Hold For Podcast: Recent Episodes
Looking for the Wisdom Path and trying to stay on it.
Three long-time friends, two Pastors and one CEO, explore the spaces between Ministry and Business, Professional and Amateur Christianity, and Faith and Disbelief, with joy, love, and a grain of salt.
holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marshall, Alex, and Macon work through whether it is proper to apologize for something someone else did. Is it proper? Is it just for Christians? Does it help? Is it true?
Show Notes:
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The Shining: Film, Novel
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Misery: Film, Novel
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Stephen King
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The Dark Tower
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Tom Clancy
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The Stand
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This Present Darkness
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Frank Peretti
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It's been One Week
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Segways
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Paul Blart
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Struggle Session
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Nehi
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Macon and Alex talk about talking about gender and sexuality. Can you have a “Big Tent?” Can you disagree with each other and still love and abide with each other?
Show Notes:
Twisters
Deadpool
Deadpool 2
Logan
Dialectical Behavior Therapy
Just when Macon thought he was out, Alex pulls him back in.
It’s 1st Corinthians 8:11-13
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon stomp around in the idea of The Powers in N.T. Wright’s new book Jesus and The Powers. Is it helpful? Does it add anything? How do we work with this idea?
Show Notes:
John Chrysostom
the 50 minute address mentioned: Alan Torrance - The Continuing Priesthood of Christ
Get Heavy Hands and Build Yourself a Great Body!
Total Eclipse of the Heart Literal Lyrics Version
Metal cover of Total Eclipse of the Heart (hang on until the 2:30 mark for the breakdown)
How did this get made?
Dune 2
Horizon: An American Saga - Chapter 1
Naaman & Elisha
Derek Webb - A New Law
Tom Petty - Won’t Back Down
The only cover of Won’t Back Down that is equal in excellence to the original.
The Waiting is the hardest part.
The podcast in question: Good Faith - The Unseen Spiritual Powers Shaping Our World
N.T. Wright is interviewed about his new book Jesus and The Powers
How do you say Recidivism?
Manichaeism
The Present Darkness by Frank Peretti
Making your way in the world today takes everything you’ve got
Rob Porras, Macon’s Youth Pastor, back in the early 1990s
Robert Conquest’s Third Law of Politics: “The simplest way to explain the behavior of any bureaucratic organization is to assume that it is controlled by a cabal of its enemies”
Surprise Surprise Surprise
James Clerk Maxwell
Darwin’s Bulldog
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marshall is back and makes a ruling on the Psalms and VBS. Then Alex, Macon and Marshall wrap up the hero discussion together. Plus bonus movie reviews!
Show Notes:
Greek Phalanx
Carthago Delenda Est
St. Francis Springs
Jody Owens
Eugene Peterson on Psalms
Sweet Caroline punk cover
WinShape
(Bonnie Tyler is actually link #2 here.)
Total Eclipse of The Heart
Weezer’s Hero is the best of all the hero songs. Fight me.
Loser
Ironic
The best part of You Can’t Do That On Television #GenXtvFTW
Movie: Thelma
Shaft
The Beekeeper
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Rachelle, and Macon discuss the proposition: It is proper to use The Hero’s Journey help us understand ourselves. Alex is For the proposition. Macon is Against. Rachelle is the referee.
Show Notes:
Hero
Holding Out For A Hero
We Don’t Need Another Hero
Anti-Hero
My Messy Beautiful Family - the complete series (SFW)
Peak Therapeutic Culture
Boundaries
Greenhouse Retreats
Growth Mindset
Lee Simmons on HFP
Previous Rachelle on HFP (Alignment Etc.)
The Hero’s Journey
The Hero’s Journey applied to Star Wars: A New Hope
Wild at Heart
Early Rohr The Male Spiritual Journey
Early Rohr The Female Spiritual Journey
Jordan Peterson’s Message to Young Men
The Mistborn Saga
Fast & Furious Family
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon talk about sticky scripture passages, whether to preach them, and if so, how to do it. Along the way they touch on the challenge of the 20 (for real people stick to 20) minute sermons and how to teach bigger ideas than what’s in that Sunday’s 30 lines of text.
Show Notes:
Scatalogical is a real word.
Richmond Marathon
Ultramarathon - not to be confused with an Ultramanathon
Issue
A good segway
What is a yute?
Mutual Assured Destruction
Revised Common Lectionary
Haddon Robinson
The Jefferson Bible
The Bible Project on Jewish Meditation Literature
Agape
For Alex next time
The Inductive Bible Study Method
Anchor Points
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex explores Rachelle and Macon’s recent (and separate) work experiences. It leads to a conversation about what it means to succeed, toil, gain, and release in our work-life.
Show Notes:
Eagle Scout 12 Steps
The Chosen
The McClintock Agency
Enneagram 3
nonsellersremorse.com is available!
Enneagram 8
Ackshually
We shall be as gods.
Technical Debt
Business Jargon: Headwinds
Inside Baseball Explainer on USPS proposed 2024 changes
It was 2006
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Macon tries out a theory of knowledge (and reality) on Alex to answer, among other things, why should we care about Theology?
Show Notes:
(Baby You Can) Drive My Car - Bobby McFerrin cover
The Arsenio Hall Show (woo woo woo woo)
Bobby McFerrin and audience member (not TAH show, tho)
Big Audio Dynamite - Rush
U2 - War
Vigilantes of Love
Vertical Horizon
Michael Jackson - Bad
My Messy Beautiful Family (aka Your Screwed Up Family)
The Techno-Optimist Manifesto
James K. A. Smith
John Chrysostom
Visualizing Muscle Growth (PubMed)
Theology and Science at the Frontiers Of Knowledge Book 1 - Reality and Scientific Theology
Where we talked about Reality and Scientific Theology
Transformation and Convergence in the Frame of Knowledge
Karl Popper
Godel’s Incompleteness Theorems
The Gospel in a Pluralist Society
Lesslie Newbigin
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
David Bailey, Founder and CEO of Arrabon, join Alex, Marshall, and Macon to talk about growing up in Richmond, VA, reading the Bible at the age of eight, and how Jesus formed and is forming him into a man with the heart, vision, and know-how to develop reconciling communities.
Aarabon
Dr. John Perkins
The alternate universe where David stays with the keytar. (He looks surprisingly like Herbie Hancock.).
The 700 Club
Kirk Whalum
East End Fellowship
God of the City
Urban Doxology Project
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worship resources
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youtube
Renovation of the Heart
Romans 12:2
The Transforming Center
Pastor Don, The Urban Mystic
Andy Crouch
James Hunter
A People, A Place, A Just Society
WeAreArrabon
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Lee Simmons joins Alex, Marshall, and Macon to talk about important things like the Fast and Furious movie series, as well as what it’s like following the Lord while living with sickness and fatigue. There’s no NOS for rushing through that, but she talks about a way of being in the small hurts that helps with the big hurts.
Lee Simmons
Grace Community Church
This kind of gravy, though
Fast and Furious watching order suggestion
Fast and Furious Funko Pop
How Did This Get Made on Fast and Furious
Flanelboard
A disease of high achieving.
Walking with God through Pain and Suffering, by Tim Keller
Family Groups
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marsh, Alex, and Macon learn about Living at the Pace of Prayer with Will Dungee of Cantag Coaching, and experiencing the militant, garrisoning, Peace of God.
Listener note: the production of this episode leaves in all the pauses on purpose. If your podcast practice is to listen at a faster pace than 1x, or have an app that shortens the pauses, you’ll miss out on some of the wisdom.
Mt. Zion Baptist Church, Greensboro, NC.
Grace Community Church, Greensboro, NC.
Bapticostal - a neologism established enough to have a Wikipedia entry. Though, like most religious, political, and sociological wikipedia entries, it’s certain to be inaccurate.
Inbox Zero - a way of life
Chances are high that you’ll run into Will &/or Marshall here.
Be anxious for nothing
On Brother Lawrence
Will before he had one lesson
You can get in touch with Will here.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marsh, Alex, and Macon come back to the subject of money, families, budgeting, and whether we have one or not. Budgets, not Families. We definitely have the latter.
Show Notes:
Jim Nantz
Vern Lundquist
I wouldn’t say I’ve been missing it
Wicked Little Letters
We totally forgot to raise the issue of Swearing
James 3:10
Naked vs Nekkid
imprecation
Civil War - the movie, but not a movie about The Civil War
De La Soul - Say No Go
Sturgill Simpson - Breakers Roar
Me myself and I
In the event that you are looking for chips to play in 2024.
Big gulps huh?
making bids to connect
improv yes and
the Athletic Stance
mo money, mo problems
Larry Burkett, founder of Crown Financial Ministries
…slightly ahead of snl’s approach
The Envelope System
Burlington, NC Outlet Village
Turks and Caicos
Domo Arigato
Greensboro High School, now Grimsley High School, opened in 1899
Financial Peace University
Debt Snowball
YNAB
no sheetz
If you don’t Budget, can I interest you in Budgies?
Grits are also groceries, despite what they say.
Phototropism and Geotropism
Why keep your score in CrossFit
All I do is win
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
This week Alex, Marshall, and Macon wander around the space of money, wealth, fund-raising, and how giving to the church might be different than giving to other ministries or things.
Show Notes:
Just Push Play
Je Ne Sais Quoi
Alex and Marshall preached through Easter
Eggstravaganzas were likely going to be point 13 on this list.
see last week’s show notes
Not Kong v Godzilla, but Godzilla x Kong
Mothra
Sonic Assault: the onomatopoeia of bands
Titans
Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes
5 movies in the original Planet of the Apes series
Langham Partnership US
Who is John Stott?
Financial Peace University
You Need A Budget (YNAB)
Tithe the mint, not to be confused with Mint
Parachurch
gracegso.org
Stokes Fog Machine (“no need dry ice!”)
So you’re telling me there’s a chance!
Are we talking practice?
Line Item vs Program Budgeting
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon discuss the end of Lent, and handling the folks coming for their second of two visits to church this year.
Show Notes:
The Holdovers
O Captain! My Captain! ← movie scene
O Captain! My Captain! ← poem
The Breakfast Club
High School Musical - We’re all in this together
We were on the Final Countdown of not mentioning Pitch Perfect, but we fixed it.
Narrative and Metaphysical Ambition: On Being In Christ
It wasn’t Kahn. It was David Kelsey. Management regrets the mis-remembering the last name, but honestly who would remember that name anyway?
Hans Frei
Not to be confused with the book, The Post-Evangelical
ChristianLee (Simmons)
Fran the workout
Explaining how Fran came to be
Luke 4:1-13
Roll Away Your Stone
On why the Father ran.
Quit kissing up to the Host!
They totally would have gotten away with it, too.
Inception
1 Corinthians 15
The Champion
Where in the world is Carmen Sandiego?
A different kind of Verve
Wake Up
Wake Up, but covered by Brass and Horns. ←this is super good
Bonus Link: It’s not Monkeys On Cats, but it’s pretty close: Baby Monkey
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marsh, and Macon talk about being married for 24+ years, marriage counseling, and a particular set of skills.
Show notes:
We’d be better at this if we took this class.
Gangnam Style but Metal
Wonka Chanting Monks
Chant, released 1994 (management regrets the error)
this is a very different vibe from Sadness - Part i, but it did come out before Chant, in 1990
Jars of Clay - first album
Appetite for Destruction
Kung Fu Panda 4
Skadoosh
School of Rock
Awkwafina
Onomatopoeia
Mr. Way Too Much Cologne Wearer
Prepare/Enrich
Gunwale - this is probably a metaphor for marriage counseling
The Five Love Languages
Not all marriages have these kinds of fireworks, but #goals.
You complete me.
a particular set of skills
Day by Day by Decades:
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Day by Day 1970s
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Day by Day 1990s
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Day by Day 2020s
You’re Welcome
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon talk about philosophies of phunerals, pet-peeves, and what we want in our own, maybe.
Show Notes:
The Tri-State Area
Fast X
Lee Simmons
Ecclesiastes 7:2-4
Better than the Geneva Collar. (The Geneva Collar.)
Psalm 95:7b-8
The Ted Lasso Final Speech
Carmina Burana
Homegoing Celebration
When The Saints Go Marching In, or, if you want, a bit more reverent.
Can’t Fight This Feeling. No self-respecting metal band has covered this and made it public. So here’s what you get instead.
Time for Me to Fly. Again, punk and metal bands aren’t touching this. BUT THIS COVER REDEEMS IT ALL.
I’ll Fly Away
Keep On Loving You. This one is a bit more tenacious.
Roll With The Changes. Finally: A punk cover, or, at least, one that looks over at the punk section of the record store with some of it’s guitar and drum rhythms. Look, I know it’s more like straight-up rock and roll, but on the spectrum is closer to punk than REO ever was.
In My Dreams. I’m not sure that any punks even know that REO Speedwagon as a song with this title.
Heat death of the universe. Also would be a good name for a metal band.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon work their way from hecklers to bullies to global war to martyrs. No animals, friends, or feelings were harmed in the making of this podcast.
Show Notes:
Dune 2
(Spoilers between 5:00 and min 7:30
Dune 1 Nerdist Recap
Six Dune Books by Frank
Twenty-two books by Brian, Frank’s son
Gratuitous Tennis
Our discussion of Lent
Emily P. Freeman:
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How To Walk into a Room
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The Next Right Thing
She also did The Quiet Collection, which Macon listened to during Advent.
First CityWide Change Bank
Driscollian - see The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill
Macon’s Philosophy Professor relative (is a cousin-in-law a thing?)
Boundaries is a good book.
The examples of Saints Perpetua and Felicity
Preston Sprinkle - Theology in the Raw
Steelmanning
Setting up the pins and knocking them down
You’re Welcome
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Are we just pretending that the Resurrection hasn’t happened yet during Lent? Marsh, Alex, and Macon stomp around in the liminal space that is Lent.
Show Notes:
We will not be talking about Alf. Likely ever.
Before there was Amazon, before there was Toys R’ Us, there was Lionel Playworld
Alex is now 50.
It’s a good age, but no Age of Ultron.
Valentines Days Ash Wednesday Vibes
If you’re doing it right, you say only:
Remember, man that thou art dust, and unto dust thou shalt return.
Malcom Guite: A Word in the Wilderness
Jordan Peterson on Genesis 1
Making Room in Advent
Brother Lawrence
I guess Presbyterians can be hippies and loosey goosey. Every Morning is Easter Morning, by Avery and Marsh. This is likely how we sounded.
Imalet you finish
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Left to their own devices, Alex and Macon follow up on their Mentor discussion, wonder about band name etymology, the excellence that is GenX, ending with how and whether one can know anything at all.
Show Notes
Nickelback
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This is How You Remind Me
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Is it a cover if the lyrics are changed, but the spirit and melody stays the same? Regardless: is also has an Official Animated Video
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For some, Primus might be more your style.
Nickel Creek
Ni is number 28
Harvard Business Review on Managing Up : It’s Harvard, so caveat emptor.
When considering Boomer and Millennials.
The book on GenX before books on GenX were cool, before books on GenX were passe.
The Fugitive
Friends
Weekend at Bernies
42
Reality and Scientific Theology
epistemology
bernoulli’s principle
John Philopinous
Neoplatonism
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon talk about having and being Mentors, though it’s not exactly clear what it means to have and be a Mentor, so they stomp around there, too.
Show Notes:
Currently at 4.9 out of 5 Stars
Rachelle McClintock was an Epic Guest
You can’t always get what you want. Fun.
You can’t always get what you want. Funky.
Firework Oreos
Future Mentor for Alex
Storage Trailers
Rubber Duck
Sir, this is a Wendy’s
We’re having a DTR
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Zoolander
Je ne sais pas
There is another
The Book of Clarence
The Life of Brian
Dune part 2
Dune
Dune Messiah
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marsh, Alex, and Macon discuss better and worse ways to think about and talk about how it is that our souls grow-up into Christ. Plus tv shows where Bad People get beat up on the regular.
Show Notes:
American Fiction
Soundtrack AF
It’s Lee Child, and here are his Jack Reacher Books
Reacher Amazon Series
Jack Reacher: Alpha Enneagram 8
Alan Ritchson on being a Christian and playing Reacher
Joe Moore appears here the first time and the second time.
The paper we read: Thinking and acting in Christ: Torrance on Spiritual Formation, by Geordie Ziegler. (More Ziegler here.)
Dallas Willard: The Divine Conspiracy
John Ortberg
T.F. Torrance
Eugene Peterson
Farming as Spiritual Discipline
Matthew 11: 28-30 The Message
Are you tired? Worn out? Burned out on religion? Come to me. Get away with me and you’ll recover your life. I’ll show you how to take a real rest. Walk with me and work with me—watch how I do it. Learn the unforced rhythms of grace. I won’t lay anything heavy or ill-fitting on you. Keep company with me and you’ll learn to live freely and lightly.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon discuss whether all their Advent/12 Days of Christmas talk amounted to anything, and while on the subject, will they execute New Year New You goals in the same way? Plus: teaser for the Theological Crossover you didn’t know you needed.
Show Notes:
It was neither Vader, nor an admiral, it was C3PO.
Alas, the video didn’t work out. Maybe next time.
Charlotte is not ECU
Beastie Boys drop the beat. But Key and Peele illustrate the drop the best.
There are totally hundreds of songs with a great drop. Here are 25.
Actual video of it coming right back at Alex.
The Quiet Collection
Alex, right now.
Hipster Coffee
It stands for autonomous sensory meridian response.
Making Room in Advent
We talkin ‘bout Practice?, and HFP on Practice
Everyday Sublime Podcast on Yin Pranayama / Gathering the Qi
Reality and Scientific Theology
God’s Trombones
The Goal
Aidpose Tissue
You could do it Funky, Metal, or Epic, but you know where you need to start when making a cha-change.
Biblical Critical Theory
Journey of 1000 steps
All you need to know about Baby Steps
You could work your way back to your original spot, or to your favorite disco.
-
Uh, Universe? These lyrics are perfect for an Emo cover. Why does this not yet exist?
-
“See link for making a cha-change.” - Universe
Alex has a gift, friends.
The Trinitarian Faith
Torrance and The Templeton Prize
The Theological Crossover we didn’t know we needed
- Torrance/Peterson vs Willard/Ortberg
Torrance and Peterson be like this
Reading for next episode:
Thinking and acting in Christ: Torrance on Spiritual Formation
Chapter 11 in the book Torrance and Evangelical Theology
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
At the end of the year, Alex, Marshall, and Macon reflect on what it means to do difficult things, why we do them, and what happens when we do. Unrelated: Marshall ran his 5th marathon.
Show Notes:
This is the 62nd episode, overall
-
13 Episodes in Season 2, starting here.
-
6 Summer Shorts, starting here.
-
23 Episodes in Season 1, starting here.
-
20 Episodes in the Pre-Season, starting here.
French Revolutionary Calendar
Revolutions Podcast Season 3: French Revolution, Episode One of Fifty-Five.
For Marshall:
Kiawah Island Marathon Race Route
Qualifying for the Boston Marathon is complicated.
Today, we salute you, Mr.Ride The Bike Alongside His Wife Wile She Runs A Marathon.
Marshall is a Marathon Runner. It will take him one hour to get prepared.
Video of Marshall blowing by a runner on his way to a Qualifying time.
Let me win but if I cannot win, let me be brave in the attempt.
Special Olympics athlete oath
Better Man
-
the clip
-
the song
A Long Obedience in the Same Direction, Eugene Peterson
CrossFit on Neuroendocrine Adaptation (scroll down to that section)
How Do You Like Me Now?
The Blindside
Janice’s Book: Restore My Soul ← a good thing to read for that New Year New You moment!
The Real El Guapo
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon talk about Advent traditions, or not, practices, or not, and the listener is left wondering: if Macon:Torrance::Marshall:Peterson, then Alex:??
Show Notes:
Whoomp there’s my butt. ← this would be a good video to, like, learn to read with.
Killers of the Flower Moon
It’s me, I’m the problem
It’s called the Karpman drama triangle.
Reading: how does it work?
Christian Laettner’s Shot. It has it’s own Wikipedia entry.
Making bank on a buzzer beater.
Schweddy Balls
Jesse Tree ← apparently an actual thing
Jesus Storybook Bible
Behold the Lamb of God
Jesse’s Girl but Emocore
Of course: Jesse’s Boy
Joyful, Joyful - Sister Act 2
Seems like they do ok.
Holy Luck, Eugene Peterson
Chrysostom Society
A Radiant Birth
Malcom Guite. → Legit Hagrid Vibes.
Making Room in Advent
Frisson is completely wrong. Friction is the right word. Management apologizes for the error.
Piebald Life - the internet has not forgotten it
Perelandra
Build The Life You Want
It’s pronounced Frankenstein
A Christmas Together: John Denver and The Muppets
Joy
The Silent Stars
Handel’s Messiah - A Soulful Celebration
O Holy Night
On Sara recording an album in prison.
Oh hey, here are some rules about 12 Days of Christmas
Suggestions for Revised Advent imagery
Mary, did you know?
Buzzed the tower.
Comment below if you know the perfectly valid reason for the icon associated with the title of the episode.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Show Notes:
There and Back Again
K1
Sadly, not a series on: Styx and Stones ← BUT AWESOME SERMON SERIES IDEA!
- remember: God Gave Rock ‘n Roll To You
The unassumed is unhealed. (Here’s more theological reading on the matter.)
Carl Henry Paragon of Evangelical Protestant Modernity.
Previously on Hold For Podcast:
-
S2E7 - Anti-Establishment actually got us going in this direction
-
S2E8 - Left Turn
-
S2E9 - Wake Up
Double-Plus Ungood
Redlining
No, seriously: End Qualified Immunity
Illustrating Banking Corruption at the level well above Redlining: The Big Short
Anathema
I’m a lover not a fighter.
Skin in the Game is also a good book.
Struggle Sessions aren’t just for China anymore!
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex, Marshall, and Macon take a break from seriously talking about serious things for an episode of picking favorite children in a game of Either/Or.
Show Notes:
Freelance
John Cena ← JUST LIKE YOU!
The Menunos Scale was discussed in S2E9
The Lost City
The Marvels
Nate Bargatze as George Washington
Welcome To the Jungle
- but do it Vintage Ochestral
Jungle Love
- but nothing like Steve Miller Band
Jungle Boogie
- but Muppets
Jungle Book
- but AK meant The Bare Necessities
Franklin Barbecue
Barre
Orange
Orange Theory
The Garage Gym Revolution
Suzuki Samurai
Three on the tree / Four on the floor
Renault 5
December, by George Winston
Graceland, by Paul Simon
All I do is win
Grimace
Not to be confused with Big Red
Not to be confused with Big Red
Liminality is discussed during S1E23
Third Eye Blind, Semi-Charmed Kind of Life
Red, no Blue
I Beeped You
Camp Willow Run
Steve Martin’s Holiday Wish
Miss Congeniality and World Piece
Unbelievable or I’m Too Sexy
I’m Too Sexy Look What You Made Me Do mashup
Unbelievable No Sleep Till Brooklyn mashup
We leave the Unbelievable I’m Too Sexy mashup as an exercise for the reader.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Marshall, Alex, and Macon continue their conversation about “Woke,” Justice, Economics, and the difficulty of holding a church together in the 2020s.
Show Notes:
Grand Turismo
Maria Menunos
-
Repping Noovie
-
HealSquad
How far should you run in your marathon training before the marathon?
Smell my Victory!
Thieves, the scent
The Envelope Budgeting System
The Business Reply Envelope
PCA
Eric Mason, Woke Church
Vodie Baucham, Not sure which book.
Rage Against The Machine, Wake Up
Wake Up, but with Trombones ← recommended!
A Theology of Liberation
Recommended on Liberation Theology: Chapter 5 of Freedom, Necessity and The Knowledge of God.
Colossians 1:24 “Now I rejoice in my sufferings for you, and I fill up in my physical body—for the sake of his body, the church—what is lacking in the sufferings of Christ.”
Founding Brothers ← to understand how close we came to not having a country
Thomas Sowell
Cato Institute
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex and Marshall talk Macon through another church leaving, which leads Macon to the question: Why have the last two churches ‘slid left’ out from under us? Is it us?
Show Notes:
Young Rock - alas, cancelled after three seasons.
Quantum Leap Reboot - No sign of “oh boy.”
It was actually…”I’m taking them all back.”
One Officiates a Funeral. Here’s how.
Ted Lasso Final Game Halftime Speech
November Rain
You’ve got a friend in me.
Nothing else matters.
Paradise City
How do you pronounce Rorschach?
Imagine at your funeral, after the final prayer, you hear this baseline start…The Seven Nation Army
How do you pronounce Parousia?
I Can Only Imagine - Country Version
When The Man Comes Around
Thank God I’m a Country Boy
Loud and Heavy
Pickup Man, for when you want some honky-tonk in that Sanctuary
Aaron Tippin
Prop Me Up Beside the Jukebox (If I Die)
The Segway:
-
This Is Going to Change the World
-
BBC agrees with Marshall about Mall Cop
-
This is even an answer on Chegg.
Grace Community Church paper on Women in Leadership
The Law of Non-Contradiction
PCA - The Presbyterian Church in America
Apophatic theology
Retributive justice
Qualified Immunity
How the Scots-Irish Shaped America
Esau McCaulley, Reading While Black
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex and Macon discuss the Individual/Institution dichotomy with its asymmetries of power, information, and the resulting difficulty of discerning the truth of things in a world where you don’t have scale without abstraction.
Show Notes:
Macarena - Original Version ← with more saxophone than you ever expected
Macarena - the one you know
So many songs about traveling!
YMCA
A Blues Traveler Top 10
Stadium Rock
Jump Around
The Hook Brings You Back ← with more harmonica than you probably needed, but the music video stands up still in 2023
1999
Ken’s job is just beach.
Cajun Man
Back in 2020, MIT published A Complete History of Pandemics
It was actually Bethel, New York.
Jesus People
Family Ties
It’s actually Two Minutes of Hate, but 70+ years of inflation gets us to Five Minutes, at least.
The amazingness of having bread on the shelves.
Chapter 8, Do Christians Worship the Same God as Those from Other Abrahamic Faiths?, in Freedom, Necessity, and the Knowledge of God.
Luke 18:9
Founding Brothers ← recommended
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Alex, Marshall, and Macon interview Janice McWilliams about her book, Restore My Soul. The three of us adore this book and highly recommend it.
Janice also has a blog, and deserves legit respect for animated gif selection in her posts. For the person considering her book check out these posts:
-
Why my book addresses thoughts
-
Why my book addresses emotions
-
Why my book addresses rhythms
-
Why my book addresses fulfillment
And while you totally should get her book and read it, you don’t have to read it in order to take advantage of the resource she offers at her site:
Make Great Hormone Soup with these 50 Self-Care Ideas!
Show Notes:
You might not know that Alex wrote a book: The Small Group Leaders Handbook
Turns out, Janice did that, too. Proof:
Unmentioned rhythms:
-
the one that's going to get you
-
the actual Night
-
the actual Night, but Metal.
No mention if reframing requires freezing them first. Just in case here’s an instrumental Cello version but softer, for self-care.
Self Care Barbie
Obvi, Jesus needed this Tim Ferris Podcast Episode.
Yin Yang, but pronounced correctly.
Step-by-step Sun Salutation
Sun Salutation, but a cat.
James Bryan Smith: The Good and Beautiful God
Most emotions last 90 seconds.
Make Great Hormone Soup!
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Macon wanted to introduce our Listener to his most favoritest theologian, Thomas F. Torrance (aka TF Torrance). Alex and Marshall help him unpack the theological themes of Torrance from an early and short paper published in 1949.
Listener, you might want to read it before listening to the episode, but you don’t need to in order to enjoy the episode.
The paper in question: Thomas F. Torrance, "Universalism or Election," Scottish Journal of Theology 2 (1949): 310-318; #1949-033
If, in the end, you’re unimpressed by TFT, that is entirely the fault of Macon, and should have no bearing on your appreciation of the theological Titan, TF Torrance.
Fanboys gonna fanboy.
Show Notes:
Ted Lasso
Turns out, Marsh is on the cutting-edge of fashion right now. Footage of Marsh at the last funeral he attended. He's so hot right now.
Mahomes on Jacob’s performance on the mound.
The only Who Let The Dogs Out video you will ever need.
T.F. Torrance’s Life and Achievements
Actually, it was Scottish Journal of Theology. Though Scottish Theology ought to have its own Journal, too.
Bishop John Robinson
The Trinitarian Faith
It wasn’t WWI. Torrance was a chaplain in WWII. Management regrets this error.
Nicean Creed
T.F. Torrance, on Karl Barth.
The Filoque Controversy
Every day, we were Joel Miller.
Robinson’s argument, version 2019 —> David Bently Hart: That All Shall Be Saved
The passage Torrance translates on the last page of the paper is 2nd Corinthians 5:11-21.
Torrance wrote more fully about election in Christ in the paper: Predestination in Christ.
You couldn't only imagine that it could be this good. 10000% improvement.
“…his name is literally “Darth Father”
Inconceivable!
30 years ago, PFR asked, “why you would walk away from Love?”
Abjure was not the word. It means, literally, the extreme opposite of what Macon was trying to say.
Tendentious was on point, though.
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After a few episodes on disappointment (or not) with God, Marshall, Alex, and Macon turn to asking people about their souls. Awkward? Necessary? And is setting your response to music for everyone, or just Horatio Spafford?
Show Notes:
Unretirement!
Franklin Planner ← elite
Franklin Covey Workshops
NIL Portal but for Pro-Christians
KPI
Gambits
One on One Meetings, according to Harvard Business Review
- a podcast about 1:1s
People Skills contrasted with Batman
CEO as a Fleet-in-being
Wishlist for Marshall
…just like everyone else
we don’t talk about Bruno
you can’t handle the truth
extremis
The Gambler, but Punk
Likely not ready for this mashed-up jelly
5 Whys
The Creator trailer
pro-am
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Marsh, Alex and Macon discuss disappointment, befuddlement, mystification, head-scratching, non-understanding on the Wisdom Path.
Show Notes:
Creed : My Own Prison
The College of William and Mary InterVarsity
The Venerable Marty Purks (Retired)
Mumford and Sons (it’s plural)
Radcliffe and Equus revival
Radcliffe and Weird Al Biopic
Mike Warnke
Switchfoot : Meant To Live
Dr. Heinz Doofenshmirtz was on Shark Tank
Phineas and Ferb : 2007 Trailer
Here I stand, I can do no other.
Marsh and Macon: The Silence of God
Alex and Macon: Walking in the dark.
Photo of actual HFP listeners:
Further reading on Theological Analogical Predication.
All Alex Does Is Win
it’s actually a Town of Carrboro, NC
Theodicy
Bethsaida ain’t Gennesaret
Evil and The Cross
Embracing Weakness
Eschaton
More accessible than Henri Blocher: N.T. Wright, Evil and the Justice of God
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In a surprising turn, Marshall watched a movie that he didn’t like. He, Alex, and Macon discuss how Preachy Art is Bad Art, that Christians like to make that kind of art, but they’re not the only ones. “Preachy” and “Bad” do most of the work in that sentence and your hosts work to figure out what they mean by it.
Show Notes:
Van Down by The River
Hurricane Ian
Chinese words in English! How do they work?
Marie Kondo
Not quite recanting, but not quite sparking the same joy.
Good and Terrible
Empty Chairs at Empty Tables
Crowders Mountain
Pilot Mountain
Kids today
Gordon-Conwell
The Hill
The Gilmore Girls
Wilson Phillips / Point of Grace
Assassin Club
Steelmanning
Release Me
Pablum
McDowells
Jars of Clay: Flood
Father Stu
Signs
George MacDonald
- Recommended: At the Back of The North Wind
Doctor Who
The Four Horsemen
The Four Horsemen, but much much cooler
His Dark Materials
Ayn Rand: Atlas Shrugged
Andy Gullahorn
Fix You
C.S. Lewis: Space Trilogy
-
Out of the Silent Planet
-
Perelandra
-
That Hideous Strength
Tell all the truth but tell it slant
by Emily Dickinson
Tell all the truth but tell it slant —
Success in Circuit lies
Too bright for our infirm Delight
The Truth's superb surprise
As Lightning to the Children eased
With explanation kind
The Truth must dazzle gradually
Or every man be blind —
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HFP Origin Story, Evangelicalism, Enneagram, and Season Two Plans
Show Notes:
Rattle and Hum
Alias - Sidney Bristow could do all the things in high heels.
The Last Thing He Told Me filmed in Austin.
Curmudgeonly
Let the National Association of Evangelicals self-define.
It’s not Richard Rawls. That’s a combination of Richard Rorty and John Rawls, neither of which advance the ethical position stated. It’s J.L Mackie who advanced the idea that in Ethics “Good” is merely “Yay!” and “Evil” is merely “Boo!”. The names of philosophers sometimes get a bit muddled up in Macon’s memory. The Management regrets this error. (For further reading.)
Peak Boo
Not to be confused with My Boo
The Nine Enneagram Type Descriptions
Richard Rohr’s Book. Lots of Inside Baseball and not the best 2023 entry-point for this ennea-stuff.
The Road Back to You, Book. Recommended.
The Road Back to You, Episode 1, of a 35ish episode Podcast. All 35 are helpful.
Enneagram Memes:
-
Marshall
-
Alex
-
Macon
The Story of You, Ian Morgan Cron
Not to be confused with The Story of You
80s 90s and Today
Taylor Swift Era
Matt Doherty Era
Salem Lake Trail
FUBU
First Lady in the American Black Church
Presbytera in the Orthodox Church
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Macon catches up with Marshall at the end of his Sabbatical. They discuss superhero movies and the less heroic but no less needed people who are deeply rooted and at peace as a result of The Way.
Show Notes
Tokyo Drift
Psycho
Blue Beetle
“How did you go bankrupt?”
“Two Ways. Gradually, then suddenly.”
Not a coconut, nor a banana, nor a watermelon, nor a lemon, nor a cherry, nor a grape.
The Burlington Sock Puppets, not to be confused with The Sockapellas.
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Alex and Macon return to the Silence of God, and navigating The Way in the midst of it.
Show Notes:
The Final Countdown - Europe ← peak 80s video
The Final Countdown, as if Metallica wrote it
The Final Countdown, but Vintage Cabaret style (don’t give up on it until you’ve at least passed 0:52)
But of course, here’s the only Final Countdown version you’ll ever need.
Getting The Band Back Together
Rucking
It came up on August, 21, 2023.
not a Darius Rucker
but similar to a Belt Squat
Summer Shorts 4 - The Silence of God
The sermon that Marshall audited. (Spoiler, the camera does not pan to Marsh for reaction shots.)
Joe Rogan has 11M listeners. % of Joe Rogan love per listener: 1^-4 %
HFP has tens of listeners. % of HFP love per listener: 10% to 20% depending on the week. Four Orders Of Magnitude Better than the Joe Rogan Experience.
Disappointment with God
Sacred Pathways
There were many widows in Israel in Elijah’s time
“…who appointed me a judge over you?”
The Lord gave, and the Lord has taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord.
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Marsh and Macon take a listener question about when retreat-y stuff just doesn’t seem to work, because sometimes it just doesn’t seem to work. The conversation doesn’t lend itself to very many punk-cover links, but acoustic-folk covers the emotional range pretty well.
Show Notes:
Evan pitches for the save, Marsh gets to watch. We interviewed Evan here.
Charlotte Knights
Quiet Time
The Jesus Prayer: The Ancient Desert Prayer that Tunes the Heart to God
Prayer Bracelet
33 knots, as it turns out
Andrew Peterson: The Silence of God
Lowland Hum: Half Here
Lowland Hum: Half Gone
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Alex started a sermon series around Core Lies we tell ourselves. Macon finds them not personally helpful. They discuss cues for growth, mental grooves, and ontological alignment.
Show Notes:
while Miriam-Webster recognizes colorway as a word, when the definition is sufficient with “a color,” you know you’ve created a dumb word.
Sparta, surrounded by men, not bricks.
Heavy Duty Extra Large Storage Bags for College Dorm Room Essentials
One Plate, One Fork, One Bowl, One Spoon, One Cup, One Riot, One Ranger.
Missing man formation.
Soul Care by Rob Reimer
Freed from the Performance Lie
Enneagram Triads (or scroll down here for “Enneagram Centers”)
Good enough, smart enough, and doggonnit, people like me.
Extreme views on holes in hearts.
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Will Greenhouse Retreats continue into year 2? Is Alex over or under doing it? Is it accessible to people, or is it enabling people? Also stay tuned for Alex’s One Weird Trick to perfect spirituality.
Show Notes:
The Fast and The Furious: a movie about family but not for watching with young families.
Greenhouse Retreats year anniversary!
Three hour tours are perfectly fine.
Which character in Gilligan’s Island are you?
Obligatory Gilligan’s Island Theme Punk Cover
But this one is a mashup that’s brilliant and amazing.
Getting Things Done: not just for planning firings
Lectio Divina
Breath Prayer
Joel 2
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It’s Summertime, and we’re paring it down to two of us and restricting ourselves to a single short subject. In this episode Macon gets a chance to contextualize what some might think was dismissive commentary about church.
Show Notes:
RDU to Iceland and Beyond
Gila Monsters
Riding Shotgun
Leave Taking, Church-style is where we were talking about church.
The Apostles Creed
The Nicene Creed
Enneagram 8
Warehouse 242
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Shane Arthur rejoins Alex and Macon for the final episode of Season One. We catch up on how his business has changed since he was last on, and we think about what it means to coach coaches. We also talk about what this season has been about or if it has been about anything at all.
Season 2 will pick up in September, though we may have some shorter, interim episodes during the summer.
Show Notes:
Coach Shane Arthur
Previously, Shane Arthur: S1E14
Tiny Steps, working.
Don’t take a sales call with Kevin.
There are many Pro Tours. Here is one.
InterVarsity Area Director Job Description from 2016
Best Alternative To a Negotiated Agreement (BATNA)
If Walk Away is your BATNA, you’re in a good position, just ask these fans of Mr. Rogers.
What’s happening at HFP? You might say it’s a quest for answers.
The Wisdom Path
Liminality
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Joe Moore joins us again to talk about Joy after and during suffering, the challenges of spiritual growth for people in these groups we call churches, and generally makes demands that our wives make appearances on HFP.
Show Notes:
Previously, on HFP with Joe: Companionship in Suffering
Death of Dreams
The Hagberg-Guelich Model of Stages in the Life of Faith
The Music Man had it right: there were bells, on the hill, but you never heard them ringing.
The Other Half of Church
The Light Behind Your Eyes
Some emotional theories have trouble with mixed emotions, others do not.
Dunbar’s Number: the number of relationships a primate can handle. Humans can handle around 150ish.
We’ve talked about Megachurches
Eugene Peterson wrote many books
Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse
Spider-Punk
Theosis
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Evan Gates is a Right Handed Pitcher, in the San Francisco Giants organization. He talks to us about life in the Minor Leagues, the Joy of Baseball, and following Jesus in a fluid and changeable environment.
Show Notes
Richmond Flying Squirrels
NCA&T Baseball
Yadier Molina
Gator not Gaiter
Gates of Fire
Gatekeeper
Gates of Hell
6/25 Win over Harrisburg, 7-2
Rubber Band Man
- Possibly the best cover you have ever seen.
What You Know
- if songs have opposites, here it is: What You Know
Ms. Jackson
- not to be confused with Miss Jackson
juco
HBCU
YouVersion
Evan’s “homes” in the past year.
High School Class of 2016 pop culture
SF Giants System
Life-changing minor league Collective Bargaining Agreement
Minor League Host Families phased out
Be Where Your Feet Are
-
is also a song
-
seems like Jason Mraz really likes roller skates
Anchor Statements
12 Athlete Rituals
Broken Bats were a significant problem back in 2013
World Baseball Classic
Adam Wainwright
Uncle Charlie (Adam Wainwright noted here.)
Abner Doubleday, angel of God?
Shohei Ohtani
- highlight reel
Evan has been on other podcasts where they talked more about baseball.
-
Unparalleled Performance Podcast with Evan Gates March 2023
-
Beyond Baseball Shorts: Evan Gates April 2023
-
There R Giants with Evan Gates May 2023
Evan’s socials
-
instagram
-
twitter
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It took us two tries to talk about this well. Two weeks ago we recorded a 45 min conversation and then dumped it. This time Alex, Marshall, and Macon do a better job talking though how to be wise about leaving a church, and how to be wise about watching people leave. Plus our time of [Fantastic Marketing Name] where we get our periodic movie reviews.
Show Notes:
The Flash: 5 Stars! (Also S1E20: 5 Stars!)
The First Batman Movie (if you're a GenXer)
Elemental
Up
Blue Beetle
The MCU
Green Lantern, The Hulk, Fantastic Four
It’s FY-ghee.
More than 5 different Spider-Man Comic Book Series.
Safe House
n00b
Logan
Shane
Was the above: A: Witty Banter B: Nothing Substantive Let us know in the comments
Joe Moore Episode S1E19
Should I Stay or Should I Go (but the vibe when you are thinking about finding a new church)
I’m a girl watcher. Easily in the top 5 on the list named “Songs That Don’t Translate into 2023.”
It’s also a proud tradition that hasn’t happened yet.
Pastors have projects: S1E11 Why does a Church need a vision?
Praxis
Weekly reminder that you didn’t come to HFP for facts: It wasn’t Jesus’ trial, it was Peter and John having been arrested.
druthers
“20 Reasons Why We Left” sounds like a sequel to 10 Things I Hate About You.
Boundaries ← Very highly recommended by all HFP members.
They are prepositions! From the best Parts of Speech poster ever.
It’s “propriety.” “Properness” isn’t a word but if you can get it past the judges on HFP, it stays in play. If the ref doesn’t call it, it didn’t happen.
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Joe Moore joins HFP to pick up on the subject of the Death of Dreams. Specifically exploring the relationship between Spiritual Formation and suffering. But it’s not all gloom and doom: Marshall gets a new band name, we find out what the K stands for in AK, and Joe give us a list of TV, Movie, and Book recommendations.
Show Notes:
-
excoriate - yes
-
exfoliate - yes
-
excruciate - yes
-
excorxiate - no
-
excorciate - no
-
excortiate - no
-
excorshiate - no
-
but if it did have a definition it would be: “to inflict severe pain on listeners by mushing together two words which results in the musher being strongly censured.”
Am I a ginger?
Spiritual Companion:
-
no
-
no
-
no, no, no
-
probably
As one unnaturally born.
Take a look at Alex now.
Same church
F.F. Bruce
N.T. Wright
Ronni’s
Rockbridge Camp
Core Soul Hungers Tree
shamwow
S1E17 The Death of Dreams
True Self / False Self summarized
- Written by Alice Fryling, herself one of those IV Senior Staff referred to.
Enneagram Types
The Denial of Death, by Ernest Becker.
- on Character Armor
Red Pill not the Blue Pill
“Red Pilled” now a thoroughgoing metaphor
Pattern Building: “Lord, my life is yours. Take me where you will.”
“If this is how you treat your friends..”
Night
Man’s Search for Meaning
The Critical Journey
Fowler’s Stages of Faith
-
Summary
-
Book
St. Dewey
Marshekinah Glory
Heartland
Pine Gap
Alias
Citadel
Green Book
Dear White People
Quantum Solution, Eric Van Lustbader (note: this is book four of the Evan Ryder series.)
Le Carre is an author (it’s a nom de plume). Selected bibliography here.
Joe Picket Series, by C.J. Box (24 books!)
Horatio Hornblower Series
Richard Sharpe Series
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Marshall is back! Alex and Macon get behind-the-scenes access from Marshall’s trip to Kenya, which we explore with our usual seriousness and sobriety.
Show Notes:
Fast X
Fiero In Space
Guardians of The Galaxy 3
Get Out
Easy A
Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
Snakes on a Plane
Marshall’s report to his church: Making Disciples in Kenya
Greensboro Urban Project Ya’ll (no longer a thing, so via the Wayback Machine) was started by Marshall back when he was on staff with InterVarsity
YWAM (Youth With A Mission)
Apparently, in Kenya, “It is common for hosts to offer tea. Accepting the offer means that one accepts the hospitality of the host.”
InterVarsity’s STIM (Student Training in Missions). (Thanks to IV’s Red River Region for having something online about it.)
It was Latin America Mission’s Spearhead program when I went. Now it’s called Avance with United World Mission.
The Ghost and The Darkness
Revelation 7:9
Pastor Maurice
- (speaking about Jesus, NOT the pompatus of love, and ESPECIALLY not this one. )
Marsh also wishes he were a baller and a little bit taller.
Top 10 Least Favorite Song Of All Time. (Top 10 Favoritist Cover Music Video.)
Langham Partnership
- Africa Bible Commentary
Brown University Library Special Collections
The Sockapellas
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Rachelle McClintock returns to HFP. Macon and Alex talk to her about storing books, writing books, discovering what it is we have to say to the world, which leads to the Death of Dreams.
Show Notes:
Amish Romance Novels. They are actually a thing.
Stone Cold Jane Austen
Like your first Doctor, not to be confused with the First Doctor, everyone remembers their first Mr. Darcy:
-
1940
-
1995
-
2005
People shelving their books wrongly.
A Potemkin Library is this guy’s library.
How stacking works at Heathrow.
Alex totally redeems himself
Principles
Rachelle’s goodreads
our interview with Shane Arthur
Rachelle’s business: The McClintock Agency
Your childhood reading is graded on how many Newberry Award Winners you read.
Johnny Tremain
The Young Astronauts Club was a National educational program, complete with merch. (And cross-branding.)
The Right Stuff (the book)
The Right Stuff (the movie)
RIP Alex Anderson
Our Alex invites you to reflect on Lazarus
The Epistle to the Romans, Karl Barth
The Message of Romans, John Stott
It wasn’t Calvin, it was the Church Fathers: Ancient Christian Commentary, Romans.
Stop everything: go read The Great Divorce. Even better, go listen to The Great Divorce.
This setup would be sufficient.
Augustine’s approach even gets a shout out from Psychology Today.
J. Alex Kirk, author. (Someone needs to give IVP the bad news.)
You think it might be difficult, but Surrender is actually a cheap trick. (Or if you prefer, you can have your surrendering to be a bit more emo with 2020 production values.) (Someone needs to tell Bruce, this might not be the path of wisdom.)
Enneagram Three. Threes are self-assured, attractive, and charming. Ambitious, competent, and energetic, they can also be status-conscious and highly driven for advancement. (You’re never going to win HFP Bingo if you don’t learn these.)
You’re not going to slow Threes down. They’ve got to keep moving.
Hamilton was a three? Likely Threes would claim him.
Chaotic Neutral. The only way to be.
Tubthumping as Three Theme Song?
Africa cover, the one Marshall actually wanted.
There is no Rachelle podcast. YET. But when she does she’ll Win, like Emma Stone.
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Alex bushwacks Macon and Marshall about Anger, and pushes all the buttons. But we’re not angry about it.
We talk about anger as a result of shame: feeling judged or that we’ve done it ‘wrong’ and, often, self-directed anger. We also talk about anger as a result of having the rules changed on us, and the relationship of justice to the rules.
Anger ain’t wrong, but it’s hard to do it right.
The final Show Note is the likeliest path.
Show Notes:
Chance The Rapper. A man of Three hats.
the LASA Raptors (aka Vertikills)
Seaforth Hawks
It took a lot to drag Marshall away from us. Probably took a hundred men or more to ever do. Set to music here in this acapella song.
Original version here. Weezer covers it with an accordion (eventually). There’s even a most excellent metal cover with long hair, double kick drum, needely needely guitar solo, and soprano vibrato singing.
However, if you click only one link today, make it the best Africa cover ever made in the history of all time. Stick with it and this too will be your favorite way to bless the rains. An 80s song, covered in a 50s style, while commenting on 2020 music, with a few J.J. Abrams lens-flares thrown in at the end.
Did production completely stop while listening to all the various covers people have made for Africa? Yep.
Marshall’s Missionary Journey
We leave it for the reader to do the compare and contrast exercise.
Marshall and Macon discussed guilt and shame in HFP’s Preseason in S0E14 Shamely Guilt.
Brene Brown Shame Ted Talk
Curt Thompson The Soul of Shame
It’s all ball bearings nowadays! (HFP represents no claim to accuracy in it’s quotes or references.)
Fletch remake(ish)
Hoodwinked, a Fletch cover.
David Puddy, on Seinfeld
Guardians of The Galaxy, Vol 3
The Rise of The Guardians
A Christmas Episode, An Easter Episode
The precipitating text:
Quantum Leap
Oh Boy Supercut
Enneagream Anger Triad
FisherPrice Popper, good for smashing things
We are up to the DSM-5
Unikitty, staying positive
Everything IS Awesome
Actual footage of when singing Everything Is Awesome ceases to work for Marshall.
Turns out, Shameless is the subject and title of a great many songs:
-
Country: Garth Brooks
-
Old Pop: Billy Joel (covering Garth Brooks)
-
Pop: Camilla Cabello
-
R&B: The Weekend
-
Metal: Tokyo Motor Fist
-
New Wave: Pet Shop Boys
-
Singer Songwriter: Ani DiFranco
-
EDM: Biometrix (remixing Camila)
Chess in an option in War Games, but the two games they actually play are Global Thermonuclear War and Tic-Tac-Toe.
Strike First, Strike Hard, No Mercy. (Contrary to our memory, Striking Fast appears to be optional.)
Trading Places
Arrested Development the show
Arrested Development the 80s Band
Joe the Plumber
Walk with the wise and become wise
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Alex, Marsh, and Macon explore the why’s of Megachurches, not being megachurch people ourselves.
Show Notes
Marshall’s Walk Out Song for real
Marshall’s Ostensible walk out songs
-
Thank God I’m a Country Boy
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(did you notice the musical reference JD makes? Sally Goodin. More here.)
-
Loud & Heavy
-
Cody Jinks seems do be doing fine.
-
but he’s not “good”
Thanks Shane!
what does infamous mean?
The Magnificent 7 (1960)
The Seven Samurai (1954)
the other guy was Charles Bronson
Santo Poco and El Guapo
Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom
Seinfeld first aired July 5, 1989.
ER first aired September 19, 1994.
Easy A (actually came out only 13 years ago, but if we can agree that 2020-2021 was actually 7 years worth of trouble, then it was 20 years ago.)
There’s actually a Pitch Perfect reference in the notes above.
skank is actually in the dictionary.
The Magnificent Seven (2016)
Non-nefarious intense chums with ensuing, though winsome, hijinks: Polite Society
Marshall was a Hussman. (A Hussy?)
Run:Amok::Hijinks:Ensue
juggling amok
Dear Listener: make a request in the comments, and we’ll probably talk about it in a future show.
Barna says megachurch cutoff is 1K, but “most megachurch researchers” say 2k.
Today we learned that there’s such a thing as being a “megachurch researcher.”
Barna Research Group: “we put numbers on things!”
Dear Listener: let us know if you do want to ask Marsh to lead your Megachurch and let’s see what he chooses. We can get your people in touch with his people.
Bonhoeffer says it in Life Together. Both the man and the book: highly recommended.
Megachurch Coffee Review
Summit, a big whompin megachurch.
Lighting the church God’s way, but we’re probably not Raising Children God’s Way.
Eli Goldratt and The Goal
Globo-gyms and Crossfit, an example from 2012.
Peacock
Macon: One Episode Winning Streak
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Alex, Macon, and Marshall interview their friend and former colleague, Shane Arthur. They ask him about the business of coaching, starting gradually, and the kinds of help driven professionals need.
Show Notes:
-
Steak-Umms
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“On Grounds” See #4.
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Jimmy Long
-
InterVarsity Regions, post VA, NC/SC split (RIP Blue Ridge Region).
-
they probably didn’t live in the water
-
of course ships need roads
-
but not everyone does
-
this is the book that got the Arthurs to Duke
-
Not just poised. But poised for Growth.
-
the next job “up” was National Field Director.
-
the view of Executive Coaching back in 2014
-
Shane, the LinkedIn version.
-
Vistage - Kurt Graves
-
bidness
-
what do you want?
-
one set of footprints
-
Fierce Conversations
-
the treasure was inside them the whole time
-
opinions on what Shane should talk about while on HFP
-
Why Greatness Cannot Be Planned: The Myth of the Objective
-
turns out, there are 26 letters in the English alphabet. Pretty tricky, the English alphabet.
-
Polanyian intuition
-
“knotty”, not “naughty”
-
cave as metaphor for personal exploration
-
It’s actually a technical term: willfull blindness
-
Mary Poppins Returned
-
it’s a pretty solid approach to controlling demand
-
Follow Shane on LinkedIn
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Marshall, Macon, and Alex talk about Spiritual Disciplines, Practices, and the structures that help us along the Wisdom Path.
show notes:
-
sodastream (not a sponsor, but we are ready to sell-out)
-
coconut water
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topo-chico
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Smokey and The Bandit
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Talkin’ ‘bout practice
-
Stations of The Cross
-
a rock
-
Police Academy 6
-
but, actually, it was Police Academy 5. We thank you, in advance, for not getting your facts from HFP.
-
“Hey Dork”
-
Joseph of Arimathea
-
where Alex and Marshall go on a retreat together
-
John Stott was also known for his naps: Half Hour Horizontal
-
Angels and Bells
-
More Cowbell
-
STIM - Student Training In Missions
-
Obsidian.md
-
Picture of Macon’s Obsidian Daily Note Practices Section
-
Karatekas
-
Dallas Willard
-
Spirit of the Disciplines
-
You remember Rachelle
-
Inside Scaffolding. Outside Scaffolding.
-
James Bryan Smith his books
-
Centering Prayer
-
Crossfit’s Workout Of The Day
-
Cramming a 4.5 year reading plan into 6 years: This Morning with God
-
don’t forget to scroll down to see it blurbed by J. A. Kirk!
-
Thrusters and Burpees are the worst.
-
dee doo deet!
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Marshall tricks Alex and Macon into writing his Easter sermon, while we talk about Good Friday, expectations of rescue, living our best lives, and our eventual death.
show notes:
Jesus Revolution
Jesus People
Crashdog
Dungeons & Dragons
the game Liza missed
no, actually, they couldn’t have called it Magicland
Mid
Tolkien’s World
A Christmas Episode
Easter follows the Lunar Calendar
Jesus Flipping Tables (Luke was unavailable for comment.)
All Night Long
All Night Long, but Singer-Songwriter
Daily Lectionary for Holy Week
yay yay Jesus
Gary Deddo, speaking about "One God, Three Persons" for the TF Torrance Reading Group
You don’t listen to HFP for “facts” but just in case: it’s Ash Wednesday where you get the ashes, not Maundy Thursday.
Live your best life now. Faster.
Manifesto: The Mad Farmer Liberation Front : “Practice resurrection.”
Two Birds Film: Look And See
The Denial of Death
All Illusions Must Be Broken
I got it right the second time, first try.
St. Peter, making his exit, Caravaggio take.
The Story of You
Smoldered, is obviously the past tense of smolding.
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Taking our first listener question. Not a question from our first listener, but the first question we’ve gotten from a listener. Alex, Marshall, and Macon work out why churches have a vision, and why it can be helpful.
Show Notes:
Thunderstruck
The Beatles
The Rolling Stones
Led Zeppelin
The many faces of Marshall
The Foo Fighters
Peter, Paul, and Mary
Hoochie Koo
U2
What is a Boy Band?
Bye Bye Bye
Chuck Berry
Of course, everyone knows where Chuck Berry got his sound.
Iron Maiden & Eddie
Guns n’ Roses - Appetite for Destruction
Best Aerosmith Unrequited Love Song
INXS - What You Need turns out to be a perfectly executed 1980’s Music Video
Here’s the Mail
Turns out Nothing Ever Happens on 38th Street.
Miracle on 34th Street Mail Scene.
Cedar of Lebanon
Becoming Brave, by Brenda Salter McNeil
Four Disciplines of Execution
Don’t Worry About Your Ministry Brand
Can you Match Pitch?
Forging Elite Fitness
Marshall’s Cell Number
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Movies restore Marshall’s soul, and he reviews the last few he’s seen. We talk about that kind of soulwork as well as Macon’s morning restorative (aka, “survival”) practices. Finally, we return to fiction, science-fiction, fantasy, and the over-arching need to sit down with a good storyteller, regardless of medium or genre.
Show Notes:
Cocaine Bear
Elizabeth Banks
Pitch Perfect
Ray Liotta
Care Bears
Fighting Grizzlies
Creed III
Not to be confused with Creed
Ant Man and The Wasp: Quantumaina
Kang the Conquerer
65
Muppets From Space
Pigs In Space
Worldbuilding
Rings of Power
Internal Chronology vs Publication Date, a short reddit discussion.
Enneagram 1 - The Reformer
Restorative Rhythm of the Night ← actual video of Marshall’s restorative practice
Not to be confused with this Rhythm, which, surprisingly, is even more 80s than the Rhythm above, though both relate to nightly rhythms.
At The Table Podcast: E166 Work Harder at Resting.
Restorative Banjo
Daily Lectionary Readings
Yin Yoga
-
Trigger Point Yin: session for Runners
-
50 min of a Yin Yoga Session
"Muscle Fibers Relax When the Nervous System Signal Is No Longer Present"
Meat and Nuts breakfast
Sample Deep Book/Paper: Resisting Reductionism: Why We Need a Truly Theological Anthropology to counter the Dehumanization of God’s Humanity
Brandon Sanderson
Battlestar Galactica Original
Battlestar Galactica Reboot
Greenhouse Retreats
Rohr on Enneagram Threes
The Stand
The Collected Stories of Arthur C. Clarke
Team of Rivals
A Man Called Cash
Paul Simon: The Life
Jim Gaffigan on his wife’s brain tumor
The Wheel of Time
Pellinor
They’re called Embedded Stories or Nested Stories.
Hero’s Journey
Brenda Salter McNeil preaching on The Woman At The Well
Sword Drills
Oh, that tournament.
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Alex and Marsh ask Macon how he applies “process engineering” to other places in his life. Macon let’s Alex and Marshall know that they both have a PKMS, it just might not be very good. Plus a theory about how all three of us accidentally learned to value the bottom-up way of life when we were on the College Pro Christian Tour.
Strap on your Nerd Hat.
Show Notes:
Jason Sudeikis as Backup Dancer
He can dance if he wants to. ← this video is a special kind of amazing.
Why Can’t This Be Love? ← uh, clearly this isn’t David Lee Roth.
The Capital Centre
It’s not Punk, but it’s Indie. (And, no, it’s not nearly as good.)
Alex’s Favorite Problem No.1: Context
Poetry In The Forest
A 15 Min, Pragmatic Guide to Getting Things Done
Field Notes
Ubiquitous Capture
The call is coming from inside the house.
Lean
5S
Gemba
Mark Manuscript Study
Happiness Study
Look out for cyclists
Between the Lions
Frederica Mathewes-Green wrote The Jesus Prayer: The Ancient Desert Prayer that Tunes the Heart to God
“Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” — Albert Einstein
The Weekly Review
Personal Knowledge Management Systems (PKMS)
Obsidian.md
Enneagram 8 - The Challenger
Consider the dachschund.
KLF - 3AM Eternal
Microsoft One Note
Plinko
How to pronounce Pericope
Probably want to wear one of these when pronouncing pericope properly.
Evernote
Consider six dachschunds.
How InterVarsity started.
This is how we do it
You totally redeemed yourself
Franklin Covey Planner
OmniFocus
Drafts
Focused Podcast
Time Blocking
Death by Meeting
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Special Guest: Rachelle McClintock
Marsh, Alex, & Macon work through with Rachelle: How do we get to having real and deep friendships? What are the qualities of such relationships? How do we know if they will stand the test of time?
Show Notes:
What is an exec team?
Windy Gap
Voxer
Marco Polo
DTR: actually a term.
The Fellowship of The Ring
The Mines of Moria
Systematic Theology III (We took this class through Fuller Seminary, though now the professor is at Grace Communion Seminary.)
Lectio 365 App
All The Single Ladies
Long Obedience In The Same Direction - the book
…long obedience…in the same direction… - the Nietzsche quote. (line 27)
Eugene Peterson (again)
"Only time will tell if we stand the test of time." Easily top 10 80’s Rock Songs with a Synthesizer.
Survivorship Bias
John Hughes Movies
How do you pronounce Zildjian?
Enneagram 3 The Achiever
Jerry Sinefield on Smartless
If I link this song, maybe will Marsh stop singing it at the end of our recordings.
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Show Notes:
Rihanna’s Super Bowl LVII Halftime Show
The Champions: UNCC Women’s Tennis
First it was a Joke. Then it was Real, sort of: The Ocho .
S0E13 Deconstructing Deconstructing
Tolkien, Lewis, and Fairy Stories (Marshall gets it right, of course.)
We shall be like gods
Nick at Night (not the Biblical one)
Nic at Night (the Biblical one)
You can’t do that on television (though they did).
Bare Necessities (safe for work)
Quantumaina
What is this? A Center for Ants?
Cocaine Bear (again)
Emerging Culture Curriculum by Jimmy Long
Seriously, Macon is pronouncing modernity (and post-modernity) correctly.
U-N-I-T-Y (asking the important question, “Who you callin’ a B*tch?”
Thomas F. Torrance, "Predestination in Christ," The Evangelical Quarterly 13 (1941): 108-141. (Heavy theological lifting in this essay, one-hundred percent worth it.)
Goodnight, Ned
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Macon asks Marsh and Alex whether God prefers the Poor. Old Testament, New Testament, Modern Commentators, Motivational Psychology, we try it all on in order to figure it out.
Show Notes:
Octordle / Wordle
Pitch Perfect. Again. Until Alex remembers.
Des Moines. It’s French.
Joy In the Margins
The Lord Hears the Cry of the Poor (a classic Slow Jam)
The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill. A great podcast series for people interested in the inside-baseball on 2000’s Evangelical Cool Kids.
Steph Curry Eeating Fresh
We would see Jesus
Grace Community Church Mission
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One of Marshall’s favorite problems is working on understanding what it means for people to “abide in Christ.” Alex and Macon try to relate, even though it feels very “woo, woo.”
Show Notes:
I’m always angry. (Best quote in all of the MCU, followed by, “I could do this all day.”)
Cocaine Bear (It’s real and it’s spectacular.)
S1E01 Favorite Problems
Macon’s Favorite Problem #1
Alex’s Favorite Problem #1
12 Life Lessons From…Gian-Carlo Rota: “Use Feynman’s Method” section
Kids In The Hall Theme Song (Clearly, they were some of the earliest listeners to HFP.)
The Spirit of the Disciplines
Abide In Christ - Book Abide In Christ - PDF
John 15
Andrew Murray
Life In The Spirit —> The Spirit of Christ - Book The Spirit of Christ - PDF
Dharma Talks in the Yoga session
Eugene Peterson
The Practice of The Presence of God
The Liturgy of the Ordinary
Brother Lawrence
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One of Alex’s favorite problems is observing, understanding, and communicating ideas from one context into another. It touches sociology, psychology, pedagogy, culture, communication, and issues of translation.
Marshall and Macon try to get Alex to more clearly articulate the problem itself, but first Macon did one of Alex’s retreats and survived.
Show Notes:
Pitch Perfect 1, 2, 3.
Sponsor 1: Greenhouse Retreats for January.
Sponsor 2: Plexus.
Galatians has 4 chapters.
So does Jonah.
There are many lesser podcasts, as it turns out. (None of these are the podcast that Alex refers to though.)
Alex is Galvinizing, but metaphorically (one of six types of Working Genius).
Enneagram 3.
Shop-Vac
Malcom Gladwell has podcasts.
Here's the episode (S0E12) where Macon and Marsh pre-critique Alex’s Counter Culture Sermon Series.
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Macon, Marshall, and Alex return to the question of retreats, because Marshall and Alex are podcasting from a cabin in NC where they’re on a retreat.
Because it’s a month into the new year and who hasn’t taken their first retreat yet?
We talk about Marshall’s “Reading Retreat,” Alex’s struggle with retreats in general, whether Amplifier has any values, and good & bad Churches.
Remember to get out your Bingo cards and listen for: Enneagram, Marsh knowing his Bible, Gary Deddo, and Greenhouse Retreats.
Other high quality references:
Mast General Store Annex, Valle Crucis, NC
Valle Crucis Community Park
The Diversity Gap
Building a Healthy Multiethnic Congregation
Let’s not bicker and argue about who killed who.
Like butter scraped over too much bread
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Macon presents one of his Favorite Problems: How is it you can know anything? Alex wants to know how far back this problem goes for Macon, and Marshall tries to figure out how to pastor a person for whom this is a Favorite Problem.
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“Richard Feynman was fond of giving the following advice on how to be a genius. You have to keep a dozen of your favorite problems constantly present in your mind, although by and large they will lay in a dormant state. Every time you hear or read a new trick or a new result, test it against each of your twelve problems to see whether it helps. Every once in a while there will be a hit, and people will say: ‘How did he do it? He must be a genius!’”
from 12 Favorite Problems, a Tool for Systematic Curiosity
My Buddy
gluhwein
Central Texas Cedar Season
the lights are going out
Richard Feynman
Meme
Making Change
Experiment - Fail - Curse/Learn - Repeat
The Explicit Episode
Explain it to a 12 Year Old
Greenhouse Retreats
Swiss Army Knives
Holacracy
Shop Class as Soulcraft
Hydraulic Supply Company
Eugene Peterson
HFP at myspace
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First CityWide Change Bank
Greenhouse Retreats
The Infinite Game
A long obedience in the same direction, the book
A long obedience in the same direction, the quote
Life is good, but it can be better
The Four Disciplines of Execution
Macon's Notepad
and now it's time for the breakdown
Holacracy
Grace Community Church 12.18.2022
The Man in the Mirror
Winds of change podcast
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A Charlie Brown Christmas
The Second Adulthood (previous episode)
The Explicit Episode (episode prior to the previous episode)
Kellsey's Plexus Page
How the Grinch Stole Christmas (1966)
How the Grinch Stole Christmas (2000)
The Grinch
Elf
The Polar Express
Die Hard
Spirited
The LEGO Movie
Paul Gould
C.S. Lewis
T.F. Torrance
George MacDonald
A Charlie Brown Christmas Album
Handel's Messiah
The Slient Stars, Alli Rogers
Behold The Lamb of God, Andrew Peterson
Joy
Halford 3 Winter Songs
Pentatonix Christmas
All I Want for Christmas, August Burns Red
Simply Christmas, Leslie Odom Jr.
Adore, Chris Tomlin
Making Room in Advent, Bette Dickinson
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Jon Tyson
Moxie
Richard Rohr
James Hollis
Jungian Psychology
The wonder of bread on the shelves.
The Return of The Prodigal Son
HFP Episode on Work
FF Nitros Scenes
Loon Shots
You know nothing John Snow
The Ungame
Steven Curtis Chapman
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This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit holdforpodcast.substack.com
Alex and Macon explore the impossible possibility of understanding one's parents and having one's children understand you.
Marshall and Macon discuss Marshal's guilt, Macon's shamelessness, Purity Culture, teenagers, and the Path of Wisdom.
Marshall, Alex, and Macon thank about what's going on with what the cool kids call, "Deconstruction," which, up to this point in history, has been referred to as, "thinking about your beliefs and how you came by them."
Alex, Marshall, and Macon work through what it might mean to live counter-culturally, if you can first figure out which culture you're going to counter.
Alex and Macon consider the inter-relationship of love and knowledge, whether there's a pre-eminent language, and how Alex is going to preach on Numbers.
What does it mean to move from one life phase to another? If we can identify those moments, how do we navigate them? Do we have to use the word "liminality," or only if we want to sound precious?
Alex and Macon explore how retreats are great, pretty much everyone would benefit from one, and Macon probably won't do it anyway.
Asking "what does it mean to have a "successful" sabbatical?" leads back to goals for ministry and businesses, and to practices for a leader's inner life.
In Episode 7, Alex and Macon discuss praying while in a "Lord Have Mercy" headspace. Alex accuses Macon of riffing anyway.
In Episode 6, Alex and Macon talk about their introductions to Spiritual Formation. We learn that for years Alex had his own Nun.
In our 5th episode, Alex and Macon discuss Philosophies of Vacationing and how Alex was directed, and failed, to "get a hobby".
Marsh and Macon talk about success, calling, epistemology, hermeneutics, and riffing in the pulpit.