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As an entrepreneur or business owner, you probably dream of owning your own home without renting for the rest of your life. But with so many loan options out there, it can be hard to know which one is the best for your needs.
The good news is that there are a variety of home loan options available for you as an entrepreneur and business owner. Here are some of the most popular home loan options, including an option that most people have no idea exists and is usually a perfect option for a business owner:
Fixed Rate Mortgages: If you’re looking for a stable and reliable loan, then a fixed-rate mortgage may be the right choice for you. With a fixed-rate loan, the interest rate and monthly payments remain the same throughout the life of the loan, making it easier to plan and budget.
Adjustable Rate Mortgages (ARMs): ARMs offer more flexibility than a fixed-rate loan, as the interest rate and payments can change over time. This type of loan can be a good choice if you anticipate your income increasing, as you can take advantage of lower rates as they become available.
FHA Loans: An FHA loan is a government-insured loan that is typically easier to qualify for than a traditional mortgage. It also comes with a lower down payment and more flexible credit and income requirements, making it a great option for entrepreneurs or business owners who may not qualify for a traditional loan.
VA Loans: If you are a veteran, active-duty service member, or a surviving spouse of a veteran or service member, you may be eligible for a VA loan. This loan offers lower interest rates, no down payment, and easier qualification criteria than a traditional mortgage.
Home Equity Loans: A home equity loan allows you to borrow money against the equity in your home. It can be a great option if you need cash quickly and can be used for a variety of purposes, such as home improvements, debt consolidation, or even starting a business.
Self-Employed Home Loan: The main difference between a self-employed home loan and a traditional home loan is the documentation requirements. Since self-employed individuals often have more complex income streams than W-2 employees, lenders may require additional documentation to verify income and financial stability. This can include tax returns, bank statements, profit and loss statements, and other financial documents. There are usually a lot of options available here to get approved when working with the right lender.
No matter which home loan option you choose, it’s important to have a lender who can walk you through the best options and support you with the process. With the right loan, you can finally own your dream home without renting for the rest of your life.
Don’t wait any longer to own your own home! With my Immediate Pre-Approval Application for Entrepreneurs and Self-Employed Business Owners, you can find out if you’re approved without affecting your credit score and get the best terms to own your first home. While interest rates may be at a couple of decades high, now is the time to buy before they come down and prices of homes skyrocket. So get the price now, and we can refinance in the future…
Head to my calendar link to book your call and start moving toward living in your dream home without renting for the rest of your life right here.
The post Home Loan Options For Business Owners: With a Surprising Option That Few Know About appeared first on The Heath Barnes Show.
Overview:
- CPI (Consumer Price Index) is the measure of price change experienced by consumers
- When CPI increases, interest rates usually follow
- When housing prices and interest rates are high, inventory is usually low but also creates a perfect opportunity to purchase
- When CPI begins to come down, usually interest rates do too, which leads to an increase in demand for houses, which causes prices to go up
- For the right person with $25,000+ saved, it may make sense to look at purchasing a home (first, or multiple) to beat inflation and have an asset that’s value historically trends upward always over time
You probably have heard the term CPI thrown out a lot lately, but do you know how it affects interest rates and home prices? The Consumer Price Index (CPI) is the average change over time in the prices paid for a basket of goods and services. It is calculated by taking price changes for each item in the predetermined basket of goods and averaging them.
Central banks set interest rates based on CPI. Generally, when the CPI increases, meaning prices have gone up on average, the central banks increase interest rates to control inflation. This makes borrowing more expensive and reduces the amount of money in circulation. This can have a direct effect on home prices, as people are less likely to be able to afford to buy a home when interest rates are higher.
When the CPI decreases, meaning prices have gone down on average, the central bank will lower interest rates to stimulate the economy. This makes borrowing cheaper and increases the amount of money in circulation. It can also affect home prices, as people are more likely to buy a home when interest rates are lower. There are huge opportunities in the market when interest rates are higher.
So, when the CPI goes up, interest rates go up, and home prices may go down. When the CPI goes down, interest rates go down, and home prices usually go up. It’s important to keep an eye on the CPI and how it is affecting the economy and housing market to make informed decisions when buying or selling a home.
In my opinion, the perfect time to buy a home is when we are between these two stages I mentioned above, which I believe we currently are. You can purchase a home and lock in the price, which might include a higher interest rate for a year or two. We can then have a plan to refinance the home and get a lower interest rate over time as the value of the home increases. This is how you can build wealth.
When interest rates begin going down. The demand AND prices of homes will increase based on historical data. It is basic supply and demand.
I can help you with your options so that when you are ready to purchase your next (or first) home. I will help you create a plan, show you how much you qualify for, and share with you how and why some of the most intelligent people are purchasing homes right now. I can share with you how you can do what the wealthy are doing to own your first (or next home) and begin building wealth.
Whether it’s time you get to wake up to that delicious coffee smell in a new house and community that you love or to check your bank account with the incoming wired money with your tenant’s monthly rent payment…
Book a call with me to explore how close you are to owning that first, or next home.
Your lender for life,
Heath Barnes,
P.S. Book your call with me here (at the time of this writing, I only have two slots open).
The post How CPI and Inflation Affects Home Prices appeared first on The Heath Barnes Show.
Stop disassociating your net worth from your self-worth. You have the find time to celebrate your wins because you are a winner. If your income is going down, that doesn’t mean you are bad at what you do. Market and demand shift all the time, so it’s not really your fault. Just understand that life is happening for you, not to you. And once you figure that out, you can shift your energy to what benefits you. Join Heath Barnes as he talks with the co-creator at NEO Home Loans and Triibe Coaching, Danny Horanyi. Learn how to navigate this weird and uncertain environment as a loan officer or originator. Find out how you can come out on top so that you can avoid suffering. Start focusing on your self-worth right now.
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Watch the episode hereListen to the podcast hereYou’re Not A Loser: Misassociating Your Net Worth With Your Self-Worth With Danny HoranyiOur guest is the Co-creator at NEO Home Loans. He’s also a Co-creator and Coach at Tribe Coaching. Danny has been making an impact in our industry for many years. He has more than $2 billion in production, and is one of the top originators in the country. He has several years in the industry. He lives in San Diego and has two kids. He loves to travel, play board games, and drink wine. A man after my own heart. Welcome, Danny.
Great to be here. Thank you so much.
It’s a pleasure. Danny is my coach at Tribe, and I have been with Tribe for quite a while now. I invited him to go on the show here. I’m fascinated by the systems and processes you have in your head and all the knowledge I’d love to share with my audience, especially in this environment we are in. First, I’d like the audience to get an idea of who Danny Horanyi is, where he came from, and how he got into the business. How did you get into the business?
To answer the question, the first thing that comes to my mind is happy hour. That’s how I got into the business. I will give you the short version. I went to college and got a degree in Accounting. I thought I was going to become a CPA. Right out of college, I got a job at Centex Homes in the accounts payable department. My Accounting degree gave me the credentials to go in and be a data input person back in a cubicle dungeon. It turned out that CTX Mortgage shared a building with Centex Homes. CTX Mortgage was the mortgage arm of Centex Homes, and we shared a break room.
As an accountant, you're just going to be a data input person at the back of a cubicle dungeon.
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I would go in every morning and afternoon. I would toast my bagel and get my coffee, and I would go back to my cubicle dungeon. I would come out and microwave my burrito. The mortgage people were in the break room too, and they were having a completely different experience of life than I was. Now, it’s 2003 in the mortgage industry, and they are loving life. At some point, I said to him, “What do you guys do? You were having a very different experience than I am back in my cubicle dungeon.” They said, “Why don’t you come to happy hour with us and find out?”
I did, and I ended up hitting it off with them. I ended up getting invited to be the loan officer assistant to what I later found out to be the top-producing loan officer at CTX Mortgage nationally. A guy named Steve Lemmons is an amazing operator, and I still owe so much of what I know now to him and his teaching and that branch manager, Laurie Peterson, as well. They brought me in, and the rest was history.
It’s funny how sometimes in life you’re at the right place at the right time. I don’t want to say it’s lucky. We create our own experiences, and that’s where exactly where you were supposed to be on the runway for you to be in the mortgage business.
To honor that statement, but also there’s an element of action. I could have gone and toasted my bagel, microwaved my burrito 100 times, never said a word, and gone back and lived my life. I could be working a terrible life at some accounting firm now instead of on this awesome call with you because I didn’t step up and act.
There’s an awareness to, “These people are living a different life than mine,” and the courage to say, “Tell me more. Your experience is different than I’m having. I’m going to my desk and I want to put a bullet in my head.” I’m assuming that’s what you wanted to do. If I were in accounting, I would want to put a bullet in my head. I’m assuming that they looked like they were having a good time. Everyone was like, “Life is good.” You are like, “Let me talk to these guys.”
They say, “Happy hour.” I’m like, “I have been training for this my whole life.” I went to UCSB like, “If I have one skill, it is this. Let’s go.”
That’s great. My hat’s off to you. To those reading, be willing to ask questions. It’s one of the things to do. I have an Italian exchange student, and the one thing that I’m trying to teach her is asking questions. It’s been my mantra since I learned that from a girlfriend. You were bold enough to ask a question and step out on a limb. Obviously, that went well because you were working for one of the top loan officers in the country.
I don’t know if you remember the name, Mark Cady. I saw him. He was one of the top loan officers at CTX out of Houston, but Steve Lemmons. It must have been good, and you followed the right people because now you are one of the co-owners of NEO Lending and Tribe Coaching, so my hat is off to you. What do you think about this crazy market? We went through a few years of going 150 miles an hour, and now we are going through a school zone, and people don’t know what to do themselves.
I have a lot of thoughts on this. I will approach it from a couple of different angles. The first way I want to approach it is one for your audience is the most actionable, something they could take away right now and put into their business because I always want to leave with value. I was having a conversation with a loan officer, and they were pretty down. They were having trouble. They don’t have a call reluctance. They had a conversation reluctance.
They would pick up the phone and call anybody as soon as they knew what they were going to say, and they didn’t know what they were going to say. I happened to have a glass of wine with a realtor friend of mine a week before, and I started asking them about their experience of the market and how things were going. They were telling me that, “Sellers were dropping prices. It’s pretty dire now, and we don’t have a lot of listings.”
I was trying to connect all the dots because I’m a very math-focused person. I love statistics and math. I love to understand how different systems fit and work together. I was hearing not a lot of listings and inventory, and then sellers dropping prices. I was like, “These things don’t connect because those things are not normally related to each other.” I’m an Accounting major with an Economist degree. Supply-demand would say low inventory, high prices, not low inventory, low prices. I asked them the question, “How many months of inventory do we have right now?” They said, “We are sitting at about two and a half months of inventory.”
I was like, “Are you saying sellers are dropping prices when there are two and a half months of inventory?” For those of you who are reading this that don’t have a baseline for this, if you think about a spectrum of buyer’s market and seller’s market, a normal market is six months of inventory. Anything an inventory exceeds six months, that’s considered a buyer’s market. It means there’s way too much inventory on the market, and buyers can force price concessions and command the marketplace. Anything below six months is typically a seller’s market where the seller’s in control and sets the price and terms. It’s not a gradient of every month of inventory lower. There’s a linear path.
Self Worth: A normal market is six months of inventory. If that exceeds six months, it’s a buyer’s market. If it’s the other way around, it’s a seller’s market. And being at below three months is enormously favorable to sellers.Being at below three months of inventory is enormously favorable to sellers. Being in the two-and-a-half months of inventory is enormously favorable to sellers. I went to this loan officer, and I’m like, “Several months ago, you had to learn the term buyer fatigue.” You had to learn how to keep your people engaged because they kept getting punched in the face because they took their seven-year-old and showed them where their bunker bed was going to be, and then they didn’t get their offer accepted.
That happened to them fifteen times in a row, and they said, “I can’t take my seven-year-old into this house again because they keep getting attached, and I’m not winning the offers.” We had to figure out how to navigate that marketplace where we had an appraisal, gap strategies in the conversation, and all of these things that we had to put in place because there was massive demand and low supply.
Now, we are in this weird environment where supply is still low, but demand is also low for reasons that are not from a macroeconomic perspective. I would defer to Barry Habib and his content on this household formation and the ratio of inventory to household formation. He does a tremendous job o on that. The fundamental answer to give you the punchline is there are not enough houses for the people that need houses, which means home prices should be going up, and they are not. They are going down in many markets. What that represents is a massive opportunity because you have a seller’s market where the seller is behaving like it’s a buyer’s market, and the buyers are not acting on that arbitrage, that opportunity to win on the emotion of that.
What I’m hearing you say is there’s opportunity out there, and it’s our job as loan officers or if you are an individual, and it is a wonderful time to be in real estate, especially buying. What I hear you saying is, on two months of inventory, where is the inventory going to come from? Some people are like, “What if inventory jumps up?” The likelihood of inventory jumping up is fairly low unless they start building a lot of houses.
It is physically impossible to do it fast enough. There’s not enough lumber. The supply chain is there. The permitting process in most markets takes years. They could start now. Our buyers are buying in this market, realizing that there could be this windfall of units created. Maybe, but it’s unlikely. Here’s the other thing that people need to go out and communicate. Empower your clients through education. Get them off the fence and make them confident buyers because they have facts that other people don’t have. This is one of the things I like to say to our team. Wealthy people are not wealthy because they have money. They are wealthy because they have access to better information.
You are the conduit of that information for your clients. 9 out of 10 people will not seek advice from a financial planner because they are embarrassed about their financial situation. They will speak with a mortgage advisor because they want to be a homeowner, and we are the greatest opportunity for that person to become wealthy.
People speak to mortgage advisors because they are their greatest opportunity to become wealthy.
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It’s a great opportunity for a loan officer to learn about inflation and how you invest money. As you probably know, when I meet with a client, 9 times out of 10, they have almost $1 million in the bank, and their knowledge of investing is very limited. Understanding that inflation means if you are at 8% inflation, you are losing on every $100,000 or $8,000 a year. If you were to take that $100,000 to buy a $500,000 home at 8% interest, your return on that $100,000 would go through the roof. That simple principle, if we can relay that to clients, will totally change your business.
Everything you said was absolutely correct, but for anybody reading this, google the term inflation-assisted debt destruction. In the same way inflation destroys holders of assets, those that hold debt win from inflation. If you get a 30-year fixed payment at $3,500 a month and you are making $80,000 a year, you fast forward. Now, inflation has made your dollars where the value of every dollar has gone down, and your wages have gone up proportionately to the rate of inflation, hopefully, but your payment is still $3,500. You are putting 3,500 widgets into the machine, but those widgets are less valuable than they were many years before. The process by which that debt is paid down, you are paying it with pennies versus dollars at that point.
I’m thinking of my 2.75% interest rate that I was talking about last time with a buddy of mine. I’m like, “I’m not paying any more than my minimum monthly payment.” Think about it in ten years. My $5,000 monthly payment is going to seem like it’s $2,500 a month.
Exactly.
I appreciate that. It’s the middle of December 2022. When I call a loan officer now and ask how I’m doing, I say, “I’m literally depressed,” and they start laughing. I’m speaking the truth and what they say in return is, “I’m depressed too.” We are all scared. I don’t care if you are a brand-new loan officer. You’ve got 25 or 30 years to go. We are all nervous because the future seems bleak, but what I hear you saying is it’s not bleak.
The other answer, and I wanted to give that very tactical answer. Get out and tell your clients to buy now because several months from now or whenever it is, they are right back in the mix of buyer fatigue and getting punched in the face because that’s where the macroeconomic economy is bringing us forward.
Self Worth: Buyers should buy now because nine or so months from now, the buyers will be back in the mix of buyer fatigue. That is where the macroeconomic economy is bringing forward.Here’s another thing I want to say, and you can google this too. Look at what Wall Street and billionaires are doing. Blackstone put aside a $30 billion fund for the purchase of the residential real estate. You think they might know a little bit more about what’s happening in the global and macro economy than our individual buyers do, and wouldn’t that be an interesting data point for them to bring into their planning?
In addition to that, I talk about this with clients. If you are a loan officer and have clients, you should be asking them the question, “What’s your understanding of the market?” That’s going to give you better information you can share with them, but things aren’t changing because of Millennials. There are 74 million of them, and they are all in the home-buying age. Meaning, they are all first-time home buyers. I didn’t realize this until one of my episodes, but a first-time home buyer takes inventory, and versus a repeat buyer, there’s no change in supply. That’s going to have a huge impact. How do we make an impact? How do we attack this market? How do we sustain market share?
Can I go back to your depressed comment first? I don’t want to gloss over that. That was my initial instinct to answer your question about what’s in store for us in this market, but I wanted to leave with that valuable tactic you can use now in your business. I did an interview with Tim Braheem at the end of 2020. Tim is my personal coach. He asked me what I was worried about. I said, “The thing I’m worried about is that people are going to believe that 2020 was their fault, and they are going to believe that the person that they are, their bank account, and their W-2, somehow is attached immediately to the value that they created, and anything less than that will create a massive amount of depression.”
I said, “I know this is a fear I have because it’s exactly what happened to me in 2017.” I came off of 2016, and if those of us who remember 2016, it was the last 2020. That was the time when we were all working twenty-hour days trying to do everything we could to get every possible deal that we could in, and then in 2017, we started to see the turn. 2017 was the first time I ever had a W-2 that was lower than the previous years.
I was devastated. I did not know what I had done wrong. It was an existential crisis for me because I felt like I was a winner and had evidence that showed I was a loser. I also had throughout ‘17 the experience where I was doing all the same work. I was putting in all the same time and effort, but I wasn’t getting the same result.
Your myopic view of yourself based on not being able to perform every year increases your income without taking a look at how freaking lucky we are to even be in this industry. We don’t have a product. We are delivering an interest rate in an experience, and we get paid more than we should. We are super lucky. I get it. A lot of us are like that in the industry. If you are reading and your income is going down, that does not mean you suck.
I had disassociated my net worth with my self-worth, and that was a problem, and it’s a problem that I still struggle with, honestly, but I’m not free of it.
Stop disassociating your net worth from your self-worth.
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What advice can you give to someone who is in that predicament, including myself, or you’re like your income has dropped, and you are looking at next year? How do you keep from freaking out? What should people be focusing on?
There are two things that come up for me immediately when you say that. The first thing is that you should be measuring yourself on effort and not the outcome, and that’s so hard to do. I’m an instant gratification person. I’m deep down in my core that I’m just a salesperson. I want to go out on the hunt, and I want to know that I came away with the kill, and if I don’t, I’m depressed, and I have that feeling.
Self Worth: You should be measuring yourself on effort, not outcome. Give yourself the opportunity for small wins. Focus on the leading indicators, not the lagging indicators.It’s about acknowledging the fact that you are still out there and still doing it. If you are doing the things, give yourself the opportunity for small wins, focusing on leading indicators, not lagging indicators. Pat yourself on the back when you go walk 1 mile. I like talking analogies. If you are trying to lose weight, you don’t stand on the scale every day, look down at the number, and hope for the best. You need to either control how much you move your body or how many calories you put into it.
Congratulate yourself on the inputs, not the outputs, and it’s very hard to do because instant gratification is not there. That instant feedback loop of the result is not there. You have to reframe, and it takes discipline to do this. That’s number one. As a one A, make sure you are doing the right things. When you are measuring the inputs, not the outputs, for this, I will use a farming analogy. When the ground is frozen, the farmer does not go out with his hoe and tries to dig a new lane for crops. They don’t do it because it would exhaust them and it would break their tool. They find the season they are in and do activities appropriate to that season.
If you are still buying freaking leads right now and thinking you are going to convert them at 1% or 2% and make a living off of that, you are digging on frozen ground. Rethink what you are going to do in winter. In winter, farmers plan their crops. They set an intention. They sharpen their tools. They train themselves, and they set themselves up for future success. Here’s the tricky part, and this is what we all screwed up big time. The other thing that a farmer does in winter is eating out of the granary. They don’t eat out of the field. Here’s what we messed up. We did not save enough money in 2020 to survive 2022 without stress, so don’t do that again.
Self Worth: If you’re still buying leads right now and thinking of converting them at 1 or 2% to make a living out of that, you’re digging on frozen ground.Most loan officers are thinking, “I’m never going to go through this again.” That’s because I’m thinking that I’m going to save and save. What I hear you saying is this is a season and opportunity as the tide goes out because the tide has been in for so long. We are seeing who does swimming without a bathing suit now.
I go every other day. I’m either depressed or I’m happy. When I’m happy, I get a list of the things that I’m doing. There was one time that I called 35 real estate agents, and instead of resisting them not wanting to meet, I set lunches for the entire month of January. I got lunch for every month of January moving forward because what are they going to say now? They are getting ready for the end of the year, so I pushed it out to the next year, and I’m double booking lunches at 11:30 and 1:00. I got two lunches every single day in the month of January.
Congratulations. There are some things that you can only script in. From that conversation reluctance, not call reluctance mindset, there are some things that you can only do from a scripting perspective in December and January. This is exactly the time for us to evaluate what our partnership is going to look like in 2023 and how we are going to grow together. We need to do this either in December or in January because if we do it in February, we lose 1/12 of our opportunity.
What I hear you saying is it’s a season of opportunity. Use this time to reach all your business. Use this time to do the things necessary to get ready because there’s going to be another refinance boom coming. Think about it. Your database now is probably more valuable. You said this to me. Your database is more valuable than it’s ever been.
I did a mortgage coach for every client that I closed this 2022 already, and we are booking calls to go over that with them and say, “I’m wanting to let you know these are going to be the opportunities and let’s talk about it right now, because when rates drop, they are going to drop and they are probably going to go back up, but if you are using us, we’ll lock you in.” That’s another good opportunity or tool you could use in this market.
There’s been a number of Harvard time-lapsed studies where they study happiness and success and things of that nature. One of them, an article I read many years ago, said that one of the greatest predictors of success in life is the ability to delay gratification, and that’s what you are describing. You are delaying the gratification of that funded unit by focusing on the leading indicator activity on some level of some statistical basis will result in you getting an abundance in your business in the future, and you are planning for that future. You are not just planning for it. You are manifesting it through your actions.
One of the greatest predictors of success in life is the ability to delay gratification.
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Another thing to think about on that point is thinking about the fact that anyone could have been a great loan officer in 2021 or 2022. If you did any amount of units, pat your back, but it’s going to take a great loan officer to get through the next 3 to 6 months. You got to make hard decisions, and this is setting you up for success in the future so that you learn how to run a better business.
In that statement, there is something that a lot of people are going to need to internalize and learn. I’m seeing a lot of loan officers struggle with this because they have never been taught it before. There are still some that are being coddled into believing that it’s not important, which is running your business like a business. Understanding that whether you see it or not, there’s truly a P&L behind the scenes that are based and rooted in fact.
It’s rooted in the total economics that is available in every loan. What you are putting into inputs and the price exceptions you take on deals should be perceived as a direct representation of your ability to sell, the product at a fair price you have in front of you. These are things that are crucible now. The people that are going to survive are those that have the entrepreneurial will to muscle through it. There will be a handful of people that stumble their way through it and make it to the other side, but I would say that group is going to have a short window still even after.
I’m looking forward to getting through to the other side. Although, I hate going through it now. I keep telling myself that I got to ask myself a better set of questions. Instead of, “Why is this happening? Why is it happening to me?” I’ll ask, “What can I learn? What do I get to improve? What do I have to work on now?” It’s been a season of opportunity here now having you on our show. I appreciate your quotes. Before I let you go and end this episode, I’d love to know how our readers can get ahold of you if they need you. Do you email or cell phone?
The best way to reach me is by email, and I have two that I will share. One is Danny@TribeCoaching.com and Danny.Horanyi@NEOHomeLoans.com.
Before I will let you go, can you share one more nugget? Either a book you read, a quote or a piece of advice that you would leave with our readers that you think we are going to help them in 2023?
You touched on it, and I want to pull out some of the spirit of what you were sharing and emphasize it because it’s important. This was a quote that I heard. It was early enough in my career that it changed the course of my career, and that is, “Be curious, not furious.” Embedded in that is a lot of what you said, “How is what happening right now serving me? In what way can I learn something?”
If I’m in pain, it’s likely that this is global pain. If I can get through my own experience and turn this into observing it almost as a neutral third party, what would somebody that was taking advantage of this market do when everybody’s in pain? I promise you. Somebody is doing that, so why not you? Curious, not furious. Life is happening for you, not to you. Figure out what that is, and pivot your energy towards the opportunities, not towards the pain and suffering you are in now.
Self Worth: Be curious, not furious. Life is happening for you, not to you. So figure out what that is and pivot your energy towards opportunities, not toward pain and suffering.You can call realtors now the biggest of any kind because they are scared, and they will meet with you because they understand that it’s going to be a difficult year. I love that quote. Thank you for ending with, “Be curious, not furious.” It’s something that you could not only use in your business but even taking it home with your kids and wife.
Even more so there, let’s be honest.
It’s like growing up. I use anger to get me through most things, but what I forget is that my anger or frustration keeps people from sharing intimate things that they are probably going to help me. If we can be curious rather than furious or angry in the future, we’ll all be successful. Danny, many thanks to you for being on here. I’d love to have you back in the future. You’ve been a huge asset, not only to me and my life, but to this show and our readers. Thank you, Danny.
It’s my pleasure. Anytime.
Important Links* NEO Home Loans * Tribe Coaching * Danny@TribeCoaching.com * Danny.Horanyi@NEOHomeLoans.com * https://www.LinkedIn.com/in/danny-horanyi-a1286018/
About Danny Horanyi Danny Horanyi is a Co-Creator at NEO Home Loans. He is also a Co-Creator and Coach at Triibe Coaching. Danny has been making an impact in the industry for 19 years with lifetime origination volume over $2,000,000,000. Formerly ranked in the top 5 originators in the nation by volume, Danny’s leadership and expertise have had a profoundly positive impact on the lives of his employees, business partners and colleagues
Whales, or large clients in the real estate business, are often very tricky and challenging to make deals with. At least, that’s usually what people think. But what does it really take to land whales? Does it have to be so tricky and mind-wrecking to get a whale to say yes? In today’s episode, Michael Harrington shares his experience with landing whales and the valuable insights he learned on how to make effective relationships with them and ultimately make them say yes. Michael is a 26-year-old veteran of the industry and was named the Number One Loan Officer in Houston Agent Magazine in 2020. Tune in as Michael informs, inspires, and entertains us with the whole deal on how to hunt whales!
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Watch the episode hereListen to the podcast hereHow To Land A Whale With Michael HarringtonOur guest is a 26-year veteran in our industry, married, and a father of four. He strikes a rare balance between family and managing his mortgage practice. He has a deep knowledge of the industry. Not only is he a coach, but he was also the number one loan officer in Houston Agent Magazine in 2020. He enjoys time with his family traveling, and he is a pilot. He’s also a coach. I attended an Amplifii event where I got to have a deeper understanding of his story. I’d love to hear more about your story. Welcome, Michael.
I’m looking forward to this.
I enjoyed our time together. Thank you for attending Amplifii. Michael, you’ve been in the business a long time, and I feel like I know you a lot better now. I have a lot more respect for you and what you’re doing in the industry. I’d love for the audience to get to know you. If you can give us a little bit of your background, like how you got into the business, that would be helpful.
When I was eighteen, I was living in New Hampshire. I didn’t have a career path, but I knew I didn’t want to go to college. I was working at that time at the United States Postal Service pushing buttons on a keyboard. I was what they call a DCO operator where stuff is flying across the screen and you’re typing in the addresses. It was the most boring job you can imagine. I thought I want to be the fastest at what I do and I kept getting faster and faster at that.
I would go in and they would sit me down and say, “Your accuracy rate is 98.736%. You could be at 99% if you slow down.” I said, “How fast am I?” They’re like, “You’re the fastest keyer here but you could be more accurate.” I was like, “If I’m the fastest keyer and I’m typing twice as fast as the next person, do I get a bonus or an override?” They said to me, “No, you don’t get any bonus. We don’t reward speed.” I realized at that point in time that no matter how hard I worked, I was only going to get a salary. That’s when I realized that I needed to do something that would pay for my efforts.
My mom knew someone down here in Texas that was in real estate, so I came down here. I’m very scared because I was by myself. I was renting a garage apartment behind the real estate office. It was international real estate and commercial. It was very hard. It was dealing with Chinese diplomats overseas. It was late nights doing faxes and so forth.
It’s back in ‘96 when we used fax machines and stuff. Having to work from midnight to 3:00 on a project, because that’s when they were overseas, I got disheartened. My mom knew someone else in Houston but she was in the mortgage business. I got robbed in the apartment and I was like, “I need to get out of this apartment.” She’s like, “You could buy a house.”
I was like, “I just turned nineteen. How am I going to buy a house?” She said, “You can buy a house. We can work this out.” I was making $22,000 a year, and the houses back then were $80,000 to $100,000. It was four times my income. I was like, “How am I going to afford a house?” In three generations, my family has rented our whole lives. We’ve never owned anything. She showed me how to use down payment assistance with the City of Houston and how to refinance my car. More importantly, the topic that we might cover has to do with what the market’s bearing right now, which is seller-paid temporary 2-1 buydowns.
The builder paid for a 2-1 buydown and then bought my rate down from 7.5% to 5.5% the first year. I was able to afford my first home and that’s what opened up my eyes to home ownership and the dream of people that thought they couldn’t own a house. At 19 and 2 months old, I bought my first home with $110.36 at the closing deal.
That’s what to be proud of. I was 32 when I bought my first home. Did you get into the mortgage business at that time?
I did.
Is she an agent?
No. My mom wasn’t an agent. She knew some people in Houston and was doing some over-the-phone consultant work. She was an interesting character, which I know you found out during our session together. It was 1996 and 1997, so it was like a market with the same interest rates. It’s almost the exact same rate than it is now, and they’re freaking out now about rates going up. I’m like, “We were excited because rates had come down 7.5%.” It’s all about perspective, but at least I was able to buy a house with such a low income. In that house, I made $30,000 three years later on the sale of that home at age 22.
People are freaking out today about rates going up. We were excited because rates had come down from 8%, 7.5%. It's all about perspective.
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That’s an opportunity most people right now might miss if they’re not looking at the market. Most people want lower interest rates but we’ve got massive inflation. That means your home prices are going up. It’s a conversation that I have every day. What’s the conversation you’re having with your clients? It seems repetitive every day right now about the market.
Obviously, they don’t want prices to keep going up. They’re concerned about raising the fed rate even further raising interest rates. I’m sure you’ve heard Barry Habib in our business say that he feels it currently padded the bonds and the market is already padded for the November and December increase in rates.
I personally think the top out is probably 8%. I don’t think it’s going to go much higher than that. When I’m talking to clients, I’m talking about the temporary aspect of the interest rates. I do think rates will come down. We can’t obviously promise that, but based on statistical data that is being provided to us by people like MBS Highway with Barry Habib’s Company, I do think rates are going to come down at the beginning of 2023. Do you use Optimal Blue as well?
No. We have our own pricing engine but similar.
A lot of pricing engines have the ability to save that price and the client. What we’re doing right now is we’re taking every single client we close, and we’ll put a rate watch on their alerts for 1 point or 1.5 below, or whatever we’re closing the math. When six months roll around, both me and the client are getting the same exact email saying, “It’s time.”
I learned that technique from a guy named David Jaffe. He’s worked for On Q Financial and Guaranteed Rate. He’s a $360 million producer in 2021. He is a Refinanced King in California. Most of his clients have always been adjustable-rate mortgages. Of course, we’re seeing a lot more ARMs. I think you saw the news where both HousingWire and Scotsman Guide were talking about the fact that an 18% increase in the adjustable-rate mortgage business. I’m seeing a lot more of that. People are going to ARMs in Texas.
I feel like it’s 99% fixed rates. People are not comfortable with a discussion yet. I would say getting them comfortable and doing a discussion with them about adjustable-rate mortgages and educating them that this is not a neg am ARM back in the ‘08 timeframe. This is a temporary interest rate until The rate comes back down. If they don’t, you can still refinance to a fixed rate down the road as well. I’m pushing people towards ARMs.
What I’m hearing you say is to use education as a way to help your client understand what’s happening in the market and getting them familiar with using an ARM. There are two schools of thought in this current market in my opinion. You can either use a buydown to help a client get a lower interest rate or if interest rates are going down, take a higher rate with no points as high as you can and then refinance it next year. Do you subscribe to either of those two philosophies? What advice would you give to a loan officer or a client who’s buying a home right now?
Landing Whale Clients: There are two schools of thought in this current kind of market: you can either use a buy down to help a client get a lower interest rate or take a higher rate with no points as high as you can and then refinance it next year.I would keep it super simple. If the seller is willing to give money, do this temporary 2-1 buydown if the seller is not willing to give money, do an adjustable-rate mortgage. Most lenders now are offering FHA, VA, and conventional on all three products. Have you seen jumbo do temporary 2-1 buydowns? Personally, I don’t think we have any yet on the ability to do jumbo but we’re in the process of asking. In regards to the adjustable-rates, I would offer that for all our jumbo and then of course, any conforming loans if the seller is not willing to work over the money.
Let’s say you’re selling a home that’s $500,000. Somebody is putting 20% down and you get a $25,000 discount on the price. Would you advise them to take 3 to 5 points and lower the interest rate rather than doing the seller buydown?
No. The rates are going to come back down. Which one would you want to sit in first? Let’s remember that if you’re in the buydown for eight months, which is the temporary 2-1 buydown, you can get a chunk of it back if, for some reason, it’s not utilized and you refinance the note. They don’t use the money in the buydown because the buydown is money that’s held escrow. if they don’t use the money, it comes back to you as a consumer, even if the seller’s loan has paid it.
I’ve never experienced a 2-1 buydown so I don’t know a lot of information about that. Could you touch on the 2-1 buydown and your understanding of how that works?
Absolutely. I’m not sure what kind of calculators most people are using. I prescribe and highly recommend having one of these puppies. I’m not sure if you’ve got one yourself.
What is it?
It’s called a Qualifier Plus III. This calculator, you can get it at the real estate store. It’s a real estate agents calculator. It’s even on the phone. It’s probably the number one app I use during the day if I was going to be honest with you. I’ll show you what it looks like on the phone here real quick. It’s a $20 app on the phone. You see the tax insurance then you see the payment term interest rate. What I do is I calculate, let’s say, 7.5% so I would put the 7.5 in for the interest rate for a 30-year term.
The price is $500,000 and they’re putting 5% down. It’s calculating everything and I can hit payment now, and there’s the payment right there. I can save it. I sort that payment in as number one and that’s 7.5%. If it’s a 2-1 buydown, then the first year is going to be 5.5%. It’s a 2% bracket difference. If I would put 5.5 payment, I’m going to store that under number two. I’m going to subtract to recall one and that’s the difference per month for the first year.
That’s a $624 difference in the first year.
What’s $25,000 on the price difference?
It’s not much.
If the seller is paying this and you multiply that by twelve, that’s the first year cost. You would do the same thing for the 6.5% and then add that to this. There’s your total and you divide that by the loan amount. It’s usually an average of 2.25% to 2.4% of the sales price on a lower down payment.
Does the client have to pay anything upfront on the 2-1 buydown? How does that work? Do they get a little bit higher interest rate?
Think of it this way. It’s a locked product like a normal locked product. All you’re doing is you’re having your closing department keep the money aside, which most companies are now offering the 2-1 buydown. Our company currently is offering the 1-1-1 and 3-2-1. 3-2-1s are very expensive because it’s 3% different.
If you think about it, that’s going to be almost $20,000 by itself. If you can get a seller to pay $25,000 or $30,000, that’s awesome. You have to check with your compliance department. Some compliance departments might think of this differently. With the temporary 2-1 buydown, it is not included in the 3% cap because the seller is paying for it.
What about jumbo? Did they have the 2-1 buydown on jumbo? Do you know any jumbo lenders out there that are doing it?
I don’t. Our company is currently asking because there’s so much interest in this now even at the higher loan amounts. As of right now, I haven’t heard of any jumbo offering either a temporary 2-1 buydown on any of the fixed products or the ARMs.
What are some strategies you’re using with your database right now as the market starts to slow down? We’ve got extra time with your database that you think will help if interest rates do come down. You already mentioned earlier about doing a rate watch in Optimal Blue. What other strategies do you think are going to help loan officers in this market that will set them up for success?
The first thing is you’ve got to decide on how many touchpoints you’re going to have and what type of touchpoints. I’m talking as if you’re designing a war room image like, “Am I going to flank them from the side? Am I going to flank them from the front?” How are we doing this in regards to attacking? I hate to say it but attacking the drawbridge that it comes down, which is their ability to see what you’re sending them. You have to design something via text, phone calls, email, and mailing. All four.
Let’s start with the most snail part, which is the mail. We don’t mail automated stuff. I have my marketing gal. She handwrites the envelopes because it’s been proven that 68% of what’s handwritten gets opened. It’s proven that if you have it typed on there, the chances of them tearing that sucker up is pretty high.
Handwritten always gets opened up. It’s rare that it doesn’t. That’s why when you do it for sale by owner or something like that, you get a lot of handwritten mail from agents. It’s because they know it’s going to get opened up. Handwritten envelopes if you can. I’ve got a huge database so we can’t mail our database every single month.
Handwritten always gets opened up. That's why when you do a “for sale by owner” or something like that, you get a lot of handwritten mail from agents. It's because they know it's going to get opened up.
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What we do is partition it with the alphabet so 1st quarter, 2nd quarter, 3rd quarter, and 4th quarter. That way, every year, every single person is getting at least one envelope from me that’s handwritten because I’ve got 2,200 people in my client database that we’ve kept in the database. We do it that way. It was put up into 400 to 500 envelopes per quarter.
What are you writing in that card?
We do a combination of Brian Buffini’s mailing that he’s got. If realtors are familiar with Brian Buffini’s systems, lenders might be as well. They have both a lender letter and they also have a realtor letter. That way, you’re not saying the same thing as your real estate agents if they’re in Brian Buffini’s system. It’s slick with a cover letter that’s usually pertinent to nowadays information. The last one that went out had to do with something to do with pets. I did a combination of that plus a little thing about the best healthy-eating pet stores around town type.
That way, it’s localized. The month before that, it was how to spring clean your house or something like that. It depends on the time of year. Christmas is approaching but I don’t send out recipe cards. I don’t like recipe cards personally. My wife does her own recipes online. Whatever you think is going to get their attention. I know with the core, we used to do Letter of the Heart. Of course, a combination Letter from the Heart, which is something more personalized about you and your family and there’s also more information about your industry.
What I hear you saying is to give something of value that you think your clients would get something out of. For those reading, if you’ve never heard of a Letter from the Heart, it’s every quarter or every month writing something about your life, a story about what’s going on, and maybe a lesson that you’ve learned. I’m surprised when I get those Letter from the Heart how often I read that but yet I’m still not doing it. You’ve inspired me to start doing a Letter of the Heart. Thank you. For mail, we got that. How about email, phone, or text?
Let’s go to the phone and text. We also want to hit them with a phone call once a quarter. What I’ve been doing is 5 to 10 phone calls per day to the past client database. It’s a rolling thing on my phone where I have all my contacts. I’ll pick a letter, start somewhere, and then start making calls from the card.
My conversation is so simple right now. You don’t even have to write this down. It’s easy. It’s like, “With everything going on with the economy and craziness out there with inflation, I want to see how you and your family are doing. How are things going?” I keep it that simple. Let them open up. Let them say, “Oh my gosh.”
I talked to a guy, Mark Graff. He’s one of my past clients. His father passed away. He wants to talk about financial advising so he’s going to be a referral that I can then give to my financial advisor. Also, a will and testament attorney. By giving them referrals, you know what that means. They refer back to me.
I’ve got three new financial planners I’ve put on my sheet because financial planners are so busy right now with conversations with people. It’s the perfect time to connect with those financial planners. That shows my old school right there. For me, it’s about making sure you’re also connecting with them as a person rather than it being about business. You’re like, “How’s your mortgage doing?” Some people will call and say, “How’s the house doing?”
The house is standing. Don’t ask them about the house and renovations because then, it starts to sound like you’re looking for a deal. What you want to do is connect with them. Let them do the talking. They might say their kid is going off to college at UT and then the conversation might turn into, “The rents are going so high.”
Landing Whale Clients: Don’t ask them about the house or renovations because it will start to sound like you’re looking for a deal. What you want to do is connect with them. Let them do the talking.You might say, “I have a client that recently purchased a condo in Downtown Austin and his kid rented it to the other three kids in the condo. They’re now cashflowing on this property. Have you looked at that?” It stems from a real estate question. All you’re doing is giving them an example but you’re trying to help them from a wealth-building standpoint. They’re going to be more accepting of it because they’re the ones that brought up the topic. You’re the one that intercede and said, “This might be a solution for you.”
What I hear you saying is call and touch them, ask them a simple question, and see where it goes from there. I love that idea. I remember when I was young in my career, I used to get nervous to call my clients. Now, the calls that we’ve been making is calling the clients and saying, “I don’t know if you’ve noticed how much your home has gone up in value.” The reason I’m reaching out is some people want to know what’s going on in the market. No surprise rates are going up and I’m referring out a lot of lines of credit. Thanks for sharing that. Any other advice on previous clients on what you could do?
If you don’t have an email campaign through your company or the marketing, find one. There are so many campaigns out there with great material. Here’s the thing. It doesn’t matter what’s in the email. It matters that your name pops up. Something went out about our veteran campaign because it’s Veterans Month. It went out to 1,500 people. I got six responses that had nothing to do with the email. I then ended up with one veteran calling me and saying, “I’m going to rent out my current place.”
I knew exactly who it was because I’ve done client appreciation parties and he’s shown up. He’s one of the biggest, baddest, looking veterans I’ve ever seen. He’s a big teddy bear. He’s got the coolest German Shepherd dog that’s so well trained. My daughter got to pet her. I was asking him about the dog and himself. I wouldn’t have done or known that much information about him or thought I know exactly who this is unless he had come to a client appreciation party. I do it every quarter.
The last thing I was going to mention is if you can do it once a year, have a nice big $6,000 to $10,000 party. I know it’s expensive, but the rewards are significant, and here’s why. You have a client appreciation party and you’re trying to figure out who your A clients are. Guess what happens? You find out immediately because they show up at your event. You write them down. Those are going to be your best referral sources out of your client base.
Most of my referrals come from realtors. That’s sad because if you were giving referrals back to your realtors’ solid referrals from your past clients, it builds a better relationship with the realtors that gave you the business in the first place. It’s half the time that client doesn’t remember the realtor, but they remember you because you’re doing all these touchpoints. Second, if it’s a realtor that you never even worked with, now you’ve got the ability to give that business out to somebody. I gave $7.2 million in business in 2021 to my realtor base. I would not have been able to do that if 38% of my business wasn’t coming from my past clients.
That idea of doing a client appreciation party has helped me. One of the strategies that I use is I limit it to 100 people. We did a Top Gun event. It’s a Top Gun movie and we had 100 seats available. It was gone literally in three days. It cost me $1,500, I dressed up in a fighter suit saying the song. It was great.
I was super nervous before I did it but it went off well. What I want you to take from this is doing a client appreciation party, once you have your clients coming, you can call the realtors that referred them to you and ask them to attend. That’s the leverage you have there. Thanks for that. For ideas on client appreciation parties. what do you do?
We’ve got three coming up with our agents. We co-op with our real estate agents, which I’m going to tell you about. You want to talk about a way of making sure you’ve weaved your web of business into your real estate agents is when you are actually doing client appreciation parties and combining it with them.
Now, they’re truly your partner. They’re not going to go off and find another lender tomorrow because now all their businesses weaved in with you. When you offer the support and ability to help them plan a client appreciation, maybe it’s their first one. This is the first one I usually do with people. That’s why we have three on November 12, 2022. It’s going to be fall photos. What we do is we tell the realtor, “Where’s the nearest part to your house or nearest part to where you normally work that you would take your kids? You basically get a photographer and you co-op the photographer.
That’s about $250 per person, you and the realtor. $150 for Chick-fil-A. because Chick-fil-A will stay for three hours because it’s nuggets. It’s real easy finger food. People can use napkins. That way, they don’t get on their nice fancy clothes. You do fall photos or spring photos for them. This is great for realtors that don’t worried about the clients and whether they’re going to like each other. They don’t have to like each other. They show up for their appointed timeframe. It’s a fifteen-minute increment to do the photos with the photographer. You’re giving them family photos, but here’s the most important thing.
You and the realtor are taking photos with the families as they’re standing there in their most perfect clothes with their kids. You’re holding a baby up. I’ve had pictures of realtor holding babies that were not their babies and then they put that on social media. It goes so viral because the baby looks awesome and the kids look great.
You got the photographer taking both photos of you mingling with the parents before the photo shoot. You also have them doing the photos themselves and then they give the photos to the families. It doesn’t cost the family anything. It’s a nice thank-you gift at the end of the year. It’s better than a pie day because it’s a lot less expensive. You don’t have to worry about ten extra pies. Everyone is doing pie day. I told everyone, “There are so many pies.” I had one person coming and they’re like, “This is my fifth pie.” I’m like, “This is no longer special anymore. Everybody is giving pies.” It’s like Oprah Winfrey, “You get a pie.”
I love that fall photos. I’m going to steal that. Any other ideas on some movie night and fall photos?
I’ve done the movie night. The one we did was instead of Cinco de Mayo, we did Casino de Mayo. I invited all my top agents and clients. I used this office space WeWork-type location. They let us use the common area and we had seven tables. It was PokerStars.net, which is Bill Howard’s company. He’s got a huge poker/casino company here in Houston. It was very inexpensive.
It won’t bust the bank. With what you said about $1,500, you can get 4 or 5 tables for $1,500. We did seven tables so we were a little bigger at the party, but I’ll be honest with you. Four tables would’ve been fine. I don’t think we needed the extra blackjack tables. It’s better if you have more people at one table. Looking back, I would limit it to maybe four.
That way, it’s got a little bit more exclusivity of people sitting. People were up. We had a cocktail at night type thing. They even have a cocktail company. You have the liquor and stuff, and they bring the bartenders as well and the card dealer. For about $1,500, you can have a nice party. Even if it’s your family and a few realtors at your house or something, they’ll move the furniture and they’ll bring the tables in.
You do none of it. You let them do their thing. You provide the food and you’re good to go. That party did require a little bit of planning because I’ve got a marking person. t. Honestly, other than getting the food here, which we had delivered. We did Lupe Tortillas. It’s nice Mexican food and of course, it was casino. We had some giveaways. It was nice tequila bottles. We did a little raffle for that. We had about 100 people show up and that was on a night. There was a major storm. We had the windows leaking in this place that night because it was way windy but people dressed up in full cocktail gear. It was awesome.
Thanks for that. You have 26 years, I know you got a few wells that you do business with. For the readers that want some ideas on what they could do to follow your footsteps and grab some of those wells, what advice do you have for some of our listeners?
The first key is the target. What’s your target audience? It’s what Rene talked about in our three-day training. He’s like, “You got to figure out who your audience is first and how are you going to communicate with the audience?” To the audience is usually top agents. When people say top agents, they can go through a list. You might not know if that agent is an agent that works for a builder. Maybe they do a lot of relocation or they’re a listing agent. They’ve got a lot of buyers agents. The key first to getting a whale account, which means to get an entire team like a top listing agent. If he or she has got 4 or 5 buyers agents, you have to go after the buyer’s agent first.
The first key in selling is the target. What's your target audience? You have to figure out who your audience is.
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The way to do that is if you have listings that are being done. Let’s say you get a buyer and they’re with the Loken Group and you’re wanting to work with Loken Group. It’s just an example. When you’re at the title company, that title company belongs to the Loken Group. How you treat the title agents and intermingle with those people at the top company is going to make a difference. There’s also an office coordinator.
I would send flowers or something to the actual transaction coordinator on that team and say, “This transaction was so amazing. I wish every one of my agents had a transaction coordinator like you.” I’ve developed relationships with the top transaction coordinators here in Houston. I could tell you one gal works for six different top whales and she’s one of the top transaction coordinators in all of Houston.
She’s very well known. I take her out to dinner, her and her husband. She pokes into the ears of those top listing agents and says, “I wish we could do more deals with the Harrington team because they got it together.” If she says that enough times then I’m the one making the phone call and I might say something like, “Chad, I know you’ve seen our deals come across your desk in the last six months. I’m a top producer. You’re a top producer.” I do that core thing that like-minded individuals need to work together. Sometimes it is timing. I’ll be honest with you. I got 2 whale accounts in the last 2 two months, and I’ve been after 1 of them for 3 years. This is also one thing I need to tell you.
It takes time. This is not something that happens overnight. If you think you’re going to have a lunch meeting or breakfast meeting with a whale and suddenly they’re going to hand you their business on a platter, that’s not going to happen. When you’re talking to a whale, don’t have a PowerPoint presentation that you’ve given to fifteen other agents.
They’re going to see through that real quick. You need to get specifics with them as to what they’re wanting me to partner with them on. It’s going to be something big like client appreciation parties or a program. For database management, how are you going to help them generate more business from their database?
I help them do stuff like that. I ask them questions first like, “What do you want from a partner other than money?” Obviously, they want to keep up with you on money. If it’s money, I’m out because that’s not a partner. You’re grabbing the money from their wallet to help pay for your stuff. I’m not going to get anything from your agents because you’re not introducing me as your preferred lender. If they keep using the word vendor, you’re out, period.
What I heard you say is go after the buyer’s agents, title companies, and the lower-level people that are working for that whale so that they put a good word in their ear. If you’re having a conversation, could you talk about what the framework looks like? what conversation would have the most impact on these whales?
I’ll give you an example. I got a text message from a whale that I’ve worked with in the past. I haven’t worked with them for years because we weren’t working together. I did a couple of strong things for them and then they went elsewhere. I still wanted the account. He texted me and said, “Would you mind doing a review for me?” I guess they’re trying to build their reviews. I said, “Sure. I would love to.” He said, “I’ll do a review for you.” I was like, “Can you mention that one time I did this for your dad in the transaction?”
He said, “Absolutely.” He sent me that little snippet of him doing a review. I send the review I had done for him. That was a couple of years ago but I went ahead and revised and edited it now. I mentioned to him, “Are you still having issues with your database management within your last 30 years of doing business?”
He’s like, “We never did get on that.” I was like, “I offered to come and show your team how to maximize the CRM and the one that you’re using currently, but also how to set up appreciation parties. I’ve got a marketing gal. She’s got a degree in event planning. I’ll bring her along for the ride. She’ll take notes and then she’ll help you guys to implement and get it done.”
We’ve got a Zoom call at 9:00 with me and him, his marketing team, and my marketing teal. It all stemmed from a text message that he sent me. I’ve been trickling on him for quite some time through both Facebook and Instagram. I said, “Congratulations.” Just so guys know, one of the top teams for eXp in the whole nation is this SS team. As I said, I’ve worked with them in the past. They’ve had a couple of turnovers but this is the guy that runs the whole team. He’s known me for twenty-something years. I hate to say it, but it’s putting the bugs in the ears.
I then segue. I didn’t go, “I’ll do a review for you.” End of the conversation. I thought this is my end and I used it. He saw right through it. I’m direct. I’m not pussy footing around. Don’t beat around the bush with top producers. They don’t like that. If you pussy foot around, they’re going to think that’s how you are with their clients. They want to know that you’re solid in the way that you deliver because that’s how they got to where they’re at.
What I heard you say is when you see the opportunity, jump on it and be direct with those agents. This actually popped into my head while we were speaking. What do you think about this? When you get done every month, is the listing agents doing a review on the listing agent for what a great transaction it was and then following that up with a phone call?
When you see the opportunity, jump on it and be direct.
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I’m guilty because we were calling all the listing agents for the last three years. We would call them and say, “I did a transaction with you last year and because rates have gone up, I’ve got so much time on my hand. I thought I would reach out to you to see whether or not we could be a good fit working.”
That conversation turned from, “Really?” They would either ask me the address and I would give it to them. The other thing that I would say is I would go directly at them and I’d say, “We’re going into a difficult time. What I believe is I’m looking for someone that number one I like and who is serious about your business. I only want you to accept this meeting.” If you’re serious about your business, you’re a little scared but you want to work with someone that thinks they can get through these next six months. It did work on a few people, but that’s just an idea.
Another idea is to do a panel. If you can pull it together, it’s a little more difficult to do that. If you’ve got a few whales as I do, you can pull together maybe some mini whales. If you do a panel of either a builder panel talking to whales or you got a whale panel talking to their agents, it gives them a little bit of honor. We talked about it in the core of how to honor agents. Quite frankly, people that are big have ego, and therefore, if you stroke the ego, it works. Instead of saying, “I heard you’re a great big agent,” that’s not enough.
You can say, “You’re a great agent. I’ve heard so much about you. I’d like to put you on a panel in front of your peers to talk about X.” Right now, we’re planning two peer panels, both builder and realtor based for the next couple of months. I’m trying to somehow figure out how to do it with the holidays but it’s critical now that people listen to the whales as to how they’re staying in business and doing it with the current marketplace the way it is.
They want hope. Listening to a few top producers is a way of getting hope, especially if they can attend it for free. I’ve done it at my church because it’s a pretty nice facility right here in Katy. I’ve done it at a public library and Lone Star College. It doesn’t have to cost you money. You can hold an event at a title company because a lot of them have training rooms like Stewart Title Elko, Chicago, and Allegiance. They all have big training rooms so they can invite their database. I’ve done a couple of things with Bar Louie here in Katy with top real estate agents. For the last one I did, I had nine people vendors that contributed towards it. Guess how much I had to pay? Zero.
Landing Whale Clients: People want hope. Listening to top producers is a way of getting hope, especially if they can attend it for free.We all like to have a little free sprinkle on top of our events, don’t we? How many whales would take that phone call when you say, “I know you’re busy but I wanted to see whether or not you’re interested in being one of our top agent panels.” As soon as you drop one anchor name like Heidi Dugan, they’re going to be like, “Yeah.” You’ve given us a lot of great information from the 2-1 buydown to what to do with our previous clients.
I’ve got a whole page of notes that I’m going to implement. The first thing is giving the review to the listing agent that you’re talking about. Before I let you go, I’d love for you to share with our audience either something that you learned from Amplifii that you think they can take with them like a quote or a book. Something that our audience will appreciate hearing.
I was talking to my number one mentor. He’s the one that brought this up. It’s called Becoming a King. It’s for men and it’s got aspects of Christianity, but it is also a big aspect of being the male figure in your household. When he told me about the book, he was like, “Michael, I only recommend two books. It’s the Bible and this one.” I was like, “I’m listening.” I would recommend that book based on the recommendation that he gave me.
I’ve read Relentless, which is the guy who was the personal coach of Kobe Bryant and Michael Jordan. Relentless taught me during a time like this how to be relentless and not sit on my laurels. That’s another book I’d recommend. Going back to Amplifii. We learned the acronym of LOVE. I’ve listened to every one of my own conversations since that happened. I’m so tempted to do that thing where he said, “Don’t try and interject and relate by telling your story.” What that does is it one ups the conversation.
It’s like I did earlier in this show. As soon as I did that, I was like, “Did I say that?” In my mind, I’m thinking this is a great idea, but I wound up you.
I almost went up on yours too so I held back. I was like, “Your party. Wait until you hear about my party.”
It’s because we know each other. I know you’re not offended. I know you’re giving more to our audience. I’ll let you explain it because it’s such a powerful way to have an impactful conversation, not only with an agent but also with your spouse. This is a great takeaway, so thank you. Go ahead and explain it. First is listen.
You’re listening to them tell you something. You make the observation of something that maybe you could pull out of that statement they gave you. Maybe they told you that they worked for a marketing firm then you validate, “You work for a marketing firm. That’s amazing. I’m always impressed with people that can think outside the box and do marketing. What do you do for the marketing firm?”
Listen to your clients as they tell you something. Make an observation, validate them, and then expand.
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That would be the Expand part and then they say, “I’m actually a project manager.” In the back of your mind, you’re thinking project manager. This is what your mortgage mind says, “This person needs both visual and audio and how they’re going to work. I’m going to have to put numbers in front of them. They’re going to want to analyze it because they’re a project manager, but they’re also going to want to take ownership of it.” You’re thinking that. That’s your analytical part but the caring part should be, “What are the last projects that you did?” That would be the fun part.
When they start talking about that project, then they’re going to be letting go of some stuff. I was talking to a guy named Ali. He was very analytical. He’s the analytical guy for Overstock.com. That’s literally his position. I got to see right on my sheet who I’m talking to. I tried to do the LOVE thing. This is where sometimes it can go wrong because I was expanding on his family situation like, “Your wife. How long have you guys been married?” He stopped me because he’s so analytical. He’s like, “I want to ask you a few questions about the mortgage.” He stopped my dig. I was trying to dig in and get to know him better. Look what’s going to happen.
That’s the Observe. You got to observe. If you’re on Zoom, you can look at someone and know what you have. I got on a phone call and it was a husband and wife. I hadn’t talked to the wife yet, but I talked to the husband. This is a decent sized loan and the wife got on and I called her by a wrong name. First of all, I didn’t read the Zoom. I didn’t have any of her information.
Instantly, she corrected me and then she’s chastising the husband. I’m like, “This is so weird.” He is observing. The reason I tell you that is because when you’re on the phone with someone, you can figure out, “Do I need to continue to ask them questions about their personality or do they want to talk about the numbers?”
Needless to say, I went in the wrong direction. The irony is he went ahead and set up a 45-minute discussion because I gave him little things but not too much information. It’s just enough for him to know that I’m the better out. I planted seeds because he was shopping me against Better.com. There are so many things wrong with Better.com right now in regards to their company.
I planted seeds without saying, “You’re going to hate that company.” I had to figure out a way to throw that in there. I said things like, “You might want to check out my reviews online because I’ve got 107 5-star reviews on Google. I’m the most highly reviewed individual loan officer in all of West Houston.” That’s 7 million people and 100,000 loan officers out there. I said, “Go check out reviews for the entire company of Better.com on Google. You’re going to find out that my little team has almost 1/3 the amount of reviews of an entire company like Better.com. I want you to look at the differences. Read through them.”
I could talk to him until I’m blue in the face and it’s not about numbers. I was like, “It’s about you closing on time. You’re getting a house.” I was trying to relate it to his job and he wasn’t biting for that. I was trying to use some of Rene’s stuff and I was working at one point. Again, it’s practice. Practice makes perfect.
Before I let you go, you said earlier that you’ve got more reviews than anybody in West Houston. I’m curious, how do you get those reviews? What do you do besides ask for them?
What I first do is observe whether or not they’ve got Gmail. If they have Gmail, they’re much more likely to do a Google review because they can easily go into their computer or iPad. If they log in, then they hit and go to Michael Harrington Cross Country Mortgage and search my name, it says Post Review right there.
I’ll send that link to them, but I’ll do it right at closing and say, “While you’re doing paperwork and getting funded right now, would you mind doing a quick review from me on Google because the company review is great? You’ve got a great transaction and you sent us some amazing emails. If it’s not on Google, I can’t show other people. I want to show people what you’ve said about my team.” I always make it not about me but about my team. That way, it doesn’t sound so big that you talk about me. Honestly, they usually talk about the entire team. That’s what the review is about. It’s not Michael. It’s Shelly, Fernando, the whole team, and the team effort. They always reference the team. That way, it makes people realize that I’m not some lone Wolf out there.
This has been outstanding. I enjoyed this episode. Thank you for opening up your book of ideas and sharing them with the audience. I’m already looking forward to our next episode and sharing a glass of wine with you soon. Thanks for being on, Michael.
Talk to you soon.
Important Links* Amplifii * Michael Harrington * MBS Highway * Optimal Blue * On Q Financial * Guaranteed Rate * Becoming a King * Relentless * Overstock.com * Better.com * https://www.LinkedIn.com/in/MichaelHarringtonCC/
About Michael HarringtonWhen you come to Michael for your mortgage, he begins by truly listening. He wants to understand your goals and priorities so he can offer a home loan that is right for you, your family, and your future wealth strategies for investment.
As a 26-year veteran of his industry and married father of four, Michael strikes a rare balance: raw knowledge of residential mortgage products as well as deep dedication to his family and community. He was voted by real estate agents as the No. 1 loan officer according to Houston Agent magazine in 2020. In his time off, you’ll find him with his family, traveling, and flying airplanes.
Michael prides himself on having a great team that includes multiple processing and administrative professionals, including a Spanish-speaking loan processor. This team allows him to focus on providing the highest service levels to his clients while also helping him serve even more families in the area.
With clients ranging from Realtors and builders to repeat clients, Harrington stays busy. Whether you are a first-time homebuyer or an avid investor, Michael offers a wide range of loan programs.
Need ideas on how to boost your real estate business? Social media is the answer. Today’s guest has only been in the industry for three years but the success they’ve amassed is proof that it works. John Schuchman is a Podcast Host and Coach at The Real Estate Survival Guide. After leaving a series … How To Use Social Media To Boost Your Real Estate Business With John Schuchman Read More »
In this generation, social media is where you find everyone immersing themselves. It has allowed everyone to widen their community socializing on different outlets like Instagram, Facebook, and even TikTok. In this episode, Justin Brown of Nuhome Team shows how he utilizes social media to his advantage with direct-to-consumer marketing, impacting his path to wealth building. He shares … Utilizing Direct-To-Consumer Marketing On Social Media With Justin Brown Read More »
Are you a loan officer struggling to get deals, missing phone calls, and just feeling lost in your day-to-day life? Then it’s time to get back to the basics with a color-coded calendar to help maximize your day. Make those calls to get those appointments with realtors. Follow up to get leads. Go to … Back To Basics: How To Maximize Your Day To Find Leads With Randall Mills Read More »
Most businesses today rely on word-of-mouth referrals to some extent. But what if you could tap into a referral network and get an influx of high-quality referrals regularly? In this episode, Larry Montani, Branch Manager at CrossCountry Mortgage, discusses why referrals are a smart way to fast-track business growth. He also explores the referral … Referral Partners – A Business Growth Strategy That Works With Larry Montani Read More »
Money and mortgages are different now than it was in the past. Are you concerned about the market moving forward? Equip yourself with the knowledge to maintain a growth mindset despite the challenges. Join your host Heath Barnes as he sits down for a conversation with Tammy Wittren about the rise in interest rates, … Ep021: The Rise In Interest Rates And Developing A Growth Mindset With Tammy Wittren Read More »
Do you want to provide your clients with a stress-free mortgage process? How can you achieve client satisfaction most effectively? Join your host Heath Barnes as he dives into a deep conversation with Roger Kube on making each moment count with your client. Roger is an accomplished 20-year mortgage advisor with a successful track … Ep020: Building Rapport, Exceeding Expectations, And Client Satisfaction With Roger Kube Read More »
People, especially entrepreneurs need to balance their goal lines with their soul lines. Soul lines mean personal growth, as opposed to goal lines, which mean the material side of things. Don’t spend too much focus on creating and maintaining a business. If you have a family, be present with them. Presence is the portal … Ep023: Goal Lines Versus Soul Lines: How To Be The Best Version Of Yourself At Work And In Life With Todd Musselman Read More »
In order to grow and evolve, chasing opportunities should always be on your career to-do list. You only need to keep their eyes peeled for any chance of leveling up. Joining Heath Barnes is Barry Habib, Founder and CEO of MBS Highway. Together, they discuss how the opportunities you grab must give meaning to … Ep019: The Massive Returns Of Chasing Opportunities With Barry Habib Read More »
Money and mortgages are different now than it was in the past. Are you concerned about the market moving forward? Equip yourself with the knowledge to maintain a growth mindset despite the challenges. Join your host Heath Barnes as he sits down for a conversation with Tammy Wittren about the rise in interest rates, facts about inflation, and mortgage-backed securities. Tammy is a licensed loan originator working to secure the best loan product with the lowest fees and most competitive rate. In this episode, she explains market changes brought by the pandemic and discusses where you should invest your money. The whole world shut down because of COVID, which significantly affects the economy. She emphasizes the importance of developing a growth mindset to achieve great things in your professional journey.
Do you want to provide your clients with a stress-free mortgage process? How can you achieve client satisfaction most effectively? Then join your host Heath Barnes as he dives into a deep conversation with Roger Kube on making each moment count with your client. Roger is an accomplished 20-year mortgage advisor with a successful track record of providing exceptional service to his clients and business associates. In this episode, he shares his journey to making six figures a month and the challenging experiences that shaped him today. He explains his expertise in creating that ‘wow experience’ that will help you better understand your clients and build rapport with them. He also emphasizes the importance of shifting your focus to the client's best interests.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I’m speaking with Brendan Donelson from Atlantic Union Bank located in Nashville. He has been helping clients realize their dream of homeownership since 1994. His self-developed “Smart Start” system specifically aids first-time homebuyers and move-up buyers. Understanding that purchasing a home is about more than the interest rate, Brendan advises and counsels clients on five key areas in order to find the right home loan solution for them.
In this episode, see how Brendan adapts to a changing industry and demographic and the tactics he uses to stay relevant to clients and referral partners.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm speaking with Matt Westervelt from NFM Lending located in Houston.
After having struggles in his own personal life in the past with finances, this became the driving factor for him to help others to be financially successful for those not only in this business but for everyone he works with.
In this episode, see the different methods Matt uses to add value to others not only the clients but realtor partners and putting them first it allows for success in this shifting environment.
LINKSShow Notes
About Cardinal Financial
About NFM Lending
GUEST
Matthew WesterveltAbout Matthew
Special Guest: Matthew Westervelt.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm speaking with Kevin Knebl an International Speaker, Author, Trainer and Executive Coach whose clients include individuals and small, medium and Fortune 500 companies.
Kevin’s background includes being the top salesperson for four different companies in four different industries including being the top salesperson in the world for an international consulting company with over 300 salespeople in 15 countries. He has trained hundreds of organizations and tens of thousands of professionals on the most profitable uses of LinkedIn, Social Selling, and Relationship Marketing since 2004.
In this episode, see how to create sincere know, like and trust with individuals and within one's self through challenging thoughts.
LINKSShow Notes
About Cardinal Financial
About Kevin Knebl
GUEST
Kevin KneblAbout Kevin
Special Guest: Kevin Knebl.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm speaking with Jane Floyd from NFM Lending located in Tampa Florida.
When the market crashed in 2008, after 22 years in the business and almost losing everything, Jane was able to rebuild and prioritize what actually needed her focus.
In this episode, see how staying disciplined and utilizing a couple of different tools can change your mindset on how you view "problems", which can actually be gifts we welcome.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm speaking with Brendan O'Driscoll and Brittany Hincka, his team lead.
By incorporating a playbook and CRM (customer relationship management system) to their team, not only has it brought structure and organization, but it has saved their team time and helped to increase the conversion of their leads.
In this episode, see how having a CRM that allows you to track your metrics and clients can change your business for the better! And remember, "habits are the compound interest of self improvements" James Clear.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm talking with Scott Evans, the number 1 producing loan officer at Cross Country's 'Core Training' program and number 1 VA Lender in the country.
Scott gives us some insight on not only how he got into the industry to be one of the top producing Loan Officers in the country but how he is constantly changing his strategy to keep that top spot.
One of the techniques he dives into is his home seminar program and how marketing and social media gets him in front of the right people.
There's a lot of great information in this show.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with Loan Officer and Branch Manager at Preferred Rate, Chris Haynes.
Before joining Preferred, Chris had spent 16 years with the same organization, and in need of a change, he decided to make a transition to a different mortgage company. We had a great conversation about that process and his steps to vet other companies and questions one should consider before making a move.
With his many years of industry experience, Chris also shares that many coaches such as Tony Robbins and the Core have helped influence his life and helped him set and achieve his personal goals .
Before joining Preferred, Chris had spent 16 years with the same organization, and in need of a change, he decided to make a transition to a different mortgage company. We had a great conversation about that process and his steps to vet other companies before making a move.
He has a lot of experience, and as well as talking about his approach to moving, we started off talking about Chris's experience with Tony Robbins.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with sales and leadership expert René Rodriguez.
For the last 25 years, René has researched and applied behavioral neuroscience as a dynamic keynote speaker, leadership advisor, world-class sales expert, and renowned speaker coach.
This is a great conversation, full of actionable ideas on how to make connections with people, frame your conversations, and amplify your influence.
René also generously gave us a discount code for the upcoming AmpCon in Las Vegas (details in the show links).
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with Brendan O'Driscoll, Co-Founder & Loan Officer at Treadstone Mortgage, the leading premier local mortgage company in West Michigan.
Brendan started as an engineer from college and moved into the mortgage business 24 years ago, co-founding Treadstone in 2003.
He's gone on to build a fantastic team, and I can't wait for you to hear how empowering and developing the group has led to their incredible growth.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with Phil Bonello, partner with Plaintext Capital, a firm actively managing a portfolio of crypto assets by combining a venture investment framework with quantitative signals to manage risk.
This is an exciting episode because although it's not about mortgages, I've had many people ask for an episode about cryptocurrency, and Phil is one of the best in this field.
He has more than six years of professional experience in crypto investing (a lifetime in this industry), including being Director of Research at Grayscale, the largest asset manager in the crypto ecosystem.
Phil is a great guy, he has unbelievable knowledge in this space, and as this is a subject I'm passionate about, I can't wait for you to hear what he has to share.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with Steve Kyles, partner with Mortgage Marketing Animals, one of the top mortgage coaching programs in the country for Loan Officers, and top-producing branch manager at SMP. He's also the host and founder of the energetic and value-packed Loan Officer Leadership Podcast, one of the top podcasts for Loan Officers across the nation. We had a great conversation about what it takes to succeed as a loan officer today and the mindsets you need to adopt to make the most of the opportunity.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're speaking with Eric Mitchell, Executive Vice President of Business Development at Gold Star Mortgage. We talk about his experience in the mortgage business, the developments he's seen, and his view on the industry today. Eric's the author of "The Why of Money", an introspective look at how do you get out of your own way and finally earn what you deserve. He's also an industry leader in marketing and business development, voted through the national mortgage professional magazine as America's most connected professional for eight years in a row, so we also talk about the attributes needed to be successful.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we speak with Dave Savage, creator of the incredible tool, Mortgage Coach, something I've been using for more than 20 years. Dave shares the story of how he created Mortgage Coach, some of the tough times he endured, and how he got through them. He also shares his experience of Amplify, which made me reconsider my own experience and look at it in a very different way. This is a great episode, and I recommend checking out the links below to many of the things we talk about today.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm talking with someone who many of you will know, Hunter Marckwardt. A top-producing loan advisor for RPM Mortgage based in Danville, California. Hunter's been in the industry for more than 20 years and has been a coach for more than 10. He has a great team who have been with him for a long time, and collectively they closed 205 loans with a $132 million value in 2019. In this episode, he shares some of his father's advice that I believe really made him a great leader and contributed to the success of his team.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we speak with Carson Vaughn of Guild Mortgage in Austin, Texas.
Carson has been a producing branch manager for 20 years and is a professional coach with Core Training, so he has a lot of experience to share.
This is a great episode and very timely as we run through our list of 'what to do in a seller's market.' I had my list, but Carson's lists blew mine away.
There's so much gold in this episode. I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.
Today on the Heath Barnes show, we're talking with my good friend, Blane Stewart.
Blane and I have been friends for a long time. He's a Branch Manager for NFM Lending based out of Charlottesville VA, and one of the reasons I wanted Blane to come on the show is to share the example of what a great loan officer looks like.
Blane plays at a level most of us only dream, and we had the chance to talk about his mentor, strategies to bring in agents, how the refi business is changing, as well as sharing some great book recommendations.
If you're a loan officer looking for strategies that work as the market moves, Blane has them for you. He's going to give you his personal cell phone number if you want to chat through some ideas! That's what I love about Blane. He's always willing to help someone improve their business.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, I'm talking with one of my mentors and friends, Jack Daly.
He's an incredible individual who's built a life by design! He's a leading sell speaker and a personal trainer with over 30 years of sales and executive expertise from his time in the Army and building six companies, including two mortgage companies.
Jack is a New York Times bestselling author, and our call focused on five strategies from his book Hyper Sales Growth and its companion, The Sales Playbook.
If you're a loan officer, let me cut to the takeaway point. You're going to need to implement these strategies in the next three to six months if you're going to survive the next five years. If you're a sales manager, three of these strategies you absolutely have to implement to start bringing on loan officers.
You're going to really enjoy this episode, and I love Jack's energy in this call, which should be no surprise as he's a 15- time Ironman competitor and has completed more than 90 marathons in all 50 states and on seven continents.
Today on the Heath Barnes Show, we're kicking off the podcast with an episode I recently recorded with my good friend David Spray.
David's show, Podcasting Stories, talks to people with successful podcasts and those who are thinking about starting a show.
I thought I did such a great job telling my story and the background to wanting to start this podcast that it was the perfect episode to rebroadcast here as the inaugural episode.
This was a really great conversation, and we talked a lot about what you can expect from the show going forward.
Welcome to
The Heath Barnes Show
.
I've been in the mortgage industry for 20 years, and I've been a professional coach in our industry for the last 10. This experience gives me a unique perspective on the opportunities, as well as the challenges we all face as professionals in our field.
I'm looking forward to interviewing some of the leading voices in the mortgage industry, as well as other business professionals you'll find interesting, and although the podcast is geared towards the mortgage industry, I believe anyone in business will find this a great show.
I'm really excited to share these stories with you, and I hope you enjoy them as well.
Don't forget to subscribe at HeathBarnes.com, or look for The Heath Barnes Show in your podcast player.