Rethinc Podcast: Recent Episodes
Rethinc Inc.
The way we work has a lot of us wondering if we should change jobs, shift careers, or finally chase some dream we’ve long imagined. For most of us, our work means much more than a paycheck - it’s our pride, our labor, and our contribution to a better world. So, who we work with and how we work - now more than ever - has become a big part of our day, our week, and our lives. In the Rethinc Podcast, Kate and the team bring their hearts and minds together with organizational, industry, and thought leaders to better understand what makes it hard, what it takes to make it better, and imagine a world in which strong human relationships actually helped us to get shit done.
Rethinc co-founder, Kenan Bishop and guest, Ron Rapatalo explore leveraging relationships as a currency to build trust in the workplace. Ron Rapatalo is an entrepreneur, talent shepherd, career/executive/equity coach, public speaker, podcaster, best-selling author, and currently the president and CEO of the Rapatalo Group LLC.
Ron’s career vision is coaching, connecting and inspiring others to find their best selves through healthier living, increased mindfulness and interconnection, and stronger intention and strategy.
He believes in the power of intuition and deepening one’s self-awareness and impact on others. He also believes that we must dismantle systems of oppression and racism to recover our fullest humanity
With over 25 years of experience across non-profits, for-profits, and government, he has seen the power of leveraging the people who care about him personally and professionally.
In this episode Kenan and Ron unpack his book Leverage and what it means to actually leverage relationships at work. Hopefully this inspires you to take a step back, assess the relationships around you, and think about how you too can leverage them for the better.
We also touch on:
3:49– Healing workplaces with the currency of love & trust
5:04– Connecting the dots
7:14– Pros & cons of the manipulator
14:03– Not caring about being liked
23:17– Why are people leaving their jobs?
27:16– Ron’s advice for those transitioning
31:58– Advice to leaders who have employees thinking about transitioning
38:02– Honey vs vinegar
Resources mentioned:
- Leverage the People Who Love and Care About You Personally and Professionally by Ron Rapatalo (not an affiliate link)
- Connect with Ron on LinkedIn
Listen to his podcast: Ronderings
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson and co-founder, Kenan Bishop explore a tension that is felt across generations by all generations. This tension might show up as different expectations in career trajectory, communication styles, the differences in what an appropriate working hour is, how urgency shows up (or shouldn’t show up), and different definitions of productivity.
Because we’re observing a lot of resentment, defensiveness, and frustration surrounding stereotypes of different generations we thought it would be helpful to name the differences so we can seek a new way of thinking about this so as not to villainize any one specific group.
In this episode we break down four different generations: the boomers, the Gen X, millennials, and Gen Z. Hopefully this inspires you to take a step back, recognize what each generation has gone through to mold where they stand today, and embrace these differences at work.
We also touch on:
2:27– Boomer’s formative experiences, their values, and stereotypes
4:09– Gen X’s formative experiences, their values, and stereotypes
6:14– Millennial’s formative experiences, their values, and stereotypes
7:46– Gen Z’s formative experiences, their values, and stereotypes
8:54– Examining and appreciating each generations formative years
11:11– The unintentional parent-child dynamic
14:40– Naming both perspectives in generational conflict
18:19– Advocacy and the importance of listening
23:04– The kids table vs the adult table
25:59– An unhealthy response from the youngs
29:18– Building the foundations for hard interactions
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Kate Gerson and co-founder, Kenan Bishop, unpack healing as a team effort, emphasizing that it is not merely an individual endeavor. . They explore recent learnings and its relationship to inclusivity, fostering a sense of belonging, and cultivating happiness.
They delve into a compelling case study of a community navigating the path of collective healing unearthing the potent impact of talking about privilege. They also confront the societal consequences when the ability to explicitly identify and discuss racism is absent or suppressed.
Kate and Kenan share stories that illustrate their immersion in communities engaged in this transformative work. Their experiences provide a tangible picture of what this looks like in practice, hopefully inspiring you to introspect on your personal engagement at work.
In this episode, we also touch on:
6:04 – Introducing the community case study
10:45– The power of talking about privilege
16:03– Connecting points of connection
20:41– Evidence signaling a desire for change
25:55– The consequences of not addressing the proverbial ‘elephant in the room’
31:56– The learning potential in sharing your lived experiences with others
36:04– The reduction of harm through self-awareness and understanding
40:28– Building spaces that encourage people to share their needs and vulnerabilities
47:51– Identifying prevalent themes in groups who are collectively navigating change
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
In this episode, Kate is joined by partner, Dr. Brandy Nelson in a conversation about how our history has shaped our workplace, how black women specifically experience work differently, and the disconnect we’re seeing between the ‘youngs’ and the ‘olds’ at work.
You see, history is a white man's story, and we’ve been taught by history books that the United States is the greatest country on Earth. We’re taught that the U.S. has fought hard to ensure equality for all. We’re taught that black people have never held positions of power, and only working hard will allow us to achieve the ‘American dream’.
The truth is, we can't talk about "hard work" without understanding the oppressive systems in place.
We also can’t ignore the new ways of work that the ‘youngs’ have brought into the workplace and how these ideas can be used for good.
Tune in to this eye-opening conversation between two colleagues so that you may recognize how our history shapes the way we work and the mindset shifts you can embrace from the younger workforce.
Key points that are explored:
1:10– Exploring how we’re raised professionally and how it shows up at work
4:04– Why has work productivity in the U.S. drastically decreased?
12:59– Black women just experience work differently
15:34– The history of the U.S. is founded on racist principles
21:44– Part of the problem lies in the hands of the leaders
31:19– The broken connection between working hard and being rewarded
39:12– Leveraging the ideas of our youthful workforce
45:33– Urgency at work
54:45– Leaving space for the new ways of being
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
In this episode, Kate is joined by co-founder, Kenan Bishop and founding partner, Dr. John E. Deasy to discuss the lines of differences within Rethinc and how they use these differences for good.
This intimate conversation unveils what it really means to be in a harmonious relationship at work.
Tune in to dive deep with Kate who facilitates this eye-opening conversation between two colleagues so that you may readjust how you show up in relationships at work to be more aligned.
Key points that are explored:
1:00– Personal responsibility, organizational wellness, and change opportunity
3:48– Identity markers
6:48– Humor fosters connection
9:22– Trends within organizations who’re committed to the work
15:02– Training vs sitting in space together
21:12– The work doesn’t always start with the CEO
26:35– The ups and downs of hiring a DEI facilitator
32:05– The frequent disconnect between a leadership department and a DEI department
36:05– How to shift the disconnect
40:44– Learning how to communicate differently
45:57– “Picking one’s own cotton”
54:26– “It’s highly irresponsible to think I can do this work alone”
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
In this solo episode Kate Gerson directly answers some questions asked via Rethinc’s Instagram, including:
Should white people talk about race?
Why should a leader have to make other people feel comfortable at work?
Should my white kids be taking responsibility for racism?
Tune in to dive deep with Kate as she talks openly about the inequities black folks face everyday and how white people can start reflecting on how they contribute to these issues.
Key points that are explored:
1:01– Race is a construction that has served white people across history
5:38– Talking to white kids about racism
9:30– We all experience struggle, but the likelihood that black people experience it is higher
12:14– An example of parental inequity as it pertains to race
15:50– The consciousness of racism is the responsibility of white people
18:40– The ‘less than’ quality
21:05– How does all of this manifest at work?
28:00– Race is always in the room
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
education policies are impacting our children, the politicalization of inclusion, and how leaders can advocate for the LGBTQ+ community within the workplace.
As Co-founder and Senior Advisor at Campaign for Our Shared Future and Consultant for Squadbuck, Ruthanne has a long history of powerful work including a leadership role in the Obama administration.
She leverages her knowledge, experience, and identity to teach us about lines of difference in schools and in politics and how we can take better care of our children.
Key points that are explored:
2:05– An intro to Ruthanne Buck
14:50– The evolution of LGBTQ+ rights and intersectionality as it pertains to our children
23:30– Conflict within the education system from a parents perspective
31:01– The education policies are harming our children
37:30– How is the politicization of inclusion manifesting at work?
47:43– What do you wish leaders knew about making the workplace more inclusive for queer folks?
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson is joined by founding partner, Dr. John E. Deasy in conversation about the different approaches that many leaders take when it comes to the work of DEI. They explore the fact that there is no role for shame, what repair actually means, and what that looks like from a leadership standpoint.
This episode's topic is grounded in building community, having grace for oneself, and honoring the developmental arch we are all moving through when it comes to diversity, equity, and inclusion.
As a senior partner at Cambiar Education and former Superintendent at Stockton Unified Public Schools (among many other positions), Dr. John E. Deasy shares his insights, personal experiences, and advice for leaders seeking to do this work in a more meaningful and impactful way.
Key points that are explored:
1:38– An intro to John E. Deasy
4:00– The pulse of the workplace
7:16– The 4 leadership approaches to DEI work
10:35– What does repair work actually look like?
17:00– What does it mean in an organizational context to repair harm?
23:18– The reactive and impulsive responses to the work
28:36– What happens when the response is, “We’re not talking about this anymore?”
31:29– The awareness of the problem
35:00–Do my struggles not matter?
36:26– How the unknowing impacts the workplace
40:50– To be in community means pushing your insecurities to the side
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson discusses what it means to build an inclusive culture with Rethinc partner, Marc Etienne. They explore what’s necessary to give up to birth this new culture and how we must challenge the old way of doing work.
They discuss a deeper level of trust that’s required from each other, the teamwork muscles that must be stretched, and the newfound layer of productivity that opens up when this environment is nourished.
This episode offers personal stories about how both Kate and Marc are making this happen in their own lives as an inspiration for you to do the same.
In this episode, we also touch on:
2:41 – What are people most struggling with as it pertains to DEI right now?
10:20 – The characteristics of a non-inclusive culture
18:08 – The risk or non-risk of assertion
21:28 – The “Karen” effect
38:05 – What does it actually mean to feel safe?
47:25 – Be aware of the power you walk around with
49:48 – When people are connected, the work is happening
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
President and CEO of Education Strategy Group, Matt Gandal talks about what it means to create work culture that’s more humanized, connected, and relatable. His company, ESG, is an organization that aims to support states, national organizations, & foundations that are committed to dramatically improving the performance of the U.S. education system.
Matt expands on how to continue showing up for inclusion and to move away from the ‘CEO check-list’ that one believes they need to do good DEI work.
This conversation uncovers what it means to be vulnerable as a white male CEO, and how he’s used his generational trauma to heal and inform the way he moves as a leader.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
1:27 – Intro to Matt Gandal
3:28 – How work is changing
6:57 – DEI work is never really done
9:40 – Part of success is building a trusting environment
12:15 – Embracing vulnerability and using generational trauma to be more open-minded
16:46 – Seeing things through people’s eyes before judging them
19:14 – Leaders don’t always have the answer
21:40 – Whiteness in the workplace
32:37 – Making a conscious effort to lead inclusively
39:50 – Concern of causing harm that bottles you up
46:15 – Creating boundaries and norms
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Dr. Brandy Nelson is a partner at Rethinc where she holds the intersection of conscious awareness, rigorous work, & genuine leadership, partnering with organizations who seek to match impact with internal integrity.
In this episode, Kate Gerson discusses the challenges leaders face with Rethinc partner, Dr. Nelson. They explore ‘leader hesitation’ as it pertains to race, personal stories about the topic, & ways in which we can approach this work differently.
Key talking points in this episode:
2:06 – Leaders who want change, but won’t put themselves inside the flames
4:13 – Committees: a double edge sword
9:30 – Fears of being in the fire of the work
13:57 – Anchoring as a strategy
18:08 – Work culture appearances & emotions that come with it
22:01 – Feedback defensiveness & the added danger for people of color
29:28 – An eye-opening experience
37:08 – A messy journey & recommitment
42:25 – What does this have to do with work?
52:33 – How does a leader move with care?
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson discusses relationships at work & the challenges black leaders face with Rethinc partner, Marc Etienne. They explore Marc’s personal upbringing and how he formed his thoughts about leadership.
He goes on to explain leadership attributes and beliefs he stands by, current challenges we face in the workplace post-pandemic, and how we can start to unlearn those beliefs to make our workplace more inclusive for all folks.
This episode offers key insights into how black leaders feel emotionally within the workplace & how white leaders can use these understandings to navigate in a more compassionate way with their employees of color.
In this episode, we discuss:
3:20 – Introduction to Marc Etienne, partner at Rethinc
4:50 – How our upbringing contributes to our perceptions about leadership
10:02 – Cultivating an effective environment for those we lead
11:50 – What ails the workplace now, post-pandemic?
19:08 – How race shows up in the workplace post-pandemic
29:15 – How white leaders can adjust their approach with black leaders or employees
37:39 – How to loosen our grip around the thought that ‘there’s one right way to do things’
44:39 – How black people are experienced in the workplace
50:31 – People of color are powerful
52:32 – The need to be ruthless because of blackness
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson engages in a thoughtful discussion with Rethinc Co-Founder and Chief Wellness Officer, gina Breedlove, about the power of care, grief, healing and dignity in the workplace. They explore the relationship between these concepts and how to create an environment that carries hope during difficult times. With trauma being so widespread amongst individuals now more than ever before, they emphasize how integral it is to establish systems of care where people have space to process their emotions while enhancing their quality of work - welcoming each person's humanity and honoring their wholeness.
This episode offers an insightful lesson in the power of emotional healing - that grief, if not released from within us, can cause a heavy burden on every aspect of our lives. gina shares an approach to freeing this weight through an intentional crying practice that encourages us to give ourselves permission to cry and let go of any trapped emotions lurking within our bodies - allowing for greater wellbeing overall.
In this episode, we discuss:
01:55 – Introduction to gina Breedlove, Rethinc Co-Founder and Chief Wellness Officer
04:06 – What does healing have to do with work?
08:30 – Holding space for grief in the workplace
12:45 – Moving grief in the body
16:31 – Crying practice for moving grief
20:45 – The importance of systems of care at work
26:05 – How healing, grief, humanity, and race interact in the workplace
28:40 – Fear of blame and the weaponization of shame
35:41 – Being in interracial spaces and being in pain at the same time
39:02 – Inclusive care and the role of holders at work
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Many people feel like they don't quite fit in at work, or that they don't quite know how to behave in order to feel like they belong. This can be a difficult feeling to shake, as the sense of not belonging can often lead to feelings of isolation and exclusion. However, there are ways to make an individual feel more connected and accepted in the workplace. In this episode, Kate Gerson sits down with Rethinc Co-Founder, Kenan Bishop, to discuss the concept of belonging in the workplace and how it affects employees on a daily basis. They dispel some of the myths around belonging and identify three specific behaviors that have an impact on an individual's sense of belonging at work.
A fundamental lesson from this episode is that developing relationships with others at work doesn't have to come at the expense of being efficient. Too often, workplace cultures believe that human connection and efficiency are mutually exclusive goals. But it doesn't have to be that way. We can find ways to create a more inclusive environment for all employees without sacrificing productivity.
We hope you enjoy this candid discussion on belonging between two of the most brilliant DEI practitioners of our day. Don't forget to take away what you learn and apply it within your own workplace. Workplace belonging is essential for every individual, no matter their background or identity. This episode of the podcast is dedicated to all those who are striving to create a more inclusive work environment and make everyone feel like they belong.
In this episode, we discuss:
1:25 – Introduction to Kenan Bishop, Rethinc Co-Founder
3:00 – Checking boxes vs. leaning into behavior change for belonging
6:00 – What it truly means to belong at work and show up as one’s authentic self
17:00 – The importance of human connection in collaborative performance
19:30 – The art and science of becoming less of an a-hole as a leader
25:30 – The role of race in the paradox of culture fit at work
31:40 – Creating an environment of continuous feedback across lines of difference
36:00 – The analogy between love languages and meeting people where they are at work
41:00 – Honoring space for other perspectives without defending
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
Kate Gerson is joined by Rethinc partner, Brandy Nelson, in a thoughtful discourse about the implications of power dynamics within organizational culture. Lisa Delpit's 1988 article, “The Silenced Dialogue: Power and Pedagogy in Educating Other People's Children,” was used as an impetus to their discussion – analyzing how this age-old concept of power profoundly shapes our experiences even today. From unspoken codes of conduct to critical aspects of work culture embedded within organizations, they discussed how these factors influence everyday interactions between individuals across lines of difference and unpacked how these dynamics are often built upon preexisting ideologies supported by those with power.
In this episode, we discuss:
1:35 – Introduction to Dr. Brandy Nelson, Partner at Rethinc
2:48 – Manifestations of power in the workplace
8:08 – Lisa Delpit’s five aspects of power
9:07 – Implicit codes that are enacted in the workplace
15:40 – Access to power in relation to race
20:31 – Those with power are frequently least aware of its existence
28:00 – The importance of slowing down to listen
36:08 – Disengagement in the workplace
38:14 – What do I do now to turn the culture of my organization around?
41:19 – The first step to change the culture of your company
49:13 – The importance of company culture and how to empower employees
56:37 – Leading in a way that acknowledges humanity
1:04:20 – The relationship between leadership and care
Join the conversation on our LinkedIn or Instagram & dive deeper into our work on our website here!
On this episode, Kate Gerson comes together with two more partners, Kenan Bishop and John Deasy, in a profound discussion that centers race and power dynamics in the workplace. This episode highlights the importance of both spoken word and action, building community with care, and fostering cultures for people to show up as their authentic selves. The three speak to this series of compelling themes from the lens of their own individual racial identity development journey as a white male, a black male, and a white female. Ultimately, the episode lands on the question of whether a white male can lead an organization that is truly inclusive?
See below for conversation topics as they unfold:
- 0:00 - Introduction to John and Kenan
- 2:15 - How we came to meet
- 5:00 - Understanding personal journeys with racial identity development
- 14:00 - Witnessing and supporting other people in their development journey
- 20:00 - Creating grace as we learn to work differently together
- 31:00 - What can people gain from understanding racial identity?
- 43:30 - Can a white man lead a truly inclusive organization?
- 46:00 - The role of critical repentance in walking forward together
In this episode, Kate Gerson sits down with fellow Rethinc co-founders Sam Hoare and Gina Breedlove to discuss the origins of the organization, co-founder backstories, the problems that Rethinc exists to solve, and Rethinc's care-driven approach to DEI.
The breakdown of topics discussed can be found here:
- 00:00 - Introduction
- 00:29 - Samantha's story
- 01:25 - Gina's story
- 03:16 - How we came to meet and work together
- 09:53 - How we do and what we do in Rethinc
- 14:57 - The core problem that we are trying to solve in Rethinc
- 16:34 - Fighting a war on consciousness
- 23:10 - The unique way Rethinc operates
- 26:23 - The conversations that we are having around racism and the collective interest in shifting it
- 30:48 - How to create psychological safety when having these conversations