Safety on Tap: Recent Episodes
Andrew Barrett | Growing leaders | Drastically improving health & safety
The Safety on Tap podcast is for leaders (yes, that's you!) wanting to grow themselves and drastically improve health and safety along the way. We bring you free-flowing ideas, perspectives and stories from interviews with only the most interesting people - to help you take positive, effective and rewarding action. Nice!
Are we doing enough? Is the fundamental question of H&S governance. And the answer, it seems at least in New Zealand, is largely not one given with confidence. And beyond NZ, the answer sometimes seems vague, unclear, or uncertain. Governance arguably is the lynchpin around which all health and safety performance relies - so there is something in this conversation for everyone.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
New Zealand has had its fair share of problems with health and safety. Catalysed by the Pike River disaster, new legislation introduced in 2015 styled off the Australian harmonised model promised to strengthen many aspects of health and safety including better control of risk, clearer duties for officers of the organisation, and greater clarity to support regulatory activities. The sad news is not much is changing, with health and safety performance lagging well behind similar regimes in countries like Australia and the UK.
Existing guidance was created around 2015 for the new duties imposed upon senior managers and directors of organisations, called 'The Blue Book'. It's clear that whilst well. Intended, this simply has not been enough, with the backdrop of tumultuous government policy for health an safety, constrained funding, and claims of bare incompetence at Worksafe NZ.
The new Good Practice Guide for Health and Safety Governance was led by the NZ Institute of Directors, in close collaboration with Worksafe NZ, the Business Leaders Health and Safety Forum, and the General Manager Safety Forum. The Steering Group was led by Chris Jones on behalf of the GM Safety Forum, and the Lead Author and Expert Advisor is Craig Marriott, both of whom join me in today's conversation.
Chris Jones is an experienced strategic health and safety leader, having had Head of Safety roles in both the UK and NZ, in rail, poisons and corrections, and now at global dairy giant Fonterra. He has also worked in health and safety lead roles within the NZ government, and a swathe of industry, regulatory, and expert advisory groups and government consultative committees. Chris is fast becoming one of the most popular health and speakers in this part of the world.
Craig Marriott is currently consulting under his own brand, having most recently been the General Manager HSEQ at FirstGas, as well as the Chairperson of the Safety Innovation Community in NZ. With a background in high hazard industries, things that really go boom, and the regulation and creation of safety cases in both the UK and NZ, Craig's experience spans both senior health and safety positions, and a diversity of consulting leadership roles. Craig is both a keynote speaker and author of Challenging the Safety Quo.
Chris and Craig are arguably two of the most well known and well respected senior health and safety professionals in New Zealand today, and both have spent time working in senior roles at Worksafe NZ. It's no wonder they've been able to bring their knowledge and leadership to this impressive piece of work on health and safety governance along with a committee of clever and hard working colleagues.
Let's talk health and safety governance, with Chris Jones and Craig Marriott:
This is a conversation about a really important mission to improve health and safety. It's also about extreme difficulty, persistence, and how being professional might actually mean straying far outside your one specific professional domain.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Today my guest is Gareth Lock. Gareth doesn't easily fit in a box or under a single label, as you'll hear in a moment. Military, flying, human factors, HOP, and diving.
I've wanted bring a conversation with Gareth to you for a while, for three reasons. First, the people I know and trust have said wonderful things about him. Second, he is generous - his writing, travel, courses, and social media contributions are a cut above the rest. Just following him on Linkedin for three months and that is like a mini-course on its own. And third, Gareth is tackling some wicked problems in the health and safety space, and I had to see what lessons he is learning from what is very tough work.
Here's Gareth:
The piece you might be missing as you try to build new things and all your efforts for making change, might actually be deliberately blowing things up.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
"Closing time, open all the doors and let you out into the world"
The song Closing Time by Semisonic is one of those classic tunes of my transition into adulthood.
"Closing time, one last call for alcohol
So, finish your whiskey or beer
Closing time, you don't have to go home
But you can't stay here"
After it was released in 1998 it was pretty common that this song was the very last song played in the bar or pub before the lights got turned back on and everyone had to leave.
"So gather up your jackets, move into the exits,
I hope you have found your friends
Closing time, every new beginning
comes from some other beginnings end"
It turns out that this anthem of the very late night party people had nothing to do with going out of drinking, or even going home.
The whole song is a metaphor for the birth of a child. Lead singer Dan Wilson was soon to become a father as he was writing this song, and the literal meaning of the last song in fact came to be a much deeper insight into the realities of getting bounced from the womb into the world.
Have you ever had an idea, or heard an idea, thinking it was brilliant, only to realise that the idea is not that new, and didn't come from where you thought it did? Welcome to the discipline of organisational psychology. Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap. Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners. Industrial and organisational psychology, or IO psych as it is often called, is well over 100 years old. It was labelled as the exploration of 'real life' psychology. It's official birth is suggested to be 1913, with the publication of the first text on the subject called Psychology and Industrial Efficiency, by Hugo Munsterberg. How is it that such a field, with 100 years of history and research and development, is not that familiar to most of us working in health and safety? Well today I hope that will change just a little, as I dialogue with Diya Dey, an organisational psychologist based in Melbourne Australia. Diya has experience in both consulting and working in-house, and is currently in a organisational psychology role focussed on organisational wellbeing in the Victorian State Government. When I first met Diya, I found her curious, and generous. A great combination in my book, so it was only natural that I would invite her into a conversation with the Safety on Tap community about how industrial and organisation psychology relates to, and can enhance, work health and safety. Here's my conversation with Diya Dey:
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep218
You seem to have answers for everything, he said to me. He was 100% right and 100% wrong at the same time. This is a podcast about how that can be, and how you can engage with better answers.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Before you think that this episode will be a gratuitous brag about how good I think I am wrapped up in some parable of a story, stay with me for a few minutes.
When he said to me, 'you seem to have answers for everything', he WAS both right and wrong at the same time.
He was right because to him, it did seem that I had answers for lots of the things we were talking about and working through in our coaching together. He was wrong, because I wasn't really giving him answers in the way that questions are usually asked, or problems are usually solved with solutions. What I was giving him was responses. Responses to his question, to his story, to his context.
Responses aren't answers. Responses are what we do when it's our turn, in a dialogue two or more people engage in a turn-taking exchange. Dialogue is an ancient word, very central to modern human experience, which comes from two Greek words put together: dia- translates to through, and logos translated to meaning, dialogos, or dialogue, the movement of flow of meaning through the people involved.
You can see turn taking all the time, which isn’t dialogue. It's more like tennis. One person serves, another receives and returns the ball. The object of tennis, and the object of a huge proportion of our interactions with other people, is to get to the end, to resolve the point, usually in favour of one person or the other.
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep217
What does it sound like, to have permission to not focus on certain things in health and safety? What one concept are we missing from risk management that makes a massive difference?
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
My guest today is Tim Lie. Is he a safety professional? I ask him that, so you'll have to wait and see what he says. What I can tell you is that his roles have included group HSE responsibilities, lifecycle alignment, culture, and capability. You don't often hear those things in people's job titles, do you?
I met Tim a while back when I was invited along to a national health and safety team workshop. It took all of 2 minutes for me to be really curious about Tim. He is broadly read, he has both a practitioner and academic background, he is an engineer who loves solving problems but is hyper tuned into the messy people side of business, and he talks in a way that gives you a deep insight into how his brain works, which is fascinating.
So that's why I wanted to introduce him to you! We had a wide ranging chat, dove deep on a few things but still covered a fair bit of ground. I hope you enjoy, here's my chat with Tim Lie:
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep216
Radio, television, and the content we consume have changed enormously since I was a kid. This is a podcast about the physics, and the metaphor of this change and how we can change too, but only if we want to remain resonant.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
There used to be just a handful of TV stations, and a handful of radio stations. It was kind of easy as a kid, because the TV guide fit onto a single page in the newspaper, and the discussion about what to watch was easier because there were only a few options to choose from. Cartoons on Channel 7 on the afternoons we were allowed to watch TV, then Channel 2 at 6pm for the ABC news, on Wednesdays the highlight of the TV week was a bit of police drama with Blue Heelers on Channel 7 at 8.30, and Friday night football on Channel 9 kicked off the sporting entertainment of the weekend.
Bandwidth used to be a constraint. On the radiomagnetic spectrum, there are only a limited number of frequencies which TV or radio could use to broadcast their content to you. Even if you have a digital radio in your car or at home, you can still see the remnants of this bandwidth constraint, when a radio station includes a number in the name - Mix 106.5, 104.1 Today FM.
The number is the actual frequency (measured in Mega Hz for FM stations), the actual number of times the wave goes up and down per second. That number meant it was easy for you to tune into the right station, to listen to what they had to offer, loud and clear. If you were one point off, one tweak of the dial, and not only did you have the wrong frequency, you had garbled, snowy, or no radio content to listen to.
There is no doubt that the use of the radiomagnetic spectrum for communication, and its associated constraint of a limited number of frequencies, shaped our culture enormously.
Until the constraint disappeared. With the internet we went from limited bandwidth to broadband - because we jumped off the radiomagnetic spectrum and entered a world of limitless channels to choose from, unlimited space for broadcast, and people who were more than happy to no longer be constrained to the 3 or 5 channels they used to have to choose from.
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep215
Are the ideas of science at odds with a humanist approach? Can we solve all the big problems with big data and analytics? Can you really succeed with tools and practices and not understand the philosophy behind them?
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
The healthcare industry is one of the biggest growing in many economies around the world as population growth continues, more people are living longer, and advances in medical care and pharmaceuticals are preventing more and more illness and death than ever before.
Dr Satyan Chari has been hard at work in this sector for many years, and I've been trying to get him on the podcast for ages. He is a great communicator, has done some cool collaborative improvement projects, and has always struck me as someone who knows his stuff but is anything but a know-it-all.
It's been a long time coming, and a little longer than usual, I hope you enjoy, here's Satyan:
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep214
Two quick questions for you: first, did you get what you got in 2023 by design, or did your year kind of happen to you by accident? Second question, what's going to change for you in 2024? I have gifts for you inside, keep listening!
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
This episode will be released on the 18th of December, and many of you may have even stopped work for the year. The past few weeks are a unique time in the yearly cycle, when the health and safety leaders I work with turn their minds to those two important questions I just asked:
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Did you get what you got in 2023 by design, or did your year kind of happen to you by accident?
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What's going to change for you in 2024?
We are now realising that just focussing on preventing bad stuff is a pretty limited view of health and safety, and that many of our approaches are limited in the application and the quality of their outputs. So how would we broaden out focus to study and improve normal work? It turns out there are theories, models, and people who've doing this for 80 years. Allow me to introduce Human Factors, Ergonomics, and Systems Thinking.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
My guest today is Associate Professor Gemma Read, from the Centre for Human Factors and Sociotechnical Systems, at the University of the Sunshine Coast.
We talk about one of Gemma's journal papers to bring this dialogue to life. The paper, called "State of science: evolving perspectives on human error", is really quite readable (click here to download it) [hyperlink URL is https://research.usc.edu.au/esploro/outputs/journalArticle/State-of-science-evolving-perspectives-on/99571607402621]
Here's Gemma:
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep212
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
If we want to improve our performance in ANY area of our life, work or otherwise, there are ONLY three ways to do it, three kinds of how before we decide what to do. For most of us, the decisions we make every day, many times a day, about which of the three ways to take, is invisible. Until now.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Most people who go to the gym exercise more than people who exercise on their own because of the very fact that they are at a gym, and there are people around them are working out. And research suggests that you tend to exercise at the level of those people around you, whether they are high fitness or low fitness, you’ll tend to match them.
Exercising at home is entirely possible for almost every person on the planet, and free.
But when we invest in doing it with help and with the right kind of others, it almost always accelerates our results.
Take that up a notch with a personal trainer, where you get more tailored help for your situation, you have built-in accountability and boosted motivation because of the design of the help/support you invest in (the PT).
I mentioned there are three ways to improve performance, and only three. Everything you do in your life fits into one of these three categories.
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep211
I don't agree. And here's why. We should hear this a lot more in health and safety practice. The need to say these words, and the way it sounds when we say it, is more important to our effectiveness than you can imagine.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
In year one, my school report said that I participated with vigour in everything, creative and imaginative, but easily distracted. In year two I was described as enthusiastic, with much to contribute, but restless and tended to distract other students. In year three, Mrs Noonan lauded my vivid imagination, pleasing progress, but said straight out I was inconsiderate of others. In year four I managed to earn the teachers label as polite, interested, capable, but lacking concentration and very easily distracted. For the first time it seems, Miss Newcombe made the connection between my apparent weaknesses and my strengths, recognising my participation in group work and class discussions as extremely good. And by year 6, poor Miss Rodgers who was one year out of teachers college didn't know what hit her. Hard working, creative, and capable she said I was, and then came the shit sandwich of feedback - great participation in discussions, but the enthusiasm leads to rather thoughtless actions, which can be disruptive, and this does hinder Andrew producing work I was capable of.
The biggest problem with communication is the assumption that it has happened. And the #1 cause of conflict is when people fail to understand each other. If I said to you that we don't have enough disagreement in health and safety, what would you say to me? Does that conjure up all the times that you've had to go up against a worker, supervisor, or manager on a hazard or inadequate risk control? Or when you've gone head to head with an auditor, client, or inspector? How many times have you had to defend a safety requirement, 'because, it's a requirement'? Or the system says? Or infamously, it's a legal requirement (said with such conviction that it's become automatic, even though deep down we know that most things labelled as legal requirements are not)?
Ok so we probably have enough disagreements.
What if I tweaked my statement, and said to you that we don't have enough good quality disagreements in health and safety? What comes to mind? What does that mean?
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep209
I have some questions for you. As you hear these, just nod your head or shake it if you agree or disagree. Does it ever feel like you can't give a good clear definition of what health and safety is? That the work is never ending? That it's tricky to definitively describe what we are trying to do? That it's difficult to predict what will happen? That we can't make firm promises about our systems or controls or interventions? That what works in one context doesn't seem to in others so we are always creating things anew? That interpretation and multiple perspectives in health and safety are both frustrating but seemingly inevitable?
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
I wouldn't be bringing you this conversation today unless I was confident you'd be nodding to most of those questions I just asked. The logical rational way to solve those problems might be to get a clearer definition of health and safety, to do more research on what works, to standardise, to invest better metrics to measure….the list of things people are putting huge time and resources into are significant.
Well what if I suggested to you that a lot of it could be wasted effort? That maybe health and safety can't be adequately defined? That it is necessarily reinvented in each context? That we cannot ever know the answer or even the problem until we throw something against the wall?
The questions I asked you come from the definition of wicked problems, which means that if you were nodding along, it's more likely that you will come to see and understand health and safety as a wicked problem.
And if health and safety is a wicked problem, then trying to improve it using methods and mindsets, tools and techniques from other kinds of problems might be as useful as trying to mow your lawn with scissors, or to educate your kids using social media as the teacher.
My guest today is Craig Ashurst. Craig's a real T shaped person, with breadth of experience including risk and health and safety, and now significant depth in the area of wicked problems.
If health and safety might be a wicked problem, then it might pay for us to understand wicked problems if we want to be more effective in our work.
Here's Craig:
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep209
We are in the business of change. But we aren't always great at it. This is a podcast about babies and blindness, carrots and elephants, and the necessary tension between where we want to go, and where we are right now.
I don't think we will ever be able to rest on our laurels, even if we become the most influential and effective safety professionals in history. Even if all the hazards are identified, all the controls are known and in place, I think two things will always be true. The first truth is that the only thing that stays the same is change - change in operations, change in people, change in resourcing, change in the work environment or industry context. The second truth, or maybe I should say what I believe to be true, comes from the High Reliability Organising research. Even when everything seems great, our ongoing job is to create and maintain a sense of unease about things, which keeps us tuned into and anticipating change and what needs to change.
I gave up the clever but trite phrase 'my job is to make myself redundant' many years ago for this reason. I will make the argument that not only is the job never finished, that we need to earn our place in our organisation using this very logic.
And until that time, it can feel really, really frustrating.
Ep208: Is your professional practice unethical?
Full show notes: safetyontap.com/ep208
Is your professional practice unethical?
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Let's begin with an agreement, I'd like to agree somethings with you before you keep listening.
The first is that the work of health and safety is a fundamentally ethical thing, we do what we do because we believe it is what is right. So the first thing I'd like to agree on is that we can't talk about health and safety without talking about ethics.
The second, is that we either can't, or shouldn't, call ourselves professionals if we don't understand the fundamentals of what we say and do. Plenty of people might know the words and activities of health and safety at a surface level, but what separates them from professionals like us is our greater grasp of the fundamental aspects of health and safety and all that entails. That's the second agreement - to be professional means a greater fundamental grasp of the nature of what we do and why.
If you don't agree with these, stop listening, there isn't any point because this conversation will be nonsensical to you. If you do agree, then this might make sense, in which case it also might be helpful to you. You decide.
Ok, you’re still here, let's proceed.
Today's guest is Simon Cassin. Simon has real range - from serving his community as a fire fighter, to lived experience of harm at work, through ongoing study and practice in the arenas of philosophy and health and safety, and importantly how the two interact.
Here's Simon:
Ep207: On the Hook & the Cost of Free, with Andrew Barrett
Full show notes: www.safetyontap.com/ep207
Today, you can access the entire collection of information used to create university-level health and safety programs, for free. Today, you could sign-up for an MBA, and in a year from now have an MBA, for free. If you haven't done either of these things, and you probably haven't, there's a reason. For the people who have taken that first step, almost all of them drop out and walk away. This is a story about the rationality of never starting and of giving up, and how we can create the conditions for you and those around us to actually get better.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
I worked in an organization in which it was normal for people to talk about responsibility saying things like 'ok Jill, you're on the hook for that action'. When discussing significant projects, or high workload, or risky things to have your name one, people might kindly ask 'do you want to be on the hook for that?'
At the time I thought it was a strange phrase. It conjured up images of 'catching' slippery sea creatures and dragging them to their demise, or in darker moments the more dread filled meat hook so favoured by horror writers and medieval dungeon keepers.
It tuns out the idiom 'on the hook' does come from fishing. A fish on the hook has been caught, it no other options, what happens next is decided. On the flip side, a fish not yet on the hook is free, and one which was on the hook but is no longer, has 'slipped' off the hook.
This metaphor for gives us a long runway into a discussion about responsibility and accountability more generally, which I will explore in an episode soon, but for now we need to talk about putting ourselves on the hook, taking responsibility for the things we control.
Ep206: Change and Change Managers, with Gilbert Kruidenier
Full Show Notes: https://safetyontap.com/ep206
Change! It's the only thing that stays the same in health and safety. Today's guest is a professional change manager, though the label doesn't entirely capture what he does and how he does it.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Gilbert Kruidenier is my guest today. He has worked all over the world in operations, process improvement, and change, which seems to be where he adds the most value, because that’s why his phone keeps ringing. In some ways, for many of you, he is also a window into the future, designing his work around projects rather than permanent roles. He is a university lecturer on change, a leader in the Change Management Institute here in Australia, and co-author of the book 'Bad Change: 50 ways change doesn't work and 266 tips to make things better!'
This conversation is a little longer than my usual interviews. I'm sorry if that doesn't fit into your commute or gym session, but I'm not sorry 'cos of how interesting and useful this conversation was, and we barely scratched the surface.
Here's Gilbert:
Ep205: Platinum, Covid, and how ideas spread, with Andrew Barrett
Full Show Notes: https://safetyontap.com/ep205
I noticed when they started saying 'Welcome back Mr Barrett' when I boarded the plane. But I really took notice, when they stopped saying it. This is a podcast about ideas, and stories, and our opportunity to pay more attention to how they affect our work as health and safety professionals.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
Before Covid I travelled a fair bit, and despite proving time and time again how effective virtual coaching and facilitation can be during Covid, once travel restrictions were eased I found myself being asked to come here and go there more than I would like. Covid saw two automatic extensions of my frequent flyer status, since if you can't fly you can't maintain it. Once travel was permitted again, I found myself dropped from the top tier frequent flyer colour down to the next one. I've always said that frequent flyer status is not exciting nor something to be coveted, all it indicates is that I spend too much time away from my family.
Stick with me, for regular listeners you'll know that my story and metaphor ties into what we do as health and safety professionals, rather than an egotistical rant. There is something small, something human about stepping onto a plane, and someone looking at the colour at the bottom of the pass, looking you in the eye, and saying welcome back. They don't know me, they see data which tells them on this airline, we value loyalty and we welcome people by name.
Until they didn't. It seems that stepping onto a plane, Gold status bumps me down the human respect pecking order, so there is no personal 'welcome back My Barrett' anymore. They changed their idea about what loyalty, status and customer service sounds like. One tiny change made me notice, and changed the way I feel.
Infectious Ideas, Genes and Memes
An idea which I was introduced to me early in my career, and which was reinforced a lot, an idea which I came to believe and would re-tell to others was that safety management systems were the solution to health and safety performance. That idea became so intertwined in my professional identity and practice that it shaped me, and blinded me, and twisted me.
Another idea which was part of my early professional shaping is the story that 'part of our job is to protect the Board of Directors'. That one did a real doozy on me, creating confusion and anger and inconsistency and bad behaviour in the name of a story which I believed at the start because other people handed that idea down to me so became my story. Except when I decided that it wouldn't be my story, that I needed a new story to replace it. Needless to say that one needs an entire lying-on-the-couch podcast session, but ultimately boils down to very important but grammatically minor tweaks I made to the core idea in the story: instead of 'part of our job is to protect the Board of Directors', my new story was 'most of my job is supporting safe and healthy work, which becomes protection for the Board of Directors'. How did those ideas come to be? In part, they were spread, like a virus, from others to me, and they became infective.
You may have heard the word genes, spelled g-e-n-e-s, in reference to the unique DNA coding which animals and plants inherit from their parents in the process of reproduction. Genes contain the information which lead to your height, your eye colour, and many parts of your physical and psychological make-up, including tendency for disease, creativity and intellect.
In the biological world, something like Covid did not exactly exist until the day that it did. What happened that day was a combination of mutation of genes within cells, an increasingly hospitable environment for those cells, and then rapid copying or replication of those virus cells and their spread into hospitable environments, namely human beings. The cells which had evolved reproduced, the ones that didn't evolve didn't survive, and that is the basic equation for the explosive spread of that virus, including it's variants which were just human labels for distinct mutations of the original genetic makeup of the virus.
The copying, mutation, and selection which ideas in our culture undergo is an analogy to biological genetic evolution through generations over time. In 1976 Richard Dawkins wrote a book titled the Selfish Gene, in which he expanded on the idea of 'memes' as described by numerous other authors, including Huxley as far back as the 1800's. A meme was originally meant to signify a cultural idea, a bit like a piece of DNA, which spreads, duplicates and mutates according to cultural pressures, like competition, and favourable or inhospitable environment.
Survival, Spread, and Virality
An example of this most of us can identify with is how ideas of hatred or violence spread. These ideas are not new in human history, but definitely evolve over time, which means that there continues to be environments of greater or lesser benefit to the ideas. We might think that a cultural environment like religion and religious believers is inhospitable to violence or hatred, yet we see institutional religion and believers as promotors and perpetrators of so much hatred and violence in the past. We might say that developed countries have cultures which are increasingly inhospitable to hatred and violence, yet every single one of them has obsessive sporting sub-cultures based on the idea that my team is the best, which means I hate your team, and the way we prove it is to go to battle with balls, batts and white lines on mowed grass fields.
Can you see how complicated it gets when we start seeing ideas and how they spread?
It's no mistake that memes, as cultural ideas akin to biological genes, are often described as 'viral' - spreading and evolving rapidly. The way to spot traits is to look for things common across multiple generations. My wife and I have blue eyes so my kids will all have blue eyes. But sporting ability? That's harder to see, but it's there if you look. So let's think about the virality of ideas in health and safety.
What are the things which you were introduced to as a young or new health and safety professional which you accepted as they were. Once of mine was about safety management systems. What about yours? That compliance is the goal? That everything needs a record? That people do make bad decisions? That complacency is a real, valid, and satisfactory explanation for an incident? That danger pay is an acceptable trade off for high risk working conditions? That Unions truly do want to protect worker safety? Or that Unions weaponise safety? That Regulators should be welcomed to the workplace? Or that Regulators should be quickly shown a fabrication of real work and shown the door?
What about our role? That we are here to protect? Or care? That if we don't do safety no one else will? That even if we know the training is crappy, we convince people it's not that bad because we think it's the right thing to do? That you are a better safety person because of your real world experience? Or you are better because you studied? Or you are better because you had a personal safety or health scare? Or you are a better professional because you had a father or brother or daughter or friend die at work?
Paying Attention to How Ideas Spread
All these things are memes, not cute cat face memes or Chuck Another Shrimp on the Barbie memes, they are the idea threads which replicate, evolve and spread in our culture, the stuff we say and do and read and pay attention to and develop and expect at work and what work expects of us.
The greatest irony of all about Dawkins concept of the meme, was that it was, in his words, 'hijacked by the internet'. Instead of an interesting theory for us to look at culture, it became the label for cheesy, cheap and shallow attention sucking snippets all within the square frame in your social media feed. This hijacking led to three very interesting things happening which we can learn from.
First, memes started behaving less like genes when people became intent and deliberate about how they changed them. Instead of evolutionary selection (which explains why giraffes have long necks) or mutation (such as the cause of Down Syndrome or Cystic Fibrosis), people actively muck around and change ideas. Think about how many memes you've seen based on The Matrix Movie, Game of Thrones, Donald Trump or anything with a cat in it.
In safety we see how people are deliberately mutating original ideas. The concept of management commitment enshrined in safety management systems was twisted into a signed policy. The concept of risk management overemphasised the risk assessment step, at the expense of risk identification and risk control. Hollnagels original idea of Safety I inside Safety II got turned into Safety I versus Safety II. Most people don't even know where the ideas have come from let alone at what point in time someone changed or twisted the original idea.
The second interesting observation coming from the internet's hijacking of memes, is that memes result in behaviours in which people are actively trying to make something viral. In biology this is kind of nonsense, even viruses aren't deliberately viral in the sense that it's not like someone or some people designed it to spread, it spread because the environment suited it and there was no downward pressure on its spread. And the internet is a far less hostile place for ideas to evolve and spread than in the natural environment. It took 1000 years for humans to figure out that the biggest juiciest seeds are worth saving and breeding to plant as next years crop, instead of wandering around the forest hoping to find enough to eat. 1000 years for the idea of agriculture to evolve. It has taken around 100 years for the idea that organisations should employ people specifically focussed on safety. It has taken only a few decades for the idea of safety management systems to become mainstream, and less than that for business leaders to think that Lost Time Injury is a good indicator of safety performance. The concept of work as imagined and work as done is over 70 years old, but the idea only spread within the last 20, and only two people on the entire planet are responsible for most of that virality.
This second insight means that the ideas that spread are the ones that win. Not the best ideas, not even the original ideas. Ideas that spread, win.
Are we infected, infectious, or both?
The concept of ideas as cultural memes gives us an opportunity to do a little reflection on something which is all around us, but not something most of us pay much attention to.
What kinds of ideas do you believe, spread, or shape without realising it?
Do you take ideas as-is, or do you try to change them as you spread them?
What kinds of ideas do you take as fact, and what ideas have you rejected or changed?
We get frustrated when people in our organisations 'don't get it'. That might be because other ideas are far more viral than the ones you are trying to make extinct.
This epsiode as been in half-draft for over two years ago (in fact, there are heaps just like that in half-draft). Thanks to Mick Bates for unknowingly giving me the nudge to finish this podcast when he shared some helpful reflections on how extremist ideas and beliefs come to be.
Thanks so much for listening. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way?
Seeya!
Sometimes, 99% is as good as 0%. And it's really quite useful to know when that's the case.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
This episode is brought to you by real people, doing real high risk work. But even more than that, this episode is brought to you because well timed, well structured curious questions asked of the people who do that work, reveal insights that we can all learn a whole lot from.
"210 to 318, am I okay to come past on your left side?"
What you just heard is often called poscomms.
Poscomms is short for Positive Communication. Poscomms serves as an important control measure to prevent the unwanted or uncontrolled interaction of people and plant, usually large plant or machinery in mining and civil construction works. Picture large dump trucks or truck and trailer, bulldozers and excavators.
So what's the actual control, the things which is effective for minimising the risk of people and plant interaction? It turns out, it’s quite a number of things. The basic ingredients are:
- People with radios
- The initial message
- The response
'I've got it Baz', I can hear you thinking. Why are you talking about a really self-evident control for a common risk on lots of kinds of sites, on a podcast designed for deeper professional development?
Well to explain, we need to make a quick diversion and talk about the bung hole.
Bung Holes
A bung is a kind of cork, which you put into the holes in a boat to stop it sinking.
Why do boats have holes? Most boats, most except really big ones which permanently stay in the water, have holes in them because the boat needs to drain when it comes out of the water. Boats take on water, so they need a drain hole. A bung hole.
If you've ever been boating, you'll know about the bung hole. Because one single piece of cork or plastic is the thing that will, without a shadow of a doubt, make the difference between you floating, or sinking the boat.
If someone forgets to put the bung back in the bung hole, you're sunk.
Even if you did secure every single bung hole, but forgot one. You will sink.
That's when 99% is as good as 0%.
So we are sitting outside with this construction crew after their morning pre-start meeting. We were talking with the people who do the work in order to discuss with the senior governance committee about whether the safety vision was evident out on site. And yes, that is data, and the process was data gathering for reporting purposes - not everything is a number, but I digress.
We had done a couple of things to do our best to get the psychological safety sufficient for the group to discuss work as done.
I asked 'what's something you know, that's really important to you, that you wish other people knew?'
One of the excavator operators jumps in without missing a beat.
"No one acknowledges me radio calls, I just wish when I jump on the radio to a spotter or another operator, that I get an acknowledgement'.
'What do you mean?' I asked. I could have guessed, but in these situations, my only goal is to encourage the person to talk more, using their own words, without my assumptions or interpretations. If you want to stimulate good dialogue, a question like 'what do you mean' is what's called an encourager.
'I got no idea whether anyone has heard me call, who is around, and what is happening on the ground'.
Remember what it sounds like? This poscomms control?
Initial message. Respond.
Initial message. No response.
99% is as good as 0%.
No response, no poscomms, incomplete visibility, incomplete information. Uncertain delay, or just as likely proceeding blind. Uncontrolled risk. Drift towards failure.
Approximately 70 seconds later, the group had talked about what good actually sounds like, and there was greater clarity of what people expected. Not only that, the group had started to self-organise around one person's expert knowledge of work as done. They took that perspective as important, and understood what needed to happen and why. The broader team who aren't involved directly in plant movement also became witness to this work as done, the potential for immediate adaptation, and what to pay attention to in the hours thereafter.
How confident are we that what we think is working, is working? How comfortable are we with our current uncertainty?
The idea of 99% = 0% is not the same as saying that everything is useless. There are positive changes that are evident, in the way that risks are understood, controls are defined, planning ensures there are enough spotters, that everyone has a radio, and the radio's are charged, inductions set clear expectations, plant operators are actually on their radio's and the calls are clear and understandable.
The 99% = 0% Rule simply means that a lot of effort means diddly squat without all the right ingredients.
These are the ingredients that come together to make the critical control cake. But even cakes need a minimum of critical parts - some dry stuff like flour, some sweet stuff like sugar, some wet stuff like milk or eggs, and something to help it rise like yeast or bicarb.
And yet a big list of those things were in place on the site for that poscomms control measure to work. Except the plant operators don't hear anything back.
The trap, the real temptation is when the 99% fools everyone into thinking that it's close enough to 100%. It makes mathematical sense if you round it up. It doesn't work that way. Near enough is good enough.
The last bung missing in the boat. The yeast missing from the cake. The acknowledgement missing after the radio call.
All too often in our game, the 99% is as good as 0%.
And it's useful to know when.
Thanks so much for listening. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way?
Seeya!
Why on earth would you remove the words health and safety, in order to improve health and safety?
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
My guest today is Rob Kirkwood. Rob is a health and safety professional with some pretty cool work experiences including as an alpine guide, industrial abseiler, a fisheries ranger and spent a few years working in Antarctica.
But what I think is most cool about Rob's work, is that he's figuring out how to improve health and safety by removing those words from his company's vocabulary. How's that make sense, I hear you wonder? Well, Rob will fill you in, but it starts with his realisation that there was just too much bad stuff associated with the words health and safety, and on the flip side a huge opportunity to refocus his leaders and people on organisational performance.
I've taken a bit of a break from creating new podcast episodes, and as I come back to you with this episode, I started reflecting on what happens when you're gone.
Hey, it’s Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap.
Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome back to all of you wonderful regular listeners.
I've been gone from new podcast production for a few months. It was a break I didn't think I would need to take decided to take and it got me thinking about what it means for me to be present for you, what it might mean for being absent, and the parallels with health and safety practice.
One of the questions I frequently encourage the professionals I coach to ask the people who they seek to serve, is 'what does good service look and sound like in practice?'
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series that brings you the candidates for the 2022 Australian Institute of Health and Safety Board elections.
Why am I doing these? Take a listen and I'll explain.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
If you have a question or a comment for a candidate, post a comment down below and you'll get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series that brings you the candidates for the 2022 Australian Institute of Health and Safety Board elections.
Why am I doing these? Take a listen and I'll explain.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
If you have a question or a comment for a candidate, post a comment down below and you'll get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series that brings you the candidates for the 2022 Australian Institute of Health and Safety Board elections.
Why am I doing these? Take a listen and I'll explain.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
If you have a question or a comment for a candidate, post a comment down below and you'll get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series that brings you the candidates for the 2022 Australian Institute of Health and Safety Board elections.
Why am I doing these? Take a listen and I'll explain.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
If you have a question or a comment for a candidate, post a comment down below and you'll get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series that brings you the candidates for the 2022 Australian Institute of Health and Safety Board elections.
Why am I doing these? Take a listen and I'll explain.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
If you have a question or a comment for a candidate, post a comment down below and you'll get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question
"Being in search of a beautiful question can lead to a new sense of purpose and direction. A beautiful question is one that challenges assumptions, considers new possibilities, and serves as a catalyst for action and change. Crafting and engaging with such beautiful questions is like an art. Like other art forms, it takes practice, and requires learning from practice. When practiced well, artful inquiry can lead to transformative learning and innovative change".
Southern, N. (2015) Framing Inquiry, in G. R. Bushe &. R. J Marshak (Eds) Dialogic Organizational Development (p. 271)
Those beautiful words you hear in the introduction are from Nancy Southern, reflecting what it takes to frame effective inquiry, based on the insights from Warren Berger's 2014 book A Beautiful Question.
Inspired by that, this episode is a wonderful combination for me. A past guest, who is curious, humble, and super interesting, combined with no structure to the podcast episode whatsoever apart from curious questions. You'll remember Ron Gantt from episode 146. Ron and I wanted to catch up, and this is what we talked about. For some of you, knowing the podcast topic and how the guest fits the topic is important for a podcast to be worth listening to. Sometimes, as Southern and Berger hint at, not knowing and trying to ask better more beautiful questions is a wonderful and productive way to learn.
I hope you enjoy this conversation with Ron Gantt, even if none of us know where it's heading until we get there.
Here's Ron:
Hey it's Andrew, and this is Safety on Tap!
On the 13th of May 2022 I had the extraordinary experience of spending a few hours in a virtual event with Safety on Tap listeners from around the world to celebrate 200 episodes of the Safety on Tap podcast.
This is a podcast, but its more than that, it's a community, and I wanted to celebrate with you.
We spent weeks getting your feedback on favourite episodes, most impactful lessons, questions for guests coming back and combing through years of feedback and emails you've been kind enough to send me.
This is the recording of that live event, if you couldn't make it I'm sorry to have missed you, but hope you feel just as much a part of this community.
We had a few technical issues with the recording in the first few minutes, so I'll catch everyone up on how it all unfolded.
We recorded the event in my home studio, which is in Kaurna country in South Australia. We had guests joining us from all over the world, and we paid our respects to the traditional custodians of those lands and to elders past, present and emerging.
I was chuffed to have previous guest and friend of the show Amanda Clements join as my co-host for the event.
The event was in FIVE main parts:
- First up I shared a few reflections on the beginning of Safety on Tap
- Next, we created some time and space for the live audience members to connect with each other. I'll tell you more about that in a few minutes.
- Next, we lined up some rapid interviews with previous podcast guests based on your favourites and your questions.
- After that, despite my protests, Amanda insisted that she would turn the mic around and interview me with questions sent in by you, and
- Finally, we put a handful of real life everyday listeners just like you in the spotlight, to hear their lessons, reflections and insights from 200 episodes of Safety on Tap.
There's only so much we could do in two hours, and we had so many past guests in the audience that if we spoke to all of them we'd have been there all day! Plus many more who sent their well wishes but couldn't make it. So, massive shout out to Tim Allred, Cam Stevens, Sue Bahn, Patrick Hudson, Todd Conklin, John Green, David Borys, Sal McMahon, Kersty Christensen, Andy White, Cam Warren, Clive Lloyd, Mark Stipic and my one and only, past guest and Dad, Brian Barrett.
We co-designed the event for and with you, the listener, combining the three big goals of a Chief Connector like me: to connect you with new ideas, to connect you with each other, and to connect you with your better future self. Learning, and taking action to improve. This was not a webinar so the chat was free and open, and we had the audience talking to each other in the chat and asking questions of previous guests - no permission required, just simple and open learning through dialogue and reflection, it was amazing.
If you were there, I hope this helps reinforce your learning. If you weren't, I'm sorry you couldn’t be with us, I hope this is the next best thing.
his is a cheeky episode, halfway between episode 199 and episode 200, with two really short messages for you - an invitation and a request.
First, I want you to be a part of episode 200!
In exactly the same way that phones are only as good as having people to talk to, a team is only a team because of who is part of it, and roads only exist because cars needed something to drive on, a podcast is only a podcast because of you, the listener!
I should say listeners, plural, since there are thousands of you all over the globe. What better way to celebrate the 200th Safety on Tap podcast episode, than to get together, in realtime, so we can connect and learn and grow as a community?!
I know her personally, we were part of a business group a few years ago.
Having gotten far more focussed and proactive with my overall financial goals and position in recent years, I asked this Financial Planner to come over and help us plan our finances.
We prepared a lot, laid it all out - mortgage situation, credit, assets, a business, a family trust, a farming partnership, superannuation (401k), insurances, cash position, investments.....it was all there.
I wanted the Financial Planner to help challenge and refine our Financial Plans.
I was confused when she kept suggesting that we really should buy more shares, and certainly move our insurances somewhere else. I just wanted a few hours of planning help I would gladly pay for.
She left saying she would send some info, and I actually didn't hear from her.
It turns out the Financial Planner isn't interested in helping people with their financial planning, but to push them towards products and services for which they get a commission.
Call me naive, I was still surprised. And I didn't get what I wanted.
So I laughed when today's email said 'We've got solutions for all your finance needs' - EXCEPT THE ACTUAL PLANNING PART OF FINANCIAL PLANNING.
My guest today is Antony Malmo.
Antony is a self described Wellbeing Smuggler, Jargon Cutter, Systems Wrangler, and C-suite Whisperer. He's a director at Allos Australia, an organisation that approaches workplace mental health systemically; from EAP support and Psych Health and Safety, to Leadership & Strategy. He studied ecosystem science and psychology at University, and then abandoned both those career paths to spend almost a decade working with businesses in Colombia (South America), in the late 2000s, as it emerged from the world's long-running civil war. Ever since, he's been trying to understand how communities build resilience, how businesses can flourish amid uncertainty, and what the future of mental health will look like.
I like the way Antony thinks, how he connects the dots between ideas, and love how generous he is and really wanted to have a deep-dive conversation with him. Instead of keeping that to myself, I wanted you to be part of it too, so here it is, my chat with Antony Malmo:
So what's the beliefs, assumptions, and images we have that make sense of our thoughts and behaviour here? Is it that war is bad? That military aggression is unacceptable? Maybe, but it doesn't explain our blindness to so many other things equally as objectionable and far more prolonged.
No, we have different kinds of assumptions and beliefs and images about how the world works, and when those get violated. And we often don't even know about them ourselves.
We'll call these mental models.
What if you could better guide your organisation on what's most important, and be more confident about the results you can deliver? That's what today's guest is asking of all of us, assuming that’s the kind of professional we want to be.
My guest today is Professor Rob Briner, and he has had a bee in his bonnet about what people like us do, in part because of what people like Rob do. He'll explain more in a minute.
Rob is Professor of Organisational Psychology at Queen Mary University of London and at Bjørknes University College Olso Nye Høyskole, Visiting Professor Birkbeck University of London, and Cofounder & Scientific Director Center for Evidence-Based Management.
Rob's been working at bridging the sometimes enormous chasm between the actual decisions and priorities and programs people like us bring into organisations, and the evidence-based things that actually work to make things better inside organisations.
That's what he and his colleagues call evidence-based management.
And as I quickly found out, this is not about finding the 'right' answer quicker, it's about a mindset and a discipline of professional practice which I think is very well-aimed at people like us.
What words do you know people use to describe you, or your team? Not words you'd like them to say, but words they have actually said and you've heard directly or second hand?
Gandhi did it with walking and without food. Michael Pollan did it with food and a book. Al Gore did it with a film. Dave Grohl did it with Youtube in 2020, and Dave Provan did it with words in 2018. Each of them, in defence of something important. And so must you.
The word defence usually conjures up three different things for people. Either, synonyms to do with the armed forces, war, and conflict, OR, playing defence in a sporting sense where there is an attacking side (again, very military-Esque), OR, being or feeling or acting defensively in the face of a personal attack. Like a conflict.
Do any of those resonate with you as a part of your professional practice? Unfortunately, probably.
But that's not what I'm talking about today.
Today, I want you to begin to think about yourself as a defender. But not any old defender, not like the images we talked about a moment ago. No, You must be in defence, you must be a defender, like these people.
There is an enormous amount of talk about new safety approaches, in theory, compared to implementation in practice. But implementation does exist, it does show promise, and it can be done at scale.
My guests today are First Officer Bogomir Glavan and First Officer Nicholas Peterson from American Airlines Learning and Improvement Team.
This team is hyper-generous, part of their DNA is to write papers, do presentations, and speak at conferences to share their work, in the hope that it does two things: first that it helps other people, and second that it helps them improve what they are doing through that collaborative process of learning, getting feedback, and reflecting.
This conversation was pretty wide-ranging, we talk about the historical beginnings of this Safety II-informed approach to learning and improvement, and how it both differs from and compliments conventional approaches to safety.
The bottom line is this: these people are doing some of the most advanced operational learning and Safety-II in practice in the world. And just because you don't work for an airline, doesn’t mean you can't either.
I'll talk you through the best way to take these amazing insights into action after the conversation, so stick around for that.
All forward-thinking leaders are interested in strategy. But what, exactly, is the purpose of strategy?
This is the first podcast out for 2022 so for new-release listeners, happy new year!
This year I'm getting far more focussed and intentional to bring you insights from the coaching work I do with health and safety professionals, and I'll tell you why that’s like gold: it's bloody lonely doing our work. It doesn’t matter whether you are the frontline safety supervisor or the head of safety, I have been gobsmacked to see this theme emerge from our work - we feel alone, often unsupported like we don't have others on our side, and certainly, we rarely have people to talk with who understand..
Let's talk about Linkedin, humanity, and being salesy.
I am connected with tens of thousands of people, in some direct way. Whether that's someone who was seen me speak, been in a workshop, listened to my podcast, or connected on social media.
All of those are one-degree of separation, there is a direct link between me and them, between me and you.
Jerry Muller wrote a phenomenal book called the Tyranny of Metrics, which he opens by saying "the title is not meant to convey the message that metrics are intrinsically tyrannical, but rather that they are frequently used in ways that are dysfunctional and oppressive". And that, by friends, is a fitting way to begin this awesome dialogue about safety indicators and metrics. Let's begin.
"Help me get people engaged". "No one is engaged with health and safety". "Engagement around here is pretty low". Requests like this and their variations are some of the most common things people come to me for help with. Health and safety have an engagement problem, but it's not limited to that. Gallup says only 36% of workers in the US are engaged at work. And no one agrees on how we define engagement in any case. What do we do?
Kym Bancroft is an organisational psychologist turned health and safety executive, who was the head of Health and Safety at Urban Utilities. Urban Utilities is a water and sewage utility supplying 1.4 million people with clean water and flushing toilets in South-East Queensland in Australia. With thousands of employees and contractors, a high risk work environment and network to build, operate and maintain, Kym led the health and safety transformation at Urban Utilities between 2017 and 2021.
This is my live keynote speech delivered at the Safeguard 2019 Conference. The theme of the conference was Dare to Disrupt. That was an idea which I respectfully disagreed with and explained why in the opening keynote when I encouraged the audience, and you, to go disrupt yourself.
I don't think this interview needs much introduction, except to say one thing: if you are inclined to turn off because the words innovation or entrepreneurialism seem too fluffy or not relevant to you, stick with this: you'll be surprised like I was.
Here's today's guest, Liz Jackson:
I, like you, have been spending a lot of time in the same workplace for a while now, my home office. And yet despite the amount of time I spend here, it was only recently that something struck me when I saw things that had been there the whole time but hadn't recognised for what they are. My space, and probably yours, are filled with theatre props - the things which bring our professional performance to life.
Rory Gallagher is the Asia Pacific Director of the Behavioural Insights Team, and a founding member of it's parent organisation within the British Government. This work as always fascinated me, ever since I read the book Nudge, based on Nobel Prize winning work by Cass Sunstein and Richard Thaler.
Have you ever thought, 'well that person's response or behaviour or inion surprised me, because it didn't seem logical or rational?'. That curiosity is at the heart of this idea that heaps of government policy, regulation and regulatory activity, system design and economic theory is based on flawed assumptions about humans and behaviour. Sound familiar, health and safety?
This is a juicy episode, I hope you squeeze lots from it, here's Rory Gallagher:
It's hard to focus on things that we can't see, that aren't visible to us. It doesn't mean they aren't there, it's just that they aren't visible to us.
Having empathy for others, and appreciating that they have a perspective and experience which is 100% valid for them, can be a difficult thing to comprehend, let alone practice.
What's the risk when we use an ISO standard approach to health and safety? That we miss the point entirely. Decades of experience have revealed what happens when standards compliance and its activities become the goal, instead of the goals of actual health and actual safety the ISO standard was meant to enable. Oh, and by the way, we're going to blow the idea of new views of safety out of the water too.
Today's partner in conversation Jeremy Scrivens sort of defies description, and definitely defies categorisation. Jeremy helps leaders and organisations enable the future of work - which he labels being an Appreciative Futurist. In the way I'm described as a reformed health and safety professional, Jeremy might be a reformed HR professional. But soooo much more.
"Tried it before, and it didn't work"
These are the words that we have all said to dismiss something out of hand, to reject a very broad or general idea or approach or suggestion .
We can choose our words better, which means everyone learns more and is more informed about our experience.
Brenton Harrison shared some thoughts publicly about the extremes of new views and traditional views of safety. Here's Brenton sharing his thoughts with you.
Does philosophy really have a place in work health and safety? Here’s what I discovered.
My earlier rejection of philosophy taught me how important philosophy actually is a conscious way of living and a competent approach to professional practice.
I might be wrong, but one thing philosophy does teach us, is that it’s worth getting curious about. I certainly have become a better professional because of it.
My guest today is the ever-humble Jo Doyle.
Jo comes highly recommended to me, she has been on my potential guest list for years now. With many years experience in strategic organisational change and executive coaching, Covid created the impetus for Jo to gravitate back to her sweet spot and passion of being in Service of Well-being. She creates space for others to self-reflect, grow in awareness, and tap into their innate capability for healing towards freedom.
Am I a cook or a chef? It turns out that has nothing to do with what I wear, or whether I have a certificate, it comes down to one simple thing. And no, it's not a bad temper.
Human performance is not just focussed on humans. It is about how we try to improve ourselves at work. It's not just about health and safety.
My guest today Diane Chadwick-Jones is the former Director, Human Performance for BP. She had an extensive career in BP, working in Belgium, Brazil and Egypt in operations and safety roles. She was instrumental in the refresh of the BP Values.
Three times this week, I have come across this challenge in health and safety leaders.
Competent, intelligent, motivated health and safety leaders who want to make change.
Who hold back, are held back, from taking the next step, making the next intention a reality, for the same reason.
The words are different, but the cause is the same.
Listen in to hear how one of the thickest Scottish accents you'll ever hear is also one of the most effective communicators.
Steve Harvey is a an operations-focused Health & Safety professional who is a proud pragmatist. He is a master of work insights and operational learning, obsessed about understanding the gap between work as imagined and work as done, and he has even featured in a documentary called 'Doing Safety Differently'. And he loves having a laugh!
Here's Steve:
What does a iPad, a 2B pencil, WISYWIG, and a microphone have in common? And how is that helpful for you as a leader?
This episode is made possible by our mission of enabling better learning that improves performance in your organisation.
Today I'm chatting with Jason van Schie, organisation psychologist, founder of FlourishDX and co-host of the Psych Health and Safety podcast.
I'm not pretending that there are any reins to hand over so to speak, but the reason why you've heard so many guests on my podcast speak to this broad topic is simple. This podcast is for leaders who want to grow themselves, like you, in order to drastically improve health and safety along the way.
Psych health and safety is a professional domain most of us need to develop, obviously recognising that we aren't pretending to be psychologists. So it ticks the 'need for growth' box we have in our mission. And, as for drastic improvements in health and safety, is there any doubt in your mind that psych health and safety needs drastic improvement?
I'm glad Jason and the team are here with their podcast. Here's Jason:
This is an awesome conversation. Real stories and experiences from a frontline HSE professional who is still learning with more than a decade's worth of it under his belt. We covered a lot, I learned a lot! None of this was planned, all Tim and I talked about before recording was just to share his story. Stick around for the takeaways at the end because this minimally planned and wide ranging conversation percolated some amazingly clear insights for us all.
Grenade throwers.
You know them.
(Real people, with metaphorical grenades)
The people in your organisation who have a tendency, even a reputation to disrupt.
They throw grenades because they object, challenge or undermine things publicly, in groups.
And they throw grenades at a distance from the real issues, often under-informed, not engaged in any meaningful dialogue or constructive improvement.
The purpose of introducing anything new is NOT to have it perfect first time. In fact, the results you get might not even be great, just average, nothing to write home about.
The ONE SINGLE UNIVERSAL purpose of introducing anything is to create the conditions so the right people say "yes, let's do that again".
That's how starting something once turns into real change.
Mental health is important enough to need a strategic approach, not just tactics. In this wide ranging conversation, David Burroughs and I explore his deep experience in mental health strategy.
David Burroughs is an experienced psychologist, with many years of consultancy and strategic leadership in the area of mental health and illness at work. And he spent an hour with you and I talking all about it.
I am setting a goal to enable people like you to plan and implement 1000 learning teams in organisations just like yours, and this is your invitation to be part of it.
Learning teams, as they are referred to in the context of health and safety, are both awesome and problematic.
They are awesome because those of us who plan, facilitate, teach/coach/enable learning teams or anyone who has participated in them know their value.
This episode was difficult to create. What can we take from a year like 2020? What hope do we have for 2021? It turns out that the question becomes the answer, and the silver lining appears.
What does it mean if something is True But Useless at the same time? It happens more often than you think.
This one started because I thought, wouldn't it be interesting to reflect on the most popular episodes from the past year? That could be interesting, right? The image on the thumbnail for this episode, which you can see if you visit safetyontap.com/ep165, is a graph of the podcast downloads.
Here at Safety on Tap we're starting a new learning teams implementation case study group soon, and I'm looking for five people to join. If you have been thinking about getting learning teams started in your company, then we will make that happen if you are ready to start. It's called learning teams implementation, because that's what we do - not theory, no classroom - every week over 10 weeks we enable you to implement the necessary pieces to have a successful learning team. And it's called a Case Study Group, because you do this with a group of people from a range of companies, all on the same journey, and instead of us using some irrelevant and far away case study examples, we simply enable you to become your own case study - guaranteed to implement learning teams.
In my first ever internal safety role, I was shocked to discover in my performance review that my results were tied to the injury statistics of the business units I was supporting. In 2020, the way I enable people like you to implement learning teams, comes with a 100% money back guarantee. The fine print is where we should be held accountable for change. But you know what else happens in the fine print….
There are conversations I bring you on the podcast which have a specific focus, topic or slant. There are others, which are simply conversations that I want to have, and I thought I would invite you in to listen. I love exploring my own curiosity about people, their stories and experiences and insights. This is one of those conversations, which is why this episode is called, Thinking Out Loud, with Adam Johns.
I've shared with you before some of the most impactful lessons I've learned in my life, which have come from my parents. That's from episode 119, called The #1 Question. My dad's was, 'measure twice, cut once'. An old carpenters mantra, my dad, not being a carpenter, seemed to be a great teacher because he himself was a kind of novice with tools and physical stuff.
Fellow nerds (or maybe just fellow spreadsheet aficionados), did you recognise what each of the keyboard shortcuts are in the title of this episode? Ctrl+C, and Ctrl+Alt+V+E? These seemingly innocuous actions might make the all the difference between wasted effort and effective work for you.
There is an elephant in my office. Its been there for ages, thought its only in the past few years that I've actually seen it. You have one, maybe more, where you work too. It's time to talk about it.
Regular listeners will know me for passionately spruiking and putting into practice a few key concepts.
Today you'll hear my conversation with Peter. Peter works in a pretty large organisation which have a very diverse risk profile, and some pretty high risk aspects.
AmThere is lots of talk about AI. As in, artificial intelligence. Tech is all the rage, and we are interfacing more and more directly with artificial intelligence - just think about the predictive text on your phone.
But a much older kind of AI hold huge promise for health and safety practice, if only more people knew about it. Appreciate Inquiry is the topic of discussion today, and I really enjoyed this conversation with Amanda Clements on what it is, and how it has enabled both of us to be better professionals. Amanda is a senior health and safety professional in a large road services construction and maintenance business. She's quite out of the box, as you will discover.
This is a short episode on a big P - a principle to help you improve. It's a journey, a tension, between trying to know the world, and constructing the unknowable. It will make sense, stick with me.
My guest today is the inimitable and supremely articulate Traci Carse. Traci is the Occupational Psychologist at Fire and Rescue NSW, one of the world’s largest urban fire and rescue services. Traci has significant experience in applying psychology in the workplace through the design and delivery of mental health, resilience & wellbeing assessments and interventions across a range of work settings. Traci is an Adjunct Fellow of Macquarie University, a Board Approved Supervisor, a Certified Gallup Strengths Coach, and recently held a position on the National Committee, College of Organisational Psychologists , as lead for the APS Workplace Excellence Awards.
One of the worst things to do whilst you are crossing the street in downtown Ho Chi Minh City, amongst the cars and mostly motorbikes and tuk-tuks screaming past in all directions, is to stop, to stand still.
Crossing the street in downtown Ho Chi Minh City. That's the analogy I used to explain what happens immediately before disruption, in my opening keynote address to the New Zealand Safeguard Conference in 2019.
So the metaphorical opposite of this is to be in motion ourselves. Not stuck, stopped, stalled or stale .
Today's guest is Kathryn McEwan an organisational psychologist, executive coach and mediator with more than 30 years consulting experience across all industry sectors. Her contribution to the profession has been recognised through the award of ‘Fellow’ by the Australian Psychological Society and the College of Organisational Psychologists. She has a special interest in workplace resilience and has authored three books on resilience at work as well as led development of the R@W Toolkit. She lectures, supervises students, is a Board member and more. And today is cutting through the BS about resilience.
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series which brings you the candidates for the 2020 Australian Institute of Health and Safety board elections.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
Let me know what you think about these - also if you post a comment or a question on safetyontap.com, you get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question.
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series which brings you the candidates for the 2020 Australian Institute of Health and Safety board elections.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
Let me know what you think about these - also if you post a comment or a question on safetyontap.com, you get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question.
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series which brings you the candidates for the 2020 Australian Institute of Health and Safety board elections.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
Let me know what you think about these - also if you post a comment or a question on safetyontap.com, you get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question.
In addition to our regular podcasts, this is a little series which brings you the candidates for the 2020 Australian Institute of Health and Safety board elections.
We've given each candidate only 10 minutes to convince you they are worthy to serve members of the AIHS. To get more info, including detailed profiles of all election candidates, visit aihs.org.au
Let me know what you think about these - also if you post a comment or a question on safetyontap.com, you get direct access to each candidate so they can respond to your comment or question.
This anchor concept is really important to understand and utilise when improving learning is your goal. Change isn't just about engines, it’s about what holds us still or steady, for better and for worse. These anchors, in the forms of assumptions and beliefs, when recognised and challenged reveal deep learning that mere knowledge can't. We can change anchors too, swapping less helpful points of reference with new ones which enhance the learning potential we are trying to tap into. Anchoring as a bias affects all of us, and opens up a discussion about the cognitive short cuts which can either make or break our learning experience and learning outcomes.
As for your growth, your development, and your effectiveness….all of this applies to you as much to your organisation. What's your plan to lift anchors, to sail, and where to drop anchors?
Today's guest recently shared a photo of her lying in the middle of one of the busiest commercial airport runways in Australia. Whilst no planes were flying given Covid-19 disruption, it was an apt visual metaphor for the scope and scale of the operations at Brisbane Airport Corporation. Kersty Christensen is the Head of Health and Safety at Brisbane Airport Corporation and has led this transformation of her function into service to her organisation.
Redundancy is a word quite familiar to health and safety people, we use it in good times, and we fear it in bad times. And I think we always have the wrong end of the stick, for all the wrong reasons. Today I want to talk about the way we talk about redundancy, to reflect on the irony which is emerging about redundancy, and to suggest a more constructive way for us to talk about our place in the world.
Today I'm chatting with Dr. Tristan Casey. He has an interest in teamwork, leadership, and organizational culture. Tristan teaches into the Graduate Certificate of Safety Leadership and Bachelor of Social Science at Griffith University. Recently, he completed his second doctorate, this time in safety leadership.
Tristan is currently working on research around the management of safety amid COVID19, psychological safety, and safety climate.
I was asked to be a judge of these awards. I declined. Later on was asked to help present the Young Safety Professional of the Year award, by way of a video interview since the awards were virtually presented, which I did do, which is kind of peripheral to this episode, but if you stick around after the music at the end I share a few reflections on why I said yes to that very intentionally. I wanted to share with you my intent about these decisions, which is less about me and this story and more about how you can reflect more deeply on why you do or don't do certain things, and how you can leverage your circle of control to make the world a better place, to actively construct a better future. Part of this episode draws on the discussion and email with the organisers, explaining my polite decline to be a judge, my reasoning and my not-so-subtle nudging towards something better than average.
As professionals, as subject matter experts, we think we are in the business of knowing. This is one of the greatest traps we can fall into, and it blinds us to arguably an equally if not more important idea - what we don't know. And actually, we aren't at all in the business of knowing.
How often do you say, 'I don't know', or some variation of that?
Questions need immediate, complete, and correct answers right? We've been trained from school and TV shows that are successful, right? Win a prize, get a good score, impress the teacher, get a good grade and some money from your Grandma……but life isn't like that.
I talk a lot about learning because it's the key to performance improvement for all of us. Today, the previous guest Ron Gantt and I compare and contrast how each of us has been putting social and experiential learning into practice for hoards of people like you amidst the Coronavirus disruption.
Through this, we created something called the Dialogue Manifesto, which I talk a little about in the conversation today, but you can read it for yourself over at safetyontap.com/manifesto. I encourage you to consider our invitation to start some dialogue of your own using this as a guide.
The past few months have been hard, for everyone.
Like it or not, we leaders who are working on improving health and safety, are inevitably closer to current challenges in business than many other professionals.
I don't work on the frontlines of health and safety. My work and my impact happen a little further back, away from the spotlight, supporting people like you to be more effective, to grow, to overcome your challenges. I help leaders like you, and the amazing people in your organisations to learn better, to be more adaptive and resilient - capacities which have never in our lifetime been more important.
Many of us would have heard a saying like "health and safety professionals have a little hand a big S". If this is true for you as it is for me, then you might have also found the H has felt smaller than ever as the world is gripped by the Covid-19 public health crisis. Similar but different, the public health perspective reveals some interesting insights beyond what an OHS perspective brings, to make us more effective.
You've heard today's guest, Steffan on the podcast before, in episode 104. Steffan was the first guinea pig who did a live coaching call with me, so you got a voyeuristic insight into Steffan's challenge, and how we worked through to a better future. This is an awesome example of really powerful learning not just for him but for you the listener.
Steffan is back today to offer his insights based on his professional expertise in public health. He was seeing how the little H was leaving many of us scratching our heads in this current mayhem, and very generously offered to share an insight into how his public health background has helped him provide the best possible support and advice to his organisation.
Many of us would have heard a saying like "health and safety professionals have a little hand a big S". If this is true for you as it is for me, then you might have also found the H has felt smaller than ever as the world is gripped by the Covid-19 public health crisis. Similar but different, the public health perspective reveals some interesting insights beyond what an OHS perspective brings, to make us more effective.
You've heard today's guest, Steffan on the podcast before, in episode 104. Steffan was the first guinea pig who did a live coaching call with me, so you got a voyeuristic insight into Steffan's challenge, and how we worked through to a better future. This is an awesome example of really powerful learning not just for him but for you the listener.
Steffan is back today to offer his insights based on his professional expertise in public health. He was seeing how the little H was leaving many of us scratching our heads in this current mayhem, and very generously offered to share an insight into how his public health background has helped him provide the best possible support and advice to his organisation.
What if we spent more time improving work, would health and safety also improve as a result? What if we did that using many of the principles built into safety thinking, but not calling it safety? What if people have been doing exactly that for almost half a decade, with great results? They have, and that's what we're chatting about today. My guest today is Ian Borges. Ian is one of the founders and senior leaders at the Semco Style Institute, a collaboration inspired by the almost half a century of revolutionary leadership of Brazilian businessman Ricardo Semler. Semler's approach to leadership is probably best described as a self-management philosophy, but this kind of approach is often described as democratic leadership, holocracy, or industrial democracy.
I went out three weeks into the real craziness of the coronavirus. I have collected hundreds and hundreds of data points from people like you giving me an insight into what you are facing right now. And the opportunities that adversity brings two things are emerging, which are the focus of today's conversation with Dr. David Provan, the tension between feeling safe versus being safe. And the need for us to intentionally build resilience into the way we work in our organizations, which it turns out seems not to be new challenges. They're just made much more apparent in tough times.
I am planning to still bring you regular podcasts. But we can't ignore what's going on in these coronavirus times. To distinguish these podcasts from the regular ones, I thought I would number them C1, C2, but then I realised, coronavirus is not defining who I am and my response right now. What is defining me, is togetherness. So this is episode is not C1, its T1, T for Togetherness. The first of these hopefully short series of podcasts focused on how together we can tackle and adapt through coronavirus times.
Today's guest brings so much learning to you today. A safety concierge, a career with laser-focused intent, not fitting into a box, and understanding where the real value lies in customer interaction. You're in for a treat.
Cameron is a career health and safety professional, with health and safety experience across many sectors with roles from the frontline into senior leadership in high-risk industries. It is his work outside of safety which really cranks up my curiosity. He is currently a Solutions Engineer at RealWear, which their website says is the world’s best hands-free wearable rugged Android tablet for industrial workers. But you won't hear a lot about RealWear or their products in this episode, and that will make sense to you at the end. Cameron is teaching us not just in what he says, but what he doesn't say.
I usually try to make episodes that are as timeless as possible, in as much as you might listen the day it comes out, or a year or two later. Today's episode is both very timely today, because it is the 17th of March 2020, amidst the exponential growth of the coronavirus, or COVID-19, or SARS-COV-2, NCOV, or any other name people give it. But even if you are listening to this in a years time when I hope things are drastically better, keep going, because whilst what you are about to hear is sharply relevant today, it will still be in the future too, because this is about the future we seek to create.
Five times in the past week, I have had business card ceremonies. You know those moments, not very long, a second or two, the cultural practice repeated millions of times every day across the business world, the moment in time for the passing of a little piece of card from one person to another. I don't want your business card, and I don’t think anyone else wants yours or mine either. And I'll tell you why.
Many of you will know Professor Erik Hollnagel. Erik said he doesn’t like long introductions, so I'll do it in the intro here before the actual interview. Erik is Senior Professor of Patient Safety at the University of Jönköping, Sweden. You may have heard of Erik from his prolific writing, with well knows books including Safety I and Safety II, the Past and Future of Safety Management, and Resilience Engineering, Concepts and Precepts.
He is here not because I am a believer, but as Erik so simply tell us, because it makes sense.
In this episode we're continuing our recent theme of looking at the future. Previous guest and friend of the show Kobi Simmat, CEO at Best Practice, shares a couple of big business trends he is seeing, which are relevant to all of us, we dig into some of the key business skills which might help you become the next CEO, and hear about an awesome live event he is putting on with a phenomenal line up of speakers to help businesses create their own better future.
It's great to bring you another listener question. These kinds of podcasts are designed to help you bridge the gap between hearing and knowing something, and putting it into practice in real life. I can tell you all the stories under the sun, but there is something special, and simply enlightening about a specific person with a specific goal and you hearing it in the first-person.
This is from Clinton Horn, writing to me in response to episode 90, How to prepare for a conference presentation:
Being future-ready and future-relevant means that we need different skills than what got us here. Not only that, today's guest today sees tensions businesses experience between competing goals, tensions we need to see and wrestle with to be future-ready and future-relevant.
My guest today is Sheri Greenwell, a health and safety leader and what I would call a neogeneralist.
Sheri is passionately engaged in health and safety which makes an impact, yet doesn't fit the usual mold for a health and safety professionals. Which is the very reason why she adds so much value?
A sunk cost is the bias in many animals, humans and pigeons included, to continue with a course of action or commitment on the basis of costs already incurred. These costs might be time, money, energy, or even social capital (being seen to be committed). The more we perceive that we have invested, the more likely we will continue down the same path even in the face of contrary information, changing circumstances or diminishing chances of success.
Can we learn better about our operations? What if we learned, to learn better?
My guest today is Andy White, a superbly intelligent, caring, and insightful safety professional. An engineer by training, he morphed into safety given what he learned about managing actual safety managing construction projects. Andy is a lifelong learner, in both the experiential sense and the academic sense. He has worked in Antarctica as safety advisor to the New Zealand contingent down there, he's worked in adventure tourism, he's a university lecturer, and now head of safety innovation at one of Canada's largest infrastructure construction firms. Andy has been such an impactful peer, and teacher for me, so it's quite exciting to share him with you.
Every episode of this podcast finishes with these same words: Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way? What does that action look like? Because there is a good action, and there is not so good action.
This one is a melting pot of ideas and perspectives. Learning about microlearning, learning from gifted kids, and all of this from a chemical engineering Ph.D.My guest today is Kirstine Hulse. She is a chemical engineer, who ended up in a really diverse range of roles including health and safety. And she is a leader in the field of gifted kids education. She is currently the General Manager of Health and Safety at Cavalier Bremworth, the carpet industry legends in New Zealand, and is a Director at the New Zealand Centre for Gifted Education.
In that sense, I am not the flower flourishing but the gardener, carefully helping prepare soil, to sow new seeds of ideas and challenge, to water and fertilise the growth of others. But events can be a flash in the pan, superbly energising and flourishing in the moment, which often fades away quickly. I will be supercharging this hybrid combo approach to learning in 2020.
For how long did you and your partner date? How long before you and your partner made some significant decisions, like meeting each other's family, going on holiday together, getting a dog, sharing bank details, moving in together, or maybe (call me old fashioned), getting married?
We are all in sales now. To sell is human. Maybe you might spend some of your reflection time in the holidays thinking about how you can improve your marketing and sales capability.
Here at Safety on Tap, we spend a lot of time looking forward to new ideas, innovation, and a future-focus. But, as you know, reflecting on our experiences, and making sense of that socially with each other, is one of the most powerful sources of learning right under our noses. Today, my guest reflects on a career of insights, to fuel your growth.
I'm chatting with Russel Skilleter. Career health and safety professional, looking back on a few decades of experiences. I'll let him tell you the story.
Here is our first taste, bringing the Safety Color Concept to an entire conference room, most of whom who have never heard it before, live from the South Australian Safety Symposium. It describes the nature causes problems and effects of Safety Cutter. Dave Provan and I started Collaborating a little while ago to bring the Safety Cutter problem and solutions to life, out of academia and into practice.
My guest today is Professor Andrew Sharman, President of the Institution of Occupational Safety and Health. Many of you listening will be IOSH members or might have done training which was delivered or accredited by IOSH. Andrew is the CEO of international culture and leadership consultancy RMS, with qualifications in health and safety law, industrial psychology and organisational behavior. Andrew is professor of leadership and safety culture at CEDEP, the European Centre for Executive Development, and a prolific author with titles including from Accidents to Zero, The Wellbeing Book, Naked Safety, and Mind Your Own Business: What Your MBA Should Have Taught You About Workplace Health and Safety which he co-authored with former Chair of the UK Health and Safety Executive Dame Judith Hackett.
I literally just had a conversation with someone, who told me about a serious near-miss incident. An incident so close to deadly for one person it gave me shivers. Thankfully they weren't badly hurt. The trouble was, after that happened, someone else died. This is the story of the relationship between blame and learning.
My guest today is not backwards in coming forwards. Sue Bottrell is a unique kind of person in our space, one of the few who has experience spanning in-house safety roles, consulting, and on top of that is a lawyer practicing in OHS law. I think it's helpful for me to give you some background on why and how I say yes to conversations on this podcast. So my starting point, is not being super enthused about the law - it's not unimportant, it's just better placed on someone else's podcast not this one and for an audience like you.
The voice you hear is not Andrew Barrett. This is a robot, an accessibility device which reads text for people with vision impairment. Some of you may have been fooled, and if you feel that way I'm sorry, it's all for a good reason. Most of you might have realised it wasn't me. But it was me, kind of. This is my words. I created this podcast, the idea, the flow, the linkage of ideas, the words, and audio features all while I was sitting in seat 8F flying to Auckland. How much of this podcast is me, and how much isn’t? When you heard, near the beginning of the podcast "Technology is great, and I would know", said in the first person, was that Andrew Barrett saying that, or was that the voice robot? Or was it both?
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents traces it's history back to a meeting in London, in 1916, the attendees of which resolved to create a Councilto tackle " the alarming increase in traffic accidents, and the direct connection therewith of the restricted street lighting which had been necessitated by the War conditions".
My guest today is Dr. Karen McDonnell, the Head of RoSPA Scotland and the organisations Occupational Health and Safety Policy Advisor.
I frequently get questions from you, which I love because it turns you, a nameless faceless listener statistic into a real life human being, with a story and emotion and successes and challenges. I learn a lot from the reflection you stimulate when you ask questions, and I learn a lot from the kinds of questions you ask too. So here is a little experiment, for the first time bringing you the Q&A between a real listener, and I.
Today I welcome back friend of the show and previous guest Michelle Oberg, to fill us in on some new ideas, her new but not so new role, and what new things we might consider if we want to innovate in safety. Michelle is the Safety Innovation Lead in the transport and infrastructure division of Downer, which employs over 50,000 people across Australia and New Zealand designing, building and sustaining a bunch of different infrastructure and facilities assets.
Close your eyes for a minute, assuming you are not jogging or walking down a busy street. If you are, maybe stop, because this is the #1 question you need to answer to drastically improve your performance.
I'm going to ask this question, and you need to immediately grab the answer which comes to your mind - don’t think about this, this is not a thinking question.
For show notes please visit: www.safetyontap.com/119
I've got some exciting news for you, but I know you come for the interviews. So I won't hold that up, stick around after the conversation and I'll tell you what I'm so excited about. Today I catch up with a previous guest, Wade Needham, helping him scratch his own itch. That'll make more sense in the first few minutes, and no, there was no actual scratching we did this all over zoom.
Regular listeners will know I took a short hiatus from the podcast after episode 116, only a few weeks ago, to spend more time writing. This writing was in the form of emails, to my email subscribers, as a form of reflection after the Safeguard Conference I spoke at in NZ a few weeks ago.
I've had a surprising number of people ask me over this time, what is it like writing vs podcasting. Writing vs podcasting. I am a regular podcaster, and I paused that to do writing. Writing vs podcasting.
I'm guessing you're listening to this podcast because you like to learn by listening, and it fits in with your busy schedule. You are a listener. I also know that listening to a podcast, especially some of my episodes, presents a time challenge. My intent is to offer value, which takes time to do. Rushing is a 21st century challenge, so everyone is under pressure to get more, do more, deliver more in less time and with less money.
Dialogue is one of the most powerful, and abundant sources of learning available to us as humans (especially professionals). Technology, in particular social media, helps us get more connected, and should enable us to have better learning dialogue. But it rarely does. Social media constrains dialogue, limited by the text medium, short length, and relative anonymity behind a keyboard. (And trolls). Learning focused dialogue on social media, especially when people disagree, too easily disintegrates into defensiveness, confusion, and negativity.
So let’s take online dialogue offline
Today's guest Sarah Cuscadden will be sharing her journey of understanding and shaping the health and safety experience in her company, in a half-day masterclass at the 2019 Safetyscape convention, part of the new events offering from the Safety Institute of Australia on from the 21st to 23rd of May in Sydney. The #SAFETYSCAPE Convention brings together a range of industry partners committed to health and safety to assemble as the largest gathering of Health & Safety professionals across a program of events, workshops, forums.
This episode is brought to you by the Safety Institute of Australia's Safetyscape Convention. Martyn will be sharing his insights about regulation, change, and the future in a panel discussion I will be hosting at the 2019 Safetyscape convention, part of the new events offering from the Safety Institute of Australia on from the 21st to 23rd of May in Sydney. The #SAFETYSCAPE Convention brings together a range of industry partners committed to health and safety to assemble as the largest gathering of Health & Safety professionals across a program of events, workshops, forums. At the centre of the overall convention is the Safety Institute of Australia’s own two day National Health & Safety Conference: Back to the Futurealong with the Workplace Health & Safety Show.
My guest today is Cameron Cox, a Director of Safety for Sydney's enormous metro and rail construction projects. Cameron is an expert, and his expertise is what he shares today.Cameron will be sharing his personal and professional expertise, taking us through his journey inside the Sydney Metro project at the 2019 Safetyscape convention, part of the new events offering from the Safety Institute of Australia on from the 21st to 23rd of May in Sydney.
This episode is brought to you by the Safety Institute of Australia's Safetyscape Convention. Stephen will be sharing his insights into supporting at-risk worker groups at the 2019 Safetyscape convention, part of the new events offering from the Safety Institute of Australia on from the 21st to 23rd of May in Sydney. The #SAFETYSCAPE Convention brings together a range of industry partners committed to health and safety to assemble as the largest gathering of Health & Safety professionals across a program of events, workshops, forums.
This episode was really far more left field as an idea which when I suggested it to my guest today, he jumped at my guest is Ron Gantt, who some of you will know as the editor of the safetydifferently.com blog. This all started with a post, which Ron put on LinkedIn.
This is what the Post said.
He said, what makes having a meaningful constructive conversation between people who disagree with one another hard on this website.
2018 was a tough year for me as I faced a lot of challenges ahead but I approached the challenged differently and I want to share it to you today, a quote from Theodore Roosevelt popped up in my social feeds which is been timing on the day when I needed it and I've adapted it, it's called "The Man in the Arena"
Today I'm chatting with Daniel Hummerdal, the relatively recently appointed, and first, Chief Advisor of Health and Safety Innovation at Worksafe New Zealand, the countries sole government regulator for work health and safety. My curiosity was really the driver for this conversation - the organisation, the role, that it's new, that it's about innovation, and Daniel's reputation for challenging the status quo to search for more effective ways to improve health and safety -
Today you'll hear my conversation with Carmen. Carmen's challenge is really significant - she is working every day in the suicide prevention and support space and wants to help a very specific group of people, who have 'lived experience' with suicide and back in the workforce. Carmen asked me for some help, I really did wonder whether I was the right person And that's where the value came from. Carmen was stuck, and after this conversation, became unstuck.
Today, for the first time, I have two guests on! Double the value. We discuss the limitation of retributive approaches, the popular but unachievable ideas behind restorative approaches, and the benefits of underpinning our work with transformative thinking and approaches.
What's it all about, and what are the alternatives? Check them out, here's Campbell and John:
I'm shaking things up again this episode, another kooky idea of mine. I love getting out and about amongst people, whether that be in workshops, team sessions, coaching or conferences. When it comes to conferences, I'm getting more and more, umm, insistent about my views about what a good event looks, sounds and feels like. What I mean, is that there is no shortage of information out there. Regular listeners will have heard me say that many times. So paying lots of money to sit in a room, to listen to live, real-time content delivery, isn't bad, it's just not optimized for this day and age. So when I'm invited to contribute to a conference or event, I tend to prefer, and try to influence, interactive sessions like panel discussions, roundtables, facilitates activities - where you can tap into way more social and experiential learning.
So here we are! These episodes, the title of which I will prefix with the words 'coaching call', I know I spent a long time with the marketing department working on that one, so you can see them easily in your podcast feed, as distinct from interviews and my solo episodes. My intention here is to help supercharge your learning and action. Just because I'm coaching one person, doesn’t mean that you won't find really helpful takeaways from the specific challenge or opportunity we work through, but in the way we go about the coaching process. Can you let me know what you think? Post a comment on this episode over at safetyontap.com/ep104. I would love to hear what you think. Without further ado, here’s our very first live coaching podcast.
This is the first interview for 2019, always exciting for me to get back into the groove of these amazingly insightful conversations, and I get really excited thinking about how much you can benefit from these in addition to my solo reflection episodes. I've got a great lineup of guests this year, we are planned out for a few months in fact. My guest today is Dr Jop Havinga. As you'll hear, Jop's PhD is so fresh that he might as well have been wearing his funny gown and hat in this conversation!
Listen in to this episode for my very brief year in review, my word of the year for 2019, and why any of that is actually relevant for you.
The reason why I share some reflections on the year that was, and my word for the year that is ahead, is not because that has any specific relevance to you. But don't switch off, just yet anyway. The reason why I share this with you is because I encourage you to go through a similar process. This podcast is for leaders, who want to grow themselves and drastically improve health and safety along the way. That's you. We cannot grow to our fullest extent, unless we have a practice of reflection. That is a habitual, and structured approach to thinking about what has happened in the past, and what we can learn from it for the future. I'm sharing with you in the hope that you might feel the value that reflective practice has, with me as an example, and that you might also benefit for your own reflective practice.
Sometimes it's good to just not think. And then sometimes its good to think, but about nothing in particular. And sometimes, that thinking leads you to places from which some insight emerges, like about balance, averages, mediocrity and what we don't know.
I am really excited to be back with you for 2019, if you are listening soon after this comes out. In this episode I share with you a few reflections from the break which I thought would be helpful to get your cogs turning, and I have some gifts for you towards the end of this episode.
So what's in a number? What's in a lost-time statistic, or the number of leadership walks done, or the average time to return an injured worker to work? Or the time-weighted average exposure to an airborne hazard, or the number of times a repetitive manual task is done? And, what's episode 100 of a podcast all about? In health and safety we work with lots and lots of numbers. Well, business in general works with numbers. And yet the numbers themselves don't mean anything, unless we give them some meaning. We have to tell a story about what they mean and why.
Let's get to it. The year is coming to a close, so much to do and so little time! Today I'm chatting with Eric Knight. Eric is the Global Head of Safety, Health and Environment at AstraZeneca, who isn't content with implementing good safety health and environment in the company, he thinks there is a bigger mission than that. And it all ties in with the United Nations 2030 Sustainable Development Goals, or SDG's.
The Pareto Principle has been observed in a range of economic areas, like global individual wealth distribution I mentioned earlier, but soverign wealth, quality defects (few defect types cause majority of quality costs/rework time), innovations (where only a few members of staff will provide the majority of innovation ideas), decision making (where only a small proportion of time in a meeting results in the majority of decisions), and complaints (where only a few aspects of your services will result in the majority of your complaints). Where this gets interesting, is that it enables us to understand how to move away from slow and incremental improvement, to improvement which is disproportional to our time and effort.
Clive Lloyd joins me today. Clive grabbed my attention for a few reasons. First, he came highly recommended by people I trust. Beautifully ironic give the focus of our conversation. Second, he is generous in helping people like you and I learn and grow and succeed. And thirdly, the focus of his work is on a topic close to my heart, which I didn’t realise wasn't just important in my own experience, but what the academic literature says is vital to effective change.
Dr Jason Fox joins us for a chat today. Jason's name has come up numerous times in previous podcasts, from me and some of my guests. Jason's been on the list to talk to as there are so many points of reference or connectedness, or as Jason says today 'poly-angulating'. Jason's writing and thinking has influenced the way I think and work, and the recent launch of his own podcast The Cleverness [https://www.drjasonfox.com/podcast/] seemed like a great occasion to link up. It was a real pleasure to go meandering with him, and for you to join us.
Previous guest and friend of the show Dr Drew Rae joins us in this episode as we poke at the idea of evidence based practice. Or more appropriately, the lack of it in health and safety. Drew is a world-renowned academic, research leader and in-demand speaker from the Safety Science Innovation Lab at Griffith University in Brisbane, Australia. And he doesn't just mind pointing at elephants in the room, he helps us make sense of our safety practice in the process.
This podcast episode has mostly come to you at around 4.30am on the day I'm due to fly out from Los Angeles back to Australia. I get on the plane in 19 hours time, but need to stay awake for an additional 5 hours after that to hopefully get my sleep patterns all right. The reason for the early start is I've taken ages to get used to the jetlag coming over here, and now having to start to adjust my sleep to get ready to return. It's a pain in the butt, and getting frustrating, and tiresome. I think we say and think this statement way too much: just get through it. If I get through it, I'll be ok. We encourage other people, 'you'll get through this', and it won't be so bad. 'It won’t be long/much effort/much pain before you are through this, and the other side will be better'
One of the things I explore in my chat with John Lee today is the concept of bureaucracy. As you'll hear, John has been a senior public servant, a bureaucrat, and I was curious to explore the linkage between being a bureaucrat, working in the bureaucracy, and the bureaucracy that is so often associated with health and safety. I talk a bit in the interview about him and his history, so I won't repeat that here, suffice it to say when I met John, I was leaning in and wanted to get to know him more, so you get to listen in too! Here's John:
Asking questions is a great way to learn, to grow and improve. Today, my question for you, is what's it for?
Discovering the answer to the question of what is it for, is hard. And it gets harder to decide what to do next. Having someone else ask, to listen and encourage reflection, to challenge and cheer you on, is helpful. Learning & growing is a social thing. Like that panel, we get great value when we learn together.
Sometimes we find ourselves victims of our circumstance. Other times, we have the ability and the potential to totally change the way we operate. It take courage, clarity and persistence, but it is possible. Learn from how Kobi Simmat is going about changing himself, his business, and his entire industry for the better. Downloads & transcripts at safetyontap.com/ep091
This is the topic of a recent coaching call I had with a client.
Check this out if you want to learn how to prepare to deliver an amazing conference presentation, or any presentation to a large group.
The water cooler. The hospital bedside. The ride along in the truck. The smokers outside. The open ended question. The conversation that happens after the conversation inside the meeting. Silence. What do these have in common that makes them so useful, so powerful? Time and space. You might realise that I'm trying to change the way I approach these solo episodes. I've realised loud and clear that many many people won't and can't tap into the work I do, whether that's facilitating or coaching or whatever. I wanted to bring a taste of that, and the stories in particular, which I reflect on as distinct in my work, in the hope that they offer some insights which are helpful for you. Let me know what you think about these episodes, leave a comment at safetyontap.com/ep089, send me an email to andrew@safetyontap.com, or leave a review on iTunes.
Sara Pazell is my guest today, and she isn't a, well she's more of a….aw I'll let you hear her explain it. Rather than eloquently describe what she is, in this episode I was far more interested in HOW she goes about her work, with the human at the centre. What I love about Sara's work, her obvious passion and some of the perspectives she brings to this conversation, is that she helps us with some practical tools, concepts and language to help us move beyond 'we're the health and safety people here to help health and safety' to something else,
Sometimes you can’t plan things, or you can but the plan doesn’t work out. On the other hand, I've learned to observe and listen for signals, which let me know what to do next. Here’s one that crept up and jumped in front of me this past week, and it’s about permission.
You don’t need permission to begin. Start small, and see if the world falls apart. I guarantee you that whatever happens, you'll learn something, and that'll help you take the next step, and the step after that.
Today I've got something a little different for you. This episode is based on an article [I wrote for the NZ Safeguard Magazine in early 2017, called from Teflon to Coach.As you listen, I want you to focus on what the explicit takeaways are, as well as the implicit lessons in the way I've created this piece. Make sure you download the article and refer back to in your reflection, or better yet grab it first and have it with you whilst listening.
This episode is brought to you by Safety on Tap Connected, the worlds only growth accelerator for health and safety professionals. One of the biggest levers for accelerated growth is through coaching. High performance in many fields, including sports teams and individuals, executives, performing artists and more all have coaches. Because a coach propels them forward, a coach holds them accountable, a coach isn't encumbered by all the day to day stuff that clouds our life and time and heads. A coach helps you accelerate your growth. I coach members of Safety on Tap Connected because it works. And that's merely one of the benefits you get when you become a member of Safety on Tap Connected. Find out more at safetyontap.com/connected
Today I'm joined by Ben Hutchinson, a generous learner and teacher, a Ph.D. candidate and an all around great guy. We talked about fantasy planning which is such a great word to get us squirming uncomfortably about this potential problem we create or at least might contribute to? It's not a new concept but the language is new to me, which is what I love about this learning journey I am on, alongside you. Why not connect with Ben, check out his example, and maybe take his lead in sharing learning, rather than just info?
Safety in unfortunately full of BS. Well-intentioned, but nonetheless BS. Why not take a BS test and see if you can remove some it?
Get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your own reflection template for this very episode, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep084
Conflict is a common part of health and safety practice - it seems to be either a pain in the butt or a badge of honour. Is all conflict bad? How can conflict help us improve? What myths might we not realise we believe about conflict?
Hear the answers in my discussion with conflict management expert Kate Russell in this episode.
Get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your own reflection template for this very episode, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep083
Want to accelerate your development (and your performance) in 2018? Join safetyontap.com/connected to get me as a coach, learn with a community of amazing peers and educational content you won’t find anywhere else.
Cognitive bias plays a part in everyone's lives (well, everyone with a brain). Find out what cognitive bias is, whether it is good or bad, and how to manage cognitive bias to improve performance, in your organisation, your team, and for yourself. Get my handwritten reflections, your own reflection template for this very episode, the full transcript and more at safetyontap.com/ep081
Dr Rebecca Michalak, a professional chameleon who is curious about workplace monsters, knows more about the dark underside of the legal industry than almost anyone, and has a mission to change the way we think about psychological safety and creating great places to work. Get Bec's perspective on the 50 shades of psych safety and how you can start to influence positive change. Get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your own reflection template for this very episode, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep080
Amanda Jones shares with us insights about psychological safety through the lens of neuroscience, and her personal development journey which led to her conference presentation on this very topic.
From neuro-porn, contagious stress, to impostor syndrome and embracing that which terrifies you, we've got a jam packed episode!
Get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your own reflection template for this very episode, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep078
Sally McMahon first said hello to me when she sent a message saying 'Loving listening to your podcast, love your people-centred approach'. You'll figure out that we have that in common not least of which because her title at Fit for Work Australia is the Chief Health Evangelist. Sally is also the creator and host of only podcast I know of in the world focused just on work health, safety and wellness, the Fit for Work Podcast. But as you'll hear in the interview, Sal is far from a zealot - she knows her stuff, she gets into the business case straight up, there isn’t any fluff about it yet she has an infectious passion for better people and great workplaces.
Download the transcript, my handwritten notes and your own reflection template at safetyontap.com/ep078
Bob Edwards is best knows as the HOP Coach. He spends his time helping individuals and organisations to perform - whatever that means in their own context. His best known method for this is probably learning teams, which we talk about during this chat. Download the transcript, my handwritten notes and your own reflection template at safetyontap.com/ep077
Naomi Kemp, who wears a few hats including a risk manager, expert advisor on enforceable undertakings, speaker and board member of the Safety Institute of Australia. Today we're talking about one stinky risk that many of us wouldn't think that much about, along with a much better smelling alternative to justice, challenging the way we often approach things going wrong. Get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your own reflection template for this very episode, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep076
In such a radically transforming world, conventional sources of insight hold diminishing value. To find our authentic edge, we must look to and be willing to learn from those who are already fluent in qualitative thinking, deep empathy and relentless reinvention. The Artists. Listen to Mykel Dixon tell us how, and get my handwritten reflection for this episode, your one template, and the full transcript at safetyontap.com/ep075
Darren Hill is a behavioural scientist, whose mission in life is to make a difference to the difference makers. Listen in as we dig into the question, whether behaviour change is a dirty word in health and safety.
Download your free transcript and my hand-written reflection, plus your own reflection template, to help you take action from this episode - visit safetyontap.com/ep074 to grab those for free!
Listen in as I share my word for 2018, abundance. Why I chose it, and how I'm going to use it to help me have a great year! Download your free transcript and worksheet to help you take action from this episode - visit safetyontap.com/ep073 to grab those for free!
Louise Howard leads health and safety at one of Sydney's largest infrastructure projects right now - a new metro line extending into Sydney's North West. She'll tell you more about that in a minute.
Louise is an action-researcher, which means learning through research, generally inside the place you work. She's curious about the relationship between leadership and safety performance on this project.
Get my free handwritten reflection and your own personal reflection template, along with the full transcript of this episode, at safetyontap.com/ep072
Many of you will know Patrick Hudson from his work on safety culture. We chat today about that, and I get to poke and prod his model, including the uses and abuses you need to be aware of when you are thinking about safety culture.
Find out more, and get my handwritten reflection notes, your own reflection template, and the transcript of this episode at safetyontap.com/ep071
Today I'm joined by Natalie Boehm, the Health and Wellness Manager at Snowy Hydro, Australia's largest hydro-electricity generator, supplying almost 40% of Australia's renewable electricity. With operations spanning three states and some pretty remote areas, Snowy is a pretty unique kind of business. Nat will be speaking at the 2018 OHS Leaders Summit which is being held on the 7th and 8th March in the Gold Coast on the topic of health and wellness and the all important question of how to decide what to focus on. The OHS Leaders Summit is the only event in Australia specifically designed for the Group Heads of health, safety and wellbeing. It offers a unique combination of standout speakers, industry thought leaders, networking and personalised meetings with the leading suppliers of products and services, meaning you can leverage the best of what's out there to help your health, safety and wellbeing programs succeed. Visit ohsleaders.com.au to find out more and get your seat - spots are limited. Here's Natalie: Some people suggest I don't ask tough enough questions. I dug deeper on that today, did I create some discomfort for you? I'd love to hear what you thought. Before my takeaways, I wanted to talk about name calling. Some people recently have started calling me names, but in a good way. Two of them are innovative, and pioneering. I'm not big on fancy adjectives, but it does give me some insight into how people perceive my mission and how I go about it. One of the things I like to do, is break the pattern, to help people see what new & different might look like when it comes to you and your teams performance. If you have an annual strategy session, planning days, internal conferences, professional development workshops, or if you have none of these but want some help to boost the effectiveness of your team, I've got plenty of value to offer, and guarantee it will not be your standard boring presentation, training or workshop. If you are ready to move away from your status quo to something better, send me an email, andrew@safetyontap.com and let's see what we can do together. Here's my takeaways from that chat with Nat Boehm: Takeaway #1: Where's the H in your health and safety practice? I might have sounded critical when we were discussing the absent H, believe me I'm not, I am one of those health and safety people who has been traditionally biased towards safety, because that’s what I was more familiar, more confident, and more competent in. The role of a leader is not to do everything yourself, but to lead the people who can do what they are best at. So if health is not your strong point, and it needs a boost in your organisation, be a leader by working on executive support, and either delegating the doing to specialists, or developing that capability internally. Takeaway #2: Are the humans at the centre of what you do? Traditional health and safety, and arguably traditional approaches to work, try and standardise & systematise everything, which means the humans aren't seen, heard, and treated as individuals. It's a bit of a paradox that we need standardising and systematising, but your job as a leader is to preserve the focus on individuals humans too. Takeaway #3: Data helps decisions. Again this might seem like a paradox when we talk about preserving focus on individuals, but having qualitative and quantitative data about the health of the workforce overall helps you identify your priorities, to engage your organisations leaders and to get the resources required to make a measurable impact on the health of your workforce. I still see well meaning fruit bowls and stock-standard EAP programs all over the place, which help us feel like we’re doing something, but are usually as effective as painting everything at your workplace in safety yellow or orange. We can do better than that. Data helps decisions. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya! [thrive_lead_lock id='1854'] Here's your FREE download of: - my handwritten notes, PLUS a reflection template for you to use for this episode. AND - The full transcript of this episode. I'll also send you the links to all the available back-catalogue of reflection templates and transcripts so you can access these at any time. [/thrive_lead_lock]
Today I'm joined by previous guest and friend of the podcast Dave Provan. You know, you are pretty amazing. I know this based on one fact alone, and that is that you are listening because you are invested in your own development, your own growth. One of the biggest challenges to improvement that I observe in my work and general conversation with health and safety professionals is seemingly simple - taking action. We know what we might be able to do. We are often motivated. But action doesn't follow. We are too busy, too distracted, too disjointed, or we simply don't know why it is that we have great POTENTIAL which doesn't turn into REALITY. I help people like you to take action to improve, to become more effective - I do this in a variety of ways like coaching, team facilitation and planning, and more. I am an action taker, and can help you to be too. If you want to improve your personal or team performance, I'd love to hear from you to see if we are a good fit and can make good stuff happen together - send me an email andrew@safetyontap.com and we can start the conversation. Dave Provan rejoins us today, after a deep and somewhat challenging chat in Episodes 41 and Episode 42. He's focussing in on what the role of a safety professional might look like leading a Safety II philosophy, which he explains in the conversation. Dave will be speaking at the 2018 OHS Leaders Summit which is being held on the 7th and 8th March in the Gold Coast. The OHS Leaders Summit is the only event in Australia specifically designed for the Group Heads of health, safety and wellbeing. It offers a unique combination of standout speakers, industry thought leaders, networking and personalised meetings with the leading suppliers of products and services, meaning you can leverage the best of what's out there to help your health, safety and wellbeing programs succeed. Visit ohsleaders.com.au to find out more and get your seat - spots are limited. The thing I like about Dave, is that we have one thing in common, to such a degree that few others do - we are both focussed, we're both fascinated, by the role of health and safety professionals, people like you. Not many people are out there with such a deep commitment to understanding and furthering you - it's not your organisation, it's not executive, it's not supervisors, it's not systems or training or technology or risk controls - it's all about you. So in this chat, you have a doubleshot, two blokes committed to a better, more effective you. Here's Dave: I just realised that at the beginning of this, I probably asked you out on a date, by suggesting I might come out to help you or your team. Which is pretty much a blind date since I don't know you and you don't know me, much. So if you want to go slow, please do listen to more podcast episodes. Connect with me on Linkedin, like a number of you have done recently - but expect me to engage you in a conversation to get to know you, I'm not a connection collector. Or send me an email to say hi, let me know anything that's on your mind, or what you thought about the podcast. I really enjoy getting to know listeners, and I'd love to hear from you. Here's my three takeaways from that chat with Dave Provan: Takeaway #One: Safety II is NOT the same as the decade old legal requirements to involve or consult with workers. Not true. Dave explained that. I suspect the vicious critics of Safety II using that objection, have probably never read Hollnagel, or Dekker, or much at all about different approaches to health and safety, so judge it on face value. It is far deeper than that, far more human than any legal requirements out there. Takeaway #Two: Don't think that you have your job nailed, all sorted out - because no one does. I am a believer of this, and have been for a while, but it's so refreshing to hear Dave give us permission to be unsure, to be curious about what's working and what's not, about what alternative perspectives or models or ways of working could improve our effectiveness. I'm sure you acknowledge this, but how much do our words and actions reflect it? And what about your boss, your team, your organisation, how confident and zealous are they in the status quo? Appreciate where they are coming from, and consider whether you can start to take them on a journey. Takeaway #Three: I want to help you be more like Dave's example, towards the end there. The way you can be a more informed, more curious, and more effective safety person, is to start by loosening your grip on safety things - anything already labelled safety. Entertain the idea that they might not exist, or might change. When you aren't then buried under all the 'safety' stuff, it will allow your mind to open and behaviour to change, as it did for Dave. Go into different areas of the business, build new and random relationships, ask lots of questions, connect people and resources together, be generally helpful. Looking for less safety things, will probably help you facilitate more safety outcomes in the end. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya! [thrive_lead_lock id='1854'] Here's your FREE download of: - my handwritten notes, PLUS a reflection template for you to use for this episode. AND - The full transcript of this episode. I'll also send you the links to all the available back-catalogue of reflection templates and transcripts so you can access these at any time. [/thrive_lead_lock]
Today I'm joined by Genevieve Hawkins from Coles. This episode is made possible by Safety on Tap Connected - what you might call a drastic innovation to your usual professional development. I had a note from a member of Safety on Tap Connected the other day, after I helped him with a bit of a breakthrough. Part of SoTC membership is members get coaching from me, which gives members access to the kind of support usually reserved for only the most senior managers. Anyway, he had been struggling with a few different things. Balancing the focus of these things was difficult for him. Two of these activities required him to present quite new and challenging ideas, to quite different audiences. It was quite a jumbled mess, but most troubling was that it was slowing him down, and clogging up his brain. Not a good situation for a go-getting kind of professional. So through our coaching we managed to disentangle these different priorities, get clear on the messages and audiences, and focus just on the next couple of steps to move those things forward. This kind of thing is quite common, and really affects out effectiveness. Coaching is one way you get accelerate your growth. The best bit about SoTC is that if you have a supportive manager, you are supercharging your chances of success. If you don't, then you aren't limited by your circumstances, you have external support right at your fingertips. If you want to know more about Safety on Tap Connected membership, check out safetyontap.com/connected Genevieve Hawkins and I share some stories today, stories about how stories are such an important part in being more effective. Genevieve leads the Health, Safety and Wellbeing function at Coles, one of Australia's largest supermarket chains. Genevieve will be speaking at the 2018 OHS Leaders Summit which is being held on the 7th and 8th March in the Gold Coast. The OHS Leaders Summit is the only event in Australia specifically designed for the Group Heads of health, safety and wellbeing. It offers a unique combination of standout speakers, industry thought leaders, networking and personalised meetings with the leading suppliers of products and services, meaning you can leverage the best of what's out there to help your health, safety and wellbeing programs succeed. Visit ohsleaders.com.au to find out more and get your seat - spots are limited. Let the story begin. Here's Genevieve: I love a good story. I really appreciated that after we stopped recording, I had the opportunity to share and hear a few more stories with Genevieve, which honestly makes me feel like I know her more than just someone I spoke to for the first time today. So before my takeaways, don't forget, check out safetyontap.com/connected if you want to accelerate your effectiveness this year, and have a look at OHSleaders.com.au if you want to head along to this year's event. Here's my three takeaways from that chat with Genevieve Hawkins: Takeaway #1: Everyone can, and does tell stories. So it's not hard for us to use stories more intentionally in our communication. I'm not suggesting it becomes forced or fake, quite the opposite - it's about harnessing the wealth of experiences we have and to share these with good intent - to educate, to inspire, to move people to action. When Genevieve mentioned her focus on mental health, I saw the opportunity to reinforce that point, because I believe it to and want to help you to take action, so I shared a story I've never shared publically before. But your stories don't have to be so deep and raw, maybe your intent is about relationship building through commonality with others, maybe it's using humour to loosen up a group, maybe it's educational about an incident so you can offset the bias people have about risk perception, which is limited by their own experience. You have the stories, and with the right intent, please use them. Takeaway #2: Let stories dominate how you communicate. Genevieve mentioned that statistic about the proportion stories should have in even the most formal presentations. This is a hard suggestion to swallow, and I struggle with it. Our ego gets in the way, and our need to spew forth as much of what we know as we humanely can in the time available, and with as much facts and figures as possible. I do this, and I have to try very hard to pull back, to strip away the detail, and to focus on the one or couple of key points, and to enhance these with story. Takeaway #3: Ask for stories! They are out there, so be curious. Literally, instead of saying "How did you get your nickname Babyface?" say "Tell me story behind your nickname, Babyface". Asking for stories does a few things. First, it establishes you as interesting, because you are showing interest. Two, it gives you common ground with that person, the beginning or strengthening of the relationship. Three, it tells you so much about the person, how they told it, how vivid was it, what they emphasised, whether it was easy or hard to retell, the emotions in the retelling. Four, it builds your repository of stories to retell. I retell other people's stories, with credit, all the time, when that helps the intent of my message. So please, ask for other people's stories. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya! [thrive_lead_lock id='1854'] Here's your FREE download of: - my handwritten notes, PLUS a reflection template for you to use for this episode. AND - The full transcript of this episode. I'll also send you the links to all the available back-catalogue of reflection templates and transcripts so you can access these at any time. [/thrive_lead_lock]
My guest Emma Blee spends her working hours at Australia Post, Australia's national postal service. In her role as Head of Enterprise Safety, Emma is the architect of her organisation's mental health strategy. Learn more about the importance of strategy, and key tips for your own in this episode.
Get the transcript & bonus reflection download from safetyontap.com/ep067
My guest today is Dave Wild, a futurist, innovator and strategist. Dave believes we can all have a part in creating a bright future. Dave speaks, coaches and innovates himself in areas such as the future of work, going beyond digital, artificial intelligence, and more. But don't take it from me, one of his clients said "What I love most about Dave is his flexibility in adapting to the requirements of the culture of the organisation and the desired outcomes. He offers fresh perspectives and exposes you to global trends and innovations. Dave brings a huge array of tools and I have seen him take people through a journey where even people who don’t consider themselves to be creative or innovative start making connections and generating new ways of thinking to start doing things differently for their business".
Get the transcript & bonus download from safetyontap.com/ep066
My guest Carsten Busch is a German born, Dutch raised, Norwegian working and English speaking curiosity - a while ago he released a book called Safety Myth 101 - Musings on Myths, Misunderstandings and More.
Now apart from his unashamed use of alliteration, it caught my attention because I had never heard of anything like it before - how many time have we had an interaction with someone in our organisation and thought "you've got it all wrong, that's a myth, it's just not right?"
Listen in!
In today's episode I'll share how to harness your reason for being, your ikigai.
I regularly hear that health and safety professionals feel stressed, anxious, frustrated and burned out because their job feels like such a grind. Some feel unfulfilled, some just unsure about their career and job decisions.
I find that when things aren't working as well as they could in my life, especially when there is high uncertainty, I can always rely on my core beliefs and values to guide me, which come together to form my collective reason for being.
The Japanese word ikigai roughly translates to mean 'reason for being'. I use this idea of ikigai when coaching people inside Safety on Tap Connected. NOW you can head over to safetyontap.com/ep059 to download the full, free transcript of this episode PLUS a worksheet to help you take action from this episode.
This is Safety on Tap! I'm your host Andrew Barrett, and since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! Today I'm joined by Dr Sarah Colley from Pockets of Brilliance. This episode is made possible by Safety On Tap Connected the world's first professional growth accelerator for health and safety professionals. If you are invested in your own development and improvement, this is right for you. For the price of about 3 coffee's a week, you can accelerate your development and your effectiveness with access to an amazing learning community, educational content like you've never been taught before, and you get 1:1 online coaching with me - your personal coach to help you accelerate your growth. This combination of things would usually be out of reach of most health and safety professionals, which is the very reason why we developed it - for you. If you want to know more, your first step is to head over to safetyontap.com/connected, and your second step would be to join our waiting list. I've had Sarah's partner in crime Jonathan Lincolne on to chat on episode 47, when we talk about the work Pockets of Brilliance does and their 5i change methodology. If you haven't listened to that episode, make sure you do, since Sarah and Jonathan are like two peas in a pod! So Sarah is an organisational psychologist who has never had a real job, and thinks that she would suck at one anyway. So instead Sarah leads Pockets of Brilliance, a research and implementation group based in Brisbane Australia. Sarah and her team have decades of success, dozens of companies all over the world and thousands of people who have benefitted from their human-centred approach to change. Whilst they are without doubt specialists in health and safety, they've realised that culture, people and change are much broader….which Sarah explains more in our conversation. So we cover a bit about culture and climate and the difference between these, the research that led Sarah into this space, and what they've learned by putting research into practice. Here's Sarah: Here's my three takeaways from that chat with Sarah Colley: 1. Be a ninja, like Sarah. Some of the stereotypes of a health and safety person is as a crusader, a teller, an enforcer, a zealot. Now that's not always bad, but sometimes we get blinded by our own passion and enthusiasm, which means we are perceived to be pushy, tactless and un-strategic. I love Sarah's image of the ninja in contrast - reflective, planned, thoughtful, agile, but swift and decisive when the time is right. If you think you or your team are a little gung-ho, channel your inner ninja, and see if you can't be more cunning about how you communicate, engage and drive change. 2. Understand climate and culture. My personal perspective on this is this: I learned about climate and culture, found it to be very loose and vague, and sort of put it to the side as I just leaned into the work of a health and safety professional. But I came back to it because the concepts of culture and climate are critical to us understanding the big picture, that health and safety doesn’t exist in a vacuum. And it especially reinforces the idea that it's not all about health and safety, which can feel confronting if we feel like we are overstepping our role. Bottom line is this - I don't think you can be effective unless you have a solid understanding of culture and climate. If you couldn't have a comfortable conversation with me about it, you've got homework to do. This link is a starting point for that homework, plus included in my handwritten reflection the 4 quadrant model Sarah mentioned. You can get access to my handwritten reflection notes for each episode, which includes a personal reflection template for yourself, if you jump on our mailing list RIGHT BELOW! 3. Take action. This isn't specific to this episode, but a core component of your ongoing growth and development. When it comes to research, Sarah mentioned that much of it never gets turned into action in the real world. Sometimes that's because it's not great research. But research is only as good as the action that happens from the insights it uncovers. So if you read something, turn it into action. Reflective practice is a great way to help you structure how to do this, so go back and listen to Ep 23 with Tim Allred to learn more about that. If you want to know more about how to take action on what you learn as a framework for professional development, I'm actually putting together a free course which teaches you about the learning frameworks which have made me successful, and how I use these now to help members of Safety on Tap Connected. Whilst the course is most helpful to managers of teams to help them improve how they do professional development, it's just as useful for individual professionals. If you are interested in that free course, send me an email with the subject line "free course" and I'll keep you in the loop.
Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya! [thrive_lead_lock id='1854'] Click here for your FREE download of my handwritten notes, PLUS a reflection template for you to use for this episode. I'll also send you the links to all the available back-catalogue of reflection templates so you can access these at any time. [/thrive_lead_lock]
Ladies and gentlemen, this is Safety on Tap, episode number 50! Wooo hoooo! I'm your host Andrew Barrett, and I'm so glad you've joined us to celebrate the 50th episode of the Safety on Tap Podcast! Since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! And of course welcome to all of you wonderful, regular listeners! Before we get into it, I want to thank Alistair Camm for reading our regular introduction. Alistair has been a long time listener, and I had the pleasure of meeting him in person a few weeks ago. I wanted to share two things about that. First Alistair has seen I had made some comments on Linkedin about stocism, and knowing we would be meeting in person he took the time to find an excellent paper about stocism from a service he subscribes to, he printed it out and he gave it to me. It was a wonderful gift - so simple and so thoughtful. It reinforced for me the power of small gestures to help others, especially when it comes to learning. Second thing about that conversation is Alistair said that he could almost recite the podcast introduction off by heart given he had heard it so many times….so I thought who better to introduce our 50th episode than him! So thanks Alistair for that! Now as health and safety leaders, I hope we recognise that numbers don't mean much without giving them meaning. So whilst 50 episodes is a pretty arbitrary number, I wanted you to help me make meaning of it, since this isn't much of a podcast without you thousands of listeners out there! I want you to know that there is a amazing community of people, just like you but different as well, with a common interest in improving yourselves as leaders in order to translate our greater effectiveness into better health and safety outcomes for the people we serve. So I put the call out for some messages from you, and so today's episode is just a handful of listeners messages reflecting on their favourite episode and how it’s helping them improve. I'm pretty intentional about most things, and this is no different. The intention behind this is to reinforce the power of social learning. Individual podcast listeners you may be, but this handful of messages may just bring you a unique perspective, a new idea, or just an episode which you haven't listened to just yet. I wanted to bring you the power of learning from each other, not just me and the people I interview. I've had a really really nice time reflecting on these messages myself, making meaning of them, and have shared my reflections of each with you in this episode too. So it is with great gratitude that we kick off our 50th episode listener messages: I hope you've enjoyed this episode as much as I did putting it together. It's lovely to reflect on the community of listeners that have grown around the podcast, and to hear that positive impact it is having for them. I'm especially happy to be able to share the personal relationship I have with some of the listeners you heard from today, because it is in the strength of our connections with each other that we find strength, opportunity, and growth. Thank you for our special listener messages from Steve, Cameron, Danielle, Kelly, Genevieve, Russel, Drewie and Sally. We sure covered a lot of ground in a short space of time! If you appreciate what I'm doing here at Safety on Tap one of the best things you can do is to share the podcast with a friend or colleague! Share the love, the podcast only works when we have listeners, and together you and I have some amazing potential to help so many more people, so think of a friend, send them a note, and say 'have a listen to this!. I'd also really appreciate an honest review from you on iTunes, could you do one for me? That also helps other people find the podcast more easily. And lastly, I know I'm asking a lot, if you have a guest you think I should interview or a topic in mind, shoot me an email andrew@safetyontap.com and I'll see what I can do! Thanks for celebrating with me, here's to the next 50 episodes. Until next time, what's the one thing you'll do to take positive, effective or rewarding action, to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya!
Today I'm joined by Greg Smith, from Nexus Lawyers in Australia. This episode is made possible by Safety on Tap Connected, the world's first growth accelerator designed for health and safety professionals to be more effective. This is professional development like you have never seen before, where you get long term social peer learning, soft skills that aren't ever part of formal education, and 1:1 professional coaching from me. If you want to accelerate your growth you need to check out safetyontap.com/connected to find out more and join the waiting list. Now Greg Smith is the first lawyer we've had on the podcast, with good reason. I've resisted many suggestions to get lawyers on, on that basis that I think as leaders we probably need to focus less on the legal stuff and more on other things to make us more effective. But Greg has an amazing passion and despite being a lawyer, has some really pragmatic reflections on how we can be more effective. Here's Greg: Greg mentioned the High Court judgement Slivak v Lurgi, where Chief Justice Gleeson provides a helpful perspective on interpreting what is reasonably practicable - not as complicated as it might seem. You can read more of Greg Smith's writings, blog articles and stay up to date with his latest books by visiting mysafetythoughts.com
Ep48: Industry 4.0 & the future of work is here, now. Innes Willox is my guest today. Innes is the CEO of Australian Industry Group, the largest cross-industry peak body in Australia. AI Group represents the interests of business to government, as an advocate and delivering services to their 60000 business members employing more than 1million staff Australia wide. This episode is brought to you by the Safety Institute of Australia's 2017 Victorian Conference called Safety STEPS, Strategies Towards Efficient Productive Systems. Innes is one of the keynote speakers this year, sharing his insights about the future of work, alongside a great lineup of speakers. You can find out more about that conference and grab a ticket at www.sia.org.au, I hope to see you there! Here's Innes: If you want info about the Net Promotor Score idea I mentioned in my take-aways, send me an email andrew[at]safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
Today my guest is Jonathan Lincolne from Pockets of Brilliance, a research and implementation company that does work that is way sexier than that description suggests. I'm heading along to a workshop that they are running on their 5i change acceleration method on the 26th July 2017 in Brisbane. I know that many of you won’t be able to go, so I thought it best to get Jonathan on to talk about their approach to change. I'll put the links in the show notes for you to check out the workshop details if you do want to attend, spots are limited and time is short! Find out what is the one thing that drives Jonathan, which should drive you too. Here's Jonathan: Two things you need to know: Register here for the Pockets of Brilliance Change Accelerator Workshop on the 26th July 2017 Come along to our FREE listener meetup in Brisbane after 5pm on the 27th July 2017 (details and RSVP are here).
This is Safety on Tap! I'm your host Andrew Barrett, and since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! Phil Bolton is my guest today. Phil is a data scientist, whose been doing this for almost as long as the concept of data science has existed. He is a Director at PWC and has spent his career in professional services companies helping clients get greater insights from their data. This episode is brought to you by the Safety Institute of Australia's 2017 Victorian Conference called Safety STEPS, Strategies Towards Efficient Productive Systems. Phil will be speaking at the conference on Machine learning and related concepts, alongside a great lineup of speakers. You can find out more about that conference and grab a ticket at www.sia.org.au, I hope to see you there! Here's Phil: [thrive_lead_lock id='1542'] Safety Analytics - One Page Summary Health and Safety Analytics - Safety Institute of Australia Magazine Premium Subscriber Article [/thrive_lead_lock] Here's my favourite links to start learning more about statistics: Basic Statistics Descriptive Statistics Once you have a basic understanding of these you need to move on to inferential statistics. I mentioned Pockets of Brilliance last episode. They've got an amazing track record not only in helping organisations change for the better, but to actually make the change stick. They call this their 5i method. If you want to find out more about their 5i method before their live training in late June, they are hosting a free webinar on the 19th June, which is less than a week from this episode's release. You can register for that webinar over at www.pobrilliance.com, I went to the last one, and found it really insightful. Speaking of their method, I've got one of their leaders Jonathan coming on the podcast next episode, to share more insights with you about leading change, the psychology behind it, and the reason why stickiness is the core mission of their business. You can get advanced notice of new episodes, my personal reflections on each episode, and a bunch more special stuff if you hop onto our mailing list over at safetyontap.com
My guest today is Peter Wilkinson, who has a wealth of experience. Peter and I met a few weeks ago and I enjoyed every minute with him, such was the value he shares. And as you'll hear, he doesn’t chase catastrophe, catastrophe chases him. Here's Peter: I also wanted to let you know about a very special group of people at Pockets of Brilliance. You might remember them from Episode 38 with Michelle Oberg, she is one of those special people at PoB. They are a team of Research and Implementation specialists who have spent decades synthesising their method for helping clients navigate challenges such as safety, change and engagement. The most exciting bit is that they are now teaching others to do this for themselves, which is the same approach we take here at Safety on Tap to helping you learn, grow and improve. They are launching their 1 day change accelerator in Brisbane on 26 July 2017, which teaches you their method. If you want to check it out head over to https://pobrilliance.com/5iapproachandevents/ you can learn more and register. I'm going, so it would be great to see you there! [activecampaign form=5]
See the value of diversity and boost your career with a balanced approach to your professional capability. One of the greatest challenges I face in my mission to help people like you grow and drastically improve health and safety is to bring our message to people who aren’t seeking it out, but who would benefit greatly from growing themselves. You might know someone like that - do them a favour and tell them about Safety on Tap, and what you get out of it. But Don't tell them not just to take your word for it, check out this recent review on iTunes: HSE Improver says 5 starts Virtual Mentor! "The Safety on Tap podcast has been a revelation for me during my long commute. It is akin to a probing mentor, generating thought as it dissects across disciplines, with health and wellbeing at its core. Some of the episodes such as the recent cast on bullying have opened up my mind, and the technique that Andrew uses to flip threat discussions into opportunities has already reaped rewards in my own continuing professional development. I would like to say a big thanks to Andrew and enjoy hearing more of your great work. " If you appreciate what we're creating here at Safety on Tap, you can also spread the word by submitting a review on iTunes or Stitcher - I am always humbled and appreciative of the feedback I get. Today's guest is Kelly Lovely, an accomplished health and safety professional, mentor and coach through Bookenz Leadership, not to mention a director on the Board of the Safety Institute of Australia. Here we go: I mentioned the Implicit Association Test which would provide your unconscious bias, you really need to take at least one of these tests: https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/australia/takeatest.html Kelly was also kind enough to create an e-book just for you, which describes the bookenz game in more detail. You can access that here: [thrive_leads id='1516'] And speaking of improving yourself, I wanted to let you know that our friends at Art of Work have released new dates for their Master Classes across Australia, the UK and New Zealand. If you haven't heard of them, Art of Work is the company to go to if you're looking for practical support in implementing safety differently principles within your organisation. If you visit their website at artofwork.solutions, you'll see a range of Master Classes that will help you to shift the conversation away from controls and constraints and towards a more proactive and appreciative approach.
I'm pretty excited at the moment. I'm happy to announce that the newest member of our family has arrived, his name is Jude Thomas, and despite the fact that he has shown his stubbornness in both labour and afterwards, my wife and I, and his 5 siblings, are glad to have him in our lives. I'm also excited about another new beginning, something of a birth I suppose as well. Safety on Tap Connected, the worlds first growth accelerator designed for health and safety professionals, launched on the 29th of May 2017. I can't tell you how pumped I am to have our founding member group starting to accelerate their growth. I've had plenty of enquiries about membership after the deadline though, since we were only open for one week. As our founders group settles down into the rhythm of ongoing growth and development through our coaching, community, content and contemplation, we may open up again for more new members in the future. So if you think Safety on Tap Connected is right to help you grow, you need to be on the waiting list at safetyontap.com, and I'll let you know when we open the doors again. If you aren't sure what this is all about still, I have something else for you. Since we are doing something quite different from conventional professional development, it's understandable that you might not be sure what you are actually going to get. One of the more common bits of feedback I got was about coaching - so many health and safety people haven't had much if any exposure to what coaching is, which arguably is the best value part of the membership. So if you are in the not sure camp, I have something special for you. So you can get totally informed, I'll let you have a sneak peek at our member onboarding videos, which explains everything in detail. If you want to check those out, send me an email andrew@safetyontap.com My guest today is Luke Anear, founder of Safety Culture, the creators of the iAuditor app, the most used audit and inspection app in the world. Luke has a great product and leads one of the fastest growing tech companies in Australia to make his mission happen - to improve health and safety by helping frontline workers. He has some great insights about user-centred design, staying true to your mission, and what the future looks like to him. Here's Luke: I mentioned a few links I'd share from that discussion with Luke: Health Monitor by Atlassian (for tracking all sorts of projects and team work) Spotlight Incident Reporting and Investigation app (for iOS) User Experience Design Cheat Sheet the Safety Culture way [activecampaign form=5]
Today we've got Part 2 of my deep discussion with Dave Provan, reflecting on the role of the health and safety professional, and how Dave is contributing to our understanding through his research. If you haven't listened to Part 1, which is Episode 41, press pause now, go back and listen to that first. If you've done that and you're ready for part two - let's go! Plenty of growth-fuelling juice in that chat, thanks to Dave Provan for sharing so generously. Before I share my reflections, the launch of Safety on Tap Connected is getting close. It's the world's first growth accelerator designed for people like you. Not sure what that is? Well it's a hub which brings people just like you together, together online from all over the world, to learn and share and support each other in a psychologically safe space, it's 1:1 online coaching from me, the sort of thing that is only normally available to executives paying mega bucks, and growth-fuelling educational content to gain knowledge about the sorts of things that will make a real difference to your career. And when you compare the price for 12 months of membership to a 2 day conference or training course…you'll see that that value you can get is simply massive. We'll only be opening the doors for a limited time soon, so hop on the waiting list at safetyontap.com/connected so you don't miss out. [activecampaign form=5]
Our guest today is Dave Provan, a guy who I found really drew me in, who made me curious to know more about him and what he's up to. The crux of the chat was meant to be about his PhD research into the role of the health and safety professional, but I enjoyed that our chat was a bit more meandering than just a description of some straightforward research. We connected in a way which both helped us to make meaning, of a whole bunch of things. It's very consistent with the approach of a rational flaneur, which I'm exploring. If you missed me explaining that one, check out episode 37. The best illustration of that approach is that Dave and I didn't really start the interview but just started chatting, and only part way through did I say to Dave I'd use some of our conversation for the recorded interview. I think this one is a nice reminder about the messiness and variation that we come across in every day work - life is just like that! I also wanted to do this discussion justice, without creating a really long podcast, so it's in two parts. Here's part one of my chat with Dave Provan: That's part one of my chat with Dave Provan. Make sure you stay tuned for Part 2 in the next episode, when Dave tells us about the rest of his plans to uncover a deeper understanding of the role of health and safety professionals through his PhD research. If you are a health and safety professional, you don't want to miss out on that one! Stay tuned for Part 2 of my chat with Dave Provan in the next episode, and in the mean time I hope you take positive, effective and rewarding action to grow yourself, and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Seeya! [activecampaign form=5]
Last episode, (#39 with Carlo Capponecheia) was all about an elephant in the room - psychosocial risk. Poorly understood, seemingly complicated, often this is put in the 'ignore basket', or the 'too hard basket', or the 'that's HR's problem to deal with' basket. Far from a criticism of all of us working in health and safety (me included), it was a reflection on how what got us here (in terms of our knowledge and our experience) won't help us get to where we need to go. I personally got a lot out of the interview with Carlo as I sought to improve my understanding, and then to explore what I implore you to do every week - HOW to take positive, effective and rewarding action. This week is in a very similar vein. Bullying you could argue is one kind of psychosocial risks, but I don't think it fits neatly into just that category. Nonetheless, it is a risk, it needs to be managed, and it holds great potential to bring positive change in organisations far beyond just solving a negative problem. My guest today Catherine Mattice from Civility Partners is one of the few people I know of who specialise in bullying (hang on, that came out wrong) - whose mission is to help organisations manage the risks and the opportunities, from bullying. Catherine welcome to the Safety on Tap Podcast: Now we've spent most of today focussed on the big picture. I want to acknowledge the very serious and real impact bullies can have on the targets of bullying behaviour. If you or someone you know is having a touch time and needs help, we've got a bunch of links to helplines and resources from around the world, so you don't suffer alone - you can get help to work through it. Check these out: http://www.mentalhealthcommission.gov.au/get-help.aspx (Australia) https://www.healthyplace.com/other-info/resources/mental-health-hotline-numbers-and-referral-resources/ (North America) http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/stress-anxiety-depression/Pages/mental-health-helplines.aspx (United Kingdom) http://www.tnp.no/norway/health/1685-call-mental-helath-line-anywhere-in-europe (Europe) http://togetherweare-strong.tumblr.com/helpline (Other countries) Speaking of reflective practice, I've been tweaking my reflective practice framework as I'm preparing the course materials on Reflective Practice - a critical skill for leaders like you to maximise the learning from everyday experience. That and a bunch more courses, engaging community and 1:1 coaching from yours truly will be available inside Safety on Tap Connected. Some people have been asking what it's all about - head over to safetyontap.com/connected to get on the waiting list to join - we're opening the doors very soon, and that will be only for a very limited time. [activecampaign form=5]
This is Safety on Tap! Have you signed up to the waiting list for Safety on Tap Connected? I've designed our revolutionary new professional development accelerator just for you - so as a listener you get first dibs on membership, which will only be available to you for a limited time. We're launching soon, and the early bird discounted membership prices will never be repeated, I don't want you to miss out. Hop onto the waiting list at safetyontap.com/connected, and you will be the first to know when we open the doors so you can join. Regular listeners know that we like to point at the elephant in the room here at Safety on Tap. Today's interview is a big elephant in the room for many of us, and our organisations. I wasn't surprised that much of the discussion in today's episode sounded pretty conventional, which is unusual for us. BUT that's because sometimes we need to get back to basics to really truly focus on the things that will drastically improve health and safety, because that's the mission right?! I think this is one of them. Carlo Caponecchia knows all about this. Here's Carlo. I mentioned a few of my favourite links to learn more about psychosocial risks. Here they are: https://osha.europa.eu/en/themes/psychosocial-risks-and-stress
https://oshwiki.eu/wiki/Managing_psychosocial_risks:_Drivers_and_barriers
http://www.who.int/occupational_health/topics/risks_psychosocial/en/
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So there are a few things that create ongoing discomfort for me as a professional, one of which is the lack of evidence in health and safety practice, and our tendency for so much of our practice to not be evidence based even when it exists. I am guilty too. I met Michelle Oberg last year when I was speaking at the Australian National Safety Convention, and she had me intrigued with her PhD research question, which I summarised in my notes as 'is less "safety" (in inverted commas) actually more safety?'. So the results have been streaming in, and Michelle's PhD is almost completed. So Michelle and I caught up to find out what she learned. Before you go..... Next week I'm lucky enough to be speaking to the wonderful staff at Safety Culture, the inventors of the iAuditor app many of us would be familiar with. They wanted my input to help their people, largely the technical boffins, to connect with their mission, the final output of their product - actual health and safety outcomes. I'm honored to be asked to help, and impressed with their commitment to keeping their mission front of mind. Lucky for you, they will be live-streaming my presentation and the following Q&A session on Facebook, that's 5-6pm Thursday 6th April (that's Sydney time), so if you want to watch that, Like Safety on Tap on Facebook and I'll post more details there.
Andrew: This is Safety on Tap. I’m your host, Andrew Barrett, and since you’re listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you. You’re in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us, and well done for trying something different to improve. And welcome back, of course, all of you excellent regular listeners. We’re super pumped to be collaborating on this podcast series with Safeopedia. Safeopedia’s mission is to organize the world’s environmental health and safety information to make access free and easy for everyone. Now, the team over at Safeopedia wanted to get to know you better, and for you to get to know Safeopedia better. So, this podcast series brings you some intimate conversations with the founders of Safeopedia and members of the Content Advisory Board. Safeopedia set up their Content Advisory Board to share observations and ideas on which topics and trends in the environmental health and safety industry will have the greatest impact for their audience. Their commitment to quality and to giving you relevant content is just top-notch. Listen in to each episode in this series, as we get to know the individuals involved, what makes them tick, and get some great advice, insightful stories, and motivation to help you grow. Here we go. Scott Cuthbert, co-founder of Safeopedia.com, welcome to the Safety on Tap podcast. Scott: Thank you very much, Andrew. A pleasure to be here. Andrew: This is the beginning of a bit of an experiment for both of us, where Safety on tap, with its support for leaders who want to grow themselves and drastically improve health and safety, and Safeopedia, aiming to be the place to go globally for health and safety and environmental information, come together. I’m pretty excited, I should say, on here, for our listeners, to be collaborating with you guys. Thank you very much, to begin with. Scott: Oh, our pleasure. We’re equally excited to be working with you and just understand the importance of leadership in environmental health and safety. Andrew: You have the genesis story. You have the very beginning, because this hatched, I’m sure, in your head, sitting in the bathtub or trudging through the snow or—one day, I’m sure, it popped into your head. So tell us a little bit about you and your story and how Safeopedia came to life. Scott: Sure. My background really started in the construction industry. Not swinging a hammer, so much, out on the job site—I started in the finance departments with the international general contractor. Because I was the guy that knew how to reboot a printer or run the backups for the AS400 at the time, I ended up getting pulled more and more into the IT side of things, and ended up leaving the grind of working for a general contractor and providing some consulting services back to the industry through project controls consulting and also system selection and implementation, and then decided to branch out on my own with a software company that was specifically designed to deal with the field data capture on these large-scale industrial projects. I guess it was really through that experience that I got pulled more and more into the safety side of the business. They needed to pull data from our system to do safety statistics, hours of exposure by plant area, by trade, by demographics of the workforce. I just sat in more and more safety meetings and really took a personal interest in it and volunteered to sit on several committees and just sit around the table more as an observer and as a safety expert and to hear what the guys out on the field were talking about, what their biggest hurdles were, and understand where their strengths were, versus where they were falling down, implementing the best practices out in the field. Andrew: How do you bridge the gap, then, between that active interest that you had in those still project-based roles on the consulting and how Safeopedia came to be? Scott: Well, it is one of those “light bulb goes on” stories, because I had— Andrew: It wasn’t in the bathtub? Scott: It wasn’t in the bathtub, but I was going to say it was one of those bathtub moments, but it was actually in my car. I was driving back from a safety committee meeting, and I had sat around the table with half a dozen—a dozen folks that had just a tremendous amount of experience. They were trying to do the best job that they could possibly do. They were trying to share best practices and understand what was working on this job site, versus that job site, and they were really struggling to collaborate with each other effectively. They were sending huge Word documents back and forth, and really, it wasn’t my idea, as much as it was the group’s idea, saying, “If there was just one place we could go where we had these best practices, where we had these tips and tricks, where we could share ideas, it would save us so much time and energy.” And so, I was driving back from the meeting, and it’s quite a ways away from where our office was, and I had this just pop into my head: “Safeopedia.” And as soon as that idea popped into my head, I just couldn’t wait to get back to the office. I drove safely, minded the speed limits, of course, but I drove straight back to the office and looked up the domain name, and it was available, and I purchased it right there and then and began the incorporation process to set it up as a legitimate company. I guess the rest is history from there. Andrew: You really just started with what was a relatively tiny bit of market research, passion for the area, and a spur-of-the-moment domain purchase. And after that, you really just worked it out from there. Scott: Yes, that’s absolutely correct. After securing the domain and starting the trademark and incorporation process, I did spend another year or two vetting the idea with industry folks to the best of my ability, throwing out ideas of “What should it be? Should we try to replicate LinkedIn? Should we make it more social, like Facebook? Or should we just be producing educational content to start with?” It was over the next 12 to 24 months where, again, the industry that had helped give me the idea helped me vet my ideas and strategies on how we should get it off the ground and where we should start. It wasn’t an overnight idea that popped into existence. It did certainly take some time to cultivate it and find the right folks to work with and align ourselves so that we could be successful out of the gate. Andrew: I think that really speaks to me, in the paradox of—on the one hand, you had an idea, and you just jumped on it. You kick-started it by that drive in the car and then purchasing that domain name. That, in itself, was very insightful, in that sometimes we spend too much time stewing on things, and we just don’t get them started. But then, on the other hand, the paradox is that you did spend a fair bit of time and effort in order to validate the idea, to make sure it worked. I think sometimes, often, there’s a learning out of that for us, where we spend too much time analyzing and thinking and planning, and maybe not enough time just getting stuff started. We might find that it is a big job—and that’s OK—but we might find sometimes that the job’s not as big as we think, and we’ll actually solve problems and help people a whole lot quicker if we just get on with it. I think that’s a great story to tell and a lesson for us to learn from. Safeopedia has been growing and growing, in terms of the numbers of people that it serves, visiting the website, attending webinars, consuming the content, contributing new content. We have our collaboration, obviously, which is moving into a new space with podcasts and potentially pushing the boundaries a little bit more. You’ve come up with this concept, which we described in the introduction, of this Content Advisory Board. From your point of view, with you leading the charge, why have a Content Advisory Board? Scott: Great question And both Jamie and I are the faces of Safeopedia. We have a tremendous amount of background and experience within these industries. But we’re not going to sit here and pretend that we know everything, that we’re experts in all the different areas. It was really important for us to pull a group together that could certainly augment our strategy and our ideas and provide some really strong expertise to the direction that we wanted to go in. As listeners will learn, we have a very diverse group of professionals across primarily North America, one in UK, and certainly, with your involvement, Andrew, some Australian representation, as well. Andrew: From Down Under. Scott: From Down Under. And they’re helping us to understand what the hot topics or the key topics are within their industries and their geographies, and help us look ahead a little bit to what will be the most valuable information we can produce for our users in those areas. Andrew: Makes plenty of sense to me. In the time that you have been grinding and driving and working to slowly grow Safeopedia, what’s the biggest lesson that you’ve learned in that process? What’s been your light bulb moment or a big height? What’s been the biggest lesson? Scott: The light bulb moment? I think it’s understanding the new economy—the Google economy, if you will—and how people are looking for information. It’s great. I think there’s a lot of really passionate people out there that are publishing great content. But unless you know how to get found, unless you know how to connect with others and have a voice in this ocean of data that we now live in, it’s all in vain. I think the most important lesson we’ve learned is, again, how to get your data out there, how to get your information out there, but make sure that you get heard, as well. I think that’s key. Andrew: Great lesson. Do you have a superpower? Scott: I don’t know if I have a superpower. Certainly, I was an early adopter on LinkedIn, and was connecting with people and keeping in touch with people. I think that, if anything, that’s been my superpower over the years. I can’t remember who wrote the book— Andrew: The Six Degrees of Separation? Scott: No, the connectors and the influencers and the mavens and Malcolm Gladwell, I think, The Tipping Point. Definitely, I’m a connector, and I’ve always been a connector. I think that’s key in this new digital economy: having an online presence and having some knowledge of how that all works. Andrew: You know what? You reached all the way across the globe in order to tap me on the shoulder. That brings us here today, so that’s a real testament to that. When we first started talking about getting together and working out how we can make a bigger dent in the world together than we might do separately—we’ll be honest with the listeners—I said to you, “I’m not sure that we’re a match. The content on Safeopedia is really good to support people in a technical sense, but it does have a focus on compliance and some of the detailed stuff, and there’s a different leaning towards stuff like hazards and IT systems and checklists and things like that.” Now, all of those things are important. They’re the foundational things that help us drive our programs in health and safety in our work. But I think, sometimes, we tend to ignore the gray and the messy and the people part, effectively. That’s very gray and messy. Here at Safety on Tap, we fuel leaders to grow themselves and drastically improve health and safety along the way, which often means challenging the status quo and pushing boundaries out of what I call “the conventional.” What direction do you personally want to see Safeopedia take in 2017? Scott: I definitely want to echo your comments. You can’t dismiss the fact that a lot of the compliance components are what has helped us build our audience of over 100,000 members. But in the long run—and this was echoed, as well, by the Content Advisory Board—there is a bit of a leadership vacuum within environmental health and safety. It’s been, to date, a very technically-focused discipline, and we really need to broaden that, to teach people and attract visionaries and leaders to the industry, so that we can not just make sure that companies are compliant, but that companies are embracing culture, health and safety, and they’re being leaders, not just followers, in the industry. Long-winded way of answering your question, but I’d really like to see us provide more content and more connections for people who want to take a leadership role, perhaps who don’t know how to get started or want to connect with leaders who have done it before and can share their experiences and best practices. That’s definitely an area that we want to focus on for 2017. Andrew: That’s the very reason why we’re talking today, because we’re all about supporting leaders to grow. I’m sure the listeners will tell I’m pretty excited about collaborating with you guys. Is there anything that you want to ask the listeners for, in terms of how they can contribute to improving Safeopedia, putting in what you get out, so to speak? Scott: Yes, absolutely. One of our biggest compliments—if you want to call it that—from last year, was when one of our team members was on a conference in Puerto Rico, thousands of miles from here, and was talking about different businesses that he was involved in, and mentioned Safeopedia, and the fellow that he was speaking to—his eyes just lit up, and he said, “Hey, I use Safeopedia all the time. I can’t believe you’re one of the guys involved in Safeopedia! We go there regularly to look at articles and share content with our management team and our guys on the field.” That’s one of the greatest compliments we can get. We see, through Google Analytics, that over 50,000 people are coming to our site every month, but we really only get an opportunity to interact with a few of them, who maybe have some suggestions for us, who have some criticisms for us, who think that we need to focus on different areas or expand an article or a term that we have posted on the site. I really encourage people to—and we listen. I’m sure there are sites out there where people send emails and you never hear back, but we want to hear from everybody. We only know what we know. If you know something we don’t, by all means, share with us. Our terms and articles—our content is there as a starting point to help improve industry and help people out in the field, so any ideas or suggestions or criticisms that you guys have for us, please, by all means, share it. We’d love to hear it. Andrew: I’ll just add to that, it’s not just about you, then, getting more of what you want out of Safeopedia, or providing feedback to our podcast, as well. It’s equally the same, where the feedback you provide will help hundreds, if not thousands, of people. Scott: That’s right. Andrew: That, I think, is the fantastic thing about this global connected economy that we live in. Scott: Absolutely, if you have a question, or you have a problem with an article, then chances are hundreds, perhaps thousands, of others do as well. It was a little while ago now, but we had posted an article, and somebody replied, and the tone of it was a little bit angry. He had written a big dissertation about what was wrong with the article and the approach that we were taking. We reached out. We contacted him and said, “Hey, this is fantastic. This criticism is absolutely invaluable. Can we take this and turn it into an opposing article that talks about the same subject from a different perspective? Because if you’re having that problem—no matter how many people like or share or retweet that original article, if you’re having problems with it, then somebody else is, too.” He agreed, and we posted his follow-up article as a Part 2, and it was hugely successful and really, really well-received. We’re here to make the site better. We don’t take anything personally, so by all means, get involved and let’s make it the best site we can make it. Andrew: That’s a fantastic example. We might link to those two articles, I think, in the Safeopedia article for this podcast interview, and also on the Safety on Tap website show notes, as well, so the listeners can have a look at those and compare and contrast for themselves. Before you go, Scott, what’s your best piece of advice for people who want to have a more effective impact in their environment, health, and safety practice? Scott: I would say, "be tenacious." It’s a very, very important industry. It’s an important part of every organization. But it still continues to be minimized. Some companies are looking at it as a cost item, and some people think that it negatively impacts productivity, but we have to keep providing them with—keep educating them and keep moving them forward, slowly if necessary. But be tenacious. Don’t give up. It’s so important. It’s about our planet. It’s about our coworkers. It’s about ourselves and making sure everybody gets to go home safe to their families at the end of the day. Don’t lose hope. Be tenacious. If you need to, reach out, and we’ll provide whatever support we can. Andrew: Fantastic advice, and I’m looking forward to continuing to make a difference in the world with you and Jamie and the rest of the guys at Safeopedia. Scott Cuthbert, thanks for joining us on the Safety on Tap podcast for Safeopedia. Scott: Thanks, Andrew. My pleasure. Andrew: Thanks to Scott for today’s conversation. Next episode, we have Scott’s partner in crime—hang on, that didn’t come out right—anyway, Jamie Young from Safeopedia. Given the commitment to improvement that we have here at Safety on Tap and at Safeopedia, let us know what you think about this episode. Give us a comment. The best way is to head over to iTunes or Stitcher to leave us a review and to comment, and we’ll be eternally grateful. If you haven’t already, check out even more episodes and great content over at Safeopedia.com and SafetyonTap.com. Until next time, I think you take positive, effective, and rewarding action to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. See you!
Since the beginning of the year I've been reflecting on the podcast, and where it's headed. In all my New Years energy I attempted to plot out a 3 month plan for the podcast, so I've got both the ideas, the guests lined up, and that many podcasts recorded ahead of time, so I don't have a pressure filled Wednesday and Thursday getting the podcast out on time, which was becoming the weekly norm, and so I felt like that would be serving you better. That just wasn't working, so instead of the trying to fix the situation with more rational planning and organising, I've thrown planning almost out of the window. I enjoy each episode because I learn so much, and each episode reveals new things to me. Planning ahead took much of the adventure out of the podcast, because the plan dictated what interview I gave you each week instead of seeing what emerged. So I'm doing the latter, planning less to maintain my sense of awe and surprise. I didn't know this at the time, but recently learned that this has a name - what Nassim Taleb has coined being a rational flaneur, being the French word for a person ambling or strolling, who makes decisions at every step based on observations and new information - not the prisoner of a plan. So out of more chaos hopefully greater insights will emerge, though I may drop a week here or there…and by all means please keep sending me suggestions for future episodes, I'll just be ruminating on them a bit more than I did last year. It is in that spirit that I invited Tim Austin to have a chat. Tim leads the WHS function at AACo, one of Australia's largest vertically integrated agriculture businesses. I recently read an elegant and thought provoking article Tim wrote on the Safety Differently blog about psychological safety, which he is in a good position to do since he has a background in psychology and is currently studying for his honours in psychology, while working full time which is no mean feat. Tim's article focussed on psychological safety in organisations, drawing on the research to explore what it is, and how we might both understand, and influence it. It got me thinking - what's the psychological safety like within our profession? Are we at risk of disengaging, hiding, causing mental anguish, failing to learn, if there isn't a high level of psychological safety? So Tim enthusiastically agreed to open that can of worms with me. Here's the link to Tim's original article on psychological safety And a TEDx talk by none other than Amy Edmonson. [activecampaign form=5]
Today I'm joined by Charles Jennings from the 702010 Institute. As Charles tells us, he is passionate about performance, through learning. I've been a fan-boy of the 702010 model for quite some time, and it has really made a profound impact on the way that I boost my performance, and they way I am able to help others - in particular, you the valued listener. In fact, 702010 is a cornerstone design input to Safety on Tap Connected - which is our way of supporting you not just to grow, but to accelerate your growth. I'll tell you more about that after the chat with Charles, along with my special offer to you. Before we begin - what does 702010 actually mean? It represents the research that suggests we learn most of what we learn in real life - 70% through experience, 20% through social exposure, and only a measly 10% of what we learn comes from education. We'll dig deeper on that in the discussion, so let's go! Here's the links Charles mentioned, you should check these out! Charles is speaking at this event in Sydney, 21st March 2017, 7.30am to 9.30am. Charles 702010 Presentation (including the research findings) The 702010 Institute has a wealth of information to help you explore the model more [activecampaign form=5]
Today I'm joined by John Green, who I call the zero harm killer in this chat. If that doesn't make sense, google him and you'll see what I'm talking about, or just settle into this interview and you'll find out more. I've got my take-aways at the end and a special bonus to better help you. Do you want to get our BONUS DOWNLOAD for this and future episodes - Andrew's personal notes PLUS a reflective journalling template specific to each episode? Click here to get access! [activecampaign form=5]
Have you joined the waiting list for Safety on Tap Connected yet? Safety on Tap Connected is the next big thing were doing to support leaders who don't just want to grow, but who want to accelerate their growth. This premium development hub exists to help you with your biggest challenges that hold you back, and cleverly designed with the right balance of content, coaching and community to help you make meaningful progress in your growth. When you are on the waiting list you will learn more about how being a member of Safety on Tap Connected will help you, and you'll get the first opportunity to snap up some serious savings compared to the full retail price for membership when it's released to the general public. Join the waiting list at safetyontap.com/connected Today I'm joined by Wade Needham, a seriously insightful yet humble health and safety professional, who has been a close contributor to my own professional and personal growth - I just had to share him with you. Stick around at the end for a listener review and my takeaways from this chat with Wade. Wade's daily blog is called Reframe my Safety Brain. Wade mentioned the following resources during the interview: - Matt Church article on Positioning - What got you here won't get you there, by Marshall Goldsmith (book) [activecampaign form=5]
We had a cracking review on iTunes recently, 5 stars no less, from Naomi. Her subject line was "Hungry, starting? I ate the whole cake!" "The messy concept of risk appetite is just that...an Eton Mess! Well with this episode (ep30), I ate the whole cake and can I have some more sir? Susy was a great guest speaker and it was so good to have her talking about a subject that is climacteric for health and safety and other risks in an organisation. Risk appetite is an area I work closely with so it was so good to have a podcast episode that is so relevant to me! Thanks Andrew & Susy So you've already heard that Mark Stipic is joining us today. He overturns a few rocks which I feel we might ignore sometimes in health and safety, and shares some seriously shocking evidence which points at a massive elephant in the room. Like most things growth-fuelling, you might not be comfortable hearing this, but you'll definitely have plenty to take away. Here we go! Mark mentioned he'll give away his e-book '5 things you need to know about RTW' with heaps of the examples and sources he mentioned, this is not your run of the mill resource. Head over to markstipic.com.au/safetyontap for that little gem And while you are browsing, you should sign up to be the first to find out about safety on tap connected, the worlds first growth accelerator designed just for you. safetyontap.com/connected is where to do that. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
Check it out below! Just because it keep's me on my toes, and breaks the pattern in our communication (thanks Jen Jackson from Episode 22 for that insight), I've flipped this episode around and upside down. Let me know what you think. First, I want to tempt you with our upcoming guests. Our schedule is looking pretty impressive, so much so that I'm actually concerned that it might almost be too much growth fuelling goodness! We've got John Green, the European HSEQ Director from Laing O'Rourke coming on the show. John is probably best known for his public stand, and that of LoR's, against the idea of zero harm. We've got a special guest, whose identity I'll keep a secret just for now, who will be enlightening us about how we really learn - which will help us as growth-hungry professionals, and will also help us in our day-to-day work. And I'm seriously excited about getting some safety on tap listeners on the line, to share with you their growth journey - I know their stories will give you plenty to identify with. I hope today's episode title causes some controversy. I seriously hope that it's not just because I've used a naughty word. Today's episode is short and sweet, the audio comes from one of Safety on Tap TV's recent video's. I hope it's controversial because it is raw, and it is personal. I hope it's controversial because I am making you feel uncomfortable - I want you to really take in what I say today, and have a good hard look at yourself. My mission is to help support your growth. That means you shouldn't always like what I have to say, but need to know that it is absolutely focussed on helping you. If you are a passive consumer of information, and just enjoy the podcast for entertainment value, that makes me happy. But if you are seriously invested in your own growth, you'll feel pushed, compelled into discomfort and to take action based on the things we discuss today. Here we go: Brent died last week. Brent was a part of my families life, and he's left his family way earlier than a young man should. The details don't matter, and the core message of this video never anticipated Brent. In fact I wasn't actually going to do this video, but his death spurred me on, because it does speak to today's take away message, and I think Brent would approve. The phrase piss or get off the pot is quite crude, and may not be used in all parts of the world. It's about being on the toilet - do something or get off, that's the point of the toilet. In fact, you can Imagine that it is a saying considerate of others, as in make way for someone who does want to piss. Does it ever feel in your work like you are just sitting, and not much pissing? I know I've been there, trying not to reflect too much because it's seriously uncomfortable when you realise you aren't making a difference, you aren't actually doing much at all despite feeling like you are just by sitting. Sitting is not the same as pissing. How much of our work in trying to support better health and safety is just sitting, no pissing? We get caught up in all the fluff and trash that fills our work day in the name of systems, compliance, corporate requirements….but how much of an impact are we really having on health and safety outcomes based on seriously important risks, in the lives of real people with real names and families? I know plenty of people who are just sitting because it's safe, and they keep telling themselves sitting is the same as pissing. It's not. So if you are serious about making a difference in the world, in the lives of people, take a good look at yourself and ask how much of your working day is spent sitting versus pissing. Because a life lived fully, but cut short, like Brent's, will be much more impactful than a life long lived but wasted by ineffectiveness. So today I want you to think about those things in your work day that are ineffective, that are just sitting…..and replace them with something proactive, positive and effective. Time on the pot, well spent. If you are a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way, you'll want to sign up for Safety on Tap Connected, the growth hub we are launching to accelerate your growth and in turn the impact you are making on the world. safetyontap.com
Today my guest Rob Sams and I cover a lot of ground, and at the same time only scratch the surface - why safety isn't that appealing anymore, the idea health and safety can a seriously religious concept in practice, the idea of paradox and how we might make sense of it all! This, is the safety on tap podcast. I'm your host Andrew Barrett, and since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! Today's interview will probably be a seriously challenging for you, which I hope creates the curiosity for you to listen. If you were safe in your comfort zone, you wouldn’t be spending your time investing in yourself by listening - I know that's not you, which is why I appreciate you so much. Check out Rob's book Social Sensemaking, A reflective journal: How we make sense of risk, and buy a copy here. Take my word for it, you need to buy a copy. If you want to warm up with Karl Weick's 7 Aspects of Sensemaking, I found this article really helpful. We also mentioned the Social Psychology of Risk discipline, which we breezed over but deserves a greater plug - learn more here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap
If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com
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How hungry are you for risk? Is your organisation starving of risk? Starvation doesn’t sound pleasant….so check out today's interview with Susy Daw, when we weave our way through the messy concept of risk appetite. If you are listening to this soon after release, very early February 2017, you're in luck - I've just sent out invitations for Safety on Tap's first meet-up, which I'm calling the Village Gathering! It's in Melbourne Australia, on the morning of the 16th of February. I'd love to meet you in person, and it would be even better if you bring along some friends of colleagues who are also leaders wanting to grow themselves. Click here to RSVP. Today my guest is Susy Daw. Susy has been involved in corporate risk management for decades, having slowly migrated to that specialisation after her early career as a nurse evolved into infection control management, then health care accreditation, which evolved into her current focus on risk. You'll hear in our chat a bit more about Susy, suffice it to say the reason why I got her on to speak with us is that she has been exposed to hundreds of different company directors, in discussion around risk. So she has a pretty wide ranging perspective, she's definitely not a theoretician, as she educates about risk through the AICD, she consults about risk through her company MQM Business Consultants, and she sits on a number of Boards herself. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
Listen in as we continue our exploration of the 8 Beliefs of relationship centred safety leadership. This, is the Safety on Tap podcast. I'm your host Andrew Barrett, and since you're listening in, you must be a leader wanting to grow yourself and drastically improve health and safety along the way. Welcome to you, you're in the right place. If this is your first time listening in, thanks for joining us and well done for trying something different to improve! Since last episode, we've achieved another pretty great milestone here at Safety on Tap, by launching Safety on Tap TV! We've heard your feedback, that long-form audio doesn’t suit everyone who is thirsty for growth fuelling ideas, perspectives and stories, so enter Safety on Tap TV! This channel is in addition to the podcast which I will continue to deliver to your ears weekly, the TV channel is again an experiment in engagement - it's short form, it will be a mix of me to camera, other visual content better shown than described, and might even include live interviews. But I need your input - and it will be really easy for you to get what you thirst for. You just need to tell me about the #1 challenge you face at the moment - that's it! And I'll take all that feedback and that will inform what we cover on Safety on Tap TV. The best way to let me know the answer to that one simple question, is to send me an old fashioned email - andrew@safetyontap.com, the reason why it's old fashioned is because it's 1:1 and I actually respond, not a robot or some random person in another country. So let me know what your #1 biggest challenge at the moment is, and we'll create thirst-quenching growth-fuelling content together. andrew@safetyontap.com Last week on Episode 28 we began exploring the 8 Beliefs of relationship centred safety leadership as proposed by our guest Rosa Antonia Carrillo. I wanted to make sure this wasn’t just a bullet point skim through, so it turned out that we needed two episodes to cover it all in more detail, which in my mind is still not enough. If you haven't already, I suggest you go back and listen to Episode 28 before this one, just so this makes sense in a logical order. Or do it backwards, or even listen to it in reverse, like some people did listening to Beatles records, and you might find some eerie prediction of death or other interesting things to come that none of us have yet discovered. I'll leave that to you. This episode we cover off the remaining four beliefs: People will speak up to stop an unsafe situation if it is in their interest.
Relationships influence emotions, feelings and beliefs. These, in turn, influence the decisions that impact safety decisions.
Our judgments prevent us from seeing the complete truth.
Drift from procedure is normal and a positive human adaptive behavior.
Don't forget to tell me your #1 challenge right now, which will help me create Safety on TV content for you! Email me andrew@safetyontap.com Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
We start 2017 with a two-part interview with Rosa Antonia Carrillo, from Carrillo and Associates in California. Rosa has spent decades looking at more effective health and safety approaches in business, and this has percolated into what we discuss in this interview - the 8 Beliefs of Relationship Centered Safety. Rosa had so much value to share that I've split this interview up into two parts, 4 beliefs this week, 4 next week, just so you have time to digest it all. The beliefs we covered in this episode are: Inclusion precedes accountability
Communication can only take place inside relationships and trust
Innovation, resilience, inclusion and accountability are interdependent
People are able and willing to contribute to the success of the enterprise
Check out Part 2 of this interview here. I mentioned during this episode that I've adopted a single word, a kind of motto for this year. Check out the debut of Safety on Tap TV to watch me explain my word in more detail, and check out my friend and previous guest Tim Allred's article about his word for 2017. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
A reflection on the year that was, plenty of exciting new things planned to better serve you, and a BIG FAT THANK YOU for listening! 2016 in review, and the outlook for 2017. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
There's few people more qualified to talk about the written word and it's role in health and safety, and that's my guest today Kevin Jones from safetyatworkblog.com. On the other hand, I brought along a pretty biased view of the written word, which becomes pretty obvious when I turn a debate into a courtroom prosecution of the written word. It's an interesting listen, and should get us all thinking about that well-worn communication tool, which so often is not the right tool for the job. So that's two metaphors (a courtroom trial, and tools) in the space of two paragraphs. I think I'll stop typing now! One last thing, I mentioned during the introduction a bit of background on 'Robens-style legislation, as context for Kevin's comments, which will help our overseas listeners understand what he is talking about. If you want to learn more, I found this paper quite helpful http://regnet.anu.edu.au/sites/default/files/publications/attachments/2015-05/WorkingPaper_10_0.pdf Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email…I actually reply personally! andrew@safetyontap.com Here's Kevin and I with our barrister's wigs on (it was his idea!) [activecampaign form=5]
I know you already get paid. The question is whether you'd still convince someone to pay for you, your team, your services, if it was entirely their choice. It takes the conversation from "you have to have us", to "do you want us?". It's a very different, and probably uncomfortable question to ask. In this episode Jenny Krasny shares how her business decided their function had made such an impact they wanted to sell their services to the rest of the market. Now that's an endorsement if I've ever heard one. Jenny tells us in this episode what it's like as quite a unique profit centre, unlike any other consultancy I've every seen. Just because the model is different doesn't mean there isn't plenty to learn. If you are feeling uncomfortable after listening, I've hit the mark, and you know you are on the path to improvement. Make sure you put your learning into action. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com [activecampaign form=5]
Click here to complete the 2016 Listener Survey - only takes 5 mins! In today's episode, we explore this new innovation in inductions and other training - based on research, and proven to be associated with increased knowledge retention and reduction in injury and property damage incidents. I haven't created the usual time-stamps (the audio equivalent of the table of contents) for this episode, as a bit of an experiment to see whether these are useful for listeners. So, if you miss them, drop a comment below to tell me, and I'll keep doing them. If not, I'll eliminate some waste from the podcast production process which means I have more time to create content for our new Safety on Tap video stream....stay tuned for that one. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap
If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
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Groundhog Day, the 1993 movie starring Bill Murray. That's what we're talking about today. Well not really - though there is a pretty clear link between today's discussion with Tim Allred on the habit of reflection, and that feeling of 'groundhog day'. It will all make sense at the end, I promise! Listen in as we cover: 1:08 Cocktails and reflection 2:02 Quick recap on Tim's last interview 5:36 The words at the end of each podcast are deliberate 7:43 Poking YSPspeak attendees to start reflecting 10:15 Succeeding in a VUCA environment 11:21 Tim's recent learning reflections on fixed vs growth mindset 15:51 Safety people traditionally lean towards fixed mindset 20:14 Growth mindset: More effort, more reward 24:02 Reflection isn't just for you, build it into the safety system 26:29 Reflection should be proportionate to the context 29:51 The roots of performance reviews (and why they mostly don't work) 32:06 Tim's 3 key points Tim mentioned two books which are worth checking out: - The light and fast organisation, Patrick Hollingworth - Mindset: The new psychology of success, Carol Dweck We also mentioned the Reflective Journalling Template. It's a good place to start. Get your copy here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
[GET YOUR BONUS]: Jen and the team at Jaxzyn showed us how to walk-the-talk, by creating a beautifully engaging summary of what we discuss in today's episode. So it's a WHAT-TO-DO guide as well as a HOW-TO guide. Clever! You can access that here. Are you one of the few, who move the many? That's a seriously deep question. Our guest today has a mission to help those few. Jen Jackson leads Jaxzyn, an energy-filled business seeking to create amazing employee experiences and engagement. Jen joins us today to share the exact model Jaxzyn uses to help massive, complex and global organisations embed safety into their DNA, and supporting those few people who move the many. In this episode we cover: 2:37 The first thing that struck me about Jen 5:23 Jen and I play corporate BS bingo 9:45 Jackson explains Jaxzyn 13:09 Jen's challenge: embedding safety 17:19 Earning people's attention, starting with empathy 22:21 How to understand your audience 24:20 Understanding your audience can be a scary thing 28:56 Break the pattern using language and visuals 32:34 The Curiosity, Attention, Action & Reflection framework. 39:39 Jen's views on knowing success or meaningful progress Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
STOP! If you haven’t already, I suggest you head over to listen to Part 1 first, then come back for this one to finish it off (it will make much more sense that way!). Gordon Bedford continues his daring challenge to the idea of risk, by explaining the concept of vulnerability in some more detail. I probe the idea to see if it really has legs, which I won't spoil before you listen :-) IN part 2 of the chat with Gordon, we cover: 2:18 Vulnerability in manufacturing 4:38 The meaning of words do matter 5:10 Risk suits cold, clinical and big numbers 6:26 Vulnerability suits anything involving people 7:43 Exploring vulnerability through hunches and experiments 9:27 Gordon puts it into practice in manufacturing 13:07 And then construction 15:10 What about 'so far as is reasonably practicable'? 17:00 Vulnerable, then Resilient, then Counter Vulnerable 24:35 How the 'vulnerability' experiment is going 29:46 How to connect with Gordon Gordon mentioned a fantastic concept (Anti-Fragile) from a great book by the same name: Anti-fragile: Things That Gain from Disorder, by Nassim Nicholas Taleb. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Have you ever had crazy thoughts, that you try and push out of your mind, but keep coming back? Like, 'why don't we throw an entire idea, methodology and industry out, and do something different'? Well you are not alone! I describe today's guest on the podcast as crazy - in a good way. Listen in as Gordon Bedford mounts the case to relegate risk to the history books, and replace it with something much more effective, much more human: 3:05 Gordon's crazy idea
7:12 Raging against likelihood & 'acceptable risk'
9:04 Risk Fail #1: Fukishima
8:58 Vulnerability vs risk
18:11 Risk Fail #2: Benign risk leads to massacre
19:22 Learning from benign risk but highly vulnerable
21:09 6 people dead, but the risk assessment was right?
27:35 How does vulnerability work in more familiar contexts?
28:53 Road safety already uses vulnerability
Once you’ve listened to PART 1, head over and listen to PART 2 of this interview, when Gordon unpacks some his idea with some practical examples. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
STOP! If you haven't already, I suggest you head over to listen to Part 1 first, then come back for this one to finish it off. This is the second part of the two-part interview with Brian Barrett, my Dad. We started with the background to Dad leading his organisation to the very end, until it was amalgamated into a new council, and the challenges he faced leading when he had little control over so much of the change. We shift into his humbling experience of getting feedback from people in his organisation, and that one person was so moved, they painted a portrait of him. Dad also shares his insights into leading work health and safety, and how his organisation leveraged amazing improvements off the back of their WHS focus. In today’s episode we cover: 2:18 Ever wonder how you'll lead right to the tumultuous end?
4:44 At the very end, what will people say to you?
10:13 At the very end, will your people be moved to get not one, but two portraits painted of you?
11:35 At the beginning, what did the end of leadership look like to you?
15:34 Leadership and WHS: Get the basics in place first, but it comes down to asking questions
20:38 To the people: "You know your business better than we do as leaders"
22:08 Stem the bleeding first
24:21 The human side of better health and safety
25:43 It all boils down to engaging people as experts in their own work
29:41 You manage processes, you lead people
30:29 Tough advice for people working under leaders who aren't interested
33:18 Don't just be busy….be fearless - you may be surprised at the response you get
Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
It's a great honour to interview my Dad, Brian Barrett this week, a leader who I think has plenty of insight to offer. This first part of the two-part interview, we cover off leading in an organisation you know will cease to exist - from which we can all take something away, including what NOT to do should you find yourself in that situation (actually, it has much a broader lesson). In today's episode we cover: 2:09 Why on earth would Dad do a podcast interview with me
3:45 The mechanics of mergers in NSW local government
5:56 First serious failure in communication (clean out your desk)
6:59 Preparing for merger, when you legally aren't allowed to
10:50 Leading people through uncertainty
14:59 Government as 'supply-chain' leader (or not?)
19:56 Planning which missed the vital ingredient
20:18 "One of the worst pieces of implementation of public policy in 39 years" and the reply which will shock you
26:30 Stand up and say it, there will be plenty of others who are thinking it
28:58 Recruitment fail - not providing feedback to all candidates
Once you've listened to PART 1, head over and listen to PART 2 of this interview, when Dad really sinks his teeth into what good safety looks like to him. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Make your life easier - Subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher!
I feel that in my attempts to improve my own effectiveness, which hopefully translates into better health and safety outcomes, I have spent way more time trying to understand what's going on outside people (the workplace, the environment, the design of work), than on the inside of people, and our brains in particular.
I'm not sure that makes sense, given how complex, and how powerful, our brains are.
Today's guest Amanda Wang Valentine shares her quest to better understand what's happening in our brains, with a focus on attention. Listen here to see how she is pushing the edges of current health and safety practice.
In today's episode we cover:
1:52 Living in Hollywood, attitudes to water & legalised marijuana
4:40 The land of the free, including everyone's right to an opinion
7:10 Amanda's journey to where she is now (it includes our Prime Minister)
11:44 The link between Intel, Netflix and Morgan Freeman
15:56 Shifting focus from physical hazards to our brains
17:41 Optimising cognitive skills
20:21 The birth of enHone's idea
23:52 Tough Q1: Where's the evidence?
28:32 Tough Q2: Will the safety 'buyers' be too risk averse (fearful) to try this?
34:33 My confession about a recent failure
37:15 The existential challenge: It's not all about safety
38:08 Tough Q3: What are the ethical/legal/industrial challenges to improving attention?
44:02 The first easy question: Amanda's suggestions for additional reading
On those few books we discussed, here's the links if you want to check them out:
The brain that changes itself, by Norman Doidge
Nudge, by Richard Thaler
SWITCH, by Chip & Dan Heath
I’d love you to subscribe, rate and review the podcast on iTunes, this helps spread the good word, so help me help you help a friend! Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Make life easier for yourself. Subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher! Kobi Simmat tells it straight. If you don't like feeling just a little bit uncomfortable about the ineffective status quo, probably best not to listen. ALTHOUGH....you must be ok with being a little uncomfortable, since that's the space where growth occurs. And that's why you listen to this podcast. So maybe this is just right for you. In this chat, we cover: 1:33 Kobi's view on WHS
4:25 Open cheque book leads to financial haemorrhaging into 'safety'
5:47 Kobi and I on how effective video and audio are
6:57 Master & apprentice vs more paperwork
7:59 NOT Auditors - Best Practice Assessor
8:51 Ban document control non-conformances
10:08 The System, must recognise failure in the form of practice
10:47 The bad reputation of the certification industry vs a best practice mindset
16:27 Learning by using FOMO
16:37 Using certification for good or evil in procurement
20:01 The death of the certification industry?
24:02 Show me your dashboard
27:03 Kobi's view of the future of workplace health and safety
31:41 Kobi's top tips for improving WHS
I'd love you to subscribe, rate and review the podcast on iTunes, this helps spread the good word, so help me help you help a friend!
Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Make life easier for yourself. Subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher! Starkers (Naked). You know what it feels like to be really open and honest? Well, you get 100% ME in this episode, come behind the curtain as I share a bit of general reflection, about podcasting, answers to common questions I get, and a little bit about how I'm improving the podcast moving forward. In this chat, we cover: 2:10 I confess - Podcasting wasn't in my plan 3: 12 The magic of podcasting (you'll be surprised with what I think) 4:34 What we can learn from the grass not being greener on the other side 8:49 What I actually do apart from hosting Safety on Tap 10:56 Show respect to people through preparation 12:38 The skill of asking questions 15:26 Collaboration: A recipe for success 19:08 Co-opetition vs competition 21:52 Reflecting on the National Safety Convention 23:34 Innovation through reverse thinking - Less safety on this podcast 24:36 Tell me who you want to hear interviewed and I'll make it happen 26:55 Shout-out to a few listeners for their feedback I'd love you to subscribe, rate and review the podcast on iTunes, this helps spread the good word, so help me help you help a friend! Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Peter Gahan leads the leading organisation on leadership in Australia, the Centre for Workplace Leadership. He's also go a firm eye on the future, to support research, turning it in practice, for effective leadership to support work which is changing so quickly all around us. In this chat, we cover: – The future of work (it's closer than you think) – What Peter thinks about leadership, including a simple and understandable definition of leadership to help us improve. – Some of the disruptive things in business impacting, and impacted by, leadership - like corporate democracy and modern performance reviews You can hear more of Peter at the National Safety Convention – get your tickets here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Richard Coleman knows a thing or two about digital disruption. He has put a number of practical and very cool digital technologies to good use for health and safety, and has his finger on the pulse with the broader digital landscape. Make no mistake, digital disruption is happening, is only getting bigger & faster, and it creates great opportunity, or poses a great threat to current health and safety approaches - Richard invites us to choose opportunity. In this chat, we cover: – What we mean by digital disruption (if you think you know, you're probably wrong like I was) – The role of health and safety driving and supporting adoption of new and emerging technologies – The drastic impact disruptive technology can make in eliminating risks, changing the way work is done, and introducing a range of new risks - How prepared current health and safety is (both the approach, and the professionals) for disruption that has already begun Peter is our there making a difference in the world - which I suppose should also be the aim of anyone caring for the health and safety of people? Plenty for us to identify with. You can hear more of Richard at the National Safety Convention – get your tickets here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Peter Baines has seen some pretty tragic stuff in his time, and has learned a thing or two about leadership in challenging and disruptive environments. Listen in as Peter, from charity Hands Across the Water, shares with us what he has learned. The biggest surprise for me was that these leadership lessons will apply to almost everyone, as work and life get more and more disrupted. No tsunami required. In this chat, we cover: – Where Peter cut his teeth as a forensic police officer, identifying victims of mass disasters all over the world – Peter's key factors for great leadership, a sneak peek from the presentation he will be delivering at the National Safety Convention in September 2016 – A very person-centred approach to leadership - no fancy programs, visions or rhetoric - straightforward concepts that anyone can focus on - The similarities between the Corporate Social Responsibility context and the health and safety context, including alternative ways to measure value Peter is our there making a difference in the world - which I suppose should also be the aim of anyone caring for the health and safety of people? Plenty for us to identify with. You can hear more of Peter at the National Safety Convention – get your tickets here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
What do Dr David Borys and Animal, from the muppets, have in common? Listen in as Dr David Borys, from RMIT University (amongst a few other places!) fill us in on the talk he is giving for the 2016 Wigglesworth Memorial Lecture, entitled Two windows to clarify the enigma that is health & safety PLUS a sneak peek at the 'intelligent risk management' workshop he is also running during the Convention. In this chat, we cover: - The connection with David and Animal the muppet (no, I'm not calling him a muppet…!) - A contrasting perspective on health and safety 40 years ago, and David's view today - David's take on what we know, whether all that knowledge has actually helped improve health and safety, and why - How David took on James Reason and left him without a good response - Some simple and free ideas for us to try and improve health and safety (you won't be disappointed!) Whether you are getting along to the 2016 National Safety Convention or not, you'll enjoy this chat with David. Enjoy! Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
The first time I've interviewed someone who has brought Lego into the conversation - now that's imagery I can understand! Listen in as Loren Murray, from Creative Works Group share with us her insights into how we can create a health and safety career worth chasing. In this chat, we cover: - How Loren fell out of the safety church, and what happened next (this has no analogy with actual falls incidents…) - Her key points from the upcoming Young Safety Professionals panel at the National Safety Convention in September 2016 - How to create a career you love (and why Loren loves her own!) If you want have more than just a job in health and safety, you'll get some great insights from this chat with Loren. Enjoy! You can hear more of Loren at the National Safety Convention - get your tickets here. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Are you a story teller? No? It's not as childish as you might think. Listen in as we hear from one of Australia's foremost safety story tellers, Dr Drew Rae, about the importance of stories in our professional practice. In this chat we hear about: - good, and less good, story telling for safety, - drowning horses, - rocket ships - the fashion of safety, and - being curious (not the first time that's come up on this podcast!) Now let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap
Do you stop, and truly think about how your going, how effective you are, what's working, what's not, and what's got to change? Tim Allred, founder of Young Safety Professionals in Australia, shares his reflection on the value of this kind of reflection! Isn't that appropriate! In this chat we cover: - the start of the Young Safety Professionals group and the benefits of a peer community - the natural tendency for younger people to ask WHY - exciting young speakers at the upcoming 2016 National Safety Conference, including Tim, and yours truly! - individual reflection which helps you improve whatever it is that you do - the courage for and the approach, to experimenting and research which everyone can do in their day to day work to test effectiveness As a special gift to our listeners, Tim is giving away his reflective journaling template, for free! If you want a copy email me andrew@fidesa.com.au, and I'll send it to you right away! And let's get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap
Do you ever feel a bit dull, without much 'oomph', plodding rather than sprinting through your work? Listen in as I get SMASHED (in a good way!) by energy, ideas and actionable improvements from Ali Uren, the change-maker at Kiikstart. We cover a lot of ground - from the courage to let go of what's not working, to personal risk assessments, through to getting dirty hands in the business planning process and creating delightful experiences for our customers. If you only take a pinch of value from this interview you will still be a richer, more effective person! Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
Alanna Ball felt a little lost in health and safety, she wanted to belong to a family, a tribe. There was no tribe for her, so she led others who were in a similar place to form a tribe: Women in Safety. What a tribe! Join us in the interview for a great insight into the importance of a professional family or tribe, and the opportunity for you to leverage other work-families and work-tribes to drastically improve health and safety. We also get two FREE slices of conference-goodness, from the the 2016 South Australian Health and Safety Conference, with thanks from conference organisers Informa. I chat on the couch with a very vivacious Professor Ian Maddocks (Australian of the Year, no less), who shares some very thought-provoking insights into the amazing opportunities, and things to consider for, ageing workforce, and John Cvetko, a client relationship manager who knows a thing or two about improving health and safety outcomes through a sharp focus on our customers. Let’s get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett. If Facebook is more your thing, check out @safetyontap If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com
"Where shall I begin, your Majesty?" he asked. "Begin at the beginning," the King said gravely, "and go-on until the end: then stop".
Thanks Lewis Carroll, the King, and the White Rabbit who asked such a great question in the first place! Since this is episode ZERO (not that kind of zero...) of the Safety on Tap podcast, I thought it gentlemanly that I tell you a little about my WHY....and a little bit more about me. Towards the end I also share two short-but-great interviews, which I recorded at the 2016 South Australian Health and Safety Conference, with thanks from conference organisers Informa. Marie Boland, Executive Director of SafeWork SA shares with us how she is disrupting her organisation from the inside, and David Clarke, CEO of the Safety Institute of Australia, makes the case for professional certification and the momentum of the health and safety profession in Australia. Not to be missed! Let's get to know each other! Connect with Safety on Tap on LinkedIn, or me Andrew Barrett, and check out the website for much more www.safetyontap.com If you want to get in touch with me, send me an email! andrew@safetyontap.com