the column specifically for five years and she's been a writer in some capacity or working with the Chicago Tribune from for 20.

KG: And Heidi is somewhat of a veteran in the industry. She's seen journalism go through so many major changes over the past several years. How has she adjusted to those changes? What changes has she seen as the most impactful? What in general did she have to say about how journalism has changed?

JAC: Heidi has been a part of the Tribune in some capacity for 20 years. She started as an intern is done everything from copy editor. She said something about being on the mail room at a certain point all the way up to columnist with a daily column, which was her dream that you'll hear about. So she on the inside has seen a lot of changes and she's become a sort of ninja within journalism in that she's able to respond to changes. She's able to adapt to them. She's now producing online content. She has incredible editorial skills, but after our interview, Heidi was part of the organizing committee that announced a guild within the Chicago Tribune, which is another word for a union, so I think she's seen a lot of changes within journalism and she's probably bracing or is embracing more changes as a part of this group as well in the future.

MU: We're thrilled to have Heidi on the podcast. So here is Jeana with Heidi.

JAC:I am Jeana Anderson Cohen on the #WeGotGoals podcast and I'm here with Heidi Stevens of the Chicago Tribune. Thank you for joining me, Heidi.

HS: Thank you for inviting me.

JAC: I have known you through your column for as long as I've been reading it and I've been reading it since I think someone posted to my news feed a few years ago, probably related to the hair incident and I've been following you closely ever since. So I'm excited to talk to you about your, about your goals. So can you first tell us sort of how you spend your days and where readers can find you?

HS: I am at the Chicago Tribune as a full time staff columnist. I write five days a week on ChicagoTribune.com, the digital version of the newspaper and then you'll find me in the Sunday print edition and the life and style section and the Wednesday print edition in health and family.

HS:Those are sort of the two guaranteed print appearances now throughout the week I might here and there show up in arts and entertainment or metro or the Op Ed page, but I'm consistently on the website five, five days a week and then in print at least two days a week. I’m on twitter of course @heidistevens13, I'm on Facebook. I'm a pretty pretty big fan and avid user of social media because I feel like it keeps me really connected to readers and stories and just kind of what people are talking about in that moment.

JAC: And you have been at the tribune since 1998, is that right?

HS: I have, I’ve been here forever and ever and ever in journalism years. That’s, like, centuries. Yeah, I started here as a 23 year old intern, it was a year long internship and when it ended they hired me on full time and I never left, so I've done a little bit of everything from like page design to working over in the paste up room when we used to have one at our printing plants and then freedom center to copy editing.

HS:I ran a section for awhile called on the town and the column that I write now has been my favorite gig. I've been doing this for five years but. But yeah, at the trip for 20.

JAC: And before we jump into the first big question, I guess we should pay off the hair incident. So about three years ago and I'm sure that you're not sick at all of answering questions related to this.

HS: I’m actually not. I promise.

JAC: Good. Because I never tire of telling people why I love you and this is why. About three years ago, I know I caught wind of you because a certain photo of you went viral. Can you take it from there?

HS:Oh sure. Yeah, I had a column photo. You know all columnists at the Tribune have their photos run with their reports, with their columns. I had one that was apparently not at all controversial. I really never heard much at all about how I looked in it, so I don’t know if people thought I looked good or bad or just not remarkable enough to decide. We all as a staff got new column photos. My hair was shorter in my second column photo, it was, I don't know, like beach wavy curls is how I would have described it on a positive note. That’s what I was going for anyway and I mean the hate mail like just started flooding in about how awful I looked in this photo, I had this terrible hair. I looked like I rolled out of bed and came to work and I looked like a messy greasy tramp and you know, what sort of pride did I have in my appearance that I would dare to come to work looking like that, let alone have my photo taken looking like that.

HS:There was just a whole bunch of hate mail from men, from women, from young people, from old people. And I, you know, I, I started asking some other columnists, it's like, do you ever get hate mail about your hair? And to a one, all the women said, oh, sure, yeah, all the time. And all the men said, uh, no. Uh, no. Chris Borelli, a columnist, a features report here at the Tribune who had his photo in the paper for awhile, said, he had a baseball cap on, in his photo. He said, sometimes I get people telling me I should wear a Cubs hat instead of a Red Sox hat, but that's about it. Mary Schmich, you know, Pulitzer Prize winning columnist. Said, oh, that's the majority of my mail is for sure about my hair. So then I was like, you know, I'm going to go ahead and write about this because I think that's interesting.

HS:I interviewed like a gender studies professor at DePaul about, you know, just what our hair kind of represents in this culture sort of appearance-obsessed culture. And I thought she had interesting stuff to say about it. So I wrote a column about it and that just sort of took on a life of its own and I, you know, I got interviewed by Huffington Post and the New York Daily News and today.com and I was on TV and I was on the radio and everybody wanted to talk about this hair hate mail and in a way, you know, and you even made reference to it like, you know, it seems like something you'd quickly grow tired of or find to be a little frivolous. It has been fascinating to me, I would say even three years later, mostly because of what different people bring to that conversation. So somebody might feel ostracized or othered to rely on a little bit of a cliché because of their skin color or because of the shape of their body or the way their, the way they choose to dress or the way they present their gender.

HS:You know, there are just a million different ways in which people feel judged and written off based on the way they look. And so all of those sorts of conversations were coming up from, from readers that I was hearing from and callers and so I just found it to be kind of endlessly interesting to talk about and I was grateful that the Tribune let me kind of go there, about something as seemingly trivial as hair. I still get the, I still got the notes. I still have readers who like literally take the time to cut out my photo. I have a new photo now, it's not that same one, but it's sort of now I've sort of become, you know, the one with the hair so people will cut my photo out and send it to me, get a haircut, you know, why can't you do your hair like Ask Amy? A lot of advice.

JAC:Well, isn't that nice of them?

HS: It's so nice. I know to take the time out of their busy lives.

JAC: Well I know, I know that you, you write about so many things from parenting from a feminist perspective to just commentary on what's happening in the world. But I want to get to your goals and how they've come to life to before I go too off track about hair and my feelings on it. So can you tell me about a big goal that you've accomplished and how you got there?

HS: Yeah, for sure. I, you know, I would say that having, having a column at the Chicago Tribune has been a goal of mine since college and I've always loved to tell stories, you know, true stories, either my own or other people's. That's what I wanted to do more than anything.

HS:When I decided to pursue journalism. At the same time I found myself really called, I would say in my mid- to late thirties really called to help other people and women especially feel less alone in whatever they were going through. And at the time I was going through, you know, I went through a divorce, single mom with two little kids and I'm trying to work full time and pursue this career that I loved and felt lucky to have and live in this crazy city that I love but can sometimes feel a little broken. Navigate the Chicago public school system, just a lot of things that can seem a little daunting to go through and I was going through all of them at once and my editor at the time, thank goodness said, you know, why don't you write about that once a week in a column? And I started to, and it was kind of this perfect marriage of two goals which, you know, were to tell stories, mine and other people's.

HS:And make people feel less alone by telling those stories and, and so that's kind of both my mission and my goal I guess if those aren't exactly the thing.

JAC: And what's interesting as I read your columns, there are a few that sort of stick out to me. I don't have kids, but I know that you have two children and a stepchild and when I read the columns you write about being a mom or even the one you wrote on your birthday. I feel like I'm experiencing a piece of parenting that's almost like, I feel jealous to put it in the best way. I feel like you’re savoring parenting in this way that I don't think I could fathom unless I read your column and it's so interesting to me even what you just wrote about going on the road trip with your son. So do you see it from that perspective?

HS:Well, first of all, thank you so much. That's just a beautiful thing to say. Second, you know, yeah, I, a lot of people who I hear from are not parents or they're done with the kind of day to day work of parenting, their kids are grown or you know. But, but not, not everyone who writes me about my parents had columns in the thick of it the way I am, kids 8, 12 and 17. My stepson’s 17. And I just think that, you know, there's a lot of commonality in the way I kind of struggled to find the best way to relate to my kids that's not so different from the way we all struggle or take joy from or you know, find meaning in the relationships we have with our partners and our siblings and our dearest friends and our parents. And I just think, you know, there's, there's a way of relating to other people that really makes life rich and worth living and for some people that's kids and for some people it's not.

HS:And, and still we all, we all want to feel a connection to other humans, you know? And so I don’t know, I hope that when I'm writing about some of my adventures and fears and triumphs with my kids, people can see themselves in those adventures and, and trials and triumphs—is there a plural for triumphs? Triumphs? That’s a hard word to say. You know, in their own lives with, with other, with other humans that aren't necessarily children. Yeah.

JAC: And what I love is now, even though you're totally opening—I’m sure you're not opening your life up totally, but you are revealing these sort of raw moments, your divorce, moments with your children and people look to you for advice. I know I saw you on a local TV show here in Chicago after the most recent school shooting and people look to you for those moments to just sort of see what another parent is thinking, and what they're counseling their kids to do. Do you feel like you're an expert?

HS: Yeah, that's such a good question. I, you know, I always shy away from that title because I'm like, ah, I don't have any sort of particular degree or license in anything that would make me qualified to give out child psychology level advice. I think I'm happy, willing and happy to talk about what I try, what I've read, what I've tried, what has worked, what hasn't worked. I'm equally, if not more willing to say here's this thing I tried that really spectacularly failed, including, you know, my first marriage. I just, I don't see any. I suppose it’s naive to say I don't see any stigma. I don't think there should be any stigma. I would prefer to push back against the stigma in you know, trying something and having a network when that comes to parenting, working out, marriage, you name it. You know, try it and if it doesn't work, try a different way.

HS:And so I'm always happy to say here's the thing I just read about it in a book by so and so, and maybe you could try that. Or here's a thing that occurred to me the last time, one of my kids was going through that and here's what I tried and here's how that went. And so I, you know, I very much hope to position myself as somebody who's sort of down in the trenches trying this stuff with you rather than handing advice down to you. Does that make sense?

JAC: Absolutely. And I think that's why you're so approachable and why I think I gravitate towards your writing is because when I read it, I feel like I could one day had children or I could one day navigate these, these hurdles that everyone faces. And that's, that's honestly why I wanted to talk to you.

HS: Well thank you.

HAC:So let's talk about the future. Is there a big goal that you want to accomplish in the future and how do you plan to get there?

HS: Yeah, I, you know, I really want to write books. I think that's, that's a pursuit. I would really enjoy doing, the physical writing of it and I also just love the idea of reaching a totally different audience, not necessarily a newspaper reading or website reading audience. And then engaging in a dialogue with that audience. I mean that, that to me is half the fun of this work is hearing from the people who have read something and then getting their questions or even their criticism. I just, I like that dialogue. I like hearing what, what you related to and what you couldn't at all relate to and I think that would be really fun on a book tour or you know, long after the book is released and people are, you know, hopefully buying and reading it.

HS:You don't want to write a book that no one reads. You know, to be able to share my stories and stories of, of people who I've been inspired by and learned from. Um, and a book is something I, I really hope to do. How am I getting there? That's a great question. I have a little word document file on my laptop that I, you know, go to and jot down notes. And, you know, I have sort of a loose introduction to a book and I'm at this point, I'm in the note taking phase, that note-taking phase might last a decade. I, you know, I don't know, I, I have a pretty, pretty specific way that I want to parent my kids and that requires me to be around and present with them a lot. And I, you know, I just don't, I don't want to hole myself up in my room and write while they're 8 and 12] and want me around and want to play with me in the basement and want me to come to all their lessons and I want to do that stuff.

HS:So, so I don't think it's something I'm going to get to in the next couple years because my kids, they're just the ages that, you know, they need, they need me around a lot. They want me around a lot and I want to be there. But down the road I think I'll collect all those notes and all these life experiences and put them in a book, you know. And it's um, well it's a balancing act to quote the name of my column. To decide what is fair game for me to write about and what is not fair game in terms of like, you know, my kids’ experiences and their right to a private life and, and, and it's not so much like, oh, what stories should I tell and not tell about them because I think I have a pretty good sense of that already. I don’t—I don't tell anything about them. I don't write anything about them that I wouldn't say out loud in front of them to like company in our kitchen, you know what I mean?

HS:I'm not telling stories about bed wetting or crushes or puberty year things that they would be like, oh my God, how could you. I would never do that to them. But there are stories about my first marriage, about dating as a single mom about, you know, things like that, that, that feel very much like my stories. But, but once they're out there for people to read, you know, then there are also stories about June and Will's mom and, and so that's a, that's a tricky thing to navigate and I want to make sure I do that well. And that means not doing it like rushed, you know.

JAC: So I, I know that I read, I've read several column in which you've mentioned your ex husband, the two of you are co parenting, correct?

HS: Um, to a degree. Yeah. I mean he, yeah, he lives in Valparaiso, Indiana. So he's two hours away. It makes the day to day co parenting. Not really possible. He doesn't, he's not, he's not around physically to co-parent, but we share custody of them, and you know, talk through decisions and stuff like that.

JAC: And as, and as you write about him in that divorce, is that something that you're sort of comfortable sharing or are there sort of boundaries that you don't cross it with that?

HS: Yeah, there are mostly because I'm really protective of my kids’ relationship with him, you know. I just, I want them to have the opportunity to develop their own relationship with their dad that's not colored by something I've written about him or said about him in public. I don't ever want them to feel like they have to choose which parent to be loyal to. I just sort of, I don't say much about my relationship with him other than kind of the broadest terms that the kids already know.

HS:You know, that we, we struggled on division of labor at home, it always felt a little—more than a little, awfully unfair to me. My kids know that, so I'm happy to say that. And I like his new wife a lot. I've written about that. That is something that I think people should feel like they have permission to do and to talk about, you know, liking their ex's new partner. I think that if you can work on doing that, it's really good for your kids. So I’m happy to talk about that. I just, yeah, I just haven't felt like it's right to bash him or, or going to a whole lot of detail about, you know, what, what drove me to end that marriage for, you know, for my kids’ sake.

JAC: So in lieu of advice. So if someone were to ask you what is one question you should ask someone who is going through a divorce, what piece of advice would you give to them?

HS:So, so your friend is going through a divorce, what should you say to them?

JAC: Yeah, because I feel like people struggle with how to have conversation with someone who's going through a hard time, whether that's divorced or whether that's losing a parent. And when, when people say nothing, it can often just still feel like they're alone. You're, you're sort of sharing your story and people are feeling less alone through you sharing, but how can I help my friend or what can I talk to my friend about who is going through a divorce for example?

HS: Yeah, that's such a good question. I remember when I was first starting to open up to a couple of friends, you know, I did that thing that a lot of us do for a long time where I put, you know, a really happy face on it. Or, it wasn’t a really happy face—I tried to make it look really happy. A false happy face on and everything and I wasn't talking to anybody about what I was struggling with.

HS:And then once I started I had a few friends who would sort of talk me out of what I was saying I was feeling or sort of try to make it seem not that bad. Well, like I'm sure what he meant was blah blah blah. And it took a friend of mine who was just really candid to say like, you know, this is bullshit, you know, you deserve better than this. And it's hard to know what your friend needs or wants to hear. I'm a big fan of asking really directly. Do you want me to listen right now or do you want me to try to coach you right now? That's like one of those management books things, but I think it's really good advice in a friendship, in any relationship really to let, to be clear about what the person wants. Do they just want a sounding board? Do they just want someone to listen and commiserate? Or do they want someone to offer them some advice and some real steps to take.

HS:So I liked, I liked doing that and conversations like, Hey, do you want, do you want me to just sit here and listen or do or do you want me to kind of coach. You tell me I'm happy to do the thing you need right now. I don't think that comes across as really like contrived or phony. Especially if you mean it. And then I would say the second thing is to not, not receive it like terrible news. I mean, if someone's presenting it to you as terrible news, like I'm devastated, my husband called off the marriage or I'm devastated this is happening, you know? I don't think it's OK to say like, that's not devastating. That's wonderful. But I think if you, if you haven't been given the very clear signal from your friend, that this is a terrible thing, don't assume it is. I mean, I wrote about this, but when I went to Chase the bank one day to get a cashier's check for a closing, I was selling the townhouse we lived on together.

HS:The nice little person handling the cashier's check said, oh, are you moving? And I said, yeah. And she said, you’re moving to the suburbs? And I said, no, I'm getting divorced. And she was like, oh, congratulations. And I was like, wow, I haven't had someone say congratulations to me before. And she was like, well, it usually means a better life is ahead. And I was like, oh my God, I loved that. Maybe other people wouldn't. But I loved it because a better life very much was ahead for me. And even if I didn't know it in that moment, it really helps to hear someone believe that and say that out loud to me. So I think to not spin it as like, wow, this is the worst thing that could ever happen to a person. I'm so sorry for you to not have that kind of, you know, in the air is good, you know, to, to be able to say like, I think this, this could end up being really good for you.

HS:This is probably going to bring some peace into your life that you haven't had for a while or, or maybe this is a chance to feel like your life is a little bit more like authentic or a little bit more yours. I think a lot of, I think a lot of good can come from divorce. I mean that's kind of a controversial thing to say. I wouldn't like you go around trying to cause divorces, but I don't, I don't think they're universally, you know, a terrible, terrible thing for someone to go through. I think, I think it can be the beginning of a better life. Like that woman at Chase told me.

JAC: That’s, I actually spit out a little bit of water as you expressed that because it was so surprising, but the sentiment is really lovely. So I guess as as we wrap this up, is there anything that you've sort of learned over the years with Balancing Act that you could condense into a parting phrase?

HS: A parting phrase. I would say shut up and listen is that good? I think in almost every one of my relationships when I've learned to shut up and listen, the relationship has improved and I've improved and I've become a better person, a more understanding person, a more empathic person by listening to other people instead of kind of waiting my turn to talk and you know, that's what you want is to go through life, always getting you know, a little bit better at it.

JAC:That's wonderful. I'm so happy that I got the chance to chat with you and I'm excited to see what that book turns into and to continue reading your column. Thank you for joining me, Heidi Stevens.

HS: It was my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me.

CK:This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and if you get a chance to leave us a rating or review, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Heidi Stevens; and to TechNexus for the recording studio.

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When we bring guests onto the #WeGotGoals podcast, we know they aren't just inspiring individuals because of what they've accomplished, but because they have a unique perspective on goal setting that we can't wait to unpack.

Lee Kemp, seven-time wrestling national champion with three gold medals in the World Championships, four in the Wrestling World Cup and two in the Pan-American Championships, might just have the most fascinating outlook on setting goals we've ever had the privilege of sharing on the podcast.

In 1980, Kemp was headed to the Summer Olympic Games in Moscow when he heard the news on television: President Carter announced America's boycott of the Olympics. This news, which may have sounded like a disappointment to avid sports fans at home, changed the course of Kemp's life forever.

"That was going to be the launching pad for my success," he told me during our interview. "Well, that launching pad wasn't there. That flight had took off and I wasn't on it."

Kemp is one of the most decorated athletes we've interviewed, but this defining moment in his career, which he describes as akin to a death in the family, propelled us into a deeper conversation about setting goals - how you respond when the one thing you're fighting for doesn't come to fruition.

Although many of us don't face literal Olympic-size disappointments, Kemp's story is relatable to every up and down we experience in our careers, relationships, dreams and goals.

"Sometimes life throws you something that you can't really understand, like a death, like a sickness, but you still have to, to move on," he says.

That's just what Kemp did. Two phrases that Kemp's role model and fellow wrestler told him in a high school wrestling camp fueled his fire throughout his wrestling career: "anyone can be beaten" and "anyone could be a champion." He took those two pieces of advice to heart at this inflection point in his career and created a fresh pathway to becoming a champion, even if his view of what "champion" meant changed.

"I went to graduate school ... I got an MBA and I went to work in New York City in marketing and start[ed] to focus on just developing other skills."

Kemp describes owning his own car dealership for 14 years like being in the ring.

"I felt like I was in a wrestling match every day trying to tackle all the things you tackle [owning a business]."

Although Kemp is grateful that wrestling made its way back into his life - he coached at the 2008 Olympics and now helps out coaching his son - he recognizes the lessons he was forced to learn may be more valuable for life than what any Olympic victory could have done for him.

"I'm kind of almost glad that things didn't go the way I thought, because I would have just been very satisfied in all my success in wrestling ... I wouldn't have [had] to really venture out to gain other skills to learn how to do other things."

Kemp's unique perspective in the professional, corporate world and as a professional athlete allowed him to see that across every industry, there are days when you have to dig deep, pull yourself together and make it through something tough.

"I realize is that every industry and discipline - sports, business, anything - there is this overwhelming drive on how can we be successful no matter what discipline that we're in," as Kemp puts it.

The 1980 Olympics were, of course, a disappointment and an unfair turn of events for Kemp. But his story of resilience is far more impactful, far more resounding, to the rest of the world than any gold medal.

Listen to how this Olympic athlete's goal setting mindset changed based on one life event, and how he's taken success into his own hands for the present and the future. And if you like what you hear, subscribe where ever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

Transcript:

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatlife.com. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen, and with me you have Kristen Geil and Maggie Umberger.

KG: Hi Jeana.

MU: Hi Jeana.

JAC: Hi Ladies. How are you?

MU: Doing well

JAC: And Maggie, you interviewed Lee Kemp this week, right?

MU: I did, I interviewed Lee Kemp. He's a world champion wrestler who has a story unlike any we've ever heard from an athlete before, and it was not only eye opening, but really inspiring to talk to him this week.

KG: One of the things with Lee is, unlike every other guest that we've had here on aSweatlife where we focus on goals that they've achieved. But with Lee the conversation, always has to include a goal that he actually missed out on, not through any fault of his own. Can you give the reader a little background of what goal he had to miss, not because of anything that he did, and maybe how that's still affecting him today?

MU: Lee is an incredibly decorated athlete. He has won so many titles as a world champion wrestler and so he has so many accomplishments that he can speak to and that are really inspiring to hear as someone who would be a guest on our, on our podcast anyway. But the main story that we ended up talking about is one that was defining for him because it was a goal he missed out on. He did not get to go to the 1980 Moscow Olympics because of the US boycott. And that was a goal for him and just hearing him outline it from his perspective of being such a world-class athlete and having the chance to go, to compete at an Olympic level and he didn't get to go and it wasn't his fault and so the aftermath of that was what we ended up talking about as a story of resilience, a story of finding a new path to success when what you thought was going to be your launching pad and envisioning some goal, having to rewrite the script and find success in another way.

JAC: And to hear Lee speak—it’s sort of interesting because this is such a defining moment for him and it is a defining topic when he speaks to young athletes when he speaks to athletes who are adult age. Maggie, do you think, do you get the sense from him that he ever got over it?

MU: I'm not sure that he did and I don't even know how I would either, like putting myself in those shoes to be at that level of athleticism and be deprived of the opportunity to compete is a huge loss, and he talks about it as such as a loss for him because he never—it wasn't like he competed and lost the Games, he just never got the chance to go. And so I don't think he's gotten over it, but where he's pivoted and the things he's done since then have truly proven that he doesn't take no for an answer and that he's going to write his own success story no matter what, and I think that was the most inspiring piece of this talk. And so hearing that he went to grad school, hearing that he started his own business and that now he helps coach his son in wrestling. He's been to the 2008 Olympics as a coach and he's written a book. He will have a movie produced about him. There are so many avenues that he can still say are success stories for him. But I think the biggest takeaway really isn't even in a tangible goal, but it's the way that you have to respond to failure. And we all in our lives deal with that on a small scale and on a huge scale. We don't always talk about the things that go wrong. We talk about the big success stories and just looking at that as holding it up as this amazing accomplishment. And sometimes it's those moments of falling down that are way more defining and way more empowering to an individual. And so that was what I was so grateful to talk to Lee about so openly.

JAC: And it sounds like he learned a lot from that. And so did you. So here is Maggie with Lee Kemp.

MU: So I'm here today on the #WeGotGoals podcast with Lee Kemp, and Lee, I'm going to try to say all your titles, but I might get it wrong, so please correct me if I am, but you're a seven-time national champion who won three gold medals in the World Championships and four in the World Cup of Wrestling as well as two in the Pan American Games. So you're a champion wrestler.

LK: Yes, I got that down.

MU: So how did you find that sport and when did you realize that you might have the potential to be very good at it?

LK: You know, that's a good question because I started out playing basketball, you know, in seventh and eighth grade and I started wrestling really late by today's standards. You know, most athletes or even people that are good at anything, you know, they start when they're six, seven, you know, four or five if, if, whatever, you know, whatever sport, gymnastics, swimming, wrestling. But I started only in ninth grade. Prior to that, I played basketball and the reason why I got into wrestling because I wasn't very good at basketball and I made a good choice. I didn't grow, didn't get any taller, and maybe I wasn't, uh, I just wasn't very good. And so I found wrestling through some friends in high school who were wrestlers and the high school gym coach, he was the wrestling coach, so he was recruiting people to come out for the wrestling team. And back then we had wrestling in gym class. I don't think they do that anymore. I got in and the one lure that got me in is that the coach needed 138-pounder and I weighed 138. So he threw me out there right away on the freshman team. So that's how I got started.

MU: The magic number 138. So usually on #WeGotGoals, we ask two big questions, one of them being, what's a big goal that you accomplished and how did you get there? Your story is very interesting because at the point where you earned your spot at the Olympics in the 1980 Games, you couldn't go to those Games. They were boycotted. So I think that this is a really interesting point to talk about a, the achievement of getting to that level and B, how did you handle and how did you deal with that shift in your plans that totally wasn't your fault.

LK: You know, that's a complex question because of the boycott. The boycott just changed everything. I’m still not totally over that. But anyway, when I got into wrestling, I was an average wrestler, as you can imagine. I just started, so I was just average. I had a 500 season the next year on varsity and that summer I met Dan Gable and Dan Gable was like the Michael Jordan of wrestling. He was, he was just, you know, he was the best wrestler in the world and the unique thing of that meeting him, it was the summer of 1972. That summer he went on to win an Olympic gold medal and I had the chance to meet him when I was just my summer after my 10th grade year in high school. And he was so good that the Russians had made a declaration that they would find a Russian to beat him cause they were the best in the world at wrestling and here this American was beating them and that was a big deal, that they were going to find a Russian restaurant to beat Dan Gable. And I was at this wrestling camp and there was Dan Gable and that was one of, I was like 14 or 15 years old and he talked about that a little bit. The pressure about that. And the thing he said that stuck with me, he said that anyone could be beaten. Doesn't matter if it's the Russian or not, you know, anyone could be beaten. So I'm setting my goals to beat this Russian and to win an Olympic gold medal. Doesn't matter if they're scouring their entire country to find a person to beat me. So that stuck with me. And the other thing that stuck with me was that he said to all the wrestlers there, any one of you could be champions and so I’m like, even me? Wow. I mean we all hear that, when we go to listen to motivational speakers or whatever, you know, they always say, if I could do it, you could do it right? It sounds like a cliché now. But there's always one or two people in the audience that will actually believe it.

LK: And I was one of those people and it's like, I could be a champion, Dan Gable said it. And the second thing he said is anybody can be beaten. And the reason why that's important is because right then I set my goal to be like him, like Dan Gable. So I went home after the camp, it was just a week-long camp and so I watched him win his gold medal on TV, on ABC. He was over in Munich, Germany. He beat that Russian and he won the gold medal. No one scored a point on him, so he was just invincible in my mind, so I said, I want to be like him. I don't want to lose any more matches. I’m going to be just like Dan Gable. That was my goal and the next two years I went undefeated in high school and won the state title and when I talked to wrestlers and when I give speeches and stuff, I talk to people.

LK: It's like, it's not. I didn't find a Superman cape in my closet when I got home, you know, it just didn't suddenly discover I was Superman. What happened was my thought process changed. My attitude changed. I started to act like Dan Gable, but when you do that, there's a lot of work that goes along with trying to be like him. There's a lot of wrestlers I coach and I try to show them what they need to do to be a champion and they look at me and go like, well, I don't want to do that. I just don't want to commit that much to it. That's fine. We all pick our place in life where we want to be. Dan held nothing back in his training. I had a chance to watch him train at the camp too. That's by the way, too. I watched him run, lift, while the other kids after the session they would go to lunch or whatever.

LK: I said, forget lunch. I just wanted to watch this man train and so I took in all that just, I don't know what you would call it, but it's just by watching him train and I, I started to understand the intensity that it took because I watched him. I could see his face, I could see the sweat, I could see the toil. I just started to understand what it was going to take to be as good as him. So when I went back right away, right when I got back from that camp I started training, I started running lifting and doing everything that I saw him do it and it allowed me to win and go undefeated the next two years, get a scholarship to college and all that. But the important part of this story is that I wrestled Dan Gable less than four years after I met him as a sophomore in high school.

LK: We fast forward to the 76 Olympics. Uh, I was in college then, Dan had won it four years earlier in the 72 Olympics. He had retired but he's making a comeback and he entered this college tournament that I was in and it was in November, so at the very start of my sophomore year and Dan Gable is in my weight class. It was like a David and Goliath type of scenario. He was 26 or 27 and I was 18 and um, I wrestled him. And I used those two statements he made at that camp through my whole life after I met him and I used those statements to beat him. He said, anyone can be beaten. It doesn't matter if it's Dan Gable, and he said Lee Kemp, he didn't use my name, but he was telling all of us campers, any one of you could be champions, any one of you could be just like me. So, so I, I approached that match with that mindset.

MU: And then going on to earn your spot at the Olympics when something seemingly unthinkable happen and President Jimmy Carter decided to boycott the 1980 Olympics. So how did you find out about that and how did you react to that moment?

LK: I mentioned Dan Gable again because he was the coach of that Olympic team, so Dan had the opportunity and I had the opportunity to be coached by him to be mentored by him. That one match was just what it was. It was just one match. We became really good friends. He didn't wrestle anymore after that. He coached me a lot after that, but after I met Dan Gable, I wanted to be Olympic champion, so at that moment I knew I was going to be an Olympic gold medalist. Everything else was just stepping stones along the way, so I had a successful college career and all that and Dan coached me to two world titles prior to the Olympic Games in 1978 the year, my senior year in college, Dan was our USA coach and I made our world team and our national team that competed in the world and I won the World Championship.

LK: I was the youngest American to ever win, I was 21 when I won the world championships then and so for over 30 years it took someone to win as a younger person. Kyle Snyder was that individual, so he's one of our phenoms in wrestling today. And I want it the next year. Dan coached me. He was in my corner. I trained with him every day so 80, he was the coach and we were focused. I was focused. It was before the Internet obviously, and all that, so just heard about it on, on the news and Dan reached out to all of us and said, don't watch the news, we're, we're, we're going to Moscow. Don’t—just focus, stay training. So I listened to him and I said, OK, I just stayed focused on stayed training and um, I couldn't in my wildest imagination think we were not going to go to the Olympic Games.

LK: That's unprecedented. I mean, even during one of the World Wars we had the Olympic Games, even when Hitler was doing, you know, all those horrible things. We still had the Olympic Games in Germany, you know, so with all that knowledge and Gable kind of informed us that, hey, we're, we're, we'll, we'll find a way to get there, just keep training. And um, and so I did. Eventually the inevitable happened. Our country, through public statements that Jimmy Carter made, I watched it and it was incredible. I mean, it was a big deal because he convinced not just, you know, America and the U.S. Olympic Committee because there was a vote that was taken, but he convinced like 20 or 30 other countries to not go to the Olympic Games. So one of my competitors, a West German, I had won it and he was second in the world championships.

LK: He was a very formidable opponent and he couldn't go either as an example in my particular weight class. It was a lot, just was, it affected a lot of people. It was just horrible. But, and you know, I equated, I guess there's a lot of analogies you can make, but probably one of the strongest ones that I use and it's pretty strong, it’s pretty harsh, because I have children. You know, it's like losing a child, losing a loved one or I mean it's even stronger than a divorce because at least a divorce, that person is still alive and they're physically there. When there's a death, when you lose a child or lose a spouse or lose a loved one, they're no longer there. Well, the Olympics was no longer there. It was gone. There was no getting it back. You can't get the time back.

LK: You can’t get the years back. You can't get the training back in. And the Olympics is gone. I missed my opportunity. In my mind, I think of it as a loss. I have people, they have to remind me, Lee, you didn't lose the Olympics, you just didn't go. And I still say why I wasn't an Olympic champion. There's times I'm in groups of other athletes that are Olympic champions and you know, and there’s photo, photo, you know, let's take some pictures, all of us Olympic champions get a picture together. And I'm there and I, and everybody kinda goes and I'm just, I can't go because I'm not Olympic champion. And sometimes they say, oh Lee come on, you can get in the picture too. I’m like, nope, I’m—it just circumstance, circumstance could've been, I could've got hurt and couldn't have gone. Or I could've got beat, which was hard for me to conceptualize at that time because I just felt I was ready and all that.

LK: But, uh, sometimes life throws you something that you can't really understand, like a death, like a sickness, like any of the things I've just mentioned, but you still have to, to move on. I would say I've learned more from that. Obviously it sounds corny, but by that huge disappointment because it forced me to have to figure out what to do and go on. And what I did is I trained for another four years and at that time there wasn't any way to support yourself. We were true amateurs. When I was competing, Michael Jordan wasn't playing in the Olympic Games and Serena Williams wasn't. And I'm not criticizing that, but that just didn't exist. The tennis players were the college players, the basketball, Olympic basketball team were the top basketball players. The moment you became a professional, you could compete in the Olympic Games or any amateur—I mean, the Olympic Games is for amateur athletes. But I guess when America started to lose in basketball, they decided. we've got to recruit some of our star athletes to play. But, but anyway, that, that was, um, you know, it, I just can't even … well, you never get over a death. You never get over a loss like that, but you just still move on.

MU: Well, and the lesson that you had to learn, that you were forced to learn that because you were presented with a scenario that was totally out of your control, probably carries over into every other aspect of your life I imagine. And so I think about how we all have to deal with all these struggles in life. Like nothing is constant but change and how you can have goals, you can set goals but things will change and you'll have to navigate those waters when they do. And so if you were to give some kind of advice to others who have wrenches thrown in their plans on route to their goals, what would you share with them based on what you learned?

LK: Well, the first thing is you can't quit. And when I say quit, I mean it's a pretty broad term. I've seen people quit in the main thing they were trying to achieve, but they quit like in everything. You know, it's like, just because you didn't win that Olympic gold medal doesn't mean you can't go on and maybe go to graduate school or maybe go set another goal or maybe, I mean, you can think of, you know, maybe start your career, whatever it is. And it's not all about making money. I've got some really good friends and good mentors that were great high school coaches. I mean they mentored young men and women through lots of different things. So the thing I had to figure out was that I needed to be successful still, I thought of myself as a successful person. The hard part was, is that my image was this wrestler that was going to be an Olympic champion.

LK: That's how I envisioned my success story was going to start and not there, but not stop there. But that was going to be the, the launching pad for my success. Well that launching pad wasn't there. That flight had took off and I wasn't on it. So I had to figure out another place that I could be successful. And I went to graduate school. I worked hard at that. And school wasn't really something that I worked hard at when I was an undergrad. So I, I got an MBA and I went to work in New York City in marketing and start to focus on just developing other skills. I was a business owner. I owned a car dealership for 14 years and I used wrestling a lot to tackle those challenges. All the employees there knew I was a wrestler and I was an athlete, I was a former wrestler. And just some relationships that I made when I was in the car business was pretty, pretty amazing.

LK: I felt like I was in a wrestling match every day trying to tackle all the things you tackle, trying to be successful in, in, in the auto industry. It’s a really tough business and I kind of have come full circle because I was in the car business for 14 years, never thought I'd ever come back to wrestling. I kind of walked away from wrestling and the thing I left out probably conveniently was when I trained for those four more years in 84, I didn't make the team. I got beat by David Schultz, another great American wrestler who's younger than me. I lost and I couldn't fulfill that dream even though that was, that was. So I lost twice kind of in my mind. Dave went on to win a gold medal. I watched him win his gold medal in L.A. The boycott screwed up two Olympic Games because in 84 the Games were going to be in Los Angeles and guess who boycotted. The Soviet Union or Russia and all their allied nations. But, but still, I mean it was like a double disappointment that it didn't make the team. So I had to go forward still in my life and that's, you know, where I previously talked about getting my MBA and working in business and having the auto dealership and all that.

MU: So when you did go to the Olympics to coach years later, what did it mean to you and how could you use your experiences to help other individuals go after their goals?

LK: Well, you know, it was 38 years later actually from the 80 games I think something like that, to 2008. Quite a lot of years later. That all came about through another disappointment, I guess you could say. The auto industry took, was taking a huge downturn in 2007. In 2008 when Obama took office, he bailed out the auto industry. That's how bad things were getting. I went through a horrible divorce then. I mean it was just a lot of things were crashing in my life at that time and a good friend reached out to me and said, Lee, why don't you come to the National World Team Trials? And it was kind of a homecoming when I went to the World team trials and I, you know, I kind of got that fire back, I guess have that feeling that I had when I wrestled.

LK: I connected with all the athletes, they remembered who I was, even though I was older, so I got back on the national coaching staff. I coached the junior team that went to China and competed, some of those wrestlers are current stars now. I coached one of our senior teams and then I, um, I got to be the Olympic coach in 2008. So that was an amazing experience. I got to march in the opening ceremonies 38 years after I missed my opportunity. And I've kind of been around wrestling ever since, you know, I do clinics and coaching and I try to motivate young men and women, you know, women are wresting now and they're doing an amazing, amazing job. And now my son is wrestling. So that was another thing. My son's a senior in high school, so I'm trying to mentor him and guide him a little bit. He's a good writer too. He's a good, uh, a very good in English, very good in storytelling and story writing and all that.

MU: So these points in your life that you're sharing that you say are disappointments, but. You know, you'll, you'll start saying this was a disappointment, but then—it shows to me like this overwhelming sense of resilience and moving forward, which is a quality I think we're all working towards and so I can only imagine that there are great things in your future. So the second piece of this equation of our podcast is asking you what is next? What's a goal that you're working towards? How do you want to get there?

LK: That's a great question because I have had to think about ,what, what am I going to do with my life now? And I'm kind of almost glad in a way that things didn't go the way I thought because I would have just been very satisfied in all my success in wrestling and there would've been some avenues maybe there that I could have earned some money, would’ve been because of that success that I wouldn't have to really venture out to gain other skills to learn how to do other things. I never would have went into the business world as I had to. I worked in New York City for four years and that was pretty competitive for a major consumer packaged goods company, forced me to learn new skills. But right now what I realize is that every industry and discipline, sports, business, anything—there is this overwhelming drive on how can we be successful no matter what discipline that we're in?

LK: So a person like myself, I've found a way to motivate people, not just in athletics. I can motivate people in business. I can people that are maybe in music because it all, it all revolves around talent, but once you have talent, you've got to do something with that talent, and it requires the ability to be motivated. So the area that I am moving into now is motivational speaking. I find that that's an area that that I think I could be very good at. I've listened to and studied and still study, just like I studied Dan Gable, I study a lot of great speakers. I love their messages and I think I could be a good motivational speaker. I've got a lot, a lot of experiences, not only as an athlete but in business because I can remember some pretty tough days in business, in the auto industry of trying to, you know, keep that business afloat over those 14 years.

LK: You know, there's, it just reminds me of the toughest day I had in the wrestling room, you know, and even in school, I remember some of those days where you have to pull yourself up. I can remember, you know, when I went through my divorce it was, you know, I mean, what divorce is a good divorce I guess? And my kids were small at the time and it was about a five year period I wasn't with my kids, so that was very difficult to have my daughter and son. My older son was—he didn't come live with me, but my younger son and daughter came to live with me when they were 10 and 16. And now my son now is wrestling. The last thing I thought ever that I would be coaching and being around my son as a wrestler. So we, we were developing that relationship together.

LK: Uh, we've got a trip planned to the UK where I'm going to be doing some speaking and coaching, wrestling, so I'm kind of moving that whole direction in my life now being able to motivate other people based on my life experiences. And there's a, there's a science to it as well to success and there's a common thread to all of it. And, you know—I wrote a book called Winning Gold and it's just a book of 75 messages, motivational messages. And in the very beginning of the book. I have a quote by Michael Jordan and you know, he talks about, you know, practice like you've never won but play like you've never lost. And that's a quote that, that opens my book. So I have quotes from myself that I kind of thought of based on my career, other things that motivated me. And so I feel like no matter what setting I'm in, the conversation always leads to how can I be more successful?

LK: And then when I hear, when I hear the conversations moving in that direction, I'm like, well, I can help you with that because I know what it takes. And I've been there. I've been, I've been at the top and I've been struggling too, and I've kind of been able to figure out how to get myself moving back up toward the top again. And you’re never there permanently. It's just a constant—it’s like paying your rent, you know, if you don't pay your rent, you're going to get evicted. Just because you have the rent money this month doesn't mean you're going to have it next month. So it's a constant battle really to stay where you want to be. And that's hopefully on top.

MU: So how can people find you and learn more about your background and your current work or speaking engagements now?

LK: My website just leekemp.com and all the information is there. I try to, um, when I, when I do speak in venues, I mean I try to promote them on Facebook and Twitter and my Facebook and Twitter and Instagram and all that is on my main webpage. You can find links to those from leekemp.com.

Mu: Well, it's been an honor to hear your story. I'm by no means any kind of athlete, but the lessons that you've learned and that you shared resonate with me, I think they'll resonate with all of our listeners, so thank you so much for joining me, Lee.

LK: Oh, awesome being here. I appreciate it.

CK: This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and if you have a chance to leave us a rating or view an Apple Podcasts or iTunes, we would be really grateful. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Lee Kemp; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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(This episode has some explicit language)

Peter Rahal, co-founder and CEO of RXBAR, didn’t set out to build a multi-million-dollar company.

But he had goals, both large and small. Practically speaking, he wanted a clean, healthy protein bar to fuel his workouts. On a bigger scale, he sought freedom and fulfillment.

“Prior to working at RXBAR, I'd always had a normal job. I felt really handcuffed and I wasn't in a position to be successful,” Rahal told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals. “And so a goal for me early on was always to really flourish and have freedom and achieve success for myself.”

Those dual quests took him and co-founder Jared Smith farther than they could have imagined. In 2012, they began pressing dates, almonds, and egg whites into bars in Rahal’s parents’ basement.

From the beginning, they established high standards and lofty values. The product had to be excellent. The process, collaborative. And even as they glimpsed glimmers of progress, they stayed humble, knowing they didn’t have all the answers.

Those years weren’t easy. In fact, the pair suffered. “It was miserable,” he says, “pressing bars with your thumbs in your parents’ basement when you’re 26 and while your friends are doing great things and having dinner in the city.”

But Rahal likens the experience to a grueling fitness routine. “The hardest workouts are where you stimulate the most growth from,” he says. “And work is the same thing. The most discomfort you have, the harder it is, the more you grow.”

And grow they did. Rahal remembers telling Smith early on that if they did things right, this could be a $10 million business. Last year, Kellogg bought RXBAR—which now sells 120 million bars per year—for $600 million.

Rahal and Smith stayed on to lead what is now a standalone unit in the larger company, a critical component of the deal, he says. “We were looking for the right muscle, and to protect our people and our culture. So those are kind of two objectives or goals that we were looking for in a partner. Kellogg fit that perfectly and now we have resources to continue to achieve our business objectives.”

Armed with Kellogg’s expertise in areas like international distribution, contract negotiation, and performance management, RXBAR will continue its ambitious quest to transform the way food is made and delivered.

That starts with shifting the corporate approach, Rahal says. Even big companies can innovate and relentlessly drive to improve. Employees who are valued and respected can truly achieve their potential. Systems codify these values, ensuring businesses continue to serve the right people in the right way.

For those of us not in the food industry, who just buy bars at the store or the gym—we’ll see the results on the shelves: “More access to food that’s better for you, that's delicious, that saves you time and that you can trust,” he says. And of course, as the RXBAR package famously proclaims, “No B.S.”

And is Rahal now free? Well, yes and no, he says—in fact, he’s not quite sure of the answer. What he does know is that he’s found a deeper satisfaction and a whole new set of priorities, ones he feels he can pursue to truly leave a legacy.

Listen to this week’s episode to hear more about what freedom means to Rahal, the reason his partnership with Smith works, and a little bit—but not TOO much—about what it takes to get hired as part of the RXBAR team.

If you like what you hear, subscribe where ever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

And if this post or anything else we’ve created impacted your life, please support our Kickstarter.

Transcript:

JAC: Hey, goal getters, it's Jeana Anderson Cohen from aSweatlife.com, and if you've been listening to #WeGotGoals over the last month, you know that we've been running our Kickstarter. And right now we have just five days to fund our big dream for $20,000 to help grow our ambassadorship to reach women across the country. We’re helping them set big, hairy audacious goals and form a network to achieve them. If you want to help out, check the link in our show notes or go to aSweatLife.com. Here's the episode.

JAC: Welcome to #WeGot Goals, a podcast by aSweatlife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Kristen Geil.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

KG: Hi Jeana.

JAC. Hi Ladies. So Cindy, this week you talk to Peter from RXBAR.

CK: I did. I spoke with Peter Rahal. He is the co-founder and CEO of RXBAR and he is a very focused, intense, high achieving person and it was great to kind of crack his code just a little bit.

JAC: One of the things that I found super interesting was sort of the driving force behind his goals: freedom. Can you talk to me a little bit about how freedom has shaped what he's done through his life and where it's taken him?

CK: Yes. He started RXBAR, not necessarily because he wanted to be an entrepreneur, but because he saw a problem that needed to be solved and also because he felt trapped in a job he didn't love, under leadership he didn't respect and he just really wanted to break free. What was interesting, and you'll hear this toward the end of the interview, was kind of how that has played out for him. He doesn't necessarily feel free, but he maybe has a little bit of a new definition of freedom or a new thing that he's seeking in its place. So a pretty interesting to hear how that all unfolded.

KG On the podcast recently we did a live recording with Julia and Lauren who are the co-founders of Stylisted. You spoke with Peter about his co-founder. Jared. One of the things I was interested to hear about was how these two different co-founders might approach goal setting similarly or differently. For example, Julia and Lauren spoke about the importance of having the same long-term vision and goals for the company, but at the same time celebrating the little wins and the small goals that you achieve along the way. Did Peter talk about how he and Jared have any approaches to setting goals as partners and working towards them together?

CK: Yeah, so like Julia and Laura and Peter and Jared were friends first and Peter talks about how important it is to have that rapport with someone that you're starting a business with. That way you can kind of tell early on when something is amiss and you can take steps to work it out before it becomes an actual problem. He said they've also worked hard not to fight about things like titles or things that were insignificant. They kind of set their egos aside and really focused on what they thought was best for the business and yeah, in terms of setting goals for the business, it's interesting. They didn't really have specific goals in terms of the money that they wanted to make or units sold or anything like that. They really just looked at making the best product that they could to fill this hole in the market and then when they got to a bigger place, finding the best people to help support them in those goals. That's really what carried them to a level of success beyond what they even could have imagined.

JAC: Well, I've certainly loved watching the story of RXBAR unfold and especially with this acquisition by Kellogg recently, so excited to hear this interview. So here is Cindy with Peter.

CK: This is Cindy Kuzma and I'm here with Peter who is the CEO and the co-founder of RXBAR. Peter, thank you so much for joining us here today on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

PR: Thank you, Cindy. I appreciate you coming to our office.

CK: It's great to be here and great to see so many people working hard. I'm wondering, Peter, I want to ask about your goals, but I'd first love to hear a little bit about what your day to day is like here at RXBAR.

PR: So my day to day first, I'm not like a routine person. I like to think of myself as highly adaptable and I always start each week with like what's the most important thing I need to accomplish. I'm really motivated by accomplishment, so like what I need to, what do I need to get done this week? So I really think about my year through weeks, everything's through weeks and I accomplish as much as possible in each week. So that's like the first half of the week, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday is very structured in terms of like what am I looking at, what's important, regular information. And then Thursday, Friday is typically like, I like think of the Wild West where I tried to leave it open and react to and be able to get some work done.

CK: I like that. It sounds like you have a nice blend of a very loose structure that you work within that helps you stay somewhat organized, but then you really leave room for creativity and inspiration and doing the work.

PR: I think I’m very unorganized, but yet organized if that like there's a paradox or I don't know what the right word is, but …

CK: Well, it seems to be working for you. You've accomplished some pretty big things in the past five years or so. Our big question on #WeGotGoals always is what is one big goal that you've accomplished that you're particularly proud of, why was it so meaningful to you and how did you get there?

PR: So goals, I guess, goal I had early on in my life, I guess career. I've always wanted freedom. I guess the outcome I wanted was always to be successful and I really wanted to be free. Not freedom in the sense of do whatever I want, but like to be able to make decisions and grow. They have kind of kind of control of my own fate. And so prior to working at RXBAR, I'd always had a normal job and whatnot and I felt really handcuffed and I wasn't in a position to be successful. And so a goal for me early on was always to like really flourish and have freedom and achieve success for myself and I guess I didn't know what that looked like. So it was really just discovering that in my early twenties and then I guess I found it with creating, creating the company with Jared, my co-founder.

CK: So you didn't really know what freedom would look like. I mean, how did you sort of take the steps to uncover that?

PR: I guess early on, early on in my life, I've always rejected poor leadership and I mis-associated with authority. Like I've always like, oh, I don't like authority, but actually I just didn't like, I shunned bad leadership and I never really had great leadership in my work experience. So that's where I felt like it didn't have freedom, right? Like I needed freedom to think, to grow, to challenge, to do. So creative freedom, work freedom, not go do whatever you want type of thing, but like to be challenged to think differently, you know, to define your own path.

CK: So that's a really interesting insight. That freedom maybe was freedom, not from any leadership at freedom from poor leadership.

PR: Yeah, for sure. Good leadership allows that, allows an individual to flourish and grow. I never had that, so I was yearning that ability and I didn't realize that until I started working here and moved into like a leadership position that like that's what I was really seeking and yearning early on.

CK: So, I mean, you have grown in the company and by leaps and bounds in the past five years and when you were started making the bars in your parents basement, right? And now you're part of a huge national company and you're selling a 120 million plus bars a year. Are those goals that you could have even foreseen back when you first started out?

PR: No, absolutely not. So I mean those were like outcomes we never planned. Jared and I were never like, oh, we're gonna build the business to sell it or like having an outcome like that or whatever achieve that. We were, our goal was to make the best product possible, our goal was to make the best company possible. And those were some of our how our approach was and those are really like our strategies and what happened is that great company, those great products, the financial financial performance and those things were really all outcomes of that. So no, and to be honest, I remember sitting back with Jared like really early on and being like, you know, if we do this right, this is a $10 million business and you know, I'd be lying to you if I said how we had planned all this out. We got lucky and we've, we've, we had the right values guiding us and we did what was important.

CK: So talk to me about some of those values. What do you think were the important step are the important values that took you from a to b to Z.

PR: That's a good question. So I guess the values that were most where I would say like humility, both we like to think of as emotionally and intellectually like, right. We didn't have all the answers. We knew we didn't have all the answers. We stayed curious. We asked for help. And then for Hared and I are working together as co-founders, we never fought over titles, we never fought over responsibility. We did what was in the best interest of the company early on. So that requires a lot of, you know, you have to free yourself of your pride and arrogance. So that was really important early on you see a lot of people fighting over this and that. And like I always say, like if Jared and I were building a house, we never fought over the color of the house, you know what I mean? It was just like we went. So humility is number one and it's both emotionally and intellectually.

PR: And then second is excellence. Just like constant improvement and entrepreneurial, like a real entrepreneurial mindset and growth mindset of like, this can get better. We've got to figure it out because you think about a company, all it is, is a group of people that are formed in teams that have to make decisions and those decisions usually are around problems, right? Or opportunity or problem, whatever way you want to look at it. And so doing that really, really well is important, people decisions and problems. So that, um, and then other one is like tenacity too, I don't know if that's an actual value, just grit, but like it was miserable like pressing bars with your thumbs in your parents basement when you're 26 and while your friends are doing great things and having dinner in the city, whatever it is. You can't, you know, it takes a lot of grit. And there wasn't like, you know, you look at the company today and it's like, ‘Oh, it's great. You guys are successful.’ It wasn't like that a while ago and it was actually quite miserable and Jared and I actually suffered a lot in a good way. I think suffering is good, but so you have to prepared to suffer in a good way.

CK: Knowing that you sort of had this idea that maybe you hadn't experienced good leadership before. Did you have other examples of leaders that you've found along the way who kind of helped shape this as you went along?

PR: Not necessarily like I'm never had great, I never really experienced great leadership. I've experienced great parenting. I have amazing parents and that is a form of leadership I'd argue, but I know I never, I never had it. When I played sports I had a coach that like was involved in practice run with us. Like was a great leader and I mean it was amazing how it worked, but I know I never had anyone, like oh, that's what great leadership looks like. I didn't realize what it was until like in action here in this company. Like I realized how important it was. So. No, but I know, I know, I yearned it. I yearned it. I never necessarily had it I would say and I didn't know what it looked like either.

CK: What's an example of kind of what it looks like now on a day to day basis here and how do you, how do you kind of know that you're here exemplifying it?

PR: So I, I think presence is super important. So being available, being around flying in and solving problems, you know what I mean? Like if there's an issue going in and helping fix it. Um, so like, can I call it, like I think of it as like reactionary, reactionary leadership support is super important so you're there and you react to the problem and go down to help fix it. And then also being super proactive in terms of breaking down potential barriers. So you're being there, you're having the vision to help break down a potential problem so it doesn't happen. So that, that's great leadership.

PR: Yeah, I mean that, I mean for us, the way we lay out the way we meet, I mean we've systemized that really through our structures. So example, if like a service call comes in and there's an issue like in I can tell, I can hear the, someone struggling with a customer, I can go in and like pick it up and help. Like that's great leadership. Presence is important, is really important. Being consistent, you know what I mean? Like not coming in moody, not, not really self regulating yourself is important. So how you show up consistently articulating the vision and where we're going and why we're going. We're making value-based decisions so being consistent with decision making, not just like arbitrarily, right? So those are all things that are important and being approachable, you know, and also there's another like knowing the business too, like I think there's a level, like a lot of times you hear EQ and like these softer skills are really important and they are absolutely empathy, understanding the business and just everyone's position and situation, but actually like having knowledge and actually experiencing and be able to like tactically help out. I think it's really important and having knowledge of the business uh, is important because imagine if someone came in from here to be a leader here but like didn't know shit about the food business, you know, it'd be hard for them to have credibility. And that's the advantage I have as a founder. Like shit I've came from the beginning, I have this knowledge from experience, like it's really helpful for people. So I think that's important too.

CK: I'd imagine that gets challenging to stay on top of as you grow, and I mean how many people work here now?

PR: I think a hundred 10?

CK: How do you kind of keep tabs on that and keep in—it sounds like some of just jumping in and solving the problems and keeps you connected to the front line. Right. What else?

PR: Well, that’s, I mean, we’re 110. So I've, I've read a lot and like I know we're on the inflection point where like, I know everyone's name, right? And now we're going to be like 140, 150, 200. At some point that's not scalable, right? Like we exceed every, every individual's capacity to know everyone's name and who they are and how they work, etc. So here it right now sub 120, whatever, it’s easy. I know everyone's name, I know how they work, I know their personality type, I know.

PR: But in a year that's going to be totally different. So I, I'm actually, I don't know the answer, but uh, you know, for me it's not necessarily about me knowing it's really about our leadership here in the different teams and the groups of teams and how they work and what is the leadership look like on those teams. So scaling, like what we do in systemizing it so it permeates the whole organization.

CK: So as you've grown, how important would you say that the type of people that you've hired has been to your ongoing success?

PR: We have the best. The amount of people we’ve accumulated is unbelievable. So I say like where like one of the companies we're in, the people business, the company's responsibility to, to ensure every individual’s achieving their goal and flourishing. So that's probably the most important thing we do is hire people; I’ve said that. We have a good process and a lot of our success actually all of our success is due to the fact that we've been able to build an awesome team.

PR: So we at the highest level, like I said, we're a group of people who make decisions and solve problems. Like we are in the people business, the highest level. At the end of the day one of the things we do is make a bar and we make food and we do other things. Um, but that Is what business we're actually in. Ao it's the most important thing. Any business that involves people.

CK: What would you say is kind of different about your process or superior about your process for finding these people.

PR: We have a very, we have a culture that people were, where the company is aligned on. We’ve defined the competencies that are great with individuals. The question is like, what competencies do individuals possess that make them successful and flourish? So we asked that question and we've really laid it out there and we, you know, we look through those in candidates and also like it's important I think, I don't know other companies like this is the biggest company I've ever worked for. So I don't know what it looks like in other places, but you know, everyone, you know, It's not like P&O or HR does the hiring. It's, it's a very cross-functional process. Our goal is to hire the best people and make sure they're, they're in a position to be successful. And then we put a, a soft process around it.

CK: So any tips on what those competencies are for people who might be looking?

PR: something that's. I don't want to like you, you have a lot of people listen to this and I don't want to tip our hands.

CK: You don't have to give out trade secrets. That's ok.

PR: Yeah. Just know that like we want our job is to make sure anyone who has it sits here and is a part of the team is in a position to flourish and achieve what they want to achieve and that's what we look for and that's the most important thing. There is no, lIke if that's not there, then it—you're just going to leave. You know what I mean? So it's actually a, it's a very mutual process. We're not just doing this for us, it's actually like in the interest of the candidate. You know what I mean?

CK: That's always, I think as it, you know, when you're a job seeker, that's a really nice feeling have when you enter into an interview and feel like it is a mutual search.

PR: To be ultimately successful. I believe it has to be. But at the same time, if there's an individual doesn't know what they want to achieve, that's ok, that's the right answer. They don't have the goal, right, like what their career goal is. It's ok, we can, as long as you have the right mindset and approach, you can discover it and that's our job then for you, to discover your passions and what are you good at. So that's a lot of times younger candidates don't know what the hell they want, which is totally normal. You know what I mean? I don't think anyone coming out of school is like, oh I want to be this. They just want to join a great team and great company and really learn and grow.

CK: What has this process been like with a partner?

PR: Kellogg?

CK: Well, I mean, even to start—starting the company with Jared. How do you two balance each other out?

PR: It's been, It's been good. So I always think of like Jared and I are like totally different birds. You know what I mean? Like, so that helps. Like we're—one of our values is collaboration and that's like we not I, right? And not seeking credit. So our relationship is like super collaborative. If you look up any personality test we’re literally the opposite ends and he has more of a financial background and he values stability where I'm more commercial facing and value action. So we're like total yin and yang. So like in the beginning when we first started, I'm remember like, we've been incorporating a company, this is a long time ago. And we're going over like, what is your role? What's our role? You know what I mean? Sometimes it's an uncomfortable conversation.

PR: It was like, ok, well you should be the CEO and I should be the CFO. And like that was from the get go really easy. So the role and responsibilities is very natural for us. So It's been amazing. And we wouldn't be here today If we didn't have that balance. For example, when a task, when it was just us and when a task came through, it was very obvious who did what. So yeah, it's been everything in, you know, I don't know what other co-founder relationships are like, but I imagine if you get to like people with the same, two types of birds that are the same, there's holes In the business and things fall through the crack. Where for us it was, we move faster. We didn't fight. I don't think we had one fight.

CK: That’s pretty amazing.

PR: I mean we've had disagreements but not like an actual like fight. Conflict is normal but not like bad conflict or like ugly conflict.

CK: Can you pinpoint any ways that communicated effectively that have prevented that. Or is it just the personality?

PR: The advantages that Jared and I have—is when you hire a, like when you work with friends, like you see this a lot with businesses early on, like where they’re, like friends starting it together, you know what I mean? And the reason why is because we have rapport. I've known him since first grade. He's known me since first grade. He knows when I'm pissed. I know when he's upset. So it actually causes us, the rapport and history we have together causes that causes us address things earlier rather than them just boiling or whatever. Like, I didn’t know you were pissed, I couldn't tell like, well no I can actually, I can smell, I can smell when he's pissed off or upset or disappointed.

PR: He can smell when I’m—you know what I mean? It's more than. It's like this feeling, this intuition and instincts that you have just because you have rapport with is another human for so long. So that's a huge advantage we've had. And that's why you see like early businesses like you think about, it's all friends usually starting it because you can't be like, hey, want to. Like you can't go to the market place and be like, hey, you want to start this business with me? I don't know you. You want to start this? I don't fucking trust you. I trust Jared, he trusts me. We’re aligned. And you think about the values of our company really stem from our relationship because those are the two people that are at the two inputs that effect how we work here early on. It's shaped it in a totally different way because you know, the next new people come shapes it in a good way. Right?

CK: That's another huge phase that you're in now. So how—you're set up as kind of as a company within Kellogg, is that right?

PR: Yeah. So like a standalone business, a different business unit in a way.

CK: Was that kind of an important goal to you when pursuing this kind of a deal?

PR: Yeah, for sure it was table-stakes. Because people use the word exit—like we never actually exited, you know what I mean? As shareholders, we show sold their shares. But um, so for us we were looking for the right, the right muscle, and to protect our people and our culture. So those are kind of two objectives or goals that we were looking for in a partner. And Kellogg fit that perfectly and now we have resources to continue to achieve our business objectives and, and flourish as a company.

CK: So the resources is obviously that's a, that's a big change. I mean, what else has changed so far? What else do you predict will change?

PR: So change. As a company, we’ve changed a lot and that's just the nature of, of a, of a business. So it's all been good change. I would say in terms of, as it relates to Kellogg and being owned by them. They're, I wouldn't say there's any significant change. It's all good stuff in the sense that like, you know, we have some things we're navigating through in terms of some legal stuff for, not legal but like contracts that we need their expertise. Like, talk about performance management or like how to operate or how to manage channel conflict as we grow. Like there's a lot of expertise that we have in internationally, the global expansion, like that's something we wouldn't really be able to do on her own very quickly. And so with their leadership and their expertise and access, we've been able to move that up on the calendar significantly and go after new opportunities like that.

PR: So there's been a bunch of good stuff. But like as a company, I wouldn't say we've changed our, there's been any change. Um, so the, the thing is, I always tell our team this, like we're gonna grow to, you know, we're gonna grow the business to 200 people and whatever—hopefully, you know, 400 people in a billion in revenue in these are things we want to achieve. We're going to change, like, you know what I mean? Change is a good thing and we, we have to fix our processes or improve our processes or whatever and let's not associate any sort of negative part of our size. Like, right, we're growing, we're getting bigger and there's some compromises that come with that. Meaning not everyone has all the information sometimes. That's part of it. Like I can't know what's going on in the social calendar. I just can’t. And mis-associating that change with new ownership or anything. Like that's, there's, we're growing and that's part of the, it's part of the territory. And um, we have to adapt in an intelligent way.

CK: Right, so there’s changes that just come from growth and there’s changes that come from the partnership from the acquisition.

PR: But like those changes are just things … ike there's really no changes so far. So it's all opportunity to be honest.

CK So the second big question that we typically ask on #WeGotGoals is about a goal you have for the future and how you plan to get there.

PR: As a company?

CK: Well, I mean that's up to you. You can answer it as a company or you can answer it as an individual.

PR: Yeah, I mean I think one of our goals is to really change and influence our legacy in the food business and really set the new standard for how food is designed, marketed and done. And so I really like remove the bullshit in big CPG and really restore confidence in different stakeholders from farmers, brokers, distributors, customers, consumers, et cetera. So we always pioneer our own path and, and so I guess the goal longer term or to really leave the impacting legacy on food and how things are done.

CK: And CPG?

PR: Consumer packaged goods. So it's a monsters industry in a good way. It's huge. Everything. everyone needs food.

CK: That's a pretty ambitious goal to change the way the food system works. I mean, what do you think are the biggest problems and how do you think you can have an impact on them?

PR: Like one of the biggest ones is like, you know, as you get bigger, you, why can't big companies innovate in a, in an authentic and effective way? So that's one problem we approach and also how organizations are built or you know, it's totally different today. So I think organizationally through different design and tactics and systemizing things, you can change it in serving, ensuring, making value based decisions in ensuring you're serving the right people in the right way and not not, you know, I think there's a great quote, I actually think it's a Martha Stewart, but power—someone's character is best measured when you give them power and influence. Um, So like when you get powerful and in positions of influence, like how do you treat people is a real test of how you work.

CK: And you mentioned that kind of no BS, which I know is on your label and something that, I mean from a consumer perspective, like what do these, what might these changes look like and what does that no BS mean.

PR: No BS really just means, like, nonsense. It's not so literal, just like nonsense, like bad, like overly marketed to, gimmicky stuff. So it's across the board, across the business and of course in the products like right, we don't want nonsense ingredients or nonsense stuff, so that's how we, how we think about it.

CK: So what can people who are out there buying RXBARs now, like what kind of change my base fee in the long term in the food system, if you are successful?

PR: More access to food that like it's better for you, that's delicious. It saves you time that you can trust. So that's how I would think about it or how we think about it.

CK: Back to thinking about your corporate path and your, your journey again from the basement to do this nice office to what I understand is going to be in an even bigger office coming soon. When you think back on your journey and if you—I’m sure you often give advice to other entrepreneurs, if you have one or two key pieces of advice that you'd offer people, what might they be?

PR: Oh, there's a lot, there's so much, and it’s so situational. A motto I always live by is like, do what's effective and what feels good for me. That’s like, for me, important. There's a ton. Be proactive, not reactive. And like solve a problem, right? I feel like at least in entrepreneurship, a lot of like—Jared and I did this because we saw a gap in the market, like a problem. Like there wasn't a product that fit our needs. It wasn't like—we didn't focus on the outcome, we're not, you know, we were like, oh, we want to start a business and grow a business and do that. It was like, well, here's this opportunity that there's problem in the marketplace and do that. So that, that's important. You know, in a lot of people, like on the surface you're like, oh I want to have a nice business. I'm going to be an entrepreneur one day, like I never, we never were like, oh, we're going to be an entrepreneur one day it was just like, hey, there's this product we didn't, um, we want to make. And like, knowing what's important, doing what's important is important.

CK: Like you said, maybe be willing to suffer a little bit along the way.

PR: Yeah, suffering’s good. Pain’s good. As long as you learn from.

CK: One of those things like, in fitness as in life

PR: Well, yeah, think about fitness—there’s actually great parallels. So think about fitness, the most painful brutal workouts, not overused of course, but like the hardest workouts are where you stimulate the most growth from, you know. And work is the same thing. The most discomfort you have, the harder it is, the more you grow. And that's what I tell people, like I've been miserably uncomfortable since the day I started this. Vulnerable and uncomfortable. But that's part of growth and it's not. There's a stupid analogy, but I like to think about it—you know when you like wake up in the morning and you're in bed and it’s like so comfortable, especially in the winter here in Chicago, like. You never, if you take the sheets off, it's like oh, it's freezing and it's uncomfortable. You can just like stay in bed. That’s comfort, is just staying there. But like ripping the sheets off, being cold. Like that’s how you get going and that's how you start. You don't want to just stay in bed all day.

CK: Just get out there, get started. Excellent advice. You mentioned early on that one of your goals was freedom. Do you think you have it?

PR: That’s such a good question. No, I feel like a slave, but I do have creative freedom, but I'm a servant a hundred percent, but I like that.

CK: So do you think your idea of what freedom is has just changed.

PR: Yeah. Yeah. I don't have absolute freedom. I guess I need to define what freedom is. I mean, I love my job. It's not a, it's not even a job. It's like what I do. I, you know, I guess to give context, when I was prior to working at RXBAR, I was in a miserable spot, like I didn't like my job. I wasn't successful, I was insecure, I didn't have any confidence and I, I wanted to be successful. I wanted freedom to pursue my talent, whatever I was good at and, and grow and so I guess I needed to do to find what freedom meant. But back to your original question today am I free? No, I'm a servant to the company and I'm not free on paper, I guess. I don't know, that's a great question. I need to reflect on this. I don't have the answer.

CK: Yeah, maybe you’re a servant, but a happier one. A servant to a good master.

PR: I think what gives humans such satisfaction in serving others actually like for me, like watching all these people grow and achieve their goals is like—I’m high as a kite. Like there's nothing more gratifying than watching someone change and grow and achieve their goals and the way I try to do that is through serving them and serving their interests and whatnot. So I guess my priorities have shifted. Like my original goal was get out of misery and find something that I was good at and be successful and that's what I kind of maybe me my freedom. And now my goals are, or what makes me happy and goals are different.

CK: Peter, I can’t thank you enough for joining me.

PR: Thank you. No, I appreciate your time and I'm always here.

CK: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. And while you're there, if you could leave us a rating or review, especially if you're an iTunes or Apple Podcasts, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Many for our theme music; to our guest this week, Peter Rahal; and to Tech Nexus, as always, for the recording studio.

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Back the Kickstarter.

Celebrating a close family member's 50th birthday in the ICU is a worst-case scenario for most people — but for Danni Allen, watching her father battle (and then overcome) weight-related health issues proved to be the catalyst that inspired her to audition for "The Biggest Loser."

After beating out 300,000 other applicants to be one of the final 15 featured on the show, Allen showed up to set and was immediately faced with the harsh new reality of her next six months — namely, the signature tough love of trainer Jillian Michaels.

"When you meet Jillian Michaels, she gives you no second to think," shares Allen. "There wasn't a minute to think before she had you on the treadmill."

And that first workout? Yeah, it lasted four hours.

Jillian Michaels, at the time, "was not my favorite person," Allen says tactfully. But eventually, the trainer wore Allen down. Or as Allen laughingly confides, "she literally beat it out of me!"

"Plus, my entire team got kicked off in the first four weeks - so I was riding solo with [Jillian] for the next six months of the show," ultimately setting up a close post-show relationship that Allen says they maintain to this day.

As Allen describes on this week's podcast — published nearly five years to the day after her win — Michaels helped her break down goals and re-define them in different ways beyond the show's narrow focus.

"At the time, it was definitely about a scale, but [Jillian] helped me find successes outside the scale." Running, doing her first-ever push-up, and practicing yoga all became staples in Allen's workouts.

Once off the show and back to real life, Allen was able to translate some of the strategies learned from Michaels into maintaining her healthiest weight.

"I took it one day at a time, one minute at a time... Being on the show helped me choose smaller goals and hit those. Find those successes, because that's what's going to launch you into the next goal."

The show also taught Allen the importance of a strong community supporting you — a philosophy Allen promotes in her work with Planet Fitness, the fitness chain known for their Judgment-Free Zone®.

"We [the cast members] created a family on the show. I think it's different than other reality TV shows — we're not there to take each other down. We are actually there to support and push each other... we wanted to be there for each other."

As far as Allen's takeaway tip towards living your best life, she encourages a twist on a gratitude journal.

"I keep a journal, and I always write down three things that I did well that day. That shows me that I'm making progress. You always get bogged down by the negativity or the things you wish you could have done or the "supposed to be's" — instead, it's about seeing what you did right."

Sounds like Allen is right where she's supposed to be.

This episode is presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code “GOALS” to get 5 percent off through March 31.

If you like what you hear, subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

And if this post or anything else we’ve created impacted your life, please support our Kickstarter.

Transcript:

JAC: Hi listeners, it's Jeana Anderson Cohen from aSweatLife.com, and I am here to talk to you quickly before we get to the high achievers who will share their goals with you. But if you have big goals or if you've been watching us help others achieve their big goals through our ambassadorship, we're asking you to help fund our Kickstarter. So if you check the link in the show notes today, you'll see that we are raising $20,000 between now and April 9th to help fund the expansion of our ambassadorship to help women set and achieve big goals in Chicago and across the country. Again, check the show notes or aSweatLife.com to learn more. Thanks so much. Let's get to those goal getters.

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me I have Kristen Geil and Maggie Umburger.

KG: Morning, Jeana.

MU: Morning, Jeana.

JAC: Morning. So Kristen, this week you talked to Danni, who many listeners may remember from The Biggest Loser.

KG: Yes, I spoke with Danni Allen who won The Biggest Loser five years ago. She is from Mundelein and she won The Biggest Loser a few years ago and now she has completely transformed her career and is working with Planet Fitness, helping them open new gyms across the Chicago land area and we actually spoke to her right before the opening of one on the Broadway location up in Wrigleyville.

JAC: And what's incredible about Danni is how she has sort of managed the change in her life. Starting first and foremost with The Biggest Loser when she had this catalyst in her life. And then Jillian Michaels was introduced into the fold. What did she have to say about coach Jillian?

KG: It was really clear throughout our interview. She references Jillian several times and the impact that Jillian had on her life and encouraging her and scaring her a little bit in really getting that tough love mentality instilled in Danni so she could push herself harder in and out of the gym to really live up to her full potential. And one of the interesting things that she really retained after meeting with Jillian for so many weeks and days in a row was the importance of breaking your goals down into bite size pieces, which is something we have heard over and over again on this podcast. Danni referred to it as Eeyore, the idea that there's this huge seemingly insurmountable goal that you have in the future. Whether it's, you know, losing half your body weight or climbing a mountain, let's just say, and it's really clear that she was able to win The Biggest Loser not by thinking about, I have to lose 120 pounds, but thinking I have to lose five pounds this week. And then just focusing and building it from there.

MU: One thing that is so fun about this podcast is that we get to interview these high achievers and talk about something that they might not always get to talk about on interviews or or with the people in their daily lives. We get to ask about how they set goals. And then one element that often comes up about goal setting is how people express gratitude for where they are and that helps them set goals for the future, but Danni has a really interesting take on gratitude, which is something that we love here at aSweatLife.

KG: Yeah. One of the things I really loved was when we talked about this, I asked Danni what her best life looks like because at aSweatLife we're all about helping our readers to live their best life and she responded that she took the time each night to write down three things that she had done well that day, not just three things that she was grateful for, but three areas where she specifically thought she had succeeded and she said, you know, at the end of the month you look back and you have 90 things that you did well and that's a huge confidence boost for yourself and helps fight that feeling of the imposter syndrome so many of us have, whether it's in the workplace or in our personal lives. So I thought that was a really great twist on a gratitude journal. Just making it a little bit different and really helping boost your confidence in a new and interesting way.

JAC: Chris. We're so excited to hear this interview with Danni, thank you so much. Here's Kristen with Danni.

KG: Welcome to the #WeGotGoals podcast. My name is Kristen Geil and I am here today with Danni Allen who is now working for planet fitness and is the former winner of NBC's The Biggest Loser. Danni, how are you today?

DA: I am doing fantastic. How are you doing?

KG: I'm good. We are so excited to have you here because we know that you are all over Chicago, which is our home base working with Planet Fitness, helping engage their new members. Can you tell me a little bit about what that role is for you and how you're working for it?

DA: Yeah, absolutely. If anyone has been to a Planet Fitness before, I mean I'm really, really passionate about making sure the brand stays here in Chicago as well, but we're 1500 locations nationwide and the best part about Planet Fitness is it's the home of the judgment free zone where anybody and everybody can feel comfortable in their own skin. And myself, who used to be, you know, almost 300 pounds at one point felt really intimidating going into a gym. So when I started working with Planet Fitness and seeing the culture that they allow everybody to feel like they belong, I had to dig in deeper and that's why I'm really excited to be part of the branding here in Chicago.

KG: What does that mean exactly that Planet Fitness does to make their members feel welcome in that judgment free zone?

DA: Well, the first thing you do when you walk into a Planet Fitness, is you'll see, purple and yellow plastered everywhere, which is always fun colors to have and make you just feel excited, but we always have really friendly staff that's always at the front desk to say, welcome you in. Always give you a tour of the gym. But the biggest piece of the puzzle with planet fitness is unlimited fitness training is included for only $10 a month, which is your membership cost. So included in that membership cost is unlimited fitness training, so that way you can have someone to be on your side and help you with your goals and you know, there are different workout sessions--over 40 of them actually every single week that you can be a part of at no additional cost to make you feel comfortable when you first walk in and that's a big goal of ours to spread that word.

KG: And let's back up just a little bit. Why don't you tell us a little bit about how you got to be on The Biggest Loser, what prompted you to try and get on that show and then what was your journey like once you're on there?

DA: Yes, so about almost, oh, wow, this is at six years ago, almost to the day. Unfortunately my Dad got really, really sick and was put into the hospital and a lot of his health concerned attributed to his weight and we actually had a very close call there. I really thought there was a moment there. I wasn't going to have my dad with me. We were celebrating his 50th birthday in the ICU hoping that things would turn around and thankfully they did and my dad had lost about a hundred pounds. He was doing so much better and really getting his life back at 50. I was 25 and just realizing, you know, as a wake up call for me that I needed to get my health in order. I was definitely tipping the scale very close to 300 pounds and knew that I needed to change something so I wasn't 50 and in the ICU and you know, hoping that I would have a longer life. So with that I started Weight Watchers and started to lose a little bit of weight with a girlfriend at work that was helping me while my dad was recovering. And then she happened to call me one night. It was like, Hey, you know, the TV show, The Biggest Loser? They have auditions tomorrow, let's go. And I was like, yeah, I don't really. I've seen what they do on that show. I'm not really sure I could quite handle it. And you know, the Jillian Michaels is just scary enough as it is.

KG: I hear that.

DA: Um, and so, but, you know, we bit the bullet, we went the next day and the funniest part was this audition started at 10:00 and I always love when they call it Chicago, but it was actually Lombard. I'm like, this isn't Chicago people, but ...

KG: It's false advertisement.

DA: Exactly. But we got there at like 7 in the morning thinking, oh, we'll be at the front of the line. No big deal. We were sadly mistaken. We actually had to wait in line for almost eight hours because there's over 3,000 people already in line waiting to get in. But we did. And this was mind you at this point. Now we're in July of 2012. Right. And you know, summers here are just excruciating. And so I came all cute because I'm like, I'm meet some producers or I really didn't know what was going on, but it's eight hours later I got to the front.

DA: I was like a sweaty mess. My hair was. I was like, well, there's no shot of making the show. And we were in and out in a matter of 10 minutes, interviewed as a group and I'm like, well, you know, I'm sure they've seen thousands and thousands of people. There is no chance here. But I went home later that evening and I got a call on my phone and it said Los Angeles. I'm like, who's calling? And little did I know it was a call that changed my life and they, I answered the phone and they said, are we speaking to the next biggest loser? Three months later of auditioning, I got to meet my trainer, Jillian Michaels, whom, um, at the time was not my favorite person. But after, after, you know, working sometime with her and she literally beat it out of me.

KG: Tough love.

DA: Exactly. Exactly. But we created a bond.

DA: My season was quite unique where, you know, we were definitely slapped right in the face of working out eight to 10 hours a day, which I do not condone for the average person every day. So we were on a reality televislon show. But I got to know Jillian more and more. And unfortunately my season, my, my entire team got kicked off in the first four weeks, so I was riding solo with her for the entire remaining six months of the show. But I really got to see a side of Jillian that she truly cares. She's hard for a reason and you know, 3,000 people just in my Chicago audition came, but over 300,000 auditioned that season alone. So we had, I was the miracle 15 that actually made the show and she just wants to make sure you work for it. And you know, six months later I was being crowned the champion dropping 120 pounds and you know, having a lot of fun over the last five years.

KG: Was there any hesitation on your part at all when you got the call or were you, did you have a gut feeling that says I have to do this for me?

DA: Oh, absolutely. I was terrified. And especially I told you, I actually went to the audition with a friend and we thought we were auditioning together and I was the one that got the call back and she didn't. So there was a part of me and you know, my mom always says I have the disease to please, I worry about everyone else before I take care of myself and I know I'm not the only one that's like that. I was ready not to do it. And then I'd seen, you know, my first after my second call audition, you know, they make you do the awesome turnarounds with just like a sports bra showing off your belly

KG: Oh, I have nightmares about that.

DA: And they're like, oh wait, no, we need to pull it out a little bit more and you can't see my hand gestures right now, but they're literally like pulling your tummy fat out of your pants so you can like see how much weight you truly need to lose. And it was quite a mortifying experience if I might say. And it really made me question. And then of course, you know, day one you're slapped in the face with our first workout doesn't end for four hours. So. And Jillian was just a spitfire. So I didn't even know once I made the show if I could even last more than one more day. But I did do, I took it one day at a time, sometimes one minute at a time, and then we created a family there on the show, so I was thankful for the contestants that were on our season. I think it's different than other reality TV shows. We're not there to take each other down. We're actually there to hopefully support and push. And then every once in a while you hope you've got five extra minutes in the gym just to get that leg up. But we wanted to be there for each other.

KG: That's amazing.

CK: Hey, it's Cindy Kuzma, the co-host and producer of #WeGotGoals. We'll get back to Kristen's interview with Danni in just a minute, but first I want to say a special thank you to our sponsor this week, Chicago Sport and Social Club--and want to let you know that they're special discount code for beach volleyball. It's been extended through March 31st. That is good news because with Chicago Sport and Social Club, it's more than a game. It's a social sports experience. When this Chicago winter finally ends, you're going to have a lot of reasons to play. It might be feeling the sand between your toes and maybe meeting people and moving your social life outside for season. Whatever your goals are, whatever your reasons for playing. There is a beach volleyball league at Chicago Sport and Social Club for you, so to sign up you can do it as a team of all women, a team of men and women, or you can sign up on your own and get set up with the team. Do that by going to www.chicagosocial.com and use the code goals. That's g o a l s when you register, you'll get five percent off now through March 31st. Thanks so much to Chicago Sport and Social Club. And now let's go back to Kristen and DannI.

KG: This is a good time to ask the first question that we ask everyone who comes on our podcast. What is a big goal that you've achieved in the past and why was it so important to you and how did you get there?

DA: You know, since winning the show, my life has flipped upside down and I think in a generic sense, what I've learned is that there's no supposed to be. That was like my biggest thing to realize is, you know, I think we matriculate through school, we go from high school hopefully to college, then you get a job and then what the show taught me is things can shake up that you need to take your life and your personal story in your own hands and it might not go the direction that you want, but to take it and, you know, just kinda jump with it.

DA: So immediately after the show I ran the Chicago Marathon, which I never thought I would do. Everyone's like, oh, did you want to be a runner? I'm like, no, I thought running was stupid. I really did. Um, but you know, I found one goal with this show and I liked the finish line analogy, is that, you know, as you're running, you can always go a little bit further. So it started with a 5k and then a 10K. And I really wanted the opportunity being from Chicago to run that marathon and the funny part is I did sign up in their lottery and I didn't get in initially and so luckily if you're ever having trouble getting into the marathon, just win a national television show and tell Savannah Guthrie on NBC Today Show that you didn't make it in and then you'll get calls the next day, so.

KG: That seems like a reasonable way to get in.

DA: Everyone can do that, right? No problem. So that was one of my biggest goals just as far as being a Chicagoan and feeling like I embraced something that is so huge and culturally diverse here, running through all the neighborhoods that Chicago has. So that was one of the big things I had. But also secondly, which is also my future goals, is working with a company like Planet Fitness that really gets the opportunity to change lives and make people feel more comfortable. And I think especially in today's day and age, we need to make sure that we are doing our best to have as many people feel comfortable in their own skin. I like to work with a lot of programs that help people just feel unique and great in their own bodies and though I lost 120 pounds, that doesn't mean that I am defined by my weight.

DA: I am not defined by my scale. So over the last five years it's using platforms like Planet Fitness to help people realize that, you know, scale weight tells you the relationship with gravity and that's, that's about it. And since then I've had great opportunities to work with other platforms like Girls on the Run, which is great here in Chicago as well. And if I can continue doing that, I think everything will be great.

KG: You mentioned Planet Fitness as being a judgment free zone, which is something that we don't feel oftentimes when we're walking into a gym. How did you feel that first day when you walked in to The Biggest Loser workout warrior coliseum is how I think of it.

DA: So I will say I didn't know it quite at the time until I first walked in, but it's actually a Planet Fitness. So yes, it's The Biggest Loser private gym, but it's supplied by Planet Fitness, so it hasn't the gears and the purple and the yellow, so you'll see that.

DA: So I wish I had known that at the time. I might have had some sort of comfort level with that, but walking in for the first time now, mind you, I was an athlete my whole life. I wasn't oblivious to what equipment and gyms were, but I had been over 200 pounds since I was 14 years old. I was heavy but I knew how to move it. I was all state in, in Illinois for soccer, I was a goalkeeper, you know, and I was getting ready to go college bound and I think I disappointed my poor father's heart, but I ended up playing water polo in eventually in college as well. And so I was really extremely athletic. I just could never figure out why my body wasn't losing the weight. So when I walked into that gym for the first time, I kind of knew what everything was.

DA: And I think if anything it was more impactful because I'm like, I also know what these things can do.

KG: Yeah, you know what you're in for.

DA: Exactly. And then you know, when you meet Jillian Michaels, she gives, you know, second to think. In all honesty, there wasn't a minute to think before she had you on the treadmill running. People were falling off. It didn't matter. You just had to stay on and pray for the life that she was going to go away soon.

KG: You said that you guys spent eight to 10 hours in the gym a day when you were on the show, but at the same time we call this a reality show and that is not realistic for most people. So once you got out of that environment and came back to the real world, how did your personal fitness and health goals for yourself change then from what they had been while you were on the show?

DA: Yeah, I would hope to say like it was simple and easy, like a light switch. Turn it on and turn it off. With the show, like any reality show, you're not watching a TV show to see someone lose one or two pounds a week, right? That's the safe and more healthy way to do things, but at the end of the day they want to make an impact and a splash and you want to see the most extreme makeovers, which is great for that scenario, but that's not real life. So after the show, it did take me some time to realize how much can I work out to try and maintain and in all honesty, maintenance wasn't even an option for me right at the beginning because I lost so much weight so quickly. Your body needs that time to adapt. So luckily I did create a great relationship with Jillian and I actually joined her on her tour for a little bit, so she was able to give me that mental strength that I needed, knowing that I didn't need to spend that much time in a gym and she was trying to dwindle me down to about 45 minutes to an hour at a time though, you know, it took time to get to that.

DA: That's what I've gotten to today. If you can work out about 45 minutes to an hour, four to five days a week and it doesn't have to be in a gym. Trust me, I work with the gym and I love going to the gym, but just going outside like for the first time here in Chicago, it's what like 50 degrees out?

KG: It feels like spring outside. So I saw a guy in shorts and a tank top riding his bike last night.

DA: I didn't bring my jacket. It was fantastic. So utilizing just your basic scenarios, going out for an extra walk or instead of you know, if it is nicer like it is today, you know, taking that opportunity to, to move more and at the end of the day move more and watch what you eat. That's the real, you know, the real solution to what we, we've got to get to.

KG: What else do people not see happening on The Biggest Loser that might surprise them?

DA: Oh, there's a lot. We always said we wanted to have a show called The Biggest Loser After Dark and there are little things, like you said, I can say what I want. We had a, we had a food porn jar so when anyone talks too much about like, oh, I could really go for a chocolate sundae with some--you had to put money in the jar, so we called it our food porn jar, so we would have food porn our where we could talk about it for just an hour, get it all out there, all the foods that we thought we were missing, but I will say as it started to evolve it and go in your body change and your taste buds honestly do change. It will happen. It's not overnight, but that food porn jar got less and less and less and we always said whoever was going to win the show is going to get the pot in that, in that jar. But I never saw any of that.

KG: Someone broke a promise.

DA: Exactly. But you know those. Those are the little things and at the end of the day, I don't think what they necessarily showed is all the different ways that we worked out. Yes, we definitely went to the gym, but we're lucky enough to be in Calabasas, California, in the in the valley, which was beautiful, so we went hiking almost every single day so that I said we were working out eight to 10 hours a day. It wasn't always in the gym, so we went hiking. I got into yoga and that's actually how I met the love of my life now, David, he was a yoga instructor here in Chicago that I met, so all you ladies that go into those fitness studios and see that cute instructor, it can happen.

KG: Like a fairy tale come true.

DA: But what they also don't show, like I said, it's a lot of the nutrition as well. Many people think we have a chef on the show. That is not the case. We have to cook all of our own food. In the beginning they did bring a nutritionist in to kind of help us. We also had Devin Alexander, who's a great chef out of LA as well. She came in a couple of times just to show us a few things, but really at the end of the day, if they could've shown what we were eating now, sometimes it was very basic and boring because all you have time for is--

KG: Chicken and greens.

DA: Exactly. But she taught us. Things like spaghetti squash pizza casserole, and you know, turkey roll ups. All these different things that you could eat and kind of have variety in your food because you're eating the same thing everyday. Now some people are black and white. They can do that. I'm not. I needed a change, so when I learned how to make sushi out of cucumbers, right?

DA: All these little things that you can still indulge, it's really good food, but it's. It's not. It's not bad for you. Those are the things that I wish they would show in the show because I think I would say you get the size you want to be from what's on your plate. You get the shape you want from the gym.

KG: Oh, that's interesting. I'll remember that. What was your approach to goal setting like before The Biggest Loser and how has it changed since then?

DA: Oh man, before The Biggest Loser, I think I was so lost in the world of what's the right thing to do, right. And I would try so many different things and probably not give it the length that it needed before I was ready to give up and try something else. So before the show, at least when it came to my health and health and fitness, I was always trying to figure out what's the quickest way for me to lose this weight and if I had just taken a step back and realize that weight was something I struggled with my whole life.

DA: So it wasn't something I was going to fix overnight. And that's why like I actually really do appreciate kind of the mindset that Weight Watchers comes from. I think it comes from a good angle, but I was all over the place. I was trying one thing and then jumping to another and then doing this or setting myself up. I kind of call it the Eeyore effect where you set this goal that is just so unattainable. I knew I had well over a hundred pounds to lose, but if I had taken it like five pounds at a time, I probably would've been more successful than realizing, you know, that cloud is following you, that Eeyore cloud, saying a hundred pounds, a hundred pounds, you gotta lose it. And then before you know, losing five pounds at a time, I was actually gaining five pounds at a time. Where after Biggest Loser and especially like I will always, you know, talk about how much Jillian was a big part of, of changing my life.

DA: She really helped me break down goals and finding goals in different ways. You know, at the time it definitely was about a scale. We were weighing, you know, in those cute little outfits on this show in front of millions of people. But she, she helped me find successes outside the scale. So like I said, running became a huge part of why I was doing what I was doing because I felt like the easiest thing you could do is put on a pair of gym shoes and just go. And with that we started to focus on those goals. You know, when I did my very first push up, that was huge for me because I didn't think I could ever do that. I'm like, my butt's too big, my stomach's huge. There's no way I can push up and down a 300 pound body. But actually it wasn't very long until I was able to.

DA: And I was still probably like a good to 60 pounds when I did my first push up. So your weight doesn't define you and being on the show, it helped me choose smaller goals, hit those, find those successes because that's going to launch you into the next goal versus thinking, what's the big picture goal? Let's find the little pictures and make a movie out of it.

KG: I love that. You also mentioned that the group you were with, your other classmates were really impactful in helping everyone work towards that goal rather than be competitive. How did that group mentality and the community support drive you guys all to the finish line of your own stories?

DA: You know what I think it was, I was so grateful for it because at the end of the day we are removed from reality. I know it's called reality tv, but we are taken out. There was no TV, no cell phones, no Internet. You're completely cut off from the outside world. Everything that you knew that was home to you was ripped away and when you met 15 or 14 other strangers, you got to know each other pretty quickly and because we had that support and we were all taken out of our own elements, we were really able to support and I think push each other as well. There was one of the contestants Francelina that was on my show is someone that I'm still very close with to this day and she and I, we, we really bonded in the beginning and so when we wanted to get to the gym a little bit extra earlier and then wanted to stay a little bit later, she was always there. She was a driver. She had a force that just like, it was slightly competitive but in the best way, right?

DA: Because we wanted to outdo each other, but like strengthening each other at the same time, so when we're in that environment, it really helped knowing that you had a support system because in all honesty there were producers, there's film, everything's going on around you. You felt like you had no control. We were the ones that felt like that constant control.

KG: Let's switch gears a little bit and talk more about how your professional goals have changed. So coming off The Biggest Loser as the winner, you have a ton of opportunities. You can really sort of change your life's direction, not just in terms of your physical fitness, but also how you want your professional life to go. Can you talk a little bit about what you wanted to do coming off of that show professionally and how you've worked to achieve that since then, and what goals you've set for yourself in that arena?

DA: Yeah. Not too much prior to the show, I had graduated from Clemson University with a degree in architecture. I was ready to be an architect. I was so excited, but I definitely, I think bit off a little bit more than I could chew. When I was in college. I did a five year program in four years, so when it came to that, I was so burned out, but I did have the opportunity of, you know, right away after college you got to start paying those loans off as soon as possible. So I started waitressing and I ended up working for a great restaurant company that I became very quickly the national trainer and got to travel all over the world, opening up restaurants in London all over the US, which was really great as well, and using my architecture degree to help actually do the floor plans.

DA: They would send me to a new location and I would be the one to draw that up and then also be the one to train a train the entire team. So it was kind of a little bit of a basket in each. And then after that I started to be a working on the marketing team for Camping World and Good Sam, which was a really great opportunity for me to really dive into marketing and graphic design, which I didn't realize how much my architecture degree would really impact that. I'm like, Ooh, I've really love graphic design. So that's where the trajectory was headed when I had the opportunity of Biggest Loser. Now mind you, when you're in the audition phase of Biggest Loser, they make you sign a contract that you're liable for up to $1.5 million if you say anything. So I was terrified, right?

DA: But I did have to tell my boss that what was going on because I had been taking a lot of time off. And then I got to the point where I'm like, I need the next 10 days to six months off is that going to be OK? And my company in Camping World was so supportive of it. They let me do what I had to do and told me I would have a job when I came back and you know, after the show and the confetti fell, you, like you said, I had the world in front of me. So many opportunities, but it actually got almost too overwhelming. You're like, what do I do? What's my next platform and how do I not make this, you know, wasted effort, right? Where can I go? So luckily I met an amazing publicist, Daphne Ortiz, who I still work with today, and she really helped me find goals that I can put my platform before Biggest Loser because I was a good person before Biggest Loser, you know, I was on the trajectory of really making some, I think impactful things and when I got the chance to work with Girls on the Run and specifically Planet Fitness at this point, I've actually helped open over 200 gyms across the country and even at the lowest end of maybe, you know, working out with 30 to 40 people, multiply that by 200 and I've had the opportunity to impact thousands of people.

DA: And in doing that I knew that's what I wanted to do and it's only been the last couple of years that those two things kind of came together for me. They allowed me to take my creative direction with graphic design and marketing and merge that into an opportunity to help more people. At the end of the day, like I said before, Biggest Loser, I was so overwhelmed by what's the right decision, what's the path that I need to do to lose weight or to get healthier or--not everyone has to lose weight. They just want. They want to feel better. I always say there's something called skinny fat too, it doesn't--you don't have to look a certain way not to be healthy and what I think Planet Fitness affords people to do, especially like I said, it's only 10 bucks a month and I'm not trying to sell here. I'm just saying it's so affordable for you to do that it just gets you the step in the right direction and whether it's, you know, Weight Watchers or South Beach Diet or all these different things that are over, you know that you can choose from. Pick one thing and that's what I think Planet Fitness helps you do. Pick one thing, let that settle and then find your next ambition instead of being overwhelmed by all these opportunities that you could do. And I think I very long windedly just said that like, you know, over the last five years it's been a great, great run on March 18th is actually exactly five years since the confetti fell. So I'm really excited to cross that finish line and see what else I can do.

KG: You mentioned that planet fitness was the sponsoring gym for The Biggest Loser and here in Chicago you don't necessarily see a lot of people gravitating towards big box gyms. There's a lot of studios. How have you seen the balance of studios versus gyms play out in terms of, are people heading more towards these big box gyms that were recently out of trend? Are they stepping away from the more expensive classes for the more affordable? How have you guys seen that reflected in Planet Fitness's popularity or their representation here in Chicago?

DA: I actually welcome studio fitness to the areas because I think studio like select fitness can go really, really well with the big box gyms. The problem with that is how do you afford both. And I think Planet Fitness gives you that great alternative. Like I said, it's only $10 a month, so you can still go to that boutique studio. We actually have one in Lincoln Park, SoulCycle is one of my favorite studios to go to right on Clybourn over there, but even though I go to a boutique studio, I go to Planet Fitness as well because I can choose anything there, right? There's a big open platform and you know here in Chicago we're expanding tremendously. We just did our big grand opening at Broadway and Addison, kind of an iconic area of Chicago near Wrigley and we're doing really, really well there. We're headed to Crestwood and a few other neighborhoods in Chicago as well, just expanding, so I hope that shows that, you know, Planet Fitness is doing pretty well in the world of boutique fitness and I think they go hand in hand together for 10 bucks a month. You can still afford to do those boutique fitness, or ClassPass is a great opportunity for it as well.

KG: Let's go into the second big question that we ask everyone who comes on the podcast, and you've kind of touched on this a couple of times, but we'll make it explicit. What is a big goal you have in the future and how do you plan to reach it?

DA: Oh, man in the future, I definitely, I mean, I think I'm making my footprint here with Planet Fitness, especially in Chicago and across North America and as we expand into Canada as well, but what I really want to make sure I do is keep my platform of I'm the girl from Mundelein, Illinois and though I appreciate being here to help be a spokesperson. I still want to always stay that real person that was able to get her life changed. Whether it's weight or finances. We all have our problems, right? If I could help be that advocate that you can do it, that's my biggest goal. It's not a personal goal. That's, you know, maybe a little geared towards, uh, you know, selfish ambitions. It's really there to help as many people as I can and be real about it. By no means have I ever said I've kept the same weight from when I lost the show.

DA: I've always been very real and honest that it's been a struggle in every day you make a decision and if I can help other people see that as well, that'd be a great goal. But, and you know, on a personal level, the more I can travel, the more I can impact, but honestly just see beautiful places, something I've done in the past as well as with Run Like a Girl, which is different than girls on the run. I did host a yoga retreat in Costa Rica so that twice. So that was amazing. So being able to like just see the cultural differences that we have across the world. I would love to just travel more and more and see new places and show people that health and wellness is not just about the food on your plate and the exercise you do. It's about discovering new places and discovering different things that you and your body can do once you hit those goals.

KG: That leads in perfectly to another question I had for you. On aSweatLife, we try and show our readers different ways to live their best lives possible. What does that look like for you?

DA: Oh, that's a loaded question. Um, you know, I think at the end of the day, you live your best life possible when you can sit down at the end of the day and say, I did one thing right. I think we get so consumed by all the things that we should have done that we didn't get to or you know, you started your day with a list and you got through the first three things when 10 more things got added. But if you could at the end of the day, just take a deep breath and look at what you did well, that's going to help advance you into the next step or the next day or on the next hour, whether whatever's getting you to that next step.

DA: And I think that will really help. That's what I tried it. It's not perfect, right? It's idealistic, but at the end of the day I keep a journal and I always write three things down that I did well that day because I think that shows me that I'm making progress. You always get bogged down, like I said, by the negativity or the things you wish you could've done or the supposed to bes, you don't see my air quotes on the "supposed to bes"

KG: She's doing air quotes, you guys.

DA: It's about you know, seeing what you did right? Because everyone is. It sounds silly, but everyone is amazing in their own unique way and if you could remember that and be reminded and a month later, look at that journal that you wrote down to the three things every single day. That's 90 things that you did well and it hopefully will make you feel better about the person that you are and what you can bring to this world.

KG: I love that as a twist on a gratitude journal because that's something that we hear recommended a lot and we hear a lot of our high achievers talking about how important gratitude is as a part of their life and of course still is very important, but I love the like self props that you get by listing things that you did well because I think a lot of people suffer from a minor case of imposter syndrome and comparing themselves to others and that's such a tangible way to have a record of yes, I am just as great as everyone thinks I am. I'm not fooling anybody. I'm not faking anything.

DA: Absolutely. And I think you brought up to the point like authenticity is key and it's really hard to feel like you're an authentic person when you're trying to figure out who you are. You're like, what is my mold?

DA: And I think that was a thing, a struggle that I had with the show is like how am I Dani Allen, Biggest Loser and how am I just Danni? Right? And how do I, you know, eat a cupcake from Sprinkles down the street and not feel the most guilty about it because honestly that's happened to me before someone takes a picture and posts it on Instagram is like, well, look at Danny eating a cupcake and I'm just like, I'm the most terrible person. I'm supposed to tell people to eat healthy. But you know, every once in a while eat a damn cupcake. It's OK. And so that's where I, I try to find the balance of authenticity of who I am and also know that I'm going to screw up and make mistakes too. And I think you honestly, you learn more when you fall.

KG: I love that. I think we can end on that note. Danni, thank you so much for coming in to the #WeGotGoals podcast today.

DA: Thank you. And it's been a lot of fun. And to meet you guys as well.

CK: This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzm. And it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe on Apple podcasts, stitcher, overcast, wherever you get your podcasts, and if you could also leave us a rating or review on apple podcasts, we would really appreciate it. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Danny Allen to Texas for the recording studio.

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Note: This episode contains explicit language

Prior to having Michelle Davis and Matt Holloway, creators of New York Times Best Selling cook books, Thug Kitchen, on our podcast, I wanted to know, "Do they curse as much in real life as they do as a brand?" The answer was - not surprisingly (and yet still delightfully) - of course.

This episode of #WeGotGoals is marked E for explicit, and in it we dove into the "why" behind the profane language.

As lighthearted and fun Davis and Holloway are to chat it up with, they mean serious business when talking about eating healthy and taking care of yourself.

"Take that shit f&$!#% seriously," Holloway said. "We want to grab the audience and shake the s#$ out of them and say, 'Eat a f*&$!#% salad, I'm worried about you!'"

Davis interjected, "The swearing levels the playing field." She emphasized that you don't have to change who you are or completely change your life if you pick up healthier and smarter eating habits.

In creating The Official Cookbook, Party Grub and 101 Fast as Fuck (I know we have a strict one-swear-word-per-post policy on aSweatLife.com, but these two make it impossible when the title of their Best Sellers also happen to be curse words) Holloway and Davis became leaders in the world of eating for your health on social media and IRL.

But that's not what they initially set out to do. In fact, before the Thug Kitchen brand, the two were posting to a Tumblr page for fun, with no idea who, if anyone, was reading.

"A big reason our blog went viral was because Gwyneth Paltrow talked about it on The Rachael Ray Show," Holloway said. "We don't have any connections with either of them, but that was like a boom in traffic for us."

But the reason Paltrow probably took notice, Davis notes, is because they were already doing the "unsexy work" and were committed to it.

Her advice to goal setters looking to achieve big things?

"Work as hard as you can and perform at the highest level you can regardless of who's looking because when they crack that door open for you just a little bit, you can be ready to shove your f*&$!#% foot in and make the most of it."

Based on the nature of their content and lack of censoring on the regular, I wasn't surprised but I still appreciated how refreshingly truthful, open and honest these founders were about the ups, downs and lessons learned over the past few years during their Thug Kitchen journey.

From the outside, when we see people achieve amazing things, we see what they have. Davis pointed out, though, that she learned going after what she wants means other things in life have to give.

She begged the question, "What are you willing to give up in your life that you also love to get what you want?"

She added, "You have to be willing to not be caught up on Game of Thrones and to not be able to go on dates and to not see people as much as you want to because you are pursuing this dream. It's not always adding stuff to your life, sometimes it's taking away."

But for these two, the give and take has been worth it. From the recipes in the best selling cook books to the Forked Up podcast, to the direct messages you'll receive on Instagram, all things Thug Kitchen come directly from the dynamic duo. Davis creates the plant-based recipes, Holloway photographs them, and the two together are in charge of the bluntly witty brand voice that stands out among any other plant-based cook books and blogs, making this company so unique.

And based on their goals for the future, I don't think they'll be going anywhere anytime soon.

This episode is presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code “GOALS” to get 5 percent off until March 15.

If you like what you hear, subscribe where ever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

Transcript:

JAC: Hi there, it's Jeana Anderson Cohen from aSweatLife.com. We're going to get to the high achievers in just a minute, but first we want to tell you about something we're doing over at aSweatLife.com, Until April 9th, we’re running a kickstarter, so if you or anyone you know has ever been impacted by any of the work we do at aSweatLife.com, whether it's the podcast that you're about to listen to here, the ambassadorship, or the content we create on a daily basis, or even the events that we host here in Chicago and across the country. We’d love for you to help us fund the growth of our ambassador program, helping women set and achieve big, hairy audacious goals. So if you'd like to contribute, check the show notes for this episode or aSweatLife.com and you'll find a link to fund our campaign. Thanks so much. Here's the episode.

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatlife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Kristen Geil and Maggie Umberger.

MU: Morning, Jeana.

KG: Hi, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning. This week, Maggie, you talked to Michelle and Matt from Thug Kitchen—and for our listeners at home, be sure you take your kids out of earshot. There will be swearing in this episode.

MU: Yes, I did speak to the founders of Thug Kitchen, Matt Holloway and Michelle Davis. I was fortunate enough to get to hear a little bit about the behind the scenes of Thug Kitchen, how it came to be and how these two have created an incredible brand, multiple best seller cookbooks and now a podcast called Forked Up.

JAC: So what's interesting and has always been sort of a part of the brand is that they sort of use swear words to punctuate their language in different and interesting ways. It’s their way of sort of staying authentic. We have a policy on how we use swear words at aSweatLife, it’s one swear per post, but they clearly adhere to a different policy. Maggie, do you care to elaborate?

MU: Yeah, so I even asked them, you know, why swear what's the, the need to do it and for them it, it isn't necessarily a distinct desire to swear. It's just the response to being a little bit more frank about what their business is. It's a cookbook, it started out as a tumblr page and then became this best selling cookbook, Thug Kitchen, but they use swearing to cut through the clutter of beautiful photography that is just fluffy language and they saw good food on the pages, but they didn't relate to the words behind how it was portrayed and so being very candid with their audience about how they view the importance of cooking good food to be healthy and to take it very seriously, but it is just that. It's just the importance that it is and and because they developed this brand that is so honest and open, they're running with it and people are loving it to the point where all of their growth through social media has been organic because they can't promote their posts on Facebook because they're explicit, but they've chosen to go that route, to be authentic to who they are and to trust that their audience is going to respond the way they're going to respond and follow them or not follow them and they're cool with it.

KG: You mentioned their Tumblr page just now and they had a stroke of luck when celebrities like Gwyneth Paltrow and Rachel Ray noticed their hard work and promoted it themselves because they thought it was something authentically cool. How does this tie in to how they view goal setting?

MU: The more we talked about goals, the more I could tell they were lighting up about talking about them and about their experience with going through the journey of starting a page for fun, not really thinking anything would come of it and then they were putting in a lot of hard work and that's when they got noticed by Gwyneth Paltrow and that was part of their. their points that they made to me as advice to other go-getters and people who were setting goals for themselves, is to know that you're going to work hard and to put in that hard work when no one's looking because you never know when someone is going to be looking and then you have to be ready when they are looking so that you can take flight and run with it and that's really what they've done from cookbook to cookbook and now to podcast. They are very much in the weeds, working day in and day out to produce everything that you see through the Thug kitchen brand.

JAC: And here's Maggie with Michelle and Matt.

MU: Awesome. So I'm here today with Michelle Davis and Matt Holloway, the authors and creators of Thug Kitchen. Thank you guys so much for joining me.

MH: It's great to be here; thanks for having us.

MD: Yeah, we’re stoked, thank you.

MU: And it's really fun too, because this conversation is about setting goals and I get to talk to both of you as individuals and as the co-creators of a brand that some people don't even know who created, but we get to, I get to hear the backstory and a little bit of the behind the scenes from Thug Kitchen, which I'm really excited about. So before all of the Thug Kitchen craziness, before the official cookbook and Party Grub and 101, Fast as Fuck, which there we go, now we're explicit. Um, I would love to hear sort of a day in the life of how did you spend your days before thug kitchen?

MD: I worked full time at a grocery store. And so that was legit all I did, like anyone who works in retail knows you don't really have set hours, they change your schedule all the time. So it felt like I lived at the grocery store and then if I wasn't working I was cooking dinner for myself, for myself and Matt, and just trying to figure out what the hell I was going to do with my life because I had been there for eight years.

MH: I was a production assistant, so essentially fetching meals for executives. I would have to arrange travel, it was just sort of like …

MD: Lots of diet coke and coffee runs.

MH: A production week—anybody who's in entertainment understands it like it's a least a 12 hour day. So you know, my, my work week was like 60, 70 hours, like every week.

MD: For like a lovely, like, what? $12 an hour? Like what were you making?

MH: I wasn’t making any money, I was broke as shit.

MD: Same thing with me. I was making at most $12 an hour at the grocery store so.

MH: So we were broke as fuck and Michelle was trying to get me to cook more on my days off and I'm like yo, I just want to sit on the couch like I don't want to cook. Like, so I get that immediate sort of like knee jerk response and be like now's me time and I don't want to cook. And I was having to like battle that as Michelle was like, dude, you should learn how to cook and like take care of yourself.

MD: It’s an important part of being a full fledged grown-up.

MH: Yeah. And she was being very encouraging with that and I was trying to, I was looking at everything, I was looking at cook books. I was looking at other websites and YouTube videos and I don't know, we just, when Michelle and I got in the kitchen together and start cooking and doing photos. Like I was just like, I don't, I don't fucking identify with these people who, you know, wrote this cookbook and they live in Malibu and have all the fucking time in the world to source their ingredients

MD: And all the money.

MH: Yeah, and all the money. It's like they take, they take literally half a day to cook lunch.

MD: hat obviously wasn't our fucking lifestyle. And so we created Thug Kitchen, because that's what we wanted to read and thought it was like a fun thing to do when we happened to have the same days off together.

MH: It was a very selfish endeavor.

MD: Yeah. But it wasn't even like we, we didn't think anything was gonna happen of it. I mean it was a tumblr account.

MH: Yeah, I mean we didn’t—it was just food memes. And we were just trying to encourage people to eat more vegetables and describing why they should eat those vegetables and like, you know, the health benefits that go along with adding this to a dish and it just fucking blew up. And like we're like, oh dude, like what does this mean? And we got, we got like some national press and then we got a book deal and we didn't even, even when we got the book deal, we didn't think was going to perform well. So Michelle and I like to sort of a hiatus from our day jobs.

MD: Yeah, we didn't burn any bridges.

MH: No, we were so ready to go back to our jobs because we're like, well it will be that thing. Where we were like, hey remember that time that we wrote a cookbook?

MD: That was so weird!

MH: But it sold like gangbusters

MD: And here we are.

MH: And we're very fortunate for it.

MU: I can totally identify with the not relating to the beautiful Instagram-worthy photos of the food, even when I cook it and it tastes fine, it's never like gorgeous and I'm definitely not going to spend time to plate it and take a photo of it before I eat it. But I also like, I don't really know how to cook that well. It sounds to me like you guys sort of, you were teaching ourselves how to cook as you were going through this process of building the tumblr and or did you have like a—

MD: I'm the cook. Yeah. I've always known how to cook; I’ve been cooking since I was a kid. It's always been like a hobby of mine. Also a way for me to eat, so. Because I’ve always been broke so I've always had to cook my own food.

MH: And I’ve just been like the echo of a thousand excuses.

MD: So it's more like I was teaching Matt how to cook through the process.

MH: And all the fucking tropes that people are used to telling themselves like, oh well I can't cook because you know, I don't have time to grocery shop. Like isn't eating healthy super expensive or like, so I was like, I was the embodiment of all those things and Michelle just kept nudging me and nudging me and yeah, I just, after awhile it was like, man, that is just a bunch of bullshit.

MD: And so we put it in the book.

MU: And then it became an explicit cookbook. Partially. I mean why, why the explicit cookbook? I get the, the idea to do it very simplistically, but then to just go all out with it. I love it. Walk me through why.

MH: Yeah, we wanted to be really aggro with like the, the tone because like, I mean we uh, we, we say this all the time, but like eating healthy and taking care of yourself and cooking a meal for yourself, like take that shit fucking seriously and we, we want to grab the audience and like shake the shit out of them and be like, eat a fucking salad, like I'm worried about you.

MD: But also it shows that you don't have to be like, I feel like eating healthy and the idea of eating like a plant based diet, people think they have to be a totally different kind of person from who they are now. And I think the swearing really levels the playing field and like let you in, like—we’re not taking this shit super seriously. You don't need to take yourself super seriously

MH: You can have some fun with it. Yeah. I feel like I was reading everyone else's cookbooks in like a hushed NPR tone, you know what I mean?

MD: That's not how we talk to each other, that’s not how we talked to our friends growing up, that's certainly not how we talk in the kitchen, especially when we fucking burn ourselves.

MH: Like, yeah, Michelle's from the Bay and I'm from Houston, like the, these, these sort of like Malibu cookbooks are not like reflective of us

MD: Or anyone we know.

MU: Yeah. I mean and, and now you have best sellers on your hands, which is incredible. So I love it.

MD: It feels very surreal.

MU: Was there a moment that you realized we're onto something, people people really love this or is it just that, that process of going from getting the book deal to it catching on fire.

MH: I mean Michelle might think differently, but I still to this day I don't know what the fuck we're doing.

MD: Yeah. Every time you know, a new book comes out or honestly anytime we post anything, I'm fucking delighted that anyone gives a shit. Like, every single time. I don't think. I mean, you know, just recently, last October we found out we've sold more than a million books in the US, but still when I meet someone and they've heard of the book, I kind of can't believe it.

MH: I don't know, I guess in those moments that we see as sort of exists in the real world that, you know, it's not just me and Michelle in the office trying to crank out food puns and jokes like, yeah, like I was in Houston just a few weeks ago and a woman came up to me and asked to take a selfie with me and that fucking blew my mind. And then she talked about how she was like, she's not vegan, but she eats more vegetables because of our book and everything like that. It's like in those moments, that's when it's like, Oh wow, this is like a, this is like a thing. I mean, most of the time it's just, I feel like we're just kind of writing jokes in the ether.

MD: Yeah. Just putting them on the Internet and just like, we’ll see what happens.

MU: I love it. And then you launched a podcast? Yeah, that was kind of, that's actually been a really big goal of ours. Our last book came out October 2016 and we wanted to kind of diversify how we interact with people and kind of try to find new mediums to further our message, but we kind of couldn't figure out a good way to make that work. You know, we really didn't have time when we were writing, we wrote three books in three years. Matt does all the photography. I do all the cooking. We write all the jokes together, like we couldn't really brainstorm for future endeavors while we were doing that. And so we really took the last year to kind of figure out how we could interact with people and, and give a bigger platform to some of our opinions in the food space. And we finally got to realize that with the podcast.

MU: So. So yeah, that's a huge goal and I think that what's something that's really cool that you were talking about is that it, it does open up the conversation about something a lot more than just food. Even though you could talk about food forever and I would love it, but you, you talk about politics and you talk about pop culture and so talk to me a little bit about how, how you want to keep sharing your viewpoints and those different endeavors in your life. Like through the podcast.

MH: Maybe it's just me, but I feel like a lot of podcasts are sort of … I, I enjoy podcasts are very conversational and I like to maybe think of what other people were sort of like, you know, their point of view and that's, that's kind of what, I mean I'm aiming to do with the podcast is that we want to have conversations with people. And food is an anger, you know, it unifies all of us.

MD: Yeah. It's like it's a really good inroad into a lot of different things

MH: and it, and it weaves through everything, like you said, from like politics and pop culture and like we just want to have like constructive conversations with people who are in these spaces and just use food as that anchor.

MD: Yeah. And I think that we want to keep bringing our different viewpoint to these conversations, the food, because I think a lot of people who are kind of the tastemakers and the big top line food writers and all that stuff kind of come from a homogenous background and you know, being the kind of kids who grew up with, you know, frozen dinners and living on a budget and buying cereal in bags like we, we want to bring that perspective to this conversation about food and healthy eating that we don't think gets a lot of representation.

MH: Yeah, I mean I'm just tired of seeing the same fucking 10 people in the food space.

MD: And everyone just talking about turmeric.

MH: Yeah, just talking about the same shit. Michelle's right. There's, there's a lot of different perspectives and backgrounds out there and we want to have those conversations so that the audience is like, yeah, identify with that.

MD: We want to, you know, kind of shine the spotlight on those people and also kind of vocalize that stuff ourselves.

CK: So we’ll get back to Maggie, Matt and Michelle in just a minute. But first we want to thank our sponsors this week, Chicago sports and Social Club. With them, it’s more than a game it's a social sports experience. Whatever your personal goals are, big or small, Chicago Sport and Social Club that can list many reasons why you should play. It could be the sand between your toes, or meeting people and moving your social life outside for a season. Whatever your goals are or your reasons for playing, Chicago Sport and Social Club has a beach volleyball league for you. Go to www.chicagosocial.com and use code GOALS, that’s G-O-A-L-S when you register to get five percent off

MU: When—if we take a step back and I hear what you say about you had to spend the first three years just really like making those cookbooks, spending that time and now you get to diversify and talk to more people and talk about different things. And it seems like that's sort of the way that you set goals is based off of what you see in front of you, what you can accomplish, and then going forth with enthusiasm and passion, is what I see. Talk to me a little bit about just your perspective on maybe how goals have shifted or how you think about goals now that you have multiple platforms, multiple cookbooks under your belt.

MD: I think something we always keep in mind as we're moving forward is, are we creating content or a product that we ourselves would consume?

MH: I wouldn't dare anyone spend $16 on a cookbook that I wouldn't buy myself.

MD: Yeah. And so that is always been one of the guiding principles as we set goals moving forward is would we want this? Like as just regular fucking people, would we be interested in this? Would we feel comfortable, you know, spending our hard earned money on something like this? Are we presenting quality or are we just trying to like toot our own fucking horn? And that has really helped us kind of knock away opportunities that have come our way that really didn't serve us.

MH: Oh there's been a lot of nonsense that’s come our way, with opportunities for like TV shows and shit and we're just like, no, like we're gonna, we're gonna do a book and we want to do, I'd rather do a good job on one thing than a mediocre job on three things. You know what I mean?

MD: Yeah, and something that I would be embarrassed to be a part of just to do it for the money. Like we, we really have let that idea of us as consumers of our own product push us forward and help us find kind of the right path.

MU: Yeah, your true north.

MD: Yeah, exactly.

MU: So where does the kitchen go from here?

MD: You know, we want to keep, you know, normalizing plant based dining.

MH: Yeah, I mean I would say that a big goal of ours going forward like is just giving plant based options in as many restaurants as possible. Nothing drives me more fucking crazy than going to a restaurant and I see six or seven gluten free options and like the only plant based options is a fucking salad.

MD: Or a hummus plate.

MH: So like yeah, we just want to normalize plant-based options in the eating space.

MD: And in all the eating spaces, you know, we, we do that for people eating at home and we also want to make it more available to people who are dining out too.

MH: Yeah. Most of our audience, they're omnivores and they want to eat more plant based dishes. They just don't know how. So yeah, a big goal of ours is to continue to normalize that just in the food space in general.

MD: So, yo know, working with restaurants, helping them develop menu items that are delicious that anybody would order regardless of their dietary preferences. That just happened to be vegan and ideally one day opening our own space.

MU: I was going to say, that sounds super intriguing. I think even just to be able to define what is plant based because we slap labels on so many things now where I don't even know what gluten-free really means. I don't even know, you know, people are semi plant based or like vegans on the weekends or like whatever it is. It's I feel like there's just so much room to clarify what's out there.

MD: Yeah, absolutely. Clarify and hone and also just show that you know, it's good food that happens to be vegan. It's good food that happens to be plant-based, it’s not a different kind of food.

MU: Right. In your cookbooks, do you have a favorite recipe?

MH: Spaghetti pie! Hands down, that's one of my favorites. Is is great because not only does it tastes fucking amazing because it does, but like it's a great party trick. People fucking lose their minds over spaghetti pie.

MD: Yeah. That's our third book, but for me, I love the spaghetti pie. It’s like choosing a baby. I like the Tex-Mex queso in our third book a lot too and I have a really special place in my heart for the chickpea dumpling soup that is in our first book. That was my take on my Nana's recipe of chicken and dumplings. I made it a fuck ton more healthy and threw in a ton more vegetables because hers was just like gray and white chicken and just like gray—it was not visually appealing.

MH: No, you're right. That's that soup is something that I have served my family and friends who are not vegan and they're like, there is no better than this? I'm like, there’s none, none whatsoever.

MD: Yeah. It's really hearty and super comfort food

MH: It’s like velvety.

MD: Yeah, it's. Yeah, that is a. That one has a really special place in my heart.

MU: Oh my gosh. I have to make this, it sounds so good.

MD: And the recipe makes a fuck ton.

MH: Yeah, every I give someone that recipe. They're like, oh, you know, it takes like a couple of hours to make.

MD: It doesn’t really.

MH: I’m like, yeah, but did you have soup for the rest of the week? Yeah.

MD: If you're terrible at chopping stuff, it's going to take you a minute.

MH: It’s worth it, it’s so worth it. That's a good recipe.

MU: Duly noted. Page marked. So I'm, I'm interested in knowing since you talked a little bit about how people aren't always sure like where, what the, the world of vegan dining is or where you can you go to get simple good food as one obstacle. Maybe as far as your journey has been so far, another obstacle along the way that maybe has tried to hinder you in attaining any of your goals? Have you encountered anything like that?

MD: Um, yeah, I would say actually our swearing, while I think it's brought a ton of people to the audience, sometimes has hindered us in growing our audience. Like we can't promote any posts on any social media accounts. So all of our growth on any account you see has all been organic all through peer to peer sharing because we can’t advertise.

MH: Yeah, we didn't find that out until like we were trying to um, advertise the first cookbook. And what was it like facebook, instagram, twitter, like all the social media platforms flagged us for language.

MD: So even if we write a clean post, we can’t boost it.

MH: There’s nothing we can do. So, we, that just like we were like, all right, well fuck, I guess people will just buy the book.

MD: You know, it really puts us at the mercy of our audience to share it with new people.

MU: That is really fascinating. I know from being on the media side of things that that is true and that can be a huge, huge hindrance.

MD: Yeah. But you know, luckily we have a really passionate and vocal fan base and so they’ve really stepped up and this shared it with people. I don't even think we've ever told them we can't advertise, but they, they're always tagging new friends and you know, sharing our posts with people and really that's what's made us survive as a business and we're so fucking grateful for it.

MH: I mean it's, it's, you know, it's helps when we have a fucking book come out, but like going out and meeting people and speaking and like, like connecting with our audience like that. And that's why like with the podcast we can like, you know, we tell people on twitter like, hey, you got somebody or something. You want us to talk about fucking Tweet us, let us know. And that dialogue and that, that communication we have with our audiences has been so key to our survival.

MU: And you guys together, you talked about it already, Michelle, you, you do everything yourselves together. You write the jokes, you do the photos, you create the recipes. How does your partnership help you guys go forward and keep chugging along and building this brand?

MD: Yeah, sure. I mean I can't imagine doing this by myself. It's so great to have a sounding board and a different perspective, you know, we don't always agree but 95 percent of the time on our plans for moving forward like I'll vocalize something, and Matt’s like, I was thinking that same shit. And so it's really great to have that built in support and also this has been a weird couple of years for us and you know like this wasn't necessarily what we planned for ourselves to get to do all of this. So it's great to have somebody to talk to you that completely understands what you're going through and so it really helps keep the business anchored in reality and we just, we are each other's cheerleaders and taskmasters and I'm really grateful for it. Yeah. And we're, I mean we're still totally involved in every facet. Like if Thug Kitchen likes your post on Instagram or Twitter or anything, I mean, that’s us. Like we don't have anybody else. So you know, we know we get retweeted on our twitter account and somebody writes something funny like that's probably Matt. And like if someone's liking your photos on Onstagram and we repost it like that's me.

MH: Yeah, we want to not like, it feels weird to hire someone to handle social media.

MD: But it also goes back to that interaction with our audience that’s so important. Like we want to see what recipes people are responding to, to what jokes people think are funny and the only way for us really do that is to be in the fucking weeds with everybody.

MU: And if you had some advice to give to either friends or significant others that wanted to launch a business or start something together as a partnership, what kind of advice would you give to them?

MH: Don't. Don't do it.

MD: I would say if you're in a romantic partnership, be willing to lose the romantic part of that partnership. If that's what this business idea of yours or whatever it is is that important to you. You really do have to prioritize what you want from that person and have realistic goals because it is really hard to work so close to someone and to be like, you know—we talk business 24-7 with each other. So it's, it's hard to then have space for whatever your personal relationship is and so you guys need to be upfront and honest with your expectations and what you want and I'm just always be super transparent with each other.

MH: Yeah, I think that there—I was joking earlier. I think people should absolutely, if you've got an idea fucking chase it, like and if you got someone you care about like do it with that person because you trust them.

MD: Yeah, trust is the partner is probably the most important.

MH: But like just make sure that you care about it as much today as you do in two years or if things go great or if things don't go great, like you have to care about it and if that's what you want to do then fucking chase it. But I think that with Michelle and I specifically a lot of people, because Michelle and I get along so well and everything, I think that when we've talked about dating in the past, like Michelle and I separated before the first book came out.

MD: Yeah, we weren't romantically dating before the first book came out.

MH: Yeah. And you just have to, like Michelle was saying, it's just like you have to trust that person and you got to care about what you're doing.

MD: And you might have to make a choice.

MH: Yeah, you might have to pick that your project is priority over, you know, your love life and you have to be OK with that. Otherwise don't do it.

MD: Yeah. There's a good quote I heard from, I can't remember who now, but it was like, you know, if you have this dream or this goal, like what are you willing to give up in your life that you also love to get what you want because it's not always going to be like, oh, now I have all of these things that I’ve always wanted. It's like, no, you have to give up things you also love. You have to be willing to not be caught up on Game of Thrones and to not be able to go on dates and to um, you know, kind of maybe not see people as much as you want to because you are pursuing this dream. Like it's not always just adding stuff to your life. Sometimes it's having to take stuff away.

MU: It can take you to places that you didn't foresee. Like you say, you didn't think that in the last couple years would be as they are and here you are. So if you have maybe one last piece of advice for others that are, that are going after a goal and they're not really where they're going to end up. How do you navigate some of those dark spaces?

MH: Just be ready to power through the valleys. You know it's going to be peaks and valleys and you can't have any ups without any downs and when, when you have the downs, like just power through it and just keep going like that.

MD: And you also don't know who is reading your stuff. So work as hard as you can and perform at the highest level you can regardless of who's looking. Because when they crack that door open for you just a little bit, you can be ready to shove your fucking foot in and make the most of it. Because if you're not doing the work when no one's looking, it's going to be really hard to keep doing it when everybody's fucking looking.

MH: A big reason that our blog went viral is because Gwyneth Paltrow talked about it on the Rachael Ray show, we don't have any fucking connections with either of them, but like that was like a boom in traffic for us and if you had told me to write like Gwyneth Paltrow, Rachel Ray were reading it, I would stop posting immediately and probably go back and like edit all the posts. Like they were all riddled with typos and shit and the photography was like whatever.

MD: We were ready when someone said jump, we were fucking ready. And so it's about doing the work, putting in the hours during the un-sexy stuff of just doing the ground work for when that peak comes for you.

MU: That's awesome advice for whatever goal you're going after, whether it's a new business or just doing your job well.

MD: Yeah, exactly. Just do it for this sake of like accomplishing something that makes you feel proud about yourself because you can't always control what people's reactions to you and you can't control who's looking at your project, so you really want to just be able to be satisfied with the product yourself. So always perform as best you can regardless of who's patting you on the back or not.

MU: Absolutely. So people can find you on the apple podcast for Forked Up. They can find you throughout social media. It's you.

MD: It’s us, we’re just @ThugKitchen, we've never over-thought any of our tags.

MU: And they can get any of your books through your website or through Amazon.

MD: Yeah. Through, um, Amazon, Barnes and noble. Anywhere books are sold.

MU: Amazing. Thank you guys so much for joining me.

MD: Thanks for having us. We really appreciated it.

MH: This has been fun. Thanks for having us.

CK: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma and it's another thing that's better with friends, so please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and if you could also leave us a rating and a review in Apple Podcasts, we will be so grateful. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guests this week, Michelle Davis and Matt Holloway; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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By now, runner, author, and activist Kathrine Switzer has logged countless miles. Most famously, she completed 26.2 as the first official female in the Boston Marathon, in 1967. The stunning photos of race director Jock Semple nearly pulling her off the course made history and cemented her life’s purpose of empowering women.

But like any others, her journey started with a single mile—one she’d run, on repeat, at her dad’s suggestion beginning when she was 12. He told her it would improve her performance on the field hockey team. Ultimately, it transformed her life.

“Every day I felt like I had a secret weapon, a magic that nobody could take away from me,” she said. “It was just amazing to have that under my belt. So by the time I was 19 and training for the Boston Marathon, I felt like I could do anything.”

Switzer’s goal of sharing that power brought her to Chicago earlier this month to speak at a fundraising luncheon for the Midtown Educational Foundation (MEF). At the MEF’s Metro Achievement Center for Girls, Switzer explained to #WeGotGoals the immediate connection she felt to the organization, a message she’d echo at the luncheon later that day.

Just like her father and her school hockey team gave her the opportunity to navigate the challenges of teenage and young adult life with confidence, MEF’s mentoring programs support low-income students in Chicago in achieving their potential. “Nobody understands what they can do unless they have those opportunities,” she said.

Switzer’s pioneering Boston run was only the first of many incredible goals. From there, she aimed both to improve her own running performance—she eventually ran a time of 2:51:37 and won the New York City Marathon in 1974—and also to help bring the women’s marathon to the Olympics. That, she did by partnering with corporations like Avon to start women’s marathons around the world, until the International Olympic Committee had no choice but to say yes, in 1984.

“I felt that if we could do that, we could level the playing field completely, and in many ways we did,” she said. “When that happened, I said—that’s it.”

But as long as injustice persisted, Switzer couldn’t sit out the next revolution. As she approached 70, she started receiving messages from women wearing her original Boston bib number, 261, saying it made them feel fearless. “When people started sending me pictures of their tattoos, I realized I had to do something with it,” she said. “It was more than kind of synchronicity.”

So, she and her colleagues launched a non-profit called 261 Fearless, which unites women around the world with the opportunities running brings. Each goal they achieve on the road or trail, each fellow athlete they meet, inspires confidence and a sense of accomplishment that carries over throughout their lives.

“It’s like, I’m going to take you by the hand and we’re going to put one foot in front of the other, we’re going to walk, to run. We’re going to forget all the junk that went on during our day and our week and our lives just for an hour, and you’re going to find your fearless.”

As a young runner, she set out to prove that women could handle long distances. Now, she’s motivated more by a sense of responsibility to the next generation. She still runs at a high level—an endeavor that energizes rather than depletes her. Last year, she ran the Boston Marathon again, 50 years after her first time.

“When I crossed that finish line, what I felt like I had done is pass the torch to the next 50 years. It was a great feeling,” she said. “There were with me 125 women who ran in Boston and who raised substantial money for the global launch of 261 Fearless, who are full of passion. And I said, you know what, it’s in good hands.”

Not that Switzer’s retiring anytime soon. Listen to this week’s episode to hear more about her future goals—which involve, yes, more running, along with another book—her perspective on why running matters more than ever in this particular social moment, and why she hopes people will support (or start) organizations like MEF in their communities.

This episode is presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code “GOALS” to get 5 percent off until March 15.

And if you like what you hear, subscribe where ever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts. Also, join the Kickstarter to support the aSweatLife.com movement.

Transcript:

JAC: 00:16 Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com, on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen. With me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger.

MU: 00:16 Good morning, Jeana.

CK: 00:29 Morning, Jeana. This is Cindy. Maggie and Jeana, you guys have some pretty exciting stuff happening at aSweatLife this week, right?

JAC: 00:31 We sure do. We launched a Kickstarter this month. Our goal is to raise $20,000 with the help of anyone who's ever benefited from anything that aSweatLife does, from the podcast to the ambassadorship to the events, to the content. We're relying on people who like us the way that we like them to help fund growth projects. We're working on expanding our ambassadorship, which helps incredible women here in Chicago right now, set and achieve big goals and support each other along the way and we've seen such magic happen, right Maggie?

CK: 01:07 So much. I mean, the past year of getting to know all of our ambassadors really well and get to see them actually accomplish goals. We did a little bit of a survey to ask people what have you actually accomplished and would like to share with us. And we were really overwhelmed with how many people said like, I finished this degree. I've been accepted into this program. I have written a book, I have, you know, bought a condo. None of them necessarily like fitness goals. Although those are always peppered in with the things that we do. But life goals and the way that people attack their goals in the gym are the way that they're attacking them in the rest of their lives and other aspects of their lives. And it's been really fun to watch that happen and to kind of get to support everyone along the way.

JAC: 01:48 And so if you want to support that growing network, check the link in the show notes and on aSweatLife.com.

CK: 01:48 Awesome.

JAC: 01:58 But on the same note, Kathrine Switzer is a big achiever who sets big goals outside of the gym. And inside it, wouldn't you say, Cindy?

CK: 02:10 I would say that is absolutely the case. She is one of the pioneers of the women's running revolution and I was so thrilled to get to speak with her. She was the first woman to officially run the Boston Marathon. And that's a race I've run a few times myself. So what an honor to speak with her and how insightful and open and honest she was about her experiences.

MU: 02:29 So when I listened to your interview, Kathrine's passion for running made me want to sign up for a marathon. And I've never thought that I would want to run any kind of distance before. But the way she talks about her fuel for life and everything she goes after and how she has used running to help her tackle her goals outside of running. It sounds infectious to me. And she talks about that being like her secret weapon. Can you talk a little bit about that experience for her?

CK: 02:59 Yeah. I mean her dad encouraged her to start running a mile every day when she was 12 and if you think about someone encouraging you to do something like that that you didn't think you could do when you were 12 and then you did it every day and you kind of gained this physical confidence in yourself and you navigated your preteen and your teenage years and you just really had this feeling that, hey, I can do this thing that I never thought I could do and that no one else thought I could do.

CK: 03:24 It really would just give you that power to think that you could do anything. And that's what it did for her. And she believes that running can be that secret weapon for so many people and it's a gospel that she preaches. You'll hear her talk about, especially in these sort of divided times, how running can really bring people together in addition to bringing confidence to each individual. But we heard her speak, Jeana and I went to hear her speak at a lunch for the Midtown Educational Foundation later the same day that I interviewed her and she also talked about the fact that everyone has a secret weapon. It might not be running for you--it might be running for you, Maggie, you might have to try it, but uh, but whatever it is, there is something that you didn't think you could do and someone gives you the opportunity to do it and you do it and you take that with you.

CK: 04:05 And it's just a matter of aligning the opportunity with setting that goal and accomplishing it and thinking about that carrying over to the rest of your life.

JAC: 04:14 And what's incredible about seeing her speak is how energized she is still to this day about the cause of women running and about how women who run can change the world. When she started this, when she took up the Boston Marathon, she was in her twenties and today she's in her seventies. Can you talk to me a little bit about how she's staying energized or why is she staying energized?

CK: 04:40 Yeah. Running, she says, gives her energy, you know, people who don't run sometimes think running makes you tired, but once you sort of tap into that secret weapon of it, it really does give you energy and fuels you. But it's certainly her motivation to, to do all the things that she does has changed in the 50 years that she's been doing them.

CK: 04:58 When she first started, she had something to prove both as an individual and as, as a woman who wanted to show people that women's bodies could handle the distance of running the marathon. And she was instrumental, you'll hear her talk about this as one of her biggest goals in getting the women's marathon, um, into the Olympics, which happened in 1984, which is not very long ago, which is crazy to me. But now she still feels the same energy and passion, but her motivation has shifted a little bit. Now she feels a responsibility. She started this non-profit 261 fearless, which is based on her number from the Boston Marathon, not because she thought it would be a good idea, but because of what she was hearing from women out there who were motivated by her to continue spreading this movement.

MU: 05:43 261 Fearless. It gives me chills to hear her talk about it in the, in the episode, and I'm sure all of our listeners will also feel that same way. So here is Cindy with Kathrine.

CK: 06:06 This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here with Kathrine Switzer on the #WeGotGoals podcast. Kathrine, thank you so much for joining us today.

KS: 06:08 Oh, Cindy I'm so glad to be here to be with you and to talk about so many really great things that are going on.

CK: 06:15 Yeah, so Kathrine, you are here in Chicago. Welcome to Chicago, first of all! We're here at the Midtown Educational Foundation's Metro Achievement Center for Girls. Could you tell me a little bit about why we're here, why you're here today?

KS: 06:27 You know, I was asked to speak today to a big fundraising luncheon for the Midtown Educational Foundation by a friend of mine who knows me through running and he said, your goals, your persistence, are so similar to what this foundation is all about. The more I heard about Midtown Educational Foundation, I really, really wanted to do the speech, so I'm grateful for being here.

KS: 06:50 It is a wonderful organization that addresses the needs of low income average students with a mentoring program after school where these kids can get the tutoring and the help and the encouragement both for character development as well as academics to make them exceptional. And I'm so pleased to be a part of that because we all need an opportunity in life. That's what my speech is going to be all about. It's all about very similar things to my running career where I began as a, I would say less than average runner, a no talent and worked really hard and trained really hard and then also saw in the course of the way inequalities that existed for women and it developed into an entire career and life goal. So that's why I'm here to take those similarities into another area, which I'm very excited about.

CK: 07:48 Let's talk a minute about how it all began. You are known for so much now, but this started in 1967 when you signed up as K.V. Switzer, you pinned on that bib 261 and you became the first woman officially to run Boston. And you finished the race that day, but, but you almost didn't because of what happened with Jock Semple and how he tried to pull you off the course and those photos are just astonishing still. And I'm sure you've told this story a million times, but I think it cannot ever be lost to history. So can you tell me one more time and how you reflect on that moment now?

KS: 08:19 Yes. First of all, Cindy, it didn't start with pinning on a bib for the 1967 Boston Marathon. It started when I was 12 years old. It started with a dad who encouraged me to run a mile a day, and so I grew up running a mile a day playing on the field hockey team and my high school, I was lucky to have a field hockey team and I had an incredible sense of empowerment from running this mile a day.

KS: 08:40 I mean every day I felt like I had, you know, a secret weapon, a magic that nobody could take away from me, um, and what a way for a little 12 year old to grow up and go through all the crazy behaviors of, of high school. It was just amazing to have that under my belt. So by the time I was 19 and training for the Boston Marathon, I felt like I could do anything. That's also why I'm here in Chicago, as you know, to talk to the Midtown Educational Foundation people and their donors and to let them know that every kid out there just needs some kind of encouragement. If my dad hadn't started me with that mile a day, probably I would've discovered running much later. And I just hate to think if I hadn't just picked up that one thing that he said, run a mile a day, my life would've been so completely changed.

KS: 09:28 Anyway, so here we are. Now. I'm a student at Syracuse University. I'm working with the volunteer coach. He's not even the real coach at the university, who is an ex marathoner who was really ancient, you know, he was 50 years old and to me I was 19. He took me under his wing and we just jogged together everyday and you know, one mile became three miles, became 10 miles, became 15. And then I told him I really wanted to run the Boston Marathon and he didn't believe a woman could do it anywhere at anytime. And I said, hey, come on. There's been about six or seven women who've run marathons, you know, with no fanfare. And there was a woman at Boston, Roberta Gibb, who jumped out of the bushes the year before and she ran. Well, he exploded in rage. And he said, "No dame ever ran no marathon."

KS: 10:15 He just couldn't believe a woman could do it even though he was so caring about me and believing in me, and so he he challenged me and said if if I showed him in practice that I could run it, he'd be the first person to take me. Which again, what an opportunity. My goal was always to show him, his name is Arnie Briggs, that I could do the distance and so in practice one day we ran 31 miles. I told him we're going to keep going another five miles and he fainted at the end of the workout. Then he was utterly convinced. An absolute evangelist and really helped me sign up for the race, insisted that I follow the rules to the letter. I was a card carrying member of the Amateur Athletic Union. You have to sign up for a race, you have to pay your entry fee.

KS: 10:59 You have to you get your medical certificate, you have to get your travel permits. It was a real nightmare of organization. Right? And I kept saying, well, you know, no other woman has done that. And he said, well that's, they should have, these are the rules and there's nothing in the rule book and there's nothing on the entry form about gender, and I said, oh, we're pushing a point, and he said it's not on the entry form, so I signed my name. Of course I signed my name K.V. Switzer, which was another amazing coincidence. I signed my name that way because I wanted to be a journalist and I thought and also I wanted to be J.D. Salinger, if you want to know the truth, it's embarrassing to say, but my also because my dad had misspelled my name on my birth certificate so it was always misspelled and I got tired of it and I started signing my name K.V Switzer.

KS: 11:42 Anyway, changed history because officials thought it was from a man, so the whole incident at Boston was really about wearing a bib number. Roberta Gibb was also in that race and she was not bothered. The official was furious because I was wearing a bib number and he thought I had pulled a fast one over on him and he attacked me in the race and tried to pull that bib number off. I mean, he was out of control. I mean, I'd never seen anybody so angry and it was out of the blue, so it kind of caught me completely off guard. I didn't panic, but I certainly tried to get away from him and my coach was screaming, "Leave her alone. She's OK. I've trained her." And my boyfriend decked him. And so I, you know, at that point, you know, I had that, that horrible moment of sinking fear and dread and I thought, should I get off the course, have I done something terribly wrong?

KS: 12:35 And then I decided if I do that, then nobody's going to believe that women can do it. So I've already got myself in enough trouble. I'm going to just finish this race, which was a really amazing decision for a 20 year old to make under fire like that. And then I got really angry and I said to my coach, I'm going to finish this race on my hands and my knees if I have to, because I was so determined that women were no longer marginalized and I hadn't felt political at all up to that point. I thought other women just didn't get it, you know, how important fitness and running was and suddenly it all came down like an avalanche and you know, we'd lost a lot of adrenaline and had to push through. Marathon's hard enough and your first one at Boston for God sakes.

KS: 13:18 The cool thing was this, is that all the guys were wonderful to me. Every guy who was around me or who passed me or who I passed said, you go for it. We're with you all the way. It was terrific. I'd like to fast forward for a minute on that note because I might forget this. Right now in this era of sexual contentiousness, I think running stands as such a beacon of gender equality, of motivation, of nonjudgmentalness. We're out there to support each other, not as males and females we're out there to support each other as runners and I don't know who you are next to me, sir, what color you are, what race, what religion, what language you speak, but I'm going to hug you at the end of this race and I and I trust you with my life. And where else are we going to find that? And so running can help everybody so much and we've learned so many lessons from it and we've seen this sport transform our major cities.

KS: 14:14 But anyway, back to the race, you know, so I finished in and the rest is history as they say. I was determined to become a better athlete and I was determined to create opportunities for women. And so a life plan was laid out in front of me.

CK: 14:25 Yeah. I just looked back at your memoir and reading about that event again. What struck me in addition to that emotion of it, the fear, I mean I can't even imagine being at the beginning of a marathon and dealing with all of that, was that realization that you seemed to have right then like the sense of your life purpose to show other women that, that they could have the secret weapon that they could feel this sense of physical accomplishment that seemed to have guided everything that you've done since.

KS: 14:50 Yes. But of course, you know, first of all I wanted to finish the race because I, I knew also if I stepped off the course and didn't finish it, I'd regret it my whole life.

KS: 15:01 And I said, I'm already here. I mean, how am I going to get home? Sort of like many runners say I couldn't quit because I had to get to the finish because that's where my clothes and my watch and my money is. That's the joke part of it. But it's true. You know, the other thing is you can't, you can't run a marathon and stay mad. And so by Heartbreak Hill, I'd even forgiven old Jock Semple. You know, he's a product of his time and overwork race director or you know, what the hell. But I was saying, why aren't women here? And that's when the realization came that they needed the opportunities. You know, I wanted to prove it for them, but it was then I realized you can't blame them for not being here if they've never had the opportunities. Nobody understands what they can do unless they have those opportunities.

CK: 15:51 Hey, it's Cindy and we'll get back to my interview with Kathrine in just a minute, but first I want to let you know this episode is brought to you by Chicago Sport and Social Club. With them. It is more than a game, it's a social sports experience and hey, maybe running isn't your secret weapon. Maybe it's beach volleyball. There are a lot of reasons why you should play. You might want the feel of sand between your toes. You might want to meet people or you could just want to move your social life outside for a season. Whatever your goals are or your reasons for playing, Chicago Sport and Social Club has a beach volleyball league for you. You can do like Kathrine does and create a team of all women. You can grab a group of co eds or you can sign up as an individual and get set up with the team. However you go about it, if bump, set spike or the words that punctuate your summer, you will want to register around the league built for you. To do it. Go to www.ChicagoSocial.com and use code goals. That's G-O-A-L-S when you register. You'll get five percent off now through March 15th. And now it's back to our interview.

CK: 17:04 So what we typically ask on the #WeGotGoals podcast is about one big goal that you've achieved and how you got there and I mean you have so many to choose from. I wonder if there's one that stands out to you as being a primary accomplishment for you.

KS: 17:17 Yes, for much of my life, a big goal, a life goal was to get the women's marathon into the Olympic Games. I felt if we could do that, we could level the playing field completely and in many ways we did. When that happened, I said that's it. Take Me God, I can go. You know, I was young, I was only 33 years old and we did this and we got the women's marathon into the Olympic Games, you know, less than 10 years after this getting official at Boston. So that was incredible. We worked five years to get women official at Boston, that took place in 72, and then the inclusion into the Olympics was voted in in 81 for the 84 games.

KS: 17:59 But life throws you some funny things. Who would have ever believed that in my sixties, my bib number 261 suddenly becomes this kind of a cult number, this magic number meaning fearless in the face of adversity. This is a number that is only been three digits to me, never had any resonance except for the fact that it was my first bib and suddenly people are saying this number makes me feel fearless. You know, and the reason is I suddenly thought is because everybody relates to a story like mine in their own way. They've been told they're not welcome. They've been told they're not good enough. They don't belong or they're the wrong race color, whatever. And then they run and they do it anyway and they become fearless and they were wearing it on their backs and inking their arms with 261 in the letters and the pictures were coming in.

KS: 18:46 What am I going to do with this? I said, finally when people started sending me pictures of their tattoos, I realized I had to do something with it. It was more than kind of synchronicity and we formed a non-profit called 261 Fearless, where we take the simple act of putting one foot in front of the other out to women around the world who have no opportunities or are fearful and show them that they can find their fearless. So it started like in a funny way. It's like the mentoring program here at the Midtown Educational Foundation. It's like, I'm going to take you Cindy by the hand and we're going to put one foot in front of it. We're going to walk, run. We're going to forget all the junk that went on during our day in our week and our lives just for an hour, and you're going to find your fearless and you do.

KS: 19:33 It is magic. Running is transformational. It changes our lives in fundamental ways because it gives us a simple sense of accomplishment. So 261 Fearless is launched as a series of global clubs where individually in different communities, towns, woman by woman, community by community. We're showing them just to get out and run and move together. We have a wonderful training program where we train the mentors, the coaches on how to create a non-judgmental environment, which is the toughest part. Learning to run is the easy part. Being non judgmental is not easy for some people. Also, we have a wonderful communications program at 261fearless.org website where women, when they join 261 Fearless also can have a closed portal and talk to each other. Sometimes in life you just need to know you're not alone out there and women can come in and say, Hey, I'm from Saudi. Can I talk to you from Canada?

KS: 20:31 You know, or hey, I'm in Iran and I'm running alone and I don't know if somebody wants to come to this race. If you come with me, I'll feel a lot better. You know, that's wonderful. And you say, Oh, come on, running can't do that. Running has changed the world. Running has become a social revolution. Already, North America, there are more women runners than men and those women are not, they're not running to be Olympic athletes, as you know, Cindy. They're running because they're empowered and the same as in Canada, France, Japan. You look at the, you as a runner yourself, understand. The Kenyan women runners, look what look what they have done. They have changed their status from third class people to esteemed revered people in their communities, the women who have been lucky enough to get out and run and come back with prize money are building schools and inoculating kids.

KS: 21:23 That changes the social fabric. So you know you change women and you've changed the world and I sincerely believe that 261 fearless is going to do that. It's amazing.

CK: 21:33 It's incredible to hear about the genesis of that basically coming from the community and you being in that prime position to to see that and realize all of these big goals.

KS: 21:45 It's scary though. I gotta tell you, it's really scary. You know, when we started forming this non-profit, I was 68 years old and I sat down with my team and I said, I don't want to do it. I don't want to do it. I'm too old to start another revolution, they said, no, no, no, we can do it. We could do. And I have a wonderful team of women who are like between 40 and 52, who are the core people they're at the top of their game.

KS: 22:08 They want a legacy. They're going to make it happen. They're full of passion. And when I crossed the finish line, I think we're going to talk about this, you know, I ran the Boston Marathon again for my 50th anniversary and when I crossed that finish line, what I felt like I had done is passed the torch to the next 50 years. It was a great feeling because I kept saying, you guys, I'm not going to be around the next 50 years. You've got to understand. And it's hard for me because I didn't even realize I was 70. You know, I kept saying I'm not 70, I'm 25. And there were with me 125 women who ran in Boston and raised substantial money for the launch of 261 Fearless. The global launch essentially who are full of passion and I said, you know what, it's in good hands.

CK: 22:54 It's amazing to think about the arc of your story from a woman almost not a lone woman, but a lone woman with a personal goal that was always bigger than you, but still, you know, to kind of being a part of a committed group of pioneers who worked to make things like the Olympic Marathon happened to now being basically like the leader of a movement. And so it's fascinating to hear that motivation for you of that idea of passing the torch because I do wonder how your drive and motivation changes through the years and I also wonder if you still feel like you have something to prove.

KS: 23:26 Yeah, I, it's not that I have something to prove because I know running works. OK. You know, I, you know, I just say it works. It works all the time. What I have, unfortunately, I guess is this huge sense of responsibility.

CK: 23:38 If you have the vision to see inequality and you walk by and you don't pick it up and do something, then I think you're doomed. And we have to do that. And that's why I kept saying to the team, I don't want to do this, I will don't. I mean I'm too old for another revolution. And they said, no, no, no, we'll handle this, you know, and thank God because, you know, I'm just, I'm too disorganized personally to, to really make another global program go. But they are wonderful and I have the voice and the vision and can see the direction. So as long as I'm able, I will continue to do this. But yeah, I do have that sense of responsibility and sometimes you know, you go to bed at night and you think, do I have the energy to carry on? And so far so good.

KS: 24:27 You know what's great though is running gives it back to you. You know, I've been running pretty hard lately and that running in pe people say, don't you get tired from the running? I said, no, they're running actually refreshes me because the running, relieves the stress and gives the creative process.

CK: 24:43 MMM hmm. I know that to be true to that is for sure. So the other big question we ask on #WeGotGoals is about a goal you have for the future and how you intend to get there. And you know, you talked about this idea of starting the movement and passing the torch, but you know, whether it's a, it's a goal for that you'd like to see happen with 261 Fearless or a personal goal of yours. What would you say is in the future?

KS: 25:06 You know, the darndest thing about having a goal is once you achieve it, you go, wow, I did that.

Speaker 3: 25:13 And then you look around and you like any athlete. Let's say you finally break three hours in a marathon as an example. You say, wow. Then you look around, you see people who are running like 2:18 and you say, oh, I have a long way to go, but yeah, do I have some more personal goals? Of course 261 and its success in changing women's lives is a huge goal of mine. But there are other goals. I have personal goals. I mean there's some broad ones like making women aware of taking control of their own health, of working with companies that that also helped people, like, I'm working with Humana for instance, in letting people know that we're on the verge of another threshold, another revolution which is aging and that people, you know, 60, 65 think they need to sit down and take it easy when the opposite is the case and they need to know that the more they more activity that they can embrace that the better their health is going to be.

KS: 26:06 This is true with my work with Go Red for Women, the American Heart Association and letting women know that heart disease is your number one killer and yet you can prevent 45 percent of your cases of heart conditions, heart disease by simple exercise, not a marathon, a walk every day. These kinds of things are are so important for me to get out there. Personally on a personal goal. I got to write another book and you know, Marathon Woman ended essentially in 1984 and it was always proposed as a two volume book. The publisher said even Bill Clinton can do it in one, so I had to shelve that, end it in 84 thinking maybe that was the culmination in my career, but it wasn't so now we have a whole other book about the evolution in the revolution of these women and how. And then the next goal I would think personally is frankly I'm fascinated with being older and running, running the Boston Marathon 50 years after I first did my first one and which made me the first woman in history to run a marathon 50 years after she ran her first one, which is not testimony to my greatness, trust me.

KS: 27:12 Trust me, it's testimony to how few women ran 50 years ago. It's going to be common place soon and there are plenty of women who are 70, 80, even 90 years old who are running marathons, which is wonderful to see. So I've enjoyed running Boston and in a, in a moment of hypoxia and delusion. I said, I'm in great shape. I'll run New York. I ran New York again last year, 43 years after I won it and people hundreds coming by and just slapping you on the back saying way to go. Now I'm running London on April 22. I'm not nearly as good as shape, but that's OK, London's just for fun. But I helped create that race in many ways and I've always wanted to run it. And then I'll run Berlin again. I've run before, but I'll run Berlin again in September and then maybe I'll do something, you know, you know, like cliché, like run the big six and I, I'll put this out there, but I don't want my husband to hear it, which is, I've always wanted to run Comrades. I've heard about that race and applied to for a sponsor to help me with in 1966. Even when I was training for Boston, I heard about Comrades and I said, I know I can do that. And so I went to a sponsor and ask if they would send me. And of course they thought I was smoking poppy.

KS: 28:32 So it's gone by the wayside all these years and it's kind of rankled me, it's kind of been in the back of my mind. I'd like to try that as well.

CK: 28:38 And for those of our listeners who don't know Comrades, it's a very famous ultramarathon in South Africa. That's some years uphill, some years downhill.

KS: 28:47 I don't know which one I'll take you to sometimes downhill's harder than uphill, especially as you get older for sure. But for right now, the wheels haven't fallen off and how grateful I am because my husband, Roger Robinson, one of the, one of the greatest runners in the world actually for many, many years has had now double knee replacements, transformed thinking about actually running on them because he ran very, very well on the first one. And now he's struggling with the second one. We'll see what happens, you know, you know, we're hoping for a miracle here and um, but, but science has changing amazingly.

KS: 29:21 But I don't know if the wheels do fall off or if they will. But let's go right now. I don't want to wait.

CK: 29:31 Well, we will be watching you every step. I know. So tell me, you mentioned where the website for 261 Fearless. How else can people follow you and keep tabs on the important work that you're doing?

KS: 29:40 Well, I mean I have somebody do Facebook for me and Twitter and stuff because you know, I'm so technophobic and idiotic with that stuff, you know, and I don't have time. I mean they get hundreds of emails a day, so shall I have somebody do that and so it's not huge, but you know, I'm on Facebook but really I think the best thing for them too, and they can always go to my website, MarathonWoman.com. Real easy to remember, but I really would love them to consider becoming a friend of 261 Fearless.

KS: 30:05 And that's again 261fearless.org or starting a club in their community and all that information is on the site. So tune in there. That's, that would be the best thing. And the last thing I'd really like people to do is support in their own communities. Things that give kids opportunities. My life was changed by a dad who told me to run a mile a day and like here in Chicago, the Midtown Educational Foundation is doing great things for kids. Everybody has something in their own community, and if you don't, why don't you create it?

CK: 30:39 That is a inspirational call to action for us all. Well, I can't thank you enough, Kathrine, for joining us today and thanks to the Midtown Educational Foundation for bringing you here and I'm, I'm just so grateful. Thanks for your time.

KS: 30:51 You're welcome, Cindy. Thanks for all you do.

CK: 31:00 This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and like so much else in life, it is better with friends. You can share it with yours by telling them about it or by subscribing yourself wherever you get your podcasts and then leaving us a rating or review while you're there. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Kathrine Switzer; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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This episode is presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code “GOALS” to get 5 percent off until March 15.

We've evolved into a team that's obsessed with goals - how people think of them, how they set them and then how they ferociously pursue them. When we set out to ask people about those things, we thought we'd given our #WeGotGoals podcast guests the perfect platform to talk about their life story.

What we actually found was that we'd created a master class in goal-setting with high achievers across the country and the team that produces the podcast each week learned a whole lot along the way.

As we cross into our second year with the #WeGotGoals podcast, all four hosts look back on the two big questions we ask all of our guests and we threw in one extra question.

And so, hosts Cindy Kuzma, Maggie Umberger, Kristen Geil and I all took a dose of our own medicine and put each other on the spot to say our big goals aloud.

In this episode, you'll hear us discuss three big questions: 1. What's a big goal that you've accomplished over the past year? 2. What's a big goal you're striving to accomplish in the future? 3. What's one big takeaway from any of our guests on the #WeGotGoals podcast?

Which episodes did we really learn from? The episodes that really changed our views on goals span the year and come from incredible people.

Kuzma recalled her interview with sports interviewer and reporter Taylor Rooks who was excited by the distance between herself and her big goals, rather than dismayed by it.

"Instead of thinking, oh gosh, I have all these things I want to accomplish, I'm so far from my goals. I don't know how I'll ever get there. This is really overwhelming and disillusioning," Kuzma recalled of her interview with Rooks. "She looks at that and thinks, wow, how exciting that I get to work toward that big goal."

Umberger brought up an early episode with Dawn Jackson Blatner and a quote that is often referenced at HQ.

"If you're enthusiastically doing the work, the opportunities will come," She quoted."If I'm doing the best I can and if I'm doing that authentically, there's nothing more than I can do than that."

Geil referenced a recent episode with Jessica Zweig who touched on the art of trusting your gut.

Geil astutely took away, "I feel like with goal setting, a lot of people are so driven by achievements and watching the numbers grow and hitting certain milestones that it can be really easy to ignore your gut or your intuition along the way in favor of going after what you think you should be doing.

For me, there were two major takeaways, one on the art of visualizing and dreaming big from Matt Matros - founder of Protein Bar and Founder/CEO of Limitless Coffee and Tea - and the art of dedication I learned from Jen Ator, Director of Fitness at Women's Health, who set out to accomplish something absolutely ridiculous at the IRONMAN World Championship at Kona.

Of Matros' interview, I remembered:

"Visualization, as we know and as science has shown us is a powerful tool to help you prepare yourself for coming up against an obstacle, a goal, a situation. Athletes use it. CEOs use it because it prepares your brain to actually encounter that thing. It prepares your brain to encounter success. It prepares your brain to encounter failure. So if you're thinking about success every single day, you're more prepared to succeed."

And when it came to Ator, I marveled at the joy she experienced during something so grueling as crossing the finish line at the IRONMAN world championship.

"She loved that experience, but it was also the hardest experience she'd ever been through and I think that if you talk to anyone who's accomplished anything great, that is something that they have in common."

Thank you for joining us for a year of #WeGotGoals - we can't wait to see what we'll learn from goal-getters next.

Transcript:

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. With me, I have Kristen Geil, Cindy Kuzma, Maggie Umberger, and myself, Jeana Anderson Cohen on this very special podaversary episode. It's our first anniversary of hosting the #WeGotGoals podcast and in celebration we are going guestless, hostful. So around the table you will hear us answer the big questions that we ask our very impressive guests, but today it's all about us.

KG: Yay.

CK: Love it.

KG: Finally.

JAC: We've been waiting for an opportunity to talk about our goals. So our first question that we want to talk about today is a big goal that you've accomplished over the past year. Kristen, would you like to start?

KG: Sure, I would. So over the past year I have gone through a couple of major career transitions. For a long time now. I've been dabbling in the thought of going full time freelance writing and also getting my personal training certification so that I could start to teach group fitness classes in gyms, which I actually started doing back in like 2014--and then I just stopped going to the classes that I was taking at DePaul and decided, no, I don't think I want to do this right now. But luckily I had a nice little nudge when my full time job back in June decided that they wanted to send all of our copywriters to Hoboken. And I said, no, thank you please. So it was the perfect--Noboken, yes, it was a hard pass. But luckily that gave me the little push that I needed to actually start being more aggressive about looking for freelance clients, which included ramping up my work with aSweatLife and starting to work on the podcast. And I was also lucky enough to be a part of the sweat life group that got their personal training certification through NASM. So for about eight months I really was doing the full time freelance writing and working in the gym and it was a really exciting time in my life and I learned that I loved working for myself and making all my own decisions and you know, not really having to answer to authority that was six levels above me in the company hierarchy. So yeah, it was really exciting. Although health insurance sucks always, always.

JAC: What about you, Cindy?

CK: Sure. So one goal that I achieved in the past year was requalifying for the Boston Marathon, which I've done for a few years in a row now. I've been fortunate enough to accomplish that, but this year it was a little bit different. I had a little bit of a wrench thrown in my plans when I had to have emergency surgery in February. And my best opportunity to re qualify for Boston was in Boston, which was in April two months later. So I've written and talked a little bit about this before, but in the context of goals, the way that I was able to accomplish that--to go to Boston to run fast enough to, to go back there--was really something that Yael Shy talked about when when Maggie interviewed her a couple months ago was kind of holding that goal with a loose hand and recognizing that just because things might not work out exactly the way I planned, they might still work out.

CK: Being OK with the fact that I wasn't going to be able to do exactly the training I thought I needed to do or wanted to do to make that race my best ever. But just approaching it day by day, doing what I could every day to speed my healing and get back to training and running. And that really just allowed me to do it. You know, like when, when I needed to rest, when my doctor said to rest, I rested. When my doctor said it was OK to run, even though I was scared to run, I ran. And just day by day, step by step, I got there. And what's great about approaching goals in that way is that you have the big target, but if, if then after you set that big target, you think about what you have to do every day to make it happen and you trust that you do that, even if you don't achieve that goal--like if I hadn't made it, I would've been disappointed, but I wouldn't have been disappointed in myself. I would've known that I had done all I could. So it was made the victory extra sweet.

JAC: I love that. OK, sorry to interject there.

CK: Jeana, what goal did you accomplish this past year?

JAC: So I, whenever I'm asked about my goals, I struggled to think of a goal that lives outside of the walls of aSweatLife. And this year is the first time I really actually did something in, in quite a few years, in the past five years that wasn't related to aSweatLife that I was extremely proud of and that was running a marathon for charity and actually unplugging to do it. And the reason why it was so prideful and just wonderful was because I actually unplugged for a day and it took a marathon for me to unplug, which is crazy and I've been saying it ever since. But it was such a wonderful experience. I mean, I'm getting emotional just thinking about it because for the first time in maybe two, two and a half years, I spent the day just thinking about what was ahead of me, what was to my right and my left and where I was at that moment, and I'm not going to cry. You are.

JAC: But the magic was in the fact that when you really stop and think about a marathon, you can be at any point in that race. You can be first or you can be last and someone is still cheering for you. And that's such a powerful metaphor for life and such a powerful metaphor ... oh my gosh! (Crying) This is like when I talk about my parents. That's such a powerful metaphor for life and such a powerful metaphor for what we're doing at aSweatLife, which is building a community that is cheering for you. Whoever you are, no matter where you are in the race, and I just spent the entire day in love with that fact and this city--it was the Chicago Marathon, by the way. And and the sounds of it, the sights of it, the friends that I got to hug along the way. I wasn't married to my time, I wasn't married to where I placed. I just wanted to finish, be happy about it and give people hugs as I did it. So that was my favorite achievement this year.

KG: Maggie, how about you?

MU: So this is an exercise in practicing what we preach because when I had to think about a goal that I accomplished this year, I was like, I don't, I don't know. It's not something in my blood to do. I, I do. I'm a doer. I work hard, but I really don't celebrate my own accomplishments that often. And so I salute all of our guests for getting on this podcast and doing that because it's hard. It's really hard. And if I really think about it, I would probably take a small step back from just the past actual 12 months, like from March 2017 to right now. And I look at the leap that I made from advertising to the world of aSweatLife and jumping in headfirst. I think so many people that have congratulated me on that, I have just passed it off as like, oh, it was no big deal.

MU: I just did it. But it was hard and I am proud that I did it and I'm so proud that I followed my gut and that it, it was never a choice of like, should I do this or should I not do this? It was like my gut was screaming to do it and so I just made it happen no matter what. And then over the last year, getting to experience all of the things that, that we have as aSweatLife, as part of that team has been unreal. And I'm only 25. So to be able to say that I've done the things I've done in the last year, which had been so full and getting to start the ambassadorship alongside Jeana has been unreal cool. To first see 26 people over the last year, go on a journey to live their best lives and then bring on another 30 plus, so now we have more than 60 ambassadors and 10 across the country on this journey with us. It speaks volumes of what aSweatLife stands for and I'm so grateful to be in the place where I am that I said yes back in 2016 to all of these new opportunities and then just kind of jumping in headfirst saying yes, making it happen. I'm very proud of it. I'm proud of what we've accomplished and I'm, I'm proud of myself for making the leap.

JAC: I'm proud of you too!

MU: OK enough about me.

JAC: I knew that was going to happen. I get to see Maggie every single day and she is a workhorse and she does big things. Then she always moves right along and she just did a crazy thing and then it's time to go.

MU: But now we look ahead at the goals that we're setting in the future. So Kristen, a big goal in the future, what is it for you?

KG: So this is more of a a fun goal for me. I say fun now. I might say not say the same thing later, but back when I first started writing for aSweatLife, I was known as the runner person, I think. I went through a year where I did three marathons and I really poured every part of my spare time and my being and my personality into like running with friends and setting these goals and putting the work in and making a schedule and sticking to it and for various reasons I've gotten far far away from that over the past two years I guess. But this year I want to get back to running for fun. I've signed up for a half marathon in September to help motivate me a little bit, but this time I want to make it a very different experience, which is maybe not quite in line with the goal setting that we talk about here. I just want to have fun. I just want to enjoy it and not worry about time and not get competitive with myself because that's when I start to lose the joy in it. I just want to enjoy going out for the lakefront path, being out there for a couple of hours and then enjoy race day. Maybe bring my dad and my sister along, explore a new city, see a beautiful course. Just get back to the fun of it and start reclaiming that part of my personality that I've kind of let go for the past couple of years. Cindy, what about you?

CK: Well, first of all, I think that's a fantastic goal and I mean, I think if we've learned nothing from from #WeGotGoals, it's that goals come in all shapes and sizes, right? And faster is just one goal when it comes to running. So that sounds awesome. One of my goals for the year ahead is to write another book. I have collaborated in the past with the fabulous Dawn Jackson Blattner, who we've had on the podcast before on her book and I'm just about to sign a contract to start a new collaboration and I can't talk too much about it yet, but you know, I'm really excited about making it happen in the next, gosh, six months or so before we turn it in. And I think the way I'm going to accomplish that is just the same way I talked about training for Boston. We've broken it down into what needs to happen month by month, week by week, day by day.

CK: So while writing a whole book seems like kind of an overwhelming proposition, you just focus on what you can do that day and that week and then you hope that you end up with the, the end product that you're going to be proud of. And I trust that we will. And, uh, I know that when we get to the point where we're publishing the book and we have to launch it and market it, I'll have to rely on another piece of advice from #WeGotGoals about asking for help from friends and other people, but that's a, that'll happen in 2019. So maybe that'll be what I talk about on the podaversary round table next year.

JAC: That's a very big goal, Cindy. And we cannot wait to read your work on this mysterious future book.

MU: Yeah. OK, Jeana, big goal.

JAC: OK. So I'm going to go back to aSweatLife because I can't be too personal, right? So my big goal for the year ahead is growing aSweatLife--I am very growth-minded right now. When I think about the company and the way that I want it to grow, my biggest concern and my biggest focus is on growing it in a way that is consistent with our values. So making sure that everyone who comes on board is sort of enlightened in the ways of everything is better with friends and is excited about creating content that helps people live their best lives and then from there, my key challenge is empowering people to do big things that they have only dreamed of doing before and getting out of their way. That is the one thing I've worked on the most professionally over the past year and a half when I went from doing it alone to having Maggie and now to having Kristen by my side. When other people are basing their personal happiness and a lot of their time on the job that you give them.

JAC: It is so important. I have learned, I do not know this implicitly, but it is so important to ensure that they are actually satisfied by the work that they're doing. So if I am the roadblock, if I am the person standing in the way of the actual job they want to be doing, then it's me. I'm the problem. So my key objective is making sure that I'm not the block, I'm not the problem and that people are empowered to do the work that they love while still growing in places, in readers, and in people we empower.

CK: Hey, it's Cindy. And we'll get back to our special podaversary round table episode in just a minute, but first a word from our sponsor this week, Chicago Sport and Social Club. With them it's more than a game, it's a social sports experience. So you're listening to us talk about our goals, but you certainly have goals of your own big or small and whatever they are, Chicago Sport and Social Club has a lot of reasons why you should play. You might love the feel of the sand between your toes. You might want to meet people or you know it's been a long winter in Chicago, as always. You just might want to move your social life outside for a season. So whatever your goals or your reasons for playing Chicago Sports and Social Club has a beach volleyball league for you. You can create a team of all women. You can grab a group of men and women or you can sign up on your own and get set up with a team as an individual. Whatever your situation, if bump set and spike are the words that punctuate your summer, it is time to register for the league built around you. To do that go to www.chicagosocial.com, and you can use code goals--that's G-O-A-L-S when you register to get five percent off from now through the 15th. Thanks to Chicago Sport and Social Club and now back to our episode.

CK: Maggie, how about you? What's up next for you? I

MU: I'll go back to more of a personal goal, since Jeana covered a career goal, I'll kind of bounce it back to a personal one, which I think is totally related to just how you live your life as a whole, is if you don't feel good, like how can you produce good work and I feel like I've had injuries over the past year where I'm just like, so over having the injuries and so I would, I would love to get back into a routine for myself. I feel like I have had the great privilege to experience all kinds of different workouts with aSweatLife and I love that. But I think having a couple of different injuries has made me need to go to physical therapy and that's been a smart thing for me to do. So I want to keep those things I've learned in physical therapy and implement them into my new routine and kind of carve out time for myself.

MU: Not every day of the week, but you know, three to four days of the week where the workouts that I do are the best ones for my body. Because I think another thing that we see at aSweatLife is the fitness trends. We get to cover them and talk about them and they're exciting. But if you don't listen to your body then you'll end up getting injured. And so one of the biggest takeaways that I've taken from the podcast was with Shane Emmett, the CEO of Health Warrior, and he kind of takes inventory of his calendar where he blocks out all of his time and he sees where he's spending his time and if and if I've spent all of my time during the week just teaching versus taking classes or doing my own workouts, I want to take note of that and make a couple changes for the next week and so constantly improving and optimizing my schedule so that I feel the best on just a personal note than I'll be able to produce the best work possible. But I think it's that constant balance that we're all striving for of how do you fit it, fit it all in the week, everything that you want to. It's just going to be kind of a week by week reassessing, reoptimizing so that so that I do feel the most rested and best every single every single week. When I start out.

KG: Maggie, you kind of touched on this just now, but over the past year we've been fortunate enough to interview dozens of goal-setters and go-getters and we've gotten to hear the tricks of the trade straight from their mouths. So one of the final things we wanted to talk about in this podaversary was our biggest takeaways from one certain episode or trends that you saw over all of the ones that we've done so far. So Cindy, you've heard every single episode several times over with your editing. What's one big takeaway that you took from any of our guests?

CK: Oh my gosh. I feel like it's been kind of a master class in goal setting and I feel so fortunate to have been able to help launch this and work on this and get the chance to learn from these guests and from you all every week. So thank you. There are actually two things that Taylor Rooks, who I interviewed not too long ago. She's a young sports anchor and journalist. Two things that she said really stuck with me in terms of kind of mindset shifts that have helped me think about my goals a little bit differently. And the first one is to remind yourself that you are where you are for a reason. That it's easy to doubt yourself. We touch so many times in so many ways on impostor syndrome. But you know, she really has this, this confidence that that's not ego. It's not off putting, but it's like the sheer, like confidence that just like inspires you and attracts you to her. And she said, one of the practical ways that she works on that is reminding herself that she wouldn't be where she was if she didn't have the skills and the talents and the ability to get there.

CK: And I think we all kind of look for these data points that, that enforce to us that we are worthwhile and we actually have them. And we just need to step back and look at them and pay as much attention to those as we do to the negative voices in our heads and in the comments and wherever else we encounter them. The other thing that she said, and I am sure she wasn't the first person to say this, but she talked about being inspired by the distance between where she was and where she wanted to be. That instead of thinking, oh gosh, I have all these things I want to accomplish, I'm so far from my goals. I don't know how I'll ever get there. This is really overwhelming and disillusioning. She looks at that and thinks, wow, how exciting that I get to work toward that big goal. I'm here where I am now and I can see the path forward and I just get to do the work. And how exciting is that? So those, both of those things have been really helpful in helping me kind of refocus on the positive and view my journey as one that has already lots of things to celebrate and a lot more to look forward to. So that is something I've learned. Kristen, what have you learned?

KG: I think I can take two viewpoints here. The first and the simpler one is what we heard from Jessica during the live podcast recently during SweatWorkingWeek and she talked for a couple of minutes about the importance of trusting her gut and her intuition and I think that is something that all of our goal-getters have in common but maybe didn't explicitly say. I feel like with goal setting, a lot of people are so driven by achievements and watching the numbers grow and hitting certain milestones that it can be really easy to ignore your gut or your intuition along the way in favor of going after what you think you should be doing. And I think just hearing that explicitly said from someone who is so in tune with herself, but admits to still making mistakes. You're, I mean you can misinterpret your gut intuition.

KG: It was just a nice reminder to maybe look inward instead of looking for outward proof of hitting your goals or setting your goals. So that's something that I'm going to try and keep in mind more as I go through my 2018. The other, and I think it was just a recurring theme across so many of our episodes. Even the ones where we didn't talk to co-founders or partners is that everyone goes further together and you know, we heard that with several people mentioning that you have to be willing to ask for help from others, especially during the early stages of a startup or you have to have a support system who's going to understand that when you're really working towards the goal, maybe you have to be really focused on that for awhile and you can't go out for dinners spur of the moment. But at the end of the day, you know, like we say, everything is better with friends. And I think that was something that all of our goal setters, even though they've got such amazing individual achievements, they never forget the people who helped them get there. Maggie, you look like you want to say something right now.

MU: Yeah. I'm just like nodding my head in agreement. And I, I really think I have to say that this statement, I think actually once a week and it's from Dawn Jackson Blatner's episode, like number three, a long time ago, when we started the podcast. When she says, if you're enthusiastically doing the work, the opportunities will come and that statement means so much to me and it, it just rings so true to me because I know I don't have all the answers and I'm, I'm one to look outward for affirmation and to wonder if the work I'm doing is worthwhile. But really it comes down to if I'm doing the best I can and if I'm doing that authentically, there's nothing more than I can do than that. And that's what people will ultimately notice and see. And we've, we've heard a lot of other guests talk about not really being sure and jumping into a world that they weren't completely sure if they should be in or if that, that whole word should, could be like a death sentence, but they just choose something else.

MU: They choose to be authentic, to go forward as best they can to enthusiastically do the work is like the biggest motivation I have on days when I'm not sure how to move forward or if I've made the right choice or you know, whatever that might be. I think it's like a little mantra for me. So I, I so appreciate her saying it for putting it into words that I can just quickly think of. Even if it's like in a workout, like if I'm here enthusiastically doing these bicep curls and then then I'm sure the muscles will come, you know.

CK: Oh my gosh, I have this awesome image of Maggie enthusiastically doing bicep curls.

MU: I smile when I work out. I do. So, so that, that's by far the biggest takeaway I have just because I think of it every single week. And Jeana, what about you?

JAC: I personally learned something from every single episode of the #WeGotGoals podcast, but I think two points in particular have stood out to me recently as I listen and re-listen to episodes. One of those being Matt Matros and the way that he talked about visualizing goals. Visualization, as we know and as science has shown us is a powerful tool to help you prepare yourself for coming up against an obstacle, a goal, a situation. Athletes use it. CEOs use it because it prepares your brain to actually encounter that thing. It prepares your brain to encounter success. It prepares your brain to encounter failure. So if you're thinking about success every single day, you're more prepared to succeed, which is insane, but hearing the detail at which he visualizes his day and encourages other entrepreneurs digitalized. There's inspired me to start using that exercise in my own life and it is also a case for not worrying. Worrying is wishing for a failure, but that's the last time. I'll preach that at Justin Cohen. But the other major takeaway that I had over the course of the year was the way that Jen Ator talked about her time with Ironman and the Ironman world championships at Kona because it became this, this great big thing that she--it became a journey that she went through and overcame and it became the thing that really punctuated her life.

JAC: Whether it was her goals at work or whether it was her goals out on the field, she loved that experience, but it was also the hardest experience she'd ever been through and I think that if you talk to anyone who's accomplished anything great, that is something that they have in common. They loved that experience. They came out on the other side, but it was incredibly challenging and difficult, so it's just a testament to the fact that doing the work, there's just no substitute for it and the emotional and physical and professional rewards that come with doing the work will be equal to the work that you put in. And here's to another great year of the #WeGotGoals podcast. Anything you want to say before you go?

CK: Thank you all for, for your amazing work. It's been awesome to see you guys on a monthly basis and to hear you in my ears every week. It's been incredible.

JAC: Thanks to the listeners and thanks to the hard work of Cindy Kuzma who produces this podcast this week and every week for the past year. We'll see you on the other side.

CK: This podcast was produced by me and it's another thing that's better with friends for, so please share it with yours. The best way to do that is subscribing wherever you get your podcasts and then leaving us a rating or a review while you're there. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music and to our guests this week, the #WeGotGoals aSweatLife team. That is Jeana Anderson Cohen, the CEO and founder; Maggie Umberger, who is the director of community and content innovation; and Kristen Geil, the editor in chief, and of course thanks to you our listeners, we wouldn't have been doing this for the past year without you and we hope you'll stick around while we keep doing it for the next year.

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Thirteen years ago, when Augie Nieto learned he had the progressive neuromuscular disease ALS, he and his wife Lynne were told to put his affairs in order. Most people live only two to five years after diagnosis, as their brains lose touch with their bodies and their muscles atrophy.

But Augie—who founded exercise equipment company Life Fitness in 1977—wasn’t one to simply accept his fate.

First, as Lynne explains on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals, the couple “tried to find somebody that would tell us we didn’t have ALS,” she says. “We traveled the country to the ALS specialists all over and unfortunately got the same answer six more times.”

Once reality set in, Augie was devastated. Lynne became his caregiver, a role that nearly overwhelmed her. But eventually, it became clear Augie just might beat the grim statistics. Over time, Augie and Lynne found balance and a new purpose: Curing the disease that threatened to kill him.

Because ALS affects the muscles in his mouth and diaphragm, Augie can no longer speak. He breathes with a ventilator and communicates with assistive technology he controls with his feet. Still, Lynne says, he works as hard as ever.

Together, Augie and Lynne co-founded Augie’s Quest, a non-profit that has raised more than $62 million. That money—and millions more—has gone to fund research at the ALS Therapy Development Institute, where Augie’s chair of the board.

These efforts are beginning to pay off. Already, the institute has a drug nearing phase 1 clinical trials, and two more promising compounds in the pipeline. Considering that there are currently only two FDA-approved treatments for ALS, that’s quite a feat.

“What we’ve really shown here is that ALS is not an incurable disease—it’s just underfunded,” Lynne says.

Working together “in lockstep” toward these goals has—incredibly—deepened the Nietos’ partnership to the point that Lynne says their marriage is stronger than ever. Raising their four children, and showing them the true meaning of “for better or for worse,” ranks as Lynne’s proudest accomplishment.

“Before ALS, I think you had two of the most independent people on the face of the planet that probably in our heads thought we didn’t need each other that much. And that’s not always a great way to go about a relationship,” she says.

Now that they’ve had to slow down and be more thoughtful in their communications, “I think we’re better people.”

Lynne has also learned to step into the spotlight, speaking in public and to the media. The self-professed introvert admits it’s still a struggle. “I am not comfortable, but I have learned to be in discomfort and just lean into the discomfort,” she says. “I know that if Augie could, he would be the spokesperson. But now I feel that sense of responsibility to being his voice.”

On Augie’s urging, the Nietos welcomed a documentary crew into their lives. Initially, Lynne resisted the idea. During filming, which proceeded on and off for a year, the lights and boom mics in their bedroom were certainly intrusive. Now that the crews have left and she’s watched the resulting film, AUGIE, many times over, Lynne says she’s glad they did it.

“My deal with Augie was that I would agree to go through with doing the documentary, but we weren’t going to sugarcoat our lives; we were going to share the bad as well as the good. And that was very cathartic in many ways,” she says.

And she’s proud of the end product: “I feel like now we have something that can shed some light on ALS, on trying to find treatments and a cure, on others living with the disease and how we really can make a difference.”

Hear more of their incredible story on this week’s episode—and beginning March 20, watch AUGIE on Netflix and Amazon.

You’ll hear Lynne mention more ways to get involved, including joining Team Quest for ALS and raising money while running a 5K, 10K, or half-marathon. You can also contribute just by working out at OrangeTheory Fitness from now through March 8, including a special 90-minute Augiethon at all Chicago and suburban locations on March 3.

Listen to this week’s episode, produced by Cindy Kuzma and presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code "GOALS" to get 5 percent off until March 15.

And if you like what you hear, subscribe where ever you get your podcasts and leave us a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

MU: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good morning. Cindy, you talked with Lynne Nieto.

CK:I did. I spoke with Lynne Nieto, who is the wife of Augie Nieto and also an incredibly accomplished person in her own right. She is, of course, many more titles than just wife, but her story is remarkable because Augie is the founder of Life Fitness, a manufacturer of fitness equipment that's based near here in Chicago. He was diagnosed with ALS 13 years ago and the journey that they've been on together since then has been really incredible and I'm so grateful to her for sharing with us.

MU: So the Nietos are doing a lot for ALS research and more than just fundraising, right?

CK: That's right. I mean they have raised a ton of money, like more than a hundred million dollars, so they've done that, but they've gone farther. Augie has really brought his entrepreneurial spirit to trying to find a cure for this disease. So they have built a research institute called the ALS Therapy Development Institute that is set up to streamline the process of finding a cure and they already have one drug that's in clinical trials. It's really exciting what they've been able to do.

JAC:It's interesting to speak with someone who's going through something like this because as a partner of someone who has a disease or who sort of has their freedom taken away, their movement taken away by a disease, it's easy to lose hope. Did you get a sense from her that she has that sort of positivity and hope that's carrying her through?

CK:I certainly did, but it was really interesting to talk with her about how she got to that place. It was definitely an evolution for both of them. It's a heart wrenching story to hear her talk about how they both reacted to the diagnosis. Augie took it very hard and she kind of went into fix it mode and was just like, how do we fix the house to make us able to stay here? How do we fix our finances? And she became his caregiver for a long time too and was really doing those day to day tasks every day. It wasn't until two key things I think happened. One was that his disease progressed very quickly and then he eventually got a tracheotomy, which is where they put in a tube to help him breathe and eat and that seemed to slow down the progress of his disease and that gave them a little bit of hope. And, she also actually stepped away from being his primary caregiver and they were able to hire people to caregive so she could go back to her role as as wife, partner, supporter.

And those two things helped them adjust to this disease being kind of their new normal instead of being a hopeless, devastating experience for them. And what's really interesting too is that she talks about their relationship actually being better now because of the way they've had to solve these problems together. And obviously I don't think she would wish this kind of a diagnosis on anyone. But wow, what a powerful message of positivity to be able to say that something in your life is better after something like this has happened to you.

And one other thing I'll say too, we mentioned the documentary in, in this interview, AUGIE is the name of the documentary and it's going to be on Netflix and Amazon beginning on March 20th. So if you are interested and inspired by their story, which I'm certain you will be, you can check it out.

MU: Here is Cindy with Lynne.

CK: This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here with Lynne Nieto. Lynne, thank you so, so much for joining us today on the #WeGotGoals podcast.

LN: Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

CK: Lynne, the first big question we usually ask people on, #WeGotGoals is about a big goal you've achieved, why it was important and how you got there and we'll kind of get to that. But you know, first of all, you're a person who's had your life and presumably your goals within that life kind of upended. I had the chance to see the incredible new documentary, AUGIE, about your life and your husband's. But for those of our listeners who haven't had the chance to see it yet, I wonder if we could start by filling them in a little bit on the basics of your story.

LN:OK. Well, about 14 years ago, Augie—who started Life Fitness when he was in his early twenties—super great athletes, very, very fit, began feeling, actually could see tangibly that those weights when he was lifting weights was he was less able to do the same amount of weight. And about that time he kept telling me that and I’m, I was basically saying, hey look dude, you're getting older, you know, things like that not work quite as well as they did before. And he noticed some twitching and some they call them fasciculations, which is basically twitching of your muscles in his pec region. And then kind of the real telling thing was he was having a hard time putting shaving cream on with his right hand. And so coming up, this is coming up March, 13 years ago, we went to the Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale and received the first of seven diagnoses of ALS.

And for, if you're not familiar with ALS, it is a progressive neurological disease that's typically fatal and two to five years. The brain works fine and it's basically almost like an electric cord gets cut where the brain is sending the impulse for movement, but the voluntary muscles aren't receiving it. So in Augie, it started out in his arms, progressed to his legs, progressed into his bulbar area, his in his mouth region where he could no longer speak and then finally into his diaphragm and he was trached, is on a ventilator, has been trached for six and a half years now, so about halfway through his diagnosis and he uses his computer and does all this business work using his feet. So he has a roller ball on his right foot. He has a left click on his left foot and he has his computer mounted on his wheelchair in front of him and he basically works a lot now.

So he always worked a lot. His golf game sucks now so he doesn't spend time playing golf that. But that being said, I just left him a few minutes ago upstairs and he was working out in our garage, so he about three years ago, four years ago, he started working out again with special coaches that up until Augie, had only worked with spinal cord injury patients. So he does three, three hour workouts weekly and that's just been really special for him to go back to something that was so core to his life before.

CK: Did you say the first of seven diagnoses?

LN: Yes. We kept going to try to find somebody that would tell us we didn't have ALS. We were unsuccessful in that. Yeah. My brother, who's an oncologist really kind of took us under his wing when we got our first diagnosis and we traveled the country to the ALS specialists all over and unfortunately got the same answer six more times.

CK: I can't even imagine what that must've felt like for you. How did you process this and how did it change the way you looked at life and at goals and at the future?

LN: It's I think any time you receive a life altering message, whether it's health or it's, there;s sort of just the shock factor that you can't quite wrap your arms around. In Augie’s case, he went into a deep depression. Couldn’t—here's this highly functioning guy, started the world's largest health equipment manufacturing company and he basically couldn't function and ultimately tried to commit suicide about three months into the diagnosis. About that time—we live in a home that’s down the side of a cliff that has at least three to five stairs in and out of every room and I kind of went the other direction to hypervigilance mode of trying to figure out how we could remain in our home and get an elevator installed and so I went into kind of fix it mode and that was sort of how I tasked myself through it and it was almost like you were trying to just keep your head above water. That's the only thing. I look back at that time as a real just kind of foggy time, really like, stopped working out, stopped of doing everything that was positive and good in our life and just trying to stay on top of things.

CK:How and when do you feel like the kind of—because obviously you all have accomplished so much since then. I mean, how did that start to shift for you, do you think?

LN:It started shifting probably about five years into the diagnosis. Actually, no—it really shifted about the time Augie was trached and put on a ventilator. Up until then his disease progressed in a pretty, a slow clip for ALS, but it was definitely, Augie was going downhill and a lot of things were thought of in terms of, you know, is this the last birthday, the last Christmas will he ever get to see our kids graduate from college? So a lot of things were kind of looked at it that way. Then in that last six and a half years since he's been trached, his disease seems to have stalled out. He's healthy with the exception of ALS. So now this is just sort of our new normal and we've lived with it so long—we were fortunate enough or we are fortunate enough to have lived this for so long that this is sort of normal. It's our normal, at least.

CK:We’ll get back to my Interview with Lynne in just a minute, but first a word from our sponsor this week. This episode was brought to you by Chicago Sport and Social Club. With them, it's more than a game. It's a social sports experience. Whatever your personal goals are, big or small, Chicago Sport and Social Club can list many reasons why you should play. It might be the sand between your toes, meeting people and moving your social life outside for a season. Whatever your goals or reason for playing, Chicago Sport and Social Club has a beach volleyball league for you. You can create a team of all women. You can grab a group of co eds or you can sign up as an individual and get set up with the team. In any case, if bump set and spike are the words that punctuate your summer, you're going to want to register for the league built around you. To do it, go to www.chicagosocial.com, and use code goals. That's G-O-A-L-S when you register for 5 percent off and hey, that's good through March 15. And uh, now it's back to my talk with Lynne

CK: So let's kind of then go, go back to that big question, what a big goal that you have accomplished is why it was important to you and how you got there?

LN:It’s interesting. When you first posed that question in the email, I was thinking back to career goals and that— as the more I sat and thought about it, the more it, it occurred to me, it wasn't my career goals that really are today the things I'm most proud of. It's our personal, our family, our four kids there who are all married, all have kids, all graduated from college. They're happy, they're fulfilled, they're productive, they're smart. That, that goal I think is probably my proudest and that we’re responsible for another human being's life and that that's a pretty hefty thing to take care of. And so I think that's, even though I'm not certain that was a conscious goal, it ended up being that way. I think how Augie and I were able, not that we can take all the credit because they're just great, great individuals, but kind of living our life by example and invest in their lives. So I think that would be probably, you know, at almost 60, that would probably be my proudest goal to date.

CK: Remind me, how old were your children when Augie was diagnosed?

LN:Our youngest was 17 and our oldest was 21. So we had three in college, one in high school,

CK:And I know it's touched on in the film, but what do you think are some ways that, that this diagnosis and the way that you and Augie have dealt with it, how has that affected your children's lives and do you think that they have taken some examples from the way that you've dealt with it?

LN:I think I'm most proud of personally of showing how a marriage can go through struggles and face very difficult times and still come out the other side in a in a good manner. I think I've been a good example to our four kids of what for better or worse means and for staying. And as I touched on in the documentary, I'm not really super certain that Augie and I would be married today without having gone through what we've gone through. Honestly, I know it sounds really weird, but we are the best part of our marriage we've ever been. So if having lived that example for our kids makes—that's a huge goal too. I'm not certain again, was a goal as much as an outcome.

CK:Yeah. Sometimes the most compelling goals are ones we didn't necessarily intend to set out for us specifically, but ones that we just reach. Lynne—you did mention, and I thought that was a fascinating part of the documentary that your partnership with Augie has changed through all of this. Can you talk a little bit more about about what you just said about how it is that you two have been able to work together and how your relationship has changed as you've, as you've grown to face these challenges?

LN: Well before ALS, I think you had two of the most independent people on the face of the planet that probably in our heads thought we didn't need each other that much. And that's not always a great way to go about a relationship. So we went from Augie being on the road all the time to us being together all the time. I became Augie’s caregiver as he needed more help. We were never apart, so that was quite the transition and never expected that to be that way and I think just in general through the struggles that, and and through the communication difficulties, we've had to learn to be more thoughtful in what we say to one another because Augie’s having to type it with his feet. I've had to learn to listen and be patient and in that quiet thoughtful time, I think we're better people. It’s so much easier to fly off the handle and it's say things without thinking.

CK:And obviously you have these common goals now with the foundation, with Auggie's Quest and with the ALS Therapy Development Institute. I wonder, does having those sorts of goals jointly also change the your relationship and the way that you work together?

LN:Absolutely. I think that’s, we're in lock step together now and have a common goal and not unlike being a proud of having taken care of our kids as individuals and and hope to have formed them in some manner into the people they are today, I think we carry that same spirit of because we are the lucky ones. We've been able to live with this disease a lot longer and adjust and we really feel like we have a responsibility to take care of those suffering with ALS that can't because of either their family situation, their progression rate. That we need to make a difference, and so we are solely dedicated at the ALS Therapy Development Institute to finding effective treatments and ultimately a cure for ALS. And we have a unique situation in that we can, Augie can bring his huge sphere of influence to bear. The fitness industry has been behind us since day one. They continue to do that, so I think we have a sense of responsibility.

CK:I know that the ALS Therapy Development Institute is a little bit different from the way a traditional academic medical center or research institute is set up. I wondered if you could talk a little bit about how you worked to find the right people and resources to to go about this goal of a cure in a slightly different way.

LN:Well, I think what's been really fun for me to watch because I wasn't around when Augie was starting Life Fitness, was to see his entrepreneurial spirit and how how he looks at things differently. He runs the institute as if it's a for profit business, it’s the world's largest not for profit, ALS only research institute, and he's gone at this as if it were a business and with the same laser focus and consideration for needing lightning speed in a disease that kills people in two to five years. So that's where I think he's done such just a unique approach to it because he is approaching it as if it's a business.

CK:And for you, I, I've read, I know that you had to get a little bit more comfortable with, with being in the spotlight then you might have been before. So I wonder if you could talk a little bit about that and how you've sort of worked on that aspect of all this.

LN:Well, I can't say I am comfortable. I'd like to say I was. I am not comfortable, but I have learned to be in discomfort and just lean into the discomfort and be okay with it and not to worry so much about how something's perfect or not perfect and just try to speak more from the heart. Sometimes I'm better at it than others, but um, and, and I know that, um, if, if Augie could, he would be the spokesperson, but now I feel that sense of responsibility to being his voice.

CK:That so clearly comes through in the documentary too. And you and I were talking a little bit before we started recording about what, what it was like to, to go through that process of making the film and, and watching the film. And could you talk a little bit more about what that, what that felt like and um, you know, you mentioned that your opinion on it has changed a little bit now that you've seen it a few

LN:Yeah. I think this was something that—Augie really wanted to do this. I being pretty much an introvert, this isn't something that would be on my radar screen and my deal with Augie was that I would agree to go through with doing the documentary, but we weren't going to sugar coat our lives that we were going to share the, the bad as well as the good. And that was very cathartic in many ways. It was also really strange to have people in your bedroom with booms and lights and cameras and, and trying to, I guess just ignore them the best you could to try to be genuine. And that was interesting at times. I'm glad in retrospect we did it. It took a year in chunks of time. It was intrusive. On the other hand, I feel like now we have something that can shed some light on ALS, on trying to find treatments and a cure, on others living with the disease and how we really can make a difference. I do believe that we will have, we know we will be in phase one trials with our first drug in the first quarter of 2018, money willing. We'll have it in phase 2A trials in the third quarter of 2018, where it's actually in people with ALS. That's huge. That's huge in a disease that's an orphan disease only because people die so quickly with it.

That's so exciting. I can't tell you. It felt like we felt like we were kind of like the little little train that could going up the hill, going up the hill, going up the hill, asking for money and just telling people to trust us that we'll do well with it and now we have something tangible and that that's, that just makes it all worthwhile. And we have two other drugs in the pipeline that look promising. So I think the difference today versus when we were diagnosed 13 years ago is that there's hope today, you’re not necessarily told to just go home and get your affairs in order like we were.

CK: I mean, it seems clear that watching Augie fight must have changed your kind of perception of what's possible, right?

LN: Absolutely. It's, it's exciting. It. I have a big smile on my face right now and there's nobody here mean it's just.

I mean, you talk about goals, we get this accomplished, we get a treatment and ultimately a cure for ALS? That's a lofty goal and uh, we're, that we quite possibly will get there.

CK: As I said, I mean, that's the other big question we ask on this podcast #WeGotGoals and I'm, I'm not really sure you could come up with a more compelling goal than, than curing this disease. What else do you think it will take to get there? And what else would you say about your plans to, to continue this effort in the next, you know, five, 10, few years, however long it takes?

LN:I hope it doesn't take that long for those living with the disease. What we've really shown here, Cindy, is that ALS is not an incurable disease. It's, it's just underfunded. So when you ask what we need, it's all money. It's money, it's a plan to accomplish what we're looking to accomplish at the institute, which is treatments and ultimately a cure for this disease. So right now that's the only thing holding us back. If we had a huge windfall of funds coming into the institute tomorrow, we have a plan in place to spend it. So we wouldn't be scrambling around trying to figure out what we're going to do with it. So that's how forward thinking our institute is.

CK:You all have raised a pretty incredible amount of money so far. Right? What have your total's been?

LN:So Auggie’s Quest has raised about $62 million in the last 13 years and Augie as the chairman of the ALS Therapy Development Institute overall during that same period of time has, has raised total between Augie’s Quest and the institute. $110 million. That's huge. It’s the biggest thing that's ever been done in ALS and we've spent it all. Yeah.

CK:What I do and I think that helps people get their, wrap their heads around a little bit. What's, what's required here. How can people. I mean, I know that everyone listening is going to want to watch the documentary as soon as they're able to. Um, what are some of the other ways that people can keep tabs on the work that you all are doing and get involved?

LN:Well, Augie’s Quest is part of the ALS Therapy Development Institute, we’re a fundraising arm of it so you can see the work that we're doing and events that we have coming up at www.augiesquest.org, and for specific things at the institute to see AT-1501, which is a drug name not too sexy, but something better will come up in time at our website at als.net. Takes you to our institute's website and I think just to see the things that we're doing and even see other people living with this disease, to put a face on it. So we also have a program within Auggie’s Quest called Team Quest for ALS.

Uh, it is, we've done. We just finished our fourth half marathon, Rock ’n Roll half marathon. They’re around the country. We did our first one in Brooklyn, followed by Philadelphia, Denver and just recently in Las Vegas. That was crazy. And we've so far through those four by getting thorough our fitness industry contacts, getting people to get teams together, we've raised over a million dollars. So if you have people that are interested in participating, you can see that on augiesquest.org website for future ones, we're doing one in San Diego, Nashville and Denver again, and New Orleans. It's a cool program.

CK:Lynne, it's been so wonderful talking with you and I can't thank you enough for sharing your story and sharing a, a glimpse of your, of your life through the film and, and through this talk today. I thank you so much for taking the time.

LN:Well, thank you for having us. And thank you to the listeners for anything you can do to help us get to our goal of finding treatments and a cure for ALS.

CK:This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it's another thing that's better with friends. So hey, share it with yours. You can subscribe to it wherever you get your podcasts and please while you're at it, leave us a rating or review. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Lynne Nieto; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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This episode is presented by Chicago Sport and Social Club, reminding you that summer is just around the corner. Get into a summer volleyball league now and use code "GOALS" to get 5 percent off until March 15.

It's no secret that we're majorly in awe of the ladies of Stylisted — after all, this isn't the first time we've talked (okay, gushed) about co-founders Julia and Lauren on aSweatLife.

But when we brought them into evolveHER to be interviewed during our Lunch-and-Learn live podcast recordings, we were reminded all over again why these ladies have inspired us so much in the first place. Seeing them speak in front of an all-female audience (many of whom had entrepreneurial inclinations) was nothing short of a kick in the pants to go after what you want.

Another thing that really came through over the microphone was the true teamwork and friendship that acts as the foundation of Stylisted.

"The partnership is our business," Lauren stated matter-of-factly. "It was in the very beginning and it is to this day."

As friends and partners, Julia and Lauren learned to rally each other when one was feeling down. At the same time, they learned one major entrepreneurial lesson early on: never be afraid to ask for help, whether from each other or from outside resources.

"People want to help," stressed Julia. "Everyone is eager in a way to show off what they're good at and help you out... definitely don't be afraid of that."

Just in case we weren't convinced, Lauren added, "Your ability to ask for help and leave your shame at the door is all you have for the first two years.” When you don't have money or experience, you're forced to admit when you don't know something. Luckily, as the co-founders discovered, all it takes is a simple ask, and the entrepreneurial community is usually excited to help a fellow founder.

Julia and Lauren recognize that they're fortunate to have been able to grow together as founders, when all too often you read about rough breakups and unwanted exits between partners in start-ups. They attribute that path to having the same long-term vision for the company. At evolveHER, Julia and Lauren spoke about the importance of having the same overall vision for a company when working with a partner and co-founder — but at the same time, they make sure to set small, achievable goals that you can accomplish on a shorter timeline.

With balanced goals and a balanced partnership, one thing is clear: the Stylisted co-founders are paving the way for female entrepreneurs in the tech space to empower each other.

KG:All right, welcome to the #WeGotGoals podcast, live edition from SweatWorkingWeek. My name is Kristen Geil. I am sitting here with Julia and Lauren from Stylisted. Hi Guys. Thanks for being here.

JC, LK: Hello, thanks for having us.

KG: We're excited to hear everything that you have to say. So let's start from the beginning. The story of how you guys came to be is more than just, you saw a problem and you worked to create a solution. It's also about the two of you coming together with your unique strengths to make an idea into a reality. Can you guys share your origin story with us?

JC: Sure. It’s Lauren's brainchild, so I'll let her tell the tale for us.

LK: Stylisted was very much born from a personal pain point. We were inspired by a professor who told us to start what we know. We had both just moved to Chicago to attend business school and we were both entrepreneurial.

We had always wanted to start a business and we had kicked around a bunch of ideas, but this start what you know concept, which seems so obvious to us now, was kind of a novel idea. We had these ideas that had nothing to do with our experience or expertise. And after many failed attempts to get my makeup done before friend's wedding, all coming to a head at a wedding that I had in Atlanta. I called Julia and I said, why is it so difficult to find out who's good and who's available when it comes to event prep? I want to get my makeup done or my hair done, but I don't know who's in my area, who can do a great job. And she completely commiserated, shared her own failed attempts and also kind of educated me on this call and told me about the life of the freelance makeup artist.

She had worked directly with makeup artists in her time at NARS cosmetics before business school and understood their pain points that they work at some salon or cosmetic counter only to be told how much, how many hours that can work and when and to give 50 percent to the salon owner. And they want to freelance more to supplement their income, but they can't find clients. So Julia's experience in my experience really came together. It was the perfect marriage and we decided to build a solution.

KG: So how did Stylisted start? I know you didn't come up with the app right off the bat.

JC: No, it was incredibly manual. We took a Powerpoint Deck and I reached out to makeup artists and hairstylists that I knew from my previous position. I told them about the idea. We got validation that they wanted what we were proposing to build and got them to send little bios, photos of their work and we created this pdf deck and started sending it to all of our friends who are getting married, who had business school formals, interviews, things like that. Anything you could think of where you'd want a blowout or you know, full-on makeup for you and your friends and people were being very receptive to it and they liked the idea. They started asking to book people and the stylists were getting excited about it. So that was our absolutely free way of starting the business and beginning to test it out.

KG: And then you saw that there was a demand for these services and you moved forward with creating an app from there.

JC:A website, your website first we scraped together our pennies and decided to hire someone. Actually it was like a godsend. Lauren met our CTO, advisor, our technical advisor at an internship and he recommended this guy to us who needed to diversify his portfolio. He had been doing political websites in DC and we're like, we have a doozy for you. We're going to have you build this beauty website.

LK:Here’s something different.

JC:And he did it for a few thousand dollars and a lot of hours and sweat and we spent our Christmas vacation our second year of business school just working on the website and iterating. And then we launched essentially when we graduated.

KG:Wow. That's a lot to accomplish while you're still in business school and dealing with all of that course load.

JC:Yes it is. But we at Chicago Booth, we did the new venture challenge, which essentially was a class that allowed us to grow and cultivate this business and test it out and get feedback. So I would argue that it's easier to do it in business school then it would be for someone with a full time job family, things like that. We were very much in a position to take the risk and spend the time.

KG:And because you guys were in this together from the start, you had that advantage of having someone to lean on when things got tough, sleepless nights. I'm sure countless hours spent trying to accomplish just one thing. We've all heard about accountability is the strategy for going after your goals, but you take it to a new level when you're talking about starting a company with a partner and a co-founder. So how do you think that partnership has impacted your business and how you guys approach goals as a team?

LK: I mean the, the partnership is our business. It was the very beginning and it is to this day. You know, for us, and I've said this before, it almost felt like the game of chicken at the beginning where we would bounce an idea or something we're going to do off the other person and say like, I'm going to email so and so like five women's groups this week and see what they say.

And once you say it out loud and you commit to that person, you're going to do that. Then they also feel like they have to do something and you're kind of like, OK, and then after awhile you're like, we're doing this like we are building towards beginning of business. So that was kind of the origin and um, you know, to this day we keep ourselves accountable and it's, it's been almost five years, very much like a marriage. You hope that you grow together. And thankfully we have. But I think in terms of goals, I think we think about goals in terms of short-term and long-term. And I think it's really important on to make sure that you have the same long-term goals or vision, but to spend most of your time and your energy on those short-term goals to make this feel digestible and something that you can actually accomplish.

So instead of saying, I'm going to sell this business in five years, and that be your primary objective, say, OK, we're going to have a thousand customers by January, or we're gonna, you know, what are the smaller chunks of short term goals that you can actually accomplish? It's like saying, if you want to start going to the gym, you're not going to say, I want to look like a babe by summer. We're going to say, OK, no, I'm going to start going to the gym every three months. Or you know, start drinking more water. Like what are those really small, shorter term goals that you can actually achieve?

KG: Speaking of goals, on the podcast, we ask everyone who comes on to main questions. So let's get into the first one. What is one big goal that you've accomplished with Stylisted? Why was it important? How did you get there? And it can be the same or different for both of you.

JC:I want to say just existing to this day has been the goal. I think from the beginning there were a few things you want to accomplish. You want to solve a problem, you want to help people. In our case, the women like us, the clients with this pain point and the stylist who now we have men and women who’ve doubled their income by working on Stylisted and it's amazing to send out the W-9s. Holy Cow, she made this much that year? And Lauren is so much more in those weeds that when I get to see it, I'm like, Whoa, that's so great.

LK: And people applying for apartments are emailing us, asking them how much did I make this year? And then we're like, oh wow, you made $30,000 last year. That's pretty good.

JC:Yeah, that's, that's amazing. So yeah, there are a lot of different goals that we had when we started it and you know, we're kind of checking them off and obviously we won't sit here and say that a lucrative exit wouldn't be the absolute, you know, wonderful end goal or what we've always said is the company, you know, outgrowing the two of us and how can we work with some larger to continue to grow Stylisted and make it the best it can be. Yeah, I mean we're here four and a half years later and I'm just so proud of.

I mean, that's not a great answer. Sorry. That's not a great answer.

KG: That's a great answer. Lauren, would you agree or do you have anything else?

LK:My answer is similar. I like that I created a job for myself that actually now has a paycheck and insurance, health insurance and that we've created that for other people, jobs that they really like, that you know, they're excited to show up to work every day for and that's really a huge. That was a huge goal for us at the onset and we accomplished that.

KG: Yeah. You can tell that you've really made a tangible impact on these peoples lives. The freelancers that you employ through Stylisted. Has that sort of affected how you look towards the future knowing that you're to thank and sort of responsible for these people and how their lives proceed from here?

JC:Absolutely. It's a lot of pressure, but in a way I think it helps keep us motivated towards those goals because we are a small internal team, but we have, you know, nearly 300 stylists who depend on us for their supplemental income and it's very much a symbiotic relationship. We work really hard for them every single day so that when they go to a client they want to work really hard for us, for the brand and I think so far that's working out.

KGI read an interview that you guys did. I'm not sure when it was from, but I think you said something about the importance of having a short term memory when it comes to achieving goals. Can you sort of share what you meant by that with the group and how it goes into, you know, accomplishing one thing and then moving on to the next.

LK:One thing that we've tried to do is celebrate really small wins but then not allow ourselves to get too hung up because you need to move on to the next small when there are so many setbacks when you're starting a business and running a business and you can't really let yourself get in too much of a funk about anything negative, you have to move forward and celebrate the small wins as they come, even if they feel really small because that kind of thing will just allow you to feel your progress and allow you to wake up the next morning and do it again.

KG: What kind of small wins for examples that you guys celebrated back in the early days or even still today?

JC:Oh, like a celebrity booking us. That’s always fun. I mean hitting a new number, like a weekend where we have, you know, dozens and dozens of weddings like, wow, I can't believe we're doing this. Things like that. They're just special for me or those moments where you do see how it's impacting the freelancers and when they send a little note of gratitude or something like that, it's so small, but that's like the coolest stuff that we love. Even seeing a five star review from a client, we look at that stuff all the time and it means so much when we know that they're getting great service and we're really proud of the brand that we built and what we're putting out there.

KG:Does it get a little bit sweeter? Being able to celebrate those, hitting those small goals with a partner and a friend?

JC:Absolutely.

LK:Absolutely, and it works both ways. The good bad to have somebody to share that with is just necessary.

KG:Yeah, takes a little bit of the burden off you.

LK:Yes.

KG:I know that with a startup, setting realistic goals can be tricky because on the one hand you want to reach for the stars and change the world or change people's lives, but on the other you don't always have a full picture of the data that you're working with or your customer base. Especially early on when you're still sort of experimenting and navigating the new platform that you're creating. How was your goal setting at Stylisted impacted by those unknown factors and how were you able to overcome that?

LKYeah, this kind of goes back to something I touched on earlier, but just starting small setting really small digestible goals for yourself, you don't have to know everything to take what you know and try to act accordingly so your goal can be super small. Like I'm going to email five media outlets today or this week and I'm going to aim to get a response from at least one of them, to have at least one brand placement. You know, you don't have to have all the answers to do something like that. And I think it's important to never use not having the answers as an excuse to not act.

JC:Yeah. I would also say find the data somewhere you can. And we, I mean coming from Booth that was necessary, like, well we would tell all of these teachers and advisors, excuse me, professors, you know there, this doesn't exist, so how are we going to tell you how big the market is? And simply they wouldn't take that for an answer. You'd go out there, look into to the beauty market. Tell us what the salon industry size is, whittle that down to what you think the, you know, how many women who go to the salon would want to take it in home, how many women are going to a makeup counter, things like that, and then start with an MVP and see what actually happens and get that small sample pool and use that and that's kind of what we had to do and that's I think what every entrepreneur has to do because you're going to be convincing a lot of people that your idea is something that you have something here with nothing to fall back on, especially without a track record, especially as women and we needed numbers to back us up and not just two women saying we have a lot of events and we really want this and we think all our friends do so like get on board.

LK:This is gonna be huge!

JC: It wasn't enough, so you find that you figure out a way to find it.

KG:I did an interview with someone who works with entrepreneurs recently and he said the two biggest qualities he tended to see over and over again in successful entrepreneurs was tenacity and being comfortable with the unknown in working with that every day, and it sounds like that's something you guys have navigated really well over the past five years.

JC:Thank you. We've tried.

LK:We’re kind of chipping away at the unknown and in a way you're helped by having it limited resources. In our case, no money because I feel that when some people have unlimited funding, they go right to the solution and they spend thousands or millions of dollars on building what they believe to be the right solution instead of really focusing initially on the problem and figuring out what the right solution is. So we've iterated and our platform has changed and our processes have changed. Our infrastructure has changed. All of that has changed because we couldn't just jump at building that million dollar platform right off the gate.

KG:At aSweatLife, one of our favorite sayings is everything is better with friends and I was really struck by your all's partnership because you weren't afraid to ask for help from each other or from outside people and I think that's something that we struggle with a lot because you don't want to appear weak or like you don't know what you're doing. What advice would you give to women who have big goals for this year, for the future and want to enlist their friend's talents and support in trying to achieve those?

JC:I think people want to help is the first thing we have asked for so much help for the past four or five years and everyone is eager to, in a way, you know, show off what they're good at and help you out. When you ask for someone's advice, they're flattered. It's a good thing to be asked for help. So definitely don't be afraid of that. And at the same time, you know, be careful who you align yourself with. You want someone who truly is there to support you. You don't want someone who's going to knock down your ideas or you know, be in competition with you. It's hard to. It's hard to find what we have. I feel very, very lucky and I think that everyone can do it, but you really have to be careful in picking that counterpart and so many times in the beginning we had people say, why are you doing this with your friend? It’s not going to end well, and here we are. We're still going.

LK:Totally.

JC: I’m Lauren's maid of honor in April.

LK:She is.

KG:Congratulations you guys are going to look beautiful I’m. You guys are going to have the best hair and makeup and the business that day.

JC:Exactly, that’s the hope.

KG:What was an example of a time where you remember having to ask for help either from each other or from an outside source?

LK: I mean, your ability to ask for help and leave your shame at the door is all you have in the first, I would say two years. You don't have money. You don't have any experience and you just have to continually put yourself out there and ask people for help and admit when you don't know something and empower people that do know that thing that you don't k

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Sick, tired, lonely and lost. That's the point where Jessica Zweig, founder and CEO of the SimplyBe Agency knew her path with Cheeky Chicago had ended and something needed to change.

The story of changing paths - especially when it means shuttering something that's gained public recognition the way that Cheeky Chicago had - may be a topic that some guests on our podcast #WeGotGoals would avoid.

But for Zweig, her willingness to share this journey was the perfect mix of authentic emotion and magic for the live audience in attendance for our recording of this episode during January's #SweatworkingWeek.

Zweig shared the inception and co-founding of the online lifestyle magazine that gave women nightlife, restaurant and lifestyle tips as well as deals and events in Chicago. Behind the events, the nights out and the years of hard work, Zweig told the audience that she was suffering during what should have been high moments.

"I ran cheeky for six and a half years and I was really burnt out by the end," Zweig said. "Inside I was miserable, especially for the last year or so."

In a downtrodden moment following chronic sickness and surgery, Jessica understood a nearly universal truth: that if she moved on, she would almost certainly be OK.

"If you've ever created anything, right, it like, doesn't feel like it's something that's separate from you. It's you, it's your creation. And that's how I felt about Cheeky.

The ability to learn from moments like that - we've found through episode after episode of #WeGotGoals - is what makes guests on #WeGotGoals successful. The lesson's that you'll hear Zweig share are useful for anyone not interested in learning them the hard way.

JACAre you guys ready? I think we are too, right?

JZ: Yes, we’re so ready.

JAC: OK, we're going to do this. I'm going to get my official podcast voice on.

JZ: Woo-hoo, me too, then.

JAC: Hello, Jessica Zweig.

JZ: Hello, Jeana with two last names.

JAC: Yes, OK, good, we’re ready. I'm live with Jessica Zweig on the #WeGotGoals podcast. Hi, Jessica!

JZ: Hi Jeana, so good to see you!

JAC: Good to see you too. Thank you so much for being here with us and with our live audience during SweatWorking week.

JZ: Thank you for having me.

JAC: So on #WeGotGoals, we talk about big goals we've accomplished and big goals that we're striving to accomplish, but first we want to get to know you. So talk to us about how you spend your days and what you do for a living.

JZ: So I run an agency called the SimplyBe Agency. So we're a personal branding agency, which means we work with people as our clients versus a typical agency that works with products and businesses and brands. We work with actual human beings in developing thought leadership for our clients. So what that looks like is we help them clarify their message, build their digital platforms, launch their initiatives, help them grow audience, ideally revenue, a new opportunity to live what they love. And what do I do on a daily basis? Like every entrepreneur, it's totally different. A lot of our time is spent strategizing and building the identities of our clients because they're, they’re—we’re all brands, right? Hello personal branding. It's the space that I'm in, but a lot of our clients, a lot of people don't know how to really articulate what they bring and their value and their, their message in a way that's clear, consistent, compelling. So we really say that that's our sauce at SimplyBe is helping really define what makes you amazing and articulating that in a way that you couldn't for yourself without us.

And then a lot of our clients, we actually manage their personal brands. So we're creating content, managing their social media channels, helping pitch them for speaking engagements, all the things. So we're full service and uh, that's, that's the core of what my agency does. But we do a handful of other little things, which I'm sure we'll talk about too.

JAC: So live what you love. I love that phrase and it sounds so simple, but I bet it's more difficult, wouldn’t you say?

JZ: Absolutely. I mean I run my own business and live what I love, but it all has its own challenges. No day is perfect. You never feel like you're there, there. Where is there? I don't even think it exists. And I think you know what? People really want to do though is feel like they're getting paid and monetizing their genius and what they're good at, you know, what they're good at and what they love to do.

And sometimes those things are not always the same. You know, ideally most people are searching and striving for that. And today we live in a beautiful world where anyone can be a media channel and audience is currency, right? So if you grow your own audience, that's a commodity that you can leverage in a lot of different ways to live what you love. So that is really why I think personal branding is so relevant right now. I don't think I could have built this business five years ago. A lot of people are like personal branding that's interesting or what's, what's that? And I get either one of those reactions and I think now we live in a really exciting time where you can, if you're intentional with how you're showing up online. You can open up a lot of new doors for yourself

JAC: And obviously you're doing very well with it. You've got a team that's present here today and you’re incredibly successful. So congrats on all of that.

JZ: Thank you.

JAC: So, let's get to the first big question. So talk to me about a big goal that you've accomplished and how you got there.

JZ: So I've had an interesting career track and I'll, I'll keep it tight, but I used to run a company called Cheeky Chicago. We were an online magazine for women in the city. We were around for seven years. If you were a millennial girl living in Chicago between 2008 and 2014, you knew what Cheeky was and I left that business in 2014 to launch SimplyBe. And I took a kind of a winding road full of detours and I ended up working for a corporate company for two years out of those these last three years. So my goal when I quit that job to relaunch SimplyBe was just to make money and pay my rent and you know, work for myself.

It was really truly that simple. I say that 2017 was the year that I built a plane in the air. Literally that's how it felt. I was just in reaction to wanting to get away from another situation and sort of re establish myself in Chicago and I didn't really know what that was gonna look like. So unlike I think a lot of entrepreneurs in and in 2018 we've gotten clear and we'll talk about that. But you know, are all about having that plan. I always advise people have a plan and I didn't have a plan in 2000, the very beginning of 2017. I just wanted to take on some clients and make some money. And within 11 months I grew from a team of two to a team of five. I have a full roster of clients, we have our own office space in the Google building and business just keeps coming and so it's a testament to, you don't always need a plan. You should, but you don't always need a plan. You just got to put the right people around you, hustle, work, work hard, and you know, believe you can do it to half the battle.

JAC: So I'm interested to know what you learned from living that phase of your life when you didn't have a plan. Y

JZ: Yeah. You know, I think it really comes down to the people you put around you. I have the most amazing team. I will say I have the best team in the city of Chicago and I really believe that and part of it's luck. Part of it is just being in the right place and the right time on both sides, but it's also really understanding as a founder, as an entrepreneur, what you're not good at as much as knowing what you are good at and putting people around you that can fill in the gaps. Not only just a fill in the gaps because you need the gaps filled, but because they are rock stars in their own right and my job as their leader is to get out of their way and let them shine and empower them to grow careers and not just be, you know, an employee of a company. And so I would say people are definitely helpful when you don't have a plan because they'll keep you accountable. When someone's on your payroll, like as an entrepreneur, as a small business owner, like shit gets real when people work for you, you are accountable to someone's livelihood. And so that really helped me get, get clear, make better decisions faster. And also the right clients, right? So your business is defined by the clients that you say yes to as much as it is the clients that you say no to. And I took on a lot of the wrong clients right up front this last year and I learned a lot and I don’t work with those kinds of clients anymore.

Right? So I think a lot of things can attribute to not having, helping you get through a year like that or a time like that without a plan. It’s really about people, mentors, employees, clients.

JAC: So in going from sort of one phase of your life with Cheeky Chicago into this brand new phase where you're empowering people and helping them find their voice, what sort of, what sort of led to that, what sort of lead to you finding your voice, which was helping others find their voice?

JZ: Yeah, that's a great question. So I always say that. OK, so you guys need to know that I went to school for theater. I got a degree as an actress. Like literally I always, I say this a lot. When I graduated college I knew how to do two things. I knew how to wait tables and be dramatic and I was really good at both.

I still am. So I was like, no, no business, like calling myself an entrepreneur. Right. And so I started Cheeky Chicago when I was 26. I had been doing the acting thing for awhile and I was ready to be done with it. I had this light bulb moment. I had a partner. We had this joint light bulb moment and we started Cheeky and we just totally faked it until we made it and I always say that during that experience I built my own personal brand by accident. I was the face of the magazine that happened to have a lot of followers, so a lot of people were interested in me and it was the dawn of social media. You guys, this was 2008, so this was before Instagram. This is right when Facebook left the universities and anyone could use Facebook and Twitter has just exploded. And so I sort of grew up on social and by virtue of that as I was starting to get Jessica's following and so I say built my personal brand by accident and then by design and then something really incredible happened in 2014 when I left Cheeky to launch SimplyBe. People. I felt like were coming out of the woodwork wanting to work with me, and no one knew how good I was, like no one knew if I sucked or if I was actually really legit and I had this Aha moment back then. Wow, there's power in building an equity in your, in your brand name, and developing a story and a persona. Ideally an authentic persona, but a persona nonetheless that people can latch onto and believe in. And it really opened up a lot of doors for me. It made me money. It gave me opportunity, it gave me exposure. I met amazing people. I mean that was all from having a Jessica Zweig's personal brand. And so that evolution of really finding that myself and it does, it comes naturally to me. I grew up on social, so I'm able to teach it to other people and for sometimes hold their hand through that process. That’s why they hire us. And um, yeah. I don't know if that answers your question.

JAC: Yes. So let's talk about the nuts and bolts of starting SimplyBe.

JZ: Yeah.

JAC: So walking away, from Cheeky, this thing that you had built that people love, that people still talk about, what did it take to know that it was time? What did it take for you to make the leap and start SimplyBe?

JZ: All really good questions, you know, to be frank, I had a—I ran cheeky for six and a half years and I was really burnt out by the end. There were a lot of things that people didn't see that happened in that business. People were like, oh, it's so glamorous and it's so fabulous and it's so fun and to be a Cheeky Girl. And like inside I was miserable. Especially for the last year or so, I started getting really sick, I actually still get like little infections from, I developed an autoimmune disease when I was running C heeky. I got super sick and ended up having to have surgery on that sickness. I had a very challenging relationship with my partner. Um, I very indirectly created a toxic environment of employee, but there were a lot of things there that were really, really hard. Right? But it was my first business and I learned so much. I love and kiss and send light to every single moment of that experience. And every single person, I swear to God I do. They were the biggest teachers. And so by the end of that I just, I was really ready to walk away. It was like a dark night of the soul kind of moment towards the end there because—raise your hand if you're a business owner. We have entrepreneurs in the room. OK, cool. If you've ever created anything, right, it's like, doesn't feel like it's something that's separate from you. It's you, it's your creation. And that's how I felt about Cheeky. It wasn't this thing that I created. It was me and I was it. And so how do you say out loud like I don't want to do this anymore? And it was incredibly painful experience. So when I, when I ended up taking the leap to leave and do SimplyBe very similar to this sort of last year when I created SimplyBe 2.0, I didn't have much of a plan either. I just knew I wanted to do my own thing and call it SimplyBe and do marketing and branding, consulting and get some clients and be a one woman shop and it was very reactive versus proactive. This year because I had such great success in 2017 and as I said, shit got real.

I put a plan in place, so 2018, we have a blueprint, like a very clear quarter by quarter micro down goals and metrics and numbers and multiple revenue streams that we're building out and sales and marketing strategy. It's all there now. Right. And that's. And that makes me feel really good because I think you need, you need that. And my whole team is vetted on that and it's just a different experience now. So the nuts and bolts weren't there. But here I am nonetheless. And you know, now we're moving forward with a lot more in place.

JAC: And it sounds like you almost led with intuition.

JZ: Yeah, absolutely. And that's so funny that you say that. So quick story, I was still running Cheeky. It was towards the tail end I had had that surgery. I tell this story often, but it's a life changing moment.

I was sitting, I was recovering from the surgery, which if anyone's ever had surgery, you know how intense that experience can be, and I was sitting outside in a park and I had like an emotional breakdown. Like I just started crying. I was so tired. I wanted to go back to work, but I couldn't. All I had been doing was Cheeky for, you know, six, five, six years and I have this little tattoo on my wrist. I don't know if you can see it, but it says simply be. It's written in my own handwriting that I'd gotten in my early twenties and I looked down at my wrist and I heard a voice like my intuition. And it was the first time in my life that I heard crystal clearly a voice, like another voice that came from somewhere else, but it was also within me that said, “You can, you can walk away, you can slow down, you can step out of this. You're OK. It's OK to take a break, a breather. It's OK to listen to your heart.” And I looked at my wrist and I was like, whatever I do next, and I didn't even know what it was I'm going to call it simply be as a reminder to be authentic to wherever I am in that particular time and to ideally help other people do the same. Right? Because every business you do, you should be in service, right? It's not about you, it's about what can you provide people. And so that's where that really came from. And that was, it was all intuition ever since then. And I've never stopped listening to my intuition.

JAC: Incredible. How did you hone that? Have you always sort of been intuitive?

JZ: I think we're all intuitive. I think we're all intuitive. We just need to give ourselves some space and time to hear it.

But that was a pivotal moment. That's when I really started meditating more. That's when I started getting into more spiritual thought leaders. I've always been a little bit into the woo-woo, but now I'm like majorly into the woo. It's like the biggest part of my life. Ask anybody that knows me well. And so ever since—and, and just to be clear, once you hear your intuition, doesn't mean that you're never going to not ignore it. Like you're, you're never gonna be perfect. Once you listen to your intuition, you're still gonna make mistakes and be led down a path where you're like, yeah, my gut is telling me not to do this, but I'm gonna do it anyway because my head and my heart and the people around me are saying this is good. Right? I've had plenty of those experiences. But it comes from sharpening your intuition and getting really quiet with yourself more often than not.

JAC:So you accomplish this big goal of doing this thing that allows you to help other people tell their own stories and build a legacy.

JZ: Yeah.

JAC: Let's talk about legacy. What, what do you sort of define legacy as for your clients? And what do you want yours to be?

JZ: That's a great question. Um, so we're, you know, we all want to make money, have a job, build a career. But a legacy is different. Legacy is what do you want? Really, what do you want to leave when you're, when you die? What do you want people to say about you when you're not in the room? What do you want your name to represent in perpetuity? And I think that for, for, you know, for my clients, it's really—we're kind of, we're kind of elitist in the sense that if you don't want to leave a legacy, we don't really want to work with you.

I don't really want to work with people who just want to be Instagram famous. Sorry, I don’t. I want to work with people who want to leave a legacy, who want to help future generations who want to make the world a better place. Not the whole world because you can't. I just had this conversation yesterday with one of my clients. He was like, I want to change the world. He's in the railroad industry, he's a technologist, and he's like, I mean, I know I can't change the whole world, but my little lot of land. And there's 8 billion of us and if we all did that, if we all made the world a better place, the world would be a better place. So that's how I'm changing the world and I have chills just now thinking about him answering that question. It's like, that's, that's really what it's all about.

Just change your life. If you can make the lot of land you sit on better, then you're making a legacy, then you're leaving a legacy. And for me, what's my legacy? Honestly, I really want to create space for women to unapologetically love and accept themselves. I, that's my challenge here on this planet. You know, I was reading this book called Material girl, Mystical world by Ruby Warrington. It's a great book and she has this whole chapter on motherhood. She's like 40, I'm 36. Jury's out if I want kids. And she. And she's like, I'm clear. I don't want kids, whatever, you know, Oprah doesn't have kids. Diane Sawyer doesn't have kids—like all these, like amazing, like thought leader women don't have kids because they feel she's like, I align to that feeling and to that purpose because I feel so maternal in creating businesses and creating impact, whatever it might be, and to be honest, I feel that way about my team.

I feel like my legacy is to make, to give them careers and to make them like super boss, amazing women. And if I can play a small role in that and their future of their lives and they love themselves and create more reverberations for more women than I, then I'm living a legacy to be honest. Like, yeah, I love being an entrepreneur and making money and doing personal branding, but I really love doing that. That's really what I love to do.

JAC: And that you can do anywhere.

JZ: Anywhere. That's the thing about building a personal brand of a higher calling that has a legacy to leave.

JAC: Incredible. So let's talk about the future. Yeah. Accomplished incredible things. What does the future look like? What's the big goal that you want to accomplish in the future and how do you plan to get there?

JZ: So I'm deeming the year 2018, the year of experiences. I think we're so like on our phones all day long in email all day long and the most impact I've experienced is when I've gotten out and traveled to a new place or met a new group of people or gone to an event like this and like learned something. That's how I've expanded, right? And so I want to create that for my business and we want to actually launch, we are launching a various series of high-touch experiences. So we, we do the agency work, we support clients as a revenue stream, but this year we're launching workshops, live workshops where you can come work with me for a day or two and we do personal branding, deep dive intensives. And then I’m also launching, I’ve launched global retreats, so three different masterminds that are happening throughout the year in Bali, Costa Rica and Italy. And these were all like visions that I had in 2017 for where I wanted the business to go and we've set timelines and revenue goals against each and marketing plans behind each. So I mean, behind it all it’s, you know, facebook ads, it's um, you know, launch marketing emails, influencer outreach, all of the things, right. So those are, those are big goals. I essentially want to double my revenues from 2017 to 2018 and that's, that's the, that's the big goal, right. And to get there, I want to open up some other streams of revenue and of course, to be in service and to be creating experiences for people that I believe in that I know will help people.

JAC: And in turn probably hiring a bigger team.

JZ: Yeah. We don't want to get too much bigger. And we have two interns on staff with us now and they're like rock stars. And I have a core team of women. There's another woman that works for me. She's not here, she's in Nashville, but we'll probably hire a couple more people and then freelance out as we need.

And yeah, I don't, I don't really want to build this huge team like 20, 30, 40 a hundred people. That's not my style. I want to keep it boutique and like family.

JAC: So how does someone find these retreats?

JZ: You can go to simply be magic dot com. They are happening in March in Bali, Italy's and May, Costa Rica as a November. They are, um, five day experiences. I partnered up with a master life coach. She's actually a spiritual life coach. So you get one full day with her one full day with me one full day with both of us. And we've built in Cultural Immersions, surfing, you know, going to the water temple in Bali, doing wine tours in Italy, going to the jungle and seeing the monkeys in the animals in the jungle in Costa Rica and all food, organic, included themed dinner parties at night. It's going to be really magical. That's why we're calling the magic mastermind.

JAC: I put Bali on my vision board for this year. So it feels like we're going to have to talk.

JZ: We should definitely this. This room is filled with a lot of women. So I'm wondering what’s one to two pieces of advice that you would give to women who want to find their voice or start anew.

JAC: So you know, I always say that you can't be all things to all people or you'll end up being nothing to no one. Know that when people go to the internet or social media or their phones, they don't go to see how cool you are or skinny you are or what you ate for breakfast. They come to help themselves. They come to better their lives to be educated and inspired, to get information to help their families or their business, whatever. So knowing that when you create content, don't just add to the noise, provide something of value.

Always be in the value mindset so that, that's how you really grow audience. And that's how you grow affinity. When people really feel like you've got something for them and that you're not just all about yourself. And then back to the nothing, everything to everyone and nothing to no one, having a relatively clear topics, right? So if you're talking about how much you love your cat one day and the next day, you're talking about where you're traveling to next and the next day you're posting a recipe and the next day or bitching about your boss and the next day you're talking about, should I move to another neighborhood? Like I don't know who you are and I don't know why I should follow you and I don't know what you have to offer. So really thinking about the core pillars of your life, the things that you really are passionate about that you could talk about every single day, and create what I call content buckets and just try and stay consistent.

So the way you grow an audience online is consistency, clarity, and constancy. That's how you compound. I call it the three Cs. If you really want to grow an engaged following, you gotta, be consistent. Pick your platforms. You've got to be constant, be there all the time and be clear in your message. You can't talk about just one thing because you're going to be boring. But if you talk about 20 things, you're confusing. So coming up with the things that you really that really move you that you love, know and do really well and just be known for that. So that's from a personal branding standpoint, what I always sort of recommend from a high level.

JAC: Perfect. From the audience. We're going to open it up for questions. You'll actually come up to the microphone today and ask your question. So would anyone like to ask a question, of Jessica? Hannah, I knew you would. Get up here.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: So first off, I actually used to love Cheeky. Get the free prosecco at HUB51.

JZ:Oh my God, yes, the Cheeky Card.

AM:I used to love it. Very obsessed, now I’m obsessed with aSweatLife instead. Swap out my obsession. But you did kind of touch on that Cheeky became a little bit toxic. And are there some lessons learned at Cheeky that sometimes now in your new company an event will happen, and you're like, oh my God, because of x, I know to do y.

JZ:Yes, absolutely. Great questions. What didn't I learn a Cheeky that I apply today. It was my first business. I was 26. I ran it for seven years. I mean that's a long time. I learned a lot. Cheeky was my first experience in managing people, so the culture got toxic, right. And I was like 28 maybe at the time when we first started hiring real people and these were like 21 and 22, 23, 24, 26 year old girls. So they were, they were not that much younger than me. They were, we were peers in a way and I wanted them to like me so much. I wanted to be friends. I wanted to hang out, I wanted them to like think I was the coolest boss and you can't, you can't be liked first. You have to be respected first. And I was so afraid of making them mad at me, right? So that when I, when I was, when I had to reprimand them, I, it was awkward like they resented me because they were like, you're my friend. We were just talking about boys an hour ago and now you want to tell me I sent that, that email out wrong. Like that was, it was a line I just did not know how to walk. And with this team, I have a team that respects me first and I respect them and they like me as much as they respect me. And that's a balance I will say. I think I strike pretty well. Now I have a no asshole policy. One of my core values is to be kind. We didn't even have core values at Cheeky. We didn't even have core values. We had a philosophy like to be Cheeky is to be fabulous to be nice to each other, but we were nice to everyone else but each other internally.

At least that's how it felt. You know, when you're running a business as a founder, you're not at your desk a lot, right? So your team, there's an expression when the cat's away, the mice will play. And that was very true for me at Cheeky. And I got burned really bad by that. And I know that when I'm away from my desk at this business, my team is working. And they're having fun, but they're not gossiping, you know, messing around on Facebook and pinterest all day like they're getting their work done. And that's a precedent that I set from the beginning. So that's just an example of it really is about team and as a leader, everything starts with you and it's a note that I set completely differently at SimplyBe.

AM:I would love to know now since you still own your own business and it probably does still feel like a lot of you is in the business. What do you do now to separate and to create boundaries for yourself and to feel good just on your own terms?

JZ:Yeah, well I definitely meditate. I work out a few days a week, so it's a non negotiable. Like I carve out time in the mornings usually before work to go to the gym or to go to a studio. I go to Pure Barre Bucktown shout out it's right across the street from my house. So good. And so there's that right? And I mean I work 24-seven, like I don't like to turn it off. I love to work. It's part of who I am. However, I will say that I brought on Tamara Edwards this year, one of my teammates. And she helps me with my, she came in within two days, she was like, you're doing all of these things and spending all of your time on things you don't need to do. This is not CEO level, this is like staff level and this is like she started policing my schedule, um, and helping me really prioritize what's really worth my time and what, where you going to get the best of me and how I should be spending the most energy and the least.

And I think again, just going back to team, like having people who can really see things you can't and push you to be your best, keep you in line is really helpful. So, you know, and I, when I ran Cheeky, I was single and you know, was like out all the time. Now I'm married, I have a dog, two dogs actually. And I love to be home and so I've just put boundaries innately around my life so I have more balance. But you're still gonna work all the time. So having, having people who can, you know, put that boundary around you to help you do that has been really instrumental.

AM:OK. For the listeners, I really would love for you to tell everyone here about, you know, we, it's this culture. I think what makes, I think all of us who have work experience. It's really the culture that you create that creates productivity and trust and those working relationships. Can you talk a little bit about our Monday meetings? Because that's why I show up on Monday. I just think it's, I just think it's so important, um, for any, any person, entrepreneurs, business owners, just something to think about. I've just always been about this and you actually put it into like an agenda.

JZ: Cool. OK, cool. So every Monday morning we hold a 90 minute meeting. It's all about what's on deck for the week. It's a very intense meeting. It's a one, one time a week. We all got together as a team to do work and to set the tasks for the week. It's very task oriented and at the very end of the meeting I have four core values that I set in my business. Simply be bold, simply be relevant, simply be true and simply be kind. And we just implemented simply be in service, but all the same. To be bold means to step and think outside of your comfort zone. I think we need more bold women in the world like in general, let’s celebrate our boldness, like beyond. To be relevant. Like we want to know what's going on in our industry. We take classes, we read blogs, we keep up, we follow the right influencers were like, we're going to be the experts. We have to. We have to be the experts. To be true is to be authentic, to be yourself, always make no apologies and to be kind is obviously to be kind.

So at the end of every meeting we do a core values roundtable where I have every one of my staff go around and ackno

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Kurt Seidensticker wasn't always obsessed with collagen. In fact, before he founded Vital Proteins, he worked at NASA, training astronauts and designing missions, developed cell phone networks, helped create the first internet in the mid- to late-90s and started a fresh-caught fish and steak eCommerce business.

Everything he learned in these endeavors when coupled with chronic pain in his joints, led him to start the clean collagen company that's quickly evolved into a lifestyle brand.

"I suddenly recognized that everything I had done, all the goals I had set in my life before ... I had this epiphany that I was built for this," Seidensticker told me in front of our very first live audience recording of #WeGotGoals. "This was my purpose. This is what all my other goals culminated in."

Vital Proteins' portfolio of clean, minimally-processed products spans from creamers to bone broths to beauty waters, and from matchas to protein powders to supplements. It's hard to believe that only five years ago, Seidensticker was intrigued by the potential benefits of collagen but couldn't find the right product to help him.

Alongside his daughter- a doctor - he said they "distilled research papers and showed that your body really needed a lot of collagen, especially as you age."

"[We] realized [the body] needed probably 20, 30 grams of collagen a day outside of what it could produce itself, outside of what you were getting in your diet."

Finding that he would have to take countless pills a day to add enough collagen into his daily diet, Seidensticker was dissatisfied. He decided to look for another way to take a larger quantity and more easily incorporate the supplement into his daily life.

At that point he became obsessed with creating what would become Vital Proteins.

"[We] probably spent about a year developing and refining some of the processing to develop a larger form of collagen that you can take."

This laser-focus and complete dedication is in line with the way Seidensticker views any and all of his goals.

"When you're thinking about goal setting, it's great to set a goal, [but] the commitment behind the goal is the key. You almost have to become obsessed with it, meaning nothing else matters."

He illustrated this point with a fitness goal. When getting into shape with a personal trainer, Seidensticker made it a hard and fast rule that he wouldn't book on top of his workout hour. Four to five days a week, he was working out.

And even though it was a personal goal, for Seidensticker it's always a little bit business.

"If I don't take that time to set my own personal goals it actually takes away from my ability to lead and run the organization professionally," he added.

Seidensticker and his team spent the past five years growing rapidly, increasing Vital Proteins' product offerings. All of that growth and innovation take trial and error and for any entrepreneur at the beginning of his or her path, he has a key piece of advice: start somewhere, accept that you'll have failures, but to learn from them, iterate and move on.

For Seidensticker, it's those mistakes and iterations are exactly what's made him able to constantly improve.

___

MU: Awesome! So thank you so much for joining us on the #WeGotGoals podcast and also for a SweatWorkingWeek lunch and learn, Kurt. It's so great to have you.

KS:Thanks for having me. I think this is a great idea. I’m glad I can participate and be a part of it.

MU:Amazing! All right. Let's jump right in because there's a lot a lot to get going on.

So Kurt. Before you started Vital Proteins, which is the clean collagen product company that we know and love you first worked at NASA training astronauts and designing missions. Let that land. And also started many other business ventures including a fresh caught fish and steak e-commerce business. So what connects all of your endeavors?

KS :Yeah it probably starts with my own passion to have challenges and to be able to work through those and kind of create something new. So when I first started off in my career at NASA my goal there was you know every kid probably has this dream to be an astronaut or something like that. So yeah I kind of set the goal like that's what I wanted to do and probably for about four years I worked on becoming an expert in flying the space shuttle and then training astronauts on how to fly the space shuttle. I tend to like—after about three years, what I've noticed in my career is about three years I master what I'm focused on and I go out and I want to seek the next challenge and the next thing in my career. And so I notice after like four years there I was ready for a new challenge. And so it's never just staying in the same place. It's really coming up with a new challenge, a new set of goals focusing on those. If you follow the path of my career there is always not only just taking on new challenges but always fitness and health were always like in my personal passion. And so I went from you know, flying simulators and training astronauts to developing cell phone networks using my software and technology experience that I developed at NASA to going on and doing investment banking and doing the starting up e-commerce businesses working, I actually helped create the very first Internet back in the mid to late 90s. And every time it's always just setting a goal working on it and then looking for the next opportunity. And over time that after doing all this I really wanted to just try to focus on marrying the two of what my passions were personally with fitness with that goal setting, the challenges that I was looking for ,the need to help other people and to be innovative. And so I found myself at Vital proteins so.

MU: Founder yourself at Vital Proteins, really, founded it.

KS: Yeah, founded it.

MU:What specifically brought you into collagen? Like, where did that come into play and say you found the need and here you are .

KS: You know, I was looking for for what to do next in my career.

I had just done an e-commerce business that was the fresh seafood and steaks. And one thing I realized was, it's a challenging business right? We were doing stuff in Hawaii where we actually went down to the harbor got the fish and then that same day then shipped him overnight to people in the U.S. and logistically that's a challenge. You know keeping it fresh is a challenge. And I said, well, I want something a little more—next business is something a little more shelf stable and non-perishable and something that would really help people. And I started looking at a variety of different opportunities and personally in my own life I was going through—aging, right? I was in my mid 40s and I was still trying to run. I've always been a passionate runner and what I noticed was I was no longer able to run every day. And soon every other day became every four days or every five days because I simply wasn't recovering and my joint pain and my knees would start aching after even just a short run of 5K. So I started thinking I was going to change my diet. I was going to actually go on a paleo diet and this is probably in 2011, 2012. And that didn't quite do and I'm trying to look for protein sources because I was still lifting weights are still running and started thinking about what protein I should be taking because really try to get off dairy and get off of whey protein which is like a traditional fitness protein. And I wasn't really into full pea protein or things like that at the time and so I looked at as I started thinking about aging and you start thinking about collagen and you start, I started thinking like OK I know in my knee things are breaking down. And how can I repair that quickly? And I started thinking about college and my daughter who's a medical doctor. We kind of distilled some research papers and showed that your body really needed a lot of collagen especially as you age. So even that even at the age of 25 your body needs a lot of collagen and start to look at how much collagen and your body needed and realized it needed probably 20, 30 grams of collagen a day outside of what it could produce itself outside of what you were getting in your diet. And at the time there were just pills on the market and there was, I started, you know you need to take like 60 pills a day just to meet your body need. I’m like, I'm not going to do that. I have a hard time just taking one or two pills a day. So I started looking for a way to develop a protein that was clean that you could take in a larger quantity that you could incorporate, that you know did not have a lot of taste to it. You can incorporate into smoothies you could incorporate it into coffee and probably spent about a year developing and refining some of the processing to develop a larger form of collagen that you can take incredible.

MU:And all of these really big ventures that you've taken on and companies that you've contributed to the projects you've worked on and Vital Proteins being this huge one now. Can you say that there is one big goal that you've accomplished above the others?

KS: I mean I look at everything I've done in my career and I've always been highly goal oriented and I had this epiphany probably about two years ago as the company is growing, I think we're about a hundred and twenty people now. And I suddenly recognize that everything I had done, all the goals I had set in my life before I had this epiphany that I was built for this. This was my purpose. This is what all my other goals culminated in, right? When when I first started this company too, I actually set out some goals. I said and people kind of laughed at me. I said I want to be have this many products this much revenue in three years. I want to be in these stores. This is, and I want to really get out there and tell people about the product and virtually every every one of those things, hhree years later I'm times like remember that presentation I gave three years ago. Here is where we are. So and that's that's really been helpful. So out of all the goals I think it's a culmination of goals over a whole career, that is, as long as you keep knocking off one of these goals after another and you have, you may not have like a full life goal in place but I always keep short term goals, one one year six months two years maybe. You never know where life's going to take you three or four years down the road. I kind of joked around like I started this company because I was passionate about fitness and running and here I am in probably one of the leading beauty brands in the country now which I did never planned on doing so.

MU:Bonus, hey. So would you say that your process for setting goals in your business endeavors. Because to me it really does make sense to set your five year 10 year goals for business and where you want to set yourself up for financially in your life. How does that translate to your other goals that you have for your own personal well-being?

KS:Well I think in a business perspective, you set goals. You may set abstract goals for 5, 10 years like hey I want to get this degree, I want to be a doctor I want to be have my own business, right? But just saying you want to have your own business in five years is not a concrete goal. That's it makes, you get lost along the way. And what I've learned is you set these, you set these goals up, shorter term goals. They have to be very temporal, meaning they have to be time based. They also have to be specific concrete and with a concrete goals you say OK I want to be—we need to get this done by March, we need to get this done by April we need to get this done by October. And it's a very definitive what needs to get done. Then you can break it down and say, how am I going to get there right. And you get you go from more strategical to tactical. In my personal life. You know I do the same thing as well. I try to do the same thing. Like for example, like this summer I found myself probably over the past year or two working a lot of hours and not really attending to my own personal health. And so I said OK instead of taking a summer vacation I'm going to actually make my number one priority working out. So I hired a trainer. I think from April to October and I worked out four or five days a week one or two hours a day. And that was my priority. It took priority over the other things. So when you're thinking about goal setting it's great to set a goal. The commitment behind the goal is the key right? You almost have to become laser focused and obsessed with it. Meaning nothing else matters. I'm going to achieve that. That's all I'm going to do. So I had a media 9:00. I can't I'm working out. I committed to working out from 7 to 9 in the morning, I’ll be there at 9:15, 9:30 and you really kind of have to adjust and say this is the number one priority and then focus everything else around that. And that's what I found has been very successful in moving your personal life and your professional life forward. I even do that with my kids, my kids are grown now. I say OK I want to make sure I reach out to them once or twice a week. Spend time with them once a week and you know if I find myself getting lost in work I always say oh it's Thursday I'm driving home let's give them a call and see how they're doing and so it's really always having that mental checklist of what your priorities are.

MU:I think about—a little bit of a tangent from a question or a tangent from kind of what you speak about with setting your goals and really attacking them like being obsessed with them but also being able to go with the flow a little bit. Goals always change and the idea of balance is something I think we strive for. So do you have to walk that line between really being like obsessed with getting to your big goal—which I mean Vital Proteins is a really incredibly fast growing company, it’s only been around four years and you can see like the momentum behind it. But then to be able to strike the balance of like living your life and having other outside goals what is that like for you?

KS:It's a tough it's a tough balance right? I think when you're—when you're trying to balance the goals you do have to take time for yourself and what I always realize too is if I don't take that time to set my own personal goals it actually takes away from my ability to lead and run the organization professionally. So what happens is, and I find myself doing it even even though I know that I found myself know not necessarily taking all the time that I needed for myself like you know staying fit eating healthy because I was traveling two, three times a week and it gets to be a problem. And what I realize is is you have to balance it out because you only have so much energy and it has to go to one or the other and if you put all in one, the other is going to suffer. And if you don't put it here you're going to know you're going to end up sacrificing on the other side. So it's always a tightrope balance that you're trying to, trying to maintain for time and energy.

MU:So as you look ahead in the future I'm sure you have some pretty big audacious goals for Vital Proteins. What is the big goal that you want to go after? And how do you plan on getting there?

KS:I think for the company like we're every day I'm grateful for what we've gotten done. I'm grateful for—I hear a story almost every day of how we help someone. I think our short term goal, you know, couple years, is really to continue that momentum and really help people. I think you know just seeing the show of hands here it seems like a lot of people have heard about us. But I also test the market. I go out there and I talk to people and I try to see who knows about collagen, who knows about the benefits of collagen and I still see a smaller percentage of people who are familiar with that. So it's really just growing the brand— becoming you know I'd like to see our product in many households and it just being a household name and so I think kind of we're focused over the next two years just continuing that momentum and you know you'll see us. I think we just launched in Target this week.

KS: So the goal is just to continue making everywhere available and educating people about the benefits. What I find goal setting as we get to be a large organization—it used to be when we were smaller and you know you go back to 3 years we were 4 people or 16 people. It was very easy to set the goals and have everyone follow those goals and achieve that. When you get to be a larger organization, now it's very hard to even have conversations with everyone in the organization. So one of my strategic goals is to really empower our employees to be entrepreneurial but also set know how to set goals appropriately. We're going through our strategic plan for 2018 right now and you know I let everyone know because it's really a top down like I give big picture but everyone in the organization has to set goals so that we move quickly we understand what we're we're all targeting and it's really the clarification of goals. So it's not like an abstract goal like hey we want to be like the number one lifestyle brand because that's not really measurable it's like how do you how do you actually get to be in that position. So I'm really kind of coaching people in the organization how to how to set those goals how to make them measurable how to make them temporal meaning—OK, by June you want to have that done right and stuff like that. So really for myself as a leader it's really that is one of my goals is how do I effectively communicate that, how do Ieffectively lead the organization and setting goals. And that's my biggest challenge for this year I think.

MU:I mean it's a big task because you like you said you've gone from a team of two or three in just a couple years to like over 120. You're growing really really fast.

Speaker 3:But when you think about how everyone can internalize, like a way to set goals for themselves I’m sure understanding like the way you work and understanding the things that are going to be your best that are understanding how how you can be almost accountable to your goals it's really like getting to know like yourself and that is a really personal process I'm sure. So for all of us that maybe our dream is to start a company ourselves, maybe not but if you have one piece of advice to leave leave us with about writing down your goals or like how to tap into what is going to make you the most effective leader that you can be, what would that piece of advice be?

KS:Yeah I think the single most successful piece of advice that I've experienced myself for what I've learned is—and it goes beyond just see if you want to start a company right? It really has to do with everything personal in your life that if Meaning, if you have this goal do do three four or five percent of it or try to do it all but do it wrong. You're incorrect right. Figure it out because iteration and failure and improvement, constant improvement—I hate to use just do it. But you know just starting to do something is the key to success. Meaning if you have a business idea don't sit down for a year and a half thinking about it just go do it tomorrow, do the first step that's necessary. If you want to change your fitness routine your diet is right. You know even when you're talking about diet right it's hard because I'm always on the road. I'm in meetings all day long, luckily I have people help me get me food and stuff like that. But you know don't try for you know don't go for a perfect diet get an 80 percent right. Right. And just take one thing out of your diet and do that right. So it's always constant iteration and improvement that I think has been you know the key to goal setting.

MU:I love that. Like start somewhere.

KS: Start somewhere, yep.

MU: Go from there. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. We have loved having you, Kurt.

KS: Thank you for having me. It was great.

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Todd Uterstaedt interacts with high-powered leaders all day, guiding them as they build their teams, create their company culture, and practice the productivity hacks that help them transform from founders to CEOs.

But ask the founder/CEO coach and "From Founder to CEO"podcast host just how he stays focused on his priorities as he juggles a family and demanding clients, and his answer may surprise you: pool walking.

Yup, you read that right. Uterstaedt's secret to being a high achiever hinges upon whether he can get to his local pool and unplug for an hour while walking laps.

"Productivity and mental clarity are intimately connected,"Uterstaedt explained to me. "You have to exercise, right? You have to do things that give your mind peace and clarity so that you know the single biggest thing to do as it relates to productivity, which is appropriately prioritize.

"You can't prioritize things if your mind is racing and you haven't given your mind the opportunity to be clear about exactly who you are, exactly what your company's doing and exactly what your responsibilities are within that company."

Uterstaedt experienced a major moment of professional clarity during his time in the Army. He was stationed in Berlin just after November 9, 1989 — a.k.a. the date the Berlin Wall fell.

"I was enlisted at the time and watching military officers do their work as intelligence officers. I was doing well and heard about a "Green to Gold" scholarship, in which an enlisted individual can apply to go back to school, finish their degree, and become army officer."

Not one to back down from a challenge, Uterstaedt decided to go for it, and got it. Now, he credits that year in Berlin and the amazing things that were happening there with him going after his first big professional moment.

And the achievements have only piled up since then. Today, Uterstaedt brings people together through his peer group for founding CEOs, Trail Team 10. Recognizing that founders need a group of peers to bounce ideas off of, Uterstaedt launched Trail Team 10 about a year ago to help a group of founders from different cities come together on a regular basis and solve practical problems. And despite being from different cities, Uterstaedt helped this group foster a distant intimacy that felt real and authentic.

But whether you're a founder/CEO or a regular 9-5er trying to grow professionally, Uterstaedt has one piece of advice for setting and achieving your goals.

First, he suggests setting six month goals instead of annual goals, reasoning that a year is too long for most goals and a June check-in can be much more valuable.

Second, Uterstaedt recommends sharing that goal with two key people: one who knows you personally and "just gets you," and one professional acquaintance who "knows the industry" and can offer their perspective there.

To hear more of Uterstaedt's tips for founders and CEOs and apply them to your own goals, listen to our episode of #WeGotGoals. Don't forget to rate and review on iTunes.

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLIfe.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Kristin Geil.

KG: Good morning, Jeana.

CK: Good morning, Jeana.

JAC: Good, morning, Kristen and Cindy.

KG: So this week I spoke with Todd Uterstaedt, who is the founder and CEO of a company called from Founder to CEO. He's got a podcast of the same name and his goal is to help level up your leadership. So he's a founder and CEO coach and he has a lot of really interesting insights into productivity and the sort of ways that you organize your day and the small changes you can make to make you not only a better more productive manager but a better leader and a better CEO.

CK: There were so many things that I thought were interesting about this interview, Kristen, and one of them was the way that Todd uses both old school techniques and technology to achieve his goals and to help others achieve their goals. I thought his workout of choice was particularly fascinating, pool walking, because this is something that as a runner who has been injured I have forced myself to do when I've been hurt but the idea that if somebody does that as their workout of choice it's fascinating and I think some of the reasons were really interesting. Can you talk to me a little bit about that.

KG: Yes absolutely. So Todd, as you will hear in this podcast, he loves technology. He is all about using technology strategically to help us replace time-sucking administration tasks. One he mentions specifically was the act of scheduling a meeting. You know there's always a lot of back and forth about. No I've got this time at this time.

But what about location and he mentioned a technology that specifically takes that back and forth out of scheduling so all you have to do is sign up for a time slot and you are good to go with your partner that you're trying to meet with. However, when everything's getting to be a little too much and he needs to clear his head his favorite way to do that is to go completely off line for some pool walking. And he said that he loves the Zen aspect of it. He loves the fact that he physically can't have a phone or an iPad or a computer with him obviously because of the water. And he said it's when he gets some of his best thinking done. So I think there's other ways to do it if pool walking has bad memories for you Cindy, I'm sure you know running without technology could be something similar. Any way to unplug throughout the day and really sort of get into a flow state where you can let the ideas come to your mind more naturally instead of having a brain that works on overdrive trying to solve every one of the world's problems in the next 24 hours.

JAC: He talks to a lot of people who have gone from starting their own company to really moving into the role of CEO. And one thing he sort of preaches is the act of accountability. Can you talk a little bit about that?

KG: Yes. So one thing that I thought was really interesting. We've all heard about accountability buddies. You know someone that you text in the morning to make sure that they're going to the gym at the same time as you or someone who is maybe trying to reach a similar goal to you at the same time so you can work on it together. And he encourages his clients to do that as well of course but with a slight twist he wants his clients to share their goals with two people. One person that you know personally and who gets you, who sort of understands the way that you're wired and maybe why you're choosing to accomplish certain goals and maybe how you'll stand in your own way or what particular strengths you have that will help you in that process. But aside from that personal friend he wants you to share your goals with one professional acquaintance who can hold you accountable while knowing maybe more about your industry and you know wha tips and tricks you can use, other people in your network who might be able to help you and sort of having this dual accountability really keeps your goal well-rounded and makes it more of a focus because you're not just segmenting it off until like this is a professional goal or this is a personal goal. It really helps to incorporate it into your whole life.

CK: Yeah I loved that and I think that that is just one of the pieces of practical advice that people are really going to be able to take away from this interview. So here is Kristen with Todd.

KG: Welcome to the #WeGotGoals podcast. My name is Kristin Geil and today I'm here with Todd Uterstaedt, the founder and CEO of From Founder to CEO. Todd, how are you doing today?

TU: I'm doing great Kristen, how are you?

KG: I'm good. Thank you. We're so excited to have you on this podcast because leadership and goal setting is something that we're very passionate about over here on aSweatLife and we've loved hearing from you about how you take people to the next level especially when they're cofounding and founding their small businesses and really going through that process to become leaders. So to kick us off can you tell us a little bit about yourself and where you got the idea for From Founder to CEO?

TU: Yeah. So I'm a former Army intelligence officer who kind of transformed myself into a management consultant at one point in time. And we started our own executive coaching firm and along the way we started getting lots of phone calls from startup CEOs who said, hey, Todd can you coach us? And Kristen, our business model was not set up for them. It was usually it was set up for mid-sized companies and for corporations. So I got the crazy idea saying well why don't I do a podcast interview successful founders about kind of their personal leadership transformation into CEO because it's really hard to scale a business and scale yourself at the same time. And so yes we started this podcast called from founder CEO and it just took off.

KG: Who was a recent guest that you had on? Anyone interesting?

TU: Yeah. Do you know Adam Braun of Pencils of Promise?

KG: No. Tell me more.

TU: So Adam wrote this book a New York Times bestselling book called Promise of a Pencil. And it describes his journey from starting Pencils of Promise, which builds schools around the world in underdeveloped areas and they've built over 400 schools now. And Adam is just a rock star. He's really great guy and he's starting a new company called MissionU. And his book is really about the transformation of him of founding Pencils of Promise into a real organization. And so it was really a joy to have him on the show because I'd read his book and he's really a good guy.

KG: That's awesome. I can't wait to check it out. One of the things we asked everyone who comes on the #WeGotGoals podcast is, what is a big goal you've achieved in the past and why was it so important to you. And how did you get there?

TU: Yeah that's a big question. I love how you guys ask that question because it's so fundamental to our lives don't you think.

KG: Yeah yeah. Really getting into the deep stuff right away here.

TU: Yeah well when we started the podcast maybe I'm a little bit ashamed to admit that we didn't really come up with a monetization version of it. We just said you know see if we can build an audience and help people around the world and now we're listened to in over 100 countries around the world. And so at some point in time I said, Well you know this is a lot of work but at the same time people started asking us well what else could you do for us? You know they would e-mail me and say we like to podcast but we need a little bit more help. So I had this goal of creating a group of founders from different cities to come together on a regular basis to really help them solve their practical problems while simultaneously helping them navigate that road from founder to CEO. And so a year ago we started it and it was a lot of work, Kristen. I mean from the branding of it into a setting you up in marketing the marketing of it was a big deal. And a year ago we launched our first group. And in the first 48 hours we got like half of our members right away. And it was just so gratifying to know that we listened to our audience and we created something that they said yes we need this. And then a couple of days ago we had a reunion. They missed each other and we had a reunion and hearing them all described their 2017 and how powerful it was and how well they were doing really made setting that goal of creating what we call Trail team 10. That's the name of the group. really kind of come full circle. Wow I'm so glad that big crazy goal to create this group called Trail Team 10 actually not only came true but also has so impactful in people's lives

KG: Ah, that's so fulfilling. I'm sure that must've been a really big moment for you.

TU: It was you know it didn't really hit me until we had this reunion call and everyone was saying it had their best year yet 2017 was their best year yet and they just were so excited to see each other again and they missed each other and it was gratifying to see them all doing so well. Because all I did was bring them together and facilitate a dialogue and help keep them focused and really bring them together in a way. It's funny that a friend of mine said to me, well Todd, how are you going to get all these people to connect with each other in a group when they don't know each other. And one of the requirements is they have to be from different cities. And I found that I didn't have to worry about it because they had what we call now distant intimacy. Because they were in different cities they felt real and authentic about sharing. And it worked out really well. So it was very gratifying to answer your question yes.

KG: You mentioned right at the start of the interview that you were an army intelligence officer. And I know that you were in Berlin soon after a major moment in human history. Can you tell me a little bit about what that moment was like and how it impacted you as a young man and still today? Not to imply that you're not a young man but it's been a few years since you were in the army.

KG: Yes yes that's true. No that's OK. You call me an old man. That's all right. No, you know, it was you know at the time I took it for granted. I was stationed in Berlin Germany just after November 9th 1989 when the wall quote-unquote came down. But it took a while to take the wall down. And I was there after November 9th 1989 and it was really a pivotal moment in my life and it actually turned out to be one of my big first goal setting kind of experiences because I was watching all the military officers and I was enlisted at the time, enlisted in the U.S. Army. And I was watching the officers do their work as intelligence officers. And I was doing well as an enlisted soldier kind of in Berlin Germany when a lot of historical things were happening so it was really interesting time period and they had this thing called a green to gold scholarship. Where basically an enlisted individual can apply to go back to school, finish their degree and become an Army officer and at some point in time I said wow you know I think I really want to strive for this really big goal of competing for this scholarship to go back to school and then go back in the Army as an Army officer. And Kristen, I had no idea whether or not I would get it or not but it was a lot of work to put out the application again and get all the recommendations and just a lot of work.

And lo and behold I got it. So I credit that year in Berlin and all the really amazing things that were happening there with me kind of getting my first big professional career goal and accomplishing it.

KG: Wow that's amazing. It was such a transformative moment in human history and it's interesting to hear about how it impacted the world at a macro level but then also how in you on a micro level and then came right back out as you work to transform other people as well.

TU: Yeah it's funny you haven't thought about that way that way until you just mentioned it but there were so many people's lives that were transformed in that year. I mean East and West Germany came together, East Berlin and West Berlin came together. Families that were separated for decades and it just was really impactful on me to see the power of the human spirit overcome oppression, overcome difficult circumstances. And it just reminded me that gosh my goal was to compete for this scholarship and go back in the Army as an officer. That's a pretty micro goal compared to the big goal of reuniting two countries and it just put things in perspective for me you know.

KG: Yeah I totally get that. As you said just now you saw a lot of people overcome huge challenges and obstacles during this time in history. But you also help founders, new founders of emerging startups face their own challenges. What challenges have you found that the founders that you work with face typically that slow them down on their way to becoming an effective CEO and leader?

TU: You know it's funny because it's my intention to go back and kind of mine our podcast episodes and pull together kind of an empirical research project and just go back to all of them and kind of catalog all of that.

But off the top of my head I would say probably the biggest issue of a founder moving to CEO is being self aware enough to know at the different inflection points the new type of leader is that they need to be for their company. It's hard because it's a constant self-awareness and you have to start off with being someone who is very in tune with who you are and that's not easy to do when your company is growing fast. You know what I mean?

KG: Yeah, absolutely. I was thinking when I was brainstorming questions for this interview I thought that maybe a ton of founders that you work with might tend to get caught up in just the small day to day administration of running a new and fledgling company which sort of leaves them hanging when it comes time to big picture and more strategic thinking.

TU: I think you're right that exactly it is exactly one of the things that happens because when you are a founder maybe there's you know three or four people on your team maybe they're all cofounders. You tend to wear many hats and it's very difficult to know which hats to begin to take off per se and give those responsibilities to someone else. And so many of them I mean the phrase, the so common phrase Kristen that all of them say is it's hard letting go right? But it means different things at different points in time in that journey. But it's a common phrase because to your point they get used to doing things and now the organization requires them, is asking them sometimes is demanding them to be a different leader and kind of rise up above some of the tasks and focus on larger issues like for example hiring key people and establishing the culture of the organization and managing the culture of the organization which is often kind of the differentiator between a successful startup and scaleup and unsuccessful one.

KG: You know that reminds me of one of our favorite things that we say at aSweatLife and that's that everything is better with friends. I also tend to think of that as a way to remind me to keep key people around me. I think of it as like my personal cabinet right. The people that I go to for advice or for help with major decisions or just when I need like a good slap on the face be like wake up a little bit. This is what you need to be doing. So what sort of advice you give the people that you work with for finding those people and maybe not just defaulting to the people who make you feel good but the people who challenge you.

TU: Yeah it's a great question the way that those people around you they serve different purposes for you personally right?

KG: Right.

TU: So I think the same it's the same thing for a founder It's realizing that you need different types of people around you to support you for various different reasons and that takes the shape of many different resources for a founder. So for example if you if you're a funded company your board obviously plays a big role in that. If you're an unfunded company you can create your own personal board of advisers to be a board for you. A lot of founders will join an organization. There's Young Presidents Organization, there's EO. There's an array of organizations to your point to bring people around you and that's why we created Trail Team 10 too because we saw a need for startup CEOs to different cities to kind of be able to come together and challenge each other kind of sharpen each other to be better. But I think it's important to remember that it's okay to have different people sort of different roles so someone could be a really good expert on you have someone who's a mentor about financial issues and you know you get together with him maybe twice a year and it could be a friend it could be a relative or it could be somebody you pay it could be just somebody who takes an interest in you in your business. But bringing those types of people around you is so important. Everyone talks about that and every interview that I've ever done and I know that there's a lot of there's like CEO roundtables that are part of a lot of chambers in different cities that are a lot of people joined as well so I think it's important. You're right not only just from the professional perspective but from a friend perspective to know other people are kind of experiencing some of the things same things that you are.

KG: Yeah it gets lonely at the top I hear for CEOs.

TU: It does. I just had a lunch appointment today with someone who literally is three doors down from my office who listens to my show. I had no idea who he was and we were just talking about that I said and he was working on some issues as you know my company really knows about all the decisions they have to make on this as it's pretty lonely isn't it he says. You don't even know, Todd. I said, of course I know. He says, oh yeah that's right. So yeah it gets very lonely but it doesn't have to be. And that's one of my kind of mantras to people is it doesn't have to be lonely. Most teams want you to be transparent with them share. Tell them what you're how you're feeling. They can't be overly maudlin about it because then they'll get scared. Right. But you have to share your emotions and how you're feeling about things.

That's the pathway for the most successful founding CEOs that I've worked with and I've interviewed.

KG: That's awesome. Let's pivot a little bit and talk about productivity. Your website and your podcasts tend to focus on practical, actionable tips that founders can take to follow their dreams. What have you found that works personally for you in your daily life?

TU: Yes so there are a lot of things now that technology wise that don't necessarily make you more productive. Like, they don't make a task for you more productive they actually replace tasks which makes you more productive. So we're used to doing things. So maybe I'll be able to do this faster. Well nowadays for example there's an x.ai which completely takes the task of scheduling meetings with people out of your list because it talks to a computer with some artificial intelligence that looks at your calendar and their calendar and sets up the meeting for you without having to do a thing but CC Amy at x.ai. And so that's an example of productivity where founders nowadays are not saying Hey I just want to be able to faster X Y Z they say no I want to use some technology and some other things that replace some of the activities that I do. I think that's the first major insight that many of them have taught me as I've interviewed them. That's number one. Number two is I personally believe that productivity and mental clarity are intimately connected. That you have to have you have to exercise. Right?

KG: Right.

TU: You have to do things that give your mind peace and clarity so that you know the single biggest thing to do as it relates to productivity which is appropriately prioritize. If you can't prioritize things if your mind is racing and you haven't given your mind the opportunity to be clear about exactly who you are exactly what your company is doing exactly what your responsibilities are in that company. And that requires you know sometimes I'll go to I work at Lifetime Fitness in Cincinnati and I'll go pool walk because it's mindless and no one bothers me and that sounds silly. But just walking back and forth in the pool because it's mindless. Instead of walking outside where there's no resistance it's walking in the pool. But that for me clears my head so that I can then prioritize correctly and then that affects my my productivity.

KG: And with that pool walking you have the added bonus of generally not being reachable by phone. You actually have to unplug unless you've got some really fancy waterproof case that I just haven't heard of yet.

TU: That's my favorite part. Next time you said I was in the pool and couldn't call you back.

KG: Well that is a lot of technology. But you use any fine tools as well.

TU: Absolutely. I still use it right here next to me a little notebook. My favorite version is the Moleskin. I love the Moleskin little books, do you know what I'm talking about?

KG: Yes absolutely.

TU: And every night before I go to bed I write down what are the top three things that I need to get done and the next day. And I do that the day before and I put it in my moleskin notebook in the morning when I wake up I'm I'm able to focus on the things that I need to do in the morning, which is take care of my family get my kids off to school make them breakfast make benefits my wife breakfast. I'm not worrying about having to prioritize what my next day's going to look like. So I do that in my little Moleskin notebook handwriting. I used to use technology for that but I find that doing that and notebook is much more KG: I'm the same way. I still use pen and paper planner which are redundant because of course I've got my google calendar my icalendar all synced up. But everything has to be written down in a paper planned as well just so that I it gets it into my memory a little bit better right like I can remember my appointments easier if I find that I've written down beforehand.

TU: There's something about handwriting isn't there?

KG: Yeah yeah. Plus not to mention the satisfaction of actually crossing something off your list.

TU: My favorite part.

KG: And it's off your plate for at least another few days.

TU: Yeah well plus you know I don't know about you but like when you do something or computer it feels ephemeral, it feels ... but in my notebook I keep my notebooks and sometimes I go back and look in them. Oh yeah I actually did get a lot accomplished.

KG: Yeah absolutely it's a great way to actually track the things that you did get done. I mean who hasn't written something in their notebook that they've already done just so that they can cross it out and feel that sense accomplishment. Right.

TU: Yes. Yes Will I also use that notebook too once a week I'll journal and I'll say hey what's bothering me right now what am I grateful for and what will bring me joy in the next couple of weeks and I just do that once a week in my notebook with my other tasks because it gets me kind of thinking bigger picture and the handwriting part I think is to your point is key because it kind of engages my brain differently.

KG: We are also big believers at aSweatLife in starting your day off strong especially starting your Mondays off strong. We started carpe Monday. The idea is just to start your week off strong so that your set the tone for everything else that you're going to accomplish the rest of the week. And I feel like that's something that everyone asks CEOs right. So I was wondering if you had a strong morning routine and noticed that the founders and CEOs you work with have similar routines or they have quirky little differences that help set them up for success for the rest of the week or the day?

TU: Yeah. So I think I'll put them in two categories and I fall into one category. One is those that have kids and those that do not have kids because for me personally I'm the mom with kids. My wife is a physician and so I always want to give her the gift in the morning of peace before she sees 30 patients in a day. And so I make breakfast for her. I make sure the kids are downstairs eating breakfast and make sure they're ready to go out the door because she brings them to school. So for me my beginning of my morning is about making three other people's lives better and that actually makes me feel good. And I can focus on the rest of the day because I know they're off to a good start. So my getting off to a good start is actually about getting three other people off to a good start. That I think gives a lot of entrepreneurs and founders and founding CEOs who have kids there's usually somehow involved in that. But for those that don't often find a lot of them will meditate or pray. Many of them tell me that they will work out. First I think many of them work out in the morning because they find that the endorphins and everything else that kick in makes them sharper during the day rather than working out at the end of the day. But I think the other thing that they often do is they have a huddle meeting with their team. This is becoming more and more common where it's not one of these big overarching meetings. It's especially for a lot of the virtual ones. They will have a huddle meeting hey here's the three things that I'm focusing on today and here's something I may need help with. Some of them will do. Hey what's your one minute win from the previous day so that they all have some sort of positivity in their lives as they start their day. But usually it's just huggle meeting. That's not long it usually last 10 15 minutes. It's not over. You think that sets the course a lot for many of them.

KG: And with those huddle meetings do they find that accountability is a key part of that you know announcing to the group what you're working on helps you sort of stay true to your tasks and maintain that focus during the day?

TU: Absolutely. And it does. Another thing I think because of that it helps the founder hear from others so they can in their mind overlay the things that they're doing with the current priorities and strategy of the company since things change so quickly. They're listening to what people are putting their efforts in and then they're able to go back and help them make adjustments. If for some reason something's changing so again it's not heavy but it gives them the kind of that touch base to be able to say oh yeah you know what my team is still focused on the things that we all agreed are the priorities or someone has something personal going on that we need to help them out with. And also maybe rise to the occasion and do their work for them so that kind of alignment with the team is a big factor in addition to the accountability piece.

KG: It sounds like it also helps keep the CEOs grounded in terms of being up to date on what exactly their employees job descriptions are and what they're having to do everyday because I know in those companies world can shift really quickly right. And sometimes a CEO might not necessarily know the many hats that someone under him is wearing.

TU: Absolutely. I think you're right. And you know they don't talk about it that way mostly but I think the roles and responsibilities is something I often talk with him about. And now that I'm thinking about some of the stories I hear on the course of time some of them actually have a chart. In fact many of them are doing this now. You know they kind of. who has primary responsibilities in this area and who is their backup and they use that conversation to figure out whether or not the backup person needs to move in to their primary role. If as you say a role is changing.

KG: Interesting. Yeah that's a great little system for people to start right from the beginning.

TU: Yeah I think you're right.

KG: Well of course not everyone who listens says podcast is a founder or a CEO. But they are probably taking this month of January to evaluate their new goals and habits that they want to set for the rest of the year. Which of your favorite productivity hacks can be adopted by non CEOs like me?

TU: That's a great question. You know I find that sharing your goal with two types of people. One a family person or someone who knows you personally could be a family person could be a friend could be someone that just knows you as a human being rather than a role and then a second person is someone who really knows you professionally. Sharing with them your first six months goal. I don't think it should be an annual goal because it's too far, too many things happen in a year. But I do think between now and the end of June sharing that that goal with two key people. It's hard when it's the same person for the personal professional that's why I think it's important to have to kind of break that out a bit. You are much more likely to accomplish that goal if you told those two people because at least one of them is going to ask you in the next two to three weeks Hey how's it going with x y z. Right. Because they're just curious. And you've stated to them unequivocally and with intention and purpose and so they are naturally going to be interested because we all kind of want to know how we're doing and you know what happens mid February the gym drains. Right?

KG: Right. There is a literal day on the calendar called quit day or quit your resolutions day.

TU: Is that what it is? I didn't know that.

KG: Yeah, it's sometime around the sixth week of the year. Sometime in mid February. I've seen it happen.

TU: It's so interesting I did not know that. It's the same idea with any other goal. You know? Whether it's fitness or whatnot if you tell at least two people then you increase the odds that you'll follow through with that six month goal in the new year.

KG: It's interesting that you break it down into six month goals instead of a full year goal. Do you envision people reevaluating that goal of the six month period to adjust their course or just hoping to be accomplished within that time frame?

TU: No definitely reevaluating definitely. In fact when I worked with founders I always tell them hey you should be having offset from your quote unquote performance evaluation conversations, offset from that you should have your career and goal setting conversations with individuals on your team because the two are very very different. And when you conflate your performance with your goals and your aspirations and hopes it's too difficult to get down. If for example you're not performing well in certain areas will you want to make sure you keep that positive energy.

And so I recommend they offset those conversations--and it's the same thing with us we have to revisit the goal setting conversation kind of separate from other things in our lives so that we can look at it and kind of give ourselves the attaboy if we accomplish it or to retweak it right because it may change because something happens between now and June. It's too long ago here.

KG: You know you sort of touched on this just now but I imagine that in your work with founders a lot of them are probably focused on very tangible results that they want to achieve for their company. Right. You want to hit this metric you want to hit that. But at the same time as you help them on their journey to becoming really effective leaders and CEOs there's some what I call fuzzy things that they're going to have to change about themselves right? Like how to become a better leader. Well how how can you really measure that? So how do you help reconcile the differences between a less measurable goal with something maybe a little bit more tangible?

TU: There is a great question and that is actually the secret sauce about what we do at from founder to CEO because we really help the individual as a human being transform themselves into someone who has more responsibility for more people. And you'd be surprised about how you can actually measure the immeasurable, or the things that you see that are appeared to be measurable. For example one way to measure. You mentioned leadership is to do a quality qualitative or quantitative 360 degree feedback with an individual at the beginning of a time period and later on in the end of a time period. And what that does is you crowdsource feedback from the key stakeholders around you. It could be friends, direct reports, peers, customers, family and you get a really good sense of self awareness around your effectiveness and some of those more intangible areas. And if you do a qualitative interviews with those individuals as well it really adds to a robust set of measurements, quantitatively and qualitatively around those issues. And then you redo that in maybe six months and you can see a shift. It is very clear whether it's just leadership or self-awareness in general.

KG: General that's a great idea. It sounds like it must be pretty humbling for the people seeking that 360 degree feedback too.

TU: You know there are times people tell me they never got so much feedback all at once about themselves.

And it can be overwhelming but at the same time to so many people tell me when I do that exercise with that it is transformational not just to them as a leader or as a founder, founding CEO but as a person because it's about quality feedback. We all get feedback on a regular basis but frequently it's reactive. And that's important that's you know. We want to give an individual an opportunity to fully think through who we are and how we lead etc. And when we do that in a more formal way the richness and robustness of that data produces patterns that are very clear.

KG: Interesting. And once you start to recognize those patterns you can start consciously putting in the habits to change them.

TU: Absolutely and that's what we do all the time. We help create development plans from that information that get to the heart of an individual's journey from founder to CEO. Because it can be disorienting because especially a fast growth company where you know a year from now there's 25 employees and you had two at the beginning of a year and 25 is the magic number where a lot of the wheels fall off the organization for a lot of different sociological reasons and you have to rethink who you are and how you're leading. Dan Shapiro, the founding CEO of GlowForge told me in his interview--and he has a book called the Hotseat, it's a really good book. And he said a lot of founders will hire someone who is not very good at some of the jobs you're giving up to hedge their bet about if when they get like 25 employees if they're not good at leading that number of people they can go back into what they were doing before. Because they're kind of concerned about their ability to lead. And I found that so interesting that and I see that now kind of how we sabotage ourselves because to your point we're not quite certain we can do these things and we don't have any measurements around them.

KG: It sounds like you work with a ton of interesting people and you know really put in the legwork in helping them accomplish their goals. Let's circle back to our second big question that we asked everyone who comes on our podcast. What is a big goal that you have for the future and how do you plan to reach it?

TU: This is hard for me because we're just talking about this right now and we're struggling with it. Our Trail Team 10 program is pretty successful and we're proud of it. And it's really producing great results not only for our customers but also for our company. But I think it's time to create a membership program for founders at a price point that is not overwhelming to them so that they can come and go into the membership when they have needs without it being a six month commitment which is what our Trail Team 10 program is. And so my goal is that by June we will have mapped out what that looks like. Got enough feedback about it we can launch a beta membership for founding CEOs. And it's a lot of work you know and I'm a little bit cautious about bringing it up but I figured if I don't talk about it, if I don't share it with you then you know and so I wouldn't be practice what I preach. But that's our big, as Collins says, are our big hairy audacious goal is to kind of create that membership platform and program that can really serve our audience of founders around the world in a different way so that they can really take advantage of democratizing what we call executive coaching for leaders who are growing fast and help them grow faster because businesses are just crazy now and they're growing faster than ever before but our ability to grow as a leader at the same speed is lagging in a membership platform where people can get what they need without having a long term commitment and a larger price point is something I'm really passionate about.

KG: While I look forward to hearing from you in June about how successful you were.

TU: Yes, holding me accountable.

KG: Just like you said. Todd, do you want to tell us where we can listen to your podcast or check out anything else about from Founder to CEO?

TU: Absolutely. We invite you all to check us out at FromFoundertoCEO.com. We are on Spotify. Super excited couple weeks ago Spotify invited us to come on their platform. We're on iTunes or on Google Play. You can pretty much find the podcast on any service that you use to listen to podcasts and I'm also probably more active on LinkedIn than any other social media platform. So feel free to connect with me on LinkedIn and if I can help out in some way I'm happy to do so.

KG: Awesome. Well thank you so much for taking the time to talk to us today, Todd. We really appreciate it.

TU: It's my pleasure Kristen you take care. Thanks for the opportunity.

KG: Thank you.

CK: This podcast is produced by me. Cindy Kuzma. And it's another thing that's better with friends. So please share it with yours. You can subscribe whereever you get your podcasts. Hey while you're at it please leave us a rating or review. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music and our guest this week, Todd Uterstaedt.

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Athletes spend their lives fighting for a spot in a field of 2,000 triathletes in the most grueling competition on Earth. Their prize? Thrashing through a 2.4 mile open-water swim in the Pacific, fighting trade winds and a convection oven of heat on a 112-mile bike and finishing with a marathon - a 26.2-mile run.

Becoming an IRONMAN at the World Championships at Kona wasn't a dream of Jen Ator's. As Fitness Director at Women's Health and author of The Women's Health Fitness Fix, she was happy to fit runs through Manhattan and no-nonsense strength-training workouts into her busy days. That all changed when reps from Chocolate Milk called with an offer to make her an IRONMAN.

And while she said it took her a few days to accept the branid's invitation - an invitation to compete in a race that allows athletes 17 hours to finish - she now counts it as the goal she's proudest of accomplishing. Alongside her on the journey to Kona that she details on this week's episode of #WeGotGoals was an all-star cast. Eight-time Olympic medalist in speed skating Apolo Ohno would train with her and both Ator of Ohno received guidance from world-class coach and seven-time IRONMAN World champion Paula Newby-Fraser (a woman who does not know the word quit).

Like most audacious goals, it didn't come without brief periods of imposter syndrome.

Three months before her trip to Kona, Ator recounts a night spent crying and questioning her own abilities as the minutes slipped away between her and her first half IRONMAN race - a 1.2-mile swim, 56-mile bike and 13.1-mile run.

"Kind of by a act of God or stroke of grace or something, my watch kind of malfunctioned after the swim in the transition to the bike," she recalled of the race. "All I could do was be in the moment and do it. And I kind of just plugged along and I worked the plan that me and my coach had figured it out and really paid attention to my effort."

Ator blew her "self-deprecating goal" out of the water and turned her new confidence and attention to Kona - the true test of her training. Because Ator was among an elite group of invite-only participants at Kona, she wasn't required to qualify for the race like the majority of participants. The thought of that made her feel unworthy of the field of competition.

"I had a talk with one of the pro Ironman athletes before and he said, 'look Jen, maybe at the beginning of this you didn't deserve to be here. Sure maybe at the very beginning. But now you've done everything that all these other athletes have done to get here,'" She said. "That kind of attitude kind of helped carry me through the rest of the day."

Even, she recalled, in the lava fields known for their heat and for the clear path that's left for unexpected gusts of wind known to knock riders clear off of their bikes. The wind was everything she'd heard. Ator recalled riding her ultra-light road bike in what's known as the arrow position. As she leaned over her handle bars, she shook with the fear that she may too have her race cut short by a fall.

Newby-fraser preparing Ator for that exact moment: "You're going to be tempted to sit up and sit back because that's the instinct that feels safer ... that is the time that you need to lean in and commit because the safest thing you can do, practically speaking, is lean over that front wheel."

Listen to how Ator's run at Kona concluded and where this author, editor and IRONMAN is setting her sights next. And if you like what you hear, be sure to rate and review #WeGotGoals on iTunes and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talked to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Kristin Geil and Maggie Umberger.

KG: Good morning Jeana.

JAC: Good morning.

MU: Good morning. Jeana, you spoke with Jen Ator, who is the fitness director of Women's Health this week.

JAC:I sure did. And what an inspiration Jen is. Throughout our talk I think I gasped, I had a smile across my face and I definitely cried.

MU:Good summary. And she is also an Ironman Kona finisher which I didn't know what that was prior to hearing this interview.

JAC: So what’s actually really interesting about this is the campaign that Jen was a part of with chocolate milk is actually something I worked on in my past life the year before she was on it. So in 2013 I was a part of that campaign working on chocolate milk. And I got to see sort of the journey that she went through and I just missed her by a year. So throughout her explanation of sort of what she went through and how she was trained by Paula Newby-Fraser and how she had these incredible teammates like Apolo Ohno I could identify with that journey so deeply because I'd seen it once before. But her sort of personal take on it was so interesting to hear, one because she had been an athlete before and two because she had this sort of wavering journey of self-doubt accomplishment and in believing in herself just as I feel anyone does. The first time they do anything.

KG: While she was training with chocolate milk team she had some sort of realization that she mentioned during the podcast. Can you speak to that and describe what her big epiphany was?

JAC:She realized that she was the thing standing in her way which was incredible to hear her say because I believe that was the moment I cried. So Jen realized at the end of her half Ironman which is a 1.2 mile swim of 56 mile bike ride and a thirteen point one mile run she realized that she blew her own projected time out of the water because she wasn't running with a watch and there was a malfunction with it in her actual swim. She saw that she actually could accomplish so much more than she was giving herself credit for when she just sort of let go and was in the moment as an athlete and trusted her training.

MU: And her training really is pretty simple she talks about loving just straight strength and running amidst being the fitness director of Women's Health.

JAC: Yes. So her preferred training normally is not Ironman training. Ironman training is really involved. Oftentimes athletes will have to do two disciplines in one day sometimes morning sometimes evening or sometimes they'll have to stack them in a brick workout. But she is generally a big fan of just down and dirty strength training program sort of similar to what you'll see on the pages of Women's Health and also in the pages of her new and second book Fitness Fix. They have a mix of a lot of different things but they'll always have the sort of tried and true, pick up some dumbbells and do this workout kind of routine. And that's her preference and it works for her. But when she was training for Ironman she was doing these long workouts these distance workouts. She was running more than five or six miles because she had to finish a day of fitness with a marathon.

JACShe'd never run a marathon before doing Ironman Kona which is sort of nuts to think about but she did it. She got through it and she was able to hug her dad at the finish line.

MU: We can't wait to hear your interview with Jen here.

JAC:I’m Jeana Anderson Cohen and I'm here with Jen Ator, who is the fitness director at Women's Health. Jen, thank you for joining me.

JA: Thank you so much for having me.

JAC: So Jen you have a really cool job and we're so excited to have you but you're also an accomplished athlete and a writer and a published author. Can you tell me a little bit about how you spend your days?

JA:Yeah you know the kind of beauty and madness of my job and my career is that no two days are ever the same in fact rarely are two days ever even remotely the same. As the fitness director here at Women's Health, I balance a lot of different responsibilities. First and foremost I'm responsible for the stories and the editing of the fitness content inside our magazine. So that involves a lot of working back and forth with writers getting stories approved. Coming up with the monthly lineups that I pitch to our editor in chief and writing a lot of the stories myself and kind of managing our internal team and all the goals and deadlines that we have here. I also work on our online content. I do a lot of our videos so there'll be days where I might take a two hour break in the middle of the day to change into some workout clothes and go record some videos for our social team and our online team. And then there's other days where I'm doing I do a lot of press and interviews with the different objectives and things that we're working on for the brand. So yesterday I was in Atlanta doing a bunch of press at the CNN headquarters there. So you know that's kind of one of the more glorious looking days where you know you're getting hair and makeup and you're running on and off set and trying to catch up frantically with your e-mails as you're in between everything. But a lot of the days are just plugging behind a desk and you know working very long hours. I always joke that there's rarely days where I don't have a second job, where I don't go home at the end of the night and and have another big chunk of assignments or things that I need to work on.

So there's plenty of days where it's just kind of grinding through a very very big long to do list and then you know I get to mix in some opportunities to have some fun and go check out new brands and new workouts and talk to experts and just kind of experience a lot of the cool stuff happening inside the fitness scene.

JAC:So before I asked you our two big questions I need to know what is your favorite workout right now?

JA: You know I I probably buck the trend of most fitness centers. I'm not I'm I'm I'm a pretty traditionalist. I am not somebody who—you know I check out a lot of the new workouts. I love them for what they give to different people and I love them for first and foremost being vessels to bring more people into fitness. I'm somebody who's lived my life with sport and fitness as a huge centerpiece of it. So for me anything that brings more people into it I'm I'm so jazzed about but I think just with my schedule and you know the different fitness goals that I tend to be working towards I tend to be a pretty straightforward, a pretty basic fundamental—I like a good run good solo run, a good long swim by myself and some pretty basic strength training. Some simple circuits and pair dumbbells or resistance band and a good playlist and I'm good to go.

JAC: Gets the job done.

JA:It does.

JAC:Yeah I get it the same way and this is not about me but I'm kind of the same way or I will a couple days a week opt to work out alone because it just clears your head.

JA:Yeah and I think you know especially in the field that I’m in we have access to so much so it's such an amazing thing to be able to go check out the latest spin studio and you know go to the latest yoga class or the latest fusion class and sometimes it can get murky of, is this my job or am I doing this for my fitness? You know and so I kind of tend to keep the two pretty separate and my workouts are my workouts and like I said you know it gives me so much and I have my own goals and objectives of why I have my own why of why I workout. So for me that just tends to be easier to do in my own kind of bubble rather than going to all the different classes. But certainly like Tone House is a great one, that's always a lot of fun to go with a group. And Swerve is a cycling studio here in New York that I've really been liking so there's there's definitely ones that you know I always have a great time whenever I get an opportunity to check them out. But I tend to be a go at my own speed type person.

JAC:I love it. Know who you are. So can you tell me about a big goal that you accomplished and how you got there.

JA:Yeah probably the biggest goal I've accomplished is I completed the Ironman, the World Championship Ironman in Kona and that was back in 2014. And it was by far, the process of it was by far the most transformative thing I've ever done. And like I said I've been an athlete my whole life. I played D1 lacrosse I have fitness in my job title but this was really pushing it for me. I had never done any type of endurance efforts before and for anyone listening that that isn't familiar with Ironman. It's a 2.4-mile swim, a 112-mile bike and then a full marathon at the end just in case you felt like you hadn't done enough. And I had done one sprint triathlon. I had done maybe two half marathons prior to tearing my ACL and having ACL and meniscus reconstruction. So I had been approached by chocolate milk, who we had worked with a bunch with work stuff and they were putting together a program and wanted one female everyday athlete and then they had a male pro athlete who was Apolo Ohno the speed skater.

And they said, hey, like we would love for you to join him and we want to kind of document the two of you trying to reach this big goal that neither of you have any experience to be able to do.

And it took me probably three weeks to answer you know there was there was a lot of gut check soul searching because it was so far outside my comfort zone. It was something that I truly did not know if I could do. I had never clipped into a road bike before. I was terrified of swimming in the open water. I don't particularly love ocean swimming. So while I grew up a competitive swimmer I I was not experienced in open water swimming. And I never run a marathon before and at that point I was only running about three miles a few times a week. I was about 13 months postop so I had a lot of doubts. A lot of insecurity about doing it because not only was I going to try to do it I was going to try to do it in six months and I was also going to do it while sharing our experience with a large audience. And it was really intimidating.

But you know I think at the end of the day it was an opportunity to do a arguably one of the most famed and historic and legendary races that I've watched you know year after year those NBC broadcast. I mean I watch them I cry to them it's always so moving. You know it is an opportunity to do something that I had so much respect and reverence for. And also it was an opportunity to really see what I was made of. And you know I realized at that point in my life, I admit I had built a career out of trying to encourage women and people to chase their big goals and I'd spent my career interviewing athletes and then you know putting those into stories that people could read and be inspired by. And yet I was kind of sitting on the sideline a little bit and I was intimidated by the challenge of it for myself.

And so you know I decided just to say OK I'll do it. I'll try and I'll try my best. And you know win lose or draw, I’ll put everything I can into it and then began some of the hardest months of my life. Thankfully my workplace was very understanding it's not like I could just be out of work for half the day to go train. But they were more understanding if you know if I squeeze in a swim in the morning and come in with a little bit wet hair you know they they kind of gave me some passes here and there. But you know I really I they teamed us up with some coaching staff and some nutrition staff members that really to just day after day give us the tools to be able to go out and do this. Because I certainly would not have been able to do it on my own. So I had a one on one coach, I used this great app called Training Peaks which you can use for free and just kind of log your workouts. It allows you to kind of like set your plan for the week and then as you complete them it syncs with your watches and it'll show you if you were like green and did an amazing job in your workout or yellow and you know kind of got there or like red you didn't do it. But I also had a coach that would then can go in and I would leave notes for him. He was really big on—he wanted me to leave emotional notes as well as performance notes so not only you know how did it go, how did it feel, how was your knee, how was you know this and that but how did you feel. So it was really an interesting process of watching how much your emotional state you know being stressed from work or you know coming back on a red eye from a business trip and you know feeling really exhausted and run down or having a lot of anxiety over a workout that felt kind of you know too much for me at that time. It showed in the performance you know it reflected in the workouts that maybe went really well or didn't go so well and he really took all that into account and would adjust my schedule and my workouts based on not just my physical progress but you know my emotional things that were going on too and my logistical things that were going on and so yeah, I basically just really committed to the plan and had a lot of doubts had no idea how all the pieces were going to fit together.

About three months in, we did a half Ironman. Apolo did Boise. Then three weeks later I did Muncie, Muncie, Indiana.

I found myself doing a half Ironman which is 70.3 so half the distance of the full Ironman and I was super intimidated and even going into that I didn't think I was going to able to do it. You know I was crying the night before I. I was I was certain that I had not done enough work to be able to do this. And kind of by a act of God or stroke of grace or something my watch kind of malfunctioned after the swim in the transition to the bike. So I was getting nothing—I had no idea where I was at. I think it was recording the whole time but it was showing me weird screens. So I had no perception of what I was doing. All I could do was be in the moment and do it. And I kind of just plugged along and I worked the plan that me and my coach had figured it out and really paid attention to my effort.

And I finished that had no idea about what my time was and I'll never forget the moment where you know I was I was with my dad and a couple of our other, you know, our team that was working on this project and they told me my time and it was easily like two hours faster than what I had projected for myself. Like. My really like self-deprecating goal just got blown out of the water. And I think that was probably the most eye opening moment. Obviously then three months later finishing the race in Kona was probably the most emotional moment—but that one in Muncie Indiana was was the most eye opening of wow. Like I can do so much more than I think I can. Like I I am the thing in my way.

I really grabbed onto that moment and really let it kind of fully you know affect me because I was so blown away that the whole time I mean my whole support staff, everybody else thought I could do this. You know everybody else was like hey your training's going really well you're doing the work outs. But me as the individual as the self doubting individual was so certain that I hadn't done enough that I wasn't measuring up that I wasn't going to be able to do it.

And then to exceed you know I hadn't even thought I would succeed. I definitely thought I was going to fail and then to not only succeed but to blow out any perception that I had of how I could do, it was really a turning point for me. And so from then I was able to kind of you know it didn't get mentally easier. There were plenty of really tough workouts and I did a lot of it on my own. And a lot of people said oh well you should join a running group here in the city or you should join a biking group here in the city because then you’ll have people to share these huge workouts with. And for me it was really important because I knew when I got to that Ironman I was going to be doing it alone. There wasn't going to be anybody running with me there wasn't going to be anybody biking with me.

And I was going to spend that time possibly up to 17 hours of my life alone. And so for me it was important to spend those months practicing that. And for me that meant having to do the workouts by myself. And so you know there were a lot of really towards the peak of that training cycle. And I was probably doing lower mileage than other people in Ironman training plans because we were trying to be really cautious of my knee to not you know get injured and to do just enough that I needed to to complete the race because I wasn't trying to race the race.

And so yeah I I remember I mean on a Friday I would do a 4-mile swim; on a Saturday then I would wake up and do 110 miles on the bike and then get right off and run 7 to 9 miles.

JAC:Wow.

JA: And then the Sunday I would run 20 miles. So this was all so new to me and so so outside of what I'd ever done before. And so yeah there were a lot of very humbling moments during all that but I really you know after that half Ironman I was able to just say hey OK something's working I don't have to understand it but I'm going to respect what they're putting together for me and what they're telling me to do and I'm going to trust that I've got really smart people helping me do this and if I do what they tell me to do to my best to the best of my ability I'll be able to do this thing. And so yeah October rolled around race was here we went to Kona two weeks early to adjust to the heat and kind of get used to everything there and even still I really did not think I'd be able do it. It's just such a massive massive thing. And I remember the night before crying to my dad who was there with me.

And I said What are you know what are they going to do? We had been recording these you know little videos that ran on YouTube and we did eight of them to kind of show the journey and I said, What are they going to do if I don't finish? What are they going to—everybody is going to see that? How are they going to make the last … you know I was so nervous about letting other people down are so nervous about the external perception of taking on something like that that was so big and you know. At the end of the day I woke up this morning and said—I still have the alarm on my phone the alarm notification on my phone because I never want to forget it but I just set up the alarm to say, Cherish this day. And I really felt like at the end of those six months I had already gone so far outside of what I thought I could do for myself that you know no matter what happened—I feel like a lot of times when we get into races and we you know are chasing the big goals we immediately are focusing on the negative of it.

You know the performance or I want to reach this goal or I want to do this thing. I just said you know I've put in so much work like this has already been like the most transformative thing I've ever done in my life. I just want to go out and enjoy it and I don't want to waste this once in a lifetime opportunity that I'm being given on being caught up on the nerves or being caught up in the anxiety of what if I fail or anything like that.

And so I went out and I had a very thought through mental game plan because for me the the performance side was a little bit more straightforward. You know it's basically just figuring out that yellow type of effort that that feels comfortable to sustain. And you know I kind of broke up the race in three parts. The swim, my mantra was I can and I just kept repeating I can do this I can do this I can do this. And for me that was a huge part of reaching a level of deservedness to be there. Because these are the best athletes in the country. These these people have worked some of them their lives to be there. And you know I kind of got a fast pass to be able to enter this race through this opportunity that I was given. And I took it so seriously but I also felt so undeserving because of all these other amazing athletes that were around me and you know I really had to I had a talk with one of the pro Ironman athletes before and he said look Jen, maybe at the beginning of this you didn't deserve to be here. Sure maybe at the very beginning. But now you've done everything that all these other athletes have done to get here. Like you've put in the work. So you have to kind of remember that that you've put in the work. So that kind of attitude kind of helped carry me through the rest of the day. During the bike I said I am doing this am doing this I am doing this I am doing this because I needed to be present.

I needed to be focused on the mile I was and I needed to not be worried about the run that was coming up. I knew that I needed to be very very present because the bike to me was the way the most technical, the thing that I had to be the most you know concentrated on getting my nutrition at the right time getting my speed at the right time focusing on my pedal stroke all of those things. So, I am doing this. And then the run was, I will do this because you know I I knew it needed to be emotional for me. I knew I knew it was going to be emotional for me. And I remember talking to my dad at the very start of this and and we mapped out you know we broke down there's different cutoff points for this race.

And you have 17 hours to complete it. So we had figured out OK well you know even if you if you make it through the bike cut off then you have eight hours to do the marathon. So technically you could walk it. You could walk it. You could walk an entire marathon. And that was kind of one of the questions that I had to answer myself before I said Yes. I said, am I willing to walk an entire marathon depending on whatever happens that day, because I've no idea. Would I be willing to walk for 26.2 miles? And I said yeah you know? To be able to walk on historic ground like that to be able to follow through on something that I’m going to set out to do.

Yeah I would be willing to walk it even though I'd be a very long long part of a day. So thankfully I got there and I didn't have to walk. And I was able to to run the whole thing but I just kept saying, I will do this. And I I broke it down by thinking about one person every mile. Because you're also not allowed to use headphones so I'm a big music person when I run other races I listen to music and you couldn't have anything.

So there's there's a lot of thinking that goes on during that day and you’ve gotta manage your your headspace more so than your you know physical space. And so I said you know I'm going to I'm in a force myself to only think about one person for every mile. And I dedicated a mile to each, to 26 people that had really been the reason that I was there. You know from from my doctor who gave me the green light and then you know help monitor everything that was going on and making sure my knee was solid. To Apolo being such a great team mate and supportive friend. To you know my best friend in high school who I played lacrosse with and she's always been an inspiration to me. You know, just different people that along the way and I get choked up even just thinking about it now.

You know who have built me up and supported me and given me the confidence that I didn't have in order to do something like this because like I said I I did not believe I could do it. But they all did. And you know I think one of the greatest gifts you can give somebody is is your confidence in them and you know I'm kind of living proof of that. I know I have been the result of people giving me their confidence in me and that lifted me up enough to take on big goals and to chase things that seem intimidating and so that that run is probably one of the most memorable runs I've ever had. And you know I got I got back after and wrote a letter to each person and told them you know what I was thinking of, and what part of the race I was in and which mile I dedicated to them and it really just brought the whole thing full circle. And you know I got to cross that finish line 13 hours and 17 minutes after I started.

JAC: Wow.

JA: Yeah a very long day. I got to do that and I got to run to my dad and hug my dad who was standing at the finish line. But it was really such a beautiful race to remember that you know to be able to finish it remembering that I'm really here because of so many people and I got to share this with so many people. And for me that made it so much more meaningful than just if I had accomplished a singular goal on my own. So yeah that very long winded story is definitely my biggest goal that I've accomplished.

JAC: Jen. What an incredible saga is the best way. It was like Odyssean.

JA:It felt it, it felt it during the time.

JAC:So I have so many questions. First and foremost I think it's so interesting that you sort of felt the weight of your decision to say yes to this throughout. Just hearing you talk about it at different points: What if I don't succeed? What if I don't succeed?

And then just seeing yourself not only succeed finish crush it. You didn't walk a marathon you probably stopped a couple times if you had to eat something but like just hear you tell it, you killed it! Was there any point during the bike during the swim during the run when you didn't think you could do it?

JA:Yes. There was one specific point in the race where I did not think I could do it. And I was approaching the climb to Hawi so the road to Hawi is kind of a signature point of the Ironman World Championship bike course. And it's about a 7 mile climb, just a steady low grade inline but steady for I believe about 7 miles. And then when you get there that's the turnaround point of the bike race and I'm climbing and it had been a really tough—again, I'm not a strong cyclist but I was climbing and you know it's really hard and there weren’t a ton of women in the race. There's probably about I think 635 the year I did it and total about 1200 age group guys. So lot of guys, not that many women. As I'm climbing this woman and all hot pink hot pink like helmet, hot pink tri suit, hot pink bike, hot pink shoes, everything. Starts climbing past me. And she's like oh, man the heat and wind are brutal today. I was like oh yeah. You could tell this woman had done this. She just looked so pro like she was like just jacked and so impressive and a slightly older woman and just looked like, OK, she's been here before and so I was like I'm glad to hear you say that because this is my first time. And she's like just keep going just keep pedaling. You're almost there. Thank you. Thank you. And she's like keep it up. Great job. And you know it was so nice because throughout the entire race whenever a woman passed you or you passed a woman there was there was a real solidarity and there was a very, everybody cheered for each other, everybody is support each other. It was really nice. So she passed me up she went you know that was it. And I get to the turnaround point. I'm coming back. And now you're going down a downhill and throughout the race you're kind of going through these lava fields and some of them have these kind of like big rocks that you're going through. So you're facing a lot of headwind but then you're also because of how these rocks are you get these sudden bursts of sidewinds that kind of come out of nowhere and you know our coach coaching staff and team had told us about this so they had said you know you're going to feel you could feel the gusts coming from the side.

And it's it's a little bit shaky at times. I mean these bikes are super light. I feel like my bike weighed probably 12 pounds you know and you're coming downhill. And all of a sudden the the sidewinds are really starting to pick up and I'm looking down and I wasn't always super comfortable in that aero position where you’re leaned over the bars and you're really down low on your bike that that was intimidating to me to get used to, especially when going downhill. And one of our coaches was the legendary Paula Newby-Fraser. And she's the queen of Kona.

And I remember her saying to me there are going to be times where you get scared and where that wind comes out of nowhere and hits you on the side and you feel shaken. And she's like, you're going to be tempted to sit up on your bike. You're going to be tempted to sit up, sit back because that's the instinct that feels safer and she's like that is the time that you need to lean in and commit because the safest thing you can do practically speaking is lean over that front wheel because these bikes are so light that if you're sitting up and sitting back that front wheel can get picked up a lot easier from these gusts up side wind. So I'd remembered that she said that to me I was trying to stay down, was trying to stay down. And all of a sudden I look up and I see all these people in front of me are swerving around something and I can't tell what's going on but they're clearly like really moving around something. And as I get closer I see the all pink everything. And the woman was being carried off in a stretcher.

JAC: Oh God.

JA: And I mean I was shaking. I was tearing up. I had to actively be like, oh my gosh calm down calm down because it was the only moment where—I had passed the point of thinking, oh my gosh can I do this. Once I got through the swim I was like oh man, all right. We'll figure this out. We're going to we're going to get through this.

It was the only point of the race where I thought maybe I won't be able to do this because there's somebody who is clearly more experienced than me clearly has done this before and she's not even able to finish because of freak—you know maybe she was reaching for her water or when when a gust of wind came in and wiped her out. Or maybe—who knows? You know and anything like that could happen. And I I could just be I could be done. And again I found myself kind of sitting up and I was trying to get my composure and I heard Paula you know as I'm like shaking trying not to cry and trying to push through it and I just found myself saying commit commit

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Before Yael Shy wrote What Now: Meditation For Your Twenties and Beyond, she founded MindfulNYU, the largest campus-wide mindfulness initiative in the country. It's hard to imagine a time when Shy struggled with meditation, but to hear her tell the story of accomplishing this big goal, being mindful wasn't always easy.

Shy had reservations about meditation when she was first introduced to the practice in college. But a few factors during Shy's years at NYU led her to feel she was lacking the tools to cope with her stress; anxiety from 9/11, a break-up and her parents' divorce made Shy hunt for a solution.

Everything changed when she decided to go on a meditation retreat.

"It transformed my life," Shy explains. "It helped me see the roots of a lot of what my anxiety was built on."

From that retreat, Shy grew her own practice. In 2009, she co-launched MindfulNYU as a small group that met to meditate. Every week, that group's numbers increased and today it's become something special. Mindful NYU offers classes every day of the week, offers sub-groups, retreats, workshops and yoga twice a day every day.

I've never really committed to a regular meditation practice. Sure, I enjoy five minutes of meditation at the end of a yoga class, but I'm not one to throw down a meditation pillow on my own. The growth of this community at NYU makes me wonder - What don't I know about this practice that seems to be so eye-opening for everyone who makes it a habit?

The biggest misconception about meditation, Yael says, is that it's about being Zen.

"It can be excruciatingly difficult to be with what is, even if you don't like it," Shy said. "Even if you want to escape with all of your mind, it's a commitment to come back. Because that's where there's a chance for healing and freedom."

The analogy Shy uses is one in the gym setting. In the same way the gym doesn't always feel great when you're there - we've all had those workouts that level us or make us think we're weak and over-exhausted - you know that you're ultimately getting stronger with every workout. Although meditation can be difficult when you're doing it, you're strengthening a different muscle by making the commitment to sit through the tough stuff, notice your thoughts and when your thoughts stray, set the intention to come back.

Practically speaking, she also knows how hard it is to show up for meditation. A regular practice can easily be interrupted by life, but Shy offered a two tips to establish the habit for yourself.

1. Create a checklist: Because we're wired to want to see the fruits of our effort - and meditation doesn't easily lend itself to that kind of sense of accomplishment - create checklists for yourself that help you feel accomplished. That comes down to the logistics of meditation (i.e. where you sit, when you'll sit, how you build your schedule in a way that gives you time for it every day).

2. Understand why you're meditating before you start The second piece of the equation is to write down why you think it's important to meditate. Write that down on a piece of paper when you're invested in spending the time. That way, when the thought comes to mind that something else is more worth your time, you'll have your handwriting ready to help you remember why you're committing to the practice.

Listen to the episode of #WeGotGoals and redefine how you see meditation for yourself. And if you like what you hear, be sure to rate it and leave a review (then hop on over to Amazon and grab a copy of Yael Shy's book).

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen Geil.

MU: Good morning Jeana.

JAC: Good morning

KG: Hi, Jeana.

JAC: Hello Kristen.

JAC: Maggie. You talk to Yael Shy.

MU: I did. I got to speak with Yael Shy, who is the author of What Now: Meditation for your 20s and beyond. And she's also the founder of Mindful NYU, which just happens to be the largest campus wide mindfulness initiative in the country. And we got to talking about what is mindfulness and how do we define that in this day and age where it really is important, but we talked about like the should of feeling like you should meditate and what are those expectations and really what you can get out of making a commitment to do it.

KG: I know I'm not alone when I say this but in theory I would love to have a meditation practice, it sounds very relaxing. But in reality I always find that I want to do something else. I want to be more active. And it just seems a little boring to be honest. And I know that’s something that Yael has dealt with when trying to bring this to campuses because sometimes it just seems like I don't want to do it task. Can you talk a little bit about how Yael views meditation and how she's sort of reconciled that to make it more accessible to everybody?

MU: She came up with this really cool analogy for me to hear where you go to the gym all the time because you know you're doing something good for you but you don't always have a good time when you're at the gym. Sometimes you really hate that five minute plank that the instructor asks you to hold. And it can get really uncomfortable and really agitating and frustrating. And she equated meditation, like the actual time that you're sitting down to do it, as that potentially agitating and frustrating. But you have to have this belief and this understanding within you that you're doing something good for you that will benefit you down the line. And so that put it in perspective for me is because I think I have this really not so realistic perspective of what meditation is, that it's a Zen environment and everyone who does it is incredibly happy and just calm.

But that was a cool point for us to talk and sort of jump off talking about goals with, because she did mention saying like just because you meditate doesn't mean you are Zen and calm and have no direction and goals. It's just a mindset and frame of how you approach those goals which which she then continue to talk about in the podcast.

JAC: And she had one key piece of advice for people who want to start a meditation practice. Can you talk a little bit about that.

MU: She gave some really sound advice about lots of steps within our interview to take to make sure that you can hold yourself accountable. But the one piece that really stuck out to me was something I've never thought to do before, which is to write down for yourself why you're doing this. So in the moments when you aren't sure that it's worth your time or that you know there's something more fun to do. You can look at that piece of paper and you can read what you wrote about what that meditation practice, and why you're setting that as a goal for yourself to stick with it.

JAC: And here is Maggie with Yael.

MU: Great, so Yael, thank you so much for joining me on the #WeGotGoals podcast. It is so wonderful to get to talk to you.

YS: I’m so happy to be here. Thanks for having me Maggie.

MU: Absolutely. So Yael, you are about to launch a book called What Now: Meditation for your 20s and beyond. And you're also the founder and director of mindful NYU which is the largest campus wide mindfulness initiative in the country. That’s huge. I'm very interested how you came upon mindfulness and how it started at NYU which is in the middle of the biggest craziest busiest city in the world.

YS: Yes, so I came to mindfulness meditation from I was actually a student at NYU many years ago and I was feeling the stress and the crazy of the city. I was in a very difficult place in my life. I was in college and it felt like the first major time in my life I was asking a lot of questions like, what is important in this life? If everybody dies then why am I alive? And it was this really formative moment. And at the same time I was just broken up with my parents were getting a divorce. It was around September 11th and I had some you know PTSD from 9/11 that was happening like, in my neighborhood. And it was just like a very difficult time, a lot of suffering a lot of anxiety. And I just felt like I didn't have any tools to work with any of it.

And so I ended up going on a meditation retreat that really transformed my life and helped me to see a lot of the roots of what my anxiety was built on. And a lot of the roots of my suffering. And it certainly didn't solve everything in one retreat but it led me down a path where meditation and mindfulness have really completely transformed my life. And so now at the Center at NYU, which we created in 2009—a student named Elizabeth and myself basically got it going as just a little sitting group that grew and grew, and now has meditation every single day of the week and it has advanced practice, it has sub groups for our LGBTQ community and our people of color community. It has retreats and workshops and yoga twice a day every day and just a lot going on. So it’s really blossomed into a really thriving place.

MU: Incredible. That's amazing to have done in not a lot of time because meditation is a buzzword and I think people have certain reservations about it. And I think that it's pretty incredible that you sort of cut through that clutter and just made a statement like this is important and people are getting on board.

MU: Yes well, and I kind of get it. I've had a lot of the same reservations. I did have when I first started meditating I had no connection to it at all. When I went on my first meditation retreat I had no idea what I was getting into and I thought meditation was boring and I thought yoga even was like pretty boring. It was not in my frame of reference.

And over the years it's just really to me it's a buzz word for meaning, learning to open up to life to be with what is and to be with oneself and in a way that helps me to really experience life in a richer way and to have more compassion for myself and for others and that connects me to this larger vitality that is life. Whereas like the everyday can sometimes feel dry or meaningless or just disconnected. Meditation to me feels like a way to connect in. So that's really how we teach it and what it means to me.

MU: And I I want to say that I get that but I am also like in that camp of I know I say I should meditate more but I don't do it. It's like I want to roll out my mat and do it and then I don't.

One thing that really sticks out to me that that you say is that essentially what meditation is is being here in the present and happy or just content with what is which is really interesting in the context of this conversation around goals because it almost is counterintuitive because goals is all about not where you are but where you're going. So I'm I'm interested in your take on goals in general.

08:16

YS: Yes. It’s such a good question and such a good insight. I wouldn’t say that meditation is about being happy or even—others might say this, but I'm not sure I would say it's about being content with what is because sometimes what is, what's going on in the present moment, is extremely painful or really difficult to be with. And in meditation, like, we make the commitment and we make the effort to be there anyway to bring our attention there to breathe through it to soften with whatever is going on, and you know it could be emotional pain it could be physical pain it could just be like a really scary moment. And to really try and drop into what is happening but it might be excruciatingly difficult. And so I guess I would just kind of readjust that to just say, to be with what is even if you don't like it and if it's like I want to escape this with all of my mind and all of my being.

It's a commitment to keep trying to come back because there in the present moment, being with whatever is happening, is I think our chance for healing and our chance for freedom in that in that moment. But then to go to the question of goals and kind of connect it to goals. For a lot of people I think their kind of resistance to meditation—and I have this as well—is, oh, it’s going to make me be kind of like a lump like a lazy happy with what is kind of person. And I'm never going to accomplish the things I want to accomplish. I'm never going to amount to anything if I just like sat there and breathed and was happy all the time.

**And I don't mean to be flippant about it it's a real struggle of like how much do we need to push ourselves and drive ourselves forward and how much do we just need to be still and to not be doing any action and to just be rather than to do? And on the one hand I do think that it's a slightly false split because the goals that I've been able to accomplish like I would say starting the meditation center or like writing my book, I had to actually create this idea in my mind before actually doing it so I had a goal or a kind of direction I wanted to go in and I thought about it and I shaped it and I dreamed about it. And all of the stuff that one does with goals that you're excited about and at the same time I think what the meditation practice has helped me do—and I’m definitely not always successful at this but it's helped me to hold that end result with a loose hand so that if my goal was to finish this book by January, which it was originally last January, and it did not get finished by January.

It's not like a tragedy of epic proportions. It’s not like frustrating and painful it might be for a minute but it's the idea is that once you set the goal, if things come in that change and the world has a role to play in sending you deviations or sending obstacles and those obstacles and deviations might be exactly what you needed to produce something even more beautiful than you had originally thought. And the only way you can know that is if you're holding your goals with kind of flexibility and looseness and remaining light on your feet.

And so that's sort of how I operate in relation to goals, like it's almost like, you know you you set an intention in your mind I'm going to go to the store today and you're walking in the direction of the store and you know what you want to buy when you get to the store. And then somebody stops you on the way to the store and you can just you know be angry or try and get away from the person to get to your goal or let's say that person stopping you would tell you that there's a much better store in a different direction and that's the way you need to go.

MU: That's super interesting for me to hear because I definitely resonate with that line that you walk between being too flippant about just not caring about your choices and then being ok with what happens and unfolds and just being with what unfolds. I think that is something that I learned or that I was conditioned in college to go after a big goal and to have huge aspirations and to work really hard and stay up really late. So I think that you working in the realm of a university has probably lots lots of rich territory to explore. Would you agree?

YS: Yes absolutely. My students constantly are in various stages of both the excitement of that realm, and being like, you know I'm chasing my dreams or working towards my dreams and I'm exploring new territory and it's all there, that like pregnancy of possibility. And I think just like you know anyone else I think it's a time of like a lot of pressure and a lot of stress and some people don't exactly know what they want to be doing and that’s its own sort of suffering just not knowing what your should be. And or just feeling like, I have a student that's on them premed track and it is just one crushing week after another. He's struggling to make these grades better, just working so hard and still struggling so much. And so it's really both sides of the equation, it’s everything at that time when you're really in a university setting, I think, trying to really figure out who you are and what your future is going to look like.

MU: Can you speak a little bit about all of the different types of students that come in that maybe have the really stressful tracks versus the less stressful tracks. Because it runs the gamut I'm sure. And how do you speak differently to people that have it in their head that they're going to go through med school and law school and it’s, the odds are against them versus those who are already open and primed for meditation.

YS: Well it's interesting. I think the Buddha had a line that said meditation is sort of like playing a stringed instrument. If the strings are too tight on the instrument and you start to play it the strings are going to snap. If they're too loose and you try and play it, there's going to be no music that can come out. You know, you can't play anything. So what you want is to exactly tighten the strings to just the right level that you can play music and it's sort of the same with ourselves in our bodies. It can be true in each person just like it's true, different types of people that were sometimes going too hard and clutching too tightly to a world that we can't control and we have to learn to loosen or we're going to snap. We might have already snapped. And so it’s just this practice of like constantly practicing letting go, constantly practicing softening and easing and being kind to ourselves and relaxing. And then the other side is the other place where we've all I'm sure been to some degree or another where you're just too loose and you're not—you really need to tighten up a little bit of a discipline so that you can go to a place that you know is better for you. Like the equivalency would be to people—I’m like this constantly where a couple of weeks will go by and I'll be like I haven't been to the gym in like a month and I know I feel better after going to the gym. I know it's so good for my health. I just, am too, I've loosened up to a degree that it's not good for me and I know I can do better.

And then it's time to not beat myself up about it but just tighten the strings a little, to build it into the schedule and to follow that path. So I think the teaching changes based on the person but it also is based on the moment that that person has been at that time.

So you started this meditation center, you started Mindful NYU and you have now written a book. These are all really big goals would you say that these are the big goals that you would really want to say aloud that you're proud of? Is there anything maybe more personal or something different that is something that’s happened for you because of or through meditation?

YS: Well to be totally honest with you these things are wonderful and I do feel like they're the fruits of the practice for sure. But I actually think maybe the biggest goal that I had that was even bigger than like a goal it was like the biggest dream of my life was to meet a partner actually and to like be with someone like a life partner. And for years—I got married very late. I met my now husband. You know not very late but a little later in life. I was 33 and I just never thought it was possible. For so many years I didn't date anyone. I was so closed and scared and carrying just so many blocks to love and to intimacy and then that I believe is like a direct correlation to meditation and to therapy that I could work with those blocks and work with all of that pain and fear around dating and all of that and then to find someone and someone I love so much that I'm currently married to and that we have one baby and another baby on the way.

And so I think like that was probably, if I had to point to one piece of evidence, like if you had met me ten years ago and met me now that that would be the most major thing that has changed, that I think I've let love into my life in a bigger way.

MU: That is so awesome that simply doing less can lead to so much more.

YS: Yeah, well, and the process is not easy and I want to kind of like support people that like you mentioned people that they like oh I want to meditate. And I just haven’t, or I’ve tried. And it's so hard. I feel like it's just a failure because I was really in that boat and I know that it is really difficult process and takes a lot of like continually coming back and learning to really forgive yourself over and over again. But it really bears fruit at least it has for me and for a lot of the people that I know.

MU: You bring up a very good point because when I think about how I say this in my head and I know a lot of people do because there is more focus around your whole health and wellness. Today the people that do say I should meditate and I want to meditate more but because I believe we are pretty goal focused people in terms of tangibility—what can we say we've done and see that we've accomplished. Mindfulness isn't something you can really see and check off the list. And so people that maybe meditating regularly is a goal or mindfulness is a goal that almost flips it on its head, like how do you accomplish that versus even how do you use that to accomplish your goals? And so in your experience what are the things that people get tripped up on or where can people practice and sort of start to feel the success? And I'm sure it's different for everybody. So that's a hard question

YS: But it's a really good question and a fair question because we're wired to want to see the fruits of our action. It makes perfect sense. And so I think that the where people get tripped up, it is different for everybody but I think it seems to fall into two main categories. One is the logistics of it, the feeling like I have no time when am I going to do this.

And that is really a question of how can you build it into your schedule and into your life that will make sense and that will fit as much as you can into your day. So for instance when I had lapsed on my meditation my regular meditation for a while I said to myself, okay where can I put it, actually physically put it into my calendar as if it was a meeting so that it would pop up and I had to go, and it is isn't meeting it's like a meeting with me and the world that is my time to say hello to myself and to open up to the world. And so first I started there. Then I asked myself, what can I do to make that time the most easy. So I place my meditation cushion in exactly the place where I needed it to be every day at that morning for meditation the night before. And I would get my slippers next to the bed, so all I had to do was put my feet in there and walk over to try to make the situation as easy as possible to make this thing happen and then I had to write out and articulate for myself, why do I think this is important? So that I can hold that really close because those times when it was I was so tired or just felt like there’s a million other things I could be doing.

I had to look at that and say I believe this is important because it leads to greater wellbeing and greater happiness in general. I know that is true and therefore I'm going to go do it. So I sort of had to do this a lot of this work and that's what I really recommend doing, just to logistically build it into your schedule and build a habit out of it. Then the other place where I think people including myself get tripped up or resist meditating is that it feel I want to say hard. But the reason why it feels hard is often because the voice that comes up in our minds when we're trying to pay attention to our breath or pay attention to our emotions and we, our minds wander away which they naturally do. The kind of judgmental and cruel voice that comes in can be really really harsh and can say like you're failing you're not good at this, you're not a good meditator. Fill in the blank of how your own critical voice sounds. You know you'll always fail at everything whatever it is. And that for a long time prevented me—I just couldn't handle it because I could only stay present for let's say a few seconds out of an hourlong meditation and then I just felt like such a failure afterwards. And not only do I feel like a failure, I felt like I had to sit with this voice that was like yelling at me about it and I just didn't want to do it anymore.

And so from that side I think really trying to redefine meditation that it is not about clearing away your thoughts and it's not about going, you know, staying focused on your breath which is a nearly impossible task to do because we're not in charge of our minds our minds wander. And so instead of that, to really redefined meditation as it is this process of the mind wandering away and us waking up to look at the contents of our mind. Oh it's interesting. I'm thinking a lot about you know this thing I'm planning I must care a lot about that. OK that's what I'm thinking about coming back. I’m thinking about what that person said to me and I'm really hurt by it. Come back and feel the hurt. You know whatever it is that you're thinking about, these are not, your thoughts are not the enemy. It’s a matter of continually bringing your attention back now and that’s the practice. Going away and coming back going away and coming back and really strengthening that muscle of being with what is there, what’s there in the present.

So those are sort of my two big tips. There's a lot more in the book to help surmount a lot of the obstacles because I'm telling you I was never like a star meditator. I've never gotten to a place where my mind is completely cleared and so I try to write the book from that place from the place like fidgety anxiety difficult stress place and still sitting through it.

MU: I like hearing the exercise of it being like a muscle to exercise because I can relate to, the more pushups I do the stronger my arms get. And then I have to take the time to get through some of the the bad workouts to get to some of the more fruitful ones.

YS: Exactly. And I think it's sort of we've sort of done a disservice in the public way of talking about meditation as just this like really relaxing activity. It can be relaxing but in my experience it can also be extremely agitating and just understanding that the same way the gym does not always feel good when you're doing it, sometimes meditation can really be difficult and agitating and just really believing, same thing with therapy that that going through this process will bring more healing more love more connection.

MY: Yes absolutely. So one last question I guess then it's even though we talk about holding goals with a loose hand if you're looking ahead after the launch of your book or beyond that, what do you have in your mind that you'd like to go after?

YS: Well my next baby is due in March. So I think from now till March I kind of have a shorter term goal of working hard to try and get the book out there and to let people know about it and to talk about it and write about it so that it can get out there and help as many people as possible and sort of has its own life and after March I think I'm setting my goals on just like keeping the kids alive just keeping myself and my husband like as sane as possible in this crazy crazy process. And beyond that, I’m not really sure. I’m kind of I'm waiting to see him opening up to what feels like the right next step the right next project to be working on. But I'm not really sure yet. So have to stay tuned for that.

MU: Well we will be looking forward to hearing what you do next. And people can buy What Now: Meditation for your 20s and beyond, starting now.

YS: Yeah, it’s out there, it’s on Amazon it's anywhere your books are sold. So definitely check it out.

MU: Awesome thank you so much Yael for joining me and for talking about meditation in a very accessible way. It's been it's been a treat.

YS: Thank you so much, thanks for having me.

CK: This podcast is produced by me Cindy Kuzma and it's another thing that's better with friends. So please share it with yours. You can subscribe where ever you get your podcasts. And if you get a chance leave us a rating or a view on Apple podcast we would be so grateful. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to our guest this week, Yael Shy; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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Oprah herself may be mulling a bid for the presidency—but if you’re looking for the next Oprah, look no further than this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

Taylor Rooks is only 25, but she’s already a sports journalist and anchor in the number-one market in the country. She has her own podcast, Time Out with Taylor Rooks, where she’s interviewed the likes of Kevin Durant, John Wall, and Snoop Dogg. And she knows what she wants for the future—a talk show on which she’d have real conversations in the style of Ms. Winfrey or of Barbara Walters.

“I always think of Barbara Walters’ Whitney Houston interview. The way she spoke to her and the way that Whitney opened up … you leave that thinking, whatever you think of Whitney, you felt like you understood it more,” she told me. “I wish to one day be able to do something like that.”

If her past performance is any indicator, Rooks will go for that goal with full gusto. She set her sights on sports journalism early and spent her college years at the University of Illinois working hard, breaking stories for scout.com and reporting from the sidelines for the CBS Sports Network. That hustle allowed her to achieve the big goal she talks about on the episode—landing her first job out of school at a network rather than a local TV station.

“We do this thing where people kind of say, OK, this is the track you're supposed to go on. You do this. You start local. And then you eventually work your way up,” she says. “But I think that by telling people that, you’re almost conditioning them to think that that’s the only way.”

She saw a different path, and followed it, landing a gig as an on­air host, reporter, and correspondent for the Big Ten Network immediately after graduating. She has nothing but positive words about her experience there—“I would have been content if it was my last job,” she says.

But when an opportunity came up a little over a year ago at SportsNet New York, she realized she couldn’t pass it up. “A really good friend of mine said, OK, this isn’t about ego or money, which place will make you better in two years? And I knew it was SNY. I kind of try to think that about everything,” she says.

She told herself: “You have to do those things that make you uncomfortable and put you in uncomfortable situations to reach that ultimate goal of having a talk show and being able to have those long conversations.”

All this takes major confidence, something Rooks has in abundance. Her family—which includes accomplished athletes like a pro-baseball-playing uncle and a father, Thomas, who was a top rushing leader for the Fighting Illini—instilled it in her from a young age.

And she continues to foster it by owning up to both her strengths and her weaknesses, and always doing whatever she can to improve her skills. For instance, she loves basketball and football most, but has been learning baseball to cover the Mets and Yankees. She spends her downtime watching SportsCenter or TedTalks instead of, say, reality shows. And while she uses social media to connect, she knows not to let either the praise or the criticism she hears there creep into her psyche.

Instead, she relies on feedback from people she truly trusts, and never forgets how she’s gotten where she is today. “You have to believe that you’re here because you're supposed to be,” she says. “You don’t really luck your way into successes or luck your way into positions. It may help get you there but it's not going to keep you there. And it’s just kind of reminding yourself, you belong there and no one can take that away.”

By the way, she wants YOU to feel this confidence, too. “I think I know what every single human can accomplish—I know that we all have this limitless potential. Every single person can be what they want to be. I truly believe that,” she says.

Listen to the episode of #WeGotGoals and you’ll finish feeling like you just got a pep talk from your kindest, smartest bestie. And if you like what you hear, be sure to rate it and leave a review (then hop on over to listen to her show).

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me, I have Cindy Kuzma and Maggie Umberger. MU: Good morning Jeana. JAC: Good morning Maggie. CK: Good morning Jeana. JAC: And, good morning Cindy. This week you interviewed Taylor Rooks right? CK: I did. Taylor Rooks is a sports journalist. She was based here in the Midwest and she recently moved to New York and she's been able to accomplish quite an impressive list of things at a relatively young age and it was fascinating to hear how she did it. MU: She talked about—she told you about how she did the legwork to find out what her strength and her weaknesses are at a really young age so that she can have time to work with those. Can you talk a little bit about that process for her? CK: Yeah I mean she's always known that she's been really good with people. And so she identified that from an early age as a strength. And so she tries to put herself in positions where she capitalizes on that. But she also thinks that it's really important to have self awareness of your weaknesses and so she thinks that a lot of people maybe are kind of afraid to admit to a weakness because it will mean failure or it might mean you have to do something to change it. But she sees it as one of her—I don't know actually if she sees it this way but I see one of her strength as the ability to recognize her weaknesses and see them as opportunities versus obstacles JAC: And that sort of points to something too, her confidence. She's overwhelmingly confident. Did you get that sense from her? CK: I did it sort of exudes from her. She says that her parents told her from a young age that she could do anything and she believed them. And I think I've heard that from from someone else before that you think Jeana has said that before too JAC: Once or twice. CK: And she continues to sort of remind herself and this was something that really resonated with me too. You know as you kind of go through your life and your career it's easy to second guess yourself or doubt yourself or get a little bit of imposter syndrome. But she tries to constantly remind herself that she is where she is for a reason that she wouldn't be doing her job if she weren't good at it. That luck can maybe bring you an opportunity but it's a reflection of your good work and your hard work that you are continuing to have success. JAC: Big snaps to that end her future goal is really big. Can you talk about that? CK: Yeah she wants to have her very own talk show a la Oprah and I don't know. I think she just might be able to do it. MU: All right. Here is Cindy with Taylor. CK: This is Cindy Kuzma and I am here with Taylor Rooks, sports journalist anchor reporter. Taylor thank you so much for joining us on the podcast. TR: Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here. CK: So Taylor You have been pretty incredibly accomplished from a young age. I mean I know as an undergrad at the University of Illinois you were breaking big stories about recruiting for scout.com, by 19 you were on the sidelines for the CBS Sports Network and now you're 25 and covering sports in the number one market in the country there at SportsNet New York. I mean would you say you were kind of a fairly goal oriented and driven person from a young age? TR : Yeah I mean I definitely have always set my mind to something and then said that I was going to do it. I think it's very important to have your eyes set on something and lock into that thing. I don't think that it's possible to really accomplish something if you aren't fully dedicated to it. So I think it's just kind of having even sort of a kind of a vision board in your head of the things that you want to do and how you want to accomplish them and then trying to stick to that path and not stray from it. And I think that I've always had in my head what I wanted my future to look like. And the steps that I felt were necessary for that future to kind of manifest itself. CK: That's really impressive because I feel like there are so many of us who spend some of those years that you've been focused on accomplishing all these goals. I'm trying to figure all that out. TR: So yeah I mean there is definitely a time where you're still figuring out you know OK how am I gonna do this? Do I want to do this? Can I do this? And I think that's kind of the blessing of being young is figuring out the things that you're really good at but then also figuring out the things that you're really bad at. And I think sometimes people are scared to find out the things that they aren’t very good at because that maybe means you have to tweak something in that journey or tweak one of those goals. But I think that the end product is that much better if you know your strengths and you also know your weaknesses because I think that that's just as important. CK: That's really interesting. What have you found to be your biggest strengths and maybe a weakness that you identified that you've worked on? TR: Yeah I mean I would say my biggest strength is people. I mean I think that I'm just genuinely a people person. I love talking to people, I love getting to know people and understanding why people work the way they work. I enjoy having conversations. I don't think that people have enough conversations these days. Everything is quick and high and by and people only ask about how you're doing so you can ask them how they’re doing, you know? But I think that that is something that's always been my strength is just really I think that I'm just a warm person in general and I've tried to harness that whether it's me interviewing me, hosting I always want that to come across whether it's in my podcast whether it's me on TV that's something that I always want to translate to people and I think that you know one of the many weaknesses that I've realized that I have is, it's very hard for me to be content with where I am. I'm always thinking ok like what's next what's next. And it's hard for me to appreciate that moment in time and learning from that moment and being in that moment because I'm always just looking forward to the next thing. And that's something that I really really had to work on is you know just embracing the time that you're in in the space that you're in and becoming better in that space that you're in. Sometimes you can kind of think that the place that you're in is a waste because you're just thinking about the next thing but every kind of moment, every experience is something that's really really vital to the next thing. And I also think that a weakness that I had that I really worked on is making sure that I spend all my time or at least all my downtime I becoming better at the things that I need to get to get better at. Like for example I love TV. I still love TV. I'm always going to watch TV but I think that at times I would I would be wasting time watching things that weren't going to better me. You know if a show was on that I just enjoyed watching but also like a SportsCenter was on and I could watch the way that Cari Champion hosts or I could watch the way that Scott Van Pelt hosts to me that's a priority. So I would want to watch that and then watch the thing that maybe just gave me some joy at a time that there wasn't something more beneficial on for me if that makes sense. And always just trying to soak in knowledge like I tried to turn off the TV at least by midnight and read a book until I go to sleep, just to kind of soak in knowledge that way. Every morning when I wake up I watch a TED talk just because it kind of puts me in a good space for the day just because time is so fleeting and you just kind of have to spend it whatever way you can just trying to be better and trying to learn more because there's just so much to learn. So I definitely had to get better at time management for sure. CK: I love both of those. I think that those things that you mention has weaknesses are sort of like parts of the human condition that we all struggle with. I know being mindful and appreciating the moment are things that are hard for a lot of people. So what are some practical ways that you cultivated that or worked on that? TR: I really think it was a symbol as just like slowing down. I think I’m—I move so quickly my mind moved so quickly that I don't just stay in the moment of what's what's happening, it's just like really taking time sometimes to just reflect looking around you and just saying OK it's really amazing that this is what I'm doing right now and I need to appreciate this, I need to soak in the things that I can. It's seriously as simple as just stopping and taking it in. But then also realizing, I remember write once so quote that it wishes. It basically said that you have to let the space between where you are and where you want to be inspire you. And so I let like this kind of middle part more so drive me to the next part more than I let it discourage me that I'm not at the next part so I get to just kind of changing your perspective on your day to day. And I think that that that certainly helped me. CK: Such a simple mindset shift but I can see how that would be really powerful. TR: Yeah, definitely. CK: So we touched on some of the pretty amazing things you’ve already accomplished. But I mentioned to you before that there are two big questions that we ask people on the #WeGotGoals podcast and the first one is what is a big goal that you've achieved, why was it important to you and how did you get there? So out of all those things that you've accomplished, what would you highlight? TR: I would say the big goal, mostly just because it was a goal of mine since like freshman year of college was, I wanted my first job to be at a network. It was so important to me that I worked hard in college to make my first job something that I loved, something I would feel fulfilled doing and mostly because I didn't want to limit myself. I think that we do this thing where people kind of say OK this is the track you're supposed to go on. You do this. You start local. And then you eventually work your way up. But I think that by telling people that you're almost conditioning them to think that that's the only way and it is important to me to not put myself in that box just because you know starting local or starting in a certain market is the norm, I never wanted to feel like that was necessary. I wanted to be able to be working in college to be able to show something when I graduated and say I spent these four years basically like I was working at a local station. I was breaking stories I was covering stories I was doing actual journalism my four years in school and I did that so that I had something to show for it once I graduated. It wasn't even just about being at a network it was about not allowing myself to be put into that box or not making myself feel like I had to take a certain path because I wanted this to be about me. I didn't want to have to follow what anyone else did or feel like I had to do something that I just truly didn't want to do. It's like I always tell people, like, everyone has to one-man-band. I totally get that. But I genuinely did not want to do that. I was like you know what I am not going to be able to carry this camera, do my live shot, edit my stuff. I want to be good enough that I don't have to do that. And even that some of it is just like OK not wanting to you know I have to do that work. I totally get it. But it was just something that I I knew I wanted to be able to skip to get to a different destination. And so I decided to work really hard to be able to to go to that next level you know I did a lot of that one-man-banding while I was in school. I wanted to learn those lessons, I wanted to make those mistakes. But yeah I just think my goal was to make my first job something that that I mean I would have been content if it was my last job. I mean Big 10 Network I'd be content if I was there right now but it was very very important to me. CK: How do you think you got the confidence to know that that could be a possibility for you? TR: I think the genuine answer is that I don't know. I have just always felt like I'm a person who really thinks that if you want to do something it can happen. And probably, I probably think that too much you know. Like I I think that I know what every single human can accomplish. Like I know that we all have this just like limitless potential like every single person can be what they want to be. I truly believe that. I tried to tell all my friends everyone I know that whatever it is you want to be you can be that. And I think I've just always believed that and because I've always felt that there’s just never really been like a doubt that I could do it or that anybody could do it. It's just I think that the thing that scares people sometimes is just like starting or just like putting your all into the thing that you want to do because putting your all into it, that means that you know if it doesn't happen you may be upset and you know if you put your all into it you may be disappointed or frustrated but you're going to be much more disappointed or frustrated if you never take that step. And I just always I think kind of think that just the limits to what we can all accomplish— there are no limits. And I just, I want everyone to just like tap into that potential and fight for whatever it is they want to do and try to accomplish that goal. And I just I don't know. I just think I've always felt that I've always been really confident in that belief.

I think that the limits to what we can all accomplish—there are no limits. I want everyone to tap into that potential and fight for whatever it is they want to do and try to accomplish that goal.

CK: So I'm inspired just hearing you talk about it. That's awesome.

CK: I did wonder too. You've always had sports around you. I know your mom is a huge sports fan and you also have some pro athletes in your family your dad Thomas Rooks is a fantastic football player for the University of Illinois. And your Uncle Lou Brock was a major league baseball player in fact a Hall of Famer for the St. Louis Cardinals. So do you think being around people who worked really hard and achieved pretty incredible things played a role in that belief that you have? TR: Yeah I mean that's not even just because you know they played baseball or played football. It's because of the things they would tell me. Growing up literally every day, my dad would say, you can be whatever you want to be if you put your mind to it. So I've always felt that way. I hear stories from my uncle Lou just about hard work. Just about the trials and tribulations that he had to go through and that's something that sticks with you because you're surrounded by people that not only tell you but they also did it. Words hold a little more weight when there is also you know action behind or just like an actual experience behind it. So I just never thought a meeting was off limits. Everyone in my family I think worked extremely hard and they try to instill that hardworking mentality into me and my sister. Sol my sister is like she wants to be the president you know. But she says it and she really means it. And that's really what she wants to be one day. I don't think that I will hear anybody tell me a goal and I'm like, whoa that's a hefty goal. I'm like no, well, you have to say that you have to believe that for it to be a thing. You know you're not going to be the president if you don't say hey I want to be the president. It's like when people ask athletes hey do you think that if you played LeBron one on one would you win? Why would they say no? You know, you're supposed to believe in yourself and have like a very strong conviction and your beliefs and your abilities. You're supposed to think that that's what you can do eventually that's what you can do one day and if you don't have a full conviction in that, then the likelihood of you being able to do it is going to be a lot less. I think you have to be like your biggest advocate, your biggest supporter and just really think that you can get there. CK: So how do you kind of maintain that when you do face obstacles or reason you faced people who are not your biggest advocates. How do you take those steps to maintain that confidence? TR: I think that that is actually something I struggled with as well especially in college maybe my first year out of school is you want people to think you're doing a good job. I think that's just a natural human desire. You want people to think you're doing a good job you want people to tell you you're doing a good job. You want everyone to you know enjoy watching you or enjoy listening to you or whatever it may be. And I think for a while I started to find like my fulfillment or my happiness in feeling like other people enjoyed listening to me or watching me. But I think the flipside to that is if somebody doesn't enjoy it or like it it kind of brings you down a lot more because if you're living for like the praise you're also going to live for the criticism as well. So I just kind of had to unplug from that and say you know it doesn't like this doesn't matter. You have to be content with your product—you know your producers your friends your family, people that matter and that are gonna be honest with you, that's who you have to really really do this for and not let somebody who doesn't believe in you or doesn't like you bring you down. Because you know they don't understand they don't truly know you. So that is definitely something that that I struggled with. But now it's just, I really don't pay it any mind I think that comes with time especially like you said being a woman in this field there's always literally always going to be somebody that has something to say and if you pay attention to all that if you give it any mind it will wear you down. It will break you down you just like you have to be happy with what you're doing and you just have to feel fulfilled kind of on your own, if that makes sense. CK: It does and I always wonder how people in a position like yours handle social media. I know you must get positive reinforcement of course but also just—the world is just crazy out there with some of that stuff. And how how, like, on a practical level do you deal with that? TR: I just I don't read the comments. Don’t read comments. Don't become too invested in it. That's the thing, social media is both the best invention and the worst invention it brings out the best in people and it really brings out the worst in people as well. And you can't let it become too much of your world. And I think right now a lot of us do, including me like like I said there was a time it really either made me or broke me that day. But it’s just letting social media be social media. Like it's not real life the people on there aren’t real life the things you see on there aren’t real life. It's just— you have to let it be what it is as hard as that is. You just have to be that way and half of the people that maybe say mean things to you would never say that to you or act that way if they saw you in real life. It's just kind of the allure of the keyboard and the screen and who you can be when you're behind them both. So you just have to kind of remind yourself of that. And I think also you have to believe that you're here because you're supposed to be. And that's something that a lot of people struggle with like no matter what your job is you know whether you're a teacher or a doctor or a salesperson a journalist whatever it is you're in that room because you belong in that room. And so it's not second guessing yourself. You're there for a reason and you can't allow the words of other people to second guess your strengths and why you're there and where you've been and how good you've done like that’s—you don't really luck your way into successes or you know you don't like luck your way into positions it may help you know how they say I may get you there but it's not going to keep you there. And it's just kind of reminding yourself, like, you belong there and no one can can take that away. CK: Right. I knew so many of us do struggle with that imposter syndrome and that way of reinforcing your own belief in yourself. Seems like it would be really helpful. So Taylor I know too because you and I have talked before. And just from what I've read about you that you have some deeper motivations in your work whether it's having these really authentic conversations on your podcast or just being the voice of a black woman who has different experiences than some of your colleagues and making sure that you are that voice in the room when you're talking about cultural or political issues in sports. So does connecting with some of those deeper motivations also helps you get through some of those tough challenges? TR: Oh definitely. Yeah because you know I I feel like I have a responsibility. I think that it's so important to have black voices and to have female voi

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"Meddling," my husband said after consulting dictionary.com to try to settle an argument, "is a bad thing."

I put my headphones back on, not acknowledging what he considered a win. Sure, a meddler isn't invited to address an issue, but that doesn't mean she can't help make it better with her unique skills. After meeting Maaria Mozaffar - civil rights attorney, policy drafter and author of More Than Pretty - who describes herself as a "meddler," I can't help but see the descriptor as good.

"I think everybody has the ability to have empathy and step in others' shoes, but not everybody pays attention to it," Mozaffar told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals. "I paid attention to it since childhood ... that it made me very satisfied."

And as we conversed our way through her accomplishments for the podcast, Mozaffar shared how her natural draw towards helping others shaped her life.

Mozaffar saw a future in which she would use her powers of meddling as an attorney, to ensure justice for those who couldn’t always stand up for themselves. First, though, there was the little matter of passing the bar exam. She tried—and failed, five times. Rather than doubt her intelligence and abilities, though, she put the situation in perpective.

"Real life and application of the law and advocacy for the law is not a multiple choice test - such as life is not a multiple choice test," she said. Resilience is a natural result of failure in the face of a big goal and when she took the test a sixth time, she succeeded at her mission to take home the license she needed to practice.

After passing the bar exam, she continued her work in policy and advocacy, inserting herself into the issues where she could impact the most people: rights at the borders, the travel ban and food deserts. Along the way, she also took notice of how women viewed themselves and their success, developing the ideas that would lead to her book More Than Pretty.

In the book, she explores issues relating to beauty, intelligence, social media (and selfies) and how strong women navigate a world where their worth may seem determined more by how they look than what they contribute.

"If I want [my three kids] to have a good example of what a strong woman is, a strong mom is, I can't just tell them about it - I have to be that," she said.

And a natural way to show your children exactly how strong you are is to add "triathlete" to a list that already includes "she who stands up for the tired, the poor, the huddled masses yearning to breathe free."

Mozaffar describes the sport of triathlon as a way to keep her body strong and feeling good to allow her to "contribute to society."

"Triathlons are uniquely interesting because triathlons are like life, right? It doesn't matter if you're first. It doesn't matter if you're last. The only thing that matters is that you cross the finish line smiling," she said.

Listen to the episode of #WeGotGoals and get the book by Mozaffar (which she used as a tool to raise money for an organization she loves, The United State of Women, for the first month it was on sale). And if you like what you hear, be sure to rate it and leave a review.

JAC:Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me I have Maggie Umberger and Kristen Geil.

KG:Hello Jeana.

MU: Good morning Jeana.

JAC: Good morning ladies.

MU: So Jeana this week you spoke with Maaroa.

JAC: I did. I spoke with Maria Mozaffar. She is a civil rights attorney. She is an author and speaker and just generally a protector of humans who need protection.

MU: And the way that she sets goals is really cool because she has her eyes and ears open to what people need. And when you say she's a protector of humans that like encompasses her many jobs because she goes into so many different realms that take her on a lot of different paths but they're all under that umbrella of like total selfless acts.

JAC:When she was describing her law practice she talked first about where she volunteers her time, which I find really interesting because the places where she volunteers her time or donates her time--those things tend to take up more of her time than sort of the billable hours stuff. So she she's been active in sort of the Border Rights and the rights that humans have at the U.S. borders as well as the ban, the travel ban. And she also wrote a book called More Than Pretty.

KG: One of the things that came through on your interview with Maaria is that she has no quit in her. Can you tell us about some of the obstacles that she's faced and how she's overcome them?

JAC:So Maaria, you're right does not know how to quit. She failed the bar exam five separate times and she'll talk through the story of how she overcame it what she did to overcome it. But she knew that she needed to pass the bar to practice law, to do the things that she wanted to do and because that was a block in the way of her big goal. She understood that she would just have to keep banging her head against that wall until she broke the wall down. And she wrote letters. She reached out to people. But I think what was most incredible was that I didn't even have a chance to ask her how it felt to pass the bar exam because she immediately explained how it felt, which was that she was on this high probably so high that it was almost as if she was stoking her own ego. But she has this incredible connection to sort of religion and the universe and she felt that the universe almost put her back in her place after feeling like she'd passed the bar and she was on this high. And she found herself sort of back down where she needed to be where her head had to be to actually move forward and achieve the things that she was there to achieve. The bar exam was just one step along the way.

MU:And when we think about fitness I think a lot of times we get to treat fitness as our little selfish moment of the day where it’s just, we do this for us and I know that's how I feel about a great yoga class or whatever it might be. But even when she talks about her relationship to fitness she's a role model to other people. Can you talk a little bit about that?

JAC:So she is a triathlete which is incredible because I don't know when she does it. A multi-sport athlete takes a lot of time for him or herself to train for the three sports, involved for swimming biking and running. And she's doing those things and she's also sort of doing them for her family. So she talks about how she crossed the finish line carrying her daughter in her arms wearing a T-shirt that said she was her husband's wife and her daughter’s mother. She's not just doing it for herself she's doing it to be a role model for her whole family which was incredible and a lesson to me as well because I as I sort of think about where my life will go selfishly I think about how children will fit in because I think so much about how you can be either a strong woman or a caretaker. And that's just not true. Because she is both of those things she is both a strong woman and a caretaker sort of in one body doing all those things, vacillating wildly between being strong so she can take care of people and taking care of people so that she can be strong. And I thought that was the most incredible thing about her was that she sort of broke all the rules.

MU:It's a truly amazing interview. So here is Jeana with Maaria.

JAC:Are you going to cry? I might cry too.

JAC:I’m Jeana Anderson Cohen and we are here on #WeGotGoals. I'm here with Maaria Mozaffar who is an accomplished lawyer, author, president of an organization and you're also an attorney with CAIR here in Chicago. Welcome to #WeGotGoals, Maaria.

MM: Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here. S

JAC: So before we get started I’d love just sort of hear what you're doing now what you're working on all the organizations you're a part of. Before we jump into the questions.

MM:Sure. So right now I'm donating my time as a legislative attorney to CAIR, Council of American Islamic Relations Chicago. They are the number one civil rights organizations for Muslim Americans in this country. And I'm also donating my time to organizations, political organizations as well that are wanting to learn about legislative drafting and how to get involved in policy and advocate for policy. And I'm also talking about the main ideas about a book I wrote called More Than Pretty, how to lead a life of substance in an artificial world. So I'm talking to women's groups and different organizations about the substance in that.

JAC: That's a lot. You’re also a mother of three.

MM:Yes I'm a mother of three. I have a 8-year old and two little four year olds and I'm a wife. So,yes. Keeps me busy, busy person.

JAC: So talk to me about a big goal that you've accomplished and what it took to get there.

MM:So I'm very excited I finally finally finished my new labor of love, which is the book More Than Pretty: How to Live a Life of Substance in an Artificial World.And I really wanted to write this book because I wanted to bring everything together that I've experienced since I was a child all the way to now of how I as a person have managed to move away from the distractions that society throws at us and focus on what's important. And it's brought me so much joy and so much purpose. And I just felt you know my day job as a civil rights attorney and as a legislative consultant, my day job shows me a lot of injustices and inconsistencies in our communities. And when I see that I try to solve those problems. But I also focus on the person and I focus on, if each individual in that situation was whole and empowered. Things would look so different they would advocate for themselves differently and the person that may be doing something that's unjust to somebody else would check themselves. So I just felt like at the end of the day no matter what movement we're in, no matter what we're advocating for movements can go so off track. If individuals themselves are not whole and that's what I wanted it to focus on.

JAC:Wow. So in that whole story that you just told the story of your life essentially. You've really been an advocate for others. What led to you doing that? What led to you sort of donating your time the way you do donating your brain power the way you do? Writing a book is not just you sit down and you write a book It takes a long time what led to all of that?

MM:You know I'd like to start out by saying that there are some things in certain people's personalities that are always there like compassion and empathy. I think everybody has. I think everybody has the ability to have empathy and to step in other people's shoes. I think not all of us pay attention to it. I paid attention to it. I paid attention to it since childhood that it made me very happy, that it made me feel very satisfied when I understood how other people felt and how I could somehow communicate with them of how they could snap out of it or change a few things in their in their daily routine or their life or whatever their circumstances. To have a better day or a better opportunity. You know since I was young I was that kid who would intervene if two kids were fighting or if I felt somebody was being mistreated I would make a point or my responsibility to go in. My sister jokes, why are you always meddling? Why are you always meddling in my stuff? And I'm a meddler. I don't say I know it all but I wanted to roll up my sleeves and try to make it go better for you. If everyone did that we would be in a better place so now and this is a really interesting exercise for anyone who's interested in writing. When you actually write your thoughts down and then you go through the summary of your experiences you actually realize more who you are than when you are going through them. So it's a really good exercise to like think about how you reacted and how you interacted with people. And so I started to really do all my work out of that space. You know how can I make somebody else's situation better? And I am a very spiritual person, I'm a person of strong faith and I do believe in the big picture and I do believe that what you put in without always thinking of yourself first, what you put in is going to be rewarded by the universe and by the Creator so I always work out of that space. You know I never think my job is to advocate to always put other people first, I feel like my job is to do the best I can to make life better for somebody else.

JAC:And right now you're working really hard to make life better for women. Among other groups with More Than Pretty. So can you talk to me about how you're sort of working with groups now to implement the ideas in More Than Pretty.

MM:Absolutely. So now I am so thankful I'm going to different town halls going to different communities, will be holding book clubs online to talk about the book and really the book is written for any woman from anywhere honestly at any age. And it is really to focus in and have that conversation that you would with your best friend. You know that you feel everything is going great but somehow you feel like they could do even better if they just heard somebody that was sincere enough to say you know maybe you can tweak here and there. And I've been through these situations you would feel more empowered. So right now that's I'm in the thick of that I'm in the thick of getting my message out. I'm in the thick of empowering women to understand that they are so more than pretty and that the consumer driven industries and the media and the way that this whole community in society is set up is to remind you that you're not. That's how that's how people make money. You know and so many products and industries have made money to tell people that they're not more than pretty. You know tell women that that's all they have to be and that's taken away from them developing their inner character and their inner strength and finding out who they are.

JAC: Today. People are posting about their lives all the time. We're surrounded by images of self,  selfies of people in the perfect situation of portraying what they want to show that pretty perfect lifestyle. How do you think social media has played in to what you're talking about and the problem you're trying to solve.

MM:  I'm so glad you asked me that question because there's a whole chapter on that and there's definitely a chapter on selfies. So we cannot ignore social media and we need to understand it react to it and comment on it. Social media is great in the aspect that it gives you the connection to individuals that you don't see physically and you can talk to people from around the world and learn about issues, humanitarian issues the things that are going on in Burma or Syria. You can learn about and read about it and see short video so I love social media for that reason. There's also a dark side of social media and with everything whether it be chocolate  or junk food of any sort. Moderation is key. Right. So social media is the same. Moderation is key. And I think that we have to understand what social media does to us personally. We have to analyze that. So we know how to use it effectively. So you brought up the example of the selfie. First of all what the selfie teaches you is that it's all about the face. It's all about the face. If the face looks good your life is good. The problem with that is there's not one face that is the standard of beautiful and looking good. There's a lot of different types of faces there's a lot of different types of skin types and the filter shows you that you don't have to worry about being different. We can all look the same. And so there's so much emphasis on the face and that you carry with you psychologically. You know when you enter in a room and you know that a selfie really matters, it really matters what you look like instead of developing your thoughts of what you're going to say at the meeting that you're going to.So it does put a lot of emphasis on your face and you'll and you'll see that this happens. I was just joking about this the other day that you see someone they look like they're on the red carpet. And then you see the same person in the grocery store and you like what happened?And they look fine, they totally look fine they're just getting tomatoes from the grocery store but they look totally different from what they look like. Justa day ago.

And so that artificial look that you're putting to the world all the time consistently basically tells you that your tomato look where you're going out to get groceries is not your real look. But which is it? Because the selfie has a filter right. So you yourself are confused what do I really look like? What is my appearance to the world? The second issue with social media is the like contest. I call it the like contest which is the need for validation for your experiences and your accomplishments and just your moments. If you're on vacation in Greece it's not valuable to you. You may intellectually think it is but it's not valuable to you until you have so many likes on your picture. And so what it does that it takes away from the actual vacation it takes away from the actual moment because you're so concerned about lets take a picture let's take a selfie.

And so it drives that need for validation to your basic existence. And then think the fact that you're breathing and experiencing these things is not valuable enough unless it's on photo. The other thing it does number three is that it takes away from you being present.

It really does because I think we've all been there where we're at social events and we're enjoying the social event we're enjoying the moment whether it be a baby shower bridal shower or what have you. But then everyone is taking a picture and everyone's posing and then it's all about the picture and it's all about that experience instead of the experience of the events.

So it takes away from you being present, it forces you to have this need for validation from others and then it puts a lot of effort on your face which you know God made all types of faces they're all beautiful. God has not made one ugly unattractive person not one. And so the fact that you have a filter fixing your face all the time teaches you that there is an imperfect face and I don't believe in that.

JAC:I think it's super powerful in that and I think what will probably unpack next is the fact that intelligence can't be shown on most of the time let's say on Instagram and these photo based and video based social channels. So how do you sort of take the emphasis from what's in front of your brain into what's actually going on in your head?

MM:I think this goes back to the idea of moderation and knowing how to use it. So first of all you have to know what is the purpose of you being on social media if your purpose is to be more vain to become more insecure to create an artificial moment for other people to see. So then they get envious and start analyzing their own lives. If that is your intention then you don't have to look smart. You just have to look exactly what you're looking like in that picture. But if you want to use it in a way where it actually makes change or does something that's meaningful to somebody else and for yourself then your pictures should have some kind of purpose. It may be a reflection on a moment. It could be a thought that you had. It could be a picture of somebody other than yourself something that you're seeing. Sometimes for example I see individuals that are doing something interesting on the street and I like to comment on it like how nice this person walked this old lady across the street something like that. And then you use that photo to teach or share or use the photo to share your intellectual thought process on a certain moment. And I think that's what we have to do we have to be more than a picture. You know I'm not a big person on Instagram. My friends love it and they're pushing me to get on it. But my hesitation only with that is that the photos don't really let me share my thoughts. It's all about just what you see what you see what you see and what you see. Always should have some context so people are able to appreciate what you're experiencing at a deeper level.

JAC: What's interesting is with us at aSweaLife is. We use Instagram. But I had the same sort of internal struggle because for a while it was just me but now we have all of these writers, all these ambassadors and I love our Instagram channel now because it's not just me. Because it's all of these different faces and humans doing incredible things. But when it was just me I'd post a photo and sort of turned my phone over and be like, why. Why would anyone care about me in a sports bra. Or why would anyone care about me doing a lunge. But now it's it's much more powerful because it's other.s

MM: Because you you figured out how to make it work for your ultimate purpose which is bigger than anything superficial. That's why it works for you.

JAC: Yes. I think that's what everyone needs their own social channels is just ask, in life in fitness and Instagram. What is your why?

MM: Yeah.

JAC: So what is your why? What gets you out of bed everyday.

MM:To be honest with you I feel like we have one life. I believe we have one life. And I believe that we are lucky to get up every day and there's many people that don't you know sometimes when I talk to organizations or at town halls I say that there's a reason you're in the audience and somebody else was in a car accident and we can't forget that you know there's many people who don't live past the age 16 or 25 or 10. So I just wake up with a lot of gratitude that I'm breathing and I know that I'm not here to take up space.

JAC:What I love about that is that I can hear you in your resolve your resilience as well. And speaking to sort of your resilience there's always failure that precedes it. So I know that you've spoken publicly about this before. I'm not outing you. But you took the bar six total times. Yes. You failed the first five. What allowed you to keep going? Or what drove you to keep going?

MM: You know with any goal just like we were having this discussion social media. We need to know what our ultimate reason for doing anything is my ultimate reason because I was a meddler from childhood was to be able to advocate for other people. I was very passionate and inspired by the civil rights movement of the 60s. I was very inspired around the world looking at individuals who would change power dynamics and how one person could make a huge difference. And I believe advocating for other people in that way, being a lawyer in that way would give me the ability to do that. So I knew I always wanted to do that. I also knew that I don't believe in the so-called notion of experts. I don't believe anybody is an expert. I think if someone says they're an expert then it's suspect because an expert if you really know about anything you know that there's so much more to know.

So a real expert kind of cautions themselves before they call themselves an expert. So when somebody is telling you that you are not able to pass a multiple choice test and that real life and application of the law and advocacy for the law is not a multiple choice test such as life is not a multiple choice test. When someone tells you that you have the choice to either believe it or to see through all that and I saw through all that I realize that you know I do. I'm not a good test taker. I'm not a good multiple choice test taker. And so I just have to figure out what to do. And I have to figure out this game. And I saw the bar as a game and every time I failed I focus on the goal of why I wanted it. And that kept me going. And you know my father said this to me when I was young: When you fail at something and you keep trying that becomes your personality your personality becomes the persistence. And I paid attention when my parents talked. That's another thing, I say that a lot in the book that my parents were the kind of parents that always spoke about certain things like general big things and then they come and hit you and you're an adult that kept me going that you know I'm going to learn something out of this and I'm going to learn that there's no shortcuts and I'm going to learn that I have to do this by myself and I remember after I failed the fifth time you know because you you have so many people saying oh there you go. Like she couldn't pass this test. But you know what your intellect is, you know what your ability is and you know what the reason was that you failed. So you don't listen to all of that. This is your life and your purpose. And you got to do what you got to do. So I remember I was at a brunch at a restaurant having brunch by myself because in those moments you have to be by yourself when you get a notice that you failed the fifth time. So I called the president of the board of admissions. I literally googled this gentleman and I googled where they worked. And I called him and I said listen this is what has happened in the process of taking this exam five times. I've also done this this and this such as developed policy and worked with other attorneys and then all this stuff even though the other people were signing off on my stuff because I couldn't sign off on it. I've done all the stuff so I know what I'm doing. I just can't pass this test. He listened for a while and then he said, you are just have to take it again. But let's talk. Let me let me call you back.

I never got a call back. So then what I did is that I wrote this long letter and I wrote this letter but everything that I had done while I was taking the bar exam to show him that I'm not just sitting here twiddling my thumbs. I'm studying and contributing as what I could do in my capacity and I wrote this long passionate letter I think it was like four pages long of everything that I was since I was a child an undergrad in high school and how I was student body president in high school in undergrad and law school and I was not someone who took a back seat and etc. No response. So then I called again and I said I wrote you a letter and he said you know I got your letter and I'm so glad you called and we shared it with all the members on the board of admissions because we were so inspired by your letter and we just want you to know. We all want you to take it again.

So obviously obviously I said OK and he goes I know you can do it. And I did. And I did and I passed. And what was hilarious about that this is the way God works is that I got the notice and I was so excited I went out for a drive and then I picked up some pizza. I was like in this mood like I was so excited. And then I got stopped for speeding. And it's like God saying like calm down. You did the work. We made it happen. Now let's not throw our hands up in the air you know.

JAC: Calm down, it's just a pizza party.

MM: It's so funny because even the cop was like I could smell the pizza in the car but it just put things in perspective and I pay attention to those things. You know whenever there are highs I enjoy them but I have perspective of why this high is occurring and when it's low I focus on what is the lesson that I'm being taught this time.

JAC: Along the way. And as a licensed attorney you started to mention, but you've advocated for change you've been inspired by the civil rights movement. You've been involved in essentially today's civil rights movement both through the travel ban and through food deserts. And I firmly believe that food is the first frontier when it comes to making change. There's more to it obviously. But can you talk through the steps that you've taking on the travel ban and what you're working on today?

MM: So this question really is not. I can speak from an attorney's perspective but really in general this is about finding your lane and finding a way to contribute to the issue. So as you stated I have three little kids and I have a husband and I have a home and I'm also just as the accomplishments professionally I'm very grateful for those. And I don't want them to slide ever because that those are really important to me. So for that reason I can't always go out when there's a protest or march I'm not able to do that I have bed time 7:30 8 o'clock homework is done. So I'm limited by those things but I am able to analyze law and I'm able to write policy and I'm able to communicate those ideas to other organizations and donate my time. So that's what I do. And right now.

So let's take the travel ban for example the travel ban came out. It identified six different countries. The first version that were majority Muslim. However the travel ban itself did not tie itself to any facts of why it was created because there is no evidence of domestic terrorism by Muslim Americans from those countries. So I am able to analyze these executive orders that are coming now. And you know how people say follow the money follow the money? I follow the intent. I'm interested in the intent I'm interested in why people are writing these laws. What is the administration thinking, whatever power? You know whoever is in power for that regard. So for the travel ban for example what I did is I analyzed the first travel ban and I wrote a response and analysis, a legal analysis of the fact that it was unconstitutional.

And I spoke to law professors a very good friend of mine Daria Rothmyer who's also a law professor and I discussed the process of why it was unconstitutional and how these executive orders actually really impact the rights of all Americans. And then I contacted legislators and I said this is my analysis. This is a bill also to call it unconstitutional. Congress should call it unconstitutional and I called different legislators and I got responses saying that this is great this is wonderful. We're really interested in advocating and so we did town halls with them which is great. But that issue specifically was left to the courts. Now there's other issues like that for example food deserts that came across my radar I would say about five years ago I read about food deserts and I'm like wow like I can't believe that there's no grocery stores in these areas.

And so I came across this research from this wonderful woman named Mary Gallagher and she had done this intense research in Detroit and in Chicago about food deserts and basically the quality of life and the hardship that occurs. And I was fascinated and I was like How can we make this into policy? How can we do something about this? And there are organizations that I work with and there's a really good organization called Inner-City Muslim Action Network. And they do grassroots organizing. And I met with the executive director there and I said let's let's do this. And they were already involved in advocating and building relationships between community members and liquor store owners. They were in that process. They had already voiced their concern for that so I was like, bam. This is what's interesting is like when you have your goal you don't have all the answers and you're not the one doing everything there's different partners that do different things.But it all comes together and sometimes you just someone needs to press go and everyone's like you know contributing and doing great work already so. So food deserts was like that.

And so I wrote a resolution that was unanimously passed in Illinois General Assembly about the importance of food deserts. And I worked with Senator Collins, Jackie Collins, in the Illinois State Senate to basically create a fresh food fund that would allow organizations to get money to be able to counter this idea. So that is a developing process policy works in this way where you identify an issue and then you work with different parties and come up with different ways to solve the problem. And right now you'd be surprised what I'm working on right now is that since the travel ban has happened we have seen that there are U.S. citizens, individuals that are detained at the airport. Their phones are taken, Facebook accounts, everything is requested. And these individuals despite being U.S. citizens are not able to see their attorney. And in fact we have called CBP the customs border patrol wanting to talk to clients and they would say well you know this is kind of a no man's zone and it's actually a privilege that they'll get to see you.

So there are people being searched as U.S. citizens because for some reason they fit some kind of description and majority of these cases all these people are just released they're like allowed to walk because they couldn't find anything on them. So the bill that I'm working on right now is to be able to make sure that if you are at CBP checkpoints you should have the right to call your attorney. No matter where you are and we have sent the bill to different legislators we're really wanting to see Illinois state senators to pick it up and that's what we're pushing for right now and I'm talking publicly about it so people can understand how vital and important it is.

JAC: Those are big issues issues big issues. Meanwhile while you're doing all of this you are also a triathlete. So I am curious to hear how your ideas of goal setting outside of the gym in sort of your public and professional life come into your goal setting when you're doing that sort of three sport athletic thing.

MM: I talk about this a lot in the book I have a whole chapter on the importance of physical fitness because I believe that if your body feels good then you will be able to contribute to society. I move out of the space of that the energy flows from what you put inside your body.

So triathlons why I even wanted to do triathlons. Number one I have like I said three little kids if I want them to have a good example of what a strong woman is, a strong mom is I can't just tell them about it. I have to be that. So my first time I did the triathlon I had a t shirt and on the T shirt I surprise my husband. My husband's initials are I.Q. so everyone calls him IQ and he is very smart.

So my T-shirt I wrote IQ's wife and then on the back I wrote Iza's mom. My eldest daughter is Isaiah and it was hilarious about this is that when I crossed the finish line. I do the triathlon but the speaker was like, IQ's wife! I was like, I did the whole triathlon, and he gets called out for it. But so I only share that that my whole purpose in that was to I got to finish this. I got to train for this because I want my child to have this memory of her mom wearing this t shirt. I want my husband to have this memory and it creates a culture in the household. And then the second time I did the triathlon I actually picked her up before I crossed the finish line and I ran with her across it. Probably not allowed. But guess what? It was a memory for her for a lifetime. And we have it on video and a picture of me doing that. So my physical fitness and my push to push my body is to serve as an example for everyone around me my family. I always say this about triathlons, triathlons are uniquely interesting because triathlons are like life right? It doesn't matter if you're first. It doesn't matter if you're last. The only thing that matters is that you cross the finish line smiling. And through the process you think you know how it's going to feel.But there's different stages. The swim may feel like oh I got this but in the middle it might get a little rocky. And then you're done with the swim and you want to pat yourself on the back but nope you got to go bike. So you've got to get up on that bike and then you're tired and your legs are exhausted and something may go wrong but you finish the bike. And then you're like, nope,  you're not done. You got to run. That's like life. There are different stages and when you finish that triathlon and you finish that whole race what are you left with? You're left with the fact that you went through all those stages and you kept going. And that's the only thing that makes you happy. I always share that story that every activity or challenge you put on yourself physically, think about how it fits into your big picture and your bigger goal. And of it gives you energy and it gives you that validation that you're doing something right and people around you getting inspired then you do it.

JAC: I love that. And at aSweatLife we believe that what you do inside the gym directly reflects the life you have outside of the gym and the way you set goals and achieve them. So it's great to hear you say that too.

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In 2004, then-18-year-old sprinter Allyson Felix went to the Athens Olympics aiming to win gold in the 200-meter dash—and took silver to Jamaica’s Veronica Campbell.

In Beijing in 2008, the two lined up for a rematch, with the same result.

But Felix never took her eyes off the ultimate target, an individual gold medal in the 200 meters. In 2012, she finally achieved it.

Of all her accomplishments—her eight other Olympic medals (including five other golds), her 11 World Championship victories—that one holds the most meaning, she told me on this week’s episode of #WeGotGoals.

“It was eight years of being dedicated and sacrificing and having doubts—you know, is this ever going to come together?” she said. “So being able to accomplish that goal represented so much for myself, and also all the people who supported me.”

Few mortals can even fathom the type of success Felix has seen in her sport. How is it even possible, I asked her, to work toward goals that are so audacious, so otherworldly? Her answer: one day, one hour, one track session at a time.

“Whether that looks like getting through a workout in certain times for a specific day or even to the sense of, I want to do something that takes me out of my comfort zone, I want to try a different event, something I’m not as comfortable with—those are all smaller goals that help me reach some of the bigger ones that can feel just a little harder to achieve,” she says.

It’s a mindset that’s obviously paid off, making her one of the most decorated athletes in track and field history. Along the way, she’s faced setbacks and obstacles, including those early Olympic defeats and a serious hamstring injury in 2013. “I don’t think I ever really get over those moments,” she says. “But they’re always fuel. They’ve taught me so much.”

Felix also finds energy and inspiration in aiding others—especially children—in achieving their goals. She spoke with me on the phone from Abu Dhabi, where she was working to help athletes with intellectual disabilities prepare for sprint events in the upcoming Special Olympics World Summer Games, to be held there in 2019.

“To me, this kind of work is just so meaningful. It truly changes lives. And so to be able to be a part of that, to see people reach their individual goals—it’s a different type of rewarding,” she said.

After all the hardware she’s earned over her 15-year career, Felix isn’t anywhere close to hanging up her track spikes. She’s still looking to compete at the World Championships in 2019 and even to earn a spot on her fifth Olympic team at the 2020 Summer Games in Tokyo.

Getting there will require just the right balance of hard work and recovery to keep her body healthy, a line that shifts along with her physiology as she ages. She knows the barriers will be significant—but that’s exactly why she keeps at it.

“I love to challenge myself, I love to do something that doesn't come easy,” she said. “I'm looking forward to the whole process and journey.”

You can follow that journey—along with Felix's work with organizations like Special Olympics—on Twitter and Instagram.

Show transcription:

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen, and with me I have Kristin Geil and Cindy Kuzma.

KG: Good morning Jeana.

JAC: Good morning. Cindy you talked to Allyson Felix this week right.

CK: I did. Oh my gosh it was such an honor to speak with her and I apologize for the quality of the audio. She was on a cell phone. But what a treat to talk to this multiple gold medalist, Olympian, and World Champion. She's had an incredible career as a sprinter, and I was so glad to speak with her about her goals.

KG: Well, what kind of goals is she working on right now?

CK: She is still—believe it or not her first Olympics was in 2004—and she still has her sights set on the Tokyo Olympics in 2020. So if you do the math there, that is incredible. She’s also taking a long term view thinking beyond her career as an athlete. And some of the work that she’s doing right now she was in Abu Dhabi to work with the Special Olympics and really doing a lot of work to help children people with intellectual disabilities and others get a lot out of participating in sports as well, and so that is something that she is working on in the long term too.

JAC: Recovery is really important to her. How does she balance the hard work she has to do to achieve these big physical goals with getting rest and recovery?

CK: Yes she made a point of talking about recovery and rest and how essential it is to have that balance as a high level athlete. She builds in a couple of weeks of rest after every season. She makes sure that after a competition she gets enough rest. And really every day she has to balance the work that she needs to do with the recovery that her body needs. And she notes that that equation has kind of changed as time has passed too, that the older you get the more you remember the harder work outs you did when you were younger and you think you have to do those you get the same results. But that equation just changes your body changes your physiology changes. And she's really conscious about maintaining the right balance as she continues into the later stages of her career.

KG: When you were training for any big goal but you know especially something like the 2020 Olympics that seems so massive and so high up on the mountain top that taking the first step could be really daunting or you wouldn't even know where to start. So how does Allyson Felix balance those huge goals with smaller more tangible ways to break it up?

CK: Yes she definitely breaks everything down year by year month by month day by day workout by workout she's focused on what she has to do that day. When she gets out of bed in the morning she thinks about that and I'm sure she keeps her sights set on those big huge goals too. But she really also makes sure that she has a clear focus on the steps along the way to get there and those process goals I think can be really served her well obviously in the long run.

JAC: And here is Cindy with Allyson.

CK: Well Allyson thank you so so much for joining me today. Now you Allyson Felix have 25 medals in total, nine Olympic medals six of them gold 16 World Championship medals 11 of them gold. If I got any of that wrong feel free to correct me, I think I counted right.

AF: It’s all good.

CK: On #WeGotGoals we typically ask people about a major goal they've achieved and how they got there. But those kinds of goals are just so so out of this world. I mean how do you even approach massive goals like those and how do you do it in a way that’s helped you sustain a successful career for so long?

AF: Well, I think that for me it's really helpful to break a goal down. Because even for myself you know when I think about the things that I want to accomplish I’ve always been someone who set my goals really high. But I think at times you know, you can set a goal and it can just seem a bit overwhelming. And so that, I have noticed that in my career and so I've always tried to kind of work backwards and think about you know how am I going to accomplish this? What does that look like? How can I break that goal down into what I need to do each month or each week all the way down to something, a week, or even setting a daily goal. And so that's always helps big goals to seem more manageable and just more of a reality. So that's something that I’ve done over the years to help me get through. So whether that look like getting through a workout in certain times for a specific day or even to the sense of, I want to do something that takes me out of my comfort zone. I want to try a different event, something that I'm not as comfortable with. Those are all smaller goals that help me reach some of the bigger ones that can feel just a little harder to achieve.

CK: Oh, that makes so much sense and I feel like a lot of times when I’ve talk to accomplished athletes I feel like they do, they have process goals like that that take them to those bigger goals. When you think back over all that I mean can you pinpoint one accomplishment that’s been the most meaningful to you? Or do they all have their own special meaning?

AF: I think they definitely all have different meanings, different parts of the journey and different times in life but one that immediately comes to my mind is within my first individual gold medal at the Olympics. And that happened for me in 2012. But before that it was actually at my third Olympics. I had been to two games prior and had gotten silver medals to the same person and so to me, accomplishing that goal really just meant a lot because it was eight years being dedicated and sacrificing and having doubts, you know, is this ever going to come together? So being able to accomplish that goal represented so much for myself and also all the people who supported me, you know. All the people who were on my team and who helped me to get to that moment. It's just, it was such a group effort as well. So that's one that sticks out in my mind as being a huge accomplishment.

CK: You mentioned the support of your team and also some of the challenges that you faced. Right. I know you've you've had injuries you've had defeats, but obviously those haven't stood in the way of your incredible success. How do you overcome those to stay confident in your abilities and focused on the bigger picture? I’m guessing your support system plays a role in that, but what else would you say about how you overcome obstacles in that way?

AF: Yeah for sure. I mean I think there's no easy way around it. Sometimes you’re just in a tough situation and it's just difficult and it just can take some time. I think taking a break always helps, refreshing my mind. After each season I try to take a good six weeks away from the track, and so when I've dealt with—whether it's not achieving goals, dealing with disappointment and failure—I’ve always tried to just take a lesson away from it. You know, learn something, give my mind a break, give my body a break, so that I can come back to it refreshed. And that’s always helped when I've had you know whether it's a devastating injury or a devastating loss, you know sometimes you just need time to process that. I don’t think I ever really get over those moments, but they’re always fuel. They’ve taught me so much. I can look back on some of the worst losses that I've had and the biggest moments of my career. And I can be thankful for them because through them I have learned the most about myself, about character and integrity and doing things the right way, that I feel like in the end have allowed me to see success later on.

CK: So it's almost like they weren't necessarily setbacks but maybe sort of like essential fact in their eventual journey forward.

AF: For sure. You know it's hard to realize that in the moment you know, I think that’s for anyone in the midst of you know the trenches of going through something. It's hard to have the vision to be able to see past that. But I think you know a lot of times it can be necessary.

CK: Well, I know your trip right now is on behalf of Play Unified and Special Olympics, which create opportunities for individuals with intellectual disabilities and that you've also done some work in the Middle East with Right to Play which helps children facing adversity. So I wondered if you could tell me a little bit about why it's important to you to help other athletes especially those who are facing some significant obstacles in their way to achieve their goals?

AF: Yeah to me, it’s—I really love to do things I’m passionate about and sport has really just changed my life, it’s given me so many opportunities. And so for me it's a privilege to get involved with some of these different organizations that are close to my heart. And as you mentioned Special Olympics is one of them and it’s the reason that I'm here and I'm really excited that Abu Dhabi is going to be the host in 2019 of these World Games. And I think the biggest reason is just the lasting legacy that I feel it will have on this part of the world. I think it's just such a movement and we're talking about really changing perception of people with intellectual disabilities and giving them and their families a sense of pride. I think a lot of times these individuals are in a sense hidden here. And these games are really changing that and allowing just greater inclusion. And so it's a cause that is really close to my heart and I'm just excited that I think that this will have a huge impact on the world.

CK: Well that's a huge goal. And I mean it must be really rewarding to work with people who are sort of reaching their individual goals and in pursuit of that really big goal. Do you kind of see that—you see like that individual involvement in sports helping these people achieve other goals in their lives too and then having that bigger impact?

AF: For sure. To me, it's like, it's really, I love what I do. I love to be able to compete and you konw know something I'm passionate about. But to me, this kind of work is just so meaningful. It truly changes lives. And so to be able to be a part of that, and as you mentioned see people reach their individual goals—it’s a different type of rewarding. And you know we were able to see it up close and the impact not only on one individual but their family and in a sense a whole culture of people is very very special.

CK: Now there is a small element of competition for you here too, right? Or a challenge, at least from Kobe Bryant? Is that is that how some of this came about?

AF: Yes this specific trip—yes it did. I had been involved with Special Olympics before. But yes he did challenge me to specifically coach some Special Olympic athletes in my expertise area of sprinting so we were able to make that happen yesterday. We held a clinic and got to do some really cool work so have to accept the challenge.

CK: In your athletic career—I know 2018 isn't on championship year and your next major event then might be the World Championship in 2019 right.

AF: Yes correct.

CK: That's a goal that's a little bit farther away. So how will you be motivated and focused to work toward it?

AF: Yeah can be it can be challenging because you know sometimes those goals that are further away it's harder to be in touch with them. It feels like you have time, and it can be a little more challenging. So for me you know again going back to breaking those goals down and that each year, each season is really a stepping stone to the ultimate goals. Like you said the 2019 World Championships or even the 2020 Olympic Games. So I really do look at it as that. I look at it as an opportunity for me to work on some of the smaller things, some technical things as well to give my body a little break of just the intensity of year after year of the championships. Especially now, I’m getting older and being in the 15th season of my career. It's an opportunity to get training and compete smarter and focus on quality over quantity has been another goal that as an athlete can be challenging but that this year is helpful to do that.

CK: Yeah, that was another question I had for you too, whether that sort of equation of balancing hard work and rest has changed a little bit and your career has progressed and it sounds like it has and you're always fine-tuning that.

AF: It is. It's probably one of the hardest things, though, as an athlete. And I think you know just competitive people in general. You know you have this idea of you know, the more work you do, the harder the work is, the more progress you’ll see. And you know as time goes on you learn that that's not always the case. You have to definitely get wiser with the work that you do, and get creative. Recovery is important. And there’s all these other aspects. It can be challenging because you know it's not the way you traditionally think but it is very beneficial getting that part of the game right.

CK: So you mentioned Tokyo 2020, and we certainly hope we’ll see you there! Besides this sort of balance that we've talked about you know what do you think will be the most important—how are you aiming to achieve that big goal and what do you think will be most important in getting you there?

AF: Yeah I mean it's definitely a big one. I mean, it would be my fifth Olympic team. So for me it would be a drea come true. But there’s definitely challenges in the the way. I think the biggest thing is staying healthy, taking care of my body and just making sure all those things are in line. And just staying you know as competitive as I can, you know, training wise and so I think it’ll be kind of a combination of all those things. But I'm really excited. I love to challenge myself, I love to do something you know that doesn't come easy and so I'm looking forward to the whole process and journey.

CK: And then I'm curious to you know even if that happens then they'll still be a time in the next phase for you right, a career beyond sport, or in sport in a different way. Do you have in mind goals right now for that future or is that something that you will think about more when you when you're when you're getting there?

AF: Yeah definitely been thinking about it of course and just really wanting to do things I'm passionate about and so you to kind of do more of the work that I've been doing with organizations like Special Olympics, like Right to Play. I have a passion for children and so I want to definitely work with kids in some capacity and so yeah, right now kind of get together what that will specifically look like. But definitely it's on my mind and thinking about you know the transition to the next journey, during the next phase of my career.

CK: Allyson, I can't thank you enough for talking with me today. Really appreciate it and I know we're about out of time. Before I let you go how can people follow your training and all of your important work with organizations like the Special Olympics?

AF: Oh sure! Well, it’s been great to talk to you. You can definitely follow me on social media. On Twitter I'm just allysonfelix and on Instagram I’m af85. And so yeah I'll definitely be keeping everyone posted with all the things that I'm up to.

CK: Excellent, wonderful—well, we look forward to keeping up with you, not that we could really keep up with you. But following along. Thank you so much.

AF: Thank you, take care.

CK: This podcast was produced by me, Cindy Kuzma, and it’s another thing that's better with friends. So please, share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and while you're at it please leave us a rating or review. Special thanks to J. Mano for the music; to our guest this week, Allyson Felix; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio and technical support.

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File this one under "things you don't want to hear while recording a podcast entitled #WeGotGoals":

We've actually stopped using the word "goal" at The Junto Institute.

"Cool, cool," I thought to myself, as I mentally face-palmed during my interview with Raman Chadha of The Junto Institute. "This is fine. Everything is fine."

Chuckling a little at my dismay, Chadha went on to explain that his team had shifted towards using the word "priority" in place of goal. They'd found that their apprentices viewed goals as "far out in the distance," while priorities had a greater connotation of urgency, and gave their apprentices something to work on that very day.

The language nerd in me sat with that thought for the rest of the day, debating the hidden meanings of goal versus priority, and how using one word over the other shifted your focus on a daily, weekly or annual basis.

It's what I call a "fuzzy concept" - an idea that you can grasp, but that doesn't always have tangible, actionable deliverables attached to it. And fittingly, that's exactly what Raman Chadha specializes in every day.

As the co-founder of The Junto Institute, a leadership revenue accelerator for growth stage companies, Chadha helps leaders and entrepreneurs improve their leadership skills and their companies' bottom lines by developing emotional intelligence skills, which they then apply to their companies for a higher probability of success.

And as anyone who watched Nick Viall's season of The Bachelor knows, emotional intelligence is another fuzzy concept that's difficult to understand, let alone apply in a high-stress environment like a growth stage company. (FYI, Chadha and Junto define emotional intelligence as "the ability to recognize and regulate the emotions in ourselves and in others, and how we use that information/data to guide our thinking, actions and behaviors by progressing through self awareness, self management, social awareness and relationship management.)

The Junto Institute is based on the belief that emotional intelligence is the single biggest contributor to leadership effectiveness and job performance - crucial factors for growth stage companies in the "sink or swim" phase of entrepreneurship.

Chadha also highlighted two common traits of leaders that he's observed throughout his time working with entrepreneurs: tenacity and the ability to cope with ambiguity, uncertainty and chaos.

"In entrepreneurship, there are more lows than there are highs," Chadha said. "So [you need] the ability to bounce back on a regular basis, the ability to power through a rough day."

Similarly, since no two days of running a company are the same, you need to get comfortable with the unknown and operating without a fully-fleshed out path of how you'll get from Point A to Point B.

For those of us not at the helm of a growing company, we can still develop emotional intelligence in our everyday lives. One specific way to do that: work on becoming increasingly aware of how you're feeling in as many moments as possible throughout the day.

Try it right now: how are you feeling? Push yourself further than "fine," "tired," "happy" or any other generic adjectives; try using the most specific word you can find (need inspo? Check out this emotion wheel for ideas). By becoming uber-familiar with your own emotions and feelings, you develop self-awareness AND empathy for those around you (which in turn helps you become a more effective leader).

Show transcription:

JAC: Welcome to #WeGotGoals, a podcast by aSweatLife.com on which we talk to high achievers about their goals. I'm Jeana Anderson Cohen; with me I have Cindy Kuzma and Kristen Geil. KG: Hi Jeana. JAC: Good morning Kristen. You talked to Raman this week, right? KG: I spoke with Raman, who founded the Junto Institute, which is a really interesting company here in Chicago that helps growth stage startup companies and takes their leaders and their key employees and helps them develop their emotional intelligence skills through a sort of nine month cohort program. So it's really interesting because they're learning about their emotional intelligence, how it's important in the workplace, how to become better leaders and better read the emotions of other people—which is a very what I call a fuzzy goal right? It's much more of a process oriented goal. But he and his co-founder have found that in doing so they're really helping these companies with their outcome oriented goals, you know, increasing their bottom line and improving their profitability and lowering employee turnover. So I thought it was really interesting, the juxtaposition of the vagueness and sort of intangible quality that I think of emotional intelligence as and how it contrasts with the black and white numbers on a page. CK: And he had some really interesting insights about how this applies on a personal level too. Right. And I loved his tangible tip for squaring up with someone when you're listening to them. What else did you get out of that transition from what they do on a corporate level to how you can apply things like this to your personal life? KG: Yeah, one of the things Raman talked about that I love and like, need to apply more in my everyday life is just the practice of being self-aware, really being aware of how you're feeling in every moment. And he pointed to the use of something called an emotions wheel. Where, instead of just saying yeah I'm doing fine when someone asks how you are you can use this emotions we to actually point to a very specific adjective whether it's tense, surprised, excited. And that really helps you ground yourself in your emotions and in turn prompts the other person to be more empathetic which I think is great just being a little more in tune with your emotions through the power of language. He also talked about the skill of listening and how you can become a better listener and how important that is with leaders especially. And he gave some really tangible takeaways through just making eye contact putting down your device squaring your hips pointing your toes in your knees towards the person that you are paying attention to, all these small non-verbal cues that really signal to the person you're having a conversation with: You have my entire attention, I am focused on you. Let's go. JAC: And so these skills that he's teaching others and practicing himself haven't always been sort of a part of his life. He learned them along the way. Can you talk a little bit about that? KG: Yeah. One of the things that we talked about I asked about qualities and personality traits that are common in leaders. And he immediately pointed to tenacity and in a sense being comfortable being uncomfortable right? Being comfortable with that you might not know the exact outcome of a situation. And he said that these traits can be both inherent, he's seen them straight up and people. Or you can work to develop them over time and how that sometimes happens with certain sort of entrepreneurs. He pointed to himself—he said he didn't think that he had always been a tenacious personality but he learned it just by getting thrown in the fire over and over again and realizing, hey, this is a situation where I can't give up, I have to persevere. And in that way he was able to develop a certain personality trait which not everyone thinks is possible. CK: Well it was a fascinating conversation and I'm can't wait for everyone to hear it. So here is Kristin with Raman. KG: Welcome to #WeGotGoals. I'm Kristen Geil here with Raman of the Junto Institute. Hi Raman. RC: Hi Kristen. KG: Raman, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what the Junto Institute does and your role in it? RC: Well I'm a lifelong Chicagoan; went to college here at the University of Illinois, went to Kellogg for my MBA. I've spent my entire career in Chicago. I founded the Junto Institute in 2012 with my co-founder Catherine. The Junto Institute is a leadership and revenue accelerator for growth stage companies, and we believe that companies and their leaders can become infinitely better at who they are and what they do through developing skills that relate to emotional intelligence and business savvy and so we designed a program through which they can learn those and ultimately apply them to their companies for a higher probability of success. KG: On the #WeGotGoals podcast we start off by asking a couple big questions of every one of our guests. First one, and we'll start with thatm is what is a big goal that you've achieved in the past? And why was it so important to you and how did you get there? RC: Yeah that's a really interesting question. I don't know if I can say that I've had a big goal that I wanted to achieve but one thing that I'm very proud of recently is, my wife and I have two daughters 19 and 17. And about 20 years ago I remember sitting on the couch when we were expecting her first child. And I read a column that described the difference between career oriented families and family oriented families and asked my wife what she wanted us to have. And she said family oriented and I said, me as well. Didn't mean that we weren't going to have successful careers or want to have successful careers it was just which one were we going to choose over the other. And at the time I remember saying to her, we're only going to have 18 years to be parents but we have our whole lives to build, so to speak, a career. Most recently in the last year and a half our oldest has gone away to college. So she's you know becoming a young adult. Our youngest is a senior in high school. And to see what they have become as young ladies has been incredibly gratifying and fulfilling and more so because it was an outcome of us paying attention to being family oriented and devoting as much time as we could to being active parents with them, being in a position where we feel really good about where our kids are knowing that there's still obviously a long way for them to go. So that's as close as I can get to a big goal. KG: That's wonderful; I’m sure you guys have had so many strong family memories made because of those choices that you and your wife made. Can you think of any specific examples of when you knew that you were choosing your family over career? And do you have any plans for how that's going to change now that your youngest is almost out of the house and it's maybe time to shift towards that career focus again? RC: So again we've always been very career driven. Both of us went on to get our graduate degrees. We both have what we would like to think are successful professional careers, but we've been very mindful of the need to devote time to our kids and for us that has been the single biggest metric is, is not the amount of time just time in general. We don't believe there's such a thing as quality time we just believe there's time. And so it is little things such as even when there was a pressing issue at work at 5:30 or 6:00 knowing that we had to delay addressing the pressing thing because it was something else and need to be paying attention to and then holding each other accountable. My wife has traveled pretty regularly over the course of her career. So part of it is for me to let her know when there were times where it was important for her to devote time to the kids. But then also for her to ask me to hold her accountable too. So those are a couple of little examples. Maybe not you know very specific and concrete ones but kind of general practices that we followed. KG: It sounds like a true partnership. Right. Working with someone else to achieve those even if it wasn't outwardly an explicit goal. You know you were doing it for the best of your family. Of the things we were talking about before we actually started recording was the difference between process oriented goals and outcome oriented goals and I can see how putting the conscious choice to put your family first above your career is more of a process oriented outcome. You also work with Junto about developing emotional intelligence in business leaders. And that seems like a process oriented goal to me because it's a little more hazy, it’s a little more fuzzy not as tangible in terms of results but you're working with business leaders who care about the bottom line. How do you take such an intangible quality like emotional intelligence and deliver measurable results to those business leaders helping them to further their business? RC: Yeah that's a big question and a great question. It's not unlike how we take care of our health. Many of us have tangible metrics to measure our health, whether it's our weight or whether it's our body fat whether it's our heart rate that I think most of us know that it's going to take a process for us to get there. And that's what developing emotional intelligence and leadership is also about. That yes, do do these companies and their leaders want to be more profitable? Absolutely. Do they want to have lower turnover? Yes. Do they want to have more credentialed people coming to work for them? Certainly. But they recognize that there is so much work that has to be done in order for them to start seeing those types of outcomes and they recognize that it all begins with them as leaders. So they—it's not so much about what we do for them but more about their willingness to enter into an experience where they are going to be learning new things, being made uncomfortable, being forced to be vulnerable. And again I run a parallel to us becoming healthier as human beings, that we all know that it takes so much work and effort and devotion and time to work out on a consistent basis, to eat healthy on a consistent basis. And hopefully if we demonstrate that we're able to do that and we do do that, we start seeing those outcomes occur. So it's not unlike that in that regard. It's not for everyone. You know we like to say that Junto is not for 90 percent of the companies that are out there because they're looking for more shorter-term results and shorter-term outcomes. But most of our alumni tell us that where they start seeing the real results of Junto is the year after they graduate because they're able to put into practice everything they've learned. KG: Before we get too far in this interview I think would be great to hear you define emotional intelligence. Again like I said earlier it's kind of a fuzzy term. Everyone might have a slightly different idea of what it means but what has the Junto Institute defined emotional intelligence as? And how do you apply that lens to what you do everyday? RC: So we actually have adopted a common definition of emotional intelligence, which is our ability to recognize and regulate the emotions in ourselves and in others. And then perhaps even more importantly is how we use that information, how we use that data to guide our thinking, actions and behaviors. And that I think is the part that most people in my experience don't pay enough attention to. It's one thing to recognize and regulate our emotions personally and in other people but then to do something with it especially in the workplace is where the rubber meets the road. And that is where we also see its relevance to leadership. So that's how we define it at Junto and how we kind of wrap our program into, how we use emotional intelligence to kind of put a wrapping around our program.

KG: Junto works a lot with leaders in developing emotional intelligence in the workplace. But do you have any suggestions for how listeners could apply emotional intelligence practices to their everyday lives, whether it's in the workplace, out of the workplace, in their relationships with their family and friends anything like that? RC: Absolutely. We have a whole array of leadership skills that our apprentices learn and practice and the programs so I’ll kind of refer to a couple of those. Well first of all let me also add to the definition that I referred to that we also have adopted Daniel Goldman's construct of emotional intelligence, which is four components: self-awareness, self-management, social awareness, and relationship management. And we have also taken the liberty to almost use them in a linear fashion that developing our emotional intelligence starts with self awareness. So part of it is to simply increasingly become aware of how we are feeling in as many moments as possible during a day. At Junto we use something called the emotion wheel as a prompt for that. Someone like myself, I used to not be able to get very specific about my emotions. I was someone who would say I'm feeling fine I'm feeling good. I'm not feeling good today. The emotion wheel allow me to pinpoint very specific words that otherwise wouldn't come to mind on my own. And so that's the beginning. That's one thing that people can do and you can find an emotional wheel on the Internet. People download them, use them. They're very effective. We use it in my own home. We've got a bunch of companies that use in their homes around the dinner table. It's a great place to initiate conversation. It also then allows us to by doing that have empathy for other people because if you tell me that you're feeling surprise right now or angry or you're feeling a lot of love I can then understand where you're coming from. I may not know why but now I know how I can guide our interaction as a result of that. Second tip that we can all do better at In my opinion is just listening better. We live in a distracted world. And so yes putting away the devices is real helpful. At Junto we use a very simple framework of Stop Look and Listen. Stop everything that you're doing. Look at the person because the only way that we even have a sense that someone might be listening to us is by eye contact. So therefore it's important for us to give that signal to other people. And then listen with your full mind and body. And what we mean by that is we talk about squaring up in Junto, whereby we are squaring up our shoulders and our knees to people so that way I'm less likely to be distracted by something else and the other person again is receiving a signal that they have my full attention. KG: You have a background in entrepreneurship and building companies from the ground up. What have you observed from leaders and other hustlers trying to reach their goals? Have you seen any strategies that work out particularly well, any common obstacles that come up, any personality traits that leaders tend to share personality types that they tend to be? RC: Yeah absolutely. There are two that are in my experience are most common—I won’t go so far as saying essential but I've found them to be very important. One of them is tenacity, is just having that ability to not always take no for an answer. Having the ability to pick yourself up when you've been beaten down. In entrepreneurship there are more lows than there are highs and so the ability to just bounce back on a regular basis, the ability to power through a rough day. So tenacity is one import one. The second one is a little bit longer and that's the ability to cope with ambiguity, uncertainty and chaos. Our days are completely unpredictable. We also encounter like I said more lows than highs and so just that uncertainty of what's going to happen tomorrow or the next day, despite our best efforts just being able to cope with that is an important attribute. And then once companies are up and running and the founders are starting to hire other people. That's where leadership becomes perhaps the most important trait or attribute. And at Junto we define leadership as moving people in the direction you're going. And that's really hard. It's really hard to inspire people, to influence them, to communicate effectively to encourage teamwork and collaboration so that people are achieving common objectives and that's what where emotional intelligence comes into play because the whole idea of recognizing and regulating emotions and other people and then using that information to guide our thinking, actions, and behavior comes into contact then with moving people in a direction you want to go. So that's why as a part of our program but you know back to your question of the attribute that leadership becomes so critical during the period when companies, when founders are starting to hire more and more employees in their businesses because they're growing. KG: Do you see a clear difference between being a leader and being a manager? RC: Yes. In fact we rarely even talk about managing, managers or management in Junto. Management in my view and in our view is something that is dealing with more of the known and has constraints around it. Management then in my experience and in my view is more relevant in larger organizations where there's plenty of history there's more predictability there's more definition. Leadership is more related to the unknown the uncertain. And back to our definition of moving people in the direction you want to go. We believe that leaders can't motivate people but they can inspire people. Motivation is an internal, is an intrinsic characteristic. But that inspiration can actually occur extrinsically and so that's a key distinction is management in our view doesn't incorporate that element of inspiring people or pulling them in the direction that one wants to go. KG: The two traits that you mentioned earlier, the tenacity and the ability to cope with the unknown. Do you find that those are just inherent in people? Or is it something that you can work to develop if you recognize it as a weakness in yourself? RC: Yeah, both. I think some people are wired and I'd like to think that I'm wired with the ability to cope with ambiguity, uncertainty and chaos. But I wasn't born with the tenacity. That's something that I acquired over time and I've seen other people flip, I've seen people who are what we call the accidental entrepreneurs that they lived a life that was very privileged and comfortable, they had everything they needed and wanted. They then entered large organizations where things were fairly predictable and stable and then boom all of a sudden at the age of 35, 40, 50 they became entrepreneurs and they all of a sudden discovered they had to have tenacity. They had to deal with the uncertainty and ambiguity and they've been successful. So I think that yes it can be acquired. It's a little bit harder perhaps, it's a big transition, it's far more uncomfortable but it can be both something that you're born with or something that can be developed. KG: And if you're developing it is the only way to do it to just get thrown in the water and run with it and swim with it as it is? RC: Certainly I think that is without a doubt one of the ways if not the most important way but the other one also is to recognize that this is normal and the only way to do that in our view is being around other people who are also experiencing it because we talk about how being an entrepreneur, it’s lonely at the top and there's so much truth to that. And so all of a sudden when one surrounds themselves with others who are going through the same thing no matter what business they're in or how old their businesses are or how big it is they realize that we're all going through the same things. And so that all of a sudden gives us greater encouragement and drive to power through and it helps increase our tenacity because we're inspired by other people who've already done it. KG: You just touched on the importance of leaders having people around them and how that can help make it a little less lonely at the top, help you go further than you would alone and that seems to be a big principle of the Junto Institute. Junto means together in Spanish, correct? RC: Yes. KG: One of the things we say at aSweatLIfe all the time is, everything is better with friends. Seems like a similar principle. Can you speak a little bit to how bringing these different companies together in a cohort for nine months really benefits each of them more so maybe than it would if you were working one on one with them? RC: Back to this whole idea of lonely at the top is that any time that we're doing something on our own we're in our own head and sometimes we develop a narrative that is self-defeating. And this idea of doing it with other companies, this idea of doing it with your full team and then the idea of doing it with people who've been there and done that we have found to be just exponentially powerful. First of all they're just learning more and they're learning more because of the diversity that everybody brings to the table and I don't mean diversity in the common sense, I’m talking about diversity of industry diversity of product diversity of backgrounds in the people diversity of backgrounds in the companies. A tech company actually can learn a lot from a food company, or a food company can actually learn a lot from a manufacturing firm, and a manufacturing company can learn a lot from a services based company. And we validate to that because they've all told us that. And then to add to that the fact that they learn together we call it growing together that this program is not focused on just the CEO or just a founder, it's the whole leadership team as well as key employees. They are building alignment and cohesion as they're going through this program together which then leads to greater alignment and greater cohesion in the future, which allows them to make better decisions faster ultimately leading to accelerated growth for the business.

KG: Though Junto you've had the chance to mentor some amazing entrepreneurs and watch some really incredible companies grow. Do any particular stories or companies that you've worked with stand out maybe in terms of what they learn from the program or how they changed after completing the nine months? RC: Well I'm not going to name specific companies because everybody has their own stories. So I'll share maybe a couple of things that have been said by our graduates which we find to be fairly compelling and oftentimes humbling for us, needless to say very fulfilling and gratifying. In our very first cohort, our first graduation ceremony, we had a CEO get up on stage. At the time I want to say he was about 40 years old and his line, this is verbatim because I've repeated it so often was not only did Junto make me a better CEO, it made me a better hockey coach, a better husband, and a better father. Another one has said that Junto didn't change who I am but it has allowed me to become who I was supposed to become sooner. Another one has said that Junto—literally these were his words—literally saved our business. We didn't know if we were going to make it and we didn't know that until we were in the program. And then we've discovered since then that some of the things that we did as a result of the program allowed us to not make mistakes we probably would've made otherwise. And that was two years ago and the COO attended our session this morning and they have almost doubled in size since the time they graduated. They have no worries about their survival. Now it's more about growing and optimizing their success. KG: Raman, you just mentioned the graduation program you have for the cohort. I noticed on your Web site pictures of people wearing leather aprons at a graduation ceremony. What is the significance of that? RC: So even though Junto means together in Spanish the name is actually inspired by Benjamin Franklin. And so Benjamin Franklin had a group of 12 artisans and tradesmen, when he was 21 years old in the year of 1727 and they would meet every Friday night for the purposes of mutual improvement and philosophical debate. And he called this group the Junto it's believed he called it the Yunto, almost like a Y. But the alternate but he had for that group was the leather apron club because back then, 1700s, these were blacksmiths and cobblers and lithographers. Men—and at that time it was all men—who literally wore leather aprons to work. So when we were planning for our first graduation ceremony I told Catherine my co-founder that I didn't want to kind of give conventional diplomas and certificates to our graduates. So we were debating for a couple of days on what we could do and you know let's do a trophy let's do a plaque and those were all boring. And then one day just out of the clear blue I said to her let's see if we can find leather aprons, in a nod of Honor to Benjamin Franklin. And sure enough Catherine found this incredible organization in Guatemala where these women artisans hand stitch leather aprons. So it's a social venture to boot which makes it even more special. And we get them in laser engraved with the company's logos and our logo. And now it's become a thing. People, we’ve had, I’ve had several people ask me how they can buy them. I've said sorry they're not available for purchase, they're only bestowed to the companies that graduate from the program. So that’s story. KG: I love that that is way more exciting than my diploma which is gathering dust at my parents’ house in Kentucky as we speak. But I love this idea that you mention of Benjamin Franklin bringing together you know a dozen different people to talk about all different topics and it makes me think about how whenever we're faced with a big decision or you're trying to reach a big goal you maybe tend to go to the same people over and over again whether it's people in your workplace or friends that have similar mindsets and similar personalities to you. And I'm wondering what you think about the value—when reaching for a goal or making a big change in your life of reaching outside your comfort zone or your normal circle of go-to people and getting a little more diversity in your inner circle or in your tribe. RC: Yeah there's a lot of power to that. We actually in a very direct way we address that through our mentor program and our mentors are volunteers, they're not compensated by us nor are they investors in the companies so they're not being paid to be there and they don't have skin in the game. And that's a reflection of what we believe is true mentorship which is purity and objectivity in the learning and discovery process. And so I believe that even on an everyday basis while it's important and valuable to get insight and input from friends and family members or loved ones it's also invaluable to get it from people who don't have any vested interest. They don't love us like our friends and family do. So they can see an issue for its truth, for its purity and offer up experiences that relates to that. And on that note I think that's another important thing that I want to emphasize is we don't allow advice giving in Junto, we only allow shared experiences and questions. And so the idea is that who am I to be telling you what you should do. Instead it's far more helpful to you in our opinion if I tell you what I've done in the past or what I know has worked or hasn't worked in the past or to ask you questions because that helps spurs your thinking ability and allows you to make a decision of your own based on what you're hearing from me as opposed to you doing what I tell you to do. And I think that that's something that's real powerful with people who are a little bit removed in our lives who aren't you know who don't love us who we don't know as well is if we rely on their shared experiences or ask them to ask questions they're going to be coming from a much more genuine place in wanting us to just address the issue and overcome our challenge versus wanting us to just feel better because they love us. KG: Are there any other specific qualities that you think are crucial in a mentor-mentee relationship, for anyone who's looking to maybe find someone to act as their spirit guide, so to say? RC: I’ll go back to what we were referring to earlier with regards to emotional intelligence. I believe that the mentor-mentee relationship is built on questions and listening. And I believe true mentorship is when the mentee brings really big important questions for that person and the mentor is able to ask big questions that he or she believes are important and that each side listens to the other. I don't believe mentorship is advising or counseling or coaching which to me is more directional and instructional and prescriptive. I believe mentorship is a discovery based activity and so that it helps being fed by questioning and listening. KG: Through your work with Junto you spend a lot of your time mentoring other entrepreneurs and focusing on their goals. Do you ever have a hard time keeping track of your own personal goals in the process? Or would you say that you've learned anything about your own goal setting strategies through working with others? RC: Yeah it's funny we in the last two years in Junto have stopped using the word goals. KG: Really. Were you like, why am I on this podcast? RC: No, no. And the reason is is because we learned that everyone defines differently, defines goal differently. So we actually started using the word priority. KG: Interesting. RC: Part of it also is from a timeliness standpoint that we discovered that a goal tends to be something that's far out in the distance whereas just changing the language to it, it could be the same goal. So my goal could be that I want to achieve 50 percent more profitability this year. But goal, from what we learned it just conveyed something that was further out in the distance versus a priority being 50 percent greater profitability gave me something to work on today and it made it more, there was a greater level of urgency around it just by changing the language so the idea is the same, that metric or quote unquote the goal is still the same. It's just using a different word created a different sensibility in people around us and it's worked. That's what we're hearing now, people use more than goals or objectives is the work priority. KG: That’s really interesting to me as someone who is a former communications person and language nerd. The way that you choose a certain word can make all the difference. RC: Yeah. Now I don't think I answered your question though right? KG: Continue please. RC: I don't have a hard time keeping track of my goals. And that's also because one of our core values at Junto is we practice what we teach and preach. And we've become very good as a business at developing our strategic plan and our annual plan that is built on priorities and we have a very limited number of priorities. And then each person has his or her own priorities that are tied to the company's priorities. And because every week we review our progress against those, it's embedded in our day to day operations. So I've become much better at that I no longer have an issue like a lot of people I have in the past. I have become as a result also better at my personal priorities if you will just because I spend obviously like most people more of my waking hours working. So it bleeds into my personal life too. KG: Well you could not have led me into our last question any better and I will shift the wording a little bit to reflect your language preferences. But what is a big priority that you have for the future and how do you plan to reach it? RC: So actually I'm going to borrow something that has the word goal in it. You’ve probably heard of BHAGS before? KG: I have not actually. RC: So this is a term that's more in the business in the business world but it refers to a big hairy audacious goal. KG: Oh I've heard that, I just hadn't heard it termed BHAGs. RC: And so we have at Junto our vision is to be a global ecosystem of growth, humanity and virtue. And our BHAG is to have a tribe 1 million strong and our tribe consists of people who are alumni apprentices and mentors in our program. So as of today I think our tribe our tribe is about 230 or 240. I haven't counted it recently but it's in that range. So we have a long way to go. But what was really inspiring was yesterday we had a group of mentors come together for a meeting and one of them said, you will achieve that BHAG. With where you guys are at and it was great to hear that because this is someone who's far more experienced than any of us are. So that's our big hairy audacious goals is to have a tribe 1 million strong. We're not hung up on it. Our big thing is focused on the priorities that are in front of us right now and if we keep staying focused on those and keep hitting those we know that BHAG will take care of itself. KG: That must have been incredibly validating to hear someone else just say oh yeah you can do it. Have someone else in your corner. Well thank you so much Raman for being with us today. Before you go, can you give us a little more information about anyone out there who's interested in Junto, how they can learn more about it, maybe a little bit about what they would need to do to apply if there if it came to that, anything else we should know? Sure. We currently operate in Chicago and we are launching in Los Angeles in 2018 as well. So those are the two markets that will be running our program. Our Web site is thejuntoinstitute.com and Junto is JUNTO, there is a link to apply to the program. And so we encourage anybody who runs a company that has 10 to 100 employees, one to 10 million in revenue. And they've been growing and want to grow. They also acknowledge that what got them to where they are isn't going to get them to where they want to be. So back to this idea of goals and priorities, they have an idea of where they want to be but they've recognized their limitations and now they want to tap into something that's far bigger than themselves. So we'd love to be able to talk to them and see if it's the right fit. KG: I love that. All right well thank you so much for being with us today Raman and thanks for being on the #WeGotGoals podcast. RC: You’re welcome, thanks for having me. I CK: This podcast is produced by me, Cindy Kuzma ,and it's another thing that's better with friends. So please share it with yours. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and if you get a chance to leave us a rating or view while you're there we would be so grateful. Special thanks to J. Mano for our theme music; to Raman Chadra, our guest this week; and to Tech Nexus for the recording studio.

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What makes you happy? What makes you unhappy? What habits would you like to improve? What and who are you grateful for in your life? What is your definition of success? Not part of your average checklist or daily to-do's, but questions like these make up the Happiness Roadmap as outlined in Mo Seetubtim's Happiness Planner.

Seetubtim asked the readers of her personal blog for input about what would help them in their everyday lives. Their overwhelming answer was help to find and feel happiness daily.

"A lot wanted to learn how they could be more positive and happier, and I thought this was so interesting," Seetubtim shares. "There are so many books out there about happiness and positive thinking, but it's not like something you can just read and change overnight. It requires practice. You need to practice the new way of thinking, of doing, over and over and over until your mind is trained."

And thus sparked the idea of The Happiness Planner, a daily journal and planner with gratitude and positive thinking at the forefront of the agenda (literally).

When we talk to gold medalists, stuntwomen or finance gurus, we tend to hear grit behind their words; their goals are specific and they've got to be fierce if they mean business about accomplishing them. But Seetubtim sees goals in a slightly different, perhaps even softer, light.

"I think one of the things I've come to realize over the years ... it's not about what I get, it's mostly about what I become," she says. "And I really like the process of competing with myself and becoming the best I can be.

Goals for this founder - no matter how big her business becomes - can still be about developing the smallest of human attributes.

Seetubtim offers up potential goals like "I want to be more organized" or "I want to be more humorous" as interesting and worthwhile goals to go after.

"I think these are some of the things that people can actually set as personal goals - and I think [they're] actually really fun to achieve. A lot of people don't even think about achieving [them]."

Gratitude and positive thinking as a habitual act that you must practice is what sets The Happiness Planner apart from millions of other diaries and journals worldwide. Taking The Happiness Planner to the global market is a huge goal Seetubtim's accomplished this year, and next up, she wants to bring the planner to more youth across the world.

Where we grow up and who we grow up with may be out of our control, but learning how to deal with our own internal conflicts is within our control. If we can do that from a younger age, we'll be better equipped to deal with even bigger conflicts in adulthood.

As Seetubtim says in the conclusion of this episode, "If everybody grows up feeling more happy and whole, there would be fewer issues in this world."

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"I do believe that at the core, people feel something different about barry's - because it is different," Joey Gonzalez, CEO of Barry's Bootcamp said as we sat surrounded by the glass walls of his West Hollywood office, talking about the future of the company.

Just down the street, you'll find where Barry Jay created the first Barry's Bootcamp with two partners in 1998. When the lore of the treadmill-slash-weightlifting concept spread across Hollywood, drawing in celebrity clients, Jay just wanted clients to be on time, see results and have a an unforgettable time in the process.

Gonzalez started at Barry's Bootcamp as a client and was soon helping to fund its growth as a partner, he said. He was named CEO in 2015 after serving as the company's COO for more than nine years. Benefitting from slow and controlled growth before, during and after the studio fitness boom, Barry's was able to find its tribe, voice and culture.

That thoughtful growth led to an investment by North Castle Partners in 2015, which yielded - you guessed it, more growth - to bring Barry's to more consumers across the world. With all of that expansion, one thing is top of mind for Gonzalez: culture.

"My biggest fear is always - as we scale - maintaining the culture of the company, which is what makes it what it is," he said, reminding me quickly that the word "fear," was really just a word. "It's not that I'm scared - it's just top of mind, which I hope is an indication that it will work."

And the lack of fear that Gonzalez has is palpable. In the episode, I jokingly refer to him as "terrifyingly calm," but the more I think about it, the more I really meant it. He is the eye of the storm that is studio fitness, staying just still enough to understand clearly what's happening around him and only reacting when it makes sense for the culture, strategy and clients of the company.

The company, he said, is committed to innovation, but it's also committed to the standards of a workout that shows true results. That's the challenge in being first - it's an act of balancing emerging competition, clients who were with you at the beginning and new standards in the industry.

"When you are an original, it's really difficult to quantify what makes it that way. It's hard to articulate what it is people experience," he said. "It's a lifestyle, it's a workout, it's like church to some people. It's such a meaningful thing ... you have to be authentic."

Listen now to this episode of #WeGotGoals featuring Joey Gonzalez and find yourself sweating just thinking about all the work that goes into these workouts.

This episode produced by Cindy Kuzma and is another thing that's better with friends. So share this episode with yours and leave us a rating and a review on Apple Podcasts if you love it as much as we do.

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